Re: [E-devel] Server/Gitlab/Etc... and our servers/sysadmins routinely letting us down.

[jaquilina]

I am more than willing to take charge of this if Bieber is ok with it.

If we containerize things cant we go with a secure and stable super long
term support distro like centos? Correct me if I am wrong each docker
container is its own mini distro right or am I incorrect in that
understanding?

-Original Message-
From: Simon Lees  
Sent: 17 December 2018 03:07
To: enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [E-devel] Server/Gitlab/Etc... and our servers/sysadmins
routinely letting us down.



On 15/12/2018 22:59, Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote:
> On Thu, 13 Dec 2018 11:36:55 -0600 Stephen Houston 
said:
> 
>> A few months ago Mike set up  a test instance of gitlab on a server 
>> for us... After testing and the like, I set up a slowvote on Phab 
>> that covered
>> 4 options:
>>
>> Gitlab with new infra
>> Gitlab with current infra
>> Phab with new infra
>> Phab with current infra
>>
>> The overwhelming support was for new infra.  As in every single vote 
>> except for one wanted new infra.  The majority also wanted gitlab, 
>> but for the sake of this email, that is irrelevant.
>>
>> The arguments against new infra, having it sponsored, cloud, etc... 
>> keep being that if someone leaves the project, or the owners of the 
>> servers changes, or policies change, or etc... that we might lose 
>> access.  To me this seems like an incredibly poor argument right now 
>> especially considering that we have been experiencing this very thing 
>> and even worse with our own current infra.  The problems I have seen are
that we:
> 
> there was an offer for new corporate sponsored infra. you have no idea 
> how close things were to that infra just vanishing a few weeks ago if 
> it had been used. we'd be back to begging for someone else to provide 
> it or everyone having to pony up and pay for some hosting and have 
> given up osuosl who have served us well (when you know the details).
> 
>> A. Failed at maintaining the physical aspects of our server.
> 
> i personally ordered 2 replacement drives for our server recently(ish) 
> and i care. i had hoped people physically closer would handle things 
> first, but that didn't happen, so i did. there are other issues which 
> i'm sorting through and have been blocked by other configuration issues.
> 
>> B. Keep having continued downtime over and over and over again.
> 
> actually we don't. we had downtime because of a software configuration 
> issue for years regarding qemu and logging. this would have happened 
> anywhere with any infra if we used vm's and had the same setup.
> 
>> C. Can never get in touch with or get a response from our server 
>> admin in any kind of remotely adequate timeframe.
> 
> admin, server+hosting and what runs on them are different matters. 
> conflating them all is a bad idea.
> 
> this is why our infra needs multiple hands from multiple people 
> involved so there is always a backup. that is what i want to happen 
> with e5 once its back up. it has to be easier to manage remotely for 
> people who are not full-time looking at the system and know it 
> backwards. so system has to be pretty boring and "standard" as 
> possible. it may be less secure as a result but that's better than not
having multiple hands making light work.
> 
>> Insanity is often said to be defined as doing the same thing over and 
>> over again expecting a different result.  It is time to have an open 
>> mind to the needs/wants of this community and make a change.
> 
> we just had a near fatal miss above AND osuosl have done a great job 
> over the years. they have more recently been locked out of helping out 
> much (the ipmi thing as well as server access to OS has not been given 
> to them like a working account with root access).
> 
> the current e.org is not even running inside osuosl. it's a temporary 
> server meant for "getting containers set up on our original server inside
osuosl".
> that has not happened after 1.5 years. i'm, not interested i going 
> into blame or what should have been done when or by who. i do want to 
> say that i consider beber a friend and he has done a lot of work over 
> the years and invested his time and effort and more and i totally respect
that.
> 
> now that temporary server runs somewhere only beber knows about right 
> now and since it seems the host had physical problems, only he can do 
> anything about that. i couldn't ssh in and do anything - no access was 
> possible for me. this temporary machine is e6.
> 
> the osuosl machine (e5). is up and working but 1 drive isn't 
> responding. fixing this has been delayed because ipmi access has not 
> worked for me since the day this machine was set up, nor has it worked 
> for osuosl - they have been unable to access console and do the basic 
> power up/down etc. without physically walking into the server room.
> 
> i have actually figured out why it doesn't work just today... it was a 
> very simple thing and never should/would have happened if there 

Re: [E-devel] Gitlab/Infrastructure Slowvote

[jaquilina]

Morning Guys,

To answer your questions.

In regards to a server to migrate the infrastructure to I am ready to 
sponsor such an endeavour. I am also ready to rebuild the existing 
server.


The question here becomes is the community ready for this to happen? I 
think this is what the vote is for. I am not trying to push beber to the 
side I know he is busy and I am willing to step up and get things goign 
in terms of being rebuilt.


Regards,
Jonathan.

On 2018-09-26 14:48, Marcel Hollerbach wrote:

There is a difference between a precise plan on what kind of changes
are done and what the overall plan looks like.

- What is happening to the CI, cgit, wiki etc.
- Is the sponsoring a permanent choice, or just something for a year or
so, and the overall plan is to migrate back, (this was also proposed
in the "Gitlab" thread).

Those questions are rather fundamental (at least to me) in order to
vote for anything. Also, how useful is it to know that the community
wants to have a sponsored service if there is no funding at all.

On 9/26/18 4:22 PM, Stephen Houston wrote:
There is no point in developing a plan if we dont know what the plan 
is or

what the desire is of the community.

On Wed, Sep 26, 2018, 9:21 AM Marcel Hollerbach  
wrote:



I don't really see where this vote does make any sense.
There is currently no one stepping up, saying he does the migration,
there is no plan how the move should be done, there is no plan on 
where

the funding would come from.

How should i decide if a move would make sense or not in this stage? 
I
don't even can see what kind of features would be included in case of 
a

switch to gitlab.

Greetings,
bu5hm4n

On 9/26/18 3:52 PM, Stephen Houston wrote:

Hello developers,

Please take the time to consider options and vote on a migration to

Gitlab

and infrastructure possibilities here:

https://phab.enlightenment.org/V39


Thanks,
Stephen

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Re: [E-devel] Gitlab

[jaquilina]

I am getting many different vibes here. Are we looking at redoing the e5 
setup and another server is needed in terms of sponsor ship in order to 
rebuild e5?


On 2018-09-25 21:08, Bertrand Jacquin wrote:

On Mon, Sep 24, 2018 at 11:54:16AM +0100, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
On Sat, 22 Sep 2018 15:57:27 +0100 Bertrand Jacquin 
 said:


> > > This is something I do not agree with. I have been kicking into pants
> > > for problems with the infra for _years_ when doing Jenkins. It has
> > > changed nothing and I moved over to cloud services to get the control
> > > and flexibility I needed.
> >
> > This is a result of policy from Beber of giving pretty minimal VM's with
> > limited ram/disk with gentoo. We have the resources - they are just not
> > being assigned and being able to provision your own is far too complex with
> > what we have. If all you had to do was run some libvirt cmds to spin up a
> > new VM of whatever size/config you wanted , I think you'd be fine.
>
> Well, e5 clearly has not enough memory and CPU to support all the build
> ran by Jenkins, this is why we had to split the building instances from

That I just don't buy. I compile all of e, efl, terminology, rage on a
raspberry pi with 768m ram (256 partitioned off to gpu) and do 
parallel
builds... and can run a gui at the same time. e5 has 48gb of ram. last 
i heard
from stefan the vm's for building had maybe 2 or 4gb ram allocated to 
them and
limited disk space. correct me if i'm wrong - this may have been a 
while ago.


Memory is not the issue here, CPU is. Each VM has 4GB or RAM, each 
build

use -j6 and we can have up to 4 jenkins build at the same time, this on
3 different VM.

Read this a different way: having build and servers (web, git etc) is 
not

achievable.

compared to a raspberry pi .. e5 runs rings around it so many times 
it's not
funny and an rpi can do this easily enough. yes - jenkins adds infra 
cost
itself, but a single vm for linux builds (with multiple chroots) would 
consume

very little resources


That is true, the VM overhead is not negligible. VM were the initial
design and we stuck on this. I am far from being against that as I'm 
far
from being against containers, finding the right time to work on this 
is

a different matter.


as it would only need a single build controller and just
spawn off scripts per build that do the chroot fun.

sure - need a vm for bsd, and windows and other OS's that can't do the 
chroot

trick.

> the hosting instances. Even still, current ressources are too limited.
> You will not be able to have more than 10 instances running at the same
> time.

10 build instances? if they are properly ionice'd and niced to be 
background
tasks vs www etc... i think we can,. they might take longer as the 
xeons are
old on the server, but they can do the task still. i regularly build 
efl/e on

hardware a tiny fraction of the power of e5.


We don't just instances for build, we have instances for web, mail, 
git,

phab etc .. Which by the way were moved to e6 last year after the
website was pretty much unsable and the disk issue we had, server that 
I'm

still paying myself. This was meant to be a temporary solution, but I
did not find the appropriate time to allocate on putting stuff back.

Cheers

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Re: [E-devel] Gitlab

[jaquilina]

Seeing as I have infra access what can I do to help?

On 2018-09-25 21:17, Bertrand Jacquin wrote:

On Mon, Sep 24, 2018 at 12:32:01PM +0100, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
On Sat, 22 Sep 2018 15:50:00 +0100 Bertrand Jacquin 
 said:


> On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 06:45:20AM -0500, Stephen Houston wrote:
> > OSUOSL is great. But it's pointless when none of us can get the access we
> > need to the server and when the person that has/controls that access takes
> > forever and a day to communicate and/or wont budge. Help has been offered
> > in sysadmin for years from multiple devs who are sysadmins by trade and who
> > could handle the complexity,
>
> You have the right to complain, that's probably fair but you have to
> remember I'm only a volunteer here, nothing else can be expected from
> me. Stop the fud.
>
> Not to blame or anything, the only actual help was provided by Raster
> from time to time to hotfix some crap going on. Raster, jaquilina and
> myself are root on the whole infra, any changes can be made. If the
> infra is seen as too complex, questions can be raised but there are not.

TBH... I'm partly to blame as I just don't know how most of it works. 
I figure
it out as I go. :) But it would be good to have more people able to do 
hot
fixes or address issues when others can't. I try and remember to let 
you know

of any changes that you need to know about.


This is correct, hotfix are fine, nothing wrong about that.  What looks
not fair is people blaming me for not being available in my spare time
to volunteer for a project when others have access. It's a lost cause,
I'm not going to whine about it.

I think having as many VMs as we have doesn't help. Containers won't 
make that
element simpler in terms of "too fragmented".  Knowing which VM (or 
which
container) something is in is hard enough to follow. :) You really 
need to know

the infra well.


Or just being used to do that. That's the thing as code, you know well
code so you can pretty much decipher code quickly, whatever language or
architecture being used. For infra it's pretty much the same thing.
When you are used to it, you can figure out pretty much all the
components very quickly.

I know it's not "secure" and "right" but having fewer VMs with "shared 
hosting"

within a single instance for many things might help a lot.


This is a design choice we made 5+ years ago when we set e5 up. The 
idea
being to be able to put each VM to a different place in case of 
disaster

recovery. This does not mean we have to stick on that. I'm in favor in
making this change. It does not mean it has to be me doing this. You're
all bunch of smart people that can come with alternative. What I'm NOT
going to do is to explain every single step to people as it would
consume me more time than doing it myself. This is exactly the speech I
have to Jacquinola multiple time, I see a will to do stuff but not seen
much proposal or action from that.


At least I have
found it easier in the past to find things that way. Don't know how 
something is

set up? "sudo grep -r  /". :)


That's a very good starting point.

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Re: [E-devel] Gitlab

[jaquilina]

Hi Guys,

From a performance stand point wouldn't bare metal be a better option to 
opt for?


On 2018-09-24 11:32, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
On Sat, 22 Sep 2018 15:50:00 +0100 Bertrand Jacquin 
 said:



On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 06:45:20AM -0500, Stephen Houston wrote:
> OSUOSL is great. But it's pointless when none of us can get the access we
> need to the server and when the person that has/controls that access takes
> forever and a day to communicate and/or wont budge. Help has been offered
> in sysadmin for years from multiple devs who are sysadmins by trade and who
> could handle the complexity,

You have the right to complain, that's probably fair but you have to
remember I'm only a volunteer here, nothing else can be expected from
me. Stop the fud.

Not to blame or anything, the only actual help was provided by Raster
from time to time to hotfix some crap going on. Raster, jaquilina and
myself are root on the whole infra, any changes can be made. If the
infra is seen as too complex, questions can be raised but there are 
not.


TBH... I'm partly to blame as I just don't know how most of it works. I 
figure
it out as I go. :) But it would be good to have more people able to do 
hot
fixes or address issues when others can't. I try and remember to let 
you know

of any changes that you need to know about.

I think having as many VMs as we have doesn't help. Containers won't 
make that
element simpler in terms of "too fragmented".  Knowing which VM (or 
which
container) something is in is hard enough to follow. :) You really need 
to know

the infra well.

I know it's not "secure" and "right" but having fewer VMs with "shared 
hosting"
within a single instance for many things might help a lot. At least I 
have
found it easier in the past to find things that way. Don't know how 
something is

set up? "sudo grep -r  /". :)


I am 100% for removing myself from the burden and willing to see what
shape things will take.

> and there is absolutely no change and it is
> not allowed. Further, Stefan is being generous... it has been more like 10
> months, nearly a year since OSUOSL asked us to replace the fan. This is
> frankly embarrassing. We cant even get a model number so that one of us
> could personally drop ship it to them. That really looks bad on us... Again
> that is basically humiliating.  With all of these issues I think it would
> be a great improvement to moved to sponsored cloud hosting. We would
> actually have access and not have to worry about the hardware maintenance.
>
> On Wed, Sep 12, 2018, 3:33 AM Carsten Haitzler  wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 30 Aug 2018 19:49:29 +0930 Simon Lees  said:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 30/08/2018 18:57, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> > > > Hello.
> > > >
> > > > On 08/10/2018 08:09 PM, Mike Blumenkrantz wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> Q: Where would this be hosted?
> > > >> A: The provided link here is a cloud service which will be funded for
> > the
> > > >> foreseeable future.
> > > >
> > > > This is a crucial point here. Business decisions change and the
> > > > community has no influence on this. With my community hat on I
> > > > appreciate that there would be a sponsoring of a cloud service, but I
> > > > truly think we should not depend on this mid or long term (having it
> > run
> > > > there for a few month of migration would not worry me).
> > > > Even if it would be more paperwork having the sponsorship going to the
> > > > foundation and the service being paid out from there would be the
> > > > right way. We can acknowledge the sponsorship on our sponsors page.
> > > >
> > >
> > > I tend to agree here, unless we knew we had a simple easy way to migrate
> > > it to other hosting at anytime we needed.
> >
> > My experience leads me to be pretty adamant on not relying on cloud
> > services we
> > have to pay for eve if someone sponsors and pays for it. We lose control
> > and
> > reality is that these helping hands come and go. OSUOSL is a university
> > and they have been supporting OSS projects for a veery long time. We
> > need to
> > get our server into better shape though. Probably simpler shape.
> >
> > --
> > - Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" --
> > Carsten Haitzler - ras...@rasterman.com
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
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> >
>
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Re: [E-devel] Gitlab

[jaquilina]

Hi Guys,

In terms of infra what can i help with what needs to be sorted?

