Stus-List Re: Winch Size for C/now speed of tack turn

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Caution on a late release of a genoa.  The boat has a 155% North 3Di, 
which has been raced 13 times.  The last race, on the last tack, leeward 
crew did a late release, resulting in the spreader punching a hole just 
above the spreader patch.  Yes, North is going to add a little more 
height to the spreader patch.


Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C 35 Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 9/12/2023 5:46 PM, Bob Mann via CnC-List wrote:
On my C mark I, I replaced the primary winches with Lewmar 42's.  
I used to sail/race with a 170 but now our class has limited the 
largest sail to 155.  62 yo and still occasionally single-hand in races.
Letting the jib/genoa backwind so the wind is pushing the bow into the 
turn before releasing the sheet helps, as well as then slowing the 
turn so the jib can be brought in quickly while not under as much 
pressure. Not much boat speed should be lost doing this.

Bob Mann
Mystic

Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu
Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Stus-List Re: Engine strangeness x 2

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Doug,

If you have an electric pump that has the oil pressure safety switch, 
between the (+) on the coil and the elec. fuel pump, I would recommend 
you install an bypass switch around the safety switch.  I just resolved 
that I had an intermittent failure mode in the safety switch that would 
ground the elec. fuel pump _and_ the coil. It looks like a bad coil, ie 
no spark to the distributor.  I finally checked the oil pres which was 
~40psi, flipped the maintenance bypass switch, engine purred to life.


Don Kern
/Fireball/, C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 6/13/2023 5:27 AM, Doug Mountjoy via CnC-List wrote:
Karl, check your whole ignition system, points, distributor, coil, and 
plug wires for any looseness damage or wear. Your problem definitely 
sounds electrical.


Douglas Mountjoy
1988 C LF 39
Mexico at large
1984 Sabre 34
Port Orchard, WA

On Mon, Jun 12, 2023, 22:42 Karl Kuzis via CnC-List 
 wrote:


Since we are on stories of oddness I have 2.

First, when cruising along at modest rpm, will have a sudden shut
down. Just off. No change in sound, smell, rpm, etc just as if
ignition switch cut out. Suspecting a loose connection I proofed
all wires / connections and we'll test it out cruising around
next week. Any odd ideas to keep in mind?

Second, episodically when motoring at higher rpm close to hull
speed will have a sudden racing of the engine with loss of power.
Pull back throttle, and goes back to normal but not unusual to
reoccur. Haven't noticed it at lower speed or rpm.
I'm suspicious of cavitation but haven't thought it thru as to
causes, tests of theory, remedies or other options. Thoughts?

C 29 Mark 1 with a recently rebuilt Atomic 4 and 2 bade folding
prop.

Karl Kuzis
Firefly
C Mk1
karl.ku...@gmail.com

On Tue, Jun 13, 2023, 3:18 AM Korbey Hunt via CnC-List
 wrote:

Scary stuff. Frustrating when "professionals" muck things up.


Get Outlook for Android 

*From:* Todd Williams via CnC-List 
*Sent:* Monday, June 12, 2023 6:40:52 PM
*To:* Stus-List 
*Cc:* Todd Williams 
*Subject:* Stus-List Re: Engine strangeness
Jon and others,

Until two years ago, my boat also used to stall in idle when
approaching docks. Then, midway across Lake Ontario from Cape
Vincent to Sodus on a calm day the fresh water pump/antifreeze
circulator seized up. There was melting belt rubber with smoke
as the bearings stopped turning. Five days and $56 later I had
a new antifreeze circulator in place and we haven’t stalled
out since. The friction in the bearings were enough to strain
the engine into a stall.

TODD

On Mon, Jun 12, 2023 at 7:26 PM JP Mail via CnC-List
 wrote:

Previous boat
‘79 Nicholson 303
Yanmar 2qm15
320 hrs.

Starts and runs all day. Slowing while approaching a
dock-stalls.
Change filters, check for loose fuel lines, change crush
washers…..
Approaching a dock….stall. Always while slowing down.
Approaching the fuel dock at Dodson’s was told “I’m going
there!” By the nice man on his Hinckley.  My response,
“Sorry,(engine stalls) I am.
The fuel pickup was at the forward end of the cylindrical
tank. When I slowed, all the crud would slosh forward and
block the pickup causing a stall.
Unfortunately the yard cleaned the tank and replaced it.
they also inadvertently punctured it and diesel would run
out the bottom. Found this out after a day sailing. Back
to the yard and a new tank was installed.
Unfortunately they inadvertently severed the propane line
while cutting a 2” hole in a bulkhead to run a new vent
line. It was obscured by the insulation. Found this out
when it blew up. With 2 of us onboard. ‘Nother story. I’m
sure I told it here at some point.
Jon Pratt
Hideaway 35-3
Stamford CT
Sent from my iPhone
Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo
Album site and help me pay the associated bills.  Make a
contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo
Album site and help me pay the associated bills.  Make a
contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album
site and help me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:

Stus-List Re: Half Century Club

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Me too (49), she is seeing her age, have to replace original uppers 
shrouds and bow & stern stays.   Weren't these boats guaranteed for 50 
years???


Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 1/25/2023 1:02 PM, Matt Wolford via CnC-List wrote:


I’m just a pup (48).

*From:*Neil Gallagher via CnC-List 
*Sent:* Wednesday, January 25, 2023 11:39 AM
*To:* Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List 
*Cc:* Neil Gallagher 
*Subject:* Stus-List Re: Half Century Club

Same here, Weatherly turns 50 this year.

Neil Gallagher
Weatherly 35-1
Glen Cove, NY

On 1/25/2023 10:20 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List wrote:

Coquina is 50 this year. Who else do we have at or past the
half-century mark?

*/Joe Della Barba Coquina C 35 MK I/*



Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and 
help me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:

https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Thanks for your help.

Stu


Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu
Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Stus-List Re: C 29 Mk1 tuning questions

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Doug,
Just a note.  I also race on a J-30 and the owner's Loos gauge scale had 
worn off.  He talk to Loos and they had him send back the gauge so they 
calibrate then add a new scale.


Don Kern
/Fireball, /C 35 Mk2
Bristol, RI

On 10/19/2022 8:55 PM, Doug Robinson via CnC-List wrote:

YO;

It has been our observation that the Loos gauge readings are relative 
and not specific, our gauge will not match yours.  But if you  use my 
gauge (or yours) and measure my rig you can use the same gauge to 
return to your boat and match settings.   We could be wrong in this.


One of those races where we interchange crew members, Chris Doyle from 
Skip Doyle's boat Rocking Chair was delegated to our boat...first 
thing he did was to loosen the rig and we did well. Wish we had kept 
those settings, I think we sail to tight.


Doug Robinson

s/v Nemesis

On 10/15/22 18:03, Karl Kuzis via CnC-List wrote:

Hello all,

We are new owners of Hull#45 "Firefly" and I am interested in hearing 
if any one has a set of starting rig tension measurements you could 
share.


Loos Gauge numbers would be great.

Just replaced the headstay due to wire damage I found under the foil. 
(Wanted to avoid burying bad wire under the new roller furling). Now 
working on retuning the rig.


All insight and experience sharing welcome!

Respectfully, Karl

Karl & Doris Kuzis
C 29 Mk1 "Firefly"

Stus-List Re: C 35 Mainsheet

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Joe,
I believe the Mk1's Mainsheet traveler is just in front of the helm 
whereas mine (Mk2) is at the bridge deck (seat) aft of the 
companionway.  I have changed over to a multi line 4:1 course line and a 
4:1 fine trim line which gives me a 16:1 advantage on the fine tune. The 
16:1 is a big advantage in racing for final trim of the main and the 
ability to release/ease the main when overpowered or rounding the upwind 
mark.


If you go to the Harken catalog 
 page 258,  my set 
up is similar to the 4:1/16:1 Gross/Fine, except I replaced the two "A" 
(#2600) blocks with a single, mid range, double block #2602 on the 
boom.  Because of the location of the traveler, low on the bridge deck i 
flipped the cams over so the release is an upward motion and to lock is 
a downward pull. The change was done in 2017 and  I can't tell from the 
catalog if the current cams will allow you to remount them.  The reason 
for the change is that the traveler being located at the forward end of 
cockpit it was difficult to release the mainsheet from the helm.


Hope this helps,

Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 7/15/2022 11:13 AM, Joe Della Barba via CnC-List wrote:


Has anyone changed their 35 to a multi-part tackle and cam cleat that 
you operate from the traveler back at the helm instead of the stock 
system that runs a line up to the mast and back to a cabin top winch?

Would 4:1 be enough or would 6:1 be better?

My preventer is a pretty big 4 part and cam cleat setup, it just about 
looks like it could do the job.


Joe Della Barba

Coquina C 35 MK I

Kent Island MD USA

Stus-List Re: Genoa sheets

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Paul
It kind of depends on your track set up.  My #4 (~110%) leads outside 
the forward lower and inside center upper and aft lower.


Don Kern
/Fireball/, C Mk2
Bristol, RI

On 7/9/2022 1:11 PM, Paul Florin via CnC-List wrote:

On a 35ft C MK II with a 110% genoa, sheets inside or outside shrouds?

-- Paul Florin



*/_
_/*

Stus-List Re: C owners need information

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Dan,

Since your boat was once registered in the US as /Rainbow /with a USCG 
registration number of 1024202 on Dec 1994 and a HIN of ZCC44001H586 you 
could request an "Abstract of a Title" which should provide record of 
all the information submitted to the USCG including the chain of 
ownership and whether the boat was subject to the "Jones Act" ie; built 
in Canada.


The USCG form (application fee $25.00 USD) can be found at:

https://www.dco.uscg.mil/Our-Organization/Deputy-for-Operations-Policy-and-Capabilities-DCO-D/National-Vessel-Documentation-Center/

Since the the USCG documentation expired Dec. 2001, it may take some 
time before you get an answer.


When I received the "Abstract of a Title" for my boat, the very first 
line was "This vessel was built at ..."


Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI



/Fireball/, C Mk-2

On 7/6/2022 10:48 PM, Motion Designs Limited via CnC-List wrote:
In February 1976, the initial models built at Rhode Island were the 
24, 26 and 29


Page 30, The Pursuit of Excellence

The Landfall 42 was project 76-1 so it wouldn’t be built till mid or 
late 76 with the Landfall 38 ( 78-13 ) being added in late 78 , early 79


Now what I’ve wondered is how much the “Jones Act” influenced the 
decision to build Landfalls in the US, if they were going to used as 
commercial charter vessels or was it just closer to the intended 
market.  I’ve read somewhere that suggestion but I don’t know how 
valid that is


JKC

www.candcyachts.com
Motion Designs Limited
647 990 7752

Stus-List Re: 86 boat for sale near me

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

This is what I have for her


C 38 Mk3  9
ZCC38009I586915272 -x   Escape



Don Kern
C 35 Mk2
Bristol, RI

On 5/3/2022 3:10 PM, Tom Buscaglia via CnC-List wrote:
I heard about this one from a friend.  It’s at the marina next to my 
club.


The broker is a dumbass from what I understand and the listing looks 
wrong too, unless there was ever a 1968 MK III 38.    But,  from what 
my friend who lives two slips away from her, she’s in great shape. 
 The owners dad fell I’ll and he had to relocate to CA.  So, the price 
is nice.


https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/1986-c$c-mk-iii-8019470/

If anyone on the list is interested, I’ll go check her out.

Tom Buscaglia
S/V Alera
1990 C 37+/40
Vashon WA
P 206.463.9200
C 305.409.3660


On May 3, 2022, at 9:43 AM, Stu via CnC-List  
wrote:




I have reorganized and retitled some of the articles in the Do It 
Yourself section of the Photo Album.


Included now are a couple of new items from Chuck Scheaffer Resolute 
1989 C 34R:


Cockpit floor using EVA Foam and Replacing Frameless Windows.  Thanks 
Chuck.


All of these projects have been sent in from C Owners so they are 
tried and tested. If you have started or completed a project you 
would like to share, let me know and I'll let you know what I need.


Stu

Stus-List Re: Spring Checklist

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Chuck

I believe the new electronic flares are acceptable as long as it carries 
the USCG approval stamp.  Of course that is the most expensive one available


Don


On 3/29/2022 9:24 AM, CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List wrote:

Hi Korbey,
I read that battery operated flares were excellent devices and getting 
very popular but USCG were not accepting them as basic requirement, 
because they require batteries that can die at any time.  I read you 
can carry the battery flares, but you still need to still carry the 
old style flares onboard to pass inspection.  Has that changed?


Chuck S


On 03/29/2022 3:34 AM Korbey Hunt via CnC-List 
 wrote:



Re replacement flares.  You can now buy a USCG approved battery 
operated strobe light on Amazon that replaces flares.  It does not 
expire though routine battery replacement is required.


Get Outlook for Android 

*From:* CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List 
*Sent:* Sunday, March 27, 2022 12:37:58 PM
*To:* Stus-List 
*Cc:* Stu ; CHARLES SCHEAFFER 


*Subject:* Stus-List Re: Spring Checklist

Printed me a copy of Stu's Spring checklist already.  It's a big 
help.  Thanks, Stu


Bought new flares at Walmart.  Mine expired 2020.  New ones are only 
good for three years.


