Re: [openhealth] FISL 10
The website is (mostly) not in English! I found Tim's item after some effort... Timothy W. Cook Title: Healthcare Information Models ApplicationsHealthcare information is full of context. The current design approach to healthcare information systems (HIS) doesn\'t provide a facility to transfer that context when the data is exchanged with other systems. This lecture will provide the attendees with an alternative information system design approach and an introduction to practical application of the information model. The adoption of this language and platform independent model will lead to future proof, semantically inter-operable systems. --- On Fri, 6/12/09, Tim Cook timothywayne.c...@gmail.com wrote: From: Tim Cook timothywayne.c...@gmail.com Subject: [openhealth] FISL 10 To: openhealth openhealth@yahoogroups.com Date: Friday, June 12, 2009, 1:32 PM Hi All, One of my personal goals for 2009 has been to reach out to FOSS groups outside of the choir here. Though you're not a bad choir. ;-) To talk about the advantages of FOSS in health care and the opportunities and struggles that exist. In that vein I wanted to let you all know about: The Forum for International Software Livre. http://fisl. softwarelivre. org/10/www/ As you can see this years event (the 10th annual) is to be held 24-27 June, 2009. Annually it draws more than 7,000 attendees with luminary speakers like Richard Stallman and Jon maddog Hall as regulars. As far as I can tell I have the only healthcare related presentation on the agenda. http://fisl. softwarelivre. org/10/papers/ pub/ I hope that next year you will attempt to attend this extraordinary event. There are many talented developers here and the entire country of Brazil is VERY pro FOSS. Cheers, Tim -- Timothy Cook, MSc Health Informatics Research Development Services LinkedIn Profile:http://www.linkedin .com/in/timothyw aynecook Skype ID == timothy.cook * * * * * * *You may get my Public GPG key from popular keyservers or * *from this link http://timothywayne .cook.googlepage s.com/home* * * * * * * [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [openhealth] EGADSS
Interesting. But how did you get the name? ganfyd? One of the difficulties of practice guidelines is that we have to fit it to the patient, not only to the disease. This is what makes things so difficult to organise it in the way computers would like to. The recent AUA recommendation for early bladder cancer has a nice way of breaking things up. Standard Recommended Opinion Only the standard will be useable in all patients, for at least an acceptable but finite period in time. Nandalal Gunaratne - Original Message From: Adrian Midgley [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: openhealth@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2008 8:01:41 AM Subject: Re: [openhealth] EGADSS I could be interested provided the licence is appropriate, one of the open source or CC ones. As one source of interactive guideline material, it is possible Ganfyd http://ganfyd. org which I'm involved in might be useful. The formalisation of information structure required for that may be beyond us. -- A !-- #ygrp-mkp{ border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:14px 0px;padding:0px 14px;} #ygrp-mkp hr{ border:1px solid #d8d8d8;} #ygrp-mkp #hd{ color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:bold;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0px;} #ygrp-mkp #ads{ margin-bottom:10px;} #ygrp-mkp .ad{ padding:0 0;} #ygrp-mkp .ad a{ color:#ff;text-decoration:none;} -- !-- #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc{ font-family:Arial;} #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc #hd{ margin:10px 0px;font-weight:bold;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;} #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc .ad{ margin-bottom:10px;padding:0 0;} -- !-- #ygrp-mlmsg {font-size:13px;font-family:arial, helvetica, clean, sans-serif;} #ygrp-mlmsg table {font-size:inherit;font:100%;} #ygrp-mlmsg select, input, textarea {font:99% arial, helvetica, clean, sans-serif;} #ygrp-mlmsg pre, code {font:115% monospace;} #ygrp-mlmsg * {line-height:1.22em;} #ygrp-text{ font-family:Georgia; } #ygrp-text p{ margin:0 0 1em 0;} #ygrp-tpmsgs{ font-family:Arial; clear:both;} #ygrp-vitnav{ padding-top:10px;font-family:Verdana;font-size:77%;margin:0;} #ygrp-vitnav a{ padding:0 1px;} #ygrp-actbar{ clear:both;margin:25px 0;white-space:nowrap;color:#666;text-align:right;} #ygrp-actbar .left{ float:left;white-space:nowrap;} .bld{font-weight:bold;} #ygrp-grft{ font-family:Verdana;font-size:77%;padding:15px 0;} #ygrp-ft{ font-family:verdana;font-size:77%;border-top:1px solid #666; padding:5px 0; } #ygrp-mlmsg #logo{ padding-bottom:10px;} #ygrp-vital{ background-color:#e0ecee;margin-bottom:20px;padding:2px 0 8px 8px;} #ygrp-vital #vithd{ font-size:77%;font-family:Verdana;font-weight:bold;color:#333;text-transform:uppercase;} #ygrp-vital ul{ padding:0;margin:2px 0;} #ygrp-vital ul li{ list-style-type:none;clear:both;border:1px solid #e0ecee; } #ygrp-vital ul li .ct{ font-weight:bold;color:#ff7900;float:right;width:2em;text-align:right;padding-right:.5em;} #ygrp-vital ul li .cat{ font-weight:bold;} #ygrp-vital a{ text-decoration:none;} #ygrp-vital a:hover{ text-decoration:underline;} #ygrp-sponsor #hd{ color:#999;font-size:77%;} #ygrp-sponsor #ov{ padding:6px 13px;background-color:#e0ecee;margin-bottom:20px;} #ygrp-sponsor #ov ul{ padding:0 0 0 8px;margin:0;} #ygrp-sponsor #ov li{ list-style-type:square;padding:6px 0;font-size:77%;} #ygrp-sponsor #ov li a{ text-decoration:none;font-size:130%;} #ygrp-sponsor #nc{ background-color:#eee;margin-bottom:20px;padding:0 8px;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad{ padding:8px 0;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad #hd1{ font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold;color:#628c2a;font-size:100%;line-height:122%;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad a{ text-decoration:none;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad a:hover{ text-decoration:underline;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad p{ margin:0;} o{font-size:0;} .MsoNormal{ margin:0 0 0 0;} #ygrp-text tt{ font-size:120%;} blockquote{margin:0 0 0 4px;} .replbq{margin:4;} -- Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [openhealth] Open Sourcing of Proteus Tools
I do too! Nandalal Gunaratne MS FRCS MRACS --- Fred Trotter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Your application is sounding more and more exciting!! I look forward to your release! -FT On Dec 19, 2007 8:37 AM, Hemant Shah [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Balu, Good Sleuthing! Yes, Jess will NOT be distributed with the open source version. We have replaced Jess based inference tool with BeanShell based inference tool. This will come with a rule editing tool (Greed) which converts the specified rules into Java code. Since Proteus Inference tools are anything that implement the inference tool interface this is possible without much difficulty. You must take a look at Greed, following the paradigm of the main authoring tool, it allows creating of rules by simple dragging and dropping. It does not allow creating every possible kind of rule but you can still create some very complex rules. I intended this to be a tool that can be used by other applications too and in due course will separate it completely from other tools to make it more widely useful. Regards, Hemant Hemant Shah, M.D., M.Surg. Sr. Research Informatician Henry Ford Health System Detroit, MI http://www.proteme.org On Dec 19, 2007 9:03 AM, balu raman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Proteus seems to have a dependency on Jess, the Rete engine from Sandia Lab. As far as my knowledge goes, which is outdated, Jess is not FOSS, may be free for academics. If I am not mistaken, you can still release Proteus as FOSS without Jess. balu raman, msee., ccp ryder brook pediatrics morrisville, vt 05661, usa - Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links -- Fred Trotter http://www.fredtrotter.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
Re: [openhealth] Link to Riehle's Economic Motivation of Open Source Software
We must not forget the end user who can contribute ideas, report bugs and thus feels closer to the developer and has a sense of belonging to a community - our software. Nandalal --- Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dirk Riehle. The Economic Motivation of Open Source Software: Stakeholder Perspectives. IEEE Computer, vol. 40, no. 4 (April 2007). Page 25-32. http://www.riehle.org/computer-science/research/2007/computer-2007- article.html Open source software has changed the rules of the game, impacting significantly the economic behavior of stakeholders in the software ecosystem. In this new environment, developers strive to be committers, vendors feel pressure to produce open source products, and system integrators anticipate boosting profits. - - - - - - - - [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross chief information officer mendocino health records exchange 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.462.6369 [office] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.mendocinohre.org - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, BCS, 2006 - - - - - - - - __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [openhealth] OSHCA Conference May 8-11 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia - Passport and Visa Planning
To get a visa we need a formal document to show that there is a conference with dates and signed by someone. Nandalal --- Molly Cheah [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: *Visa Requirements for Travel To Malaysia* Your passport must be valid for at least 6 months... http://www.imi.gov.my/eng/perkhidmatan/im_Permit.asp *ENTRY AND VISA REQUIREMENTS - MALAYSIA* No visa is required for nationals of Commonwealth countries (except Bangladesh, India, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, and Nigeria), Republic of Ireland, Switzerland, Netherlands, San Marino, and Liechtenstein. No visa is required for a stay not exceeding three months for nationals of Albania, Algeria, Argentina, Austria, Bahrain, Belgium, Brazil, Bosnia Herzegovina, Chile, Croatia, Cuba, Czech Republic, Denmark, Egypt, Finland, France, Germany, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Japan, Jordan, Kyrgyzstan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Luxembourg, Norway, Oman, Peru, Poland, Qatar, Romania, Saudi Arabia, South Korea, Spain, Sweden, Slovakia, Tunisia, Turkey, U.A.E., Uruguay, and Yemen. No visa is required for U.S.A. citizens visiting Malaysia for social, business or academic purposes (except for local employment). No visa is required for a stay of not more than one month for nationals of all ASEAN countries and Hong Kong (Special Administrative Region), Macau (Special Administrative Region), British National Overseas (BNO) and North Korea. For a stay exceeding one month, a visa will be required, for nationals of Thailand, Laos, Vietnam, Myanmar, Indonesia, Cambodia and the Philippines. No visa is required for a stay not exceeding 14 days for nationals of Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, Libya, Syria, Macau (travel permit) and Portugal Alien Passport. Nationals of Bangladesh, Bhutan, Peoples Republic of China, India, Nepal, Niger, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Angola, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cameroon, Cape Verde, Central African Republic, Chad, Comoros, Congo Republic, Cote D'Ivoire, Djibouti, Equatorial Guinea, Eritrea, Ethiopia, Guinea Republic, Guinea-Bissau, Liberia, Madagascar, Mali, Mauritania, Mozambique, Rwanda, Senegal, Western Sahara, Taiwan, Laisser Passer holders, Certificate of Identity Holders and Titre De Voyage must obtain a visa before entering Malaysia. Citizens of Israel and Yugoslavia are required to apply for Special Approval from the Ministry of Home Affairs before entering Malaysia. Citizens or nationals other than stated above do not require a visa for social/business visit for stay not exceeding one month. The above entry regulations are subject to change, and were correct at the end of January, 2005 These Regulations are subject to change. If in doubt, check with your nearest Malaysian consular office. (all care but no responsibility) Molly Joseph Dal Molin wrote: For anyone considering attending the upcoming OSHCA conference please ensure that you have looked into the visa and passport requirements for your country. Expedia UK provides a good guide.here: http://www.expedia.co.uk/daily/wg/P42138.asp?CCheck=1; and something important to plan for: Passports: A valid passport or other travel documents recognised by the Malaysian government required by all. The former must have enough pages for the embarkation stamp upon arrival and be valid for at least six months at date of entry. The latter should be endorsed with a valid re-entry permit. If not in possession of a passport or travel document, a Document in lieu of Passport must be obtained from any Malaysian Representation Office. Holders of travel documents such as a Certificate of Identity, a Laisser Passer, a Titre de Voyage or a Countrys Certificate of Residence must ensure guarantee of return to country that issued the documents or the nationals country of residence. Cheers, Joseph OSHCA, Conference Technical Committee Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links The fish are biting. Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing. http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/arp/sponsoredsearch_v2.php
Re: [openhealth] Experimental OSHCA catalogue of FOSS application for health and healthcare
I think a map will be cool. There is a map in one of the exibit demos, but it does not show up when I go into it. Tiddliywiki is a really nice tool. I can add a gui toolbar to it and make it editable, then anyone can easily edit it. It is easier than exibit in thay way. But on the other hand those who visit this site will usually be familiar with html/javascript I should think ;-) Since it is a wiki, we could allow members to edit it while the exibit can be kept under dictatorial control by Tim. Do we add the disclaimer that listing in the site does not mean OSHCA endorses it? Nandalal --- Tim Churches [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David Forslund wrote: This is a big help. I'll check it out. I saw the link for trial SIMILE Exhibit, but had no idea what that was or what the Data file was about. What is SIMILE? It is a project group at MIT: Semantic Interoperability of Metadata and Information in unLike Environments - see http://simile.mit.edu/ - they created the excellent Exhibit and Timeline Javascript frameworks used to organise and display the data. Exhibit allows data to be exported as RDF and N3 and other Semantic Web formats - that's its real aim. Very clever. Isn't the FOSS Health Applications link showing some of the same data? Yes, that was Nandalal very useful first go. Teh SIMILE Exhibit stuff is marked as a trial because we still haven't decided to abandon Nandalal's TiddlyWiki presntation entirely - at least not until all teh data in it are harvested. And even then I it may still be useful (I love TiddlyWiki...) I added an OpenEMed entry to the Exhibit data file - could you check it please? Also, what do people think about maps? Does every open source in health project have a geographical home (or homes)? Not really, but a map would still look pretty cool... Tim C It's the one that says: Data file for trial SIMILE Exhibit listing In JSON format and points to here: http://www.oshca.org/healthdir/foss_health.js Regards, Tim Don't get soaked. Take a quick peek at the forecast with the Yahoo! Search weather shortcut. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#loc_weather
Re: [openhealth] Experimental OSHCA catalogue of FOSS application for health and healthcare
Karsten, That is true. I suspect OIO library has not been updated for a long time though. Do you know how to set this up? What was used really? I think exibit can also be translated to other languages, after all it is just html and javascript. Tim, any idea? I could make the tiddlywiki editable and add a gui toolbar as I mentioned. It is translated already. see: http://trac.tiddlywiki.org/tiddlywiki/wiki/Translations * The languages available for Tiddlywiki are: * Basque * Bulgarian * Catalan * Chinese * Croatian * Czech * Dutch * Esperanto * Finnish * French * Galician * German * Hebrew * Hungarian * Italian * Japanese * Korean * Polish * Portuguese * Russian * Slovak * Spanish * Swedish Nandalal --- Karsten Hilbert [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sat, Mar 10, 2007 at 05:53:22PM -0800, Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Subject: Re: [openhealth] Experimental OSHCA catalogue of FOSS application for health and healthcare --- Tim Churches [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: it separates the data from the presentation. Not every view has to use or display every data element. Tim C This is what Zope does too! The OIO library uses Zope. The interface they use for editing is Wiki-on-steroids. They have been hosting a list of medical (and related) FOSS for a *long* time. It was quite convenient to edit/translate. No hacking JSON files and sending them snippet-wise. Karsten -- GPG key ID E4071346 @ wwwkeys.pgp.net E167 67FD A291 2BEA 73BD 4537 78B9 A9F9 E407 1346 8:00? 8:25? 8:40? Find a flick in no time with the Yahoo! Search movie showtime shortcut. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#news
Re: [openhealth] Experimental OSHCA catalogue of FOSS application for health and healthcare
I think Tim can add a home button on the first page Nandalal --- Molly Cheah [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tim, When I click this Trial SIMILE link, it opens on same window and does not take me back to the previous page, http://www.oshca.org/healthdir/ Maybe its better to make it open on a separate window. Trial SIMILE Exhibit listing of free, open-source applications for health and health care http://www.oshca.org/healthdir/foss_health.html http://www.oshca.org/healthdir/foss_health.html Rgds, Molly Tim Churches wrote: I have quickly put together an experimental OSHCA catalogue of FOSS application for health and healthcare, using The MIT SIMILE Semantic Web research lab's fabulous Exhibit and Timeline products (open source of course). See http://www.oshca.org/healthdir/ If you would like to add other free, open-source health applications or projects, or edit any of the existing data, please see the JSON data file also listed on that page. Edit the relevant section or copy a section and edit it to reflect your application, and email me just that section - just pasted intot he body of an email message will do, doesn't have to be an attachment. Eventually an online catalogue maintenance facility can be built (volunteers welcome), but for now hand editing of the JSON file (by me or volunteers) will have to do. Feel free to add new data fields if you edit the data file. Tim C Yahoo! Groups Links TV dinner still cooling? Check out Tonight's Picks on Yahoo! TV. http://tv.yahoo.com/
Re: [openhealth] Experimental OSHCA catalogue of FOSS application for health and healthcare
--- Tim Churches [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: it separates the data from the presentation. Not every view has to use or display every data element. Tim C This is what Zope does too! Nanda 8:00? 8:25? 8:40? Find a flick in no time with the Yahoo! Search movie showtime shortcut. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#news
Re: [openhealth] Experimental OSHCA catalogue of FOSS application for health and healthcare
Tim and David, I wonder if David is looking at the Tiddlywiki? Given below is the part of the JSON file and the links are correct. The CorbaMed link has been corrected. It is not listed under standards anymore and is under software applications. Is it necessary to have application framework as a category as David himself mentions that this should be listed under software applications? I have added to the description that it is an application framework. Nandalal { label : OpenEMed, type : software applications, homepage-url : http://openemed.org/;, logo-url : http://openemed.org/openemed.gif;, summary : OpenEMed is an application framework, consisting of a set of distributed healthcare information service components built around the OMG distributed object specifications and the HL7 (and other) data standards and is written in Java for platform portability. We emphasize the interoperable service functionality that this approach provides in reducing the time it takes to build a healthcare related system. It is not intended as a turnkey system but rather a set of components that can be assembled and configured to meet a variety of tasks. OpenEMed includes sample implementations of the Person Identification Service, Clinical Observation Access Service, Resource Access Decision, and Terminology Query Service which have been adopted as international standards by the Object Management Group (http://healthcare.omg.org) through the OMG's Healthcare Domain Taskforce . The system requires a CORBA 2.3 compliant ORB to run, and works with the OpenORB ORB , for example.pIt includes a complete JSP client implementation of a infectious disease monitoring system (B-SAFER) for use in an Urgent Care setting. This includes filters for a variety of data feeds including HL7, CSV, SQL, flat files, and XML. It is being used to acquire a variety of data from multiple hospital systems. Also included is a example of a simple immunization registry pilot. The power of using these components in a variety of settings can ultimately lead to a fully distributed medical record accessible by a patient. This could be ideal in a regional healthcare management scenario (RHIO). The OpenEMed components have also been used in the FIRST clinical research project at the City of Hope Medical Research Center in Duarte, California as well as initial implementation of a health record exchange at http://OpenHRE.org;, licenses : ['BSD'], categories : ['Public health','Epidemiology and statistics','EHR','EMR'], supported-os : ['Linux','MS-Windows','Apple Mac OS X'], languages : ['English'], platforms-dependencies : ['Java','CORBA'], first-release : 2003-04 } , --- David Forslund [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The link for OpenEMed would better point to OpenEMed.org rather than OpenEMed.net. Also, I don't see any link to JSON data. OpenEMed should be listed as a application framework, not as a standard. It implements a set of standards, but isn't a standard in its own right. Also CORBAmed should be listed as the OMG Healthcare DTF and simply to http://healthcare.omg.org. The link you have is way outdated. I would also link to the hssp.wikispaces.com link for current healthcare standard efforts. OpenEMed should certainly show up in the list of healthcare software applications. I have no idea of how to do this with JSON, particularly, since I see no mention of any JSON links on the referenced web pages. Thanks, Dave Tim Churches wrote: I have quickly put together an experimental OSHCA catalogue of FOSS application for health and healthcare, using The MIT SIMILE Semantic Web research lab's fabulous Exhibit and Timeline products (open source of course). See http://www.oshca.org/healthdir/ If you would like to add other free, open-source health applications or projects, or edit any of the existing data, please see the JSON data file also listed on that page. Edit the relevant section or copy a section and edit it to reflect your application, and email me just that section - just pasted intot he body of an email message will do, doesn't have to be an attachment. Eventually an online catalogue maintenance facility can be built (volunteers welcome), but for now hand editing of the JSON file (by me or volunteers) will have to do. Feel free to add new data fields if you edit the data file. Tim C We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list. http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/265
Re: [openhealth] Experimental OSHCA catalogue of FOSS application for health and healthcare
David, You are the best person to advice us on this matter. What should go into the open standards in healthcare? section? The list below is what I compiled for starters to be edited and corrected. Nandalal Open Healthcare Framework (OHF) Project eHealth Standardization Coordination Group (World Health Organization) Health Level Seven (commonly HL7) OpenECG openEHR OASIS (Organization for the Advancement of Structured Information Standards) National Electronics and Computer Technology Center (NECTEC) Open EMPI OpenHRE CORBAmed --- David Forslund [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The link for OpenEMed would better point to OpenEMed.org rather than OpenEMed.net. Also, I don't see any link to JSON data. OpenEMed should be listed as a application framework, not as a standard. It implements a set of standards, but isn't a standard in its own right. Also CORBAmed should be listed as the OMG Healthcare DTF and simply to http://healthcare.omg.org. The link you have is way outdated. I would also link to the hssp.wikispaces.com link for current healthcare standard efforts. OpenEMed should certainly show up in the list of healthcare software applications. I have no idea of how to do this with JSON, particularly, since I see no mention of any JSON links on the referenced web pages. Thanks, Dave Tim Churches wrote: I have quickly put together an experimental OSHCA catalogue of FOSS application for health and healthcare, using The MIT SIMILE Semantic Web research lab's fabulous Exhibit and Timeline products (open source of course). See http://www.oshca.org/healthdir/ If you would like to add other free, open-source health applications or projects, or edit any of the existing data, please see the JSON data file also listed on that page. Edit the relevant section or copy a section and edit it to reflect your application, and email me just that section - just pasted intot he body of an email message will do, doesn't have to be an attachment. Eventually an online catalogue maintenance facility can be built (volunteers welcome), but for now hand editing of the JSON file (by me or volunteers) will have to do. Feel free to add new data fields if you edit the data file. Tim C Never miss an email again! Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/
Re: [openhealth] Medsphere really is an open source company after all?