On 2018-09-22 14:57, Bertrand Jacquin wrote:

> This is something I do not agree with. I have been kicking into pants
> for problems with the infra for _years_ when doing Jenkins. It has
> changed nothing and I moved over to cloud services to get the control
> and flexibility I needed.

This is a result of policy from Beber of giving pretty minimal VM's 
with
limited ram/disk with gentoo. We have the resources - they are just 
not being
assigned and being able to provision your own is far too complex with 
what we
have. If all you had to do was run some libvirt cmds to spin up a new 
VM of

whatever size/config you wanted , I think you'd be fine.


Well, e5 clearly has not enough memory and CPU to support all the build
ran by Jenkins, this is why we had to split the building instances from
the hosting instances. Even still, current ressources are too limited.
You will not be able to have more than 10 instances running at the same
time.

Again, I'm 100% for someone else to take over and do it's own mistakes.

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Re: [E-devel] Gitlab

[jaquilina]

Here is as valid point to bring up. When was the last time the version 
of phab was updated? im sure there is a newer version that fixes alot of 
the issues that you guys might be encountering.



On 2018-09-15 08:45, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 12:57:07 +0200 Stefan Schmidt 


said:


Hello.

On 09/14/2018 09:48 AM, Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote:
> On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 12:44:52 +0200 Stefan Schmidt
>  said:
>> This is the core problem. OSUOL has indeed doing a great job for us over
>> the years for hosting and connectivity. But they can only be as good as
>> we allow them to be. Waiting for us for a fan to be shipped to be
>> replaced for over 6 months is nothing we are helping them with.
>>
>> To be blunt here our infra is a nightmare. To complex to manage for
>> anyone besides Beber. Beber not being available means _nothing_ changes.
>
> precisely. I would like to go back to something very simple. not a bunch of
> vm's or containers etc. ... my thoughts right now are a simple single sub
> vm on our current gentoo parent box. no fancy network layering/routing
> etc. ... then it's manageable for multiple people as it's simple and
> obvious and easy to figure out. yes. it's probably not as secure... but
> that's what the vm is for. extract the data out, and rebuild if the worst
> happens.
>
> or at least something like the above. something very simple to manage/set
> up/run etc.

As I am not going to handle anything of this my opinion on it is not
worth much. I find containers easy to use for such things. What I 
really
want to see in the end so is a system where we have a _group_ of 
people

having access and understanding the system.


I totally agree. I tend to leave things alone if they work. If they 
don't... I
often find that I have had to stick my fingers in and figure it out. 
I'd like
others to be able to do the same. It's a necessity of our project to be 
able to

do this.


>> Is that was all discussed during EDD in Malta in 2017 and promised to be
>> worked on. This was 15 months ago and I see zero impact so far.
>>
>> This is not about to point fingers to Beber. He has been helping us many
>> many years as a volunteer. He has all rights to take time off or even
>> disappear completely and we still should be thankful for the work he did.
>>
>> It is however a big problem in the project if we want to self host
>> everything, but our infra is simply not ready for it.
>
> well one big big big issue is the ipmi console. i have tried to get access
> to it. i have asked cedric and beber. without that there is no way i can do
> a kernel upgrade on a gentoo host because you have to compile by hand and
> something is bound to go wrong... and without that console there is no
> rescue.

I guess you should ask Beber how to get access to IPMI (password, etc)
and if he fails to reply you would need to go back to OSUOL. They 
should

still have you listed as a person with rights to access, I hope (?).


I have. to both. :( I need to try again.


>> To summarize: I share your concerns on cloud hosting with sponsoring,
>> but our infra is not ready for anything new. _If_ we move to gitlab
>> having it hosted for a few months on a cloud service with a migration
>> plan to our own infra is something I consider a fair deal.
>
> my gut and experience tells em few months then becomes a few years and then
> something goes wrong and we're in a dark place. :(

Not much difference from the dark place we are in right now with our 
own

infrastructure. :(


At least it's ours and we aren't footing a monthly bill...


> my take is that if there is to be any move in addition to it "being worth
> it" we have to get our infra into shape FIRST. let this be the kick in the
> pants to do that. if we just put that off then it will just never happen as
> above.

This is something I do not agree with. I have been kicking into pants
for problems with the infra for _years_ when doing Jenkins. It has
changed nothing and I moved over to cloud services to get the control
and flexibility I needed.


This is a result of policy from Beber of giving pretty minimal VM's 
with
limited ram/disk with gentoo. We have the resources - they are just not 
being
assigned and being able to provision your own is far too complex with 
what we
have. If all you had to do was run some libvirt cmds to spin up a new 
VM of

whatever size/config you wanted , I think you'd be fine.


Making a fixed infra a dependency for the potential move to gitlab is
not reasonable in my opinion. Forcing it to wait on something that has
not happened in 15 months and putting the extra work on the shoulders 
on

people who want to handle the move. Its like telling someone who wants
to add a new elm widgets to finish interfaces and get it out of beta
first. :-)


It's a change of management/direction away from being dumped onto the
community's laps. What we have works. It has its warts. Everything else 
does

too.

The infra problem should get tackled 

[E-devel] gitlab test instance

[jaquilina]

Hi Guys,

So the setup for gitlab was super simple for a clean new installation. 
If any one is interested do let me know and ill get you the link and 
once you register and setup an account I can give you guys that will 
need it gitlab admin access.


Let me know if you guys are interested.

Regards,
Jonathan


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[E-devel] Gitlab test instance

[jaquilina]

Hi guys,

I know alot of you havent had a chance to play around with gitlab. I am 
setting up a linode instance with gitlab for playing around with I have 
included backups as they are dirt cheap, and once everything is setup I 
will take a snapshot so if you guys break it all you need to do is let 
me know and I can restore from the snapshot.


Also I know you guys mentioned using cloud services. Linode what I like 
the most about them they arent expensive is the first thing, the second 
thing is that I can give those that want and need access to manage the 
infrastructure (VPS) access to individual accounts so if I am not around 
you guys can administer the VPS. I would highly advocate linode as a 
temporary solution until we get our main machine in working order.


You can also keep the vps if you opt to do so and turn the main server's 
that e have into CI servers.



I thought i would let you guys know about this. Git lab from what I 
found on the documentation is rather easy to setup from the looks of 
things.



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Re: [E-devel] Gitlab

[jaquilina]

How much space are we looking at as I am thinking a VPS running centos 
or even debian would be enough and then docker on it


On 2018-09-13 00:43, Simon Lees wrote:

One positive of migrating to gitlab if its done right ie containerized
is the fact that it should be simple to move, so if someone can provide
a machine and hosting somewhere it can sit there until the point until
it no longer works for whatever reason or someone comes along with a
better solution, at which point recreating the infra then migrating the
data to a new server is a simple process. If it reaches a point where 
no

one is willing to provide infra we can equally move onto a public cloud
for as long as necessary.

As long as the gitlab instance is created right this is probably a 
major

reason I think its worth migrating. I also don't have the time to do it
so if it doesn't happen I wont complain but I think that if we do
something it should be done properly otherwise we may as well stay with
what we have.

On 13/09/2018 02:49, jaquil...@eagleeyet.net wrote:

To be fair I am more than willing ot sponsor a server at OVH and give
ssh access to those that need it.

On 2018-09-12 11:45, Stephen Houston wrote:
OSUOSL is great. But it's pointless when none of us can get the 
access we

need to the server and when the person that has/controls that access
takes
forever and a day to communicate and/or wont budge. Help has been 
offered

in sysadmin for years from multiple devs who are sysadmins by trade
and who
could handle the complexity, and there is absolutely no change and it 
is

not allowed. Further, Stefan is being generous... it has been more
like 10
months, nearly a year since OSUOSL asked us to replace the fan. This 
is
frankly embarrassing. We cant even get a model number so that one of 
us

could personally drop ship it to them. That really looks bad on us...
Again
that is basically humiliating.  With all of these issues I think it 
would

be a great improvement to moved to sponsored cloud hosting. We would
actually have access and not have to worry about the hardware
maintenance.

On Wed, Sep 12, 2018, 3:33 AM Carsten Haitzler 
wrote:


On Thu, 30 Aug 2018 19:49:29 +0930 Simon Lees  said:

>
>
> On 30/08/2018 18:57, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> > Hello.
> >
> > On 08/10/2018 08:09 PM, Mike Blumenkrantz wrote:
> >>
> >> Q: Where would this be hosted?
> >> A: The provided link here is a cloud service which will be
funded for
the
> >> foreseeable future.
> >
> > This is a crucial point here. Business decisions change and the
> > community has no influence on this. With my community hat on I
> > appreciate that there would be a sponsoring of a cloud service,
but I
> > truly think we should not depend on this mid or long term (having it
run
> > there for a few month of migration would not worry me).
> > Even if it would be more paperwork having the sponsorship going
to the
> > foundation and the service being paid out from there would be the
right
> > way. We can acknowledge the sponsorship on our sponsors page.
> >
>
> I tend to agree here, unless we knew we had a simple easy way to
migrate
> it to other hosting at anytime we needed.

My experience leads me to be pretty adamant on not relying on cloud
services we
have to pay for eve if someone sponsors and pays for it. We lose 
control

and
reality is that these helping hands come and go. OSUOSL is a
university and
they have been supporting OSS projects for a veery long time. We
need
to
get our server into better shape though. Probably simpler shape.

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Re: [E-devel] Gitlab

[jaquilina]

To be fair I am more than willing ot sponsor a server at OVH and give 
ssh access to those that need it.


On 2018-09-12 11:45, Stephen Houston wrote:
OSUOSL is great. But it's pointless when none of us can get the access 
we
need to the server and when the person that has/controls that access 
takes
forever and a day to communicate and/or wont budge. Help has been 
offered
in sysadmin for years from multiple devs who are sysadmins by trade and 
who
could handle the complexity, and there is absolutely no change and it 
is
not allowed. Further, Stefan is being generous... it has been more like 
10

months, nearly a year since OSUOSL asked us to replace the fan. This is
frankly embarrassing. We cant even get a model number so that one of us
could personally drop ship it to them. That really looks bad on us... 
Again
that is basically humiliating.  With all of these issues I think it 
would

be a great improvement to moved to sponsored cloud hosting. We would
actually have access and not have to worry about the hardware 
maintenance.


On Wed, Sep 12, 2018, 3:33 AM Carsten Haitzler  
wrote:



On Thu, 30 Aug 2018 19:49:29 +0930 Simon Lees  said:

>
>
> On 30/08/2018 18:57, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> > Hello.
> >
> > On 08/10/2018 08:09 PM, Mike Blumenkrantz wrote:
> >>
> >> Q: Where would this be hosted?
> >> A: The provided link here is a cloud service which will be funded for
the
> >> foreseeable future.
> >
> > This is a crucial point here. Business decisions change and the
> > community has no influence on this. With my community hat on I
> > appreciate that there would be a sponsoring of a cloud service, but I
> > truly think we should not depend on this mid or long term (having it
run
> > there for a few month of migration would not worry me).
> > Even if it would be more paperwork having the sponsorship going to the
> > foundation and the service being paid out from there would be the right
> > way. We can acknowledge the sponsorship on our sponsors page.
> >
>
> I tend to agree here, unless we knew we had a simple easy way to migrate
> it to other hosting at anytime we needed.

My experience leads me to be pretty adamant on not relying on cloud
services we
have to pay for eve if someone sponsors and pays for it. We lose 
control

and
reality is that these helping hands come and go. OSUOSL is a 
university and
they have been supporting OSS projects for a veery long time. We 
need

to
get our server into better shape though. Probably simpler shape.

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--

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Re: [E-devel] Gitlab

[jaquilina]

I am interested in helping with this project. I would also be very 
interested in taking charge of a bug triaging team. and closing out 
fixed bugs as well as this will give us a chance to have a clean tracker 
with only open and valid bugs



On 2018-09-06 15:07, Mike Blumenkrantz wrote:
We've had some great feedback in this thread, but this is a big 
decision
and there are still a number of key people who have not replied, making 
any

sort of transition infeasible at this time.

As for who is doing migration: I am willing to help with this and teach
people everything that is needed for migration/setup. This does not,
however, mean that I will handle it all by myself; I am not a primary
driver for switching off phabricator--though I do think it is 
objectively
worse than gitlab for many things--I am just the guy who put together 
some

script modifications and spent 5 minutes setting up a cloud instance.

On Wed, Sep 5, 2018 at 8:11 AM Stefan Schmidt 


wrote:


Hello.

I can't find answers to my questions raised in this reply.

As I just had a private conversation with q66 on the potential move 
let

me ask one core question again.

Who is driving this transition and doing the work to get it all 
deployed?


