KR> Manifold vacuum

[david]

Not sure if I mentioned it in here, but for IN only, it is hard to beat
the open-software stratux.  Less than $120 for everything.  Or make it
as fancy as you like.  :)

David Merchant

On 01/29/2016 03:28 PM, Dj Merrill via KRnet wrote:
> On 01/29/2016 04:20 PM, Mike Stirewalt via KRnet wrote:
>> It's still early days yet in this area.  Cost will be half that or less
>> in another couple years.  There might even currently be cheaper
>> solutions.  Right now I'm focussed on upgrading my navigator and
>> installing an autopilot.  Thanks.  
>
> No doubt there are, and will be, other options available.  I was simply
> mentioning one possible option as an example, not trying to recommend
> any particular solution for you.
>
> I'll not bother you with any further information.
>
> Thanks.
>
>

KR> Manifold vacuum

[david]

I highly recommend checking out the "stratux" open-source ADS-B -IN
project.  For about $110 overall (not counting batteries or power
supplies) you can have in-flight weather, gps location, true AHRS (if
your tablet software can use it,) and location of other ADS-B out and/or
transponder equipped planes (within FAA design limits.)

It is a LOT of fun!  Actually works, especially in-flight weather and
location of other aircraft. 

I test it at home a lot...

David Merchant



On 01/26/2016 01:35 PM, Mike Stirewalt via KRnet wrote:
> Jeff said, 
>
> "Gyros are heavy and require a vacuum source with a lot of associated
> heavy plumbing. Mike Stirewalt has his Dynon D2 for sale for a very
> reasonable price." 
>
> I did have it for sale . . . but within minutes of listing it on
> Vansairforce I had two buyers.  I sold it to the one whose email came in
> first.  
>
> I can't recommend the Dynon D2, although it worked exceedingly well on
> the recent ferry flight for which I bought it.  The attitude information
> it displays is dependent upon receiving a GPS signal.  It has it's own
> internal GPS and gyros it's true but for some inexplicable reason if it
> loses a GPS signal - it happens - you lose your horizon.  
>
> For a low-cost attitude instrument I highly recommend the TruTrak ADI. 
> Used ones sometime show up on eBay in the $500-600 range.  They used to
> make the 3 1/8" ADI which is the one I have in the KR.  Currently their
> ADI that looks like mine is a 2+ inch instrument, which is fine.  I just
> prefer the larger one.  They do make a couple newer instruments which do
> the same thing as their ADI but look a little different.  The name Gemini
> comes to mind, but check out their website.  These instruments by
> TruTrak, the ADI, Gemini and I think a couple others they make are
> self-contained attitude instruments.  They do connect to a GPS puck but
> that is strictly for ground track (heading) information. 
>
> The D2 is very smooth and usable.  I liked it.  However, just imagine
> being totally dependent on it when in IFR conditions - cloud or on a very
> dark night without any outside reference.  I don't like the idea at all
> of its dependency upon a GPS signal.  
>
> Thanks Jeff.
>
> Mike
> KSEE
>
> 
> Experience Threedom
> $49.99/mo 3 years. Same great TV price. Netflix included for 1 year.
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/56a7cad746e524ad713bbst02vuc
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change 
> options

KR> Manifold vacuum/vacuum pumps

[david]

My Mustang II vacuum pump is a purely electrical one and while I have
zero flight hours on it, I'm confident enough that the engine-driven
alternator supplies more than enough power.  Battery has enough juice to
run the engine for many minutes should the alternator die or belt
slip/break.  The electrical vacuum pump already has backups in the
tablet running iFlyGPS for up to 8 hours and the stratux ADS-B/AHRS has
it's own battery backup unit good for maybe 6 hours or more (not tested
to exhaustion yet.)
So the engine battery will give up first should the alternator or vacuum
pump itself go out.  All necessary instruments have MEMS-based backups
already.  Engine/prop RPM's will be controlled by the noise they make.  :)

David M.



On 01/26/2016 10:49 AM, S via KRnet wrote:
> Thank a lot to all who expressed their opinions, they are very helpful for my 
> overall approach in using vacuum-driven instruments !
> I do not intend to fly IFR but would like to enjoy the turbulence-free winter 
> flying in Canada, which is subject to severe icing and quickly changing 
> weather. 
> What I know regarding the dry vacuum pumps, is that they break every 500hrs 
> or so in my flying club C-152/C-172's, the extreme temperatures are probably 
> contributing a lot to shorten their operating life.
> I will continue to explore the use of "no energy loss" vacuum but will also 
> consider a belt-driven wet vacuum pump from automotive engine. 
> Many of you are probably considering exhaust gases augmented cooling, 
> venturi-assisted cooling air output ports, etc. - there is enough "energy" 
> for a decent suction, I believe.
> I have been designing for many years touchscreen-enabled devices, I may 
> probably design my own low-cost electronic AI. EFIS-simulated artificial 
> horizon is for sure a good solution for getting out from IMC... but I have a 
> preference for independant from electrical power solutions. By -20?C, the 
> battery is not the best power source...
>
> Stefan 
> Ottawa, ON, Canada
> s_sbal "at" hotmail.com 
> 
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change 
> options

KR> Regardez "VID 20131216 144515 420" sur YouTube

[david]

Which engine is that?  Hand propping always kinda scared me.  Also, I've
read many articles where it is strongly advised NOT to hand prop an
automobile engine (probably because they rev up so high so quickly.)



On 01/25/2016 12:58 PM, jean paul GLOTIN via KRnet wrote:
> https://youtu.be/u95DXZiIO1w
>
> Connect? par Motorola
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
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> options

KR> Manifold vacuum

[david]

The electric vacuum pumps (for the brakes) from the mid-90's 'Vettes are
about the best out there.  I put one on my Mustang II.  Very durable. 
Not too expensive.

David M.




On 01/25/2016 10:41 AM, Dave Acklam via KRnet wrote:
> Use 12v vac pump??
>
> Manifold pressure isn't a constant enough source
> On Jan 25, 2016 4:35 AM, "S via KRnet"  wrote:
>
>>> It was a very long time ago.  The engine was a Type 1 VW, and the carb
>> was
>>> probably a POSA.  If there was any mixture control, it had to be manual.
>>>
>> Thank you Dan !
>> I got a full set of vaccum instruments from a very friendly aircraft
>> mechanic and I am exploring the best way to supply them, preferably without
>> the use of draggy and icing-prone external venturi.
>> I may try to use some sort of combined manifold vacuum/exhaust venturi to
>> create enough vacuum in all flight conditions.
>>
>> Stefan
>> s_sbal "at" hotmail.com
>>
>> ___
>> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
>> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
>> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
>> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change
>> options
>>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
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> options

KR> how likely to sit in one?

[david]

Huntsville, Alabama, about halfway between Birmingham and Nashville.



On 12/27/2015 04:20 PM, Mike Arnold via KRnet wrote:
> Where are you at David?
> On Dec 27, 2015 11:13 AM, "david via KRnet"  wrote:
>
>> How likely are KR2S owners going to be to allow me just to sit in one
>> and see if I fit, please?  :)
>>
>> Thanks,
>> David M.
>>

KR> how likely to sit in one?

[david]

How likely are KR2S owners going to be to allow me just to sit in one
and see if I fit, please?  :)

Thanks,
David M.

KR> Personal info on the map

[david]

I'll reply at the risk of irritating Mark.

You do not need to enter your address, phone number, or anything.
If you guys would like to do this AND require moderator approval for
someone to join, that can be accomplished, I think although I have not
personally done that.

David M.


On 12/26/2015 09:35 AM, Paul VISK via KRnet wrote:
> I would have a concern about having a link to the map with all of our 
> addresses on the open internet at krnet.  If we can put it on the email list 
> somewhere would be alot better. At least you have to get approved and there 
> is some control.
>
>
> Paul Visk Belleville Il618-406-4705
>
> __
<<>>

KR> Convenience Map

[david]

Oh no.  The base code has changed.  There is no longer a default
icon/group, meaning the colors are not working as they used to.  I'll
figure it out, hopefully.

David M.


On 12/26/2015 08:51 AM, david via KRnet wrote:
> A minor change. 
> Removed the legend for pilots, etc., so that when you unclick "all" you
> can still see everyone except vendors and designer/factory.  With you
> own choice of color it wasn't showing up right, and I think we'd prefer
> to have our own choices.
>
> In case you hadn't noticed, the legends at the bottom left can be
> clicked or unclicked to show only what you're looking for at the
> moment.  The default is ALL.
>
> So we have KR people in Sweden, Israel, and Australia.  How very cool!
>
> David M.
> and this is only the second day.  :)
>
>
>
> On 12/25/2015 11:33 AM, david via KRnet wrote:
>> Folks, I've created a map to show where everyone is.  It might help in
>> locating others near you and to find vendors (hopefully near you!)
>>
>> Please try it out and see if you can add yourself (if I've set it up right!)
>>
>> Link is here:
>> https://www.zeemaps.com/map?group=1778611
>>
>> Merry Christmas!
>>
>> David Merchant
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
>> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
>> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
>> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change 
>> options
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change 
> options

KR> Merry Christmas

[david]

Dubi, make sure you get on the KR map!  (Use the candle icon as a
vendor.)  Pretty cool to have someone in Israel.



On 12/26/2015 06:36 AM, Dubi Gefen via KRnet wrote:
> Merry Christmas for all the KR builders and flying from yours representative
> in Israel.
>
> Dubi Gefen
> Dubi_g at maanit.org.il
> http://www.dubigefen.50megs.com/
> +972-54-4921263
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: KRnet [mailto:krnet-bounces at list.krnet.org] On Behalf Of Roger via
> KRnet
> Sent: Friday, December 25, 2015 8:37 PM
> To: KRnet
> Cc: Roger
> Subject: Re: KR> Merry Christmas
>
> Merry Christmas all
> I am working in the cowl plug. Hope to start on the mold n a couple of days.
> The O235 is built up. Sanding on and on and on:) Roger Owasso, OK
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html see
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> options
>
> This mail was received via Mail-SeCure System.
>
>
>
>
>
> This mail was sent via Mail-SeCure System.
>
>
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change 
> options

KR> Convenience Map

[david]

good idea.



On 12/26/2015 03:16 AM, bjoenunley via KRnet wrote:
> 
> I added aircraft spruce east with hours and phone numbers.  I used the candle 
> icon.  The legend worked fine. 
>
>
> Joe Nunley CW2 US Army RetiredBaker JROTC Instructor Baker Florida 
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change 
> options

KR> Convenience Map

[david]

As  map owner, I might could make a URL change without wrecking
anything.  Let me check some permissions first, though.

David M.



On 12/25/2015 07:03 PM, Adam via KRnet wrote:
> When first creating your flag, when you submitted it gave you a pop-up that 
> had a URL and it said copy and save this URL or you will not be able to edit 
> it later. 
>
> Adam Tippin
> A KR2S builder
>
>> On Dec 25, 2015, at 7:46 PM, Flesner via KRnet  
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> I apologize. ? I added my flag to the map as blue before I read your post. 
>>> ? I picked blue because because I want to be flying.
>> +++
>>
>> That was not a rule, simply a suggestion.  I just thought it would be more 
>> informative without a lot of verbiage.
>>
>> Now I have the same question that someone posted earlier and I thought I had 
>> the answer.  Apparently not.  How do you edit your personal flag?
>>
>> Larry Flesner
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
>> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
>> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
>> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change 
>> options
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change 
> options

KR> Convenience Map

[david]

no problem!



On 12/25/2015 05:53 PM, bjoenunley via KRnet wrote:
> 
> David,
> Your map is a great idea. I am now on the map. Thank you
>
>
> Joe Nunley CW2 US Army RetiredBaker JROTC Instructor Baker Florida 
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change 
> options

KR> Convenience Map

[david]

Click on your icon, make your changes, then choose "submit" at the
bottom of the box.  If that doesn't work, then there are some
permissions I need to change.

David M.



On 12/25/2015 03:58 PM, BOB ROBERT via KRnet wrote:
> Got location but does not show my name or other details , how do we modify
> or delete ?
> Bob lalonde
>
> On Friday, December 25, 2015, Flesner via KRnet 
> wrote:
>
>>
>> Great idea , David.  One question: once I zoom in I can't get it to zoom
>> back out.  What's the trick.
>>
>> Thanks for building the map.  While it's still early, maybe builders could
>> stick with the Burgundy flag and fliers could use blue or something like
>> that.
>>
>> Larry Flesner
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
>> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
>> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
>> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change
>> options
>>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change 
> options

KR> Convenience Map

[david]

I've made a new part, "Legends," so lets keep the sunflower and candle
reserved for those.
The sunflower is for the location of the designer and or factory(ies.)
The candle is for repair shops andor KR vendors.

Do we need any further delineation?  Something that we could see at a
glance?  Would be nice if we had a "designated examiner" icon that would
show us where they are.  :)  Flight instructors for the KR fall should
use the candle.

