Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
Then there's the free(as in beer) Apple Developer Tools, which you need to install, but include: XCode and all the other good stuff it brings, including WebObjects, IPhone SDK, general Cocoa SDK tools, various profilers etc etc. the list just goes on an on.. In my experience IDEs like Eclipse, Flex Builder, Netbeans etc etc work fine on OS X. Visual Studio Express is also free (as in beer) and also is a good development environment for Windows. Now it has to be said that XCode is a lovely IDE!
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
I have made the switch to Mac, and wanted to chime in. I have developed on Windows for most of my career, but I'm moving everything to Mac. I am more than satisfied with FB3 on the Mac. In fact, I've been slowly moving to Mac for practically everything for a year now. Development is better, and overall stress is way down. It's a little different, just like Linux is different. Everything just works, all the time, as far as tools goes. That is my experience anyway. I'm not alone. One by one, my co-workers are running necessary Windows programs from VMWare Fusion, with no complaints. In fact, our office is just buying new Macs. Linux seems to be the fate of all our Windows PCs nowadays, especially if it says Dell. That's working out extremely well also. The bottom line is we are more productive on Macs. Isn't that the point? I am fortunate to have a MacBook Pro, with 4GB and 8MB of L2 cache. So, there's a lot to be said for good hardware and memory. But since this a general Mac statement, I say yes, it's great. Scared of Vista? It's okay, you can say it, we all know. Thinking now's a good time to switch? Definitely consider it. With people scavenging for unused XP licenses, because they are tired of rebuilding Vista, it's good timing. I was fine with XP, but that's not a real choice for the future. Vista is a big step backwards, in our experience. Who knows when a new Windows is coming out. We can't wait a few years for them to get their act together. Macs have never been so good. It's not just the new and shiny, as has been suggested previously. Mac makes a solid case for productivity, now and the next few years. I'm sure Adobe would agree. Right now, I can't image not having a Mac to develop on. -- Cole From: Gustavo Duenas [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 7:53:10 AM Subject: Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac? welcome to the mac family :) On Oct 24, 2008, at 1:52 PM, Jatin Nanda wrote: I still use both forms extensively. I have a development PC, which I am slowly de-commissioning and a dell laptop that is primarily used for off-site work. My new development machine is actually a 2Gb 24 iMac (am awaiting delivery of the additional 2Gb). Apart from the big screen, the main reason why i bought this is the lact of wires. It has a single power cable, i have an Ethernet cable an additional DVI cable for a 2nd screen. But no other wires (keyboard and mouse are wireless). Its got a built in cam for video conferencing, and built in speakers. Where my development pc had upto 15 different cables (power, additional monitors, speakers, keyboard mouse) the iMac makes my desk tidier. Oh yes and it looks good too. As a development experience, I am slowly beginning to lean towards the mac. Eclipse does not look as good/polish as it does on a PC. Expose Spaces is very useful. But since I still need a lot of windows apps, which are installed in VMs. I could do with more RAM though Regards, J 2008/10/24 john fisher [EMAIL PROTECTED] net yeah, thanks, have that. Its much better than a couple of years ago. Probably plenty good enough for a bushwhacker like me if I just took some time with it. J Guy Morton wrote: Inkscape is a reasonable Illustrator- replacement, and it's free. Gustavo A. Duenas Creative DirectorLEFT AND RIGHT SOLUTIONS 904. 265 0330 - 904. 386 7958 www.leftandrightsolutions.com Jacksonville - Florida
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
Hi, For me, Windows is not even remotely comparable to OS X for a software development machine. These are some very useful tools for software development that come with OS X. Straight out of the box. crab:~ shaun$ which python /usr/bin/python crab:~ shaun$ which ruby /usr/bin/ruby crab:~ shaun$ which perl /usr/bin/perl crab:~ shaun$ which apachectl /usr/sbin/apachectl crab:~ shaun$ which at /usr/bin/at crab:~ shaun$ which emacs /usr/bin/emacs crab:~ shaun$ which vi /usr/bin/vi crab:~ shaun$ which java /usr/bin/java crab:bin shaun$ which diff /usr/bin/diff crab:share shaun$ which patch /usr/bin/patch crab:bin shaun$ which svn /usr/bin/svn crab:bin shaun$ which head /usr/bin/head crab:bin shaun$ which tail /usr/bin/tail crab:bin shaun$ which grep /usr/bin/grep crab:bin shaun$ which find /usr/bin/find crab:bin shaun$ which awk /usr/bin/awk crab:bin shaun$ which sed /usr/bin/sed crab:bin shaun$ which bash /bin/bash crab:bin shaun$ which zip /usr/bin/zip crab:bin shaun$ which tar /usr/bin/tar crab:bin shaun$ which ssh /usr/bin/ssh crab:bin shaun$ which scp /usr/bin/scp crab:share shaun$ which curl /usr/bin/curl crab:share shaun$ which ftp /usr/bin/ftp Then there's the free(as in beer) Apple Developer Tools, which you need to install, but include: XCode and all the other good stuff it brings, including WebObjects, IPhone SDK, general Cocoa SDK tools, various profilers etc etc. the list just goes on an on.. In my experience IDEs like Eclipse, Flex Builder, Netbeans etc etc work fine on OS X. Basically, OS X is a /great/ developer platform. cheers, - shaun