People seem to be under the impression it would be you or your intern,
but I never heard a confirmation on this. If any of the supporters in
this thread want to step up and driving this now would be a good time.

regards
Stefan Schmidt


On 09/04/2018 05:45 PM, Mike Blumenkrantz wrote:
> I've uploaded the script from my intern here:
> https://git.enlightenment.org/devs/zmike/bztogl.git/
>
> In the event that anyone is interested in using this script on a
different
> gitlab instance (which can be trivially set up locally using the official
> community edition gitlab docker image):
> * have phabricator api token
> * have gitlab api token
> * import project repository using gitlab web interface
> * edit L760 of bztogl/phabtogl.py to point to gitlab instance
> * run example: phabtogl --token $gitlab_token --target-project efl/efl
> --project efl --callsign EFL
>  - script may stall and need to be run a few times per project
>
> Feel free to commit any changes to the script directly to this repo.
>
> On Thu, Aug 30, 2018 at 5:28 AM Stefan Schmidt <
ste...@datenfreihafen.org>
> wrote:
>
>> Hello.
>>
>> On 08/10/2018 08:09 PM, Mike Blumenkrantz wrote:
>>>
>>> https://gitlab-prototype.s-opensource.org/
>>
>> Thanks to the intern without name to get a real PoC out for this.
>> While people have advocating for such a move no one before her/him spent
>> the actual time to get this demonstrated!
>>
>> This will help us to understand the details of a potential move way
better.
>>
>>>
>>> Some notes:
>>> * This is read-only for now
>>> * User creation is disabled, don't bother trying
>>> * Issues with their comments have been imported
>>
>> Cool
>>
>>> * Patch submissions have been imported (the intern screwed up some of
the
>>> early imports so there are a few patches without the diff inlined)
>>>   - Comments on patch submissions cannot be imported because
Phabricator
>>> has no API for retrieving comments on patch review
>>
>> That is a bit of a pity. One could think of scraping the original
>> diffusion web pages for the comments. Not sure if it would really be
>> worth the effort spent on a script doing that.
>>
>> If we are able to clear out our patch queue enough this issue would
minor.
>>
>>> * Wiki pages are not imported since some decision-making is required
>>>
>>> As is easily noticeable, not all projects have been imported by my
>> intern.
>>> Importing the repo takes some time on its own, and then running the
>>> migration script takes a variable amount of time on top of that
depending
>>> on the size of the project (EFL was estimated to take 10+ hours to
fully
>>> import).
>>
>> As a first demonstration this helps already. If the community wants to
>> go this way we can have further steps where we import more projects and
>> check for consistency and sanity. I would expect there would be several
>> of such cycles before we are happy and would make a final switch
>>
>>> Wiki pages have not been imported. On Gitlab, a wiki is
project-specific
>>> and so it is impossible to do a 1:1 copy unless we decided to stick
>>> everything onto a specific project. We would have to decide how we want
>> to
>>> do this.
>>
>> Hmm. The way we used the phab wiki was really for the overall community
>> and not individual projects. Having said that I would think that most of
>> the wiki pages could be attached to efl, EFL or Terminology. The rest
>> will most likely be pages on process (commits guidelines, releases, etc)
>>
>> There will also be a ton of outdated pages which could simply be
removed.
>>
>> In the end we would need to go through all of them and decide what to
>> do. e.g move process docs into dokuwiki, remove outdated ones, move to a
>> specific project.
>>
>> If we should do this sortign before or 

Re: [E-devel] Gitlab

[jaquilina]

Also to add I think stuff wiht lack of activity or things have changed 
for now should be closed as well. I see the issue tracker as something 
for key issues that are reproducible as well as key things that need to 
get done that are key for a release or bugs to be fixed.


On 2018-08-16 14:38, Jonathan Aquilina wrote:

The way I see it if there is lack of activity it gets closed and if
need be reopened when the issue resurfaced

Sent from my iPhone

On 16 Aug 2018, at 16:29, Mike Blumenkrantz 
 wrote:


I am a bit curious where you think we need this much work with 
triaging?


The biggest issue that we will have here is actually from our
passive-aggressive method of rejecting things we don't like. For 
example,
there are many, many patches that have been rejected and are idle for 
a
long time but not abandoned. These will not be closed using the 
current
migration method. There are also unlimited tickets set to 'pending on 
user
input' which are dead; these also will not be closed. Most likely both 
of

these types of open items should just be closed during migration.

On Sat, Aug 11, 2018 at 2:56 AM Jonathan Aquilina 


wrote:

Guess then would be to migrate everything and I’ll work on triaging 
the

bigs after

Sent from my iPhone


On 11 Aug 2018, at 08:23, Pierre Couderc  wrote:

On 08/11/2018 07:30 AM, jaquil...@eagleeyet.net wrote:
If we are going to migrate I think we should migrate tickets slowly 
to
see which ones are still valid and not pollute the new tracker with 
issues

that are either moot or no longer valid.


Mmm, it is not logical. Migrate is a thing. Process tickets is 
another

thing. Trying to do 2 independant things simulteaneoulsy?




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Re: [E-devel] EFL 1.22 Development and Features

[jaquilina]

Stupid question if you prefer i will email you off list but how do i 
find the groups on phab?


On 2018-08-13 16:43, Mike Blumenkrantz wrote:

Sure, though currently all that's needed is to join the group on
phabricator...

On Mon, Aug 13, 2018 at 12:28 PM  wrote:


Hi All,

I am interested in joining the release team to help with things

@zmike can i touch base with you on irc at some point this week as I 
am
on vacation in spain and will have alot of time on my hands to chat 
and

get things going.

Regards,
Jonathan

On 2018-08-13 12:16, Al Poole wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> With the 1.21 release of EFL coming to closure and its soon release,
> now is the right time for us all to decide where to focus development
> efforts in the EFL 1.22 release cycle.
>
> There will be 12 weeks of development time available for 1.22.
>
> There are two polls listing proposed changes in this new development
> cycle.
>
> You can keep track of them both here:
>
> https://phab.enlightenment.org/T7283
>
> The two polls are at: https://phab.enlightenment.org/V36 and
> https://phab.enlightenment.org/V37.
>
> Please can you spend some time looking at these proposals and express
> your opinion on which of these proposals you oppose work being done on
> in the EFL 1.22 development time.
>
> Thanks very much,
>
> Alastair (netstar)
>
>
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Re: [E-devel] EFL 1.22 Development and Features

[jaquilina]

Hi All,

I am interested in joining the release team to help with things

@zmike can i touch base with you on irc at some point this week as I am 
on vacation in spain and will have alot of time on my hands to chat and 
get things going.


Regards,
Jonathan

On 2018-08-13 12:16, Al Poole wrote:

Hello all,

With the 1.21 release of EFL coming to closure and its soon release,
now is the right time for us all to decide where to focus development
efforts in the EFL 1.22 release cycle.

There will be 12 weeks of development time available for 1.22.

There are two polls listing proposed changes in this new development 
cycle.


You can keep track of them both here:

https://phab.enlightenment.org/T7283

The two polls are at: https://phab.enlightenment.org/V36 and
https://phab.enlightenment.org/V37.

Please can you spend some time looking at these proposals and express
your opinion on which of these proposals you oppose work being done on
in the EFL 1.22 development time.

Thanks very much,

Alastair (netstar)

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Re: [E-devel] Gitlab

[jaquilina]

If we are going to migrate I think we should migrate tickets slowly to 
see which ones are still valid and not pollute the new tracker with 
issues that are either moot or no longer valid.


On 2018-08-10 18:09, Mike Blumenkrantz wrote:

Hello,

For some time now, everyone in the community has been expressing
significant dissatisfaction with the current project management 
software,
Phabricator. A number of individuals have proposed switching to Gitlab 
for

various reasons.

Some will recall that recently all of the FDO infrastructure migrated 
from
Phabricator to Gitlab thanks in large part to an incredible, 
hand-crafted
migration script authored by notable open source figure Daniel Stone. 
While

this script was not exactly what could be used to migrate our own
infrastructure, it gave me an idea.

Thanks to a low-pay intern who just graduated and whose name I don't
recall, work began to modify the original FDO migration script and 
update
it to handle various features exclusive to our usage of Phabricator. 
Thanks
to generous hosting provided by the basement of the intern's parents, I 
was

able to review the work as it progressed to see if it would be worth
showing to the community.

Weeks have passed, and now, thanks to many sleepless nights and long
weekends that this devoted intern spent doing devops work, I was able 
to
provide justification for more robust hosting and acquire a cloud 
service

to host an official proof-of-concept for a Gitlab migration:

https://gitlab-prototype.s-opensource.org/

Some notes:
* This is read-only for now
* User creation is disabled, don't bother trying
* Issues with their comments have been imported
* Patch submissions have been imported (the intern screwed up some of 
the

early imports so there are a few patches without the diff inlined)
  - Comments on patch submissions cannot be imported because 
Phabricator

has no API for retrieving comments on patch review
* Wiki pages are not imported since some decision-making is required

As is easily noticeable, not all projects have been imported by my 
intern.

Importing the repo takes some time on its own, and then running the
migration script takes a variable amount of time on top of that 
depending
on the size of the project (EFL was estimated to take 10+ hours to 
fully

import).

Wiki pages have not been imported. On Gitlab, a wiki is 
project-specific

and so it is impossible to do a 1:1 copy unless we decided to stick
everything onto a specific project. We would have to decide how we want 
to

do this.

If we decided to switch to Gitlab, there would be a number of questions
that need to be answered:
Q: How do we migrate?
A: Gitlab cannot accurately mirror all of Phabricator, it can only do a
one-time migration of projects. This means we would at some point lock 
phab
and then begin migrating, likely over a weekend for the major projects 
with

the remainders being added later.

Q: What happens to phab?
A: We would likely want to keep phab in read-only mode for a while 
after
the migration since all the migrated tickets/patches will provide links 
to

it. We can later evaluate if we need to keep it running.

Q: Where would this be hosted?
A: The provided link here is a cloud service which will be funded for 
the
foreseeable future. At present I am very strongly opposed to hosting 
this
anywhere on the existing EFL infrastructure since it has been 
impossible

for anyone to get access to any part of the server or to have tasks
reliably handled in anything but a random and notification-less manner. 
A

community project cannot have infrastructure which is unable to be
accessed, managed, or maintained by the community which is using it.

Regards,
Mike
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[E-devel] Quality of bugs on phab

[jaquilina]

Hi Guys,

I think a good place for me to start as I fight with getting things 
built on fedora from git is that of traging of bugs that have had no 
activity for an extended period of time. I am posting a comment on them 
to see if I get any feedback and if there is no feed back I will mark a 
note on it for those subscribed to reopen the ticket if its still valid.


Also I am seeing alot of bug reports of very low quality. In the sense 
there isnt any detail as to what the issue is. Is there a work flow that 
we can setup to ensure a standard of bug reports is met in the sense 
what steps we can take to try and reproduce as well as maybe hardware 
specs.


I am sending this more to open up a discussion on this as i feel like 
phab should be used to help us report issues that developers can then 
try to reproduce and if replicated fixed.


Regards,
Jonathan.

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Re: [E-devel] Mac server sponsorship

[jaquilina]

Hi Carsten,

Thanks for the update. I am in search of another mac host provider. I 
know back in 2009 that osx was around 12gb installed then at some point 
they managed to get that down to 6gb for the os installed. My suspicion 
is that they moved alot of big apps like xcode out of the os and onto 
the app store.



On 2018-07-28 05:40, Carsten Haitzler wrote:

On Sat, 28 Jul 2018 04:56:44 + jaquil...@eagleeyet.net said:


Hi All,

I am looking at this to see what I can get and the initial provider I
found sadly his page is saying sold out on all models granted 2 say 
sign

up.

My question though is how much storage space for code as well as the
built product is needed?


spare space beyond dependencies and OS that is NEEDED is about 1gb, but 
that's
a bare minimum (well ok 700m for an efl git tree plus build files, with 
some
extra space for the install). once you start using ccache and need 
space for
comfort, maybe 8gb? that's beyond the base os + dependencies. i don't 
know how
much osx uses and i might hazard a guess that dependencies beyond basic 
osx
might add up to 200-500m. so maybe 16gb and call it a day if osx isn't 
too

bloated...


On 2018-07-25 06:54, Stefan Schmidt wrote:
> Hello.
>
> On 25.07.2018 08:41, Jonathan Aquilina wrote:
>> Seeing as there is quite a bit of interest in this tonight, which is
>> going to probably be the first evening relaxed at home with my wife
>> since we got back from the honeymoon, I will purchase the server. Can
>> someone open up some tickets on Phabricator with what you guys want me
>> to do and what the end goal is that way progress can be tracked by
>> those following the ticket.  If not I will open a ticket on my
>> helpdesk.
>>
>> I’m also a bit concerned about accuracy of documentation. Is
>> everything up to date?
>
> https://www.enlightenment.org/docs/distros/osx-start.md
> https://git.enlightenment.org/core/efl.git/tree/.ci/ci-osx-deps.sh
> https://git.enlightenment.org/core/efl.git/tree/.ci/ci-osx-build.sh
>
> This is what I used when setting up the osx builds on Travis. Likely
> there are more details to figure out.
>
> regards
> Stefan Schmidt
>
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Re: [E-devel] Mac server sponsorship

[jaquilina]

Hi All,

I am looking at this to see what I can get and the initial provider I 
found sadly his page is saying sold out on all models granted 2 say sign 
up.


My question though is how much storage space for code as well as the 
built product is needed?


On 2018-07-25 06:54, Stefan Schmidt wrote:

Hello.

On 25.07.2018 08:41, Jonathan Aquilina wrote:
Seeing as there is quite a bit of interest in this tonight, which is 
going to probably be the first evening relaxed at home with my wife 
since we got back from the honeymoon, I will purchase the server. Can 
someone open up some tickets on Phabricator with what you guys want me 
to do and what the end goal is that way progress can be tracked by 
those following the ticket.  If not I will open a ticket on my 
helpdesk.


I’m also a bit concerned about accuracy of documentation. Is 
everything up to date?


https://www.enlightenment.org/docs/distros/osx-start.md
https://git.enlightenment.org/core/efl.git/tree/.ci/ci-osx-deps.sh
https://git.enlightenment.org/core/efl.git/tree/.ci/ci-osx-build.sh

This is what I used when setting up the osx builds on Travis. Likely
there are more details to figure out.

regards
Stefan Schmidt

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Re: [E-devel] Mac server sponsorship

[jaquilina]

I have no problem with setting it up with harbourmaster.

Do you have any documentation on how to set it up or how to interact 
with HM?


On 2018-07-24 07:21, Stefan Schmidt wrote:

Hello.

On 23.07.2018 18:31, Mike Blumenkrantz wrote:

Actually, if we were able to do Mac builds elsewhere then this would
greatly improve our CI build times. Mac builders on Travis are very 
highly
contested and so have even fewer resources available than Linux 
builders.
Even on my CI feature branch, Mac builds take 2x longer (10+ mins 
more)

than Linux builds.


The problem is that you can not simply hook up some external osx server
to Travis to speed it up. Its a completely different resource. The only
way I could see it used for CI would be through Phabricator's 
harbourmaster.


regards
Stefan Schmidt

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Re: [E-devel] Mac server sponsorship

[jaquilina]

Leave setup and administration to me.

Is this a green light on this?

On 2018-07-24 07:28, Stefan Schmidt wrote:

Hello.

