Re: Apache XMLGraphics 'blurb' for ApacheCon 2004
I signed up for ApacheCon last night so I'll be there next week. Glen - Original Message - From: Clay Leeds [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2004 12:09 AM Subject: Fwd: Apache XMLGraphics 'blurb' for ApacheCon 2004 FYI, I just sent this msg to Tina so they can have something to show for the XML Graphics Project at ApacheCon 2004 US.
Re: XMLGraphics temp site up (was Re: Can we please disable the Wiki on Nagoya?)
Hi Guys, Well, I must admit to not being really excited by the new logo. Not to hurt people's feelings, note that it is good, but I think it could be better. None of these are really strong held but are my opinions. As it currently is I actually prefer the 'non svg shapes' version as the used shapes are rather simplistic (it makes it looks like an 80's graphics package). The text is a bit hard to read over the Apache feather. I know that you added the white surround and it helps but the letters still 'disappear' into the noise of the feather more than I would like. Now for a few suggestions: I have seen some of the Apache projects that left justify the text and move the feather up next to the 'The Apache'. This would work well for us since 'XML Graphics Project' is quite a bit longer. The URL in the corner is the old xml.apache.org URL, it should of course be xmlgraphics.apache.org (Ideally I'd like to turn this 90deg and have it run vertically, but it's too long to be readable when this is done). If we want to have 'svg' in the logo I would look at the samples directory of Batik[1] and pull out some of those. The one's that come to mind would be either of the map images (mapSpain, mapWaadt - which could be used pretty much 'as is') or perhaps grab elements from sunRise (although that is a little 'eclipse' like). My actual preference would be to include 'icons' from the sub projects in the new logo. For Batik this is simple since we already use the 'squiggle' heavily for this purpose (this is the red/green/blue mark in a bunch of places). I don't know if FOP has a similar readily available icon you could use. I would picture these icons 'looped' together in a clear area on the right side (think of an infinity sign with the batik logo on one side and Fop on the other). As more projects join we can add icons for them to the looping. Alternately we could come up with a new icon just for XML Graphics (a complex 'document' with the corner turned and on the back is XML - might be hard to pull off in a ~51px square) [1] http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs.cgi/xml-batik/test-references/samples/ Glen Mazza wrote: Very nice--I like the xmlgraphics logo, and the layout of the text is well done. I think in general having fewer pages but of higher quality is preferable. Glen Clay Leeds wrote: On Oct 9, 2004, at 1:30 AM, Jeremias Maerki wrote: snip what=wiki-stuff While we're talking about volunteers, when the resolution passes we will have some work to do, creating a charter, setting up a website for XML Graphics which will link to the two existing websites under XML and a few other things. I intent to do a good part of this but I hope I will get some help. I've placed a temporary xmlgraphics.apache.org site live on my homepage. Please take a look and provide feedback and comments: http://homepage.mac.com/webmaestro/xml-fop/xml-graphics/
Re: Apache XMLGraphics 'blurb' for ApacheCon 2004
On Nov 8, 2004, at 5:44 AM, Glen Mazza wrote: I signed up for ApacheCon last night so I'll be there next week. Glen Wish I could be there to meet you, Glen. Web Maestro Clay -- Clay Leeds - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Webmaster/Developer - Medata, Inc. - http://www.medata.com/ PGP Public Key: https://mail.medata.com/pgp/cleeds.asc
Re: XMLGraphics temp site up