Chuck S


> On 03/27/2022 2:05 PM Stu via CnC-List  wrote:
>
>
> Spring is here and it will soon be sailing season (well for some
> people).  Don't forget to get your copy of the Spring Checklist - 
it is

> a lot easier than trying to remember.
>
> 
https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fcncphotoalbum.com%2FSpring_Checklist.pdfdata=04%7C01%7C%7C0ab90b2576d740bf76c408da102963fb%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637840067196951639%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000sdata=lXsyXp9BXgiEim0vZswRKXmKoVk%2B5IISICbOnlKbqvI%3Dreserved=0 
 


>
> Stu

Stus-List Re: List problems

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Stu,

No problem, but I use Thunderbird and have not had problems with the CnC 
list


Don Kern

On 3/8/2022 9:43 AM, Stu via CnC-List wrote:

I guess I was wrong.  The problems started when I put the cutting board
footer in the emails.

Now we have identified the problem -- it is not with the list but
specifically with how some email programs and providers handle the
emails.  What is disturbing is that one company decides what is best for
you and all the other companies do not see a problem.

Now as an experiment, I am adding a link to the body of this message.
Let's see how it goes through --

http://www.cncphotoalbum.com/cutting_boards

Stu
There are no links in this footer.

There are no links in this footer.

Stus-List Re: Email headaches

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Stu

I use Thunderbird as the email client, no problems

Don


On 2/3/2022 1:25 PM, Stu via CnC-List wrote:


From what I am reading, these problems are not across the board. 
Individual

email clients, servers, etc. appear to be the culprits.

The archives for the list, are not showing any 'ghosts'.  Every 
message has

full content and appears as regular text -- no funny html characters.

I am sure with all the help I am getting that we will conquer.

Stu
There is still time to get the Admiral something for Valentine's Day:
cncphotoalbum.com/cutting_boards

There is still time to get the Admiral something for Valentine's Day:
cncphotoalbum.com/cutting_boards

Stus-List Re: List has been quiet

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

C custom logoed kitchen/galley cutting boards are now available at:
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com/cutting_boards


Stu
Nope  message said 404 Not Found
Don


On 1/26/2022 11:14 AM, Stu via CnC-List wrote:

C custom logoed kitchen/galley cutting boards are now available at:
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com/cutting_boards


Just making sure that the list is working but little activity.
Stu

https://www.paypal.me/stumurray   Thanks - Stu -->
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu -->

Stus-List Re: C to race - cold weather discussion topic

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Dennis,

You are close with the boat you own.  Found the 35 mk1 hard to beat.  My 
boat 35 Mk2 (47 years old) does sail close to her PHRF rating.  Unless 
we really screw up tactically, (going to wrong side of the course, etc) 
she finishes in the the top 5-10% of the class. Family sailed boat (41 
years), out of water every year (New England), bottom redone every 
spring, faired and spray painted, sails are OK for PHRF (just bought new 
number 1 Genoa
replacing the 2002 North).  You have to sail her on her design lines and 
keep her pointing.  She is old, so you have to keep up with her maintenance.


Don Kern
Fireball, C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 11/29/2021 3:57 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List wrote:
If one was to buy a C to totally trick out for handicap racing, 
which model would you buy and why?


What modifications would you make if you had a bunch of boat bucks?

!!!  Don't forget to trim your responses if this thread builds.  !!!

--
Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --https://www.paypal.me/stumurray   Thanks - Stu
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Sacrificial anodes

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Dave,

Did you change the bottom paint ?
Many years ago I had the eating the anodes problem and what I determined 
was the bottom paint was conductive and was setting up hull surface 
loops thru the paint.  Further I found that all my bronze overboards had 
connecting ground wire even though the piping was all plastic/pvc.  I 
removed all the overboard ground wires and changed to Int'l CSC bottom 
paint.  I now use a single new doughnut shaft anode every year and it is 
approx 30-40% sacrificed at the end of the sailing season.


Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 11/19/2021 5:11 PM, David Knecht via CnC-List wrote:
Some may remember a Stump the Chumps post I made back in 2015.  At 
that time, I had pulled the boat for the season and found that two of 
my three anodes were gone, and the third barely present, which was 
something that had never happened before.  They were previously in 
such good shape that I had to decide whether to reuse them the next 
season or not.  We decided that Joe deserved a prize for suggesting 
the idea that stray current in a marina I stayed at for several days 
had eaten the anodes.  I am afraid I am going to have to recall the 
bottle of Rum that I never gave Joe.


That year seemed an anomaly and every year since then, the anodes have 
been in pretty good shape at the end of the season so I presumed Joe 
was right and the problem was gone.  Aries was hauled yesterday, so I 
went down to winterize and cover today.  To my surprise, the situation 
was much like 2015: the prop anode was completely gone and one of the 
two shaft anodes was gone.  The other was nearly completely consumed 
with just a bit of metal hanging on.  What eliminates the stray 
current hypothesis is that I never plugged into shore power at any 
time this season.  I don’t really understand stray currents, but I 
thought that if you don’t plug into shore power, you are not going to 
have this problem.  Is that correct and if so, any new hypotheses?   
Nothing electrical on the boat has changed over the last 3 years, so 
it is not some new wiring that I have done.   Dave


S/V Aries
1990 C 34+
New London, CT



Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --https://www.paypal.me/stumurray   Thanks - Stu
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Bed-It Butyl Tape

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Dennis,

As usual, thank you for the info, order placed with Hamilton Marine.

Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 10/2/2021 8:14 AM, Dennis C. via CnC-List wrote:
https://shop.hamiltonmarine.com/products/butyl-tape-bed-it-1-2--x-50--roll-4482.html 
<https://shop.hamiltonmarine.com/products/butyl-tape-bed-it-1-2--x-50--roll-4482.html>


--
Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA

On Sat, Oct 2, 2021 at 5:15 AM DJ via CnC-List <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


So,  marine-how-to is run by just one man and he had a stroke a
few weeks ago (I posted about it, here, at the time).  Last I
heard he was alert but had a long recovery ahead of him.  There is
no one to service the site or the store right now.  So, I believe
they just disabled the whole thing.

It's going to take some searching to find the right stuff.

Please, let us all know if you're able to find a source.

Danny

On Oct 2, 2021 2:19 AM, Donald Kern via CnC-List
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


I went to the web site http://marinehowto.com/bed-it-tape>> that this forum
recommended to purchase a roll of Bed-It tape and did not find
that the tape was available.  Did /Marine how to/ get out of
the Butyl tape business?  Is there a recommended alternate ?


Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI


Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to
help with the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to
the list - use PayPal to send contribution --
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray <https://www.paypal.me/stumurray>
Thanks - Stu





Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu


Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Exterior Teak hand rails and trim

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

There was discussion on teak and what was the best application to 
apply.  However, on my '74 C Mk2 the exterior trim and handrails 
have been bare for the last 10 years (the varnish flacked off).  I kind 
of like the look of the lightly greyed teak, what are the disadvantages 
of not putting a finish on the teak?


Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Bed-It Butyl Tape

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

I went to the web site  that this forum 
recommended to purchase a roll of Bed-It tape and did not find that the 
tape was available.  Did /Marine how to/ get out of the Butyl tape 
business?  Is there a recommended alternate ?



Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: C 33-II vs 35-II now race course design

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Dennis
Does ORRez provide a base from which they adjust a boat model?  Also how 
does the rating compare to the previous PHRF ratings, especially away 
from the middle ratings of the fleet?


Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 9/12/2021 4:40 AM, Dennis C. via CnC-List wrote:

My area is switching from PHRF to ORRez.

Dennis C.
Touché 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA


On Sep 11, 2021, at 10:17 PM, Donald Kern via CnC-List 
 wrote:


 With the computer power we now have, PHRF can produce Spin, 
non-Spin, W/L and Random (around the buoys) ratings.  There are also 
formulas to adjust the rating given wind conditions (low, med, and 
high) which can be applied pre or post race. And Time-on-Distance 
(ToD) or Time-on-Time (ToT) Systems.
The problem becomes the reluctance for the organizing authorities to 
implement the varied adjustments (to hard/difficult) and the racers 
to accept them (that is not the way we did it last year, I'm confused).


There is also the problem on how to handle sports and foiling boats, 
i.e. those boats that are extremely maneuverable and can take off 
(literally) in the right (higher) wind conditions.


Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI


Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu


Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: C 33-II vs 35-II now race course design

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

With the computer power we now have, PHRF can produce Spin, non-Spin, 
W/L and Random (around the buoys) ratings.  There are also formulas to 
adjust the rating given wind conditions (low, med, and high) which can 
be applied pre or post race.  And Time-on-Distance (ToD) or Time-on-Time 
(ToT) Systems.
The problem becomes the reluctance for the organizing authorities to 
implement the varied adjustments (to hard/difficult) and the racers to 
accept them (that is not the way we did it last year, I'm confused).


There is also the problem on how to handle sports and foiling boats, 
i.e. those boats that are extremely maneuverable and can take off 
(literally) in the right (higher) wind conditions.


Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 9/11/2021 12:21 PM, Gary Nylander via CnC-List wrote:


I’m surprised that nobody has mentioned the Chesapeake Bay PHRF which 
has adopted multiple ratings for boats. They have Circular/Random 
ratings which cover the kinds of courses which run around government 
marks and have all kinds of directions and they have W/L ratings for 
those courses. Messy but trying to cover the bases. Th main issue is 
they give all us old folks with old types of boats (read C) the same 
ratings for all courses. That’s why more boats are racing CRCA and 
CHESS (Ches Bay Short Handed). That’s why I don’t bother any more.


Gary

30-1

Maryland

*From:* David Risch via CnC-List 
*Sent:* Saturday, September 11, 2021 7:14 AM
*To:* Stus-List 
*Cc:* David Risch 
*Subject:* Stus-List Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: C 33-II vs 35-II now race 
course design


It was my understanding that PHRF ratings factored in reaching.

That said.   1 ¼ mile W/L course(s) on a sym 40’  got old real fast.   
Needed 8 crew.  And then burnt out that crew in a 4 race a day 
regatta.   No fun.


We stopped that silliness years ago.

Only long distance now.

*From:* Randal Stafford via CnC-List >

*Sent:* Friday, September 10, 2021 10:58 PM
*To:* Stus-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
*Cc:* Randal Stafford >
*Subject:* Stus-List Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: C 33-II vs 35-II now race 
course design


This debate has raged within Colorado Sail & Yacht Club for the last 
several years.  The J/22 racers argue that the larger PHRF boats 
(spinnaker or not) should sail windward/leeward courses like they do. 
 The larger PHRF boats (including spinnaker boats) like reaching 
because that’s when they’re fastest.  And it’s not unusual for RC’s 
best-laid plans to be ruined by mother nature (e.g. 180-degree wind 
shifts after a race has started on a course around fixed buoys).


I conclude that a single rating number is a poor compromise across 
multiple points of sail and a range of wind speeds - it’s like 
estimating a surface with a point.  I win when it’s blowing hard, but 
get beat in light air by asym boats on broad reach.  There’s no way a 
single number can equalize boats across all possible courses and 
conditions.


So as an experiment we’ve done what Donald Kern mentioned in another 
reply - sometimes we make the J/22s and Capri 22s sail triangles in 
addition to W/L, and the larger PHRF boats sail W/L in addition to 
triangles, using long courses that combine course types.  At the very 
least it gives us some empathy for each other.


Cheers,

Randy Stafford

S/V Grenadine

C 30-1 #79

Ken Caryl, CO

On Sep 10, 2021, at 12:49 PM, Andrew Burton via CnC-List
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:

Joe, Kenny Read agrees with you. He wrote an article to that
effect some months ago.

Andy

Andrew Burton

26 Beacon Hill

Newport, RI

USA 02840

+401 965 5260

https://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/



On Sep 10, 2021, at 12:35, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:



I have been in races that were almost 100% downwind or 100%
upwind, thanks to perfect timing of wind shifts. Somehow it
worked out and the PHRF ratings are what they are and we dealt
with it.

I know many people disagree, but IMHO making big boat racing
resemble dinghy racing and making dinghy racing a science
experiment with perfect upwind and downwind legs has not been
a good thing at all. I once had 3 dinghy fleets and sent the
Lasers reaching up the river a bit to deconflict them with the
other fleets and I never heard so much whining – we can’t sail
on a REACH! It turned out you actually can if the RC makes you 

YMMV

   

Stus-List Re: C 33-II vs 35-II now race course design

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

At one time we use to set the triangle and run the boats around the 
triangle, then windward leeward (beat, reach, reach, beat, downwind).  
That course always seemed better for different generation boats since it 
involved all points of sail.
Now if the organizer sets a W/L course the lightweight A-sym boats sail 
a course close to triangle reach course, the med displ symmetric spin 
boats sail a broader reach downwind and the heavier symmetric spin (like 
my 35 mk2) sail close to down wind.  Can never figure out who is ahead 
until we cross the finish line.


Don Kern
/Fireball/, C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 9/10/2021 12:54 PM, Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List wrote:
The problem is with the handicap numbers.  A triangle course has only  
33% beat, if equilateral.  The more you spread out the offset mark, 
the less percentage the beat; the more you pull it in, the higher 
percentage beat.
For PHRF to work, I believe they recommend at least a 40% beat.  
Preferred is a 50% beat like a windward/leeward or a triangle with an 
extra beat.
On a dead downwind course one should sail their best angle for the 
wind speed, not go dead downwind.  That's true even for the white sail 
fleet.  There was a great article decades ago about the pole adjusted 
forward to improve the broad reach for white sailed boats. But with my 
filing system, I'll never be able to produce it if asked.

