Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Yeah, we can't waste empathy or good vibes on these people, they don't even deserve the scraps from the collective food table until they quit this shit. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551659/#p551659 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @94Whether or not I give people slack, it can still get under my skin. Also, that level of morality is the kind of thing you develop by the time you're 10 or so for most people, so in this case I don't give nearly as much slack as I do on other things."Stealing is bad" is like basic morality 101, right up there with "Murder is bad". Sometimes there's a gray area, i.e. Eloquence, but unauthrized forks very definitely isn't one. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551647/#p551647 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @CamlernI would try not to take it so seriously dude, for your own sanity. Your holding kids to adult standards when they haven't even fully developed a moral compass or good reasoning skills yet.And kids are the large majority of the people who are fine with unauthorized forks.Obviously it's still bad for the community, but as long as we keep explaining it to them and not condescending or condemning to the point that they just get defensive, we'll get through to some of them as they get old enough to really fill the shoes of the past developers anyway.That's what I hope at least... And I have already seen it happen a few times. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551635/#p551635 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Yeah, unauthorized forks gets under my skin. The site has done things about it, but the fact that there's still a sizable vocal contingent who thinks that it's okay to steal code and assets bothers me. Not an audiogames.net problem of course, but it's probably part of why so many new programmers around here keep trying to find some sort of encryption silver bullet which is a waste of time, and if you go most other places it's not even debatable that stealing is bad. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551623/#p551623 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Oh sure, I disappear for months or even years at a time as well, and there's really nothing wrong with doing so. Though in my case it wasn't necessarily because the endless drama, still it's completely understandable if you can't deal with it anymore and if its in your best interest, as well as that of the other users of the site, to leave.What I don't get, however, is why there seem to be so many people who want to leave with fireworks. But perhaps its because they made contributions to the site and feel they owe the public an explanation for not being around anymore, which is understandable. Still, however, I would've probably just limited it to one message and called it a day.I'm not going to lie, I wasn't really around for any of the drama pertaining to unauthorized forks, although I read some of it back, and overall that does seem to be a lot nastier than what we've had these last couple of weeks, but perhaps it's just me. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551609/#p551609 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Audiogames.net was (among other things) how I found muds, and as far as I know this is the only place audiogames are discussed. At all. It is weird to look back into the archives of Audyssey, sometimes, and realize that once upon a time people thought audiogames could be commercially viable and were treated professionally. Audiogame Maker was what Sable wants to be, people like GMA Games used to do a lot, etc. I'm not sure where it all went, I guess just people realizing that blind people don't have money and then the older people leaving/getting pushed out/growing up, but my point is there's almost 20 years of stuff on here. I wouldn't be so eager to see it go, if only because if it did, we probably wouldn't see another site like it for a long time, if ever. These sorts of communities die faster than new ones get created. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551584/#p551584 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. I agree with what most people have said on here. I enjoy the social interaction around you a lot, and even if people can be ridiculous at times, I choose to be apart of a playerbase on here who trie' to generally be a middle-ground, and want to help people as much as I can, and not to hurt them, or push them away. As long as there remains a blind person to play with and to connect with in some way, I will stay here and represent myself as helpful in the best way I can. I commend all the work you have done Jayde, as a single moderator, seeing that most of the other moderators don’t come on here as much as you do. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551502/#p551502 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
2020-07-12
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — Off-topic room : KenshiraTheTrinity via Audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done. Yup, I actually enjoy the social interaction and shared interests around here, which is partially why I'm sticking around, even with how ridiculous some people can be sometimes.Jayde reminded me of an old site that I used to frequent, think it was called pspminis.com, and was uk based. They did a lot of previews and reviews for psp minis, which to those that don't know, are digital only psp games that are less than 100 mega in size, and less than 10 bucks per game. The people were really nice, and back in those days I was really social on the net and didn't know no better, so I created an account and made many friends there. It was kinda cool because I was the only blind person there, but we all had an interest in games in general, and they didnt treat me any differently, even gave game recommendations when I asked for some. We swapped gamer tags accross various platforms too. There were frequent giveaways from which I was fortunate enough to get a few games, and I even got to host my own month of ps plus giveaway because sony had just launched the program and had emailed some promo codes out to some people, so i kept one, gave one to my brother, and gave one to someone on that site.Eventually, psp minis started dying down until they were no longer a thing anymore because of the release of the vita, so the site stopped making articles of upcoming releases, reviews and the like. I saw little reason to visit the site anymore and just kinda vanished, even though the forum would still remain open. Kinda felt bad for doing that now, and I do wonder what became of those other members. I've forgotten most of the names, but a couple still remain. I hadn't been a part of any forum since, until I joined up here a couple years ago. Sure I posted a few things on applevis, but I didn't know anyone or interact with anyone there. So yeah, in light of all of that old experience, I wouldn't want this old place to just vanish, because as long as there are blind gamers, then it serves a purpose, a couple, actually. The first is to provide a comprehensive list of playable games accross various platforms. The second is to provide a diverse hangout for likeminded and similarly situated individuals to socialize, no matter what platform they play on, no matter what type of games they play. So yes, I wouldn't know where else to go if I decided to just up and leave one day, though I will admit that it is rather depressing to see people generally unhappy with the turn of things here and decide to leave over it. It is often said that we know not what we have until it is taken away, and to that I say, truer words were never spoken. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551421/#p551421 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Once upon a time there was a website called the Zone BBS.It existed from roughly 2004 to 2017 or 2018, but after 2011 or so, it didn't really receive all that many updates. It was a social hub, with games, a chat system and forums. There were a bunch of regulars, and a bunch of people who'd pop on now and again, and then disappear. By the last couple of years, problems were mounting and no one was fixing them. The code that ran the site was extremely deprecated and old, and the only real ways to move forward were either to trash the site entirely, or to start a massive rebuild.Well, one day, the admins decided to be done with it. And a whole lot of people were upset about it, but it also made sense. It had been expected for months, if not years, by some. A lot of people (self included) who thought they wouldn't much care if the site died found out that yes, they did in fact care once it was confirmed to be happening. There were tons of people there the night it shut down. Chat was going absolutely crazy. Memories flowed. People realized just how integral that site had been for some of them.While audiogames.net has its problems, I feel that it occupies a similar niche. No, it doesn't have any games of its own like the Zone BBS did, and no, it doesn't have an active chat system. But peple do come here to talk, and I'd wager a lot of us actually like some of the socialization we can get here, to say nothing of the shared interest (gaming) which brought most of us here in the first place.This is all to say that I think it's important not to underestimate the impact of a website like this. It's well and good to say "Ah well, it's had its fun, if it dies, meh", but I doubt that the overall impact will be so casually represented by most folks. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551396/#p551396 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. only read up to 61@OP your attitude is very bitter. You are acting like a boss trying to squeeze as much profit out of their company as they can by only highering new people. Then when they reach 30 or 40, firing them because they are slightly not as strong or as fast at doing tasks anymore. And if they have a disability, then fuck it, no work for them. Youwant the best of the best, no flaws, no exceptions. Which is very ironic because we as people with disabilities are treated like this in the workplace all the time. Like garbage.Also I really wouldn't delete your existence from this sight, because trust me, you won't be viewed as the same person if you return. People aren't going to enjoy your company as much. People aren't going to be as cheered up with your posts. More than half your reputation will be gone, and your somewhat strong voice will be no more than a whisper.Can we please not use the word drama in every thread? Debates are not drama. Polls are not drama. There is also good drama, and bad drama. And mixed drama. Now this thread is mostly bad drama but has some good drama in it. But sometimes when we call drama in a thread, it actually isn't drama.Remember quality over quantity, you seem to be forgetting that. Also the site isn't magically going to transform, especially from the complaints of one person. If you hate the forum this much, higher someone or learn coding to make a better one. We all know this forum is outdated, broken, trashy, etc. But imagine waking up tomorrow and it just be gone. Entirely. Well that actually can happen if someone alerts big legal companies, so you know, not that far off from being unrealistic. This is better than nothing. You will leave now, but if you were to return to this place and it not exist, trust me you wouldn't feel the same. Don't rely on it always being here, especially if you aren't here for it. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551377/#p551377 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. only read up to 61@OP your attitude is very bitter. You are acting like a boss trying to squeeze as much profit out of their company as they can by only highering new people. Then when they reach 30 or 40, firing them because they are slightly not as strong or as fast at tasks anymore. And if they have a disability, then fuck it, no work for them. Youwant the best of the best, no flaws, no exceptions. Which is very ironic because we as people with disabilities are treated like this in the workplace all the time. Like garbage.Also I really wouldn't delete your existance from this sight, because trust me, you won't be viewed as the same person if you return. People aren't going to enjoy your company as much. People aren't going to be as cheered up with your posts. More than half your reputation will be gone, and your somewhat strong voice will be no more than a whisper.Can we please not use the word drama in every thread? Debates are not drama. Polls are not drama. There is also good drama, and bad drama. And mixed drama. Now this thread is nothing but bad drama, but sometimes when we call rama in a thread, it actually isn't drama.Remember quality over quantity, you seem to be forgetting that. Als othe site isn't magically going to transform, especially from the complaints of one person. If you hae the forum this much, higher someone or learn coding to make a better one. We all know this forum is outdated, broken, trashy, etc. But imagine waking up tomorrow and it just be gone. Entirely. Well that actually can happen if someone alerts big legal companies, so you know, not that far off from being realistic. This is better than nothing. You will eave now, but if you were to return to this place and it not exist, trust me you wouldn't feel the same. Don't rely on it always being here, especially if you aren't here for it. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551377/#p551377 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. At one point, during the discussion of whether Crazy Party should be banned from this forum, I sincerely thought about asking for my account to be deleted. I didn't agree with the stance the mods were taking about it, not because the game doesn't contain copyrighted assets, but because I thought, and still do think, actually, that attacking one blatant example of piracy while sweeping others under the rug because it would be too difficult, or too devastating, to go through the entire database wiping out games left and right, would be too hypocritical for me to bear. I figured that, by my account existing here, I was condoning that stance. I realize, however, that even if it is possible for them to erase accounts, it would probably do more harm than good. Not to toot my own horn, but it's possible, though quite unlikely, that people have found some of my posts useful. These days, I rarely come around much anyway. I'm often too tired to give one iota about bullshit that is inconsequential in the real world. Plus, the internet is forever, and you can't really nuke all traces of yourself from a given site or community, no matter how hard you try.As for pandemic loneliness, I can absolutely relate to that. As an introvert myself, I don't need tons of social interaction, but I do suffer without my baseline, which I'm not getting, and God knows when I will again. My partner and I haven't seen each other since March. We are in a long distance relationship to begin with, but this, among other reasons, has intensified the anxiety that I feel at least about being apart. That, coupled with the fact I've started a new job recently that is, shall we say, not ideal, plus the stress of living with people I can't share any of my true identity or feelings with about pretty much anything, makes life difficult. I recognize that there's a comfort in knowing that someone would notice if I died, but it's honestly kind of fucked that that's one of the few positives of my situation. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551308/#p551308 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Brad,Just take care of yourself. This thread has meandered quite a bit to the point where I don't even know what it is about anymore. But the gist, I think, is that this forum isn't a good fit for you right now. I'm not saying "Go away, no one wants you here." But I think it's fair to say that the only reason I keep coming back is because I try not to take this place too seriously, beyond sympathizing or empathizing with those of you who have it harder than I do, and beyond figuring out how to kill damned shamblers. Point is, the only way I've managed to keep coming back is by not taking it too seriously, and that isn't something everyone can do. If you can't, then this place probably isn't good for you now. If I ever get to that point, I'll probably just stop posting or reading, though. I wouldn't feel the need to fart on my way out the door. Admittedly I'm trying to be funny, but I think it's a good analogy as well. That fart is only going to smell bad for a short time, and when it's all gone, the community won't really have changed for having done it. If you want to fix this place, then the way to do it is to push for serious change while you're there, and while you have the energy to do some of the work. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551154/#p551154 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Brad, I'm sorry if you are leaving. Remember though, you do still have an account should you ever wish to return, plus you can, essentially, watch the forum from the sidelines here and there without an account, i.e: read all posts and then come back when or if you ever feel like it.For my part, I was wondering why Jayde wasn't responding to my emails on the list. Now I know why. He can't seem to send emails to the list.How can we even set anything up if some of us might not be able to communicate for the time being? I am now in a situation where I do not know how to proceed. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551151/#p551151 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. The thing with Reddit is that you can tailor it to meet your needs by removing default subs and only joining a handful that you can take shelter in. But, if you do trawl through mainstream subs, you'll realize real quick that Reddit is just as vitriolic and hate-filled as any other site on the net. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551145/#p551145 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. ok, I'll respond one more time before scrambleing my password.@jade, It's interesting to me that you're saying these things. I guess youtube and things fills the silence, I do have my grandparents to talk to if I want to so there's that but I think I'd be able to cope alone too but I can understand why this could be getting to people.It isn't getting to me that much though but I'm not one for socialising that much so this doesn't bother me as much as it seams to bother others.also jade, try drinknig more water if you can, it should help with headaches.@ironcross, ok.@musicalman, but the thing is it is as symple as that, now Jade has mygranes and his own issues to deal with, if the forum had other mods before this whole virus thing happend it might have been quicker to crack down on this stuff, can I say without a shadow of a doubt that it would be? No. But if changes aren't voiced, we just sit and this stuff repeats again and again.And the forum really can't do much about it as they don't have a mod topic or something, where they can be interviewed to help with parts of the site.There was one, I believe a couple weeks ago but I don't know what happened to it.Then there's the devs who don't seam to give a shit, so yes, it's tricky i'll give you that and I'm leaving because of this trickyness, I can't change it all I can do is voice my views and I feel that I've had enough posting on this old site that is broken.I'm sure Jade's doing his best, in fact I know he is, but more is better than one in this case.If there are more mods than Jade, I've not noticed them in a long time, maybe they're ill, maybe they have their own family stuff to deal with but then a, hmm, back up set of mods, might be a good idea. I honestly don't know but it isn't for me to figure that stuff out.As for archives of posts, that's on them if they want to go after the posts, but I don't think anyone willl. I've only deleted a couple of threads.Yes my post was partly a venting post but I would love for changes to happen because of it, sadly; I don't see that happening and wish to move to less broken sites like reddit where I am updated when I get a message and have a huge choice of things to read and write about that don't involve drama because with subreddits you can choose what to subscribe to and what you wish to leave alone.Yes, I'm talking about the mods and what I believe they could do better, yes I'm talking crap about the dsites lack of up to date development but i'm only saying what people have said before.As for not speaking up in the past, I have just not to this extent.I can't help if I'm tired of the drama on this forum, like rory, I check it nearly every day because it's so easy to do, I open firefox, press alt d, f, enter, and I'm done, and him calling out for help and basicly getting mocked for it was the final straw.I would stay but I don't think there's going to be any changes in the future that would be worth it for me to do so.If there is, great! I'm wrong and will be happy to be so, maybe one day there will be more mods than just jade moderating, maybe one day the site will be up to date, if that's true; I'll know it along side you guys and girls and then I may request a password recovery email or however it will be you get passwords then.I will leave this thread up and if my posts mean that much to you; I hope I haven't deleted any you enjoy or enjoyed taking part in.I wish you guys and girls the best of luck with your lives and I hope to read some amazing posts in the future. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551144/#p551144 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @JadePeople don't say this enough because of things you've done in the past which they disagree with, including my self. That's negligent of me and I'm sorry.But I very much appreciate you sticking it out for the long haul here, because I honestly don't know anyone else from the community who could have.Your a pretty rare breed if you can deal with this much bullying, shit starting, pointless drawn out arguing, and personal drama, especially when nearly everything you do or don't do is judged harshly and communication with the other mods is shot.You've held down the fort essentially on your own for weeks at a time, while others who hold the title of moderator aren't doing the thing they signed up for for one reason or another. Even while almost every forum member was against you to some degree, and while still having your own life to deal with and getting absolutely no compensation for your efforts. That takes an incredible amount of dedication and resolve, and I continually find my self impressed by your resiliency.Very few people here are truly willing to consider your basic humanity when arguing with you, and that's just not fair or honest, regardless of how upset we might be.I may not believe your an example of a good mod in some important ways, but in this you are one of the best I've ever seen, and it's especially appreciated at a time like this when stress and anger is at an all time high. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551137/#p551137 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. I'm in a similar position to Ironcross. I am the sort of introvert who actually loves people, right up till I need my space. I can have a great time with friends hanging out all day, or even for like a weekend camping (although if I do that, I'll probably sneak away to be alone for ten or twenty minutes here and there). I have seen my partner exactly once in the last four months or so. I've seen my father about six times (two of which were for weekend visits at his house, not the best idea but he lives way out in the country and I wasn't really in public much). And...yeah, that's pretty much it. I'm sleeping badly. I'm restless, apathetic and almost manic by turns. My creative muse went off and died somewhere, though lately she seems to have made some sort of comeback. I'm all over the place. Point is, yes, I'm coping, but not well, and not easily, and it's not without help. I make a point to talk out loud to someone almost every day, because even though I like my own company, I can't be alone this long without showing the strain. I am here with just my cat, so perhaps that's different. Sometimes I feel like if I lived with even one other person, I'd be in a lot better mental health situation than I am now.So it's not surprising that my sleep schedule is shot to hell, or that I'm getting random headaches that are basically migraines at times. It's not surprising that I am making a bit of an extra point to moderate here, because it's one of the places where I actually feel like I'm doing something semi-useful. And let me tell you, it's no picnic. But I'm not after your pity. The only point here is to say that probably it would be days before someone noticed I was dead, if I died, and as Canlorn pointed out, that's a lot of us right now. I'm trying to give folks a bit of benefit of the doubt if they're close to jumping over a line, because a lot of folks are just not coping very well and aren't equipped to know it, or aren't prepared to do what it may take to fix it. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551131/#p551131 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. At least it helps you appreciate human interaction more I guess. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551129/#p551129 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @Brad you're wrong, and that's really all there is to it.Yeah, as someone who is introverted myself, I am kind of feeling it. As someone who would say I don't need people, and as someone who has enough of socializing after like four hours or so, and who gets exhausted and overwhelmed at big events, this is rocketed me into territory I've never known before. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551122/#p551122 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Thanks @76 for expressing it better than I ever could. I was going to post something similar in my earlier post, but didn't quite know how to put it yet. Bottom line: it's completely understandable if you get frustrataed and want to leave as a result, but continuously putting the blame on others (even the ones who can't help it) is a big no no. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551120/#p551120 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Edit: It appears the op has decided to leave early right before I submitted this post. Therefore I don't think this post is necessary anymore, but I'm leaving it here for posterity's sake:original post wrote:Ugh... Brad I did not expect this side of you to come out. Right now you're coming off as arrogant and rather self-indulgent. I was going to give you the benefit of the doubt and fully sympathize with you, but while you still have some of my sympathies, you have lost my respect. I don't believe you always carry yourself like this; in the few other posts I've read of your's, you always seemed like a mild, pleasant, easy-going person. This thread is completely out of your character.The way you keep hounding on the mods to just do things because they're just, "simple as that!" is really grading my nerves right now. No community ever solved problems because one person got fed up and laid it all out supposedly like it is. It really does take community effort and understanding to make changes happen, and we are severely lacking in the understanding department, and we have been for some time imho. During difficult times you have a binary choice: stay and be part of the solution, or leave for your own sanity. Either one would be understandable, but I've never understood the point of making these threads which are obviously meant as a venting thread more than anything else. I could understand a benign message saying "Folks I'm done," and detailing your reasons for leaving, but the way you're turning a cold shoulder to everyone's perspective but your own is hardly part of that. You have a right to do what you need to for your own sanity, but when you start denying other people's feelings, no good comes out of that, as there are many sides to every story which are just as valid as your's.If you really want to leave, why not just do it and be done with it? Nobody's stopping you. If you want to delete your threads, well. Both sides have contributed fair points. Even you Brad are saying things which I can potentially sympathize with. I've been in a situation where I wanted my hands clean of anything I have done on the internet. I don't believe that's a reasonable request though; the Internet is sort of like a record of human conscience and thought. Removing everything you have ever done is going to do more harm than good, especially if you're willing to take everyone else with you on this deletion spree. Furthermore, somewhere, your threads are backed up for archival/crash recovery purposes. I don't know how easy it is for the end user to see them, probably not very. But still, deleting entire threads here will motivate users who feel their contributions were unjustly deleted to go chasing after those backups if at all possible, and who knows where that'll end up? But you clearly are not interested in a proper debate, you're just going to do what you want and that's the end of it. So why you're letting this fester is beyond me. Furthermore you're giving those who are afraid of seeing their posts deleted a chance to back up all your threads for their own personal amusement. I'm not saying anyone's doing that, but again it's a possibility. In the end, I think it's better to just accept anything you put on the Internet as is, and go on the assumption that you can't take it back. Because while the edit feature and the delete features have purposes, they're not going to magically change the course of history. In fact people are going to lose trust in you if they find out you were tampering with your words too much.Above all, though, the main thing that's getting me here is: Do you truly want to leave, or do you just need to vent? Are you interested in having a multi-sided discussion, or a one-sided discussion? Since you've posted a number of times in this thread, then I believe you're at least interested in some kind of interaction, but I don't know what sort. Maybe you're seeking validation? Assurance? Only you know that answer,. Whatever the case may be, I can't see how drawing this out is doing anyone, including yourself, any favors.In closing I'll just say this: If some part of you deep down actually wants to see things in this place turn around, it's never too late to be part of a solution. If that's not your cup of tea and you just want out, I get it, I really do. But this thread... simply will not do. At least, not for me. But what do I know? I'm just an american blind guy who's spoiled and entitled and full of drama-starting fire.Sarcasm aside, I wish you the best of luck Brad, but I really think you need to get back into a rational state of mind first before doing anything. Efficiency is your friend, not these emotions. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551116/#p551116 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Ugh... Brad I did not expect this side of you to come out. Right now you're coming off as arrogant and rather self-indulgent. I was going to give you the benefit of the doubt and fully sympathize with you, but while you still have some of my sympathies, you have lost my respect. I don't believe you always carry yourself like this; in the few other posts I've read of your's, you always seemed like a mild, pleasant, easy-going person. This thread is completely out of your character.The way you keep hounding on the mods to just do things because they're just, "simple as that!" is really grading my nerves right now. No community ever solved problems because one person got fed up and laid it all out supposedly like it is. It really does take community effort and understanding to make changes happen, and we are severely lacking in the understanding department, and we have been for some time imho. During difficult times you have a binary choice: stay and be part of the solution, or leave for your own sanity. Either one would be understandable, but I've never understood the point of making these threads which are obviously meant as a venting thread more than anything else. I could understand a benign message saying "Folks I'm done," and detailing your reasons for leaving, but the way you're turning a cold shoulder to everyone's perspective but your own is hardly part of that. You have a right to do what you need to for your own sanity, but when you start denying other people's feelings, no good comes out of that, as there are many sides to every story which are just as valid as your's.If you really want to leave, why not just do it and be done with it? Nobody's stopping you. If you want to delete your threads, well. Both sides have contributed fair points. Even you Brad are saying things which I can potentially sympathize with. I've been in a situation where I wanted my hands clean of anything I have done on the internet. I don't believe that's a reasonable request though; the Internet is sort of like a record of human conscience and thought. Removing everything you have ever done is going to do more harm than good, especially if you're willing to take everyone else with you on this deletion spree. Furthermore, somewhere, your threads are backed up for archival/crash recovery purposes. I don't know how easy it is for the end user to see them, probably not very. But still, deleting entire threads here will motivate users who feel their contributions were unjustly deleted to go chasing after those backups if at all possible, and who knows where that'll end up? But you clearly are not interested in a proper debate, you're just going to do what you want and that's the end of it. So why you're letting this fester is beyond me. Furthermore you're giving those who are afraid of seeing their posts deleted a chance to back up all your threads for their own personal amusement. I'm not saying anyone's doing that, but again it's a possibility. In the end, I think it's better to just accept anything you put on the Internet as is, and go on the assumption that you can't take it back. Because while the edit feature and the delete features have purposes, they're not going to magically change the course of history. In fact people are going to lose trust in you if they find out you were tampering with your words too much.Above all, though, the main thing that's getting me here is: Do you truly want to leave, or do you just need to vent? Are you interested in having a multi-sided discussion, or a one-sided discussion? Since you've posted a number of times in this thread, then I believe you're at least interested in some kind of interaction, but I don't know what sort. Maybe you're seeking validation? Assurance? Only you know that answer,. Whatever the case may be, I can't see how drawing this out is doing anyone, including yourself, any favors.In closing I'll just say this: If some part of you deep down actually wants to see things in this place turn around, it's never too late to be part of a solution. If that's not your cup of tea and you just want out, I get it, I really do. But this thread... simply will not do. At least, not for me. But what do I know? I'm just an american blind guy who's spoiled and entitled and full of drama-starting fire.Sarcasm aside, I wish you the best of luck Brad, but I really think you need to get back into a rational state of mind first before doing anything. Efficiency is your friend, not these emotions. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551116/#p551116 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @71You say that, but only because you live with people. If you actually had absolutely zero human contact, I would be willing to bet money that you'd change your mind. It doesn't take much to meet your (or my) minimal social requirements, but the number of people who could actually go live in a cave somewhere with no contact at all whatsoever, except maybe for food delivery, are really rare.There's a difference between "I don't need people to keep myself entertained" levels of social introversion, and "If I died right now it would take days for someone to notice and that'd be because I'm decaying and the neighbors complained about the smell" levels. And for as long as this pandemic lasts, around half the world but probably more is in the latter camp. We're not just saying "it's okay if you drop off the face of the earth" right now. We're actively pushing people off the face of the earth as much as we possibly can.I don't have any on hand, because it's been a while, but you should Google and read about the experiences of people in solitary confinement. You'd probably find it very enlightening. Suffice it to say that if it were so easy as you think it is, we'd just give them books or something and it wouldn't be considered an international form of torture that reliably destroys people for life. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551114/#p551114 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Everyone, I've decided that i'm going to leave earlier than I thought, I've deleted some threds but couldn't be bothered to go through all of them, so I'm leaving today and will be scrambleing my password in an hour or so, so won't be responding to any more answers to this thread.I'll leave my Harry potter stuff up so that anyone can take it but for now and the future, as far as I know it, I'd like to say thanks for the chats and have a good life. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551107/#p551107 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. i've deleted some threads as that is a function of the site, deal with it. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551105/#p551105 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. I really don't get why you so desperately want to erase something that will never, ever hurt you in the slightest, while, by erasing your threads, you destroy the work and effort of others. I would maybe get it if there would be an advantage for you, but there is absolutely none. Not the slightest.Brad wrote: @jade, the thing is, I wouldn't tell Joe to delete the texts but wouldn't care either way if he did or not.Exactly, by your current stance, you would not tell Joe to delete the texts, you would hack into his smartphone and delete them yourself. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551103/#p551103 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @camlorn, that's interesting to me because I don't live alone, I wish I did, but if I did I'd find things to do like cook healthy meals for myself, watch youtube videos, check out music, things like that.I don't need to socialise, it's nice but I can get on without it.@Exodus, basicly; yeah. I'm taking on that mindset at the moment because it's what I want to do.I've not deleted that many threads and won't be deleting all of them, if others want to make their own threads and keep them up, that's on them, but I've decided to get rid of some of mine. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551100/#p551100 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Fuck me it's the I'm gonna try Linux thing all over again. I'll say what I said then, your thread stops being your thread the minute people pour their time and effort into building on it. It will be Just as shitty, if not more so to knowingly wipe out content that people spent time building with you. It's why I'll never answer a question you ask unless the answer is yes, no or just fucking Google it.It's also why people should stop actively persuading op to not do the thing he says he's going to do, because we've been before and the answer was essentially it's mine so fuck you. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551096/#p551096 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @61yeah, so I'm with Nolan here. Live alone. Was doing the blindie thing of slowly building up from ground zero after moving, where you spend a year doing what sighted people can do in 1-2 months, in terms of building a social network. Cue pandemic. Now it's no chance of hanging out with another person for the foreseeable future without planning it weeks in advance. Don't even have a dog. Have been set back by 1-2 years in terms of most of my social life goals. Find myself hoping that maybe a friend turns out to have Covid antibodies or something so that there's someone safe/willing to hang out. If you're not slowly building to some sort of breaking point then consider yourself very lucky.Even before the pandemic, if you're blind, it's easy to fall off the grid. I kind of had, because moving across the country does that. But when pandemics happen, unless you have a really close circle you're just out in the cold, and we don't get the ability to do online social stuff either because let's face it, 99% of online social stuff is inaccessible. Even card games are out, unless you hang out primarily with other blind people.My and/or Nolan's experiences here are typical. Being able to disregard this and go "I know, how about I opt into daily drama" is atypical. You're not going to find a lot of people right now who want to take on projects like moderation, especially for free.Audiogames.net forum drama is probably above baseline right now because there's nowhere else for many of the people who are here to go. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551094/#p551094 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @KenshiraTheTrinity, well for once I'm doing something for me and me alone.@nolan, maybe in the end my thread will mean nothing, in fact I'm probably going to delete it too, because it's not going to make a change and if the mods want to make a change, they will with or without my thread, this is my version of stress and i'm doing what I can about it. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551092/#p551092 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @61 Speaking for myself, I live in a pandemic hot spot. I also live in an apartment co-op. Before all this started, we collectively bought groceries and supplies, made meals most nights per week, and spent time together in our courtyard. Now, most of us are self-isolating in our individual apartments. I've bought a small chest freezer to minimize Costco trips, and am now cooking for myself. I'm also not getting the social time I need, especially during the summer when we'd typically hang out more. And I'm not even saying "woe is me, I have to cook and hide." But the reality is that I didn't have to just a few months ago, and every single day my baseline stress level is that much higher because the community I need is now a liability. I fall toward the introverted end of things, and for me to say that I feel lonely means something.I'm not saying this to make anyone feel bad--there's no point making folks on a forum I'll never meet feel bad about this. I'm saying it because I think there are hundreds of little stories like that on this forum, each of which raises the collective baseline stress level. I'm sure they contribute to the recent uptick in drama here. But they also mean that, if I had to choose between volunteering to moderate this place or living my newly more stressful life, the latter wins out over something that is only going to ratchet that stress up even more.So, yes, the pandemic does make this "wave a wand, summon more mods" prospect even dicier. I agree that something should be done. I just don't know that crawling up the asses of those trying to do it because they needed to take care of themselves is good, nor is expecting more mods to wade into this mess realistic. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551087/#p551087 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
2020-07-11
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — Off-topic room : KenshiraTheTrinity via Audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done. I think the issue isnt so much what you do to your own stuff, but what you do to others in the process. Suppose I owned an apartment and it was full of occupants when suddenly I decided to demolish it on short notice, thereby displacing all of the occupants and giving them no room or time to protest. That's what deleting a thread would basically do. Suppose that someone, that was not you, posted some information that was useful on one of the thread you deemed useless and deleted, and they needed to access that information but couldn't because you decided to delete the thread. What you are doing may be for your peace of mind, but I do agree with those here who have said that you should more carefully consider your actions and how it will impact others in the future. What you feel is a positive step could have a negative consequence for someone in the future, and that's something you need to weigh before acting or reacting.@64 absolutely. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551081/#p551081 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @jade, the thing is, I wouldn't tell Joe to delete the texts but wouldn't care either way if he did or not.As for your manamon thread, that would be up to you and again I wouldn't care. Even if I contributed to it, it wouldn't bother me.If people want to keep up their posts and threads; that's on them but it's equaly on me what I do with my life and threads. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551083/#p551083 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
2020-07-11
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — Off-topic room : KenshiraTheTrinity via Audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done. I think the issue isnt so much what you do to your own stuff, but what you do to others in the process. Suppose I owned an apartment and it was full of occupants when suddenly I decided to demolish it on short notice, thereby displacing all of the occupants and giving them no room or time to protest. That's what deleting a thread would basically do. Suppose that someone, that was not you, posted some information that was useful on one of the thread you deemed useless and deleted, and they needed to access that information but couldn't because you decided to delete the thread. What you are doing may be for your peace of mind, but I do agree with those here who have said that you should more carefully consider your actions and how it will impact others in the future. What you feel is a positive step could have a negative consequence for someone in the future, and that's something you need to weigh before acting or reacting. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551081/#p551081 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Brad, think of what you're doing a bit like this.Let's say I'm friends with Joe. Now during our friendship, Joe and I had some fun, but we also had some bad fights. So one day, I decide that I'm just through being this guy's friend, and I tell him I'm cutting him out of my life. I cannot change what Joe thinks of me, and what he remembers. It's not reasonable of me to tell Joe to delete all the texts I ever sent him, or to remove the copy of that hilarious video where we got his cat stoned on catnip and then gave it Styrofoam packing peanuts to chase. Joe is a part of those memories, those artifacts.Likewise, whether you started a thread or not, other people are a part of the discussions. I'm totally with Ironcross here. You have every right to remove your own direct contributions if you like, but when other people respond to something you have written, it is no longer just your contribution. That's actually kind of arrogant, if you think about it. Look at my 180+ page manamon thread that got enormous. I would be a colossal jerk if I nuked that thread, even if I felt there was too much info and drama and whatever else in it. Even if I have the capacity to do so, I would feel it was a huge slap in the face to everyone else who asked questions, gave ideas, offered support and otherwise partook of the conversation.So I mean, if you've got a thread that makes you look like an idiot, and its net impact was tiny, and you really, really think it needs to go, that's one thing. But if you nuke a big thread because you started it, and it had actually generated good conversation in its time, then perhaps it really is a good thing that you're leaving. I don't want you run out on a rail, but this mentality of "I started it, I can blow it up" seems rather self-serving to me. This is my opinion as a person, and not an administrator. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551080/#p551080 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @ironcross, I'm not deleting posts, i'm deleting threads.As for guest books, I've never signed one.If the ability for me to delete threads is there and I feel they serve no more perpus for *me* then it is my right to be able to delete them.By your logic, you would still want all your emails to stay on the server if you delete that email address as it is a chat between two or more people, the same goes for Twitter and Facebook. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551072/#p551072 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. As a proponent of personal freedom, I don't think it applies to deleting threads. Yes, you started it, but you're contributing to something larger than yourself. You should not have the power to silence others; which is exactly what deleting threads does. Think of posting here like signing a guestbook at an event. Even if your name was the first one on that page or in the book, you don't have the right to just rip it up. When you contribute to something that is more than the sum of your own works, especially when others hinge off of that, I feel that you lose your rights to removing it.Editing is another story. If you wanted to go in and edit every single one of your posts with a ***REDACTED*** or something like that, then by all means, go ahead. Doing so isn't affecting anyone else's posts, so it avoids the issue. But when it comes to you deleting threads, I couldn't disagree more strongly that you have the right. I would even say you shouldn't be able to delete posts, because it re-orders everything and makes things out of place. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551062/#p551062 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @nolan, I agree with everything you've said apart from the pandemic, people can skype and whatsapp and email and use discord, I'd assume that's how they're doing things anyway and don't see what the pandemic has to do with that.If they have sick family members who can't take care of themselves then don't sign up to be a mod, it's as simple as that.As for having access to the web devs and all that, I agree, maybe because of this there will be no more mods apart from Jade and, two others, was it? Either way, I personally won't be sticking around to find out and post and be a part of a sometimes negative comunity.@Jayde, when I go, I want to hopefully delete myself from a place permenetly so that means all posts, but instead I'm going to delete the ones that I think people wouldn't get any use out of.You aren't to blame here and it isn't just that post that made me say I'm done, it's the drama on this forum in general, I've honestly been building up to this and need to take my life into my own hands for once so am doing what I feel is best for me and not caring, not in a horrible way but I'm sure you know what I mean, what others say because it is my life and if I wanted to delete all my posts and threads I have the power to do that. It would be long and tiring but I could do it, I'm not going to however but will be doing what I feel is needed for me.As for round the clock stuff, that's not what I mean, let's say you get a mod from America, then one from Europe, you've got two time zones right there and less of a chance of this silly rama stuff happening again, that's all i'm saying. Now if it happens that's up to you and these other mods but if it were me, I'd do something man because as I've said, I give it another 10 years tops until this site goes down.Who knows what the internet will be like in a couple years, I doubt older sites just won't be supported but who knows?You know how sometimes when you go on a site and it gives you an error because of an outdated Certificate, that could happen to this site and has, if I remember correctly. I get it, you're just one person and this is not an attack on you at all, I'm just tired of how this site is run and want out.OH and yes, I probably would have applied for a mod position if there was a mod sign up sheet, if you were wondering.@thetechguy, thanks. It's not good how these guys pay for the site but are off hand about it and don't seam to care at all.@arjan, well if they didn't feel up to it, then they shouldn't be interviewed for a spot on the mod team.I've been around this forum long enough to know that there were quite a few mods, then dark quit and others too, which i'm fine with by the way, if you've got stuff to deal with that's cool, it's life and I get it, but now jade seams the only mod on here, which isn't fair on jade at all, so I'm trying to make it easier on him.@Lucas1853, you know, as much as I like removing myself from places, I like that idea a lot, that way the thread would still be there for everyone but it would be clear it's deleted.@defender, exactly.@NevEd, not if you set up a system where you couldn't reply after x amount of months like with some subreddits.@techmaster20, oh no! The magical mod powers! Oh crap, does Jade know where we live?@Mayana, techmaster was only messing @Socheat, thanks. I'm deleting *some* of my posts for me, not to fix the site.God, remember *stars?* man that's old.