[Biofuel] lye supply
Our cooperative here just made arrangements for continuing, large scale NaOH delivery from a large chemical supply company. As an effort to share this with the community, we're prepared to offer it to homebrewers for $2 a pound plus shipping (and shipping is apparently about $6 most of the time). You might be able to find it cheaper locally, and if so I applaud you and please disregard this message. Shipping is the real killer. If you're interested, toss me an email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] and we'll go from there. I'm not sure yet whether it's flake or pellet, but I'll assume that it's flake since it's low-cost and bulk. If enough people are interested, we'll put up a website or something similar, maybe run it through ebay or something for security. ~Thanks!~ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor
Totally Enclosed Fan Cooled - TEFC.If you follow link on my originalpost, the pump displayed has a motor attached to looks generally like a TEFC motor.I don't know that it is though. Ah. I figured it was something Fan-Cooled but I figured TE stood for something technical and electrical in nature. So I kept trying to come up with a term that would fit. I have fan cooled, but none have enclosed windings and all of them do occasionally spark. One of them sparks constantly, so I won't be using that one. Not when turning it on and testing it produced a plume of sparks a good three feet long at first. Nope, no sir. It's a 1hp motor though, so I pity losing it. Would have made a good pumper. Best of luck to ya in your searches. Peace -Kurt ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Measuring tools...
I'd rather not get beaker etc on line. I'm thinking craft stores but it hasn't worked out so well so far. Mike Luich ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Starting at Square One
Food for thought. I have a '79 Rabbit. I recently put in an ammeter mostly out of curiosity and because I had one lay'n around. The bolts that hold the alternator bracket to the block broke off one night (non-spec bolts + cyclic fatigue over time). The alternator is the belt tensioner for the water pump. By losing the tension in the belt, the water pump stopped pumping. Over heating is the weak link in the otherwise amazing VW diesel engine. Fortunately the ammeter indicated something was up, I pulled over to have a look and was surprised to find my alternator dangling. The idiot light never came on to indicate that the alternator was no longer alternatoring. I could have easily cooked my motor that night. Macgyver trick: the rubber gasket in the lid of a 5 gallon bucket is a great emergency fan belt. I doubled one up and ran it around the main pulley and water pump pulley. I found one in a nearby dumpster. Once again, I found my salvation in the bottom of a dumpser. Happy motoring! From: Kurt Nolte [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Starting at Square One Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 17:33:51 -0400 From the picture the engine looks the same, but could be the same design and smaller displacement I suppose. The non-working temperature guage is concerning, because overheating a diesel with an aluminum head and cast iron block usually means putting a new head gasket in it -- as least in the VW diesels. But that's pretty easy to add a new temperature guage. Zeke Yeah, if I do end up getting it, I have a whole suite of gauges and meters that are going in it. Head temp, Oil temp, Voltmeter, Ammeter (Iffy about putting this one in, unnecessary work.), stuff of that nature; I've been scrounging up meters for a while now. If it doesn't have a tach I'll see what I can do to pick a tasteful one up, instead of those gaudy racer style tachos. Still flirting with the idea, guess I should my act together and make a decision, eh? -Kurt ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor
Generally pump motors are 2 pole: meaning they spin twice as fast as 4 pole motors, hence half the torque. Washing machine motors are usually 4 pole. regards Doug On Thursday 27 October 2005 3:49, Ken Dunn wrote: On 10/26/05, Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Totally Enclosed Fan Cooled - TEFC. If you follow link on my original post, the pump displayed has a motor attached to looks generally like a TEFC motor. I don't know that it is though. Yes it is. More info here: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_processor10.html#pumpcap Journey to Forever 90-litre processor Keith, Care to wager on whether the pump motor could be converted for use in my stir process? Take care, Ken ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
But you must agree that it is moving from a boat that leaks like a sieve to a boat that needs an occasional bale?? I find now I get extremely frustrated at work where I must use the M$ systems: because I cannot multi task as easily as on my home system. (And I have occasionally had over 60 web pages open at once in Linux - try that on the other system!) regards Doug On Wednesday 26 October 2005 10:16, Rafal Szczesniak wrote: On Wed, Oct 26, 2005 at 04:54:01PM +1000, Doug Foskey wrote: Good reason to go Linux. It doesn't really matter. If one of your addresses is publicly available (either on a website or mailing list archives) it will be abused this way sooner or later. I use Linux and FreeBSD all the time and it happened to me too (several times). Naturally, using Windows mail readers exposes you more due to impact the mail worms and viruses have on internet these days, but just using Linux is not an ultimate solution. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
Unfortunately, there are too many specialized engineering software packages that I use every day that can only operate under windows (often they are even picky about the version of windows) for me to consider Linux. If it was just web browsing, spreadsheets, word processing, and the like, I'd get rid of windows in a heartbeat. I've already dumped IE and outlook. I want Google or Mozilla to come out with an operating system. On 10/26/05, Doug Foskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But you must agree that it is moving from a boat that leaks like a sieve to a boat that needs an occasional bale?? I find now I get extremely frustrated at work where I must use the M$ systems: because I cannot multi task as easily as on my home system. (And I have occasionally had over 60 web pages open at once in Linux - try that on the other system!) regards Doug On Wednesday 26 October 2005 10:16, Rafal Szczesniak wrote: On Wed, Oct 26, 2005 at 04:54:01PM +1000, Doug Foskey wrote: Good reason to go Linux. It doesn't really matter. If one of your addresses is publicly available (either on a website or mailing list archives) it will be abused this way sooner or later. I use Linux and FreeBSD all the time and it happened to me too (several times). Naturally, using Windows mail readers exposes you more due to impact the mail worms and viruses have on internet these days, but just using Linux is not an ultimate solution. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
My win2k box runs Firefox with 100+ at times with little issue aside Firefox's memory leak. Windows (any ver) used by someone who has little to no clue how to secure it and make it purr along will result in what we have: Massive network issues from worms, Fraud, and Theft. I personally welcome id10t users as i am a tech and I make the bulk of my money from said users. I also offer classes on how to use a pc and keep your self clean. Even the minor of steps goes a very long way for windows security and safety. I use Debian as my poison of choice for workstations and fBSD for servers or high load boxes. Just my $0.02, inflation has devalued to $0.005 Doug Foskey wrote: But you must agree that it is moving from a boat that leaks like a sieve to a boat that needs an occasional bale?? I find now I get extremely frustrated at work where I must use the M$ systems: because I cannot multi task as easily as on my home system. (And I have occasionally had over 60 web pages open at once in Linux - try that on the other system!) regards Doug On Wednesday 26 October 2005 10:16, Rafal Szczesniak wrote: On Wed, Oct 26, 2005 at 04:54:01PM +1000, Doug Foskey wrote: Good reason to go Linux. It doesn't really matter. If one of your addresses is publicly available (either on a website or mailing list archives) it will be abused this way sooner or later. I use Linux and FreeBSD all the time and it happened to me too (several times). Naturally, using Windows mail readers exposes you more due to impact the mail worms and viruses have on internet these days, but just using Linux is not an ultimate solution. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
Have you tried Wine? What about VMWare and windows? Ive found that VMware helps a bunch when the client OS likes to crash alot. The base system will remain stable. I assume you never found a OSS verison of the software your needing, or that it doesnt interoperate with what others are using? Zeke Yewdall wrote: Unfortunately, there are too many specialized engineering software packages that I use every day that can only operate under windows (often they are even picky about the version of windows) for me to consider Linux. If it was just web browsing, spreadsheets, word processing, and the like, I'd get rid of windows in a heartbeat. I've already dumped IE and outlook. I want Google or Mozilla to come out with an operating system. On 10/26/05, Doug Foskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But you must agree that it is moving from a boat that leaks like a sieve to a boat that needs an occasional bale?? I find now I get extremely frustrated at work where I must use the M$ systems: because I cannot multi task as easily as on my home system. (And I have occasionally had over 60 web pages open at once in Linux - try that on the other system!) regards Doug On Wednesday 26 October 2005 10:16, Rafal Szczesniak wrote: On Wed, Oct 26, 2005 at 04:54:01PM +1000, Doug Foskey wrote: Good reason to go Linux. It doesn't really matter. If one of your addresses is publicly available (either on a website or mailing list archives) it will be abused this way sooner or later. I use Linux and FreeBSD all the time and it happened to me too (several times). Naturally, using Windows mail readers exposes you more due to impact the mail worms and viruses have on internet these days, but just using Linux is not an ultimate solution. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Scientific method- Easy Keith!