On 23.07.2018 11:11, Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote:
On Mon, 23 Jul 2018 09:42:43 +0200 Stefan Schmidt 


said:


Hello.

On 23.07.2018 06:59, jaquil...@eagleeyet.net wrote:

Hi Guys,

I am willing to work on getting a CI setup on a mac machine going.

I am willing to sponsor a server. I happened to find the following

https://www.hostmyapple.com/macdedicated.html

What do you guys think?


You know that we already have CI testing on OSX via TravisCI?

What would this do better than the current CI setup we have?

https://travis-ci.org/Enlightenment/efl (look at the build job with 
an

apple as logo)


run apps and debug them interactively? you'd need vnc or some remote
display/access setup ...but that. :) it'd require people to not fight 
over the

same display... i.e. one person at a time... :)


If we have one osx system for CI builds and another one for debugging
problems on OSX I easily see how they could be very different in terms
of OSX versions, libraries, homebrew installs, etc.

Anyway, I do not want to shoot this down. As long as someone else will
take care of it and handles things I just take it as a gift horse. :-)

regards
Stefan Schmidt

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Re: [E-devel] Mac server sponsorship

[jaquilina]

I think an ideal place for me to help the project is on the mac side of 
things. I can only sponsor 1 server.


On 2018-07-24 14:01, Mike Blumenkrantz wrote:
Sure, it would have to go through harbormaster or similar and we would 
not

be mailing the server to Travis for them to use.

Any series of builds which requires a macos on Travis is subject to 
delay
until a macos builder can be provided, meaning we may end up having to 
wait

an undetermined amount of time for each new build if a lot of macos
builders are in use. If we could eliminate that builder from our build
matrix, it would help us from this angle.

On Tue, Jul 24, 2018 at 3:22 AM Stefan Schmidt 


wrote:


Hello.

On 23.07.2018 18:31, Mike Blumenkrantz wrote:
> Actually, if we were able to do Mac builds elsewhere then this would
> greatly improve our CI build times. Mac builders on Travis are very
highly
> contested and so have even fewer resources available than Linux builders.
> Even on my CI feature branch, Mac builds take 2x longer (10+ mins more)
> than Linux builds.

The problem is that you can not simply hook up some external osx 
server
to Travis to speed it up. Its a completely different resource. The 
only

way I could see it used for CI would be through Phabricator's
harbourmaster.

regards
Stefan Schmidt


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[E-devel] Mac server sponsorship

[jaquilina]

Hi Guys,

I am willing to work on getting a CI setup on a mac machine going.

I am willing to sponsor a server. I happened to find the following

https://www.hostmyapple.com/macdedicated.html

What do you guys think?

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Re: [E-devel] A (Serious) Note Regarding Eflete

[jaquilina]

On 2018-06-29 09:29, Carsten Haitzler wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jun 2018 05:44:37 + jaquil...@eagleeyet.net said:


I will start working on this once I am back from my honeymoon on the
22nd as I am getting married tomorrow so hopefully I can find some 
tags

on phab by then to work on with some guidance :)


oh congrats + good luck! don't let anything distract you from your more
important tasks tomorrow. :)


Hey Raster,

Just saw this now it was a killer night. Off the grid for the next two 
weeks as of tomorrow. Hope to get things going to help with creating 
unit tests when I am back.





On 2018-06-29 05:40, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
> On Fri, 29 Jun 2018 05:31:20 + jaquil...@eagleeyet.net said:
>
>> Can someone start tagging bugs that need unit tests or is that already
>> done?
>
> That is a good idea. From now on when I see a bug that seems it could
> do with a
> unit test (i.e. it's readily unit-testable), I'll add some tag - TBD.
>
>> On 2018-06-28 11:28, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
>> > On Thu, 28 Jun 2018 05:25:42 + jaquil...@eagleeyet.net said:
>> >
>> >> Hi all,
>> >>
>> >> I think writing unit tests would be good for someone like me whose new
>> >> to the code base if it helps to catch issues. My question though is do
>> >> we have a tags on phab where senior devs post tickets for tests that
>> >> someone like me can grab and start working on?
>> >
>> > you are absolutely right. it would be very helpful. turning  a bug into
>> > a unit
>> > test would be a great way of tackling little bite-sized bits of work
>> > that still
>> > are kind of a time-sink.
>> >
>> >> On 2018-06-28 04:36, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
>> >> > On Wed, 27 Jun 2018 13:14:39 -0400 Mike Blumenkrantz
>> >> >  said:
>> >> >
>> >> >> I don't think we need to do testing in EFL, we do have unit test
>> >> >> coverage
>> >> >> for these functions and they pass. Given that this has never occurred
>> >> >> in
>> >> >> any other circumstance (and we have testing), this should be
>> >> >> considered an
>> >> >> application bug only; I've already filed a ticket for it.
>> >> >
>> >> > Well first reproducing it (in a test environment) and grabbing a
>> >> > backtrace to
>> >> > unlink() functions called with gdb so we know the code path that
>> >> > caused it. I
>> >> > to am doubtful it's EFL itself just deciding to delete. It's probably
>> >> > something
>> >> > triggered by the app, but could it be a change in response from EFL
>> >> > that then
>> >> > triggers code logic to do this? We won't know until we find the root
>> >> > trigger
>> >> > (the above bt) and then figure out the logic that caused it to run. :)
>> >> >
>> >> >> On Wed, Jun 27, 2018 at 11:03 AM Stephen Houston
>> >> >> 
>> >> >> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> > Okay we need to do some testing and make sure changes to
>> >> >> > eina/ecore/eio file ops are not the culprit, because if they are...
>> >> >> > Ephoto, Rage, Terminology, EFM, many gadgets, etc... are all
>> >> >> > possible to do the same.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > On Wed, Jun 27, 2018, 9:56 AM Xavi Artigas
>> >> >> >  wrote:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > > What? I have been working with it on my dev machine!
>> >> >> > > I hope my recent changes to bring it back to life didn't cause
>> >> >> > > this...
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > Xavi
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > El lun., 25 jun. 2018 9:06 p. m., Mike Blumenkrantz <
>> >> >> > > michael.blumenkra...@gmail.com> escribió:
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > > Hi,
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > Do not attempt to use Eflete.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > I was attempting to examine a related issue from phab today on
>> >> >> > > > my test machine and Eflete somehow managed to delete nearly
>> >> >> > > > EVERYTHING from my
>> >> >> > > home
>> >> >> > > > directory. All my .directories, all my source trees, everything
>> >> >> > deleted.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > Fortunately, this was only a testing machine and nothing other
>> >> >> > > > than
>> >> >> > some
>> >> >> > > > local configs were lost.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > DO NOT USE EFLETE.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > Regards,
>> >> >> > > > Mike
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > 
--
>> >> >> > > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> >> >> > > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> >> >> > > > ___
>> >> >> > > > enlightenment-devel mailing list
>> >> >> > > > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>> >> >> > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > 
--
>> >> >> > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> >> >> > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> >> >> > > ___

Re: [E-devel] A (Serious) Note Regarding Eflete

[jaquilina]

I will start working on this once I am back from my honeymoon on the 
22nd as I am getting married tomorrow so hopefully I can find some tags 
on phab by then to work on with some guidance :)


On 2018-06-29 05:40, Carsten Haitzler wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jun 2018 05:31:20 + jaquil...@eagleeyet.net said:


Can someone start tagging bugs that need unit tests or is that already
done?


That is a good idea. From now on when I see a bug that seems it could 
do with a

unit test (i.e. it's readily unit-testable), I'll add some tag - TBD.


On 2018-06-28 11:28, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
> On Thu, 28 Jun 2018 05:25:42 + jaquil...@eagleeyet.net said:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I think writing unit tests would be good for someone like me whose new
>> to the code base if it helps to catch issues. My question though is do
>> we have a tags on phab where senior devs post tickets for tests that
>> someone like me can grab and start working on?
>
> you are absolutely right. it would be very helpful. turning  a bug into
> a unit
> test would be a great way of tackling little bite-sized bits of work
> that still
> are kind of a time-sink.
>
>> On 2018-06-28 04:36, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
>> > On Wed, 27 Jun 2018 13:14:39 -0400 Mike Blumenkrantz
>> >  said:
>> >
>> >> I don't think we need to do testing in EFL, we do have unit test
>> >> coverage
>> >> for these functions and they pass. Given that this has never occurred
>> >> in
>> >> any other circumstance (and we have testing), this should be
>> >> considered an
>> >> application bug only; I've already filed a ticket for it.
>> >
>> > Well first reproducing it (in a test environment) and grabbing a
>> > backtrace to
>> > unlink() functions called with gdb so we know the code path that caused
>> > it. I
>> > to am doubtful it's EFL itself just deciding to delete. It's probably
>> > something
>> > triggered by the app, but could it be a change in response from EFL
>> > that then
>> > triggers code logic to do this? We won't know until we find the root
>> > trigger
>> > (the above bt) and then figure out the logic that caused it to run. :)
>> >
>> >> On Wed, Jun 27, 2018 at 11:03 AM Stephen Houston
>> >> 
>> >> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > Okay we need to do some testing and make sure changes to
>> >> > eina/ecore/eio file ops are not the culprit, because if they are...
>> >> > Ephoto, Rage, Terminology, EFM, many gadgets, etc... are all possible
>> >> > to do the same.
>> >> >
>> >> > On Wed, Jun 27, 2018, 9:56 AM Xavi Artigas 
>> >> > wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > > What? I have been working with it on my dev machine!
>> >> > > I hope my recent changes to bring it back to life didn't cause
>> >> > > this...
>> >> > >
>> >> > > Xavi
>> >> > >
>> >> > > El lun., 25 jun. 2018 9:06 p. m., Mike Blumenkrantz <
>> >> > > michael.blumenkra...@gmail.com> escribió:
>> >> > >
>> >> > > > Hi,
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > > Do not attempt to use Eflete.
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > > I was attempting to examine a related issue from phab today on my
>> >> > > > test machine and Eflete somehow managed to delete nearly
>> >> > > > EVERYTHING from my
>> >> > > home
>> >> > > > directory. All my .directories, all my source trees, everything
>> >> > deleted.
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > > Fortunately, this was only a testing machine and nothing other
>> >> > > > than
>> >> > some
>> >> > > > local configs were lost.
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > > DO NOT USE EFLETE.
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > > Regards,
>> >> > > > Mike
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > 
--
>> >> > > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> >> > > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> >> > > > ___
>> >> > > > enlightenment-devel mailing list
>> >> > > > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>> >> > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
>> >> > > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > 
--
>> >> > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> >> > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> >> > > ___
>> >> > > enlightenment-devel mailing list
>> >> > > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>> >> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
>> >> > >
>> >> >
>> >> > 
--
>> >> > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> >> > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> >> > ___
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>> >> > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>> >> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
>> >> >
>> >> 

Re: [E-devel] A (Serious) Note Regarding Eflete

[jaquilina]

Can someone start tagging bugs that need unit tests or is that already 
done?


On 2018-06-28 11:28, Carsten Haitzler wrote:

On Thu, 28 Jun 2018 05:25:42 + jaquil...@eagleeyet.net said:


Hi all,

I think writing unit tests would be good for someone like me whose new
to the code base if it helps to catch issues. My question though is do
we have a tags on phab where senior devs post tickets for tests that
someone like me can grab and start working on?


you are absolutely right. it would be very helpful. turning  a bug into 
a unit
test would be a great way of tackling little bite-sized bits of work 
that still

are kind of a time-sink.


On 2018-06-28 04:36, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Jun 2018 13:14:39 -0400 Mike Blumenkrantz
>  said:
>
>> I don't think we need to do testing in EFL, we do have unit test
>> coverage
>> for these functions and they pass. Given that this has never occurred
>> in
>> any other circumstance (and we have testing), this should be
>> considered an
>> application bug only; I've already filed a ticket for it.
>
> Well first reproducing it (in a test environment) and grabbing a
> backtrace to
> unlink() functions called with gdb so we know the code path that caused
> it. I
> to am doubtful it's EFL itself just deciding to delete. It's probably
> something
> triggered by the app, but could it be a change in response from EFL
> that then
> triggers code logic to do this? We won't know until we find the root
> trigger
> (the above bt) and then figure out the logic that caused it to run. :)
>
>> On Wed, Jun 27, 2018 at 11:03 AM Stephen Houston
>> 
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Okay we need to do some testing and make sure changes to eina/ecore/eio
>> > file ops are not the culprit, because if they are... Ephoto, Rage,
>> > Terminology, EFM, many gadgets, etc... are all possible to do the same.
>> >
>> > On Wed, Jun 27, 2018, 9:56 AM Xavi Artigas 
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> > > What? I have been working with it on my dev machine!
>> > > I hope my recent changes to bring it back to life didn't cause this...
>> > >
>> > > Xavi
>> > >
>> > > El lun., 25 jun. 2018 9:06 p. m., Mike Blumenkrantz <
>> > > michael.blumenkra...@gmail.com> escribió:
>> > >
>> > > > Hi,
>> > > >
>> > > > Do not attempt to use Eflete.
>> > > >
>> > > > I was attempting to examine a related issue from phab today on my
>> > > > test machine and Eflete somehow managed to delete nearly EVERYTHING
>> > > > from my
>> > > home
>> > > > directory. All my .directories, all my source trees, everything
>> > deleted.
>> > > >
>> > > > Fortunately, this was only a testing machine and nothing other than
>> > some
>> > > > local configs were lost.
>> > > >
>> > > > DO NOT USE EFLETE.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > Regards,
>> > > > Mike
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > >
>> > 
--
>> > > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> > > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> > > > ___
>> > > > enlightenment-devel mailing list
>> > > > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>> > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
>> > > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > 
--
>> > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> > > ___
>> > > enlightenment-devel mailing list
>> > > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
>> > >
>> >
>> > 
--
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>> > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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>> > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
>> >
>> 
--
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>> enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel

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Re: [E-devel] A (Serious) Note Regarding Eflete

[jaquilina]

Hi all,

I think writing unit tests would be good for someone like me whose new 
to the code base if it helps to catch issues. My question though is do 
we have a tags on phab where senior devs post tickets for tests that 
someone like me can grab and start working on?


On 2018-06-28 04:36, Carsten Haitzler wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jun 2018 13:14:39 -0400 Mike Blumenkrantz
 said:

I don't think we need to do testing in EFL, we do have unit test 
coverage
for these functions and they pass. Given that this has never occurred 
in
any other circumstance (and we have testing), this should be 
considered an

application bug only; I've already filed a ticket for it.


