Re: problem playing audio cd's

2001-01-26 Thread Scott Patterson



Hi, I had the same problem as Phillip. I was advised to add the user to
audio and disk ...

I have already undone this, after reading the post. My problem is I do not
seem to have /dev/cdrom
To get gtcd to play I had to change the device from /dev/cdrom to /dev/hdc.

Looking through the /etc/group file I noticed that I have a cdrom group.

Any ideas?

Intermediate newbie :)

As root, type ln -s /dev/hdc /dev/cdrom.

Scott





Re: Installing Debian

2001-01-24 Thread Scott Patterson



My brother got me a set of 2.2 release disks, and I would like to install them
on an IBM PC 750. I have tried a couple of times, but am quite new at Linux
and have not been able to get my printer to work, or get online once the
system is installed. I'm sure that it is something that I am doing wrong when
I install the system as I can install SuSE 6.4 and get everything to work, so
it works under Linux. I'm using SuSE now.

I really like what I have been reading about Debian, and it is the distro that
I want to run on my system, just need a bit of help getting everything working
at this point. One of the big problems I have is I don't have a clue as to
what drivers I need to install when loading Debian. And I use a dial up PPP
access for the Internet.

I really want to use Debian so any help anyone would be willing to give me to
get it up and running on here would be most appreciated.

Log in as root and type pppconfig. This will setup all your PPP dial-up
options. Once you complete this process, type pon and see if you connect. You
disconnect via the poff command. If you have problems connecting, run plog
to see what type of error messages you got. HTH.

Once you get PPP running as root, add yourself to the group dip so you need
not be root to start PPP. This is done by typing adduser lute dip.

Scott





Re: problem playing audio CD's

2001-01-24 Thread Scott Patterson



On Wed, Jan 24, 2001 at 06:49:43PM +, Philipp Bliedung wrote:
 Hi,

 I'm new to the multimedia things under Linux :)
 I have the problem that I can't play audio CD's on my computer.
 I've installed everyhting that's related to sound properly - so I'm able
 to play mp3s, *.wav,etc. with freeamp for example, but when I put in a
 CD (even CD's I bought, no CD-R or CD-RW) and I want to mount it I get:

 mount: wrong fs type, bad option, bad superblock on /dev/cdrom or too
 many mounted file systems

 Even as root I can't do it!  This is how /etc/fstab looks like:

 /dev/cdrom   /cdrom   iso9660
 defaults,user,noauto,ro  00

 When I start 'gcd 2.91' under Gnome I get this:

 Unable to open cd device. Please make sure that you are using teh
 correct device and that you have permission to access the device..
 The cd-drive works perfectely fine with every CD (cd-rom). So it's not
 the cd-drive that's not working!

 What am I missing, or what am I doing wrong? Any ideas for a good
 cd-player?

Make sure that you are in the cdrom group.  I also had a problem where
I was in the cdrom group but not in the disk group.  Since /dev/cdrom
was a link to /dev/hdc which was in the disk group, I couldn't access
the cdrom.  So if you are still having problems, add yourself to the
disk group.

This is a VERY bad idea, IIRC. By doing this, any user in the disk group can
then do whatever to a file of that group. Something like cat /dev/null 
/dev/hda1 comes to mind. Ouch!

You're much better off changng the group to cdrom for the actual CDROM device
in your system.

Scott









RE: Why Choose Debian?

2001-01-18 Thread Scott Patterson
I started using Linux around 1995 at one of my employers. I had heard about it
at college, but could never install any of the distributions from the Infomagic
discs successfully. I just didn't have the Unix/Linux skills. Nowadays,
installation is MUCH easier. Things have changed quite a bit!

So, after leaving this job, I started working at another company that was doing
UNIX consulting. When I started, half of the office was running Linux, the other
half, Windows. Since Linux rarely crashes and it fit nicely with our Unix
servers, we all converted to Linux. We used Redhat Linux and I discovered why,
it was the easiest to install. So, now I could finally install Linux by myself
and put it on my home system.

After a couple of years at this job, I learned much about Unix/Linux in general.
I also had the oppurtunity to test several Linux distributions ranging from
Redhat, Mandrake, Corel and Caldera (somewhere in my past I used Slackware as
well). Of course, these were all RPM based.

After hearing a talk by Richard Stallman, I was gung-ho to replace all my
proprietary software with free software. Debian seemed to have the strictest
policy regarding licenses. Also, Debian is a volunteer project, which really hit
home for me. I think big business is becoming too big...this could be why I
like Dr. Stallman so much:) Also, Debian was about due to release Potato. One
more point, Debian had a different packaging system that seemed too good to be
true.

Well, after installing Potato a couple times, I finally got the hang of how it
worked. All that RPM knowledge I had was useless, except the fact that it allows
me to appreciate apt so much more!!! Anyway, it's something like 6 months
later and I don't see myself trying any other distribution anytime soon.

What really keeps me using Debian is it's freeness. Debian has no one to
answer to because it is a volunteer effort. Because of this, I also believe that
the developers take more pride in their work and it shows! Things like the
package management system, filesystem strucure, vast software archive and
helpful mailing lists are just results of what happens when you truly open up
your sources and mind!

Long live Debian.

Scott




Re: IDE CD-RW

2001-01-16 Thread Scott Patterson



I've purchased a Traxdata 8x4x32 CD-RW, and can only install it on my
main box. Unfortunately, this has two Hard Disks (both on the Primary
IDE channel) and a normal CD Drive as Master on the second channel.

The literature with the CD-RW is basic and suggests ways in which it
can be installed on those channels already in use. This seems to
imply that I shouldnot/cannot use the secondary channel slave, but it
does not specifically say so.

I have very vague recollections of some advice against putting CD
Drives on the secondary slave, but am unable to remember where I read
this (if in fact I did!)

I've had my CD-RW drive as a secondary slave for years. Linux and Windoze
detects it fine and I can't remember any problems associated with having it as
the secondary slave. I have hard drives occupying all the other channels. HTH.

Scott





Re: Cross-Platform Development?

2001-01-15 Thread Scott Patterson


I plan to develop a little GUI application (GPLed of course ;-) using
Debian/GNU-Linux as primary development environment. Unfortunately the
app also has to run on Windoze... :-((
Does anybody have experience developing such cross-platform apps? Can
you recommend a language or a toolkit? (I have some practice in C  C++
but would also like it to learn something new... ;-)

QT - http://www.trolltech.com

It's the toolkit used in KDE. Supposedly it cross-platform. KDE has been ported
to other Unices, so, it obviously works across Unix-land. YMMV with Windows
though...