"It seems you are intent on grouping all Americans as one." Yes, It looks that way, doesn't it? So, I will explain. Usually, I try not to generalize because it leaves out a lot of information and can be manipulated to align itself with a particularagenda. However, on those occasions when I say "Americans" (my apologies to Canadians and others living on this hemisphere) or US citizens in general, I'm pointing toward a trend. The references I give below, are what I use to at least partly back up my position on those trends. Now, although theargument I give is my own, Ifind others who agree (some of them are my neighbors). "...I went to war for this country and would do it over, for the right reasons..." The fact that there are soldiers who are duty bound and fighting honorably in a war is not the reason for the arrival ofoneto three hundred thousand protesters in Washington DC on September 24th. Itis the horribly convoluted reason for war whichisso disturbing. "All I can do is try in my own way to change things for the better." The US as a whole is showing symptoms of fascism. If I, as you say, "group all Americans as one", please prove me wrong and resist the simpleperception of our culture whichhides our dark little secrets and makes hypocrites out of our government each time they go to preach democracy to another sovereign nation. Our government needs to "play nice with others" and work toward being a participant in a World community instead offurther construction of it's empire. Mike Derick Giorchino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You get not too much of an argument from me but. It seems you are intent on grouping all Americans as one. I also have more than one citizenship. But I went to war for this country and would do it over, for the right reasons, when I came to America many years ago it was the envy of the world. And I feel it still would be. If not for the government and corporate B.S. It disgusts me, but I donât include myself as part of that. All I can do is try in my own way to change things for the better. If not for me but maybe my kids and grand kids. Not that I think it will ever be as it was. But surly it could stand just a tad of improvement. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael RedlerSent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 7:35 AMTo: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSubject: Re: [Biofuel] Scientific method- Easy Keith! OK, you have my attention. Derick wrote: "Not all Americans are lazy stupid or helpless." As an American, I'd like to think that this is true. In fact, I don't thinkthat Americans aremore lazy than any other country or culture. Despite being the most obese country in the world, we find ourselves in the workplace at least as many hours as any other country in the world. Joe wrote: "This explains the typical american arrogance that drips from his rhetoric and which irritates you so well." There are expectations by Americans that other countries and cultures recognize us as somehow superior. If anyone doubts this, here is a little experiment: Take comments so commonlyheard in political speeches as well as at backyard barbecues (i.e. "We are the greatest country in the world") and apply it to Germany (for example). In fact, when an Americanpresident (especially our current president) makes a speech and it's translated into German and"The United States" is replaced with "Germany", I would argue that manyAmericans would be shocked thatANYhead of state would make such a speech. This is the American double standard which I like to call a kind of pseudo-mutuality since t! here are still a few countries who arepolitically and culturally aligned with this image. There issomething terribly wrong with our culture and it's just outside the view of most citizens. CallingAmericans"lazy" though, isinaccurate andminimizesour long list of troubles. This is what I mean by "list". You try to connect the dots. 1.) "We" have more homicides in our major cities than casualties inwar (irrespective of the circumstancesin that war). 2.) "We" have abizarre view of leadership and fairness by virtue of the fact that thepresident (irrespective of which president) is pledged allegiance even when he (not "she" -yet) takes action which adversely effects the majority of citizens. At the same time, Americans are knownfor supporting the "underdog" and down trodden - almost as if to perpetuate and preserve this demographic. 3.) "We" struggle to have a standard of K-12 education that matches that of other developed countries while placing huge emphasis on "faith" and mixed interpretations of morality. 4.) Half of the citizens in the United States do not support a document which prevented dictatorships and provided the means for citizens to prosper for the last two and a half centuries. At the same time, the same proportion of citizens don't show up to vote for (arguably) the most powerful political position in the free world.
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
On Wed, Oct 26, 2005 at 03:08:26PM -0600, Zeke Yewdall wrote: Unfortunately, there are too many specialized engineering software packages that I use every day that can only operate under windows (often they are even picky about the version of windows) for me to consider Linux. Yes, I'm in fortunate position of being a programmer and network engineer. As for now it is a great environment for people of this profession. I must agree though, engineers using CAD software (of various fields) still have a hard time when trying to switch to free unix-like systems. It just needs a bit more time, like many new things. If it was just web browsing, spreadsheets, word processing, and the like, I'd get rid of windows in a heartbeat. I've already dumped IE and outlook. Indeed. You can already switch to safer and open replacements of web browser and mail reader as well as office suite (especially with just-released OpenOffice 2.0). Isn't it great ? There's a choice finally for average user. I want Google or Mozilla to come out with an operating system. No need to. Just wait for unix desktop environments to become mature enough to be widely usable. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Scientific method- Easy Keith!
Sometimes I wonder if the rest of the world understands that all americans don't support GW and his policies though... After all, we claim to be a democracy, so therefore, shouldn't the government by nature reflect the will of it's people. In reality, only my congressional representative actualy represents me, but neither of my senators does, nor my president or vice president. I actually voted, but I effectively have almost no vote in our government. Our system is set up for rule by a very narrow majority with no effective minority voice. But if you listen to our rhetoric abroad, it's easy to forget this. Zeke On 10/26/05, Michael Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It seems you are intent on grouping all Americans as one. Yes, It looks that way, doesn't it? So, I will explain. Usually, I try not to generalize because it leaves out a lot of information and can be manipulated to align itself with a particular agenda. However, on those occasions when I say Americans (my apologies to Canadians and others living on this hemisphere) or US citizens in general, I'm pointing toward a trend. The references I give below, are what I use to at least partly back up my position on those trends. Now, although the argument I give is my own, I find others who agree (some of them are my neighbors). ...I went to war for this country and would do it over, for the right reasons... The fact that there are soldiers who are duty bound and fighting honorably in a war is not the reason for the arrival of one to three hundred thousand protesters in Washington DC on September 24th. It is the horribly convoluted reason for war which is so disturbing. All I can do is try in my own way to change things for the better. The US as a whole is showing symptoms of fascism. If I, as you say, group all Americans as one, please prove me wrong and resist the simple perception of our culture which hides our dark little secrets and makes hypocrites out of our government each time they go to preach democracy to another sovereign nation. Our government needs to play nice with others and work toward being a participant in a World community instead of further construction of it's empire. Mike Derick Giorchino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You get not too much of an argument from me but. It seems you are intent on grouping all Americans as one. I also have more than one citizenship. But I went to war for this country and would do it over, for the right reasons, when I came to America many years ago it was the envy of the world. And I feel it still would be. If not for the government and corporate B.S. It disgusts me, but I don't include myself as part of that. All I can do is try in my own way to change things for the better. If not for me but maybe my kids and grand kids. Not that I think it will ever be as it was. But surly it could stand just a tad of improvement. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael Redler Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 7:35 AM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Scientific method- Easy Keith! OK, you have my attention. Derick wrote: Not all Americans are lazy stupid or helpless. As an American, I'd like to think that this is true. In fact, I don't think that Americans are more lazy than any other country or culture. Despite being the most obese country in the world, we find ourselves in the workplace at least as many hours as any other country in the world. Joe wrote: This explains the typical american arrogance that drips from his rhetoric and which irritates you so well. There are expectations by Americans that other countries and cultures recognize us as somehow superior. If anyone doubts this, here is a little experiment: Take comments so commonly heard in political speeches as well as at backyard barbecues (i.e. We are the greatest country in the world) and apply it to Germany (for example). In fact, when an American president (especially our current president) makes a speech and it's translated into German and The United States is replaced with Germany, I would argue that many Americans would be shocked that ANY head of state would make such a speech. This is the American double standard which I like to call a kind of pseudo-mutuality since there are still a few countries who are politically and culturally aligned with this image. There is something terribly wrong with our culture and it's just outside the view of most citizens. Calling Americans lazy though, is inaccurate and minimizes our long list of troubles. This is what I mean by list. You try to connect the dots. 1.) We have more homicides in our major cities than casualties in war (irrespective of the circumstances in that war). 2.) We have a bizarre view of leadership and fairness by virtue of the fact that the president
Re: [Biofuel] Grass for fuel
having read this article, i seem to be missing some of the math... this miscanthus is a rhizome, correct? and like other rhizomes (i.e. strawberries) there is a good sized chunk of sugars and other carbon based items stored in the root/stem system, also correct? so that would imply that it STORES carbon and does not reintroduce all of it when burned, because it stays in the field as the jump start for the next growing season. am i correct in this extrapolation? --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor
There is a router speed controller in harbor freight when it on sale that is most of the time it is inexpensive and works quite well I have used it with a small high speed motor from a 110v wench that I luvjoyed to a week hydraulic pump. I found that the motor was so fast it wanted to spit out the luvjoy the speed reducer worked well to help. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ken Dunn Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2005 9:59 AM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor I had a moment of clarity and called a local electric motor repair shop. It would seem that they might have something that someone decided not to pay to bill for. It would also seem that they might be willing to move it cheap to recoup expenses. Lo and behold, they have a 1/2 hp TEFC motor with a weak low speed (1200 +- RPM) but a strong high speed (1720+- RPM). The price is good, the best I've found. Is this thing going to be total overkill for a 55 gallon stir processor, though? Take care, Ken ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor
There is a router speed controller in harbor freight when it on sale that is most of the time it is inexpensive and works quite well I have used it with a small high speed motor from a 110v wench that I luvjoyed to a week hydraulic pump. I found that the motor was so fast it wanted to spit out the luvjoy the speed reducer worked well to help. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ken Dunn Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2005 9:59 AM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor I had a moment of clarity and called a local electric motor repair shop. It would seem that they might have something that someone decided not to pay to bill for. It would also seem that they might be willing to move it cheap to recoup expenses. Lo and behold, they have a 1/2 hp TEFC motor with a weak low speed (1200 +- RPM) but a strong high speed (1720+- RPM). The price is good, the best I've found. Is this thing going to be total overkill for a 55 gallon stir processor, though? Take care, Ken ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor
Derick Giorchino wrote: snip from a 110v wench whoopee, she sounds like fun. -- Bob Allen http://ozarker.org/bob Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling ourselves - Richard Feynman ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor
On 10/26/05, Derick Giorchino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There is a router speed controller in harbor freight when it on sale that is most of the time it is inexpensive and works quite well It doesn't look like Harbor Freight is offer that item right now. I see that some other sites are offering something called a router speed controller. No issue with the motor overheating using the speed controller? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
snip If it was just web browsing, spreadsheets, word processing, and the like, I'd get rid of windows in a heartbeat. I've already dumped IE and outlook. Indeed. You can already switch to safer and open replacements of web browser and mail reader as well as office suite (especially with just-released OpenOffice 2.0). Isn't it great ? There's a choice finally for average user. This choice exists on Windows to. The core windows OS can be very stable (just needs configured correctly, not hard just takes more then a average Joe). I personally use OO 2.0, Firefox, and Thunderbird (as does my wife) over IE except in those very rare cases where a site is IE only. Avast is hands down the best Windows based AV there is and it is free (for home use) too. I want Google or Mozilla to come out with an operating system. No need to. Just wait for unix desktop environments to become mature enough to be widely usable. Define mature enough? I think its more the add on software that needs to mature more then the OS and GUI environment. One of the issues I find with OSS is there are to many options. Since there is not this one app for all monolithic force in OSS, how do you get people to try something new, even if it would work very well for them? The Linux Live CD's help alot. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor
On 10/26/05, Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Totally Enclosed Fan Cooled - TEFC. If you follow link on my original post, the pump displayed has a motor attached to looks generally like a TEFC motor. I don't know that it is though. Yes it is. More info here: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_processor10.html#pumpcap Journey to Forever 90-litre processor Keith, Care to wager on whether the pump motor could be converted for use in my stir process? Frankly, Ken, I'm not that interested in whether it could or not. Improvise, sure, go ahead, best of good luck and all, but motors are common enough aren't they? Why not just use a motor? On the other hand if you get it to work that's great. Whatever, I can't see why you think I might want to bet on it. You asked if it's TEFC, I told you it is and pointed you to some information on its pumping limits, and so? Best Keith Take care, Ken ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor
Sorry I mean winch. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of bob allen Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2005 5:54 PM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor Derick Giorchino wrote: snip from a 110v wench / winch whoopee, she sounds like fun. -- Bob Allen http://ozarker.org/bob Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling ourselves - Richard Feynman ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Measuring tools..XX.