Ron
Wild Cheri
C 30-1
STL


On Friday, September 10, 2021, 11:31:22 AM CDT, Della Barba, Joe via 
CnC-List  wrote:



This is an ongoing issue with racing, everything is W/L dinghy racing 
no matter if your boat is 10 feet long or 110 feet long. Back in the 
day when men were men and sheep were scared we used government marks 
and you got what you got, reaches, beats, runs, whatever.


When I used to RC C races I decided dead downwind on a hot day was 
misery for the white sail fleet, so the spinnaker boats went on a W/L 
course and the non-spin fleet used the same windward mark but had an 
offset somewhere, say beam reach to the offset and then broad reach to 
finish. Less tactics but less heatstroke too!




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Stus-List Re: Dorade vent replacement

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Peter
My 35 has a SS mushroom vents similar to what Defender carries (Vetus 
Mushroom Vent (PORTOS1)).  Racing with spray coming onto cabin top they 
are screwed down to prevent water entry. Cruising they are lifted to 
vent,  but being a RI boat we don't have extreme hot weather.  They have 
never fouled the sheets.


Don Kern
/Fireball/, C 35 Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 7/1/2021 2:33 PM, Peter McMinn via CnC-List wrote:


My 85 37 has the traditional cowl vents on the dorade boxes. Jib sheet 
caught one and tossed it in the drink yesterday, motivating me to 
upgrade to a low profile vent that will fit the 7” space. Nicro and 
Marinco make a nice mini solar vent that will fit, but I think these 
are designed for direct thru-deck application, not a dorade box.


What solutions have you folks found for a low profile vent?


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costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
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Stus-List Re: Our next online rendezvous

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Dave,
Wed night beer can racing for me to!
Don Kern
Fireball, C 35 mk2
Bristol RI
Commodore PHRF-NB

On 6/30/2021 11:15 AM, David Knecht via CnC-List wrote:

Wed night beer can racing for me to!  Dave

David Knecht
Rear Commodore
Thames Yacht Club
New London, CT



On Jun 30, 2021, at 11:10 AM, Novabraid via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


Stu,
I don’t know about the other folks in the group, but Wednesday nights 
in the summer are beer can racing nights for me.  Any chance that 
could get moved to a Monday or Tuesday?
The choice between sailboat racing and sitting in a Zoom meeting is a 
no brainer for me..

Cheers,
Chuck Gilchrest
S/V Half Magic
Padanaram, MA
*From:*Stu via CnC-List >

*Sent:*Wednesday, June 30, 2021 10:35 AM
*To:*C Email List >

*Cc:*Stu mailto:s...@snghost.com>>
*Subject:*Stus-List Our next online rendezvous
An invitation to all C enthusiasts --  you are invited to our next 
online rendezvous.

When: Jul 7, 2021 07:00 PM Eastern Time (US and Canada)
Now that most boats are in the water, a few races have been run and 
won, there should be some good stories to share.

Register in advance for this meeting:
https://us02web.zoom.us/meeting/register/tZ0vcO6ppzIoEt1vmmyDndPMSChNT1VMCc2T 

After registering, you will receive information about joining the 
meeting.

Stay safe & healthy
Stu
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help 
with the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the 
list - use PayPal to send contribution -- 
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
 Thanks - Stu



Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu


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costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Deck hold -down?

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Shawn, My new holding tank is located on centerline below the v-berth.  
It was the largest I could fit through the aft access after removing the 
covers support pieces.  A little bit more plumbing lines required, a 
further forward than I like, but it is pumped out before racing for free 
- thank you Bristol Marine Center keeping our waters clean.


Don Kern
/Fireball, /C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 6/9/2021 11:18 AM, Shawn Wright via CnC-List wrote:
Interesting, Don. Mine has some signs of patched holes on the deck, 
but I haven't been able to see anything below on the bulkheads. 
Possibly the deck holes are from something else.


So the holding tank was originally in that outboard area in the head? 
That explains the large hose hole at the bottom. My holding tank is 
now under the vberth, port side. It's a 16USG Kracor that fits ok, 
with a bit of crude surgery done to the plywood by a previous owner.




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Stus-List Re: Deck hold -down?

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Like Shawn's boat mine is also C 35 Mk2 (1974), but there is no 
indications of deck straps ever being installed.  Two years ago I 
removed the failed holding tank from its outboard location behind the 
outboard mahogany paneling. This required removing most of the head 
cabinetry, all of which was unattached to the overhead and only floating 
in the overhead's channels.  The only item that appears to secure the 
deck away from the the toe-rail are the hang tangs that are thru bolted 
to the mast.  The mast was removed since the boat winters in my side 
yard.  Also re-tabbed all the forward v-berth structures, since three 
quarters of the screws had worked loose due to hull flexing.  Yes the 
boat creaks when sailing, but after 40 years of sailing her you ignore 
that noise (also failing hearing??).


Don Kern
/Fireball, /C Mk2
Bristol, RI

On 6/9/2021 10:15 AM, Shawn Wright via CnC-List wrote:
My 35 mk2 apparently had these, but they have been removed. I have not 
seen a close up of any boats that still had them, so would be 
interested in some photos. I don't see any signs that anything was 
done to replace them with any kind if adhesive; the holes are just 
filled on the deck. The bulkheads do creak a bit as they move in the 
channels in the fiberglass liner, while under sail in a sea, or as 
they deck expands and contracts in the morning and evening, but I 
don't know if the straps would have made a difference for this. The 
space you describe under the deck pad may indicate a problem, 
although I can't imagine why this would happen, unless the deck is 
cored at that point and has collapsed, but 5/16" is quite a lot.

--
Shawn Wright
shawngwri...@gmail.com 
S/V Callisto, 1974 C 35
https://www.facebook.com/SVCallisto 


On Wed, Jun 9, 2021 at 4:25 AM Rod Fisk via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:









I have a C 36-1. There are stainless strap assemblies bolted
through the main bulkhead  port and starboard. These are welded to
stainless pads bolted through the deck. I have removed
the mounting bolts and the holes in the bulkhead are not elongated
yet there is a gap of about 5/16" under the plate on the deck
above. What is this for? I am guessing a deck hold--down, yet the
deck appears to be firmly in contact with the bulkhead below. Has
anyone else seen this? What have you done about it?

Thanks

Rod Fisk
C 36 Corsair
Oshkosh, WI

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the list - use PayPal to send contribution --
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
Thanks - Stu


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Stus-List Mainsheet traveler systems C 35 Mk2

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

from C Sailboat Owners Group discussion- Mine is also off right now, a 
gross and fine tune Harkin sheeting system, but interestingly have still 
have the original Mk2 set up with movable pin stops and no traveler 
block and tackle. Use the secondary cockpit winch with a single line to 
the mainsheet car to adjust the boom position and a hard vang for twist 
in mod to heavy air - not efficient set up. Peter, why did you remove 
the Lewmar traveler system, since that is what I was contemplating 
putting on the boat this Spring? Don Kern /Fireball,/ C Mk2 Bristol, RI
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Stus-List Re: Virtual Rendezvous

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Stu
any day except Mon & Tue are good for me.
Don


On 2/25/2021 11:33 AM, Stu via CnC-List wrote:

Looks like a real toss-up for Tues or Wed.  How about Thurs or Friday?
Stay safe and healthy
Stu

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Stus-List Re: Virtual Rendezvous

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Stu
Wednesday OK for me.. I have a Dave Perry racing on Tuesday
Don


On 2/25/2021 9:15 AM, Stu via CnC-List wrote:
Is anyone interested in a virtual Zoom rendezvous next week – say Tues 
or Wed nite?

Stay safe & healthy
Stu

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costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
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Stus-List Re: 135% vs 155% headsail when racing

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Chuck is absolutely correct, different PHRF have different rating 
adjustments.  Do pull up the rating adjustments for the PHRF area you 
are in when making significant investments on a boat.


On Narragansett Bay we review our rules/rating adjustment yearly and 
changes are published and voted on by the members. PHRF-NB use tables 
for headsails, mains and spinnakers based on the sail area. We are 
trying to keep boats racing and believe that giving some relief to those 
who are moving from cruising to racing or can no longer afford a full 
sail inventor; ie, headsail 1>4, code 0, spinnaker .50 and .75 oz, etc.


As an example the headsail table adjust the rating by 1sec/nm for every 
3% of the sails LP% change with 155% being 0 sec adjustment, 170% -5sec, 
145% +3 sec, 135% +6 sec and 125% +9 sec. (samples from table).


Don Kern
/Fireball, /C Mk2
Bristol, RI



On 2/9/2021 8:44 PM, CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List wrote:

Each PHRF area is slightly different and it changes from year to year.
Chesapeake Bay PHRF gives 3 sec credit to smaller headsails up tp 139%.
Here is what is posted on their website:

1.
LP up to 109% - 6 sec/mi. credit.
2.
LP between 110% and 139% - 3 sec/mi. credit.
3.
LP between 140% and 155% - 0 sec/mi. (No Credit)

  Chuck S


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Stus-List Re: Interior 'walls'

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Being a graduate of Annapolis I was familiar/use the common nautical 
terms of overhead, deck, bulkhead, ladder, lines, head (much to my 
wife's ridicule at home).  When working for Raytheon doing radar and 
collision avoidance instructions, i did find an interesting anomaly 
aboard a 1000' Great Lake ore carrier in the 80's.  I do not know if the 
captain was pilling my leg, but he referred to the above in common 
household terms; ie ceiling, floor, wall, stairs etc.  to the point that 
the placards on the "front wall" of the bridge said "Left" and "Right" 
and spoke of the ships railings as "fences".  His explanation to a 
"Salty" was that his small crew came from Midwest and it was easier to 
use terms they were familiar with, especially in an emergency or drill.


Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 1/31/2021 12:38 PM, MICHAEL BRANNON via CnC-List wrote:
Way back in NAVY bootcamp they taught us to call it the overhead.   
There are also decks and bulkheads.   The USN spin on things.

Mike Brannon
Virginia Lee 93295
1978 C 36 CB
Virginia Beach, VA






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Re: Stus-List R: Cockpit plaque - C 30

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Dan

Have you look closely near the top, stb'd, outboard side of the 
transom.  My 1974 35 carries her HIN there, there was no plaque 
installed.  The HIN was mandated in 1972 so you should have it there 
unless the transom was damage or you have many coats of paint that 
filled it in.  HIN can be decoded as Aaron described below and will 
start with either CCY or ZCC  (C's manufacturer's code).


Don Kern
/Fireball / C Mk2
Bristol RI



On 8/17/2020 8:00 PM, Aaron Rouhi via CnC-List wrote:

Dan,
Your hull number is part of your HIN. Hull numbers used between 
October 31, 1972 and August 1, 1984 are formatted this way:


HIN:
ABC12345M79A

ABC = Manufacturer's code
12 = Model
345 = Serial Number (Hull Number)
M
79 = Year built
A = Month: A= August B =September...

Aaron R.
Admiral Maggie,
1979 C 30 MK1 #540
Annapolis, MD



*From:* Daniel 
*Sent:* Sunday, August 16, 2020 5:05 PM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
*Cc:* Aaron Rouhi 
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List R: Cockpit plaque - C 30
Where is that plaque? I can’t find mine. No idea what hull number she 
is. 1973 mk1.


Sent from my iPhone




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Stus-List Fwd: Re: 1979 C 34: why hangers on thru-deck mast fitting?

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

 Forwarded Message 
Subject:Re: Stus-List 1979 C 34: why hangers on thru-deck mast 
fitting?
Date:   Wed, 12 Aug 2020 10:13:03 -0400
From:   Donald Kern 
To: Glen Eddie via CnC-List 



Glen
I believe the MK1 and the Mk2 were set up the same.  Check the mast, 
inside the cabin, for a thru hole about 6 to 8 inches below the cabin 
top.  That is where the the tangs bolted to the mast. You also should 
see a detente topside in the mast collar on either side of the mast, 
which is where the tangs held the deck down.  If you have these 
indications someone removed he tangs and thru bolts.

Don Kern
Fireball  C Mk2
Bristol RI


On 8/12/2020 8:49 AM, Glen Eddie via CnC-List wrote:


I don’t have any hangers on my C 35 Mk I.  Is there a reason why?  
Thanks in advance.


*Glen Eddie***

Tel:  416-777-5357

Fax:  1-888-812-2557

*Torkin Manes LLP*
Barristers & Solicitors

T



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Re: Stus-List New-guy C 40 Shopping questions

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Jeff
No capstan on the 35'.  We carry two anchors on Fireball, both 
Danforths; a small <20 lb and a heavy >35 lb.  Both we store vertically 
in the cockpit side locker.  The small one we uses for anchoring at 
lunch time where we are with the boat or racing when the wind dies and 
we sneak it over the side amidships so we can go thru the fleet at a 
couple knots in an adverse current.  The larger anchored is used for 
overnight and has 20 ft of chain, whereas the rode for the light anchor 
is a  nylon line only.  We carry two 200 ft 3 strand nylon rodes in the 
bow locker.

