Re: Change in mailing list configuration

[Bruce Bannerman]

Well said Florian,

I won’t be far behind you.

…and we wonder why user engagement on the lists has dropped off.

I have made some great friends within the OSGeo community over the years. Best 
wishes to you all.

I’ll be decommissioning this email address in the near future.  If you’d like 
to stay in contact drop me a private email.

Kind regards,

Bruce


> On 12 Jan 2024, at 19:05, Florian Ledermann  
> wrote:
> 
> I'm unsubscribing in protest of those changes.
> 
> I was hoping that this proposal would be objected by more active community 
> members, but as a mere lurker it is not worth it for me to engage in lengthy 
> discussions, if the people in charge decide to break decodes-long established 
> UX conventions on short notice for the sake of "spam protection". As far as I 
> see it these developments are mainly driven by corporations who pursue the 
> political goal of destroying independent email infrastructure, and I would 
> have hoped the OS community to resist those developments instead of happily 
> nodding along.
> 
> Best, Florian
> 
> 
>> On 11.01.2024 19:31, Sandro Santilli wrote:
>> We've changed the configuration of this mailing list to respect the
>> recomendations from the SysAdmin team:
>> 
>> https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/SAC:Mailing_Lists#Configuring_the_mailing_list
>> Notable changes are:
>>   1. No more [OSGeo-Discuss] prefix in email subjects
>>   2. No more added footer
>>   3. Real sender address in the From field
>>   4. DKIM signed emails will not be considered maliciously tampered \o/
>> For filtering the emails or finding mailing list address to change
>> user preferences you will be able to use the email headers.
>> Many mail user agents should be able to figure this out by themselves,
>> others might need manual configuration.
>> Just as an example, my mail configuration for the PostGIS Developers
>> looks like this (procmail recipe):
>>   :0
>>   * ^List-ID:.*postgis-devel.lists.osgeo.org
>>   * !^X-List-Administrivia: yes
>>   .postgis-devel/
>> Happy mailing !
>> --strk;
>>   Libre GIS consultant/developer
>>   https://strk.kbt.io/services.html
> 
> -- 
> Dipl.-Ing. Dr. Florian Ledermann
> Senior Lecturer
> Cartography Research Group
> Department of Geodesy and Geoinformation
> TU Wien, Vienna, Austria
> 
> Check out my list of Mastodon accounts for cartography & GIS:
> =>  https://cartolab.at/cartography-on-mastodon/  <=
> 
> https://cartography.tuwien.ac.at/florian-ledermann/
> https://mapstodon.space/@floledermann

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Mailing lists to discourse migration

[Bruce Bannerman via Discuss]

Apart from these few emails telling me that a move to something called Discourse is happening, I have not seen any discussion on our lists explaining the pros and cons of such a move. I find this lack of community engagement on this issue to be troubling.This does not seem to be a very open source community way of making such a significant move.Personally, what we have now has been working nicely for me for close on 20 years.The lists have been very quiet for quite a while now, but that is a community engagement issue. It is not something that technology will magically fix.It seems to me that we have a case of the tail wagging the dog.Kind regards,BruceOn 29 Dec 2023, at 05:15, Jody Garnett via Discuss  wrote:Reading online it appears there is:1. A mailing list mode so notifications are sent out each time a post is made (this is a user preference)2. A reply via email modeSo experimentation is needed.Reference:- https://meta.discourse.org/t/what-is-mailing-list-mode/46008/8- https://meta.discourse.org/t/set-up-reply-by-email-with-pop3-polling/14003--Jody GarnettOn Thu, Dec 28, 2023 at 10:09 AM Jody Garnett  wrote:I think we need someone who understand how discourse works to make an informed decision.If the forum fills up with questions; and the developers are minding the email list - it will not work out so well :) At least as described.--Jody GarnettOn Thu, Dec 28, 2023 at 6:58 AM Vicky Vergara  wrote:On Wed, Dec 27, 2023 at 11:43 AM Jody Garnett  wrote:Q: So if a mailing list is mirrored to discourse it operates similar to nabble used to? Is searchable etc …I don't know the details of how discourse works,  But replies done via discourse are not sent to mailing list subscribers - so it is one way communication.https://meta.discourse.org/t/create-a-read-only-mailing-list-mirror/77990 And the thinking here is that discourse is easier for people who want to ask a specific question without subscribing to a mailing list (and getting yet more email).Yes, so you can have the mirror in one category and another catergory for Q --Jody GarnettOn Wed, Dec 27, 2023 at 9:07 AM Vicky Vergara  wrote:Hi JodyWe are offering optionsBefore:Use mailing listAfter:* Use mailing list and see the archives only on https://lists.osgeo.org/* Use mailing list and see the archives also on discourse* Use discourse without a mailing list 
This are the possibilities regarding migration of mailing list* Have the mailing list migrated completely to discourse example [1]  (Use discourse without a mailing list, but get previous conversations from mailing list)* Have a mirror of the mailing in discourse example [2] (Use mailing list and see the archives also on discourse)* Have a category on discourse and not have a mailing list example [3] was created by Jody (Use discourse without a mailing list)* Opt to not migrate or mirror the mailing list example [4] (Use mailing list and see the archives only on https://lists.osgeo.org/)[1] https://discourse.osgeo.org/c/qgis/qgis-fr-user/5[2] https://discourse.osgeo.org/c/sac-global-category/sac/13[3] https://discourse.osgeo.org/t/about-the-osgeo-site-feedback-category/1[4] https://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/foss4g2008loc/RegardsVickyOn Wed, Dec 27, 2023 at 10:16 AM Jody Garnett  wrote:I was lurking in the sys admin chat as I was working on the osgeo sign up form. Mailing lists are not going away, but I am unclear at what is being offered.--Jody GarnettOn Wed, Dec 27, 2023 at 8:01 AM Eli Adam  wrote:






Hi,




I'm also unclear on what is going on.  It looks like discourse options are being added.  This raises questions about mailing lists.  1. Are mailing lists going away?  2. Can projects choose to keep just the mailing list and not add dicourse?




Thanks, Eli


From: Discuss  on behalf of Vicky Vergara via Discuss 
Sent: Tuesday, December 26, 2023 9:52 PM
To: OSGeo Discussions 
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Mailing lists to discourse migration
 




Hi Jody,




On Tue, Dec 26, 2023 at 9:31 PM Jody Garnett  wrote:


Vicky,


Is there any more information on what is being offered here?


I have not used discourse very much. What do you mean by having a category Can you be more clear about migrate and mirror.




Category, is like the one you created about the discourse site feedback.
Mirror, is a category that mirrors the mailing list, so the mails received on the mailing list are also shown on discourse.

If you "reply" to those mails using discourse, they will not be shown on the mailing list, as the mirror does not send mails to the mailing list.

The reply that will be shown is the one done using mail.






Will the existing list of email subscribers be part of migrating a mailing list


 

When migrating subscribers are also migrated and are "staged 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Conf] Poll: Change FOSS4G structure to have some continuity of organization and management

[Bruce Bannerman via Discuss]

Well said Sanghee.

As a former member of the LOC for FOSS4G-2009 I agree with the local community 
development argument, though in our case it led to a lot of burn-out.

There is also the practicality of finding a conference organiser that can 
operate effectively anywhere in the world.

Should the alternate approach go through, significant thought also needs to go 
into the procurement process to avoid the very real potential for corruption.

Kind regards,

Bruce

> On 9 Feb 2022, at 01:28, 신상희 via Discuss  wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi all, 
> 
> I prefer option 1. 
> 
> If this poll was asked just after FOSS4G Seoul 2015, I would have selected 
> option 2 without any hesitations. 
> 
> However I now realize that I, LOC members, and local community had learned a 
> lot by going through the difficulties of preparing the event altogether. That 
> experience was very unique, invaluable and is now one of driving force of 
> vibrant activity of OSGeo Korean chapter. Community driven FOSS4G with help 
> from PCO is not so bad model, I think. 
> 
> Kind regards, 
> 신상희
> ---
> Shin, Sanghee
> Gaia3D, Inc. - The GeoSpatial Company
> www.gaia3d.com
> 
> -- Original Message --
> From: "michael terner" 
> To: "Steven Feldman" 
> Cc: "OSGeo-Conf" ; "OSGeo Discussions" 
> ; "Massimiliano Cannata" 
> ; "Eli Adam" 
> Sent: 2022-02-06 오전 6:09:42
> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Conf] Poll: Change FOSS4G structure to have some 
> continuity of organization and management
> 
>> +2 for considering change
>> 
>> There's definitely room to consider continual improvements for the 
>> conference process, as the world, and our community has evolved considerably 
>> over the last few years. No easy solutions, but lots to think about.
>> 
>> Eli starting this thread with an "informal poll" makes complete sense. The 
>> Committee is simply doing it's job of helping the Board to manage and 
>> promote the conference activity. We don't get to make decisions by 
>> ourselves, but generating ideas is certainly part of the mandate. And, as 
>> others have said, if the board disagrees with a proposal/idea, they do not 
>> have to approve it.
>> 
>> MT
>> 
>>> On Fri, Feb 4, 2022, 6:02 AM Steven Feldman  wrote:
>>> +2 from me
>>> 
>>> Everyone is welcome to participate in the conversation about changes to the 
>>> organisation of FOSS4G, then the Conference Ctee should vote and make a 
>>> recommendation (or recommendations) to the Board and the Board should 
>>> decide.
>>> 
>>> Our organisational model is that the charter members elect the board and 
>>> the board then makes decisions on their behalf, if CM’s don’t agree with 
>>> board decisions they have the option to vote in a new board, we do not have 
>>> a direct voting or referendum system where CM’s are consulted on individual 
>>> decisions.
>>> __
>>> Steven
>>> 
>>> Unusual maps in strange places -  mappery.org
>>> 
>>> Subscribe to my weekly “Maps in the Wild” newsletter
>>> 
 On 4 Feb 2022, at 09:01, Jeroen Ticheler  
 wrote:
 
 Hi Maxi,
 Thanks! I completely agree with those type of changes indeed. It makes 
 sense we have a list of scenario’s forward and have a vote on that by the 
 community. 
 
 For what the membership of the conference committee is concerned, I left 
 simply because of the supposed/imposed barrier of not having been a 
 conference chair, although I didn’t agree with that at all. Didn’t feel 
 like fighting over it though. It would be better to make membership 
 voluntary just like other committees. Possibly approved by the board or 
 charter members. 
 
 Cheers,
 Jeroen
 
 
 Jeroen Ticheler
 Mobile: +31681286572
 E-mail: jeroen.tiche...@geocat.net
 https://www.geocat.net
 Veenderweg 13
 6721 WD Bennekom
 The Netherlands
 Tel: +31318416664
> On 4 Feb 2022, 09:02 +0100, Massimiliano Cannata 
> , wrote:
> Dear Jeroen,
> Thanks for your considerations.
> 
> I wasn't proposing to extend the evaluation of proposals to the whole 
> community. I understand a dedicated committee should do this (even though 
> I believe a part of the evaluation of a proposal could be assigned by 
> votes of the community, maybe 10%?).
> 
> My point is that decisions of changing the organisation of the FOSS4G 
> cannot be done without the involvement of the whole community. It's not 
> about changing the evaluation process, it's about deciding for example to 
> have a fixed location, to completely leave it to an external company, to 
> pay the committee members to do it, to have it online or in person, to 
> cancel the global and keep only to local conference...
> 
> Another point is that so far there's the assumption that only organizer 
> of previous FOSS4G have the competence to understand technical matters. 
> That's quite aleatory and in no other committee there is such an entry 
> barrier... 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Conference selection transparency (Was Announcement: Call for Location global FOSS4G 2023)

[Bruce Bannerman via Discuss]

Jonathan,

Do you have a suggestion as to how the process can be improved?

Kind regards,

Bruce

Disclosure:

I was a member of the LOC for FOSS4G-2009.

I personally don’t have a problem with the process as is, but it may be 
possible to improve things. That is, provided that we don’t make the job of our 
volunteers more difficult than it needs to be.

In the end the people who have stepped up to do the work will need to make the 
call. We may not like the outcome, but we need to trust that they are acting in 
OSGeo’s best interest and respect their decision.

> On 13 Jan 2022, at 20:58, Jonathan Moules via Discuss 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> > Anyone can ask questions to the candidates.
> 
> Yes, they can (and yes, I have asked questions), but here's the thing: The 
> only people who actually matter are the people who vote. And we have no idea 
> what they vote (for the valid reason stated) or what their criteria are for 
> their vote (which is a problem). If the committee don't read and/or care 
> about the questions asked/answered then said questions/answers are 
> meaningless.
> 
> > The only two things that are not public are:
> 
> I disagree, the third thing that's not public, and by far the most important, 
> is the actual scoring criteria. Each committee member is a black-box in this 
> regard. Not only do we not find out *what* they voted (fine), we also never 
> know *why* they voted a specific way.
> 
> Did Buenos Aires win because:
> 
> * it had the shiniest brochure?
> 
> * it was cheapest?
> 
> * that's where the committee members wanted to go on holiday?
> 
> * nepotism?
> 
> * the region seemed like it'd benefit the most?
> 
> * they were feeling grumpy at the chair of the other RfP that day?
> 
> * they had the "best" bid?
> 
> ... etc
> 
> 
> 
> Disclosure: I am definitely *NOT* stating those are the reasons it was 
> chosen!!! I'm highlighting them because the lack of transparency means we 
> can't know what the actual reasons were. Frankly, given the absolutely huge 
> list of cognitive biases that exist, there's a reasonable chance that the 
> voters aren't voting why they think they're voting either. That's just the 
> human condition; we're great at deceiving ourselves and rationalisations (me 
> included).
> 
> To work around this, with public sector contracts in the western world you 
> have a list of requirements and then all the bids are scored against those 
> requirements. The one with the highest score wins the contract. *That* is 
> transparent.
> 
> 
> 
> TL;DR: We don't know why the voters vote as they do. The public sector solves 
> this by requiring scoring of bids against a list of pre-published 
> requirements.
> 
> I hope that clears things up. I'm not in any way suggesting impropriety, I'm 
> highlighting we have no way of knowing there's no impropriety. Hence my claim 
> as to a lack of transparency; the votes are opaque.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Jonathan
> 
> 
> 
> On 2022-01-13 07:35, María Arias de Reyna wrote:
>> On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 10:50 PM Jonathan Moules via Discuss
>>  wrote:
>>> On the surface, this is a good idea, but unfortunately it has a fundamental 
>>> problem:
>>> There are no "criteria for selection" of the conference beyond "the 
>>> committee members voted for this proposal". There's zero transparency in 
>>> the process.
>> I can't let this serious accusation go unanswered.
>> 
>> All the process is done via public mailing lists. All the criteria is
>> published on the Request For Proposals. Anyone on the community can
>> review the RFP and propose changes to it. Anyone on the community can
>> read the proposals and interact with the candidatures.
>> 
>> The only two things that are not public are:
>>  * Confidentiality issues with the proposals. For example sometimes
>> providers give you huge discounts in exchange of not making that
>> discount public. So you can't show the budget publicly, unless you are
>> willing to not use the discount.
>>  * What each member of the committee votes. And this is to ensure they
>> can freely vote without fearing consequences.
>> 
>> Which are two very reasonable exceptions.
>> 
>> Anyone can ask questions to the candidates. If I am right, you
>> yourself have been very active on this process for the past years.
>> Were you not the one that asked what a GeoChica is or am I confusing
>> you with some other Jonathan? If I am confusing you with some other
>> Jonathan, my mistake. Maybe you are not aware of the transparency of
>> the process.
>> 
>> The process is transparent and public except on those two exceptions
>> that warrantee the process is going to be safe.
> ___
> Discuss mailing list
> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
> https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
___
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[OSGeo-Discuss] Fwd: [TC-Announce] OGC invites Tenders for the Provision of Compliance Testing Software Engineering Consulting Services

[Bruce Bannerman via Discuss]

FYI

> Begin forwarded message:
> 
> From: announce--- via TC-Announce 
> Subject: [TC-Announce] OGC invites Tenders for the Provision of Compliance 
> Testing Software Engineering Consulting Services
> Date: 15 July 2021 at 23:38:01 AEST
> To: tc-annou...@lists.opengeospatial.org
> Reply-To: "annou...@opengeospatial.org" 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> OGC invites Tenders for the Provision of Compliance Testing Software 
> Engineering Consulting Services
> 
> OGC is seeking the provision of consulting services in support of the 
> Compliance Program’s TEAM Engine validator tool and related Executable Test 
> Suites.
> 
>  
> 
> Contact: i...@ogc.org 
> 
> 15 July 2021: The Open Geospatial Consortium (OGC) invites organizations to 
> bid for providing Software Engineering Consulting Services to the OGC 
> Compliance Program. Interested organizations should respond to the Invitation 
> To Tender (ITT) 
> .
>  Responses close August 15th, 2021.
> 
> The OGC Compliance Program provides a certification process that ensures 
> organizations' solutions are compliant with OGC Standards, creating 
> confidence that any compliant product will seamlessly integrate with other 
> compliant solutions - regardless of the vendor that created them. 
> 
> The certification process makes use of the OGC Validator tool 
> 
>  (aka TEAM Engine), which enables software developers to test whether their 
> products comply with OGC Standards. The Invitation to Tender (ITT) concerns 
> the provision of consulting services in support of the OGC Compliance 
> Program, including working on issues and improvements related to TEAM Engine 
> and the Executable Test Suites that power it.
> 
> Further information on the required services, as well as instructions for 
> bidders, are contained in the Invitation to Tender: Provision of Compliance 
> Testing Software Engineering Consulting Services 
> .
>  The deadline for responding to the ITT is 22:00hrs UTC on August 15th, 2021. 
> 
> More information about the OGC compliance process is available at 
> ogc.org/compliance 
> .
> 
> 
> About OGC
> The Open Geospatial Consortium (OGC) is a collective problem-solving 
> community of experts from more than 500 businesses, government agencies, 
> research organizations, and universities driven to make geospatial (location) 
> information and services FAIR - Findable, Accessible, Interoperable, and 
> Reusable.
> The global OGC Community engages in a mix of activities related to 
> location-based technologies: developing consensus-based open standards and 
> best-practice; collaborating on agile innovation initiatives; engaging in 
> community meetings, events, and workshops; and more.
> OGC's unique standards development process moves at the pace of innovation, 
> with constant input from technology forecasting, practical prototyping, 
> real-world testing, and community engagement.
> OGC bridges disparate sectors, domains, and technology trends, and encourages 
> the cross-pollination of ideas between different communities of practice to 
> improve decision-making at all levels. OGC is committed to creating an 
> inclusive and sustainable future.
> Visit ogc.org for more info on our work.
> 
>  
> This press release is also available online at: 
> ogc.org/pressroom/pressreleases/4506 
> 
> EDITORS: When publishing this on your blog or website, we kindly request that 
> you link back to the above URL.
> The image used in the PR is available without text or logo here 
> 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] OSGeo Statement on Community Standards

[Bruce Bannerman via Discuss]

Agreed Jody.

My preference is the Berlin Code of Conduct. It is short, succinct and says 
what we need to say in a number of languages.

Bruce

> On 1 Jun 2021, at 03:57, Jody Garnett via Discuss  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> Astrid:
> 
> The page links to the code of conduct for several communities, but we no 
> longer have a single code of conduct as an organization. Indeed projects / 
> events / local chapters are able to choose an appropriate code of conduct - 
> just like we ask free and open source projects to choose an appropriate 
> license for their community.
> 
> Personally I recommend adopting one of the community managed code of conducts 
> (Berlin Code of Conduct or Contributor Covenant) since it is not a lot of fun 
> to write one of these things and keep it up to date. Or keep it simple, as 
> the bards once said: Be excellent to each other
> --
> Jody Garnett
> 
> 
>> On Sun, 30 May 2021 at 23:18, Astrid Emde (OSGeo) via Discuss 
>>  wrote:
>> 2021-05-31
>> News Item: 
>> https://www.osgeo.org/foundation-news/osgeo-statement-on-community-standards/
>> 
>> The OSGeo Board of Directors issues this statement in response to recent 
>> events in the tech and global communities in relation to issues of 
>> inclusion, equity, and justice:
>> 
>> OSGeo strives to be an open, welcoming, and safe community and, to that 
>> end, we continue to work to improve how we treat all members of our 
>> community.  We believe our community is built on the collective of all 
>> of our actions and that each individual has an impact on whether people 
>> feel welcome.
>> 
>> OSGeo values the contributions of each and every member in all aspects 
>> of the organization, including (but not limited to) using and promoting 
>> open source geospatial software, contributing code, documentation, event 
>> speakers, participating in joint events with other organizations, or 
>> within  various committees.
>> 
>> All participants, regardless of how or where they participate in OSGeo 
>> activities, are expected to behave with integrity and respect for all 
>> people.  We encourage all members to review the Code of Conduct, make 
>> necessary adjustments to their behaviors as needed, and to discuss the 
>> Code of Conduct within committees and projects.
>> Code of conduct: https://www.osgeo.org/code_of_conduct/
>> 
>> OSGeo Board of Directors
>> ___
>> Discuss mailing list
>> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
>> https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> ___
> Discuss mailing list
> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
> https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Parsing well-known text

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hello Pierre,

It is dangerous to assume what the coordinates in a data set represent. It may 
not have implications for your particular use, but could have serious 
consequences for other uses downstream.

A good approach is to consult the discovery metadata that describes the dataset 
that you are using. It should help you to interpret the data. Any good data 
provider will also provide discovery metadata, typically in ISO 19115 format 
(or derivative).

If such metadata is not available, ask the data provider to better define their 
data, in your case, the spatial reference system used. If they can’t, or won’t 
provide this information then I would question the need to use that data set 
and look for an alternative, as the data quality is suspect.

It is important that blind assumptions of what an unqualified coordinate in a 
spatial reference system means is not built into software that will be used by 
others without explicitly stating that this is what is being done. 

Kind regards,

Bruce


> On 7 Sep 2020, at 02:53, Pierre Abbat  wrote:
> 
> On Wednesday, 2 September 2020 05:41:40 EDT Even Rouault wrote:
>> As far as I know, you can't create a CRS WKT with just unit information. The
>> most minimal content that validates the WKT1 grammar would be something
>> like:
>> 
>> LOCAL_CS["unspecified CRS",
>>LOCAL_DATUM["unspecified datum",2000],
>>UNIT["metre",1,
>>AUTHORITY["EPSG","9001"]],
>>AXIS["Easting",EAST],
>>AXIS["Northing",NORTH]]
> 
> That doesn't seem to have an elevation unit; should I assume that they're 
> both 
> meters?
> 
>> Yes, PROJ >= 6 has support for parsing and creating WKT in several versions
>> of the WKT standard.
>> 
>> See proj_create_from_wkt() at
>> https://proj.org/development/reference/functions.html, and all other
>> proj_ getters.
>> 
>> For creation of WKT, you might need the more advanced functions of
>> https://github.com/OSGeo/PROJ/blob/master/src/proj_experimental.h , before
>> exporting with proj_as_wkt()
> 
> That's overkill for what I'm doing. I don't need to make a projection, all I 
> need to know is the units. I don't need to create a WKT except in the case 
> that the original cloud doesn't have one and I'm adding one to specify the 
> units.
> 
> The code to parse the WKT is in YACC, which I don't know how to work with, 
> and 
> I don't need all the tokens. Treating them as opaque atoms and looking for 
> "UNIT" should work. Where can I find the grammar of the language of which WKT 
> is an instance?
> 
> Adding any library multiplies the complexity of building and packaging on 
> Windows. PROJ is 79 times as big as Wolkenbase so far and 17 times as big as 
> PerfectTIN. Even Bezitopo, which handles projections, but only conformal 
> ones, 
> is only 1/7 as big as PROJ, by running du on the source trees with .git 
> included.
> 
> Pierre
> -- 
> When a barnacle settles down, its brain disintegrates.
> Já não percebe nada, já não percebe nada.
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> Discuss mailing list
> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
> https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Standards] Spare OGC membership slot

[Bruce Bannerman]

Thanks Adam.

We have a lot to do to get the best out of our relationship with OGC so that it 
is a more win/win situation for both communities.

Therefore, do not worry too much about wading through past archives.

I’m much more interested in what we can do moving forward.

Kind regards,

Bruce

> On 21 Feb 2019, at 23:27, adam steer  wrote:
> 
> Hi Bruce, all
> 
> In the interests of open-ness that person is me - I’d like to look over the 
> standards list archive for a couple of days before officially tossing my hat 
> into the ring if that’s allright. My contact so far with OGC is primarily in 
> the point cloud DWG; and in a former life a couple of years working for an 
> OGC member organisation delivering training/internal advice on what OGC web 
> data services meant with respect to climate/EO data (WMS/WCS/WFS/WPS). There 
> is a whole lot I *don’t* know, in particular about how OSGeo interacts with 
> OGC (hence a discovery mission to do)
> 
> Regards
> 
> Adam
> 
> 
> 
>> On Thu, 21 Feb 2019 at 22:42, Bruce Bannerman 
>>  wrote:
>> I’ve had one more expression of interest, off list.
>> 
>> I’ve asked the person to submit it to this list over the next few days.
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> 
>> Bruce
>> 
>>> On 21 Feb 2019, at 18:31, Suchith Anand  
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> May I also request that  OSGeo representatives who take up these slots to 
>>> please also take some time to share OSGeo events updates and information in 
>>> the OGC maillists to help build wider collaborations/synergies. As part of  
>>> the OSGeo-OGC MoU , they can share key OSGeo events (FOSS4G conferences 
>>> etc) to the OGC maillists etc. So please respond to this call for 
>>> volunteers request if you are interested. Thanks.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Best wishes,
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Suchith
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> From: Discuss  on behalf of Cameron 
>>> Shorter 
>>> Sent: 20 February 2019 19:37
>>> To: standa...@lists.osgeo.org; OSGeo Discussions
>>> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Standards] Spare OGC membership slot
>>>  
>>> I'm looping Scott's comments (from the OGC) into the general OGC discussion 
>>> forum, as I think there are others who might be interested.
>>> 
>>> I'll add that you should plan to dedicate a lot of time if you intend to 
>>> partake in OGC initiatives. The OGC tackles hard interoperability problems 
>>> and you will likely need to think and discuss deeply with like minded 
>>> people. It is hard work, but it can be very satisfying and rewarding to be 
>>> working on the bleeding edge of technology (as many open source developers 
>>> are doing already).
>>> 
>>> Warm regards, Cameron
>>> 
>>>> On 19/2/19 7:52 pm, Scott Serich wrote:
>>>> Hi Jonathan (and anybody else listening). Something that might be 
>>>> attractive to providers of open-source offerings is the opportunity to 
>>>> participate in OGC testbeds and other initiatives. Any OGC member who's 
>>>> interested might consider the following:
>>>> 
>>>> 1. Sign up as an Observer for the OGC Testbed-15 initiative to learn how 
>>>> they work.
>>>> 2. Plan on submitting a bid in early 2020 to implement new offerings as 
>>>> part of OGC Testbed-16.
>>>> 3. Selected bidders will become participants to receive cost-share funds 
>>>> to help offset the cost of developing testbed component implementations.
>>>> 4. These participants will retain full control over the source code 
>>>> assets. All that must be delivered are interoperability demonstrations 
>>>> showing how the work helps advance the OGC standards baseline.
>>>> 
>>>> Under current testbed policies, OGC does not take possession of any of the 
>>>> developed source code. So in some sense, this is a roundabout way to get 
>>>> "paid" to develop open-source code. It's generally not sufficient funds to 
>>>> enable full cost recovery. But if the alternative is to receive no funding 
>>>> at all, this might present an attractive option.
>>>> 
>>>> Contact me or visit 
>>>> "https://www.opengeospatial.org/projects/initiatives/active; if you're 
>>>> interested in learning more. Full observer privileges are available to all 
>>>> OGC members (including the OSGeo slot).
>>>> 
>>>> 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Standards] Spare OGC membership slot

[Bruce Bannerman]

I’ve had one more expression of interest, off list.

I’ve asked the person to submit it to this list over the next few days.