David M.



On 12/25/2015 01:04 PM, Dan Heath via KRnet wrote:
> Easy to use.  Good idea.
>
> My Panther Building Documentation at PantherBuilder Web Site
>
> Daniel R. Heath - Lexington, SC
>
> -Original Message-
> From: KRnet [mailto:krnet-bounces at list.krnet.org] On Behalf Of david via
> KRnet
> Sent: Friday, December 25, 2015 12:33 PM
> To: KRnet
> Cc: david
> Subject: KR> Convenience Map
>
> Folks, I've created a map to show where everyone is.  It might help in
> locating others near you and to find vendors (hopefully near you!)
>
> Please try it out and see if you can add yourself (if I've set it up right!)
>
> Link is here:
> https://www.zeemaps.com/map?group=1778611
>
> Merry Christmas!
>
> David Merchant
>
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html see
> http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change
> options
>
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change 
> options

KR> Convenience Map

[david]

Mouse support aiin't the greatest.  One can use the sliders on the left,
+ to zoom in, and - to zoom out.

Scrolling still seems to work with the mouse.

David M.



On 12/25/2015 03:33 PM, Flesner via KRnet wrote:
>
>
> Great idea , David.  One question: once I zoom in I can't get it to
> zoom back out.  What's the trick.
>
> Thanks for building the map.  While it's still early, maybe builders
> could stick with the Burgundy flag and fliers could use blue or
> something like that.
>
> Larry Flesner
>
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to
> change options

KR> Convenience Map

[david]

Folks, I've created a map to show where everyone is.  It might help in
locating others near you and to find vendors (hopefully near you!)

Please try it out and see if you can add yourself (if I've set it up right!)

Link is here:
https://www.zeemaps.com/map?group=1778611

Merry Christmas!

David Merchant

KR> Merry Christmas

[david]

Hey, Mike.  I'm in Huntsville, just a couple hours north of you.

David Merchant
Thinking about a tricycle KR2S -- IF I can fit into it!



On 12/25/2015 07:47 AM, Mike Sylvester via KRnet wrote:
> Merry Christmas guys. My two sons and their families will be here today for 
> Christmas Dinner but unlike Paul, I have timed a couple of projects on the KR 
> that need an extra set of hands. I'm hopeful that they'll look at it as good 
> father / son bonding time. It's looking like just a few more months to get my 
> girl in the air. And then I'll be expecting calls to meet for lunch or just 
> to go visit someone. Yee Haa.  Again Merry Christmas to all.
>
> Mike Sylvester 
> kr2s builder 
> Birmingham,AL.
>
> Cell no.205-966-3854
>
>  
>> Date: Fri, 25 Dec 2015 06:38:55 -0600
>> To: krnet at list.krnet.org
>> Subject: Re: KR> Merry Christmas
>> From: krnet at list.krnet.org
>> CC: ppaulvsk at aol.com
>>
>>
>> Dan said:Good morning and Merry Christmas to my KR Family.  For some of you, 
>> it is
>> well into the day and for others, you are still having visions of sugar
>> plums.
>> And to you Dan and everyone else.My Wife and I our spending four days at my 
>> daughters house in Tennessee with ALL my kids and grandkids and won't be 
>> working on my plane for awhile.  That is ok, I need to remind myself once in 
>> awhile what the real important things in life are.  Again, Mary Christmas
>> Paul ViskBelleville Il618-406-4705
>>
>>
>>
>> Dan said:Good morning and Merry Christmas to my KR Family.  For some of you, 
>> it is
>> well into the day and for others, you are still having visions of sugar
>> plums.
>> And to you Dan and everyone else.My Wife and I our spending four days at my 
>> daughters house in Tennessee with all my kids and grandkids and won't be 
>> working on my plane for awhile.  That is ok, I need to remind myself once in 
>> awhile what the real important things in life are.  Again, Mary Christmas.
>>
>> ___
>> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
>> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
>> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
>> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change 
>> options
> 
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
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> options

KR> risk taking?

[david]

How do you think they cover the planet in one night



On 12/22/2015 09:23 PM, Mark Langford via KRnet wrote:
> > In the spirit of Christmas I have to ask, "What would Santa do"?
> > Reindeer?, type 1?, reindeer? type 1? Oh Rudolph
>
> Reindeer don't swallow exhaust valves...
>
> Mark Langford
> ML at N56ML.com
> http://www.n56ml.com
>
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to
> change options

KR> Panel VHF vs handheld?

[david]

And, btw, I got a replacement non-Icom battery with greater amp-hour
storage.  However, it has to be mounted with a sledgehammer.  



On 12/22/2015 10:23 AM, Mark Langford via KRnet wrote:
> Chris Prata wrote:
>
> >> One disadvantage is that most if not all handhelds cannot transmit
> >> when plugged in, too much current. I believe I read that a few wont
> >> run at all while charging
>
> My ICOM A-24 came with the following warnings:
>
> CAUTION: To avoid damage to the transceiver, turn the
> power OFF while charging.
>
> NEVER connect the transceiver to an AC outlet or to a
> power source of more than 11.5 V DC. Such a connection will
> damage the transceiver.
>
> DO NOT charge BP-210N more than 12 hours. Otherwise,
> BP-210N will be damaged. BP-210N must be charged for
> 8?12 hours only.
>
> These limitations really surprised me.  If you can't operate it while
> charging, this rules out using it as the primary radio in an airplane
> unless you carry spare batteries, which is a non-starter in my book.
> Can't hook it to anything more than 11.5 Vdc?  That's another
> non-starter.  Can't charge it more than 8-12 hours without damaging
> the battery?  That's just plain unreasonable.  I'd have thought a high
> tech electronics company could incorporate some smart charging
> capability that's fairly common in the marketplace.
>
> So I carry my A-24 in my flight bag when I go on trips as a backup,
> and that's about all it does for me.  Most of the time it sits on my
> bench.  Apparently (if you believe the instructions), I can't even use
> it to listen to local airport traffic while I'm at the hangar, unless
> I want to risk completely discharging the battery (another evil
> mentioned in the manual), or overcharging the battery (even worse,
> apparently)...
>
> Mark Langford
> ML at N56ML.com
> http://www.n56ml.com
>
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
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> change options

KR> Panel VHF vs handheld?

[david]

I called Icom about the 11.5V thing.  What the engineer told me was that
is the minimum voltage, not maximum.  When I said that makes not sense,
he responded, yeah, I know.

Please call them yourself and see if you can get a definitive answer. 
I've not plugged mine into vehicle power, only house charging so far. 
Sure would like to.

I use an A24 and an A26.



On 12/22/2015 10:23 AM, Mark Langford via KRnet wrote:
> Chris Prata wrote:
>
> >> One disadvantage is that most if not all handhelds cannot transmit
> >> when plugged in, too much current. I believe I read that a few wont
> >> run at all while charging
>
> My ICOM A-24 came with the following warnings:
>
> CAUTION: To avoid damage to the transceiver, turn the
> power OFF while charging.
>
> NEVER connect the transceiver to an AC outlet or to a
> power source of more than 11.5 V DC. Such a connection will
> damage the transceiver.
>
> DO NOT charge BP-210N more than 12 hours. Otherwise,
> BP-210N will be damaged. BP-210N must be charged for
> 8?12 hours only.
>
> These limitations really surprised me.  If you can't operate it while
> charging, this rules out using it as the primary radio in an airplane
> unless you carry spare batteries, which is a non-starter in my book.
> Can't hook it to anything more than 11.5 Vdc?  That's another
> non-starter.  Can't charge it more than 8-12 hours without damaging
> the battery?  That's just plain unreasonable.  I'd have thought a high
> tech electronics company could incorporate some smart charging
> capability that's fairly common in the marketplace.
>
> So I carry my A-24 in my flight bag when I go on trips as a backup,
> and that's about all it does for me.  Most of the time it sits on my
> bench.  Apparently (if you believe the instructions), I can't even use
> it to listen to local airport traffic while I'm at the hangar, unless
> I want to risk completely discharging the battery (another evil
> mentioned in the manual), or overcharging the battery (even worse,
> apparently)...
>
> Mark Langford
> ML at N56ML.com
> http://www.n56ml.com
>
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
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> change options

KR> Dual ignition

[david]

probably customer demand.  People have had dual plugs in airplanes so
long, they think it is the best medicine, rather than thinking it through.
But that's just a guess.



On 12/14/2015 05:55 PM, peter via KRnet wrote:
> Ford went to the trouble of putting dual plugs into their 2.4L, 
> ultra-successful, Lima engine. Anyone know why?Peter
> ___
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KR> Dual ignition

[david]

Jeff, for smaller volume cylinders, it's a Ford vs Chevy argument about
whether to use one or two plugs per cylinder and the debate will rage on
long after we've passed.  I prefer single plug where possible due to 1.
flame front calculations, 2. fewer holes in the head for stronger
structural integrity, and 3. lower overall cost and maintenance.
Yes, beyond a certain volume, two plugs are absolutely required.

Don't even get me started on the mag versus electronic ignition debate...

David M.



On 12/14/2015 09:24 AM, Jeff Scott via KRnet wrote:
> Sorry for the blank emails.  My email keeps changing itself to html 
> formatting...
> -
>
> An engine with dual ignition is set up to have the flame front within the 
> cylinder coming from two points in the cylinder, typically top and bottom.  
> It really doesn't have anything to do with the cylinder volume itself, but 
> with efficiency and redundency.  For instance, if one wanted to run a typical 
> aircraft engine designed for dual ignition on a single ignition, you would 
> advance the timing several degrees to compensate for the time it takes for 
> the flame front to propagate from a single plug vs dual plugs. 
>  
> Most aircraft engines have each magneto fire 2 top plugs and 2 bottom plugs.  
> However, some of the small Continentals have the magnetos split so one mag 
> fires all the top plugs and the other mag fires all the bottom plugs.  
> Engines configured in this manner typically have the mag that is firing the 
> bottom plugs advanced 3? ahead of the mag firing the top plugs.  The bottom 
> seems to run a bit richer, so the flame front tends to propagate slower.
>  
> As Larry described, most aircraft engines use an impulse coupler to retard 
> the timing back to near TDC for starting.  This is to avoid kickback, whether 
> turning on the starter or hand propping.  Most Lycomings only have an impulse 
> coupler on the left mag, so the mag switch grounds out right mag when 
> starting.  Most Continentals use an impulse coupler on both mags.  
> Additionally, the impulse Coupler stops the magnet inside the magneto.  The 
> snap you hear is the magnet and shaft releasing, which will also cause the 
> magneto to generate a hot spark for starting.  The impulse coupler has a set 
> of counterweights on it that will cause the catch pawl on the coupler to 
> retract once the engine is turning more than 400 rpm.  
>  
> Most of the after market ignition systems for aircraft also use an electronic 
> scheme to sense that the engine isn't running and retard the ignition timing 
> back to TDC for starting.  Retarding the timing for starting, while 
> desirable, isn't really necessary on the smaller Continentals like the A 
> series engines.  Same is true for the VW and Corvairs in that the kickback is 
> light enough that it isn't going to be tearing up a starter drive or hurting 
> someone propping the engine.  Many of the 1940s vintage aircraft with A-65 
> Powerplants didn't have impulse couplers when they were new. 
>  
> -Jeff Scott
> Los Alamos, NM
>  
>
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KR> GPASC dual-plug 10mm plugs?

[david]

We don't really *need* dual plugs in such low volume firing chambers. 
Dual plugs are an adequate solution for jugs with massive volumes.  For
smaller engines, they just give another place for the head to crack and
serve no useful purpose.  Engines are so reliable these days, when was
the last time you heard of a plug breaking down in a normally maintained
engine?  So if you have the choice, one plug per cylinder in normal
sized jugs is just fine.




On 12/09/2015 07:44 AM, Roger Bulla via KRnet wrote:
>
>
> -Original Message- From: Donald Laverick via KRnet
> Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2015 11:38 PM
> To: KRnet
> Cc: Donald Laverick
> Subject: Re: KR> GPASC dual-plug 10mm plugs?
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> Don't forget my spark plug question.  Plug wire info would be good too.
>
>
> Mark
>
> I was using NGK C7HSA spark  plugs for the secondary. I didn't have
> any trouble and the always looked good when inspecting them. For the
> wires I was using 7mm resistance wire I got from NAPA. I just used
> bulk wire and the need hardware.
>
> Right now I am using heads with a single plug and using the NGK
> equivalent to Bosch W7CC , again with 7MM resistance wire. No problems.
>
> Roger Bulla
> rbulla2 at wic.net
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>

KR> selling a KR2-S with tricycle gear?

[david]

Yes.