search vwr supply, buck From: Michael Luich [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: [Biofuel] Measuring tools... Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 14:33:28 -0400 Any one have any idea's where i can go to look for measuring devices in new england. I'd rather not get beaker etc on line. I'm thinking craft stores but it hasn't worked out so well so far. Mike Luich ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ _ Donât just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Measuring tools..XX.
From: Buck Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Measuring tools..XX. Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 19:30:51 -0700 you cann do coleparmer, or vanwater and rogersss, catalongs are easy,, or search vwr supply, buck From: Michael Luich [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: [Biofuel] Measuring tools... Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 14:33:28 -0400 Any one have any idea's where i can go to look for measuring devices in new england. I'd rather not get beaker etc on line. I'm thinking craft stores but it hasn't worked out so well so far. Mike Luich ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ _ Donât just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ _ Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee¨ Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor
Keith said: Frankly, Ken, I'm not that interested in whether it could or not. Improvise, sure, go ahead, best of good luck and all, but motors are common enough aren't they? Why not just use a motor? Well, while motors are common enough buying the motor off the shelf instead of the pump will cost me atleast twice as much. On the other hand if you get it to work that's great. Whatever, I can't see why you think I might want to bet on it. You asked if it's TEFC, I told you it is and pointed you to some information on its pumping limits, and so? Absolutely! I don't want to bet on it. That's why I'm asking questions. I'm trying to raise a family and do the right things. $50 is not much on the grand scale but $50 here or there is all together different. And, as I've mentioned in the past, everything that I'm doing, I want to be able help others with. That pump at Harbor Freight is something that seems readily available at an affordable price. The TEFC motor (again, off the shelf) is not quite as affordable. I'm here to tell you, though, if I can save myself, a friend or someone else who may be following the thread 50 bucks, I'm gonna do it. In as globally friendly manner as possible, of course. I'll more than likely buy the motor that I found but, test the improvised motor taken from the pump, when I can afford it, later. Take care, Ken ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Testing for Purity of KOH
This weekend I will be attempting to use KOH instead of Lye. I got a deal on a 50 lb bag of KOH but I don't know what the purity is. I'm not sure how to titrate to determine the purity so here is what I am going to try. I'll make 3 batches, Batch 1 I will assume 99% pure and use 4.9 grams, batch 2 I will assume 92% pure and use 5.3 grams and batch 3 I will assume 85% purity and use 5.8 grams. I will be using new oil and see which batch turns out good and passes the shake test. Is this a good way to determine the purity? Any help is appreciated here. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Starting at Square One
exactly picture what you're looking at, since I replaced the waterpump and all related belts. I personally retrofitted my own bracket mount anyway, because the one that was there was WAY bigger than necessary. Also, when I bought a new belt (mine fell off sometime and no, no indicator light came on) it was the wrong one, so I went back and bought another. It wasn't right either, BUT it was exactly the right tension for the alternator in the full DOWN position, thus eliminating the tensioner adjustment on the mount. I sold it to a guy who had a 81 diesel rabbit, mine was gas, and ALMOST offered a partial trade, his motor was still churning 47 mpg. But, alas, his inspection was running out that month and the body was mostly rusted into oblivion. 81 scares me anyway, fuel lines and 175k miles of dino-d. Good story though, haha. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Testing for Purity of KOH
Rob, Is this a good way to determine the purity? It's a good way to determine a baseline for your 50# bag. For all practical intents and purposes, that's what you want. See http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make2.html#stockmeth and See http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make2.html#poor before you begin for some ideas that could help you zero things in a bit. Todd Swearingen This weekend I will be attempting to use KOH instead of Lye. I got a deal on a 50 lb bag of KOH but I don't know what the purity is. I'm not sure how to titrate to determine the purity so here is what I am going to try. I'll make 3 batches, Batch 1 I will assume 99% pure and use 4.9 grams, batch 2 I will assume 92% pure and use 5.3 grams and batch 3 I will assume 85% purity and use 5.8 grams. I will be using new oil and see which batch turns out good and passes the shake test. Is this a good way to determine the purity? Any help is appreciated here. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] lye supply
my name is now officially "people" Hi all, I cleared this with Keith, so please be advised it is NOT an ad.Our cooperative here just made arrangements for continuing, large scale NaOH delivery from a large chemical supply company. As an effort to share this with the community, we're prepared to offer it to homebrewers for $2 a pound plus shipping (and shipping is apparently about $6 most of the time). You might be able to find it cheaper locally, and if so I applaud you and please disregard this message. Shipping is the real killer. If you're interested, toss me an email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] and we'll go from there. I'm not sure yet whether it's flake or pellet, but I'll assume that it's flake since it's low-cost and bulk.If enough people are interested, we'll put up a website or something similar, maybe run it through ebay or something for security.~Thanks!~ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
Rafal, congratulations on being part of the Samba team! I am constantly amazed how many Biodiesel list members are involved with Open Source software. A comment to others on Linux: there is now a move by the major Linux developers to standardise the way that Linux is seen by programs, so the old issues of differing packages for different flavours of Linux will then be a thing of the past. The common Linux desktop is ever closer. regards Doug On Thursday 27 October 2005 9:20, Rafal Szczesniak wrote: On Wed, Oct 26, 2005 at 03:08:26PM -0600, Zeke Yewdall wrote: Unfortunately, there are too many specialized engineering software packages that I use every day that can only operate under windows (often they are even picky about the version of windows) for me to consider Linux. Yes, I'm in fortunate position of being a programmer and network engineer. As for now it is a great environment for people of this profession. I must agree though, engineers using CAD software (of various fields) still have a hard time when trying to switch to free unix-like systems. It just needs a bit more time, like many new things. If it was just web browsing, spreadsheets, word processing, and the like, I'd get rid of windows in a heartbeat. I've already dumped IE and outlook. Indeed. You can already switch to safer and open replacements of web browser and mail reader as well as office suite (especially with just-released OpenOffice 2.0). Isn't it great ? There's a choice finally for average user. I want Google or Mozilla to come out with an operating system. No need to. Just wait for unix desktop environments to become mature enough to be widely usable. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] lye supply
This sounds like an outright lye!! regards Doug On Thursday 27 October 2005 3:17, Jason and Katie wrote: my name is now officially people Hi all, I cleared this with Keith, so please be advised it is NOT an ad. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Grass for fuel
Jason and Katie wrote: having read this article, i seem to be missing some of the math... this miscanthus is a rhizome, correct? and like other rhizomes (i.e. strawberries) there is a good sized chunk of sugars and other carbon based items stored in the root/stem system, also correct? so that would imply that it STORES carbon and does not reintroduce all of it when burned, because it stays in the field as the jump start for the next growing season. am i correct in this extrapolation? It sounds that way to me and the math I wondered about is tonnage or tons compared to tonnes. The 25 ton/acre or 60 tonnes/hectare from Giant Miscanthus compared to corn grain and corn stover yields sounds pretty good if I look only at the high end of the 10-30 tons per acre dry weight each year. This makes me wonder about the dry ton yield per acre for cellulosic ethanol compared to switchgrass or corn or sugar cane. Biofuels and Agriculture A Factsheet for Farmers 4 page, 584k PDF ftp://bioenergy.ornl.gov/pub/pdfs/farmerfactsheet.pdf - A bushel of corn (56 lb or 25 kg) yields about 2.5 US gallons (9.5 liters) of ethanol - A ton (2000 lb or 980 kg) of corn stover will yield about 80-90 US gallons (300-340 liters) of ethanol, - A ton of switchgrass will yield in the range 75-100 US gallons (285-380 liters) Biofuels from Switchgrass: Greener Energy Pastures http://bioenergy.ornl.gov/papers/misc/switgrs.html Bransby's 6-year average, 11.5 tons a year, translates into about 1,150 gallons of ethanol per acre. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Electric eraser was: Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor
Greetings, Thank you so much for this idea. I do have an electric eraser and it certainly is much quieter that the drill for small test batches. I will inform Garth he needs a new rod that is the right size for his stirrer, then I can stand being home while he plays. Last night Garth titrated his first batch of used oil. Extremely well defined separation with one hour. Progress is happening. We have 2.5 fifty five gallon drums of used oil to use up, so I am hoping for real production soon. Bright Blessings, Kim At 08:43 AM 10/26/2005, you wrote: I don't know about a TEFC motor but while on the subject I thought I would throw in an idea for a really low cost stirrer I built that was too easy. It may be too light for large batches but is perfect for 30 liters or maybe more. I picked up some surplus electric pencil erasers. A 1/4 inch shaft fits perfectly where the eraser rod used to fit. Tap the end of the shaft with a 4-40 thread and put a plastic model boat prop on. I use this for mixing methoxide (stainless rod) all the time. It is a very quiet motor :-) Joe I wonder if someone could provide some assistance. Is it in fact a TEFC motor? What sort of HP are we talking about? Could I disassemble the pump and use the motor to drive my planned stir biodiesel process? ___ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] lye supply