Well first reproducing it (in a test environment) and grabbing a 
backtrace to
unlink() functions called with gdb so we know the code path that caused 
it. I
to am doubtful it's EFL itself just deciding to delete. It's probably 
something
triggered by the app, but could it be a change in response from EFL 
that then
triggers code logic to do this? We won't know until we find the root 
trigger

(the above bt) and then figure out the logic that caused it to run. :)

On Wed, Jun 27, 2018 at 11:03 AM Stephen Houston 


wrote:

> Okay we need to do some testing and make sure changes to eina/ecore/eio
> file ops are not the culprit, because if they are... Ephoto, Rage,
> Terminology, EFM, many gadgets, etc... are all possible to do the same.
>
> On Wed, Jun 27, 2018, 9:56 AM Xavi Artigas 
> wrote:
>
> > What? I have been working with it on my dev machine!
> > I hope my recent changes to bring it back to life didn't cause this...
> >
> > Xavi
> >
> > El lun., 25 jun. 2018 9:06 p. m., Mike Blumenkrantz <
> > michael.blumenkra...@gmail.com> escribió:
> >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > Do not attempt to use Eflete.
> > >
> > > I was attempting to examine a related issue from phab today on my test
> > > machine and Eflete somehow managed to delete nearly EVERYTHING from my
> > home
> > > directory. All my .directories, all my source trees, everything
> deleted.
> > >
> > > Fortunately, this was only a testing machine and nothing other than
> some
> > > local configs were lost.
> > >
> > > DO NOT USE EFLETE.
> > >
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > Mike
> > >
> > >
> >
> --
> > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
> > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
> > > ___
> > > enlightenment-devel mailing list
> > > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
> > >
> >
> >
> --
> > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
> > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
> > ___
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> > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
> >
>
> --
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> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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> enlightenment-devel mailing list
> enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
>
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Re: [E-devel] Mailing list headaches

[jaquilina]

If the project is up for moving away from SF I am more then willing on 
my cpanel server to setup an account for the mailing list and give 
certain people access to manage the mailing list on my server as well if 
they want to install mlmm or other filtering platform.


Would be great to get rid of the wonkyness.

On 2018-03-28 17:21, William L. Thomson Jr. wrote:

On Wed, 28 Mar 2018 16:30:22 +
jaquilina <jaquil...@eagleeyet.net> wrote:


Can anyone confirm if my email regarding fedora packaging of bleeding
edge enlightenment. are my emails getting through.


Confirmed, you can also check online. I use that as confirmation.
https://sourceforge.net/p/enlightenment/mailman/enlightenment-devel/thread/111f5bb9961f45887cb845607eb706a6%40eagleeyet.net/#msg36278174

http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=enlightenment-devel

S.F. email is a bit wonky at times, but least they are still providing
such. As great as things like Github are. They provide nothing for
mailing lists, etc. Nice that S.F. still does. I have run some myself
and they do require effort. I ran ASSP in front of ezmlm, and had some
upset users It happens, spam is a PITA whack a mole game...
Though ASSP has made my life spam free for decades
https://sourceforge.net/projects/assp/

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[E-devel] Packages for fedora

[jaquilina]

Hi All,

I am very interested in working with you guys on providing packages for 
fedora of the bleeding edge enlightenment stuff to help the dev's as 
well s end users test the platform for us. I know Raster had told me we 
should discuss, so I am sending this email to open up a discussion.


Regards,
Jonathan

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[E-devel] Mailing list headaches

[jaquilina]

Can anyone confirm if my email regarding fedora packaging of bleeding 
edge enlightenment. are my emails getting through.


On my cpanel email server in the delivery report logging I am seeing the 
following


SMTP error from remote mail server after RCPT 
TO:: 451-IPADDRESS is not yet 
authorized to deliver mail from\n451- to 
.\n451 Please try later.


Regards,
Jonathan

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Re: [E-devel] Current State and Future Direction of E/EFL

[jaquilina]

Not sure if my reply from earlier today made it to the list as I then 
got an email shortly after saying my address had been suspended from the 
list,

God SF is a POS, but i digress there with that little rant.

I am more then eager and willing to put together an enlightenment spin 
on fedora 27 with binary packages in a custom repository that anyone 
could connect to as needed. I would base it off master branch given that 
fedora is the more bleeding side of RHEL and centos are based off of it.


On 2018-03-07 15:52, William L. Thomson Jr. wrote:

On Wed, 7 Mar 2018 14:56:13 +0900
Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman)  wrote:


last i checked bodhi wanted to fork e because they didn't want to
update themes for compositing+wayland support (and e18 and on got
more overhead as more objects were in the canvas - this should have
been fixed by objects in buffers in evas but hasn't been to date) and
voted to fork instead.

last i knew elive was on an ancient version of e.


Ideally at some point the communities find some way to re-unite and
combine efforts. That maybe more utopian than realistic.


when i am thinking a distro i am thinking something that is up to
date. probably 2 versions - last stable release one and a "bleeding
edge" one from git to show off new things.


Not all distros are that up to date. Example I cannot find a deb for
Debian or Ubuntu for newer libcheck/check. They still use 0.10.0...
https://github.com/libcheck/check/releases

I may have missed something but could not find one in ppa etc. For EFL
I already have to use ppa stuff on Ubuntu in Travis.


> If not using either of those, I could likely help with one based on
> Gentoo. Either livecd or stage 4 base system, etc.

a distro where people have to wait for everything to compile... i'm
not a fan of.


The other choice is to wait for others to package stuff in binary
format. Some distros are better than others. But who says it has to
remain that way? Ever checked out Sabayon? A binary distro built on
Gentoo.
https://www.sabayon.org/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabayon_Linux


:( i think for gentoo having the gentoo emerge package
builds up to date and clean and tidy and well done is probably the
right thing. when i say "distro" i mean something that out of the box
just works. boots right into e. working desktop etc. etc. ... and if
they want to install more they don't have to wait for compiles. quick
package download+install and presto.


That is Sabayon philosophy as well, "out of the box".


> I have all sorts of E stuff in my overlay, updated eclass, sets,
> etc. I already have a custom profile based on E, and could make
> others.
> https://github.com/Obsidian-StudiosInc/os-xtoo/blob/master/eclass/e.eclass
> https://github.com/Obsidian-StudiosInc/os-xtoo/blob/master/sets/e-desktop
> https://github.com/Obsidian-StudiosInc/os-xtoo/blob/master/sets/e-desktop-dev
> 
https://github.com/Obsidian-StudiosInc/os-xtoo/blob/master/profiles/linux/amd64/workstation/packages
>
>
> P.S.
> One reason I feel Gentoo and E/EFL are good for each other. Gentoo
> preffixes most everything with the letter e...

hahahah!

despite all of that. i don't think its a good experience for users if
they just want to try something out. :) i think gentoo is fine for
the kind of people who want precisely what it provides. that is not
imho the average user wanting an out-of-the-box experience. if those
were the users to address then a wiki page on how to compile and
configure an os for e is enough... that;'s not really what i think we
need though.


I think your thinking of Gentoo as it is now, rather than a foundation
to build what you want on top. Who says a E distro based on Gentoo
would required compiling? E could easily compile stuff and setup a
binhost etc. Lots of options if you think creatively.

Plus you will want to build stuff to offer options. Otherwise you
either ship with all the lights/bells and whistles turned on, or you
choose for people. There are various compile time options for both EFL
and E. Thus either need to provide different binaries for each combo or
choose for people, which may exclude others.

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Re: [E-devel] Current State and Future Direction of E/EFL

[jaquilina]

Hi simon,

I think what you are talking about is gerrit code review. I know 
Libreoffice use it and for them I think you need to have 3 reviewers 
before the code is committed as well the code gets compiled and built as 
well to ensure it works.


https://gerrit-review.googlesource.com/Documentation/intro-how-gerrit-works.html

I am not sure if jenkins has a flow like what you are describing, but at 
least you have more control over the quality of whats committed.


On 2018-03-06 00:25, Simon Lees wrote:

On 06/03/18 03:56, Stefan Schmidt wrote:

Hello.

I snipped away a lot of text here to make it easier to follow. If you 
feel I quoted out of context let me know.


On 03/05/2018 12:57 PM, Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote:

1. Code reverting.

I take API breaks seriously. An API break shouldn't happen. It should 
get
caught as soon as possible if it does before anything is built on top 
and that
may mean reverting work that created a break ASAP if that is the most 
efficient
path. More generically here is the order of bad things for git 
master:


#1. Builds break.
#2. Building against X breaks (e.g. building terminology or e against 
efl).
#3. The app or lib just crashes or doesn't work in regular usage 
leaving people

with an unusable environment
#4. API/ABI breaks (code, data files, theme etc. - we only do these 
with a lot

of careful thought, discussion and weighing up of the pros and cons).
#5. A new design or idea/direction that then will be built on top of 
and if

#this design/idea has big issues.

git master should be "usable day to day" for developers and "advanced 
users".
It will get bugs and issues but they should be resolved ASAP and 
avoided as

much as possible.


But at least in my reality this is just not happening. A lot of things 
stay broken until I poke people to fix them, bisect them or push to

get a release out.

Right now there is at least the osx build broken for a while and 
edje_cc does run when build on a aarch64 system.
These are simply not the development systems we use. One could say 
that everything not x86_64 and Linux will stay undetected.
Once detected such things are often to hard to revert by the pure 
amount of commits that hit master in between.


People who do the work get to call the shots. It is of course 
affected by
history of contribution, knowledge of the project and what it 
interacts with
etc. etc. ... I do not think having some committee of project 
managers is going
to make anything better. I think if anything it just makes things 
worse by
adding overhead. If we made everything code-reviewed ala phab, I 
think it'd be
far worse. development would dwindle and die. I absolutely know that 
I'd
personally just stop if I had to put every commit I do through 
review. Review
is a tool for developers who are not trusted yet or who need to learn 
or who
are not involved deeply enough to be held responsible for their work. 
Then I

believe the cost is justified.


If you see that the majority of breaks actual comes from developers 
with commit access this is partly amusing and partly sad.


I my opinion we should actually be happy if we could slow down the 
amount of commits. Way to often I see rushed in commits which get
followed up by n more commits to fix things that could have been 
spotted during QA and review before letting it in master.


I realize this is something fundamentally disagree on. You want all 
commits in master as soon as possible so other can actually use it.
I only want a stable and tested subset of changes being put in master 
after the code maybe has gone through some iterations.


The world is not going to stop spinning just because a commit gets 
into master a day later.


The way we use CI is a toothless tiger. Whatever it detects (and it 
does not detect as much as it should, actually) nobody cares if I not
personally come after the person. Given the little impact it can have 
this way my interest does dwindle and die to push it forward. I am
fighting this area alone and no interest has been shown from others 
(which is fair enough), which basically means it will drop dead if I
stop looking after it. Maybe someone would pick it up again, but 
future telling is not my string side.



Which does summarize my stand point as:
1) ALL commits should go through review and automated QA
2) New things can easily be tested by using branches, no need to have 
it in master for this.
3) Slow down of commits  by taking your time and addressing found 
issues in new iterations instead of fix up later on in master.

4) QA, test cases, etc should be the objective of all devs.

So yeah, very far a way from what you think as the best workflow. 
Well, we agree that QA, test cases and review is needed but not at 
what

point in the workflow. :-)

regards
Stefan Schmidt



Morning all,

Maybe a half way point here is if every commit (or maybe group of
commits) had to go through a simple review where jenkins or some other
bot checks that the commits 

Re: [E-devel] Enlightenment Developer Days 2018 location proposals

[jaquilina]

Wish I could join you guys this summer but for me its going to be rather 
tough.


On 2017-12-05 07:59, Stefan Schmidt wrote:

Hello.


On 12/04/2017 10:39 PM, Andrew Williams wrote:

Hi,

It's perhaps worth noting that ELCE will be in Edinburgh this year -
http://events.linuxfoundation.org/events/embedded-linux-conference-europe 
.
The venue is really close to where I had proposed for the E Dev Day, I 
know

it's later in the year but perhaps we could schedule to co-inside?



Good point. Forgot to mention this.

The benefit would be mostly around travel schedules and budget. The
amount of extra people we got when co-hosting with LF events have been
really low (we have been doing so in Barcelona, Edinburgh and kind of
in Duesseldorf). I might be mistaken but my guts tell me we got 1-3
extra people due the co-hosting only.

regards
Stefan Schmidt

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Re: [E-devel] Improving web site accessibility

[jaquilina]

Hi guys this is something I can contribute to in terms of website. and I 
can even host it if you all so desire. Question is do you want this 
built off a framework, such as wordpress where it will be easy to 
include a forums section or something custom built?


On 2017-11-16 22:26, Stephen Houston wrote:

+1 I've been saying we need a new website bad. And one that is sleek,
modern, and yes white.  Time to look up to date and kept with the 
times.
You will notice nearly every major linux distribution and nearly all 
major
linux software websites are in the confines of what you describe. 
Simple,

flat, white background and black text, sharp but small images that are
mostly subtle, and responsive design to look good across devices. The
reason being that this is proven to be the easiest on the eyes and the 
most

pleasing to the reader as you said.

On Thu, Nov 16, 2017, 3:58 PM Cedric Bail  wrote:


Hi,

As some of you may have noticed we are doing some improvement to our
documentation and trying to get things easier when starting with EFL. 
One
of the main issue we are facing is that our website is definitively 
hard to

read for a lot of people. So Paul went on trying to figure out why.

The first problem is actually the constrast ratio between background 
and

text. According to W3C accessibility guidelines (
https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG21/#contrast-minimum )it should be 4.5:1 at
least. Our colors are #818181 for the text and #303030 which give a
contrast ratio of 3.39:1 ( 
https://webaim.org/resources/contrastchecker/
). And it is worth for people with vision impairment where it should 
be 7:1.


Black on white or white on black would work, but according to some 
random
person on Internet (could not find a scientific evidence/citation of 
it) a
white background force your pupils to contracts, making it easier to 
focus
your eye with a smaller pupil (much like the depth of field is 
increased
with a smaller camera lens). This could be shown by a test carried on 
136
subject, where the people reading black text on a white background 
scored

better than any other combination of colors (
http://lite.mst.edu/media/research/ctel/documents/LITE-2003-04.pdf ).

The second problem are our links that are difficult to tell wether 
they
have been clicked on or not. Also they have a slight glow around the 
links
that makes them harder to read. The best link on the subject we can 
point

to would be
https://www.nngroup.com/articles/guidelines-for-visualizing-links/ .