Cheers,

Bruce

> On 21 Feb 2019, at 18:31, Suchith Anand  
> wrote:
> 
> May I also request that  OSGeo representatives who take up these slots to 
> please also take some time to share OSGeo events updates and information in 
> the OGC maillists to help build wider collaborations/synergies. As part of  
> the OSGeo-OGC MoU , they can share key OSGeo events (FOSS4G conferences etc) 
> to the OGC maillists etc. So please respond to this call for volunteers 
> request if you are interested. Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> Best wishes,
> 
> 
> 
> Suchith
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Discuss  on behalf of Cameron Shorter 
> 
> Sent: 20 February 2019 19:37
> To: standa...@lists.osgeo.org; OSGeo Discussions
> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [OSGeo-Standards] Spare OGC membership slot
>  
> I'm looping Scott's comments (from the OGC) into the general OGC discussion 
> forum, as I think there are others who might be interested.
> 
> I'll add that you should plan to dedicate a lot of time if you intend to 
> partake in OGC initiatives. The OGC tackles hard interoperability problems 
> and you will likely need to think and discuss deeply with like minded people. 
> It is hard work, but it can be very satisfying and rewarding to be working on 
> the bleeding edge of technology (as many open source developers are doing 
> already).
> 
> Warm regards, Cameron
> 
>> On 19/2/19 7:52 pm, Scott Serich wrote:
>> Hi Jonathan (and anybody else listening). Something that might be attractive 
>> to providers of open-source offerings is the opportunity to participate in 
>> OGC testbeds and other initiatives. Any OGC member who's interested might 
>> consider the following:
>> 
>> 1. Sign up as an Observer for the OGC Testbed-15 initiative to learn how 
>> they work.
>> 2. Plan on submitting a bid in early 2020 to implement new offerings as part 
>> of OGC Testbed-16.
>> 3. Selected bidders will become participants to receive cost-share funds to 
>> help offset the cost of developing testbed component implementations.
>> 4. These participants will retain full control over the source code assets. 
>> All that must be delivered are interoperability demonstrations showing how 
>> the work helps advance the OGC standards baseline.
>> 
>> Under current testbed policies, OGC does not take possession of any of the 
>> developed source code. So in some sense, this is a roundabout way to get 
>> "paid" to develop open-source code. It's generally not sufficient funds to 
>> enable full cost recovery. But if the alternative is to receive no funding 
>> at all, this might present an attractive option.
>> 
>> Contact me or visit 
>> "https://www.opengeospatial.org/projects/initiatives/active; if you're 
>> interested in learning more. Full observer privileges are available to all 
>> OGC members (including the OSGeo slot).
>> 
>> Thanks.
>> -Scott
>> 
>> =
>> Scott Serich, Ph.D., JD
>> Director, Innovation Programs, Open Geospatial Consortium (OGC)
>> +1 (703) 283-3432
>> sser...@opengeospatial.org
>> Skype: scott.serich.ogc
>> The OGC: Making Location Count.
>> www.opengeospatial.org 
>> =
>> 
>> From: "Bruce Bannerman" 
>> To: standa...@lists.osgeo.org
>> Sent: Monday, February 18, 2019 10:21:02 PM
>> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Standards] Spare OGC membership slot
>> 
>> Hi Jonathon,
>> 
>> Are you still interested in taking up an OSGeo membership slot within OGC.
>> 
>> It will give you a private membership that you will be able to use to 
>> participate within various OGC working groups and access member only OGC 
>> content.
>> 
>> If so, then I suggest that you use the membership slot to see how you can 
>> best contribute your skills to benefit both organisations.
>> 
>> I request that you provide updates to this list, at least yearly, but 
>> ideally when you come across items that you believe will be of interest to 
>> the OSGeo community.
>> 
>> You’ll find a wealth of resources on the OGC web site:
>> 
>> https://www.opengeospatial.org/
>> 
>> Kind regards,
>> 
>> Bruce
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 12 Feb 2019, at 02:17, Jonathan Moules  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Bruce,
>> 
>> I might be. It depends what it entails etc, and what value it would bring to 
>> OSGeo.
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> Jonathan
>> 
>> 
>> On 2019-0

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Invitation to participate in the 2018 OSGeo Charter Member elections

[Bruce Bannerman]

I am also concerned at the lack of information and discussion that took place 
this year.

I do not recall seeing anything through the Discuss lists and was not aware of 
the Wiki page listed below. Hence my votes were limited accordingly.

At the least, it would have been useful to have the wiki page URL included in 
the survey. 

While I would not have nominated anyone this year, it would have been useful to 
have a more prominent call for nominations. Given the number of nominees on the 
wiki, there was obviously some process in place that I have missed.

Please take this as constructive criticism for next year.

Kind regards,

Bruce

> On 20 Oct 2018, at 07:22, Michael Smith  wrote:
> 
> Cameron,
> 
> Do you mean https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/New_Member_Nominations_2018?
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> --
> Michael Smith
> OSGeo Foundation Treasurer
> treasu...@osgeo.org
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Discuss  on behalf of Cameron Shorter 
> 
> Date: Friday, October 19, 2018 at  4:09 PM
> To: OSGeo CRO , OSGeo Discussions 
> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Invitation to participate in the 2018 OSGeo 
> Charter Member elections
> 
>Vasile, Vicky, Jorge,
> 
>I can't seem to find a list of nominations for new charter members which 
>descriptions about why they have been nominated. I've used such a list 
>in the past to assess whether I'd vote for someone or not.
> 
>I suggest publishing on this page 
>https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Election_2018, and if not too late, adding 
>to the Limesurvey page.
> 
>Cheers, Cameron
> 
> 
>>On 19/10/18 7:42 pm, OSGeo CRO wrote:
>> 
>> Dear
>> 
>> Cameron,
>> 
>> As an existing OSGeo Charter Member, you have been invited to 
>> participate in the 2018 Charter Member elections.
>> 
>> To participate, please click on the link below.
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> Vasile, Vicky & Jorge
>> 
>> CRO 2018
>> 
>> 
> 
>-- 
>Cameron Shorter
>Technology Demystifier
>Open Technologies and Geospatial Consultant
> 
>M +61 (0) 419 142 254
> 
>___
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> 
> 
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Diversity in FOSS4G

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hello everyone,

It is good to see this discussion.

We have a very good community, with talented people from many diverse 
ethnicities, cultures and gender.

From my point of view, I would prefer to see a situation where we concentrate 
on getting the best representation for a particular event. We just need to 
ensure that the selection process is clearly defined.

I don’t want to see us select people in order to just fill a specific quota of 
one particular group, or another. 

If we have a situation where a specific event then has 100% female 
representation, then great. Similarly for other currently less represented 
groups.

Kind regards,

Bruce

> On 13 Aug 2018, at 05:31, Maria Antonia Brovelli  
> wrote:
> 
> Dear Maria, Jonathan, Peter (and All)
> in my opinion, we shall distinguish between equality and equity. Even 
> supposing that there were countries where there is equality  (but this is not 
> true: think simply to the "gender gap", i.e. the difference in salary between 
> men and women), the point is not of ensuring equality because there are great 
> differences inherited by our history and by our culture. If we want to reach 
> equality of outcomes, we have to consider equity, which is more than simply 
> giving the same opportunities. Obviously, this is a choice. This is my 
> choice, even if sometimes it is difficult and if sometimes I make mistakes. 
> What we have collectively to decide is if, as OSGeo, we want to go in this 
> direction. And, about that, I'm thinking of diversities that are wider than 
> the gender (and, also about gender, better not to limit ourselves to the 
> binary logic ;-) ).  I'm absolutely positive about having a BOF on 
> diversities at next FOSS4G. The more diversities, the better. 
> Thanks for starting this thread!
> See you in Dar.
> Maria
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A paper to read this summer ;-)
> 
> http://www.mdpi.com/2220-9964/7/8/289
> 
> 
> Prof. Maria Antonia Brovelli
> Professor of GIS and Digital Mapping
> Politecnico di Milano
> 
> P.zza Leonardo da Vinci, 32 - Building 3 - 20133 Milano (Italy)
> Tel. +39-02-23996242 - Mob. +39-328-0023867,  maria.brove...@polimi.it
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> Da: Discuss  per conto di María Arias de 
> Reyna 
> Inviato: domenica 12 agosto 2018 16:54:23
> A: jonathan-li...@lightpear.com
> Cc: OSGeo Discussions
> Oggetto: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Diversity in FOSS4G
>  
> I understand it is difficult to see your own privileges and biases[1].
> That's why I always prefer that a PoC talks about racism instead of
> me. But I can still talk about inequality regarding women. Remember
> that 90% of said here applies to all PoC. And that WoC suffer this
> from both sides.
> 
> So I'm going to take a couple of steps back and start again, to see if
> you can see the flaw. Sorry for not having the best bibliography, but
> I have a weak connection here so I have to rely on things I have
> already offline. But I am sure you will be capable of following the
> lead and find better sources.
> 
> Those researchers have the prejudice that a country that has better
> indexes regarding gender equality means there should be more women
> studying STEM because nothing stops them to do so. So they call it a
> paradox that "the more equal a country is, the fewer women go into
> STEM". But the thing is, if they have researched a bit more (even just
> asking the women of the study why they don't follow a STEM career!!)
> they wouldn't call it a paradox, but something natural coming from
> other causes.
> 
> In Europe, the percentage of women studying Science is increasing,
> while percentage of women studying Technology is decreasing, according
> to Eurostat[it was a bunch of links with data from different years,
> just use the search engine from Eurostat]. That's one of the reasons
> why talking about STEM is already a first bias because you are mixing
> stuff. But many authors do this, so let's just skip it.
> 
> In Tech, women are leaving studies and the industry at higher rate
> than men[2]. Which means, we have even less women working in our
> industry than the real percentage of women that would like to work in
> our industry. This unfriendly environment causes a lack of successful
> happy role models that could encourage other girls to enter the field
> too.[3] Role models are even more important to girls than to boys
> because of the Otherness[4]. By default, everything is male.
> 
> So, first loop that explains the "paradox".
> 
> But even then, why are there fewer female college students in STEM?
> Because, as all the links I posted previously already explained,
> society pushes you out of STEM [5] [6]. Only stubborn woman like me
> get far and it is just a matter of time to get burned because of this
> unfriendly environment.
> 
> And there's more variables that influences why women are not into STEM
> in supposedly "more egalitarian countries", but I don't think I should
> extend more here. I am more 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Board] How to retire membership status?

[Bruce Bannerman]

Well said Cameron.

Bruce

> On 23 Jun 2018, at 07:35, Cameron Shorter  wrote:
> 
> Could each of us please be a bit more measured and forgiving when responding. 
> It seems a few words have been selected which caused more offense than 
> intended. 
> I remember Jeff McKenna once saying that he sometimes takes a step back from 
> the keyboard for a day or so before responding, and being much kinder and 
> wiser as a consequence (my memory of Jeff's words).  I can think of a few 
> emails Jeff sent where I think he did just that - his excellent email 
> describing his reasons for wanting to join the current OSGeo board comes to 
> mind.
> 
> Confrontational tit-for-tat conversation is uncomfortable and if we take it 
> too far, we will find that productive members of our community will start 
> silently dropping off.
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] withdrawal from Board election

[Bruce Bannerman]

+1 

Bravo Vicky!

Very well said. Thank you.

Kind regards,

Bruce

> On 22 Oct 2017, at 23:45, Vicky Vergara  wrote:
> 
> Open letter to Jeff McKenna.
> 
> Dear Jeff:
> 
> I am so sad about the situation that led you to ask about the withdrawal.
> 
> All of us, OSGeo members, no matter the position on the organization, are 
> volunteers.
> We volunteer our time, our knowledge, our resources, our energy, sometimes 
> even our family.
> We don’t make comparisons between the someone that took one minute to make a 
> contribution, with the other someone who took 5 minutes. Maybe this last 
> statement its not 100% true, the exception I see is when we nominate a person 
> for the board and we want the rest of the community to notice the 
> contributions that are done by the nominee.
> 
> I was the first person to second your nomination, even when I was nominated 
> myself, because, I don’t see any of the nominees as opponents, I see them as 
> work team. From the fact that none of us participated on any attack of any 
> kind I deduce that we have the same view about each other: we are a team.
> 
> At the moment of your nomination, I see you trying to keep up to date the 
> OSGeo wiki pages, twitting events, volunteering time for SAC, planning to go 
> to a FOSS4G, doing administration of GSoC OSGeo program, applying for GCI 
> program, asking for volunteers, commenting on my poster design, making the 
> MapServer releases, and maybe more things that I don’t know about, but I am 
> leaving at the end of this list: you were also helping the CRO. 
> Because of your extra will to help and to give more to the community, how 
> fortunate the CRO was to have your help for the charter member elections, 
> specially this year, with so many new nominated people for charter member, 
> and how unfortunate for you to be pointed at because of the helping inertia, 
> keep on helping. Even when you stepped down from helping the CRO to accept 
> the nomination.
> 
> I must tell you that, not even in my wildest dreams I expected to be asked if 
> I would accept to be part of the board, I consider that an honor, and it 
> comes with a lot of responsibilities. If instead of you helping the CRO, was 
> me the one helping the CRO, I would have done the same, step down to accept 
> the nomination, basically because someone considers that my possible, non 
> CRO, future contributions are more valuable than contributing helping the CRO.
> 
> One thing that worries me is to see that helping so much, deserves an attack 
> of such magnitude, and if its not for your “helping the CRO” reason, and, 
> despite of being a reminder, the “stepping down from board past” that was 
> started, might have been the cheery of this sour cake.
> 
> I don’t know about that past, and I don’t ask, as I mentioned I have being 
> only two years on the organization, I only know about what I have seen during 
> these 2 years, and that knowledge gives me a feeling of what I want to see in 
> the future.
> 
> Based on what I see, and what I can foresee with you on the board, I am not 
> withdrawing my second-ing your nomination made by Nicolas Bozon.
> As a person, I can understand, and I fully support what ever decision you 
> make/made, to keep your mind in peace, after all things that have happened.
> 
> There are other things that worries me for the future:
> - Members could refrain from nominating (or seconding a nomination) because 
> when you nominate a person, you never ever want the person to be treated like 
> that,
> - We all make mistakes, and the fear of being overly attacked because of that 
> speck of sawdust, could refrain accepting the nomination.
> - Members could stop asking about what they feel is important because they 
> don’t know how a question can be overly used or be considered  by others.
> This really was a lose-lose situation.
> You can be sure you that no matter what the outcome is, because, as charter 
> member, I will do, within my capabilities and knowledge, what ever I can, for 
> this kind of situation never to repeat in the future to any of us.
> 
> Despite of being repetitive, I understand what you are going through, and you 
> have my support and friendship.
> 
> With all my respect and admiration, your friend and colleague, 
> Celia Virginia Vergara Castillo.
> OSGeo Charter Member
> 
> 
> 
>> On Sat, Oct 21, 2017 at 9:34 AM, Jeff McKenna 
>>  wrote:
>> Dear CRO,
>> 
>> Please accept my withdrawal from the Board election.  I am sorry to cause 
>> all of the problems so clearly explained by so many here publicly this 
>> election.
>> 
>> I wish to take the time now to thank all of the candidates for volunteering 
>> their time for the OSGeo community.
>> 
>> Yours,
>> 
>> -Jeff McKenna
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ___
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>> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
>> https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] withdrawal from Board election

[Bruce Bannerman]

+1 Maxi.

I’m very sorry to see this Jeff.

As a community, we need to look closely at what we allowed to happen during 
this process.

We cannot afford to chase away very talented and passionate people. Jeff is but 
one of them.

I have not been impressed by our actions.

Bruce

> On 22 Oct 2017, at 08:20, Massimiliano Cannata 
>  wrote:
> 
> Dear Jeff,
> I hope your withdrawal is not accepted.
> 
> With a community of hundreds of charter members I wouldn't care so much of 
> the respectable opinion of a couple of people and I would let the board take 
> the responsibility to take a decision.
> 
> I don't see anything irregular in your participation, did anyone cheat? I'm 
> sure this is not the case...
> Then, any lesson learned is useful to improve the process in the future...
> 
> I bet the charter members who voted for you want you to stand for respect of 
> their votes.
> 
> Maxi
> 
> Il 21 ott 2017 2:34 PM, "Jeff McKenna"  ha 
> scritto:
>> Dear CRO,
>> 
>> Please accept my withdrawal from the Board election.  I am sorry to cause 
>> all of the problems so clearly explained by so many here publicly this 
>> election.
>> 
>> I wish to take the time now to thank all of the candidates for volunteering 
>> their time for the OSGeo community.
>> 
>> Yours,
>> 
>> -Jeff McKenna
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ___
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Costly FOSS4Gs

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hello Ravi,

I have not really been following this discussion closely, but I can see from 
this email that you are upset.

I’m not sure what it is that you are upset over based on the few lines in your 
email.

I suspect that the issue may be:

"Is there a solution to OSGeo FOSS4G events, that are affordable to 
Users/Developers/Students..”

If my assumption is not correct, then I apologise for the comments below.
 

From my perspective:

Having been a member of a FOSS4G LOC (2009), I know how much effort is required 
to run a successful conference.

In our planning, we kept as a primary driver that we would need to minimise 
costs, but still deliver a professional conference.

This is not an easy thing to do. On the whole, I think that FOSS4G LOC 
typically strike a good balance.


When you look at the costs associated with a person attending a typical 
international FOSS4G event, the actual conference fees a small amount of the 
actual cost.

Consider airfares, transportation, accomodation, meals, lost wages etc. There 
is nothing that an LOC can do about these individual costs.



Affordability is an subjective term and will be viewed differently for each 
person, depending on their income, funds available and the value that they 
place on the event.

There are many events that I’d love to go to, but cannot afford to attend. This 
includes many FOSS4G events unfortunately.


I have noted a trend over many years to try and make videos of FOSS4G sessions 
available online for community members who were not able to attend an event to 
get an idea of what was presented.

Perhaps this will have to suffice for people who decide that in their 
circumstances, they cannot afford to attend a FOSS4G event?


Kind regards,

Bruce






> On 18 Oct 2017, at 4:57 pm, Ravi Kumar  wrote:
> 
> GFOSS.. Commercial Support.. +1 for this.
> But.. now that this has come to a boil..
> 
> WHY NOT THE BOARD AND WOULD BE BOARD COME OUT CLEAR ON THIS..
> SURE THIS WILL HELP THE CHARTER.. WHOM TO VOTE..
> 'Free and Open Source'.. has brought to where we are.. This is a community 
> effort.
> 
> Is there a solution to OSGeo FOSS4G events, that are affordable to 
> Users/Developers/Students..
> 
> Ravi Kumar
> 
> 
> 
> On Tue, Oct 17, 2017 at 3:45 PM, Tom Chadwin  wrote:
> Hello all
> 
> A significant group who have possibly not yet chimed in on this issue are the 
> commercial organizations who sell GFOSS support and development. I presume 
> that FOSS4G is one of their best opportunities to get new business.
> 
> I know there have been recent discussions/disagreements on this list about 
> how far OSGeo should promote commercial organizations. However, these 
> companies are the crucial element in GFOSS adoption in many larger public- 
> and private-sector bodies. Many simply will not entertain GFOSS without 
> commercial support, many believe the old myth that open source means no 
> support, and many simply will not accept the risk of GFOSS without that 
> support.
> 
> My point is that GFOSS would not have anything like the market penetration it 
> now does without commercial companies offering open-source support and 
> development. As I say, I stand to be corrected, but FOSS4G surely enables 
> them to persuade others to migrate to GFOSS, which is to the whole 
> community's benefit.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Tom
> 
> PS  Please forgive enormous corporate sigfile...
> 
> 
> Tom Chadwin, ICT Manager
> Telephone: 01434 611530 Mob:
> Web: 
> www.northumberlandnationalpark.org.uk
> 
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Hackathon: building fully open climatic monitoring system [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Massimiliano,

I will be very interested to see how this initiative develops. It overlaps with 
a couple of the areas that I'm working in.

One of the hats that I wear is as Co-chair of the Expert Team - Climate Data 
Management Systems (ET-CDMS).  ET-CDMS is sponsored by the World Meteorological 
Organisation's Commission for Climatology.

Within ET-CDMS, we are aiming to provide guidance on the functionality that is 
expected within modern Climate Data Management Systems.

We have released WMO #1131, Climate Data Management System Specifications [1]. 
This is the initial version of this document aimed at providing climate data 
managers, and IT Architects with an overview of where we need to head in order 
to get consistent climate data (and federated climate data services) to support 
future climate data analysis.  More work on WMO #1131 is planned and also 
underway, with an initial focus on software developers.

You may find WMO #1131 of use to support your Hackathon.

On another note, there is some preliminary planning work underway aimed at 
establishing an open source CDMS called Open-CDMS that is intended to provide 
the functionality described by WMO #1131. We're not ready to publicise this, at 
this stage. What I can say is that we're aiming to re-use quality open source 
projects where possible. If anyone is interested in helping us with the 
preliminary planning, please contact me off-line.

Bruce

[1] http://library.wmo.int/opac/index.php?lvl=notice_display=16300



From: Discuss 
> on 
behalf of Massimiliano Cannata 
>
Date: Saturday, 22 October 2016 at 03:46
To: Discuss OSGeo >
Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Hackathon: building fully open climatic monitoring 
system

Dear All,
I would like to announce that on the 6th and 7th December 2016 in Italy, in San 
Michele all'Adige at Fondazione Edmund Mach (Trento) [1] there will be the 1st 
hackathon of the OSGeo's Open Monitoring System WG [2].

The hackathon named " building fully open climatic monitoring system" [3] will 
bring together developers to work on Open Hardware and Open Software so that we 
could promote and advance in the topic of Open Monitoring Systems.
Interested people may sign up on the wiki page [3] where a draft of the program 
which includes presentations and practical experiments is presented.

For more information on the topic please take a look at [4]

The participation is free, while materials should be purchased by participants 
in advance (approx 150 USD).

The organisers [4] will try to collect sponsors and OSGeo support to reduce the 
cost of participants.

Sign-in, seats are limited !

Best Regards from the organisers :-)



[1] OSM
[2] https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Open_Monitoring_Systems_Working_Group
[3] https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Building_fully_open_climatic_monitoring_system
[4] 
http://www.slideshare.net/cannata/open-technologies-for-monitoring-systems-aimed-at-disaster
[4] Luca Delucchi, Yann Chemin and Massimiliano Cannata




--
Massimiliano Cannata

Professore SUPSI in ingegneria Geomatica

Responsabile settore Geomatica


Istituto scienze della Terra

Dipartimento ambiente costruzione e design

Scuola universitaria professionale della Svizzera italiana

Campus Trevano, CH - 6952 Canobbio

Tel. +41 (0)58 666 62 14

Fax +41 (0)58 666 62 09

massimiliano.cann...@supsi.ch

www.supsi.ch/ist
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] OSGeo and Open Data?

[Bruce Bannerman]

Several years ago, Cameron Shorter and I responded to an Australian
Government Parliamentary Inquiry into opening up access to public sector
data. (8 years now Cameron...)

This was done on behalf of OSGeo AustNZ. See [1].

There is definitely a role for OSGeo in lobbying for access for open data.

Bruce

[1] http://wiki.osgeo.org/images/1/14/Osgeo-austnz_vic_inquiry_psi_v1.1.pdf




On 17/10/2016, 23:17, "Discuss on behalf of Jeff McKenna"
>  jmcke...@gatewaygeomatics.com> wrote:
>
> >Hi Sanghee,
> >
> >I know that Codrina Maria Ilie[1] has focused on promoting Open Data,
> >and has given some great talks at past FOSS4G events.  She has also been
> >the chair of the open data track for many events.  I see her as an OSGeo
> >leader in open data, and she would have so many presentations to share
> >with you (she was recently part of FOSS4G-Romania as well).
> >
> >[1] https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/User:Codrina
> >
> >-jeff
> >
> >
> >--
> >Jeff McKenna
> >President Emeritus, OSGeo
> >http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Jeff_McKenna
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >On 2016-10-17 12:08 AM, Sanghee Shin wrote:
> >> Dear all,
> >>
> >> Can anybody share presentation file about the OSGeo and open data, if
> >>any? I’m invited to give a keynote talk at ‘Open Data in Action
> >>Conference’[1] in Korea and I don’t want to make the file from the
> >>scratch.
> >>
> >> FYI, OSGeo Korea[2], R Korea[3], Open Data Institute(ODI) Seoul[4],
> >>Open Knowledge(OK) Korea[5] will co-host the event on 15th Nov near
> >>Seoul. The main theme of the conference is ‘Experiment on Open Data
> >>based Society.’ Anybody who has similar interest can join this
> >>conference.
> >>
> >> Kind regards,
> >> 신상희
> >>
> >> [1]http://event.r-kor.org/
> >> [2]http://www.osgeo.kr/
> >> [3]http://r-kor.org/
> >> [4]http://seoul.theodi.org/
> >> [5]http://okfn.kr/
> >> ---
> >> Shin, Sanghee
> >> Gaia3D, Inc. - The GeoSpatial Company
> >> http://www.gaia3d.com
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Discuss mailing list
> >> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
> >> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> >>
> >
> >
> >___
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> >Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
> >http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>
>
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] CoverageJSON

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Jon,

In the longer term, I think that you will have more take-up if this is a joint 
OGC/ W3C standard.

While you go through this process there is the opportunity for refining the 
format through practical implementations.

Bruce

> On 30 Aug 2016, at 19:29, Jon Blower <j.d.blo...@reading.ac.uk> wrote:
> 
> Dear Jachym,
>  
> We define the MIME type as “application/prs.coverage+json”. See [1] for more 
> information about this and about our concept of “profiles”.
>  
> Currently CovJSON is being discussed in the context of the joint OGC/W3C 
> “Spatial Data on the Web” working group, although there is no formal 
> standards process in place at the moment. In the longer term I’d like to make 
> this a community standard, although I’m not sure whether to do this under 
> OGC, W3C, OSGeo or something else! I’m not very experienced in such things, 
> so any suggestions or guidance would be welcome.
>  
> Best wishes,
> Jon
>  
>  
> [1] 
> https://github.com/covjson/specification/blob/master/spec.md#10-media-type-and-file-extension
>  
> From: Jachym Cepicky <jachym.cepi...@gmail.com>
> Date: Tuesday, 30 August 2016 10:15
> To: Jon Blower <sgs02...@reading.ac.uk>, OSGeo Discussions 
> <discuss@lists.osgeo.org>
> Cc: Massimiliano Cannata <massimiliano.cann...@supsi.ch>, Bruce Bannerman 
> <bruce.bannerman.os...@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] CoverageJSON
>  
> Hi,
>  
> just humble suggestion: you can make this to OSGeo Community standard, like 
> TMS [1] was at it's time and get more publicity and possible more 
> collaborators to the project. Promote and colaborate via standards mailing 
> list [2]
>  
> btw: what is the mimetype, we shall stick to? (OGC WebProcessingService and 
> others need one single clear mimeType)
>  
> Cheers
>  
> J
>  
> [1] https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Tile_Map_Service_Specification
> [2] https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/standards 
>  
> út 30. 8. 2016 v 11:09 odesílatel Jon Blower <j.d.blo...@reading.ac.uk> 
> napsal:
> Dear all,
>  
> (Second attempt at sending this, I wasn’t subscribed before!)
>  
> I’m the leader of the project under which CoverageJSON is being developed 
> [1]. My colleague Maik Riechert is the main developer of this. Thanks very 
> much to Bruce for advertising to this list! I’ll pick up on a few of the 
> points in this thread:
>  
> 1.   Regarding adoption, it’s early days yet, but I’m aware of a few 
> applications in development (including our own projects of course, but also 
> some external folk). We’re building in library support for a few languages 
> (e.g. Javascript, Python) and some tools (e.g. Leaflet and NASA’s Web World 
> Wind).
> 2.   I think CovJSON can work nicely with O (the coverage can be the 
> result of the observation). O could provide the “hooks” on which other 
> metadata (e.g. provenance) could be hung.
> 3.   Regarding compression: yes, this is going to be important. JSON 
> gzips very well on the wire, which helps a lot with transfer speed and our 
> tests indicate that it’s typically not very much worse than a compressed 
> binary format. We’ve worked successfully with rasters of millions of pixels 
> in size.
> 4.   We’d be very happy to help people who want to implement support for 
> CovJSON in software (e.g. istSOS). Maybe our libraries will be of some use 
> here.
>  
> Any feedback on the spec or tools (positive or negative) is very welcome and 
> timely, as we are moving towards a stable 1.0 release.
>  
> Best wishes,
> Jon
>  
> [1] http://www.melodiesproject.eu
>  
> -- 
> Dr Jon Blower,
> MELODIES project coordinator,
> University of Reading
> j.d.blo...@reading.ac.uk
>  
> From: Massimiliano Cannata <massimiliano.cann...@supsi.ch>
> Date: Thursday, 18 August 2016 09:47
> To: Bruce Bannerman <bruce.bannerman.os...@gmail.com>
> Cc: Jachym Cepicky <jachym.cepi...@gmail.com>, OSGeo Discussions 
> <discuss@lists.osgeo.org>, Jon Blower <sgs02...@reading.ac.uk>
> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] CoverageJSON
>  
> Dear All,
> the coverage in O is addressed also at EU level within the SOS but in XML.
>  
> I may be interested in exploring this format and add this capability to 
> istSOS in the next future...
>  
> Maxi
>  
> 2016-08-17 22:58 GMT+02:00 Bruce Bannerman <bruce.bannerman.os...@gmail.com>:
> Thanks Jachym.
>  
> 
> I can also see the potential of this format.
>  
> 
> I like the potential for tying in the Observations and Measurements Observed 
> Property with associated community agreed definitions to the coverage. This 
> has been a missing piece of the puzzle

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] CoverageJSON

[Bruce Bannerman]

This is good to see Jon.