If Medsphere OpenVista is to be included in OSHCA, alongside World Vista, please give me the details that should be included and if any clauses need to be mentioned. Nandalal --- Tim Churches [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Fred Trotter wrote: The software in question was not VistA at all. It was developed internally at Medsphere. We are simply talking about a company that placed an open source offering on sourceforge and then, dramatically, had the software removed. They have since released one of the items they yanked under an open sourcy badgeware license (OSI is debating internally regarding the validity of badgeware), they have also released some changes to VistA as GPL. They have also released public statements that they will always keep 5% proprietary. As a result Medsphere is a hybrid company, both open source and proprietary. Just as an aside, it is better to use the term 'closed source' instead of proprietary. Proprietary means someone owns the code, and that applies to the vast majority of open source code - copyright is clearly asserted on the code, and some rights are reserved by the copyright holder (and some rights are granted, as specified in teh open source license that applies to the code in question). I would suggest that they should be listed on the OSCHA website, but along side IBM which also releases both FOSS and proprietary medical software. There is a difference between companies that commit to releasing everything under a FSF and OSI approved licenses, like mine, and those that do not. I would hope that OSCHA would make the distinction. This is a policy question for OSHCA to consider, and debate should probably take place on the OSHCA mailing list. However, my view, that i will expressing there, is that with the exception of badgeware, OSHCA should support and applaud all open source releases of health-related software, on an application-by-application basis, not on a company-by-company basis. The key test should be whether what is released as open source has some utility or potential utility to others. Thus, if a company, like, say IBM, has huge software holdings but chooses to only release a few percent of those holdings as open source, then those bits that it does release as open source should have OSHCA's support, and the company should be praised for doing so (with the addded message that releasing even more as open source would be better), and not condemned or shunned by OSHCA because it chooses to pursue mixed open- and closed-source licensing strategies. At the same time, OSHCA must take care not to promote or endorse as open source software or applications which are not actually available under an open source license, even if those application are themselves built with open source components. Tim C On 3/5/07, Gregory Woodhouse [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 5, 2007, at 9:17 PM, Fred Trotter wrote: Tim, I suggest you wade through the mess under the blog post entitled Medsphere betrays community on GPLmedicine.org. This is a very complicated situation and there is little short of understanding everything that will give clarity. I don't see how it clarifies your reference to the original license. VistA is in the public domain in the sense that it may be obtained though FOIA. That's not the same as being licensed under an open source license. Indeed, speaking as a non-lawyer, I don't see how anyone can release VistA itself under GPL or any other license. At best, I'd think modifications to VistA could be released under an open source license. Medsphere's client is, of course, unrelated to VistA (unlike OpenVista, which I understand to be a modified form of VistA). Gregory Woodhouse [EMAIL PROTECTED] Life can only be understood going backwards, but it must be lived going forwards. --Søren Kierkegaard [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links Don't get soaked. Take a quick peek at the forecast with the Yahoo! Search weather shortcut. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#loc_weather
Re: [openhealth] Suppressing Sensitive Info From Free Text
Will, It is not a good idea to have sensitive information in free text. If you do, it should not go to general circulation, right? How can one extract such info from free text? One way is to remove such words from free text files using a macro of some sort. FInd and replace can be used to remove words like HIV with a blank? There cannot be an automated solution to this, unless it is cutting edge! ( ..or so we like to think to cover our ignorance!) I wonder if we have adequate knowledge as to what constitutes sensitive information to patients. A good study is needed Nandalal --- Fred Trotter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Will, I am confused too. Wouldnt such a technology have to be turning test capable? Are you looking for something that can search Free Text make a determination if it is related to HIV, and then catagorize the whole text as related to HIV? Or are you looking for something that is capable of allowing the rest of the note to pass through, and only eliminate the portions relating to HIV. (which seems much harder). Could you give an example of how your application might work? -FT On 3/2/07, Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm looking for a tool to suppress sensitive information (e.g., HIV status, etc.) from free text clinical notes prior to allowing the notes to be published from a protected, physician-only area into general circulation patient records for the clinic. What existing FOSS solutions are available? With best regards, [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross chief information officer mendocino health records exchange 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.462.6369 [office] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.mendocinohre.org - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, BCS, 2006 - - - - - - - - Yahoo! Groups Links -- Fred Trotter http://www.fredtrotter.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/
Re: [openhealth] Suppressing Sensitive Info From Free Text
Thanks Ross! Due to your question i have come to know the present state of text mining and NLP. These will give you your solution I guess. http://portal.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1089824dl=acmcoll=CFID=15151515CFTOKEN=6184618 nandalal --- Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear 80n, This is, in fact, the use case in discussion. Assume the patient has agreed to suppress detail x from circulation beyond his/her physician's eyes in the local free text based records system. What are the best FOSS tools to publish to the general circulation records environment a correctly edited version of a text file? With best regards, [wr] - - - - - - - - On Mar 2, 2007, at 4:08 PM, 80n wrote: Will The only acceptable answer would be Maury's option 3. The patient decides. Anything else would be be inappropriate. And not just HIV status. The patient, and only the patient, should have the right to determine who has access to anything that the patient might consider sensitive. And only the patient can determine what is or is not sensitive. 80n On 3/2/07, Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm looking for a tool to suppress sensitive information (e.g., HIV status, etc.) from free text clinical notes prior to allowing the notes to be published from a protected, physician-only area into general circulation patient records for the clinic. What existing FOSS solutions are available? With best regards, [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross chief information officer mendocino health records exchange 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.462.6369 [office] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.mendocinohre.org - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, BCS, 2006 - - - - - - - - [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Yahoo! Groups gets a make over. See the new email design. http://us.click.yahoo.com/hOt0.A/lOaOAA/yQLSAA/W4wwlB/TM ~- Yahoo! Groups Links [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross chief information officer mendocino health records exchange 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.462.6369 [office] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.mendocinohre.org - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, BCS, 2006 - - - - - - - - The fish are biting. Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing. http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/arp/sponsoredsearch_v2.php
Re: [openhealth] VistA Office EHR SemiVivA 2.3.1 released
It was VistA itself I was asking about. Porting it to Java was being attempted, was it not? Nandalal --- Joseph Dal Molin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: CPRS is based on Delphi not MUMPSand yes it is being ported to Java by VA. Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Right now it is in hibernation. Pity. I find that it is difficult to get people to look at MUMPS. They all shy away from it. I have yet to meet someone in asia who uses VistA and M or GT.M for that matter. Porting it into Java was being discussed sometime ago. I guess that would be a difficult job? Nandalal --- Joseph Dal Molin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It got 95% of the way there and needs more funding to complete the work. Right now it is in hibernation. Joseph Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Thanks. There was an attempt with CodeWeavers to build the CPRS to work with Linux instead of MS Windows. How far has this gone? Nandalal --- Joseph Dal Molin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Does this have a GUI interface? That is a very broad question.the answer is not everything in VOE nor VistA has a GUI interface... the backend components like lab and pharmacy are role and scroll for the most part but if you are a provider of care you work in a GUI world. The clinical GUI interface for VOE is primarily CPRS, we are also using a couple of other components which have their own GUI like document scanning etc. We have integrated EsiObjects to provide a web browser patient registration capability. There is no online demo for VOE but you can get a good idea of what it is like by going to the online demo that the VA has: www.va.gov/cprsdemo Joseph Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Does this have a GUI interface? IS there a demo online to try out? Nandalal --- Joseph Dal Molin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: a couple of important clarifications to Bhaskar's post: Please note that this VERSION OF THE software has not been field tested. this specific version has not been field tested Furthermore, most of the components IN THIS VERSION OF VOE were introduced to none of the usual VistA SDLC (Software Development Life Cycle) where packages and patches of any complexity usually endure a number of iterations between SQA (Software Quality Assurance) reviews, field testing and developer responses. VOE is currently undergoing completion of SQA using the same standards as are used in the VA. This work will be completed toward the end of March. WorldVistA has submitted its application to certify the software under the CCHIT 2006 criteria...assuming all goes well successful certification will be announced in late April or very early May. Joseph . VOE Program Manager, WorldVistA K.S. Bhaskar wrote: VistA Office EHR SemiVivA 2.3.1 (MD5 sum 16a0e6ae1951a512e88d83edd4e254a9) is available for downloading from the WorldVistA project page at Source Forge (http://sourceforge.net/projects/worldvista). VistA Office EHR SemiVivA 2.3.1 packages the release of VistA Office EHR 2.3.1 as made available at the VistA Office EHR project page at Source Forge (http://sourceforge.net/projects/vista-officeehr) on January 31, 2007. Nancy Anthracite configured the settings for it to run on GT.M, and provided the CPRS and Vitals executables (for Windows). An access code of VistAis#1 and verify code of #1isVistA will work for CPRS to connect. Please note that this software has not been field tested. Furthermore, most of the components for VOE were introduced to none of the usual VistA SDLC (Software Development Life Cycle) where packages and patches of any complexity usually endure a number of iterations between SQA (Software Quality Assurance) reviews, field testing and developer responses. This software is intended for evaluation / demonstration purposes. You take all responsibility for using it. This SemiViVA package is bundled with GT.M V5.2-000, as available under the GNU General Public License from the GT.M project page at Source Forge (http://sourceforge.net/projects/sanchez-gtm). A SemiVivA package is a one-step install of VistA and GT.M on a Linux machine. Assuming the file has been downloaded as /Distrib/VistAOfficeEHRSemiVivA_2.3.1.tgz, to === message truncated === The fish are biting. Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing. http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/arp/sponsoredsearch_v2.php
Re: [openhealth] VistA Office EHR SemiVivA 2.3.1 released
Thanks. There was an attempt with CodeWeavers to build the CPRS to work with Linux instead of MS Windows. How far has this gone? Nandalal --- Joseph Dal Molin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Does this have a GUI interface? That is a very broad question.the answer is not everything in VOE nor VistA has a GUI interface... the backend components like lab and pharmacy are role and scroll for the most part but if you are a provider of care you work in a GUI world. The clinical GUI interface for VOE is primarily CPRS, we are also using a couple of other components which have their own GUI like document scanning etc. We have integrated EsiObjects to provide a web browser patient registration capability. There is no online demo for VOE but you can get a good idea of what it is like by going to the online demo that the VA has: www.va.gov/cprsdemo Joseph Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Does this have a GUI interface? IS there a demo online to try out? Nandalal --- Joseph Dal Molin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: a couple of important clarifications to Bhaskar's post: Please note that this VERSION OF THE software has not been field tested. this specific version has not been field tested Furthermore, most of the components IN THIS VERSION OF VOE were introduced to none of the usual VistA SDLC (Software Development Life Cycle) where packages and patches of any complexity usually endure a number of iterations between SQA (Software Quality Assurance) reviews, field testing and developer responses. VOE is currently undergoing completion of SQA using the same standards as are used in the VA. This work will be completed toward the end of March. WorldVistA has submitted its application to certify the software under the CCHIT 2006 criteria...assuming all goes well successful certification will be announced in late April or very early May. Joseph . VOE Program Manager, WorldVistA K.S. Bhaskar wrote: VistA Office EHR SemiVivA 2.3.1 (MD5 sum 16a0e6ae1951a512e88d83edd4e254a9) is available for downloading from the WorldVistA project page at Source Forge (http://sourceforge.net/projects/worldvista). VistA Office EHR SemiVivA 2.3.1 packages the release of VistA Office EHR 2.3.1 as made available at the VistA Office EHR project page at Source Forge (http://sourceforge.net/projects/vista-officeehr) on January 31, 2007. Nancy Anthracite configured the settings for it to run on GT.M, and provided the CPRS and Vitals executables (for Windows). An access code of VistAis#1 and verify code of #1isVistA will work for CPRS to connect. Please note that this software has not been field tested. Furthermore, most of the components for VOE were introduced to none of the usual VistA SDLC (Software Development Life Cycle) where packages and patches of any complexity usually endure a number of iterations between SQA (Software Quality Assurance) reviews, field testing and developer responses. This software is intended for evaluation / demonstration purposes. You take all responsibility for using it. This SemiViVA package is bundled with GT.M V5.2-000, as available under the GNU General Public License from the GT.M project page at Source Forge (http://sourceforge.net/projects/sanchez-gtm). A SemiVivA package is a one-step install of VistA and GT.M on a Linux machine. Assuming the file has been downloaded as /Distrib/VistAOfficeEHRSemiVivA_2.3.1.tgz, to install on your Linux PC, execute the following, as root: cd /usr/local tar zxvf /Distrib/VistAOfficeEHRSemiVivA_2.3.1.tgz This will create new directories /usr/local/VistAOfficeEHR_2.3.1 and /usr/local/gtm_V5.2-000. Please note that this will overwrite any directories or symbolic links you have with those names. You may wish to replace your symbolic links with new ones (i.e., the following is optional; also to be executed as root in /usr/local): rm gtm ; ln -s gtm_V5.2-000 gtm rm VistAOfficeEHR ; ln -s VistAOfficeEHR_2.3.1 VistAOfficeEHR To use it, you will need to create a working environment (see http://tinyurl.com/738jk for details). To create an environment in ~/myVistAOfficeEHR (the choice of directory name is entirely yours), as a normal user, execute: /usr/local/VistAOfficeEHR_2.3.1/install ~/myVistAOfficeEHR Subsequently, to get to an interactive mode GT.M prompt in that environment, execute: ~/myVistAOfficeEHR/gtm_V5.2-000/run To run entryref ABC^DEF in that environment, execute: ~/myVistAOfficeEHR/gtm_V5.2-000/run ABC^DEF To get a CPRS GUI to connect to the environment in ~/myVistAOfficeEHR, you should set up inetd/xinetd to execute ~/myVistAOfficeEHR/gtm_V5.2-000/cprs_direct in response to a connection request. If you have set up
Re: [openhealth] Re: Hi folks..
Thank you Thomas. This is not urinalysis but urea and electrolytes! What is the Any Result data type is not set doing here. It is, after all, urea and electrolytes, and the electrolytes are mentioned. Is this to leave room for rare electrolytes like the level of copper in the blood or iron? Nandalal --- Thomas Beale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: The power of this approach is hard to appreciate until you're in a situation where lots of people have lots of things they want to characterize in a system. It allows non-developers to own and augment their own notions of what data matters to them, without altering the underlying database model. This is important for clinicians in different specialities with various interests in the specifics. No FOSS EMR I tried/used, except OIO, allow this to be done easily by users. The Concept Dictionary approach seems to be similar to the Archetypes approach of OpenEHR, which goes a further step. you can see a urinalysis archetype here: http://svn.openehr.org/knowledge/archetypes/dev/html/en/openEHR-EHR-OBSERVATION.laboratory-urea_and_electrolytes.v1.html (main page: http://svn.openehr.org/knowledge/archetypes/dev/index.html) - thomas beale Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. http://new.mail.yahoo.com
Re: [openhealth] Re: Hi folks..
Paul, This is a good explanation of what OpenMRS is about, and I find it quite refreshing. The problem of constraints to allow greater acceptance and accuracy (OpenEHR) against allowing change as you seem to do to allow freedom to improve and grow in new directions, but which can cause confusion and inaccuracy, will last forever. The correct path is the middle path. nandalal --- Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Thomas, --- In openhealth@yahoogroups.com, Thomas Beale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: The power of this approach is hard to appreciate until you're in a situation where lots of people have lots of things they want to characterize in a system. It allows non-developers to own and augment their own notions of what data matters to them, without altering the underlying database model. This is important for clinicians in different specialities with various interests in the specifics. No FOSS EMR I tried/used, except OIO, allow this to be done easily by users. The Concept Dictionary approach seems to be similar to the Archetypes approach of OpenEHR, which goes a further step. you can see a urinalysis archetype here: http://svn.openehr.org/knowledge/archetypes/dev/html/en/openEHR-EHR-OBSERVATION.laboratory-urea_and_electrolytes.v1.html (main page: http://svn.openehr.org/knowledge/archetypes/dev/index.html) - thomas beale Thanks for the link. It hasn't worked for me, but I'm familiar enough (I think) to have at least a cursory understanding of what archetypes are. Probably enough to be dangerous. :) Defining the relative metadata around medical concepts is typically a good thing, and for your work on that I applaud this effort. However, where I get worried with this approach is in both the vagaries of health care and practice patterns. A wise quote that I heard when I started medical informatics training was a lot of what we practice today is wrong. I'm a pediatrician, and I can attest to this... and because of the constant evolution in best practices, there's always a scattergram of practice styles vs. best practices. That is, the urinalysis today, might not be the urinalysis of tomorrow. Some might continue to use the old urinalysis for a number of various reasons, and some of those reasons might be correct. Therefore, there arise various flavors and colors of a single archetype that I think I understand represent models of how certain care is delivered. These coexisting vagaries and various evolutions of medical concepts unfortunately I think are a necessary reality of health information system design. What we've attempted to do at Regenstrief (and within OpenMRS for that matter) is to abstract out one level further. That is, all medical concepts have descriptions, datatypes, classes, and for a given combination of class, datatype some relative metadata. For example, a urine pH is a numeric datatype, and a test class. Therefore, it has metadata such as absolute, critical, and normal ranges, a unit designation, etc etc. These concepts live in the database right alongside the actual repository of data to serve as a general resource to the entire enterprise. Any user can populate the database with new concepts, and we're actively working on building a resource, the OCC (OpenMRS Concept Cooperative) to allow for imports/exports of these creations for the use of the entire community. That being said, it's probably a good idea for the community to try something that inherently feels more tightly defined and interoperable. We however, made the choice based on pragmatics. That is, the approach I've described has been road tested for a very long time with good success. We wanted to stack our odds for success, and were more reluctant to experiment. The OpenMRS group took advantage of our institution's work, added some extra details (such as the ability to pre and post-coordinate ccmplex questions and answers, richer synonymies, etc.) Best, -Paul Expecting? Get great news right away with email Auto-Check. Try the Yahoo! Mail Beta. http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/mailbeta/newmail_tools.html
Re: [openhealth] openEHR archetype licensing by UK NHS (was Re: Hi folks.)
