--- Bob Simons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I look at it this way-a boy can go all through life and never go camping > or > hiking and in the same sense he can go through life and never hear about > or > receive Jesus.
I'm tempted to beleve that is a myth- There are a lot of myth's taken as fact in Royal Rangers.. many of the drop-out boys have smelled a rat<G> What I think a boy needs, is to be encouraged to do his best and not be constantly sold a bill of goods by a *non-professional salesman. > Which one do you think is more important for him to experience before he > dies? Scary as it may sound, that is his choice. It has to be that way.. because it is his life, not mine.. Here we have a difference of opinion on the duty of RR Leadership. I'm not denying the proclimation of the Gospel by you or anyone and reserve the right to *Preach Jesus, if needed.. Royal Rangers however makes it to much the "reason for our existance" to the exclusion of other valid efforts to raise character or build self-esteam. Balance is needed here, to understand what I'm saying.. "Jesus first, Jesus is everything, all is folly save Jesus" is even at odds with open reading Ranger Code... > It is good to show them love-that is God like. But if I don't impress on > them that they need to accept Jesus I lose them for eternity. They may > not > like to hear that but there are things that we need to tell the boys to > protect them, whether they like it or not. Thats real love-not candy > coating > the truth and telling them what they want. Here's what concerns me, and take it anyway you want.. At RangerCamp NW we have a "Holy Ghost" night.. and it seemes the point is to get boys to stutter and have an emotional moment that we can sight as evidence of the infilling of the Holy Ghost. In practical terms, I can pray with a boy or boys for something to happen, *I can speek in my prayer language,put hands on them- but I am *checked from going any further.. I do not try to "get them to do anything".. I don't blow on them, shove them, power-slay them out or *Command them or the direction of their prayer's... When we hold the Salvation night... I wait for the boy to say his fill before "Leading him, to the Lord" and taging his name on a multi-part NCR form. I personaly just want to be there in "agreement" with him, not form words or speek for him with a responce of "Ahh-huhh" I figure it's like signing him off on an advancement<G> The boys performs, I whitness.. that's it. > I used to live outdoors, like Jesus. I loved to hike and fish, too. But > one > thing was wrong-I was a sinner and didn't know God. So everything else > didn't matter. I was free as a bird but as lost as can be. There's only > one > compass that can and did show me the way. It is Gods Word. Some other > guys > prayed with me and invited me to their church. At that point I realized > that > I really was free and the other freedom was only a deception, an > imitation. > Because who ever the Son sets free is free indeed. *Right, Beleve on the Lord Jesus and be set free- Yet the gospel in a word is "Love" and the confirmation of that is a personal relationship with out ties of social obligation to others.. I think the active ingrediant is "Membership" or the act of joining a cause by my own free will. If we use Ranger camping as a lure or "bait" we cross ourselves up before the boys when we say behind the sceans that only *Jesus is important<G> To me it's like, constructing a situation or conspireing.. to save a life. > Yes it is black & white. If we pussy foot around and neglect telling > them > the truth we are failing our calling. Love you Bob.. *But a Man does not fail who ministers in the program. That can even be, weilding the hitch to the Ranger trailer- Duane > Bob Simons > Outpost 48 > Tucson, AZ. > O'Day 20 > > For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, > "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give > you hope and a future. Jer. 29:11 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "This Lil'light'r Mine" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Bob Simons" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2002 10:35 AM > Subject: Re: [RR] Eagle's nest- the next adventure > > > > > > --- Bob Simons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > True theres more to life than talking about Jesus -theres walking > with > > > Him, > > > talking with Him. He is the Way, the Truth and the "Life". Out of > Him > > > flow > > > all the issues of life. Life with out Him is dead-lifeless and > > > meaningless. > > > > I think you confuse a doctrine of Jesus first.. with a gospel of > peace, > > where we have a duty to stand for Justice, Peace and the welfare of > > all God's children. God gives us povidence to minister with talent > > and with our fortune. > > > > Along that path we share a Duty to God,our self and others.. > > > > Perhaps our duty is as you prescribe.. or perhaps our duty to God > > will have us become