@All how can we make this happen within OSGeo?

Bruce

> On 30 Aug 2016, at 19:09, Jon Blower <j.d.blo...@reading.ac.uk> wrote:
> 
> Dear all,
>  
> (Second attempt at sending this, I wasn’t subscribed before!)
>  
> I’m the leader of the project under which CoverageJSON is being developed 
> [1]. My colleague Maik Riechert is the main developer of this. Thanks very 
> much to Bruce for advertising to this list! I’ll pick up on a few of the 
> points in this thread:
>  
> 1.   Regarding adoption, it’s early days yet, but I’m aware of a few 
> applications in development (including our own projects of course, but also 
> some external folk). We’re building in library support for a few languages 
> (e.g. Javascript, Python) and some tools (e.g. Leaflet and NASA’s Web World 
> Wind).
> 2.   I think CovJSON can work nicely with O (the coverage can be the 
> result of the observation). O could provide the “hooks” on which other 
> metadata (e.g. provenance) could be hung.
> 3.   Regarding compression: yes, this is going to be important. JSON 
> gzips very well on the wire, which helps a lot with transfer speed and our 
> tests indicate that it’s typically not very much worse than a compressed 
> binary format. We’ve worked successfully with rasters of millions of pixels 
> in size.
> 4.   We’d be very happy to help people who want to implement support for 
> CovJSON in software (e.g. istSOS). Maybe our libraries will be of some use 
> here.
>  
> Any feedback on the spec or tools (positive or negative) is very welcome and 
> timely, as we are moving towards a stable 1.0 release.
>  
> Best wishes,
> Jon
>  
> [1] http://www.melodiesproject.eu
>  
> -- 
> Dr Jon Blower,
> MELODIES project coordinator,
> University of Reading
> j.d.blo...@reading.ac.uk
>  
> From: Massimiliano Cannata <massimiliano.cann...@supsi.ch>
> Date: Thursday, 18 August 2016 09:47
> To: Bruce Bannerman <bruce.bannerman.os...@gmail.com>
> Cc: Jachym Cepicky <jachym.cepi...@gmail.com>, OSGeo Discussions 
> <discuss@lists.osgeo.org>, Jon Blower <sgs02...@reading.ac.uk>
> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] CoverageJSON
>  
> Dear All,
> the coverage in O is addressed also at EU level within the SOS but in XML.
>  
> I may be interested in exploring this format and add this capability to 
> istSOS in the next future...
>  
> Maxi
>  
> 2016-08-17 22:58 GMT+02:00 Bruce Bannerman <bruce.bannerman.os...@gmail.com>:
> Thanks Jachym.
> 
> 
> I can also see the potential of this format.
> 
> 
> I like the potential for tying in the Observations and Measurements Observed 
> Property with associated community agreed definitions to the coverage. This 
> has been a missing piece of the puzzle for some time.
> 
> 
> I understand that Jon and his team would welcome collaboration to further 
> test and develop the format.
> 
> 
> I expect that Jon will respond when he gets back off his holiday.
> 
> 
> Bruce
> 
> On 17 Aug 2016, at 19:03, Jachym Cepicky <jachym.cepi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi Bruce and Jon,
>  
> I went through the spec, and I like it in general (not that it would be so 
> important) 
>  
> JSON usage is certainly still growing, so is size of the data. Are you guys 
> using the CoverageJSON in some application already? I like the metadata 
> verbosity, and overall readiness for international environment.
>  
> Have you been thinking about data compression too? For raster data, this 
> could be key issue IMHO.
>  
> good luck
>  
> Jachym
>  
> čt 11. 8. 2016 v 0:47 odesílatel Bruce Bannerman 
> <bruce.bannerman.os...@gmail.com> napsal:
> Hi,
> 
> Are any projects doing any work with the emerging data format, CoverageJSON?
> 
> See:
> 
> - https://covjson.org/
> 
> - https://github.com/covjson/specification/blob/master/spec.md
> 
> 
> I understand that this is still a work in progress, but is in a fairly stable 
> state at the moment.
> 
> If anyone has looked at the format in detail, what are your thoughts on its 
> viability for:
> 
> - data exchange; and
> 
> - to underpin spatial and image analysis?
> 
> Bruce
> ___
> Discuss mailing list
> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> 
> ___
> Discuss mailing list
> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> 
> 
>  
> --
> Massimiliano Cannata
> Professore SUPSI in ingegneria Geomatica
> Responsabile settore Geomatica
>  
> Istituto scienze della Terra
> Dipartimento ambiente costruzione e design
> Scuola universitaria professionale della Svizzera italiana
> Campus Trevano, CH - 6952 Canobbio
> Tel. +41 (0)58 666 62 14
> Fax +41 (0)58 666 62 09
> massimiliano.cann...@supsi.ch
> www.supsi.ch/ist
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] CoverageJSON

[Bruce Bannerman]

Thanks Jachym.

I can also see the potential of this format.

I like the potential for tying in the Observations and Measurements Observed 
Property with associated community agreed definitions to the coverage. This has 
been a missing piece of the puzzle for some time.

I understand that Jon and his team would welcome collaboration to further test 
and develop the format.

I expect that Jon will respond when he gets back off his holiday.

Bruce

> On 17 Aug 2016, at 19:03, Jachym Cepicky <jachym.cepi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi Bruce and Jon,
> 
> I went through the spec, and I like it in general (not that it would be so 
> important) 
> 
> JSON usage is certainly still growing, so is size of the data. Are you guys 
> using the CoverageJSON in some application already? I like the metadata 
> verbosity, and overall readiness for international environment.
> 
> Have you been thinking about data compression too? For raster data, this 
> could be key issue IMHO.
> 
> good luck
> 
> Jachym
> 
> čt 11. 8. 2016 v 0:47 odesílatel Bruce Bannerman 
> <bruce.bannerman.os...@gmail.com> napsal:
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Are any projects doing any work with the emerging data format, CoverageJSON?
>> 
>> See:
>> 
>> - https://covjson.org/
>> 
>> - https://github.com/covjson/specification/blob/master/spec.md
>> 
>> 
>> I understand that this is still a work in progress, but is in a fairly 
>> stable state at the moment.
>> 
>> If anyone has looked at the format in detail, what are your thoughts on its 
>> viability for:
>> 
>> - data exchange; and
>> 
>> - to underpin spatial and image analysis?
>> 
>> Bruce
>> ___
>> Discuss mailing list
>> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
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[OSGeo-Discuss] CoverageJSON

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi,

Are any projects doing any work with the emerging data format, CoverageJSON?

See:

- https://covjson.org/

- https://github.com/covjson/specification/blob/master/spec.md


I understand that this is still a work in progress, but is in a fairly
stable state at the moment.

If anyone has looked at the format in detail, what are your thoughts on its
viability for:

- data exchange; and

- to underpin spatial and image analysis?

Bruce
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[OSGeo-Discuss] Fwd: FW: Some more stuff about coordinate reference systems

[Bruce Bannerman]

FYI, info on the Apache SIS library.

Martin Desruisseaux of Geomatys has done a good job with his presentation
at [2] that describes why spatial reference systems are important.

Bruce



-- Forwarded message --

On 5/08/2016, 19:59, "Jon Blower"  wrote:

>Hi all,
>
>I¹ve been talking offline with Martin Desruisseaux of Geomatys, a CRS
>guru. He has given me lots of information that I thought this group might
>be interested in, to help better understand issues around CRSs. This is a
>complicated area so I apologise if I make any mistakes in transmitting
>Martin¹s wisdom!
>
>Firstly, a couple of useful references. Martin is in the Apache SIS
>project, which provides a Java library for spatial data, including very
>comprehensive treatment of CRSs and conversions between CRSs. The SIS
>developer guide [1] is still in development but already has a lot of
>useful information about CRSs, which is useful even if you don¹t use the
>library. He also has written a presentation [2], which is a great
>explanation of why we don¹t always use WGS84 lat-lon, the importance of
>different datums and some of the issues in transforming between CRSs.
>
>Secondly, a useful point that is not always understood by newcomers. We
>usually talk about latitude and longitude, but often forget about the
>third dimension (ellipsoidal height). When converting between CRSs that
>use different datums, we need the third dimension as well. EPSG
>guidelines say that, if the height is missing, reasonable assumptions are:
>
>1. Height = 0 (i.e. we are standing on the surface of the ellipsoid)
>2. The height is given by a digital elevation model (i.e. we are standing
>on the surface of the planet)
>
>These two assumptions will, of course, lead to different answers for *all
>three* coordinates in the ³new² system (and both assumptions might be
>wrong). This could be important on the Web, because we frequently give
>latitude and longitude, but no information about ellipsoidal height. This
>means that if we convert these coordinates into a new system, we will get
>an uncertain position (and even the horizontal positions in the new
>system are uncertain, not just the height). [Does the Best Practice
>document mention this?]
>
>Finally, the process of converting coordinates between CRSs that use
>different datums can be very involved. Few open-source libraries do it
>³properly² (this is one of the gaps that SIS hopes to fill). I have a lot
>more information from Martin on this point but I think this email is long
>enough already!
>
>Hope this is helpful!
>Jon
>
>
>[1] http://sis.staging.apache.org/book/en/developer-guide.html
>[2] http://home.apache.org/~desruisseaux/SIS/2016-05.odp
>
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Does rasdaman CE solve an open source geospatial problem?

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Edzer,


Thank you for your timely email.

I agree that the functionality of the community version has been
constrained and have noted your comments below on aa earlier thread on the
Rasdaman lists that proceeded down a similar line with direct responses to
issues avoided through diverting the discussion around the nuances of the
query used.

I have also noted that Rasdaman Gmbh has been gradually reducing the
difference between the two versions by porting some functionality across to
the Community version, just not the performance aspects that matter.


I tend to be quite pragmatic on these issues. The approach that I took was
that we need to focus on getting open project governance with many parties
involved as per [b1].


I considered that once we got a wider representation and a truely open
project we could begin to address these types of issues within an
appropriate framework.

In part, this is why I deliberately chose the wording at [2], in order to
expose and to force the issue.


This approach has clearly not worked and I cannot see the governance issue
resolved to the benefit of a truely open community as thinks currently
stand.


On reflecting through the past archives of the Incubation list relating to
Rasdaman Incubation, I see that these have been issues right from the
beginning.


We should not dictate to a commercial organisation how they run their
business. They will need to make decisions that are appropriate for their
future growth.


IMO, I see an organisation that is trying to find a viable way to make a
living from open source. They have chosen this approach. Many organisations
have this issue. Other organisations take alternate approaches.


It is time to call this for what it is and pull the plug on incubation.
Perhaps market forces will dictate an alternate approach for Rasdaman, but
I doubt it.



After (sadly) watching how this has played out and the intransigence
adopted, I’m personally treating any further investment of my time into
Rasdaman in its current structure to be a very poor investment. Though this
could quickly change if the governance issue is addressed constructively.


I have therefore shelved any plans that I have for use of Rasdaman. I’d say
that Thredds and PyWPS will meet my immediate needs.


I agree with you that this is a lost opportunity. The project has so much
potential.

As has been discussed recently on this list, there is always the option to
fork Rasdaman, but I do not think that this is something to be undertaken
lightly.


Bruce

[b1] http://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/incubator/2016-May/003050.html

[b2] http://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/incubator/2016-April/002996.html





On 22/05/2016, 23:23, "Discuss on behalf of Edzer Pebesma"

>  edzer.pebe...@uni-muenster.de> wrote:
>
> >Cameron, my comment is in-line:
> >
> >On 21/05/16 14:06, Cameron Shorter wrote:
> >> Hi Edzer,
> >> Thank you for raising this topic questioning the value of radsaman
> >> community edition. It is pertinent considering recent discussions about
> >> Rasdaman incubation.
> >>
> >> Peter, your comments about programmers wanting to get paid for their
> >> work is valid, but does not provide justification for OSGeo promoting a
> >> proprietary business model. OSGeo is in the business of promoting open
> >> source software, and helping people who create open source software.
> >>
> >> Rasdaman's business model is in a grey zone. It provides a community
> >> edition and a proprietary edition. This is often referred to as an "open
> >> core" business model, or sometimes less favorably called "crippleware".
> >> I think Rasdaman is the only OSGeo (proposed) project which provides an
> >> open core model. All prior projects have been pure open source.
> >>
> >> Although a an open core model deviates from OSGeo's original principles,
> >> one could argue that Rasdaman community edition stands on its own as a
> >> valuable, quality open source geospatial application by itself, worthy
> >> of OSGeo promotion.
> >>
> >> Edzer's comments appear to counter this argument. Edzer, I understand
> >> you suggest Rasdaman community edition is of little value for real world
> >> problems?
> >
> >Yes; the example Peter mentions, http://planetserver.eu/ does solve a
> >problem: providing a download service for large scale imagery, and it is
> >good if rasdaman CE can do this for 20 Tb, with sufficient performance.
> >There are however several other open source technologies that can also
> >do this, potentially much simpler (e.g. thredds data server, maybe even
> >gdal VRT).
> >
> >The problems where array data management systems really come into play
> >is scalable computing: doing something useful with large data sets
> >without having to download all the data first ("bringing the
> >computations to the data, instead of data to the computations") - this
> >is what much of the big data scalability fanfare is about, not about
> >serving or downloading 

[OSGeo-Discuss] Rasdaman has been in OSGeo Incubation for 4.5 years, not 6 years

[Bruce Bannerman]

This email is just to correct the public record. Several of us have stated that 
Rasdaman has been incubation for six years.

This is not the case.


I have just been going through the Incubation list archives.

Rasdaman was accepted into OSGeo Incubation in November 2011:

http://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/incubator/2011-November/001670.html


I make this 4.5 years in Incubation, not 6 years.


Bruce
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Recent comparison of desktop GIS and image processing capability?

[Bruce Bannerman]

Tom,

Good points, particularly the involvement of some of our academic community 
members (perhaps Geo4All) to better define each of the functional components 
and relate them to citable sources.

Rather than playing catch-up, there is potential to set the agenda.

Why limit this to just Desktop GIS?

Bruce



> From: Discuss <discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org> on behalf of Tom Roche 
> <tom_ro...@pobox.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, 18 May 2016 9:17 AM
> To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org
> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Recent comparison of desktop GIS and image 
> processing capability?
> 
> Bruce Bannerman [1]
>>> Your spreadsheet[2] comparison shows a lot of potential, but I can see that 
>>> will take a lot of effort to keep it current.
> 
> Markus Neteler[3]
>> to my knowledge the effort is stalled. In my view the maintenance of this 
>> table is a perfect task for OSGeo :-)
> 
> +1. I suspect (YMMV) the table would be more maintainable if it was first
> 
> 1. translated into a lightweight markup that (of course :-) supports tables. 
> Candidates include one of the markdown extensions[4], MediaWiki, and 
> reStructuredText.
> 
> 2. version-controlled in an online repository.
> 
> I would also urge OSGeo to try to get third-party input (e.g., GIS 
> Geography[5], folks from some of the GIS curriculum bodies) into the 
> evaluation/maintenance process to inhibit (to paraphrase) unduly preferring 
> the taste of our own koolaid.
> 
> FWIW, Tom Roche <tom_ro...@pobox.com>
> 
> [1]: https://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/discuss/2016-May/016128.html
> [2]: 
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nNEtjWBROepTzGgTjZ8PslWyv7z_QqzgF1uRSm-0at0/edit?usp=sharing=CPGQ26EG
> [3]: https://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/discuss/2016-May/016129.html
> [4]: Native markdown does not support tables directly (except via native 
> HTML), but extensions that support tables include GFM, Markdown Extra, and 
> MultiMarkdown.
> [5]: http://gisgeography.com/qgis-arcgis-differences/
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Recent comparison of desktop GIS and image processing capability?

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Paolo, Markus, Tom and Till,

You have provided some good links there that will be sufficient for my
immediate need.

Many thanks for your help.


@Markus,

Your spreadsheet comparison shows a lot of potential, but I can see that it
will take a lot of effort to keep it current.

Is this something that projects are doing currently?


Bruce



On Tue, May 17, 2016 at 4:09 PM, Bruce Bannerman <b.banner...@bom.gov.au>
wrote:

>
>
> On 13/05/2016, 16:08, "Discuss on behalf of Paolo Cavallini"
> <discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org on behalf of cavall...@faunalia.it>
> wrote:
>
> >Il 12/05/2016 23:57, Bruce Bannerman ha scritto:
> >> Has anyone done a recent comparison of desktop GIS and image processing
> >> capability?
> >>
> >> It would be interesting to see where we stand now with FOSS4G software
> >> functionality.
> >>
> >> It appears that this is what ESRI is using to compare the functionality
> >> of their various license levels:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> https://esriaustralia.com.au/u/lib/cms/arcgis1021-desktop-functionality-m
> >>atrix.pdf
> >>
> >> Is there something comparable (that also refers to additional capability
> >> that is offered via OS?
> >
> >Hi Bruce,
> >previous attempts proved difficult, as a proper comparison involves a
> >lot of work. The ESRI document seems a good starting point. Unsure we
> >would be allowed to reuse it.
> >Would you be willing to help filling up the table for some free GIS?
> >All the best.
> >
> >--
> >Paolo Cavallini - www.faunalia.eu
> >QGIS & PostGIS courses: http://www.faunalia.eu/training.html
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>
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[OSGeo-Discuss] Recent comparison of desktop GIS and image processing capability?

[Bruce Bannerman]

Has anyone done a recent comparison of desktop GIS and image processing 
capability?

It would be interesting to see where we stand now with FOSS4G software 
functionality.

It appears that this is what ESRI is using to compare the functionality of 
their various license levels:

https://esriaustralia.com.au/u/lib/cms/arcgis1021-desktop-functionality-matrix.pdf

Is there something comparable (that also refers to additional capability that 
is offered via OS?

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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [rasdaman-dev] Re: [Incubator] Rasdaman and OSGeo Incubation: Proposed way forward

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hello Alex and Mattijn,

Thank you for your reply. I appreciate your thoughts on this.

I see your names popping up often in my email as you help people on the
Users and Developers lists. So it is good to see your comments.


As I read through your email, I realised that I need to clarify a few
concepts from my viewpoint, particularly as it relates to a PSC.

When I think of an open source community, I think of:

   - A community of people (Developers, Testers, Domain Specialists, Users,
   Technical Writers, Marketers, Managers etc) who are interested in working
   together and collaborating on the development of a specific functionality.
   We are not just talking about developers.


   - All people within the community should be free to contribute effort to
   develop the functionality as they are able to.


   - The community should be open, to allow those with merit and skill to
   rise to decision making and/or leadership roles within the community.
   Ideally the community will use the concept of 'meritocracy' to facilitate
   this. That is, the more good work that a person does, then the more that
   they are able to do.


   - Therefore, anyone, from any background, should be able to aspire for a
   leadership role within the community, including controlling the integrity
   of the project's source code as a 'Committer', through to working on the
   PSC to guide the community and its future directions.


   - While the community member may aspire towards this goal, it will be up
   to their own efforts, knowledge and ability to demonstrate that are fit for
   such a role.


   - The Project's Governance Framework should be structured to support and
   facilitate this openness, and to provide a structure and process to allow
   those with merit to lead.


This way, we can grow the community and bring in new volunteers, sponsors
and perhaps funding. Ideally, we'll get the community to a stage where it
is self-sustaining and can survive the loss of key people and sponsors.

This is what we are trying to achieve via OSGeo Incubation.

We are nearly there with the Rasdaman Community.

However, we don't have the key part, the enabling Project Governance
Framework right yet.
The project has achieved what it has through the dedication and hard work
of community members, and facilitated by Peter Baumann's leadership.

We are not trying to change the leadership of the Rasdaman.

What we are trying to do, is to ensure that Rasdaman's Governance Framework
is open to allow those deserving, to rise to leadership and decision making
roles through merit.

For practical purposes, as you have suggested Alex, I expect that this will
lead to little difference in the current day to day running of the Rasdaman
Community.

But it will have a significant impact on the Project's future viability and
its ability to attract new volunteers and contributions!


We all want Rasdaman to succeed and to live up to, and ideally surpass, the
potential that it is showing.




My challenge to the Rasdaman Community is to speak up on this issue. Do you
want a project that values and facilitates meritocracy?



Bruce Bannerman
OSGeo Mentor for Rasdaman


--
> *From:* rasdaman-...@googlegroups.com <rasdaman-...@googlegroups.com> on
> behalf of Alex Mircea Dumitru <m.dumi...@jacobs-university.de>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, 10 May 2016 9:25 PM
> *To:* rasdaman-dev
> *Cc:* rasdaman-us...@googlegroups.com; incuba...@lists.osgeo.org;
> discuss@lists.osgeo.org
> *Subject:* Re: [rasdaman-dev] Re: [Incubator] Rasdaman and OSGeo
> Incubation: Proposed way forward
>
> Dear Bruce,
>
> First of all, I would like to thank you for your continued commitment to
> the incubation process and the guidance that you have provided that in the
> end has lead to better developer practices in our small community of
> contributors. Automated testing, better documentation and many other of our
> development features would have probably came a lot later if not for your
> contributions.
>
> I understand the position of OSGeo and its desire to standardize community
> practices for the projects it endorses. But as software developers we know
> all too well that there's no one-fit for solution for all our problems.
> Rasdaman has a small core team (alongside temporary contributors) that
> works round the clock to provide users of our database a fully functional
> raster database. Not a research prototype and certainly not some simple
> software with a highly specific target. We provide an open-source database
> capable of storing terabytes of data in an area filled only by commercial
> companies with thousands of developers and many more in support teams
> (Testing, QA, Research etc).
> Even in these conditions, we do our best to provide the utmost support to
> our users, be it questions on usage, specific use cases or feature and bug

[OSGeo-Discuss] Radaman relationships. [was: Re: [Incubator] Should OSGeo accept "benevolent dictator" projects into OSGeo?]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hello Marc and Moritz,

This is not just an issue relating to Academia and Open Source.

In the interests of full disclosure, there is also a proprietary interest here:

- Rasdaman Gmbh [1] offers a dual licensed [2] version of Rasdaman. This has 
been discussed previously on the Incubation list.

- at [3], you will see Peter Baumann listed as Managing Director of Rasdaman 
Gmbh.

Bruce

[1] http://www.rasdaman.com

[2] http://www.rasdaman.com/commercial-free.php 

[3] http://www.rasdaman.com/index.php#imprint 

> 
> From: Discuss  on behalf of Marc Vloemans 
> 
> Sent: Monday, 9 May 2016 12:56:08 AM
> To: Peter Baumann
> Cc: OSGeo Discussions; incuba...@lists.osgeo.org
> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Incubator] Should OSGeo accept "benevolent  
>   dictator" projects into OSGeo?
> 
> Peter,
> 
> I did certainly not realise there was such a cultural gap between academia 
> and open source.
> 
> Also, I gather that bazar style negotiation is not to your liking not 
> efficient. You perhaps rather have a single representative 
> speaking/negotiating on behalf of the OSGeo Foundation? Unfortunately, nobody 
> has that remit within OSGeo. So you need to be more convincing. Presently, a 
> take-it-or-leave-it attitude has not helped your cause.
> 
> In order to grow 'your' project you are at the end of the day dependent on 
> additional skills and genius. Not for money, but for free (as in beer). Just 
> 'open sourcing' your project under the wings of OSGeo to do so requires some 
> careful consideration of your audience and joint planning in stead of blunt 
> negotiation. Laying down the law and emphasising how you want things will 
> IMHO not gain you followers, developers or others to do the hard Dev work, 
> the (easier, but still volunteer work) management, promotion etc.
> 
> So I invite you to be more appealing to all the bright minds in our 
> community. Because, as far as this discussion goes I see no crowd jumping up 
> and say 'I want'
> 
> To give you another pointer; perhaps a route to a mutually beneficial 
> solution could be found in the area of license-policy(please, give it a 
> thought. It would take a new look at things that could work for all).
> 
> And in case no consensus is arrived at, then consider Cameron and I and 
> anyone joining in (pro/neutral/contra) as activists for that matter.
> Personally, I sometimes tear my hairs out of impatience, when I see that 
> building consensus takes so long. But during various recent online 
> discussions I learned a lot as well. From people I consider bright and 
> skilful even though I do not agree with them. And they give me room to work 
> on what I think is best, even though they do not agree with a lot I am saying 
> and doing. That's both courageous of them and humbling for me. So ... the 
> top-down alternative is flat-out horrifying to me.
> 
> Vriendelijke groet,
> Marc Vloemans
> 
> 
>> Op 8 mei 2016 om 14:48 heeft Peter Baumann  
>> het volgende geschreven:
>> 
>> Marc-
>> 
>> if we just discuss on meta level we bypass the real facts. It is not about
>> bazaar style negotiation - both sides have laid their cards open on the 
>> table,
>> and now OSGeo needs to see what to do with it.
>> Also, I note in passing that science is not really understood, discussion is 
>> all
>> about money. Maybe look at my mail again, it is about skills and genius in 
>> fact.
>> (No pun intended!)
>> 
>> Tot ziens,
>> Peter
>> 
>> PS: Just to remind, this code of conduct discussion some time back was not
>> guided by a general negotiation, and not even by a vote of the OSGeo 
>> membership
>> at large (just some activists).
>> 
>> 
>>> On 05/07/2016 08:52 AM, Marc Vloemans wrote:
>>> @Peter
>>> From the discussion I take away the impression that Cameron et al have 
>>> tried to keep the conversation going and not close any doors. You have 
>>> called that word smithing, which raises a proverbial eyebrow.
>>> The fact that you have just turned it into a take it or leave it deal, is 
>>> not conducive to a potential win-win.
>>> I appreciate your frankness, however.
>>> The role of PI is clear; the one who holds the purse strings has the power. 
>>> Something most developers are familiar with.
>>> 
>>> As a volunteer I am happy to give time and brain cells to our mission. 
>>> Attracting interest, creating adoption, acquire funds for our projects 
>>> support (shout out to Jody and Arnulf/LOCBonn) for your project that has 
>>> this form of dependency on a single person is not "my-itch". Scratching it 
>>> would make ultimately you(r ambitions) better-off, not the inclusive 
>>> participative culture of the community at large.
>>> 
>>> @Patrick
>>> No disagreement with the daunting task this world faces (I do not want to 
>>> leave a mess for my children, nor ruin the globe, which we IMHO only 
>>> borrow).
>>> But if 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Incubator] Rasdaman and OSGeo Incubation: Proposed way forward

[Bruce Bannerman]

Dear Rasdaman Community members,

As per below, I proposed a 3 month period of time for the Rasdaman Community to 
reflect on the OSGeo Incubation discussion over the last two weeks and to 
decide how the Rasdaman Community wishes to proceed (or not) with OSGeo 
Incubation.