I agree with Tim. The licensing is ambiguous in regard to open licenses (OSI) and copyleft principles of FOSS. However OpenEHR may want to keep this open for change. The archetypes at least, must be protected from being commercialised as they are the collaborative work of many people. Nandalal --- Tim Churches [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thomas Beale wrote: Tim Churches wrote: However I am still not completely comfortable with the way openEHR archetype definitions are licensed. The biggest problem is probably the indefinite nature of the licensing, because there is no direct reference to the license(s) which cover them. However, as far as I understand it, openEHR archetype definitions which are available from the openEHR archetype repository are covered by the openEHR Public Licence and the openEHR Free Commercial Use Licence as detailed here: http://www.openehr.org/about_openehr/t_licensing.htm Neither of these licenses can be considered as adhering to open source licensing principles. The openEHR Public Licence is actually very from my memory, this license was written by UCL based on normal 'licenses' for re-use of academic materials. The idea against modification is the same as for academic texts and papers. Whether (in hindsight) it was a good license to apply to archetypes I don't know - we now have a lot more experience with them. I agree that a more source-code like license would make sense (since source licenses are oriented toward allowing change; document licenses are oriented toward preserving copyright and not allowing change of the original). Yes. openEHR archetype definitions are analogous to the SQL back-end database schema and triggers, and to some degree to the middleware business logic, in traditional applications. All of these need to be freely modifiable and shareable if one's data is not to be locked-in, or at lest if exchange is not to be seriously hampered. In open source applications, the database schema and triggers etc are all covered by the open source license, which allows modification and sharing. restrictive and does not allow modification or redistribution of archetype definitions covered by it. The openEHR Free Commercial Use Licence is much less restrictive but discriminates on the basis of field of endeavour, which is antithetical to the commonly accepted definition of open source licensing (see http://www.opensource.org/docs/definition.php ) Are you saying this because the first paras mention healthcare? I can't find anything else about 'field of endeavour'. No, I am referring to the distinction between academic and commercial endeavour which the openEHR licenses make, and the fact that the openEHR Free Commercial use License specifically does not apply to Private, Non-Commercial Activities as it sates in its Introduction. In any case, the bullet points are just examples, as the text of the license says. No it doesn't mention examples anywhere except in the warranties section. What it actually says is: Commercial Use shall include, without limitation: * the normal commercial licensing of the Materials (whether alone, incorporated into another program or document, or as a work derived from the Materials in whole or part); or * where the Materials are used (whether alone, incorporated into another program or document, or as a program or document derived from the Materials in whole or part) directly or indirectly for the treatment, evaluation or medical care of patients, or in the recording, compiling and analysing of any facts, records or statistics in regard to, patients. Now you may read that as open-ended, but from an end-user's perspective, it is uselessly open-ended, as it is never clear where some other use is commercial use for the purposes of this license or not, unless the other use is for teaching or for Private, Non-Commercial Activities, in which case it is not Commercial use under this license. Do you see the problem with licenses which restrict use or applicability based on field of endeavour - they tie themselves and would-be users in knots trying to work out whether one's own field of endeavour is covered or not. Very bad practice and a complete turn-off for widespread adoption. I can't see anything in it that limits how you use the materials; the intent of the license is in fact to remove liability for use from UCL, in other words, the usual 'user's responsibility' condition. I am sure there are better licenses around, but so far I am not sure why this one is broken. Well, if a user does not fall under the definition of Commercial Use, or if they do fall into the categories of Private, Non-Commercial Activities or teaching, then the licenses limit them from doing anything except read the materials. They are not allowed to share or modify
Re: [openhealth] Re: Hi folks..
The power of this approach is hard to appreciate until you're in a situation where lots of people have lots of things they want to characterize in a system. It allows non-developers to own and augment their own notions of what data matters to them, without altering the underlying database model. This is important for clinicians in different specialities with various interests in the specifics. No FOSS EMR I tried/used, except OIO, allow this to be done easily by users. The Concept Dictionary approach seems to be similar to the Archetypes approach of OpenEHR, which goes a further step. Nandalal --- Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Karsten, --- In openhealth@yahoogroups.com, Karsten Hilbert Agree. I'm reading this thread with interest. I have been interested in the Concept Dictionary approach ever since I learned about OpenMRS a year ago or so. There's a strong camp opposed to EAV-only schemata. I have a nagging feeling, however, that having a Concept Dictionary approach can be of great value where it fits (as a poor-mans export system, perhaps ?). I have read most of the OpenMRS docs but haven't yet been struck by lightning going Ah yes ! That's how I'd want to use that in GNUmed !!. As I said, I do think I am missing out on something very elegant and would like to be educated on that. It's the same feeling I have that once I eventually get around to implementing forms (as in paper) support I will turn to studying NetEpi on that. Well, Burke and I started down the pathway of a concept dictionary based EAV model not due to any divine wisdom on our part, but because of the education we received from our mentor, Clem McDonald, who is the father of the RMRS, one of the oldest (40+ years) and largest clinical information systems I'm aware of. We thought, if it's not broke, let's not try to fix it. Of course, we've modernized and extended out some of the functionalities from the RMRS model, but the basic ideas have remained intact. The most important technical a-ha for me was once I got the point that the dictionary defines both the questions and the answers within an observation. My favorite example is a simple test in any urinalysis, the urine color. We create a concept for the question urine color and then define all of the appropriate meta- data that drives that question. Like, what is the datatype of the concept, what are it's synonyms, what is it's description? In the case of urine color, you might set it's datatype as coded so that you can make separate concepts for each answer. (ie, yellow, straw colored, clear, etc.) The magic of this dictionary is that any concept can be used throughout the system in a lot of ways. Want to use urine color as an answer to another question? No problem. Want to use yellow to describe's someone skin color? No problem as well. The power of this approach is hard to appreciate until you're in a situation where lots of people have lots of things they want to characterize in a system. It allows non-developers to own and augment their own notions of what data matters to them, without altering the underlying database model. The RMRS has over 30k of these concepts. If you'd like me to set you up with some examples of what this looks like in a live system, just let me know. I'll point you to a demo that you can hack around with. Hope this is helpful, -Paul Need Mail bonding? Go to the Yahoo! Mail QA for great tips from Yahoo! Answers users. http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=listsid=396546091
Re: [openhealth] Re: Hi folks..
This is just the type of discussion we should have in the May OSHCA Conference!! FOSS interoperability - from theory to practice Nandalal --- David Forslund [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tim Churches wrote: Paul wrote: Hi Dave, Our API is built around the standard health objects within the OpenMRS data model (ie, person, encounter, order, observation, etc) , as a way of abstracting out CRUD-type operations to the database. There are layers of API calls on top of this bedrock which provide business type functionality (user authentication, medical logic services, etc). Maybe I'm misunderstanding your question, but wouldn't standard APIs necessitate that the database schemas underneath those calls are represented the same as well? The answer is no. This is the major result of the Clinical Observation Access Service (COAS) specification from the OMG in the late 90's. It standardized an interface that was independent of the underlying storage schema. In a sense this is the same question that arises with XML. One can store an XML file with structure without having to have a database that has the specific XML schema in it.COAS did this without requiring XML. Take a look at the RLUS work coming from hssp.wikispaces.org for the follow on to this work. Part of the challenge our team continually struggles with involves finding that right balance between being pragmatic and creating a framework that's everything to everyone, and potentially smolders under it's own weight. Yes, this is an absolutely central problem, and we also wrestle with it all the time - the trade=off between specific solutions to specific requirements, which are much simpler and quicker to implement, and more general solutions to more general requirements, which are much harder to design and implement. People may not agree with the COAS effort of the OMG, but this was exactly its goal and I believe it achieved it. It provides an underlying basic support for interoperability of medical records. It doesn't provide all the business logic for healthcare which isn't required for interoperability. We made a fairly conscious decision for example, not to try to represent the HL7 RIM, as it's been our experience that work in that domain is high on promise but lacking in successful, well vetted implementations. If on the other hand, you believe there's a way to adapt our API approach to be more closely aligned with existing standards, yet allowing us to continue our EAV, concept modeling approach to repository design, I'd love to hear your thoughts. The openEHR model is probably relevant - it can be viewed as a more evolved form of the two-level model which OpenEMR (and the Regenstrief Clinic for several decades before that) uses. The openEHR people have put forward their work as the basis for an ISO standard - only a proposed standard at this stage. There is a java-based open source openEHR kernel currently available, but it is still in beta or incomplete (I think), and there are some other open-source tools for working with openEHR archetypes, but relatively few people have much experience with this technology and those that do have not published descriptions of their experience except anecdotally (eg it seems to work). So, openEHR has promise but it is a rather untrodden path at present, and a complex and twisting one at that with steep (learning) hills (curves) along the way. We are keeping a watching brief on openEHR for potential use in our NetEpi suite of public health/epidemiology tools (see http://www.netepi.org ). I should note here that the COAS model supported the GEHR model which was the predecessor to OpenEHR. It specifically took into account in the standardization process. I still believe that a COAS interface can be used with OpenEHR, but I don't have the time to actually demonstrate this. COAS has been shown to work in fairly interesting situations including epidemiology. Our implementation is available, of course, as open source. What is curious is that there have been, so far, no other open source projects which have attempted to follow this interoperability path even though an open source example of it has been out there for more than 7 years. Today, our vision of interoperability is through standard HL7 messaging, and web-services where they make sense. That seems sensible. Have you looked at Mirth? http://www.mirthproject.org/ Messaging is fine, although using HL7 for interoperability has its issues. I think a service oriented approach is much more powerful and provides a stronger layer of interoperability. It is this approach that is being used in the HSSP effort: http://hssp.wikispaces.org as a joint effort of HL7 and the OMG. To vastly oversimplify it,
Re: [openhealth] OSHCA Conference Topics
Hi Christian, You are right on-the-ball here. What the asian colleagues would want is exactly what you suggested - intro to the core of the standards and what they mean in simple short form. They may also want more interactive hands on stuff regards FOSS apps rather than talks on them. The thing is many have attended FOSS conferences where they heard about apps but never really saw them working! Since installation is the most important part, this must be well documented. Issues regards the version of different software that work and do NOT work are important in FOSS -eg: the exact Apache/Tomcat/java/mysql/postgresql/php/python versions that that work together for that particular application, and those that do not. Nandalal --- Christian Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Klaus, Re question 3, I would like to suggest we look at the topic How can FOSS applications share data with other existing healthcare applications?. This aim of the topic is that there already are well-established standards (HL7, LOINC, SNOMED, etc.) in use in healthcare systems and that to be able to integrate into existing healthcare institutions any new (FOSS) system must be able to use these standards. We started on this topic at the London OSHCA meeting, but much more work needs to be done. yes, you are correct. As I wrote yesterday in my other email on Getting OSHCA organised, it should not: 1 Define technical architectures 2 Mandate use of specific standards .. nor try to define its own That is at least what we in the committee agreed upon. Opinions welcome. In other words, OSHCA should focus on inter-operability using *existing* standards, instead of defining its own, as you write. However, it may give recommendations on which standards to prefer. Although OSHCA would be neutral assessing standards, open standards would clearly be preferred. My thoughts are that it'd be nice to have one-hour presentations of standards like HXP, HDTF (CORBAmed), OpenEHR, HL7, xDT etc. on one day. Ideally, the presentations would give few theory and demonstrate on practical examples (code snippets, live demo or whatever), how they work, just like at a developer's conference. Although I know basic principles behind most of these standards, the conference would already be worth visiting for me, because I'd get essential knowledge in a compact form. And this is presumably also what our Asian (developer) colleagues expect from the conference: to get a brief overview of important technologies. I suggest to exclude terminology standards this time, or to plan just one presentation giving an overview of some of them. Instead, we should focus on pure data exchange. But these are just my ideas and wishes. Others in this list may vote me down and change the conference agenda. Tell us your wishes and we will try to realise them. Christian Don't get soaked. Take a quick peak at the forecast with the Yahoo! Search weather shortcut. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#loc_weather
Re: [openhealth] Re: [Fwd: [FOSS-PDI] OSHCA Conference - Preliminary Announcement]
Hello THomas, To give you an idea of the kind of thinking that could be exposed, here is my opinion: I think they should be open and freely usable - in fact I think the only sensible business model for standards development is to give them away free and charge some money for compliance testing. The development of standards can be quite costly as Stephen pointed out, is it possible to get money just by compliance testing? They could charge a licence fee for continuous use. What ISO and many other bodies do is completely wrong, and hence fails most of the time (there are far more ISO standards than are actually used, because people cannot even examine them for fitness without paying for them. Hence a vast amount of talking, time off and air miles are wasted on producing documents that never see the light of day). This is true. HL7 was also being criticised for going on and on and not producing anything useable. Just to continue on my software ecosystem comment a few posts back, I think this conference would be an opportunity to show more than just why open source is good in a general sense. We already have the proof that this is true in some areas, with category-topping efforts like Linux Apache. We also already have some great medical open source systems. We need to identify these great systems, from the good systems. Could you list a few you think are great? What we don't have is a standard-based, interoperable ecosystem of software that we can offer the industry as a whole. What I think we want is to show that we can build a cathedral, but do it in the bazaar. We need something that looks like objectweb.org, but in health. Putting openly developed standards together with openly developed software is the key to the future in my view, and we should be developing the necessary thinking now; the conference is an ideal opportunity to aim for exposing such ideas. Openly developed standards with openly developed software is my own favorite phrase too :-) Nandalal - thomas Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. Try the free Yahoo! Mail Beta. http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/mailbeta/features_spam.html
Re: [openhealth] Re: [Fwd: [FOSS-PDI] OSHCA Conference - Preliminary Announcement]
--- Molly Cheah [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Open Source is also a open standard of software development! We need to define/re-define these open standards, remove the obsolete and invoke those of the future. As for objective 4, we need to discuss this now rather than wait. Think big and start small is perhaps the way to go? Nandalal Thanks for the suggestion, Stephen. I have added as suggested but include the word open to standards as in Objective 4. These objectives and tentative programme is in our web-portal. The programme is tentative and to be discussed at the Openhealth list as well. I will post this discussion to the Openhealth list to see if the FOSS community wish to add further to this. The Conference programme can be found here: http://oshca.org/conference/conf2007/conf2007prog Conference Objectives: 1. Share and review current FOSS applications in healthcare 2. Share and review current technologies in healthcare software 3. Conceptualise and define OSHCA's role in managing FOSS collaborative services 4. Explore the role of open standards in facilitating interoperable health information communication 5. Promote OSHCA and its activities particularly to IT and healthcare communities in ASEAN/Asia-Pacific region 6. Promote the advantages of using FOSS applications to managers of healthcare facilities in public and private sectors in the ASEAN/Asia-Pacific region. For the information of the FOSS community, APAMI stands for Asia-Pacific Association for Medical Informatics, which is an affiliate of IMIA. I believe Peter Murray is at the Openhealth list and would be happy to get his views on the OSHCA conference. Perhaps I should add here that Objective 3 is important to OSHCA in preparation and anticipation of the IDRC's Pan Asia eHealth Research Network Programme 2006-2011. OSI's information programme has special interests for funding FOSS projects around open standards. Rgds, Molly Stephen Chu wrote: Hi, Molly: If interoperability is one of the focus of the conference, I suggest that you add one more item to the existing conference objectivies: Explore the role of standards in facilitating interoperable health information communication. We can certainly discuss how national and international standards and information infrastructure building play a role in interoperable health information communication. Regards, Stephen On 1/17/07, *Molly Cheah* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Klaus, I spoke to HM just now and I think in principle there shouldn't be a problem co-organising with APAMI. We have already obtained some support from UNDP-APDIP's IOSN programme (with the help of Alvin Marcelo) It would be great to also get support from HL7 Australia and NZ, since our focus is on interoperability and data exchange. No doubt our target applications are FOSS applications and as such presentations of applications and technology used will be restricted to FOSS. If May 8-11 (tuesday to friday) is acceptable, we'll work towards those dates, making available time for those attending HIMSS in Singapore, the opportunity to take off for a 3-day exclusive getaway in bungalows by the sea in Pulau Langkawi or anywhere else, before going down south to S'pore. This is VMY2007 :). Would May 8-12 (Wednesday to Saturday) a better alternative? I'm copying this e-mail discussion on the dates to the OSHCA committee to avoid me having to repeat the views expressed. Rgds, Molly Klaus Veil wrote: Molly, I think an association with APAMI would be very beneficial to OSHCA 2007 and the FOSS approach in general. We could also explore if HL7 Australia and HL7 NZ would be able to provide some backing... Klaus -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Molly Cheah Sent: Wednesday, 17 January 2007 14:52 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Fwd: [FOSS-PDI] OSHCA Conference - Preliminary Announcement] Dear Stephen, Thank you for your assistance to promote this event. I'm hoping that APAMI may come in as co-organisers. Can't seem to get hold of HM Goh to discuss this. Klaus suggested that the date be moved to May 8-11 to avoid clashing with some of the other HL7 meetings, as well as convience for those attending the HIMSS Asia-Pacific event on 15-17 in Singapore. I don't think
Re: [openhealth] SCALE talk
--- David Forslund [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks David. Please clarify the following for me: The MPI has to be global to be of any use, each human being being uniquely identified. To what layer/level the identification entities can be extended, maybe of concern to individuals and countries. WIll this affect the lobal application of unique identifiers? Nandalal OpenEMed continues to be in modest development but perhaps not visible at a higher level. The MPI work is based on the OMG PIDS standard. It is open source and has been so since 2000. The next generation of PIDS will result from the current EIS RFP from the OMG which is currently soliciting responses. The EIS is a joint effort of the OMG and HL7. We would like to provide an implementation of EIS as part of OpenEMed and are soliciting help in anyone interested in doing so. Dave Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Hello Will, I do not see any MPI projects in the OpenHRE except the description of four Patient-Data Matching Software. The OpenEMed project is somewhat dormant and did not have a fully developed MPI software based on it's Person identification service. I am not sure if during the aborted Phoenix project anything was done regards the development of an MPI using OpenEMed, except the Patient identification terminology service itself. Therfore your peoject maybe the first open-source one, if it is used for this purpose in the future. Please correct me if I am wrong. Nandalal --- Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:wross%40openhre.org wrote: Hello World, Like Fred I'm also speaking at SCALE. During the afternoon at SCALE my presentation will discuss FOSS options for MPI solutions. Here's my short list of open source MPI projects: [1] OpenEMed [2] OpenHRE If you know of any further FOSS options for MPI, please send me links to the MPI project(s). Also, Dr. Stuart Turner and I have launched a small portal to persistently track FOSS options for MPI solutions. http://www.openempi.org/ http://www.openempi.org/ All comments and suggestions are welcome. With best regards, [wr] - - - - - - - - On Jan 11, 2007, at 7:31 AM, Fred Trotter wrote: Hello OpenHealth, I hope you are all aware of the SCALE healthcare day... http://www.socallinuxexpo.com/healthcare07/ http://www.socallinuxexpo.com/healthcare07/ If you can make it you should, the speakers line up is full of real players in our industry. I am scheduled to talk on Whats going on in healthcare the intent of my talk is to give a summary about what is REALLY going on in Free and Open Source Healthcare. I want to talk about what projects are moving and which projects are dead. I want to talk about what we as a larger community are doing well with and what we as a community are doing poorly with. In short I want to present my audience with useful bias as opposed to mere information. I fully intend to make some bold statements about the state of our industry. But I do not want to do that without having more information about what is really happening. So I am turning this question on the community? What IS going on in Free and Open Source Healthcare? Here are the areas that I would like commentary on. Please feel free to comment on areas that I am overlooking. First whats going on in medical imaging? ie Osiris Second what is happening in Genomics/Protenomics/Cell Modeling? i.e. http://www.bioconductor.org/ http://www.bioconductor.org/ What is happening in decision support/diagnostics? OpenPsyc etc etc Clinical Trial/ Research Software ie OIO Drug Database - i.e. Uversa effort EHR clinical i.e. MirrorMed/ClearHealth -- VOE EHR hospital ie. VistA/Care2x PHR ie Indivo Interoperability/MPI Mirth/OHF etc etc. There are lots of fine project lists out there. I do not want information that I could find on Google. I want the inside scoop! Who are the loosers who are the winners. In some of these areas I already know the answers, and I simply need a gut-check. In other areas I am truly ignorant. Feel free to email me privately if you want something to be off-the-record. Regards, -- Fred Trotter http://www.fredtrotter.com http://www.fredtrotter.com - - - - - - - - [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross project manager mendocino informatics 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.462.6369 [office] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.minformatics.com - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, BCS
Re: [openhealth] SCALE talk
Hello Will, I do not see any MPI projects in the OpenHRE except the description of four Patient-Data Matching Software. The OpenEMed project is somewhat dormant and did not have a fully developed MPI software based on it's Person identification service. I am not sure if during the aborted Phoenix project anything was done regards the development of an MPI using OpenEMed, except the Patient identification terminology service itself. Therfore your peoject maybe the first open-source one, if it is used for this purpose in the future. Please correct me if I am wrong. Nandalal --- Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello World, Like Fred I'm also speaking at SCALE. During the afternoon at SCALE my presentation will discuss FOSS options for MPI solutions. Here's my short list of open source MPI projects: [1] OpenEMed [2] OpenHRE If you know of any further FOSS options for MPI, please send me links to the MPI project(s). Also, Dr. Stuart Turner and I have launched a small portal to persistently track FOSS options for MPI solutions. http://www.openempi.org/ All comments and suggestions are welcome. With best regards, [wr] - - - - - - - - On Jan 11, 2007, at 7:31 AM, Fred Trotter wrote: Hello OpenHealth, I hope you are all aware of the SCALE healthcare day... http://www.socallinuxexpo.com/healthcare07/ If you can make it you should, the speakers line up is full of real players in our industry. I am scheduled to talk on Whats going on in healthcare the intent of my talk is to give a summary about what is REALLY going on in Free and Open Source Healthcare. I want to talk about what projects are moving and which projects are dead. I want to talk about what we as a larger community are doing well with and what we as a community are doing poorly with. In short I want to present my audience with useful bias as opposed to mere information. I fully intend to make some bold statements about the state of our industry. But I do not want to do that without having more information about what is really happening. So I am turning this question on the community? What IS going on in Free and Open Source Healthcare? Here are the areas that I would like commentary on. Please feel free to comment on areas that I am overlooking. First whats going on in medical imaging? ie Osiris Second what is happening in Genomics/Protenomics/Cell Modeling? i.e. http://www.bioconductor.org/ What is happening in decision support/diagnostics? OpenPsyc etc etc Clinical Trial/ Research Software ie OIO Drug Database - i.e. Uversa effort EHR clinical i.e. MirrorMed/ClearHealth -- VOE EHR hospital ie. VistA/Care2x PHR ie Indivo Interoperability/MPI Mirth/OHF etc etc. There are lots of fine project lists out there. I do not want information that I could find on Google. I want the inside scoop! Who are the loosers who are the winners. In some of these areas I already know the answers, and I simply need a gut-check. In other areas I am truly ignorant. Feel free to email me privately if you want something to be off-the-record. Regards, -- Fred Trotter http://www.fredtrotter.com - - - - - - - - [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross project manager mendocino informatics 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.462.6369 [office] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.minformatics.com - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, BCS, 2006 - - - - - - - - Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask your question on www.Answers.yahoo.com
Re: [openhealth] SCALE talk
--- Tim Churches [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The African project OpenMRS (see http://openmrs.org/wiki/OpenMRS ) is, to my mind, the most exciting open source clinical application at present, in the field, good technical underpinnings, and charging ahead. Thanks Tim for this info, I was not aware of this project. It seems to be in development stage yet, and the link is http://openmrs.org It is using the same FOSS software as OSCAR BTW OSCAR is alive and well too! GNUmed (http://www.gnumed.org/ ), which is also technically very good, is finally getting somewhere after many, many years of effort. EHR hospital ie. VistA/Care2x I take my hat off to the Hospital OS team in Thailand: http://www.hospital-os.com/en/ Yes, unfortunately the English version of the new 3.0 is not available yet PHR ie Indivo Interoperability/MPI Mirth/OHF etc etc. Mirth looks exciting and well-executed, and we are keen to use it. Has anyone tested it or used it for serious work? Public health/epidemiology (think avian/pandemic influenza): OpenEpi is a useful tool: http://www.openepi.com/ Our own NetEpi project (see http://www.netepi.org ) is approaching its Version 1.0 release - V1.0beta and updated Web site by the end of Jan 2007, plus, I hope, a bootable liveCD demo disc, with V1.0 final to follow in Feb. The disaster Mangament Project Sahana, is developing a module for pandemics, and I will be joining in it's finalizing touches soon. http://www.sahana.lk/ Nandalal Tim C Looking for earth-friendly autos? Browse Top Cars by Green Rating at Yahoo! Autos' Green Center. http://autos.yahoo.com/green_center/
Re: [openhealth] Please help out my little website.