Don

On 7/21/2020 1:38 PM, Jeffrey Brideau via CnC-List wrote:

Thanks Joe,

My wife and I have noticed this as well. Most, but not all, examples 
have no windlass and we do like to anchor in bays for lunch now and 
then and we've explored options to add a windlass even if it's just 
manual.


On Tue, Jul 21, 2020 at 12:50 PM Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


Another thing you may not have thought of coming from a 23 foot
boat: Ground tackle. It is bigger, heavier, more expensive – by
FAR – and IMHO the 40 is on the ragged edge of what one can deal
with without a windlass, which is also not a cheap thing.

J





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Re: Stus-List New-guy C 40 Shopping questions

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Yup,
Installed my first autopilot last year, does make cruising easier. Have 
two wheels; a C standard small one with the autopilot attached and a 
large wheel for racing.  The large one allows the helmsman to easily sit 
at either rail to see the luff of the genoa, but makes going aft by the 
helm difficult.


Don Kern
/Fireball/, C 35 Mk2
Bristol RI

On 7/21/2020 12:11 PM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List wrote:


What he said – you will either buy a boat with a furling jib and an 
autopilot or spend the $$$ to add them first thing. My boat is broke 
if the autopilot is broke ;)


*/Joe Della Barba Coquina C 35  MK I/*

*/www.dellabarba.com/*

*From:*CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of 
*Donald Kern via CnC-List

*Sent:* Tuesday, July 21, 2020 11:36 AM
*To:* Charlie Nelson via CnC-List 
*Cc:* Donald Kern 
*Subject:* [EXTERNAL] Re: Stus-List New-guy C 40 Shopping questions

Jeff,
A 40' is a big boat.  I own a 35' and have sailed and cruised 40' and 
38' C  Unless the boat is set up for two you will be spending some 
money so it will be manageable by two. Because I sail on Narragansett 
Bay the wind (except mid Jul to mid Aug) comes in every afternoon at 
12 to 15 kts which my wife finds to be too "tippy" for her liking.  
Thus, I cruise with her aboard with only my rollerfurl (140%), main 
not used. Because my boat was modified for SORC racing it has a short 
boom and with main only is under powered and unbalanced.
I have done cruises from Long Island sound to Bar Harbor and use to 
live in Harpswell ME, so am quite familiar with the ares you would 
most likely.  Biggest advice I can give you for ME is make sure you 
have a good GPS system with a display that is visible from the helm - 
FOG is prevalent.  My 35' draws a little over 6' (again modified for 
racing) and have found that almost all harbors and marinas are 
reachable except the very ends of the ME inlets at low tide - 
aay-yup.  I have had the boat for 40 years and had nine kids grow up 
with her. The boat handles six adults (racing), cruise a week 
comfortably with four adults or two adults and a group of children 
(amount dependent on childs' sizes).  The boat was bought in 
Burlington VT and trucked to Narragansett Bay and with a six foot 
draft did have low bridge restrictions.
My best advice is take your wife out on a sail on a similar sized C 
to make sure she is comfortable with the power of these boats. 
Beneteaus, Catalinas  and Hunters do not count as similar!  If the 
Admiral is not happy on the boat, you will not be happy.


Don Kern
/Fireball/, C 35 Mk2
Bristol RI


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Stus-List Sailing with a spin thru the lee of a bigger boat

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Chuck,
Good demonstration of what happens when you decide to sail a smaller 
boat thru the lee of a bigger boat.  Especially dead downwind with a 
A-chute and the bigger  has a symmetric chute.   Unless the A-chute was 
in restricted water or closing the mark they should have been maxing 
their VMG by tacking downwind.
Brings back memories of those blue and gold chutes - use to skipper the 
wood and first glass NA 44 yawls. Preferred the wood, they were faster; 
had no engines, less weight and drag.  Bristol YC and Herreshoff Marine 
Museum sponsor the boat school's 44s each June for the last 5yrs (missed 
this year of Offshore Training because of CORVID 19).


Beat Army !!

Don Kern
Fireball C Mk2
Bristol, RI

On 7/21/2020 10:55 AM, CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List wrote:
I focus on the sailing ability in selecting a boat.  If you sail in a 
steady high winds, go big.  But if you are more like the rest of us 
and have low wind predominantly, I would steer toward the smallest, 
lightest model C that still has just enough interior to 
accommodate my family.  Smaller, lighter, hulls move first as the wind 
builds from a calm while heavier boats struggle until the wind gets up 
over 10 knots.  It takes much less wind to move a 10,000# boat than a 
20,000# one.  Even less to move a 5000# boat like a 27 footer which 
has standing headroom and can be trailered home for the winter.  They 
will all sail to hullspeed once the wind reaches about 12 knots and 
then the longer waterline boat has a speed advantage, but under 10 
knots which is predominantly what we sail in, the lighter boats win 
and are easier to singlehand and dock, etc.  Check out this video of a 
C 99, a 32 footer catching a J109 and two Navy 44 footers in a race.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBKifuS60Go

I also prefer the C 34/36 model as I own the racing version w vee 
berths (removable for racing) and settee berths, pilot beths, a full 
width aft berth and two pipe berths.  We rate faster than the 40 and 
the bigger sister, the 37/40 rates faster still, though I think the 
34/36 was an improvement over it.

Check out the brochures on Stu's cncphotoalbum.com

Chuck Scheaffer Resolute 1989 C 34R Pasadena, Md


On 07/21/2020 9:55 AM Nathan Post via CnC-List 
 wrote:



Welcome Jeff,

Something to keep in mind is that a 40 is almost twice as much boat 
compared to a 34 or 35 (18000+ lbs rather than 1 or so. 
Everything is bigger, heavier and more expensive.   And it can also 
get more complicated to sail - does it have running backstays?  I 
think that a 38 such as Ocean Phoenix does have running backstays - 
not sure about the 40.  My 34 does not.  Not a big deal for long 
passages, but we tend to go out to tool around for an evening tacking 
and jibing a dozen times in the process or go sail around the islands 
outside of Marblehead and Beverly and I would prefer to sail rather 
than motor whenever possible if there is any wind (which is why it is 
nice to have a light C that will move in light air).  Dockage, 
hauling and winter storage all scale with length too.  If offshore 
passages are your plan then the bigger boat is likely a better choice 
and you want to pay attention to the stability numbers as well, and a 
C may not be the right choice at all (although I am sure there are 
those on this list who would differ).


Any 30-40 ft keelboat boat in the under $2 sale price range is 
going to need a lot of TLC, fiberglass work, paint, rigging work, 
sails (likely at some point) and replacements over the coming 
years. We have a 34 KCB and it is a nice size for us and is easy for 
my wife and me to handle (we don't have or fly a spin although I am 
looking to add an asymmetrical at some point). If I was to do it 
again I might look for a 34+ or 34/36 which is a little larger and 
has a newer style interior layout with a separate shower from the 
head I believe.  While that would have been more money up front, but 
as I put 10+k into improvements plus lots of time each year it would 
not have made a big difference in the long run. My boat budget ends 
up around $20/year, about half of which is slip, hauling, winter 
storage and insurance, and the other half is maintenance and 
upgrades.  The first year we had the sails cleaned and repaired for 
$600, had the prop rebuilt for $500, new water heater, new head 
plumbing, new bilge pumps, new foam for the cushions (which I 
restuffed myself, etc.), etc. etc.. Last year we got new cruising 
sails for $6k and some new lines, new water pump, inflatable life 
jackets, etc.. This year it was quite a bit more (I haven't kept 
track) because we had the rod-rigging re-ended and needed a new 
furler and I repaired soft spots in the deck, repainted and refit the 
entire deck and included replacing winches with self tailers and 
added a custom bow roller I designed and sent out to a machine shop 
along with a new anchor and rode.  I am glad she is only 34ft long 
rather than 40!  Can you do it for a 

Re: Stus-List New-guy C 40 Shopping questions

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Jeff,
A 40' is a big boat.  I own a 35' and have sailed and cruised 40' and 
38' C  Unless the boat is set up for two you will be spending some 
money so it will be manageable by two.  Because I sail on Narragansett 
Bay the wind (except mid Jul to mid Aug) comes in every afternoon at 12 
to 15 kts which my wife finds to be too "tippy" for her liking.  Thus, I 
cruise with her aboard with only my rollerfurl (140%), main not used. 
Because my boat was modified for SORC racing it has a short boom and 
with main only is under powered and unbalanced.
I have done cruises from Long Island sound to Bar Harbor and use to live 
in Harpswell ME, so am quite familiar with the ares you would most 
likely.  Biggest advice I can give you for ME is make sure you have a 
good GPS system with a display that is visible from the helm - FOG is 
prevalent.  My 35' draws a little over 6' (again modified for racing) 
and have found that almost all harbors and marinas are reachable except 
the very ends of the ME inlets at low tide - aay-yup.  I have had the 
boat for 40 years and had nine kids grow up with her. The boat handles 
six adults (racing), cruise a week comfortably with four adults or two 
adults and a group of children (amount dependent on childs' sizes).  The 
boat was bought in Burlington VT and trucked to Narragansett Bay and 
with a six foot draft did have low bridge restrictions.
My best advice is take your wife out on a sail on a similar sized C to 
make sure she is comfortable with the power of these boats. Beneteaus, 
Catalinas  and Hunters do not count as similar! If the Admiral is not 
happy on the boat, you will not be happy.


Don Kern
/Fireball/, C 35 Mk2
Bristol RI

On 7/20/2020 10:08 PM, Charlie Nelson via CnC-List wrote:
If draft is an issue (or might be a future issue depending on your 
plans for cruising, etc.) I would consider the cb model.


I have a 36 XL/kcb (your 40 ft C is actually a kcb since the cb 
retracts into a serious keel, unlike some cb boats that have boards 
only or very small keels) since I sail in the skinny NC sounds where 
a 5 ft draft is often the rule in marinas, not the exception.


I Replace the pennant every 5 or so years and otherwise forgetaboutit!.
Upwind, board down, it will point with or better than any others and 
downwind, board up, it will get up and go! OTOH, it likely has a 
weighted board which probably weighs over 1000 lbs. Unless you are 
racing, grinding the board up is not an easy job—I use a Lewmar 30 
with 3:1 purchase AND my strongest crew to bring her up. Of course, as 
some have noted, it is a simple matter to pin it up permantly.


Of course the kcb won’t be as fast as a deep keel of the same model 
(lots more wetted surface than a fin) but there probably isn’t any 
harbor in NH/ME that you could not get into, even at low tide, with 
the board up.

Welcome to the list!

Charlie Nelson
1995 C 36 XL/kcb
Water Phantom

Sent from AOL Mobile Mail
Get the new AOL app: mail.mobile.aol.com 

On Monday, July 20, 2020, Jeffrey Brideau via 
CnC-List  wrote:


Allow me to first apologize for any ignorance we may suffer before
I introduce our situation. I've been sailing all sorts of small
craft for 35+ years but this will be our first adventure in
something no-longer trailerable.  I and my wife are shopping for
an upgrade in size from our O'Day 23-2 and are attracted to the
C line of boats given our budget, the perceived quality,
performance/comfort reputation, and availability in the local
market. We started eyeing a 35-3 in VT (and may still consider it)
but after looking at a few 35' boats locally we are realizing they
may still be a bit small for our rapidly growing family of four
(and trucking and bottom painting a boat from VT to NH/ME seacoast
adds a lot of costs), we have started looking at some C 40 boats
in MA/RI  area. I'm not afraid of some small projects that can be
carried out while we use it or in the offseason but not interested
in a "project boat"  that would need work to be safe before use.


https://www.yachtworld.com/core/listing/pl_boat_detail.jsp?slim=broker_id=3558367_boats=3558367=MattapoisettYachtSales&==Feet=Public_id=81236=
https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1981-c-c-tall-rig-7442829/

Now for the questions:

We have scheduled the two 40's above for a visit next weekend, one
we saw in the boatyard without invitation this weekend. They are
both on the hard, and the one we briefly visited is a centerboard
version. The other is a tall-rig/deep-keel.  See the photos linked.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/7xUVbSnHMob2YmYP8

1. On this boat, what is the drain in the keel for? Is it a bilge
drain or a centerboard trunk vent? There was something, perhaps a
piece of wood, loose inside the drain that I could move with a
finger.
2. On cabin top starboard, there appears to be a wire cable winch
that I've not seen 

Re: Stus-List Listers Age Range

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Do not go up the mast no more, that's for my son (52 yrs).   All my 
winches are the original Barients.  Since /Fireball /is sitting in my 
yard (too many COVI 19 restrictions in RI) I have pulled my primaries 
(28s) and secondaries (26) to overhaul.  I need to get the drums sand 
blasted in middle since they slip too easily, it is either that or I am 
getting weaker.  Have had Fireball since 1980, my son was 23.   Started 
sailing in 1957 off NewCastle NH in a 8' pram (P-Dink), Graduated to 
Thistle (wood kit built in garage) in 1959 which I campaigned until 
1976. Besides Fireball still have the P-dink and a Laser, but it getting 
harder to duck under their booms.  I guess everything ages.


Don Kern
/Fireball /C Mk2
Bristol RI

On 7/15/2020 11:50 AM, Matt Wolford via CnC-List wrote:


No. Anyway, I’m old school.  My primaries (and secondaries) aren’t 
even self-tailing.