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
Le 23 oct. 08 à 21:20, Matt Chotin a écrit : So a lot of us on the Flex team now have Macs. One reason is because we have a lot of designers who use Macs anyway. Another is because we obviously build software for Macs, and in running Macs we can actually do tests on both Mac and Windows (via virtual machine). I was entirely a PC guy before I got my Mac about 15 months ago. I don't mind the Mac, but I wouldn't say it's more stable than my PC was, and the inconsistency in how keyboard shortcuts work and whatnot drives me up wall. My IDE is no longer Eclipse/Flex Builder but my email client and Word and PowerPoint, and I gotta say I like the Windows versions better than the Mac. What IDE do you use ? I'm trying to get rid of Eclipse/FlexBuilder on my Mac and I have trouble finding the right way to compile, build and deploy our applications without FlexBuilder (of which we bought the professional version ;^) ). Thanks, Farid
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
I think he meant I'm not coding any more :) On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 6:19 PM, Farid SALAH [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Le 23 oct. 08 à 21:20, Matt Chotin a écrit : So a lot of us on the Flex team now have Macs. One reason is because we have a lot of designers who use Macs anyway. Another is because we obviously build software for Macs, and in running Macs we can actually do tests on both Mac and Windows (via virtual machine). I was entirely a PC guy before I got my Mac about 15 months ago. I don't mind the Mac, but I wouldn't say it's more stable than my PC was, and the inconsistency in how keyboard shortcuts work and whatnot drives me up wall. My IDE is no longer Eclipse/Flex Builder but my email client and Word and PowerPoint, and I gotta say I like the Windows versions better than the Mac. What IDE do you use ? I'm trying to get rid of Eclipse/FlexBuilder on my Mac and I have trouble finding the right way to compile, build and deploy our applications without FlexBuilder (of which we bought the professional version ;^) ). Thanks, Farid -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Alternative FAQ location: https://share.acrobat.com/adc/document.do?docid=942dbdc8-e469-446f-b4cf-1e62079f6847 Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.comYahoo! Groups Links -- Therefore, send not to know For whom the bell tolls. It tolls for thee. Like the cut of my jib? Check out my Flex blog! :: Josh 'G-Funk' McDonald :: 0437 221 380 :: [EMAIL PROTECTED] :: http://flex.joshmcdonald.info/
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
Le 24 oct. 08 à 10:27, Josh McDonald a écrit : I think he meant I'm not coding any more :) That's what happens when one thinks one thinks he can read and understand english as one's native language. Maybe I'll start a new thread on this... Thanks, Farid from Paris, France
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
I have been moving towards OSX three years ago. Only I have the feeling you replacing the BSOD with annoying rotating beachballs. You are having a lot of beachballs under OSX sometimes at odd times. Anyways, beside of things like Disco, QuickSilver and TextMate are nice applications which ain't available under Windows/Linux.
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
yeah, thanks, have that. Its much better than a couple of years ago. Probably plenty good enough for a bushwhacker like me if I just took some time with it. J Guy Morton wrote: Inkscape is a reasonable Illustrator-replacement, and it's free.
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
I still use both forms extensively. I have a development PC, which I am slowly de-commissioning and a dell laptop that is primarily used for off-site work. My new development machine is actually a 2Gb 24 iMac (am awaiting delivery of the additional 2Gb). Apart from the big screen, the main reason why i bought this is the lact of wires. It has a single power cable, i have an Ethernet cable an additional DVI cable for a 2nd screen. But no other wires (keyboard and mouse are wireless). Its got a built in cam for video conferencing, and built in speakers. Where my development pc had upto 15 different cables (power, additional monitors, speakers, keyboard mouse) the iMac makes my desk tidier. Oh yes and it looks good too. As a development experience, I am slowly beginning to lean towards the mac. Eclipse does not look as good/polish as it does on a PC. Expose Spaces is very useful. But since I still need a lot of windows apps, which are installed in VMs. I could do with more RAM though Regards, J 2008/10/24 john fisher [EMAIL PROTECTED] yeah, thanks, have that. Its much better than a couple of years ago. Probably plenty good enough for a bushwhacker like me if I just took some time with it. J Guy Morton wrote: Inkscape is a reasonable Illustrator-replacement, and it's free.