Peter Bauman has responded on your behalf that this time for reflection is not 
wanted. He would like OSGeo to make the decision now.

I will allow a three day period for comments from the Rasdaman Community before 
taking further action.

I would like to hear the view of Rasdaman Community members on this, so please 
respond. An email response to the Rasdaman Users list is all that is required.

Bruce Bannerman
OSGeo Mentor for the Rasdaman Project

> On 8 May 2016, at 21:02, Peter Baumann <p.baum...@jacobs-university.de> wrote:
> 
> Allow me to respectfully disagree.
> 
> rasdaman is leading technology due to rigorous science and excellent 
> engineering. This is what rasdaman users enjoy and what rasdaman developers 
> are proud of. Independent research shows that rasdaman is much faster than 
> Apache SPARK and other related technology. Today, rasdaman databases exceed 
> 100 TB in size in operational setups by leading data centers, and we are 
> going Petabyte now.
> 
> Still, OSGeo wants us to replace this "design by innovation" by a "design by 
> committee" approach governed by a "dictatorship of voting". (Note that the 
> term "dictatorship" is not brought up by me, but the provocative term has 
> been used on us first by OSGeo in an intense discussion preceding this mail).
> 
> Disclaimer: TL;DR:
> 
> Don't get me wrong, the team and myself will always listen to input, and will 
> discuss it openly. Decision will be solely based on technical merits, and 
> nothing else. In particular: no majority vote. Yes, this obviously requires 
> decent hardcore Computer Science skills, and these do not come by vote. Feel 
> invited to join the party under these conditions, and you will find that we 
> value genius over committees.
> 
> To add more background, rasdaman is now entering its seventh year of 
> incubation (for comparison: OSGeo has celebrated its 10th anniversary). This 
> gives a hint that OSGeo's own governance might be worth reinvestigating. BTW, 
> OSGeo has not passed its own incubation rules and thinks this is not 
> necessary.
> 
> The rasdaman team has been working hard to accommodate OSGeo requests, some 
> of which indeed are useful for software quality, undeniably. However, we 
> cannot afford any longer to get distracted from innovating rasdaman further, 
> so there are no resources for waiting a couple of months and then going the 
> next iteration, like the last 6 years.
> 
> A brief summary of this history can be found here (annually updated in some 
> spare late-night moments): http://rasdaman.org/wiki/OSGeo .
> 
> Your annual OSGeo sprints are much acknowledged, Bruce, but we all seem to 
> agree that this story needs to converge, in one or the other way: either to 
> fundamentalistically focus on one specific niche setup, or to broaden its 
> perspective and accept that the world has many colors... is Linux 
> committee-driven? Drupal? Django? Ruby? Even NASA has tried to explain OSGeo 
> that their approach does not always fly. 
> 
> OSGeo has had ample time to come to conclusions, it knows what rasdaman is 
> and how it works. Let us see whether (and when) OSGeo is able to decide. 
> Therefore, we will patiently await OSGeo's verdict, accepting whatever its 
> decision may be.
> 
> Hope that clarifies,
> Peter
> 
> 
>> On 05/06/2016 02:43 AM, Bruce Bannerman wrote:
>> Dear Radaman Community and the OSGeo Incubation Committee,
>> 
>> 
>> I propose that we suspend a decision on the way forward with Rasdaman 
>> Incubation for a period of three months.
>> 
>> This will provide time:
>> for all to reflect on incubation discussions events over the last two weeks; 
>> and
>> for the Rasdaman Community to discuss and decide on the way forward that 
>> they wish to take.
>> 
>> Should the Rasdaman Community wish to continue with OSGeo Incubation, then I 
>> will be happy to continue as OSGeo Mentor for a short period of time to work 
>> through the Project Governance approach with you. I will also be prepared to 
>> stand aside, should you prefer an alternate mentor.
>> 
>> Should the Rasdaman Community decide that it does not wish to continue with 
>> OSGeo Incubation, I am sure that you will be encouraged to continue your 
>> association with OSGeo as an "OSGeo Community Project" [1]. You will be able 
>> to do this using your current Governance Pro

[OSGeo-Discuss] Rasdaman and OSGeo Incubation: Proposed way forward

[Bruce Bannerman]

Dear Radaman Community and the OSGeo Incubation Committee,


I propose that we suspend a decision on the way forward with Rasdaman
Incubation for a period of three months.

This will provide time:

   - for all to reflect on incubation discussions events over the last two
   weeks; and


   - for the Rasdaman Community to discuss and decide on the way forward
   that they wish to take.


Should the Rasdaman Community wish to continue with OSGeo Incubation, then
I will be happy to continue as OSGeo Mentor for a short period of time to
work through the Project Governance approach with you. I will also be
prepared to stand aside, should you prefer an alternate mentor.


Should the Rasdaman Community decide that it does not wish to continue with
OSGeo Incubation, I am sure that you will be encouraged to continue your
association with OSGeo as an "OSGeo Community Project" [1]. You will be
able to do this using your current Governance Process.


We have come a long way over the last six years. I'm impressed by how well
the Rasdaman Community has developed and by the processes and the
functionality of the software developed. Rasdaman has great potential in
the future.

It is a credit to you all.


Bruce Bannerman

OSGeo Mentor to Rasdaman


[1] https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/OSGeo_Community_Projects
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[OSGeo-Discuss] Request to OSGeo Board for more information on Jeff McKenna's resignation [was: Re: Board give us some infor About Board]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Thanks Ravi for posting this.

I have just returned after an extended absence to find this issue.

I have great respect for Jeff and for the exceptional job that he has been
doing over the years for open source spatial software.

I do not like how this has played out, particularly with very little
information being provided.

I second Ravi's call to the OSGeo Board for more information on what
actually occurred to arrive at this outcome.

Bruce Bannerman


From: Discuss <discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org> on behalf of Ravi Kumar <
> manarajahmundry2...@gmail.com>
> Date: Sunday, 27 December 2015 15:03
> To: Discuss OSGeo <discuss@lists.osgeo.org>
> Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Board give us some infor About Board
>
> Dear All,
> have been checking certain emails from Board List..
> There was some exchange about Jeff Mecanna falling out.
>
> What is the present situation. Do we have a Wiki where it is explained ??
> Else pl write about it to the list.
> Jeff has been of great inspiration, he went around the world especially
> Asia initiating Local chapters,, earlier he once resigned and ran for the
> board again; May be to Prove a point !!
>
> Have a great new-year.
>
> Ravi Kumar
>
>
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Use cases and requirements for web maps

[Bruce Bannerman]

The joint working W3C/OGC group that Scott refers to may be found at:

  http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Main_Page

Bruce





> From:  on behalf of Scott Simmons <
> ssimm...@opengeospatial.org>
> Date: Tuesday, 29 September 2015 07:04
> To: Cameron Shorter 
> Cc: Discuss OSGeo 
> Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Use cases and requirements for web maps
>
> Cameron,
>
> Thanks!  Yes, we do currently have a joint working group with W3C for
> “Spatial Data on the Web” and that group has been keeping tabs on the
> activity of this community in W3C.  Interestingly, I think that Jo’s e-mail
> has rekindled some of the interest (certainly has for me!).
>
> Best Regards,
> Scott
>
>
> On Sep 28, 2015, at 2:45 PM, Cameron Shorter 
> wrote:
>
> Scott, Carl,
> I suspect this initiative would be something that the OGC would be
> interested in?
>
> Cheers, Cameron
>
> On 28/09/2015 9:06 pm, Jo Cook wrote:
>
> Hi All,
>
> I just wanted to draw your attention to this, from W3C if you have not
> already seen it. I don't have the technical know-how to see if there are
> any negative implications but there are opportunities to comment.
>
> https://www.w3.org/community/maps4html/
> http://maps4html.github.io/HTML-Map-Element-UseCases-Requirements/
>
> Regards
>
> Jo
>
> --
> *Jo Cook*
> Astun Technology Ltd, The Coach House, 17 West Street, Epsom, Surrey, KT18
> 7RL, UK
> t:+44 7930 524 155
> iShare - Data integration and publishing platform
> 
>
> *
>
> Company registration no. 5410695. Registered in England and Wales.
> Registered office: 120 Manor Green Road, Epsom, Surrey, KT19 8LN VAT no.
> 864201149.
>
>
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>
> --
> Cameron Shorter,
> Software and Data Solutions Manager
> LISAsoft
> Suite 112, Jones Bay Wharf,
> 26 - 32 Pirrama Rd, Pyrmont NSW 2009
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FW: code of conduct: another real case

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Cameron,

I was very surprised to see the email below. It seems to me that the issue
may just be a simple misunderstanding by someone, not a deliberate act of
sabotage.


I'll add some comments as the OSGeo Incubation Mentor for the Rasdaman
project:

Thanks for digging out the reference at [1]. That is indeed that latest
formal advice that has been provided on incubation.

Since then Peter and I have been in private discussion as to how we can
move this forward and have agreed on a joint approach.

Both Peter and my spare time is very limited however and this is causing
delays:

   - In addition to his day job, Peter is doing invaluable work extending
   open spatial standards within OGC and W3C forums; and
   - I'm similarly busy in a new role, team and large project, together
   with commitments to WMO, OGC and W3C.

Consequently our volunteer time is scarce and this inevitably causes delays.

Peter and I believe that Rasdaman is ready for graduation from Incubation.

However, Peter and I need to ensure that we adequately describe why we
believe this, as per the advice at [1].


Regarding the OSGeo Incubation Process:

   - I can appreciate the frustration that Peter is obviously experiencing.
   I can see this developing within gvSIG as well;
   - We may wish to look at our graduation process. It is currently quite
   subjective in many places and open to interpretation by the Incubation
   Committee members. I can see that the same project could conceivably
   graduate or not, depending on who is a member of the committee at the time
   of the application.
   - I do not see that Rasdaman has been unfairly singled out in its
   graduation attempt and stand by my comments at [1];
   - I'm seeing similar Incubation Committee comments in the gvSIG
   Graduation process to those that were provided on Rasdaman's first attempt
   at graduation;
   - Personally I think that a key issue that affects both gvSIG and
   Rasdaman relates to commercial involvement with the projects and open
   decision making processes. Daniel Morrissette, Evan Rouault and yourself
   summarised this issue well in the thread at [2]. We still don't have this
   right within the Rasdaman Community, but we are heading in the right
   direction and there is a definite willingness to address the issue; and
   - The Rasdaman view of the OSGeo relationship may be found at [3]. There
   are some valid criticisms of the process, together with some selectively
   edited excerpts from emails, e.g. the update on 2015-09-14 update
   references a private email between myself and Peter, where I forwarded the
   email thread at [2] with the covering text


   - "This is something that we'll need to work on before we put Rasdaman up
  for graduation again.

  I'm still buried in my priority task, so I have not had time to look
  at
  incubation issues yet. Sorry."


Regarding the Rasdaman Intellectual Property issue:

   - I believe that Peter may be referring to the comment at [3] dated
   2015-07-25.


   - I have no knowledge of how this eventuated, however I'd make the
   observation that it could be seen as being a badge of honour to be
   classified as an OSGeo Project. That was the reason for the OSGeo
   application in the first place, wasn't it? So I'm not sure what the actual
   issue is here and will wait for Peter's comment;


   - From my view as a layman, the IP in the Rasdaman source code clearly
   rests with Peter Baumann and Rasdaman GmbH as per:
  - The Rasdaman License as described at [4];
  - The Rasdaman Contributer agreement as described at [5]; and
  - The Rasdaman Copywrite header as described at [6].


   - Therefore, I don't see that there is anything to give back with
   regards to the ownership of the software. I will make the observation
   though, that as the software is licensed under GPL and L/GPL that it is
   possible for anyone to fork the software.



@Peter,

What have I missed?

On re-reading your post, I suspect that you may be referring to control of
the Rasdaman Project's OpenHub Project repository and that is what you
would like to be given back.


On a personal note:

Over the five plus years that I have been involved with Rasdaman as the
OSGeo Project Mentor, I have learned a lot from the Incubation Process and
admire what Peter and the Rasdaman Community have achieved. This project
and software has incredible potential and is a credit to all involved.

I would be sorry to see Rasdaman leave the OSGeo fold, particularly if the
cause is a misunderstanding.


Bruce

[1] https://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/incubator/2015-April/002695.html

[2] https://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/incubator/2015-September/002787.html

[3] http://rasdaman.org/wiki/OSGeo

[4] http://rasdaman.org/wiki/License

[5] http://rasdaman.org/wiki/ContributorAgreement

[6] http://rasdaman.org/wiki/CodeProvenance




On 18/09/2015 07:21, "discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org on behalf of Cameron
> Shorter" 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Fw: [Election 2015] Board Nomination for Jody Garnett

[Bruce Bannerman]

+1

I've known Jody for many years. He is constantly demonstrating his
commitment to open source spatial through his involvement in many projects
and his willingness to help.

Jody displays a considered and pragmatic attitude that would suit him well
on the OSGeo Board.

Bruce


On Thu, Sep 17, 2015 at 6:59 AM, Bruce Bannerman <b.banner...@bom.gov.au>
wrote:

>
> 
> From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org <discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org>
> on behalf of Vasile Craciunescu <vas...@geo-spatial.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, 16 September 2015 4:20:20 PM
> To: OSGeo Discussions
> Cc: OSGeo Chief Returning Officer
> Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Election 2015] Board Nomination for Jody Garnett
>
> Forwarding Jody Garnett nomination to the board of directors by Cameron
> Shorter.
>
> Best,
> Vasile
> CRO 2015
>
>
>  Forwarded Message 
> Subject:Re: Run for the OSGeo board?
> Date:   Wed, 16 Sep 2015 14:42:05 +1000
> From:   Cameron Shorter <cameron.shor...@gmail.com>
> To: Jody Garnett <jody.garn...@gmail.com>, OSGeo CRO <c...@osgeo.org>
>
>
>
> Dear CRO,
>
> I would like to nominate Jody Garnett to serve on the OSGeo Board.
>
> Jody is a man who has a depth of experience with the OSGeo foundation,
> right from getting his hands dirty writing code, through to setting up
> and managing projects, through to evangelising at conferences and
> workshops, as well as chairing OSGeo committees.
>
> He steps up to tackle the hard problems, provides insightful feedback
> and advice, as well ask taking on the less exciting tasks to get things
> done. This depth of can-do practical experience will serve OSGeo well if
> Jody were voted onto the OSGeo board.
>
> For background: Jody chairs the OSGeo Incubation committee, was on the
> FOSS4G 2007 and FOSS4G 2009 organising committees, has presented
> regularly at conferences and workshops, is on the Project Steering
> Committees for UDig, GeoTools, GeoServer, and is a regular contributor
> to numerous OSGeo email lists.
>
> Warm regards,
> Cameron Shorter
>
>
>
> ___
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>
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Invitation to participate in the OSGeo membership consultations

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Vassile,

This survey appears to be flawed.

I applaud your efforts to bring this issue to a head, but I'm not convinced
that we'll get valid results from the survey.


In my case:

I believe that there should be open membership for any interested, perhaps
with a membership fee.

I also see the value of recognising key contributors voted through some
meritocracy process as the current Charter Membership allows, with this
group having a voting responsibility. This is in essence not very different
from the concept of a 'committers' group within an open source project. I
don't really care if the name 'Charter Membership' is changed.


However the survey appears to lead people into a binary situation where
they believe in 'open' or 'closed' with 'closed' apparently assigned to
those favouring 'Charter Membership'.


For example:

I'd like to vote NO to 'Should OSGeo move from the actual elected Charter
member model to an (open) regular membership?'

But, YES to 'If you agree with the OSGeo regular membership, do you also
agree with a low annual membership fee?'

However, I'm precluded from doing so, because I answered NO to Q1.

For Question 4, I would like to answer both:

- YES for Open, in the context that everyone interested should be able to
participate in discussions and the OSGeo Community (perhaps having paid a
membership fee); and

- YES for 'Closed', in the context of key votes being subject to the
equivalent of a 'Committers' list where people have been voted in through
some meritocracy process.

- However, I can only choose one or the other!


I haven't read the remaining questions at this stage, given the flawed
questions at the beginning.



I apologise if you had sent this out for review earlier. I have not been
following this debate closely as this type of membership noise pops up on a
regular basis.

However, when this proceeds to a vote of the OSGeo Charter membership, I
need to register a comment.


For consideration.

Bruce









From: Vasile Crăciunescu c...@osgeo.org
 Reply-To: Vasile Crăciunescu c...@osgeo.org
 Date: Thursday, 30 July 2015 23:52
 To: Bruce Bannerman 
 Subject: Invitation to participate in the OSGeo membership consultations

 Dear Bruce,

 As an existing OSGeo Charter Member, you have been invited to participate
 in the 2015 OSGeo membership consultations.

 To participate, please click on the link below.

 Sincerely,

 Vasile ()

 --


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[OSGeo-Discuss] Open Source Python framework for working with OWS services [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

(Apologies for cross posting)

Hello Colleagues,

We’re looking around for a good, robust open source python framework for 
working with OGC Web Services.

Our initial need is to automate the validation and testing of our internal 
services, though I expect that our need will grow from there.

Can anyone point me in the direction of some effective libraries that work with 
current versions of OWS?


We’ve come across OWSlib [1] and [2], but are not aware of how people are 
finding its functionality.

Bruce

[1] http://geopython.github.io/OWSLib/

[2] https://www.openhub.net/p/OWSLib




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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Incubator] New incubation procedure

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Jody,

The work keeps falling back on the same people…

We still don’t have a clear rationale as to what is broken and what we’re
trying to fix.

I'm inclined to not do anything until this is clearly understood.

Bruce



On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 11:11 AM, Jody Garnett jody.garn...@gmail.com
wrote:

 I will volunteer after foss4gna to look at this.

 I am still interested in keeping our current procedure (as I think it is
 producing good results) and relaxing the requirement for a mentor (which is
 an embarrassing bottleneck).

 Rather than a star system I think we can highlight how far along in the
 checklist each project is.

 --
 Jody Garnett

 On 10 March 2015 at 16:12, Bruce Bannerman 
 bruce.bannerman.os...@gmail.com wrote:

 We need to be careful when playing around with our 'Incubation Procedure'.

 It causes considerable angst and disruption to both mentors and to the
 relevant communities going through incubation when we keep trying to change
 to rules.

 From my opinion as a mentor, the current process while subjective in some
 cases is still valid and effective in guiding a project to the ideals that
 we as a community aspire to.

 When a project graduates from incubation, it gains considerable
 credibility as a viable open source spatial project. It is a badge of
 honour for the project and something to aspire too. So why are we trying to
 dilute this?

 While there are aspects that could improve, what is the rationale for
 wanting to change the process (together with the inevitable disruption that
 follows)?

 If we are serious about changing the incubation rules, then a more formal
 methodology such as those referred to by Cameron at [1] may be more
 appropriate.

 Now, who has the spare time to investigate and drive this forward, **if
 we deem it appropriate**.?

 Are there any volunteers?

 Bruce

 [1] http://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/incubator/2015-March/002644.html


 ===

 I recently came across a number of Open Source Maturity Methodologies,
 which is worth being aware of, and possibly incorporating and/or
 referencing from OSGeo Incubation processes:
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open-source_software_assessment_methodologies








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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Incubator] New incubation procedure

[Bruce Bannerman]

We need to be careful when playing around with our 'Incubation Procedure'.

It causes considerable angst and disruption to both mentors and to the
relevant communities going through incubation when we keep trying to change
to rules.

From my opinion as a mentor, the current process while subjective in some
cases is still valid and effective in guiding a project to the ideals that
we as a community aspire to.

When a project graduates from incubation, it gains considerable credibility
as a viable open source spatial project. It is a badge of honour for the
project and something to aspire too. So why are we trying to dilute this?

While there are aspects that could improve, what is the rationale for
wanting to change the process (together with the inevitable disruption that
follows)?

If we are serious about changing the incubation rules, then a more formal
methodology such as those referred to by Cameron at [1] may be more
appropriate.

Now, who has the spare time to investigate and drive this forward, **if we
deem it appropriate**.?

Are there any volunteers?

Bruce

[1] http://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/incubator/2015-March/002644.html


===

I recently came across a number of Open Source Maturity Methodologies,
which is worth being aware of, and possibly incorporating and/or
referencing from OSGeo Incubation processes:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open-source_software_assessment_methodologies
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Fixing FOSS4G [SEC=UNOFFICIAL]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Cameron,

I just re-read this wiki page.

Well done on collating this information in such a concise and thoughtful manner!

Bruce


From: Cameron Shorter 
cameron.shor...@gmail.commailto:cameron.shor...@gmail.com
Date: Saturday, 20 September 2014 7:17
To: Discuss OSGeo discuss@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:discuss@lists.osgeo.org
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Fixing FOSS4G

Dan,
You might want to look over the lessons learned from 2012. 
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/FOSS4G_2012_Lessons_Learned
I respectfully disagree with Michael. I think that early support of the China 
FOSS4G could have steered the event to be a successful, although smaller event.

On 20/09/2014 5:47 am, Michael Gerlek wrote:
China would still have failed, but we would have known about it [and, 
hopefully, acted] sooner.

-mpg



On Fri, Sep 19, 2014 at 3:43 PM, Dan Ames 
dan.a...@byu.edumailto:dan.a...@byu.edu wrote:
Again from the sidelines... It would be an interesting exercise to 
conceptualize how having a single professional conference organizing company 
would have/have not made a difference with the failed voyage of FOSS4G to China 
in 2012. - Dan

**
Daniel P. Ames, Ph.D., P.E.
Associate Professor, Civil  Environmental Engineering
Brigham Young University, Provo, Utah, USA





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--
Cameron Shorter,
Software and Data Solutions Manager
LISAsoft
Suite 112, Jones Bay Wharf,
26 - 32 Pirrama Rd, Pyrmont NSW 2009

P +61 2 9009 5000,  W www.lisasoft.comhttp://www.lisasoft.com,  F +61 2 9009 
5099
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[OSGeo-Discuss] Fwd: Hacking OSGeo

[Bruce Bannerman]

IMO

Hi Jeff,

I don't believe that this public 'Mea Culpa' is warranted. You are a
respected member of the community and are entitled to a personal view.

I understood from what I read that your comments were personal. Perhaps
using an 'official OSGeo email address' might make it clear when the email
content is more formal in future.

I'm personally very glad that you chose to speak up as you are echoing the
disquiet that I and I'm sure many others are feeling with regards this
conversation.



@All,

We are at a turning point within our community, and this is no time for
rushing to a particular course of action.

I echo the comments of those such as Steve, Cameron and Jo who are asking
for a bit of respect for all view points and for time to reflect and
consider how we want to move forward as a community.

We have a robust community and can work through the issues if we remember
that others are entitled to their views.

I agree with Massimillo, Puneet and others that this discussion has become
so convoluted that we need to separate out the threads into managable
pieces to work through.



The LocationTech issue is really a surprise to me, particularly that the
conversation has been continuing in private within OSGeo circles for a
number of years. To be honest, the organisation was not even on my radar.
I'm personally not that interested in LocationTech that I want every second
OSGeo email that I read to be about it. Perhaps we can tone down the
advocacy?

I have read some vigorous comments from community members who I respect in
support of LocationTech. What I took out of these comments is that it is
hard trying to run a business that is trying to make money out of Open
Source and that people have already decided that this particular
organisation offers something to them.

Other business operators are tackling the problem in a different way and
are working within the OSGeo-Industry mailing list to discuss the issue in
a constructive manner. I'm seeing some very good leadership there from Dirk
and Peter.

I ran my own consultancy in the past for ~ten years and understand how
difficult entrepreneurial work can be. There were many times when I didn't
know where income to support my next weeks rent and meals was coming from.

We just need to remember in our discussions that OSGeo is more than just
developers, and business. We have a growing number of people from a range
of fields who are working with us, e.g. Government, Not for Profits,
Acadaemia and Research.

In my day job, I'm starting to see interest in a number of peer
organisations around the world to collaboratate within open source
communities to develop the functionality that we require. We may not have
funding to pay businesses to get work done, but we do often have
developers, testers etc. We are just very mindful at this stage that we are
not seen as trying to 'take over' the communities that we are interested in
collaborating with.


As to the comments on FOSS4G, this needs to be handled very carefully.

As a former member of the FOSS4G-2009 LOC, the work in organising such an
event is not as difficult as some are trying to make out. Particularly so
if you have a good team who collaborate and pull their own weight as we
did; you have LOC members who were on previous FOSS4G; and when you have a
good local professional conference organiser who understands your city and
culture with appropriate experience in International events to help you
with the day to day work.

Cameron initiated the FOSS4G 'Lessons Learned' wiki to ensure that
learnings are passed on to future LOC. I suggest making sure that it is
used and updated.

I'd encourage anyone interested in FOSS4G to 'give it a go'. You will find
it a very satisfying professional development exercise.


As the time pressure that people are expressing seems to be on the bid of
FOSS4G-2016, I suggest that we continue with our current processes and
request bids. I'd be happy to see LocationTech put in a bid. I'm also very
happy to see a potential bid from Switzerland for the 10th anniversary. Are
there any other potential bids out there?



Bruce






From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On
Behalf Of Jeff McKenna [jmcke...@gatewaygeomatics.com]

 Sent: Thursday, 18 September 2014 2:26 AM
 To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org
 Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Hacking OSGeo

 Hi Bart,

 Sort of off topic, the timing was good for me to get into my truck and
 drive 5 hours by myself this morning at 5am, to a meeting in cute small
 island province, Prince Edward Island
 (http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=17/46.25739/-63.13748).  In other
 words, I had lots of time to think.  I am happy to grab a wifi spot to
 respond now.

 I think my actions recently offended several leaders in our geo
 community, including Andrew, Daniel, Arnulf, yourself Bart, and likely
 others.  I did not mean this to happen.  I am sorry and embarrassed of
 my actions and words.

 I can see Bart and Daniel's 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Inquiry: Help please! [SEC=UNOFFICIAL]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Sid,

A search on the term photogrammetry may also help. This is a very specialised 
discipline.

You will find that some photogrammetric software already exists.

Bruce


From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On 
Behalf Of Pat Tressel [ptres...@myuw.net]
Sent: Saturday, 2 August 2014 4:34 PM
To: S.A. Mouti
Cc: OSGeo Discussions
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Inquiry: Help please!

Hi, Sid!

I would like to develop an algorithm that uses remote geographic sensing data 
to automatically identify, highlight, and measure rooftops and buildings 
surfaces and contours using  Geospatial data. My preference is to overlay the 
results on one of the existing  map providers such as Google Earth/maps or Bing 
.

 My aim is to get the following outputs from the proposed model:

 *   Accurately highlighted and identified rooftops on Google maps (using geo 
sensing data, elevation? and
 *   Property Address or GPS coordinate.
 *   Surface and square footage available for solar power generation including 
the position of the property(N-S or E-W). At the exact surface of the south 
facing portion of the roof.
 *   Integrate sun tool in google maps to calculate shading for each building.
 *   Total surface/square footage of the roof.

I would appreciate your guidance on the following:

 *   Any individual developers or companies active in this area who would be 
willing to undertake this challenge
 *   View on technical do-ability of the project…
 *   What free geospatial data is available/needed to build the model and who 
the providers are? (I understand that  US cleared higher resolution imagery for 
domestic )
 *   An idea about the overall cost  for such a model.

Best regards,

Sid

Just want to mention two things:

1) Building outlines are available for some locations in both commercial maps 
(Google and Bing, for instance).  In OpenStreetMap, if buildings have not been 
mapped for a specific area you're interested in, you might be able to get local 
mappers to do it.  (Of course, the building outlines obtained that way may not 
be accurate.  Many times, the building outline is simplified from the actual 
building as it's only needed to indicate, there is / was a building here, 
e.g. for rescue workers looking for survivors after a natural disaster.)