As for:On 10/27/05, Doug Foskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This sounds like an outright lye!! regards Doug I did email keith separately several days ago to get his permission. We're not making money on this proposition, I'm just trying to share, if you're got your own supply or are afraid of ebay/paypal or w/e, then please ignore it. I guess my name on here makes it seem funny, but, you know, whatever. Again, it's no sweat off my back, we're going through the stuff in 550lb bags locally so your $4 isn't making us rich. We're working on a pretty good sized production model here, please pardon my exuberance at wanting to share. If it offends you, that was not my intention. And then for: my name is now officially people Are you saying that I should address each person individially, or that maybe you're interested? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Scientific method- Easy Keith!
Amen Mike, Amen. And please don't appologise to Canadians when you use the term American because we ARE american in both senses of that word for all intents and purposes. I was shocked and amazed when Jean Cretien (our former prime minister) decided to go with the voice of sanity and not back the US in its illegal war but asside from that and a few noises once in a while we basically toe the line and do as we are told. Just this week Condoleeza Rice told us to settle down over the softwood thing. Yeah we will Condi. It's only 5 billion dollars. Play nice eh? LOL Joe Michael Redler wrote: The US as a whole is showing symptoms of fascism. If I, as you say, "group all Americans as one", please prove me wrong and resist the simpleperception of our culture whichhides our dark little secrets and makes hypocrites out of our government each time they go to preach democracy to another sovereign nation. Our government needs to "play nice with others" and work toward being a participant in a World community instead offurther construction of it's empire. Mike Derick Giorchino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You get not too much of an argument from me but. It seems you are intent on grouping all Americans as one. I also have more than one citizenship. But I went to war for this country and would do it over, for the right reasons, when I came to America many years ago it was the envy of the world. And I feel it still would be. If not for the government and corporate B.S. It disgusts me, but I dont include myself as part of that. All I can do is try in my own way to change things for the better. If not for me but maybe my kids and grand kids. Not that I think it will ever be as it was. But surly it could stand just a tad of improvement. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Michael Redler Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 7:35 AM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Scientific method- Easy Keith! OK, you have my attention. Derick wrote: "Not all Americans are lazy stupid or helpless." As an American, I'd like to think that this is true. In fact, I don't thinkthat Americans aremore lazy than any other country or culture. Despite being the most obese country in the world, we find ourselves in the workplace at least as many hours as any other country in the world. Joe wrote: "This explains the typical american arrogance that drips from his rhetoric and which irritates you so well." There are expectations by Americans that other countries and cultures recognize us as somehow superior. If anyone doubts this, here is a little experiment: Take comments so commonlyheard in political speeches as well as at backyard barbecues (i.e. "We are the greatest country in the world") and apply it to Germany (for example). In fact, when an Americanpresident (especially our current president) makes a speech and it's translated into German and"The United States" is replaced with "Germany", I would argue that manyAmericans would be shocked thatANYhead of state would make such a speech. This is the American double standard which I like to call a kind of pseudo-mutuality since there are still a few countries who arepolitically and culturally aligned with this image. There issomething terribly wrong with our culture and it's just outside the view of most citizens. CallingAmericans"lazy" though, isinaccurate andminimizesour long list of troubles. This is what I mean by "list". You try to connect the dots. 1.) "We" have more homicides in our major cities than casualties inwar (irrespective of the circumstancesin that war). 2.) "We" have abizarre view of leadership and fairness by virtue of the fact that thepresident (irrespective of which president) is pledged allegiance even when he (not "she" -yet) takes action which adversely effects the majority of citizens. At the same time, Americans are knownfor supporting the "underdog" and down trodden - almost as if to perpetuate and preserve this demographic. 3.) "We" struggle to have a standard of K-12 education that matches that of other developed countries while placing huge emphasis on "faith" and mixed interpretations of morality. 4.) Half of the citizens in the United States do not support a document which prevented dictatorships and provided the means for citizens to prosper for the last two and a half centuries. At the same time, the same proportion of citizens don't show up to vote for (arguably) the most powerful political position in the free world.
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
Keep asking for Linux version when you talk to your rep. I do with my clients on Camworks and so on. LSB is a step in the right direction. Now, who wants to leap into the Debian Geetoo Progeny roll your own question! Doug Foskey wrote: Rafal, congratulations on being part of the Samba team! I am constantly amazed how many Biodiesel list members are involved with Open Source software. A comment to others on Linux: there is now a move by the major Linux developers to standardise the way that Linux is seen by programs, so the old issues of differing packages for different flavours of Linux will then be a thing of the past. The common Linux desktop is ever closer. regards Doug On Thursday 27 October 2005 9:20, Rafal Szczesniak wrote: On Wed, Oct 26, 2005 at 03:08:26PM -0600, Zeke Yewdall wrote: Unfortunately, there are too many specialized engineering software packages that I use every day that can only operate under windows (often they are even picky about the version of windows) for me to consider Linux. Yes, I'm in fortunate position of being a programmer and network engineer. As for now it is a great environment for people of this profession. I must agree though, engineers using CAD software (of various fields) still have a hard time when trying to switch to free unix-like systems. It just needs a bit more time, like many new things. If it was just web browsing, spreadsheets, word processing, and the like, I'd get rid of windows in a heartbeat. I've already dumped IE and outlook. Indeed. You can already switch to safer and open replacements of web browser and mail reader as well as office suite (especially with just-released OpenOffice 2.0). Isn't it great ? There's a choice finally for average user. I want Google or Mozilla to come out with an operating system. No need to. Just wait for unix desktop environments to become mature enough to be widely usable. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] People of the lye
Dear People, where are you? I am always looking for new lyes; I am tired of the old ones. Mike W Jason and Katie wrote: my name is now officially people Hi all, I cleared this with Keith, so please be advised it is NOT an ad. Our cooperative here just made arrangements for continuing, large scale NaOH delivery from a large chemical supply company. As an effort to share this with the community, we're prepared to offer it to homebrewers for $2 a pound plus shipping (and shipping is apparently about $6 most of the time). You might be able to find it cheaper locally, and if so I applaud you and please disregard this message. Shipping is the real killer. If you're interested, toss me an email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] and we'll go from there. I'm not sure yet whether it's flake or pellet, but I'll assume that it's flake since it's low-cost and bulk. If enough people are interested, we'll put up a website or something similar, maybe run it through ebay or something for security. ~Thanks!~ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Oil and democracy -was-Scientific method
Well time for a new thread I guess cause we are a long way off topic. I think you are right Zeke it's hard not to draw certain conclusions about the people who put these monsters in office. The problem is it's like going shopping. You think you have choice but then you find out your money goes to the same people at the top regardless of the choices you thought you made. The real problem is that the american lifestyle is not negotiable. How many here would willingly give up a bunch of affluence and convenience so that things might be a little more even in the world? Most of them are too busy trying to catch the carrot on a stick. Even when the government gives aid don't the farmers and shipping companies expect to be paid handsomley in the deal? So what really is the will of it's people that the government should reflect? Or is it really already doing that but in a way that upsets people but is really the only way left to maintain it? The oil is necessary to maintain the american lifestyle. Control of world economy is ideal to this plan even if it means doing dirty things that aren't right. People are told they have democracy and they believe it but as you said voting once every four years is hardly democratic. Representative governance works for the rich and hopefully they can take everyone along for the ride (because they need them). Boy they must have some real belly laughs in private when they think about the common man and the illusion of freedom and democracy. I wonder what things would look like if we had a real democratic system. If every important decision was put to a vote, sure it would slow things down but hell a lot of people I talk to seem to think things are 'progressing' -and I hate to use that term, too quickly anyways. Surely electronic voting could make a system of national (and god forbid should I be so bold as to suggestinternational) referendum possible. I know that only a tiny fraction of the world is on the web in terms of it's population but that does not mean that people could not have acces to a voting terminal. That must be a very scary thought. Joe Zeke Yewdall wrote: Sometimes I wonder if the rest of the world understands that all americans don't support GW and his policies though... After all, we claim to be a democracy, so therefore, shouldn't the government by nature reflect the will of it's people. In reality, only my congressional representative actualy represents me, but neither of my senators does, nor my president or vice president. I actually voted, but I effectively have almost no vote in our government. Our system is set up for rule by a very narrow majority with no effective minority voice. But if you listen to our rhetoric abroad, it's easy to forget this. Zeke On 10/26/05, Michael Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: "It seems you are intent on grouping all Americans as one." Yes, It looks that way, doesn't it? So, I will explain. Usually, I try not to generalize because it leaves out a lot of information and can be manipulated to align itself