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
Aye. A longtime mantra of mine is that you can never have too much RAM or hard disk, doesn't matter which platform. :-) On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 1:52 PM, Jatin Nanda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I could do with more RAM though -- Howard Fore, [EMAIL PROTECTED] The universe tends toward maximum irony. Don't push it. - Jeff Atwood
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
Too bad, the iMac 20 has a terrible LCD display which lacks the ability to display grayscale reasonable. On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:52:15 +0100, Jatin Nanda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I still use both forms extensively. I have a development PC, which I am slowly de-commissioning and a dell laptop that is primarily used for off-site work. My new development machine is actually a 2Gb 24 iMac (am awaiting delivery of the additional 2Gb). Apart from the big screen, the main reason why i bought this is the lact of wires. It has a single power cable, i have an Ethernet cable an additional DVI cable for a 2nd screen. But no other wires (keyboard and mouse are wireless). Its got a built in cam for video conferencing, and built in speakers. Where my development pc had upto 15 different cables (power, additional monitors, speakers, keyboard mouse) the iMac makes my desk tidier. Oh yes and it looks good too. As a development experience, I am slowly beginning to lean towards the mac. Eclipse does not look as good/polish as it does on a PC. Expose Spaces is very useful. But since I still need a lot of windows apps, which are installed in VMs. I could do with more RAM though Regards, J 2008/10/24 john fisher [EMAIL PROTECTED] yeah, thanks, have that. Its much better than a couple of years ago. Probably plenty good enough for a bushwhacker like me if I just took some time with it. J Guy Morton wrote: Inkscape is a reasonable Illustrator-replacement, and it's free.
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
I do. And it's better for everything except Flex ;-) In all seriousness, I can't abide Windows, and the mix of real Unix plus all the Aqua goodness (not to mention various third-party tools like Textmate) more than make up for the (slightly) crappier quality in Builder and Eclipse on Mac. -Josh On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 4:49 PM, Haykel BEN JEMIA [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote: Hi, this is probably off topic, but I noticed that most of the screencasts I watched about Flex are made on Mac OSX. Do most Flex developers work on Mac? Are most developers in the USA using Macs (as most screencasts I watched are done by people from the US)? Are their any advantages on using a Mac instead of a PC for Web/Flex development? I'm just wondering as I never used a Mac before. -- Haykel Ben Jemia Allmas Web RIA Development http://www.allmas-tn.com -- Therefore, send not to know For whom the bell tolls. It tolls for thee. Like the cut of my jib? Check out my Flex blog! :: Josh 'G-Funk' McDonald :: 0437 221 380 :: [EMAIL PROTECTED] :: http://flex.joshmcdonald.info/
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
i use a mac, but alongside this i develop in windows using vmware, the advantages of vm'ing is really what i am after, some people use ubuntu and a vm others use pc in our team. the vm is the key, new developer joins, here you go a complete setup environment. my environment gets a bit slow after installing a bunch of crap for the last project, revert to snapshot.of course several gig of memory is the needed here. On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 9:02 AM, Josh McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I do. And it's better for everything except Flex ;-) In all seriousness, I can't abide Windows, and the mix of real Unix plus all the Aqua goodness (not to mention various third-party tools like Textmate) more than make up for the (slightly) crappier quality in Builder and Eclipse on Mac. -Josh On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 4:49 PM, Haykel BEN JEMIA [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote: Hi, this is probably off topic, but I noticed that most of the screencasts I watched about Flex are made on Mac OSX. Do most Flex developers work on Mac? Are most developers in the USA using Macs (as most screencasts I watched are done by people from the US)? Are their any advantages on using a Mac instead of a PC for Web/Flex development? I'm just wondering as I never used a Mac before. -- Haykel Ben Jemia Allmas Web RIA Development http://www.allmas-tn.com -- Therefore, send not to know For whom the bell tolls. It tolls for thee. Like the cut of my jib? Check out my Flex blog! :: Josh 'G-Funk' McDonald :: 0437 221 380 :: [EMAIL PROTECTED] :: http://flex.joshmcdonald.info/ -- j:pn \\no comment
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
I use a Mac, however I¹m also coming from the graphic design / web development side. I, a long time ago, was a diehard PC user. Actually I was a technician, skilled in the art of fixing all things WinTel. Then one day, kicking and screaming, I was introduced to the white computer with the distinctive bitten apple logo. Reluctantly, over time, I came to the understanding that I could actually get work accomplished without requiring an A+ certificate, numerous Microsoft Certs or an on-call IT support team. The damn thing just worked! Can you believe that? Amazing... Actually, using the OSX operating system natively allows you to work with files as they would appear in an Apache server. Being a Unix based OS (closer relative, not distant cousin like Winx), you can do things that would require extra software, patches, etc on Windows. Add in virtualization and you can easily and efficiently run any OS in real time, switching at will and it doesn¹t break! Sure Windows has it¹s place... As a virtual OS on my OSX desktop ;) -- Blair From: Haykel BEN JEMIA [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 08:49:58 +0200 To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac? Hi, this is probably off topic, but I noticed that most of the screencasts I watched about Flex are made on Mac OSX. Do most Flex developers work on Mac? Are most developers in the USA using Macs (as most screencasts I watched are done by people from the US)? Are their any advantages on using a Mac instead of a PC for Web/Flex development? I'm just wondering as I never used a Mac before. -- Haykel Ben Jemia Allmas Web RIA Development http://www.allmas-tn.com