2) If you use satellite imagery (or possibly low-elevation imagery if you have 
accurate info on the camera path and orientation), then the shadows cast by 
buildings can be used to estimate their height.  A very brief web search turns 
up a fair number of papers on this -- just one example, with references to 
earlier work that may be more relevant:

http://www.asprs.org/a/publications/pers/98journal/january/1998_jan_35-44.pdf

-- Pat
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Using ArcGIS Desktop with PostGIS [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Many thanks Gavin.

We have the required licenses, so that will be OK.

From memory, ESRI's support is a few versions of Postgres and PostGIS behind 
the current releases.

Have you had any luck with using versions of Postgres and PostGIS higher than 
ESRI claim to support.

We're running ArcGIS 10.1 and the new Postgres / PostGIS environment that we're 
looking at is 9.3.4 with PostGIS 2.1.3.

We'll be running our own tests, but it would useful to have an idea of 
potential issues.



If anyone would like me to move this thread off Discuss, please let me know. 
However I suspect that it may be of interest to a number of sites.

Bruce



From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On 
Behalf Of Gavin Fleming [gavinjflem...@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, 11 July 2014 5:29 PM
To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Using ArcGIS Desktop with PostGIS  
[SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

Hi Bruce

I've done fairly  extensive research as this is a very common situation. The 
landscape is quite fluid though.

There are a few third party extensions out there but I haven't had much luck 
with them in a read-write production environment.

Native read support of PostGIS from ArcGIS desktop has been available for a few 
versions now. The clincher is write support. For that you need to pay up and as 
a minimum get ArcGIS Editor (now called Standard). ArcGIS ArcView (now called 
Basic) won't get you write access. And you can't get around it with WFS-T 
either.

So in a nutshell, to write to native PostGIS via a database connection or WFS-T 
you need either ArcGIS Standard ('Editor') or Enterprise ('ArcInfo') or ArcGIS 
Server (set up to use native PostGIS geometry).

Gavin

On 11/07/2014 06:56, Bruce Bannerman wrote:
Hi,

Does anyone have any experience using PostGIS as a vector spatial data source 
with ArcGIS Desktop as a client?

I’m particularly interested in our ArcGIS Desktop users being able to create, 
update and delete spatial data managed within a PostGIS environment, without 
the use of ArcSDE or similar middle wear.

Would you be interested in sharing any experiences that you’ve had from 
implementation to operational use?


We have a mixed spatial environment with both ArcGIS Desktop and open source 
Desktop GIS applications as client tools.

Provided that we can arrive at a good robust solution, I’d like to move our 
ArcGIS Desktop clients away from ArcSDE, and consolidate our vector spatial 
database environment on Postgres / PostGIS.

Bruce




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--
Gavin Fleming
t: 0218620670
w: 0218630660
c: 0845965680
f: 0866164820
Paarl
South Africa
18°59'19.6E 33°44'46.1S
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Using ArcGIS Desktop with PostGIS [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Andrew,

I admired the work that your former team was doing. It was a pity that 
sufficient time and resourcing was not allocated to see this potential work 
through to fruition.

People often under-estimate how much effort is required to sponsor an open 
source project, and allow sufficient time for a self-sustaining community to 
evolve.

In our case, we will not be able to add another database platform to our suite. 
We're actually reducing and trying to consolidate our technology base.

Therefore we would not be able to look at Ingres as a platform, even though it 
has the same roots as Postgres.

Bruce


From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On 
Behalf Of Andrew Ross [andrew.r...@eclipse.org]
Sent: Saturday, 12 July 2014 2:11 AM
To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Using ArcGIS Desktop with PostGIS  
[SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

Dear Bruce,

Not sure if this is interesting or not. In my previous role, my team  I worked 
on adding ArcGIS support for Ingres, which is also open source and similar to 
Postgres/PostGIS. I learned quite a bit during the process. I appreciated that 
Esri offers a very useful layer to plugin  extend ArcMap/ArcCatalog, etc. You 
can code in Python, .NET, or Java.

Despite being warned by many that we were crazy to even try to do this, after 
investing to grok Esri's architecture, we got it done in only a few months. The 
end result was pretty good... full read/write and most major features worked 
well. It didn't require ArcSDE.

This wasn't every single feature of course.  For example, we didn't do long 
transaction support as it wasn't that urgent for our customer at the time  was 
going to be a lot of work. From what I understand from the outside, the team 
has nudged it along over the years fixing up bugs and edge cases we didn't 
consider in the first release.

At the time, we took a brief look to understand the landscape and there seemed 
to be some fairly significant limitations in ArcGIS support for PostGIS. I'm 
not sure if that's changed since then as it has been a couple of years.

The team has disbanded since, but if there were interest in engaging any of 
them, I'd be happy to make introductions. I also know of companies that do work 
in this space.

Andrew

On 11/07/14 00:56, Bruce Bannerman wrote:
Hi,

Does anyone have any experience using PostGIS as a vector spatial data source 
with ArcGIS Desktop as a client?

I’m particularly interested in our ArcGIS Desktop users being able to create, 
update and delete spatial data managed within a PostGIS environment, without 
the use of ArcSDE or similar middle wear.

Would you be interested in sharing any experiences that you’ve had from 
implementation to operational use?


We have a mixed spatial environment with both ArcGIS Desktop and open source 
Desktop GIS applications as client tools.

Provided that we can arrive at a good robust solution, I’d like to move our 
ArcGIS Desktop clients away from ArcSDE, and consolidate our vector spatial 
database environment on Postgres / PostGIS.

Bruce


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[OSGeo-Discuss] Using ArcGIS Desktop with PostGIS [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi,

Does anyone have any experience using PostGIS as a vector spatial data source 
with ArcGIS Desktop as a client?

I’m particularly interested in our ArcGIS Desktop users being able to create, 
update and delete spatial data managed within a PostGIS environment, without 
the use of ArcSDE or similar middle wear.

Would you be interested in sharing any experiences that you’ve had from 
implementation to operational use?


We have a mixed spatial environment with both ArcGIS Desktop and open source 
Desktop GIS applications as client tools.

Provided that we can arrive at a good robust solution, I’d like to move our 
ArcGIS Desktop clients away from ArcSDE, and consolidate our vector spatial 
database environment on Postgres / PostGIS.

Bruce

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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Board] Proposed process for selecting OSGeo charter members [SEC=UNOFFICIAL]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Cameron,

I agree that on re-read the new wording covers this.

Bruce

From: Cameron Shorter 
cameron.shor...@gmail.commailto:cameron.shor...@gmail.com
Date: Friday, 4 July 2014 9:01 am
To: Bruce Bannerman b.banner...@bom.gov.aumailto:b.banner...@bom.gov.au
Cc: Discuss OSGeo discuss@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:discuss@lists.osgeo.org, 
bo...@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:bo...@lists.osgeo.org 
bo...@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:bo...@lists.osgeo.org
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Board] Proposed process for selecting OSGeo 
charter members [SEC=UNOFFICIAL]

Hi Bruce,
I agree that a nominating member should explain why a candidate is worth voting 
for (rather than a candidate promoting themselves). I think the words below 
address that. If you can think of a better way of expressing your intent, can 
you please suggest alternative wording.

On 3/07/2014 10:34 am, Bruce Bannerman wrote:
Cameron,

There is perhaps one other aspect of the process that you may wish to review.

This is the requirement for nominees to ‘beat their own chest’ saying how good 
they are.

I think that this step is not required. What needs to be said, should be said 
by the person who is doing the nomination.

There are also cultural issue to consider, where people do not feel comfortable 
doing this step.

We also discussed this last year on Discuss [1].

Bruce

[1] http://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/discuss/2013-July/012079.html



From: Cameron Shorter 
cameron.shor...@gmail.commailto:cameron.shor...@gmail.com
Date: Tuesday, 1 July 2014 8:40 pm
Cc: Discuss OSGeo discuss@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:discuss@lists.osgeo.org, 
bo...@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:bo...@lists.osgeo.org 
bo...@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:bo...@lists.osgeo.org
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Board] Proposed process for selecting OSGeo 
charter members

Thanks all for your comments. I've updated based on your feedback to:

1a. Charter member to nominate potential new charter member(s) (as before).

1b. A person who meets the Positive Attributes for Charter Members [1], may 
ask an charter member who can vouch for the person to nominate them.

2. Charter members then vote (in/out/abstain) nominated charter members. This 
will be different to prior years, as we previously voted in a fixed number of 
members for a larger selection pool. (eg vote in 20 people from a list of 30). 
For this year, I propose we have a Yes/No vote. Ie, if we have a list of 30 
candidates, we will ask all charter members to vote Yes or No against each 
candidate. Each candidate with more YES votes than NO votes as well as greater 
than 5% of charter members who voted will be included as new charter members.

3. Charter members would be guided to select candidates who fit the Positive 
Attributes for Charter Members [1]

4. There will be no limit to the number of new charter members who can be 
selected. This will require an update of 
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Membership_Process

[1] http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Membership_Process#Positive_Attributes

---
Some specific answers below:
On 30/06/2014 6:39 am, Alex Mandel wrote:

The only reservation I have is on the 50% Yes/No, but maybe I just need
a clarification.
I see plenty of people potentially voting Yes/No/Abstain(just not
marking a particular candidate).

Good suggestion. Text updated to move YES votes than NO votes.

On 30/06/2014 9:33 am, Angelos Tzotsos wrote:
Perhaps we should ask for a minimum of Yes votes on each candidate before 
acceptance. A fixed percentage of the Charter Members maybe?
Good suggestion. Added ..as well as 5% of charter members who voted.
So if there are 180 charter members, and say 100 vote, that would mean you 
would need 5 YES votes.

On 30/06/2014 11:51 am, Eli Adam wrote:

If the goal is to have an inclusive charter membership, then some of
these voting methods would potentially better accommodate all nominees
based on an evaluation of
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Membership_Process#Positive_Attributes.

Even brought up that most OSGeo projects work on some form of
consensus.  50%+ is nothing like consensus.  I would support requiring
much less opposition for approval.  Perhaps no more than 5-10 no
votes.  For me, to vote no I will need to know the person very well
and know that they lack all or most of these,
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Membership_Process#Positive_Attributes or I
will need to know that they actively think or behave counter to one or
more of those characteristics.

Angelos brought up the idea of a minimum level of support.  That could
be combined with a minimal level of opposition.

Good thoughts. I think there is a balance to be struck between being exclusive 
and inclusive, and I think it better to err on being more inclusive. Hopefully 
adding in ..as well as 5% of charter members who voted should address your 
concerns.

On 30/06/2014 8:34 pm, Steven Feldman wrote:
If we want to avoid establishing a self-sustaining oligarchy” then perhaps we 
need to consider ways of becoming a mass membership organisation rather than

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Board] Proposed process for selecting OSGeo charter members [SEC=UNOFFICIAL]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Cameron,

There is perhaps one other aspect of the process that you may wish to review.

This is the requirement for nominees to ‘beat their own chest’ saying how good 
they are.

I think that this step is not required. What needs to be said, should be said 
by the person who is doing the nomination.

There are also cultural issue to consider, where people do not feel comfortable 
doing this step.

We also discussed this last year on Discuss [1].

Bruce

[1] http://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/discuss/2013-July/012079.html



From: Cameron Shorter 
cameron.shor...@gmail.commailto:cameron.shor...@gmail.com
Date: Tuesday, 1 July 2014 8:40 pm
Cc: Discuss OSGeo discuss@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:discuss@lists.osgeo.org, 
bo...@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:bo...@lists.osgeo.org 
bo...@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:bo...@lists.osgeo.org
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Board] Proposed process for selecting OSGeo 
charter members

Thanks all for your comments. I've updated based on your feedback to:

1a. Charter member to nominate potential new charter member(s) (as before).

1b. A person who meets the Positive Attributes for Charter Members [1], may 
ask an charter member who can vouch for the person to nominate them.

2. Charter members then vote (in/out/abstain) nominated charter members. This 
will be different to prior years, as we previously voted in a fixed number of 
members for a larger selection pool. (eg vote in 20 people from a list of 30). 
For this year, I propose we have a Yes/No vote. Ie, if we have a list of 30 
candidates, we will ask all charter members to vote Yes or No against each 
candidate. Each candidate with more YES votes than NO votes as well as greater 
than 5% of charter members who voted will be included as new charter members.

3. Charter members would be guided to select candidates who fit the Positive 
Attributes for Charter Members [1]

4. There will be no limit to the number of new charter members who can be 
selected. This will require an update of 
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Membership_Process

[1] http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Membership_Process#Positive_Attributes

---
Some specific answers below:
On 30/06/2014 6:39 am, Alex Mandel wrote:

The only reservation I have is on the 50% Yes/No, but maybe I just need
a clarification.
I see plenty of people potentially voting Yes/No/Abstain(just not
marking a particular candidate).

Good suggestion. Text updated to move YES votes than NO votes.

On 30/06/2014 9:33 am, Angelos Tzotsos wrote:
Perhaps we should ask for a minimum of Yes votes on each candidate before 
acceptance. A fixed percentage of the Charter Members maybe?
Good suggestion. Added ..as well as 5% of charter members who voted.
So if there are 180 charter members, and say 100 vote, that would mean you 
would need 5 YES votes.

On 30/06/2014 11:51 am, Eli Adam wrote:

If the goal is to have an inclusive charter membership, then some of
these voting methods would potentially better accommodate all nominees
based on an evaluation of
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Membership_Process#Positive_Attributes.

Even brought up that most OSGeo projects work on some form of
consensus.  50%+ is nothing like consensus.  I would support requiring
much less opposition for approval.  Perhaps no more than 5-10 no
votes.  For me, to vote no I will need to know the person very well
and know that they lack all or most of these,
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Membership_Process#Positive_Attributes or I
will need to know that they actively think or behave counter to one or
more of those characteristics.

Angelos brought up the idea of a minimum level of support.  That could
be combined with a minimal level of opposition.

Good thoughts. I think there is a balance to be struck between being exclusive 
and inclusive, and I think it better to err on being more inclusive. Hopefully 
adding in ..as well as 5% of charter members who voted should address your 
concerns.

On 30/06/2014 8:34 pm, Steven Feldman wrote:
If we want to avoid establishing a self-sustaining oligarchy” then perhaps we 
need to consider ways of becoming a mass membership organisation rather than 
one governed by a self selecting elite group.
I don't think we need worry to much about establishing a self-sustaining 
oligarchy”. By setting the above criteria, I think that anyone who fits the 
Positive Attributes will now find it easy to become a charter member.

On 30/06/2014 8:34 pm, Steven Feldman wrote:

Should we consider separating the Charter Members who could continue to be 
acknowledged for their contributions to OSGeo (but maybe by the whole 
membership not just existing Charter Members) from the process of voting for 
the board? If we want to be open and inclusive we need to empower a larger 
group of contributors to vote for the people who set policy and manage our 
organisation. Perhaps it could be a requirement for board membership that 
candidates have already been voted as charter members by the wider membership.

We could go for something like the 

[OSGeo-Discuss] What is sponsorship?: was Re: Membership fee (was: Proposed process for selecting OSGeo charter members) [SEC=UNOFFICIAL]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Dirk,

I’ve had another think about this. There is a fundamental issue here that
needs to be discussed.

I’ll use the Government example below to try and explain my concern:

=
*G*overnments are happy to have such a movement as the Free and open
source software [2] movement, because they can avoid vendor lock-in,
gain control over their projects (read: become free again), and save a
lot of money. They should take this advantage seriously and sponsor open
source activities.
=


As someone who works within a Government organisation and who is an
advocate for the use of open source software, I feel that I can comment.


Your observations are valid, apart for 'saving lots of money', because
there is always a cost associated with any software, including open source.

I’ve had a a number of conversations over the last twelve months with a
number of my peers both within my organisation and within peer
organisations globally about how we can better work within selected open
source communities to help develop, maintain, test, document etc  software
that is of interest to us. We are particularly interested in extending
some software for specific requirements that we have.

We are very mindful that we don’t want to be seen as trying to take over a
project, or to take it in a direction that their PSC don’t want to go in.
Therefore there will need to be ongoing engagement to ensure that we act
as, and are also seen as being, team players within the relevant project.

I won’t discuss the actual types of development yet. That will be for a
future email.


Speaking generally, while we are often constrained on what dollars we have
available to spend on either sponsorship or procurement, we often have
developers, testers etc who could perhaps work on OS Project activities
that **meet our business requirements**.

This approach does create challenges for us, particularly for the need to
work within internal projects that are subject to internal governance
processes, timelines and deliverables. As well as the need to ensure that
new developments are available for the long term within OS projects.
However, I think that these challenges can be worked through.

One of the benefits for us in working with open source software,
particularly on some of the areas that we need to work on, is that the
investment that we make in *time and effort* is not locked away in a
‘black-box’ implementation, but can be re-used by other projects and
parties as required.




So the issue is that we can’t assume that organisations in the categories
that you’ve outlined below (and others as yet to be defined) are in a
position to contribute funding by way of sponsorship dollars. Some may be
able to, and some won’t.

In my opinion, contributing dollars by way of sponsorship places me in a
situation that I don’t want to be in. That position is one of being a
customer to OSGeo. I don’t want a customer/supplier relationship.

I would much rather be seen as a good contributing community member who is
working towards a common goal.

Therefore the sponsorship that I would like to contribute is expertise,
time and effort: not dollars.



Thank you for initiating this thread. We need more discussion on these
types of issues.


Bruce






On 2/07/2014 9:57 am, Bruce Bannerman b.banner...@bom.gov.au wrote:

Hi Dirk,

Well said.

However as someone who fits in all four categories that you¹ve defined, I
must point out that the sponsorship dollars may perhaps not be in these
categories either.

I find it easier to contribute time as **a member of the community** and
definitely do not want to be seen as merely a sponsor.

Bruce



On 2/07/2014 2:46 am, Dirk Frigne dirk.fri...@geosparc.com wrote:

Although I am not so active on the mailing list,  I am an OSGeo's
advocate, and I take the opportunity to promote OSGeo wherever I can.

I became an OSGeo member in 2007 because I was proud on what the
organisation did and I wanted to support it, with the scarce resources I
own.

One of the things I appreciate enormously is

- The organisation is open (as in open source)
- Becoming a member of the organisation is totally free (*yes* like in
free beer!)
- the organisation has a perfect DNA:
- members can
- act as *A* user
- act as *T*echnical skilled person (sofware developers,
industry, documentation)
- work at *G*overmental body
- member of the s*C*ientific world (academic world)

In the world of today *free* as in gratis, *free* as in *free* *beer*,
doing something for
somebody else is very rare (scarce) that it becomes very valuable.
Being a part of a community like OSGeo not only is *fun* but also gives
you a *good* feeling, and it is very motivating to work in a company or
organisation that supports OSGeo.

I may be naive, but for me personally this works out well, and having
that feeling is one of the important incentives to keep contributing to
the community. (And by the way, working with other members of the OSGeo

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Membership fee (was: Proposed process for selecting OSGeo charter members) [SEC=UNOFFICIAL]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Dirk,

Well said.

However as someone who fits in all four categories that you¹ve defined, I
must point out that the sponsorship dollars may perhaps not be in these
categories either.

I find it easier to contribute time as **a member of the community** and
definitely do not want to be seen as merely a sponsor.

Bruce



On 2/07/2014 2:46 am, Dirk Frigne dirk.fri...@geosparc.com wrote:

Although I am not so active on the mailing list,  I am an OSGeo's
advocate, and I take the opportunity to promote OSGeo wherever I can.

I became an OSGeo member in 2007 because I was proud on what the
organisation did and I wanted to support it, with the scarce resources I
own.

One of the things I appreciate enormously is

- The organisation is open (as in open source)
- Becoming a member of the organisation is totally free (*yes* like in
free beer!)
- the organisation has a perfect DNA:
- members can 
- act as *A* user
- act as *T*echnical skilled person (sofware developers,
industry, documentation)
- work at *G*overmental body
- member of the s*C*ientific world (academic world)

In the world of today *free* as in gratis, *free* as in *free* *beer*,
doing something for
somebody else is very rare (scarce) that it becomes very valuable.
Being a part of a community like OSGeo not only is *fun* but also gives
you a *good* feeling, and it is very motivating to work in a company or
organisation that supports OSGeo.

I may be naive, but for me personally this works out well, and having
that feeling is one of the important incentives to keep contributing to
the community. (And by the way, working with other members of the OSGeo
community didn't result in any bad experience until now)

Of course, an organisation needs money, To support some stuff (.svn or
whathever goal is worth supporting). But I think we should keep the
membership *free* (and not as in *free* beer!), because it is in my eyes
a very essential part of OSGeo:
 
Core principles are:

OSGeo should act as a low capital, volunteer focused organisation.
OSGeo should focus support on OSGeo communities and initiatives
which support themselves.  [1]

As in DNA, different chains have different roles.

*G*overnments are happy to have such a movement as the Free and open
source software [2] movement, because they can avoid vendor lock-in,
gain control over their projects (read: become free again), and save a
lot of money. They should take this advantage seriously and sponsor open
source activities.

the s*C*ientific world is happy to use open source solutions, because
they can study the tools themselves and focus on research, not being
bothered of the licenses they are using.
They also should take this advantage seriously and donate scientific
relevant material they don't want to exploit immediately to the community.

*A*ny user should be free (*not* as in free beer) to use and experiment
with the results of what the community is producing. The community
should welcome *A*ny user and help him to find his way, so he can take
his responsibility and earn respect for what he is doing.

And last but not least: the *T*echnically skilled persons are the heart
of the community. Being able to create great teamwork and donate back to
the community. Also they should take their responsibility and earn the
respect they deserve.

But where is the money we need to operate the organisation?

Personally, I don't think it are the users nor the community members who
should take care of that. Because the belonging to the community should
remain a *free* right, where the value comes from respect and the
intense feeling of giving something without expecting something back.

The strange thing is that many of the members are also professional
involved into OSGeo (acting as A T G or C).
So I suggest it should not be the (community) members who should pay for
the support, but these professional actors.
And they (the professional actors) should become a member (in their role
of incorporation) to support it. But sponsored membership should not
give rights to vote, or whatsoever. The only thing you gain is that you,
as a professional incorporation, are happy with an organisation as
OSGeo, fighting for your rights to be able to use *free* software.  And
the sponsors should trust and believe that a low capital, volunteer
focused organisation will do that for them, as they do it already today.

The sponsoring should not be an obligation either, but should be the
common responsibility of the companies sponsoring the FOSS4G events today.

my 2c

[1] http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Board_of_Directors#Board_Priorities
[2] http://www.fsf.org/about/what-is-free-software

Dirk
On 24-06-14 15:12, Even Rouault wrote:
 Hi,

 Interesting topic that raises quite a few questions.

 I think that all people who have commented in that thread have not
necessarily
 agreed if membership fees would be something in addition to the
nomination and
 election processs, or if it would 

[OSGeo-Discuss] Fwd: FW: Possible CS-W Portal Opportunity

[Bruce Bannerman]

Paul,

I noted your last paragraph below, which does ring alarm bells for me.

What is the intent of this approach? Is it:

   - To potentially launch a piece of software as an open source project
   that DHS ST will sponsor and support through the incubation process until
   the project becomes self sustaining; or


   - To declare some software that DHS ST has developed as open source
   with a view for OSGeo, or some other party, to pick it up, sponsor and
   support it through the incubation process, with DHS ST hoping to get the
   software maintained by others with little or no involvement by DHS ST.

I'm unclear of the intent behind the approach from your email.


I suspect that you would receive a more favourable response if it was the
first option above. You may even find that an existing project that works
in this space may pick up the software if it is appropriate for their long
term road map.


Bruce



Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Possible CS-W Portal Opportunity

snip

There may be an opportunity to completely open source the system, which
would require some additional development to fully support the CS-W
interface.  Based upon the responses I've received so far (thanks again),
it seems like there may be some interest, but I think DHS ST may need a
stronger expression of interest from OSGeo to move forward. If there's
interest, I could try to schedule a webex meeting to show the system.

/snip
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[OSGeo-Discuss] FW: [Meteo.DWG] Interested in Governing Earth Science Data Communities? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

fyi

From: Ted Habermann thaberm...@hdfgroup.orgmailto:thaberm...@hdfgroup.org
Date: Friday, 3 January 2014 9:28 am
To: 
meteo@lists.opengeospatial.orgmailto:meteo@lists.opengeospatial.org 
meteo@lists.opengeospatial.orgmailto:meteo@lists.opengeospatial.org,
 
hydro@lists.opengeospatial.orgmailto:hydro@lists.opengeospatial.org 
hydro@lists.opengeospatial.orgmailto:hydro@lists.opengeospatial.org,
 ess@lists.opengeospatial.orgmailto:ess@lists.opengeospatial.org 
ess@lists.opengeospatial.orgmailto:ess@lists.opengeospatial.org
Subject: [Meteo.DWG] Interested in Governing Earth Science Data Communities?

Hello all,

EarthCube (www.earthcube.orghttp://www.earthcube.org) is an NSF initiative 
with the goal of creating a community-driven data and knowledge management 
system for the geosciences. The EarthCube Test Governance Project is holding a 
series of stakeholder workshops to help formulate ideas and models for 
governing this community. Private sector and open-source software/tool 
developers will have an important role in this community. A workshop will be 
held in Boulder during the first week in March to get input from this group. 
Travel funding may be available from NSF.

Please let me know if you are interested in attending.

Thanks and Happy New Year,
Ted

[cid:302D-45F4-4250-BB1C-8AFBD78174C5]

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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Nomination for Mark Leslie [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

+1

Mark is a passionate advocate for OSGeo and FOSS4G.

He delivers a good course too ;-)

Bruce

From: Cameron Shorter 
cameron.shor...@gmail.commailto:cameron.shor...@gmail.com
Date: Thursday, 18 July 2013 10:52 AM
To: Jody Garnett jody.garn...@gmail.commailto:jody.garn...@gmail.com
Cc: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:discuss@lists.osgeo.org
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Nomination for Mark Leslie

I second Mark Leslie's Nomination.

Mark works along side me at LISAsoft. I can vouch for his depth of experience 
with regards to Geospatial Open Source (and OGC standards).

He was one of the major contributors to OSGeo-Live during the difficult early 
days when the project was starting out.

He played a major role coordinating FOSS4G 2009, in particular coordinating 
workshops.

He has run numerous training courses, in PostGIS and GeoServer in Australia.

And he has contributed to PostGIS, Geotools, UDig and GeoServer projects.

On 18/07/2013 9:57 AM, Jody Garnett wrote:
I would like to nominate Mark Leslie as Charter Member. Mark Leslie is a long 
time member of the open source community, participating in the GeoServer and 
PostGIS communities. In Australia Mark is active in supporting the OSGeo 
Aust-NZ chapter.

--
Jody Garnett




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--
Cameron Shorter
Software and Data Solutions Manager
Tel: +61 (0)2 8570 5050
Mob: +61 (0)419 142 254

Think Globally, Fix Locally
Geospatial  Data Solutions enhanced with Open Standards and Open Source
http://www.lisasoft.com
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[OSGeo-Discuss] Fwd: End the vote!

[Bruce Bannerman]

Adrian,

As a 'reject';-)I agree with your assessment.

It did cause me to reassess my level of contribution, but did not stop me
from working within the community.

I also did not like the requirement to 'bang my own drum'. That left me in
a very uncomfortable situation and I chose not to do so. What needed to be
said had already been outlined by my nominees.

Bruce



On 16/07/13 12:58 AM, Adrian Custer acus...@gmail.com wrote:

The former sucks since its only effect will now be to 'exclude' or
'reject' people who are passionate and respected enough to have been
nominated. In other words, up to now all has been positive, building
respect and support but, now, the only outcome of *voting* is rejection
and possibly discouragement of those same people. That seems silly.

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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FW: OSGeo Board Priorities

[Bruce Bannerman]

Cameron and 'The Board',

Thanks for putting these thoughts together.

This seems like a good strategic approach to take.