So it would be best to come up with a more accessible design for our 
web
site. If someone want to suggest a new design within those constraint, 
it

would be great, but I would suggest to look at
https://gstreamer.freedesktop.org/documentation/ or at 
http://doc.qt.io/
. They are simple and work well in term of readability. We could 
easily go

with something like that. What do you think ?

Cedric

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[E-devel] vm's

[jaquilina]

Hi All,

If you guys need any vm's for testing in the sense you dont have any 
hardware do let me know. I have setup a server with citrix xen server 
and I am building up my ISO repository for these vm's. I will be glad to 
fire one up for you guys if need be do let me know.


Regards,
Jonathan

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Re: [E-devel] efler issues on mac

[jaquilina]

Hi Jean,

Thanks for letting me know what version of OSX are you on im on the 
latest (high sierra) my question is where do i need to start to fix 
those errors?


On 2017-11-04 16:37, Jean Guyomarc'h wrote:

hi.

those are "normal". there is no new breakage here. it should not 
prevent

apps to work as they are expected to

Jean


On Nov 4, 2017 09:27, "jaquilina" <jaquil...@eagleeyet.net> wrote:

Hi everyone,

It seems like there is some breakage with efler on mac osx high sierra

Fontconfig warning: ignoring UTF-8: not a valid region tag
ERR<6227>:elementary lib/elementary/elm_cnp.c:5215 
elm_drop_target_del()

Please contact developers, you should probably not get here.
## Copy & Paste the below (until EOF) into a terminal, then hit Enter

eina_btlog << EOF
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b8358f1 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b838359 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b837d01 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a20ebba 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a269bc2 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a402d63 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a3287e0 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a328681 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a324e78 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a3206fe 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a32230d 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a26c1c3 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libevas.1.dylib   0x10aa46f3c 0x10a9e4000
/opt/efler/lib/libevas.1.dylib   0x10aa4b0ff 0x10a9e4000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a411223 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a32634c 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a30d3d7 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a268ce1 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7ef2e7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a259f6c 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18f310 0x10a18d000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18ea07 0x10a18d000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18f7f1 0x10a18d000
/usr/lib/system/libdyld.dylib0x7fff7fb53115 0x7fff7fb52000
??   -
EOF

ERR<6227>:elementary lib/elementary/elm_cnp.c:5215 
elm_drop_target_del()

Please contact developers, you should probably not get here.
## Copy & Paste the below (until EOF) into a terminal, then hit Enter

eina_btlog << EOF
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b8358f1 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b838359 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b837d01 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a20ebba 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a266a45 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a25cba6 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a26428f 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18f333 0x10a18d000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18ea07 0x10a18d000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18f7f1 0x10a18d000
/usr/lib/system/libdyld.dylib0x7fff7fb53115 0x7fff7fb52000
??   -
EOF

back traces will also be added below

eina_btlog << EOF


/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9d78f1 0x10a9b8000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9da359 0x10a9b8000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9d9d01 0x10a9b8000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9f142c 0x10a9b8000
/opt/efler/lib/libeldbus.1.dylib  0x10b189c7e 0x10b17f000
/opt/efler/lib/ecore/system/upower/v-1.20/module.so  0x10ae6a9fb
0x10ae69000
/opt/efler/lib/ecore/system/upower/v-1.20/module.so  0x10ae6a9b3
0x10ae69000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9e69d9 0x10a9b8000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9e7686 0x10a9b8000
/opt/efler/lib/libecore.1.dylib  0x10ab65f80 0x10ab64000
/opt/efler/lib/libecore.1.dylib  0x10ab65995 0x10ab64000
/opt/efler/lib/efreet/v-1.20/efreet_desktop_cache_create  0x10a94b8a1
0x10a94a000
/usr/lib/system/libdyld.dylib  0x7fff7fb53115 0x7fff7fb52000
EOF

   /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   
 |

??/eina_log.c   : 2055 @ eina_log_print_cb_stderr()
   /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   
 |

??/eina_log.c   : 1456 @ eina_log_print_unlocked()
   /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   
 |

??/eina_log.c   : 2260 @ eina_log_print()
   /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   
 |

??/eina_safety_checks.c :   85 @ _eina_safety_error()
   /opt/efler/lib/libeldbus.1.dylib 
 |
??/eldbus_core.c: 1399 @ 
e

Re: [E-devel] efler issues on mac

[jaquilina]

Hi Andrew,

Firstly I am trying to get on slack but im not able to whats the 
enlightenment slack channel is it enlightenment.slack.com?


Also it ends up crashing and asks me if I want to report the issue, 
reopen or ignore.


On 2017-11-04 10:56, Andrew Williams wrote:

Hi,

None of those issues should stop the app from working.
What problem do you see when trying to use it?

Thanks,
Andrew
On Sat, 4 Nov 2017 at 08:27, jaquilina <jaquil...@eagleeyet.net> wrote:


Hi everyone,

It seems like there is some breakage with efler on mac osx high sierra

Fontconfig warning: ignoring UTF-8: not a valid region tag
ERR<6227>:elementary lib/elementary/elm_cnp.c:5215 
elm_drop_target_del()

Please contact developers, you should probably not get here.
## Copy & Paste the below (until EOF) into a terminal, then hit Enter

eina_btlog << EOF
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b8358f1 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b838359 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b837d01 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a20ebba 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a269bc2 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a402d63 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a3287e0 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a328681 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a324e78 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a3206fe 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a32230d 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a26c1c3 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libevas.1.dylib   0x10aa46f3c 0x10a9e4000
/opt/efler/lib/libevas.1.dylib   0x10aa4b0ff 0x10a9e4000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a411223 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a32634c 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a30d3d7 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a268ce1 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7ef2e7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a259f6c 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18f310 0x10a18d000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18ea07 0x10a18d000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18f7f1 0x10a18d000
/usr/lib/system/libdyld.dylib0x7fff7fb53115 0x7fff7fb52000
??   -
EOF

ERR<6227>:elementary lib/elementary/elm_cnp.c:5215 
elm_drop_target_del()

Please contact developers, you should probably not get here.
## Copy & Paste the below (until EOF) into a terminal, then hit Enter

eina_btlog << EOF
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b8358f1 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b838359 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b837d01 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a20ebba 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a266a45 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a25cba6 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a26428f 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18f333 0x10a18d000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18ea07 0x10a18d000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18f7f1 0x10a18d000
/usr/lib/system/libdyld.dylib0x7fff7fb53115 0x7fff7fb52000
??   -
EOF

back traces will also be added below

eina_btlog << EOF
> /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9d78f1 0x10a9b8000
> /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9da359 0x10a9b8000
> /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9d9d01 0x10a9b8000
> /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9f142c 0x10a9b8000
> /opt/efler/lib/libeldbus.1.dylib  0x10b189c7e 0x10b17f000
> /opt/efler/lib/ecore/system/upower/v-1.20/module.so  0x10ae6a9fb
> 0x10ae69000
> /opt/efler/lib/ecore/system/upower/v-1.20/module.so  0x10ae6a9b3
> 0x10ae69000
> /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9e69d9 0x10a9b8000
> /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9e7686 0x10a9b8000
> /opt/efler/lib/libecore.1.dylib  0x10ab65f80 0x10ab64000
> /opt/efler/lib/libecore.1.dylib  0x10ab65995 0x10ab64000
> /opt/efler/lib/efreet/v-1.20/efreet_desktop_cache_create  0x10a94b8a1
> 0x10a94a000
> /usr/lib/system/libdyld.dylib  0x7fff7fb53115 0x7fff7fb52000
> EOF
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib
| ??/eina_log.c   : 2055 @ eina_log_print_cb_stderr()
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib
| ??/eina_log.c   : 1456 @ eina_log_print_unlocked()
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib
| ??/eina_log.c   : 2260 @ eina_log_print()
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib
| ??/eina_safety_checks.c :   85 @ _eina_safety_error()
  

[E-devel] efler issues on mac

[jaquilina]

Hi everyone,

It seems like there is some breakage with efler on mac osx high sierra

Fontconfig warning: ignoring UTF-8: not a valid region tag
ERR<6227>:elementary lib/elementary/elm_cnp.c:5215 elm_drop_target_del() 
Please contact developers, you should probably not get here.

## Copy & Paste the below (until EOF) into a terminal, then hit Enter

eina_btlog << EOF
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b8358f1 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b838359 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b837d01 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a20ebba 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a269bc2 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a402d63 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a3287e0 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a328681 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a324e78 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a3206fe 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a32230d 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a26c1c3 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libevas.1.dylib   0x10aa46f3c 0x10a9e4000
/opt/efler/lib/libevas.1.dylib   0x10aa4b0ff 0x10a9e4000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a411223 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a32634c 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a30d3d7 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a268ce1 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7f84b7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libeo.1.dylib 0x10b7ef2e7 0x10b7eb000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a259f6c 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18f310 0x10a18d000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18ea07 0x10a18d000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18f7f1 0x10a18d000
/usr/lib/system/libdyld.dylib0x7fff7fb53115 0x7fff7fb52000
??   -
EOF

ERR<6227>:elementary lib/elementary/elm_cnp.c:5215 elm_drop_target_del() 
Please contact developers, you should probably not get here.

## Copy & Paste the below (until EOF) into a terminal, then hit Enter

eina_btlog << EOF
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b8358f1 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b838359 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib   0x10b837d01 0x10b816000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a20ebba 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a266a45 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a25cba6 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/lib/libelementary.1.dylib 0x10a26428f 0x10a19f000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18f333 0x10a18d000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18ea07 0x10a18d000
/opt/efler/bin/efler 0x10a18f7f1 0x10a18d000
/usr/lib/system/libdyld.dylib0x7fff7fb53115 0x7fff7fb52000
??   -
EOF

back traces will also be added below

eina_btlog << EOF

/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9d78f1 0x10a9b8000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9da359 0x10a9b8000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9d9d01 0x10a9b8000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9f142c 0x10a9b8000
/opt/efler/lib/libeldbus.1.dylib  0x10b189c7e 0x10b17f000
/opt/efler/lib/ecore/system/upower/v-1.20/module.so  0x10ae6a9fb 
0x10ae69000
/opt/efler/lib/ecore/system/upower/v-1.20/module.so  0x10ae6a9b3 
0x10ae69000

/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9e69d9 0x10a9b8000
/opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib  0x10a9e7686 0x10a9b8000
/opt/efler/lib/libecore.1.dylib  0x10ab65f80 0x10ab64000
/opt/efler/lib/libecore.1.dylib  0x10ab65995 0x10ab64000
/opt/efler/lib/efreet/v-1.20/efreet_desktop_cache_create  0x10a94b8a1 
0x10a94a000

/usr/lib/system/libdyld.dylib  0x7fff7fb53115 0x7fff7fb52000
EOF
   /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib
| ??/eina_log.c   : 2055 @ eina_log_print_cb_stderr()
   /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib
| ??/eina_log.c   : 1456 @ eina_log_print_unlocked()
   /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib
| ??/eina_log.c   : 2260 @ eina_log_print()
   /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib
| ??/eina_safety_checks.c :   85 @ _eina_safety_error()
   /opt/efler/lib/libeldbus.1.dylib  
| ??/eldbus_core.c: 1399 @ 
eldbus_name_owner_changed_callback_del()
/opt/efler/lib/ecore/system/upower/v-1.20/module.so  
| ??/ecore_system_upower.c:  473 @ _ecore_system_upower_shutdown()
/opt/efler/lib/ecore/system/upower/v-1.20/module.so  
| ??/ecore_system_upower.c:  460 @ _ecore_system_upower_init()
   /opt/efler/lib/libeina.1.dylib
| ??/eina_module.c:  339 @ eina_module_load()

Re: [E-devel] E Phab Organization

[jaquilina]

Hi All,

Do we have a triaging team? Reason I am asking is we can have all these 
groupings but if someone isnt going to stay on phab categorizing them 
accordingly and testing the reports to see if they are even valid bugs 
or new features etc.


On 2017-11-03 11:48, Mike Blumenkrantz wrote:

I've created some subprojects for the enlightenment-git project:

https://phab.enlightenment.org/project/subprojects/4/

Currently this amounts to core, filemanager, gadgets, and settings. It
should allow tickets to be more easily categorized and for people to 
more

easily associate with specific components that they have interest in.

I've also added 3 new base projects: easy, difficult, impossible. These
have no code-based project associated, and exist solely for tagging 
tasks.
This should enable new developers or developers looking to expand into 
new
projects to more easily determine which tasks they are able to 
effectively

take on.
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Re: [E-devel] Phab EFL ticket management

[jaquilina]

I would be willing to test and triage bugs if need be. Also I want to propose a 
method that libreoffice uses and that is of what they call easy hacks.
They are classified according to complexity and would be a good way to 
encourage new developers to join and a good way for them to get used to the 
code Base. 


Sent from Samsung tablet. Original message From: Andrew 
Williams  Date: 15/07/2017  22:12  (GMT+01:00) To: 
Enlightenment developer list  
Subject: [E-devel] Phab EFL ticket management 
Hi team,

As many would probably agree by now we have a very high ticket volume which
is rather hard to manage... Whilst folk are doing a great job of
marshalling the incoming tasks I think that some more structure would help
us to see what is needed in each area and for the next release etc...

In preparation for 1.21 I would like to start working on this a little to
help us manage the work for our next release (especially as it will be the
eo interfaces release!) and propose to do the following in phab, as it is
otherwise managing to keep track well:

* Add a milestone to efl phab project for the next release - this will be
used to mark the issues we have agreed must go into the next release
* Add sub projects for each area of EFL so we can better categorise the
tasks (we can either use EFL or a "common" subproject for those that apply
to all
  * efl-eina
  * efl-eolian
  * efl-canvas
  * efl-canvas-layout
  * efl-ui
(etc etc)

Notice the use of the new namespaces for everything in the interfaces -
this is surely how we should be thinking going forward :)
If we are able to split things out a bit more then we can have more people
assigned to projects with fewer issues per project.
Then the milestone for release can be the main point of concern for a
release manager :)

I wanted to throw the concept out to the list before doing anything in case
there are any concerns with this approach that I may have missed?

