Re: [Finale] a hopeful sign
I would not concur with this, as I recently did a piece in B major and had to convert some key-signature A sharps to Bb accidentals and back again as I changed my mind, and they went wonky. It seems to be that any time you hit 9 in Speedy you take your life (well, your enharmonic life anyway!) into your hands. Hitting it twice on the same note almost guarantees a problem somewhere along the line. Christopher I'm fed up with this flaw, it is so unpredictable that it has slowed down my work flow considerably and there is a constant need to re- proof everything as you can't trust Finale. It's also dangerous with explode parts too. Not only do enharmonics get changed but the order of part distribution is buggy. So much for a short cut. I frequently use the old speedy entry trick of putting the cursor over a note/chord while playing the midi keyboard and hitting the enter key to change only the notes. I discovered that if the spelling table contradicts what you have in the stave (i.e. you want to change the notes _back_ to the spelling table settings from their enharmonics) this method doesn't always change the note(s) straight away but if you hold the midi chord or note for a few seconds longer after hitting the enter key it does! It appears to me that the whole enharmonic thing and the spelling table priorities are all messed up. I'm still in Finmac 2007, does this happen in 2008 also? Jonathan ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] a hopeful sign
On Jul 23, 2007, at 3:27 AM, Jonathan Smith wrote: I would not concur with this, as I recently did a piece in B major and had to convert some key-signature A sharps to Bb accidentals and back again as I changed my mind, and they went wonky. It seems to be that any time you hit 9 in Speedy you take your life (well, your enharmonic life anyway!) into your hands. Hitting it twice on the same note almost guarantees a problem somewhere along the line. Christopher I'm fed up with this flaw, it is so unpredictable that it has slowed down my work flow considerably and there is a constant need to re-proof everything as you can't trust Finale. It's also dangerous with explode parts too. Not only do enharmonics get changed but the order of part distribution is buggy. So much for a short cut. I frequently use the old speedy entry trick of putting the cursor over a note/chord while playing the midi keyboard and hitting the enter key to change only the notes. I discovered that if the spelling table contradicts what you have in the stave (i.e. you want to change the notes _back_ to the spelling table settings from their enharmonics) this method doesn't always change the note(s) straight away but if you hold the midi chord or note for a few seconds longer after hitting the enter key it does! It appears to me that the whole enharmonic thing and the spelling table priorities are all messed up. I'm still in Finmac 2007, does this happen in 2008 also? Yup. No change, as far as I can see, except sometimes the part distribution is even MORE screwed up (before, only the top voice was wrong, now it is possible for all the voices except the bottom one to be wrong.) As for holding down the MIDI key and hitting Enter to change pitches, I find that the enharmonic is indeed wrong according to the spelling tables the FIRST time you hit Enter (if you have ever hit 9 in that measure), but the SECOND time you hit Enter the spelling table value comes up, as if it clears any mention of the 9 key for that note. Christopher ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] a hopeful sign
On Jul 13, 2007, at 6:20 AM, Randolph Peters wrote: Randolph Peters wrote: Because the Finale 2008 upgrade didn't fix what many thought were important bugs, a lot of people wrote complaints to MakeMusic. I just got a response back from Quality Assurance regarding the enharmonic flipping bug. It appears that MM is taking it seriously and is working on it. At least that is how I read this: OT37068: When inside the Speedy Frame, necessary accidentals can disappear or unnecessary accidentals (naturals) can be forced to appear with certain notes in staves with certain Chromatic transpositions. It all depends on if the note would have an accidental in the key sig. I would not concur with this, as I recently did a piece in B major and had to convert some key-signature A sharps to Bb accidentals and back again as I changed my mind, and they went wonky. It seems to be that any time you hit 9 in Speedy you take your life (well, your enharmonic life anyway!) into your hands. Hitting it twice on the same note almost guarantees a problem somewhere along the line. Christopher ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] a hopeful sign
Randolph Peters wrote: Because the Finale 2008 upgrade didn't fix what many thought were important bugs, a lot of people wrote complaints to MakeMusic. I just got a response back from Quality Assurance regarding the enharmonic flipping bug. It appears that MM is taking it seriously and is working on it. At least that is how I read this: OT37068: When inside the Speedy Frame, necessary accidentals can disappear or unnecessary accidentals (naturals) can be forced to appear with certain notes in staves with certain Chromatic transpositions. It all depends on if the note would have an accidental in the key sig. I'd like to make sure there isn't another issue lurking that we're overlooking because we think we've got it covered with this one. Darcy James Argue wrote: The problem definitely goes much deeper, and if the description below is supposed to be comprehensive, then they don't have it remotely covered with this one. Chris Smith seems like the go-to guy on this bug -- perhaps Randolph would let Chris know which CS person he was talking to and the two of them can get in touch. I'm glad MM is taking this bug seriously, but it seems like they don't yet know how serious it truly is. This is unfortunate, because I know Chris has sent in detailed reports on the 9-flip bug. I didn't include all of my correspondence. In another email I was told that they are also aware of the explode function bug and how it is related to the enharmonic flipping bug and are working on that as well. Whether they know the full extent of the problem, I can't say. It all depends on if the note would have an accidental in the key sig. makes sense because I tend to use C major as my key signature (not that the music is in C!) and all of my accidentals can give me problems. The fact that MM is actively looking into this issue is a sign of hope because they ignored it for the 2007 upgrades and the first 2008 version. -Randolph Peters ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] a hopeful sign
Randolph Peters écrit: The fact that MM is actively looking into this issue is a sign of hope because they ignored it for the 2007 upgrades and the first 2008 version. (Denis) dc wrote: This reminds me of the hyphen bug, that MM claimed to have solved with one of the first 2007 updates. Actually, only a small part of it was adressed, and the rest is still there in 2008. I've send quite a few messages and files to tech support, the last ones one week ago already, and am still waiting to here from them. I did get a reply about the hyphen issue. It is somewhat encouraging and also disappointingly revealing how slowly a company like MM can get around to fixing things: We are also aware of an issue with hyphens that used to appear in earlier versions but now do not. We were very close to finding the resources for this one and it remains near the top of the priorities. -Randolph Peters ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] a hopeful sign