It's a C++ toolkit BTW:)

Scott







Re: **NVIDIA driver petition**

2001-01-15 Thread Scott Patterson



Has anyone stopped to think that maybe nvidia can't open
source their drivers? I know for a fact they can't because
of certain things, that if anyone has paid attention to
game boards or interviews, restrict them from open sourcing
their code.

I'm curious as what prevents them from opening up their source? Can you please
expand on this...

I personally would love to see their 4.0 drivers released
as open source, and I know they are trying to one day reach
that goal, but for right now like I said. They can't open
source them.

Until then, you can only hope that Nvidia further supports Linux driver
development.

Scott
PS: I'd be willing to sign the petition as well:)





Re: **NVIDIA driver petition**

2001-01-15 Thread Scott Patterson



If I remember correctly when I was out there ..
what prevents them from open sourcing it, is
the OpenGL code they use in their drivers.

Something with the OpenGL code, and something
with SGI (If memory serves me right). I have
a few good friends at nvidia .. and I know
they are trying hard to make their drivers
open source .. and to support the linux
community better, its just gonna take some time.

On Mon, Jan 15, 2001 at 02:22:41PM -0500, Scott Patterson babbled:
 I'm curious as what prevents them from opening up their source? Can you
please
 expand on this...

 Until then, you can only hope that Nvidia further supports Linux driver
 development.

 Scott
 PS: I'd be willing to sign the petition as well:)

I wonder why the other video card manufacturers don't have this problem? I would
assume ATI is using OpenGL. Also, someone mentioned that the Utah-GLX drivers
were open sourced but when they overhalled them to be compatible with XF4, they
became closed. Why don't people port the Utah-GLX Nvidia drivers to XF4 so they
remain open? What has changed since then? Something just doesn't sound right to
me!

Scott




Re: new boot disk?

2001-01-12 Thread Scott Patterson



 Greetings, everyone.
 
 I just migrated from RedHat over to Debian potato and I'm thrilled so
 far.
 
 But, I think my boot disk is defective, since it takes 5-7 minutes for
 the
 
 Loading Linux..
 
 process to complete from /dev/fd0 before Linux actually boots. I suspect
 I have a bad floppy, and I want to make a new boot floppy.

 I just had to boot from a floppy and had the same situation. It does take a
LONG
 time (I don't remember other distribtions (Redhat, Caldera, etc)
boot-floppies
 being so slow...), but eventually my system boots up properly. I'd install
LILO
 or grub ASAP and not rely on a floppy. IMHO, floppies are an unreliable
media.

If you use grub, then your 'unreliable media' would be useful.

I was referring to how  floppy discs just seem to crap out on you. There not
made very well nowadays, and thus, I don't use floppies as a storage medium
(except as a backup boot disk). And if a floppy is your only method to boot, a
bad floppy could be really bad news.

BTW, I've been using grub since all the LILO changes going on in unstable. I
sort of like the pretty little menu it gives. It's easier for my wife to use at
least:)

Scott









Re: Any Linux-based PhotoID software?

2001-01-12 Thread Scott Patterson



My university creates ID cards for students using a small camera
attached to a Windows box running PhotoCard software. I am getting
mighty tired of trying to keep this Winblows box running. Does anyone
have any leads on high-quality photo imaging/idcard-generating software
that'll run on Debian (or even some other Linux distro - at this point
I'd even settle for a DOS-based solution)?

I'm sure you've heard of Gphoto by now. It's supports many digital cameras. You
can take pictures interactively with the GUI interface, or use the command line
utilities.

I did a quick search at Freshmeat and couldn't find any such package available
for photo ids:( Could you simply create a template in Gimp for the ID card. Then
call up this template and edit it by filling in the name, etc. Finally, insert
the picture you just took and print it.

I'm really surprised there is no package available. Maybe I'll mention this to
the Gphoto team as I'm sure there is a need for this type of software.

Scott






Re: new boot disk?

2001-01-11 Thread Scott Patterson



Greetings, everyone.

I just migrated from RedHat over to Debian potato and I'm thrilled so
far.

But, I think my boot disk is defective, since it takes 5-7 minutes for
the

Loading Linux..

process to complete from /dev/fd0 before Linux actually boots. I suspect
I have a bad floppy, and I want to make a new boot floppy.

I just had to boot from a floppy and had the same situation. It does take a LONG
time (I don't remember other distribtions (Redhat, Caldera, etc) boot-floppies
being so slow...), but eventually my system boots up properly. I'd install LILO
or grub ASAP and not rely on a floppy. IMHO, floppies are an unreliable media.

Scott





Gravis Gamepad Module

2001-01-10 Thread Scott Patterson
I cannot get my gravis gamepad to work. I'm using a Sound Blaster Live and
plugging the gamepad directly into the gameport. I can get the joystick.o module
to load, but, that's it. I tried loading joy-analog.o but no luck (it fails).
Same for the joy-grip.o module (it fails also). I'm running the 2.2.18-pre21
kernel. Help...

Also, anyone have a recommendation for a gamepad with more than 4 buttons? I'd
like compatibility with DOS, Windoze and Linux, but can give up DOS if
necessary. TIA.

Scott




Re: Gravis Gamepad Module

2001-01-10 Thread Scott Patterson



Yes, the emu10k1 module is needed, I believe.

I've loaded the module from the 2.2.18-pre21 kernel. It works as I have sound,
but I guess it could be possible that the one at soundblaster's website is more
up-to-date. Possibly my module doesn't have gameport support while the other one
does. I'll try updating my kernel first (as I was planning on doing that anyway)
and see if that changes anything.

http://opensource.soundblaster.com should have it.. I am pretty sure I
remember seeing the gameport support being compiled into it when I installed
it myself.

Thx





Re: How stable is testing?

2001-01-10 Thread Scott Patterson




Dear community,

I've noticed that there are some programs in testing that I'd
like to use (and at least one that I have to use), but I'm
very scared of it not working correctly or breaking badly
when, say, I'd need to get something done fast.

So, I'd like to ask you: how stable is testing compared to
potato?

Testing is very new, so, time will tell it's stability.

However, based on unstable's performance, I've never had downtime greater than a
day since Potato was released. Of course, I don't use my computer all the time,
and I update just a couple times a week. But, most bugs seem squashed fairly
quickly or at least there is a workaround posted somewhere.