Thanks :)
Andy
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Re: [E-devel] Server down

[jaquilina]

All I know is that beber adding my ssh key to the system and reencrypted the 
credentials store which could be the root cause of these issues with git over 
ssh


Sent from Samsung tablet. Original message From: Andrew 
Williams  Date: 15/07/2017  22:59  (GMT+01:00) To: 
Jonathan Aquilina , Enlightenment developer list 
 Subject: Re: [E-devel] Server down 
Correction, for git I'm getting either connection closed or permission 
denied... every 5th or so connection makes it through.
On Sat, 15 Jul 2017 at 20:46, Andrew Williams  wrote:
Hi,
Thanks to whoever prodded it. Now git and web are working again.I use git+ssh 
and it is working OK (on and off actually) but I can't get in through ssh any 
more. Bu5hm4n and others have noted the same thing. Have permissions on SSH 
been altered?
Thanks,Andy
On Sat, 15 Jul 2017 at 15:06 Jonathan Aquilina  wrote:

I think that it might be worth contacting the hosting provider as I am 
wondering if they are doing something with their network hardware or maybe 
something that is causing our server to really not be happy.
---

Regards,
Jonathan Aquilina




On 2017-07-15 15:59, Derek Foreman wrote:
Somewhat related, I've been monitoring the server with "smokeping" for a few 
weeks now, and the majority of the blackouts start between 5AM and 5:10AM north 
american central time (10ish UTC I guess?)
 
 Sometimes they clear in under an hour (I don't know if this is an automatic 
recovery or manual intervention).
 
 During the blackouts generally the git server is partially responsive and the 
web server is completely borked.
 
 Today's blackout started between 5:00AM and 5:10AM CST.  Currently the git 
server is semi responsive and the web server is hosed.
 
 I don't know if that gives any useful input into tracking down what's knocking 
over the house of cards (or if knowing what's knocking it over is even useful), 
but there ya go. :D
 
 Thanks,
 Derek
 
 
 On 2017-07-15 05:26 AM, Andrew Williams wrote:
Hi,
 
 That's the server keeled over again. I would fix it but today it's
 rejecting my login.
 
 Can someone please help, I was in the middle of a bunch of work on docuwiki
 that I would like to complete?
 
 Thanks,
 Andy
 

 
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Re: [E-devel] Notes from community discussion in Malta

[jaquilina]

Any idea why not a separate wiki to function as a knowledge basee? 


Sent from Samsung tablet. Original message From: Andrew 
Williams  Date: 09/07/2017  20:32  (GMT+01:00) To: 
Enlightenment developer list  
Subject: Re: [E-devel] Notes from community discussion in Malta 
With another way to get folk on IRC we don't necessarily improve the
experience for folk looking for help - it's a mass of folk who may be afk
or may not be able to answer the questions - a lot of the time we see
people join, ask a question and leave some time later having "no waited
long enough" for the right person to swing by. I'd be keen to see if there
are mechanisms for answering questions quicker or helping folk identify how
to get answers faster or more reliably...

Andy

On Sun, 9 Jul 2017 at 10:25, Carsten Haitzler  wrote:

> On Sun, 9 Jul 2017 22:06:16 +0900 Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman)
>  said:
>
> > On Sun, 9 Jul 2017 11:14:29 +0100 Al Poole  said:
> >
> > > I think you're right if you're only talking about developers. It would
> be
> > > good to get users involved, i see there's quite a lot of people who
> hang
> > > out in #e on freenode. If they could be more engaged that might be
> > > encouraging to them and let developers do dev
> >
> > the problem is we need and want developers to engage with users. reddit
> is a
> > good example of a well done "forum". the real thing is a stand alone
> forum
> > fragments further. if we can tie it to email that'd be perfect.
> >
> > smooch is a good idea too. has technical issues and usability problems,
> but i
> > think we could take the idea and improve it with better integration to
> irc
> > e.g. use an irc bot on #e and the bot just provides a WWW window into #e
> for
> > as long as the chat window in the browser is up.
>
> FYI:
>
> http://rdf4j.org/support/irc-web-chat/
> https://kiwiirc.com/
>
> having that come up and just join #e (and nothing else) on our www might
> actually be the best :) maybe just provide a "select nick name here"
> box
> with a "go chat" and have it randomly choose the default nick name in js
> on the
> www page... :) glue #e to slack like we glued #edevelop with a bot. IMHO
> better
> than smooch by far.
>
> > > On Sun, Jul 9, 2017 at 7:27 AM, Pierre Couderc 
> wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 07/09/2017 06:30 AM, Vincent Torri wrote:
> > > >
> > > >>
> > > >> with mailing list, phab  and irc as the current way to ask
> questions,
> > > >> file bugs or talk about development, is there sufficiently manpower
> to
> > > >> ask more questions in a forum ?
> > > >>
> > > >> i don't think so.
> > > >>
> > > >> Vincent
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> +1
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > 
> > > > --
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> > >
> >
> >
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> > - Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" --
> > The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler)    ras...@rasterman.com
> >
> >
> >
> --
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> >
>
>
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> The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler)    ras...@rasterman.com
>
>
>
> --
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Re: [E-devel] Notes from community discussion in Malta

[jaquilina]

Did you ,an age to determine why?


Sent from Samsung tablet. Original message From: Andrew 
Williams <a...@andywilliams.me> Date: 10/07/2017  10:19  (GMT+01:00) To: 
Enlightenment developer list <enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net>, 
Vincent Torri <vincent.to...@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [E-devel] Notes from 
community discussion in Malta 
Hi,

I've done that several times but they always get banned...

Andy

On Mon, 10 Jul 2017 at 09:16, jaquilina <jaquil...@eagleeyet.net> wrote:

> If you want I can see about setting up an irc both to log chat in the
> channel and upload it somewhere at the end of the day or every hour
>
>
> Sent from Samsung tablet. Original message From: Vincent
> Torri <vincent.to...@gmail.com> Date: 10/07/2017  10:12  (GMT+01:00) To:
> Enlightenment developer list <enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net>
> Subject: Re: [E-devel] Notes from community discussion in Malta
> On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 7:30 AM, Carsten Haitzler <ras...@rasterman.com>
> wrote:
> > On Mon, 10 Jul 2017 04:40:29 + Andrew Williams <a...@andywilliams.me>
> said:
> >
> >> I think it would be reasonable to assume that I was not meaning force
> >> everyone to be awake all the time. Something that I have learned
> recently,
> >> however, is that there is a big difference between massages and
> >> communication (think similar to how data is not as meaningful as
> >> information) - that is what interests me. Rather than just creating a
> >> bigger room where more people can miss each other why not figure smarter
> >> ways to get the right folk connected - or connect new people with their
> >> answers directly. It does not have to mean sleep depravation!
> >
> > for something instant where people don't have the patience to wait
> around for
> > an answer... i don't see another option. either volume (more people on
> at more
> > times so there is a higher chance of someone answering) or hard work
> (the same
> > number of people are available and awake for more hours) :).
> >
> > i would go for the volume approach. that would be getting more people
> into one
> > place with as few barriers as possible IMHO.
> >
> > also forums/mail vs slack/irc i would treat differently. theoretically
> they
> > could be unified ... but i dont see that happening any time soon for us.
>
> if there were some irc logs, that would help
>
> Vincent
>
>
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Re: [E-devel] Notes from community discussion in Malta

[jaquilina]

Could we connect Web based irc chat like qwebirc that free noted uses to 
connectar to their network and have it by default connect to purchase channel?


Sent from Samsung tablet. Original message From: Andrew 
Williams  Date: 10/07/2017  06:40  (GMT+01:00) To: 
Carsten Haitzler , Enlightenment developer list 
 Subject: Re: [E-devel] Notes from 
community discussion in Malta 
I think it would be reasonable to assume that I was not meaning force
everyone to be awake all the time. Something that I have learned recently,
however, is that there is a big difference between massages and
communication (think similar to how data is not as meaningful as
information) - that is what interests me. Rather than just creating a
bigger room where more people can miss each other why not figure smarter
ways to get the right folk connected - or connect new people with their
answers directly. It does not have to mean sleep depravation!

Andy

On Mon, 10 Jul 2017 at 00:39, Carsten Haitzler  wrote:

> On Sun, 09 Jul 2017 18:32:23 + Andrew Williams 
> said:
>
> > With another way to get folk on IRC we don't necessarily improve the
> > experience for folk looking for help - it's a mass of folk who may be afk
> > or may not be able to answer the questions - a lot of the time we see
>
> we at least connect the people. you can't force people to be awake 24/7 or
> to
> answer things. you can smooth the entry barriers down as much as possible
> in
> the hope things improve.
>
> > people join, ask a question and leave some time later having "no waited
> > long enough" for the right person to swing by. I'd be keen to see if
> there
> > are mechanisms for answering questions quicker or helping folk identify
> how
> > to get answers faster or more reliably...
>
> pay people fulltime to be alert 24/7 to reply? irc (and even slack) is for
> the
> impatient and for "instant response". that's it's nature. otherwise we have
> used email for longer term stuff. and as was mentioned - forums are the www
> equivalent. you still then have a barrier of making people register etc.
> and
> then if forms don't integrate with email as it stands we divide the
> community
> again... which is why i'd prefer a solution that keeps it together as much
> as
> possible to improve the chances that people actually interact. :)
>
> > Andy
> >
> > On Sun, 9 Jul 2017 at 10:25, Carsten Haitzler 
> wrote:
> >
> > > On Sun, 9 Jul 2017 22:06:16 +0900 Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman)
> > >  said:
> > >
> > > > On Sun, 9 Jul 2017 11:14:29 +0100 Al Poole  said:
> > > >
> > > > > I think you're right if you're only talking about developers. It
> would
> > > be
> > > > > good to get users involved, i see there's quite a lot of people who
> > > hang
> > > > > out in #e on freenode. If they could be more engaged that might be
> > > > > encouraging to them and let developers do dev
> > > >
> > > > the problem is we need and want developers to engage with users.
> reddit
> > > is a
> > > > good example of a well done "forum". the real thing is a stand alone
> > > forum
> > > > fragments further. if we can tie it to email that'd be perfect.
> > > >
> > > > smooch is a good idea too. has technical issues and usability
> problems,
> > > but i
> > > > think we could take the idea and improve it with better integration
> to
> > > irc
> > > > e.g. use an irc bot on #e and the bot just provides a WWW window
> into #e
> > > for
> > > > as long as the chat window in the browser is up.
> > >
> > > FYI:
> > >
> > > http://rdf4j.org/support/irc-web-chat/
> > > https://kiwiirc.com/
> > >
> > > having that come up and just join #e (and nothing else) on our www
> might
> > > actually be the best :) maybe just provide a "select nick name
> here"
> > > box
> > > with a "go chat" and have it randomly choose the default nick name in
> js
> > > on the
> > > www page... :) glue #e to slack like we glued #edevelop with a bot.
> IMHO
> > > better
> > > than smooch by far.
> > >
> > > > > On Sun, Jul 9, 2017 at 7:27 AM, Pierre Couderc 
> > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On 07/09/2017 06:30 AM, Vincent Torri wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> with mailing list, phab  and irc as the current way to ask
> > > questions,
> > > > > >> file bugs or talk about development, is there sufficiently
> manpower
> > > to
> > > > > >> ask more questions in a forum ?
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> i don't think so.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Vincent
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> +1
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
> > > > > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! 

Re: [E-devel] Notes from community discussion in Malta

[jaquilina]

If you want I can see about setting up an irc both to log chat in the channel 
and upload it somewhere at the end of the day or every hour


Sent from Samsung tablet. Original message From: Vincent Torri 
 Date: 10/07/2017  10:12  (GMT+01:00) To: 
Enlightenment developer list  
Subject: Re: [E-devel] Notes from community discussion in Malta 
On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 7:30 AM, Carsten Haitzler  wrote:
> On Mon, 10 Jul 2017 04:40:29 + Andrew Williams  
> said:
>
>> I think it would be reasonable to assume that I was not meaning force
>> everyone to be awake all the time. Something that I have learned recently,
>> however, is that there is a big difference between massages and
>> communication (think similar to how data is not as meaningful as
>> information) - that is what interests me. Rather than just creating a
>> bigger room where more people can miss each other why not figure smarter
>> ways to get the right folk connected - or connect new people with their
>> answers directly. It does not have to mean sleep depravation!
>
> for something instant where people don't have the patience to wait around for
> an answer... i don't see another option. either volume (more people on at more
> times so there is a higher chance of someone answering) or hard work (the same
> number of people are available and awake for more hours) :).
>
> i would go for the volume approach. that would be getting more people into one
> place with as few barriers as possible IMHO.
>
> also forums/mail vs slack/irc i would treat differently. theoretically they
> could be unified ... but i dont see that happening any time soon for us.

if there were some irc logs, that would help

Vincent

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Re: [E-devel] Notes from community discussion in Malta

[jaquilina]

I actually meant phab. Damn auto correct!


Sent from Samsung tablet. Original message From: Andrew 
Williams <a...@andywilliams.me> Date: 10/07/2017  08:15  (GMT+01:00) To: 
Enlightenment developer list <enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net> 
Subject: Re: [E-devel] Notes from community discussion in Malta 
Really? When he meant phpbb he said so - phase seemed like an autocorrect
of phab, apologies if it was not. But perhaps we should wait for his reply
rather than guessing.

Andy

On Mon, 10 Jul 2017 at 06:37, Carsten Haitzler <ras...@rasterman.com> wrote:

> On Mon, 10 Jul 2017 04:41:54 + Andrew Williams <a...@andywilliams.me>
> said:
>
> no - he meant PHPBB... not PHAB. it's a www forum engine thats rather
> popular.
>
> > My preference would be to keep users off phab if we can - it contains a
> lot
> > of really useful stuff for devs and if that gets clouded in lots of user
> > contributions it could get frustrating (not to mention that the search is
> > already pretty hard to use).
> >
> > Andy
> >
> > On Mon, 10 Jul 2017 at 04:44, jaquilina <jaquil...@eagleeyet.net> wrote:
> >
> > > Does phase have built in forums? My main concern with using forumsome
> like
> > > phpbb is they are plagued with spam issues if not setup correctly.
> > >
> > >
> > > Sent from Samsung tablet. Original message From: Simon
> > > Lees <sfl...@suse.de> Date: 10/07/2017  04:13  (GMT+01:00) To:
> > > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [E-devel] Notes
> > > from community discussion in Malta
> > >
> > >
> > > On 09/07/17 08:13, Al Poole wrote:
> > > > A lot of that makes sense. Definitely "wow" factor is what attracted
> me
> > > to
> > > > Enlightenment. I remember back in 05 when e16.999 went public just
> how
> > > > amazing it was and looked, even now it remains impressive.
> > > >
> > > > A forum is a good idea. Like a bridge between phab and the mailing
> list.
> > > > Also it might not be so intimidating? Good for helping people with
> common
> > > > issues. Maintaining pages also so people realise the project is
> active,
> > > > even if there's a while between releases.
> > >
> > > I like the idea of a forum, certainly more then more slack channels,
> > > forums for example are not only public and searchable but indexed by
> > > google so answers start showing up in google as well. To get the most
> > > out of it though it would be nice if we had a irc / slack bot that
> > > posted every new forum topic to IRC then people who help there would
> > > probably also see and answer the questions on the forum.
> > >
> > > The reality is many users don't understand irc or mailing lists, there
> > > simply not old enough but they do understand forums, bodhi for example
> > > has a reasonably active forum. If such a forum existed, i'd be happy to
> > > help monitor and moderate it and forward appropriate questions to the
> > > bugtracker / mailing list / irc as needed so they reach the right
> people
> > > where needed.
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Simon Lees (Simotek)    http://simotek.net
> > >
> > > Emergency Update Team   keybase.io/simotek
> > > SUSE Linux   Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30
> > > GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> --
> > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
> > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
> > > ___
> > > enlightenment-devel mailing list
> > > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
> > >
> > >
> --
> > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
> > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel
> > >
> > --
> > http://andywi

Re: [E-devel] Notes from community discussion in Malta

[jaquilina]

Does phase have built in forums? My main concern with using forumsome like 
phpbb is they are plagued with spam issues if not setup correctly.