David


On 12/08/2015 06:26 PM, PatS via KRnet wrote:
> David, I think I didn't understand, you are looking for a flying kr2-s?
>
> IHS PaTS
> Seminary MS
>
>> On Dec 7, 2015, at 01:34, david via KRnet  wrote:
>>
>> Oh, sorry.  My email is ainutatknology.net
>>
>> South MS is good!
>>
>>
>>
>>> On 12/06/2015 10:23 PM, PatS via KRnet wrote:
>>> David I have one in south Mississippi, if interested l will shoot you a 
>>> picture.  I will need your e-mail.
>>> IHS Pshows
>>> Seminary Ms.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> ___
>> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
>> To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave at list.krnet.org
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>> options
>>
>
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> options

KR> W and CG's

[david]

And I forgot to mention the extremely high $$$ annuals.




On 12/07/2015 03:31 PM, david via KRnet wrote:
> Thanks, and I'm looking at them, but spam cans are like "the last
> resort."  Adequate utility, slower speeds, even lower fun rate.
>
> David M.
>
>
>
> On 12/07/2015 01:51 PM, Dj Merrill via KRnet wrote:
>> On 12/07/2015 02:36 PM, david via KRnet wrote:
>>> Thatcher 5 looks good except it also has the max front of 250 lbs. 
>> You might look at some used Cessna 172s or similar which can be had
>> fairly cheaply these days.  Not as cheap as a KR, for sure, but offer a
>> lot more utility in terms of CG and weight carrying capacity, and lots
>> of dogs per trip.
>>
>> Many older GA aircraft from $20 - $40k on Barnstormers.com.
>>
>> I think there are plenty of options available to you.  Poke around on
>> Barnstormers and "window shop" for a bit.
>>
>> -Dj
>>
>
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KR> W and CG's

[david]

Thatcher 5 looks good except it also has the max front of 250 lbs. 




On 12/07/2015 01:09 PM, Dj Merrill via KRnet wrote:
> Thatcher CX5

KR> W and CG's

[david]

That's what the Challenger was for as it is tandem seating, too.  Have
to look up a Thatcher.




On 12/07/2015 01:09 PM, Dj Merrill via KRnet wrote:
> On 12/07/2015 01:49 PM, david via KRnet wrote:
>> That's not good news.  I don't mind sitting in the middle but then I
>> couldn't do the Pilots thing. 
>
> Have you considered something like the Thatcher CX5 that has two seats
> in tandem?  You'd have to confirm the CG limits but may be a better
> layout for carrying the dogs in the rear seat.
>
> -Dj
>
>

KR> W and CG's

[david]

One reason I am looking at the KR2-S is that my current plane is a
Challenger II.  I have gained weight (for reasons beyond my control but
doesn't everyone say that?) and at 310 lbs sans clothing, I am way
beyond the spec for pilot in the CII, which is set at 250 lbs.  So it is
for sale, too.  :)
So what I'd like to know from you guys, is are my W and CG calcs
accurate?  I did them with (a) me, full fuel, and no one else, (b) me
and passengers up to gross allowable, (c) me and 3 gallons of fuel, and
(d) me with pax and 3 gallons of fuel.  All were with 35 lb baggage, and
all were using Mark Langfords owners manual numbers as published on his
web page.

Ok, physical part: even at 310, all my weight is forward, in the gut. 
Very little sideways widening.  I'm 5'11".  Can I comfortably and safely
do long cross-countries?
Or will I be unsafe and/or unhappy?  :(

My primary goal is to do the Pilot thing, and of course visit
people and places over time.  Not sure how practical it will be, due to
just room on the pax side, to take anything but a few puppies.

Thanks,
David M.

KR> selling a KR2-S with tricycle gear?

[david]

Oh, sorry.  My email is ainutatknology.net

South MS is good!



On 12/06/2015 10:23 PM, PatS via KRnet wrote:
> David I have one in south Mississippi, if interested l will shoot you a 
> picture.  I will need your e-mail.
> IHS Pshows
> Seminary Ms.
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://tugantek.com/archmailv2-kr/search.
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> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
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> options

KR> selling a KR2-S with tricycle gear?

[david]

Then I'm interested.  :)
There is one on Barnstormers but it is tailwheel.  Are they hard to
convert if that is the only one available now?

Closer to Huntsville, Alabama, the better.  :)

Thanks,
David M.

KR> 2016 KR Gathering location...MVN?

[David Mullins]

> , "Randy Moore Newbern Tn. N318RM via KRnet"  wrote:
>   i bet the builders who show up will be bigger.
>
>
> Randy Moore
> Newbern Tn 38059
>
>

I am already bigger, I need to get SMALLER!

Dave M
Nashua NH

KR> Gathering photos

[David Mullins]

Thanks for the Compliment.

I was the one who set up the group photoshoot with the help of Chris Collins
(MVN Manager) for getting the Bucket Truck.

I hold an Associate of Science Degree in Photography and have been
photographing for about 35 years. For more of my photos visit here:

http://photocamel.com/gallery/u15407-malodave.html

Dave Mullins
Nashua, NH


On 9/14/2015 2:10 PM, Mike Stirewalt via KRnet wrote:
> http://bouyea.net/KRGathering/index.html
>
> That was sure a great picture.  I can't recall who it was that went
> through the trouble of getting us all set up for that photo but thank you
> again, whoever you are, for having such skill and patience.
>
>
>

KR> KR Gathering

[David Mullins]

Off to the Airport,

  See y'all there!
Dave Mullins
Nashua NH

KR> Gathering transportation?

[David Mullins]

Larry,

I have a 6:45a departure at PDX. I will be staying at the Mcminville Inn.

Dave Mullins
Nashua NH



On 8/26/2015 8:58 PM, Flesner via KRnet wrote:
>
>
> Is anyone leaving the Gathering Sunday morning early and headed up to 
> Portland airport with an empty seat?  I need to be at the Portland 
> airport by 8:00AM for a 9:00AM flight.  I think I have all my other 
> transportation needs covered.  Thanks.
>
> Larry Flesner
>
>
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>
>
> -
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2014.0.4830 / Virus Database: 4365/10517 - Release Date: 
> 08/26/15
>
>

KR> Fuel capacity

[David Mullins]

On my 3XL KR2S the Stub wing tanks calculated out to 14.5 Gal each.
They are aluminum following the contour of the airfoil between the
Spars. My stub wings are 2 feet long.  The Header tank, I am guest-a-mating
at 18-20 Gal. I will have to find that out when I fill it.

Dave Mullins
Nashua NH




On 8/23/2015 7:55 PM, Paul VISK via KRnet wrote:
> Yesterday I filled my out board wing tank and found it holds 10 gallons. With 
> my stub wing tanks of 4 gallons each.  I want to add a 10 gl header tank to 
> help with cg. Total of 38 gallons. What are some of fuel capacity of some of 
> the bigger tanks out there?  I'm thinking this might be a little to much. 
> I'll be putting on  a 3.0L Carvair.
>
> Paul ViskBelleville Il618-406-4705
>
> ___
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>
>
> -
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2014.0.4830 / Virus Database: 4365/10496 - Release Date: 08/23/15

KR> Gathering

[David Mullins]

I am coming in on Wed the 2nd at 11am @ PDX. Reserved a Quad Cab
pickup at off airport Car rental. Return on Sunday with a 6:45A 
Departure flight.

Dave M
Nashua NH


On 8/10/2015 2:14 PM, jon kimmel via KRnet wrote:
> Things might work out at the last minute for me to come to the
> gathering...thinking about flying and camping rather than driving...is
> there anyone still looking to share rental car cost?
>
> https://sites.google.com/site/mykr2stretch/
> https://sites.google.com/site/mykr2stretch/parts-for-sale
> ___
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>
>
> -
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2014.0.4830 / Virus Database: 4365/10410 - Release Date: 08/10/15
>
>

KR> KR2 high altitude

[david]

Started building my KR2 summer 1981, completed it summer 1984, first flight 
September 18, 1984. To date 1480.4 hours.

Flew and designed many RC models from 1973 to 1981 when I and another fellow 
were chased off the John Day Airport (local timber baron though we were a 
danger to his Aero Commander!). Started construction on my KR2 in retaliation. 
The tail area looked way too small in comparison to empennage/wing area ratios, 
so I increased the aft surface areas by approximately 25%, and lengthened the 
fuselage behind the rear spar 2 inches to compensated length lost when bending 
aft fuselage. Also reduced reaction of the elevator to stick movement by 1/2 
resulting in smoother handling. Other than these mods it is pretty much plans 
built including retract tail-dragger configuration.

Many years ago I took a calm weather winter flight to see how high it would go. 
Had a HAPI 1835cc at the time. At just over 14,000 foot altitude it was still 
climbing at 100 feet per minute wide open throttle indication 80 mile per hour 
indicated air speed. Handling was a bit sluggish but not at all twitchy, did 
not feel any way near a stall condition. I live in the southern Blue Mountains 
and Strawberry Peak (9,500?) and Vinegar Hill (11,000?) did not look all that 
impressive. Sure took a while to get down using enough engine power to keep the 
cylinder heads warm (field elevation 3,700?).

Dave F
John Day, OR

KR> engine

[David Peterson]

may have nose gear but would have to take the wing gear also?
Dave



On Wednesday, February 12, 2014 6:05 PM, Randy Moore  
wrote:


I am in need of a revmaster to put my KR II single seat, could also use a nose 
gear? trhanks

Randy Moore
731 589 1330
avid mark IV
KR II project

-Original Message-
From: Lee Van Dyke 
To: KRnet 
Sent: Wed, Feb 12, 2014 5:16 pm
Subject: Re: KR> 2013 KR Gathering Trip - Very Long Story.

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KR> Flaps

[david]

Built mine per plans. First flight 1984, 1476.5 hours logged to date.  30, 45, 
and 90 degree deployment. In the 90 degree position its awfully close to terra 
firma, so ?30? in the pattern, ?45? short final, and ?90? if I?m too hot.  I 
learned decades ago earning my ticket in a Piper Warrior that flaps adds a 
little stability at low airspeed, and you can see down the runway a little 
longer during the final flare.

Real pilots drag their tail!

KR> (no subject)

[David Peterson]

Dave

KR> made it home

[David Stowers]

Larry
Glad you made home safe. Didn't see you fly over, but it's good to hear
you're home safe.
On Jul 29, 2013 5:47 PM, "Larry Flesner" 
wrote:

>
>
> Mark and I landed at my home base a few minutes before 5:00 pm this
> afternoon after a fuel stop and a hot dog at Dekalb, Illinois.  Mark is now
> on the highway home to Huntsville and should arrive home before 10:00 pm.
>  Good to see the KR crowd and they took excellent care of Mark and I while
> at Oshkosh.  Thanks guys.  See you at Mt.Vernon.
>
> Larry Flesner
>
>
> __**_
> Search the KRnet Archives at 
> http://tugantek.com/**archmailv2-kr/search
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>  change options
>

KR> O-235-C

[David Hartz]

i have a 0-235c that is timed out but has engine logs..no carb or exhaust..if 
your interested call me at 415-505-7995  Dave Hartz

--- On Thu, 12/8/11, Barrett  wrote:


From: Barrett 
Subject: KR> O-235-C
To: terry_warner2...@yahoo.com, "'KRnet'" 
List-Post: krnet@list.krnet.org
Date: Thursday, December 8, 2011, 8:15 AM


I have located an O-235-C at what appears to be a very good price and it
also has another spare engine for parts. No papers or log books. My question
is would this be a good selection for the KR2S? I'm thinking it would be,
but I'd like to get a few opinions. It is much cheaper than building a
corvair engine (assuming it doesn't need any major work, which it isn't
supposed to). They say all it needs is the carb and exhaust.
-Barrett
Sooner to be a KR2S builder :)


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KR> KR-2 plans

[David Stowers]

I purchased a partially built KR2 a few months ago without a complete set of 
plans. I might be interested in your set. Can you contact me off net at 
stowers62...@yahoo.com?


David Stowers

From: "laser...@juno.com" <laser...@juno.com>
To: kr...@mylist.net
Sent: Thursday, November 10, 2011 11:56 AM
Subject: KR> KR-2 plans

KR-2 PLANS ? $150 ? AVAILABLE FOR SALE ? Unused KR-2 plans for sale.
Serial # 7145. ? Contact Donnie Watson, Owner - located Hallsville, TX
USA ? Telephone: 903-238-9390 ? Posted October 28

Penny Stock Jumping 3000%
Sign up to the #1 voted penny stock newsletter for free today!
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/4ebc109c4d3a0155c0dcst02vuc
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KR> (no subject)

[David wade]

Hello everyone reading this. 
 
   I recently purchased a KR-2 with a number of repairs that need to be made. I 
have a builders log on the internet already http://www.mykitlog.com/KR2aviator/ 
. I am planing to rebuild my wing stubbs with Blue core foam and a 4 layer lay 
up on top and 2 layer on bottom. 

Mr wade

KR> tip tanks

[David Mullins]

I liked the looks of tip tanks and have some
fake ones made them to go onto my wings.