Done! :-) --- Ignacio Valdes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello all, I've written an original book review on Marcel Gagne's Moving to Free Software book on Linux Medical News. Book reviews tend to generate a lot of traffic for a website but the current queen of it all is Digg. If you have an account on digg.com and would like to help out my little website, please take a moment of time to vote for this well-written article to appear on the front page of digg, by going to this page: http://digg.com/linux_unix/Book_Review_Moving_to_Free_Software and clicking the 'digg it' link to the left. -- IV __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [openhealth] Open standards are meaningless.
--- David Forslund [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think EHR applications should be interoperable without having to use the same underlying code. Given some time and effort I would like to show that OpenEMed can accommodate the OpenEHR specifications. Since the archetypes are central to the OpenEHR and these are in turn dependent on terminologies, ontologies and vocabualries, how does OpenEMed support this? Is the Terminology Query Service sufficient to support these? Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. http://new.mail.yahoo.com
Re: [openhealth] Re: GPs Revolt
Thanks for the information. Nandalal --- David Chan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: PING is now called Indivo (http://indivohealth.org/) and the recent conference generated a lot of interests: http://www.pchri.org/2006/ Best regards, David David H Chan, MD, CCFP, MSc, FCFP Associate Professor Department of Family Medicine McMaster University - Original Message From: Nandalal Gunaratne [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: openhealth@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, November 27, 2006 10:41:32 AM Subject: Re: [openhealth] Re: GPs Revolt Why not hand over the keeping of the patient records to patients ( like PING), where clinicians just upload to this, and they also carry it with them in a storage format that is secure and easily accessible? The National Health Card Taiwan http://www.gi- de.com/portal/ page?_pageid= 42,55000 _dad=portal _schema=PORTAL --- Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] org wrote: thomas, i appreciate your concern for what you allege is dr. grove's naivete, but i share dr. grove's concern that when it comes to intelligent health information systems, the perfect is the enemy of the good. in the age of wikis, soa, voip, wifi and rfid there is no reason we cannot leverage existing secure internet transport and composing capabilities to substantially improve the interoperability of existing clinical text and image files. when i look at where dr. grove's fire is directed -- at overpriced enterprise packages that deliberately build new proprietary silos -- i find an ally who is saying the right disruptive things to people who would never listen to me. with best regards, [wr] - - - - - - - - On Nov 26, 2006, at 11:52 PM, Thomas Beale wrote: Will Ross wrote: With regard to the underestimated complexity of Healthcare IT, the recent comments by Andrew Grove are relevant. But a key problem with this plan is the lack of a good medical records system, Grove said. His solution? Not the complicated, expensive medical record-keeping system that many companies and health-care providers are trying to develop, but something much simplerthe use of existing mass-produced technologies. http://news- service.stanford .edu/news/ 2006/november8/ med- grove-110806. html classic complete naivete: Although there's debate about how to create a record that would be accessible to a range of providers and still protect files, Grove presented a simple answer: Keep medical records on a Web-accessible word-processing file. It costs nothing because it's already in place, Grove said. The technology already exists. === message truncated === Cheap talk? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. http://voice.yahoo.com
Re: [openhealth] Re: GPs Revolt
I would certainly like to help. Since I am a Surgeon interested in HIT (rather than a HIT specialist interested in surgery!), tell me how I could help, and I most certainly will. Best regards Nandalal --- Thomas Beale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Will Ross wrote: in other words, in my neighborhood a bunch of electronic clinical documents that are easily organized, securely stored and safely shared is an improvement over the current regime of inaccessible paper and electronic silos. and when semantically interoperable solutions arrive, we can consider them, if they are practical and suit the site level business processes of primary care. I take your point Will, that's completely fair. In terms of what has arrived so far, we actually have proper openEHR systems running now, full archetyping, templating and so on. Ours (Ocean Informatics) is being trialled in a number of countries. Functionally it does about 85% of everything openEHR promises, including templates, supporting archetype-based queries in a new query language (looks like SQL Xpath; this will be published soon), and the other 15% won't be long. I would like to know if anyone here is interested in being able to play with a demonstration system (located in Australia) over a web-service (published API); currently you would write C# code against a client-side DLL - the idea is to use the openEHR repository as a proper versioned, archetyped, semantically queryable back-end. This would be for the purpose of evaluating openEHR in a hands-on way. I don't want to get into arguments about open source at the moment - today it is closed source, but it will become open source as soon as we find an economic model that pays for what we release before we release it (and in any case, everything that we learn becomes part of the openEHR specifications, and eventually the Java project). So the offer is for people interested in contributing to openEHR / e-Health progress in general, with all feedback (code if wished) being made public. - thomas beale Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. http://new.mail.yahoo.com
Re: [openhealth] Re: GPs Revolt
Why not hand over the keeping of the patient records to patients ( like PING), where clinicians just upload to this, and they also carry it with them in a storage format that is secure and easily accessible? The National Health Card Taiwan http://www.gi-de.com/portal/page?_pageid=42,55000_dad=portal_schema=PORTAL --- Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: thomas, i appreciate your concern for what you allege is dr. grove's naivete, but i share dr. grove's concern that when it comes to intelligent health information systems, the perfect is the enemy of the good. in the age of wikis, soa, voip, wifi and rfid there is no reason we cannot leverage existing secure internet transport and composing capabilities to substantially improve the interoperability of existing clinical text and image files. when i look at where dr. grove's fire is directed -- at overpriced enterprise packages that deliberately build new proprietary silos -- i find an ally who is saying the right disruptive things to people who would never listen to me. with best regards, [wr] - - - - - - - - On Nov 26, 2006, at 11:52 PM, Thomas Beale wrote: Will Ross wrote: With regard to the underestimated complexity of Healthcare IT, the recent comments by Andrew Grove are relevant. But a key problem with this plan is the lack of a good medical records system, Grove said. His solution? Not the complicated, expensive medical record-keeping system that many companies and health-care providers are trying to develop, but something much simplerthe use of existing mass-produced technologies. http://news-service.stanford.edu/news/2006/november8/med- grove-110806.html classic complete naivete: Although there's debate about how to create a record that would be accessible to a range of providers and still protect files, Grove presented a simple answer: Keep medical records on a Web-accessible word-processing file. It costs nothing because it's already in place, Grove said. The technology already exists. there's nothing more to say. - thomas beale Yahoo! Groups Links [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross project manager mendocino informatics 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.462.6369 [office] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.minformatics.com - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, BCS, 2006 - - - - - - - - Yahoo! Groups Links Cheap talk? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. http://voice.yahoo.com
Re: [openhealth] Re: GPs Revolt
I presume you mean that holding it at the GP level is far more stable for the patient? Admin/manager changes can vary, and their approach to change as well. THerefore it all depends. As for change in underwear, this could vary as well, if you listen to this story :-) A customs officer was checking the bags at an airport, and there were three persons in a row. The first one had just one underwear, and the officer asked, just one? with some surprise. I wash it daily said the first person. The second had seven, and he said One for each day of the week. The third was a lady, really impressive having a dozen, until she said One is for January, One is for February Similarly, the changes in administration is not directly proportional to system changes and therefore to stability. The GP may not be good at keeping his data safe and if he is running windows without updating his virus guard, the EHR could just be gone with the wind --- Adrian Midgley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thomas Beale wrote: Having the shared EHR literally at the GP clinic is unlikely to be a good approach for technical reasons, even though the GP will in many cases be the best gatekeeper. A better solution is on secure servers at about the level of the primary care trust (UK) ** Stability ** We just lost 400 of those! I trained in a general practice which was then in its third century of continuous provision of medical care in its district. It had not been computerised so long, but since then it has changed systems, perforce, once already. (It also had a different building, different partners, and different patients, although significantly it had some of the same families on the list, I do not doubt.) General practices endure. Hospitals likewise. Health service administrative organisations are changed a little slower than underwear, but are far from constant. And the persistence of information between two avatars of essentially the same admin-org is similar to that on underwear. And that is the way the admindroids taking control of each new spasm like it - each wheel is reinvented, every 3 to 5 years. I agree about the technical reasons, but continuity is a huge merit. Cheap talk? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. http://voice.yahoo.com
Re: [openhealth] Re: GPs Revolt
10 years ago! Do you think that is still valid, now? Have you changed your views since then? If the patients record is held in different places, how does the patient keep up with the changes? Is it his responsibility to keep it completed and upto date? Maybe he should carry the version wth him in a e-card of some sort, especially in this era, when people are moving from country to country and suddenly need their records in a strange land! --- David Forslund [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Absolutely not! I do want the patient to be in control of his/her data, with GPs assisting. I believe in a distributed EMR with control by the patient. Sometimes we called this a Virtual Medical/Patient Record (about 10 years ago in a journaled publication). Dave Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: IT would seem to me that, what you favour is a system where, all patients will have their EMR with their GPs and nobody else and nowhere else. What is done in a hospital encounter, for example a Urological Surgery, Cardioloical tests, CT scan reports, will be sent to the GP for inclusion in the EMR. For this these must be interoperable with each other. Making the GP the crux of EMR development, recording and storing, makes sense as it is patient based. He will decide as to whom he will provide access? HE has also to ensure access without fail to the patient in an emergency, which may happen in another country at an ungodly hour. Unfortunately not every country has such a well developed, GP based system, as in the UK. Nandalal --- Adrian Midgley [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:amidgley2%40defoam.net wrote: David Forslund wrote: I tend to think that my notes, made by me, and sitting where they currently sit, upstairs in my Practice building, mean something. It is clear to me that anyone else who gets to read them, now or later, makes their own judgement about what they mean and to what degree of relevance and reliability, and so do I for others' notes. So providing the means for other people to negotiate access to my stored notes seems sensible, they will interpret them in the light of whatever is going on, and the next person will do _their_ own thing. Pushing them all into one heap, or passing them around into everyone's heap until none of us know which are ours and which are some school-leaver's is a different and semantically inferior process. -- A __ Cheap talk? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. http://voice.yahoo.com http://voice.yahoo.com __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [openhealth] Re: GPs Revolt
--- Adrian Midgley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: as The Rt Hon Mr Anthony Blair MP steps back to being a back bench MP, the plan is likely to fall apart. I hope not! In the sense that the NHS forgets about plans for EMR. Maybe a more sensible and practical approach will result? Nandalal -- Midgley Not by any means an astute political commentator, but occasionally known to get it right. Yahoo! Music Unlimited Access over 1 million songs. http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited
Re: [openhealth] Re: GPs Revolt
IT would seem to me that, what you favour is a system where, all patients will have their EMR with their GPs and nobody else and nowhere else. What is done in a hospital encounter, for example a Urological Surgery, Cardioloical tests, CT scan reports, will be sent to the GP for inclusion in the EMR. For this these must be interoperable with each other. Making the GP the crux of EMR development, recording and storing, makes sense as it is patient based. He will decide as to whom he will provide access? HE has also to ensure access without fail to the patient in an emergency, which may happen in another country at an ungodly hour. Unfortunately not every country has such a well developed, GP based system, as in the UK. Nandalal --- Adrian Midgley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David Forslund wrote: I tend to think that my notes, made by me, and sitting where they currently sit, upstairs in my Practice building, mean something. It is clear to me that anyone else who gets to read them, now or later, makes their own judgement about what they mean and to what degree of relevance and reliability, and so do I for others' notes. So providing the means for other people to negotiate access to my stored notes seems sensible, they will interpret them in the light of whatever is going on, and the next person will do _their_ own thing. Pushing them all into one heap, or passing them around into everyone's heap until none of us know which are ours and which are some school-leaver's is a different and semantically inferior process. -- A Cheap talk? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. http://voice.yahoo.com
Re: [openhealth] Needed: (mammographic) recall with some tracking
that could prompt and print mammogram requests over the 10 years of our surveillance? What do they mean exactly by requests? Ideally it would be a program which would also act as a very basic database of patients such that we could recall all basic details (i.e. Node positives or Grade 3s) for audit and research etc. Strangely there are hardly any open source programs to do this sort of thing - research and audit. They are made for either clinical practice or for full blown EMRs. I suppose one could use open office base to make a small database which one could query. The best FOSS program for research and audit that I have seen and use is Open Infrastructure for Outcomes. However it is complicated to setup, unless they download and use the LiveOIO CD or, are adventerous enough to do the setting up. So far, it cannot be used in Windows, but can be used as a livecd and the data saved to a usb or HDD running Windows. If they use Linux and a debian variant like Ubuntu, things become simpler. If any programs for research and audit are available, I would like to hear about them and compare with OIO. Best regards Nandalal What approach does the panel favour to offering a supportable open source approach to this? -- Adrian Midgley __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] FOIAVistA SemiVivA 20060615 available
You said: As always, critiques, comments and questions are welcome. Are you serious? If you are, let me request that a document on how to use this, once installed, with a real example, with screenshots where necessary be put up. Without this it is useless. The LiveCD you kindly sent me was not helpful for the above reason. http://sourceforge.net/forum/forum.php?forum_id=342412 The questions asked in this forum also show what I am talking about. You said: I don't know enough about VistA to tell you how to run it. For that, you will need to join the mailing list This is not quite OK. Do you know anyone who will write a document specific to your downloadable version? I am sure if we can get it working, we can send you some documentation for the WorldVistA version ourselves! Nandalal --- K.S. Bhaskar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Downloadable from the WorldVistA project page at Source Forge (http://sourceforge.net/projects/worldvista), FOIA VistA SemiVivA 20060615 is a package of FOIA VistA June 15, 2006 with OR_30_215 and GT.M V5.1-000. To install, download the release to a directory, e.g., /Distrib. Then as root excute: cd /usr/local tar zxvf /Distrib/FOIAVistASemiVivA20060615.tgz This will create the needed subdirectories off /usr/local. Then, to install a development environment, e.g., in ~/myVistA, execute as a normal user: /usr/local/FOIAVistA20060615/install ~/myVistA Once a development environment is installed, you can run it (as a normal user) with: ~/myVistA/run Or to start at an entry point, e.g., P^DI: ~/myVistA/run P^DI As always, critiques, comments and questions are welcome. -- Bhaskar __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Yahoo! Groups gets a make over. See the new email design. http://us.click.yahoo.com/XISQkA/lOaOAA/yQLSAA/W4wwlB/TM ~- Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Re: VistA Office as 'open' EHR software
CPRS source is in the public domain but needs Delphi to run. The version runs only in Windows. It can be made to run in Linux using Wine, but just barely. A commercial organization has come forward to create something based on Wine that will run CPRS in Linux, as well as it does in Windows. Therefore it will remain dependent on a commercial product even on linux! But if it works, this is acceptable in my opinion, as CPRS itself can be modified by anyone subsequently. Nandalal --- Gregory Woodhouse [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jun 25, 2006, at 5:18 AM, Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: In addition, there can be claims for various developers of the GUI for VistA, which was not in the Public Domain. Nandalal I'm unsure what you mean here. CPRS was built using a commercial product called Delphi. but the source is in the public domain. Granted, if someone set out today to develop an open source product, this would be an unlikely platform choice, but that's not the way VistA started out life. I believe that alternative user interfaces have been developed as well, but they are different products, not VistA. There are a few options for building GUI interfaces to VistA, and there is nothing to stop developers from building new GUI applications for use in conjunction with VistA if they wish. Gregory Woodhouse [EMAIL PROTECTED] Judge a man by his questions not his answers. --Voltaire [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Great things are happening at Yahoo! Groups. See the new email design. http://us.click.yahoo.com/TISQkA/hOaOAA/yQLSAA/W4wwlB/TM ~- Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Re: VistA Office as 'open' EHR software
Thank you for clearing many things. However, the way VistA is developing and branching out, will create many problems in the future. I hope World Vista takes suitable precautions to ensure that future users of the FOSS version of World VistA, will not get into difficulties as you have pointed out in your last sentence. In addition, there can be claims for various developers of the GUI for VistA, which was not in the Public Domain. Nandalal --- sickleofzeus [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While I have not studied the MUMPS licensing issues closely, mixing proprietary licensing with public domain domain software causes problems. It is not clear how VistA is going to be able to surmount these legal quandaries. __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- See what's inside the new Yahoo! Groups email. http://us.click.yahoo.com/2pRQfA/bOaOAA/yQLSAA/W4wwlB/TM ~- Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] VistA Office as 'open' EHR software
Thanks Joseph, for the clarification. It is good to know that the value of the open source model is becoming more accepted and that in the future, GUI based versions of VistA too, will be open source. What type of open source licence is likely to be used for these implementations? Public Domain is a bit tricky on the legal front, as legally it is owned by the US Public, and therefore, the US government. They could refuse certain countries the free use of VistA for political reasons for example? Please clarify. Nandalal Joseph Dal Molin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hopefully the following facts about VistA and VistA-Office (VOE) will set the record straight about their claim to openness: First a couple of points of clarification: WorldVistA, not I, was awarded the tender by the Iowa Foundation for Medical Care in May of last year to establish the VistA-Office Vendor Support Organization (VVSO). IFMC is the prime contractor to CMS for VistA-Office. My role was writing the RFP response for WorldVistA and I am WorldVistA's program manager for the VVSO. Regarding the Wisconsin QIO initiative that Dan mentioned: one of the QIO's roles is to provide impartial advice to physicians to help them select an EHR. The QIO's are funded to do this work by CMS. Unfortunately the QIO's direct funding of a VOE port to Linux fell into a gray area which would have created a potential for conflict of interest. It was for this reason the parties involved decided it was best not to proceed. Ironically, this disappointment was a blessing in disguise as we have applied a large number of enhancements to VOE since last summer, bringing it up to date with FOIA VistA. Our plans are to port VOE to a full open source stack in the next couple of weeks. ...now to the discussion at hand ~ FOIA VistA (the version released under the Freedom of Information Act by the VA) is public domain software and as such the source code is free to be downloaded and used in any way you want. It can be downloaded from the VA's FTP sitethis version requires a proprietary database to run. Alternatively you can download a full open source stack of VistA based on GT.M and Linux from the WorldVistA Sourceforge site (www.worldvista.org). FOIA VistA has been available as public domain for over 15 years through the VA. The open source stack has been available from WorldVistA for about 3 years. It is an open source stack which is currently being implemented by the Mexican government's IMSS healthcare agency, which is implementing VistA in 200 public hospitals. ~ VistA Office EHR, whose development is funded by CMS (Centers for Medicaid and Medicare) is currently in beta testing and will also be made available primarily as public domain software when this process is complete late this year. Although as I will explain shortly, some parts of it will have an open source license. An evaluation version has been available for download since last August by registering at the WorldVistA VVSO web page (http://www.worldvista.org/vvso/add). The software comes bundled with a vendor qualification test which we are using to determine whether vendors are qualified to support VOE. So far 6 vendors have passed the test. Initial VOE development was indeed a closed processit was the traditional contracting and development model you find in gov't and private industry. This is not surprising given that the open source model was very unfamiliar territory to CMS nearly 3 years ago when the project was conceived. Over the past year the development process has been gradually, all be it quietly, opening up. This in part was a result of WorldVistA's role in the project expanding and because IFMC and CMS became more familiar with the strategic value of the open source model and how open, collaborative development can be managed. We have in the past few months begun accepting external contributions to VOE and are currently in the process of integrating code developed by VOE Solutions (which is LGPL) and the Pacific Telehealth Hui. Suffice it to say that the open source approach has become a key strategic building block for VOE's future. The bottom line is that VistA, while public domain, is definitely open source and has a large, growing and very active community of users and developersjust visit the Hardhats mailing list archive on Sourceforge. As for VOE, while its development was initially closed, the plan has always been to make it available as public domain. The development process for VOE is now open and as the full infrastructure needed to support collaborative development is better established community participation will be more proactively encouraged. Regards, Joseph VP Business Development, WorldVistA Tim Cook wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi Dan,