Bruce




*From: *Cameron Shorter cameron.shor...@gmail.com

*Date: *Mon, 4 Mar 2013 10:44:42 +1100
*To: *OSGeo Discussions,  OSGeo-Board List
*Subject: *[OSGeo-Discuss] OSGeo Board Priorities




A productive virtual meeting of the OSGeo Board 
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Board_Meeting_2013-02-26 resulted in general
consensus over OSGeo's priorities, which in turn should help the OSGeo
Board and OSGeo committees when guiding OSGeo into the future.

These principles are:


   - OSGeo should act as a low capital, volunteer focused organisation.
   - OSGeo should focus support on OSGeo communities and initiatives which
   support themselves.


Current priority areas include:


   - Global, regional and local FOSS4G related events, or events which
   include a FOSS4G stream.
   - Marketing OSGeo, which is currently focused around OSGeo-Live 
   http://live.osgeo.org/ .
   - Education, which is currently focused around the network of Open
   Source Geospatial Research and Education Laboratories 
   http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Edu_current_initiatives .
   - Local Chapters, as outreach initiatives are typically driven at the
   local level.


So lets expand on these:

*OSGeo as a low capital, volunteer focused organisation
*
Should OSGeo act as a high capital or low capital organisation? I.e.,
should OSGeo dedicate energy to collecting sponsorship and then passing out
these funds to worthy OSGeo causes.

While initially it seems attractive to have OSGeo woe sponsors, because we
would all love to have more money to throw at worthy OSGeo goals, the
reality is that chasing money is hard work. And someone who can chase OSGeo
sponsorship is likely conflicted with chasing sponsorship for their
particular workplace. So in practice, to be effective in chasing
sponsorship, OSGeo will probably need to hire someone specifically for the
role. OSGeo would then need to raise at least enough to cover wages, and
then quite a bit more if the sponsorship path is to create extra value.

This high capital path is how the Eclipse foundation is set up, and how
LocationTech propose to organise themselves. It is the path that OSGeo
started following when founded under the umbrella of Autodesk.

However, over the last seven years, OSGeo has slowly evolved toward a low
capital volunteer focused organisation. Our overheads are very low, which
means we waste very little of our volunteer labour and capital on the time
consuming task of chasing and managing money. Consequently, any money we do
receive (from conference windfalls or sponsorship) goes a long way - as it
doesn't get eaten up by high overheads. As discussed and agreed by the
board, this low capital path is something that is working very well for us,
and is the path we should continue to follow.

*Support initiatives which support themselves
*
With the thousands of great initiatives and opportunities that OSGeo could
get involved in, and limited budget, how should OSGeo set funding
priorities? Acknowledging that our volunteer community is blessed with many
talented individuals, our most effective way to tap into community
potential is to welcome individuals to help scratch their itch. Extending
on this, funding priorities should follow the *actions* of already
successful communities. (Note the difference between talk and action).
If a task or project is important enough, it will attract volunteers and/or
sponsors to make it happen. In practice, this will usually equate to
providing co-contributions rather than outright funding.

OSGeo's focus should be on initiatives which are of value to all or most
OSGeo projects, and to get best value for our limited budget, OSGeo should
target initiatives which have high value with minimal investment.

With that in mind our priorities should be:


   - Cover the costs of running OSGeo: Bank fees, insurance,
   infrastructure, hosting etc.
   - Support marketing and out reach activities, with a primary focus on
   our FOSS4G global conference, followed by regional and then local FOSS4G or
   related events.
   - Educational type activities are a high priority, but likely will be a
   minimal cost activity from OSGeo's perspective.
   - Other initiatives which fit our priorities, as suggested by
   membership.


Initiatives which probably wouldn't quality:


   - Sponsoring core development of a particular project. (Too expensive,
   and only supports one project)
   - OSGeo speaker travel expenses, or booth registration costs at a
   conference. (If conferences/local community feel this is important, they
   will either: 1. pay for the keynote, 2. make use of local talent, 3. waive
   fees for our non-profit, 4. find a local sponsor)


*Conferences and related events
*
Conferences are financially risky events. They need to be planned well in
advance, and you are never sure how many people will turn up, or whether
some global 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G North America - Blind voting [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Cameron,

Agreed.

As has been discussed in similar threads, and as we found for Sydney, it helps 
the LOC determine relative popularity of presentations for room allocation.

However, perhaps the actual final results  do not need to be published.

Presenters are either accepted or they're not, after deliberation by the LOC.

There is no need to establish a popularity contest.

Bruce


On 18/01/13 6:24 AM, Cameron Shorter cameron.shor...@gmail.com wrote:

On 17/01/13 03:58, David William Bitner wrote:
 Additionally following advice from other events as well as many
 members of our community, we are making the community review process
 for presentation submission author anonymous as a concern with how we
 have done this in the past has been the fear that many folks have of
 feeling publicly shamed with critique and voting of their proposals.
 These are only two small steps that we are taking to addressing an
 environment in the overall open source world that by the numbers is
 very unwelcome to women and other groups (while there have not been
 any overt issues that I know of as part of any FOSS4G, if you look at
 the percentage of female conference goers or developers in our
 community, we do have a long ways to go).

David,
If I understand you correctly, you are suggesting blind voting on
abstracts without knowing who will be presenting it?
I've heard that blind auditions has been successfully applied to
recruitment for orchestras, (which makes sense), however I don't think
it is applicable for Open Source communities.

You see, in selecting Open Source presentations, I think it is very
important to know who will be presenting, almost as important as the
presentation content itself. This is because the presenters who will
have the most insightful content, and who will attract the most audience
are usually those who have built up a large, very public reputation, (as
leaders of open source communities, usually with a long history of
insightful emails, blogs, and IRC trails).

I appreciate the importance of being welcoming to all communities. In
fact, I think that successful Open Source communities are naturally
welcoming as they have managed to attract developers and community.
However, I don't think that blind voting is right for us.

--
Cameron Shorter
Geospatial Solutions Manager
Tel: +61 (0)2 8570 5050
Mob: +61 (0)419 142 254

Think Globally, Fix Locally
Geospatial Solutions enhanced with Open Standards and Open Source
http://www.lisasoft.com

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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G presentation review process [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Agreed.

Well said Cameron, with the aside that there may be an interesting talk from a 
previously little known person.

I suggest leaving this to the discretion of the LOC and interested parties who 
subscribe to that year's FOSS4G mailing list.

A popularity campaign is not required or wanted.

Bruce


On 2/10/12 9:36 AM, Cameron Shorter cameron.shor...@gmail.com wrote:

I believe that for the general program, we should publish both the
presenter and abstract. Reasons:
1. I'm attracted to a talk by both the topic and the presenter. I'm more
likely to listen to a talk by someone who has a deep knowledge of a
topic, which typically equates to someone with a big reputation.

2. And I think it is appropriate that people who have committed much
time to the Open Source community, and hence have built up a big
reputation, are allowed to be recognised by the selection community.

3. It also makes good business sense to the FOSS4G conference, as big
names on the program will likely attract more delegates, and will likely
have the delegates going away satisfied that they have seen
presentations that they wanted to see.

4. The alternative of only seeing an abstract when voting is that anyone
who can write a good abstract can potentially present on a topic, even
if they don't have a deep insight in the topic of interest.


On 2/10/2012 4:59 AM, Schlagel, Joel D IWR wrote:
 I believe anonymous reviews has a place as a component of paper selection - 
 as a compliment to editorial review and professional judgement.FOSS4G 
 conference is the number one marketing opportunity for the OSGEO community.  
 We should make a deliberate effort to have a balance between inward focused 
 technical / developer oriented presentations and outward focused policy / 
 success / benefit type good news presentations.

 -joel


 
 From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] on 
 behalf of Paul Ramsey [pram...@opengeo.org]
 Sent: Monday, October 01, 2012 2:43 PM
 To: Volker Mische
 Cc: osgeo-discuss
 Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G presentation review process

 I'm in favour too. It has potential, let's see how an anonymous
 community process works in practice.

 P.

 On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 11:31 AM, Volker Mische volker.mis...@gmail.com 
 wrote:
 Hi all,

 On 10/01/2012 06:10 PM, Barry Rowlingson wrote:
 In our bid for FOSS4G 2013 Nottingham, we didn't precisely say how we
 intended to select presentations for the main track of the conference.
 Some discussion amongst the committee has been going on, and we think
 it necessary to informally poll the community to get a feel for what
 method is preferred.

 Previous FOSS4Gs have not used anonymous reviews (note: the Academic
 Track will be a double-blind review process, we are discussing the
 main conference presentations here), and have used a blend of
 committee reviews and community reviews. Note that even with a
 numerical ranking system its normally still necessary to do a manual
 step to get a balanced conference.

 The big change we could do would be to have anonymous community
 reviews. Proposals would be rated based on title and abstract only.
 The arguments for this include:

   * selection is on quality of proposal rather than bigness of name
   * rating procedure can prevent up-votes from whoever has the most
 followers on twitter
   * promotes inclusivity:
 http://2012.jsconf.eu/2012/09/17/beating-the-odds-how-we-got-25-percent-women-speakers.html

 and against arguments include:

   * some names are big draws, and it would be disappointing to not have
 someone because their abstract wasn't that exciting.
   * previous FOSS4Gs have used non-anonymous reviewing and that worked
 fine. Why change it?
   * it may be hard to distil an exciting talk into an abstract without
 losing the excitement.

 So, as this would be quite a change for FOSS4G, what do you - the
 OSGeo community at large - think? I do have a google poll nearly ready
 on this, but lets have a bit of a debate here and maybe it won't even
 be necessary.
 I think an anonymous selection process makes a lot of sense. I
 personally always hoped that people don't do a please up-vote me
 campaigns on blogs or Twitter, but it happened. It will still be
 possible as people could publish the titles of the abstract, but I hope
 this won't happen and everyone will play along nicely.

 One thing we have to keep in mind, that this conference is different
 from the JSConf.eu. The JSConf.eu is about the bleeding edge an what's
 hot in the fast changing JavaScript world. The audience are definitely
 non-beginners. At the FOSS4G the audience is way more wide-spread. It
 ranges from beginners to absolute pros. Hence there are also talks that
 are kind of the same every year. Things that come to my mind are my own
 talks, which are always about GeoCouch, or the State of ... talks.
 They have a place, but you'd know upfront the the State of GeoServer
 e.g. is 

[OSGeo-Discuss] NOAA's standards based Enterprise Spatial environment [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

In case you missed this:

http://www.opengeospatial.org/blog/1665


Bruce
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G 2012 Cancel Request

[Bruce Bannerman]

 @LOC FOSS4G-2012,

This is a courageous decision. Well done!

It would have been a very difficult decision to make after the time that
you have spent in organising this event.

I know from experience how critical a professional conference organiser is
in putting together a successful event of the calibre of recent FOSS4G. If
our professional organiser for FOSS4G-2009 had pulled out months before our
event, I suspect that we would have had to do what you have done.


@Jeff, well said.

Bruce Bannerman



-- Forwarded Message

*From: *Jeff McKenna jmcke...@gatewaygeomatics.com
*Date: *Tue, 10 Jul 2012 21:40:33 +1000
*To: *foss4g2012 foss4g2...@lreis.ac.cn, board bo...@lists.osgeo.org
*Cc: *tomgaoang tomgao...@gmail.com, chengcx chen...@lreis.ac.cn,
yanxunyx yanxu...@gmail.com, discuss discuss@lists.osgeo.org,
song.osgeo song.os...@gmail.com, chenrg che...@lreis.ac.cn
*Subject: *Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G 2012 Cancel Request


Hello Chen, Gao, Dr. Song, Venka-sensei, and all of the 2012 Committee,

This is unfortunate news, and I thank you for making such a difficult
decision now, before any travel plans are made by attendees.

Having been recently on behalf of OSGeo to Beijing (late 2010), I know
the passion for FOSS4G there is very strong; Dr. Song, Venka-sensei,
Gao, and Professor Yu (who unfortunately passed away recently) are
leaders in the community there.  I still get questions through a mailing
list that Venka-sensei setup there for local researchers examining FOSS.
 I have no doubt that this passion will continue in China and Asia.

I am honored to call such local leaders such as Dr.Song, Professor Yu
(may he rest in peace), and Venka-senei my close friends as well.

I hope personally that a smaller local FOSS4G event can be planned in
Beijing, and I would be sure to attend that wonderful event.

FOSS4G is indeed strong in Asia, I hope to relay this message in this
email from me.  Having traveled there so many times (more than 7 times
recently, now too many to keep track) I have seen this first hand.

Lastly, I know how much hard work it is to put together proposals for
FOSS4G, gather committee members, talk to the venue, etc. and I thank
you for all of the effort you put into that.  I believe this experience
will help you for planning another event in the future.

I hope to see you all in an Asia-region event soon, where we can
together continue to share this wonderful FOSS4G passion.

Thank you.  Your friend,

-jeff





On 12-07-10 6:25 AM, OSGeo China wrote:
 Dear OSGeo Board,

 With great regret, the FOSS4G Beijing Local Organizing Committee (LOC)
 has made the difficult decision of cancelling the event due to a lack of
 financial resources and the unexpected withdrawal of the Professional
 Conference Organizer.  Please officially approve our decision and advise
 any procedures we may need to follow to minimize the impact on the
 community.

 We also wrote letter for FOSS4G Beijing 2012 potential participants, we
 will publish this announcement on the foss4g2012 website and e-mail them
 after we get feedback from Board.

 **
 Dear Participants of FOSS4G Beijing 2012,

 With great regret, the FOSS4G Beijing Local Organizing Committee (LOC) has
 made the difficult decision of cancelling the event due to a lack of
 financial resources and the unexpected withdrawal of the Professional
 Conference Organizer. We sincerely apologize for any inconvenience this
has
 caused.

 For those interested in FOSS4G events, the LOC suggests consider:

  *  FOSS4G 2013, to be held in Nottingham, United Kingdom, 2013
  *  The Asian Geospatial Forum, September 2012, Hanoi, Vietnam, which will
 have an OSGeo session. http://www.asiageospatialforum.org/
 http://www.asiageospatialforum.org/

 Thank you for your patience and support!

 Best regards,

 FOSS4G Beijing 2012 LOC
 *

 Best regards,

 FOSS4G Beijing 2012 LOC



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[OSGeo-Discuss] Xlink 1.1 [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Please note Carl Reed's blog on OGC's policy and timeline to move to Xlink 1.1:

http://www.opengeospatial.org/blog/1597

Bruce Bannerman
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FW: [OSGeo-Discuss] chart/diagram of all osgeo projects and library connections [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

I put together a mind map of foss4g projects several years ago.

It hasn't been maintained for the last couple of years, but may be of use.

You can access it via:

http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/User:Bruce.bannerman

Bruce

-- Forwarded Message
From: Cameron Shorter
Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 17:22:14 +1000
To: Bruce Bannerman
Subject: Fwd: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] chart/diagram of all osgeo projects and 
library connections


  Bruce,
 I seem to remember that you created a map of osgeo-projects at one point?

  Original Message 
 Subject:  Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] chart/diagram of all osgeo projects and library 
connections
 Date:  Fri, 30 Mar 2012 08:34:29 +0200
 From:  Jorge Gaspar Sanz Salinas js...@osgeo.org mailto:js...@osgeo.org
 Reply-To:  OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org 
mailto:discuss@lists.osgeo.org
 To:  discuss@lists.osgeo.org


-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

El 30/03/12 07:37, maning sambale escribió:
 My websearch skills are failing right now.  I beleive it was mentioned
 here before of very big flow chart/diagram of all OSGEO projects.  I
 distinctly remember that almost all projects connects to GDAL.

 I need for a presentation about osgeo.


We uploaded the diagram Miguel Montesinos and me created for an article
some time ago. It's really outdated (2009!) so any improvement is more
than welcomed

https://svn.osgeo.org/osgeo/community/mindmaps/project-relationships-diagram/

I used Inkscape to edit the map so it's in SVG format.

Cheers
- --
Jorge Gaspar Sanz Salinas
http://es.osgeo.org
http://jorgesanz.net
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Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Talk on Copyright and Licensing for Geospatial Data [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Landon,

At [1] you'll find the report from the 'Inquiry into Improving Access to 
Victorian Public Sector Information and Data' from Australia's Victorian 
Parliament.

Their approach is to move towards a Creative Commons scheme. This allows the 
recognition of the data set creator's copyright.

There are a lot of relevant observations in the report.

CC is becoming the default approach from many governments around the world.

If you dig a little deeper at [1], you'll see the OSGeo AustNZ submission put 
together by myself and Cameron Shorter. We were even cited in the final report 
a few times.

Bruce

[1] http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/component/content/category/31





From: Landon Blake sunburned.surve...@gmail.com
Reply-To: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2012 04:06:02 +1100
To: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org
Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Talk on Copyright and Licensing for Geospatial Data

OSGeo Folks:

I'm giving a talk to CCVGPG (http://www.ccvgpg.org), our local GIS
user group this Friday. My talk will be about copyright and licensing
of geospatial data. I've found a good amount of information on
copyright and a bit on its application to GIS. However, I haven't
found much at all in the way of information about the licensing of
geospatial data. If you have some references I can investigate, I
would appreciate that.

Or, if you work for an organization that had to make decisions about
the licensing of geospatial data, and you'd be willing to discuss
things you considered as part of that decision process, please let me
know.

I'll post a link to a video of the talk if recording and editing goes OK.

Thanks.

Landon
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Mapping Tools for Real Estate Parcels [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Arnie,

Is this data not available via your local government authority that is 
responsible for property related data?

Bruce


On 7/01/12 3:37 AM, Arnie Shore shor...@gmail.com wrote:

Hello all.  We have a need for mapping a few hundred parcels, and I
expect that will mean walking the property boundaries with  GPS device
in order to pick up corner coordinates, for subsequent entry into a
database.

Nothing at all unusual, I'm sure.

I'm OK with taking the point data for presentation, but I wonder if
anyone here can speak (actually, type!) to experiences with the
initial point data capture step; devices, etc, with recommendations.

AS
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[OSGeo-Discuss] FW: [OGC Press Release] Take the 'Business Value of OGC Standards' Survey! [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

For those who haven't seen this.


If you have the time, please take this survey. The results will be very useful.

Bruce Bannerman



-- Forwarded Message
From: OGC Press Release annou...@opengeospatial.org
Reply-To: annou...@opengis.org, annou...@opengeospatial.org
Date: Wed, 2 Nov 2011 06:54:14 +1100
To: me...@lists.opengeospatial.org
Subject: [OGC Press Release] Take the 'Business Value of OGC Standards' Survey!


PRESS ANNOUNCEMENT FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
For information about this announcement, contact:

Contact:
Steven Ramage
Executive Director, Marketing and Communications
Open Geospatial Consortium (OGC)
http://www.opengeospatial.org/contact

---


*** Win an Apple iPad 2 Tablet, an Apple iPod touch or Bose AE2
headphones! ***

The survey is a joint effort by two academic researchers who are OGC
members and by the OGC Business Value Committee. Dr. Mu Xia at Santa
Clara University and Dr. Kexin Zhao at the University of North
Carolina at Charlotte developed the survey based on requirements from
the OGC Business Value Committee to support their studies on standards
effectiveness. The OGC Business Value Committee will use a summary of
the results to help the OGC better understand the value of the
OGC's open standards and improve its programs for geospatial
standards development, compliance testing and outreach.

We encourage everyone involved with geospatial or location data,
software and services to complete the survey. This is an opportunity
for technical and commercial colleagues to work together and highlight
their business needs and requirements around open standards.  OGC
membership is not a requirement, and you can participate even if the
software you use or provide does not implement OGC standards.

The survey takes about 10 to 15 minutes to complete. Individual
responses will be seen only by the researchers and OGC staff. The
researchers will summarize the data gathered from the survey, removing
all references to individual responses, and make the summary available
to OGC Business Value Committee members. An executive summary will be
provided to survey respondents.

The researchers have prepared two versions of the online survey. To
take the survey, if you are a technology user, visit
http://uncc.surveyshare.com/s/AQAIJDC. If you are a technology
provider (a vendor or a system integrator) or a consultant, visit
http://uncc.surveyshare.com/s/AQAIZBC. If you are not sure which
version to use, contact us. Please also forward this message to others
who might be interested in completing the survey.

The survey period is 1st November through 18th December 2011.
 Prizes will be awarded at random to three individuals who
complete the survey. The first person whose name is drawn after the
survey has closed will receive an iPad 2 (16GB, WiFi), the second will
receive an iPod Touch (8GB, 4th Generation) and the third will receive
a set of Bose AE2 headphones.

Thanks for your support!

The members of the OGC Business Value Committee
http://www.opengeospatial.org/projects/groups/businessvalue

The OGC is an international consortium of more than 430 companies,
government agencies, research organizations, and universities
participating in a consensus process to develop publicly available
geospatial standards. OGC Standards support interoperable solutions
that geo-enable the Web, wireless and location-based services, and
mainstream IT. OGC Standards empower technology developers to make
geospatial information and services useful with any application that
needs to be geospatially enabled. Visit the OGC website at
http://www.opengeospatial.org/contact.


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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Geomajas Geometry Project [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Pieter,

I agree with Jody.

I'm seeing increasing demand for clients that can utilise vector data 
constrained by an application schema.

Europe is probably most advanced in this work with Inspire.

In Australia we have a lot of work currently at research and at implementation 
stage trying to work with Simple Features 1 (aka Complex Features).

Some examples are WaterML 2.0 and GeoSciML. We will also be looking seriously 
at CSML 3.0.

Bruce Bannerman


On 13/07/11 10:52 PM, Jody Garnett jody.garn...@gmail.com wrote:


 It is the ISO 19107 specification; the same one that lurks behind GML Ready to 
leap out from under a surface and foist trans finite set on an unsuspecting 
world.  It is worth while getting the ISO 19107 document (ie pay for it) as it 
is much easier to read and follow then learning this information second hand.

We had a brief code sprint with deegree (compatible LGPL license) in order to 
see if multiple project would be interested in attacking the problem. GeoAPI 
was the first attempt (which has now been released last month), we have a 
couple of implementations in GeoTools (mostly ports or wrappers of JTS). 
deegree has an implementation that is closer to the GML constructs etc

If you are interested in pursuing this I recommend talking to Tisham who has 
been more active research. I am afraid I am interested in using a Geometry 
library and enthusiasm goes as far as setting one up with a good design so that 
it can be completed successfully.

--
Jody Garnett



On Wednesday, 13 July 2011 at 9:54 PM, Pieter De Graef wrote:


Hi Jody,

that's the GeoApi specification no?

At first we would be using it on the GWT client we where hoping to also include 
curves, as those can be directly drawn in SVG/VML. At a later stage we could 
switch the backend to make use of it as well.

Jody, you have been looking into creating you own Geometry library for some 
time now I understand. How would you approach this? I was hoping to start with 
something simple, that can grow at it's own pace. Important for me is that I 
can use the same objects on both client and server (meaning Java with some GWT 
restrictions).

I am also afraid to be re-inventing the wheel, but using 2 different libraries 
on client and server would be a shame when using GWT...


2011/7/13 Jody Garnett jody.garn...@gmail.com

 There is a third model; the ISO19107 model that deals with a few more things; 
it is however object oriented in nature

--
Jody Garnett



On Wednesday, 13 July 2011 at 6:36 PM, Pieter De Graef wrote:


Hi everyone,

for the Geomajas project, we are looking into separating the Geometry 
functionality into an independent project. In other words, I am talking about a 
Geometry project for the Web. This code would be written in Java for GWT and 
thus be available on Java backends as well as client environments (we intend to 
add a JavaScript wrapper around the GWT code).

Now the problem that I'm facing here, is which model to follow

On one hand there is the Simple Feature Specification which is clearly an 
Object Oriented model with the advantage that it is well known but is also more 
difficult to implement the JavaScript wrapper around.

On the other hand we could follow a service based model (more like SFS for SQL) 
which is easier to get up and running, easier to create a JavaScript wrapper 
for and easier to translate into web services.

As it's difficult for us to chose and as it's a pretty crucial decision for the 
future of the Geomajas project, I as wondering how you guys feel about this.

Kind regards,

Pieter De Graef
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] weave release [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Percy,

Fyi there is already a spatial intelligence framework on the market called 
Weave [1]. We've been using it with great effect recently.

I'll be interested in looking at your product as well.

Bruce Bannerman

[1] 
http://www.cohga.com/index.php?option=com_contentview=articleid=9Itemid=26




On 17/06/11 4:17 AM, percy per...@pdx.edu wrote:

I'm happy to announce that a new open source interactive data
visualization tool for the web is available. It's called Weave, and is
currently in beta. It requires a java servlet engine on the server, and
flash in the client.

I am using it to serve up data for the Portland region, as I've been
lucky enough to participate in the pre-beta testing. What's really cool
is the interactivity between the graphs, data tables, legend and map.
It's all linked up. Plus time animations for map data!

Other regional indicator projects are also using it, and we anticipate
a big rollout in the Fall.
Since it's beta, don't expect a lot of support yet...
Cheers,
Percy

--
David Percy
Geospatial Data Manager
Geology Department
Institute for Metropolitan Studies
Portland State University
http://gisgeek.pdx.edu
503-725-3373

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[OSGeo-Discuss] Re: [Meteo.DWG] multi-lingual WMS-legends [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Fyi,

Thanks Jeff,

Bruce


On 28/05/11 12:06 AM, Jeff de La Beaujardiere 
jeff.delabeaujardi...@noaa.gov wrote:

There is already an HTTP mechanism for language negotiation: the
Accept-Language header described at
http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec14.html#sec14.4 and
elsewhere.
OGC and OSGeo should not invent another mechanism for this.

Regards,
Jeff DLB
--

Jeff de La Beaujardière, PhD
NOAA Data Management Architect
NESDIS/OSD/TPIO





On 2011-05-24 18:14, Bruce Bannerman wrote:
 An issue from OSGeo-Discuss that may be of relevance here as well.

 Do we have a proposed way of handling this?

 Bruce



 -- Forwarded Message

 *From: *Steven M. Ottens ste...@minst.net
 *Reply-To: *OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org
 *Date: *Tue, 24 May 2011 19:51:44 +1000
 *To: *OSGeo Discussions Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org
 *Subject: *[OSGeo-Discuss] multi-lingual WMS-legends


  Hi all,

 I'm currently building a multi-lingual Web-GIS application. One of the
 requirements is that the legends of the maps are multi-lingual.
 E.g. if
 the chosen language is English, the legend will say 'forest', whereas
 when the chosen language is Dutch it will say 'bos'. So no need to
 have
 all the languages in one image, using something like lang=en is
 fine by me.

 I've done a quick look in the mapserver documentation but it doesn't
 appear to support lang for generating legends. Nor does the WMS 1.3.0
 specification for that matter.

 Has anyone tried to do such a thing?

 regards,
 Steven

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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Fedora Geo/GIS Spin [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Do we really need two projects doing this work?

To my perhaps naive thinking, wouldn't the results of both projects be 
essentially the same?

Bruce


On 18/11/10 6:36 AM, Cameron Shorter cameron.shor...@gmail.com wrote:

Hi Viji,
This sounds very interesting.

I suggest touch base with Mathieu from the Enterprise Linux packaging
efforts, who are packaging for redhat. I assume that between your two
projects there will be much that you can share.
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Enterprise_Linux_GIS

Also,
I've involved in the OSGeo-Live packaging effort, which has packaged 42
of the best geospatial open source applications on top of Ubuntu,
including all the OSGeo incubated projects.
Of particular interest would be our shell install scripts which you
should be able to copy in order to create your rpm installers, and also
the documentation which projects are creating for us which you will
likely be interested in copying too.
http://live.osgeo.org (for docs)
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Live_GIS_Disc (our main wiki)
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Live_GIS_Add_Project (provides links to our
build scripts)

Good luck, I'm interested to hear how things go.

On 17/11/10 21:05, Viji V Nair wrote:
 Hi,

 I am a Fedora project contributor and have been working on Linux for
 the last 10+ years, specifically on GIS projects for the last 4+
 years.