Dave Mullins
Nashua, NH


Fred Johnson wrote:
> Rudi wrote:
>
> "Sakkie's plane with tip-tanks, ZS-UKU, is currently being restored after 
> standing for many years, more information available here: 
> http://www.avcom.co.za/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=100=79408[Fred Johnson] "
>
>
>
> This is great. I have been reading Pazmany's article about the PL-1 and it
> got me thinking about this on a KR. According to him, they increase wing
> efficiency the same as winglets. They also increase the aspect ratio.
>
> Does anyone know if his tip tanks actually held fuel?
>
>
>
> Fred Johnson
> Reno, NV
>
>
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>   

KR> Well Here Go's

[David Rayburn]

I have a real nice KR1 project for sale cheap, ( Lots of Extras ).

Dave  314 971 3433St. Louis ,Mo.   Area.

On Tue, Aug 16, 2011 at 8:55 PM, Gary Robison  wrote:
> I hate to clutter up the KRnet with this but I just have
> to announce it.
>
> I retired this year on May 1st
>
> I have under construction a 24 X 40 heated/air conditioned
> "MANCAVE" to be completed in time for the gathering.
>
> Today I called and gave up my credit card number for a pile
> of spruce and plywood.
>
> Eight years I have be looking at the KR
>
> Four years ago I bought the plans.
>
> Two years ago I collected 3 Corvair engines.
>
> Let the gluing and sanding begin.
>
> Gary
>
> .001% done 120% to go.
>
>
>
>
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KR> A different prop hub

[david...@centurytel.net]

I discovered this  about a week ago and this morning I had the chance to verify 
the prop pattern. 
A smart car (2008 or newer) with the 3 bolt wheel  pattern is the same as a 
SAE-1 prop pattern. 
While this isn't a great discovery , having a mostly pre-made  prop hub is 
useful for working on
gear reduction, a test stand or build a mount for the corvair. Just line it up 
drill three more holes and 
your done. I hopes this helps the group.Thanks  David Boyer 

KR> KR-1

[David Rayburn]

If you would be in the market for a boat stage KR1 that has been done
rite with tons of extras, ( Sort of as a parts spare ) I have almost
everything you need to finish the air frame. At a price that could
save you several thousand.   And I might even be able to deliver it
for just travel expenses. This could be a cheap way to put your
restoration into fast forward.  And I guarantee you won't be
disappointed with the workmanship on this project.

Dave  314 971 3433

On Tue, Aug 9, 2011 at 11:06 PM, Steve Rice  wrote:
> Ok, I got the KR-1 form a friend that had it stored forever. It was however,
> in far worse shape than I had thought that it was. I firgure that it is
> repairable, but I am in the process of calculating how much time and money
> it will take. Upon investigation, I discovered that the sheer web of the
> main center spar has the grain running horizontal. Looking at the manual, it
> shows that the grain is to be verticle. I am just learning about wood
> structure airplanes, so help here is REALLY needed. There are some big RED
> flags that I see in the construction of this plane. Am I correct in thinking
> that having the sheer web grain in the wrong direction is a really bad
> thing? I have some grave concerns now about restoring this plane.
> Thanks for any help
> steve...@gmail.com
>
> --
> Have a good day -- Steve
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>

KR> krs close by

[David Stowers]

I was wondering if there are any kr netters living close to Southern Illinois? 
I have recently purchased a partially completed KR2 and would like to see a 
finished one up close, maybe even get a ride. I do plan on being at KR 
gathering in Mt Vernon (it's only 20 minutes away from me) in September, but 
was wanting to see one sooner. 


David Stowers

KR> Landing Helper Idea

[David Boyer]

This is a basic idea to give you the distance from touching down and if 
you dipping a wing.

http://www.backupsensorshop.com/Car_Backup_SD2.asp

This is a basic backup alarm with the ability to measure distance.

On your final leg you would turn it on and get a visual distance and 
audible tone all the way to landing.

This would be simply to do, just hook the wire that goes to reverse wire 
to a power switch and turn it on.

Since we flare to land (depending if your a taildragger) you can mount 
the sensors at a countered flare angle or put them

on a ball mount so they always hang down regardless of the plans angle.

I think this would be helpful for the landing gear slammers and the 
occasional miss judge landings.

If the sensors are wing mounted then you can see if you dipping a wing 
upon landing.

I hope this is helpful for us new guys. Thanks, David Boyer

KR> Simply Folding Wing

[David Boyer]

I have been talking with badbob0007  (Bob Johnson) and we both would 
like the ability to fold our wings up and directly over the top of the 
canopy for transport.
This is a basic idea on a double pivot design so the wing can have 
enough clearance to fold.

http://i1081.photobucket.com/albums/j354/davidpob/wing.jpg

I hope this will be useful. Thanks  David Boyer

KR> KR2 for sale or trade

[David Stowers]

Russ,
Please e-mail me photos of what's included
Thanks!

David Stowers

From: Russ Sing <russellspho...@yahoo.com>
To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Friday, April 29, 2011 9:44 AM
Subject: KR> KR2 for sale or trade

I am selling my kr2 project.  $1000 or trade for something equal value.  
Guns, motorcycles, RV's, cars, what do you have?  I need the money or something 
I can sell pretty easy.

I can email photos,
Thank you
 
Russ
Mexico, MO
573.253-4501
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KR> roll bar (long) from experience

[David Goodman]

Stef wrote:

I am using 4130 steel for my roll bar but my plane is a radical departure
from a standard KR so I don't know how carbon fiber would work.  I think
that strength is only 1/2 the equation here.  Abrasion resistance is just as
important if your scraping down the runway upside down at 30-40 knots.  I
would go as many layers as you can afford.

Stef,

Steel will work, though it MIGHT be overkill depending on the thickness.  I
am planning an aluminum bar for my own plane based on my own experience.

While it is unlikely you will ever be upside down on the runway, I have
proven it can happen, regrettably.  

>From a practical perspective it is unlikely you will be sliding down the
runway upside down at 30-40 knots, as the failure of the nose strut (or
pitching over the nose of a tail dragger), and flipping the plane
perpendicular to the relative wind will take a huge amount of speed off the
plane.  Here is what I believe happened to us in our mishap:

Nose wheel fold:  60 MPH
Edge of the runway:  40-45 MPH
Begin rotation over nose strut as it dug into the ground:  35 MPH
Tail impacting the ground: 10 MPH or less.

In going over, we probably lost 25 MPH or more.  This is based on the fact
there was no dragging of the tail or fuselage visible in the dirt under the
plane (no witness marks).  We flipped, we stopped.

The biggest reason to have the roll bar is to prevent the crushing in of the
fiberglass and canopy bow when weight is put on it from the vertical.  Jim
did not have his seatbelt cinched down tight (I did).  The result was his
face and head made contact with the ground and broken canopy while we were
upside down and the turtledeck compressed ~ 4-6 inches.  Even a light roll
bar will delay or eliminate that crush.  The key was the inability of the
fiberglass to withstand the weight placed on it out of plane.

It only took one person to lift the whole plane off of us from the tail, so
the amount of weight the roll bar would need to hold is not hundreds of
pounds (in our mishap, anyway).

Of course, if you impact the ground at high speed (100+ MPH) and the plane
flips you are out of Schlitz no matter how big your roll bar is.

KR> re:iFly 700

[David Goodman]

Paul,

You are one ahead of me.  I was not able to get the resolution fine enough
to be able to read all the data on the screen.  I could read most of it, but
not all, and that is a very dangerous place to be when flying an approach
for real.  I have been in the goo too many times to be risking it.  If you
got your iFly to be fully readable, my hat is off to you.

Have a blessed Sunday!

IHS,
Dave

KR> re:iFly 700

[David Goodman]

Todd wrote:

Anybody out there have anything bad to say about these systems?

Todd,

The one problem I have found with the iFly is on the approach plates.  If
you are going to use the approach plate feature, be aware that the entire
plate does not fit on the screen.  You will have to slew it around to see
the bottom numbers (MDA, DH and such).  If you were going to fly ANY IFR my
recommendation would be to have paper plates in front of you for an approach
you might need to make.  For VFR/IFR high this would be an excellent thing
to have in the plane.  

One could argue flying an IFR approach in the KR is not wise, but I would
disagree with that assessment unless icing were a factor.

Other than that, I have a few hours fiddling around with the iFly.  It is a
solid product, and the company, as you said, is planning some very nice
upgrades.  It is viewable in bright sunlight, a very useful feature in the
KR series.  If someone does a lot of flying outside their local patch, this
is a great way to have all the charts available for those cross country
flights.

My opinion.

IHS,

Dave "Zipper" Goodman
President, EAA-818

KR> Flight suites

[David Goodman]

>Yep, Short people get no respect.  (5'7" and all my height is in my upper
torso).  So, I don't fit the suits.  

All,

Flight suits are not designed to really fit anyone well.  The only ones that
look like they fit have been tailored (Blue Angels, Thunderbirds, actors,
the Village People, and the like).  For the jet jocks, if it was not baggy
beneath your crotch you were going to regret it when you put on the speed
jeans (g-suit).  If it is a bit longer at that point than you think it
should be, you will look like someone who actually wore it for business in
days gone by.  Unless the crotch goes down to your knees.  A personal
observation from the retired Navy carrier guy.

If you do get a flight suit and actually do want to look good in it, wear
boots or at least leather shoes with it instead of sneakers.  Nothing looks
worse than a middle-aged guy with long hair and/or a paunch, and sneakers
with white socks wearing a military style flight suit.

IHS,
Zipper Goodman
LCDR USN(ret)
575 carrier traps

KR> spruce vs other woods

[David Stowers]

I was wondering if there was anyone that has used other woods for aviation 
projects instead of spruce. Spruce is getting hard to obtain at reasonable 
prices and there are other woods that are stronger, but a little heavier. I am 
looking at a larger engine so I think the weight issue could be balanced off.
 
Any help would be appreciated.

David Stowers

KR> RE: Panel Layouts

[David Goodman]

My input would be the Dynon systems are hard to beat.  

Easy to install (from personal experiences).  
Very easy to operate (for the stick-ape in all of us).  
More features than even a control freak can use up.  
Great price (from sources other than AS).  
Can be used for IFR (with a back-up).  NAV sources  (GSP, VOR, LOC) can be
put on its HSI from external inputs.  
Can monitor more about your engine than even Mark Langford can digest (not a
knock to Mark, just acknowledgment that Dynon has superb capability).  
Optional transponder that can be operated from the SkyView panel (no extra
unit in the instrument panel face).

MGL makes some excellent systems as well.  Same basic functions, but
different interface.  Solid construction.  The V10 radio is probably the
best overall 5-watt transmitter going today, and it can be operated
remotely.

I have 100+ hours behind a Dynon D180 in my KR2 after 200 hours behind steam
gauges.  Great unit.  

IHS,
Dave "Zipper" Goodman
President, EAA-818

KR> Christas Day Flight

[david feiger]

Went up today to celebrate my birthday, Two days late because of snow and ice 
on my hanger ramp; finally melting off. Born 12-23-'36, spent my first year and 
a half (fourth generation) in Elijah Ransom's (civil war vet) old farmhouse 
south of Traverse City, Michigan.

Unseasonably warm at 45 F; strong east winds made for moderate turbulence with 
the surrounding mountains here in eastern Oregon. A short flight with a few 
bumps on landing: 90+mph airspeed with the gps showing 70 mph on short final to 
runway niner. 

Still have fun in my stock KR2, retrac gear that has had the gear legs replaced 
three years ago with my version fabricated out of 1/4" cold rolled steel plate 
after one of the aluminun legs failed. Replaced the spring bar last year when 
it failed at the left side pivot attachment, metal fatigue. But then with 
1412.3 hours as today on the books I guess its expected. 

Missed a lot of flying this past summer and monthly saturday breakfasts and 
wednesday chili lunchens at our EAA chapter hanger in Prineville, OR due to  a 
three month battle with the flight physical people in Oklahoma City. They 
finally conceeded that I am healthy enough to pilot, and don't want to hear 
from me again for another six years (still gotta do the biannuals here). 
Hmmm... in six years I'll be 80, doubt if I'll be around to fly! 

KR> Merry Christmas fellow KR folks

[David Goodman]

Kris wrote:

"This is off the KR aircraft subject, but Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays
to all of you."

Kris,

I do not think it at all off the subject.  Angels in the biggest formation
in history announced the first Christmas, flying VFR at night over shepherds
in Israel.  That qualifies as aviation in my book.  The only formation
bigger will be the one at the end of the book.

Merry Christmas!

IHS,
Dave "Zipper" Goodman

KR> KR2S vs KR2; Bill of Materials?

[David Rayburn]

I have a KR1 that has the same stretch as the KR2S in boat stage for
sale. Foam and fiberglass, closed spars with second inspection done,
And some extras.  You won't find better workmanship on any other
project.  You may be able to get it real cheap.

Dave 314 971 3433  cell call anytime,  Early or late.

