Re: so wish apple had done this
Will, before you say that Mountain Lion sucks on the web, use CMD-SHFT-R to read stories. It's your friend. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 5:04 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: hi all i know this is not a windows list i know that smile but has anyone heard the podcast, about flexible web? apple usually inovate not freedom sicentific but i have to say on this occasion using the web with windows i think is more preferable now than on mac, even on mountain lion it is so clunky to actually get to stories on n gadget etc listen here and sorry off topic but i want to know peoples views http://podcast.freedomscientific.com/FSCast/episodes/fscast070-september2012.mp3 --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
RE: so wish apple had done this
What does CMD SHFT R do? -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Orin Sent: Saturday, 29 September 2012 8:13 PM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Re: so wish apple had done this Will, before you say that Mountain Lion sucks on the web, use CMD-SHFT-R to read stories. It's your friend. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 5:04 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: hi all i know this is not a windows list i know that smile but has anyone heard the podcast, about flexible web? apple usually inovate not freedom sicentific but i have to say on this occasion using the web with windows i think is more preferable now than on mac, even on mountain lion it is so clunky to actually get to stories on n gadget etc listen here and sorry off topic but i want to know peoples views http://podcast.freedomscientific.com/FSCast/episodes/fscast070-september2012 .mp3 --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: so wish apple had done this
doens't work with hardly anything i use at least with that rule you can set it to go to every start of a story on sites you want it guaranteed to work On 29 Sep 2012, at 11:18, Debbie April Yuille debbieyui...@bigpond.com wrote: What does CMD SHFT R do? -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Orin Sent: Saturday, 29 September 2012 8:13 PM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Re: so wish apple had done this Will, before you say that Mountain Lion sucks on the web, use CMD-SHFT-R to read stories. It's your friend. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 5:04 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: hi all i know this is not a windows list i know that smile but has anyone heard the podcast, about flexible web? apple usually inovate not freedom sicentific but i have to say on this occasion using the web with windows i think is more preferable now than on mac, even on mountain lion it is so clunky to actually get to stories on n gadget etc listen here and sorry off topic but i want to know peoples views http://podcast.freedomscientific.com/FSCast/episodes/fscast070-september2012 .mp3 --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: so wish apple had done this
it shows the reader whereby you can read news stories, or blog posts or fanfictions without having to waid through all the unnecissary clutter on the rest of the page. you've been able to do this on an IOS device since version 5. hth On 29/09/2012, at 7:48 PM, Debbie April Yuille debbieyui...@bigpond.com wrote: What does CMD SHFT R do? -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Orin Sent: Saturday, 29 September 2012 8:13 PM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Re: so wish apple had done this Will, before you say that Mountain Lion sucks on the web, use CMD-SHFT-R to read stories. It's your friend. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 5:04 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: hi all i know this is not a windows list i know that smile but has anyone heard the podcast, about flexible web? apple usually inovate not freedom sicentific but i have to say on this occasion using the web with windows i think is more preferable now than on mac, even on mountain lion it is so clunky to actually get to stories on n gadget etc listen here and sorry off topic but i want to know peoples views http://podcast.freedomscientific.com/FSCast/episodes/fscast070-september2012 .mp3 --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: so wish apple had done this
still clunky though needs to be more customisable and safari keeps crashing on sites, even now disappointing really when i log on to my bank site i do not expect half way through transactions to be booted off On 29 Sep 2012, at 12:14, Orin orin8...@gmail.com wrote: System Access does that too. Anyway, learn to use heading commands, item chooser, etc. I know most people just use VO right arrow and left to navigate, but that won't work around the whole web, guys. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 6:37 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: doens't work with hardly anything i use at least with that rule you can set it to go to every start of a story on sites you want it guaranteed to work On 29 Sep 2012, at 11:18, Debbie April Yuille debbieyui...@bigpond.com wrote: What does CMD SHFT R do? -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Orin Sent: Saturday, 29 September 2012 8:13 PM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Re: so wish apple had done this Will, before you say that Mountain Lion sucks on the web, use CMD-SHFT-R to read stories. It's your friend. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 5:04 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: hi all i know this is not a windows list i know that smile but has anyone heard the podcast, about flexible web? apple usually inovate not freedom sicentific but i have to say on this occasion using the web with windows i think is more preferable now than on mac, even on mountain lion it is so clunky to actually get to stories on n gadget etc listen here and sorry off topic but i want to know peoples views http://podcast.freedomscientific.com/FSCast/episodes/fscast070-september2012 .mp3 --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at:
Network analyser
greetings humans, Sorry for the possible length of this mail. I have a wireless network consisting of an Airport extreme which is connected to the ADSL modem, and a little Express which extends the network. The Extreme is located at the top of the house in our home office whilst the express is down in our living room. Also on the network is an Apple TV, and various desktops and i-devices; not all going at the same time. I've tried to use Airplay from my mac to the AppleTV but alas the music is choppy; that is stops and starts. I suspect it's network throughput. What I want is a tool which will tell me: 1. the speed I'm getting through the house on my own network; 2. any other local traffic (networks, other devices) and what channels they are broadcasting on. I want to eliminate cross-talk etc. So can anyone recommend such a tool, or is there anything I can tweak to improve things? My logic is that if this doesn't work for music video is going to be horrendous. Thanks as ever, Dónal Dr. Dónal Fitzpatrick School of Computing, Dublin City University, Glasnevin Dublin 9, Ireland tel.: +353-(0)1-700-8929 email: dfitzpat(at)computing.dcu.ie *“This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and are intended solely for use by the addressee. Any unauthorised dissemination, distribution or copying of this message and any attachments is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the sender and delete the message. Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and cannot be relied upon as being those of Dublin City University. E-mail communications such as this cannot be guaranteed to be virus free, timely, secure or error free and we do not accept liability for any such matters or their consequences. Please consider the environment before printing this Email ”** *** --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: so wish apple had done this
This is exactly the truth. I hear people claim you can't do this or that in Safari and the real issue is often user ignorance and not lack of features. This is not at all meant to be insulting, but I find it amazing that even in Windows, people often never learn how to fully use their screen reader effectively. Then, the perceived shortcomings are blamed on the screen reader and not the individual user's lack of knowledge. The point is, there are several ways to navigate web content and easily find what you are looking for on a website. Read the VO getting started guide and figure out which tools are most effective in a given situation. This is what I train folks to do, and once they are aware, their browsing experience suddenly is a lot different. Take Care John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net On Sep 29, 2012, at 7:14 AM, Orin orin8...@gmail.com wrote: System Access does that too. Anyway, learn to use heading commands, item chooser, etc. I know most people just use VO right arrow and left to navigate, but that won't work around the whole web, guys. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 6:37 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: doens't work with hardly anything i use at least with that rule you can set it to go to every start of a story on sites you want it guaranteed to work On 29 Sep 2012, at 11:18, Debbie April Yuille debbieyui...@bigpond.com wrote: What does CMD SHFT R do? -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Orin Sent: Saturday, 29 September 2012 8:13 PM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Re: so wish apple had done this Will, before you say that Mountain Lion sucks on the web, use CMD-SHFT-R to read stories. It's your friend. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 5:04 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: hi all i know this is not a windows list i know that smile but has anyone heard the podcast, about flexible web? apple usually inovate not freedom sicentific but i have to say on this occasion using the web with windows i think is more preferable now than on mac, even on mountain lion it is so clunky to actually get to stories on n gadget etc listen here and sorry off topic but i want to know peoples views http://podcast.freedomscientific.com/FSCast/episodes/fscast070-september2012 .mp3 --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to