*From:*CnC-List  *On Behalf Of *Bill 
Coleman via CnC-List

*Sent:* Wednesday, July 15, 2020 11:33 AM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
*Cc:* Bill Coleman 
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List Listers Age Range

I bought my wonderful SS Barient  STs from a very pleasant Banker from 
Long Island, who said he had just had a great charter vacation on a 
boat with Electric Winches.  He said, Ya’know, I think I’m worth this 
– so he bought some, ceded his old ones to me, and extended his boat 
ownership another ten years.


Some nice electrics would wing you right up there!  Are you worth it, 
Matt?


Bill Coleman

Erie PA

*From:*CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of 
*Matt Wolford via CnC-List

*Sent:* Wednesday, July 15, 2020 9:17 AM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
*Cc:* wolf...@erie.net 
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List Listers Age Range

58 here.

Last evening I installed my wind transducer at the masthead using an 
ATN climber.  I wondered whether this is really a job I want to keep 
doing.


Matt Wolford

Erie, PA

C 42 Custom

*From:*CnC-List > *On Behalf Of *Della Barba, 
Joe via CnC-List

*Sent:* Wednesday, July 15, 2020 9:09 AM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
*Cc:* Della Barba, Joe >

*Subject:* Re: Stus-List Listers Age Range

56 here.  Between sailing and flying I sometimes think I will be 
perpetually the youngest person doing it, neither seems to get much 
new blood.


Glad to see a 35 year-old on the list!

Speaking of age, a broker told me C owners were terrible customers. 
He said something like “Most people trade up every 3 to 5 years, you 
all keep boats for generations”


*/Joe Della Barba Coquina C 35  MK I/*

*/www.dellabarba.com /**//*


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Re: Stus-List Listers Age Range

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Interesting, /Fireballs/ offshore crew commutes from Dallas TX and are 
ardent racers on the Viper 830, ages: two in 50s and one early 40s.  
Beside lake races they do Charleston and Harvest Moon (Galveston to Port 
Aransas).


Don Kern
/Fireball/ C Mk2
Bristol RI

On 7/15/2020 9:11 AM, Dreuge via CnC-List wrote:

Human Age?

How about the oldest and youngest of the C era vessel?  That would 
be an interesting honor.



Regarding age spans, the limits are less meaning full.  For example, 
the local amateur
radio club has about the same 35 - 86 limits, but mean of the 
distribution  is
likely 70.  On the other hand, the age spread of our clubs Viper fleet 
is about 16 - 68,

with an average age in the 20s.


-
Paul E.
1981 C Landfall 38
S/V Johanna Rose
Fort Walton Beach, FL

http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/

On Jul 15, 2020, at 8:54 AM, cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com 
 wrote:


Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2020 08:16:02 -0400
From: James Hesketh >

To:cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Listers Age Range
Message-ID:
>

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Randy wrote:


So far we?ve got:

Youngest: Luke Wolbrink, age 35
Wisest: Doug Robinson, age 86

I?m in that range, 56.  Neither young nor wise :)

Good to see some young people here - way to go guys.



These ages parallel the informal surveys from various motorcycle groups I
belong to. Maybe youngsters don't like motion?

I'm 64 and have been motorcycling most of my life, and sailing for 
2/3s of

it.

Jim Hesketh
C 26
Miami, Fl



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Re: Stus-List 2020 C Rendezvous: Cancel due to COVI

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Jim
You got me. Will be 77 in Nov.
Don Kern
Fireball C MK2
Bristol RI

On 7/14/2020 10:04 PM, detroito91 via CnC-List wrote:

77...might be the old winner
Jim Schwartz
SEA YA !
38 landfall
Washington nc



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone



On Jul 14, 2020, at 8:28 PM, Joel Delamirande via CnC-List
 wrote:



What is the youngest age in this group and oldest

I’m 40




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Re: Stus-List HilleRange stove parts

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Glen,
I can speak to the 35 Mk2 and I believe was he same stove for the Mk1.  
It is a pressurized alcohol with the alcohol tank being mounted on the 
forward bulkhead of the cockpit locker.

Don Kern
/Fireball /C&35 Mk2
Bristol, RI

On 7/10/2020 9:04 AM, Glen Eddie via CnC-List wrote:


Does anyone know whether the original stoves on the C 35 Mk I were 
alcohol or propane?  Just like at home, I have never tried to use 
it.  I don’t even know if it works.  I do know that I do not have a 
propane locker.


*Glen Eddie***

Tel:  416-777-5357

Fax:  1-888-812-2557

*Torkin Manes LLP*
Barristers & Solicitors

This email message, and any attachments, is intended only for the 
named recipient(s) above and may contain content that is privileged, 
confidential and/or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If 
you have received this message in error, please notify the sender and 
delete this email message. Thank you.


*From:*CnC-List  *On Behalf Of 
*ahycrace via CnC-List

*Sent:* July-10-20 08:44 AM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
*Cc:* ahycrace 
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List HilleRange stove parts

Brian

I have a stainless steel hillerange not sure of the model. The control 
wingback of the oven knob is frozen I need that control assembly.  Is 
your stove a stainless steel model and could I send you a picture of 
the part I need. I would be happy to send Stu a contribution as payment.


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy Tablet

 Original message 

From: Brian Davis via CnC-List >


Date: 7/9/20 9:09 AM (GMT-05:00)

To: C Stus List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>

Cc: Brian Davis >


Subject: Stus-List HilleRange stove parts

Hello C members,

If anyone has a HilleRange stove/range on their vessel and is in need 
of spare parts please let me know. Everything is now posted on ebay 
[link below]. For members on this list you can have them free and only 
pay shipping. I carefully took everything apart and had to cut a few 
things in order to get it through the doorway. But everything listed 
is in good shape.


http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?icep_ff3=2=5575378759=5338273189=_item=324224174947=psmain_vectorid=229466=902099=824=lg=1

Regards

Brian

West Palm Beach,  FL 33412

(954) 892.1128



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Re: Stus-List economics of hatches

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Dave,

Your estimate is a little dated.  Below is an A estimate (Mar 2020) to 
refurbish the original forward hatch (A model XR300) on 1974 C 35 Mk2:

Labor- $250
1/2” lens - $500
Gasket - $55.65
Seals for through hardware - $65
Polishing anodizing $200
Total  $1070.65

Shipping back and forth is usually in the $60-$80 range. USD$ pricing

Don Kern
/Fireball/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 6/25/2020 3:46 PM, Dave Godwin via CnC-List wrote:

Joe,

I have both 
 an 
original 24” x 24” Atkins and Hoyle hatch and a new 24” Lewmar Ocean 
hatch on my boat. Because I stupidly bent the lower frame 
 while 
pulling all my deck hardware I needed a replacement, ergo the mismatch.


Although not as sexy as the Lewmar Ocean hatch 
, 
I think that the A is a much sturdier and rugged item. As others 
have noted, around $600 USD. The good news is that it was 90% drop 
into place and matching up with the C finished cutout. And the A 
can be reversed if you have a mind.


I had A completely rebuild both hatches back in 1998 and with 
shipping it came to ~$600 USD per hatch…


Regards,
Dave Godwin
1982 C 37 - Ronin
Reedville - Chesapeake Bay
Ronin’s Overdue Refit 


On Jun 25, 2020, at 3:26 PM, ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


Joe:

Any time I can buy the materials and do the work myself, the money I 
save buys a new tool for me. If you buy a standard size piece of 
acrylic,  you can cut the hatch lens yourself, and also not have to 
pay for the labor and wasted pieces of acrylic that you didn't use. 
So, for a piece of 19" x 19" you might be paying for a piece of 24" x 
48" (or whatever width the acrylic comes in) plus labor. If you can 
get the old lens out, you can cut the new one, and use a router and 
pattern bit to make the new one. I'm sure you can find a use for the 
leftover acrylic.


Alan Bergen
35 Mk III Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR

On Thu, Jun 25, 2020 at 12:01 PM Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


Since this seems to be hatch week, here goes after numerous calls
and checking around:
To have new glass and gaskets put in my hatch by someone else -
$450 to $600 est.
Parts to DIY - Probably at least $300, getting a 19x19x1/2" piece
of cast acrylic cut is not cheap plus the gaskets and sealers.
Buying the acrylic pre-cut is about $550 from AH.
Brand new Lewmar Ocean 60 hatch - about $600.
New AH hatch - $1800.
I am trying to wrap my mind around it being about the same to
just buy a new hatch as pay someone to fix it. Does anyone have
an opinion on new Lewmar Ocean (not the cheap low profile ones)
vs. 47 year-old A-H?

This all started because my gaskets are getting a bit ratty, but
I have this fear one day I'll step right through the hatch at
some point. The UV has to be doing a job on it coming up on 50 years.



Joe Della Barba Coquina C 35  MK I

https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.dellabarba.com__;!!LIr3w8kk_Xxm!-XxntstlzBPjAZ41zME0jnlSXRXs79mx8INeYLdack3g9rY-6PF1zdiK2OsQLszzVEE$




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Re: Stus-List Rob Ball comment on 41 "robustness"

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

David,
Thanks,
Never saw that piece of insight.  I have no idea how accurate the 47 
year old backstay gage is.  Those are relative settings that feel 
right.  Have not folded the boat in half nor driven the mast thru the 
keel  - yet!


Don Kern
/Fireball,/ C Mk2
Bristol RI


On 6/10/2020 10:38 PM, david--- via CnC-List wrote:
I am not sure this picture will be small enough for the list. When I 
bought my 35-2, I found a memo from C in the nav  table saying the 
maximum back stay tension is 2050 pounds




David Kelly
Baraka C 35-2
Noroton, CT



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Re: Stus-List Loong Sails

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Since my boat has a modified rig I get all my sails locally, so the loft 
can measure and advise on the boat. I do realize that the sail may not 
be built at the local loft, but not in China.  I try to stay away from 
things manufactured in China, it is hard, but I do try.

Don Kern
/Fireball/ C Mk2
Bristol RI

On 6/4/2020 8:20 AM, DANIEL WATTS via CnC-List wrote:
All, a friend told me about Loong Sailmakers, supposedly one of the 
largest sailmakers in the world. Has anyone had an experience with 
them? Looking at possibly getting a quote on a mainsail for my C 33.


Thanks,
Dan Watts
s/v Counterpoint

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Re: Stus-List Spinnakers

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Barry,

Thanks for the vote of confidence and yes I am well aware of R JMS - 
been seeing way too much of her transom !!  Drop by the boat, we will be 
in Mitchell Park Marina for the Fall Off Soundings flying a large Texas 
flag due to my son boarding Fireball with his Viper 830 crew from 
Dallas.  (Given the nanny states lifts the 14 day quarantine restrictions.}


Don Kern
/Fireball/ C Mk2
Bristol, RI

On 5/15/2020 10:18 PM, Barry Lenoble via CnC-List wrote:

Hello,

Regarding spinnakers for racing - you didn’t write (or maybe I just 
missed) if you are currently using a spinnaker now or not. If you’re 
currently a Jib and Main (JAM) boat and you’re trying to race against 
spinnaker boats, you will not do well (especially in light air).


If you are JAM and looking to enter the spinnaker fleet then I would 
suggest going to asymm sails over standard square sails, spin pole, up 
haul, downhaul, guys, blah blah blah.


If you are currently flying a chute then I suggest you spend more time 
working on that before you scrap everything and go to asym sails.


I do most of my racing on a C 35. First - listen to Don. I have 
raced against Fireball many times and he knows what he is doing (Don, 
in case you are reading I race on R JMS, the white boat from Port 
Jefferson, NY). We raced with standard spinnakers for years and did 
well. A few years ago the owner changed to asym sails and a Selden 
sprit, and we have never looked back. Depending on conditions, 
sometimes the asym has an advantage and other times the square chute 
does. But the asym is easier to set, jibe, trim, and douse than the 
square chute. We used to need 6-7 guys to race in breezy conditions. 
Now we do it with 4-5 guys. No pole to worry about, no guys, no 
worrying about gibing the pole, etc.


Last point, I have never seen a real fast boat use a sock or a furler. 
I’m sure there are some out there, but for a fully crewed boat there 
is no way a sock or furler would be faster than just a standard set 
and douse. In light to regular conditions we douse down the front 
hatch. Helm steers down, tack line released, foredeck grabs tack line 
and passes to crew in the V Berth. Halyard is eased and the chute 
pulled into the boat. In windy conditions we do a letter box take 
down. I’m usually in the back of the boat tending the main so I can’t 
tell you how exactly we do that one, I try to stay out of the way,


Around here racing is on hold for now and that makes me sad.

Good luck.
Barry

Barry Lenoble
Deep Blue C - C 110
Mt. Sinai, NY

Barry. Sent from iPad


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Re: Stus-List Tacking Down an Asym on a 30 MK I

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Randy,

Most PHRF rating organizations will adjust (negatively) your rating for 
adding a tack point forward of the "J" measurement of the boat. You may 
receive a credit for both a retrofit application and due to a smaller 
sail area for a spinnaker - depends on the rating rules for your PHRF 
organization.  Also an asymmetrical spinnaker is a free fly sail, thus 
adding a hard furler is not done for an asym.  I do not understand why 
you stated "So I can’t just shackle an asym tack line block to the spare 
headsail shackle on the stem, and hoist/douse the asym using a sock." 
That should be an option. Lastly, the 30 Mk1 was designed to go deep 
downwind with a symmetrical spinnaker, which would have a greater sail 
area projected to windward an inherently faster than a asym rig deep 
downwind.  The plus side that an asym would give your 30 Mk1 would be on 
reaching legs.  Hope this helps.