On Jul 13, 2007, at 7:49 AM, dc wrote: This reminds me of the hyphen bug, that MM claimed to have solved with one of the first 2007 updates. Actually, only a small part of it was adressed, and the rest is still there in 2008. I've send quite a few messages and files to tech support, the last ones one week ago already, and am still waiting to here from them. Don't know if it'll mean much, but hyphens definitely went missing in the arrangement I was just working on in 2007c (. Once I retyped the syllables-plus-hyphens using Type Into Score, they were fine again, but it wasn't fun scouring 15 pages to find and fix the missing hyphens -- probably about 10 to 15 missing hyphens in all. I will say, however, that I didn't help my situation -- I typed into score all along the way, in an arrangement that I did a few pages at a time, with much copying and pasting (including lyrics) between sections and between vocal parts. I haven't wanted to get close to seeing what my lyrics look like in the Edit Lyrics window. I did this consciously, knowing I might set myself up for problems, but it still doesn't change the fact that the bug is there and shouldn't be. -- Mike ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] a hopeful sign
Randolph Peters wrote: Randolph Peters écrit: The fact that MM is actively looking into this issue is a sign of hope because they ignored it for the 2007 upgrades and the first 2008 version. (Denis) dc wrote: This reminds me of the hyphen bug, that MM claimed to have solved with one of the first 2007 updates. Actually, only a small part of it was adressed, and the rest is still there in 2008. I've send quite a few messages and files to tech support, the last ones one week ago already, and am still waiting to here from them. I did get a reply about the hyphen issue. It is somewhat encouraging and also disappointingly revealing how slowly a company like MM can get around to fixing things: We are also aware of an issue with hyphens that used to appear in earlier versions but now do not. We were very close to finding the resources for this one and it remains near the top of the priorities. -Randolph Peters Yeah, near the top. I'm certain that improved midi file import and percussion-map overhaul is near the top as well. Just like I live near Washington, D.C. -- compared to someone living in Moscow! (I'm in southern New Hampshire) What does near the top really mean? What's above it, what's at the top? It should have been removed from the list because it was fixed! Close to finding the resources for this one What does that really mean? They're tracking down an old Commodore and almost have located one? They've decided to cut the janitor's overtime so they've got some more development dollars? Or is it that they have to wait until the company has saved enough money to buy a better debugging program or more robust development platform to make it easier to find and fix those bugs? I don't want them to be close to finding the resources for it -- I've paid them for two upgrades and it remains broken. They've got my share of their resources. It's terrific that we can now synch our earth-shatteringly-beautiful music to audio. Just make sure that music doesn't involve choruses who need to read lyrics which will depend on hyphens for easier reading of melismas or require the use of 9-key flipped enharmonics! Please, MakeMusic, stop with the new crap before you fix the old crap! Especially since including the new crap is what broke the old crap in the first place, back with Fin2007! Both those bugs were non-existent before that, and there should have been no new features before they were fixed. Man with the sort of necessity of the development team to find the resources, the only resources they'll need to find is the resources to make peanut-butter and jelly sandwiches to take to the unemployment line while waiting to find new jobs! It must be so frustrating to be on the MakeMusic Finale development team, to know those bugs are there but to have to wait to somehow find the resources before being allowed to fix them. And even more frustrating to be told the product is going gold, even with those bugs remaining unfixed. What sort of professional pride can they take in that? That they are professionals is to be understood, or the program wouldn't be as good as it is, even with those bugs. But it is the very quality of Finale overall which makes those bugs more annoying. As I'm sure it annoys the developers, too. -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] a hopeful sign
Because the Finale 2008 upgrade didn't fix what many thought were important bugs, a lot of people wrote complaints to MakeMusic. I just got a response back from Quality Assurance regarding the enharmonic flipping bug. It appears that MM is taking it seriously and is working on it. At least that is how I read this: OT37068: When inside the Speedy Frame, necessary accidentals can disappear or unnecessary accidentals (naturals) can be forced to appear with certain notes in staves with certain Chromatic transpositions. It all depends on if the note would have an accidental in the key sig. I'd like to make sure there isn't another issue lurking that we're overlooking because we think we've got it covered with this one. -Randolph Peters ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] a hopeful sign
The problem definitely goes much deeper, and if the description below is supposed to be comprehensive, then they don't have it remotely covered with this one. Chris Smith seems like the go-to guy on this bug -- perhaps Randolph would let Chris know which CS person he was talking to and the two of them can get in touch. I'm glad MM is taking this bug seriously, but it seems like they don't yet know how serious it truly is. This is unfortunate, because I know Chris has sent in detailed reports on the 9-flip bug. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 12 Jul 2007, at 9:55 PM, Randolph Peters wrote: Because the Finale 2008 upgrade didn't fix what many thought were important bugs, a lot of people wrote complaints to MakeMusic. I just got a response back from Quality Assurance regarding the enharmonic flipping bug. It appears that MM is taking it seriously and is working on it. At least that is how I read this: OT37068: When inside the Speedy Frame, necessary accidentals can disappear or unnecessary accidentals (naturals) can be forced to appear with certain notes in staves with certain Chromatic transpositions. It all depends on if the note would have an accidental in the key sig. I'd like to make sure there isn't another issue lurking that we're overlooking because we think we've got it covered with this one. -Randolph Peters ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