On Nov 8, 2004, at 5:51 AM, Thomas DeWeese wrote: Hi Guys, Well, I must admit to not being really excited by the new logo. Not to hurt people's feelings, note that it is good, but I think it could be better. None of these are really strong held but are my opinions. I was hoping for feedback (my first post RE: the 'new' logo was in August--albeit on fop-dev), so I welcome any feedback I can get. Glen's comment RE: using ws.a.o as another example notwithstanding (thanks Glen!), I haven't had any other comments yet (hint! hint! ;-)). As it currently is I actually prefer the 'non svg shapes' version as the used shapes are rather simplistic (it makes it looks like an 80's graphics package). I agree wholeheartedly. My intent was to get the idea of pushing the graphics out there, but perhaps using gradient-filled shapes or something might be better (or better yet, perhaps I should just shrink the tiger...). This logo is actually my first *real* attempt at playing with SVG (I'd done some shapes before--which is why I added the shapes). The text is a bit hard to read over the Apache feather. I know that you added the white surround and it helps but the letters still 'disappear' into the noise of the feather more than I would like. I agree. I actually spent a bit of time on that, and was never particularly happy when I was done. Now for a few suggestions: I have seen some of the Apache projects that left justify the text and move the feather up next to the 'The Apache'. This would work well for us since 'XML Graphics Project' is quite a bit longer. Sounds good. If I can find the time this week, I'll play around with it. The URL in the corner is the old xml.apache.org URL, it should of course be xmlgraphics.apache.org (Ideally I'd like to turn this 90deg and have it run vertically, but it's too long to be readable when this is done). If we want to have 'svg' in the logo I would look at the samples directory of Batik[1] and pull out some of those. The one's that come to mind would be either of the map images (mapSpain, mapWaadt - which could be used pretty much 'as is') or perhaps grab elements from sunRise (although that is a little 'eclipse' like). Thanks! There's some really cool stuff in there! http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs.cgi/xml-batik/test-references/samples/ batik3D.png?rev=1.6view=markup http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs.cgi/xml-batik/test-references/samples/ batik70.png?rev=1.6view=markup http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs.cgi/xml-batik/test-references/samples/ batikLogo.png?rev=1.10view=markup Favorite ideas/themes: http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs.cgi/xml-batik/test-references/samples/ batikBatik.png?rev=1.5view=markup http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs.cgi/xml-batik/test-references/samples/ batikYin.png?rev=1.5view=markup http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs.cgi/xml-batik/test-references/samples/ textRotate.png?rev=1.10view=markup I also like the Sun and the 'waxing crescent Moon' from here: http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs.cgi/xml-batik/test-references/samples/ moonPhases.png?rev=1.11view=markup I think I like batikBatik.png best! I'd like to see what I could do to get an Apache XML Graphics Project logo done in that kind of 'theme'... My actual preference would be to include 'icons' from the sub projects in the new logo. For Batik this is simple since we already use the 'squiggle' heavily for this purpose (this is the red/green/blue mark in a bunch of places). That's doable. I don't know if the squiggles are well commented in those .svg files, but if they are they should be easy to add. If not, could you or someone familiar with these attach the svg/ for it to a JIRA/bugzilla issue? I don't know if FOP has a similar readily available icon you could use. This is about all we have: http://homepage.mac.com/webmaestro/xml-fop/images/logo.jpg although I have a close approximation for an svg logo. I'll see what I can come up with. I would picture these icons 'looped' together in a clear area on the right side (think of an infinity sign with the batik logo on one side and Fop on the other). As more projects join we can add icons for them to the looping. Alternately we could come up with a new icon just for XML Graphics (a complex 'document' with the corner turned and on the back is XML - might be hard to pull off in a ~51px square) I like the idea of the separate icon for XML Graphics, because I envision other projects joining in. [1] http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs.cgi/xml-batik/test-references/samples/ I've placed a temporary xmlgraphics.apache.org site live on my homepage. Please take a look and provide feedback and comments: http://homepage.mac.com/webmaestro/xml-fop/xml-graphics/ I would guess that given your background in Batik, you might have more 'dexterity' in creating SVG than I. If you (or anyone else reading) has the time (I know, who has that?) I'd love to see what other folks can come up with. Web Maestro
Re: Is Bugzilla Safe?