Re: so wish apple had done this
on some sites i go to john no links show up in the link chooser even though they are there, bugs i feel that apple have had long enough to get rid of by now, surely! On 29 Sep 2012, at 17:03, John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net wrote: This is exactly the truth. I hear people claim you can't do this or that in Safari and the real issue is often user ignorance and not lack of features. This is not at all meant to be insulting, but I find it amazing that even in Windows, people often never learn how to fully use their screen reader effectively. Then, the perceived shortcomings are blamed on the screen reader and not the individual user's lack of knowledge. The point is, there are several ways to navigate web content and easily find what you are looking for on a website. Read the VO getting started guide and figure out which tools are most effective in a given situation. This is what I train folks to do, and once they are aware, their browsing experience suddenly is a lot different. Take Care John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net On Sep 29, 2012, at 7:14 AM, Orin orin8...@gmail.com wrote: System Access does that too. Anyway, learn to use heading commands, item chooser, etc. I know most people just use VO right arrow and left to navigate, but that won't work around the whole web, guys. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 6:37 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: doens't work with hardly anything i use at least with that rule you can set it to go to every start of a story on sites you want it guaranteed to work On 29 Sep 2012, at 11:18, Debbie April Yuille debbieyui...@bigpond.com wrote: What does CMD SHFT R do? -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Orin Sent: Saturday, 29 September 2012 8:13 PM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Re: so wish apple had done this Will, before you say that Mountain Lion sucks on the web, use CMD-SHFT-R to read stories. It's your friend. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 5:04 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: hi all i know this is not a windows list i know that smile but has anyone heard the podcast, about flexible web? apple usually inovate not freedom sicentific but i have to say on this occasion using the web with windows i think is more preferable now than on mac, even on mountain lion it is so clunky to actually get to stories on n gadget etc listen here and sorry off topic but i want to know peoples views http://podcast.freedomscientific.com/FSCast/episodes/fscast070-september2012 .mp3 --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to
Re: so wish apple had done this
There are a lot of things you can do to fiddle and troubleshoot such issues. Do you have examples of sites and what you are specifically looking for? The reality is that VoiceOver and Safari are not perfect, but neither are web designers. Don't discount the possiblity of the site simply being badly designed. Take Care John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net On Sep 29, 2012, at 12:17 PM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: on some sites i go to john no links show up in the link chooser even though they are there, bugs i feel that apple have had long enough to get rid of by now, surely! On 29 Sep 2012, at 17:03, John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net wrote: This is exactly the truth. I hear people claim you can't do this or that in Safari and the real issue is often user ignorance and not lack of features. This is not at all meant to be insulting, but I find it amazing that even in Windows, people often never learn how to fully use their screen reader effectively. Then, the perceived shortcomings are blamed on the screen reader and not the individual user's lack of knowledge. The point is, there are several ways to navigate web content and easily find what you are looking for on a website. Read the VO getting started guide and figure out which tools are most effective in a given situation. This is what I train folks to do, and once they are aware, their browsing experience suddenly is a lot different. Take Care John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net On Sep 29, 2012, at 7:14 AM, Orin orin8...@gmail.com wrote: System Access does that too. Anyway, learn to use heading commands, item chooser, etc. I know most people just use VO right arrow and left to navigate, but that won't work around the whole web, guys. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 6:37 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: doens't work with hardly anything i use at least with that rule you can set it to go to every start of a story on sites you want it guaranteed to work On 29 Sep 2012, at 11:18, Debbie April Yuille debbieyui...@bigpond.com wrote: What does CMD SHFT R do? -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Orin Sent: Saturday, 29 September 2012 8:13 PM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Re: so wish apple had done this Will, before you say that Mountain Lion sucks on the web, use CMD-SHFT-R to read stories. It's your friend. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 5:04 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: hi all i know this is not a windows list i know that smile but has anyone heard the podcast, about flexible web? apple usually inovate not freedom sicentific but i have to say on this occasion using the web with windows i think is more preferable now than on mac, even on mountain lion it is so clunky to actually get to stories on n gadget etc listen here and sorry off topic but i want to know peoples views http://podcast.freedomscientific.com/FSCast/episodes/fscast070-september2012 .mp3 --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all
Re: so wish apple had done this
when i log on to my online banking the links are on the page i can see them with VO keys left right but not in link chooser i use google chrome for this as safari keeps throwing me out of my bank site On 29 Sep 2012, at 17:24, John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net wrote: There are a lot of things you can do to fiddle and troubleshoot such issues. Do you have examples of sites and what you are specifically looking for? The reality is that VoiceOver and Safari are not perfect, but neither are web designers. Don't discount the possiblity of the site simply being badly designed. Take Care John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net On Sep 29, 2012, at 12:17 PM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: on some sites i go to john no links show up in the link chooser even though they are there, bugs i feel that apple have had long enough to get rid of by now, surely! On 29 Sep 2012, at 17:03, John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net wrote: This is exactly the truth. I hear people claim you can't do this or that in Safari and the real issue is often user ignorance and not lack of features. This is not at all meant to be insulting, but I find it amazing that even in Windows, people often never learn how to fully use their screen reader effectively. Then, the perceived shortcomings are blamed on the screen reader and not the individual user's lack of knowledge. The point is, there are several ways to navigate web content and easily find what you are looking for on a website. Read the VO getting started guide and figure out which tools are most effective in a given situation. This is what I train folks to do, and once they are aware, their browsing experience suddenly is a lot different. Take Care John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net On Sep 29, 2012, at 7:14 AM, Orin orin8...@gmail.com wrote: System Access does that too. Anyway, learn to use heading commands, item chooser, etc. I know most people just use VO right arrow and left to navigate, but that won't work around the whole web, guys. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 6:37 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: doens't work with hardly anything i use at least with that rule you can set it to go to every start of a story on sites you want it guaranteed to work On 29 Sep 2012, at 11:18, Debbie April Yuille debbieyui...@bigpond.com wrote: What does CMD SHFT R do? -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Orin Sent: Saturday, 29 September 2012 8:13 PM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Re: so wish apple had done this Will, before you say that Mountain Lion sucks on the web, use CMD-SHFT-R to read stories. It's your friend. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 5:04 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: hi all i know this is not a windows list i know that smile but has anyone heard the podcast, about flexible web? apple usually inovate not freedom sicentific but i have to say on this occasion using the web with windows i think is more preferable now than on mac, even on mountain lion it is so clunky to actually get to stories on n gadget etc listen here and sorry off topic but i want to know peoples views http://podcast.freedomscientific.com/FSCast/episodes/fscast070-september2012 .mp3 --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update