On Sat, Dec 18, 2010 at 12:51 PM, Dan Morehouse  wrote:
> Hello :-)
>
> I'm considering building a KR-1, -2, or -2S. I'll be finishing up my plans 
> built
> Sonex over the next few (or several) months and am looking at building a
> composite airplane for my next project. I've almost no experience in
> fiberglass.
>
> It seems there are precious few KR1's and the stretched 2's are much more
> popular than the original shorter version. I prolly wouldn't like the KR1 as
> much as the -2 or -2S. Even though most of my flying would be short solos, 
> once
> in awhile I'd want the space for a passenger or baggage.
>
> That narrows it to the original vs. stretched 2. From the specs sheets, it 
> looks
> like the 2S is 18" longer with a wingspan that's 2' 4" longer. Chord must be
> shorter, cuz the wing area goes only from 80 to 82. It says there's also more
> headroom. Cockpit width is unchanged.
>
> I'm 5' 7", so certainly wouldn't need the extra leg room, but extra for 
> baggage
> might be nice. And I've read the KR2S isn't as pitch sensitive, which 
> certainly
> would appeal to me. Many have widened the cockpit a few inches, which I'd 
> prolly
> consider. If I'm gonna have a 2 seater, it would be nice to have the room. I'd
> like to hear the pros and cons of the 2 vs 2S, including any other mods.
>
> I see that NVAero sells parts and kits. ACS doesn't show much except for a
> Spruce kit. Wicks lists more kits that are itemized. Is there a bill of
> materials somewhere for these planes? If not, then are the Wicks lists 
> accurate?
>
> Thanks,
> Dan
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KR> iFly 700... a great unit

[David Goodman]

James wrote:

I've used the iFly 700 since Lowrance had problems with their updates.  I
love it and wouldn't consider any thing else.  

KR-netters,

Vertical Avionics got one of iFly's demo units to show my EAA chapter.  As
James wrote, they are excellent units, with touch screens.  Very intuitive,
very easy to use.  They have Sectionals, low, and high charts, approach
plates, airport diagrams, frequencies, and touch screen route planning and
update using rubber band.  All in all, this is the chart toy everyone has
ever wanted.  The chart subscription gets you all the charts for the states
(sectional) or the IFR subscription gets you updates on everything.  The
subscription options alone make this a great deal for the guy who flies
outside his local area or the occasional high IFR world.

The only thing I have found not to like with the iFly is the approach
plates.  The plate scale is slightly bigger than the display, so the whole
Jeppsen chart is not visible.  This is only an issue if one is trying to fly
a no-kidding IFR approach.  Not recommended (personal input).

The $499.00 price is temporary, and will be going up sometime early next
year, TBD.  The rep I worked with said the new price has not been set, but
he inferred it would be in the $580 range.  Still, not bad for what one
gets.

Updates they are planning/working on include tracking the plane against the
approach plates, which would be so much like cheating the old-school
navigator in me finds it repulsive.

We worked out a deal to get a break for our local EAA chapters, about $30
each if people wanted send in a mass order through me.  iFly does not have
dealerships or distributorships, so I worked out the deal for my EAA chapter
as a non-business one.  Orders would be sent directly from the factory to
you, wherever you are.  If anyone in the KR world is interested in that, let
me know offline.  We can add your order to the one for our chapter and
possibly save a few dollars.

I have the demo unit and the deal up to about mid-January.

Merry Christmas!

IHS,

Dave "Zipper" Goodman
President, EAA-818

KR> insterment wiring

[David Goodman]

Robert wrote:

I have a question on hooking up my CHT sensor and my EGT sensor. The leads
on the sensors are only about 12" long. Do I need to use the same type of
wire

Robert,

The short answer is you should use the same type wire, but...

Using a different type wire will introduce some degree of bias to the
sensor, since they operate on bi-metal characteristics.  Having said that,
at some point the sensor is going to have to change from its own wire to
your display's wire, making a second bi-metal connection.  If you are using
something like a Westach unit, you may not want to splice a different kind
of wire into the sender.  If you are using something like a Dynon or MGL
EFIS, the effect of lengths of a different wire will be somewhat mitigated.

I have a Dynon FlightDEK D-180 display.  My EGT and CHT senders all have
22GA wire extensions on them and I do not see any appreciable impact on
their readings.  They have been tested with boiling water and against an IR
thermometer to verify their accuracy.  It may not be textbook, but it works
fine.

IHS,

David Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com

KR> Ailerons

[David Goodman]

Herbert wrote:

..can anyone tells me the average counterweight of a plans built
aileron balance arm for the new 16% airfoil wing?

Herbert,

I think mine were just over 2.5 lbs, about 2 lb 9 oz as I recall.

IHS,

David Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com
360 678 1602 (W)

KR> FAA perspective on the mishap in N522PC (long)

[David Goodman]

KR pilots and builders,



The FAA sent me a "WARNING NOTICE" for my part in the mishap involving Jim
Morehead's KR2, N522PC.  Rather than regurgitate all the facts here, the
short is this:



- I flew the plane for 12.1 hours, including dual time with several other
pilots in the 40-hour Phase I test phase.

- Per FARs, no passengers may be carried in this phase of flight.

- The FARs do not define what a passenger is, nor what an essential crewman
is.

- It was my contention, based on precedent and a strict reading of the FARs
that each person I flew with was a required crew member for those flights.
When I was not PIC, I acted as a safety pilot for the other pilot, within
the letter and intent of the FARs.



The result of the investigation was a warning letter, which stated:



"It has been determined that this matter does not warrant legal enforcement
action." and "Legal Effect.  Neither a Warning Notice nor a Letter of
Correction constitutes a finding of violation..."



In other words, they did not find anything to hang me on, and believe me,
after the dressing down I gave the inspector, they wanted to hang me high. 



I am not a lawyer, but I do know how to read English.  Take my input as
completely anecdotal.



Only the PIC can determine if another person in the cockpit during Phase I
testing is required.  I recommend you not try to insist your ten year old is
required.  I also STRONGLY recommend you NOT CARRY ANYONE unless it is
essential to the flight.



The big lessons learned for me personally were a) to show others how a KR
flies from the left seat is fine, but never fly in the right seat (unless
the pilot is well qualified and experienced in THAT KR), b) a person needs
to be current in something with performance and handling qualities more
closely matched to the KR than a Cessna 150 (five hours in a Cessna DOES NOT
MAKE ONE READY TO FLY A KR), and c) KNOW WHAT THE FARs ACTUALLY SAY.



My response to the FAA's initial charge of violation, their letter (front
side data only), and my e-mail response to it will be on my website at
sites.google.com/a/wildblue.net/goodmans/Home/2010-kr2-mishap .  Rather than
drag this into a thread that most will not be interested in, please write to
me offline for any questions or input on this incident.



IHS,

Dave

KR> Unusual attitude recovery

[David Goodman]

KR fliers,

A couple of folks e-mailed me offline and asked me to be a bit more specific
in my suggestions.  Pardon my regression to military-speak in my last post.
Here we go:

Nose high unusual attitude recovery:

Throttle - max.

Push the stick to less than one "G" toward the horizon.  Note that you are
not trying to level the plane, you are trying to get load off the wings to
prevent stall.  My own observation is about half a "G" works very well.  It
takes load off the wings, but does not cause everything on the floor to end
up on the canopy.

Roll to horizon (wings level) - Once the plane's nose is level with the
horizon it is time to concern yourself with getting the wings level.  If you
were slow or close to stall you can let the planes nose fall through the
horizon a few degrees to gain some speed back quickly.  In the KR, going to
full throttle and  unloading is going probably get you all the speed you
need by the time the nose reaches the horizon.

 I remember this as POWER-PUSH-ROLL

 Nose low recovery

Throttle - idle.

Roll to nearest horizon - If you find yourself upside down, say 45 degrees
nose down inverted, if you just pull in the plane's vertical you will have
to go 135 degrees to get to the horizon.  If, however, you roll the plane
upright to wings level BEFORE you pull to the horizon, you will only have to
pull 45 degrees (plus ten degrees or so for the roll).  It will take a great
deal less time and altitude to do this than to not roll first.  While this
may seem counter-intuitive, use your hand as an airplane and work through
the maneuver.

Pull to horizon - Do not exceed buffet onset to do this.  The temptation
(fear induced) is to pull for all it is worth to the horizon.  Doing this
can either overstress the plane or cause an accelerated stall (if done below
maneuvering speed.  It is accepted this is a remote possibility, but it has
been known to happen in aircraft I have flown.).  Remember, people have done
loops in the KR just fine, so it can be recovered from 90 degrees nose down
without trying to pull the wings off.  If you are at the backside of a loop
and panic or lose situational awareness and need to recover, you could well
be nose low with low airspeed inverted.  Do not panic, fly the recovery as
described.

 I remember this as POWER-ROLL-PULL

If you are going downhill AND speed is a problem, AND you are able, AND your
plane can accept speed brakes at any airspeed, putting out the speed brakes
will decrease the amount of altitude lost.  In jets this was just a matter
of pulling a thumb switch on the throttle aft.  Honestly, this is probably
not a good idea for most of us, unless you have a switch controlled speed
brake.  Obviously, if you are not sure the brake can sustain the airloads it
is also best to keep it in.  The place where this could be a live or die is
when the ground is in close proximity and the five hundred or 1,000 feet
this may save you will save you.

I would not put the flaps out in any circumstance.

For what it may be worth to someone.

IHS,

Dave

KR> Unusual attitude recovery

[David Goodman]

KR fliers,



Something else that should be discussed after our productive discussion of
stalls is how to recover the plane properly should one find oneself looking
at the dirt from an unusual attitude.  From reading reports of several
people's recoveries from being nose down the approach that comes to mind
first might not be the best.  I submit the following recovery procedures:



Nose high recovery:

Power-full

Less than one "G" to horizon (unload the aircraft, preventing stall)

Roll to horizon (wings level)



I remember this as POWER-PUSH-ROLL



Nose low recovery"

Power-idle

Roll to nearest horizon

Pull to horizon



I remember this as POWER-ROLL-PULL



If one is suddenly looking at dirt upside down the natural tendency is to
pull through to the horizon.  In most cases this is not the nearest horizon
and will greatly increase the amount of altitude lost during the recovery.
My rolling to the nearest horizon, especially in the KR with its good roll
rate, recovery to level flight will be quicker.



In jets we would add Boards to Power, but I do not think this is a good idea
if it means you have to either look inside the cockpit or take a hand off
stick or throttle to do.



IHS,

Dave

KR> Stalls

[David Goodman]

Martin wrote:

I would think that the best way to approach this is to practice slow 
flight as much as possible, extending the lower speed slowly and 
cautiously over many flights

Martin,

You should be doing at least a power off approach to stall on the very first
flight in the plane.  If you do not do this, how else are you going to know
where the approach speed actually is?  How will you know if you are getting
ready to stall the plane on its first landing?

This was my fear about the thread about stalls on the net.  The discussion
has been on FULL POWER or POWER ON stalls.  This is a very different beast
compared to the power off stall.  In a power off stall, the plane is not
going to be cocked up as much, you need far less rudder and you have extra
power to add coming out of the stall.  In the power on stall there is no
extra power available, you will likely have a huge amount of rudder in to
balance the torque of the motor, and there power becomes your enemy unless
the plane is in balanced flight throughout.  They are very different events.

Pilots like Jeff Scott are high hour pilots who have a tremendous amount of
experience in the KR and other aircraft.  Maneuvers that come easily to them
do so because they have gained insight into doing them well, often through
scary experiences, or at least enough experience to have become proficient.
A person writing on the KR net may have no hours at all, or be a high time
pilot, and his or her experience level will be reflected in their comments.


At 300 hours in my KR-2S I see no reason to be doing power on stalls in it.
It is not that I cannot do them, but I have enough experience from other at
high g or inverted maneuvering to not feel the need to do this type flight
in this airplane.  Other pilots may want to go out and do high power stalls
on every flight, and for them that is just as good an answer as my own.  It
all depends on what you want to do in your plane.

Before you do any maneuvers or fly make sure you review and brief to
yourself all the maneuvers you plan on doing.  Think your flights out, plan
safe, fly safe... and have fun!

IHS,

Dave "Zipper" Goodman
www.verticalavionics.com

KR> Caution on stalls

[David Goodman]

KR fliers and soon to be fliers,



I hope the discussion on stalls has been a fruitful one.  Please no one out
there think I am saying the plane should not be flown to approach to stall
or full stall.  My point is to present a word of caution on flying full
power stalls.  It does not take a great deal of inattention in the KR to
find oneself in a place one did not expect.  At full power there is no extra
margin for error, and inattention here could be deadly.