Clay Leeds wrote: Considering that we're going to be moving the FOP wiki[1] away from the security challenged nagoya[2], does FOP's Bugzilla[3] also need to move? Currently the only Bugzilla installation within the ASF is the one on Nagoya so there is nothing to move to. But IIRC infrastructure's plan is to migrate (and update, version 2.14 is quite old) Bugzilla to ajax (a machine sponsored by HP and located in Amsterdam) We might think about using JIRA which has a nicer interface but isn't free software. Christian
Re: XMLGraphics temp site up
Clay Leeds wrote: On Nov 8, 2004, at 5:51 AM, Thomas DeWeese wrote: As it currently is I actually prefer the 'non svg shapes' version as the used shapes are rather simplistic (it makes it looks like an 80's graphics package). I agree wholeheartedly. My intent was to get the idea of pushing the graphics out there, but perhaps using gradient-filled shapes or something might be better (or better yet, perhaps I should just shrink the tiger...). This logo is actually my first *real* attempt at playing with SVG (I'd done some shapes before--which is why I added the shapes). This is a lot easier to do with an appropriate tool like Adobe Illustrator, or perhaps SodiPodi, or Sketsa (I've only really used Illustrator). Now for a few suggestions: I have seen some of the Apache projects that left justify the text and move the feather up next to the 'The Apache'. This would work well for us since 'XML Graphics Project' is quite a bit longer. Sounds good. If I can find the time this week, I'll play around with it. See attached example. It's not great, the xml on the page isn't _quite_ large enough I don't think (for a 52 pixel rendering). Also the radial gradient is a cheap way to keep the rest of the logo from looking too plain. It would be better to have something like a floorplan or chart or Illuminated text softly in the background. That's doable. I don't know if the squiggles are well commented in those .svg files, but if they are they should be easy to add. If not, could you or someone familiar with these attach the svg/ for it to a JIRA/bugzilla issue? The squiggle is a 'symbol' from batikLogo.svg. It should be trivial to pull out. I don't know if FOP has a similar readily available icon you could use. This is about all we have: http://homepage.mac.com/webmaestro/xml-fop/images/logo.jpg Very good, but not quite Iconic, although I really like the idea of using the Apache feather as a 'quill'. :) I like the idea of the separate icon for XML Graphics, because I envision other projects joining in. Yes, this is the main problem with the 'icons' logo it doesn't really 'unite' the projects. It actually tends to emphasize there independence. I would guess that given your background in Batik, you might have more 'dexterity' in creating SVG than I. If you (or anyone else reading) has the time (I know, who has that?) I'd love to see what other folks can come up with. For 'artsy' stuff you really can't hand code SVG you have to use a tool. But it helps to know SVG to trim and combine the 'artsy' elements into a compact logo. inline: xmlgraphicsLogo.png
RE: Apache XMLGraphics 'blurb' for ApacheCon 2004
-Original Message- From: Clay Leeds [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Nov 8, 2004, at 5:44 AM, Glen Mazza wrote: I signed up for ApacheCon last night so I'll be there next week. Glen Wish I could be there to meet you, Glen. Same here... Vegas, right? Drag yourself away from those slot-machines in time ;-P Enjoy! Greetz, Andreas
Re: XMLGraphics temp site up
Clay Leeds wrote: I've attached a slightly (very rough!) modified version which gives an idea of what I think may work better. Namely, the paper is curled in a different direction, so the XML on the 'back side' is horizontal, making it more readable. Although it's not 'true' (i.e., the text would actually look more like yours), I think the readability outweighs the suspension of disbelief :-). I'll try and work on it, but I'm awfully busy right now. Since you're using Illustrator for your version, I'm hoping you could make it even better using the source files. Still, I do like the batikBatik.png theme. On a related note, I'm having trouble when I open batikBatik.svg[1]. The image is almost all on one layer (one of the leaves has handles and can be moved). Any ideas? This is sort of the way the document is created. The fill is a rect that covers the canvas, and it is made to look like a leaf with a clip-path. Also there is some grouping going on so you need to ungroup to get to some stuff. My oldish version of Illustrator drops some of the fill content :/
Re: XMLGraphics temp site up