 We are adding more GIS application to fedora. If everything goes fine,
 there will a GIS/Geo spin for Fedora 15. Please have a look at:

 http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Geo_Spin
 http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/GIS

 The following new packages have been pushed for Fedora 13/14 and
 rawhide (F15), currently under testing.

 pgRouting (Provides routing functionality to PostGIS/PostgreSQL)
 tilecache (A web map tile caching system)

 To test:
   yum --enablerepo=updates-testing install python-tilecache
   yum --enablerepo=updates-testing install pgRouting

 If you are interested in becoming a contributor, we are very happy.
 Please feel free to contact me if you have any queries.

 Thanks
 Viji Nair
 https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Viji_V_Nair
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Charter member candidates, pls step forward! [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Michael,

I don't like beating my own drum...

I'll let my actions stand on their merits.

We are indeed fortunate to have such a wealth of talent in our community, as 
can be seen by the nominees.

Bruce


On 5/11/10 3:46 AM, Michael P. Gerlek m...@lizardtech.com wrote:

Those of you who've been nominated, feel free to announce yourselves with a few 
immodestly chosen lines about why we should vote for you!

There are a lot of seemingly good candidates, but not enough votes to go 
around...

-mpg


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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: git like for geodata management [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Ragi,

I agree. I think that we have a way to go yet to have something comparable to 
the ArcSDE / ArcGIS Multi-versioning and version conflict detection 
functionality.

The advantage that the ArcSDE solution has is that edits are made directly 
within the database. This works well within an Enterprise environment as 
described by Fabio earlier in this thread.

I may be wrong, but I think that git works on files, but I haven't used it 
myself. Can git detect changes to the spatial representation of a feature 
within a binary file?

Also, speaking as someone who implemented an ArcSDE/ArcGIS Multi-versioned edit 
scenario several years ago, the ESRI solution is far from perfect. It imposes 
very strict environment management on the system managers, e.g.:


 *   All versions of the software used (client and server) must be at precisely 
the same version, service pack and patch;
 *   The environment can only use software that implements the ArcObjects 
environment (from experience, this rules out the use of the ArcSDE Java and C 
API's);
 *   Editors must be well trained and knowledgeable in using both ArcGIS and 
Multi-versioned processes;
 *   The Organisation needs to think through their maintenance processes to get 
best advantage of the functionality; and
 *   It doesn't remove the need for data maintenance people to talk to each 
other about work that is going on, as the software cannot resolve all 
conflicts. For example, if two editors make changes to the spatial 
representation of a feature, which one is correct? The software will detect the 
conflict, but the editors (or their managers) will need to resolve the issue of 
which version of the feature's spatial representation is correct.


Bruce


On 24/09/10 4:05 AM, Ragi Burhum r...@burhum.com wrote:

Hi Noli,

thanks for the link. That is definitely a step in the right direction, but it 
is hardly comparable to git ArcSDE versioning at that.

The article and sample code you describe above generates hashes for all rows 
and tables in the db and compares them to the target db. So 1 million rows in a 
db, regardless if the two dbs are identical, would cause 1 million hashes to go 
over the wire. Every single time you ask to sync you pay the price.

Git and ArcSDE keep track of changesets, and when it is time to synchronize, 
they exchange that changeset and apply it. One insert? That is all that needs 
to be sent.

Another issue is that there is nothing about conflict resolution there (what 
happens when you delete one row in one db and modify it in another one?). There 
is also the problem of allowing multiple versions of the data in the same db 
(Like having multiple heads).

Regardless, thank you for the link,

- Ragi


Date: Thu, 23 Sep 2010 13:22:17 +1000
From: Noli Sicad nsi...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: git like for geodata management
To: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org
Message-ID:
aanlkti=3anc4baand4hk9uuzfsasxn-8ybpnkyong...@mail.gmail.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

PostgreSQL Synchronization Tool  --- psync [1]

 The article introduces a method of synchronizing two PostgreSQL
databases. Although, this seems to be an easy task, no product (slony,
londiste, ...) really satisfied the needs within the maps.bremen.de 
http://maps.bremen.de  http://maps.bremen.de
project. Either they have special prerequsits that didn't apply for
our problem or they didn't support synchronizing of large objects.

Large objects are used to store tiles of a street/aerial map within
PostgreSQL. My GIS-server queries the database and gets the tiles out.
By using this construction we are getting a flexible infrastructure
for updating and maintaining different versions of the maps.

Everything was working fine until the service needs to be spread over
three servers. How can we easily synchronize the databases? I really
found no really working solution that is clean and easy to use.  

[1]http://www.codeproject.com/KB/database/psync.aspx 
http://www.codeproject.com/KB/database/psync.aspx


Noli

On 9/23/10, Ragi Burhum r...@burhum.com wrote:
Are you looking for an alternative to (1)ESRI's versioning, (2)ESRI's
disconnected editing, or a mix of both (3)git like? the scenario that you
described first was more like (2), but this one fits (1).

I would love to see something like (3), but truth of the matter, AFAIK,
there is nothing like that implemented for geo (yet).

On Sep 22, 2010, at 9:00 AM, discuss-requ...@lists.osgeo.org wrote:

On Wed, 2010-09-22 at 12:10 +0800, maning sambale wrote:
Any real world cases for this?

Imagine the following scenario:

* 50 ~ 70 digitizers
* 5 QA
* 1 Manager

Each QA has 10 digitizers assigned. After all the data is validated, the
manager merges it and generates the geodb.

All users work against the same DB, most of them linked. This causes
disconnections, duplicated data, and lots of random errors.

Also, they can't be forced to work on different DB's because they are
all working on the 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: Staistical analysis support needed [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Mayank,

You may wish to implement this functionality via an OGC Web Processing Service.

That way, if your technology requirements change in the future, you can limit 
the impact of the change.

Bruce



On 14/09/10 1:40 AM, Alex Mandel tech_...@wildintellect.com wrote:

On 09/13/2010 06:45 AM, mayank_agarwal wrote:

 Hello Christopher,
 Sorry for that, I didnt mean to be so harsh on GRASS, but as R can be
 bridged with JAVA using JRI library, that's why I prefer R, and then it is
 simpler in using, and I agree that both will have there pros and cons, no
 doubt.
 Never the less thanks for helping me so much and iI am sorry if I hurt you.

Note you can also implement R code inside of Postgres.
http://www.bostongis.com/PrinterFriendly.aspx?content_name=postgresql_plr_tut01

Enjoy,
Alex
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[OSGeo-Discuss] EU Guide on procurement of open source revised [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

fyi:

For those who keep tabs on these issues:

http://www.osor.eu/news/eu-guide-on-procurement-of-open-source-revised

Bruce 

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FW: [OSGeo-Discuss] Automatic-Metadata Catalogueing [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Fyi,

Ben Searle from Australia's OSDM, asked me to forward this to the list.

Bruce


 

 -Original Message-
 From: Ben.Searle
 Sent: Thursday, 26 August 2010 10:38 AM
 To: Bruce Bannerman; discuss@lists.osgeo.org
 Subject: RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Automatic-Metadata Catalogueing 
 [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
 
 Bruce and Others,
  
 Thank you for providing this information to Timmie.
  
 As an update on some of your comments, OSDM is undertaking a 
 couple of related activities that may also be of interest.
  
 We are currently in the process of re-building ASDD using 
 GeoNetwork.  This will enable a greater range of 
 functionality including establishing direct access to data, 
 rather than just the metadata record, provision of a 
 catalogue of services and a significantly improved user 
 interface (the Interface is part of a phase two activity).  
 We are hoping to have the GeoNetwork version up in the next 
 month or so.
  
 Secondly, we are in the process of re-developing the National 
 Gazetteer and will be making this available at no cost via a 
 new interface that will support both human and web service 
 interactions.  We are looking at roughly 20 weeks to have 
 this completed.  It is also likely that there will be a 
 single interface to the gazetteer and the ASDD.
  
 Finally, we have some ANU software engineering students 
 working on an ANZMet Lite replacement (for various reasons we 
 are not able to make ANZMet Lite open source and also its 
 architecture is such that it is very difficult to add new 
 profiles or other metadata capabilities such as Dublin Core.
  
 The student project is focussing on similar capabilities to 
 ANZMet Lite but with the ability to 'easily' add new 
 profiles.  A level of auto-configuration of entry screens 
 based on the schema provided is part of this.  While their 
 project will not provide a production ready capability, we 
 are aiming to employ one of the students to take it to a 
 production ready application.  I am anticipating this to be 
 available early in the new year.
  
 I hope this additional information is of interest.
 
 Regards 
   
 Ben Searle
 General Manager,
 Australian Government Office of Spatial Data Management 
 
 
   -Original Message-
   From: Bruce Bannerman [mailto:b.banner...@bom.gov.au] 
   Sent: Thursday, 26 August 2010 9:55
   To: OSGeo Discussions
   Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Automatic-Metadata 
 Catalogueing [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
   
   
   Timmie,
   
   The Australian Government's Office of Spatial Data 
 Management (OSDM) has been coordinating a few resources 
 relating to Metadata that you may find of use.
   
   They are aimed at the ANZLIC Profile of ISO 19115 / 
 19139, however they are also relevant to other users of the 
 standards as well.
   
   (fyi, ANZLIC is Australia and New Zealand's SDI Governance body.
   
   Also , essentially there is minimal difference between 
 the ANZLIC Profile and the default ISO standard).
   
   
   Items of interest:
   
   [1] OSDM Metadata entry point.
   
   [2] Metadata resources page.
   
   [3] What we're planning with GeoNetwork.
   
   [4] An introduction to using ISO 19115. In particular, 
 I'd recommend checking out
the document 'ANZLIC Metadata Profile Guidelines'. 
 It gives a good overview
of why we need Metadata.
   
   [5] The ANZMet Toolkit.
   
   [6] ANZMet Lite: A stand alone Metadata Entry tool that 
 generates ISO 19139 XML records 
 that can be imported into GeoNetwork. While I do 
 not consider it an appropriate Enterprise
grade tool, it does provide an interesting 
 'Wizard' type user interface to guide people
   through the entry of their Spatial Metadata. The 
 Australian Government retains the
   IP to this product. If there is sufficient 
 interest, I understand that OSDM may be willing
   to release the source code under an appropriate 
 Open Source license. (It is Windows
   based and I think uses MS Access).
   
   [7] A page containing presentations describing and 
 showing the ANZMet Lite user interface.
   
   
   Congratulations to OSDM for putting this excellent 
 resource together.
   
   
   And before we get too complacent, consideration should 
 go to Rob Atkinson's and Rob Woodcock's (Australia's CSIRO) 
 vision of future Spatial Metadata, where metadata is stored 
 and exchanged as part of the data (and data model), ideally 
 via OGC GML Community Schema / Profiles.
   
   
   Bruce Bannerman
   
   (apologies Markus, I won't have time in the next few 
 weeks to add this to the wiki...)
   
   
   
   [1] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/default.aspx
   
   [2] 
 http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/ANZLIC+metadata+resources/default.aspx
   
   [3] http

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Automatic-Metadata Catalogueing [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Timmie,

The Australian Government's Office of Spatial Data Management (OSDM) has been 
coordinating a few resources relating to Metadata that you may find of use.

They are aimed at the ANZLIC Profile of ISO 19115 / 19139, however they are 
also relevant to other users of the standards as well.

(fyi, ANZLIC is Australia and New Zealand's SDI Governance body.

Also , essentially there is minimal difference between the ANZLIC Profile and 
the default ISO standard).


Items of interest:

[1] OSDM Metadata entry point.

[2] Metadata resources page.

[3] What we're planning with GeoNetwork.

[4] An introduction to using ISO 19115. In particular, I'd recommend checking 
out
 the document 'ANZLIC Metadata Profile Guidelines'. It gives a good overview
 of why we need Metadata.

[5] The ANZMet Toolkit.

[6] ANZMet Lite: A stand alone Metadata Entry tool that generates ISO 19139 XML 
records
  that can be imported into GeoNetwork. While I do not consider it an 
appropriate Enterprise
 grade tool, it does provide an interesting 'Wizard' type user interface to 
guide people
through the entry of their Spatial Metadata. The Australian Government 
retains the
IP to this product. If there is sufficient interest, I understand that OSDM 
may be willing
to release the source code under an appropriate Open Source license. (It is 
Windows
based and I think uses MS Access).

[7] A page containing presentations describing and showing the ANZMet Lite user 
interface.


Congratulations to OSDM for putting this excellent resource together.


And before we get too complacent, consideration should go to Rob Atkinson's and 
Rob Woodcock's (Australia's CSIRO) vision of future Spatial Metadata, where 
metadata is stored and exchanged as part of the data (and data model), ideally 
via OGC GML Community Schema / Profiles.


Bruce Bannerman

(apologies Markus, I won't have time in the next few weeks to add this to the 
wiki...)



[1] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/default.aspx

[2] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/ANZLIC+metadata+resources/default.aspx

[3] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/GeoNetwork/default.aspx

[4] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/ANZLIC+Metadata+Profile/default.aspx

[5] 
http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/ANZLIC+metadata+resources/ANZMet+Toolkit+%28final+draft+-+07.2009%29/default.aspx

[6] 
http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/ANZLIC+metadata+resources/ANZMet+Toolkit+(final+draft+-+07.2009)/ANZMetLiteSetup-1.01.zip/?id=959

[7] 
http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/ANZLIC+metadata+resources/ANZMet+Toolkit+(final+draft+-+07.2009)/06_1QuickStartIntroToANZMetLite.pdf/?id=999



On 26/08/10 3:41 AM, Markus Neteler nete...@osgeo.org wrote:

On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 6:40 PM, Timmie timmichel...@gmx-topmail.de wrote:
 Hello,
 I have piled up quite some data for a current project.

 In order to keep track of the data I would like to use some automatic indexing
 to create a data catalog.

Important issue! Time ago I put together this Wiki page:
 http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Metadata_software

Please add all new findings to it,

Markus
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[OSGeo-Discuss] Open Source OGC Sensor Web Enablement implementations [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

I'm trying to get an understanding of which FOSS4G projects are currently
(or are planning to) support OGC Observations and Measurements as well as
other OGC Sensor Web Enablement related standards.

We see this as a strategic direction that we'll need to explore.

Can you please reply to the list with urls to your documentation?

Many thanks in advance.

Bruce Bannerman

 

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[OSGeo-Discuss] Install gvSIG 1.10 on Mac? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Can someone point me in the right direction here please?

I'd like to install gvSIG 1.10 under Mac OSX 10.6.

From doco at OSGeo project listing and at gvSIG site, the project appears to
support Macs.

At the downloads page [1], I only see options for Windows and Linux.

I'm assuming that the Linux install will also work for Macs. Is this the
case?

Bruce


[1] http://www.gvsig.org/web/projects/gvsig-desktop/official/gvsig-1.10

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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Display of Multibeam data in open source gis [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

In addition to Grass, there are several image processing apps that may be of 
assistance:

ossim: http://www.osgeo.org/ossim

mbsystem: http://www.mbari.org/data/mbsystem/

rat: http://radartools.berlios.de/

Bruce


On 18/07/10 7:15 AM, Markus Neteler nete...@osgeo.org wrote:

On Sat, Jul 17, 2010 at 2:30 AM,  cruise...@comcast.net wrote:
 am in a quandry,

 have dense/large multibeam files i wish to display i a GIS for various
 purposes, essentially XYZ files, in DD WGS84 coordinates, ASCII
 tab-delimited or Mapinfo mid-mif formats, up to 10-million points plus in a
 datset.
 1. have tried GVsig and quantumGIS, but neither seems to like the ascii
 tab-delimited format.
 2. Quantum does not like the Mid-mif files i have, and it appears GVsig does
 not take the format

 Everything open-source GIS seems to want CSV or shapefiles.

Find here a dedicated Wiki page for the GRASS software:
http://grass.osgeo.org/wiki/Import_XYZ

GRASS 6.4+ can meanwhile deal with extremely large data sets.

Markus
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[OSGeo-Discuss] Commercial Support for OSGeo / FOSS4G applications [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

I need to respond quickly to an international / intergovernmental group,
where I'd like to cite examples of:

- Proprietary companies using FOSS4G software (e.g. ESRI using GDAL);

- Examples of sizable organisations that provide support for FOSS4G
applications, development and customisation.

- studies showing the take up of FOSS4G within Government organisations.

I'd appreciate responses by (today +4hrs of email date/time) 13 July 2010 at
02:30:00 UTC time [1].

Many thanks,

Bruce


[1] 
http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?day=13month=7year=201
0hour=2min=30sec=0p1=0 

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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] How to make a map on a CD [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Perhaps use GeoPDF [1] as the destination format on the CD?

Bruce

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GeoPDF



On 1/07/10 2:53 AM, Landon Blake lbl...@ksninc.com wrote:

Leith,

I believe what you are proposing may not be as simple as it sounds.

You might be able to create some type of live CD that they use to demo Linux 
distributions, but otherwise your map viewing software needs to be installed on 
the target computer.

There are a few good open source desktop GIS programs that can display 
shapefiles. I'd promote OpenJUMP, but QGis is another program I hear really 
good things about. MapWindow also runs as a stand alone desktop program, not 
just a viewer.


Landon
Office Phone Number: (209) 946-0268
Cell Phone Number: (209) 992-0658





From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] 
On Behalf Of Leith Bade
Sent: Monday, June 28, 2010 10:09 PM
To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org
Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] How to make a map on a CD

Hi,



I am new to GIS.



I would like to make a vector map that can be burned onto a CD then viewed just 
by running a program on it which copies the map data and a simple viewer. The 
dataset is very large (all of New Zealand) so the viewer needs to be effcient, 
and I have all the data in shapefiles.



What would be the best way to do this?



I see that MapWindow lets you build a custom viewer application around its map 
viewer, but it would only work on Windows.

Another idea I have is to make some sort of portable web server that runs 
GeoServer or MapServer.



Otherwise I could start developing my own custom map viewer that uses 
OpenGL/Direct3D/Direct2D or something to make the render fast with smooth 
scrolling etc.

This would allow me to develop a data format that is faster for rendering than 
shapefiles.



Similar commercial products are 
http://www.maptoaster.com/maptoaster-topo-nz/topographical.html or 
http://memory-map.com.au/products/maps/topo-nz-std.html


Thanks,
Leith Bade
le...@leithalweapon.geek.nz



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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] displaying complex GML in web-based enviroment ? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

CSIRO have a portal [1] that can consume WFS 3.1.1 including Complex Features 
as well as WMS.

This was created as part of their GeoSciML collaborative work to consume and 
display data from Australian State Geoscience organisations.

The work was created by Rob Woodcock's Auscope team.

I'm not sure if it has been released under an Open Source license, though much 
of their work has been.

Andrea, I think that you have contacts on this team via the GeoServer community.

[1] http://portal.auscope.org/gmap.html


Bruce Bannerman


On 16/06/10 12:28 AM, Raj Singh r...@rajsingh.org wrote:

I would love to know this too!
---
Raj


On Jun 15, at 10:00 AM, andrea giacomelli wrote:

 Hi - I received a request from a team who is not (yet) on the discussion list

 --
 ...We are looking for free/open source package which can display
 complex GML 3.1.1 features in a web based environment, and supports
 both WFS and WMS
 --

 TIA for any feedback

 Andrea
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] 5 Star OSGeo project maturity rating [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Cameron,

Well stated.

As an organisation that is implementing Open Source spatial, we are looking to 
applications that have graduated from OSGeo Incubation as an indication of 
quality.

If this is not the case, as has been indicated in this thread, then IMHO, we as 
OSGeo need to devise an approach that will allow organisations to select 
quality applications for deployment.

The last thing that anyone wants is for a major player to implement a poor 
quality application and have problems with the bad publicity that would follow.

We cannot expect that knowledgeable OS Spatial people will always be doing 
product selection. This is often a function assigned to an IT group through 
Enterprise IT Governance processes. The people doing the selection, may or may 
not have appropriate skills and experience.

Bruce




On 9/06/10 8:24 AM, Cameron Shorter cameron.shor...@gmail.com wrote:

Michael,
Your comments have been good in that they have made me think deeper
about what OSGeo stands for and then how we market that. Successful
product companies first find out what the market wants, the build a
marketing message, then build the product to fit the market. Developing
a shiny product then discovering no-one wants it is a sad but common story.

In our case, we have created a brand called OSGeo Incubation. What
does that mean? Why is it valuable? How can we get that message across
to our target market of GIS users who are interested in Open Source but
don't know what OSGeo is?

If OSGeo Incubation doesn't represent quality or maturity (which is what
the market are looking for) then what is the point of spending years of
volunteer time going through incubation?

I'm afraid that OSGeo Project is not a compelling sales message to our
target market, unless we can tie the message to quality or maturity (or
another word with similar meaning).

Unless we can provide such positive marketing, I expect that we will
have spin off projects or organisations defect from OSGeo create their
own marketing message. (I wouldn't be surprise if OpenGeo had similar
thoughts before they created and then marketed the OpenGeo suite.)

Marketing like everything else has positives and negatives.
Positives:
+ Lots of users which draws in money and developers and we all make
money and thrive

Negatives:
- We need to distill our messages down into marketing sound bytes and
generalised rating systems and the like

- We need to be honest in describing ours and others projects because
that is what the market wants to hear before they will spend money on us


On 08/06/10 09:17, Michael P. Gerlek wrote:
 Since this is an OSGeo-based CD, presumably with the OSGeo logo all over it 
 in various places, I'd suggest there are only three kinds of projects:

   - those which are Approved by OSGeo
   - those which are Undergoing OSGeo Approval
   - everything else

 With two simple logos you can indicate projects of the first two categories; 
 I don't think much explanation should be required up front, especially if one 
 avoids jargon words like graduated and incubation.

 -mpg


 From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org 
 [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Cameron Shorter
 Sent: Monday, June 07, 2010 3:57 PM
 To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org
 Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] 5 Star OSGeo project maturity rating

 There have been some passionate views against rating projects.

 Maybe I should start by explaining the drivers which led to the proposal for 
 a 5 star rating.

 Previously only OSGeo graduated and incubation projects were promoted by 
 OSGeo at conferences and the like, however, with the OSGeo LiveDVD, we are 
 packaging and hence promoting many non-graduated projects. How do we credit 
 that a project has gone through the extensive graduation process in our 
 marketing material in a manner that will be understood by the target audience?

 Unfortunately, putting OSGeo Graduated against a project is meaningless 
 because the target audience usually hasn't heard of OSGeo and is even less 
 likely to know what Graduated means.

 We could write a paragrah explaining what OSGeo and Graduation are on each 
 Project Overview flier, but that wastes valuable marketing real-estate.

 Note: I'm basing our target audience on the typical profile of people who 
 drop by the OSGeo booth at conferences. They pick up a LiveDVD and fliers 
 which have Open Source on the cover. They are typically GIS users, have 
 heard of Open Source and want to know what Open Source packages are available 
 to replace their existing , but usually haven't heard of OSGeo and almost 
 certainly don't know about the graduation process. They want to know about 
 the best 2 or 3 packakges they should consider, and they definitely don't 
 want to have to trawl through 350 software packages on http://freegis.org . 
 They spend 5 to 20 minutes talking at the OSGeo stand, then walk onto the 
 other 50 exhibition booths at the conference.
 Visitors to the OSGeo website are 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] 5 Star OSGeo project maturity rating [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

On 9/06/10 10:40 AM, P Kishor punk.k...@gmail.com wrote:

 The last thing that anyone wants is for a major player to implement a poor
 quality application and have problems with the bad publicity that would
 follow.

 We cannot expect that knowledgeable OS Spatial people will always be doing
 product selection. This is often a function assigned to an IT group through
 Enterprise IT Governance processes. The people doing the selection, may or
 may not have appropriate skills and experience.

Due diligence, caveat emptor and all. If the people doing selection
don't have appropriate skills and experience, then those people should
be replaced with people who have the appropriate skills and experience
to do the selection. Makes me shudder to think that not only might we
have inexperienced and inappropriate people at the helm, we are
willing to accept them there instead of changing them.



The point that I was making is that Enterprise IT Governance processes often 
remove the product selection from the people specifying the Business 
Requirements. This is often an IT function. Spatial requirements are often seen 
as a Business function.

In an ideal world, organisations would have people with appropriate IT, 
Spatial, OGC and OS Spatial skills making the recommendations.

In the real world, we cannot expect that this will actually happen.


Have you tried recruiting for people with appropriate IT, Spatial, OGC and OS 
Spatial skills lately (and at government wages...)?

Bruce
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] 5 Star OSGeo project maturity rating [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Jason / Cameron,

From the potential utiliser / implementer viewpoint:

I'd like to think that any project that has graduated OSGeo Incubation could be 
considered a quality project with all of the vectors described by Andrea.

This proposed rating system implies that this may not be the case.

Comments?


Bruce



On 6/06/10 10:14 AM, Jason Birch ja...@jasonbirch.com wrote:

Wow, I'm really having opinions this week :)

IMHO getting into rating projects is just asking for trouble, infighting, 
bitterness, and people/projects walking away from OSGeo.

Jason

On 5 June 2010 16:37, Cameron Shorter wrote:
Andrea and others, does this fit with people's expectations?


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RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Raster catalog ideas [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Mike,


A product for managing (muti-dimensional) raster data within a database that 
I've been monitoring since around 2002 has just been released under GPL. 

They have also applied for OSGeo Incubation.

This product, Rasdaman, can be used with Postgres as its data store.

Rasdaman has its lineage going back to around 1995 (I think). They are claiming 
the French government as a client using the product to manage TB image mosaics.

I understand that there is a sister product that will soon be merged in with 
Rasdaman that offers good OGC support (WCS 1.1 and 2.0, WMS and WCPS).

We intend investigating this product as a potential tool for managing grid, 
model and multi/hyperspectral remotely sensed data relating to the Climate 
domain. 

If you look at the product, let me know. I'll be happy to share experiences.



See [1] for Rasdaman product information and [2] for example implementations.


==

Another option is the Brazillian Terralib Project [3].

They have developed an integrated suite of server and framework tools for 
developing integrated applications based around the use of imagery and the 
management of imagery within a database (Postgres from memory). 

I'm not doing them justice with this brief description. They have done some 
very impressive work. I'd recommend Gilberto Camara's intro paper at [4] for an 
overview of Terralib.


===


[1] http://www.rasdaman.org/

[2] www.earthlook.org

[3] http://www.terralib.org/index.php

[4] http://www.terralib.org/docs/papers/TerraLib-OSBook-versionJanuary2008.pdf




Bruce Bannerman




From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On 
Behalf Of Mike Toews [mwto...@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, 4 May 2010 6:11 AM
To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org
Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Raster catalog ideas

Hi All,

I'm wondering what existing open source options are available to store rasters 
with attributes.

For example, I have several hundred air photos from northern Canada spanning 
from the 1940s to now. They have different projections (UTM zones), cell sizes, 
etc. This data store needs to be accessed from both web and desktop GIS 
software, but needs to have a definition query for the year attribute (so I 
can take all air photos from 1962, or between 1973 to 1978, or whatever is 
required).

Our (my company) present solution is to use ESRI's raster catalog on a 
geodatabase. We've had a mixed range of problems on File/Personal/SDE 
Geodatabases. We've experienced corruption on all levels of storage options, so 
we keep our file path attributes to the original GeoTIFFs so the raster 
catalogs can be restored, if required.

I'm a bit lost for the available options. The future PostGIS with raster 
capabilities sounds promising, but I need something that already exists. I 
don't think a WMS service will work, since it cannot use a query definition 
(e.g., I don't want to make layers for each year).

What are other people doing for large stores of air photos? Thanks in advance.

-Mike
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Software Copyright ownership

[Bruce Bannerman]

Hi Arnulf,

I'm just catching up on my email and noticed your renewal of this thread.

If OSGeo is to go down the route of getting IP into one organisation, it
would be good to see the IP protected in a regime that is not subject to
software patents and can offer some protection against them.

That doesn't really offer much scope at this stage (...and I'm not an expert
in this area).

...perhaps somewhere in the EU?