Don Kern
Fireball C Mk2
Bristol, RI
Commo. PHRF-NB


On 5/15/2020 12:22 PM, Randy Stafford via CnC-List wrote:

Listers-

A guy in my yacht club has started an arms race by adding an asym with a 
top-down furler to his Ranger 28.  Wednesday night in light air I beat him to 
the windward mark by a minute or two, then he hoisted his asym and dropped me 
like a bad habit.  He beat me by five minutes corrected time in a one-hour race 
despite spotting me 12 sec/mile with his new adjusted rating (demonstrating yet 
again that ratings don’t necessarily account for performance differences).  It 
was an eye-opening demonstration.

So now I’m thinking I need an asym to compete.  I know a guy who flew one on a 
30 MK I.  He welded a bracket forward of the stem, to fasten a tack line block, 
and had a sock instead of a furler.  If I want to compete with this Ranger 28, 
I’ll have to add two furlers (one on the forestay and one for the asym) to be 
able to set sails as fast as him.  So I can’t just shackle an asym tack line 
block to the spare headsail shackle on the stem, and hoist/douse the asym using 
a sock.  I need a tack point forward of the stem to accommodate a furler.

Thus my question to you listers: any experience with adding a bowsprit or bracket 
etc. to your C for tacking down an asymmetrical spinnaker?  I did some 
reading last night on after-market bowsprits (e.g. Selden), but of course wanted to 
check with the collective wisdom on Stu’s list.  Any advice or recommendations?

Thanks,
Randy Stafford
S/V Grenadine
C 30 MK I #79
Ken Caryl, CO
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Re: Stus-List Moving Main Sheet Traveler on a C-34

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

On my ol' C 35 mk2 with a shorten boom my traveler is still mounted on 
the thwart seat just aft of the companionway.  It carries a  4:1 
gross-trim for most trimming (cruising) and the 16:1 fine-tuning 
(racing) with control done by two fiddle blocks with cam cleats (fine & 
gross) mounted to the traveler car.  For cruising we set the traveler 
stops just inboard of the full length cushions and let it freely slide 
between the stops when tacking.  I can handle the main sheets from the 
helm.  The heavier main sheet is long enough to reach the helm when 
running and the cam is at angle that it can be released and set from the 
helm.  When racing (crew of six) the order of easing the main is fine 
trim>traveler> gross trim and when tacking is traveler then fine trim, 
gross trim is pretty much set. When cocktail hour comes at anchor/dock, 
the shackle holding the fiddle blocks to traveler car is moved to the 
toe rail -  head banger clear of cockpit/companionway.


Don Kern
/Fireball /C 35 Mk2
Bristol RI

ps: Boat still in my side yard - weather has been ugly - frost warning 
again last night



On 5/13/2020 9:49 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List wrote:
Moving the traveller into the cockpit has engineering and leverage 
advantages.  The compromise is that it is much more inconvenient to 
the cockpit occupants.


Moving the attachment point aft on the boom gives better leverage so 
less tension is needed to position the boom.  It is also less likely 
to break the boom (most likely in the event of an accidental jibe).


Instead of moving the traveller back, you may find that you can get 
away with creating some sort of better purchase system.  I have a 3/4 
boom attachment with cockpit traveller and still had difficulty 
trimming the main with the original 3:1 mainsheet.  Here's a link to a 
video of my improvement.  It is a compound purchase system which 
allows a course adjustment (3:1) and a fine adjustment (12:1).  My 
first action is to always relieve the pressure on the traveller by 
releasing the 12:1.  Then adjust the traveller. Then use the 12:1 to 
fine adjust.  It works really well for me but the cockpit traveller 
allows for almost 5 feet of tackle length.  I'm not exactly sure how 
it would work with the shorter distance of a cabin top arrangement.  
Still probably cheaper to give it a try before moving the traveller.


https://youtu.be/VNUGnNAGsDo


All the best,

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C 37+
Solomons, MD


On Wed, May 13, 2020, 20:20 Pamela & David via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


Hello

Has any one moved the mainsheet traveler from the cabin top to
just in front the wheel?  When sailing wife the wife I find
adjustments to the main difficult at times. Have tried playing
with the traveler but the sheet tension is the problems.
Any thoughts

David
MUDPUDDLE ( Whitby)



Virus-free. www.avg.com




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Re: Stus-List Paddle Wheel Anti-fouling...?

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

David

What I found with mine is to to turn it 180, reversing the direction of 
paddle rotation.  That works about 75% of the time, then it is a pull 
and clean.


Don Kern
/Fireball /C 35 Mk2
Bristol RI

On 4/13/2020 11:32 AM, David Risch via CnC-List wrote:
My paddle wheel fouls if you just look at it...any solutions to 
reducing fouling (besides putting it in/taking it out which is a total 
PIA)


Sent from my Android. Please forgive typos. Thank you.


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Re: Stus-List Number of C 41s that are still afloat?

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Tony,
Your new  data has been incorporated.
Thank you
Don

On 4/4/2020 8:22 AM, Tony Wroblewski via CnC-List wrote:
Don, I have the C 41 "Triumph" on your list. I would like you to add 
the following information:
HIN #ZCC41096C586, Year Bought: 1986, Club: Anchorage Marina YC, 
phone: 248 930-7949


thanks for your effort with the list
Tony


*From:* CnC-List  on behalf of Donald 
Kern via CnC-List 

*Sent:* Sunday, March 1, 2020 11:39 PM
*To:* Will Gerstmyer via CnC-List 
*Cc:* Donald Kern 
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List Number of C 41s that are still afloat?
Will,

Here is a list of some forty-four C 41s that participate in the forum
or do PHRF races.  If you have any additional data on 41s I would like
to incorporate into my list.
Don Kern

Fireball C 35 Mk2
Bristol RI



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Re: Stus-List Lewmar opening hatch screen solutions

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

My boat also came with Velcro on the overhead which became unsightly.  
Took it off and removed the glue.  Replaced the original with fabric 
screen from the hardware store and cut it so it lapped over the outside 
edge of hatch combing.  Put a hem by folding over and using double sided 
fabric tape
with small rectangles of lead at each corner and in the middle of each 
edge.  The hatches on 1974 C 35 are Atkins & Hoyle and the fabric does 
not interfere with it partially open or even the closing of the hatch.  
The screens fit into a single a quart ziplock bag.


Don Kern
Fireball C 35 Mk2
Bristol RI

On 3/30/2020 11:44 AM, Dennis C. via CnC-List wrote:

Charlie,

Dwight's wooden frame screen insert is probably similar to my 35-1 
midships wooden frame screen.  The frame fits inside the hatch opening 
flush with the headliner.  There are two small metal triangles that 
are across the aft corners of the hatch opening.  Centered in the 
forward side of the hatch opening is a door button (like a Perko 
1217DP0CHR).  To install, you put the aft end of the frame in the 
opening, rest it's aft corners on the two triangles, lift it in place 
and secure it with the door button.


If you want pics, I hope to be on the boat Wednesday if I can get 
through the Florida COVID-19 check point on Interstate 10.  :)


Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA


On Mon, Mar 30, 2020 at 10:24 AM Charlie Nelson via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


Thanks Dwight--

Can you briefly describe how the wooden screens were attached? My
Lewmar hatch frames (that screw into the deck) do not extend into
the cabin and are semi-circular in profile so any screens I
use/make need to attach to the cabin ceiling somehow. They cannot
be attached to the hatch frame.

Thanks,

Charlie


-Original Message-
From: dwight veinot via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
To: cnc-list mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
Cc: dwight veinot mailto:dwight...@gmail.com>>
Sent: Mon, Mar 30, 2020 7:51 am
Subject: Re: Stus-List Lewmar opening hatch screen solutions

My 35mkii came to me with a set of wood framed screens. They work
quite well but the companionway screen is awkward to stow onboard.
My Beckson opening ports came with screens that work well and are
very easy to stow.


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Re: Stus-List Racing Marks Question -- Not C Related

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Edd,
On Narragansett Bay almost all the clubs use Gov't marks augmented by 
RC/YC dropped marks for their courses.  If a mark starts drifting or the 
USCG pulls a gov't mark the race is normally abandoned. Narragansett bay 
East passage is defined by the USCG as a "Narrow Channel" and therefor 
deepdraft vessels have the right of way over sailboats.  Sooo... about 
once a year some boat attempts to cross the bow of a laden commercial 
deepdraft and gets 5 short blast and the RC gets a call from the pilot.  
(Duct tape does not fix stupid!!).  In fact next week the USCG is 
speaking to a group of the various race committees on an incident last 
year.  All organizing authorities are required to notify the USCG of 
their events which are published in Notice to Mariners.


Like others that have spoken, virtual marks would be problematic.

Don Kern
Fireball, C 35 Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 3/6/2020 1:06 PM, CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List wrote:

I agree too.
On March 6, 2020 at 11:58 AM dwight veinot via CnC-List 
 wrote:


Same here agree with Joe

On Fri, Mar 6, 2020 at 11:14 AM Matt Wolford via CnC-List < 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com > wrote:


As usual, I agree with Joe.

*From:* CnC-List mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com>> *On Behalf Of *Della
Barba, Joe via CnC-List
*Sent:* Friday, March 06, 2020 9:41 AM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
*Cc:* Della Barba, Joe mailto:joe.della.ba...@ssa.gov>>
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List Racing Marks Question -- Not C Related

IMHO this is a bad idea.

The whole idea of how mark roundings happen in racing cannot work
if the notional idea of where the mark is differs by even 5 or 10
feet from boat to boat. I would either use government marks or
you all cough up enough cash to get an old Whaler and teenager to
run around moving marks.

Joe

Coquina

*From:* CnC-List mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com>> *On Behalf Of *Matt
Wolford via CnC-List
*Sent:* Friday, March 6, 2020 9:17 AM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
*Cc:* wolf...@erie.net 
*Subject:* [EXTERNAL] Re: Stus-List Racing Marks Question -- Not
C Related

I recall being in a race a number of years ago in which the mark
was missing.  The owner of the lead boat claimed the boat did a
“navigational rounding” – which it may have done – but everyone
was so skeptical that the race was abandoned.

As long as you have a fleet of Corinthian sailors and everyone
agrees ahead of time, I suppose you can do whatever the fleet
decides.  That said, don’t be surprised if you get some
disgruntlement in practice.

*From:* CnC-List mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com>> *On Behalf Of *Edd
Schillay via CnC-List
*Sent:* Thursday, March 05, 2020 5:13 PM
*To:* Edd Schillay via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
*Cc:* Edd Schillay mailto:e...@schillay.com>>
*Subject:* Stus-List Racing Marks Question -- Not C Related

Listers,

As you all know, this past summer, I relocated my home, office
and the Enterprise from City Island to the Suncoast of Florida —
and I’m getting involved in the race management over here, which
has been terribly lazy.

One of the big issues we face is lack of resources. Marks are
dropped in the water a day or two in advance of a regatta and
then are either cut loose, vandalized or have broken free by the
time a race is actually run. And there is no chase boat usually
available to either drop a new mark or put up an M flag to act as
one.

Someone brought up the idea of a virtual mark in case a mark is
missing, which is a new concept to me. I was thinking of language
in the SIs that say something along the lines of “If a mark is
missing or has moved more than 300 feet from its stated
latitude/longitude position, and the race committee is unable to
replace it, then the mark shall be the stated latitude/longitude
position.”

Basically, the thought is, especially since this happens now and
again, not to have to cancel a regatta because a mark has
disappeared.

Has anyone ever used “virtual marks”? Does anyone object to the
practice? If so, why?

Appreciate anyone’s input. Even Risch’s.


All the best,

Edd

Edd M. Schillay

Captain of the Starship Enterprise

C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B

Venice Yacht Club | Venice Island, FL

Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log








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Re: Stus-List Number of C 41s that are still afloat?

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Will,

Here is a list of some forty-four C 41s that participate in the forum 
or do PHRF races.  If you have any additional data on 41s I would like 
to incorporate into my list.

Don Kern

Fireball C 35 Mk2
Bristol RI



On 2/29/2020 8:49 PM, Will Gerstmyer via CnC-List wrote:

Hi. I can find that there were 700-something C built—but no breakdown by 
model, so that includes all models. Does anybody know how many were 41’s? How many 
are still afloat? Thanks, Will

Will Gerstmyer
978-609-1331
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C^0C 41.xlsx
Description: MS-Excel 2007 spreadsheet
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Re: Stus-List C 99 Class Association and Fleet

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Rod
I have attached an extracted list of the C 99s that have come up on 
the cnc-list or PHRF fleet listings, etc.  The list I have, started 
about three years ago when I was interested in C owners on how long 
they owned their C (Brand loyalty). It now has a little over 1350 C 
boats. On the extracted list, the boats following /Bear Necessity/ (line 
36) are from your site that I added to my list.