Re: Network analyser
Hello Donal Try the tools at http://sustworks.com Lynne On 29 Sep 2012, at 12:22, Dónal Fitzpatrick dfitz...@computing.dcu.ie wrote: greetings humans, Sorry for the possible length of this mail. I have a wireless network consisting of an Airport extreme which is connected to the ADSL modem, and a little Express which extends the network. The Extreme is located at the top of the house in our home office whilst the express is down in our living room. Also on the network is an Apple TV, and various desktops and i-devices; not all going at the same time. I've tried to use Airplay from my mac to the AppleTV but alas the music is choppy; that is stops and starts. I suspect it's network throughput. What I want is a tool which will tell me: 1. the speed I'm getting through the house on my own network; 2. any other local traffic (networks, other devices) and what channels they are broadcasting on. I want to eliminate cross-talk etc. So can anyone recommend such a tool, or is there anything I can tweak to improve things? My logic is that if this doesn't work for music video is going to be horrendous. Thanks as ever, Dónal Dr. Dónal Fitzpatrick School of Computing, Dublin City University, Glasnevin Dublin 9, Ireland tel.: +353-(0)1-700-8929 email: dfitzpat(at)computing.dcu.ie *“This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and are intended solely for use by the addressee. Any unauthorised dissemination, distribution or copying of this message and any attachments is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the sender and delete the message. Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and cannot be relied upon as being those of Dublin City University. E-mail communications such as this cannot be guaranteed to be virus free, timely, secure or error free and we do not accept liability for any such matters or their consequences. Please consider the environment before printing this Email ”** *** --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: so wish apple had done this
Unfortunately, online banking sites are not the best examples to use for accessibility. I don't know of many banks that have really accessible websites, regardless of your platform and browser. The problems is typically that the site is designed browser specific or they hired a company to develop the site who has no idea that blind people can use computers, let alone tie their own shoes. In the past when I was paid to do web accessibility testing, they were always an adventure. For example, I have the opposite issue. Not that I use Chrome any more because I don't like a browser that phones home every hour for reasons Google won't fully disclose, but Chrome misses links and information on the TD Bank online banking site, while Safari does see the links, as does Firefox. The problem is that Safari sometimes crashes on the site and Firefox seems to get stuck at times when loading parts of it. Take Care John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net On Sep 29, 2012, at 12:29 PM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: when i log on to my online banking the links are on the page i can see them with VO keys left right but not in link chooser i use google chrome for this as safari keeps throwing me out of my bank site On 29 Sep 2012, at 17:24, John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net wrote: There are a lot of things you can do to fiddle and troubleshoot such issues. Do you have examples of sites and what you are specifically looking for? The reality is that VoiceOver and Safari are not perfect, but neither are web designers. Don't discount the possiblity of the site simply being badly designed. Take Care John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net On Sep 29, 2012, at 12:17 PM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: on some sites i go to john no links show up in the link chooser even though they are there, bugs i feel that apple have had long enough to get rid of by now, surely! On 29 Sep 2012, at 17:03, John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net wrote: This is exactly the truth. I hear people claim you can't do this or that in Safari and the real issue is often user ignorance and not lack of features. This is not at all meant to be insulting, but I find it amazing that even in Windows, people often never learn how to fully use their screen reader effectively. Then, the perceived shortcomings are blamed on the screen reader and not the individual user's lack of knowledge. The point is, there are several ways to navigate web content and easily find what you are looking for on a website. Read the VO getting started guide and figure out which tools are most effective in a given situation. This is what I train folks to do, and once they are aware, their browsing experience suddenly is a lot different. Take Care John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net On Sep 29, 2012, at 7:14 AM, Orin orin8...@gmail.com wrote: System Access does that too. Anyway, learn to use heading commands, item chooser, etc. I know most people just use VO right arrow and left to navigate, but that won't work around the whole web, guys. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 6:37 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: doens't work with hardly anything i use at least with that rule you can set it to go to every start of a story on sites you want it guaranteed to work On 29 Sep 2012, at 11:18, Debbie April Yuille debbieyui...@bigpond.com wrote: What does CMD SHFT R do? -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Orin Sent: Saturday, 29 September 2012 8:13 PM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Re: so wish apple had done this Will, before you say that Mountain Lion sucks on the web, use CMD-SHFT-R to read stories. It's your friend. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 5:04 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: hi all i know this is not a windows list i know that smile but has anyone heard the podcast, about flexible web? apple usually inovate not freedom sicentific but i have to say on this occasion using the web with windows i think is more preferable now than on mac, even on mountain lion it is so clunky to actually get to stories on n gadget etc listen here and sorry off topic but i want to know peoples views http://podcast.freedomscientific.com/FSCast/episodes/fscast070-september2012 .mp3 --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive:
Re: so wish apple had done this
That's why in most web sites the article tag which is I believe an html5 thing is done. Simply press cmd shift r on any web page to see if the builder did this. This is called the safari reader. It skips past adds and puts the article in to a window of sorts.. Try it in some of the articles I'v event over the past month. I make sure the reader is available in them and I only send the ones where the reader is available on the web site.. On Sep 29, 2012, at 2:04 AM, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: hi all i know this is not a windows list i know that smile but has anyone heard the podcast, about flexible web? apple usually inovate not freedom sicentific but i have to say on this occasion using the web with windows i think is more preferable now than on mac, even on mountain lion it is so clunky to actually get to stories on n gadget etc listen here and sorry off topic but i want to know peoples views http://podcast.freedomscientific.com/FSCast/episodes/fscast070-september2012.mp3 --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Making The Most Of Your Accessible Tools; A Passionate Rant [Was so wish apple had done this]