Bruce




 -Original Message-
 From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org
 [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Arnulf
 Christl (aka Seven)
 Sent: Sunday, 14 February 2010 5:44 PM
 To: OSGeo Discussions
 Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Software Copyright ownership

 Cleaning up an older thread...

 From what I gather from the lists there seems to be no broad
 opinion in
 favor of making projects move their copyright under the hood
 of OSGeo.

 With the recent discussion of potential export restriction
 enforcement by incorporated organizations incorporated in USA
 the the need for a more global organization seems to be
 higher. I am frankly at a loss at where such an organization
 would be incorporated and what it could look like but if it
 existed I would very much like to support it. If anyone has a
 great idea what a truly global OSGeo should look like please
 speak up.

 We should spend some thought on copyright every time we admit
 and evaluate projects in incubation. My personal experience
 shows that having the copyright of Open Source projects
 completely under the hood of a community owned organization
 is a good thing. Everything else is messy. The messy bit only
 shows when things go wrong so lets keep fingers crossed and
 as long as nothing happens we'll all be fine.

 Best regards,
 Arnulf.

 On Mon, 2009-12-14 at 21:34 +, Chris Puttick wrote:
  The other issue with assigning code copyrights to a US-based
  organisation is a simple one. The US has the strongest
 software patent
  machine and the most supportive courts (if you pick your state
  carefully ;) ).
 
  As FOSSGIS applications bite ever harder into the profits
 of the dominant player(s), the chance of the game being
 changed to a legal one rather than a sales and marketing one
 is pretty high; a fight OSGeo couldn't afford to be in.
 
  Chris
 
  - Landon Blake lbl...@ksninc.com wrote:
 
   One example of the restrictions Luis is talking about is the
   prohibition against distributing certain cryptographic software
   outside of the
   US:
  
   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Export_of_cryptography
  
   Don't know that OSGeo would bump into that, but it is one
 example of
   a US specific restriction on organizations involved in software
   development.
  
   Landon
   Office Phone Number: (209) 946-0268
   Cell Phone Number: (209) 992-0658
  
  
  
   -Original Message-
   From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org
   [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Luis W.
   Sevilla
   Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 10:40 AM
   To: OSGeo Discussions
   Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Software Copyright ownership
  
   Hi,
   one thing must be taken in account, IMHO. If I'm not
 wrong OSGeo
   is an USA foundation (is registered in the States, and
 must follow
   his laws, of course. As USA maintains a commercial
 embargo to Cuba
   [1], it
  
   seems there are a lot of things in technology fields
 restricted to
   American companies (and also foundations).
  
   If OSGeo will not became a more global (not so USA laws
   conditioned)
  
   institution, it doesn't seem so good the idea of giving all and
   every
  
   copyrights to the foundation.
  
   My two cents
  Luis
  
   [1]
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba
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   Warning:
   Information provided via electronic media is not
 guaranteed against
   defects including translation and transmission errors. If
 the reader
   is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any
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 information in error,
   please notify the sender immediately.
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Re: FW: [OSGeo-Discuss] Looking for information about Open Data practicesand how it help to foster collaboration. [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Bob,

Another one from Australia:


The url at [1] contains the link to the final report for the (Australian
State) Victorian Government Parliamentary Inquiry into improving access to
Public Sector Information and data.

If you look closely at the report you'll see a number of references to the
OSGeo-AustNZ submission made by Cameron Shorter and myself.

The link to the OSGeo-AustNZ submission may be found at [2] if you're
interested.


Bruce Bannerman


[1]
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/edic/inquiries/access_to_PSI/final_report.html

[2]
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/edic/inquiries/access_to_PSI/submissions/PSI_Sub_33_Open_Source_Geospatial.pdf





  -Original Message-
  From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org
  [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Bob Basques
  Sent: Wednesday, 20 January 2010 1:44 AM
  To: OSGeo Discussions
  Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Looking for information about
  Open Data practicesand how it help to foster collaboration.
 
  All,
 
 
  Thanks for all the links to information, I've got a pretty
  good list of Federal initiatives, now I'm after more
  localized efforts, something at the City or Municipal level.
  Really it can be anything related to making government
  (geospatial) data available to the masses and why it makes sense.
 
 
  I will post my (short) write-up here as well.
 
 
  Thanks again.
 
 
  bobb
 
 
 
 
   Haris Kurtagic ha...@sl-king.com wrote:
 
 
  I really like presentation from Jason Birch from City of
  Nanaimo about reasons to open data and how to do it.
  http://www.slideshare.net/JasonBirch/moving-beyond-the-desk
 
  http://www.slideshare.net/JasonBirch/moving-beyond-the-desk
  Don't forget to look at notes too, I did forgot first time.
 
 
 
 
 
  Haris
 
 
 
  On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 10:11 PM, Bob Basques
 
  bob.basq...@ci.stpaul.mn.us
 
  wrote:
 
 
All,
 
 
 
 
I'm putting together a proposal here at the City to
  open up more of our datasets to the public. We currently have
  about 30 GIS data layers available to the public, http://,
  with ~170 layers that are not public. While there are some
  layers that won't be made available for security or licensing
  issues, there are many that the owners of simply don't want
  to make available.
 
 
 
 
I'm looking for information to include in a short
  proposal that might sway some of the folks sitting on
  datasets internally to get them to publish the data to the
  masses and need points of reasoning to point them at.
 
 
 
 
I already have some info related to general practices
  moving towards this type of data availability, and some of
  the recent threads on the OSGEO lists about data licensing
  would likely come into play as well.
 
 
 
 
Thanks for any pointers on this.
 
 
 
 
bobb
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Looking for information about Open Data practices and how it help to foster collaboration. [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

IMO:

The Australian Federal Government's efforts currently appear to be focused on 
an initiative called 'Government 2.0'. See the blog at [1].


If you scroll down a bit you'll see a link to the final Taskforce Report.


Bruce Bannerman


[1] http://gov2.net.au/ 





 

 -Original Message-
 From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org 
 [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Bob Basques
 Sent: Saturday, 16 January 2010 8:12 AM
 To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org
 Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Looking for information about Open 
 Data practices and how it help to foster collaboration.
 
 All, 
 
 
 I'm putting together a proposal here at the City to open up 
 more of our datasets to the public.  We currently have about 
 30 GIS data layers available to the public, http://,  with 
 ~170 layers that are not public.  While there are some layers 
 that won't be made available for security or licensing 
 issues, there are many that the owners of simply don't want 
 to make available. 
 
 
 I'm looking for information to include in a short proposal 
 that might sway some of the folks sitting on datasets 
 internally to get them to publish the data to the masses and 
 need points of reasoning to point them at. 
 
 
 I already have some info related to general practices moving 
 towards this type of data availability, and some of the 
 recent threads on the OSGEO lists about data licensing would 
 likely come into play as well.   
 
 
 Thanks for any pointers on this. 
 
 
 bobb 
 
 
 
 
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RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] HELP PLEASE - Does anyone know where I can get high resolution GIS data for use in tutorials? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Simon,

Check out the Australian Spatial Data Directory [1].

Geoscience Australia also have a wide range of datasets that I understand are 
now available via Creative Commons.


Bruce Bannerman

[1] http://asdd.ga.gov.au/asdd/tech/zap/basic.html






 

 -Original Message-
 From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org 
 [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Simon 
 Cropper (Botanicus Australia Pty Ltd)
 Sent: Wednesday, 13 January 2010 10:36 AM
 To: OSGeo Discussions; Users and Developers mailing list
 Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] HELP PLEASE - Does anyone know where 
 I can get high resolution GIS data for use in tutorials?
 
 Hi,
 
 *** Sorry for cross-posting for those people on both lists ***
 
 Does anyone have or know of some high resolution vector and 
 raster data that can be used in tutorials?
 
 The datasets need to be unfetted by intellectual property 
 constraints. 
 
 Essentially I want to build a set of tutorials around this 
 data and have the users able to download and manipulate the 
 data without breaking any laws.
 
 Preferably I would like data for Australia, even better 
 southeast Australia.
 
 Data 
 
 
 * georeferenced aerial photography (ECW or JPG, 0.15m/pixel)
 * shapefiles showing cadastral data, soils, contours, roads
 * DWG files showing details of a development or plan
 
 Spatial Reference System
 
 
 * GDA94 MGA55
 
 -- 
 
 
 Cheers Simon
 
 Simon Cropper
 Botanicus Australia Pty Ltd
 PO Box 160, Sunshine, Victoria 3020.
 P: 9311 5822. M: 041 830 3437.
 mailto: scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au 
 mailto:scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au
 web: www.botanicusaustralia.com.au 
 http://www.botanicusaustralia.com.au  
 
 
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RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] HELP PLEASE - Does anyone know where I can get high resolution GIS data for use in tutorials? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Simon,

IMO:

After the recent Victorian Government Inquiry into public sector information, 
the outcome was that Vic Govt data should also be provided via Creative Commons.

You should be able to see most of their VicMap datasets via the ASDD. There 
will be a lot of other more detailed data via DSE/Catchment Management 
Authority partnerships. Probably to the scale that you're after. Again check 
the ASDD.

I'm assuming that you have DSE/SII contacts. Contact me off line if you don't.

Bruce


 

 -Original Message-
 From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org 
 [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Simon 
 Cropper (Botanicus Australia Pty Ltd)
 Sent: Wednesday, 13 January 2010 11:20 AM
 To: OSGeo Discussions
 Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] HELP PLEASE - Does anyone know 
 where I can get high resolution GIS data for use in 
 tutorials? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
 
 Bruce,
 
 I have been looking at the GeoScience Australia Downloads but 
 all these are too broad for most of what I do. Need something 
 at 1:25,000 or better. 
 
 I suppose the biggest problem is aerial photography. What 
 little is out there is very broad scale regional stuff. 
 Nothing showing just one small area at a scale typically used 
 by people such as myself.
 
 I am aware of the Australia Spatial Directory but I was 
 hoping to find some freely downloadable and free to use 
 datasets, before I go begging to data suppliers or data custodians.
 
 
 Cheers Simon
 
 Simon Cropper
 Botanicus Australia Pty Ltd
 PO Box 160, Sunshine, Victoria 3020.
 P: 9311 5822. M: 041 830 3437.
 mailto: scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au 
 mailto:scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au
 web: www.botanicusaustralia.com.au 
 http://www.botanicusaustralia.com.au  
 
 
 
 On 13/01/2010 11:07 AM, Bruce Bannerman wrote: 
 
   
   Simon,
   
   Check out the Australian Spatial Data Directory [1].
   
   Geoscience Australia also have a wide range of datasets 
 that I understand are now available via Creative Commons.
   
   
   Bruce Bannerman
   
   [1] http://asdd.ga.gov.au/asdd/tech/zap/basic.html
   
   
   
   
   
   

   
 
 
   -Original Message-
   From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org 
   [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On 
 Behalf Of Simon 
   Cropper (Botanicus Australia Pty Ltd)
   Sent: Wednesday, 13 January 2010 10:36 AM
   To: OSGeo Discussions; Users and Developers mailing list
   Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] HELP PLEASE - Does 
 anyone know where 
   I can get high resolution GIS data for use in tutorials?
   
   Hi,
   
   *** Sorry for cross-posting for those people on 
 both lists ***
   
   Does anyone have or know of some high 
 resolution vector and 
   raster data that can be used in tutorials?
   
   The datasets need to be unfetted by 
 intellectual property 
   constraints. 
   
   Essentially I want to build a set of tutorials 
 around this 
   data and have the users able to download and 
 manipulate the 
   data without breaking any laws.
   
   Preferably I would like data for Australia, even better 
   southeast Australia.
   
   Data 
   
   
   *   georeferenced aerial photography (ECW 
 or JPG, 0.15m/pixel)
   *   shapefiles showing cadastral data, 
 soils, contours, roads
   *   DWG files showing details of a 
 development or plan
   
   Spatial Reference System
   
   
   *   GDA94 MGA55
   
   -- 
   
   
   Cheers Simon
   
   Simon Cropper
   Botanicus Australia Pty Ltd
   PO Box 160, Sunshine, Victoria 3020.
   P: 9311 5822. M: 041 830 3437.
   mailto: scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au 
   mailto:scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au 
 mailto:scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au 
   web: www.botanicusaustralia.com.au 
   http://www.botanicusaustralia.com.au 
 http://www.botanicusaustralia.com.au   
   
   
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RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: Include remote sensing software in OSGeo desktop shootout? Re: Discuss Digest, Vol 36, Issue 31 [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

IMO:

Hi Drew,

A good question.

I had assumed that as image manipulation and processing functionality is 
required as part of the normal desktop workflow for a significant range of 
spatial use cases that it would be included in this type of comparison.


Bruce




 

 -Original Message-
 From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org 
 [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of 
 pilant.d...@epamail.epa.gov
 Sent: Thursday, 24 December 2009 2:53 AM
 To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org
 Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: Include remote sensing software 
 in OSGeo desktop shootout? Re: Discuss Digest, Vol 36, Issue 31
 
 
 Dear All, 
 
 The discussion of an OSGeo desktop shootout prompts me to 
 inquire if remote sensing / image processing software could 
 be included in the comparison. Or, does anyone have an 
 existing comparison of features and capabilities? 
 
 More specifically, how do the FOSS remote sensing toolkits 
 compare with commercial packages such as ENVI, ERDAS Imagine, 
 PCI Geomatics, Idrisi, ECognition, Feature Analyst, Genie 
 Pro, etc (sorry for any omissions on this list). Where are the gaps? 
 
 By remote sensing packages, I'm referring to software that 
 ingests satellite and aerial imagery and data (optical, 
 infrared, thermal infrared, SAR, LIDAR, microwave), and 
 applies various transformations, filters and workflows to 
 generate geospatial information and maps. The remote sensing 
 output is typically imported into GIS for further analysis 
 and visualization. 
 
 Many thanks and happy holidays, 
 
 Drew 
 
 Drew Pilant, Ph.D.
 Remote Sensing Research Scientist
 US Environmental Protection Agency
 Office of Research and Development
 Landscape Characterization Branch
 tel:  919.541.0648
 fax: 919.541.9420
 pilant.d...@epa.gov
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RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: Will there be an OSGeo Desktop shootout atFOSS4G 2010? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

IMO:

This may have already been covered.

Several years ago Todd Buchanan prepared a thesis comparing ArcGIS and Grass 
[1].

The approach he used could provide a potential framework. It has features of 
Cameron's structured comparison; Simon's process approach; with a comparison of 
actual results of algorithm operations based on a control set of data.


I'd like to see the list of features that Todd compared (at Table 13) expanded 
somewhat to include e.g. functionality related to data capture and maintenance; 
transformations; reprojections etc etc.


Just a thought.


   --
   Bruce Bannerman


[1] http://www.toddbuchanan.net/thesis_ver.pdf



 

 -Original Message-
 From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org 
 [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Daniel Ames
 Sent: Tuesday, 22 December 2009 5:25 AM
 To: Maxim Dubinin; OSGeo Discussions
 Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: Will there be an OSGeo 
 Desktop shootout atFOSS4G 2010?
 
 Folks, I like the structured comparison approach that Cameron 
 outlined. Also equally (or perhaps more useful) would be to 
 put together a wiki page with goals and benchmarks based on 
 ArcGIS 9.3. And then indicate where the os packages compare. 
 This would provide us with the ability to answer the most 
 important question which is can this do what the proprietary 
 software does.  For example, we could post a couple of maps 
 made in AG and then challenge each desktop team to create and 
 upload the same maps. Etc.  I have a line shapefile with 200 
 shapes. We could upload it and have everyone do some timing 
 to show how fast to load,pan, etc on the data. This could 
 also serve as a way for some of the teams to see their own 
 deficiencies and find critical tasks to work on (they could 
 then update their reporting on the wiki and indicate the 
 version number)... - Dan
 
   On Dec 20, 2009 4:40 PM, Maxim Dubinin 
 s...@gis-lab.info wrote:
   
   
   Simon,
   
   I was merely suggesting an approach. As I said, we 
 didn't have a goal to inform other what Desktop GIS is the 
 best, we just wanted to present a model dataset for many 
 different packages, so that a person can try and choose by himself. 
   
   However, there are some notes for each package at the 
 bottom of the page. Personally, I have a favorite, of course, 
 but I don't think this is appropriate to describe it here. 
 That said, I think this will be relatively easy to construct 
 a matrix based on our experience with missing bits for this 
 particular task. We're currently going through updating 
 software and this project and will discuss this among participants.
   
   Maxim
   
   Вы писали 20 декабря 2009 г., 16:52:06:
   
   
 
   Maxim, I looked at the webpage but could not find an 
 outcome -- which system worked the best? Chee...
 
   Sometime ago, we were also interested in why are there 
 so many desktop open GIS packages. So what w...
 
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 http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss  
 
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] OSGeo barriers to entry

[Bruce Bannerman]

Tyler,

Perhaps this 'issue' is not so big after all...

A comment that was made to me by a colleague after FOSS4G-2009 was that she
thought that it was great to see such a high percentage of attendees were
female; dramatically higher than she would have traditionally seen at a
spatial / geoscience event in Australia.

She commented further that this was a good reason to get more involved...



Bruce





  -Original Message-
  From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org
  [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Tyler Mitchell
  Sent: Tuesday, 17 November 2009 9:07 AM
  To: OSGeo Discussions
  Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] OSGeo barriers to entry
 
  Thanks for the discussion Landon.  I'll leave Pandora well
  enough alone :)
 
  Perhaps we can turn the thread to discussing what are the
  real or perceived barriers people, in general, find to
  getting involved with OSGeo.   I'm sure that any barriers
  women would have might also affect others, so it might be
  useful to broaden the discussion so more participate.
 
  1 What barriers are there to joining OSGeo and its projects?
  2 How can we be more inviting?  Have you heard negative
  comments from potential members?  Are there any reasons you
  might not invite a colleague to join?
  3 How can we encourage more people to contribute to our
  projects or join  with the OSGeo mission?
  4 What areas in OSGeo and its projects need more helpers?
  5 What are the most interesting/compelling aspects?
 
  I'm sure there are more pointed questions but these are just
  off the top of my head.
 
  Best wishes,
  Tyler
 
 
  - Original Message -
  From: Landon Blake lbl...@ksninc.com
  Date: Monday, November 16, 2009 1:01 pm
  Subject: RE: RE: RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] new: OSGeo women mailing list
  To: tmitch...@osgeo.org
  Cc: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org
 
   Tyler,
  
   I understand your wife's perspective completely. It seems
  reasonable
   to conclude that there are fewer women involved in OSGeo projects
   because there are fewer women involved in open source computing to
   begin with.
 
  
 
 
 
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RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Regarding The Microstation DGN Maps georeferencing [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

[Bruce Bannerman]

Padmini,

It has been a long, long time since I used MicroStation, however this may help.

Typically it will depend on the people who captured the data that you are 
working with:

- some are only concerned with the immediate vicinity of their 
  engineering project and will arbitrarily define a local (cartesian) 
  grid with a datum point of (0,0) or similar and work with these coordinates.

- others will be quite pedantic and work with projected coordinates
  e.g. UTM coords within their design files.


With the first example, you'll have to find the relationship between the 
arbitrary datum and your Spatial Reference System and transform the data.

With the second example, if you know the source SRS try just applying it.



Now being good spatial professionals, your data providers will have provided 
spatial metadata (at least ISO 19139) with their spatial datasets, so you'll be 
able to easily work out the lineage of the data sets that were provided to you 
and work out the appropriate course of action.



HTH.


Bruce 

 

 -Original Message-
 From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org 
 [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of 
 bpadm...@bel.co.in
 Sent: Wednesday, 11 November 2009 4:43 PM
 To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org
 Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Regarding The Microstation DGN Maps 
 georeferencing
 
 hello,
 
 I am newbie using Quantum GIS.
 I am able to extract layers from DGN file, but couldn't 
 geo-reference it.
 are their any ways of doing so, please suggest.
 
 thanks and regards,
 Padmini
 
 
 Confidentiality Notice
 
 The information contained in this electronic message and any 
 attachments to this message are intended for the exclusive 
 use of the addressee(s) and may contain confidential or 
 privileged information. If you are not the intended 
 recipient, please notify the sender at Bharat Electronics  or 
 supp...@bel.co.in immediately and destroy all copies of this 
 message and any attachments.
 
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] new military OSS policy

[Bruce Bannerman]

Miles,

It is encouraging to see this policy development.

When combined with the new UK Government Policy on Open Source and Open
Standards [1],  I can see that OS (spatial) is finally starting to get some
serious momentum within government circles.

Perhaps other Governments will also start following suit...

Bruce Bannerman

[1] http://www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/government_it/open_source.aspx



  -Original Message-
  From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org
  [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Miles Fidelman
  Sent: Wednesday, 28 October 2009 4:16 AM
  To: OSGeo Discussions
  Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] new military OSS policy
 
  ... fresh from the OSD e-press
 
  --
  Miles R. Fidelman, Director of Government Programs Traverse
  Technologies
  145 Tremont Street, 3rd Floor
  Boston, MA  02111
  mfidel...@traversetechnologies.com
  857-362-8314
  www.traversetechnologies.com
 
 
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[OSGeo-Discuss] The Rabbit

[Bruce Bannerman]

Paul,

By unanimous decision of the LOC, you have been entrusted as keeper of the
FOSS4G-2009 Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch [1].

We felt it better not to leave loose ends, and know that you will keep it in
safe hands.


Bruce

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Hand_Grenade_of_Antioch
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[OSGeo-Discuss] Fwd: [SDI-AsiaPacific] NAVTEQ Global LBS Challenge

[Bruce Bannerman]

fyi


 -Original Message-
 From: sdi-asiapacific-boun...@lists.gsdi.org
 [mailto:sdi-asiapacific-boun...@lists.gsdi.org] On Behalf Of
 Kate Lance
 Sent: Thursday, 15 October 2009 11:03 PM
 To: SDI-Africa; SDI-Europe; SDI-AP; SDI-LAC; SDI-North America
 Subject: [SDI-AsiaPacific] NAVTEQ Global LBS Challenge


http://developer.navteq.com/site/global/market/lbs_challenge/p_lbs_home.jsp


 NAVTEQ Global LBS Challenge
 The NAVTEQ Global LBS Challenge is focused on driving the
 development and visibility of innovative location-based
 solutions (LBS) for wireless devices. The Global LBS
 Challenge has become the premier event in the wireless
 industry and a global symbol of LBS innovation and
 opportunity. From business applications to sports, travel and
 security, integrating the accuracy and richness of NAVTEQ
 digital map data facilitates the discovery of the next wave
 of LBS using dynamic positioning technology.
 Winners are chosen by a panel of distinguished judges in each
 of five regions. Since the launch of the NAVTEQ Global LBS
 Challenge, over 32% of the finalist companies have gone on to
 receive venture capital funding or launched
 commercially-distributed applications, many on major wireless
 carriers.
 Registration for all regions is now open.

 Europe-Middle East-Africa (EMEA) registration deadline:
 October 30, 2009 Europe-Middle East-Africa (EMEA) solution
 submission deadline: November 20, 2009

 North American registration deadline: November 20, 2009 North
 American solution submission deadline: January 8, 2010

 India registration deadline: December 11, 2009 India solution
 submission deadline: January 22, 2010

 South America registration deadline: February 12, 2010 South
 America solution submission deadline: March 12, 2010

 Asia-Pacific (APAC) registration deadline: March 5, 2010
 Asia-Pacific (APAC) solution submission deadline: April 9, 2010


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 around http://mail.yahoo.com

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Fwd: [OSGeo-Discuss] Mind Map - Open Source Spatial Projects

[Bruce Bannerman]

 It would be great if you could add in the MapWindow project.
 MapWindow GIS Desktop Application is a C#/.NET desktop GIS
 that is completely open source and has about 6000 downloads
 per month from www.MapWindow.org.

 Also, under your library/developer tools, we the project also
 includes a set of .NET libraries and a COM C++ ActiveX
 component based on both NTS and GDAL.

 - Dan


done




 OpenScales is a user-friendly and fast interface written in
 ActionScript3/Flex/AIR designed to visualize and manipulate
 spatial data.

 OpenScales is open source with an LGPL license.



 Aurélien Barbier-Accary


done



Bruce
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[OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G-2009 Volunteers required - OSGeo Booth

[Bruce Bannerman]

We need people to help 'man' (or is that 'person ;-) ) the OSGeo Booth
during FOSS4G-2009.

The booth will be a centre of activity and you will get to meet a lot of
the OSGeo personalities.

Please volunteer for a half hour session, or two, or three...



To sign up, add your name to the Wiki at:

http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/FOSS4G_2009_Volunteers#OSGeo_Booth



Bruce



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Fwd: [OSGeo-Discuss] Mind Map - Open Source Spatial Projects

[Bruce Bannerman]

Tyler / Bob,

Yes, it is in Freemind v0.8.1, the current stable version.

I agree that a viewer will need to be dynamic. I expect to see updates for a
long time to come.


According to the Freemind FAQ, there is an applet that will allow the
mindmap to be presented via a Web Page [1].


I have not tried this yet.

Perhaps something hosted by OSGeo if the applet works OK?



Bruce


[1]
http://freemind.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php/Asked_Questions#Mind_maps_on_web_pages_with_FreeMind.27s_applet




 -Original Message-
 From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org
 [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Tyler
 Mitchell (OSGeo)
 Sent: Tuesday, 13 October 2009 3:32 PM
 To: OSGeo Discussions; Bob Basques
 Subject: Re: Fwd: [OSGeo-Discuss] Mind Map - Open Source
 Spatial Projects

 Looks like it says it's 0.8.1 Freemind map version. I've
 looked a bit at other clients but they are usually involving
 a conversion step. e.g. you can do mm format into S5
 presentation format and a few others. I'd like a more dynamic
 'flowing' viewer for presentations - any hints and I'd like
 to hear them too.

 Tyler

 original message-
 From: Bob Basques bo...@gritechnologies.com
 To: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org
 Date: Mon, 12 Oct 2009 23:16:25 -0500
 -


  Bruce,
 
  Yeah I got that to work, but was wondering if there were
 other client
  that could read it.
 
  I use a similar (pay for) application called Inspiration
 that allows
  for building of similar diagrams. I thought it might open
 the MM file,
  but no go.
 
  Nice file BTW.
 
  bobb
 
 
 
  Bruce Bannerman wrote:
  Bob,
 
  
  
   What's the best Client for this MM stuff? A little
 research on it
   reveals there are more than one version of the file
 format as well
   as more than one version of client, and not all clients read all
   formats . . .
  
 
  The format is Freemind mind mapping software.
 
  As per my original post:
 
  
   Details are at:
  
   http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/User:Bruce.bannerman
  
  
 
  I've received a few emails advising me that some people's email
  clients have hidden the above URL.
 
  Two suggestions to get around this:
 
  - view the email source
 
  - go to the OSGeo Wiki and search for 'User:Bruce.bannerman'. You
  will find the details there.
 
 
  Bruce
 
 
 
  --
  --
 
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[OSGeo-Discuss] Mind Map - Open Source Spatial Projects

[Bruce Bannerman]

Thanks George,

 Amazing. Congratulations!

 Can i suggest a project that has been around for some years?

 Check Terralib and TerraView. It's a brazilian project and it's quite
 mature.

 http://www.terralib.org/ http://www.terralib.org/

 Regards,

 George

Terralib is there.

See Software DevelopmentToolkitsTerraLib

From my assessment, I categorised it as a toolkit to help you develop
spatial applications.

I must say that I was impressed by the functionality available. If you
haven't already, have a read of Gilberto Camara's overview of TerraLib /
TerraView. The link is in the MindMap as per above.



Bruce
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[OSGeo-Discuss] Mind Map - Open Source Spatial Projects

[Bruce Bannerman]

I have been developing a Mind Map for a number of years, showing various
Open Source spatial projects, with a summary of project features and links
to project urls.

It should help as an aide-memoire for Open Source spatial projects.

I've released this under a Creative Commons license with the source in the
OSGeo subversion repository.



Details are at:

http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/User:Bruce.bannerman


The information in the mind map is a little dated. Perhaps a few of us can
collaborate to maintain it.


Thanks to Tyler for his help in getting this into subversion.



Bruce Bannerman
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