Re: [openhealth] VistA Office as 'open' EHR software
I agree with Tim. VistA has a lot going for it, but there are some good fully FOSS projects that can be developed further. They are build on modern languages and well established FOSS - like LAMP. The end users are more IT literate now than at the time VistA started, and would like to be able to modify things easily themselves. I fail to see VistA developing in a true FOSS way, and the various implementations will cause legal confusion with time as to where the open source bits of software end and proprietary begins. Nandalal Tim Cook [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi Dan, Please note that this reply must be assumed to NOT be sarcastic. Just my (hopefully) reasoned, if pointed, opinion. Daniel L. Johnson wrote: But... this is our best hope for non-proprietary EHR software in the USA, and is worth pursuing. I believe there is a lot of room for disagreement here. First of all are you distinguishing between VistA and VistA-Office? Because at this point I would judge VistA-Office as proprietary if the code cannot be downloaded or even obtained through a FOIA request. The idea of this being a best hope is certainly misleading and I would like to know what facts you base that assertion on. There are other EMR applications that from all appearances are being supported rather successfully by dependable vendors. The best part is that they already are open source, sustainable and experiencing incremental improvements through customer funded desires. No softening needed. There's been considerable softening of the government position on use and sharing of VistA code, and so we all need to continue to encourage CMS (the agency formerly known as HCFA) to permit open, collaborative development on the VistA-Office code, and to support its use and propagation on open-source platforms. So for those that knowwho is the PERSON that we should encourage (within) CMS? Pointing to a shapeless, soulless bureaucracy is not very helpful. A year ago, I had forged an initiative by the Wisconsin QIO (Quality Improvement Organization) to fund development of VistA-Office on Linux, and distribution, but we were prohibited by CMS from proceeding. That doesn't bode well for community supported, sustainable software now does it? Joseph Dal Molin was then awarded a contract by CMS to develop vendor training for VistA Office, and anyone who wants to form a company to support this open VistA Office is welcome to work with Joseph to help make this truly OS and collaborative. Anyone who could do so, should. Otherwise, don't complain. The same can be said for end-users that constantly complain that they don't have an open source EMR when in fact there are several available if they were to make a decision to implement one and get on with it. In fact, this is even an easier solution than forming a company based on supporting a proprietary MUMPS based EMR. Implementing an EMR is a painful process for the end-user, but essentially the same process no matter which one is chosen. Building a business supporting a proprietary EMR (defined as one where you do not have access to inspect the source code and participate in the ongoing design and development) would be a much greater financial risk. IMHO of course. In any case, VistA Office is committed to remaining code-compatible with the official VA system VistA, So then there will only be one VistA? IF not ... What are the differences? Why the different name? and the VA is not currently willing to subject its code to free and open collaborative development Ok. - -- so collaboration on VistA Office will have to occur in the presentation layer. So are you saying that someone (outside the VA) has or will start and run an open source VistA-Office presentation project? I would be interested in hearing your sustainability model for that. Certainly would be difficult to build a support business on it since any end-user willing to use a proprietary EMR would just as likely chose the proprietary presentation. This is not an entirely bad thing; ...and what part of that is not a bad thing for people that want to use and support open source software? and if that develops, my guess is that useful pressure could be put on the VA to crack open a bit. If what develops? I didn't understand the context of that phrase. Dan Johnson, md (open-source EHR fan, Hm, I would question the veracity of that characterization based on this email. QIO trustee, Very nice. simple backwoods internist) self-deprecation is seldom flattering. Cheers, Tim -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.3rc2 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFEl+T9MOzvb7luwR0RAgYPAKCbiFRsFTzRVSbu0ADOtKF8qKudIQCgsdNR
Re: [openhealth] Re: OSHCA
I second what Tim says. Do not think of the politics/politicians of the country concerned, but of the ordinary people of that country, who form the WASTE majority! Your expertise is of value to them. Tim.Churches [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David Forslund wrote: I apologize for bringing this up, but it does affect my relationship with OSHCA since it is being incorporated in Malaysia. I will be unable to support OSHCA in Malaysia because of the politics/human rights issues I see happening in that country. I am sorry that you feel that way, Dave. However, it is your call and I don't think it is productive or wise to try to change your mind. We will have a separate OSHCA mailing list established very shortly which will handle all OSHCA business, and this openhealth list can be devoted purely to more general health informatics issues. I hope you will continue to participate in the openhealth list, because your technical expertise is greatly valued. Tim C K.S. Bhaskar wrote: Please, let's keep the discussion on this mailing list focused on Free/Libré and Open Source Software (with a broad interpretation of software, so discussion of ICD codes and OSHCA incorporation are within the scope of the group) as it pertains to healthcare. There are plenty of other forums for other topics. Thank you very much. Regards -- Bhaskar SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Feel free to call! Free PC-to-PC calls. Low rates on PC-to-Phone. Get Yahoo! Messenger with Voice [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Beyond standards.
I think your argument to convince business is pretty good, if they are accepting it. In the same way we mayed a way to convince them that the use of interoperability also saves them a lot of money in the long term and gives them bargaining power when purchasing software from different vendors. Nandalal Thomas Beale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David Forslund wrote: I am familiar with this problem. It seems to me to stem from negotiating the wrong kind of contract. I don't think FOSS helps that much because the contracts seem to me to be negotiated from ignorance. If the local organization demands interoperability BEFORE they sign a contract they will have more power over the provider. If they don't understand the technology this is a little bit off the topic, but Dave's comments here just reminded me to post something we have been finding useful in negotiating contracts (as a software vendor) where the software is FOSS (my company, Ocean Informatics is offering a GPL or commercial licence choice to buyers). Anyway, recently we had a conversation during the negotiation phase with one very large (typically skeptical) company that wanted our software development expertise but of course wanted to own all the software we developed for them. We on the other hand try to build things very generically, and don't want to go around having to rewrite all the time due to not having access to the IP. We took a pretty strong stance in the negotiation on open source. In the end it came down to them saying: why should we pay you to develop your product? Well, of course we said the obvious things like: - it's your product too. You set the requirements, not us - you'll get the benefit of maintenance and bugfixing due to wider use than just you - etc But in the end the argument that they understood was this: - every piece of software has a total cost over its lifetime. It is commonly accepted that the build cost to first deployment is roughly 30% and that the cost of maintenance and enhancement over the remaining life of the product is 70% (obviously this varies but it's a pretty common figure given in the literature). - so you (the customer) are paying for 30% of the total cost, upfront for a generic component. - we (the builder) pick up 70% of the cost, in an incremental ongoing fashion. - You get free access for the life of the product. Now, if we just charge reasonable contracting rates to get the thing built, the price the customer pays is the price of building it. But what they get is a lifetime of use, including all updates, upgrades etc etc. This is all obvious to people on this list, but not to most corporate customers. I don't know if this particular way of justifying open source in contracts is commonly used or described in the open source literature, but for convincing hard-nosed businesses who are most interested in monetary arguments, it works quite well. - thomas beale Yahoo! Groups Links - New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] article re IBM and others contributing open source epi and other
This is another interesting paragraph A statement from IBM said the company will engage with industry leaders. But it did not mention whether it will coordinate efforts with the so-called Interoperability Consortiuma group of large IT vendors including IBM, Cisco Systems Inc., Microsoft Corp. and Oracle Corp.who banded together to call for open standards to be used in any national health information network. Nanda Heitzso [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Not sure what pieces of this are relevant, but it raised a flag for me (was posted on LinuxToday.com). One of the interesting sentences: IBM has created a software framework, IHII (Interoperable Healthcare Information Infrastructure), to ease sharing of health data. http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1963157,00.asp - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Feel free to call! Free PC-to-PC calls. Low rates on PC-to-Phone. Get Yahoo! Messenger with Voice [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] What to Call the OpenEMR/ClearHealth/FreeMed/MirrorMed Universe?
Is NetEpi based on EpiInfo or something growing out of that?? I used EpiInfo it some years ago and can remember writing to the CDC to create a linux version :-) Regards Nanda Gunaratne Tim.Churches [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ignacio Valdes wrote: Linux Apache MySQL PHP server setups are so common that they have their own designation, collectively called 'LAMP' applications. It seems that in the United States, the hotbeds of FOSS Electronic Medical Records (EMR)'s activity are falling into two universes: that based upon the VA's VistA and a consortium of groups using a combination of OpenEMR, ClearHealth, FreeMed, FreeB and MirrorMed which also happen to be LAMP applications. Might there be a term currently to call the latter? Could this apparently thriving community invent one? We use Linux, apache, Python and PostgreSQL for our NetEpi applications. Does that make us LAPPlanders, or LAPPis (Wikipedia tells me that Lappi is the Finnish name for Lapland). Tim C - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Standards -- more questions
ICD-10 has tried to be more accurate in making the diagnosis, thereby going into great detail, with the obvious effects of bloat. The ICD-10 -PCS is taking quite the opposite way of doing things, but could be difficult to get people to use it for this reason. They will not have their favorite ways of describing an operation, but will have to create it from set and defined nomenclature. I have personally used it in over 1000, mostly major, surgical procedures without any serious issues. Nanda Gunaratne Heitzso [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I do *strongly* recommend researching human engineering studies re determine whether a fine granularity such as is provided by ICD-10, which may be very accurate from a technical point of view, does, in practice, provide more accuracy than a lower granularity encoding. If such a study does not exist then some psychiatrists should be consulted re the ability of humans when, under stress, to accurately assign diseases to one of 10,000 buckets. I do know that the CDC has to scrub all incoming data to get rid of the obvious data encoding errors such as women with testicular diseases and men with vaginal diseases. That scrubbing catches only the obvious encoding problems. Second, to at least understand the data inference problem imposed by a fine granularity standard encoding when mapping from a lower granularity to the finer granularity. - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] What to Call the OpenEMR/ClearHealth/FreeMed/MirrorMed Universe?
Thank you for the detailed explanation. I will tell some people who are into epideomological aspects of healthcare to look at Netepi. Regards Nanda Gunaratne Tim Churches [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Is NetEpi based on EpiInfo or something growing out of that?? I used EpiInfo it some years ago and can remember writing to the CDC to create a linux version :-) Not based on Epi-Info but inspired by it - see http://www.netepi.info - that page is rather out of date - we'll update it in the near future - but the motivation behind the projects hasn't changed. As far as I know CDC are not contemplating a version of Epi-Info for non-MS-Windows platforms. There was an attempt about 5 or 6 years ago to convert the old Epi-Info version 6 for MS-DOS to a Linux terminal mode programme, but I understand that not all of the necessary source code could be obtained from CDC under a Freedom of Information request, and the project foundered. I think that Jens Lauritsen hopes to create a Linux GUI version of EpiData, which currently only runs on MS-Windows, at some stage - see http://www.epidata.dk/ However EpiData is not open source, although Jens says that it may become open source at some stage in the future. Also, Andy Dean, one of the original authors of Epi-info, is now one of the people behind the open source OpenEpi project - which provides epidemiological calculators in pure _javascript_ - see http://www.openepi.com Finally, we plan to create versions of both NetEpi Case Manager and NetEpi Analysis which can run on MS-Windows machines as well as, as they do at at present, on Linux, Unix and Mac OS X. The port to MS-Windows should be fairly trivial, since the applications use Web browser interfaces and the underlying infrastructure of Python and PostgreSQL are both cross-platform, but in practice it is never quite that simple and we want to complete Version 1.0 of each app first. Tim C - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Standards
James Busser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is the way it is and multiple licences are necessary depending on the number of users. Maybe things have changed recently? Nanda Gunaratne On May 11, 2006, at 8:23 AM, David Forslund wrote: In the US (and UK) SNOMED-CT is freely available. Do folks use the ICPC-2 spec? If so what do you all think of it? I thought it was only available freely within geographic boundaries and, within that, possibly only to members of certain organizations. Which limits the ability to roll it out more broadly. Is that correct and is any significant loosening on the immediate horizon? SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Mail goes everywhere you do. Get it on your phone. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Standards -- more questions
Alvin B. Marcelo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Any thoughts about that statement? Can we actually call a standard open if there are limitations to its implementation by FOSS? No. Unless the limitation is due to the laziness of the FOSS developers ;-) Nanda Gunaratne alvin --- Nandalal Gunaratne [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Alvin B. Marcelo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You are quite right. Interoperability depends in turn on the agreement on standards. Coding systems included. Unfortunately the best nomenclature coding system is SNOMED-CT which is a proprietary product. But I am sure the new versions of the ICD system will improve if they are widely used. Can our group agree on such standards? Nanda Gunaratne However, my question to the group is: can there actually be interoperability without agreement on coding systems? And if we accept the fact that yes we need to share coding systems, what coding systems should these be and why. I believe this is an area where openhealth can greatly contribute by laying down these 'open' standards upon which future interoperabilty can be made more possible. alvin SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Standards -- more questions
This is the ideal. But if the differences between the two are substantial, it could be a lot of work. IDC-9 was never made for electronic medical records - just paper. I am not sure if ICD-10 is, but it is more likely to be electronically usable. ICD-10-PCS on the other hand was made exclusively (almost!) for use in electronic databases. Nanda Gunaratne Joseph Dal Molin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ...some thoughts... What would standardizing on ICD-10 mean in the context of an organization such as OSHCA given the reality the heterogenous landscape of ICD adoption... what would this mean in real practice? What would this imply for those systems using ICD - 9 for example? Would it be more appropriate to support the notion of being able to plug in a standard like ICD and use it than only a specific version? Joseph Alvin B. Marcelo wrote: First thread: I propose we standardize on ICD-10 (as a minimum). It's an international standard anyway (albeit difficult to use). This of course does not preclude the others from using SNOMED if they can afford to do so. That being the case, OSHCA can also 'standardize' on the preferred mapping system between SNOMED to ICD-10. Any proposals? Molly, how do 'sweeping statements' like these get to be approved officially by OSHCA? Second thread: An interesting insight I got at the last Regional Conference in Open Standards sponsored by NECTEC and IOSN in Bangkok (May 2-4) -- an Intel smployee (Danese) emphasized that open standards may only be considered open if they can be fully implemented by open source software. Any thoughts about that statement? Can we actually call a standard open if there are limitations to its implementation by FOSS? alvin --- Nandalal Gunaratne [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Alvin B. Marcelo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You are quite right. Interoperability depends in turn on the agreement on standards. Coding systems included. Unfortunately the best nomenclature coding system is SNOMED-CT which is a proprietary product. But I am sure the new versions of the ICD system will improve if they are widely used. Can our group agree on such standards? Nanda Gunaratne However, my question to the group is: can there actually be interoperability without agreement on coding systems? And if we accept the fact that yes we need to share coding systems, what coding systems should these be and why. I believe this is an area where openhealth can greatly contribute by laying down these 'open' standards upon which future interoperabilty can be made more possible. alvin SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=msk=Software+distributionw1=Software+distributionw2=Salon+softwarew3=Medical+softwarew4=Software+associationw5=Software+jewelryw6=Software+deploymentc=6s=142.sig=XcuzZXUhhqAa4nls1QYuCg Salon software http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=msk=Salon+softwarew1=Software+distributionw2=Salon+softwarew3=Medical+softwarew4=Software+associationw5=Software+jewelryw6=Software+deploymentc=6s=142.sig=CW98GQRF3_rWnTxU62jsdA Medical software http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=msk=Medical+softwarew1=Software+distributionw2=Salon+softwarew3=Medical+softwarew4=Software+associationw5=Software+jewelryw6=Software+deploymentc=6s=142.sig=86bMQqtlpuDBvFzrRcQApw Software association http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=msk=Software+associationw1=Software+distributionw2=Salon+softwarew3=Medical+softwarew4=Software+associationw5=Software+jewelryw6=Software+deploymentc=6s=142.sig=YhKUbszKHqjPXh21AbTSwg Software jewelry http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=msk=Software+jewelryw1=Software+distributionw2=Salon+softwarew3=Medical+softwarew4=Software+associationw5=Software+jewelryw6=Software+deploymentc=6s=142.sig=9EWe0V3gtVyQaCqOgchvlw Software deployment http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=msk=Software+deploymentw1=Software+distributionw2=Salon+softwarew3=Medical+softwarew4=Software+associationw5=Software+jewelryw6=Software+deploymentc=6s=142.sig=VNvgzp250z70B2EFV3JYqg YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
Re: [openhealth] Standards -- more questions
David Forslund [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes. Let us decide which of these nationally decided ones we should support. Regards Nanda Gunaratne It isn't clear to me the role that OSHCA can/should play in the standards world. It might be useful for the community to agree on things that everyone will support, but that alone doesn't make it a standard. Standards my be dictated by national entities or other bodies outside the control of OSHCA. Alvin B. Marcelo wrote: First thread: I propose we standardize on ICD-10 (as a minimum). It's an international standard anyway (albeit difficult to use). This of course does not preclude the others from using SNOMED if they can afford to do so. That being the case, OSHCA can also 'standardize' on the preferred mapping system between SNOMED to ICD-10. Any proposals? UMLS has some such mappings, I believe. If SNOMED isn't free outside the US and UK, it isn't clear how one could agree on a mapping. Molly, how do 'sweeping statements' like these get to be approved officially by OSHCA? Second thread: An interesting insight I got at the last Regional Conference in Open Standards sponsored by NECTEC and IOSN in Bangkok (May 2-4) -- an Intel smployee (Danese) emphasized that open standards may only be considered open if they can be fully implemented by open source software. Any thoughts about that statement? Can we actually call a standard open if there are limitations to its implementation by FOSS? The question is what types of limitations are we talking about. ASTM's CCR, for example, costs money but can easily be implemented in open source without any licensing issues. There is an open source implementation of HL7 V3 in Java but it requires the HL7 RIM to properly function and this costs money to use (but not to deploy?). People have argued that the OMG specs might be encumbered by a patent and thus don't want to implement them in open source. But many areas of software are in this category that they might be encumbered by a patent, so I argue this is a red herring. We have existence proofs that OMG specs can be implemented in open source. It might be possible to implement CPT codes in open source, but not to be able to deploy it for free. I don't think open source necessarily implies free. This is the old argument as to what one means by free. (as in beer vs ideas). Dave alvin --- Nandalal Gunaratne [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Alvin B. Marcelo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You are quite right. Interoperability depends in turn on the agreement on standards. Coding systems included. Unfortunately the best nomenclature coding system is SNOMED-CT which is a proprietary product. But I am sure the new versions of the ICD system will improve if they are widely used. Can our group agree on such standards? Nanda Gunaratne However, my question to the group is: can there actually be interoperability without agreement on coding systems? And if we accept the fact that yes we need to share coding systems, what coding systems should these be and why. I believe this is an area where openhealth can greatly contribute by laying down these 'open' standards upon which future interoperabilty can be made more possible. alvin SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Zombie hacker pleads guilty to hospital infection