Not everyone's experience, comfort level, or skill will react properly to
seeing a face full of dirt after rolling inverted if the plane is not kept
in balanced flight.  The effort to keep a KR in balanced flight approaching
full power stall as Jeff points out is different for each airframe built due
to the diversity of builders.  Basic aerodynamics says that as AOA increases
approaching a full-power stall, less and less of the rudder and tail will be
in free air to counter both the helical prop wash and the torque of the
engine.  With the tail of the KR as small as it is in stock form this can
pose a problem if the plane is not flown smoothly.



I have zero doubt Jeff flies safe and even less doubt he can fly the KR to a
full power stall without great risk.  His tail has been increased in size
over the stock plans, and his wing's trailing edges have been modified as
well should help.  Based on his experience he surely did the same flying
before the modifications, but his skill level is also probably above many of
ours.



I agree that pilots should regularly fly their aircraft outside of the
straight and level regime to become comfortable with how the plane operates
outside "normal" flight regimes.  Jeff forgive me as I am not trying to put
words in your mouth.



Mark Langford again is a good example of why these things are important.  He
has had two engines croak on him in flight, has departed his plane from a
full-power stall, and landed on a freeway.  For myself, I have had one real
engine out landing, lost a brake after landing in a strong crosswind (which
lead to a high-speed toboggan ride off the runway), and been in a plane
where a split second of improper control input caused a beautiful KR2 to
crash and flip upside down.  Others out there have had some equally exciting
events in their aircraft, both KR and others.



Go out and fly your plane!  Think through what you are going to do and go do
it!  Just be safe, because someday when I do get to fly to The Gathering, I
want to meet you all.



IHS,



Dave "Zipper" Goodman

KR> Stalls

[David Goodman]

Jeff wrote:

Before we start beating drum about the KR being a dangerous craft to stall, you 
need to look a little farther.  I practice both power off and power on stalls 
in 
my KR.  

Jeff,

I agree with you about stalling the KR.  The chances of the average pilot 
making a mistake I a full power stall and turning it into either an inverted 
departure or spin is great enough to caution most KR pilots to not go out and 
try this maneuver.  

Ken Rand dropped 8000 feet after on by one report, and Mark Langford dumped his 
plane upside down doing the same.  It is not the stall that is going to be the 
issue, it is the incipient spin phase of flight that if going to get someone 
killed.

In my opinion there is zero good reason for the average KR pilot to be doing a 
full power stall in the KR.  The attendant risk of departed flight is not 
something the average pilot (whether right or wrong) is ready for.  Even as 
someone who has a lot of hours in planes doing high alpha flight I have zero 
reason to do this type flying in my own KR.

If you enjoy flying in this envelope, by all means go for it!  That is part of 
the fun of flying, to do things the way you want to.  I would not advise others 
to do this is all I am saying, as the KR is unforgiving of mistakes one might 
make in this regime.

IHS,

David Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
663 El Prado Ave.
Coupeville, WA 98239
www.verticalavionics.com
360 969 1174 (C)
360 678 1602 (W)




It's more docile and controllable in a power on stall than my Tomahawk 
was (the Tommy always wanted to roll over and spin).  I would compare the 
handling in that regime to a Cessna 150, only quicker.  Very docile and easy to 
recover.  I have also spun it, but did not allow the spin to fully develop.  
Spin entry and recovery were also very docile.  The spin entry was from an 
accelerated power on stall and was actually captured on video from another 
plane 
for use in an art video.  Unfortunately, I only saw the video once and was 
never 
able to obtain a copy.  For the average KR, your mileage may differ 
significantly, mostly due to CG considerations.  Mark's plane is a different 
story with a completely different plan form from most. The one thing to 
remember 
about stalls, which really shows up during a power on stall, is that your 
ailerons are useless until you recover.  You are handling the plane with rudder 
and elevator. -Jeff ScottN1213W -- Original Message --

Hello Phil,

I once had a conversation with an early KR pilot that personally knew Ken Rand. 
He said that he did a full power stall in his KR at 9000 feet. He said it took 
more than 8000 feet to recover. It was so bad he said he had already decided 
that he was going to die but tried one more time and was able to get it to come 
out of the spin. It is not the "KR" that is the problem but any close coupled 
high power to weight?airplane. It is not going to stay straight when it stalls 
unless the ball is perfectly centered. 

I have more than 17,000 hours and a lot of aerobatic experience and I would not 
stall the KR with full power. 

I am not saying not to do it because I don't know your qualifications but 
simply 

wanted you to know what to expect based on the experience of this guy.
On another note as a KR guy if you are ever in the southern part of Alabama 
look 

me up and we can go do some flying. 


Victor Taylor
Irvington Alabama



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KR> Stalls (long)

[David Goodman]

KR-netters,



There have been two excellent posts recently concerning full power stalls in
the KR.  Mark Langford's personal experience of flipping upside down after a
hard roll out of a full power stall is not unique to the KR, but the math
behind the snap roll says the high-powered short KR should respond this way.



While most of us will not see an intentional full power stall in the KR, a
more likely scenario is an accelerated stall during a hard turn or maneuver.
If you are tail chasing a Glasair or RV around the patch this could be a
problem if you are not paying attention to the rumble in the fuselage as it
approaches stall.  The feeling/sounds are the same as the stall series we
all did in Phase I and are distinct from the sound of just having "G" on the
plane.  For my bird, Goliath, the rumble begins about 10-12 MPH before the
calculated stall point and builds in intensity to a heavy rumble as approach
to stall deepens.



The School of Aviation Safety in their course, Fundamentals of Fixed-wing
Aerodynamics covers critical conditions affecting directional stability.
Two that are of interest to us in the KR world:



"When an aircraft is flying at a high AOA the flow field over the vertical
tail is blocked and disturbed.  This causes a lost of lift which in turn
results in a lower restoring moment.  A technique to counter this effect is
to add ventral fins on the bottom of the aircraft."  I can tell you from
personal experience this is why the F-16 has the huge ventral fins.  Flying
over the top at 40 KIAS in full blower would be impossible without them.



"At high angles of side slip an aircraft can lose its directional stability
because a large enough restoring force cannot be created.  This would cause
the aircraft to quickly diverge and depart controlled flight.  To
counter-act this less than desirable occurrence a dorsal fin is sometimes
added to the vertical tail.  This device reduces the effective aspect ratio
of the tail and increases the angle at which stall occurs."  This loss of
directional stability is exacerbated by the P factor of the motor and
helical prop wash on the aircraft.  At higher AOA as the tail becomes more
and more blanked eventually the motor is going to win and the plane is going
to snap roll.  Mark, I am glad you did not prove this in the ultimate
manner.



In the KR, the trend has been to add a dorsal fin to increase lateral
stability.  This certainly increases stability in normal flight for most who
have tried it.  Reducing the aspect ratio on the top of the fuselage would
not help recovery from a deep stall or spin as it would be effectively
blanked by the fuselage.



I have not heard of anyone doing this, but has anyone put a ventral fin on a
KR?  This would have the effect of increasing stability in normal flight
like the dorsal extension and should provide some increased measure of spin
resistance.  I am considering this addition to my plane this winter as I do
the tail chase thing and a good deal of formation flying.



IHS,

Dave "Zipper" Goodman

Vertical Avionics, Inc.

www.verticalavionics.com

360 678 1602 (W)

KR> Outboard wing tanks

[David Goodman]

Steve wrote:

How close to the rear of the forward spar should the back of the tank be?

Steve,

I have aluminum tanks in my outer wings.  They run almost to the tips.
Inboard they are 14 inches aft toward the rear spar and outboard they are
nine inches deep.  My tanks are almost right up against the forward spar,
with the 1/4" space between spar and tank side being filled with expanding
foam.  This helps keep the tank in position and prevents chaffing of the
two.

Baffles for long tanks are a must.  I have two in each tank.  Without them
you are at great risk in uncoordinated flight of your plane becoming
unbalanced and difficult to control.

As far as CG, my plane does not move more than one third of an inch between
full tanks and empty ones.  I usually do not have to make more than one or
two small trim changes on a long cross country flight due to shifting CG.
If you make your tanks so they go all the way to the aft spar this probably
is not the case, but that is opinion.

Have a joyous Thanksgiving. 

IHS,

Dave "Zipper" Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com

KR> Header tank, coils, and battery proximity

[David Goodman]

Steven wrote:

I was thinking of doing like others and
placing them on the firewall shelf but wasn't sure because of the 
close proximity of the fuel tank.

Steven,

As long as raw fuel cannot get to them, the shelf if a good location.

Use the location of the battery to balance out your weight and balance if
needed.  My battery has migrated from the shelf to right in front of the
spar on the passenger side.  It moves the CG aft a bit, which is good for my
plane.

Put the fuel cutoff switch where you can reach it without moving your hand
more than a few inches.  This was a lesson Jim Morehead and I learned
hanging upside down from the straps in his plane after flipping in a mishap.
Neither one of us could reach the fuel cutoff switch, even though it was on
the bottom of the center console.  In my own plane these switches are right
below my thighs on the front of the main spar.  

I would have expected Jim's location to be perfect.  It turned out not to
be.  Only the experience can teach on this one.

IHS,

Dave "Zipper" Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com

KR> 1300# gross weight question

[David Goodman]

Craig wrote:

No doubt about it I am going to be right near 1300# full fuel and the wife
with 30# baggage if I can get the empty weight at 764# like Marks plane.  

Craig,

I would shoot for a plane that weighs in around 700 even.  Mark's plane is a
very heavy aircraft.  I think when he originally weighed it there was a 2nd
battery in it and a number of other things that made it heavier than the
norm.  

That is not saying his aircraft was poorly made, but as builders we make
choices that effect weight.  Obviously, Mark's plane flies very well and is
very, very, fast.  Everything you add is going to cost something (dollars
and weight).

My own plane weighed 698 pounds when it was first weighed, and it has 15+
pounds of nosegear.  So, in my rendition of the KR-2S I made choices that
made my plane 66 pounds lighter than Mark's.  If it were a tail dragger, and
had less items in the instrument panel it might well have weighed in the 680
range, with a Corvair motor.  That is an 84 pound difference in the weight
of the airframe and gear for two planes made from the same plans.

Think light, build light.

IHS,

Dave "Zipper" Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com

KR> Dynon Autopilot Servos

[David Goodman]

Stef wrote:

I am also very interesting about the [Dynon} servos.

Stef,

The Dynon servos are "small" and designed to work in RV sized aircraft.  The
KR wing is similar in size, though I do not know anyone who has them
installed in our birds.  Kurt from Dynon has been after me for a year now to
put servos in my bird, but I have not had time or dollars to do it yet.

One of the best things about them is the integrated control from the SkyView
display.   They even have an integrated mode-S transponder that works from
the SkyView.

I have a Dynon FlightDek-180 in my own KR and I love it, but am considering
the SkyView as an upgrade to get the transponder and a few other features.
If you want more info, contact me offline.

IHS,

David Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com
360 678 1602 (W)

KR> N128JH

[David Goodman]

Jay wrote:

Sorry folks, I had intended to send this out before the NTSB did but I have 
 been busy doing NTSB reports, FAA reports and NASA report. Plus trying to 
get  the plane home since last Friday. So here is the story:

Jay,

That you are safe is all that matters.  Good write-up and recommendations
for those who follow.

One question.  When you say you leveled the plane after bouncing, do you
mean that you gave the plane any forward stick after bouncing or just held
what you had before the second touchdown?

The plane can be fixed.  Glad to hear you are fine.

IHS,

David Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com
360 678 1602 (W)

KR> Fly By Wire

[David Goodman]

Terry wrote:

The KR is so light and delightful on the controls now; it's hard to imagine
making it better.

Terry,

I agree and disagree.  

It would be a lot of work, but look at how much work ML put into his plane.
While we certainly all benefitted from his efforts, if the goal was to just
build a plane to fly many would look at his focus as a builder as overkill.
The same could be said for Dr Dean's hinges, or the new airfoil, or many
other improvements over the original KR-series designs that all of us take
(almost) for granted today.  Thankfully there are those out there who have
that passion to make that better mousetrap.

Who of us is to say Jose does not come out with something truly spectacular
that boosts the roll rate or slow flying characteristics, or even better,
dampens the pitch responsiveness in certain situations.  Ten years from now
we may all be wanting Jose's FBW, just like all the other improvements we
now enjoy.

More power to the experimenter!

IHS,

Dave "Zipper" Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com

KR> Fly By Wire

[David Goodman]

Jose wrote:

I had been thinking about a fly by wire design, I had posted this on my
other forum I'm a member of, but too many of them are "BUILD IT to PLANS!!"
type, I like to change things for the better.

Jose,

I applaud your motivation and enthusiasm!  This sounds like a tremendous
amount of work for little return, but if you are charged up about it, go
forth and slay dragons.  The Wright Brothers did and look what happen with
their ideas.

Two words of caution.  First, have a back-up that is instantaneous and
failsafe.  Second, your FBW is guaranteed to fail at the worst possible
times; if you plan for it and expect it you may be able to eliminate the
risk involved.