@toto, thanks URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551055/#p551055 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. hi allI did not read all the post but in my opinion well that the audiogames site eczistas because many people do not know about new games and so on... and what about those people who have chosen to leave this community should not make fun of them or otherwise insult them is their determination. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551032/#p551032 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Jayde has been a long standing member and now an active moderator, too. I appreciated what he's done to keep the forum clean, and a good place for people to enjoy. Remember, the moderator position is not getting paid. It's a volunteer position, and it can be stressful at times. Don't just expect that the moderators are all with you 24/7. They had their own personal things that need to be delt with as well. And, by the way, deleting your post today doesn't fix the site tomorrow.Thank you, and I hope your leave will be interesting for you. I wish you luck. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551025/#p551025 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Jayde has been a long standing member and now an active moderator, too. I appreciated what he's done to keep the forum clean, and a good place for people to enjoy. Remember, the moderator position is not getting paid. It's a volunteer position, and it can be stressful at times. Don't just expect that the moderators are all with you 24/7. They had their own personal things that need to be delt with as well. And, by the way, deleting your post today doesn't fix the site tomorrow.Thank you, and I hope your leave will be good. I wish you luck. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551025/#p551025 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @techmaster20 Anyone can hide their email. Just go to Profile, Settings, then find a section named "Email Settings". Jayde is not abusing any fancy mod powers here. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551016/#p551016 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Yeah thats what I'm saying 55. In a perfect world where anything could get done around here, it would work like Reddit instead. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551014/#p551014 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Jayde, I sent you a pm. I would've sent an email but I guess you hid it somehow with your magical mod powers, lol. Anyway, if you looked at it just send me an email in responce. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551013/#p551013 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Unfortunately the forum doesn't work like Reddit. I've seen posts where the original post and all of OPs comments in it were gone but I was still able to read the responses. Pretty sure the whole topic would get nuked if he tried to do that here.I don't think deleting anything is accomplishing anything, but he can do what he wants.At least that horrid goddamn dumpster fire of a thread got locked. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551012/#p551012 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @arjanThat's why you would have people apply for the position, then make a list of those people for the community to vote on off forum.But Nolen has a good point about it really not fixing much anyway. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551009/#p551009 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Deleting the first post in a thread should not delete the whole thing. Deleting any post should not delete the whole post either, it should replace it with [deleted] or something so that people can see where there's a hole in the thread instead of how it currently works where it just shifts all the posts around and stuff. I personally think deleting all your threads is childish but any content you put up you should have the right to delete. But your thread is just started by you, other people contributed to it. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551006/#p551006 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. I think the OP has been around long enough to know that more mods also means more chances that people will cry foul and make a complaint against a certain mod because they don't like what they're doing. Now I'm not saying that the OP had any party in it in the past, but that's what tends to happen in general. To then put the blame mostly on the current mods for basically not being able to make multiple copies of themselves strikes me as more than a little unreasonable.And don't even get me started on mod elections, which were also mentioned sometime during this thread. It would just increase the drama tenfold, only then it would involve different people.For example, if I were to ask any of you right now to post a list of people you think would be good mod candidates, then I'm sure many others would immediately raise their voice in protest to say that no, person A isn't suited for this job at all, and neither is person B, and the list goes on. Not to mention that you haven't even considered the would be candidate's personal feelings on the matter. Theoretically, there might be people out there who would be fair and good, but they might not have enough time, or enough motivation to basically dive headfirst into a wasps nest. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551005/#p551005 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. I agree on the OP's point on the web masters. Yeah they pay for the hosting, but they don't maintain this site. You can't even call them web masters anymore. You can probably call them site hosting people or something. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/551000/#p551000 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Mayana, thank you. It's appreciated when folks actually see most of what we're getting at. I won't pretend that I'm perfect, I make mistakes just like the next person, but I'm trying to walk a pretty thin line here, and I'd like to think I succeed more than I fail, at any rate.Brad, we fundamentally disagree about deleting threads. To me, the best thing to do, if a thread really and truly does not represent you well, is one of two things. First, own it, admit you were wrong or misguided or that a certain post or idea should never have come to light. Or, if that's too much drama, just forget it. Bury it. Ignore it, and other people will do likewise. People do stupid things sometimes. People change their minds. That's not such a bad thing.Deleting your own posts is one thing, but basically removing an entire conversation just because you started it and now no longer want it around strikes me as pretty iffy, at the very least.As I said, we agree that more mods would help with coverage, though we definitely differ on how many might be needed. Also, Nolan makes a good point re: we'd just be adding relatively powerless people to a very tenuous situation. I saw the point you were getting at. But I also want to point out that there is no way to guarantee round-the-clock coverage, either. If this was a paid position and people were actually on shift during specific periods, then sure, maybe. But we aren't big enough and this is a volunteer position. That is absolutely -not an excuse to do a half-arsed job, by any means, but it does imply that even during periods of normal availability, sometimes we will not be available. If this situation had gone for a couple of days not being resolved, and especially if you'd seen me or other mods active and talking in other places, then yeah, you have a leg to stand on. But I'm pretty sure there wasn't one mod post between when that thread started and when I came in to squash it. I could be wrong there, but the one thing I am certain about is that I, personally, was not here and cannot be blamed for that. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550999/#p550999 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Mayana, thank you. It's appreciated when folks actually see most of what we're getting at. I won't pretend that I'm perfect, I make mistakes just like the next person, but I'm trying to walk a pretty thin line here, and I'd like to think I succeed more than I fail, at any rate.Brad, we fundamentally disagree about deleting threads. To me, the best thing to do, if a thread really and truly does not represent you well, is one of two things. First, own it, admit you were wrong or misguided or that a certain post or idea should never have come to light. Or, if that's too much drama, just forget it. Bury it. Ignore it, and other people will do likewise. People do stupid things sometimes. People change their minds. That's not such a bad thing.Deleting your own posts is one thing, but basically removing an entire conversation just because you started it and now no longer want it around strikes me as pretty iffy, at the very least.As I said, we agree that more mods would help with coverage. I saw the point you were getting at. But I also want to point out that there is no way to guarantee round-the-clock coverage, either. If this was a paid position and people were actually on shift during specific periods, then sure, maybe. But we aren't big enough and this is a volunteer position. That is absolutely -not an excuse to do a half-arsed job, by any means, but it does imply that even during periods of normal availability, sometimes we will not be available. If this situation had gone for a couple of days not being resolved, and especially if you'd seen me or other mods active and talking in other places, then yeah, you have a leg to stand on. But I'm pretty sure there wasn't one mod post between when that thread started and when I came in to squash it. I could be wrong there, but the one thing I am certain about is that I, personally, was not here and cannot be blamed for that. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550999/#p550999 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. I'd never, in a million years, offer to moderate this forum. All due respect to the current staff, but I find the idea that a handful of mods are capable of suddenly creating a process worthy of vetting new mods to this dumpsterfire, without access to the forum's web hosting, with a broken mailing list, during a global pandemic, very tough to swallow. That's a tall order, and way to go pushing more folks towards burnout with posts like these.Maybe this place was amazing once, and I'll grant that it does have value. But you're up against a pretty hard limit if you don't have access to the forum's web hosting, and there's just no way around that. Maybe it is time to just give up and start somewhere new. But wringing your hands and summoning new moderators isn't how you're going to get there. This post just contributed to the current poor state of things while fixing nothing. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550998/#p550998 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @Mayana, I doubt I'm coming back and I have my reasons for saying what i've said.Things got fixed and that's great, i'm just tired of the drama on here.Why did I make this post then? Simple, so people can know how I feel and hopefully some changes or something will come out of it, or at least; people can download the hary Potter stuff before I'm gone. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550995/#p550995 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @jade, ah, I can see how you'd think that.I apologise, I only meant that if there are more mods, this stuff wouldn't happen as much.As for the thread, the way I see it is; I started it so should be able to do waht I like with it.As for the email, in this case; no, but in other cases it might, especially if, at the moment, you're the only active mod.I still think having mods from different parts of the world would help, for example, now it's nearly 7 in the morning, a brit might just be waking up and go on the forum and tackle the issue, where as an American would probably be sleeping.Yeah i get that man, we've all got our own issues to deal with and having people say, see! I knew jade would do, x thing, isn't nice, and yes I'm aware how the bullying comment came across so basicly I'm saying exactly that. Perhaps I should think before writing things down but I do see where you're coming from.Anyway, I'm sure you'll all figure it out in time, I just don't feel like this forum is a thing I want to take part in anymore. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550994/#p550994 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @Jayde I'd just like to say that I am thankful for all the hard work and effort you and the other mods are putting towards keeping this forum from descending into chaos. Not kissing your ass here; I honestly am. Because this place has been hellish lately, and yet you've had to walk on eggshells to avoid upsetting the community while taking care of that.Not that that helped. Close a topic too soon? Power hungry mod. Not close it soon enough? Well clearly you support bullying.Whenever I check the list of new topics, I'm just waiting for the one where you too decide to resign.Sorry to disappoint, folks, but pretty much no forum has 24/7 coverage. If shit gets resolved within 24 hours, I consider that good moderation. And here, it did. Much earlier than that, even.And yet, apparently those few hours are so long for some people that they feel it necessary to become offended and start blaming the mods for everything; not just the slow(er than usual) response time, but also the unresponsiveness of the developers (because that totally is the fault of the mods and admins, and not, you know, the devs) and the copyright rules (which are also a fault of the admins, never mind the fact that they are trying to protect the site from being taken down because of actual laws on this subject).Is there too much drama on this forum? Yeah. But perhaps if that bothers you, you shouldn't make yet another "The Admins Suck And I Quit!" topic, because I'm not sure if you've noticed, but those never cause anything productive. If you're done, then go. At least then it'll be less awkward if/when you come back, as most who decide to leave in a huff do. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550992/#p550992 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. My stance is that it's okay if you want to edit your own posts, but you should not be able to remove a thread outright, particularly not if others have written in it. At that point, you're not only censoring yourself; you're directly impacting the words of other people. Perhaps they had valid things they thought were worth saying in those threads you're thinking of deleting. Why does your right to remove your own thread trump their right to keep their posts intact? To me, it doesn't.No, there is no head mod or head admin at this point. There used to be - I believe Dark unofficially held that post - but that is not how we're doing it at present. Ask Carter and Aaron if you want to. I have a loud voice, but it is still equal to their own in virtually all things. In fact, I tend to defer to those with greater expertise rather than just saying, "Okay, so this is what's happening now".And as far as the bullying thing:Brad wrote:"And also jade? I'm sorry you're the only mod at the moment man but if you want us to think you don't condone bullying, perhaps you shouldn't have let the first rory topic get to 20 or more answers before shutting it down. Also; perhaps an email address on your page would be a good idea, that way; people don't just contact you through the PM system that is basicly broken."This implies that you believed that Rory's first thread carried on as long as it did because on some level we condone bullying. Please reread your post carefully, and perhaps you will see what I mean.In addition, an email address would not have helped in today's situation. I was literally lying in the dark with a fan going for white noise, trying in vain to sleep through head pain that was making my left eye tear up more or less constantly. I would not have known I was receiving email, and would not have responded to it even if I knew. Pretty much the only thing that was going to get through to me at that point was someone hammering on my door; I even had my phone's ringer turned off.You believe that having four or five more mods would be helpful, and would add to coverage. I can see where you're coming from there, but at that point you'd maybe be looking at having mods more for their time coverage than for their skills. I'm not entirely opposed to the idea, but again, I can't just make that decision myself. I suspect that if I tried being the leader, the first among equals as it were, folks would start getting pissed and claiming they saw this coming two years ago, and frankly I don't need that, now or ever. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550987/#p550987 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @rings2006, jade is reading the thread URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550986/#p550986 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @jade, if you were to ask someone from London, how many blocks is that? They'd have no idea what you meant I've crossed the road from the pavement or sidewalk plenty of times,and the corners, I think it's just different in america although I could be wrong.relating to site stuff, I doubt this will be fixed but, when deleting a topic today I was put back on the general game discussion page instead of my threads page and i find that to be strange. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550985/#p550985 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. hope he gets here son URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550984/#p550984 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. So, a few things not directly related to mod stuff.Representing the blind communityThe reason people say this is because some sighted folks have a tendency to see a certain behaviour and then make stupid assumptions. If they saw one blind person stumbling around uncertain of where they were going, they might assume that all of them will have that problem. If they see one person who's doing really well with a dog, they may assume dogs are best for everyone, when that's not the case. As such, there is an increased pressure in some circles to do what you can not to fumble or make yourself look bad, because some will misread this and as a consequence other blind people will look bad. I think it's about 85% bullshit, honestly. I try hard to represent myself well, and I definitely don't want to contribute to people making assumptions...but the assumptions are theirs, not mine. I think it's very important to educate the ignorant where possible.Regarding roads, I am very, very confused. The reason Americans (and Canadians) use blocks is because...that's kind of how roads work in most places. Roads are by no means always straight, and blocks are by no means always the same size, but especially in cities and towns, streets tend to meet one another roughly at right angles a lot of the time. Depending on the width of the street, this will mean traffic lights. Traffic lights allow you to hear traffic patterns, and thus judge when it's safe to cross the street. I'll say right now that there are some roads which are quiet enough that you can just dash across wherever you please, but if you try that on your average city street - in Canada, in America, in England too, because yes I've been there - you're going to end up roadkill. If you aren't crossing at a corner, and if traffic is going more than about twenty kilometres an hour, it's going to have a lot of trouble slamming on the brakes and stopping in the middle of the street while you nip across the road. Also, that's a great way to cause a pile-up. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550983/#p550983 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @jade, I never said you were ok with bullying man. Yes you're a good mod but getting more in will help you out a tun.As for just 1 or 2, no, I think it should at least be 5, that way there's a lot more spred, I guess you could say. The more there is; the easier it will be to crack down on things.So if you're not the head of the mods, who is? Is there even a head mod? Perhaps there should be? One to take care of meeting times and things like that, it's up to you and your group to sort this out.As for deleting threads, I'm going to go through them and delete the ones I feel are worth deleting to me. People put things out there on the internet all the time and get it removed, I don't see it as a big deal.It sounds to me like you'd prefer it if no one can delete their threads and I can't agree with that, it's our threads therefor our freedom to remove them if we see fit to do so. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550982/#p550982 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @Accman, I wonder where it comes from?It's strange to me that peple feel they're better than others, we all have our daly struggles so what makes person 1 better than person 2.You know; i'd love to go to a blind centre in America to see what it's like, I'm sure i'd like some of it because it's different to how we have things here in the UK, but it's very expencive.Another diffirence is the US vs the UK streets and road, from what I've heard; in the US you cross at the end of the street and use these things called blocks, where as in the UK we mostly cross anywhere we can going down the streat and don't have a block system. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550981/#p550981 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Brad, would you care to take three or four minutes and go back through the punishments thread? If you do, you'll note a really interesting thing. I drop an awful lot of warnings for personal attacks. A lot of personal attacks are down to bullying. Do you remember how loudly I defended Haily, just as one specific example? Do you remember that I was the one who proposed a way to let people like rory get officially banned without being punished in the first place? I'd appreciate it if you were to focus on the whole picture, and not just the bits that serve your purpose. I say this because, while I think you've got some good points, I also think you're misrepresenting the situation.I am not at all opposed to having another mod or two on the team to help out. As far as time zones go, I'm all over the place, but frankly I don't care where a mod is from so long as they are good at what they do, and relatively impartial in the bargain. But did you see that bit where I mentioned I have been having hell trying to get through to the list? Right now, that's our primary method of address. We've talked about changing that, but it never really got off the ground. That's on us as a team. What I'm left with, unfortunately, is a situation where I'd love to change a bunch of things, but cannot do it on my own. I can't just tell the team, "hey, we're switching to discord now, here's an invite link". I can't just say, "Okay, I'm tossing the mod application open for two weeks, everyone get your applications in". While I am -capable of doing these things, I am not first among equals here, and believe it or not, as I don't want to just wield the big stick, I'm not interested in using power on the folks I'm trying to work with. This means that right here, in the moment, my hands are pretty tied.Now, if you can be patient and realize that we're trying to work through that, then cool. If you can't, though, and you're just done waiting for things to get better, I guess I can understand that. What I will say is that I think deleting your threads or posts is a bit counterproductive. Deleting threads, especially, seems a bit silly, because then you're also deleting the words of other people, and I'm not sure -anyone outside of an official capacity should even be doing that in the first place. As such, I can't straight-up stop you leaving or doing what you wish, but I'd ask you to strongly reconsider.We are actually in agreement on a lot of things. The only thing I'm stuck on is the implication that I'm actually okay with bullying, when you know full well that I'm not. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550980/#p550980 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @jade, I'm glad you're looking into discord and other things, I'd recommend skype too as people might find that a bit easeier to use.The thing is, if you did have more mods, it could have been tackled in an hour or so of the post being up.The piracy thing, I was just venting there man, I know I can go to other places for that stuff and will but i'm sorry to say that I actually am leaving on Monday.I find this comunity can be great but it can also be dramatic and I don't need nore want that in my life, now you can say and i'd agree with you that you don't have to read the posts, but I feel that for my own health and relaxation; I have to do this.If things change hugely, i'll probably be back but this site is going to need a huge update from the devs or something for me to consider it. This site is, god knows how old, there's tuns of knew HTML PHP and all that jazz that can make this site better but because of lazy devs, not mods, although I do feel they could get onto them a bit more, it probably won't happen. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550978/#p550978 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @jade, I saw you locked the rory topic but you say you don't get how a couple of hours of mod inactivity means I and others who think like me think the mods condone bullying, what mods? The only mod I've seen around here is you. If there were more mods, you'd not have to post with a mygrane because other mods would be on this already.Do I think the mods condone bullying? no, but I do think there should be more and not just american mods iether, if you can get it; try to get some from all over the world. That way; if something like this happens again; the team can shut it down a lot quicker.And also jade? I'm sorry you're the only mod at the moment man but if you want us to think you don't condone bullying, perhaps you shouldn't have let the first rory topic get to 20 or more answers before shutting it down. Also; perhaps an email address on your page would be a good idea, that way; people don't just contact you through the PM system that is basicly broken.As I've said many times now, get more mods who can deal with these things when you can't. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550975/#p550975 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Brad, you will see by now, hopefully, that yes, I did get to that thread.I was also hoping you'd realize that seven hours of downtime does not mean that the mods are not going to deal with something. I'm not precisely sure what you're expecting, but if you believe there is a workable setup where there is a mod on hand to squash things within ten minutes, guaranteed, please think again. I would have hoped that the important thing was that it -did get dealt with fairly, and I've endeavoured to do that. I'm sorry that I happened to be dealing with a migraine today. This heat wave sucks, folks.I would really rather not see you leave, and feel that perhaps you're overreacting a bit. You've done this before, which is why I say so. Mayhap it would be advisable to assume that when mods don't deal with someone who's clearly gone off the rails, it's because they haven't seen it yet, not because they're tacitly okay with it. Because honestly, I hope that none of you reading this actually thought I was going to let BobTheBuilder's thread just hang around untouched. I am many things, but a hypocrite I am not.I know you don't like the piracy issue, but Defender and Canlorn summed that up very well so I won't bother.I also know that we could be doing a better job, but this is where we're at at present, as far as mod activity goes. I have been having no end of trouble getting mails through to the list lately, and I have no idea why. I want to seriously suggest making a Discord server or something, which will at least be more accessible and much more of a realtime way to keep in touch. This problem of it being largely me alone on the staff team being active is not a forever thing, but please bear with us, all right? URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550972/#p550972 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Agreed. For a while, I lived at home in Vermont with my parents and they would help me get to a lot of my local gigs. When I'd be on tour performing with the band I worked with, then I'd just go with them and it would be an awesome time. If I hadn't gotten married, I'd probably still be there with my folks, running my music business right from where I grew up. When my family and I are in Vermont for shows now, my mom and dad still help by taking us to the shows, we help out around the house when they need it. I wasn't what one would call the most successful musician, but I did achieve a lot, and toured from the New England states all the way west to states like California, Washington, Oregon, and so on. I can certainly relate to this Molly you spoke of. I wasn't made fun of like she has been, but I know that feeling of some blind folks approaching me as if I am not even from here on the same planet. It hasn't happened often, but it is not pleasant. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550971/#p550971 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @Draq, I hope jade gets round to it when he can.But like i keep saying, if they had more mods, it would make things tuns easier.@Accman, thanks, I'm really glad you enjoy the Harry Potter stuff.Sadly I agree with you about blind people, I don't know what makes our people entitled but boy can they be.For example; people shitting on Molly Burk, I' not a huge fan of her youtube stuff but oh man, there was an entire thread on vorale about how she's not representing the blind comunity propperly and people ranting about her, it honestly makes me sad. this woman may live with her mum, she may not do things the way other blind people do but you know what she did do that we haven't, got on TV, spoken in front of thousands of peple, visited places to do talks, made quite a bit of money doing said talks and probably more. It seams that when the blind comunity see someone with tallent or who's making a name for themselves, they don't like it at all.I think that's sad and wish Molly the bes of luck.OH and this is another thing and I don't know if it's an american mindset but what's this whole, you aren't representing the blind comunity thing all about? Of course I'm not, I'm representing me, what's the blind comunity got to do with it? Sure, one driver may see 1 blind person and think, ah, they're all like that but that's on the driver not on the blind person, surely? URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550968/#p550968 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Folks,I don't know this Rory at all, but I certainly do feel for the young man. Here he is trying to get it together, and he gets mocked, and even scorned, for it. I followed that recent threat where he was being made fun of. I would love to be able to say that I couldn't believe some of what I saw there and in other threads where he has been mocked. The trouble is that none of it shocks me in the least any more. That boy hasn't had it easy from the sound of it, and goodness only know what the remarks he has seen might have done now. I can agree with you, Brad, when you say that, at least as far as America goes, the blind community really isn't a community in the true sense of the word. It isn't. Some of the nastiest things I think I've ever seen posted anywhere have come from other blind people, and I mean downright hurtful at times. Then we sometimes wonder why sighted folks refer to folks like us as whiny and demanding. Sure, not all blind people are like that, but when all a person has dealt with were ones that were as I just described, then that's not going to leave a good impression at all. I can certainly understand why you would want to leave this forum Brad. There has been an awful lot of drama lately, and that isn't fun for anyone. Some might even go so far as to say that I was part of instigating some of it, but I can assure you that was not my intention. Whatever the case, I've been enjoying reading your posts that I've seen, and am still enjoying the Harry Potter content. Thanks for all you've contributed here. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550967/#p550967 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. As far as the topic making fun of Rory goes, it's entirely possible that Jayde or some other moderator simply hasn't gotten around to dealing with it yet. Give it some time and if it needs to be dealt with it probably will. As you said, Jayde can't be everywhere at once. That includes being on the forum and in real life at once as well. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550965/#p550965 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @jj, Is that posts or threads?I've edited my post to mention the threads instead of my posts. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550961/#p550961 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Ok, what I will do is look through the posts and the ones I don't find useful or think have any use, i will delete but I'll look carefully.Oh and I should make it clear, I mean my threads and will be editing my first post to make that clearer.Why am i deleting my threads, because it makes me feel... Happier, I don't actualy know if i can explain it really, clearer in the head perhaps? Less nervous.It's like a meditation I guess, washing away the thoughts, does that make any sense? URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550960/#p550960 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @jj, Is that posts or threads? URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550961/#p550961 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. 5,029 to delete. What a fun monday. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550958/#p550958 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @defender, I do agree but that's the chance you have to take with these kind of things.@jimmy69, I see where you're coming from and perhaps people could get help from them but honestly I want to leave and be as deleted as i can be. I have nothing to hide, it's just a... Thing... I don't know, I like to leave places completely if i can. I'll see how many I delete on Monday. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550957/#p550957 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. deleting your traces from the forum isn't solving anything, dude. What does that accomplish?If you wanna leave, then leave. I understand why. But deleting yourself is a waste of time and really almost a detriment, you had lots of good posts. This isn't a domestic issue. This isn't like, "I'm packing my shit and leaving you, you asshole!" URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550956/#p550956 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @Brad, don't delete posts. That's a terrible thing to do. Maybe somebody is reading your posts and maybe someone finds value, or is able to push through better. Don't delete posts man. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550954/#p550954 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Lol. this has blown up URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550955/#p550955 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @NevEd, I want to delete as much of myself as I can from the forum so will be removing my posts.@defender, yes actuallly, that's what I'm saying. Use skype or something to make sure they're good at their job, maybe give a couple of test questions over skype, I don't know and it's not my job to figgure that stuff out but their needs to be more mods because Jade can't be everyware at once.About the kids, hmm; true. But if the site was updated and they use the same email address they'd not be able to access the site. and if they used another one, well what if the site tracked the IP ddress and if it noticed someone was trying to make a new acount it could tell the user that they can't do that due to being in the system and that this IP address has been band for x amount of days. Yes VPNS can get around that but, these are all off the top of my head, I'm sure something could be done if smarter people than I put their heads together and thought about it.Well if people in this comunity are going to act up, people should talk about it otherwise it will be done again and again and again. The fact it's like everyware else on the internet should tel you that the internet isn't always the best place. I guess I was annoyed because it's my part of the internet and nothing is being done about it. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550953/#p550953 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Did you not see the part where he mentions interview via skype? URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550948/#p550948 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. I think we should have mod elections every year just to make sure that everyone is still invested in doing it and hasn’t been worn down yet URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550951/#p550951 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Not a bad idea honestly. Though I would even say every 6 months, and we'd have to have some good, simple guidelines. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550952/#p550952 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. So what your suggesting is that we open it up for a bunch of random people to become mods?Yes, because that's worked so well in online games and other short lived audiogames.net alternative forums in the past.And I'm not saying that the kids should be allowed to get away with bullying, simply that no matter what you do they are going to get around bans quite easily if they want to, so some of that is pretty much just a given with the current user makeup.Still, like you said if we had more mods and better systems, it would be easier to handle by far.My problem with your post isn't really that your pissed off about the state of the forum, but more that your not thinking the reasons for the current situation through enough. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550946/#p550946 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. No I didn't actually, thanks for pointing that out.I think that would help sure, but many people are good at giving a positive outward appearance, because they genuinely do want to help... At first.But as soon as the shit hits the fan or things get boring, the real person comes out. That's the drawback of volunteers. In such a small community especially, it seems that all the best ones are either never really there or burn out quickly and leave. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550950/#p550950 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Why delete your posts though? They’ve all been quite good and well thought out. You should leave them for everyone to see them and know that you were a good guy To have posting here. I think your posts can still do a lot of good buy staying up URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550949/#p550949 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. So what your suggesting is that we open it up for a bunch of random people to become mods?Yes, because that's worked so well in online games and other short lived audiogames.net alternative forums in the past.And I'm not saying that the kids should be allowed to get away with bullying, simply that no matter what you do they are going to get around bans quite easily if they want to, so some of that is pretty much just a given with the current user makeup.Still, like you said if we had more mods and better systems, it would be easier to handle by far.My problem with your post isn't really that your pissed off about the state of the forum, but more that your blaming the community at large when it's little different from the rest of the internet from what I've seen. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550946/#p550946 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Did you not see the part where he mentions interview via skype?Come on, dude. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550948/#p550948 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. So what your suggesting is that we open it up for a bunch of random people to become mods?Yes, because that's worked so well in online games and other short lived audiogames.net alternative forums in the past.And I'm not saying that the kids should be allowed to get away with bullying, simply that no matter what you do they are going to get around bans quite easily if they want to, so some of that is pretty much just a given with the current user makeup.Still, like you said if we had more mods and better systems, it would be easier to handle by far.My problem with your post isn't really that your pissed off about the state of the forum, but more that your blaming the community at large when it's little different from the rest of the internet. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550946/#p550946 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Deleting posts isn't going to fix anything. Its not like everyone else is doing it. Just stay for a bit and go. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550945/#p550945 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. IMO there never was and the internet just highlights that fact, because we should realistically be closer like most communities became when the internet got popular, and we are, but not as much as you'd think.Seeing as how we're pretty much always a decade behind the mainstream for most things though, this isn't really surprising.But don't forget about Applevis or Elten as gaming hubs. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550936/#p550936 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @rings, some people are corrupt but the mods aren't, they're just doing their jobs but I think they can do much better.@defender, applevis is awesome and has a new layout.You know the whole blind comunity thing, that's an intirely American thing, some blind people outside of that country will they they're part of it but it's very rare and honestly I can't blame them when this is what the "blind comunity" is.Here there's bullying and all that and it's the same on vorale, so I don't count myself as part of that comunity because it's shameful.Blind people have done some great things for each other but i'd never call us a comunity, reddit is the best place for the comunity idea but even it has issues. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550944/#p550944 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. ok, I'll admit the piracy thing makes sense but I don't care anymore, like I said; I'm done.@Lucas1853, I'm not just deleting a post, i'm deleting all of my posts. This sight needs to change and like I said above, the piracy thing makes sense from a standpoint of protecting the site but that's not all I'm talking about and I even said that I'm not saying people should do that but the mods need to step up, I'm sure there's more than one and if there isn't, there should be mod forms or something so there can be more of them to help this site out.@camlorn, OH I know I can, I'll admit to a bit of venting at that part.@defender, Yes I'm mad because this forum is full of bullying and nothing is done. There's only one mod and he can't be everywhere at once? Then get more mods, it really is that simple.Make a form, ask audiogamers if they want to be mods, let them fill it out, talk on skype or something and go from there, it's simple. I know I did this before and I thought this would be brought up but I don't care anymore, I actually am done, by monday if you bother to look; you'll see my posts disappearing and I'll be gone from this forum.1. Then I'm glad I'm leaving and honestly that's just an excuse, oh they're kids so they're going to fight, let them do it. no! If they're going to bully others, you explain why that isn't good and if that doesn't work, well, then they can't use that website, in other words; they're band. Just because they're teenagers does not mean they don't know what they're doing, trust me; they do.2. I don't know either but it's annoying that only some things are fixed, I'm telling you; people are going to jump from this place to the next one in a couple years or so.3. I do agree and that's why I said in my first post that I'm not saying that people should give links out, I was venting there; I'll give you that.As for the kids, let them come, I don't care, because they need to learn that what you do and say actually means something in the long run. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550941/#p550941 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. i sadly agree with op,but knowing the way the world works the mods will step in on this because some people are corrupt not saying these mods are but who knows URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550937/#p550937 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. i sadly agree with op,but knowing the way the world works the mods will step in on this because some people are corrupt URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550937/#p550937 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. IMO there never was and the internet just highlights that fact, because we should realistically be closer like most communities became when the internet got popular, and we are, but not as much as you'd think.Seeing as how we're pretty much always a decade behind the mainstream for most things though, this isn't really surprising.But don't forget about Applevis. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550936/#p550936 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. IMO there never was and the internet just highlights that fact, because we should realistically be closer like most communities became when the internet got popular.But don't forget about Applevis. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550936/#p550936 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. @10Frankly, it's kind of sad, but this site is in many ways a lot more than the entire English speaking blind gaming community. To my knowledge there's audiogames.net, Twitter/facebook, insert-blindness-org-mailing-list-here, and that's it for global communities. Everything else is local, and the blindness org lists are kind of like political parties.It's probably mostly nostalgia speaking, but it feels a lot like blind people have turned inward in the last 10 years. Being as I can think of lots of explanations for that there's some truth in it. We've not stopped fighting the battles or anything, but there's no longer cohesion outside whatever your local circle is. Maybe there never was. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550935/#p550935 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Temper tantrum much? I'd respect this more if you hadn't done it once before and if your points were better...We're all pretty stressed and pissed off right now though so I can't really be that upset at you Brad, especially given how good you've been to this community over the years.1. Some people were mocking Rory because they are ignorant children and that's what ignorant children do when they don't understand something. That pisses me off as well, but the fact is that a large part of the audio gaming scene has now moved into the next generation, and there is little that can be done about it when at least half the community is under 18. Plus we only have one active mod, he can't be everywhere at once, but the lack of good moderator candidates can probably be blamed more on the community at large than the forum.Others criticized him because they understood that Rory was almost certainly full of it since he had quote unquote quit the forum several times in the past only to come back a couple days later, and since he was still posting inflammatory nonsense after that ban topic it looked as though this would be no different.Some of us see any mental health issue as vitally important. Some of us feel like we're getting played when the same person keeps doing the same things again and again without changing significantly, regardless of their situation. Some of us just don't take mental health seriously enough. I fall into the second camp and you seem to fall into the first.Maybe that's because I haven't had anyone close to me who has struggled with anything more than non suicidal depression, so I don't appreciate the gravity of it as much, but on the other hand, maybe that makes me more objective about it and less easy to manipulate as well.2. Blame the web devs for their absents, not the mods. Neither you nor I knows the specifics about when and how contact was attempted, but they have said they've tried several times, and the devs in question have come on to perform needed maintenance a couple times in the last few years and completely ignored the obvious issues and calls for communication while doing so.So I'm really not sure what the mods could be doing differently here...3. As mainstream gaming slowly becomes more accessible and more mainstream indi devs show interest in making games for us, so too does the attention grow for the site it's self. I'm sure you've noticed the shift in the last few years... It's impossible not to have.Therefore, the site naturally must adapt to those changes. Anti piracy measures are a good way to improve public image, and since this site represents the entire English speaking blind gaming community, and we're just too small to have piracy topics get berried, it's pretty damn important that we make a good impression.Weather you believe that non gaming/software piracy should fall under that is your business, but you can't deny how hypocritical it would be if the mods were to just tacitly allow certain types of it, and it would be only a matter of time before they would have to make their position clear in writing, which would implicate the site legally in the unlikely but more possible now than ever event that someone took issue with something posted here.If the drama is the main issue your having than I totally get it, but pretty much everything else you said was highly subjective. Obviously that doesn't invalidate your feelings, but I would ask you to at least consider the situation better before launching into a righteous diatribe and firing up all the angry kids. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550931/#p550931 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: I'm done.
Re: I'm done. Temper tantrum much? I'd respect this more if you hadn't done it once before and if your points were better...We're all pretty stressed and pissed off right now though so I can't really be that upset at you Brad, especially given how good you've been to this community over the years.1. Some people were mocking Rory because they are ignorant children and that's what ignorant children do when they don't understand something. Others criticized him because they understood that Rory was almost certainly full of it because he had quote unquote quit the forum several times in the past only to come back a couple days later, and since he was still posting inflammatory nonsense after that ban topic it looked as though this would be no different.Some of us see any mental health issue as vitally important. Some of us feel like we're getting played when the same person keeps doing the same things again and again without changing significantly, regardless of their situation. Some of us just don't take mental health seriously enough. I fall into the second camp and you seem to fall into the first.Maybe that's because I haven't had anyone close to me who has struggled with anything more than non suicidal depression, so I don't appreciate the gravity of it as much, but on the other hand, maybe that makes me more objective about it and less easy to manipulate as well.2. Blame the web devs for their absents, not the mods. Neither you nor I knows the specifics about when and how contact was attempted, but they have said they've tried several times, and the devs in question have come on to perform needed maintenance a couple times in the last few years and completely ignored the obvious issues and calls for communication while doing so.So I'm really not sure what the mods could be doing differently here...3. As mainstream gaming slowly becomes more accessible and more mainstream indi devs show interest in making games for us, so too does the attention grow for the site it's self. I'm sure you've noticed the shift in the last few years... It's impossible not to have.Therefore, the site naturally must adapt to those changes. Anti piracy measures are a good way to improve public image, and since this site represents the entire English speaking blind gaming community, and we're just too small to have piracy topics get berried, it's pretty damn important that we make a good impression.Weather you believe that non gaming/software piracy should fall under that is your business, but you can't deny how hypocritical it would be if the mods were to just tacitly allow certain types of it, and it would be only a matter of time before they would have to make their position clear in writing, which would implicate the site legally in the unlikely but more possible now than ever event that someone took issue with something posted here.If the drama is the main issue your having than I totally get it, but pretty much everything else you said was highly subjective. Obviously that doesn't invalidate your feelings, but I would ask you to at least consider the situation better before launching into a righteous diatribe and firing up all the angry kids. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/550931/#p550931 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