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
Like someone else already posted. The main advantage to using OSX instead of WindowsXP/Vista is that you spend more time actually getting work done. I spent fifteen years in various Windows boxes. I switched last year and I'll never go back. -- Matthew On Wed, Oct 22, 2008 at 11:49 PM, Haykel BEN JEMIA [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, this is probably off topic, but I noticed that most of the screencasts I watched about Flex are made on Mac OSX. Do most Flex developers work on Mac? Are most developers in the USA using Macs (as most screencasts I watched are done by people from the US)? Are their any advantages on using a Mac instead of a PC for Web/Flex development? I'm just wondering as I never used a Mac before. -- Haykel Ben Jemia Allmas Web RIA Development http://www.allmas-tn.com
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
I use a mac, but I've been using Apple products since 1979 OSX is Unix based, and a lot of devs like the Unix- ish features. My experience with designing and developing on a mac is that it's more straight forward to use. If you love to inker with your OS and hardware, go Microsoft, for a more straight forward enviroment go OSX. Apple has an very large market share of US laptops - and gaining fast. Alan On Oct 23, 2008, at 1:48 PM, Matthew Shirey wrote: Do most Flex developers work on Mac?
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
I recently switched to a MAC and love it. On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:04 PM, Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I use a mac, but I've been using Apple products since 1979 OSX is Unix based, and a lot of devs like the Unix- ish features. My experience with designing and developing on a mac is that it's more straight forward to use. If you love to inker with your OS and hardware, go Microsoft, for a more straight forward enviroment go OSX. Apple has an very large market share of US laptops - and gaining fast. Alan On Oct 23, 2008, at 1:48 PM, Matthew Shirey wrote: Do most Flex developers work on Mac? -- When you choose hope, anything is possible. -Christopher Reeve
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
So a lot of us on the Flex team now have Macs. One reason is because we have a lot of designers who use Macs anyway. Another is because we obviously build software for Macs, and in running Macs we can actually do tests on both Mac and Windows (via virtual machine). I was entirely a PC guy before I got my Mac about 15 months ago. I don't mind the Mac, but I wouldn't say it's more stable than my PC was, and the inconsistency in how keyboard shortcuts work and whatnot drives me up wall. My IDE is no longer Eclipse/Flex Builder but my email client and Word and PowerPoint, and I gotta say I like the Windows versions better than the Mac. I think if you are a happy Windows user and don't have a compelling reason to use a Mac you don't need to switch just because it appears others are using it. Not saying the Mac is bad, just saying it hasn't made me a convert. Matt On 10/23/08 12:06 PM, Clint Tredway [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I recently switched to a MAC and love it. On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:04 PM, Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I use a mac, but I've been using Apple products since 1979 OSX is Unix based, and a lot of devs like the Unix- ish features. My experience with designing and developing on a mac is that it's more straight forward to use. If you love to inker with your OS and hardware, go Microsoft, for a more straight forward enviroment go OSX. Apple has an very large market share of US laptops - and gaining fast. Alan On Oct 23, 2008, at 1:48 PM, Matthew Shirey wrote: Do most Flex developers work on Mac?
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
I made the switch in February and will never look back. Don't listen to Matt ;-) Brendan On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:20 PM, Matt Chotin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So a lot of us on the Flex team now have Macs. One reason is because we have a lot of designers who use Macs anyway. Another is because we obviously build software for Macs, and in running Macs we can actually do tests on both Mac and Windows (via virtual machine). I was entirely a PC guy before I got my Mac about 15 months ago. I don't mind the Mac, but I wouldn't say it's more stable than my PC was, and the inconsistency in how keyboard shortcuts work and whatnot drives me up wall. My IDE is no longer Eclipse/Flex Builder but my email client and Word and PowerPoint, and I gotta say I like the Windows versions better than the Mac. I think if you are a happy Windows user and don't have a compelling reason to use a Mac you don't need to switch just because it appears others are using it. Not saying the Mac is bad, just saying it hasn't made me a convert. Matt On 10/23/08 12:06 PM, Clint Tredway [EMAIL PROTECTED]grumpee%40gmail.com wrote: I recently switched to a MAC and love it. On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:04 PM, Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED]ultraky%40gmail.com wrote: I use a mac, but I've been using Apple products since 1979 OSX is Unix based, and a lot of devs like the Unix- ish features. My experience with designing and developing on a mac is that it's more straight forward to use. If you love to inker with your OS and hardware, go Microsoft, for a more straight forward enviroment go OSX. Apple has an very large market share of US laptops - and gaining fast. Alan On Oct 23, 2008, at 1:48 PM, Matthew Shirey wrote: Do most Flex developers work on Mac? -- Brendan Meutzner http://www.meutzner.com/blog/