On Nov 8, 2004, at 11:20 AM, Thomas DeWeese wrote: Clay Leeds wrote: I've attached a slightly (very rough!) modified version which gives an idea of what I think may work better. Namely, the paper is curled in a different direction, so the XML on the 'back side' is horizontal, making it more readable. Although it's not 'true' (i.e., the text would actually look more like yours), I think the readability outweighs the suspension of disbelief :-). I'll try and work on it, but I'm awfully busy right now. I don't see this as a showstopper, so take your time. We can always update the logo when we tire of the 'old' one. :-) In fact, we don't even have the domain stuff ironed out yet (although it's forthcoming). Since you're using Illustrator for your version, I'm hoping you could make it even better using the source files. Still, I do like the batikBatik.png theme. On a related note, I'm having trouble when I open batikBatik.svg[1]. The image is almost all on one layer (one of the leaves has handles and can be moved). Any ideas? This is sort of the way the document is created. The fill is a rect that covers the canvas, and it is made to look like a leaf with a clip-path. Also there is some grouping going on so you need to ungroup to get to some stuff. My oldish version of Illustrator drops some of the fill content :/ My mistake. I figured it out. I clicked in the document window (selecting the entire graphic plus the leaf), and then looked for Ungroup in the Object menu, which was inactive/gray. However, I deselecting the graphic, and doing a Select-All. I needed to choose Select Next Object Below. Sorry for the 'waste' of time. Web Maestro Clay -- Clay Leeds - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Webmaster/Developer - Medata, Inc. - http://www.medata.com/ PGP Public Key: https://mail.medata.com/pgp/cleeds.asc
Re: cvs commit: xml-fop/src/documentation/content/xdocs/dev book.xml
Clay, On Sun, Nov 07, 2004 at 08:48:23PM -0800, Clay Leeds wrote: Simon, Does the book.xml file in your DnI section serve any specific purpose (DnI-related), or is it to follow the common coding/forrest convention? I ask, because the use of book.xml is deprecated in Forrest-0.6 in favor of the site-wide src/documentation/content/xdocs/site.xml file. book.xml is the top-level file that calls in all the chapters. It is indispensible, it is _the_ book, so to speak. I compared it with the book files you have removed. I see that it has a different purpose. The other book files seem to define menus. Regards, Simon On Nov 7, 2004, at 8:26 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: clay2004/11/07 20:26:29 Removed: src/documentation/content/xdocs book.xml src/documentation/content/xdocs/design book.xml src/documentation/content/xdocs/design/alt.design book.xml src/documentation/content/xdocs/design/alt.design/properties book.xml src/documentation/content/xdocs/dev book.xml Log: removed all book.xml files (except DnI) Web Maestro Clay -- Clay Leeds - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Webmaster/Developer - Medata, Inc. - http://www.medata.com/ PGP Public Key: https://mail.medata.com/pgp/cleeds.asc -- Simon Pepping home page: http://www.leverkruid.nl
Re: cvs commit: xml-fop/src/documentation/content/xdocs/dev book.xml
On Nov 8, 2004, at 12:48 PM, Simon Pepping wrote: Clay, On Sun, Nov 07, 2004 at 08:48:23PM -0800, Clay Leeds wrote: Simon, Does the book.xml file in your DnI section serve any specific purpose (DnI-related), or is it to follow the common coding/forrest convention? I ask, because the use of book.xml is deprecated in Forrest-0.6 in favor of the site-wide src/documentation/content/xdocs/site.xml file. book.xml is the top-level file that calls in all the chapters. It is indispensible, it is _the_ book, so to speak. I compared it with the book files you have removed. I see that it has a different purpose. The other book files seem to define menus. Regards, Simon I suspect this could be a problem for the Forrest site-generation process[1]: Specifying menus with book.xml Historically, menus in Forrest have been generated from a book.xml file, one per directory. This mechanism is still available, and if a book.xml is found, it will be used in preference to the menu generated by the site.xml file. The book.xml files can use site: URIs to ease the maintenance burden that led to obsolescence of book.xml files. In general, however, we recommend that users avoid book.xml files. Is it possible for you to rename that file so it doesn't conflict? (I'm hoping it is trivial for you to change that file name. Perhaps fop-=dni-book.xml or something). If not, I'll see if I can come up with some other solution, although my guess is that any workaround will preclude it from having the same look feel as the rest of the FOP web site. [1] http://forrest.apache.org/docs/linking.html#book-menu-selection Web Maestro Clay -- Clay Leeds - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Webmaster/Developer - Medata, Inc. - http://www.medata.com/ PGP Public Key: https://mail.medata.com/pgp/cleeds.asc