Doctors,Lawyers and Mechanics. All service, > > includeing being of good cheer and becomeing good company is worship > > to his presence. > > > > > > > > > If I teach boys anything else it will not help them for eternity. > > > > Wrong.. > > We find God in our own way. > > The Holy Spirit does the work. > > His tools are many, and found in Nature,Communication,Education,Art > > and Science. > > > > Therefore, our ministry my be to proclaim, or it may be to abide in > faith. > > Our trails are adventures in learning by *process.. > > > > I object to giveing the absolute answer to every question a boy > raises. > > Who am I to "box in" his intrest and curosity. I may in fact "Teach" > > by many suttle ways of being a encouragement and a guide. > > > > > > > I take Rangers a step further-If I cook them some food over a > campfire I > > > have fed them for one meal. If I teach how to cook over a campfire I > > > have fed them for a lifetime. > > > > I get that concept- > > I agree, however NO BOY SCOUT has ever starved to death on a campout. > > > > That may be that, all campouts are short term.. or it may be that > > what food is brought is allways just enough.. cooked any way as they > > do.. and it even may mean that the boys cook *their food and cook mine > > over there- as I see fit<G> > > > > > > If I teach them about Jesus I have fed them for > > > eternity. Now thats keeping them for Christ! > > > > *Ok- got it, and- > > > > After I was told about Jesus 45,000 times.. I sort of wondered > > what I would become in life. I wondered what successful people do > > and what my Professors were trying to say.. > > > > I came away loseing my Dad over this.. He's a AoG head in the Bible > > Jesus first old man. He like you say's ALL IS FOLLY save Jesus. > > > > *I disagree.. I say catching a Steelhead trout has worth. > > Rideing down a road with the wind in my long hair was FREEDOM > > and liveing Life with balance is wisdom. > > > > > > > This life is but a vapor-it disppears real fast-before you know it. > We > > > will > > > be standing before the Father and He will ask us what we have done > in > > > our > > > life of eternal value. > > > > Right Bob.. *I'm ready.. > > > > My life is not a waste when I tell my son that I love him the way > > he is right now and the way he will become.. > > > > No one can be perfect and justifyed when born in sin.. *But once > > that sin is forgiven, we are free. This thing, "Freedom" takes some > time > > to fall in love with. We learn it, and it isn't natural to all people. > > > > Some are prone to bondage, slavery and vices.. some suffer low self > > esteam or have been dominated into subjection. God brakes those > chains. > > > > > > > > Camping, cooking, fishing, hiking, and all the > > > "Ranger stuff" won't cut it. When He sees boys names written in the > > > "Lambs > > > Book of Life" and knows that you helped to get their name there and > they > > > in > > > turn helped others get there then He say "Well done thou good and > > > faithful > > > servant, enter into the eternal joy of the Lord." > > > Anything else is a waste of time. > > > > Bull Pucky on a hot plate. > > > > The entire life of Christ was spent outdoors on a extended > Campout/Hike! > > > > *IF Jesus, would have had access to a Mountian Bike, he would have > rode > > and gotten air off a bump.. he would have enjoyed dressing in layers, > > and sleeping in a nice down bag in the desert and a poly-fibre bag in > > a wet climet<G> Jesus would have cooked with a dutch oven or enjoyed > > low impact de-hydrated food just like you. > > > > Because he was a OUTDOOR KIND OF GUY! > > > > > Sure we can use things to gain their interest but we should never > lose > > > sight of the real goal. Souls for eternity. Amen. > > > > We do that in "one way" right? > > > > Duane > > > > > > > > > Bob Simons > > > Outpost 48 > > > Tucson, AZ. > > > O'Day 20 > > > > > > For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, > > > "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give > > > you hope and a future. Jer. 29:11 > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "This Lil'light'r Mine" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > To: "Bob Simons" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Cc: "Rangernet" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2002 1:23 PM > > > Subject: Re: [RR] Eagle's nest- the next adventure > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bob Simons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > Introduce Jesus to them and see what happens. > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === ===== *High MORALE is the Index of effective Leadership. --------------********+********-------------------- Morale raises belief of the Leader in the follower, of the follower in the Leader, of each in themself, and both in the .....cause! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus � Powerful. Affordable. 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