Airbus still had not perfected their FBW in the 319/320 and 330/340 series
aircraft even after ten years of the planes flying passengers!  One of the
unfortunate realities of being trained as an aviation mishap investigator is
learning a lot of behind the scenes info that the public is not allowed to
know.  My family never flies in these aircraft, ever.  I hope you efforts
are worthwhile and work!  Good luck to you!

IHS,

David "Zipper" Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com

KR> Stabilizer and rudder modifications

[David Goodman]

Steven wrote:

The horizontal stab and rudder installed and built per plans.  I have been
contemplating on rebuilding the horz. stab and rudder using Mark L. airfoils
and Dr. Dean hinges.  The elevator has 3 non-bearing hinges same as rudder.
I would think that the elevator would not be "airworthy" knowing what we
know now about the kr hinges.

Steven,

The stock hinges are perfectly airworthy, based on all the flying KR series
aircraft flying with them, unless your projects has a defective in
installation.  My own plane has just under 300 hours on the stock hinges and
they are working fine.

If you want to replace them because DR. Dean's hinge idea is better (which I
agree it certainly is) this is the time to do it.  If this is not a hill to
die on, you might want to go ahead and use the hinges that are already
installed.

I have no doubt my hinges will need to be replaced on the elevator
eventually, probably in another 150-200 hours or so.  I will cross that
bridge when it is before me.

IHS,

David Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com
360 969 1174 (C)

KR> KR1 plans

[david feiger]

Bought my KR2 plans spring of '81. Had not seen another experimental aircraft 
under construction before or during construction of mine (three years). Had no 
trouble at all. Possibly years building model airplanes (mid-'40s to late-'70s) 
prepared me. Just think of the KR1 as a 'big model. The dimension are there: 
datems for laying out the fuseloge sides, etc.

Dave Feiger 
KR2 N39426, 1,410 hours to date.

KR> kr control sensitivity/ my final thoughts

[David Goodman]

Jeff wrote:

Is the KR2 really a lot more sensitive than a KR2S?

Having recently flown both the KR2S (mine) and test flown a basically stock
KR2 (small extensions on the horizontal stab) I can say they felt the same
to me.  I honestly could not tell enough difference between them to say one
felt any different than the other in pitch.  My plane has outer wing fuel
tanks and the KR2 I flew did not.  As a result, the KR2 has significantly
better roll rate, but I could not give you a degrees per second comparison.
It was noticeable.

Others mileage may vary.

IHS,
Dave "Zipper" Goodman
President, EAA-818

KR> kr control sensitivity

[David Goodman]

Pat wrote:

This seems to be a characteristic of the KR, at least as far as pitch is
concerned and maybe it isn't a problem for experienced or high time pilots
but for those of us considering building one of these cool little machines,
would it be possible to make it control more like a trainer and then
transition the controls to a sportier version later as the pilot gained
experience in the craft?

Pat,

Your idea of changing the movement rate of the elevator sounds like a good
fix, but there are problems associated with the idea.  If one does that, the
limits of travel will likely be reduced.  That could mean the plane will run
out of control authority when you need it most.

As far as getting used to flying the KR, the biggest issue close to the
ground is to never push the nose over, or even think of doing it until one
has some hours in the plane and has a feel for how it flies.  Once a pilot
has made the transition the KR is pure joy to fly.  The challenge is getting
those first few hours under your belt safely.

It would be easy to fret enough about controlling the KR to convince oneself
it is an unmanageable plane.  This is not the case.  It is a good plane with
good characteristics.  The big issue is simply being aware of those
characteristics and preparing beforehand when flying one the first time.

If you want more info, call me.

IHS,
Dave "Zipper" Goodman
360 969 1174 (C)

KR> Copper State

[David Goodman]

Todd wrote:

Anyone attending Copper State next weekend?

Todd and KRnetters,

My family and I will be there as vendors.  Come by Vertical Avionics in the
main tent.  Looking forward to seeing some other KR folks there.
Unfortunately, Goliath will not be there and we will not have our Aeromax
engine there, either.  I had to decide between wife and children or engine
and plane.  Family wins!

IHS,
Dave"Zipper" Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com

KR> kr2 accident (long) with the facts

[David Goodman]

KrNetters,

Ted wrote:

Could you elaborate on the nose gear that collapsed?  Where did it fail?
Whose nose gear was it? Diehl?  He has two, a standard and a Corvair version
(don't know the difference). Do any recommendations come out of this
incident regarding the mounting of the nose gear?

Jim Morehead was the builder of this plane, so he final authority on the
nose gear.  It appeared to me to be a standard (VW) Diehl system.

As far as where it folded, you can take a look at link
http://sites.google.com/a/wildblue.net/goodmans/Home/2010-kr2-mishap.
There is a good photo from the side of just the nose gear located there.

We hit extremely hard on the nose on the first bounce.  I could not tell you
how hard the second hit was compared to the first, as my eyes were
completely uncaged for about one second after the first impact.  What I can
tell you is the gear did not shatter until after the second impact
nose-first of the plane onto the runway.  I know this because though my eyes
were uncaged I could still see the prop shatter on the second hit.

That the landing gear withstood the first impact is a testimony to the Diehl
gear's solid design.

Having nose-planted my own plane three years ago on a Corvair-weight gear
(which bent, but did not fail) and last year taking that same strut
off-roading at 35 KTS off a runway in California the Diehl gear is superb.
In both my excursions outside the norm I took the strut to a muffler shop
and had it bent back out ~15 degrees or so... good as new.

A safety plug (again) for those new to the plane.  My own first bent strut
came from an inadvertent takeoff during high speed taxi.  I pushed the nose
over (1/16 to 1/4 inch stick forward) and came crashing down on the nose.
The second came on a landing in very rough weather and one of my brake
pistons failed.  Not able to stop, I bled as much speed off as I could
before the end of the runway.  Nothing I could do about it, but the strut
held again, though I dug a good sized furrow with the nose tire in the soft
dirt.

Sorry for the long answer.  If you need more data, let me know and I can
e-mail you privately.

IHS,

David Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com

KR> laser level advice

[David Goodman]

Craig wrote:

Is there one (a laser level) out there for under $150 that does everything I
will need it to do?

Craig,

If you have the money to burn, a laser level might not be a bad item to
have.  It is not needed to make a straight KR though.  The vertical tail on
my plane was done with a plumb bob from the ceiling and a bubble level and
it is less than 1/4-degree off perfectly upright.  Even that level of
accuracy is certainly not needed for a KR, as heat, humidity, and air loads
in flight are going to distort the alignment constantly.

One might use a laser to align the wheels, but I used chalk, string, and
angled aluminum and my wheel alignment is quite acceptable.

There will be plenty of things to spend money on down the road, for the
engine, fuel system, and cockpit.  My recommendation is to hold on to your
hard-earned cash until then.

IHS,

David Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com

KR> kr2 accident (long) with the facts

[David Goodman]

 to talk to, give
Bill Clapp or I a call.

For the tall, big, or otherwise unable to fly in with another in the KR, do
not despair.  Give Bill or I a call.  Many people (including myself)
successfully flew a KR with no prior time.  My first landing in my own KR,
Goliath, looked like a missile coming down the glideslope.

- Yes, the plane bounced, exactly twice.  The first time was under control,
the second was not.  The third contact collapsed the nose gear and the
propeller's disintegration drove us to the left side of the runway.

- We did not "continue off the left side of the runway" after landing left
of centerline as the NTSB report states.  This implies we were lined up left
with a vector not in line with the runway.  That is incorrect.  On a wide
runway we landed slightly left and were driven off the left side by the
disintegration of the propeller.  If you have a prop strike with the prop
turning full power after the nose gear collapses, you are going to be driven
by that prop to the side of the runway.  Expect it.

- The firewall was not damaged, or even cracked like the NTSB report states.
The upper plywood was bent, but not fractured, and the lower firewall did
not appear to have broken away from the fuselage.  Other than repairing the
damage to the upper portion of the airframe, and overhauling the engine this
plane should be repairable.  I have seen military jets crashed worse than
this that went on to fly 20 more years.

- There were no passengers in this aircraft, nor were there any passengers
in the aircraft on any previous flight.  Per FAA order 8130.2 (series) Par
134(10) there were only essential crew in the plane.  One can look at 14
Code of Federal Regulations, Part 91 and Advisory Circular 20-27 (series),
Certification and Operation of Amateur-built Aircraft for more information.
Interestingly, nowhere in the CFR or FAA regulations will you find a
definition of what an "essential crew" is.

If anyone has questions about this mishap, call me at 360 678 1602.  The FAA
investigation is ongoing, but I will share anything and everything safety
related with anyone who calls.

There are more photos and write-up of the mishap aircraft at:
http://sites.google.com/a/wildblue.net/goodmans/Home/2010-kr2-mishap

If you have questions about flying a KR for the first time, call me as well.
I will spend however much time you need or want to help you get ready for
that first flight.

IHS,
David Goodman
Vertical Avionics, Inc.
www.verticalavionics.com

KR> Re: Wing Tanks

[David Goodman]

>   Gonna also do a water leak test

>before I put the top on the tank



When my aluminum tanks were done, the person who welded them swore he did a
leak check.  He lied.  The tanks showed numerous holes with the water test,
but even those we found were not the end of it.



The solution was to use POR15 to seal the inside of the tanks.  POR can be
found online http://www.por15.com/.  This is a metal sealer and works very
well.  I used it on my tanks and have 300 hours on them without a drop
leaked (other than through my fuel cap, but that is another problem).



One solution to leaks in metal tanks to think about.



IHS,



David Goodman

Vertical Avionics, Inc.

www.verticalavionics.com

KR> GPS Verification

[David Goodman]

Todd wrote:

> Can someone walk me through how to get accurate wind
> information  at 7500' with only a GPS?

Mark Langford wrote:
But to answer your question, the guys with a Dynon would just tell you to 
look at the screen if you want wind direction and velocity...

Mark's point about checking your winds by doing runs works.  Looking at the
Dynon, or MGL will not work unless the pitot/static system is properly
calibrated.  If the system is five or six knots off, the computer will give
you erroneous winds in heading and intensity as it compares to the GPS.
>From personal experience with the Dynon D-180 and two different pitot/static
systems.

IHS,
Dave "Zipper" Goodman
President, EAA-818

KR> Throttle cable update

[David Goodman]

> Am I the only one that seems to screw up so much or am I the only one that

> admits it?
>Joe Horton,

Thomas Edison: 10,000 tries to make the light bulb before he got it right
and changed the entire world.

IHS,
Dave "Zipper" Goodman
President, EAA-818

KR> Cruise Speed/Dive Brakes

[David Goodman]

Mike wrote:

"Jim Morehead's has the right idea for a drag flap.  It is large, goes
down to almost 90º, has a very nicely designed deployment lever, and
worked beautifully.  It really slowed the plane down with no fuss.  I
would copy Jim's design if I were building a KR with a belly drag flap."

Having 12 hours in this plane myself I agree that Jim's belly board design
was/is excellent.  It has three notches of flaps, but the last notch was not
usable under most of the circumstances I flew the plane in.

When installing and using a belly board, consider your ability to fly away
at any setting you may have on it.  I am not sure Jim's plane had a fly-away
capability with one person in it at temperatures above 90 degrees (SL, VW
engine).  It did have fly-away capability with two people in it at those
temperatures at the second notch of flaps, about 45 degrees as I recall.
Two notches dropped the speed 10 MPH and made seeing the runway over the
nose very easy

No fly-away means the pilot's options are limited to landing on the given
pass.  I am not comfortable in this realm unless the landing is assured or
it is critical to be on the ground on the first pass.

Going from two notches to zero caused the plane to pitch downward
noticeably, not uncontrollably but enough that it could be a problem if the
pilot was trying to get speed brake off the plane in close proximity to the
ground and was not paying attention to the nose.  The plane was not tested
at full speed brake but this effect would certainly have been magnified.

Use caution, think everything through, and go for it... wisely.  Jim's
design was very well thought out and worth looking at, especially the handle
design.

IHS,
Dave "Zipper" Goodman
President, EAA-818

KR> KR-2 . WANTED TO BUY

[David Rayburn]

If your interested in a nice KR1, I have one in the boat stage. You
will not be disappointed with the workmanship. I have nearly all the
stuff to complete it. And I am sure we can come to an agrement on a
price that will make us both happy.