Sent from Samsung tablet. Original message From: Simon Lees 
 Date: 10/07/2017  04:13  (GMT+01:00) To: 
enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [E-devel] Notes from 
community discussion in Malta 


On 09/07/17 08:13, Al Poole wrote:
> A lot of that makes sense. Definitely "wow" factor is what attracted me to
> Enlightenment. I remember back in 05 when e16.999 went public just how
> amazing it was and looked, even now it remains impressive.
> 
> A forum is a good idea. Like a bridge between phab and the mailing list.
> Also it might not be so intimidating? Good for helping people with common
> issues. Maintaining pages also so people realise the project is active,
> even if there's a while between releases.

I like the idea of a forum, certainly more then more slack channels,
forums for example are not only public and searchable but indexed by
google so answers start showing up in google as well. To get the most
out of it though it would be nice if we had a irc / slack bot that
posted every new forum topic to IRC then people who help there would
probably also see and answer the questions on the forum.

The reality is many users don't understand irc or mailing lists, there
simply not old enough but they do understand forums, bodhi for example
has a reasonably active forum. If such a forum existed, i'd be happy to
help monitor and moderate it and forward appropriate questions to the
bugtracker / mailing list / irc as needed so they reach the right people
where needed.

-- 

Simon Lees (Simotek)    http://simotek.net

Emergency Update Team   keybase.io/simotek
SUSE Linux   Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30
GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B


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[E-devel] Audio production studio for enlightenment

[jaquilina]

Hi all,
At EDDell I had mentioned to Andrew that I would like to create my own audio 
production studio site, I large to that of lmms (this is open source and based 
on fruity loops studio). My question is where would be a good place to get 
started with this project?


Sent from Samsung tablet.
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Re: [E-devel] server down

[jaquilina]

I wonder if we could run Windows in a container. 


Sent from Samsung tablet. Original message From: Andrew 
Williams  Date: 11/06/2017  21:39  (GMT+01:00) To: 
Enlightenment developer list  
Subject: Re: [E-devel] server down 
I think here it's recommended to split the ui from the agents. Your windows
agent vm going down should not be an issue for the ui - only some builds
would fail. That way Jenkins main could be containerised.

Andy
On Sun, 11 Jun 2017 at 03:53, Carsten Haitzler  wrote:

> On Sun, 11 Jun 2017 06:57:58 +0200 Jonathan Aquilina <
> jaquil...@eagleeyet.net>
> said:
>
> > For Jenkins would docker containers work?
>
> not for windows, bsd etc. (non-linux based os's).
>
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> > > On 11 Jun 2017, at 06:07, Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman)
> > >  wrote:
> > >
> > > On Sat, 10 Jun 2017 19:51:27 +0930 Simon Lees  said:
> > >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>> On 10/06/17 15:20, Jonathan Aquilina wrote:
> > >>> Good Morning All,
> > >>>
> > >>> There is lots of food for thought in this thread.
> > >>>
> > >>> Here is some food for thought. What about using a microservices
> > >>> management platform such as puppet for example to manage everything
> on
> > >>> the primary server as well as the secondary one in france?
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >> As I said on IRC given the small scale of what we need I suspect its
> > >> going to be overkill on our setup, on the other hand, having every
> > >> config file thats modified in a git repo somewhere probably makes
> sense.
> > >> On the small number of machines I configure I tend to type "git init"
> in
> > >> /etc as about the first thing I do.
> > >
> > > this actually would be by far the most sensible thing. have all cfg
> files
> > > in a git repo. symlink the real ones to the ones in this repo.
> > >
> > > we now have a very simple:
> > >
> > > 1. list of anything that is modified on the system(s) that isn't a
> default
> > > 2. history of changes being tracked.
> > >
> > > indeed i don't see puppet as being better. just complexity. if we had
> > > dozens or 100's of machines... i'd definitely see the value.
> artificially
> > > having dozens of machines imho is not worth it. if it's containers or
> vm's
> > > we only need a small number. where we REALLY do need vm's is for
> jenkins
> > > builds/tests, but these are not "services" as such. they are a target
> > > jenkins is bnuilding on and testing on, so is really part of the whole
> > > jenkins services itself.
> > >
> > >> --
> > >>
> > >> Simon Lees (Simotek)    http://simotek.net
> > >>
> > >> Emergency Update Team   keybase.io/simotek
> > >> SUSE Linux   Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30
> > >> GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > - Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am"
> --
> > > The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler)    ras...@rasterman.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> --
> > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
> > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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> >
> >
> >
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> >
>
>
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>
>
>
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Re: [E-devel] enlightenment.org is DOWN

[jaquilina]

Curiosity is getting the best of me. What exactly was the issue?


Sent from Samsung tablet. Original message From: Bertrand 
Jacquin  Date: 10/06/2016  21:18  (GMT+01:00) To: Cedric 
BAIL  Cc: Enlightenment developer list 
,   moa.blueb...@gmail.com 
Subject: Re: [E-devel] enlightenment.org is DOWN 
Thank for calling me Cedric, I know where the problem is now. I'll do a 
deep fix during the week end.

Now everything is back on line and no reboot (of the host) was needed.

Cheers


On 10/06/2016 17:45, Cedric BAIL wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 10, 2016 at 8:26 AM, Jonathan Aquilina
>  wrote:
>> Where is this being hosted currently? If you guys want I can host a
>> backup site on my server. Only thing I would not be able to host are 
>> the
>> large amount of download tarballs etc.
> 
> I don't think it is an hosting issue at this point. We do already have
> 3 operationals servers as I know. One master in the US (the biggest
> one doing the build), two in france (One able to run test on GPU and
> the other being a dev server). The current problem is I think one that
> has been lurking around for some time. Once in a while the server goes
> overloaded and we haven't had the opportunity to investigate what is
> going on. Raster usually just reboot the server and that solve this. I
> have asked Beber to look at it so that we can fix the problem instead
> of requiring a reboot every n months.
> 
> Cedric
> 
>> On 2016-06-10 16:00, Amitesh Singh wrote:
>> 
>>> Hello Guys,
>>> 
>>> It seems like all web stuffs of e.org are down. Also git 
>>> clone/pull/push is
>>> super slow.
>>> 
>>> please check.
>>> 
>>> Regards
>> 
>> --
>> What NetFlow Analyzer can do for you? Monitors network bandwidth and 
>> traffic
>> patterns at an interface-level. Reveals which users, apps, and 
>> protocols are
>> consuming the most bandwidth. Provides multi-vendor support for 
>> NetFlow,
>> J-Flow, sFlow and other flows. Make informed decisions using capacity
>> planning reports. 
>> https://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/305295220;132659582;e
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>> 

-- 
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Re: [E-devel] phab down! :(

[jaquilina]

Did you try restarting the web server you guys are using. If the DB is 
showing its ok the only other thing it would be is the web server. Any 
chance you can check the web server logs?

On 2014-08-09 06:42, ChunEon Park wrote:
 :(

 

 -Regards, Hermet-

 -Original Message-
 From: Carsten Haitzlerlt;ras...@rasterman.comgt;
 To: Bertrand Jacquinlt;be...@meleeweb.netgt;;
 elt;enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.netgt;;
 Cc:
 Sent: 2014-08-09 (토) 11:13:37
 Subject: [E-devel] phab down! :(

 phab's down. it's having problems with database...

 specifically:

 [2014-08-08 19:12:55] EXCEPTION: (AphrontQueryConnectionException) 
 Attempt to
 connect to phab@localhost failed with error #2002: No such file or 
 directory.

 (and the rest of the trace)

 i restarted mysqld, phd... no go... mysqlcheck reports all db's are
 OK... so it
 seems to be semi ok. not sure here... what went wrong where?

 --
 - Codito, ergo sum - I code, therefore I am 
 --
 The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler)ras...@rasterman.com


 
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Founder Eagle Eye T

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Re: [E-devel] [e-users] Emotion Media Center 1.0 first beta is out

[jaquilina]

On 2014-08-05 01:11, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
 On Mon, 04 Aug 2014 18:25:49 +0200 jaquilina 
 jaquil...@eagleeyet.net said:

 What I am about to say could be totally off topic for this 
 discussion,
 but wouldnt you need some high DPI images etc especially for a media
 center which will run on rather big screens. I am not toally sure 
 what
 it involves but if its something that would sound like its needed I 
 can
 do some research and provide links to my findings.

 you don't have to - images can/will be scaled up as needed. it might 
 not look
 as nice, but it works. it's better to provide higher res versions - 
 we have
 image sets for that and edje auto picks the right image for you.


Wouldnt SVG formatted high res files be good for that sort of stuff? 
What format are the images currently in?


 On 2014-08-04 09:33, Cedric BAIL wrote:
  Hello,
 
  On Mon, Aug 4, 2014 at 9:07 AM, Davide Andreoli
  d...@gurumeditation.it wrote:
  2014-08-04 2:54 GMT+02:00 Daniel Juyung Seo 
 seojuyu...@gmail.com:
  Hi, great job!
  I had svn version of epymc but I can't even remember how it was
  because
  there were a lot of enhancements.
  Thanks to you.
 
  By the way, I have a couple of comments.
  1. The icon and text sizes are too big compared with the default
  elementary
  theme with the default scalability. I had to manually scale it 
 down
  to 0.5
  to match it with default elementary theme from the general
  configuration
  panel. Is there a reason behind this?
 
 
  This is a media center, it is designed to be used in fullscreen 
 from
  your
  couch...
  Can you read the texts from the couch at 0.5 scale? this app is 
 not
  designed
  to match the default elm theme for the desktop.
  But, if you really prefer a smaller scale (maybe your monitor has
  different
  dpi?)
  you can adjust the interface scale right from the config, there's 
 a
  proper
  option
  for that.
 
  Hum, I think the intent of scale is different. We should define 
 what
  scale 1.0 means, but until now it has pretty much means that it is 
 a
  90 dpi screen being read at 60 cm. Now your issue is with 
 elementary
  config and this is something we need to solve. Enlightenment make 
 it
  possible to specify an elementary profile per virtual desktop (If 
 you
  manage to find the configuration option). The idea being that we
  should have a TV profile for elementary that will be used when we 
 use
  it with a TV screen. I would argue that Enlightenment need
  improvement
  in that regard, but it would be neat to provide a config dialog 
 with
  widget preview when a screen is plugged in to solve this kind of
  config hazard.
 
  Anyway point is, current situation need to improve. I understand 
 why
  you did that as it help users until we have a better configuration
  infrastructure/UI, but when that happen Daniel will be perfectly
  right.

 --
 Regards,
 Jonathan Aquilina
 Founder Eagle Eye T

 
 --
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Regards,
Jonathan Aquilina
Founder Eagle Eye T

--
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Build stunning WinForms apps today!
Reboot your WinForms applications with our WinForms controls. 
Build a bridge from your legacy apps to the future.
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Re: [E-devel] [e-users] Emotion Media Center 1.0 first beta is out

[jaquilina]

What I am about to say could be totally off topic for this discussion, 
but wouldnt you need some high DPI images etc especially for a media 
center which will run on rather big screens. I am not toally sure what 
it involves but if its something that would sound like its needed I can 
do some research and provide links to my findings.

On 2014-08-04 09:33, Cedric BAIL wrote:
 Hello,

 On Mon, Aug 4, 2014 at 9:07 AM, Davide Andreoli
 d...@gurumeditation.it wrote:
 2014-08-04 2:54 GMT+02:00 Daniel Juyung Seo seojuyu...@gmail.com:
 Hi, great job!
 I had svn version of epymc but I can't even remember how it was 
 because
 there were a lot of enhancements.
 Thanks to you.

 By the way, I have a couple of comments.
 1. The icon and text sizes are too big compared with the default 
 elementary
 theme with the default scalability. I had to manually scale it down 
 to 0.5
 to match it with default elementary theme from the general 
 configuration
 panel. Is there a reason behind this?


 This is a media center, it is designed to be used in fullscreen from 
 your
 couch...
 Can you read the texts from the couch at 0.5 scale? this app is not
 designed
 to match the default elm theme for the desktop.
 But, if you really prefer a smaller scale (maybe your monitor has 
 different
 dpi?)
 you can adjust the interface scale right from the config, there's a 
 proper
 option
 for that.

 Hum, I think the intent of scale is different. We should define what
 scale 1.0 means, but until now it has pretty much means that it is a
 90 dpi screen being read at 60 cm. Now your issue is with elementary
 config and this is something we need to solve. Enlightenment make it
 possible to specify an elementary profile per virtual desktop (If you
 manage to find the configuration option). The idea being that we
 should have a TV profile for elementary that will be used when we use
 it with a TV screen. I would argue that Enlightenment need 
 improvement
 in that regard, but it would be neat to provide a config dialog with
 widget preview when a screen is plugged in to solve this kind of
 config hazard.

 Anyway point is, current situation need to improve. I understand why
 you did that as it help users until we have a better configuration
 infrastructure/UI, but when that happen Daniel will be perfectly
 right.

-- 
Regards,
Jonathan Aquilina
Founder Eagle Eye T

--
Infragistics Professional
Build stunning WinForms apps today!
Reboot your WinForms applications with our WinForms controls. 
Build a bridge from your legacy apps to the future.
http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=153845071iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
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