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
I've been using a MacBook Pro for some time now. I agree with Matt on all counts. I got one cuz you can run Windows + OS/X on it which is useful for testing. I have to say I still don't get why people rave about them. It's just a computer. Its shiney and pretty and there are some features which are sorta nice (backlit keyboard,etc) but nothing earth-shattering. Usability-wise I find it requires more from the user than Windows. It seems to be a Apple pattern to hide things from the user (I guess to reduce complexity of UI and hide dangerous functionality). I really feel like I'm missing something ... like there's some yet undiscovered gems ... that have escaped my view. All my attempts to seriously explore why its so great by asking other Mac users have failed. It's almost as if the computer you use defines who you are as a person ... so anything thats exposed as a short-coming in the Mac is received as a personal attack. I don't know ... its very confusing to me why anyone would care that much one way or another. Generally speaking I find all Actionscript/Flex develop to be much less problematic (and often runs faster) in my VMWare Windows installation than natively on the Mac. Thats my 2 cents On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 12:31 PM, Brendan Meutzner [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote: I made the switch in February and will never look back. Don't listen to Matt ;-) Brendan On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:20 PM, Matt Chotin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So a lot of us on the Flex team now have Macs. One reason is because we have a lot of designers who use Macs anyway. Another is because we obviously build software for Macs, and in running Macs we can actually do tests on both Mac and Windows (via virtual machine). I was entirely a PC guy before I got my Mac about 15 months ago. I don't mind the Mac, but I wouldn't say it's more stable than my PC was, and the inconsistency in how keyboard shortcuts work and whatnot drives me up wall. My IDE is no longer Eclipse/Flex Builder but my email client and Word and PowerPoint, and I gotta say I like the Windows versions better than the Mac. I think if you are a happy Windows user and don't have a compelling reason to use a Mac you don't need to switch just because it appears others are using it. Not saying the Mac is bad, just saying it hasn't made me a convert. Matt On 10/23/08 12:06 PM, Clint Tredway [EMAIL PROTECTED]grumpee%40gmail.com wrote: I recently switched to a MAC and love it. On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:04 PM, Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED]ultraky%40gmail.com wrote: I use a mac, but I've been using Apple products since 1979 OSX is Unix based, and a lot of devs like the Unix- ish features. My experience with designing and developing on a mac is that it's more straight forward to use. If you love to inker with your OS and hardware, go Microsoft, for a more straight forward enviroment go OSX. Apple has an very large market share of US laptops - and gaining fast. Alan On Oct 23, 2008, at 1:48 PM, Matthew Shirey wrote: Do most Flex developers work on Mac? -- Brendan Meutzner http://www.meutzner.com/blog/
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
lol... I never thought of a computer as a pen*s extender... good one James! So I think I'll elaborate on why I like Mac in response. I certainly respect James' opinion and can see where he's coming from. Like anything else in the IT industry, you have people on both sides of the fence when it comes to competing technologies. I don't profess to be on the extreme side of Mac, but will say the following: 1) I started by getting Mac Pro and the fact it has dual quad core processors probably helped in my immediate satisfaction with performance. However, I noticed early on that the number of times the OS crashed had reduced dramatically. I think it's frozen up maybe 3 times since I got it back in February. After years of PC use with weekly (if not daily) reboots made this a discovery. I've since gotten a Macbook Pro and again, no crashing. 2) The thing I really noticed with the Macbook Pro (hardware similar to what you'll get in any other laptop) was that performance with a large amount of apps open at the same time was not degraded. I can't say I've done any comparison tests between app usage in windows, and now in mac, but I will say that the perceived difference is huge. I have everything but the kitchen sink open at the same time and the machine doesn't falter this is huge! 3) The interface did take some getting used to. I was never a big keyboard shortcut guy, but have adapted to make the most of the Mac. I'm really glad that it forced me into this because my wrists will thank me for slowing the RSI inevitability in my future. There's two sides to this of course, windows made it very easy to navigate with the Mouse, but Mac has made it a lot faster given a bit of training. 4) Installation and upkeep of applications and drivers is a no brainer. I'm definitely not one of those guys who wants to know or tinker with what's under the hood, so this is a big feature. I suppose a lot of folks out there are not in the same camp as me on this one, but if you are, you'll love this about Mac. 5) As others have already pointed out in this thread, I have Windows if I need it through VMWare. I have it running pretty much constantly, but admittedly never use it anymore. The only reason I would is for testing or use of an application (ie. quickbooks) which doesn't come on Mac. 6) Things just work... from application install, to drivers, to wireless... it's all good. I can't describe how many times it was next to impossible to get wireless working on open networks at various conferences and locations. With Mac, it just does... Maybe I'm just a dummy when it comes to this though. 