Hello John, Will and all As somebody with vision looking in, so to speak, I frequently find it astonishing when I hear people criticising what Apple is doing with accessibility; particularly in view of the practicalities. For instance, unless you're a pirate and by definition, therefore, a thief, Freedom Scientific, GW Micro and Dolphin Access, to name but three vendors, charge a very great deal of money for their accessibility tools. Also, Microsoft charges for their operating system, even for the most basic version, over 5 times what Apple does. VoiceOver is a free and, most of the time, very reliable product. It gives the user access to a WYSIWYG, (what you see is what you get) interface to websites. Most of which can, if you take the time to learn to use it, be navigated extremely well using VoiceOver and Safari. Ultimately, it really depends upon the individual. If you just want a sheet of virtual paper with a hand-holding web environment, by all means use your other products and I wish you the very best of luck in all you do. I, (and I count my lucky stars, believe me), have the advantage of vision and I have seen both sides of this. I do see some sites where VoiceOver just will not play nicely and yes, we have seen some pretty spectacular crashes at times. However, in the general scheme of things, the environment is more stable and just as, if not more, reliable than the competition if, and it is a very big if, the pilot of the machine takes the time and effort to learn to handle it. I sincerely hope that we see a time when Apple perfects their accessibility tools. But make no mistake about it; they are committed to accessibility and they will improve their offerings. Remember also that the competing products have been available far far longer than has VoiceOver. Yes, I know that you can't always go by that and I know also that Apple has been involved in the field of accessibility for around 8 years now. However, just cast your mind back to how things were before Apple entered the market. Apple really has made a difference, not only to their own products, but also the competition. I recall the vice president of one accessibility company saying: It's all very well having an operating system with a talking installer. But that's not much use if you can't do anything with it afterwards. That statement was a direct quote. It was, and remains, the utterings of a frightened man who feared losing custom. As things have worked out, that is exactly what has happened. Literally tens of thousands of visually impaired users across the world have now migrated to Apple's products; desktop and mobile. Indeed, the vice president of Freedom Scientific himself is the proud owner of an iPhone. Make of that what you will! Anyway, I am ranting. But I sometimes find it really disappointing when I hear people complaining like this. People who have freedom to choose. The long and the short of this is: If you want perfection, you'll be waiting for a very very long time. If you are prepared to be flexible and innovative, you have the power at your fingertips, quite literally in some cases. If, however, you are happy with constant virtualisation, hand-holding and costly solutions, then perhaps Apple's platforms are not for you. yes, there are free and low-cost applications available out there for other operating systems. And that is to be applauded. However, you are still working within the confines of an often insecure, vulnerable and unstable environment. Which ever option you choose to take is entirely down to your preference. However, although I can understand a degree of frustration when things don't quite work out; and yes, it does happen to my other half as well quite frequently, the best thing you could do is to make the most of the failures. Try to reliably replicate them and, if possible, send your crash reports to Apple. That is the only way your problems will be fixed. It isn't reasonable to expect Apple to foresee every eventuality and I urge cooperation and patience. Believe it or not, as somebody with vision, I can tel you that Internet Explorer 9 and FireFox 15 are not invulnerable and do crash quite frequently, even without accessibility tools in the mix. Speaking personally, I learned to do much more than point and click and I learned most of it on an Apple Mac. I also made it my business to learn to use VoiceOver in order that I can interact with my other half who is, like many people in this group, totally bl ind. I feel for each and every one of you. But I urge you to try and make the very best of what you have available. Only in that way will you be able to evolve with the ever-changing world of technologies, assistive and otherwise. Ladies and gentlemen, I apologise for the rant. This is, however, a topic on which I hold passionate views. My very best and most sincere wishes to each and every one of you. Lynne On 29 Sep 2012, at 17:24,
OnLine Banking With Accessibility; [Was so wish apple had done this]
Hello John I can report that our bank, the Halifax, here in the UK, has a totally accessible and very well designed website. They use absolutely no non-standard controls and every aspect of their website, from statements to logging in, to account management and mobile messaging, is totally accessible. Perhaps that is unusual, but that's how it is. Also Gordon uses VoiceOver and Safari 6 on that site without a problem. It is lacking in some respects, I agree. For instance, it is difficult if not impossible to configure using statement grabbing financial software packages. But in every other respect it is accessible. They also use two levels of validation when you log in; again, each of which is totally accessible. Lynne On 29 Sep 2012, at 18:15, John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net wrote: Unfortunately, online banking sites are not the best examples to use for accessibility. I don't know of many banks that have really accessible websites, regardless of your platform and browser. The problems is typically that the site is designed browser specific or they hired a company to develop the site who has no idea that blind people can use computers, let alone tie their own shoes. In the past when I was paid to do web accessibility testing, they were always an adventure. For example, I have the opposite issue. Not that I use Chrome any more because I don't like a browser that phones home every hour for reasons Google won't fully disclose, but Chrome misses links and information on the TD Bank online banking site, while Safari does see the links, as does Firefox. The problem is that Safari sometimes crashes on the site and Firefox seems to get stuck at times when loading parts of it. --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
RE: Making The Most Of Your Accessible Tools; A Passionate Rant [Was so wish apple had done this]
Very well said! I'll be the first to admit that I don't take full advantage of all the tips and tricks that could make web browsing easier, but I don't blaim apple or other screen reader developers. It's entirely my fault if I'm too lazy or stubborn to take the time to learn how to use web browsers properly. It always frustrates me when I see any product being bashed for seemingly no good reason. True, there are things I personally don't use, but I'm willing to respect others' rights or desire to use such products. I don't know if this is making any sense or not, but in a nut shell, all I'm trying to say is that I agree with you 100%. Thanks for the well-written post, and I hope that you're having a great day! Missy -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2012 1:39 PM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Making The Most Of Your Accessible Tools;A Passionate Rant [Was so wish apple had done this] Hello John, Will and all As somebody with vision looking in, so to speak, I frequently find it astonishing when I hear people criticising what Apple is doing with accessibility; particularly in view of the practicalities. For instance, unless you're a pirate and by definition, therefore, a thief, Freedom Scientific, GW Micro and Dolphin Access, to name but three vendors, charge a very great deal of money for their accessibility tools. Also, Microsoft charges for their operating system, even for the most basic version, over 5 times what Apple does. VoiceOver is a free and, most of the time, very reliable product. It gives the user access to a WYSIWYG, (what you see is what you get) interface to websites. Most of which can, if you take the time to learn to use it, be navigated extremely well using VoiceOver and Safari. Ultimately, it really depends upon the individual. If you just want a sheet of virtual paper with a hand-holding web environment, by all means use your other products and I wish you the very best of luck in all you do. I, (and I count my lucky stars, believe me), have the advantage of vision and I have seen both sides of this. I do see some sites where VoiceOver just will not play nicely and yes, we have seen some pretty spectacular crashes at times. However, in the general scheme of things, the environment is more stable and just as, if not more, reliable than the competition if, and it is a very big if, the pilot of the machine takes the time and effort to learn to handle it. I sincerely hope that we see a time when Apple perfects their accessibility tools. But make no mistake about it; they are committed to accessibility and they will improve their offerings. Remember also that the competing products have been available far far longer than has VoiceOver. Yes, I know that you can't always go by that and I know also that Apple has been involved in the field of accessibility for around 8 years now. However, just cast your mind back to how things were before Apple entered the market. Apple really has made a difference, not only to their own products, but also the competition. I recall the vice president of one accessibility company saying: It's all very well having an operating system with a talking installer. But that's not much use if you can't do anything with it afterwards. That statement was a direct quote. It was, and remains, the utterings of a frightened man who feared losing custom. As things have worked out, that is exactly what has happened. Literally tens of thousands of visually impaired users across the world have now migrated to Apple's products; desktop and mobile. Indeed, the vice president of Freedom Scientific himself is the proud owner of an iPhone. Make of that what you will! Anyway, I am ranting. But I sometimes find it really disappointing when I hear people complaining like this. People who have freedom to choose. The long and the short of this is: If you want perfection, you'll be waiting for a very very long time. If you are prepared to be flexible and innovative, you have the power at your fingertips, quite literally in some cases. If, however, you are happy with constant virtualisation, hand-holding and costly solutions, then perhaps Apple's platforms are not for you. yes, there are free and low-cost applications available out there for other operating systems. And that is to be applauded. However, you are still working within the confines of an often insecure, vulnerable and unstable environment. Which ever option you choose to take is entirely down to your preference. However, although I can understand a degree of frustration when things don't quite work out; and yes, it does happen to my other half as well quite frequently, the best thing you could do is to make the most of the failures. Try to reliably replicate them and, if possible, send your crash reports to Apple. That is the
Re: Making The Most Of Your Accessible Tools; A Passionate Rant [Was so wish apple had done this]
Hello Missy I think that is a fair and reasonable perspective. I'm certainly not trying to involve anybody in a My toy's better than yours debate. What people do and how they choose to do it is entirely down to their choice. All I can say in conclusion to this is that this group is here for all of those people who share a desire and even a passion to see Apple's products improve. Also those who are keen to use and, in many cases, learn to use the products. Whatever your skill level and whatever your application for Apple's products may be, you are very welcome here. Lynne On 29 Sep 2012, at 18:53, Missy Hoppe mitmee@gmail.com wrote: • Very well said! I'll be the first to admit that I don't take full advantage of all the tips and tricks that could make web browsing easier, but I don't blaim apple or other screen reader developers. It's entirely my fault if I'm too lazy or stubborn to take the time to learn how to use web browsers properly. It always frustrates me when I see any product being bashed for seemingly no good reason. True, there are things I personally don't use, but I'm willing to respect others' rights or desire to use such products. I don't know if this is making any sense or not, but in a nut shell, all I'm trying to say is that I agree with you 100%. Thanks for the well-written post, and I hope that you're having a great day! --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: OnLine Banking With Accessibility; [Was so wish apple had done this]
natwest is too but to keep being thrown out when i am trying to work on it is unacceptable to me as in windows this does not happen and i can transfer money and do other tasks with ease On 29 Sep 2012, at 18:53, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith ly...@mac-access.net wrote: Hello John I can report that our bank, the Halifax, here in the UK, has a totally accessible and very well designed website. They use absolutely no non-standard controls and every aspect of their website, from statements to logging in, to account management and mobile messaging, is totally accessible. Perhaps that is unusual, but that's how it is. Also Gordon uses VoiceOver and Safari 6 on that site without a problem. It is lacking in some respects, I agree. For instance, it is difficult if not impossible to configure using statement grabbing financial software packages. But in every other respect it is accessible. They also use two levels of validation when you log in; again, each of which is totally accessible. Lynne On 29 Sep 2012, at 18:15, John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net wrote: Unfortunately, online banking sites are not the best examples to use for accessibility. I don't know of many banks that have really accessible websites, regardless of your platform and browser. The problems is typically that the site is designed browser specific or they hired a company to develop the site who has no idea that blind people can use computers, let alone tie their own shoes. In the past when I was paid to do web accessibility testing, they were always an adventure. For example, I have the opposite issue. Not that I use Chrome any more because I don't like a browser that phones home every hour for reasons Google won't fully disclose, but Chrome misses links and information on the TD Bank online banking site, while Safari does see the links, as does Firefox. The problem is that Safari sometimes crashes on the site and Firefox seems to get stuck at times when loading parts of it. --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: OnLine Banking With Accessibility; [Was so wish apple had done this]
Hello William On 29 Sep 2012, at 19:27, william lomas will.d.lo...@gmail.com wrote: • natwest is too but to keep being thrown out when i am trying to work on it is unacceptable to me as in windows this does not happen and i can transfer money and do other tasks with ease As I said, use what works for you. But it's alright complaining, why not do something to help the situation such as sending your crash logs to Apple; Perhaps then they may be able to fix your issue. Have you thought about that? Lynne --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Missing AudioBook Problem resolved
Hi all When I upgraded our iPad 3 and my iPhone 4S to the final release version of iO6, I was baffled by the sudden disappearance of all of my audiobooks from the MusicMore tab. Upon further investigation this evening, I have discovered why, and I thought this information might help Donal and others like him who encountered this issue. Although the Sync Selected AudioBooks radio button was checked in the iTunes profile for all of the affected devices, when I looked in the table of books stored on our Mac, I discovered to my amazement that all of the books which should have been synched were unchecked. In other words, because I had the Sync Only Selected AudioBooks option enabled, the specific books which were checked prior to the release of iTunes 10.7 which, I believe, is when this changed, the specific books themselves were disabled with the net result that nothing at all was transferred and, therefore, the AudioBooks category totally vanished. When I finally realised this earlier this evening, I re-enabled the entries for all of the books I wanted synched and, hey presto! The AudioBooks category, along with all of the books I wanted synched, re-appeared on the devices in question. So, if anybody else is having similar issues, you may like to check this. I haven't a clue why it happened, or how. But there we are. Gordon --- Gordon Smith --- If you wish to contact me privately, please use E-Mail in the first instance, before you try the below. Please also observe time differences. I prefer telephone calls by prior arrangement where possible. E-Mail: gor...@mac-access.net Telephone: If you have a SIP phone, just dial: supp...@mac-access.net United Kingdom: Free Phone: 0800 8620538 Europe and other non-specified: +44 1642 688095 United States Of America And Canada: +1 646 9151493 Australia: +61 38 8205930 Fax: +44 1642 365123 Follow Us On Twitter: http://twitter.com/@maciosaccess -- --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: Missing AudioBook Problem resolved
Alas Gordon, for me the books were synced and present on the device. Interestingly, Apple contacted me through the bug reporter utility as soon as the GM seed was released to ascertain if the bug still remained. It didn't, so I closed it. On 29 Sep 2012, at 19:55, Gordon Smith gor...@mac-access.net wrote: Hi all When I upgraded our iPad 3 and my iPhone 4S to the final release version of iO6, I was baffled by the sudden disappearance of all of my audiobooks from the MusicMore tab. Upon further investigation this evening, I have discovered why, and I thought this information might help Donal and others like him who encountered this issue. Although the Sync Selected AudioBooks radio button was checked in the iTunes profile for all of the affected devices, when I looked in the table of books stored on our Mac, I discovered to my amazement that all of the books which should have been synched were unchecked. In other words, because I had the Sync Only Selected AudioBooks option enabled, the specific books which were checked prior to the release of iTunes 10.7 which, I believe, is when this changed, the specific books themselves were disabled with the net result that nothing at all was transferred and, therefore, the AudioBooks category totally vanished. When I finally realised this earlier this evening, I re-enabled the entries for all of the books I wanted synched and, hey presto! The AudioBooks category, along with all of the books I wanted synched, re-appeared on the devices in question. So, if anybody else is having similar issues, you may like to check this. I haven't a clue why it happened, or how. But there we are. Gordon --- Gordon Smith --- If you wish to contact me privately, please use E-Mail in the first instance, before you try the below. Please also observe time differences. I prefer telephone calls by prior arrangement where possible. E-Mail: gor...@mac-access.net Telephone: If you have a SIP phone, just dial: supp...@mac-access.net United Kingdom: Free Phone: 0800 8620538 Europe and other non-specified: +44 1642 688095 United States Of America And Canada: +1 646 9151493 Australia: +61 38 8205930 Fax: +44 1642 365123 Follow Us On Twitter: http://twitter.com/@maciosaccess -- --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ Dr. Dónal Fitzpatrick School of Computing, Dublin City University, Glasnevin Dublin 9, Ireland tel.: +353-(0)1-700-8929 email: dfitzpat(at)computing.dcu.ie *“This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and are intended solely for use by the addressee. Any unauthorised dissemination, distribution or copying of this message and any attachments is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the sender and delete the message. Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and cannot be relied upon as being those of Dublin City University. E-mail communications such as this cannot be guaranteed to be virus free, timely, secure or error free and we do not accept liability for any such matters or their consequences. Please consider the environment before printing this Email ”** *** --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
face time and i message questions in foreign countries
Hi, Can I use either face time or iMessages to talk with my friend on her i devices in the states from canada? I think the answer is yes, but am unsure.. thanks if anyone knows.. Caitlyn --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: face time and i message questions in foreign countries
Definitely, because it is all done either via 3G or wifi. Facetime wifi only for most users I think even if they are on iOS 6. On 29/09/2012 22:33, Cait Furness wrote: Hi, Can I use either face time or iMessages to talk with my friend on her i devices in the states from canada? I think the answer is yes, but am unsure.. thanks if anyone knows.. Caitlyn --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: face time and i message questions in foreign countries
I'm looking forward to someone I know to have an iPhone, and try using FaceTime like the VisWiz app, only real-time visual assistance. I don't need that sort of help that often, so I haven't tried it for this yet. Glenn - Original Message - From: Chris christopher...@gmail.com To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility mac-access@mac-access.net Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2012 6:11 PM Subject: Re: face time and i message questions in foreign countries Definitely, because it is all done either via 3G or wifi. Facetime wifi only for most users I think even if they are on iOS 6. On 29/09/2012 22:33, Cait Furness wrote: Hi, Can I use either face time or iMessages to talk with my friend on her i devices in the states from canada? I think the answer is yes, but am unsure.. thanks if anyone knows.. Caitlyn --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: OnLine Banking With Accessibility; [Was so wish apple had done this]
I'll add to this that in Australia St George bank have spent much time and effort along with consultation with the blind to build a fully accessible online banking site on windows and os10. Also, although I haven't yet fully tested their iOS app, everything I've tried has been accessible. Shop round for the right financial institution both for value and honesty but also for accessibility. Danny. Sent from my phone On 30/09/2012, at 3:53 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith ly...@mac-access.net wrote: Hello John I can report that our bank, the Halifax, here in the UK, has a totally accessible and very well designed website. They use absolutely no non-standard controls and every aspect of their website, from statements to logging in, to account management and mobile messaging, is totally accessible. Perhaps that is unusual, but that's how it is. Also Gordon uses VoiceOver and Safari 6 on that site without a problem. It is lacking in some respects, I agree. For instance, it is difficult if not impossible to configure using statement grabbing financial software packages. But in every other respect it is accessible. They also use two levels of validation when you log in; again, each of which is totally accessible. Lynne On 29 Sep 2012, at 18:15, John Panarese jpanar...@mac-access.net wrote: Unfortunately, online banking sites are not the best examples to use for accessibility. I don't know of many banks that have really accessible websites, regardless of your platform and browser. The problems is typically that the site is designed browser specific or they hired a company to develop the site who has no idea that blind people can use computers, let alone tie their own shoes. In the past when I was paid to do web accessibility testing, they were always an adventure. For example, I have the opposite issue. Not that I use Chrome any more because I don't like a browser that phones home every hour for reasons Google won't fully disclose, but Chrome misses links and information on the TD Bank online banking site, while Safari does see the links, as does Firefox. The problem is that Safari sometimes crashes on the site and Firefox seems to get stuck at times when loading parts of it. --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Rumola is unique! Rumola beats the CAPTCHA test!
Unfortunitally I cannot try this as it says that the browser (safari 6) is not supported at this time but those of you using firefox nightly can tell us using safari if it works or not. Be blessed. http://skipinput.com/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: Rumola is unique! Rumola beats the CAPTCHA test!
Yes it does work under safari six. Even though the page said that, i tried it anyway. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 10:48 PM, Sarah Alawami marri...@gmail.com wrote: Unfortunitally I cannot try this as it says that the browser (safari 6) is not supported at this time but those of you using firefox nightly can tell us using safari if it works or not. Be blessed. http://skipinput.com/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
My Thoughts on the Mac Accessibility was RE: Making The Most Of Your Accessible Tools; A Passionate Rant [Was so wish apple had done this]
Here, Here. Well said. I've just migrated to mac and I'm quite surprised with how accessible it really is. I have virtually no site, and I'm learning to get around it quite well. I particularly love the way that you can use the Item chooser to navigate around a page rather than tab around a hole screen in other systems to find what you want. Debbie -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith Sent: Sunday, 30 September 2012 3:39 AM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Making The Most Of Your Accessible Tools; A Passionate Rant [Was so wish apple had done this] Hello John, Will and all As somebody with vision looking in, so to speak, I frequently find it astonishing when I hear people criticising what Apple is doing with accessibility; particularly in view of the practicalities. For instance, unless you're a pirate and by definition, therefore, a thief, Freedom Scientific, GW Micro and Dolphin Access, to name but three vendors, charge a very great deal of money for their accessibility tools. Also, Microsoft charges for their operating system, even for the most basic version, over 5 times what Apple does. VoiceOver is a free and, most of the time, very reliable product. It gives the user access to a WYSIWYG, (what you see is what you get) interface to websites. Most of which can, if you take the time to learn to use it, be navigated extremely well using VoiceOver and Safari. Ultimately, it really depends upon the individual. If you just want a sheet of virtual paper with a hand-holding web environment, by all means use your other products and I wish you the very best of luck in all you do. I, (and I count my lucky stars, believe me), have the advantage of vision and I have seen both sides of this. I do see some sites where VoiceOver just will not play nicely and yes, we have seen some pretty spectacular crashes at times. However, in the general scheme of things, the environment is more stable and just as, if not more, reliable than the competition if, and it is a very big if, the pilot of the machine takes the time and effort to learn to handle it. I sincerely hope that we see a time when Apple perfects their accessibility tools. But make no mistake about it; they are committed to accessibility and they will improve their offerings. Remember also that the competing products have been available far far longer than has VoiceOver. Yes, I know that you can't always go by that and I know also that Apple has been involved in the field of accessibility for around 8 years now. However, just cast your mind back to how things were before Apple entered the market. Apple really has made a difference, not only to their own products, but also the competition. I recall the vice president of one accessibility company saying: It's all very well having an operating system with a talking installer. But that's not much use if you can't do anything with it afterwards. That statement was a direct quote. It was, and remains, the utterings of a frightened man who feared losing custom. As things have worked out, that is exactly what has happened. Literally tens of thousands of visually impaired users across the world have now migrated to Apple's products; desktop and mobile. Indeed, the vice president of Freedom Scientific himself is the proud owner of an iPhone. Make of that what you will! Anyway, I am ranting. But I sometimes find it really disappointing when I hear people complaining like this. People who have freedom to choose. The long and the short of this is: If you want perfection, you'll be waiting for a very very long time. If you are prepared to be flexible and innovative, you have the power at your fingertips, quite literally in some cases. If, however, you are happy with constant virtualisation, hand-holding and costly solutions, then perhaps Apple's platforms are not for you. yes, there are free and low-cost applications available out there for other operating systems. And that is to be applauded. However, you are still working within the confines of an often insecure, vulnerable and unstable environment. Which ever option you choose to take is entirely down to your preference. However, although I can understand a degree of frustration when things don't quite work out; and yes, it does happen to my other half as well quite frequently, the best thing you could do is to make the most of the failures. Try to reliably replicate them and, if possible, send your crash reports to Apple. That is the only way your problems will be fixed. It isn't reasonable to expect Apple to foresee every eventuality and I urge cooperation and patience. Believe it or not, as somebody with vision, I can tel you that Internet Explorer 9 and FireFox 15 are not invulnerable and do crash quite frequently, even without accessibility tools in the mix. Speaking personally, I learned to do much more than point and click and I
Rogue Amoeba's 10th Anniversary Birthday Sale
Hi All, We mentioned that there would be a sale in celebration of Rogue Amoeba's 10th anniversary on September 30th. If you visit their main web page, there's now a 10th anniversary.png link that will take you to this site: http://www.rogueamoeba.com/store/deals/TenthAnniversary.php You'll save $10 off each of their advertised products, so Airfoil for either Mac or Windows is $15 instead of $25, and if you want their combined Airfoil bundle for both platforms it's $30 instead of $40. Audio Hijack Pro, which has been discussed extensively here, is $22 instead of $32. Fission, the lossless audio editor that Lynne mentioned recently, is $22 instead of $32, and if you want to buy the Audio Hijack Pro + Fission bundle, it's $40 instead of $50. Nicecast for broadcasting your music is $49 instead of $59, and Piezo, a very simple recording app, is $5 instead of $15. I'm writing out the prices because the announcement of prices of the column three labels on their web page doesn't accurately reflect the prices announced in their email newsletter, and all the entries read the same, incorrect price drop ($25 to $5 -- unfortunately not true.) If you activate the buttons in the fourth column of this page, the items will be placed in your shopping cart at the discounted price. For that matter, if you purchase items from the regular page today, they'll show up in your shopping cart at the discounted price in honor of the 10th anniversary. OK, one more accessibility fix announcement: On the check out page, there are two radio buttons for the payment option that are not further detailed. The first one, selected by default, is for credit card payments. The second radio button is for Paypal. This is obvious when you activate the Continue link to provide the final payment information. Despite the checkout issues, the software is very good. This offer is in effect for the next day. HTH. Cheers, Esther --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: My Thoughts on the Mac Accessibility was RE: Making The Most Of Your Accessible Tools; A Passionate Rant [Was so wish apple had done this]
I love the mac, I no longer have a pc here, voiceover does things somewhat differently than the windows screen readers, but once you get usd to that, it works just as well as the windows screen readers and in many ways, it works better. On Sep 29, 2012, at 10:15 PM, Debbie April Yuille wrote: Here, Here. Well said. I've just migrated to mac and I'm quite surprised with how accessible it really is. I have virtually no site, and I'm learning to get around it quite well. I particularly love the way that you can use the Item chooser to navigate around a page rather than tab around a hole screen in other systems to find what you want. Debbie -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith Sent: Sunday, 30 September 2012 3:39 AM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Making The Most Of Your Accessible Tools; A Passionate Rant [Was so wish apple had done this] Hello John, Will and all As somebody with vision looking in, so to speak, I frequently find it astonishing when I hear people criticising what Apple is doing with accessibility; particularly in view of the practicalities. For instance, unless you're a pirate and by definition, therefore, a thief, Freedom Scientific, GW Micro and Dolphin Access, to name but three vendors, charge a very great deal of money for their accessibility tools. Also, Microsoft charges for their operating system, even for the most basic version, over 5 times what Apple does. VoiceOver is a free and, most of the time, very reliable product. It gives the user access to a WYSIWYG, (what you see is what you get) interface to websites. Most of which can, if you take the time to learn to use it, be navigated extremely well using VoiceOver and Safari. Ultimately, it really depends upon the individual. If you just want a sheet of virtual paper with a hand-holding web environment, by all means use your other products and I wish you the very best of luck in all you do. I, (and I count my lucky stars, believe me), have the advantage of vision and I have seen both sides of this. I do see some sites where VoiceOver just will not play nicely and yes, we have seen some pretty spectacular crashes at times. However, in the general scheme of things, the environment is more stable and just as, if not more, reliable than the competition if, and it is a very big if, the pilot of the machine takes the time and effort to learn to handle it. I sincerely hope that we see a time when Apple perfects their accessibility tools. But make no mistake about it; they are committed to accessibility and they will improve their offerings. Remember also that the competing products have been available far far longer than has VoiceOver. Yes, I know that you can't always go by that and I know also that Apple has been involved in the field of accessibility for around 8 years now. However, just cast your mind back to how things were before Apple entered the market. Apple really has made a difference, not only to their own products, but also the competition. I recall the vice president of one accessibility company saying: It's all very well having an operating system with a talking installer. But that's not much use if you can't do anything with it afterwards. That statement was a direct quote. It was, and remains, the utterings of a frightened man who feared losing custom. As things have worked out, that is exactly what has happened. Literally tens of thousands of visually impaired users across the world have now migrated to Apple's products; desktop and mobile. Indeed, the vice president of Freedom Scientific himself is the proud owner of an iPhone. Make of that what you will! Anyway, I am ranting. But I sometimes find it really disappointing when I hear people complaining like this. People who have freedom to choose. The long and the short of this is: If you want perfection, you'll be waiting for a very very long time. If you are prepared to be flexible and innovative, you have the power at your fingertips, quite literally in some cases. If, however, you are happy with constant virtualisation, hand-holding and costly solutions, then perhaps Apple's platforms are not for you. yes, there are free and low-cost applications available out there for other operating systems. And that is to be applauded. However, you are still working within the confines of an often insecure, vulnerable and unstable environment. Which ever option you choose to take is entirely down to your preference. However, although I can understand a degree of frustration when things don't quite work out; and yes, it does happen to my other half as well quite frequently, the best thing you could do is to make the most of the failures. Try to reliably replicate them and, if possible, send your crash reports to Apple. That is the only way your problems will be
Re: Rumola is unique! Rumola beats the CAPTCHA test!
Odd. Mine came up with an error which I sent to you over twitter. Will try it out and see if the page just made a mistake. or what ever. Tc all. On Sep 29, 2012, at 7:50 PM, Orin orin8...@gmail.com wrote: Yes it does work under safari six. Even though the page said that, i tried it anyway. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 10:48 PM, Sarah Alawami marri...@gmail.com wrote: Unfortunitally I cannot try this as it says that the browser (safari 6) is not supported at this time but those of you using firefox nightly can tell us using safari if it works or not. Be blessed. http://skipinput.com/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: Rumola is unique! Rumola beats the CAPTCHA test!
Hi, Yes, it does work, I've used rumala before. It's a wonderful extension. Courtney Sent from my iPad On Sep 29, 2012, at 10:55 PM, Orin orin8...@gmail.com wrote: Yes it does work under safari six. Even though the page said that, i tried it anyway. Orin orin8...@gmail.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/orinks Skype: orin1112 On Sep 29, 2012, at 10:48 PM, Sarah Alawami marri...@gmail.com wrote: Unfortunitally I cannot try this as it says that the browser (safari 6) is not supported at this time but those of you using firefox nightly can tell us using safari if it works or not. Be blessed. http://skipinput.com/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: Have any of you used this app?
Yes, I love it! Really helped me last winter when searching for a new home. The website works great, also. Diane - Original Message - From: Laurie Mehta laurieme...@yahoo.com To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility mac-access@mac-access.net Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2012 10:52 AM Subject: Have any of you used this app? Hi, Someone sent me the following and I am interested in hearing feedback from any of you who may have used this app. Thanks! == Walk Score == http://www.applevis.com/ios-app-directory/lifestyle/walk-score (from AppleVis - Recent Additions to the App Directory) Get your Walk Score and find walkable places to live. Walk Score instantly calculates the walkability of any location and shows you a map of nearby restaurants, coffee shops, grocery stores, etc. Walk Score helps you find apartments and rentals near the places you love. It's the only app that lets you search by commute time or near public transit. We help you find a place where you can drive less and live more. FEATURES: + Instantly get the Walk Score for any location + See nearby restaurants, groceries, shops, parks, etc. + Find apartments and rentals by commute time + See the freshest listings from top rental sites + Search for apartments near public transit + Customize your search: price, beds, pets, etc. + Contact landlords on the go Everything you need to find a place you love! About Walk Score: We believe walkable neighborhoods with access to public transit, shorter commutes, and people and places you love are the key to a happier and healthier lifestyle. Version2.1.1Free or PaidFreeCompatibilityThis is a native iPhone and iPod Touch app that is displayed in 2x mode on an iPadDevice(s) App Was Tested OniPhone 4Accessibility CommentsVery simple and surprisingly accessible, with the possible exception of the maps. All buttons and form fields are clearly labeled and I had no trouble at all getting around. This app only works with IOS 5 or later, so make sure you're up-to-date before downloading it. I'm running IOS 6 and had no problems whatsoever. VoiceOver PerformanceVoiceOver reads all page elements.Button LabellingAll buttons are clearly labelled.UsabilityThe app is fully accessible with VoiceOver and is easy to navigate and use.Other CommentsThis app and the website behind it is such an awesome idea and I'm so glad they're both very accessible. As someone wishing to live on my own finding the most walkable area possible is of great importance to me, and this app will be a great help with that. It's also encouraged me to do more walking in my current place of residence. The walk score in my neighborhood is 62%. What a pleasant surprise. --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/ --- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net --- To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access@mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/mac-access/index.html or at the public Mail Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/. Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: http://www.mail-archive.com/mac-access@mac-access.net/maillist.xml The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/mac-access/options/
Re: My Thoughts on the Mac Accessibility was RE: Making The Most Of Your Accessible Tools; A Passionate Rant [Was so wish apple had done this]
I've also had it said to me that if you can get hold of a numpad, bluetooth or otherwise, you can make full use of numpad commander and it makes the navigating experience just that much better. I personally had no issue with learning to use the mac. I learned to drive on around two years ago, as a friend of mine had one. ever since then, I could wander into a store, turn voiceover on and have a play. Now I have one, I've not looked back. On 30/09/2012, at 12:45 PM, Debbie April Yuille debbieyui...@bigpond.com wrote: Here, Here. Well said. I've just migrated to mac and I'm quite surprised with how accessible it really is. I have virtually no site, and I'm learning to get around it quite well. I particularly love the way that you can use the Item chooser to navigate around a page rather than tab around a hole screen in other systems to find what you want. Debbie -Original Message- From: mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net [mailto:mac-access-boun...@mac-access.net] On Behalf Of Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith Sent: Sunday, 30 September 2012 3:39 AM To: Mac OSX iOS Accessibility Subject: Making The Most Of Your Accessible Tools; A Passionate Rant [Was so wish apple had done this] Hello John, Will and all As somebody with vision looking in, so to speak, I frequently find it astonishing when I hear people criticising what Apple is doing with accessibility; particularly in view of the practicalities. For instance, unless you're a pirate and by definition, therefore, a thief, Freedom Scientific, GW Micro and Dolphin Access, to name but three vendors, charge a very great deal of money for their accessibility tools. Also, Microsoft charges for their operating system, even for the most basic version, over 5 times what Apple does. VoiceOver is a free and, most of the time, very reliable product. It gives the user access to a WYSIWYG, (what you see is what you get) interface to websites. Most of which can, if you take the time to learn to use it, be navigated extremely well using VoiceOver and Safari. Ultimately, it really depends upon the individual. If you just want a sheet of virtual paper with a hand-holding web environment, by all means use your other products and I wish you the very best of luck in all you do. I, (and I count my lucky stars, believe me), have the advantage of vision and I have seen both sides of this. I do see some sites where VoiceOver just will not play nicely and yes, we have seen some pretty spectacular crashes at times. However, in the general scheme of things, the environment is more stable and just as, if not more, reliable than the competition if, and it is a very big if, the pilot of the machine takes the time and effort to learn to handle it. I sincerely hope that we see a time when Apple perfects their accessibility tools. But make no mistake about it; they are committed to accessibility and they will improve their offerings. Remember also that the competing products have been available far far longer than has VoiceOver. Yes, I know that you can't always go by that and I know also that Apple has been involved in the field of accessibility for around 8 years now. However, just cast your mind back to how things were before Apple entered the market. Apple really has made a difference, not only to their own products, but also the competition. I recall the vice president of one accessibility company saying: It's all very well having an operating system with a talking installer. But that's not much use if you can't do anything with it afterwards. That statement was a direct quote. It was, and remains, the utterings of a frightened man who feared losing custom. As things have worked out, that is exactly what has happened. Literally tens of thousands of visually impaired users across the world have now migrated to Apple's products; desktop and mobile. Indeed, the vice president of Freedom Scientific himself is the proud owner of an iPhone. Make of that what you will! Anyway, I am ranting. But I sometimes find it really disappointing when I hear people complaining like this. People who have freedom to choose. The long and the short of this is: If you want perfection, you'll be waiting for a very very long time. If you are prepared to be flexible and innovative, you have the power at your fingertips, quite literally in some cases. If, however, you are happy with constant virtualisation, hand-holding and costly solutions, then perhaps Apple's platforms are not for you. yes, there are free and low-cost applications available out there for other operating systems. And that is to be applauded. However, you are still working within the confines of an often insecure, vulnerable and unstable environment. Which ever option you choose to take is entirely down to your preference. However, although I can understand a degree of frustration when things don't quite work out; and yes, it does happen to my