Don Kern
Fireball C 35 Mk2
Bristol RI

On 2/21/2020 8:45 AM, Rod Stright via CnC-List wrote:


We are in the process of revitalising the C 99 class and have 
developed a new Class Association and website @ 
http://cnc99class.com/#home and are trying to track down the current 
inventory and ownership of C 99 fleet.  If you own a C 99 and are 
not on our fleet list @ _http://cnc99class.com/the-fleet/ _please 
email mail me and we will get you signed up.  If you know of a C 99 
owner not on the list please pass on this information.


Thanks for your attention and help in rejuvenating the class.

//

/Safe Sailing,/

//

/Rod Stright/

//

/President/

/C 99 Class Association/

/Halifax/

/Nova Scotia/


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C 99.xlsx
Description: MS-Excel 2007 spreadsheet
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Re: Stus-List New thought re: anchor light?

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Thanks Shawn,  No need to go after the previous owner.  You got answers 
from Ken and Nathan that had two different sources of slightly different 
hull running lights.  I will be out at the boat and measure to see which 
fits most closely.  Hopefully it will be the one at Defender so I can 
pick them up at my annual March Defender foray.

Don


On 2/5/2020 9:49 AM, Shawn Wright via CnC-List wrote:

Hi Don,

Some new bulb holders came with the boat, I can ask the previous owner 
if he knows. They don't appear to be marine grade though, so I don't 
know how they will hold up. If the fixtures don't pass the leak test, 
I will look at going with the marinebeam LED units.


--
Shawn Wright
shawngwri...@gmail.com <mailto:shawngwri...@gmail.com>
S/V Callisto, 1974 C 35
https://www.facebook.com/SVCallisto


On Tue, Feb 4, 2020 at 9:23 PM Donald Kern via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


Shawn,
Where did you get the bulb holders for the original hull "eye"
lights? Mine need replacing and have not found a source.
Don Kern
Fireball C 35 mk2
Bristol RI



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Re: Stus-List New thought re: anchor light?

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Shawn,
Where did you get the bulb holders for the original hull "eye" lights? 
Mine need replacing and have not found a source.

Don Kern
Fireball C 35 mk2
Bristol RI

On 2/4/2020 11:06 PM, Shawn Wright via CnC-List wrote:
Sorry, a bit confusing. Yes, I have two sets of bow lights - the 
original in-hull "eye" lights which are currently not functional, and 
a bi-colour light hanging from the pulpit, which I don't like. I have 
new bulb holders for the original lights, so I will try to get them 
going again, or at least that's the plan. First, I want to do a hose 
test on them to see if they leak, as I suspect they do. If they can't 
be sealed well enough, they may have to go also...


Alternatively, I need to replace the pulpit with a welded one, as the 
original is in rough shape and the bronze fittings are worn out. I 
have seen some nice compact LED bow lights integrated into newer 
pulpits, so that is an option too.

--
Shawn Wright
shawngwri...@gmail.com 
S/V Callisto, 1974 C 35
https://www.facebook.com/SVCallisto
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Re: Stus-List New Sails...

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

David
I have a Hood Vectron main that I bought for racing in 2007.  It is now 
my cruising sail and still has reasonable shape and would recommend it.  
A J30 skipper was so impressed with it that he bought one for cruising 
(Vectron was not class legal for racing on a J30). However, since the 
Hood loft got bought by Quantum (2017) I do not know if the cloth would 
still be available, It was last year but I had to ask the Loft.  I have 
attached a fairly technical exploitation on sailcloths and below is a 
newer article found in Practical Sailor:

https://www.practical-sailor.com/sails-rigging-deckgear/sailmakers-advice-and-prices

Don Kern
Fireball C 35 Mk2


On 1/15/2020 5:36 PM, David Risch via CnC-List wrote:


Hello,

I am sure we have been there and done that, but please indulge me…

Going through the process of shopping for new sails.   Not a small 
budget item for a 40.   Know the arguments of local vs. national vs. 
offshore.   Cruising with offshore racing and cruising with occasional 
beer can.   Main and 125%.     Leaning toward high quality Dacron 
cross-cut as they are easier to repair and I do not want to get into 
the laminates.   Blew a big budget on those years ago


Specific questions are regarding cloth choices generally and 
specifically as C & C  have tall skinny mains (especially the 40). 
 What has been your experiences with the differing sail lofts?  I am 
getting prices with 50% swings and that is a bit mind-boggling as I am 
getting information that many sails are built in the same lofts 
overseas and re-branded.  I am sure that is an over-simplification, 
but there it is.   Difficult to compare pricing with the cloth specs 
being a foreign language to me.


Thanks in advance.

*/David F. Risch/*

*/(401) 419-4650/*


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Sailcloth 101.docx
Description: MS-Word 2007 document
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Re: Stus-List Fuel guage issue

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Mine fell apart as you described.  Burnished the top edge and epoxy the 
face back on a couple of years ago. Still holding together and operating.

Don Kern
Fireball C 35 mk2

On 1/15/2020 5:22 PM, Richard Bush via CnC-List wrote:
Hi all; I took the gauge panel apart to see why the fuel gauge wasn't 
working; when I checked the connections, it worked fine; however, when 
I went to put everything back together, the front
piece of the fuel gauge, (clear plastic, within a black plastic ring) 
came off of the whole assembly and I cannot find a way to re-connect 
it; there are no screw spirals, or tabs or anything, I believe it 
simply broke off;


I checked the Yanmar Operation Manual and the Yanmar parts catalogue 
and neither even mentions a fuel gauge;


the boat is 1985 37;
Engine is Yanmar, model 3HMF, 3-cylinder; original to boat;

So, what say ye...is it repairable, or should I look for a new 
gauge..and if so, what kind


Thank you in advance, and please let me know if you need more info...

Richard
s/v Bushmark4; 1985 C 37 CB; Ohio River, Mile 596;


Richard N. Bush Law Offices
2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462
502-584-7255



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Re: Stus-List listed weights

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Shawn,
Did the marna forget to look below and pump out the 2 1/2 tons of water 
that was up to the v-berth ??

Don
Fireball C 35 Mk2

On 12/16/2019 6:55 PM, Shawn Wright via CnC-List wrote:
I was told by the crane operator that my 35-2 weighed 19,000 lbs at 
haulout, which seems a bit excessive, even with full tanks and 
cruising gear. The crane is limited to 20,000 lbs, and since at least 
two other larger boats were hauled at the same time (Cabot 36 - 17,800 
rated and Hughes 38 - 14,800 rated), I have my doubts about this 
figure. I would like to know the actual weight though. Two larger 
boats in our club, a Landfall 42 and a 40-2, manage to get hauled by 
the crane after a weight reduction exercise.

--
Shawn Wright
shawngwri...@gmail.com 
S/V Callisto, 1974 C 35
https://www.facebook.com/SVCallisto


On Mon, Dec 16, 2019 at 1:03 PM CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


Sometimes marketing people adjust specifications to sell boats.  I
would call it lying, but sales people call it marketing.  I'm a
person who would pour over data and specifications to make a
buying decision and the sales guys know us and simply change the
manufacturing specs to sell product.  As a resuIt, I never believe
manufacturers' specs.

Chuck Scheaffer, Resolute, 1989 C 34R


On December 16, 2019 at 1:36 PM Gary Nylander via CnC-List
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:

The listed weight of the 30-1 on the spec sheets is 8000#. I
doubt there was ever one that light. The ones which have been
weighed seem to hover around 9000. After looking at Rich’s #1, I
can see a lot of differences, such as his chainplate system. And,
after seeing pictures of other boats – mine has the teak and
holly floor throughout, a sump pump for the shower, pressure
water, hot water heater, two batteries, and the three burner
propane stove/oven which were accessories.

From some earlier comments by owners, I don’t think the raising
of the boom did much for performance, but it did relieve a lot of
headaches.

And I agree with Michael, the boat does quite well in 15 knots
and above.

Gary


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Re: Stus-List PHRF Reviews and Adjustments

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

David
PHRF ratings in Narr Bay are done on the apparent design performance of 
specific class variants (Mk-1, Mk-2, dk, cb, tm, etc} and then any of 
the boat's modifications that are shown on that boats PHRF application 
(weight reduction, sail areas, etc.) This is compared to other boats 
racing on Narragansett Bay, not to other venues.  The rating committee 
assumes the boat is well prepared, equipment, bottom, sails, crew,...  
Looking at the PHRF-NB ratings for C 40s I can only see one 40 rated 
in the last few years, a C 40 Mk2 tm dk with no direct comparison 
rated in NE.  However scanning the ratings I do find that Narr Bay's 
rating for the 40s about 3sec slower compared to NE.


Don Kern
Fireball C 35 Mk2
Bristol RI


On 12/16/2019 12:48 PM, David Risch via CnC-List wrote:
This does not explain why my 40's base  rating is slower in a light 
air venue (Narragansett) and faster in breezy venue (Buzzards Bay) 
when the boat historically is a faster light air boat.


One of the reasons I only race long distance vs. Chasing my tail 
around buoys.




Too subjective even at base.

Sent from my Android. Please forgive typos. Thank you.


*From:* CnC-List  on behalf of CHARLES 
SCHEAFFER via CnC-List 

*Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 9:19:42 AM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
*Cc:* CHARLES SCHEAFFER ; Michael Brown 


*Subject:* Re: Stus-List PHRF Reviews and Adjustments
My two cents;  With hundreds of boats to rate, I wouldn't expect the 
rating committees to make any rating adjustment unless there was a 
serious complaint or an appeal to get their attention, and some good 
solid race results to make a judgement.  Someone I know asked for an 
appeal to raise his rating and was denied.  He had to answer a list of 
questions that revealed he had older sails, inexperienced crew, and 
never scrubbed the bottom of his boat during the racing season.  The 
rating assumes you have properly prepared the boat to race, have 
decent sails, and knowledgeable crew and clean bottom.


Does anyone race in a fleet where they give a handicap for solo 
sailors?  I heard San Francisco gives 13 seconds.


Chuck, Resolute 1989 C 34R

On December 16, 2019 at 12:08 AM Randy Stafford via CnC-List 
 wrote:


Thank you all for the responses on this subject.  I got information I 
was looking for:


* The Gulf Yachting Association PHRF Committee conducts an annual 
review. The minutes of the most recent annual review show +3/-3 
adjustments based on performance.
* The Narragansett Bay PHRF Committee reviews boat performance 
regularly.  Its principles state that handicaps are adjusted on the 
basis of the boat's performance.
* At Shawn Wright's club (somewhere in British Columbia), the club 
handicapper provides a rating and it is reviewed after each series of 
races based on results.
* In PHRF Lake Ontario, classes that consistently perform differently 
from their rating get reviewed by PHRF-LO Central Council every year.


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Re: Stus-List Winter Cover Measurements for C 30-2

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Peter,
per se, I do not use a winter cover.  However, I did have the topside of 
the boat newly shrink wrapped this fall.  The is the second shrink wrap 
cover I have done.  The first shrink wrap cover was 10 years old and had 
gotten a little tired and duct tape patched.  For four years the boat 
was out of the water sitting in the yard with this cover in place.  The 
other years it was off from mid May to early October and stored in the 
overhead of my garage. It is supported by a 4" pvc pipe mounted in the 
mast step extending some 3 ft above the cabin top.  Spinnaker pole 
mounted forward and light galvanized fence pipe to a foot above the aft 
pulpit with poly strapping going across the center to the stanchions to 
handle snow load.


Don Kern
Fireball  C 35 Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 12/15/2019 12:00 PM, kelly petew via CnC-List wrote:


Hey fellow C listers,

Does anyone use a winter cover on their boat?  If so, would you have 
its measurements handy to share?


Thanks!

Pete W.

1991 C

Siren Song

Deltaville, Va.


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Re: Stus-List PHRF Reviews and Adjustments

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Being on the Narragansett Bay PHRF Rating Committee I can state that we 
do review boat performance regularly (monthly meetings).I did not 
realize how difficult it is to rate boats ranging from the latest 
high-performance racers to 1919 Herreshoff S class boats.The committee 
consist of sailing professionals, sail makers, boat builders, engineer, 
statistician, and a 'good old boat' owner (me).


The committee, in an effort to keep the Narra. Bay PHRF rating rules 
relevant, compatible with other rule systems _and_ making PHRF more 
attractive to boats outfitted with cruising sails is modifying our rules 
for 2020. The most significant rules change is that ratings will be 
adjusted for all sails based on their actual sail area. This will 
account square-top and large roach mainsails, cruising spinnakers / 
undersized spinnakers and owners purchasing secondhand sails.Genoa 
adjustments were already based on area and the range of adjustment has 
been modified to better account for observed performance.


I have attached extract from Narragansett Bay PHRF documentation on how 
the committee functions and its guidelines.


Don Kern
Fireball, C 35 Mk2
Bristol, RI




PRINCIPLES OF PHRF OF NARRAGANSETT BAY reva.docx
Description: MS-Word 2007 document
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Re: Stus-List Water system

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Yes, I have always disconnected the accumulator so it will drain out the 
bottom.  The one time i forgot it cracked and had to be replaced.  Also 
all my water lines can be opened for draining at their lowest point, 
just in forward of the engine.