7) Horizontal wheel scrolling rocks... the mighty mouse took some getting used to, but I love it now. Things I find frustrating about Mac: 1) I mentioned the ease of interface above, but there are also things about the OS which are frustrating. It often seems like Apple is behind the times on certain features which have been available in Windows forever (ie. resize of windows on edges, not just bottom corner... mouse speed, etc..). However, I've found that most of these situations can be remedied through prefPane apps or AppleScript routines. It's not fun to have to install these to get the functionality I want, but hey... I've already saved time by not worrying about drivers and application installs so I'll take the trade off. 2) Spaces is awesome, but also pretty funky sometimes. I'm not sure if it's issues with the particular applications, or with Spaces itself, but when switching between them on different spaces it gets fugged up. 3) Macbook Pro specific: the trackpad blows... I put up with it when it doesn't make sense to use a mouse, but I carry one with my constantly to use when I can. Multi touch is sorta useful, but cons outweigh pros. It'd be really nice if Apple came out with a similar feature to what Lenovo and Dell have with the small rubber mouse thingy in the center of keyboard... I loved that about my Thinkpad. I'll finish this off by also saying that I don't seen the issues that others do with FlexBuilder on Mac. I've used it extensively on both Mac and PC now and can't say that one is better than the other. Also... I should clarify... listen to Matt on everything else, just not his opinion on Mac :-) And that completes my 2 cents... Brendan On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:55 PM, James Douma [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've been using a MacBook Pro for some time now. I agree with Matt on all counts. I got one cuz you can run Windows + OS/X on it which is useful for testing. I have to say I still don't get why people rave about them. It's just a computer. Its shiney and pretty and there are some features which are sorta nice (backlit keyboard,etc) but nothing earth-shattering. Usability-wise I find it requires more from the user than Windows. It seems to be a Apple pattern to hide things from the user (I guess to reduce complexity of UI and hide dangerous functionality). I
RE: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
No, I do not. Few, if any of my business clients do either. Tracy From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Douma Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2008 3:55 PM To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac? I've been using a MacBook Pro for some time now. I agree with Matt on all counts. I got one cuz you can run Windows + OS/X on it which is useful for testing. I have to say I still don't get why people rave about them. It's just a computer. Its shiney and pretty and there are some features which are sorta nice (backlit keyboard,etc) but nothing earth-shattering. Usability-wise I find it requires more from the user than Windows. It seems to be a Apple pattern to hide things from the user (I guess to reduce complexity of UI and hide dangerous functionality). I really feel like I'm missing something ... like there's some yet undiscovered gems ... that have escaped my view. All my attempts to seriously explore why its so great by asking other Mac users have failed. It's almost as if the computer you use defines who you are as a person ... so anything thats exposed as a short-coming in the Mac is received as a personal attack. I don't know ... its very confusing to me why anyone would care that much one way or another. Generally speaking I find all Actionscript/Flex develop to be much less problematic (and often runs faster) in my VMWare Windows installation than natively on the Mac. Thats my 2 cents On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 12:31 PM, Brendan Meutzner [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I made the switch in February and will never look back. Don't listen to Matt ;-) Brendan On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:20 PM, Matt Chotin [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So a lot of us on the Flex team now have Macs. One reason is because we have a lot of designers who use Macs anyway. Another is because we obviously build software for Macs, and in running Macs we can actually do tests on both Mac and Windows (via virtual machine). I was entirely a PC guy before I got my Mac about 15 months ago. I don't mind the Mac, but I wouldn't say it's more stable than my PC was, and the inconsistency in how keyboard shortcuts work and whatnot drives me up wall. My IDE is no longer Eclipse/Flex Builder but my email client and Word and PowerPoint, and I gotta say I like the Windows versions better than the Mac. I think if you are a happy Windows user and don't have a compelling reason to use a Mac you don't need to switch just because it appears others are using it. Not saying the Mac is bad, just saying it hasn't made me a convert. Matt On 10/23/08 12:06 PM, Clint Tredway [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:grumpee%40gmail.com wrote: I recently switched to a MAC and love it. On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:04 PM, Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:ultraky%40gmail.com wrote: I use a mac, but I've been using Apple products since 1979 OSX is Unix based, and a lot of devs like the Unix- ish features. My experience with designing and developing on a mac is that it's more straight forward to use. If you love to inker with your OS and hardware, go Microsoft, for a more straight forward enviroment go OSX. Apple has an very large market share of US laptops - and gaining fast. Alan On Oct 23, 2008, at 1:48 PM, Matthew Shirey wrote: Do most Flex developers work on Mac? -- Brendan Meutzner http://www.meutzner.com/blog/ http://www.meutzner.com/blog/
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