with a particular agenda. However, on those occasions when I say "Americans" (my apologies to Canadians and others living on this hemisphere) or US citizens in general, I'm pointing toward a trend. The references I give below, are what I use to at least partly back up my position on those trends. Now, although the argument I give is my own, I find others who agree (some of them are my neighbors). "...I went to war for this country and would do it over, for the right reasons..." The fact that there are soldiers who are duty bound and fighting honorably in a war is not the reason for the arrival of one to three hundred thousand protesters in Washington DC on September 24th. It is the horribly convoluted reason for war which is so disturbing. "All I can do is try in my own way to change things for the better." The US as a whole is showing symptoms of fascism. If I, as you say, "group all Americans as one", please prove me wrong and resist the simple perception of our culture which hides our dark little secrets and makes hypocrites out of our government each time they go to preach democracy to another sovereign nation. Our government needs to "play nice with others" and work toward being a participant in a World community instead of further construction of it's empire. Mike Derick Giorchino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You get not too much of an argument from me but. It seems you are intent on grouping all Americans as one. I also have more than one citizenship. But I went to war for this country and would do it over, for the right reasons, when I came to America many years ago it was the envy of the world. And I feel it still would be. If not for the government and corporate B.S. It disgusts me, but I don't include myself as part of that. All I can do is try in my own way to change things for the better. If not for me but maybe my kids and grand kids. Not that I think it will
Re: [Biofuel] Starting at Square One
Twicky Wabbit As I recall, those things bear a good cooling system flush frequently aw well... Ed Hall wrote: Food for thought. I have a '79 Rabbit. I recently put in an ammeter mostly out of curiosity and because I had one lay'n around. The bolts that hold the alternator bracket to the block broke off one night (non-spec bolts + cyclic fatigue over time). The alternator is the belt tensioner for the water pump. By losing the tension in the belt, the water pump stopped pumping. Over heating is the weak link in the otherwise amazing VW diesel engine. Fortunately the ammeter indicated something was up, I pulled over to have a look and was surprised to find my alternator dangling. The idiot light never came on to indicate that the alternator was no longer alternatoring. I could have easily cooked my motor that night. Macgyver trick: the rubber gasket in the lid of a 5 gallon bucket is a great emergency fan belt. I doubled one up and ran it around the main pulley and water pump pulley. I found one in a nearby dumpster. Once again, I found my salvation in the bottom of a dumpser. Happy motoring! From: Kurt Nolte [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Starting at Square One Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 17:33:51 -0400 From the picture the engine looks the same, but could be the same design and smaller displacement I suppose. The non-working temperature guage is concerning, because overheating a diesel with an aluminum head and cast iron block usually means putting a new head gasket in it -- as least in the VW diesels. But that's pretty easy to add a new temperature guage. Zeke Yeah, if I do end up getting it, I have a whole suite of gauges and meters that are going in it. Head temp, Oil temp, Voltmeter, Ammeter (Iffy about putting this one in, unnecessary work.), stuff of that nature; I've been scrounging up meters for a while now. If it doesn't have a tach I'll see what I can do to pick a tasteful one up, instead of those gaudy racer style tachos. Still flirting with the idea, guess I should my act together and make a decision, eh? -Kurt ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Oil and democracy -was-Scientific method
What if we had a voting sytem like American Idol, where people can text message their votes every night Sort of scary. But is it scarier to think of a democracy where the average person could vote on each issue, or one where as many people follow TV shows as care about their actual government On 10/27/05, Joe Street [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well time for a new thread I guess cause we are a long way off topic. I think you are right Zeke it's hard not to draw certain conclusions about the people who put these monsters in office. The problem is it's like going shopping. You think you have choice but then you find out your money goes to the same people at the top regardless of the choices you thought you made. The real problem is that the american lifestyle is not negotiable. How many here would willingly give up a bunch of affluence and convenience so that things might be a little more even in the world? Most of them are too busy trying to catch the carrot on a stick. Even when the government gives aid don't the farmers and shipping companies expect to be paid handsomley in the deal? So what really is the will of it's people that the government should reflect? Or is it really already doing that but in a way that upsets people but is really the only way left to maintain it? The oil is necessary to maintain the american lifestyle. Control of world economy is ideal to this plan even if it means doing dirty things that aren't right. People are told they have democracy and they believe it but as you said voting once every four years is hardly democratic. Representative governance works for the rich and hopefully they can take everyone along for the ride (because they need them). Boy they must have some real belly laughs in private when they think about the common man and the illusion of freedom and democracy. I wonder what things would look like if we had a real democratic system. If every important decision was put to a vote, sure it would slow things down but hell a lot of people I talk to seem to think things are 'progressing' -and I hate to use that term, too quickly anyways. Surely electronic voting could make a system of national (and god forbid should I be so bold as to suggestinternational) referendum possible. I know that only a tiny fraction of the world is on the web in terms of it's population but that does not mean that people could not have acces to a voting terminal. That must be a very scary thought. Joe Zeke Yewdall wrote: Sometimes I wonder if the rest of the world understands that all americans don't support GW and his policies though... After all, we claim to be a democracy, so therefore, shouldn't the government by nature reflect the will of it's people. In reality, only my congressional representative actualy represents me, but neither of my senators does, nor my president or vice president. I actually voted, but I effectively have almost no vote in our government. Our system is set up for rule by a very narrow majority with no effective minority voice. But if you listen to our rhetoric abroad, it's easy to forget this. Zeke On 10/26/05, Michael Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It seems you are intent on grouping all Americans as one. Yes, It looks that way, doesn't it? So, I will explain. Usually, I try not to generalize because it leaves out a lot of information and can be manipulated to align itself with a particular agenda. However, on those occasions when I say Americans (my apologies to Canadians and others living on this hemisphere) or US citizens in general, I'm pointing toward a trend. The references I give below, are what I use to at least partly back up my position on those trends. Now, although the argument I give is my own, I find others who agree (some of them are my neighbors). ...I went to war for this country and would do it over, for the right reasons... The fact that there are soldiers who are duty bound and fighting honorably in a war is not the reason for the arrival of one to three hundred thousand protesters in Washington DC on September 24th. It is the horribly convoluted reason for war which is so disturbing. All I can do is try in my own way to change things for the better. The US as a whole is showing symptoms of fascism. If I, as you say, group all Americans as one, please prove me wrong and resist the simple perception of our culture which hides our dark little secrets and makes hypocrites out of our government each time they go to preach democracy to another sovereign nation. Our government needs to play nice with others and work toward being a participant in a World community instead of further construction of it's empire. Mike Derick Giorchino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You get not too much of an argument from me but. It seems you are intent on grouping all Americans as one. I also have more than one citizenship. But I went
Re: [Biofuel] Starting at Square One
Ah.. My '91 rabbit isn't even running yet. Currently the car's in the driveway, and the rebuilt engine's on the garage floor... But with luck, it'll be up and running on waste veggie oil in a few more weeks, or months (3 months and counting so far) On 10/27/05, Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Twicky Wabbit As I recall, those things bear a good cooling system flush frequently aw well... Ed Hall wrote: Food for thought. I have a '79 Rabbit. I recently put in an ammeter mostly out of curiosity and because I had one lay'n around. The bolts that hold the alternator bracket to the block broke off one night (non-spec bolts + cyclic fatigue over time). The alternator is the belt tensioner for the water pump. By losing the tension in the belt, the water pump stopped pumping. Over heating is the weak link in the otherwise amazing VW diesel engine. Fortunately the ammeter indicated something was up, I pulled over to have a look and was surprised to find my alternator dangling. The idiot light never came on to indicate that the alternator was no longer alternatoring. I could have easily cooked my motor that night. Macgyver trick: the rubber gasket in the lid of a 5 gallon bucket is a great emergency fan belt. I doubled one up and ran it around the main pulley and water pump pulley. I found one in a nearby dumpster. Once again, I found my salvation in the bottom of a dumpser. Happy motoring! From: Kurt Nolte [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Starting at Square One Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 17:33:51 -0400 From the picture the engine looks the same, but could be the same design and smaller displacement I suppose. The non-working temperature guage is concerning, because overheating a diesel with an aluminum head and cast iron block usually means putting a new head gasket in it -- as least in the VW diesels. But that's pretty easy to add a new temperature guage. Zeke Yeah, if I do end up getting it, I have a whole suite of gauges and meters that are going in it. Head temp, Oil temp, Voltmeter, Ammeter (Iffy about putting this one in, unnecessary work.), stuff of that nature; I've been scrounging up meters for a while now. If it doesn't have a tach I'll see what I can do to pick a tasteful one up, instead of those gaudy racer style tachos. Still flirting with the idea, guess I should my act together and make a decision, eh? -Kurt ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Democracy