Jason Tan Boon Teck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well anything making the work of an evil mind more difficult is worth it :-) Total security being a myth. Nanda On 5/12/06, Franklin M. Siler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On May 11, 2006, at 10:22 PM, Jason Tan Boon Teck wrote: BeatriX has a nifty feature - copy image of CD to HDD, and then use that image from that point onwards. It's remains as a single image file on the HDD and would require a uber l33t to hack that. I'm afraid that statement uses some flawed logic. If a machine is compromised and an attacker gains enough privileges, it is possible to write to the drive, regardless of whether it was copied from a CD or not. It is not impossible to compromise but he sure needs to go through a lot of hoops. The image is an iso image of a compressed HDD install. None of the binaries are in expanded form and are expanded on the fly. One would have to perform a reverse of this just to modify them. If the compromise do not require a HDD write to the executable directories, then it would be easier to take over. Also, running off a CD doesn't *really* make you that much safer; it just means that an attacker can't write changes to disk. An attacker can certainly compromise your running system. You can reboot, of course, and there's no way for him to plant a backdoor, but the vulnerability will still be there. Access time is now limited to HDD speed. That's true, but you're no better off than any normal hard drive install. This is to address the weakness of slow optical drive access. -- Franklin M. Siler UIUC: Undergraduate, Computer Science http://www.silerfamily.net/~fms/ http://www.silerfamily.net/%7Efms/ Regards, -- Jason Tan Boon Teck [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messengers low PC-to-Phone call rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Re: request for advice re electronic medical record
Nice thoughts! If you are having Zope on your server i hope you tried Open Infrastructure for Outcomes, which is the best software for research and audit for clinicians you can get! Torch is another quite complete and usable system running on Zope. I have setup OSCAR on Ubuntu Breezy and would gladly help anyone to set it up. All the above are running on my server as well. Best regards Nanda Gunaratne sickleofzeus [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Karsten, Also, please do be specific in your statements: how usable for me, as a physician, in private practice may or may not actually mean can do US billing which is all I care about. I don't use any of the electronic health records to do billing. I use an old DOS based practice management system that is lightning fast and very efficient at what it does and have not been very motivated to change until these new systems have had some time to mature. I am referring to the projects in their ability to help a physician (and practitioners) provide better health care. So the issue of whether a particular program does billing or not has never really affected my decision making process. I lurked on the GnuMed developers mailing list for a long time. After many months, I finally got tired of waiting for your team to decide that you could call GnuMed anything more than pre-alpha. I am relieved to hear that GnuMed is close to an official release. While I use OpenEMR, I am actually promoting and supporting all free open source medical software. While on this list I have read a lot of volatile, fractious comments. I would rather this group be working together towards a common goal instead trying to determine who is king. SO my comments are not directed to a specific developer but to the community of developers who subscribe to this list. I have started a not-for-profit company, Open Source Medical Software, to promote all of the open source electronic health records. I have been serving primarily the OpenEMR community but want to see all of the different projects succeeding. I am already operating a version of OpenEMR on this server. So I have late models of PHP, MySQL, Apache 1.3.*, Python, SQL-Ledger, PostgreSQL, ZOPE and Plone already functioning on this server. OSCAR would take some additional configuration due to the JAVA Tomcat requirements. It is difficult for the average open source user to set up working systems especially with the more difficult configurations like OSCAR. Would any of the developers from MirrorMed, GnuMed, TORCH, and OSCAR be willing to set up demo programs of their software on www.openmedsoftware.org ? Each of these projects has a number of features that are note worthy. I know that you, Karsten, personally have put in many hours of the GnuMed back end database and take your schema very seriously. Setting up these systems would give average users a single location to shop and compare. Sam Bowen, MD Hickory, NC SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] request for advice re electronic medical record
Jel Coward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Have you got the latest build with the greater granularity of permissions? OSCAR 2.1.0 is what I am experimenting with. -- Jel Coward SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1cent;/min. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] request for advice re electronic medical record
Jel Coward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Have you got the latest build with the greater granularity of permissions? OSCAR 2.1.0 is what I am experimenting with. -- Jel Coward SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messengers low PC-to-Phone call rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Standards
Alvin B. Marcelo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You are quite right. Interoperability depends in turn on the agreement on standards. Coding systems included. Unfortunately the best nomenclature coding system is SNOMED-CT which is a proprietary product. But I am sure the new versions of the ICD system will improve if they are widely used. Can our group agree on such standards? Nanda Gunaratne However, my question to the group is: can there actually be interoperability without agreement on coding systems? And if we accept the fact that yes we need to share coding systems, what coding systems should these be and why. I believe this is an area where openhealth can greatly contribute by laying down these 'open' standards upon which future interoperabilty can be made more possible. alvin SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Zombie hacker pleads guilty to hospital infection
Bhaskar, KS [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Let me take an even stronger position. If you really want to secure your network of PCs, you should run the OS off a Linux live CD-ROM which cannot be infected. It is so straightforward to create customized Linux live CDs, that I see no reason to not use them. It's very hard to infect a live CD, and even if it does get infected, a simple reboot will clean the machine. I have done this, but the problem is that we do have to save the data that is added on, and this data is saved on to some medium which has to be writeable. Therefore the data remains vulnarable each time it is uploaded to use on the software running in memory off a live CD. It is also my experience that the software freezes much more often whne running off a live CD for long periods, than when running off the HDD. It has it's benefits, but not a great practical solution, nor safe enough, as one may want to assume. Best regards Nanda Gunaratne -- Bhaskar SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Get amazing travel prices for air and hotel in one click on Yahoo! FareChase [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Standards
David Forslund [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The coding system standards in the US have been specified by CHI. We should share coding systems, but even more important is to provide mappings between coding systems, since not everyone will ever use the same coding system. OSS could lead by example. Proprietary systems are moving rapidly in this direction. The ASTM CCR enables one to describe an event in multiple coding systems. The ASTM CCR isn't free, but the cost is nominal and isn't per site. The OpenEHR project is also setting these standards, but not using a coding system. It uses archetypes to describe every clinical item in a standard and explicit manner. It could be able to map to different coding systems as well. OpenEHR is free and FOSS. The ASTM CCR has some inconsistencies in exported reports. Take the chronological order for example. Encounters are from the oldest to the latest from top to bottom and Results are the other way. There is also a large amount of text fields in use which means coding becomes useless or difficult. Dave alvin SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Get amazing travel prices for air and hotel in one click on Yahoo! FareChase [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Zombie hacker pleads guilty to hospital infection
Bhaskar, KS [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It has it's benefits, but not a great practical solution, nor safe enough, as one may want to assume. [KSB] Like perfection, absolute security does not exist in this universe. All we can do is make intelligent trade-offs! Yes! This truth makes the liveCD a good solution, and the reason that i used it! The LiveCD must be closed on writing, not multisession, and on CDR not CDRW. You maybe aware the Puppy linux live CD/CVD/USBpen/flashcard etc. is capable of writing to its own CD/DVD/ :-) Yes you can run them off all types of media, not just CDs. I call them MOLLS (MObile Live Linux Systems!) - have one hanging on your arm, whereever you go ;-) Regards Nanda Regards -- Bhaskar SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] request for advice re electronic medical record
Could you please explain the difference between the Templates (there are quite a few of these, but very basic) and the eforms? If one needs to add patient data regarding the procedures they undergo, what is the best approach? I believe that all the data is stored in the MYSQL database, and PDFs are generated to print out a report. The similarity between the UI of the receptionist and the doctor is a bit unnerving :-) Nanda Gunaratne Jel Coward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tim.Churches wrote: Tim (or anyone else familiar with OSCAR), Can you elaborate on this? What sort of data is being stored solely in PDFs, presumably as BLOBs in a table, or in the filesystem with pointers to them in a table? I can conceive of several circumstances in which storage of PDFs would be quite OK eg scanned copies of paper correspondence, given that paper is still by far the most common modality for health communication, and copies of outgoing reports and correspondence. As far as I know OSCAR only uses pdfs for scanned in paper (and some printing). Even if such reports were generated entirely from data in the database, there may be a business or legal requirement to keep a snapshot of the data as it was when used to generate the report - and just storing a PDF of the generated report might be a convenient way of doing that. Yes. I've heard good reports about how functional OSCAR is in real-life practice from a person whose opinion I trust, although he did mention that the user interface wasn't entirely to his taste, but admitted that was a matter of personal preference. Thus your assertion that OSCAR may contain an FDF (Fundamental Design Flaw) is the source of some surprise. To me also. More details would be useful. I suspect that OSCAR may instead contain an FDDO (Fundamental Design Difference of Opinion), also known as an INDILT (I'd Never Design/Do It Like That). However, if it really is an FDF as you assert, then you need to provide more details and evidence to convince us and to help the OSCAR people and others to correct or avoid such design mistakes - if they are in fact mistakes. Tell us more about the circumstances in which OSCAR is using embedded PDFs as a primary data store. I think Tim Cook has answered this with the apology that followed his posting. As to whether OSCAR is a 'serious contender'. OSCAR has grown to being used in 10 (known) offices in BC over the last year. It is one of the EMRs that the local Health Authority has chosen to be part of a potential Clinical Indicators Project (basically Prevention and CDM reporting developement and implementation. OSCAR stores data in one place that is then pulled (as a view and for data entry) to 'populate' Chronic Disease Management 'forms'. The 's are there because the 'forms' are just a view on the data. THis allows single data entry for multiple purposes and facilitates reporting on that data. I am not a techy - so that is as far as my explanation of this will go. OSCAR is growing in Ontario and here in BC the users all seem to love it. Is it mainstream? Yes, it definitely is. Is it a serious contender? Well, it seems to be doing quite well :) Regards all -- Jel Coward Co-chair of OSCAR BC UserGroup SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Mail goes everywhere you do. Get it on your phone. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Standards for health information systems
Hi Alvin, Tell me where I can find something of the Phillipine RUV system for procedures? If you are using ICD-10 for disease codes you could have used the ICD-10-PCS (Procedure Coding System). Interoperability is not something to do with just using the same coding systems though... Thanks Nandalal Gunaratne [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all, I'm collating standards (open or otherwise) that are being used in open source health applications. I'd appreciate if the developers on the list would explicitly publish what standards they base their applications on and perhaps we can establish interoperability from thereon. For CHITS, we use ICD-10 (for disease codes), the Philippine medicare's RUV (relative unit values) system for procedures, and are currently developing an XML schema for our local claims processing system (most probably a subset of HL7). Although HL7 is an international standard, this Philippine subset still has to go through the process of approval by local authorities. Thanks in advance. SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] request for advice re electronic medical record
Hi David, Does OSCAR allow patients to keep their own records or access them? Are you hoping to implement something on the lines of PING? I have installed OSCAR and am trying it out. I installed it on Ubuntu, and I am also documenting things as I go along. As a surgeon I must find a way to record operations. Any advice on how to proceed? Nanda Gunaratne David Chan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: P.S. OSCAR's main aim is NOT to sit on any throne but to help patients. Our programmers are reminded regularly to that very fine point;-) David --- Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Fred, First of all, a question (showing my ignorance) -- OSCAR is written in Java? Second, FWIW I think it is important to keep in mind that the title the throne of US EHR systems is a rather sweeping statement. I hope the competition for this throne is open to any system, whether open source or not. I expect the the marketplace will confer its own rewards on title contenders, regardless of any testbench ranking system. With best regards, [wr] - - - - - - - - On May 6, 2006, at 11:50 AM, Fred Trotter wrote: This is a good time to point out that the only thing that keeps OSCAR from being a major player in the US, is its billing engine. We have tossed around an effort to intergrate FreeB with OSCAR for some time. If that happened FreeB would provide the US billing that OSCAR lacks, and we would have a solid Java-based contender for the throne of US EHR systems. -FT Great scheduler - but billing is Canadian (Ontario and BC modules) -- Fred Trotter SynSeer, Consultant http://www.fredtrotter.com http://www.synseer.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get to your groups with one click. Know instantly when new email arrives http://us.click.yahoo.com/.7bhrC/MGxNAA/yQLSAA/W4wwlB/TM ~- Yahoo! Groups Links [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross project manager mendocino informatics 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.462.6369 [office] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.minformatics.com - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, BCS, 2006 - - - - - - - - David H Chan, MD, CCFP, MSc, FCFP Associate Professor Department of Family Medicine McMaster University __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: Openhealth Archives? (was) Re: RES: [openhealth] OSHCA - Notion of founding members
Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: dear sir, unfortunately, i believe the record will show that i am qualified to share the disputation sandbox from this side of the pond. we can't have california not represented; after all, look who we elected governor. Yes! And he will be back! Nandalal vbg [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross project manager mendocino informatics 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.462.6369 [office] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.minformatics.com - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, BCS, 2006 - - - - - - - - SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Re: oshca inaugural meeting - constitution
Joseph Dal Molin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Will, Please forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing ;-) They have not done this before! Perfection is worth striving for, but it is almost never reachable, Therefore it was agreed by most of us that it was OK to get it going and then change it. If this democratic process is not there, and your suggestions for change are not accepted by the others in the future, let us both resign and join another group. The way of holding the meeting looks wiered for most of us, but it is a method that is accesible for all, does not limit us to a time ( I was in the operating theatre for 11 hours today and one surgery was 6 hours. meaning if Molly fixed a video conference at this time, i would not had the opportunity to take part), and gave us a whole new experience :-) I was asked by Molly if i wanted to be in the Protem committee, I agreed. I was made Asst. Secretary at first, then made into representative for Asia and Juliana, her daughter, became the asst. secretary, all without a word to me! But I think that was probably a good thing, both for the committee and me ;-) We would really like to have you with us and therfore, forgive but do not forget! Come back with your proposals and I am sure they would be welcome. Nandalal Will, I agree that the process we are following is a clunky. My suggestion is let's do what democratic countries do with imperfect constitutions and amend it after we have bootstrapped OSHCA into existencethe US did it so can OHSCA :-). Would you be comfortable boostrapping OSHCA for now and then working to amend the constitution? Given that OSHCA is a democracy we can deal with flaws and omissions more effectively with real voting membership in place. Joseph Will Ross wrote: molly, with all due respect, what is the point of offering opportunities to vote for or against a position if a nay vote is disallowed or prevents the possibility of membership? please explain to me how the loyal opposition can voice their opinion without harassment, retribution, exclusion and expulsion. please review the motions. i approved the creation of the entity, the naming of the entity, and the members of the protem committee, but i opposed submission of the proposed constitution because i consider it to be unnecessarily flawed, and the process to be unnecessarily rushed. i fail to see to see the connection between my nay vote on the constitution and your assertion that i am disallowed to be a founding member. if anything, it is flawed instructions for a meeting process that is interfering with my good faith attempt to openly join oshca. with best regards, [wr] - - - - - - - - On Apr 24, 2006, at 9:00 PM, Molly Cheah wrote: Hi Will, What you have done is incorrect. As you disagree with the constitution, we will not be able to include your name in the list of founding members to the ROS simply because the ROS will not register OSHCA. Therefore there will be no OSHCA for you to be a member of. I am posting this to the openhealth list for the information of others. Molly Will Ross wrote: joseph, not sure if this is correct. [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross project manager mendocino informatics 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.462.6369 [office] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.minformatics.com - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, BCS, 2006 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - --- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.4.6/323 - Release Date: 4/24/2006 [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross project manager mendocino informatics 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.462.6369 [office] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.minformatics.com - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, BCS, 2006 - - - - - - - - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group openhealth http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/. . SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment
Re: [openhealth] Re: oshca inaugural meeting - constitution
Fred Trotter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Fred, There was enough time given for dissent/discussion. Molly asked everyone repeatedly to comment on the issues. We can't wait for ever, therefore a time limit was set, and the FINAL draft was set down. Therfore there was really nothing to disagree about! Perhaps, Molly should have removed the disagree part and just left everyone to approve. Will sent his comments once everything was done and over with. Where was he all that time? His late comments would only disrupt a process set in motion in a very democratic manner. If you cannot understand this situation, by all means wait in the sidelines and join when you are happy to do so. Nobody will stop you. See the democracy at work ? :-) Hope to see you back soon, dissenting and arguing! Nandalal OSCHA committee, It is a little troublesome that Will's membership is being discarded along with his comments. Essentially the arguments of the committee is lets get it working and then worry about getting it right. This is fine but I, at least, will have to wait to see it working right before I can toss my hat in the ring. This is not so much a criticism, perhaps the committee has the right idea! But until there is an entity that merits trust (which means having a forum for dissenting supporters) then I will have to stay on the sidelines with (apparently) Will. -- Fred Trotter SynSeer, Consultant http://www.fredtrotter.com http://www.synseer.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messengers low PC-to-Phone call rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[openhealth] The Free Standards Group Announces Availability of First Integrated Linux Desktop Standard