Dave 314 971 3433  St Louis, Mo.  dderstl @ gmail.com

On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 4:36 PM, Scott woodard
 wrote:
> Have you located your KR 2? I have one I want to sell and it is a tri gear. 
> If interested contact me at scott-wood...@sbcglobal.net. I have a Saratoga 
> and I just purchased a 421 I do not need the KR 2.
> Have a Great Day
> Scott
>
>
> --- On Sat, 9/18/10, Tim  wrote:
>
> From: Tim 
> Subject: KR> KR-2 . WANTED TO BUY
> To: "KRnet" 
> Date: Saturday, September 18, 2010, 8:00 AM
>
> Barnstormers.com >
>
>
> KR-2 . WANTED TO BUY . I want to buy a low priced, quality Tri-gear KR-2 or 
> KR-2s. Either a project of a flying plane. . Contact Derek Lewis, End User - 
> located Hurricane, UT USA . Telephone: 435-275-5110 . . Posted September 17, 
> 2010 . Show all Ads posted by this Advertiser . Recommend This Ad to a Friend 
> . Email Advertiser . Save to Watchlist . Report This Ad
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp
> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp
> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
>

KR>Things happen

[David Goodman]

>Joe wrote:

>Sorry this is so long but I thought it may help someone to know what can
happen at >the wrong times.



If safety information keeps one person alive, or helps mitigate a mishap or
injury down the road, it is more important than virtually anything else put
on the net.



Were there any warnings or twinges of impending failure with your throttle
cable?  Did it go from 100% to broken without warning?



Dave Goodman

President EAA-818

KR> KR VW engine cowling for sale

[David Goodman]

KR-netters,



I have a KR VW cowling that needs to go on a plane vice sitting in my
hangar.  This is an original RR cowling, still in the original RR shipping
box.  New they are $599.  Asking $250.00 for it.  If interested e-mail me
privately at dgoodman(at)verticalavionics.com.  If no one wants it here, it
is going to e-bay in two weeks.



IHS,

Dave "Zipper" Goodman

KR> Photos of mishap on website

[David Goodman]

KR-netters,



Photos and a write-up on the mishap with N522CP are now on my website,
http://sites.google.com/a/wildblue.net/goodmans/Home/2010-kr2-mishap for
anyone who is interested in how it looked.  As with all mishaps, there are
some good lessons to be learned from this that may keep you from having a
similar mishap yourself.  If anyone has questions, they are certainly
welcome to call or e-mail me.



IHS,



Dave "Zipper" Goodman

President, EAA-818

KR> Jim Morehead's (and my) mishap in N522PC, lesson learned (long)

[David Goodman]

KR builders and pilots,

Here is a narrative of the salient points from Jim and my mishap last week
at KRIU.  If anyone has questions, they may either e-mail me or call me at
360 678 1602.  The goal is that everyone out there who is getting ready to
fly or will fly a KR understands how quickly things can go wrong.  At the
same time, DO NOT BE AFRAID OF THIS AIRCRAFT!  It responds to your inputs…
very quickly.

N522PC was a standard KR-2 with a Revmaster VW engine.  The h-tail had small
extensions on it for stability, and had a trim tab that worked extremely
well.  The instrument panel was a purely VHF-only set-up, with traditional
steam gauges, and it was well thought out.  The workmanship was first rate,
and actually made me a bit envious.  I had 12.1 hours on this airframe, and
it flew great.  The total time on the plane was around 25 hours.  2PC flew
very well, with a stall speed around 53 MIAS, and was very easy to trim up
and fly hands off.
 
LESSONS LEARNED UP FRONT:
1.  NEVER, EVER RESET THE NOSE FORWARD ON A BOUNCED LANDING.  The result
will be a landing on the nose, with a high probability of nose gear
collapse.  My first “flight” in N191PZ (My own KR-2S) was inadvertent on a
high speed taxi test, and I did what Jim did, but not as severe.  The result
in my plane was a destroyed nose gear that had to be replaced.  I probably
only moved the stick forward 1/4”, but it was enough to bring the nose
through.  Jim moved the stick more than that and we came through much faster
as a result.

The proper procedure for a bounced landing is to add full power and hold the
nose attitude.  If you contact the ground again, you will still be in a good
nose high position.  If not, you are flying again and can execute a go
around.  I have only seen one person salvage a bounced landing in a KR
gracefully, and he was an ATP with an unbelievable amount of experience.
 
2.  FLY THE PLANE TO STOP.  I do not know if Jim got the brakes on or
not, but I do know if we had more speed on when we flipped, we would
probably have been killed.
3.  WITH TWO PEOPLE IN THE KR, UPSIDE DOWN THERE IS NO ROOM TO MANEUVER.
 Our feet were stuck under the instrument panel when we came to rest.  I
managed to get mine free of the panel, but once I got my belt off, there was
almost no room to maneuver under the plane.  I might have been able to get
out of the plane eventually, perhaps a ten minute effort, but if the plane
had been on fire it would have been doubtful we could have gotten out before
the flames reached the cockpit.
4.  BRIEF EVERYTHING YOU ARE GOING TO DO BEFORE YOU FLY.  Even if you
are flying by yourself, go over what you will do in an emergency.  We did
this, and having a plan in your minds when things go bad will help you solve
the problems as they present themselves.
5. BRIEF UP, STRAP IN, AND THINK THROUGH WORST CASE SCENARIOS.  Jim suffered
some bad lacerations to his face and forehead.  When the plane stopped, I
checked myself, hands move, feet move, nothing feels broken.  I was hanging
with my head about three or four inches from the ground.   I looked over at
Jim and his face was in contact with the ground /canopy.  When I examined
the aircraft in the hangar that afternoon, Jim’s lap belts were about eight
inches longer than mine.  While Jim is a bit thicker than I am, I did strap
in very tightly using the seat straps first, then the shoulder harness.  My
lower back was immobile.  Additionally, when I saw the plane begin to tip, I
pulled my hands to my lap and tucked my head down and full forward.
 Maximize your survival chances by thinking out what you will do beforehand,
then keep thinking as events unfold.

6. REINFORCE YOUR TURTLEDECK.  The turtledeck on 2PC collapsed about four
inches after the canopy shattered.  If we had flipped with any more speed
than we did, the outcome would have been much different.  Having now been in
a KR that went end-over, I will be strengthening my own turtledeck shortly.
On the subject of flipping, I never expected this to be something I would
experience in a KR.  It happened anyway.

Narrative:
 
The day of the mishap, Jim and I flew for 1.1 hours in the morning, with him
flying from the right seat most of the time.  We did nine landings, and
other than a tendency to line up right and accept right drift in close, Jim
flew very well. He was ready to fly from the left seat based on how he had
done on the right, so we talked about line-up, power, missed approaches, and
bounced landings.  I stopped just before we got in and said a quick prayer,
“Lord, thank you for the great day to go flying, give us a safe flight, and
watch over us, amen.”  We hopped in and were airborne ten minutes later.
 
Takeoff was unremarkable, and we headed to the downwind.  The first pass was
tight on the field so we went around.  Jim did drop the nose on the first
pass at about 400 feet and I talked to him about it as we climbed out, that
he had to not let the nose drop drastically on approach 

KR> Draft tube

[David Lininger]

Glenn Martin wrote:
> Wasn't the Draft tube replaced with the PCV valve long ago?

Yes, it was, and then came all the rest of the anti-pollution add-ons, 
until the computers were able to do more of the work.

I didn't recognize the term "draft tube" until I saw the explanation. 
Back in Nebraska we knew them as "breather tubes." They were usually 
designed to interfere as much as possible with getting at other parts.

-- 
David Lininger, kb0zke
EM37kt
Rev. 2:10
kb0...@gmail.com

KR> KR GATHERING

[David Mullins]

Netters,

Unfortunately,  I will not be able to attend this years Gathering.
I am in the middle of negotiations to build myself a home. The
money that I would have spent is needed for the down payment
and closing costs.

The house will be a 1400 square foot Ranch with a full drive under
basement. The plan is to put in 12' high ceilings, clear span in
the basement, and a 22' insulated garage door. This will allow
me to finish building my KR and I might just revamp the KR-Cam
on a new website.

The 12' high ceiling is to make a photo studio in there too.

I wish all the pilots and attendees a safe journey. Have an enjoyable
KR Gathering. I will be back at the 2011 Gathering for sure.

Who knows, My KR could be finished by then.


Dave Mullins
Nashua, NH (Soon to be Greenville NH)


Mark Jones wrote:
> WOW, just a mere 40 days left till the greatest KR show on earth. But the 
> fact that we only have 38 people pre-registered and only 8 planes committed 
> to fly in REALLY BOTHERS ME. Come on guys. We need you to pre-register if you 
> are coming to the Gathering. The following link will get you to the KR 
> Gathering web page and the pre-registration link is on the left side of the 
> page. Please pre-register now
> http://krgathering.org/
>
> ONLY 40 DAYS
>
>
> Mark Jones (N886MJ)
> Stevens Point, WI
> E-mail: flyk...@charter.net
> Web: www.flykr2s.com
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp
> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
>
>   

KR> Re; Trailering

[David Rudi]

A KR2 trailered to my local airport took a rock through the canopy
during the trip. Unfortunately, the rock won.

KR> Re: KRnet Digest, Vol 352, Issue 156

[David Rudi]

On 6/6/10, krnet-requ...@mylist.net  wrote:
> Send KRnet mailing list submissions to
>   kr...@mylist.net
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>   http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>   krnet-requ...@mylist.net
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>   krnet-ow...@mylist.net
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>1. RE:  KR Gathering rooms available for reservations (Dana Overall)
>2. RE:  KR Gathering rooms available for reservations (Dan Heath)
>3.  Re:Smooth Prime (smwood)
>
>
> --
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 5 Jun 2010 06:37:49 -0400
> From: Dana Overall 
> Subject: RE: KR> KR Gathering rooms available for reservations
> To: 
> Message-ID: 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
> Dan, no need to "challenge" our host hotel over a couple bucks.  I'm sure
> you got the standard response from the person at the front desk.  This, I am
> certain, can be easily rectified on Monday when I make a call to corporate
> sales.  Remember, this time of the year is going to be a financial bonanza
> with the World Equestrian Games coming to Lexington.  Homes in Richmond are
> renting for $3,000.00 per week...the week following our gathering.  Let's
> not individually rock the boat, let me make the call.
>
> Dana Overall
>
> 1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host
> Richmond, KY i39
>
> RV-7 slider "Black Magic"
> Flying..well sorta, useta, kinda
> Barrett Precision O 360 A1A
> Hartzell C2YR-1BFP/F7497-2
> http://rvflying.tripod.com/blackmagic.jpg
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMi05-WU2D0#GU5U2spHI_4
> http://rvflying.tripod.com
>
> do not archive
>
>
>
>> From: da...@windstream.net
>> To: kr...@mylist.net
>> Subject: RE: KR> KR Gathering rooms available for reservations
>> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 18:55:10 -0400
>>
>> Great, got my reservation.  However, I will warn you.  If you want to come
>> in on Thursday, you will have to make two reservations because Thursday is
>> outside the block and costs more.  I am going to call in the morning and
>> speak to the manager to see what I can do about that.
>>
>> Dana, tell me the name of the other hotel and maybe I can use that for
>> leverage.  In the past, the hotel with the blocked rooms was glad to get
>> another night during the week and never even mentioned a different rate
>> for
>> that night.  I actually had to make two reservations.
>>
>> See N64KR at http://KRBuilder.org - Then click on the pics
>> See you at the 2010 - KR Gathering in Richmond, Ky - I39
>> There is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for Flying
>> has begun.
>> Daniel R. Heath - Lexington, SC
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: krnet-boun...@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-boun...@mylist.net] On Behalf
>> Of Dana Overall
>> Sent: Friday, June 04, 2010 11:08 AM
>> To: kr...@mylist.net
>> Subject: KR> KR Gathering rooms available for reservations
>>
>>
>> I've been waiting to post anything about the block of rooms for this years
>> gathering as the two competitors were in a bidding war to get the block of
>> rooms.  While I think I could have got a better rate, $65.00, the time to
>> make a command decision happened this morning.  The block of rooms is at
>> Country Inn & Suites by Carlson, 330 Walnut Creek Drive, Berea, KY  40403
>> 859 228-0340 http://www.countryinns.com/bereaky .  Be sure and mention you
>> are reserving a room for the KR Gathering. This motel is just down the
>> road
>> from the airport so getting to and from the motel will be a piece of cake.
>>
>>
>> The cutoff date for individual pay for each room will be August 10th.  I
>> will be posting this information on a regular basis.  The block of rooms
>> is
>> for Friday and Saturday, Sept. 10 & 11.  If you early arrivals want a
>> Thursday reservation, they will accommodate your request on an individual
>> basis.
>>
>> See everybody here shortly at i39
>>
>> Dana Overall
>>
>> 1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host
>> Richmond, KY i39
>>
>> RV-7 slider "Black Magic"
>> Flying..well sorta, useta, kinda
>> Barrett Precision O 360 A1A
>> Hartzell C2YR-1BFP/F7497-2
>> http://rvflying.tripod.com/blackmagic.jpg
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMi05-WU2D0#GU5U2spHI_4
>> http://rvflying.tripod.com
>>
>> do not archive
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>  
>> _
>> The New Busy is not the too busy. Combine all your e-mail accounts with
>> Hotmail.
>> http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?tile=multiaccount=PID283
>> 26::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:042010_4
>> ___
>> Search the KRnet