Don Kern
Fireball C Mk2
Bristol, RI



On 1/19/2019 11:11 PM, Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List wrote:
If we are talking about the water pressure accumulators, I wonder if 
anyone has any experience with winterising them. Do you need to 
disconnect it for the winter? Do you go through any extra steps?


Thanks

Marek
Ottawa,  ON



Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


 Original message 
From: "Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List" 
Date: 2019-01-19 15:07 (GMT-05:00)
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: "Matthew L. Wolford" 
Subject: Stus-List Water system

Listers:
    I replaced my potable water tank last year and discovered that the 
water system must have a leak in one or more of the ancient 
hoses/fittings.  I decided that it’s time to replace the old hoses and 
check/replace fittings, and I’m considering also adding an accumulator 
tank.  The hose currently coming from the tank is 5/8” ID, but the 
accumulator tank I’m thinking about adding to the system accepts 1/2” 
ID hose.  Two questions: 1) are small accumulator tanks worth the cost 
and effort to install; and 2) is there any benefit of using 5/8” hose 
instead of 1/2” hose (or vice versa).  Please advise. Thanks.

Matt Wolford
C 42 Custom
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Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Cockpit scupper drains

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Dwight

i believe you are good.  I also have a C MkII with the same cockpit 
drain set up, which I believe is the factory setup. The seacocks are 
always in the open position, whether boat is in or out of the water.  
Since I haul the boat every fall, one of the items on my checklist in 
the spring is to cycle the valves closed then open, look at the cockpit 
drain houses to insure no cracks and that the hoses have two pipe clamps 
in place.  Have been having engine/transmission problems and need to 
remove hoses for aft engine access.


The seacocks are in place in case the a hose fails, since one is usually 
located completely below the waterline when sailing due to boat heel.  I 
race in all kinds of weather and do not need to carry extra weight aft 
because water in the cockpit.


Don Kern
Fireball, C 35 MK2
Bristol, RI


On 12/31/2018 5:40 PM, dwight veinot via CnC-List wrote:
The aft cockpit drains on my 35mkii cross over and feed into the 
forward cockpit drain seacocks. Works fine and has done so for a long 
time. The Groco bronze seacocks can get seized but that can be freed 
and they are all difficult to access but they all work and i leave 
thrm all open always. My bad??




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Re: Stus-List 37+, Removing adjustable jib sheet tracks

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Josh,

Had the same problem on my C Mk2 with a slight leak on a jib track.  
We pulled the bolts fore and aft of where the water was coming thru on 
the headliner and forced silicon sealer into each bolt from topside by 
holding a wood peg against the reinforcement bar. (a C has a bar 
under the deck, above the liner running the length of the track). We 
also ran a small bead of sealant around the track topside.  So far no 
leak.  Since the sail tracks on the 35 are inboard of cabinets, each 
washer and nut is positioned thru a small diameter hole in the liner.  
We went on-line and procured a bag (50) of clear plastic hole plugs, 
went to Ace and got a can of spray paint that closely matched the liner 
(a little whiter) and replaced all the missing or yellowed original 
liner hole plugs and winch mounting liner covers.


Don Kern
Fireball C 35 Mk2
Bristol, RI



 Original message 
From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
Date: 12/11/2018 10:15 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: C List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
Cc: Josh Muckley mailto:muckl...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Stus-List 37+, Removing adjustable jib sheet tracks

Alright 37/40 owners,

Anybody ever remove the tracks for the adjustable jib sheet
leads?  We detected some water leaking around the fasteners (in
the aft berth, stbd closet and cabinet).  I was initially
concerned that the deck area might be cored and that leakage was
going to mean rot.

I removed some of the bolts this afternoon.  Most of the nuts
weren't even tight and the backing washers seem a little
inadequate.  The first difficulty was finding a socket deep enough
for the exposed stud.  Is seems that the machine screws are about
1 inch too long.  I suspect that this was to help engage each bolt
and curve the track.  Anyone have other theories for the extra
length?

I probed around with a drill bit and was pleasantly surprised to
find that the deck appears to be solid glass.  I was disappointed
to find that at least 2, and more likely 3, of the 30 screws are
obstructed by the headliner.  2 are in cabinets where cutting out
headliner material will be irrelevant.  1 is against the aft
bulkhead on the forward side.

I believe that the original bedding material was 4200 or 5200.  It
is already proving difficult to unseat the aft section of track
where I've removed the bolts.  I'm torn as to whether or not to
proceed or just reassemble and live with the minor leaks.  I'd
probably be quick to live with simply re-bedding to bolts accept
that I can't access the deck hole/deck surface without removing
the track.  The track has a hollow channel and I suspect that
water accumulates in the hollow where it is then able to wick down
the threads of each fastener.  If I'm able to remove the track
I'll be able to easily apply bed-it butyl tape to the track and
fasteners.  I'll also be able to ensure that the holes in the deck
are counter sunk.

Anybody have and further thoughts, ideas, or experience?

Thanks,
Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C 37+
Solomons, MD

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Re: Stus-List Reaching Strut Pole replacement - death roll

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Forgot to mention that we still laugh about the second event as the 
helmsman was on his knees behind the wheel, waist deep in water, with 
the white of his eyes showing around his sunglasses. This after a Off 
Soundings race, heading from Gardner's Bay to Block Island, some ten 
years ago.


Don Kern
Fireball C Mk2
Bristol, RI

On 12/7/2018 10:36 PM, Donald Kern via CnC-List wrote:

Been there, done that!

In the two instances was after racing, running home (both times 5 hour 
of sailing), crew relaxing with beers, helmsman being not that 
experienced. Each time dug the pole into the ocean.  First time bent 
the pole's closing pin at the mast and bent the mast fitting, both had 
to be replaced.  Second time we did it, the pole slammed down on the 
life lines to the extend that it pulled the aft pulpit out of the deck 
fittings on the port side, almost lost the #1 genny and the crewman 
lying on it overboard and also put solid water into the cockpit.  For 
a reason I do not understand the that helmsman never sailed with us 
again (his choice).


Don Kern
Fireball C Mk2
Bristol, RI



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Re: Stus-List Reaching Strut Pole replacement - death roll

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Been there, done that!

In the two instances was after racing, running home (both times 5 hour 
of sailing), crew relaxing with beers, helmsman being not that 
experienced. Each time dug the pole into the ocean.  First time bent the 
pole's closing pin at the mast and bent the mast fitting, both had to be 
replaced.  Second time we did it, the pole slammed down on the life 
lines to the extend that it pulled the aft pulpit out of the deck 
fittings on the port side, almost lost the #1 genny and the crewman 
lying on it overboard and also put solid water into the cockpit.  For a 
reason I do not understand the that helmsman never sailed with us again 
(his choice).


Don Kern
Fireball C Mk2
Bristol, RI


On 12/7/2018 4:32 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List wrote:
Our rule to minimize the possibility of a death roll is to NEVER, EVER 
let the center seam of the chute be to windward of the forestay in 
heavy breeze.  That's on the guy trimmer.  It's one of the few things 
one can do on Touche' where you get yelled at by me.


Ease the pole forward so the center seam is 1-2 feet to leeward of the 
forestay.  If the boat starts to heel to windward, ease the pole more 
and trim the chute IN, not out. Pulling the chute behind the main will 
lessen the chance of a death roll.  Unfortunately, the natural 
tendency of most trimmers is to ease or release a sail in such a 
situation.  If the chute is eased, it will swing further to windward 
and drag the boat down into a death roll.  Bad, bad scene.


For non-racers, death rolls are scary bad.  They can occur when 
sailing dead downwind with the chute poled out.  The boat can become 
unstable and start into a "windshield wiper" oscillation.  If extreme, 
the boat heels well to windward and the pole enters the water.  The 
speed of the boat can snap the pole's bridle or downhaul and the pole 
will pivot into the shrouds.  It can bring the rig down.


Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA



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Re: Stus-List Spinnaker Running Rigging

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Alan, I find that my 35 Mk2 is sensitive to crew forward  of the mast, 
thus the only time I like to have crew forward of the mast is for sail 
set ups and sail changes.  Thus in spinnaker take down I have one person 
in cabin and two hauling the chute down.  Normal racing crew is 6 or 7.  
Also race on a J30 and find on her that crew forward is good and only 
have two aft of the cabin companionway (helm & mainsheet/tactician), 
Normal crew on her is the same, 6 or 7.


Would also like to know what others think about fore-aft trim on the 
older C


Don Kern
Fireball C 35 MK2
Bristol, RI


On 12/7/2018 7:00 PM, ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List wrote:
My arrangement is similar to yours, Don. The spinnaker guy has a 
shackle with a large bale The sheet is attached to the guy and the guy 
is attached to the spinnaker clew. I have a two or three inch diameter 
disk on the guy just aft of the shackle which prevents the shackle 
from getting caught in the jaws of the pole. My guy goes to a pad-eye 
just aft of the shrouds, and the sheet to a block on the rail all the 
way aft. When dropping the chute, we drop it under the jib, and down 
the forward hatch. That keeps the companionway clear, and the 
spinnaker doesn't tangle with the cockpit crew.


Alan Bergen
35 Mk III Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR


  Don Kern via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>


1:08 PM (2 hours ago)


Reply
to cnc-list, Don

I race quite a bit (more than I cruise) and I have not used the 
reaching strut in years, though it carried below on the shelf above 
the v-berth.  We use both a sheet and a guy attached to each clue. The 
sheet is lead to a turning blocks at the aft most opening on the toe 
rail, the guy is lead to a snatch block on the toe rail about a foot 
aft of the lower-aft shroud, then inboard aft to the cockpit.  In 
light air we will drop the guy and just go with the sheet.  The 
shackle of the guy is normally hooked into the ring of the sheet's 
shackle. For spinnaker take downs we grab the lazy guy, easy since 
there is no tension on it, lead it over the life line down the 
companionway into cabin. Then let the pole go forward and blow the 
sheet's shackle (guy is hooked into the sheet) and haul the chute down 
behind the main. Two other advantages with this arrangement is that 
with the guy led into the toe rail amidships it also acts as a pole 
downhaul and when running dead before the wind, in very heavy blow we 
choke the spinnaker with the lazy guy to inhibit death roles.


Don Kern
Fireball C MK2
Bristol, RI

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Re: Stus-List Cruising Destinations in Narraganset Bay

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

Brian

If you are going to circle the bay after Dutch I would consider stopping 
in Greenwich Bay, then go north around the top of Prudence down to 
Bristol.  There are two Potter Cove in Narragansett bay one north of the 
Newport Bridge which is open to NE winds and the other is across from 
Bristol on Prudence Is. which is open to the SE winds.  You can drop the 
hook in either and go ashore on Prudence Is.  Neither has any services.  
Bristol is having a Harborfest on August 18th, great food available.  In 
Bristol there are four available moorings for overnight; Bristol YC, 
Bristol Harbor (Harbormaster), Bristol Marina, and Herreshoff Marine 
Museum. Best to make arrangement to any of these thru dockwa.com.  Be 
aware there is no engine fuel available in Bristol.  Send me an email if 
you would like a tour of Herreshoff.  If you are planning to go down the 
Sakonnet River be very careful going thru Old Stone Bridge in Tiverton, 
3-5 knots current and the buoys get moved around in the current (at 
least that is my excuse for touching riprap on the East side).  Before 
jumping out to Cuttyhunk I have put up in either Third Beach or just 
outside Sakonnet Pt Harbor depending on the wind direction. In August 
the prevailing wind will be light in the morning coming out SSW in the 
afternoon.


Enjoy Narragansett Bay,
Don Kern
Fireball, sail 12708
C 35 MkII
Bristol, RI



On 7/16/2018 10:53 AM, Nauset Beach via CnC-List wrote:


We are planning a cruise to Narraganset Bay next month and are 
interested in any suggestions / tips / things to see on land, places 
to provision, etc. on various harbors / anchorages.  It has been years 
since we have spent any time there, though frequently stop over at 
Sachuest  on the Sekonnet when passing by traveling east or west.  We 
prefer to anchor or grab a mooring vs. tying up at a dock. Our 
preliminary itinerary is to make a circle around the bay:


Dutch Island – probably a mooring at Dutch I Marina

Potter’s Cove – is there a place to anchor or is it all moorings, are 
any moorings open and available?


Bristol YC – plan to go to the Herreschoff and AC museum as has been 
redone since we were there last, possibly the Blithewold Estate.  Is 
Linden Place museum worth a visit?


A couple nights going down the Sekonnet

Any suggestions about any of these locations or others is 
appreciated.  Am not planning on going to Newport as it is just too 
crowded.  Wickford has been recommended as a great village to visit 
but the only time have been there was tied up at a marina on a very 
hot and humid August day [not the best memory] and did not see any 
moorings or a place to really anchor.  Battleship Cove is a possible 
though not sure the Admiral really wants to visit the Massachusetts, 
and I am not sure I want to spend the night there, if one can.


TIA,

Brian



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Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Stus-List Fwd hatch on C

[Donald Kern via CnC-List]

The original forward hatch on my C 35 Mk2 (1974) has a few problems 
besides crazing, in that both of the aft hinges have crack in the 
castings and one of the dogs now leaks.  I have been unable to take 
apart the latching dog to try to replace what must be a O-ring failure.  
Has any one successfully repaired this latch?  Is there a direct 
replacement for the hatch and frame?


Don Kern
Fireball 12708
Bristol. RI








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