LSB 3.1 also incorporates the recently approved ISO standard LSB Core (ISO/IEC 23360) into the standard. The Free Standards Group also has said that Red Hat, Novell, Ubuntu, Asianux and others are all certifying their versions of their operating systems to the LSB, delivering true world-wide coverage of LSB certified distributions. http://www.linuxelectrons.com/article.php/20060425051329541 - Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1cent;/min. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Re: oshca inaugural meeting - constitution
Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Will, You are right! The flawed process was an attempt to get the OSHCA formally retgisterd, start a web site and get going. Endless changes and debate are not going to do this. Therefore, with this somewhat awkward, even ridiculous process, we become a formally registered organization. The alternative? Endless debates as to where to register, endless changees to the constitution, exasperating changes of the formalization, dates to have meetings, ways to have the meeting. Molly gives up. No formalization. Nobody to take over the formalization and registration. OSHCA remains what it is. A tiny, very tiny email forum with about 5-7 regular mailers and several lurkers. I give up. OSHCA is all yours! Take it, keep it, own it, mail each other and keep each other happy. Nandalal nandalal, from the perspective of a simple discussion at a face to face meeting, this is what is happening: we have a motion and a second to approve the 1.0 draft of the constitution. is there any further discussion? as a responsible member of the community i first evaluate whether or not it makes sense to initiate further discussion. deciding that it makes sense to raise the objection, i ask for the floor and state my concern so that my concern is noted as part of the process, even if i have every confidence that the motion will pass over my further discussion. then, the chair receives a motion to close the discussion, which is seconded and passed. does this disrupt the process or is it a legitimate part of the process? you decide. [wr] - - - - - - - - On Apr 25, 2006, at 11:20 AM, Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Fred Trotter wrote: Fred, There was enough time given for dissent/discussion. Molly asked everyone repeatedly to comment on the issues. We can't wait for ever, therefore a time limit was set, and the FINAL draft was set down. Therfore there was really nothing to disagree about! Perhaps, Molly should have removed the disagree part and just left everyone to approve. Will sent his comments once everything was done and over with. Where was he all that time? His late comments would only disrupt a process set in motion in a very democratic manner. If you cannot understand this situation, by all means wait in the sidelines and join when you are happy to do so. Nobody will stop you. See the democracy at work ? :-) Hope to see you back soon, dissenting and arguing! Nandalal OSCHA committee, It is a little troublesome that Will's membership is being discarded along with his comments. Essentially the arguments of the committee is lets get it working and then worry about getting it right. This is fine but I, at least, will have to wait to see it working right before I can toss my hat in the ring. This is not so much a criticism, perhaps the committee has the right idea! But until there is an entity that merits trust (which means having a forum for dissenting supporters) then I will have to stay on the sidelines with (apparently) Will. -- Fred Trotter SynSeer, Consultant http://www.fredtrotter.com http://www.synseer.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messengers low PC-to-Phone call rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross project manager mendocino informatics 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.462.6369 [office] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.minformatics.com - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, BCS, 2006 - - - - - - - - Yahoo! Groups Links - New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] Re: OSHCA Membership question
David Forslund [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David, If the OSHCA takes on the task of making the glue * to get FOSS for Health groups to understand the true value of FOSS which is sharing/contributing and collaborating with ideas and code *to demonstrate the value of interoperability and common set of standards as the crux, the way forward and the power of FOSS for health does that make OSHCA worthwhile? Nandalal I don't see that your answer has much to do with my question. It isn't about where we have been but where we are going and why. I don't doubt the need for an international forum but what will be the constraints on participation? I currently don't see any difference in most open source systems as to the vendor lock-in other than that one can look at the code. I don't see that the proposed fees for OSHCA will do anything other than allow it to organize (but not fund) meetings. I'm not sure that that will accomplish much without some purpose or goal to the meetings. I need to see the value of the organization. People can participate in our project, for example, for nothing and this includes contributing code, etc. This typically would be a lot more participation than might occur in OSHCA itself. Without a strong set of goals which might include interoperability, the value of OSHCA is unclear to me. If OSHCA is non-profit, will it be recognized as such in the US so that gifts to it would be tax-deductible, or is the membership fee not a charitable gift but something that you purchase and receive value in return? Thanks, Dave Joseph Dal Molin wrote: OSHCA meetings have always been open to anyone. While there has been much progress without OSHCA and there are other open source working groups imbedded in organizations like AMIA etc. there is a need for an open international forum whose focus is solely open source in health and provides a place both in the form of meetings and online venues for what I perceive to be islands of activity to interact and cross pollenate. This will evolve into concrete initiatives where there is sufficient itch to scratch and motivation to actI would definitely vote for promoting open source interoperability as a good starting pointit would be truly ironic if open source projects reinvented lock-in. Where OSHCA goes from here will be up to its membership and the goal creating a formal organization will allow the scope of what OSHCA can accomplisy, through funding etc. to expand significantly. Joseph David Forslund wrote: Is OSHCA membership intended to simply be an issue of who can vote on decisions by the organization or does it entail other matters? Most organizations allow for observers and external contributors, but those can't vote on organizational decisions. For example, can anyone participate/attend an OSHCA meeting (subject to possible meeting fees which are distinct from membership) or only paying members? Will this list only be for paying OSHCA members? So far the benefits of this list on discussion of technical issues is valuable, but I don't yet see the benefits of joining OSHCA. There are other open source organizations that are at least as valuable being a member of. I don't know what OSHCA will be doing. I would think that promoting interoperability amongst open source systems would be a good task to do, but I don't see that on the list. We have been fairly successful championing and promoting open source in healthcare without OSHCA. I need to understand the benefit of joining the organization. The cost isn't the issue; the time and effort is. Thanks, Dave Forslund SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "openhealth" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [openhealth] request for advice re electronic medical record
Rod Roark [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. OpenEMR is also well developed and has good commercial support and commercial modules that allow voice recognition etc - probably in windows. Is there anyone in this list who s involved with OpenEMR development? Are you Rod? nandalal Don't forget OpenEMR which has been around for quite a while and has seen a great deal of activity and user-contributed improvements over the past year. Indeed one of its greatest strengths is the ability of users to easily create or sponsor new features that are important to them. www.oemr.org -- Rod www.sunsetsystems.com On Monday 17 April 2006 08:58 am, Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Andrew Schamess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Andrew, There are several open source products but I doubt if any one of them can do all that you ask. LAMP based ones include OpenMed, FreeMed, MirrorMed and ClearHealth. All look good but still not able to give you what you need. JAVA based Oscar Mcmaster is promising too but is unable to provide what you want, at the moment. MUMPS based VistA or GT.M based WorldVistA version is of course the most mature of the products, but is still not as user friendly as we would like it to be. It seems to be the best bet for you. OIO based on Zope/Python is a great product for the researcher or for audit of a units work. It is very flexible and configurable, has scheduling and workflows, user roles, permissions and some degree of reporting, but does not have the billing software and some of the coding etc integrated yet. The ease of use of Zope, the many excellent Zope Products that are available for education/content management/communication/forums/wikis etc make it great for an intranet too. GNUMed is also developing to provide practice management and hoping to become quite thorough and is one of the main products of Debian-Med. HTH NandA I'm new to this listserve. I'm an internist, planning to leave a group practice and open my own solo pratice in western Massachusetts. I would like to use an electronic medical record. I was wondering if others here could advise or share their experience. The features most important to me are: - Assist in meeting Medicare DOQ guidelines. - Track preventive screening - know which patients are overdue for Pap, etc. - Templates, reminders, reports etc. configurable by MD. - Improve documentation and coding. - Integrated practice management (scheduling and billing software). - If possible... patient interface that allows patient self-scheduling for appointments, patient access to own health info, secure email and messaging. I've looked into VISTA office a bit (thanks to Joseph Dal Molin for the tip). It looks promising, since it's based on the VAMC system which I know works brilliantly; but I see it was put out for beta testing, and the sign-up period ended in 11/05. I've written to the companies listed on the website just the same. Anyone know if it's available at all outside beta-testing, or if they're still signing up testers? Joseph also suggested Oscar McMaster. Wondering if it handles U.S. cpt and diagnosis codes? Or can they be obtained and installed? I saw the MirrorMed (OP/EN) link that just came over... also looks good. I'd really welcome any advice at all. I've looked at commercial products too, but I have a bias toward open source and I'd rather participate in testing and building something for public use than buy a license from a private company if it's possible. Thanks very much to all in advance for any responses! Andrew Schamess Lenox, MA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Community Health Information Tracking System www.chits.info
alvinbmarcelo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This looks like a very good system. Congratulations! I will try this and introduce it to my colleagues in community health. Maybe some of them are already aware of it. Nandalal Hello all. This is Alvin Marcelo (formerly of NLM) re-subscribing. Happy to be back and to see that everyone is well. I return because now we have source code to share :) Our system is called Community Health Information Tracking System (www.chits.info) and it runs on LAMP. It was designed to be modular so you can add on modules as you see fit. This way the system 'grows' with you. Although the primary targets are village health centers in developing countries, the same modules can be used for practice management anywhere around the world. Developers and testers are welcome. System architect is Dr. Herman Tolentino (who is now a public health informatics fellow in CDC). alvin PS. CHITS shirts are also on sale in Stockholm if you are interested :) Alvin B. Marcelo, MD Director-OIC National Telehealth Center, University of the Philippines Manila 547 Pedro Gil Street Ermita, Manila Philippines 1000 - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] MirrorMed Highlights FOSS in Action
It is indeed most encouraging to see such developments. When I clicked the screenshots i was taken to the Microsoft web site!!! Your link should be http://www.mirrormed.org/fb/ Not http://http//www.mirrormed.org/fb/ Regards nandalal Ignacio Valdes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The MirrorMed project shows how Free and Open Source Software (FOSS) in medicine works by creating an electronic medical record/electronic health record(EMR/EHR) using code from several projects: OpenEMR, FreeMed, Uversa's ClearHealth and the FreeB medical billing project. Successful health IT software is very difficult to create from scratch. Together, these projects have threaded the needle and become the few that survive the real world in Health IT. http://www.linuxmednews.com/1144959631/index_html - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1cent;/min. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] MirrorMed Highlights FOSS in Action
Tim.Churches [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You are quite right, TIm. This is a funny thing with Firefox. I am using 1.0.7 maybe they ahve sorted things in 1.5.1, hopefully! Nandalal Tim.Churches wrote: Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: It is indeed most encouraging to see such developments. When I clicked the screenshots i was taken to the Microsoft web site!!! Your link should be http://www.mirrormed.org/fb/ Not http://http//www.mirrormed.org/fb/ This seems to be a peculiarity of Firefox. Other browsers (correctly) report an error with the above URL, whereas Firefox does indeed take you to the Microsoft Web site. Why, I wonder? Here is the explanation: http://www.oreillynet.com/cs/user/view/cs_msg/43360 That leads to a whole genre of single word, non-deterministic URLS in Firefox. Try these (in Firefox, results will be disappointing elsewhere): http://mirrormed http://gnumed http://oshca http://linuxmednews http://netepi Tim C - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] MirrorMed Highlights FOSS in Action
Tim.Churches [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tim, All the following work with Firefox - in that i am taken to the correct URL! What were you trying to point out here? Nandalal That leads to a whole genre of single word, non-deterministic URLS in Firefox. Try these (in Firefox, results will be disappointing elsewhere): http://mirrormed http://gnumed http://oshca http://linuxmednews http://netepi Tim C - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] EHR Review makes progress, needs help!
It seems to me that Fred is going to review just these, and others are supposed to chiop in with some reviews or part of reviews of any other EMRs worth talking about. Open VistA remains to be reviewed and OSCAR. Zope based SPIRIT? and OIO are two others that come to mind. While the ones reviewed are in dire need of HTML forms for data collection, OIO makes web forms with ease and is a clinicians dream for research and audit. Nandalal James Busser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:On Apr 4, 2006, at 12:00 PM, Fred Trotter wrote: EHR review on LinuxMedNews... http://www.linuxmednews.com/1144128464/index_html At this point, I have finished about 80% of the reviews... Hi Fred The site lists only 3 EMRs, so I wonder what is meant by 80%. Do you mean you have completed 80% of the 3, or do you mean there are many others which you have not yet posted? Maybe in the Review process (or ahead of it) it would be worth inserting Selection process. PS While a few misspellings could be casually tuned, Ignacio Valdez might like something fixed earlier (Ignacio is posses both an M.D. and a M.S. on the page Who_are_the_Reviewers) SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] OSHCA registration update
Constitution of the Open Source Health Care Alliance Hi Molly, A few questions/suggestions. 9.3 - Names for the above offices in Article 9.1 shall be proposed and seconded and election will be by a simple majority vote of the members at the annual general meeting on alternate years. All the office-bearers shall serve for two years and be eligible for re-election. How many times can any one of the office bearers be re-elected? Should there be a restriction? 10.6 - The Ordinary Committee Members shall carry out such duty as directed by the President or the Committee. under the guidance and approval of the President and Committee? Constitution of the Open Source Health Care Alliance 11.2 - Subject to the following provisions in this rules, the funds of OSHCA may be expended for the purpose necessary for the carrying out of its objects, and to spend at the end of the financial year approximately seventy percent (70%) from the income and donation received.Expenditures may include the expenses of its office-bearers and paid staff, and the audit of its accounts, but they shall on no account be used to pay the fine of any member who may be convicted in a court of law. Is it compulsary that we spend 70% or is that the maximum allowed? Constitution of the Open Source Health Care Alliance 16.4 - No University/College student can be allowed to be a member of OSHCA without the prior written approval from the Vice Chancellor of the University concerned. This clause shall only be applicable in Malaysia and any other country that has a similar restriction. Membership for University/College students may need the prior written approval of the Head of the University concerned. This applies in Malaysia and any other country where such rules and restrictions apply. NandA Constitution of the Open Source Health Care Alliance Molly Cheah [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Since the list has become unduly quiet, I'm taking this opportunity to provide a short update on the OSHCA registration. The registration document is at version1 draft 3, sent out to the Protem Committee yesterday. I think we are quite close to the final draft, which will be uploaded to the list for comments and discussions, hopefully by tomorrow but for a limited period of time, possibly 7 days. I would also need to submit a list of resolutions for adoption, essentially to say that we all agree to the registration of OSHCA and adopting the constitution. I had been to see the Registrar of Societies and obtained the necessary forms that was used as sample to develop the registration constitution/document. I had also spoken to GKP which used the incorporation method for their organisation - company limited by guarantee with a non-profit status. As a company is more costly to maintain, preliminary view of some protem committee members feel that we register under the Societies Act. We will then provide a list of items for discussions (as guidelines) but you're welcomed to comment on any item, except for those which constitute minimal requirements for registration in Malaysia. Issues to think about are: types of membership membership info membership dues OSHCA chapters/country branches office-bearers - how many, length of term etc. Rgds, Molly - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: next steps. (was Re: [openhealth] Important announcement and oshca update)
Richard Schilling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Richard, What you say seems fine. But software patents can cause problems to us here. Most software come from the US and software is so expensive that there is rampant piracy of software in many countires. Recent WTO agreements have made this illegal and therefore it is not posssible for people here to get pirated copies anymore. This is a good thing, in my opinion, but there are many people who find that they can't get software nor can they afford it. They are frustrated and unhappy. They look at FOSS with some interest and our LUG has been very actively doing a lot of stuff. The government agency setup to do the e-government and promotion are also naturally interested. However patents related to software is rearing it's ugly head and worrying people here. We feel if software patents are brought in here by law, it will cause a lot of concern as peopl here can ill afford legal costs that may come with such laws. You in the US and me because I use FOSS for everything do not care. But for students and people here software costs are prohibitive. Piracy was a godsend that has now gone. They feel helpless, don't they? The digital divide is maintained. This is why any laws that may affect FOSS worries us as it is the only way forward. Even those in the US and EU do not think software patent issues are silly. NandA Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Definitely no anti-US sentiments from here. But we worry about the laws which stifle the development of lesser developed countires in their progress inICT. Really? That amazes me. Alright, I'll play U.S. QnA session here. Tell me your concerns and I'll try to address them as they relate to OSCHA operating internationally with members in the U.S. First off... Silly patents that have been applied for are irrelevant to OSCHA. Membership in the WTO, as Malaysia has achieved, help protect OSCHA's intellectual properties. If OSCHA is registered in the U.S. as a trade association all anyone has to do is sign up. It's that easy. If OSCHA is registered as a domestic, U.S. non-profit corporation all we have to do is direct OSCHA resources to carry out its mission in other countries. OSCHA branches in other countries might have different limitations and permissions on its activities. Richard - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] CCHIT biased towards proprietary software??
Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I too agree. Certification is a matter of standards and quality. ther should be no compromise. The FOSS once equally certified maybe able to make stroner claims. However because of the collaborative/community type of development, there could be a waver of the fee or some consideration given if the software or a version of it is to be given free, and the FOSS based company hopes to make money by the enterprise edition or by support only. Thus the fee can be 1. less 2. full but paid in installments? NandA Fred, I oppose the creation of a separate open source certification process. I think it compromises the opportunity for open source solutions to displace commercial solutions, and it distracts open source projects from leveraging the collaborative process to create seriously superior solutions. With best regards, [wr] - - - - - - - - On Mar 27, 2006, at 10:16 AM, Fred Trotter wrote: This is an interesting discussion. However we do have some decisions to make. 1. Does the different nature free and open source medical software warrant different consideration than proprietary models for CCHIT certification pricing. (If a large number of people feel this way then we should draft our own letter.) Yes/No 2. In NOT should the pricing generally be lowered for everyone so that small and open source projects will have the opportunity to get certified. (If you feel this way then you should just sign the emrupdate.com letter) Yes/No Feel free to continue the substance of the discussion by saying why or why not for your answers. In any case if you feel that a letter should be written or signed... now is the time to do so the review window is closing. -- Fred Trotter SynSeer, Consultant http://www.fredtrotter.com http://www.synseer.com phone: (480)290-8109 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links [wr] - - - - - - - - will ross project manager mendocino informatics 216 west perkins street, suite 206 ukiah, california 95482 usa 707.272.7255 [voice] 707.462.5015 [fax] www.minformatics.com - - - - - - - - Getting people to adopt common standards is impeded by patents. Sir Tim Berners-Lee - - - - - - - - - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1cent;/min. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] CCHIT biased towards proprietary software??