viz straight represetative democracy - be careful what you wish for. If Saudi Arabia had a pure representational system they'd wind up with a far more radical Wahab state. Look at California's referendum system - it's out of control. It's created an ungovernable state. Looks at Arizona's you pay no school taxes if you're over a certain age measure. Great - I got my free education the hell with you. Just keep paying my social security. Presumably we elect leaders to make decision in the best interest of the governed. I don't know that the founders ever expected the voters to be so apathetic and so easily fooled. And no, I don't think ANY of my neighbors would give up ANYTHING so that others might have a bit more. In fact, I'm amazed at the lengths they will go to to try to make me comply with their notion of what's proper. No woodstoves No older cars (yes, it looks fine, it's just an '89) Quotes: That garden really looks out of place - you're not going to do that every year, are you? Yes, I am. I wish you'd get rid of that woodpile, and it's noisy when you split wood. Awww the list goes on... Zeke Yewdall wrote: What if we had a voting sytem like American Idol, where people can text message their votes every night Sort of scary. But is it scarier to think of a democracy where the average person could vote on each issue, or one where as many people follow TV shows as care about their actual government On 10/27/05, Joe Street [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well time for a new thread I guess cause we are a long way off topic. I think you are right Zeke it's hard not to draw certain conclusions about the people who put these monsters in office. The problem is it's like going shopping. You think you have choice but then you find out your money goes to the same people at the top regardless of the choices you thought you made. The real problem is that the american lifestyle is not negotiable. How many here would willingly give up a bunch of affluence and convenience so that things might be a little more even in the world? Most of them are too busy trying to catch the carrot on a stick. Even when the government gives aid don't the farmers and shipping companies expect to be paid handsomley in the deal? So what really is the will of it's people that the government should reflect? Or is it really already doing that but in a way that upsets people but is really the only way left to maintain it? The oil is necessary to maintain the american lifestyle. Control of world economy is ideal to this plan even if it means doing dirty things that aren't right. People are told they have democracy and they believe it but as you said voting once every four years is hardly democratic. Representative governance works for the rich and hopefully they can take everyone along for the ride (because they need them). Boy they must have some real belly laughs in private when they think about the common man and the illusion of freedom and democracy. I wonder what things would look like if we had a real democratic system. If every important decision was put to a vote, sure it would slow things down but hell a lot of people I talk to seem to think things are 'progressing' -and I hate to use that term, too quickly anyways. Surely electronic voting could make a system of national (and god forbid should I be so bold as to suggestinternational) referendum possible. I know that only a tiny fraction of the world is on the web in terms of it's population but that does not mean that people could not have acces to a voting terminal. That must be a very scary thought. Joe Zeke Yewdall wrote: Sometimes I wonder if the rest of the world understands that all americans don't support GW and his policies though... After all, we claim to be a democracy, so therefore, shouldn't the government by nature reflect the will of it's people. In reality, only my congressional representative actualy represents me, but neither of my senators does, nor my president or vice president. I actually voted, but I effectively have almost no vote in our government. Our system is set up for rule by a very narrow majority with no effective minority voice. But if you listen to our rhetoric abroad, it's easy to forget this. Zeke On 10/26/05, Michael Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It seems you are intent on grouping all Americans as one. Yes, It looks that way, doesn't it? So, I will explain. Usually, I try not to generalize because it leaves out a lot of information and can be manipulated to align itself with a particular agenda. However, on those occasions when I say Americans (my apologies to Canadians and others living on this hemisphere) or US citizens in general, I'm pointing toward a trend. The references I give below, are what I use to at least partly back up my position on those trends. Now, although the argument I give is my own, I find others who agree (some of them are my neighbors). ...I went
Re: [Biofuel] Oil and democracy -was-Scientific method
It would still favor the richer people, unless the poor were well organized and voted in blocks. The minority has protections in the Constitution. The representative Republic we have in the US was setup by rich landowners for rich landowners and it hasn't changed that terribly much since then. I could see national referendums on certain issues being a good thing and might increase voter interest and turnout overall. I think we need to get rid of the electoral college as far as Presidential elections go...1 person does not equal 1 vote...The last 2 elections would have probably gone the other way if it were simple majority. I think the concerns over time zones and the like could be worked out and we might have more than 2 twin parties. On 10/27/05, Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What if we had a voting sytem like American Idol, where people cantext message their votes every nightSort of scary.But is itscarier to think of a democracy where the average person could vote oneach issue, or one where as many people follow TV shows as care about their actual government-- Thanks,PCHe's the kind of a guy who lights up a room just by flicking a switchHistory teaches us that men and nations behave wisely once they have exhausted all other alternatives. - Abba Eban ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Oil and democracy -was-Scientific method
Zeke; A democratic system modelled after a TV show. That is just perfect. Why not? (shakes head sadly) TV is the basis for everything almost it seems. Well as long as a large percentage of people vote it might be good. (I invite criticizm here please) The larger the voting population the better. There is always the risk of some madness being sustained at a local level. For example if this idea were enacted in the last century at the state level chances are that the southern states would never have abolished slavery, but if it happened at a national level the laws may have come even sooner. As long as we are using TV as our model it would also be good if there was a prime time slot devoted to some kind of federally funded open platform where people could put forth thier ideas or give information that does not pass the traditional media filters. The internet is great for this but unfortunately it requires that people go looking for alternative information. Ironically it's just the kind of people who don't go looking for the truth that hold sway in these farce elections it seems, and the type who do are not sufficient in numbers to make much of a difference. All those who didn't vote for Bush for example. All those who were against the war crime of invading Iraq for example. Of course the downfall of that idea is the inevitable censorship that would be required to keep that form of media within certain bounds of tastefulness. Certain bastions of power and wealth would no doubt still try to sway the masses. This has always been the case, but I like to believe that americans are smart enough to choose wisely if they are well informed ( even though I berate my fellow man often for seeming to be just the opposite , I believe it is just because we are so well DISinformed which is totally forgiveable). Joe Zeke Yewdall wrote: What if we had a voting sytem like American Idol, where people can text message their votes every night Sort of scary. But is it scarier to think of a democracy where the average person could vote on each issue, or one where as many people follow TV shows as care about their actual government On 10/27/05, Joe Street [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well time for a new thread I guess cause we are a long way off topic. I think you are right Zeke it's hard not to draw certain conclusions about the people who put these monsters in office. The problem is it's like going shopping. You think you have choice but then you find out your money goes to the same people at the top regardless of the choices you thought you made. The real problem is that the american lifestyle is not negotiable. How many here would willingly give up a bunch of affluence and convenience so that things might be a little more even in the world? Most of them are too busy trying to catch the carrot on a stick. Even when the government gives aid don't the farmers and shipping companies expect to be paid handsomley in the deal? So what really is the will of it's people that the government should reflect? Or is it really already doing that but in a way that upsets people but is really the only way left to maintain it? The oil is necessary to maintain the american lifestyle. Control of world economy is ideal to this plan even if it means doing dirty things that aren't right. People are told they have democracy and they believe it but as you said voting once every four years is hardly democratic. Representative governance works for the rich and hopefully they can take everyone along for the ride (because they need them). Boy they must have some real belly laughs in private when they think about the common man and the illusion of freedom and democracy. I wonder what things would look like if we had a real democratic system. If every important decision was put to a vote, sure it would slow things down but hell a lot of people I talk to seem to think things are 'progressing' -and I hate to use that term, too quickly anyways. Surely electronic voting could make a system of national (and god forbid should I be so bold as to suggestinternational) referendum possible. I know that only a tiny fraction of the world is on the web in terms of it's population but that does not mean that people could not have acces to a voting terminal. That must be a very scary thought. Joe Zeke Yewdall wrote: Sometimes I wonder if the rest of the world understands that all americans don't support GW and his policies though... After all, we claim to be a democracy, so therefore, shouldn't the government by nature reflect the will of it's people. In reality, only my congressional representative actualy represents me, but neither of my senators does, nor my president or vice president. I actually voted, but I effectively have almost no vote in our government. Our system is set up for rule by a very narrow majority with no effective minority voice. But if you listen to our rhetoric abroad, it's easy to forget this.