There's a split between the media/creative industry and those who do a real job, err I mean everybody else (that's a joke BTW). Generally speaking Macs are to be found with media/creative/trendy types, but rarely outside that circle. I've lived in a development environment and until I switched to Flash/Flex had only encountered two macs! Since moving to a flash environment I've seen loads of macs. I'd like to have a MacBook though.. Paul - Original Message - From: Tracy Spratt To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2008 9:50 PM Subject: RE: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac? No, I do not. Few, if any of my business clients do either. Tracy -- From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Douma Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2008 3:55 PM To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac? I've been using a MacBook Pro for some time now. I agree with Matt on all counts. I got one cuz you can run Windows + OS/X on it which is useful for testing. I have to say I still don't get why people rave about them. It's just a computer. Its shiney and pretty and there are some features which are sorta nice (backlit keyboard,etc) but nothing earth-shattering. Usability-wise I find it requires more from the user than Windows. It seems to be a Apple pattern to hide things from the user (I guess to reduce complexity of UI and hide dangerous functionality). I really feel like I'm missing something ... like there's some yet undiscovered gems ... that have escaped my view. All my attempts to seriously explore why its so great by asking other Mac users have failed. It's almost as if the computer you use defines who you are as a person ... so anything thats exposed as a short-coming in the Mac is received as a personal attack. I don't know ... its very confusing to me why anyone would care that much one way or another. Generally speaking I find all Actionscript/Flex develop to be much less problematic (and often runs faster) in my VMWare Windows installation than natively on the Mac. Thats my 2 cents On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 12:31 PM, Brendan Meutzner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I made the switch in February and will never look back. Don't listen to Matt ;-) Brendan On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:20 PM, Matt Chotin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So a lot of us on the Flex team now have Macs. One reason is because we have a lot of designers who use Macs anyway. Another is because we obviously build software for Macs, and in running Macs we can actually do tests on both Mac and Windows (via virtual machine). I was entirely a PC guy before I got my Mac about 15 months ago. I don't mind the Mac, but I wouldn't say it's more stable than my PC was, and the inconsistency in how keyboard shortcuts work and whatnot drives me up wall. My IDE is no longer Eclipse/Flex Builder but my email client and Word and PowerPoint, and I gotta say I like the Windows versions better than the Mac. I think if you are a happy Windows user and don't have a compelling reason to use a Mac you don't need to switch just because it appears others are using it. Not saying the Mac is bad, just saying it hasn't made me a convert. Matt On 10/23/08 12:06 PM, Clint Tredway [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I recently switched to a MAC and love it. On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:04 PM, Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I use a mac, but I've been using Apple products since 1979 OSX is Unix based, and a lot of devs like the Unix- ish features. My experience with designing and developing on a mac is that it's more straight forward to use. If you love to inker with your OS and hardware, go Microsoft, for a more straight forward enviroment go OSX. Apple has an very large market share of US laptops - and gaining fast. Alan On Oct 23, 2008, at 1:48 PM, Matthew Shirey wrote: Do most Flex developers work on Mac? -- Brendan Meutzner http://www.meutzner.com/blog/
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
That's not so true any more. I have lots of hard-core geek friends and many of them are moving to OSX because it's got unix under the hood, looks great, has a ton of open-source software available for it and it isn't Microsoft. Those are pretty good reasons if you ask me, and yes, I've used both at different stages in my career. Like others here, I use a VM (Parallels Desktop) to run windows when I need to test things under IE. I can also run up a quick Ubuntu machine using it if need be, It's a sweet setup, and one you can't duplicate on a Windows PC. It's the perfect web development setup because you get access to all the OSes in one well-designed package. Guy On 24/10/2008, at 7:42 AM, Paul Andrews wrote: There's a split between the media/creative industry and those who do a real job, err I mean everybody else (that's a joke BTW). Generally speaking Macs are to be found with media/creative/trendy types, but rarely outside that circle. I've lived in a development environment and until I switched to Flash/Flex had only encountered two macs! Since moving to a flash environment I've seen loads of macs. I'd like to have a MacBook though.. Paul - Original Message - From: Tracy Spratt To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2008 9:50 PM Subject: RE: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac? No, I do not. Few, if any of my business clients do either. Tracy From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Douma Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2008 3:55 PM To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac? I've been using a MacBook Pro for some time now. I agree with Matt on all counts. I got one cuz you can run Windows + OS/X on it which is useful for testing. I have to say I still don't get why people rave about them. It's just a computer. Its shiney and pretty and there are some features which are sorta nice (backlit keyboard,etc) but nothing earth- shattering. Usability-wise I find it requires more from the user than Windows. It seems to be a Apple pattern to hide things from the user (I guess to reduce complexity of UI and hide dangerous functionality). I really feel like I'm missing something ... like there's some yet undiscovered gems ... that have escaped my view. All my attempts to seriously explore why its so great by asking other Mac users have failed. It's almost as if the computer you use defines who you are as a person ... so anything thats exposed as a short-coming