If your machine is mission critical (server), I wouldn't do the upgrade; but, if
it is a workstation, I don't see any harm. Perhaps updating right before you
leave work might be best. This way, if something breaks, it might possibly be
fixed by the next morning.

I wonder how many people really use testing? Do people downgrade from unstable
to testing or upgrade from stable to testing? Where are the users coming from???
This would be interesting to find out. Aren't there some graphs showing download
usage at Debian?

Scott







Re: [OT] all you emulator folk, please read this

2001-01-02 Thread Scott Patterson



Hey,

Over the past year, I have begun a conquest to find the perfect emu's =
under Linux.  Here's what I got.

SNES: snes9x: beautiful, I love this emulator, the only flaw is, no =
screenshot support?
correct me if I'm wrong about the screenshots

GENESIS: dgen: not to great, they say it's the best Linux has to offer.  =
Please tell me this is not true.  The sound
   quality/timing sucks, and I can't get the joystick support to work.

MAME: mame: excellent, no problems

PLAYSTATION: I haven't found anything that is working (yet).

N64: same as Playstation.

DREAMCAST: I Don't think this has ever been emulated at all

Anyways, if you guys can think of any others I need to know about, =
please share.

Your list is pretty much what I've come up with as well, minus some missing
systems!

Go to http://www.zophar.net and look on the right hand side. Unix emulators are
way down at the bottom, but they're there. This is the best list of emulators
available for Linux I've seen.

Mess, the sister project to MAME is very interesting. Simply put, it's trying
to support game consoles (NES, Sega Master System, Genesis, Atari 2600, etc.)
and old computers (TI-994A, C64, Apple IIe, etc.). Pretty much everything that
MAME doesn't emulate! For some reason though, most emulator developers perfer to
start from scratch vs. using a very functional code-base (aka MAME). I
understand there is more to learn by reinventing the wheel and you can optimize
more, but cmon...Oh well.

IMHO, Linux is behind Windoze in emulation but I've been working to change
that:)

Scott











Re: networked filesystems

2000-12-26 Thread Scott Patterson



I have just configured a simple network with one harddiskless computer
that boots from a floppy and mounts a remote root through nfs.

It should make administration much easier:)

Now my questions:
- which other alternatives are there? I have heard that nfs has a big
overlay. I have also heard about nbd.

I've never heard of ndb, but I know the LTSP project uses nfs. They also allow
the use of NIS to manage passwords and such.

- is it true, or can you configure your client so, that when using a
networked filesystem, it tries to cache as much as possible in memory?

Don't know.

- what kind of ethernet is suiteble for a good (fast) working client? How
much difference is there between 100Mb and Full Duplex (I may ask the same
here, excuse for my veil of ignorance)? Will a server at 200MHz
(i586) work fine?

That depends on what you want to do. I remember hearing something like 30+
clients running xterms and FVWM95 on a 10mb network with PLENTY of bandwidth to
spare. I never recall LAN bandwith being a problem. Of course, if you plan on
streaming video/audio, that's another case!

The server is where you need to be careful. You need to determine what
applications the users need to run. Netscape was always troublesome as the
memory leaks pose a serious problem to the server. We had scripts that would
look for stray netscape processes every half hour or so. If you plan on
running KDE or GNOME, you might need a more powerful server. What you'll need to
do is calcuate the number of users and mulitply it by their memory/CPU use.

Hope that helps,
Scott








Re: CD Audio tracks/file system

2000-12-26 Thread Scott Patterson



I had done that, but overlooked one small fact; I was in the cdrom group,
but not the disk group, to which /dev/hdc was pointed.  I had no rights to
physically scan the CD for tracks!

How has everyone else set up the permissions for their IDE /dev/cdrom links?
I don't like being in the disk group, I just hope it's usually automatically
set up the *proper* way and I just wrecked it myself...

I'm guessing that ALL /dev/hd? are setup as group disk. What I did and I
believe is the *proper* procedure, is simply change the group of /dev/hdc (or
whatever your CDROM is) from disk to cdrom (chgrp cdrom /dev/hdc). Of
course, any users that need access should be in the cdrom group. Use adduser
username cdrom to do that and have the user log out, then log in again for the
changes to take place.

Scott





Re: cdr recomendations

2000-12-26 Thread Scott Patterson



I have recently installed a CDRW drive on my machine. I chose a Philips
CDRW800, a 4x 8x 32x drive. It is IDE and Linux needs to see CDR drives as
SCSI - so a little configuring of the kernel and a couple of lines in
/etc/lilo.conf was all it took. I now have both my CD-ROM and CDRW drives
recognised as SCSI and the Linux software (especially XCDRoast) works very
well indeed. As long as you are OK compiling a kernel you should have no
problem at all with an IDE drive.

I didn't recompile a kernel (although I'm running kernel 2.2.18pre21 from a deb
in woody). I simply added hdd=ide-scsi to the append option in /etc/lilo.conf.
I also added the modules sg.o (generic scsi support) and ide-scsi.o (ide scsi
emulation) to make it work. I added these using modconf. HTH.

Scott





Re: debian help

2000-12-21 Thread Scott Patterson



I installed debian in the belief that it would install. Xwindows  simply
will not install. As newcomer I can't work with a program w/o the gui.
I wanted xwindows (eventually kde) ppp connection, printer, netscape and I
want to do experiments with star office and other suites. Debian was
suggested because a lot of people use it and there would be paid support.
This has simply not been the case.
In any event I need to get xwindows - gnome up and running and I can hack
my way to the other goas w/o support.

You've come to the right place for support. There are many knowledgable people
here eager to help.

So, without any delay what have you done so far?

It sounds like you've installed a minimum set of packages. If you can boot your
computer into Linux with a login prompt, login in as root and then type
tasksel. This will present you with a list of tasks, one of which is to
install X.

Perhaps you've already loaded X and don't know it. Try typing startx at the
command line prompt.

Scott





Re: dselect problems in woody

2000-12-20 Thread Scott Patterson



For roughly the last week I have had many of the packages in dselect showing
up as obsolete.  This includes KDE, perl-5.6, netscape, and many other
packages that I commonly use.  I thought at first that there were
replacements for these packages with new names but I couldn't find them.

My instalation is woody, and my mirror is ftp.us.debian.org.  Can anybody
help me with this problem?