Re: [Biofuel] Democracy
Mike Weaver wrote: viz straight represetative democracy - be careful what you wish for. If Saudi Arabia had a pure representational system they'd wind up with a far more radical Wahab state. Look at California's referendum system - it's out of control. It's created an ungovernable state. Looks at Arizona's you pay no school taxes if you're over a certain age measure. Great - I got my free education the hell with you. Just keep paying my social security. Yes because it was referendum taken at too local a level. The more you shrink the voting pool the more radical and crazy it becomes. The more you broaden it the more even (and slow) it becomes. Presumably we elect leaders to make decision in the best interest of the governed. I don't know that the founders ever expected the voters to be so apathetic and so easily fooled. A dangerous and foolishly naive presumption it has turned out to be don't you think? Aren't we all dumb for letting the charade go on! Joe ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Oil and democracy -was-Scientific method
Paul S Cantrell wrote: It'd be the best reality TV show yet! American Idol: The West Wing...Yes, Very Scary! It would still favor the richer people, unless the poor were well organized and voted in blocks. The minority has protections in the Constitution. The representative Republic we have in the US was setup by rich landowners for rich landowners and it hasn't changed that terribly much since then. But the poor and mid class are the MAJORITY. A lot of people don't vote because they are apathetic and feel that things are out of thier hands. They don't like it but feel that there is nothing they can do about it. If didn't have that assumption and felt empowered they would have the voice and collectively would change a lot of things. I could see national referendums on certain issues being a good thing and might increase voter interest and turnout overall. Yes and there would still be international problems but it would be a start. Perhaps an international system could be worked out. Maybe that was the notion that the united nations was supposed to serve?? Way back when the world was united against a fascist?? Joe ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Democracy
An interesting case in point is the small town that I'm moving to. Back in the 70's they set up their own participatory democracy (not a representative democracy), and basically succeeded from county control. They have their own building department, water board, etc. Only 60 some people live there full time. However now, 30 years later, the biggest problem they have is apathy. They can't even get 15% of the town to regularly show up for community meetings, which is where they're supposed to decide stuff. On 10/27/05, Joe Street [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mike Weaver wrote: viz straight represetative democracy - be careful what you wish for. If Saudi Arabia had a pure representational system they'd wind up with a far more radical Wahab state. Look at California's referendum system - it's out of control. It's created an ungovernable state. Looks at Arizona's you pay no school taxes if you're over a certain age measure. Great - I got my free education the hell with you. Just keep paying my social security. Yes because it was referendum taken at too local a level. The more you shrink the voting pool the more radical and crazy it becomes. The more you broaden it the more even (and slow) it becomes. Presumably we elect leaders to make decision in the best interest of the governed. I don't know that the founders ever expected the voters to be so apathetic and so easily fooled. A dangerous and foolishly naive presumption it has turned out to be don't you think? Aren't we all dumb for letting the charade go on! Joe ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Democracy
viz straight represetative democracy - be careful what you wish for. If Saudi Arabia had a pure representational system they'd wind up with a far more radical Wahab state. Well, that would not be so good for the US I agree. But are you saying that a dictatorship is better than a democracy, if the majority of the people don't agree with us? That is exactly what Muslims have learned: democracy means will of the people, as long as that will isn't to become a religious state. Back in Algeria in the 60's, and continuing on till today. I've talked to a number of arabs who hate the US and Europe promoting democracy, because they know that we don't really mean it. Perhaps why the wahabists enjoy such support in Saudi Arabia now? Besides, the religious fundamentalists are succeeding in taking power just as well here as in the middle east. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Oil and democracy -was-Scientific method
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Paul S Cantrell wrote: The last 2 elections would have probably gone the other way if it were simple majority. I think the concerns over time zones and the like could be worked out and we might have more than 2 twin parties. Personally, I think some simple changes would fix a lot of what is currently borked in the US political system. Debates for instance, pretty much all public debating (meaning televised) is done of, by and for the Twin Partys. This should cease immediately. This much of the system process would be well served by true open debate, including by design third or fringe party candidates. I think this alone would be easy to handle under law. I think it could make a huge difference. I concurr that the electoral college system is also borked, however, the simple majority system is also deeply flawed. Folks try to look at things as if there were red and blue states (because it's the state vote that counts). But it isn't red and blue states, it's urban vs rural. http://brianhayes.com/2005/09/red-blue-rural-urban.html in a popular election, the urbanites would win outright. Policy would be set by those living furthest from the elemental necessities of existance. blah blah blah. The Twin Party system is very much a very real problem. imho, the democrats have nothing to offer, they (at the top tiers) represent a life that I know little of. The republicans have nothing to offer, they (at the top tiers) represent a power structure that has no grasp on what the philosophic common man has to face in day to day life, AT ALL. The Libertarians (with a capitol L) have become the party of I've got mine, and whatever I do to keep it is okay, you don't matter, at all. America, the US, is hardly a united states at all. It is a chain (as it's nicely worded in the Urban Archipelago) of islands. I'm just old enough to have spent a few formative years hitchhiking around America, in some ways too many years, in other ways, not enough. But in those days people still hitchhiked, and still met all kinds of folks. Now, no one hitchhikes, but everyone jabbers on cellphones, ignoring the person standing next to them in line. blah blah blah. - -- -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFDYP1G0STXFHxUucwRApFMAJ4i11uS058qyaEC4DdE59Q515LjigCgjZ/6 EmYs/BO+956ZBq/jAivzsfA= =YGb/ -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] lye supply
Include me in the interested group. Bobby Clark From: Evergreen Solutions [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: [Biofuel] lye supply Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 13:53:27 -0400 Hi all, I cleared this with Keith, so please be advised it is NOT an ad. Our cooperative here just made arrangements for continuing, large scale NaOH delivery from a large chemical supply company. As an effort to share this with the community, we're prepared to offer it to homebrewers for $2 a pound plus shipping (and shipping is apparently about $6 most of the time). You might be able to find it cheaper locally, and if so I applaud you and please disregard this message. Shipping is the real killer. If you're interested, toss me an email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] and we'll go from there. I'm not sure yet whether it's flake or pellet, but I'll assume that it's flake since it's low-cost and bulk. If enough people are interested, we'll put up a website or something similar, maybe run it through ebay or something for security. ~Thanks!~ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Oil and democracy -was-Scientific method
Personally, I think some simple changes would fix a lot of whatis currently borked in the US political system. Debates forinstance, pretty much all public debating (meaning televised)is done of, by and for the Twin Partys. This should cease immediately. This much of the system process would bewell served by true open debate, including by designthird or fringe party candidates. I think this alonewould be easy to handle under law. I think it could make a huge difference. I agree completely...They refused to let Nader in the debates which I think would have further shown how similar the twin parties are...Both parties have become conglomerations of extremists and moderates that better approximate 4 or 5 parties that caucus together. I concurr that the electoral college system is alsoborked, however, the simple majority system is also deeply flawed.Folks try to look at things as if there were redand blue states (because it's the state votethat counts). But it isn't red and blue states,it's urban vs rural. http://brianhayes.com/2005/09/red-blue-rural-urban.htmlin a popular election, the urbanites wouldwin outright. Policy would be set by those living furthest from the elemental necessitiesof existance. This is very interesting...http://www.urbanarchipelago.com is...ummm...interesting, too, but divisive...My question is, realistically, if we do away withe electoral college, won't more of these urbanites realize that their votes count and go out and actually vote? Like here in South Carolina, many non-republicans stay home because they feel their vote doesn't count because SC is a red state blah blah blah. The Twin Party system is verymuch a very real problem. imho, the democrats have nothing to offer, they (at the toptiers) represent a life that I know littleof. The republicans have nothing to offer,they (at the top tiers) represent a powerstructure that has no grasp on what the philosophic common man has to face inday to day life, AT ALL. The Libertarians(with a capitol L) have become the partyof I've got mine, and whatever I do tokeep it is okay, you don't matter, at all. America, the US, is hardly a united statesat all. It is a chain (as it's nicely worded inthe Urban Archipelago) of islands.I'm just old enough to have spent a few formativeyears hitchhiking around America, in some ways too many years, in other ways, not enough. Butin those days people still hitchhiked, and stillmet all kinds of folks. Now, no one hitchhikes,but everyone jabbers on cellphones, ignoring the person standing next to them in line.blah blah blah. I'm jealous of your opportunity to do so...Things really changed in the '80's didn't they? I like your use of the word 'borked'...I may have to use that...Maybe 'Miers' will come to mean bleeding incompetence and cronyism?-- Thanks,PCHe's the kind of a guy who lights up a room just by flicking a switchHistory teaches us that men and nations behave wisely once they have exhausted all other alternatives. - Abba Eban ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Oil and democracy -was-Scientific method