Business Readiness Rating - Home Could HIS be included here as well? NandA Thomas Beale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Tim.Churches wrote: Will Ross wrote: Fred, I oppose the creation of a separate open source certification process. I think it compromises the opportunity for open source solutions to displace commercial solutions, and it distracts open source projects from leveraging the collaborative process to create seriously superior solutions. This is a US matter, but as I set out, my position would be to argue for a reduced-cost certification process of any software which makes all the necessary documentation, source code, unit tests, functional test scripts etc needed to satisfy the certification criteria publicly available for scrutiny by anyone. But the actual criteria to be met should be the same. I agree that this should be the basis. Certification should be a case of paying someone to do the same thing you have already done, just without you being there. It should be a $2k or less operation. - thomas beale SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Important announcement and oshca update
Richard Schilling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Wow after all that feedback I'm honestly trying to pick where to start on this one. I'm seeing some confusion here between legal aspects and the socio-political. Perhaps this is because socio-political is far more important in asia than in the US :-) I agree to what you are saying, but there is another aspect here I am trying to bring out. The laws in US are a biit too rigid for asian countries. Their purses are samll, and yet, they want to use ICT for their development. This is not the time to have too many impediments - legal or other. WHile copyrights are OK, patents on software is a problem. Maybe I am wrong? If so please tell me!! NandA Molly, I'm not implying that there's no legal protection in Malaysia. I'm saying, based on what I know there's less protection than in the U.S. Malaysia is a constitutional monarchy. All peninsular Malaysian states except two have hereditary rulers, which, for a company means that the laws governing corporations can be set along heridetary lines rather than an independent legal standard. Read: muslim, heridetary lines. Is OSCHA a religious organization or an independent world-wide technological organization accessible to everyone regardless of religious conviction? (Tim, you're not making any sense with your star and crescent comment). And, what I'm suggesting is that you start with a U.S. incorporation. Then incorporate elsewhere. What is below is point/counter-point. And, it's not talking about suitability based on religion, the people or any other facet other than legal. So, let me boil this down to simple terms: 1. Legal protections: U.S. incorporation means that as a U.S. company, OSHCA has the same rights as an individual. Intellectual property rights and agreements are upheld. In other countries, especially ones with new regimes, this might not be the case. U.S. subsidiaries running in non-U.S. countries would work just fine and be stabilized by the U.S. based parent. 2. Repatriation of capital: As OSCHA earns fees, receives donations, pays taxes, etc... it's much more straightforward in the U.S. I believe. The tax burden on a non-profit like OSHCA would be minimal or non-existent. 3. Political stability: In politically less-stable countries (e.g. Malaysia, Taiwan, Mexico, South Africa, Haiti, etc..) when regimes change so does the law - you can find your corporation and all its assets suddenly owned by someone else. 4. Government funding: incorporating in a country because it looks like there's government funding is a bad idea. You need a much harder offer than that. What are the incentive programs, specifically that the other government offers? Who, specifically in the government, is offering them? Richard Molly Cheah wrote: I was born in Malaysia and lived through the period where we obtained independance from the British and from whom our legal framework was adopted. Just wondering what are the concerns of Richard and David on the legal protection for OSHCA. Can you elaborate rather than make a comment that imply there isn't legal protection. Incidently we don't have the equivalence of Guantanano Bay in Malaysia. Molly Joseph Dal Molin wrote: Legal protection in the context of an organization like OSHCA is IMHO not a major concern. What is more important is how the countries laws influence governance. David Forslund wrote: I don't understand why this is good or even relevant. What should matter is the legal protection provided by the incorporation in the various countries participating, which I think was Richard's point. Dave Forslund Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Important announcement and oshca update
Richard Schilling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The next GKP annual meeting is here in Sri Lanka. Anyone coming? :-) NandA Molly, I think you should incorporate in Malaysia eventually. As a Malaysian you'll have a very easy time doing it and know what it means. The members of the protem committee have been discussing OSCHA incorporation since 2002 or perhaps earlier if memory serves. Why it didn't happen in France or Canada already is a mystery to me. globalknowledge.org provides a wonderful model. Is Microsoft the only north-American company a member of globalknowledge.org? Richard Molly Cheah wrote: David, There is and not may be because there are legal frameworks (acts of parliament) that governs corporations, civil societies, unions etc. If OSHCA is to be my organisation, I would have it up in 3 days (not one as suggested by Richard). My timeline of 3 months is not due to technical grounds for setting it up but rather to allow members and the protem committee to discuss and accept what should go into the incorporation papers. The procedures are laid out and transparent. Even the choice of incorporation in a developing country went through discussions on this list and there were no objections. I picked Malaysia because I'm from here and I had undertaken to do the job. If anyone else would like to volunteer to do the job please by all means. The other reason why I picked Malaysia is provided by the evidence of the incorporation and success of the global knowledge partnership http://www.globalknowledge.org. There are several other similar organisations too. And look at the list of GKP members, their activities etc. Please enumerate what we want to do in OSHCA that is not done by global knowledge partnership. We had already gone through discussions on OSHCA's vision, mission statements, principles and activities. Though this is out of context here, Malaysia has a secular constitution and therefore it is not an islamic country, though majority of the population are muslims. Unfortunately the media especially in the US says we are an islamic state and most people rely on the media for information and believes them. But this (muslim or secular) should not be of concern to anyone. Molly David Forslund wrote: There may be legal protection, etc in Malaysia. We are more familiar with the situation in the US. It is more of a question of comparing what is required and what you can do with a corporation in Malaysia than in the US. The decision shouldn't be made on political grounds but on technical grounds, in my opinion. Dave Molly Cheah wrote: I was born in Malaysia and lived through the period where we obtained independance from the British and from whom our legal framework was adopted. Just wondering what are the concerns of Richard and David on the legal protection for OSHCA. Can you elaborate rather than make a comment that imply there isn't legal protection. Incidently we don't have the equivalence of Guantanano Bay in Malaysia. Molly Joseph Dal Molin wrote: Legal protection in the context of an organization like OSHCA is IMHO not a major concern. What is more important is how the countries laws influence governance. David Forslund wrote: I don't understand why this is good or even relevant. What should matter is the legal protection provided by the incorporation in the various countries participating, which I think was Richard's point. Dave Forslund Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC for low, low rates. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: next steps. (was Re: [openhealth] Important announcement and oshca update)
Tim Cook [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am a great admierer of the US and it's people, the films, the sports, the comics on which I was introduced to reading :-) I still think it is one of the best countires and even the President is not all bad flamebait Most of the FOSS software come from the US too. Definitely no anti-US sentiments from here. But we worry about the laws which stifle the development of lesser developed countires in their progress inICT. Nandalal -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Richard Schilling wrote: Molly deserves extra credit for hanging in there. I'm anxious to see things progress. It doesn't sound like, though, you or anyone is interested in seeing a U.S. component. Is that true? Richard Hi Richard, Let me be quite clear in that I would enjoy seeing a US component. I doubt there is ANYONE more patriotic to the US than I (retired US Marine MSgt.) However, I try to be very pragmatic in world politics and quite frankly our latest President is a duff! If it was 1969 I would move to Canada anywaythough that is another story entirely. I love my country and in the great big scheme of things the men and women of he US are fair and decent people. However, the stage of politics is embarrassing and frankly depressing. As Ben Franklin said: - -- The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. Benjamin Franklin - --- Cheers, Tim -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.3rc2 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFEKiiSMOzvb7luwR0RAmGXAKCb07nRFLJXIedrwf34MpssbSdNMACfTc1R mqvdNrtrYQBGuRKMfjMzNI8= =jfzp -END PGP SIGNATURE- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1cent;/min. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] [Fwd: [GPCG_TALK] Open Source Software: A Primer for Health Care Leaders]
Will Ross [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tim has done a good job of analysing this report. I do not think anyone whould have the freedom to create their own versions of what FOSS means and the licences mean as well! There is however a subtle difference between open source software and Free Libre Open Source Software.. Nandalal Tim, I agree with your take on the report. To me it falls into the category of any publicity is better than no publicity. I winced when reading it, knowing that the intended audience is inherently unfamiliar with open source as a license category. The muddled idea that the level of restriction on a license has any causal relationship in the world with project forking is nonsensical, but unfortunately it seems coherent to outsiders seriously describing open source to their fellow outsiders. The up side of the report is that as wrong as it is on the details, it still opens the door for more expansive adoption of open source. I encourage non-technical executive decision makers to read it because the net effect is more legitimacy for open source solutions in the enterprise. [wr] - - - - - - - - On Mar 11, 2006, at 12:44 AM, Tim.Churches wrote: Maury Pepper wrote: Tim, I'd be interested to hear why you feel that way about the report. I have read comments by others praising it. Perhaps they have missed something. As I said, I have not read the entire report, and my observation that teh authors did not understand what they were talking about was restricted, as I indicated, to the section titled Licensing for Open Source. Here is what they say (numbers in square brackets refer to my commentary which follows): There are two basic types of open source licenses: unrestricted and restricted.[1] Each applies in certain circumstances.[2] Unrestricted licenses are a great way to promote broad use of a new technology very quickly, such as implementing an important new privacy standard. They do not limit the distribution of derivative works or the use of open source software in commercial software.[3] The Apache and BSD licenses are examples. Restricted licenses are ideal for maintaining the integrity of software code and preventing splinter efforts.[4] The restrictions ensure that the code will always be freely available.[5] This enables integrators and the hospitals, clinics and practices they support to have a reliable code base.[6] The Free Software Foundation has coined the term copyleft (vs. copyright) to refer to restrictive licenses, like the GNU general public license (GPL), which requires that modified versions of a GPL program be free software as well.[7] [1] This would appear to be a brand new classification or characterisation of open source licenses which the authors have dreamt up. I find it misleading at worst, unhelpful at best. [2] No, each type of license might best be applied in certain circumstances (or for certain purposes or projects). But circumstances rarely dictate that a restricted (i.e copyleft) or unrestricted (i.e non-copyleft) license *has* to be applied, except of course for derivative works. [3] No, but nor do restricted licenses (such as the GPL) limit the *distribution* of derivative works. [4] Really? How? Forking of projects and code bases is just as easy with GPLed code as it is with BSD licensed code, as is independent distribution of modified versions of that forked code. [5] The restrictions imposed by the GPL don't ensure that code will always be freely available - BSD-licensed code is just as likely to remain freely available as GPLed code - once released, BSD or GPL code will always remain freely available (as long as someone archives it and makes copies of those archives freely available in perpetuity, but with facilities such as SourceForge and Savannah, that almost always happens these days). [6] This is ambiguous: do they mean access to a body of reliable code or reliable access to a body of code (of variable reliability)? If the former, then I'm afraid that free availability of code does not necessarily mean that it will be reliable. [7] Wrong. The GPL requires that modified versions which are distributed to third parties or otherwise published also be distributed under the GPL. However, a hospital or clinic or practice may modify a GPLed program as much as it likes, but as long as it does not distribute or publish that modified version (and the GPL puts it under no obligation to do so), it does not have to apply the GPL to the modified code - see section 2.b of the GPL V2. I am not sure if the authors misunderstand how various open source licenses work, or whether the problem is their terribly sloppy use of language, but either way, I feel that these foregoing paragraphs would misinform a naive reader. What do others think? I hope the rest of the report is better researched and/or
Re: [openhealth] Re: OSS for Healthcare Leaders Primer
ivhalpc [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Okay, so I haven't been reading openhealth digests lately :-) I've been BUSY ;-) -- IV Fishing? Nandalal --- In openhealth@yahoogroups.com, Ignacio Valdes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: iHealth and Technology brings you a Forrester Whitepaper: Open Source Software Primer for Health Care Leaders. While not heralding the end of commercial software vendors, the report concludes that conditions are ripe for open source solutions to take root in health care, and that it will likely become the standard for capturing, sharing, and managing patient information to support quality care. It also notes that health care businesses have the opportunity to take the lead and drive the shift to this new model. Discussion and links: http://www.linuxmednews.com/1142058421 SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Mail Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [openhealth] Re: Software Developers, BOTH too rigid and too complex
Koray Atalag [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Pls. do not take my prior post as advertising of a company; and I assure you that I have no financial interest with this company... If it was it was poor advertising! The link gave a 404 error :-( Thanks for a dumb gui for dumb and dumber medical people. Honesty is the best policy.;-) - Bring words and photos together (easily) with PhotoMail - it's free and works with Yahoo! Mail. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Senator Endorses VistA for EHR Standard
Bhaskar, KS [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If the software is released under GPL, does that make it any less Free if the organization developing it is a commercial entity? Not in the proper sense of the word free as in freedom that FOSS exemplifies. But for a lot of people who think OSS is free software, it causes confusion. Should I care whether my healthcare is delivered by a Protestant, Catholic, Jewish, Hindu, Muslim, or atheist doctor as long as the care is not at issue? It depends on the person. Some people DO care, and they have the freedom to do so. I personally do not care, but that is the way I think. The Freedom in FOSS comes from the rights granted to the user by a license such as the GPL, and is completely independent of the nature of the organization developing it. Tell that to those outside FOSS mailing lists. They do not have the wisdom to know the difference? :-) Nandalal On Fri, 2006-01-27 at 09:14 -0600, Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Bhaskar, KS [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The trouble comes from using the word FREE (FOSS) in an increasingly commercial world of software. Maybe commercial users of FOSS should drop the word Free and call it OSST (open source software technologies). Free as in beer belonged to the last centuary... Nandalal SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Bring words and photos together (easily) with PhotoMail - it's free and works with Yahoo! Mail. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Re: Software Developers, BOTH too rigid and too complex
Rick Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In openhealth@yahoogroups.com, Nandalal Gunaratne [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Can someone advise me, why does OpenEMR tend to have so many checkboxes in its forms? (I am without a clue, just a sentence or two is sufficient.) Free form text in a database cannot be used to generate reports etc, which are needed to get statistics and do audit and research. THerefore the innumerable check boxes. The other way to do is to use workflows, where the way you fill a few check boxes will direct you accordingly to other forms with check boxes. Once you get the hang of it, and if you are concerned about the ability to generate statistical reports, it becomes , er, acceptable? Nandalal P.S. If some of you can identify that bull-crap package from the fact that the psychiatric 'progress note/existing pt. visit' form is 17 pages, you win the prize! - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Senator Endorses VistA for EHR Standard
Bhaskar, KS [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The trouble comes from using the word FREE (FOSS) in an increasingly commercial world of software. Maybe commercial users of FOSS should drop the word Free and call it OSST (open source software technologies). Free as in beer belonged to the last centuary... Nandalal On Thu, 2006-01-26 at 16:02 -0600, Greg Woodhouse wrote: --- Bhaskar, KS [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One of the myths that is part of the FUD spread by vendors whose business models are not based on open source licenses is that software based on open source licenses is not commercial. Please do not inadvertently help spread this myth. Thank you for your consideration. Regards -- Bhaskar How would you prefer that GT.M be described, if not open source? I can understand your concern here, especially since many open source projects are not commercially supported. I suppose a phrase like Commercial software with a GPL compatible license (or something like it) is possible, but it's awkward. Certainly, I want to refer to the product in the appropriate manner. Commercial and licensed under the GPL (or the broader category of FOSS software) are orthogonal attributes, and there are packages that fall into all four combinations of those attributes. So, in this case, to be completely precise, it was not Cache (commercial) vs. GT.M (open source), but Cache (commercial, non-FOSS) vs. GT.M (commercial, FOSS). So, removing the common attribute commercial, it would be correct to say Cache (non-FOSS) vs. GT.M (FOSS). Regards -- Bhaskar - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Autos. Looking for a sweet ride? Get pricing, reviews, more on new and used cars. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] FOIA VistA SemiVivA 20060113 available
Bhaskar, KS [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks! A bit complicated but understandable. But Wine is needed to get the CPRS GUI going? IT is a pity that there is no GUI for unix systems WHile your liveCD based on DSL is commendable, it is one of the most diffcult liveCDs to configure and run! Nandalal FOIAVistA SemiVivA 20060113 is now available and can be downloaded from Source Forge (http://sourceforge.net/projects/worldvista). A SemiVivA package is an installation of VistA that is bundled with GT.M and ready for use if you alreay have a PC running Linux. Assuming that the distribution file is downloaded on your PC as /Distrib/VistA/FOIAVistASemiVivA20060113.tgz, you can install it with the following commands which must be executed as root: cd /usr/local tar zxvf /Distrib/VistA/FOIAVistASemiVivA20060113.tgz This OpenVistA SemiVivA is slightly different from (i.e., hopefully better than) its predecessors. When OpenVistA SemiVivA 20060113 is installed on your PC in a development environment, the intent is that the files distributed with this release will not normally be modified (unless, for example, you move to a new GT.M release and need to recompile and generate new object files) - please read http://tinyurl.com/738jk for a discussion of the model. This OpenVistA SemiVivA comes pre-configured as a Release. You can still use the vista script to demo VistA, but I expect that you are more likely to use the install script to set up integration and development environments and the run script thence to run an installed environment. This OpenVistA also comes able to handle a direct connection from a CPRS GUI, as well as the latest CPRS GUI itself the program CPRSChart.exe in /usr/local/FOIAVistA20060113/CPRS_Gui). To enable an installed environment to handle a CPRS GUI connection request, you will need to do the following: 1. Choose a port, e.g., 9297. 2. Identify the environment to handle the connection, and the userid for the server process (e.g., /home/kbhaskar/myVistA and kbhaskar). 3. Add 2 lines to /etc/services, thus: cprs-gui 9297/tcp cprs-gui 9297/udp The second line is not required, but it is traditional to reserve TCP and UDP ports together. 4. Determine whether you are running inetd or xinetd as the Internet superserver. If you are running inetd, you will need a line such as the following in your inetd.conf: cprs-gui stream tcp nowait kbhaskar /home/kbhaskar/myVistA/cprs_direct If you are running xinetd, you will need something like: service cprs-gui { disable= no socket_type = stream wait= no user= kbhaskar server= /home/kbhaskar/myVistA/cprs_direct } (I don't use xinetd, so the above is my guess as to what the entry should be.) 5. Restart inetd/xinetd (on Debian GNU/Linux systems, this is a line like /etc/init.d/inetd restart). 6. You may need to configure your firewall to allow connections on port 9297. A CPRS GUI client should now be able to connect. If you have wine installed on your Linux machine, you can try running the CPRS GUI on Linux with (one line, look out for line breaks): wine /usr/local/FOIAVistA20060113/CPRS_Gui/CPRSChart.exe s=localhost p=9297 SPLASH=OFF CCOW=DISABLE Good luck. I promised to document the process of creating a SemiVivA package from a FOIA release, and I have copious notes that I need to convert into something readable. I will do that after I create FOIAVistA VivA 20060113. Regards -- Bhaskar SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - What are the most popular cars? Find out at Yahoo! Autos [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Senator Endorses VistA for EHR Standard
Greg Woodhouse [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One problem in people not learning from VistA is that it is so difficult to install and run! The other point is that the various modules have different licences. It is not fully open sourced in that sense (or am I wrong?). Some of the largest modules are for insurance purposes and they may be useless for some others. especially outside the USA. Let us develop good documentation and make VistA easier to setup, and separate the open source free parts clearly from the others. I know that there is an OpenVistA project but, the documentation is insufficient on the above facts. Nandalal --- Joseph Dal Molin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nandalal, you have in one sentence described how VistA was first developed and evolved for the better part of its history, all be it the number of collaborators was much larger. [GW] I think that's a fair statement. So the real issue IMHO is not designing and building the perfect system is but how to leverage the vast experience and knowledge that is imbeded in VistA's DNA. [GW] What form does that DNA take? There seems to be some disagreement on this point. Some have argued that the knowledge that has been gained through the development of VistA (and I think it's immense) is to be found only in the code itself. Othewrs argue that artifacts such as data dictionaries, manuals, user interfaces, etc. are realizations of knowledge at a slightly higher level of abstraction. VistA was not developed through something like the Rational Unified Process, starting with functional requirements, UML models, etc., but grew in a more organic bottom up fashion. But that doesn't mean the knowledge isn't there. It seems unfortunate to me that no one is asking What can we learn from VistA? For that matter, what is its essence? What sets it apart from other systems to which people often prefer it? I know those questions seem abstract, and rather philosophical, but at some point, I think we need to ask ourselves what type of problem it is that we're attempting to solve, and what is it that constitutes a good solution. Why? === Gregory Woodhouse [EMAIL PROTECTED] All truth passes through three stages: First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident. --Arthur Schopenhauer SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Bring words and photos together (easily) with PhotoMail - it's free and works with Yahoo! Mail. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Senator Endorses VistA for EHR Standard
Phillipe, I would like to know your approach to things, more clearly. The list I made is more in fun than an initiative for OSHCA!! My interest infact is in the use of IT for the area of Research, audit and CME for clinicians. The BIG jobof making those for administrators, managers, ministers, governments is far too complex. I think it has been clearly shown that the ability to communicate between different type of acpplications and to have an international standard on this may solve one major issue. Interoperability will stop here, most likely. How far will SNOMED go, in the worldwide context to standardize nomenclature? Let us wait and see. nandalal Philippe AMELINE [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Joseph Dal Molin a écrit : I feel a partnership between a couple of IT savyy clinicians and expert programmers with a wholesome way of looking at things, can create the infrastructure of the future HISs. Nandalal, you have in one sentence described how VistA was first developed and evolved for the better part of its history, all be it the number of collaborators was much larger. So the real issue IMHO is not designing and building the perfect system is but how to leverage the vast experience and knowledge that is imbeded in VistA's DNA. Frankly speaking how many lives could be saved and improved by simply implementing VistA as far and wide as possible and at the same time engaging that community to improve the software? Is chasing perfection by starting from a clean slate worth the human opportunity cost? Joseph Joseph, By simply implementing VistA as far and wide as possible, do you mean that you want to provide the patients with Vista ? Because even if VistA is a very good system, it can't replace all existing systems (so you will have many discrepancies in the network) and beside, it is not possible to address the continuity of care issue through HISs (in the same way motion pictures and still images are different). Nandalal's point 5 : 5. Scale to a hospital/region/country/world! is, from my point of view, a very dangerous feeling. It gives me the same feeling as if you would say : our aquarium architecture is made of a carbon filter and an air pump, and we want to scale it on a lake, a river, an ocean. A HIS is an into the box solution, don't even try to scale it in order to manage the open world. This sort of things makes me nervous because in France I am fighting everyday against HIS vendors selling their solution as county wide scalable. Sometimes just because they can manage all Dicom modalities. I hope I can convince the people in charge of current national health record that a perfect HIS is a dangerous object in the landscape if it restricts its scope from in-patient to out-patient and doesn't have as a primary duty to contribute to a global patient health journey. As you know, a single period of time, a single location, a single problem is the usual architecture of... the classical tragedy. Philippe SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Senator Endorses VistA for EHR Standard
Thomas Beale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:yes...well, systemic solutions to interoperability require systemic changes to the architecture, not ad hoc additions on the outside. You have to be consciously designing for interoperability (along with the other 28 incredibly complex things you have to design for in health. I'll work out the list of these one day;-) Hi Thomas, Maybe we should work out this right now! IF there is a list of all the complexities that need to be taken into consideration, it may help people who want to start somethng comprehensive or want to reverse or re-engineer something which already has substance (like VistA). 1. Interoperability 2. Standards for above 3. Coding systems for clinical/paraclinical/laboratory/insurance/ etc. 4. