Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap stretch Wuz: The SDL

[Floyd Thursby via Mercedes]

The AGD car!


On 9/8/16 4:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes wrote:

Herbie!


clay via Mercedes 
September 8, 2016 at 3:18 PM
I have a set of table rails. the sort that allows you to stretch a 
table. Maybe those will be useful. Then Jim could have a short as 
well as LONG wheel base car.


clay




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--
--FT


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[MBZ] Frankenheap stretch Wuz: The SDL

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

Herbie!


clay via Mercedes 
September 8, 2016 at 3:18 PM
I have a set of table rails. the sort that allows you to stretch a 
table. Maybe those will be useful. Then Jim could have a short as well 
as LONG wheel base car.


clay




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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap fun!

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Did you miss the term "heap"? Owning a heap is not about obtaining new parts 
its about keeping it running for cheap. Bonus points will be when Jim welds 
tube steel (bed frames?) underneath so the doors don't flap.
-Curt

  From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: Andrew Strasfogel <astrasfo...@gmail.com>
 Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2015 10:00 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap fun!
   
WHy not simply obtai another shift stalk?  What year/model is your 'Heap?

On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 1:43 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Driving home in the Frankenheap from work, trying to shift into second
> as I pulled out of the parking lot, the shift lever snapped off!
> Yikes!  I was able to wiggle the stub into third gear, and thoroughly
> abuse the clutch taking off.  Shifting between third and fourth was
> possible without the lever, but nothing else was.  I was able to get
> home OK, on only two from-stop starts.
>
> I'm going to look into welding or brazing this back together.
>
> -- Jim
>
>
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>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap fun!

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

WHy not simply obtai another shift stalk?  What year/model is your 'Heap?

On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 1:43 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Driving home in the Frankenheap from work, trying to shift into second
> as I pulled out of the parking lot, the shift lever snapped off!
> Yikes!  I was able to wiggle the stub into third gear, and thoroughly
> abuse the clutch taking off.  Shifting between third and fourth was
> possible without the lever, but nothing else was.  I was able to get
> home OK, on only two from-stop starts.
>
> I'm going to look into welding or brazing this back together.
>
> -- Jim
>
>
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>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap fun!

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

I was thinking of him retrieving a used one from a salvage yard.  His plan
is like stitching together a seat belt - ill advised IMO.

On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 10:15 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Did you miss the term "heap"? Owning a heap is not about obtaining new
> parts its about keeping it running for cheap. Bonus points will be when Jim
> welds tube steel (bed frames?) underneath so the doors don't flap.
> -Curt
>
>   From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
>  To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> Cc: Andrew Strasfogel <astrasfo...@gmail.com>
>  Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2015 10:00 AM
>  Subject: Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap fun!
>
> WHy not simply obtai another shift stalk?  What year/model is your 'Heap?
>
> On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 1:43 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > Driving home in the Frankenheap from work, trying to shift into second
> > as I pulled out of the parking lot, the shift lever snapped off!
> > Yikes!  I was able to wiggle the stub into third gear, and thoroughly
> > abuse the clutch taking off.  Shifting between third and fourth was
> > possible without the lever, but nothing else was.  I was able to get
> > home OK, on only two from-stop starts.
> >
> > I'm going to look into welding or brazing this back together.
> >
> > -- Jim
> >
> >
> > ___
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> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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>
>
> >
> >
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap fun!

[Randy Bennell via Mercedes]

On 08/12/2015 10:33 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes wrote:

WHy not simply obtai another shift stalk? What year/model is your 'Heap?


Grey-market 115 200D, was converted from column shift to floor
shift, using God-only-knows what parts.  Not well.  IIRC I had
another shift lever, but it's the wrong shape.  (This is [some
of] the Franken part.  The Heap part is self-evident.)

-- Jim


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What you need is a nice big chrome Hurst Shifter!

RB

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap fun!

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

WHy not simply obtai another shift stalk?  What year/model is your 
'Heap?


Grey-market 115 200D, was converted from column shift to floor
shift, using God-only-knows what parts.  Not well.  IIRC I had
another shift lever, but it's the wrong shape.  (This is [some
of] the Franken part.  The Heap part is self-evident.)

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap fun!

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

What year/model is your 'Heap?


Oh, and it's 115.115-50-1372xx, circa 1972.  Probably made in
Mechelen, Belgium.

VIN doesn't look up.  I suspect the engine is not original, too.
It was clearly somebody's unfinished project when I got it.
Abandoned, literally.  I used the State procedure for gaining
ownership of it, a sanctioned version of "finders, keepers."

-- Jim


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[MBZ] Frankenheap fun!

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

Driving home in the Frankenheap from work, trying to shift into second
as I pulled out of the parking lot, the shift lever snapped off!
Yikes!  I was able to wiggle the stub into third gear, and thoroughly
abuse the clutch taking off.  Shifting between third and fourth was
possible without the lever, but nothing else was.  I was able to get
home OK, on only two from-stop starts.

I'm going to look into welding or brazing this back together.

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

Saturday I didn't get much done, but I did get the car jacked up.  The
road rash doesn't look as bad as I'd feared.

On Sunday I got to work on it.  The forward end of the exhaust pipe
that was dragging on the ground was all collapsed.  I got the end of
the pipe opened back up, and the ruined metal broken off.  (Yes, it's
that thin!)  I rooted around in the garage and came up with an 8
piece of scrap exhaust pipe that would slip over what was there, and
used it as a sleeve to bridge the break and cover up the missing
metal.  I then welded it into place.  It leaks a bit, but the noise is
gone and it seems sturdy enough again.  I replaced the one rubber
exhaust hanger that had disappeared.

Today I put in some engine oil, which was low, and while I was at it I
slopped a bit into the injection pump.  I tested the fuses, and rolled
them in their sockets, and all seems well again.  I re-set the clock,
and replaced the burned out indicator in the flasher switch.  Ready to
roll again!

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[WILTON via Mercedes]

'Nother ATTABOY!

Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Jim Cathey via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com

To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2014 11:08 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap



Saturday I didn't get much done, but I did get the car jacked up.  The
road rash doesn't look as bad as I'd feared.

On Sunday I got to work on it.  The forward end of the exhaust pipe
that was dragging on the ground was all collapsed.  I got the end of
the pipe opened back up, and the ruined metal broken off.  (Yes, it's
that thin!)  I rooted around in the garage and came up with an 8
piece of scrap exhaust pipe that would slip over what was there, and
used it as a sleeve to bridge the break and cover up the missing
metal.  I then welded it into place.  It leaks a bit, but the noise is
gone and it seems sturdy enough again.  I replaced the one rubber
exhaust hanger that had disappeared.

Today I put in some engine oil, which was low, and while I was at it I
slopped a bit into the injection pump.  I tested the fuses, and rolled
them in their sockets, and all seems well again.  I re-set the clock,
and replaced the burned out indicator in the flasher switch.  Ready to
roll again!

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[dseretakis--- via Mercedes]

Nice going!
Remind me now. Is this the euro w115 200D?

Sent from my iPhone

 On Dec 15, 2014, at 11:08 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 Saturday I didn't get much done, but I did get the car jacked up.  The
 road rash doesn't look as bad as I'd feared.
 
 On Sunday I got to work on it.  The forward end of the exhaust pipe
 that was dragging on the ground was all collapsed.  I got the end of
 the pipe opened back up, and the ruined metal broken off.  (Yes, it's
 that thin!)  I rooted around in the garage and came up with an 8
 piece of scrap exhaust pipe that would slip over what was there, and
 used it as a sleeve to bridge the break and cover up the missing
 metal.  I then welded it into place.  It leaks a bit, but the noise is
 gone and it seems sturdy enough again.  I replaced the one rubber
 exhaust hanger that had disappeared.
 
 Today I put in some engine oil, which was low, and while I was at it I
 slopped a bit into the injection pump.  I tested the fuses, and rolled
 them in their sockets, and all seems well again.  I re-set the clock,
 and replaced the burned out indicator in the flasher switch.  Ready to
 roll again!
 
 -- Jim
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

Remind me now. Is this the euro w115 200D?


Yes.  I don't want to let it go.

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

Well, the muffler really fell down yesterday.  The patch (which I have
not had time to reinforce) fell off, and I couldn't get the muffler out
from under the car.  So I had to drive home at 15 per, scraping all
the way.  Ground off (literally!) quite a bit of metal, I don't know
if I'll be able to fix this easily or not.

The emergency flashers stopped some miles into our scrapey trip,
as did the clock.  The dome light did, too.  Fuse, no doubt.
Finished the trip with the right blinker on instead.

Sigh.


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[WILTON via Mercedes]

Trying to set a record, aren't you?  How far can one drag it into the 
future?   ;)


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Jim Cathey via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com

To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Friday, December 12, 2014 9:48 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap



Well, the muffler really fell down yesterday.  The patch (which I have
not had time to reinforce) fell off, and I couldn't get the muffler out
from under the car.  So I had to drive home at 15 per, scraping all
the way.  Ground off (literally!) quite a bit of metal, I don't know
if I'll be able to fix this easily or not.

The emergency flashers stopped some miles into our scrapey trip,
as did the clock.  The dome light did, too.  Fuse, no doubt.
Finished the trip with the right blinker on instead.

Sigh.


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

I removed the windshield wipers and the air intake grille, and
lubricated the blower fan.  (Again.  Has it really been eight years?)
Got my wrist all scraped up, again.  I hate this job.  I used Mobil 1
5W20 motor oil.  The pot-metal casting for the passenger-side
windshield wiper blade broke while I was putting it back.  Evil stuff,
that pot metal.  It seems to be intact enough to hold together even
broken as it is, but this does not please me.  Anyway, the fan is
working again.

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[WILTON via Mercedes]

And ATTABOY!

Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Jim Cathey via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com

To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2014 11:16 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap



I removed the windshield wipers and the air intake grille, and
lubricated the blower fan.  (Again.  Has it really been eight years?)
Got my wrist all scraped up, again.  I hate this job.  I used Mobil 1
5W20 motor oil.  The pot-metal casting for the passenger-side
windshield wiper blade broke while I was putting it back.  Evil stuff,
that pot metal.  It seems to be intact enough to hold together even
broken as it is, but this does not please me.  Anyway, the fan is
working again.

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[dseretakis--- via Mercedes]

Oh minor stuff!

Sent from my iPhone

 On Dec 4, 2014, at 9:43 PM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 The blower fuse fried again, and the muffler just fell off.
 Again.  Perhaps the car is trying to tell me something?
 
 -- Jim
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

The blower fuse fried again, and the muffler just fell off.
Again.  Perhaps the car is trying to tell me something?

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[Curly McLain via Mercedes]

The blower fuse fried again, and the muffler just fell off.
Again.  Perhaps the car is trying to tell me something?

-- Jim


Its just telling you I want attention

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[Peter Frederick via Mercedes]

you need to replace the blower motor and the exhaust, maybe?

Peter

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[OK Don via Mercedes]

Perhaps it's telling you - TANSTAAFL (Ride)

On Thu, Dec 4, 2014 at 10:46 PM, Peter Frederick via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 you need to replace the blower motor and the exhaust, maybe?

 Peter


-- 
OK Don

NSA: The only branch of government that actually listens to US citizens!

There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves.

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 44 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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[MBZ] Frankenheap

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

Two days ago I notice the heater fan wasn't working anymore.
Yikes!  This morning I had a chance to look at it, and it's
merely a blown fuse.  I was thrown by the fact that it wasn't
working on the preheater either, which does not require the
fuse.  (But it only runs it on low, and the fan was a bit
sticky with disuse.  Once the car was able to run it at
higher speeds the preheater function started working right
too.)  Just in time for the snow/ice they're predicting.
It's been very cold here, but mostly very dry.

I also found a split vacuum plug on the main line, that might
explain the intermittent loss of boost.

I got the torn headliner in the back glued back up, and the
Christmas lights re-hung.  'tis the season!

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Wed, 3 Dec 2014 08:11:24 -0800 Jim Cathey via Mercedes
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Two days ago I notice the heater fan wasn't working anymore.
 Yikes!  This morning I had a chance to look at it, and it's
 merely a blown fuse.  I was thrown by the fact that it wasn't
 working on the preheater either, which does not require the
 fuse.  (But it only runs it on low, and the fan was a bit
 sticky with disuse.  Once the car was able to run it at
 higher speeds the preheater function started working right
 too.)  Just in time for the snow/ice they're predicting.
 It's been very cold here, but mostly very dry.
 
 I also found a split vacuum plug on the main line, that might
 explain the intermittent loss of boost.
 
 I got the torn headliner in the back glued back up, and the
 Christmas lights re-hung.  'tis the season!

Congratulations!


Craig

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[MBZ] Frankenheap

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

Did I mention that it is back on the road again?  Insurance
all settled out, mechanics all sorted out.  This, though, is
probably its last year: the rear doors are starting to sag,
and don't close without lifting.  I think the tinworm has
weakened the spine of the car enough that maybe I should
try to avoid speed bumps!

It's sad, really, that the lazy SOB's in conjunction with
the EPA have caused them to switch from sand to salt for
the roads here in winter.  With sand your paint didn't last
forever, but the car could.  With salt the paint is OK, at
least until the rust bubbles up from underneath and takes
the entire car out too.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[dseretakis--- via Mercedes]

That's good to hear!
Might I suggest that you spray the heck out of the underbody parts exhibiting 
rust and body cavities with Fluid Film. It is an excellent rust inhibitor!

Sent from my iPhone

 On Nov 28, 2014, at 7:53 PM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 Did I mention that it is back on the road again?  Insurance
 all settled out, mechanics all sorted out.  This, though, is
 probably its last year: the rear doors are starting to sag,
 and don't close without lifting.  I think the tinworm has
 weakened the spine of the car enough that maybe I should
 try to avoid speed bumps!
 
 It's sad, really, that the lazy SOB's in conjunction with
 the EPA have caused them to switch from sand to salt for
 the roads here in winter.  With sand your paint didn't last
 forever, but the car could.  With salt the paint is OK, at
 least until the rust bubbles up from underneath and takes
 the entire car out too.
 
 -- Jim
 
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

Might I suggest that you spray the heck out of the underbody parts 
exhibiting rust and body cavities with Fluid Film. It is an excellent 
rust inhibitor!


The new budget for this on-its-last-legs car is zero.  I might
spray some used 15W40 under there.  Or not.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap fan clutch rebuild

[Jim Cathey]

I've been doing some thinking and some reading, and it may be that
this viscous fan clutch is _not_ thermostatic.  It may in fact be only
RPM-sensitive and is intended to couple at idle speeds and decouple at
higher speeds, making the assumption that the car is moving when the
engine revs up.  The fins on its body might be just for dissipating
the heat from the clutch slippage itself.  This would make some sense,
I suppose, but I doubt it's as useful as a more elaborate clutch.
Perhaps that's why we don't see this kind anymore.  Still, it's
probably perfect for _this_ car, given how it's used.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap fan clutch rebuild

[Craig]

On Mon, 16 Apr 2012 07:23:30 -0700 Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net
wrote:

 I've been doing some thinking and some reading, and it may be that
 this viscous fan clutch is _not_ thermostatic.  It may in fact be only
 RPM-sensitive and is intended to couple at idle speeds and decouple at
 higher speeds, making the assumption that the car is moving when the
 engine revs up.  The fins on its body might be just for dissipating
 the heat from the clutch slippage itself.  This would make some sense,
 I suppose, but I doubt it's as useful as a more elaborate clutch.
 Perhaps that's why we don't see this kind anymore.  Still, it's
 probably perfect for _this_ car, given how it's used.

Interesting commentary on fan clutches. RPM-sensitive reminds me about
the old fiberglass-bladed clutch a friend put on a Ford 302 in a Sunbeam
Tiger. The blades were flexible enough that at high RPM they flattened
out and moved less air.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap fan clutch rebuild

[OK Don]

That's the same fan I used on the 215 Olds engine in the MGA --

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 11:35 AM, Craig diese...@pisquared.net wrote:



 Interesting commentary on fan clutches. RPM-sensitive reminds me about
 the old fiberglass-bladed clutch a friend put on a Ford 302 in a Sunbeam
 Tiger. The blades were flexible enough that at high RPM they flattened
 out and moved less air.


 Craig





-- 
OK Don
2001 ML320
1992 300D 2.5T
1990 300D 2.5T
1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager
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[MBZ] Frankenheap fan clutch rebuild

[Jim Cathey]

The last few weeks I've been slowly rebuilding the viscous fan clutch
on the Frankenheap's 116 205 12 06 aluminum fan which ate its
bearings.  (I swapped this in years ago to try to save noise and fuel,
over its original fixed plastic fan.)  Its Behr 4088.3 fan clutch
actually looks like a repairable part: it was held together with
screws and bolts, and no crimping.  Once I got it apart I found two
bog-standard bearings and a shaft seal totally ruined, which cost me
all of $20 at the local bearing supply house.  The only mystery is
that I could find no trace of any thermostatic element within the
clutch, only a centrifugal spring-loaded slide valve.  (This clutch
has no external mechanism, either.)  The gray grease inside was heavy
yet runny, and left a silicone feel on the fingers after it was wiped
off.  It was a close match in viscosity to the clear 12,500 cst
silicone oil I'd procured years ago for just such purposes.  (I'd
bought a gallon, and sold off seven pints to list members to recoup
the cost of the gallon.)  The operating face of the rotor is its
10mm spiral-grooved edge, not mating grooved faces, so it's not like
most other clutches I've read about.

Anyway, with new bearings and a seal I reassembled the thing, picked
the bearing bits out of the goo, and put it back together.  I added a
generous dollop of new oil to the clutch before putting it back
together, to make up for losses.  Once together it was quite stiff, as
it should be, and I put it on the car.  It took a fair bit of time
before the clutch decoupled and the car quieted down, but quiet down
it did.  When I stopped the engine the fan only made it maybe half a
revolution, but when worked by hand it had loosened up considerably.
I think I'm going to have to declare this one a success.  Even if it
never does fully couple (how _does_ it exhibit thermostatic action?)
it blows enough air to satisfy a winter beater's needs, yet should
satisfy my fuel/noise desires.

See: http://userweb.windwireless.net/~jimc/frankenheap.html#fanrebuild
for more details.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Rich Thomas]

Yeah, what he said.

--R

On 12/5/11 9:22 PM, Allan Streib wrote:

Hans Neureiterdiese...@gmail.com  writes:


And patiencently applied skill.
Remember, soft steel (hex rounds off) and hollow (shears at the weak
pont = end of threads).
If all fails, Easy-Out. No drilling! Tapered seat below.

And if you think you're in a fix when the bleeder shears off, just wait
until you have an EZ-Out snaps off.  Don't ask me how I know.  Luckily
I've never had an issue with the bleeders on a Benz.  Pretty much
everything else though.

Allan



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Randy Bennell]

On 05/12/2011 8:22 PM, Allan Streib wrote:

Hans Neureiterdiese...@gmail.com  writes:


And patiencently applied skill.
Remember, soft steel (hex rounds off) and hollow (shears at the weak
pont = end of threads).
If all fails, Easy-Out. No drilling! Tapered seat below.

And if you think you're in a fix when the bleeder shears off,just wait
until you have an EZ-Out snaps off.  Don't ask me how I know.  Luckily
I've never had an issue with the bleeders on a Benz.  Pretty much
everything else though.

Allan

That was when I got the new caliper! (not MB - old Suburban a number of 
years back)


Randy
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Dimitri Seretakis]

I bet the caliper rebuilders love receiving those cores!

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 6, 2011, at 3:08 PM, Randy Bennell rbenn...@bennell.ca wrote:

On 05/12/2011 8:22 PM, Allan Streib wrote:
Hans Neureiterdiese...@gmail.com  writes:

And patiencently applied skill.
Remember, soft steel (hex rounds off) and hollow (shears at the weak
pont = end of threads).
If all fails, Easy-Out. No drilling! Tapered seat below.
And if you think you're in a fix when the bleeder shears off,just wait
until you have an EZ-Out snaps off.  Don't ask me how I know.  Luckily
I've never had an issue with the bleeders on a Benz.  Pretty much
everything else though.

Allan

That was when I got the new caliper! (not MB - old Suburban a number of years 
back)

Randy
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Gerry Archer]

Probably not all rebuilders.  Rebuilder of a set I bought had
apparently drilled out and rethreaded the ports and installed
bigger bleeder valves that could only be loosened/tightened
with a U.S. size wrench.  Don't know if the threads were
metric or U.S.
Gerry

From: Dimitri Seretakis dsereta...@yahoo.com

I bet the caliper rebuilders love receiving those cores!

Hans Neureiterdiese...@gmail.com  writes:
And patiencently applied skill.
Remember, soft steel (hex rounds off) and hollow (shears at the weak
pont = end of threads).
If all fails, Easy-Out. No drilling! Tapered seat below.



And if you think you're in a fix when the bleeder shears off,just wait
until you have an EZ-Out snaps off.  Don't ask me how I know.  Luckily
I've never had an issue with the bleeders on a Benz.  Pretty much
everything else though.
Allan

That was when I got the new caliper! (not MB - old Suburban a number of 
years back)


Randy
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Jim Cathey]

What are the bleeder screws actually made of?  Brass? Steel?  Do they 
so

often get stuck due to galvanic action between dissimilar metals or
simply rusting?


Brake fittings are hollow steel, thus somewhat weak, and they rust.
There's a lot of heat and water down there, not to mention road salt.
The calipers are iron, but I don't think there's much galvanic
action even though the metals aren't identical.  Penetrant and
heat are your friends.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Hans Neureiter]

And patiencently applied skill.
Remember, soft steel (hex rounds off) and hollow (shears at the weak
pont = end of threads).
If all fails, Easy-Out. No drilling! Tapered seat below.

 Brake fittings are hollow steel, thus somewhat weak, and they rust.
 There's a lot of heat and water down there, not to mention road salt.
 The calipers are iron, but I don't think there's much galvanic
 action even though the metals aren't identical.  Penetrant and
 heat are your friends.

 -- Jim



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-- 
Hans Neureiter, Katy, TX
'82 300SD
'01 VW New Beetle 1.9L TDI

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Allan Streib]

Hans Neureiter diese...@gmail.com writes:

 And patiencently applied skill.
 Remember, soft steel (hex rounds off) and hollow (shears at the weak
 pont = end of threads).
 If all fails, Easy-Out. No drilling! Tapered seat below.

And if you think you're in a fix when the bleeder shears off, just wait
until you have an EZ-Out snaps off.  Don't ask me how I know.  Luckily
I've never had an issue with the bleeders on a Benz.  Pretty much
everything else though.

Allan

-- 
1983 300D
1979 300SD

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose

[Gerry Archer]

Been using powdered graphite on threads for years.  While others
were installing helicoils in their stripped out Beetle heads, the plugs
in mine were coming out easily.  The antiseize of the 1050s-60s
didn't work very well.  Never had problems with bleeder screws;
probably because the cars lived in Florida.
Gerry

From: Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com

Nice story. Antiseize on the bleeder screw. Makes me nervous.

Makes me nervous NOT to have anti-seize on the bleeders.  They break 
off very easily.

As Jim said, you put it on  the threads, not on the sealing surface.



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose

[Jim Cathey]

The antiseize of the 1050s-60s didn't work very well.


Bear grease?  :-)  Heat heat was probably a killer, this application
doesn't have that, naturally.


Never had problems with bleeder screws;


They salt here, now.  Wanted all the help I could get.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Dieselhead]

As Elmer Fudd used to say:  Be vewy vewy careful  Coat the threads, 
but not the tip.  Actually, I think Elmer's quote is overdone.  Just 
be careful to only put it on the threads.


Well, I think you have convinced me! I tremble every time I crack 
open a bleeder that looks rusty. I will start applying the antiseize 
from now on.


Sent from my iPhone


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Dimitri Seretakis]

How about just the tip? Sorry, I couldn't help myself:)

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 4, 2011, at 11:38 AM, Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com wrote:

As Elmer Fudd used to say:  Be vewy vewy careful  Coat the threads, but not 
the tip.  Actually, I think Elmer's quote is overdone.  Just be careful to only 
put it on the threads.

Well, I think you have convinced me! I tremble every time I crack open a 
bleeder that looks rusty. I will start applying the antiseize from now on.

Sent from my iPhone

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Russ Williams]

If you do just the tip Your Fuzes WILL MELT :-D

On 12/4/2011 11:36 AM, Dimitri Seretakis wrote:

How about just the tip? Sorry, I couldn't help myself:)

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 4, 2011, at 11:38 AM, Dieselhead126die...@gmail.com  wrote:

As Elmer Fudd used to say:  Be vewy vewy careful  Coat the threads, but not 
the tip.  Actually, I think Elmer's quote is overdone.  Just be careful to only put it on 
the threads.

Well, I think you have convinced me! I tremble every time I crack open a 
bleeder that looks rusty. I will start applying the antiseize from now on.

Sent from my iPhone

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Dimitri Seretakis]

Tell me about it'

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 4, 2011, at 1:19 PM, Russ Williams rawil...@eatel.net wrote:

If you do just the tip Your Fuzes WILL MELT :-D

On 12/4/2011 11:36 AM, Dimitri Seretakis wrote:
How about just the tip? Sorry, I couldn't help myself:)

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 4, 2011, at 11:38 AM, Dieselhead126die...@gmail.com  wrote:

As Elmer Fudd used to say:  Be vewy vewy careful  Coat the threads, but not 
the tip.  Actually, I think Elmer's quote is overdone.  Just be careful to only 
put it on the threads.

Well, I think you have convinced me! I tremble every time I crack open a 
bleeder that looks rusty. I will start applying the antiseize from now on.

Sent from my iPhone

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Allan Streib]

What about using pipe-sealing teflon tape on the bleeder threads?  That
would not tend to migrate to anywhere else, would it?

Allan

Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com writes:

 As Elmer Fudd used to say:  Be vewy vewy careful  Coat the threads,
 but not the tip.  Actually, I think Elmer's quote is overdone.  Just
 be careful to only put it on the threads.


-- 
1983 300D
1979 300SD

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Dieselhead]

Many professionals I know won't use tape anywhere.  The little shreds 
go everywhere.  They cause problems in gas valves, hydraulics etc.




What about using pipe-sealing teflon tape on the bleeder threads?  That
would not tend to migrate to anywhere else, would it?

Allan

Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com writes:


 As Elmer Fudd used to say:  Be vewy vewy careful  Coat the threads,
 but not the tip.  Actually, I think Elmer's quote is overdone.  Just
 be careful to only put it on the threads.



--
1983 300D
1979 300SD

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Dimitri Seretakis]

I like that idea.

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 4, 2011, at 2:35 PM, Allan Streib str...@cs.indiana.edu wrote:

What about using pipe-sealing teflon tape on the bleeder threads?  That
would not tend to migrate to anywhere else, would it?

Allan

Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com writes:

As Elmer Fudd used to say:  Be vewy vewy careful  Coat the threads,
but not the tip.  Actually, I think Elmer's quote is overdone.  Just
be careful to only put it on the threads.


-- 
1983 300D
1979 300SD

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[G Mann]

Teflon tape should NOT be used in hydraulic systems. The seal effect relys
on the cone shape of the tip and the area it sets in.. NOT the threads.
More importantly, anti-seize compounds use materials that make a barrier
against the thread and the body doing a rust weld and becoming one solid
piece.

Teflon does not do that, and in fact is not a very tough material..  ie.
a teflon coated cooking pan must always use plastic food turners and such
to keep from scratching through the surface.  As soon as you thread the
bleeder fitting on to the bore, it does exactly that, and you will have
metal to metal contact that will rust in a salt / moisture environment.

Grant...
AZ... Where diesels roam free

On Sun, Dec 4, 2011 at 1:12 PM, Dimitri Seretakis dsereta...@yahoo.comwrote:

 I like that idea.

 Sent from my iPhone

 On Dec 4, 2011, at 2:35 PM, Allan Streib str...@cs.indiana.edu wrote:

 What about using pipe-sealing teflon tape on the bleeder threads?  That
 would not tend to migrate to anywhere else, would it?

 Allan

 Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com writes:

 As Elmer Fudd used to say:  Be vewy vewy careful  Coat the threads,
 but not the tip.  Actually, I think Elmer's quote is overdone.  Just
 be careful to only put it on the threads.


 --
 1983 300D
 1979 300SD

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Allan Streib]

What are the bleeder screws actually made of?  Brass? Steel?  Do they so
often get stuck due to galvanic action between dissimilar metals or
simply rusting?

G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com writes:

 Teflon tape should NOT be used in hydraulic systems. The seal effect relys
 on the cone shape of the tip and the area it sets in.. NOT the threads.
 More importantly, anti-seize compounds use materials that make a barrier
 against the thread and the body doing a rust weld and becoming one solid
 piece.

 Teflon does not do that, and in fact is not a very tough material..  ie.
 a teflon coated cooking pan must always use plastic food turners and such
 to keep from scratching through the surface.  As soon as you thread the
 bleeder fitting on to the bore, it does exactly that, and you will have
 metal to metal contact that will rust in a salt / moisture environment.

 Grant...
 AZ... Where diesels roam free


-- 
1983 300D
1979 300SD

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Dimitri Seretakis]

They are made of steel but being hollow except for the conical seating surface 
at the base, they don't tolerate a lot of torque. They simply shear. This has 
happened to be at least three times and is a major pita. The last time it 
happened was on my pagoda. I couldn't get a replacement caliper soon enough for 
a pagoda gathering I organized so I drilled it out. I damaged the caliper 
threads a bit but it all came out leaving the conical seating surface 
unscathed. While bleeding some brake fluid would leak past the damaged threads 
but once tightened it formed an airtight leak free seal. I really don't care to 
have to deal with this problem again! 

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 4, 2011, at 5:45 PM, Allan Streib str...@cs.indiana.edu wrote:

What are the bleeder screws actually made of?  Brass? Steel?  Do they so
often get stuck due to galvanic action between dissimilar metals or
simply rusting?

G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com writes:

Teflon tape should NOT be used in hydraulic systems. The seal effect relys
on the cone shape of the tip and the area it sets in.. NOT the threads.
More importantly, anti-seize compounds use materials that make a barrier
against the thread and the body doing a rust weld and becoming one solid
piece.

Teflon does not do that, and in fact is not a very tough material..  ie.
a teflon coated cooking pan must always use plastic food turners and such
to keep from scratching through the surface.  As soon as you thread the
bleeder fitting on to the bore, it does exactly that, and you will have
metal to metal contact that will rust in a salt / moisture environment.

Grant...
AZ... Where diesels roam free


-- 
1983 300D
1979 300SD

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[MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose

[Jim Cathey]

Rusty's brake parts for the Frankenheap came Thursday, now I guess I
have to get to work!

I jacked up the car, only the RR hose was wet.  It was cold outside,
so I decided to do only that side.  The reservoir wasn't as empty as
I'd thought, so I also decided to defer the reservoir grommets until
later.  I put the extra brake parts in the trunk.  I removed the RR
wheel and took the brake caliper off the car.  The easiest way to work
on the thing is to cut the hose, which I did.  (There was no way that
one was ever going to get used again!)  When you do this you can use a
box-end wrench instead of a flare on the hose ends.  The PB Blaster
had been working, both nuts actually broke loose from the hoses fairly
easily.  The nuts, however, were themselves pretty well rusted to the
hard lines.  I used the acetylene torch to heat the one on the caliper
to a red heat, enough to break it loose from the pipe.  The torch hose
didn't reach to the wheel, though, so I used the propane torch to heat
that one.  That also did the job.  I used wire brushes to clean things
off well, taking care not to get crud into the brake guts, and then
used anti-sieze compound on the nuts and the lines.  I also removed
the brake bleeder and cleaned it off, then used a bit of anti-sieze on
its threads, taking care not to get it down to the sealing surface.  I
then reassembled everything, making sure the new brake hose didn't
have any twist in it when it was in operating position.

Enlisting my son's help I then bled that brake.  Though I have a
variety of bleed-by-yourself tools the traditional two-man approach
works best.  I made sure the brake reservoir didn't run low!  We then
aired up the tires and took it for a drive, the brakes seemed like
they ought to.  Done for now!

While I was under the car I noticed that one of the exhaust donuts had
broken and fallen off, so I replaced it with another junkbox one.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose

[Dimitri Seretakis]

Nice story. Antiseize on the bleeder screw. Makes me nervous.

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 3, 2011, at 5:37 PM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote:

Rusty's brake parts for the Frankenheap came Thursday, now I guess I
have to get to work!

I jacked up the car, only the RR hose was wet.  It was cold outside,
so I decided to do only that side.  The reservoir wasn't as empty as
I'd thought, so I also decided to defer the reservoir grommets until
later.  I put the extra brake parts in the trunk.  I removed the RR
wheel and took the brake caliper off the car.  The easiest way to work
on the thing is to cut the hose, which I did.  (There was no way that
one was ever going to get used again!)  When you do this you can use a
box-end wrench instead of a flare on the hose ends.  The PB Blaster
had been working, both nuts actually broke loose from the hoses fairly
easily.  The nuts, however, were themselves pretty well rusted to the
hard lines.  I used the acetylene torch to heat the one on the caliper
to a red heat, enough to break it loose from the pipe.  The torch hose
didn't reach to the wheel, though, so I used the propane torch to heat
that one.  That also did the job.  I used wire brushes to clean things
off well, taking care not to get crud into the brake guts, and then
used anti-sieze compound on the nuts and the lines.  I also removed
the brake bleeder and cleaned it off, then used a bit of anti-sieze on
its threads, taking care not to get it down to the sealing surface.  I
then reassembled everything, making sure the new brake hose didn't
have any twist in it when it was in operating position.

Enlisting my son's help I then bled that brake.  Though I have a
variety of bleed-by-yourself tools the traditional two-man approach
works best.  I made sure the brake reservoir didn't run low!  We then
aired up the tires and took it for a drive, the brakes seemed like
they ought to.  Done for now!

While I was under the car I noticed that one of the exhaust donuts had
broken and fallen off, so I replaced it with another junkbox one.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose

[Curt Raymond]

Hallelujah! 

I've missed these posts, glad to see them return.

-Curt

Date: Sat, 3 Dec 2011 14:37:03 -0800
From: Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose
Message-ID: 52be52a2-1dff-11e1-9b66-000502d9a...@windwireless.net
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed

Rusty's brake parts for the Frankenheap came Thursday, now I guess I
have to get to work!

I jacked up the car, only the RR hose was wet.  It was cold outside,
so I decided to do only that side.  The reservoir wasn't as empty as
I'd thought, so I also decided to defer the reservoir grommets until
later.  I put the extra brake parts in the trunk.  I removed the RR
wheel and took the brake caliper off the car.  The easiest way to work
on the thing is to cut the hose, which I did.  (There was no way that
one was ever going to get used again!)  When you do this you can use a
box-end wrench instead of a flare on the hose ends.  The PB Blaster
had been working, both nuts actually broke loose from the hoses fairly
easily.  The nuts, however, were themselves pretty well rusted to the
hard lines.  I used the acetylene torch to heat the one on the caliper
to a red heat, enough to break it loose from the pipe.  The torch hose
didn't reach to the wheel, though, so I used the propane torch to heat
that one.  That also did the job.  I used wire brushes to clean things
off well, taking care not to get crud into the brake guts, and then
used anti-sieze compound on the nuts and the lines.  I also removed
the brake bleeder and cleaned it off, then used a bit of anti-sieze on
its threads, taking care not to get it down to the sealing surface.  I
then reassembled everything, making sure the new brake hose didn't
have any twist in it when it was in operating position.

Enlisting my son's help I then bled that brake.  Though I have a
variety of bleed-by-yourself tools the traditional two-man approach
works best.  I made sure the brake reservoir didn't run low!  We then
aired up the tires and took it for a drive, the brakes seemed like
they ought to.  Done for now!

While I was under the car I noticed that one of the exhaust donuts had
broken and fallen off, so I replaced it with another junkbox one.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose

[Dimitri Seretakis]

Agreed. That's probably why I enjoyed the story. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 3, 2011, at 5:50 PM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote:

Hallelujah! 

I've missed these posts, glad to see them return.

-Curt

Date: Sat, 3 Dec 2011 14:37:03 -0800
From: Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose
Message-ID: 52be52a2-1dff-11e1-9b66-000502d9a...@windwireless.net
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed

Rusty's brake parts for the Frankenheap came Thursday, now I guess I
have to get to work!

I jacked up the car, only the RR hose was wet.  It was cold outside,
so I decided to do only that side.  The reservoir wasn't as empty as
I'd thought, so I also decided to defer the reservoir grommets until
later.  I put the extra brake parts in the trunk.  I removed the RR
wheel and took the brake caliper off the car.  The easiest way to work
on the thing is to cut the hose, which I did.  (There was no way that
one was ever going to get used again!)  When you do this you can use a
box-end wrench instead of a flare on the hose ends.  The PB Blaster
had been working, both nuts actually broke loose from the hoses fairly
easily.  The nuts, however, were themselves pretty well rusted to the
hard lines.  I used the acetylene torch to heat the one on the caliper
to a red heat, enough to break it loose from the pipe.  The torch hose
didn't reach to the wheel, though, so I used the propane torch to heat
that one.  That also did the job.  I used wire brushes to clean things
off well, taking care not to get crud into the brake guts, and then
used anti-sieze compound on the nuts and the lines.  I also removed
the brake bleeder and cleaned it off, then used a bit of anti-sieze on
its threads, taking care not to get it down to the sealing surface.  I
then reassembled everything, making sure the new brake hose didn't
have any twist in it when it was in operating position.

Enlisting my son's help I then bled that brake.  Though I have a
variety of bleed-by-yourself tools the traditional two-man approach
works best.  I made sure the brake reservoir didn't run low!  We then
aired up the tires and took it for a drive, the brakes seemed like
they ought to.  Done for now!

While I was under the car I noticed that one of the exhaust donuts had
broken and fallen off, so I replaced it with another junkbox one.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose

[Dieselhead]

Nice story. Antiseize on the bleeder screw. Makes me nervous.



Makes me nervous NOT to have anti-seize on the bleeders.  They break 
off very easily.


As Jim said, you put it on  the threads, not on the sealing surface.

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose

[Dimitri Seretakis]

I agree about them breaking off. It has happened to me too many times but at 
the same time I wonder if some brake fluid doesn't reach at least some of the 
threads while bleeding. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 3, 2011, at 10:19 PM, Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com wrote:

Nice story. Antiseize on the bleeder screw. Makes me nervous.


Makes me nervous NOT to have anti-seize on the bleeders.  They break off very 
easily.

As Jim said, you put it on  the threads, not on the sealing surface.

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Dieselhead]

When bleeding, the fluid is outbound, so no prob.  If you are 
worrying about the minute contact of fluid with threads at the time 
the bleeder is closed, first I think it is inconsequential as the 
bleeder cuts off the fluid maybe 1/4 inside before the threads, so 
that minuscule potential contamination is likely isolated outside the 
working system.


The brake fluid picks up pieces of rubber and metal from the parts. 
There is much more contamination from water, metal and rubber than 
any potential contamination from the threads on the bleeder screw.


Ever look in the bottom of a 15-20 year old MB (or anything else) 
that has not been flushed and cleaned?  I have seen 1/8 of crud in 
the bottom of the reservoir.


I have had no failure of the brake systems I have applied anti-seize 
to.   I have never busted a (anti-seize treated) bleeder either.  I 
have only broke 1 bleeder, but I have changed some out because I 
didn't trust that they would not twist off if reused.  Of the 
bleeders I have put anti-sieze on, I have had no issues of breaking 
or distorting bleeders.  I do agree that it is not something you'd 
want to write into a manual, as a bunch of monkeys would schmear it 
on the end and in the hole of the caliper/cylinder.


(40+ years of working on trucks, tractors, motorcycles and what have 
you.)  Never-seez is your friend.
in 1-2 million miles, the only brake failures I have had is when the 
front brake cable on my motorsickle broke, and that was no big deal, 
because I kept a spare clutch cable and a clutch-brake adapticator I 
made out of a chunk or 1/8 pipe under the seat.


I agree about them breaking off. It has happened to me too many 
times but at the same time I wonder if some brake fluid doesn't 
reach at least some of the threads while bleeding.




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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap brake hose/ anti-seize on brake bleeders

[Dimitri Seretakis]

Well, I think you have convinced me! I tremble every time I crack open a 
bleeder that looks rusty. I will start applying the antiseize from now on. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 4, 2011, at 12:04 AM, Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com wrote:

When bleeding, the fluid is outbound, so no prob.  If you are worrying about 
the minute contact of fluid with threads at the time the bleeder is closed, 
first I think it is inconsequential as the bleeder cuts off the fluid maybe 
1/4 inside before the threads, so that minuscule potential contamination is 
likely isolated outside the working system.

The brake fluid picks up pieces of rubber and metal from the parts. There is 
much more contamination from water, metal and rubber than any potential 
contamination from the threads on the bleeder screw.

Ever look in the bottom of a 15-20 year old MB (or anything else) that has not 
been flushed and cleaned?  I have seen 1/8 of crud in the bottom of the 
reservoir.

I have had no failure of the brake systems I have applied anti-seize to.   I 
have never busted a (anti-seize treated) bleeder either.  I have only broke 1 
bleeder, but I have changed some out because I didn't trust that they would not 
twist off if reused.  Of the bleeders I have put anti-sieze on, I have had no 
issues of breaking or distorting bleeders.  I do agree that it is not something 
you'd want to write into a manual, as a bunch of monkeys would schmear it on 
the end and in the hole of the caliper/cylinder.

(40+ years of working on trucks, tractors, motorcycles and what have you.)  
Never-seez is your friend.
in 1-2 million miles, the only brake failures I have had is when the front 
brake cable on my motorsickle broke, and that was no big deal, because I kept a 
spare clutch cable and a clutch-brake adapticator I made out of a chunk or 1/8 
pipe under the seat.

I agree about them breaking off. It has happened to me too many times but at 
the same time I wonder if some brake fluid doesn't reach at least some of the 
threads while bleeding.


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[MBZ] Frankenheap 'car payment'

[Jim Cathey]

Welding day!  Yesterday I got back the $50 gas-less Hobart welder that
the neighbors had borrowed, so I whacked away a bit at the car's rust
problem.  I filled in one pinhole up by the driver's headlight, and
then chopped away at the hole in the side by the RR passenger's feet.
I removed the trim strip and cut away a bunch of the ratty rusted-out
rocker, the back section I hadn't addressed last time, and
wire-brushed what I could.  What a mess!  I removed the seat belt from
the anchor, and noted that the remaining metal was so loose back there
that in an accident it is doubtful that the belt would have held.  Not
good!  I cut out the rusty part, just above the 'waterline', and
started welding in new sheet metal strips.  Some four or five hours
later I'd finished closing up the inside wall, it is one of the
worse-looking welding jobs ever.  (I have a real problem with burning
through, then I circle the hole and fill it back in.  Often the hole
spreads quite a bit before I get it back under control.)  I
wire-brushed everything, in the process I managed to snag the loose
strings of the ruined side carpet and rip loose a big chunk of the
carpet that wound itself around the brush spindle.  Another mess!
Anyway, with the wall cleaned off I rattle-canned some primer on
there, inside and out, then some gray paint.  This phase should cure
the interior noise problem, but I have a lot left to do on the
outside.  I used anti-seize on the seat belt anchor when I put it
back.

When I jacked the car up I noticed that the RR rubber brake line is
weeping.  I need a new one, but the rust back there is bad enough that
I imagine that removing the old one will be a real treat.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap 'car payment'

[Walt Zarnoch]

Wow, quite a chore!

I'd say hit the rusty brake section with the good old PB or acetone/ATF
mixture twice a day for ~ 3 days running, then use some good 6 point tubing
wrenches.

They pay for themselves very quick if you don't have a set, and autozombie
or similar might have them on loan for a deposit.

I think HF has a set  as well.

Walt
On Apr 4, 2011 2:30 AM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote:
 Welding day! Yesterday I got back the $50 gas-less Hobart welder that
 the neighbors had borrowed, so I whacked away a bit at the car's rust
 problem. I filled in one pinhole up by the driver's headlight, and
 then chopped away at the hole in the side by the RR passenger's feet.
 I removed the trim strip and cut away a bunch of the ratty rusted-out
 rocker, the back section I hadn't addressed last time, and
 wire-brushed what I could. What a mess! I removed the seat belt from
 the anchor, and noted that the remaining metal was so loose back there
 that in an accident it is doubtful that the belt would have held. Not
 good! I cut out the rusty part, just above the 'waterline', and
 started welding in new sheet metal strips. Some four or five hours
 later I'd finished closing up the inside wall, it is one of the
 worse-looking welding jobs ever. (I have a real problem with burning
 through, then I circle the hole and fill it back in. Often the hole
 spreads quite a bit before I get it back under control.) I
 wire-brushed everything, in the process I managed to snag the loose
 strings of the ruined side carpet and rip loose a big chunk of the
 carpet that wound itself around the brush spindle. Another mess!
 Anyway, with the wall cleaned off I rattle-canned some primer on
 there, inside and out, then some gray paint. This phase should cure
 the interior noise problem, but I have a lot left to do on the
 outside. I used anti-seize on the seat belt anchor when I put it
 back.

 When I jacked the car up I noticed that the RR rubber brake line is
 weeping. I need a new one, but the rust back there is bad enough that
 I imagine that removing the old one will be a real treat.

 -- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap 'car payment'

[Rick Knoble]

Walt wrote:

 I'd say hit the rusty brake section with the good old PB or acetone/ATF
 mixture twice a day for ~ 3 days running, then use some good 6 point tubing
 wrenches.

Also, take some emory cloth or sand paper and sand the rust off of the brake 
line at the fitting. That will help the penetrant get to where it needs to be 
and may help the line from being seized to the fitting and twisting in two when 
you loosen it. 

Rick
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap 'car payment'

[Jim Cathey]

I'd say hit the rusty brake section with the good old PB or acetone/ATF
mixture twice a day for ~ 3 days running, then use some good 6 point 
tubing

wrenches.


Yeah, it's certainly the first step.  I have flare wrenches, both
crow's-foot and regular.  HF, but they work well enough.

My money's going to be on the red heat, though.  It's amazing
what that can do for rust when you don't care about what happens
to the rubber line.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap 'car payment'

[Walt Zarnoch]

Brake fluid is flamable...
I was going to say hit it with heat till  I remembered that.

Walt
On Apr 4, 2011 9:27 AM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote:
 I'd say hit the rusty brake section with the good old PB or acetone/ATF
 mixture twice a day for ~ 3 days running, then use some good 6 point
 tubing
 wrenches.

 Yeah, it's certainly the first step. I have flare wrenches, both
 crow's-foot and regular. HF, but they work well enough.

 My money's going to be on the red heat, though. It's amazing
 what that can do for rust when you don't care about what happens
 to the rubber line.

 -- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap 'car payment'

[Randy Bennell]

The one thing that I would suggest is that you cut the rubber line 
before heating the fittings. If you don't the pressure may well blow the 
line off. I expect you know or will figure out how I know that.


Randy

On 04/04/2011 8:38 AM, Walt Zarnoch wrote:

Brake fluid is flamable...
I was going to say hit it with heat till  I remembered that.

Walt
On Apr 4, 2011 9:27 AM, Jim Catheyj...@windwireless.net  wrote:

I'd say hit the rusty brake section with the good old PB or acetone/ATF
mixture twice a day for ~ 3 days running, then use some good 6 point
tubing
wrenches.

Yeah, it's certainly the first step. I have flare wrenches, both
crow's-foot and regular. HF, but they work well enough.

My money's going to be on the red heat, though. It's amazing
what that can do for rust when you don't care about what happens
to the rubber line.

-- Jim






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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap 'car payment'

[Mitch Haley]

Randy Bennell wrote:
The one thing that I would suggest is that you cut the rubber line 
before heating the fittings. If you don't the pressure may well blow the 
line off. I expect you know or will figure out how I know that.


That way you only need one line wrench, you can put a socket on the hose fitting 
after removing the rubber.


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[MBZ] Frankenheap, gotta stick it to it...

[Jim Cathey]

Time for a bit of TLC on the Frankenheap.  I aired the tires and
checked the oil, good.  I re-oiled the fan clutch bearing, just in
case.  The hood pad has been coming down, so I got out a rubber glove
and the big can of crappy environmentally-friendly contact cement that
I hate and slathered some around, then used a broom to hold it up
while it dried.  It never did want to stick well, so I went to the
brush pile and found a long hardwood stick, about 1/2 in diameter at
the small end, and wedged it behind the lip of the hood at one side.
I then eyeballed it at the other (fat) end and cut it at an angle that
would wedge into that side.  I then bowed the stick and tucked the
wedge in.  The stick bows up nicely, holding the pad up in spite of
glue failures, and seems very secure.  Some minor repositioning got it
out of the way of things like the windshield washer tank lid, which
protrudes upwards and is fragile plastic.  A couple of thin sticks
wedged crossways behind the big stick completed the retaining web.
That should hold until the pad completely disintegrates.

I used more penetrant on the one rusty door (LR) hinge, it seems to
have been getting a bit worse lately.  I would like to remove the
hinges and heat the bad one red-hot to free it up, but they're welded
to the door frame.  I could remove the door and tackle it that way,
but that still might not be pretty!  I removed the broken driver's
seatback adjustment knob cover (which probably got pounded by the
seatbelt adjustment buckle on a door slam) and used cyanoacrylate glue
to put it back together.  Good enough for one day's effort, I think.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap, gotta stick it to it...

[Allan Streib]

I'm disappointed, you didn't use Shoe Goo for anything

On Fri, 01 Apr 2011 06:26 -0800, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote:
 Time for a bit of TLC on the Frankenheap.  I aired the tires and
 checked the oil, good.  I re-oiled the fan clutch bearing, just in
 case.  The hood pad has been coming down, so I got out a rubber glove
 and the big can of crappy environmentally-friendly contact cement that
 I hate and slathered some around, then used a broom to hold it up
 while it dried.  It never did want to stick well, so I went to the
 brush pile and found a long hardwood stick, about 1/2 in diameter at
 the small end, and wedged it behind the lip of the hood at one side.
 I then eyeballed it at the other (fat) end and cut it at an angle that
 would wedge into that side.  I then bowed the stick and tucked the
 wedge in.  The stick bows up nicely, holding the pad up in spite of
 glue failures, and seems very secure.  Some minor repositioning got it
 out of the way of things like the windshield washer tank lid, which
 protrudes upwards and is fragile plastic.  A couple of thin sticks
 wedged crossways behind the big stick completed the retaining web.
 That should hold until the pad completely disintegrates.
 
 I used more penetrant on the one rusty door (LR) hinge, it seems to
 have been getting a bit worse lately.  I would like to remove the
 hinges and heat the bad one red-hot to free it up, but they're welded
 to the door frame.  I could remove the door and tackle it that way,
 but that still might not be pretty!  I removed the broken driver's
 seatback adjustment knob cover (which probably got pounded by the
 seatbelt adjustment buckle on a door slam) and used cyanoacrylate glue
 to put it back together.  Good enough for one day's effort, I think.
 
 -- Jim
 

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap, gotta stick it to it...

[Craig]

On Fri, 01 Apr 2011 10:29:01 -0400 Allan Streib str...@cs.indiana.edu
wrote:

 I'm disappointed, you didn't use Shoe Goo for anything

Well, yes, but the use of additional, free, non-factory parts (sticks)
makes up for it.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap, gotta stick it to it...

[Jim Cathey]

Well, yes, but the use of additional, free, non-factory parts (sticks)
makes up for it.


The glue wasn't particularly sticky, so I added some.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[MG]

Jim,

I found that the wire is less expensive at Lowe's then at Harbor 
Freight. If you have one near you it might be worth looking there.


The welding tips do tend to wear as you run wire through them so 
the .030 tip[ may by now be large enough for .035 or more. I 
don't know how often the pros change them but since they don't 
cost very much I change the tip every time I put a new roll of 
wire on (10 lb) it makes for better contact with the wire and 
supposedly better welding.


Manfred




Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2010 19:44:43 -0800
From: Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net


Of note is that the Hobart wire was much shinier and smoother 
than the

cheap Harbor Freight stuff, and seemed to work better.  It was a bit
too large for the job (the old stuff was 0.030), but surprisingly it
fit through the gun's 0.030 tip.  (I should get the correct tip,
which Big R carries.  I also will need some more 0.024 bare wire for
the Miller, I noticed it was getting low when I tried to borrow its
0.030 tip [which doesn't fit].)

-- Jim

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Jim Cathey]

I stopped by a muffler shop Friday and nabbed some cut-offs.  (2-3
inch pieces of new pipe.)  I also bought more flux-core welding wire
for the Hobart.  Ten pounds this time, $55 for the 0.035.  I'd lost a
rubber exhaust hanger with the muffler Thursday.  As I was at the
U-Pull I got a couple more, along with a rather nice trunk mat and
carpet from a 114 gasser.

Saturday it rained heavily all day, so I had to wait 'til today to fix
the muffler.  I put the rear of the car up on ramps and selected the
best piece from my scrap exhaust collection to collar the break.  I
glued the dislodged rubber bumper (114 987 00 39, aka 479076-28) back to
the frame, as the rubber 'tit' had torn half off.  (Shoe Goo, of 
course.)

I had to notch the new collar in order to get the best fit to the
ratty tailpipe, and its prior welds.  I didn't need to remove the
exhaust system, lowering the back was sufficient.  The new collar was
somewhat larger than the exhaust pipe, so I welded a strip onto the
pipe remains so that I could then weld the collar to that strip.  I
welded the new collar onto the muffler, then welded the collar to the
exhaust pipe.  I had to grind and re-weld a number of times in spots
to cure exhaust leaks.  I found another hole in the exhaust pipe and
had to weld a patch over that.  That took nearly as long to do as the
muffler, because it was much less accessible.  The whole job was
something like three and a half hours.  (The off-the-car part was
_so_ easy, but underneath the car, not so much.)

The muffler ended up a bit cocked so that the rubber hangers and
bumpers don't fit as well as they did.  Oops.  I broke a rubber
hanger, but I got two Friday so I was still OK.

Of note is that the Hobart wire was much shinier and smoother than the
cheap Harbor Freight stuff, and seemed to work better.  It was a bit
too large for the job (the old stuff was 0.030), but surprisingly it
fit through the gun's 0.030 tip.  (I should get the correct tip,
which Big R carries.  I also will need some more 0.024 bare wire for
the Miller, I noticed it was getting low when I tried to borrow its
0.030 tip [which doesn't fit].)

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Dimitri Seretakis]

That car really is a frankenheap with all that patchwork!  Do you have any 
recent photos of this car? I'm sure Ive seen it before but that was years ago.  
I need to get motivated to get my 220D back on the road. I started with an 
extensive trunk floor and quarter panel rust repair project 5 years ago but 
never finished. It doesn't help that I now have a 123 240D to replace the 115 
as my daily driver.  I really miss driving the 220D.  

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 17, 2010, at 10:44 PM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote:

I stopped by a muffler shop Friday and nabbed some cut-offs.  (2-3
inch pieces of new pipe.)  I also bought more flux-core welding wire
for the Hobart.  Ten pounds this time, $55 for the 0.035.  I'd lost a
rubber exhaust hanger with the muffler Thursday.  As I was at the
U-Pull I got a couple more, along with a rather nice trunk mat and
carpet from a 114 gasser.

Saturday it rained heavily all day, so I had to wait 'til today to fix
the muffler.  I put the rear of the car up on ramps and selected the
best piece from my scrap exhaust collection to collar the break.  I
glued the dislodged rubber bumper (114 987 00 39, aka 479076-28) back to
the frame, as the rubber 'tit' had torn half off.  (Shoe Goo, of course.)
I had to notch the new collar in order to get the best fit to the
ratty tailpipe, and its prior welds.  I didn't need to remove the
exhaust system, lowering the back was sufficient.  The new collar was
somewhat larger than the exhaust pipe, so I welded a strip onto the
pipe remains so that I could then weld the collar to that strip.  I
welded the new collar onto the muffler, then welded the collar to the
exhaust pipe.  I had to grind and re-weld a number of times in spots
to cure exhaust leaks.  I found another hole in the exhaust pipe and
had to weld a patch over that.  That took nearly as long to do as the
muffler, because it was much less accessible.  The whole job was
something like three and a half hours.  (The off-the-car part was
_so_ easy, but underneath the car, not so much.)

The muffler ended up a bit cocked so that the rubber hangers and
bumpers don't fit as well as they did.  Oops.  I broke a rubber
hanger, but I got two Friday so I was still OK.

Of note is that the Hobart wire was much shinier and smoother than the
cheap Harbor Freight stuff, and seemed to work better.  It was a bit
too large for the job (the old stuff was 0.030), but surprisingly it
fit through the gun's 0.030 tip.  (I should get the correct tip,
which Big R carries.  I also will need some more 0.024 bare wire for
the Miller, I noticed it was getting low when I tried to borrow its
0.030 tip [which doesn't fit].)

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Dimitri Seretakis]

Well now that the entire trunk floor is out I have a nice view of the 
differential and rear axle shafts.  The right side boot is torn and I'm sure 
that the sandblasting that I did way back when didn't help matters since sand 
probably found it's way into the torn boot.  I figure it needs a new shaft.  
This job should be made much easier now that I can access the axleshaft from 
top and bottom! But is this job easy? What is involved? I read the BBB but it 
isn't that straightforward.

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 17, 2010, at 11:26 PM, Dimitri Seretakis dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote:

That car really is a frankenheap with all that patchwork!  Do you have any 
recent photos of this car? I'm sure Ive seen it before but that was years ago.  
I need to get motivated to get my 220D back on the road. I started with an 
extensive trunk floor and quarter panel rust repair project 5 years ago but 
never finished. It doesn't help that I now have a 123 240D to replace the 115 
as my daily driver.  I really miss driving the 220D.  

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 17, 2010, at 10:44 PM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote:

I stopped by a muffler shop Friday and nabbed some cut-offs.  (2-3
inch pieces of new pipe.)  I also bought more flux-core welding wire
for the Hobart.  Ten pounds this time, $55 for the 0.035.  I'd lost a
rubber exhaust hanger with the muffler Thursday.  As I was at the
U-Pull I got a couple more, along with a rather nice trunk mat and
carpet from a 114 gasser.

Saturday it rained heavily all day, so I had to wait 'til today to fix
the muffler.  I put the rear of the car up on ramps and selected the
best piece from my scrap exhaust collection to collar the break.  I
glued the dislodged rubber bumper (114 987 00 39, aka 479076-28) back to
the frame, as the rubber 'tit' had torn half off.  (Shoe Goo, of course.)
I had to notch the new collar in order to get the best fit to the
ratty tailpipe, and its prior welds.  I didn't need to remove the
exhaust system, lowering the back was sufficient.  The new collar was
somewhat larger than the exhaust pipe, so I welded a strip onto the
pipe remains so that I could then weld the collar to that strip.  I
welded the new collar onto the muffler, then welded the collar to the
exhaust pipe.  I had to grind and re-weld a number of times in spots
to cure exhaust leaks.  I found another hole in the exhaust pipe and
had to weld a patch over that.  That took nearly as long to do as the
muffler, because it was much less accessible.  The whole job was
something like three and a half hours.  (The off-the-car part was
_so_ easy, but underneath the car, not so much.)

The muffler ended up a bit cocked so that the rubber hangers and
bumpers don't fit as well as they did.  Oops.  I broke a rubber
hanger, but I got two Friday so I was still OK.

Of note is that the Hobart wire was much shinier and smoother than the
cheap Harbor Freight stuff, and seemed to work better.  It was a bit
too large for the job (the old stuff was 0.030), but surprisingly it
fit through the gun's 0.030 tip.  (I should get the correct tip,
which Big R carries.  I also will need some more 0.024 bare wire for
the Miller, I noticed it was getting low when I tried to borrow its
0.030 tip [which doesn't fit].)

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Jim Cathey]

Do you have any recent photos of this car?


No.  Just the one photo on the website, but it's starting to
look a bit tattier than that, the salt they now use around here
is really taking its toll.

This job should be made much easier now that I can access the 
axleshaft from top and bottom! But is this job easy? What is involved?


Fairly straightforward.  Jack up car, remove diff cover,
use small vise grips or a strong pick to pull out retaining
clip.  It's all in the manual instructions.

-- Jim



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[MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Jim Cathey]

Well, that didn't work out so well.  The muffler fell off
the car today!  Sheared right off next to where I did all
the welding.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Kevin Kraly]

I didn't know that they used salt on the roads in eastern WA.  Hopefully, 
you can fix it easily.


Kevin in Hillsboro, OR, Mercedes-less but not Diesel-less 



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Jim Cathey]

I didn't know that they used salt on the roads in eastern WA.


Yep, the last 10 years or so.  I'm livid whenever I think about it.
Supposedly the EPA drove them to it, our air was so 'polluted'
due to particulate count that they stopped sanding the roads
in the winter and switched to salt instead.  Yeah, that's a winner.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Redghost]

Time for a PnP replacement.  Bring your sawz-all

clay

On Jan 15, 2010, at 12:13 AM, Jim Cathey wrote:


Well, that didn't work out so well.  The muffler fell off
the car today!  Sheared right off next to where I did all
the welding.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Kevin Kraly]

What a bummer.  Good thing there are lots of scrap microwaves to use to keep 
filling in the holes.


Kevin in Hillsboro, OR, where it's just wet today 



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[R A Bennell]

Yeah BUT pretty soon the car will weigh so much that a 240 diesel engine will 
not be able to get it moving.

Randy

-Original Message-
From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com
[mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com]on Behalf Of Kevin Kraly
Sent: Friday, January 15, 2010 3:11 PM
To: Mercedes Discussion List
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery


What a bummer.  Good thing there are lots of scrap microwaves to use to keep 
filling in the holes.

Kevin in Hillsboro, OR, where it's just wet today 


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Jim Cathey]

What a bummer.  Good thing there are lots of scrap microwaves to use 
to keep

filling in the holes.


I use cut-off scraps from the muffler shop for this kind of thing.
I got some more today, and more flux-core wire.

Yeah BUT pretty soon the car will weigh so much that a 240 diesel 
engine will not be able to get it moving.


Then I've got some room for improvement if I ever need it.
It has a 200 diesel in it now!

-- Jim



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[MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Jim Cathey]

The heap's been getting kind of noisy lately, so yesterday
I jacked it up and dropped the exhaust system.  Full of holes!
The top of the pipe where it goes into the muffler was half
gone.  I used the $50 Hobart wire-feed welder to stitch some
scraps of exhaust pipe metal (new, from cutoffs) over the worst
of the holes, and put it back.  That took four hours.  The smoke
wrench was required to heat the retaining nuts red-hot so that
they could be removed intact.  Not all holes were addressed,
but the big ones were and I was sick of it by then.  That damned
salt!  I really need a new exhaust system, but those aren't cheap
[but I am] and where's the fun in that?

The exhaust was a single piece that couldn't be removed
from the car unless it was perhaps very high in the air.
Aren't most of these two pieces, normally?

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Dimitri Seretakis]

I have successfully welded up some cracks in my 220D but then drove over a 
raised(because the asphalt was shaved for repaving) manhole cover which ripped 
half the exhaust off the car.  I then replaced the whole thing up to the front 
pipe.  I did however enjoy driving it down Bostons Newbury street without an 
exhaust.  The oudoor cafes and restaurants weren't amused.

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 10, 2010, at 10:25 AM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote:

The heap's been getting kind of noisy lately, so yesterday
I jacked it up and dropped the exhaust system.  Full of holes!
The top of the pipe where it goes into the muffler was half
gone.  I used the $50 Hobart wire-feed welder to stitch some
scraps of exhaust pipe metal (new, from cutoffs) over the worst
of the holes, and put it back.  That took four hours.  The smoke
wrench was required to heat the retaining nuts red-hot so that
they could be removed intact.  Not all holes were addressed,
but the big ones were and I was sick of it by then.  That damned
salt!  I really need a new exhaust system, but those aren't cheap
[but I am] and where's the fun in that?

The exhaust was a single piece that couldn't be removed
from the car unless it was perhaps very high in the air.
Aren't most of these two pieces, normally?

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[Craig McCluskey]

On Sun, 10 Jan 2010 07:25:17 -0800 Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net
wrote:

 The exhaust was a single piece that couldn't be removed
 from the car unless it was perhaps very high in the air.
 Aren't most of these two pieces, normally?

The ones I have worked on have been one piece from the downpipe back. The
downpipe connects to the manifold near the engine.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap weldery

[OK Don]

Since you have a welder, make a new one from tubing from NAPA -- I did that
to one of the 115s - a long time ago.

On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 6:24 PM, Craig McCluskey diese...@pisquared.netwrote:

 On Sun, 10 Jan 2010 07:25:17 -0800 Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net
 wrote:

  The exhaust was a single piece that couldn't be removed
  from the car unless it was perhaps very high in the air.
  Aren't most of these two pieces, normally?

 The ones I have worked on have been one piece from the downpipe back. The
 downpipe connects to the manifold near the engine.


 Craig

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-- 
OK Don
Panic! (the national past time).
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[MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Archer]

Father started teaching me wood and metal work at age 5.  First skill taught 
was nail driving.  Nailed his wooden tool chest shut using about fifty nails 
while he was out of town, but wasn't punished.  He just said don't do it 
again.  At age 7 or 8 built a neat pushmobile that was popular with the 
neighborhood girls because they could drive it without hiking up their 
skirts.  Since the girls were wearing us pushers out pushing them up and 
down the sidewalk, I took
it apart and used the wheels/axles to build a racer with a high hood that 
the girls couldn't straddle with their skirts on, and girls didn't wear long 
pants or shorts in those days.  The racer was popular until another kid and 
I decided to see how fast it would go down a long steep hill.  We had 
forgotten about a ditch at the bottom of the hill, so we both wound up on 
top of the hood with both axles torn off the racer.  We never repaired it.
Wood and metal work were valuable skills during the 1930s depression since 
there was very little money to buy toys.  Instead, kids would build scooters 
out of a discarded roller skate taken apart and attached to a frame made of 
discarded pieces of wood; sleds made of scrap wood with waxed runners; etc.


When sister loaned me her 1935 Chevrolet during WW-2 because she couldn't 
buy tires for it, my mechanical
education began.  Built a motorscooter out of angle iron and a gasoline 
motor out of a washing machine.  It was slow, but still better than walking. 
Bike riders could blow it off the road when they went by. When BIL, an army 
mechanic, came home from Germany after WW-2 with his tech manuals on motor 
repair, we did a valve job on the Chevy before the whole clan moved to 
Florida from Indiana and I was given the Chevy permanently.  The car was an 
ugly dog, but the motor was indestructible.
Further auto repair, Mercedes included, was pretty much self taught with 
help from friendly local mechanics who provided parts.  The early training 
in handling and using tools was invaluable.

Gerry.

From: Max Dillon
No excuse LT, I still haven't taught my dad to change oil! I had to learn 
fast, growing up in a country household that normally had more cars than 
drivers but that was to improve the odds of finding a running car when you 
needed one... One of only two new cars that my father has ever bought was a 
Gremlin; that car cured him of buying new cars for 20 years, and then he 
bought a Nissan pick-up, a FAR better vehicle all though soul-less. His 
typical pattern was to spend a few hundreds of dollars for a 'new car', 
drive it until the repair costs would exceed a replacement cost, then start 
over. Our local junkyard had a row devoted to my family, started with a '47 
Hudson, 20-odd years later I added my college ride, a '67 Plymouth VIP 
(coupe with 383 Commando V8 that drank almost as much oil as gas).



From: Wonko the Sane don.b...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

One reason I am so mechanically retarded compared to some of you is that 
I

taught my father how to change spark plugs when I was in college.


Jim,

Congratulations on your son's welding, watchout or he'll surpass your skill 
soon! A very inspirational and entertaining blog on the Frankenheap, easily 
soaked up a few hours of dead time I had, and I haven't reached the most 
current post yet.


Ciao ciao,
/s/
Max Dillon
'87 300TD 313k miles
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Craig McCluskey]

On Sat, 14 Feb 2009 18:30:54 -0800 Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net
wrote:

  I'm going to have to come up with another heat gun or hair drier. 
 But  in the meantime I'll just continue to use the space heater inside
 the  cabin.
 
  It will be warm inside, but will it start. BTW, please refresh my 
  memory
 
 The battery charger and block heater are still operative.
 This is just the window-clearing part.

Oh. Here I thought it was something that helped start the car. The space
heater in the cabin sounds like a good solution to me.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Luther]

Don, that's no excuse.  My dad only changed the oil and changed air 
filters on cars, and that stopped when I was in the 3rd grade. All I've 
learned in MB repair has been from this list and by following MB repair 
manuals.  If you can take apart aircraft electronics and get them back 
together the same way, you have the skills needed to do repairs on your 
MB[s].  Follow my drift?


Luther

Wonko the Sane wrote:

One reason I am so mechanically retarded compared to some of you is that I
taught my father how to change spark plugs when I was in college.

  

--
Luther   KB5QHUAlma, Ark
'87 300SDL (281,xxx mi)
'85 Ford F250 6.9 diesel (x59,xxx mi) BioBeast
'82 300CD (183 kmi)
'82 300D  (74 kmi) getting donor engine-sold
'85 300D (280,176) parts car sans engine The Accordion


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Mitch Haley]

Wonko the Sane wrote:

We had  two bachelor pilots at CGAS Cape Cod who shared a house. They
decided they would build a home-built airplane in the garage. They did. The
day it came time to pull it out and drag it (somehow) to the local airfield
so the FAA guys could check it out, and they discovered that it couldn't
leave the garage due to wing span.


They couldn't rotate it a bit on dollies and slip one wing tip out the door at a 
time?


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Mitch Haley]

Jim Cathey wrote:


I figured Jill's been having him help in the kitchen enough
that I ought to let him play with some of _my_ toys!


Good point. I could fry an egg when I was 5 or 6. Hardest part was getting it 
open without making a mess. I could turn a wrench (box end were easier than open 
end, which required some coordination to keep the wrench from slipping off) when 
I was 7.


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Rich Thomas]

Great job, and it did involve microwave oven sheet metal.  Did I miss 
the ShoeGoo inthe writeup?


--R

Jim Cathey wrote:

Some may recall that the cheap Harbor Freight heat gun I was using
as part of the Frankenheap's preheater seized up and burned out,
and I've been mulling over how to fix this.

A few days ago I grabbed a three-wire computer cooling fan from the
discard pile at work, it's rated 12 V at 250 mA.  (Of the three such
fans there today, two were siezed up.)

Yesterday I played with the cooling fan on the bench and I found that
on the power supply the Black wire was negative and the Yellow
positive.  (Leaving White as the presumed tachometer wire.)  The fan
turned nicely and was very quiet, but only moves a modest amount of
air.  Enough for the preheater?  We'll see.

I got out the heating element and checked its motor taps.  I found
two (of the four) terminals that had 14 VAC on them, so I dug out
a full-wave bridge rectifier that I'd used for one of the prior
preheater version attempts, and hooked it all up on the bench.
Nothing but buzzing.  So I got out a small filter capacitor and wired
it in too.  That did it.  The fan blows air, but not a whole lot.  I
suppose I should try assembling the mess into something that'll work,
but I was out of time.  (This is turning into a real pain in the ass.)

Today I cut out a cardboard template for the air funnel to mate the
box fan to the heating element and got it shaped.  I then traced it
out on a piece of microwave oven sheet metal, and cut and welded that
into shape.  (That took hours, in fact.)  As a side-job I got Daniel
to weld!  I gave him a chunk of metal and the helmet, and he tried
writing his initials on it with the Hobart.  It sort of worked.  After
practicing a bit he used a clean piece of metal so that he could take
it to school or something like that.  It didn't really work out so
good, but I'm very proud of him.  He's calling it art now.  (This
[spot] is a bird...)

Myself, I'm not so proud of.  Once I got the sheet metal banged into
shape I wired up the heating element and the fan, and got it all put
together.  By early afternoon I was ready to test.  Plugged in the
thing fired up and started blowing out hot air, so I jacked it into
the car.  After a few minutes, the new preheater caught on fire!  (Not
enough airflow.)  Disgusted, I threw the abortion into a snow bank
to put it out.  Some time later I'll salvage what I can from it.

I'm going to have to come up with another heat gun or hair drier.  But
in the meantime I'll just continue to use the space heater inside the
cabin.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Max Dillon]

Catching up on digest here, beg forgive etc. etc.

No excuse LT, I still haven't taught my dad to change oil!  I had to learn 
fast, growing up in a country household that normally had more cars than 
drivers but that was to improve the odds of finding a running car when you 
needed one...   One of only two new cars that my father has ever bought was a 
Gremlin; that car cured him of buying new cars for 20 years, and then he bought 
a Nissan pick-up, a FAR better vehicle all though soul-less.  His typical 
pattern was to spend a few hundreds of dollars for a 'new car', drive it until 
the repair costs would exceed a replacement cost, then start over.  Our local 
junkyard had a row devoted to my family, started with a '47 Hudson, 20-odd 
years later I added my college ride, a '67 Plymouth VIP (coupe with 383 
Commando V8 that drank almost as much oil as gas).

From: Wonko the Sane don.b...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

One reason I am so mechanically retarded compared to some of you is that I
taught my father how to change spark plugs when I was in college.

Jim,

Congratulations on your son's welding, watchout or he'll surpass your skill 
soon!  A very inspirational and entertaining blog on the Frankenheap, easily 
soaked up a few hours of dead time I had, and I haven't reached the most 
current post yet.

Ciao ciao,
/s/
Max Dillon
'87 300TD 313k miles
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[brian . toscano]

I think thats awesome.  I wish my Dad taught me more about cars.  But I did get 
a good schooling on electrical work.

Regards,
Brian
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-Original Message-
From: Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net

Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 18:31:25 
To: Mercedes Discussion Listmercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage


So nobody noticed that my 7-year-old was welding today?

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Jim Cathey]

Great job, and it did involve microwave oven sheet metal.  Did I miss 
the ShoeGoo inthe writeup?


None this time.  But I did use Duct Tape, does that count?

-- Jim



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[MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Jim Cathey]

Some may recall that the cheap Harbor Freight heat gun I was using
as part of the Frankenheap's preheater seized up and burned out,
and I've been mulling over how to fix this.

A few days ago I grabbed a three-wire computer cooling fan from the
discard pile at work, it's rated 12 V at 250 mA.  (Of the three such
fans there today, two were siezed up.)

Yesterday I played with the cooling fan on the bench and I found that
on the power supply the Black wire was negative and the Yellow
positive.  (Leaving White as the presumed tachometer wire.)  The fan
turned nicely and was very quiet, but only moves a modest amount of
air.  Enough for the preheater?  We'll see.

I got out the heating element and checked its motor taps.  I found
two (of the four) terminals that had 14 VAC on them, so I dug out
a full-wave bridge rectifier that I'd used for one of the prior
preheater version attempts, and hooked it all up on the bench.
Nothing but buzzing.  So I got out a small filter capacitor and wired
it in too.  That did it.  The fan blows air, but not a whole lot.  I
suppose I should try assembling the mess into something that'll work,
but I was out of time.  (This is turning into a real pain in the ass.)

Today I cut out a cardboard template for the air funnel to mate the
box fan to the heating element and got it shaped.  I then traced it
out on a piece of microwave oven sheet metal, and cut and welded that
into shape.  (That took hours, in fact.)  As a side-job I got Daniel
to weld!  I gave him a chunk of metal and the helmet, and he tried
writing his initials on it with the Hobart.  It sort of worked.  After
practicing a bit he used a clean piece of metal so that he could take
it to school or something like that.  It didn't really work out so
good, but I'm very proud of him.  He's calling it art now.  (This
[spot] is a bird...)

Myself, I'm not so proud of.  Once I got the sheet metal banged into
shape I wired up the heating element and the fan, and got it all put
together.  By early afternoon I was ready to test.  Plugged in the
thing fired up and started blowing out hot air, so I jacked it into
the car.  After a few minutes, the new preheater caught on fire!  (Not
enough airflow.)  Disgusted, I threw the abortion into a snow bank
to put it out.  Some time later I'll salvage what I can from it.

I'm going to have to come up with another heat gun or hair drier.  But
in the meantime I'll just continue to use the space heater inside the
cabin.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Craig McCluskey]

On Sat, 14 Feb 2009 16:42:51 -0800 Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net
wrote:

 Myself, I'm not so proud of.  Once I got the sheet metal banged into
 shape I wired up the heating element and the fan, and got it all put
 together.  By early afternoon I was ready to test.  Plugged in the
 thing fired up and started blowing out hot air, so I jacked it into
 the car.  After a few minutes, the new preheater caught on fire!  (Not
 enough airflow.)  Disgusted, I threw the abortion into a snow bank
 to put it out.  Some time later I'll salvage what I can from it.

You may not take this as solace, Jim, but those of us out here who are
trying to be even half as productive as you are relieved to see you're
human, too. We're just embarrassed to broadcast our failures to the list,
since they're a greater fraction of our efforts. Thank you for your story
telling.


 I'm going to have to come up with another heat gun or hair drier.  But
 in the meantime I'll just continue to use the space heater inside the
 cabin.

It will be warm inside, but will it start. BTW, please refresh my memory
on where the heated air goes in the Frankenheap. Is it a W123 or a W115?


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Wonko the Sane]

In your spare time, would you please come up with plans for an electric
W-123?

On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 6:42 PM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote:

 Some may recall that the cheap Harbor Freight heat gun I was using
 as part of the Frankenheap's preheater seized up and burned out,
 and I've been mulling over how to fix this.

 A few days ago I grabbed a three-wire computer cooling fan from the
 discard pile at work, it's rated 12 V at 250 mA.  (Of the three such
 fans there today, two were siezed up.)

 Yesterday I played with the cooling fan on the bench and I found that
 on the power supply the Black wire was negative and the Yellow
 positive.  (Leaving White as the presumed tachometer wire.)  The fan
 turned nicely and was very quiet, but only moves a modest amount of
 air.  Enough for the preheater?  We'll see.

 I got out the heating element and checked its motor taps.  I found
 two (of the four) terminals that had 14 VAC on them, so I dug out
 a full-wave bridge rectifier that I'd used for one of the prior
 preheater version attempts, and hooked it all up on the bench.
 Nothing but buzzing.  So I got out a small filter capacitor and wired
 it in too.  That did it.  The fan blows air, but not a whole lot.  I
 suppose I should try assembling the mess into something that'll work,
 but I was out of time.  (This is turning into a real pain in the ass.)

 Today I cut out a cardboard template for the air funnel to mate the
 box fan to the heating element and got it shaped.  I then traced it
 out on a piece of microwave oven sheet metal, and cut and welded that
 into shape.  (That took hours, in fact.)  As a side-job I got Daniel
 to weld!  I gave him a chunk of metal and the helmet, and he tried
 writing his initials on it with the Hobart.  It sort of worked.  After
 practicing a bit he used a clean piece of metal so that he could take
 it to school or something like that.  It didn't really work out so
 good, but I'm very proud of him.  He's calling it art now.  (This
 [spot] is a bird...)

 Myself, I'm not so proud of.  Once I got the sheet metal banged into
 shape I wired up the heating element and the fan, and got it all put
 together.  By early afternoon I was ready to test.  Plugged in the
 thing fired up and started blowing out hot air, so I jacked it into
 the car.  After a few minutes, the new preheater caught on fire!  (Not
 enough airflow.)  Disgusted, I threw the abortion into a snow bank
 to put it out.  Some time later I'll salvage what I can from it.

 I'm going to have to come up with another heat gun or hair drier.  But
 in the meantime I'll just continue to use the space heater inside the
 cabin.

 -- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Wilton Strickland]

I wanta do an electric Krmann Ghia.

Wilton

- Original Message -
From: Wonko the Sane don.b...@gmail.com
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Saturday, February 14, 2009 8:07 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage


 In your spare time, would you please come up with plans for an electric
 W-123?

 On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 6:42 PM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote:

  Some may recall that the cheap Harbor Freight heat gun I was using
  as part of the Frankenheap's preheater seized up and burned out,
  and I've been mulling over how to fix this.
 
  A few days ago I grabbed a three-wire computer cooling fan from the
  discard pile at work, it's rated 12 V at 250 mA.  (Of the three such
  fans there today, two were siezed up.)
 
  Yesterday I played with the cooling fan on the bench and I found that
  on the power supply the Black wire was negative and the Yellow
  positive.  (Leaving White as the presumed tachometer wire.)  The fan
  turned nicely and was very quiet, but only moves a modest amount of
  air.  Enough for the preheater?  We'll see.
 
  I got out the heating element and checked its motor taps.  I found
  two (of the four) terminals that had 14 VAC on them, so I dug out
  a full-wave bridge rectifier that I'd used for one of the prior
  preheater version attempts, and hooked it all up on the bench.
  Nothing but buzzing.  So I got out a small filter capacitor and wired
  it in too.  That did it.  The fan blows air, but not a whole lot.  I
  suppose I should try assembling the mess into something that'll work,
  but I was out of time.  (This is turning into a real pain in the ass.)
 
  Today I cut out a cardboard template for the air funnel to mate the
  box fan to the heating element and got it shaped.  I then traced it
  out on a piece of microwave oven sheet metal, and cut and welded that
  into shape.  (That took hours, in fact.)  As a side-job I got Daniel
  to weld!  I gave him a chunk of metal and the helmet, and he tried
  writing his initials on it with the Hobart.  It sort of worked.  After
  practicing a bit he used a clean piece of metal so that he could take
  it to school or something like that.  It didn't really work out so
  good, but I'm very proud of him.  He's calling it art now.  (This
  [spot] is a bird...)
 
  Myself, I'm not so proud of.  Once I got the sheet metal banged into
  shape I wired up the heating element and the fan, and got it all put
  together.  By early afternoon I was ready to test.  Plugged in the
  thing fired up and started blowing out hot air, so I jacked it into
  the car.  After a few minutes, the new preheater caught on fire!  (Not
  enough airflow.)  Disgusted, I threw the abortion into a snow bank
  to put it out.  Some time later I'll salvage what I can from it.
 
  I'm going to have to come up with another heat gun or hair drier.  But
  in the meantime I'll just continue to use the space heater inside the
  cabin.
 
  -- Jim
 
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[Wonko the Sane]

If it is a drop-top, I am right there with you. I am getting to be ... uh,
... non-limber these days to crawl into a Ghia hartop.

On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 7:46 PM, Wilton Strickland wilt...@nc.rr.comwrote:

 I wanta do an electric Krmann Ghia.

 Wilton


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Re: [MBZ] Frankenheap failures, and rites of passage

[OK Don]

I was thinking of an electric Triumph GT-6+

On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 7:53 PM, Wonko the Sane don.b...@gmail.com wrote:

 If it is a drop-top, I am right there with you. I am getting to be ... uh,
 ... non-limber these days to crawl into a Ghia hartop.

 On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 7:46 PM, Wilton Strickland wilt...@nc.rr.com
 wrote:

  I wanta do an electric Krmann Ghia.
 
  Wilton


-- 
OK Don
W124 Diesels
Ubuntu 8.10
KD5NRO
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