What debates? No one debates. The moderator pitches one question, which is ignored, and the candidates answers another in general platitudes. There is no debate. Paul S Cantrell wrote: Chip, On 10/27/05, *Chip Mefford* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Personally, I think some simple changes would fix a lot of what is currently borked in the US political system. Debates for instance, pretty much all public debating (meaning televised) is done of, by and for the Twin Partys. This should cease immediately. This much of the system process would be well served by true open debate, including by design third or fringe party candidates. I think this alone would be easy to handle under law. I think it could make a huge difference. I agree completely...They refused to let Nader in the debates which I think would have further shown how similar the twin parties are...Both parties have become conglomerations of extremists and moderates that better approximate 4 or 5 parties that caucus together. I concurr that the electoral college system is also borked, however, the simple majority system is also deeply flawed. Folks try to look at things as if there were red and blue states (because it's the state vote that counts). But it isn't red and blue states, it's urban vs rural. http://brianhayes.com/2005/09/red-blue-rural-urban.html in a popular election, the urbanites would win outright. Policy would be set by those living furthest from the elemental necessities of existance. This is very interesting...http://www.urbanarchipelago.com is...ummm...interesting, too, but divisive...My question is, realistically, if we do away withe electoral college, won't more of these urbanites realize that their votes count and go out and actually vote? Like here in South Carolina, many non-republicans stay home because they feel their vote doesn't count because SC is a red state blah blah blah. The Twin Party system is very much a very real problem. imho, the democrats have nothing to offer, they (at the top tiers) represent a life that I know little of. The republicans have nothing to offer, they (at the top tiers) represent a power structure that has no grasp on what the philosophic common man has to face in day to day life, AT ALL. The Libertarians (with a capitol L) have become the party of I've got mine, and whatever I do to keep it is okay, you don't matter, at all. America, the US, is hardly a united states at all. It is a chain (as it's nicely worded in the Urban Archipelago) of islands. I'm just old enough to have spent a few formative years hitchhiking around America, in some ways too many years, in other ways, not enough. But in those days people still hitchhiked, and still met all kinds of folks. Now, no one hitchhikes, but everyone jabbers on cellphones, ignoring the person standing next to them in line. blah blah blah. I'm jealous of your opportunity to do so...Things really changed in the '80's didn't they? I like your use of the word 'borked'...I may have to use that...Maybe 'Miers' will come to mean bleeding incompetence and cronyism? -- Thanks, PC He's the kind of a guy who lights up a room just by flicking a switch History teaches us that men and nations behave wisely once they have exhausted all other alternatives. - Abba Eban ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor
Hi Ken Keith said: Frankly, Ken, I'm not that interested in whether it could or not. Improvise, sure, go ahead, best of good luck and all, but motors are common enough aren't they? Why not just use a motor? Well, while motors are common enough buying the motor off the shelf instead of the pump will cost me atleast twice as much. I think free motors should be common enough too, lots of things you can salvage a motor from, some might be TEFC. What gets junked that uses TEFC motors but it's not usually the motor failing that gets it junked? On the other hand if you get it to work that's great. Whatever, I can't see why you think I might want to bet on it. You asked if it's TEFC, I told you it is and pointed you to some information on its pumping limits, and so? Absolutely! I don't want to bet on it. That's why I'm asking questions. I'm trying to raise a family and do the right things. $50 is not much on the grand scale but $50 here or there is all together different. And, as I've mentioned in the past, everything that I'm doing, I want to be able help others with. That pump at Harbor Freight is something that seems readily available at an affordable price. The TEFC motor (again, off the shelf) is not quite as affordable. I'm here to tell you, though, if I can save myself, a friend or someone else who may be following the thread 50 bucks, I'm gonna do it. In as globally friendly manner as possible, of course. Absolutely to you too, and strength to yer arm withal. I didn't want to put on one side or the other on whether it'll work or not. I'll more than likely buy the motor that I found but, test the improvised motor taken from the pump, when I can afford it, later. Take care, Ken And you, good luck Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Oil and democracy -was-Scientific method
What if we had a voting sytem like American Idol, where people can text message their votes every night Sort of scary. But is it scarier to think of a democracy where the average person could vote on each issue, Lots of arguments about that in the past. Typical American answer: There is no way I will ever support Mob Rule, over Rule of Law. Short and Simple answer. Others disagreed, including other Americans IIRC. Everybody likes short and simple answers, trouble is things aren't any more simple than they are, which often isn't. Why not start a KISS Party? I bet you'd get rich anyway, LOL! Here's one thread (whole thread linked at the end of the page): http://snipurl.com/j5lt [biofuel] Direct Democracy Best Keith or one where as many people follow TV shows as care about their actual government On 10/27/05, Joe Street [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well time for a new thread I guess cause we are a long way off topic. I think you are right Zeke it's hard not to draw certain conclusions about the people who put these monsters in office. The problem is it's like going shopping. You think you have choice but then you find out your money goes to the same people at the top regardless of the choices you thought you made. The real problem is that the american lifestyle is not negotiable. How many here would willingly give up a bunch of affluence and convenience so that things might be a little more even in the world? Most of them are too busy trying to catch the carrot on a stick. Even when the government gives aid don't the farmers and shipping companies expect to be paid handsomley in the deal? So what really is the will of it's people that the government should reflect? Or is it really already doing that but in a way that upsets people but is really the only way left to maintain it? The oil is necessary to maintain the american lifestyle. Control of world economy is ideal to this plan even if it means doing dirty things that aren't right. People are told they have democracy and they believe it but as you said voting once every four years is hardly democratic. Representative governance works for the rich and hopefully they can take everyone along for the ride (because they need them). Boy they must have some real belly laughs in private when they think about the common man and the illusion of freedom and democracy. I wonder what things would look like if we had a real democratic system. If every important decision was put to a vote, sure it would slow things down but hell a lot of people I talk to seem to think things are 'progressing' -and I hate to use that term, too quickly anyways. Surely electronic voting could make a system of national (and god forbid should I be so bold as to suggestinternational) referendum possible. I know that only a tiny fraction of the world is on the web in terms of it's population but that does not mean that people could not have acces to a voting terminal. That must be a very scary thought. Joe Zeke Yewdall wrote: Sometimes I wonder if the rest of the world understands that all americans don't support GW and his policies though... After all, we claim to be a democracy, so therefore, shouldn't the government by nature reflect the will of it's people. In reality, only my congressional representative actualy represents me, but neither of my senators does, nor my president or vice president. I actually voted, but I effectively have almost no vote in our government. Our system is set up for rule by a very narrow majority with no effective minority voice. But if you listen to our rhetoric abroad, it's easy to forget this. Zeke On 10/26/05, Michael Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It seems you are intent on grouping all Americans as one. Yes, It looks that way, doesn't it? So, I will explain. Usually, I try not to generalize because it leaves out a lot of information and can be manipulated to align itself with a particular agenda. However, on those occasions when I say Americans (my apologies to Canadians and others living on this hemisphere) or US citizens in general, I'm pointing toward a trend. The references I give below, are what I use to at least partly back up my position on those trends. Now, although the argument I give is my own, I find others who agree (some of them are my neighbors). ...I went to war for this country and would do it over, for the right reasons... The fact that there are soldiers who are duty bound and fighting honorably in a war is not the reason for the arrival of one to three hundred thousand protesters in Washington DC on September 24th. It is the horribly convoluted reason for war which is so disturbing. All I can do is try in my own way to change things for the better. The US as a whole is showing symptoms of fascism. If I, as you say,
Re: [Biofuel] Oil and democracy -was-Scientific method
Mike Weaver wrote: What debates? No one debates. The moderator pitches one question, which is ignored, and the candidates answers another in general platitudes. There is no debate. I agree. Compare the quality of the debate between Nixon and Kennedy with the most recent interchange between Alfred P. Neumann and his retarded cousin to gain an appreciation of the height from which we've fallen. robert luis rabello The Edge of Justice Adventure for Your Mind http://www.newadventure.ca Ranger Supercharger Project Page http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Still looking for a cheap TEFC motor
Keith said: I think free motors should be common enough too, lots of things you can salvage a motor from, some might be TEFC. What gets junked that uses TEFC motors but it's not usually the motor failing that gets it junked? I've been considering the exact same question. I haven't come up with the answer yet though. Let me know if you think of something, I'll do the same. Take care, Ken ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Biediesel shelf life.
What is the shelf life of BD? Can I make 6 months of fuel at a time? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Oil and democracy -was-Scientific method
Or compared to the political debates of a hundred years ago when people would come out and sit for hours to listen to debates. Neil Postman talks about this in his book Amusing ourselves to death. Joe robert luis rabello wrote: Mike Weaver wrote: What debates? No one debates. The moderator pitches one question, which is ignored, and the candidates answers another in general platitudes. There is no debate. I agree. Compare the quality of the debate between Nixon and Kennedy with the most recent interchange between Alfred P. Neumann and his retarded cousin to gain an appreciation of the height from which we've fallen. robert luis rabello "The Edge of Justice" Adventure for Your Mind http://www.newadventure.ca Ranger Supercharger Project Page http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Liquid-liquid separator
Hi,all, It seems I can get a new toy-a navy fuel purificator,which is a kind of centrifuge,used to separate water from the fuel. Has anyone have an idea how to use the separator in the BD processing?Is it suitable for filtering the WVO?Can I use it to avoid settling periods or even washing?The thing is really massive and makes 4000-12000 RPM,continuous feeding. Any suggestions,guys? Keith? Best, Rumen __ Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/