in the Mac is received as a personal attack. I don't know ... its very confusing to me why anyone would care that much one way or another. Generally speaking I find all Actionscript/Flex develop to be much less problematic (and often runs faster) in my VMWare Windows installation than natively on the Mac. Thats my 2 cents On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 12:31 PM, Brendan Meutzner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I made the switch in February and will never look back. Don't listen to Matt ;-) Brendan On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:20 PM, Matt Chotin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So a lot of us on the Flex team now have Macs. One reason is because we have a lot of designers who use Macs anyway. Another is because we obviously build software for Macs, and in running Macs we can actually do tests on both Mac and Windows (via virtual machine). I was entirely a PC guy before I got my Mac about 15 months ago. I don't mind the Mac, but I wouldn't say it's more stable than my PC was, and the inconsistency in how keyboard shortcuts work and whatnot drives me up wall. My IDE is no longer Eclipse/Flex Builder but my email client and Word and PowerPoint, and I gotta say I like the Windows versions better than the Mac. I think if you are a happy Windows user and don't have a compelling reason to use a Mac you don't need to switch just because it appears others are using it. Not saying the Mac is bad, just saying it hasn't made me a convert. Matt On 10/23/08 12:06 PM, Clint Tredway [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I recently switched to a MAC and love it. On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 2:04 PM, Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I use a mac, but I've been using Apple products since 1979 OSX is Unix based, and a lot of devs like the Unix- ish features. My experience with designing and developing on a mac is that it's more straight forward to use. If you love to inker with your OS and hardware, go Microsoft, for a more straight forward enviroment go OSX. Apple has an very large market share of US laptops - and gaining fast. Alan On Oct 23, 2008, at 1:48 PM, Matthew Shirey wrote: Do most Flex developers work on Mac? -- Brendan Meutzner http://www.meutzner.com/blog/
RE: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
I first switched to a Mac about 3 1/2 years ago, and have had a MBP as my primary system for about 2 years now, though at my new job I've been moved back to an XP box. I'm still on the fence. For development I still feel Windows XP wins hands down - especially with multi-monitor set-ups. Eclipse on Windows is still leagues ahead, mostly due to the way windowing works on OSX - on OSX Eclipse just doesn't really behave as well with docked/undocked windows. I also find keystrokes to be an absolute pain in the butt on OSX - where I might do something like shift-home on Windows the equivalent keystroke on the Mac will convoluted. Even after learing the keystrokes on a Mac I feel efficiency in editors is far higher on Windows. And then there's just general applications, which I find to be on average far better for Mac. Seriously, where's the Winamp equivalent for OSX? No, iTunes is definitely not it. Flash dev on the other hand for some reason I find better on a Mac. I also like having a native *nix shell available to me. Application management/installation is often less painful or time-consuming. I've pretty much decided at this point that my next replacement notebook will be an XPS rather than a MacBook (a large factor was also Apples recent .au price increases), though I'll likely keep using a Mac for a number of tasks. --Tim Rowe From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Haykel BEN JEMIA Sent: Thursday, 23 October 2008 5:50 PM To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac? Hi, this is probably off topic, but I noticed that most of the screencasts I watched about Flex are made on Mac OSX. Do most Flex developers work on Mac? Are most developers in the USA using Macs (as most screencasts I watched are done by people from the US)? Are their any advantages on using a Mac instead of a PC for Web/Flex development? I'm just wondering as I never used a Mac before. -- Haykel Ben Jemia Allmas Web RIA Development http://www.allmas-tn.com http://www.allmas-tn.com
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
Just in case anybody cares, it is also possible to use Flex Builder on Linux. Since I don't normally use any non-free software, and I do a lot of Linux sys admin, thats good for me. There are a few apps I can't duplicate, like Illustrator and Google Sketchup and Rhino, but mostly I don't miss anything from Windows-land. true I don't care about iTunesmusic, but I do subscribe to podcasts. (I don't do professional graphics or audio.) In the last year or so the package system for Ubuntu has gotten mature, so that software installation is just select and click. It used to be a PITA sometimes. Most of the sys admin apps now work in KDE, too. Theres a few things that still don't work, but in Linux you can be pretty sure they'll be fixed. I like OSX, too, and used DOS and Windows since 1985. just sayin'
Re: [flexcoders] Do you use a Mac?
Inkscape is a reasonable Illustrator-replacement, and it's free. On 24/10/2008, at 9:23 AM, john fisher wrote: Just in case anybody cares, it is also possible to use Flex Builder on Linux. Since I don't normally use any non-free software, and I do a lot of Linux sys admin, thats good for me. There are a few apps I can't duplicate, like Illustrator and Google Sketchup and Rhino, but mostly I don't miss anything from Windows- land. true I don't care about iTunesmusic, but I do subscribe to podcasts. (I don't do professional graphics or audio.) In the last year or so the package system for Ubuntu has gotten mature, so that software installation is just select and click. It used to be a PITA sometimes. Most of the sys admin apps now work in KDE, too. Theres a few things that still don't work, but in Linux you can be pretty sure they'll be fixed. I like OSX, too, and used DOS and Windows since 1985. just sayin'