Recent changes
-
Potato = stable
Woody  = testing
Sid= unstable

Point to unstable or sid if you want the latest and greatest, otherwise,
wait for Woody to absorb more packages from Sid (i.e. the conversion of ALL
packages is not complete). Consult the list archives or the latest Debian Weekly
News for more info on this change.

Scott







Re: diskless debian

2000-12-19 Thread Scott Patterson



 May I ask where you found the HOWTO documents? I
 have a friend who want to install a diskless
 workstation but we can't seem to find any
 information.
 thanks!

There is also a project called LTSP, Linux Terminal Server Project, at
http://www.ltsp.org. The developers use Red Hat, but I know people have ported
it to Debian. The project is very active and support is excellent via the
mailing list.

Scott





Re: Debates about the 'deb' in debian?

2000-12-19 Thread Scott Patterson



On a recent linux radio show  a guest pronounced the 'deb'
with an 'a' sound as in 'day'.And a bio article in the  Nov/Dec
issue of 'Maximum Linux'  quotes Debra (Ian's wife)  as
'...remembering debates on how to pronounce the name'.
So are there still debates about  saying 'deb' as in Debra or
as in 'day' or maybe even as in 'debate'?

Maybe Ian should record a sound file pronouning Debian, juts like Linus has
one pronouncing Linux!

Personally, I go the Maximum Linux route.

Scott





Re: Low SBLive volume

2000-12-18 Thread Scott Patterson



Finally can hear sound, but with low volume and when I try to move the
control in the mixer the sound vanishes.

I have a similar problem. When I installed my SBLive, the volume is low in both
Linux and Windoze compared to my previously installed SB16. I can increase the
main volume to its maximum level and it's acceptable, but, it seems like I
shouldn't have to do that. I'm using the kernel 2.2.18pre21 module for sound.
Anyone else have a similar problem?

Scott





Re: Digital Photo in Linux

2000-12-15 Thread Scott Patterson


 gphoto vs. photopc (phototk), which is best?

Gphoto supports over 100 cameras and is being actively developed. The gphoto
development team is actually revising the code to make it VERY modular (a
library). This change will make it independent of the interface (ex: GNOME, KDE,
tk, curses, etc). I'd vote gphoto as it works for me:)

Scott





Re: MP3 players

2000-12-14 Thread Scott Patterson



 The little baby 64M players, I don't see the point of.  I don't know what
 song I want -next-, let alone for the next hour, or you're stuck with
 this hours worth of music all day.  Icky.

 Wrong...64MB is plenty for when I go running.  It's very lightweight
 and durable.  Besides, I'd rather not run around with a hard drive
 in my hand.  It all depends on what you use it for.

Wrong?

Excuse me?

How pretentious of you to state that an hours worth of music, which is
fine for you, should also be fine for me to take to work for 10 hours.

Settle down now...I simply stated that there reasons to make a 64M player. To
me, a 64M player is not icky at all. That's all I'm saying:)

Send flames to /dev/null.

Peace,
Scott







Re: I'm Confused with SBLive!

2000-12-14 Thread Scott Patterson



I tried to install the emu10k1 module from ALSA. Having any troubles with
it, I deinstalled it. When I read that the final kernel (version 2.2.17)
had these module in it, I download, compile and install it with the modules.
But I can't use audio.

There is a debian package for kernel 2.2.18pre12 or something like that you can
download vs compiling your own kernel. It also has support for accelerated 3D
for XF4. Just in case you'd rather not compile a kernel.

The kernel starts and don't install the module. When I use cat /proc/modules
it's list all the modules loaded at the time. But no the this module. Try
loading with insmod. Fine. When I use cat /proc/modules it displays that the
module is unused.

I tried to many forms for solving this trouble. I read docs at many sites
I've found and nothing. All refers at usr/src/linux/Documentation/sound for
the specified card docs. But in the latest kernel hadn't included docs for
it.

After I installed the packaged kernel, I loaded 3 or 4 modules, IIRC. Try
loading sound, soundlow, soundcore and emu10k1 modules. It's using the
kernel module instead of ALSA, but, I don't do anything fancy (mp3s and CDs),
so, it works for me;)

Scott





Re: MP3 players

2000-12-13 Thread Scott Patterson



The little baby 64M players, I don't see the point of.  I don't know what
song I want -next-, let alone for the next hour, or you're stuck with
this hours worth of music all day.  Icky.

Wrong...64MB is plenty for when I go running. It's very lightweight and durable.
Besides, I'd rather not run around with a hard drive in my hand. It all depends
on what you use it for.

Scott







How do you remove Helix GNOME

2000-12-07 Thread Scott Patterson
I'm interested in following the Woody releases of GNOME instead of Helix Code's.
Problem is, how do I remove ALL the Helix Code packages. Seeing they all have
helix in their package name, a simple script should easily do this. Too bad
I'm not that familiar with dpkg and apt. Going manually through each package is
not preferable!

Scott




Modconf not working after 2.4.x kernel install

2000-12-06 Thread Scott Patterson


I recently compiled and installed a 2.4.x kernel using the debian
kernel-installer package. Everything seems fine except that when I run modconf,
no modules appear. I was hoping to browse my modules this way, but no luck. I
should mention that my modules do work fine, just modconf seems broken. Is there
something I need to do to make modconf see my available modules?

Scott





Re: X4 and my Voodoo Banshee

2000-12-05 Thread Scott Patterson



I'm having a hell of a time getting this to work.

Ahhh, the painful process of learning.

I'm running a mostly-clean install of Debian.  It'd be wholly clean,
except that when I set my sources to woody to get the .debs I'd like,
dselect threw in a bunch more and I wasn't inclined to argue :)

Anyways, as the subjects says, I'm trying to get X4 running _properly_
with my video card, meaning that I'd like to have proper acceleration of X
with my Banshee.  I followed the instructions at debianplanet for X4 under
3dfx cards, but it balked at the libglide3 step, and when I searched the
packages under dselect I couldn't find it either.

But I have installed the proper libglide2 packages, or so it appears.  As
I understand it, I now have to install the device3dfx packages for
libglide2 to run properly.  I've downloaded and installed the source .deb,
to want compiled kernel sources in /usr/src/linux?  I tried out the
header-package, ran debian/buildpkg, got a .deb out of that, but it
doesn't install properly.

So what's the secret?  What am I supposed to do?  I'm not sure exactly
_how_ I'm supposed to compile the .deb myself, so it's possible and likely
that I've done something wrong in that regards.  I'm willing to compile a
kernel, if I have to.  I'm willing to reinstall if that's needed.

So what am I supposed to do?

I'm no pro at this, but I did get 3D acceleration working on my Banshee, so I
know it works. Here we go...

Glad to see you followed the debainplanet tutorial. Along with cleaning out my
old XF3.3.6 stuff, I also removed most (if not all) of my glide/3d stuff. IIFC,
you need libglide3 and that's it. Libglide2 and device3dfx are for XF3.3.6.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong. I'd look at my installed packages, but, that
box is at home.

Also, you need to recompile a kernel to support DRI and tdfx. I'm running
2.4.test10. The only problem I with my setup was that my default depth for X was
set to 32. It should be 16 as that is what the Voodoo Banshee supports for 3D
acceleration. Once I changed that, I had 3d support fullscreen and in windows.

Email me if you need more help (am I asking for trouble???).


Nigel

http://www.flipside.org/vol3/apr00/00ap20a.htm


Scott





Re: Voodoo 3, XFree 4.0 and DRI

2000-12-05 Thread Scott Patterson



 Can anybody tell me, what I have to install / configure to have a working
 GL-lib based on DRI with hardware acceleration?
 
 mfg
   Mischel S aus P

 Go to http://www.debianplanet.org and look on the left hand side. There is a
 nice tutorial on installing XF4 in Debian using a Voodoo card.

 Scott

Ok, I succeeded in installing my voodoo properly, but it is very slow
(20fps XFree4.0 DRI, 35 fps XFree3.6 dev3dfx) and applications using
GL seems to stop from time to time (for just a second or less). But games
are not playable with this. Is this a driver-related issue and can I speed
up things a little bit (20fps are ok, but those short freezes of my Quake3
are not)?

Good question...I got this from http://www.linuxgames.com.
It was the latest article I found about 3dfx and XF4. It's
dated Friday Aug 18 23:26:06 2000.

---START---
There are new XFree86 4.0.1 X Server/Mesa prereleases
for the Voodoo Banshee, Voodoo3, Voodoo4 and Voodoo5
available. These drivers should be used in conjunction
with XFree86 4.0 and Glide 3 with DRI support (provided).
These are the drivers that were used in the demonstrations
at 3dfx's Linux World Expo booth. They ran games such as
Quake3, Unreal Tournament (with OpenGL renderer), Soldier
of Fortune and others. Note these drivers will still not
work with, Myth2, Quake2 or other Glide and Mesa2x based
applications but, the the DGA mouse bug been has been
fixed. Also note, these drivers are still in early
development. At this time only a single chip on the
board is supported, that means that the board will not
run at its full speed potential, nor are Full Scene
Antialiasing (FSAA) and T-Buffer Cinematic effects
available. As development continues these features
will be implemented in the drivers.
---END---

Anyone know if they've been updated since???

Scott




Re: PPP connection.

2000-12-05 Thread Scott Patterson



 From the pppd man page:

8  The connect script failed (returned a non-zero exit
   status).

  Any sugestions?

 Run pppconfig and try connecting with pon.

I did that already... No results... pon starts the connection,
seems to make the transaction and dies. After that, poff doesn't even
find any pppd... So, I don't know whats going on.

  Daniel.

plog is your friend. It will give you some debugging info. If you have trouble
reading the log, email it to the group for us to debug. Also, make sure you are
in the dip group. As root, type adduser user dip, substituting your
username for user. This is a common error.

Scott






Re: LI- Lilo just stops working

2000-12-05 Thread Scott Patterson



After setting up  lilo on my MBR to allow me to dual-boot Debian and my
game-OS, everything worked well.  I had to use the lba32 option in lilo.conf
to get this to work, so initially I was booting lilo from a floppy.

Well everything is fine for a while, then one day, I reboot and get:
LI-

And the computer just locks.  I'm 99.9% sure that I didn't re-run lilo, so
this must be some problem either with hardware, or some virus, or a bug in
lilo.  Anybody got a good starting point for investigation?  I can still use
the boot-disk for now, but we all know how reliable diskettes are... insert
ominous music

I would assume it's not a virus since the LI- is common when your MBR is
messed up. Did you install a new kernel recently?

Anyway, you should be able to run /sbin/lilo to reinstall LILO to the MBR.
That should solve the problem.

Scott





Re: Voodoo 3, XFree 4.0 and DRI

2000-12-04 Thread Scott Patterson



Can anybody tell me, what I have to install / configure to have a working
GL-lib based on DRI with hardware acceleration?

mfg
  Mischel S aus P

Go to http://www.debianplanet.org and look on the left hand side. There is a
nice tutorial on installing XF4 in Debian using a Voodoo card.

Scott






Re: Woody Progress

2000-12-04 Thread Scott Patterson



In closing, I'd like to ask another (related) question. Is there some
particular piece of software that you think Woody is waiting for that will
be here in a years time? GCC 3.0 perhaps?

1. GCC 3.0 - good call
2. Kernel 2.4 - add a couple releases after the initail release to stabilize it
even more
3. new installer - someone else mentioned it, but this is a definite in my book

Most of the other stuff is not so important, IMHO. GNOME and KDE are not vital
to have a system up and running. XF4 is questionable. Many people run X, so,
this could be considered important. In the meantime, XF4 keeps getting better
with more drivers as well as improved/optimized drivers. Wasn't there also
discussion for more features/changes to the package management system?

I'd guess 1-3 months after ALL of those three items are released is when they'll
(the debain gods) start to plan a freeze. Of course, it could be a year beyond
that the freeze will even complete! Until then, enjoy Woody:)

Scott

PS: Don't quote me on any of this as I'm just speculating.





Re: Pkg XFree86-common 4.0.1-9

2000-12-04 Thread Scott Patterson



I did an apt-get upgrade on my woody box.  The last time was
about 3 months ago.  Now it no longer gives me a gdm login screen.
It just stays in a command line console.  When I do startx I get:
cannot stat /etc/X11/X (No such file or directory),
aborting...Can't connect:  errno=111, giving up.
It looks like woody now uses release 4 of Xfree86.  Is there
a new configuration tool?  XF86Config no longer works to
configure X.  The Debian site for the package says to read
/usr/share/doc/xfree86-common but that file does not exist
either.

dexter





Re: How to purge and reinstall XFree86 [woody] ?

2000-12-04 Thread Scott Patterson



Ouch

I've gotten myself into a real dill of a pickle.  I run woody, but
around Thanksgiving I hadn't upgraded for weeks.  I did apt-get upgrade
which screwed up KDE and X.  After apt-get dist-upgrade, uninstalling and
reinstalling KDE (from 1.x to 2.x), and making a symlink from the X binary to
xserver-3dlabs, I got things working.

Or so I thought.

Last night, I did another apt-get upgrade and X would no longer
start.  I tried using apt-get remove on xserver-common, and whatever other
xfree86 related packages I could find.  I made sure all the xfree86 version
3.x stuff was gone.  Then I did apt-get install for the various version 4
packages.

dpkg --purge xserver-svga should clean out all the cobwebs.

Finally, I did xf86cfg, which is supposed to try to autodetect my
hardware, then give me configuration options.  It did give me an X screen
with a cursor, but it hung after that.  I rebooted, and now it just seems
like it keeps trying to start the X server.  It shows the VGA text startup
screen, blinks a minute, then goes back to that screen.

Try running dexter. Rumor has it works much better than xf86cfg.

I can't even log in on the console!!  I'm going to bring another
machine home tonight so I can ssh in to try to fix this, but can anybody give
me pointers as to what I need to do?

I believe you can tell your computer which run-level to start with at the LILO
prompt (assuming you're using LILO). IIFC, simply typing 2 and enter, will start
you at run-level 2 (no X-Server running...plain ole console mode). Check some
documentation on this feature of LILO on the net as I could be incorrect. I know
you can do this (specify the run-level at boot time), but I forget how.

If this fails, ssh into your box and edit your /etc/inittab and set the
run-level from 5 to 2. This way, X won't start up upon booting the machine,
thus, making debugging much easier. Once you've got X running fine, you can
switch back to run-level 5 to use you display manager (xdm/gdm/kdm).

Scott








Re: sound not working right (woody/AWE64/2.4-test)

2000-11-29 Thread Scott Patterson



I have compiled pnp, sound, awe32 and 100% SB Compatible
support into my kernel (monolithic, no modules).  Sound
works, sort of.  chmod 666 /dev/dsp and /dev/mixer

Bad idea for security reasons. Simply add yourself to the audio group via
adduser user group. Then logout and back in and you have access to that
device.

However when playing something like Enya with XMMS using
ESD it sounds like a helicopter is in the background. Don't
know why and can't seem to find help with this anywhere.

I had something similar happen that might be the cause. Check for other wires or
devices touching something connected to your soundcard. IIRC, a cable from my CD
player to the soundcard was touching some part of the hard drive. As soon as I
moved it, there were no more unwanted sounds!

Anything would be appreciated at this point.

Maybe that'll help:)

Scott





Re: Sound in Gnome

2000-11-28 Thread Scott Patterson



In order to make more space on my hard drive I recently created a new partition
and copied /home over to this using the following:

tar cSpf - . | (cd /home2 ; tar xvSpf - )

Now, running off my new partition as home, I've come across an error that I
attribute to this change (as far as I can tell because I have no other
explanation at present): sound does not work in Gnome.  Yet under KDE2 sound
works.  I don't even seem to be able to get access to the cdrom for playing
music, yet my permissions for that are in tact.

I've also experienced sound not working in KDE2 if I happen to go into Gnome
first, logout, and then login in KDE2.

Any ideas and solutions would be much appreciated.

---
Arlen Carlson [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Both environments have sound daemons running so more than one sound can be
played at the same time. KDE2 uses artsd for sound and GHOME used esd. After
you leave KDE2 or GNOME, do a ps -ef and look for one of these sound daemons.
If it's still active, do a kill -9 pid on it. I believe these daemons should
stop once you leave the environment, but, I could be wrong. You can't have two
of these running at the same time!

Another method would be to run the sound app from an xterm while in KDE2 or
GNOME. This way you'd get the stderr messages indicating the audio device is
already in use or something like that. At that point, kill any sound daemons
running and start the respective sound daemon for the enviroment you're in.
Then, try running your sound app again.

Scott









Re: XFree 4.0.1 and xdm

2000-11-28 Thread Scott Patterson



I=B4ve succesfully installed Woody and XFree 4.0.1-8 last weekend. Only
xdm shows a strange behavior. It starts nearly one minute after the
system has bootet. It=B4s possiblke to login to a console, and suddenly
xdm awakes. Any ideas?

Regards, Sven

I had/have the same problem. Probably not what you want to hear, but I simply
removed XDM from starting up by running update-rc.d xdm remove. This will
remove xdm from all your startup scripts.

Now that I think of it, I should just purge the package since I don't really
want it. It must have been installed when I updated to XFree 4.0.1-x!

Scott





Re: Installing Woody on new box

2000-11-28 Thread Scott Patterson



I'm currently waiting for my new box, which will have an Asus A7V
motherboard, Duron CPU, Maxtor DiamondMax HD, and Matrox videocard.
On my current system, I installed potato, after which I upgraded to
Woody. As I've found some unofficial debian Woody CD images, I'd rather go
that way, but if I remember the installation procedure correctly (I only
did it once, about 6 months ago, and that was my first experience
with Linux...), I'll be needing some boot floppies and such.
Could some kind soul point me to some info on installing Woody, so my
installation won't turn out in a disaster?

Thanks in advance,

Frederik

Since this is a new system, I'm about 99% sure that the motherboard allows you
to boot from the CD. So, set your BIOS to boot from the CD, insert the first CD
and start installing. No floppies needed, unless you want a rescue diskette
(which I'd advise).

I don't think it really matters if you use the woody or potato images as Woody
has seem some BIG changes lately (XF4, glibc). I'd simply start off with a
minimum install, switch my sources.list file to point to unstable and then
install the rest of the packages. Any way you go about it, you'll probably
upgrade a lot of stuff to get the current Woody.

Scott





Re: debian-user-digest Digest V100 #676

2000-11-28 Thread Scott Patterson





Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 12:28:17 -0800
From: Kenward Vaughan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Debian Users debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: XFree 4.0.1 and xdm
Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Disposition: inline


On Tue, Nov 28, 2000 at 10:07:03AM -0500, Scott Patterson wrote:



 I=B4ve succesfully installed Woody and XFree 4.0.1-8 last weekend. Only
 xdm shows a strange behavior. It starts nearly one minute after the
 system has bootet. It=B4s possiblke to login to a console, and suddenly
 xdm awakes. Any ideas?
 
 Regards, Sven

 I had/have the same problem. Probably not what you want to hear, but I simply
 removed XDM from starting up by running update-rc.d xdm remove. This will
 remove xdm from all your startup scripts.

You'll need to change that to update-rc.d -f xdm remove to force removal
of the links.

I always forget the -f and end up having to run it again with the -f.
Someday I'll rememeber:)

 Now that I think of it, I should just purge the package since I don't really
 want it. It must have been installed when I updated to XFree 4.0.1-x!

It comes with other things under the umbrella task-x-windows-system package.
I expect you'll want to remove that package after dumping xdm so it doesn't
get brought in on your next upgrade.  (IIUTC, trashing the task package
won't touch the underlying apps.)

Good point. I never though about that.

Scott









Re: startx lxdoom - wrong colormap

2000-11-27 Thread Scott Patterson



Hi,

There's an old P90 at my school that we use during the breaks and it's
running potato.  I have installed lxdoom (the svgalib version of doom
doesn't work for some strange reason although other svgalib programs
like thrust work fine) on it and it works, however there is one
problem:

As the machine is quite old and has a very slow VGA I would like to
start doom this way:

startx lxdoom

so it will be the only X-client running.  When I do this, the game
works but the colors are just weird - the wrong colormap is set.  So I
have to type:

startx lxdoom -- -bpp 16

which shows perfect colors but is quite slow.

Is there a way to set the right colormap when running lxdoom
exclusively with 8bpp without a window manager?

Thanks for your help,

Christoph

What I do is put the executable in my $HOME/.xinitrc file. So, my .xinitrc file
looks like this:

# START
#! /bin/sh

/usr/local/bin/quake3
# END

This way only X and quake3 start up (I believe)...no window manager. Doing it
this way, quake3 seems to run faster for me. YMMV.

Scott





Re: VCD/SVCD - Kernelpatch

2000-11-24 Thread Scott Patterson



Hi,
I know you can watch vcds with tools like mtv or the smpeg-plugin for xmms
or with xtheater (http://xtheater.sourceforge.net) but what really
interests me now is: Is there a VCD-Kernel-Patch Out there? if yes, where?
else, plz
tell me where I could search for it.
My Actual problem is, I want to run SVCDs which are in mpeg2-format but i
just have a mpeg2-codec that cannot read from SVCDs raw (like the above
mentioned vcd-players do--but they are mpeg1-only) so I needed kernel-support
for vcd/svcd for reading the appropriate files on the cds.
It would be great if someone knew help here cause it looks like this is
still a domane of Windows that Linux couldn't manage yet for some reasons...
(maybe cause VCD is somewhat a asia-only-thing?)
I'm looking forward to your replies,
Michael

Kernel 2.4 supports the UDF file system which is used by DVDs. Perhaps that is
what you need to view SVCD's since they seem similar.

Scott









Re: 3dfx, Potato and X 4.0.1, is this possible?

2000-11-22 Thread Scott Patterson


I installed the stable version of Debian.

I then changed to kernel 2.4 test10, thats including all updates to =
modutils, util-linux etc, etc...

I stuck KDE2.0 on.

Everything ok so far sound and all.

I then installed the 4.0.1 binaries, configured it.
Now I get a screen of 640x480 at a depth of 8=20
(depth/fbbpp =3D 8/8).

I have been looking at and for config files for days and still have not =
come anywhere close to finding the problem, does anybody know how to =
solve this problem?
thanks Ian.

If you're trying to run 3dfx cards in XF4, go to http://www.debianplanet.com.
There is a good tutorial that has had positive results for at least 3 users on
this list. It worked for me!

Scott









Re: good sound cards?

2000-11-22 Thread Scott Patterson



The SBLive is a great card with *really* good support. I got mine well over a
year ago I have no idea what they cost now but they are sweet cards.

I just bought a Sound Blaster Live Value for $42 dollars on the net ($52 after
shipping). Go to http://www.thedukeofurl.org/ and then select Prices. Lots of
good equipment that should work with Linux. Also, you can almost guarentee that
any Sound Blaster card will work under Linux.

Scott





Re: X 4.0.1 w/ VooDoo3 300

2000-11-21 Thread Scott Patterson



I've seen several people say they have gotten this combo to work, but I
have had no success.  If someone could tell me *exactly* the steps they
have taken, I would appreciate it.  I have installed
task-x-window-system-core 2.0, task-x-window-system 3.0, and kernel
2.4.0-test11 on a fully Woody system.  I used the symlink hack to get
around the current xserver bug in woody.

Should  DRI and the VooDoo3 be enabled in the kernel, and if so, as
modules or not?

Also, dexter doesn't ask which kind of video card I have it just goes
straight to mouse selection.

The error log file is given below.

If I use xf86cfg or XFree86 -configure (same thing) it simply dies with
a 'caught signal 11 - aborting'


Let me know if you need more information.
Thanks for any help any VooDoo users may have!

Kelly

There is a quick tutorial on what to do at http://www.debianplanet.org. It's
even geared towards 3dfx chipsets. I followed it and had no problems.

Yes, you need DRI and tdfx. Compile it in or make it a module, it shouldn't
matter. I compiled mine in, IIFC.

Nothing like accelerated 3d in a window...

Scott










Re: Quake 3 ran, I upgraded. . . Well, It doesn't run any more

2000-11-20 Thread Scott Patterson



Okay.  I decided to upgrade to the most recent version of woody.  Good =
Idea?  Of course.  Everything works . . . except Quake 3 (deja vu!).  =
I've got this down to an art now.  I know that for some reason X isn't =
finding the libGLcore.so.1.0.5 (or what ever it is) file and therefore =
fails to load when I use the NVdriver driver.  ???  Can somebody help =
me?  Do you think it has something to do with the symbolic links not =
going into /usr/lib/? (I ran ldconfig)
I checked.  There aren't any other types of GL stuffs on my system.

Thanks,

Brandt Dusthimer (Who will no longer upgrade on a regular basis if =
everything is functional like it was)

I haven't seen any replies yet, so, here we go...

Upon upgrading to Woody, XF4.0 should've installed. This uses new GL drivers and
such. So, if you installed any GL drivers in the Quake3 install (it's one of the
options) remove them as they are not compatible with XF4. The old lstuff should
be in /usr/local/games/quake3/?.

For me, I have a Voodoo Banshee. I first upgraded to XF4 and then installed
Quake3 after that. During the install, I did NOT select the option to install
the GL drivers. Suprisingly (as something usually goes wrong), Quake3 started up
with no problems. I was very pleased:)

If you still have problems, make sure that 3d apps work in general, then proceed
to Quake3. Also, IIFC, there is a flag you can pass when starting Quake3 to
specifiy which library to use. Hope this helps.

Scott





Re: OT: Compiling gnucash

2000-11-20 Thread Scott Patterson



I'm trying to compile gnucash on a Potato system and I get this error:

debian-mobile:/usr/local/gnucash-1.4.8# ./configure --host=i386-linux
loading cache ./config.cache
checking for a BSD compatible install... /usr/bin/install -c
checking whether build environment is sane... yes
checking whether make sets ${MAKE}... yes
checking for working aclocal... found
checking for working autoconf... found
checking for working automake... found
checking for working autoheader... found
checking for working makeinfo... missing
checking host system type... i386-pc-linux-gnu
checking build system type... i386-pc-linux-gnu
checking for ranlib... ranlib
checking for gcc... gcc
checking whether the C compiler (gcc  ) works... no
configure: error: installation or configuration problem: C compiler cannot
create executables.

This may be a dumb question but is it required to have the kernel source and
headers to compile programs on a system?

Jesse

It looks like you're missing some stuff to compile programs in general. Have you
had success compiling before?

If not, as root run tasksel and then select the C development/programming
task. That should load a whole bunch of packages which are necessary for C
compiling.

Scott









Re: is possible mp3?

2000-11-17 Thread Scott Patterson



Of course, mp3 is a lossy format. So, every time you re-compress the mp3 it will
sound a little worse. However, since mp3's sound pretty good to start with, one
re-compression shouldn't sound much different:)

A better solution would be to squeeze the audio directly into the file. I don't
know if such a solution exists though, or is even possible.

Scott

Jaye,

  You can decode the MP3 to WAV format (can be done using mpg123 -w), and
use your favorite WAV editor (waveforge, xwave, sweep) to layer in your
content.

  I've never done any editing or mixing with the available Linux
utilities, so I can' thelp you with specifics. Abstractly speaking, I
would send the decoded WAV through a channel, send the layer you'd like to
add through another channel, mix the two channels, and output them to a
WAV.

Nick

On Fri, 17 Nov 2000, Jaye Inabnit ke6sls wrote:


 Hello,

 Is it possible to add content to an exsisting mp3? I would
 like to take a particular track and add an voice identifier
 to it.. If so, what utility would I use to edit/create mp3's?

 tia, regards
 --

 Jaye Inabnit, ARS ke6sls e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 707-442-6579 h/m 707-441-7096 p
 http://www.qsl.net/ke6slsICQ# 12741145
 This mail composed with kmail on kde on X on linux warped by debian
 If it's stupid, but works, it ain't stupid.











How do 3D cards work under Linux (Debian)

2000-11-08 Thread Scott Patterson
Hi all,

I'm no rookie to Linux, but, I'm missing something on how 3D really works in
Linux. I've been able to get 3D working but don't really understand what's going
on. When I say 3D, I'm speaking of 3D video-hardware acceleration under Linux!

If someone could present me with a step-by-step tutorial/walkthrough of what's
going on, I'd greatly appreciate it. I'd like to see it geared towards Debian
(which debs to grab) and possibly my hardware (Celeron 300, 3dfx voodoo
banshee). Something in line with a textbook or HOW-TO is what I'd like to see
the info in. Of course, since you're not being paid, any info will be
appreciated. Thanks.

Scott




Re: How do 3D cards work under Linux (Debian)

2000-11-08 Thread Scott Patterson

Hi all,

I'm no rookie to Linux, but, I'm missing something on how
3D really works in Linux. I've been able to get 3D working
but don't really understand what's going on. When I say 3D,
I'm speaking of 3D video-hardware acceleration under Linux!

If someone could present me with a step-by-step
tutorial/walkthrough of what's going on, I'd greatly
appreciate it. I'd like to see it geared towards Debian
(which debs to grab) and possibly my hardware (Celeron 300,
3dfx voodoo banshee). Something in line with a textbook or
HOW-TO is what I'd like to see the info in. Of course,
since you're not being paid, any info will be appreciated.
Thanks.

Scott

Geez, I hate to answer my own question...but, I've found a good summary that is
probably enough to get me started. It's at
http://www.debianplanet.org/debianplanet/. It's basically a summary of
installing XF4.01 based upon #debian IRC. Hopefully this will help someone else
as well.

Scott




Re: Gnome or KDE2

2000-11-02 Thread Scott Patterson



what would you suggest Gnome oder KDE2 ?

It would be great if you also could comment why the one you suggest is
better =)

thx

Tom

I can't believe this hasn't caused a flame-war yet. Anyway, here's my take...

For GNOME, I'd suggest getting Helix's GNOME packages. There usually up-to-date
and give a polished appearance. GNOME is mostly written in C and was started
after KDE. For this reason, GNOME is usually about 6 months behind KDE. GNOME is
going through changes right now in preparation for 1.4 (a minor release) and
then 2.0 (when all hell breaks loose). The changes for 2.0 will require code to
be modified as it will NOT be backwards compatible. Oh yea, GNOME also has the
backing of IBM, SUN and some other big boys.

KDE just released KDE 2.0 (aka KDE2) which is mostly coded in C++. It has a web
browser (Konqueror) that is similar to IE but not as complete. Konqueror still
needs some work on javascript and other areas, nonetheless, it's quite speedy
and can also be used for purposes (file browsing, ftp access, etc). KDE2 also
includes KOffice, KDE's office suite. It's not complete by any means, but
supposedly it has all the basic functionality minus the bloat-ware features:) I
should also mention that KDE2 still crashes apps every now and then, but hey, it
was a major rewrite.

In regards to both, I believe GNOME is more popular in the US whereas KDE is
more popular everywhere else (I know at least in Europe according to the latest
LinuxWorld article). Also, KDE has won the people's choice award the last two
years for their desktop, if that means anything to ya. Another pesonal note, it
seems that GNOME is always pushing projects (Evolution, Nautilus) that are not
quite finished, whereas KDE just presents the finished goods.

In the end, I suggest trying out both environments. Some people swear by one,
and some the other. It seems to be just a matter of preference for most users.

Scott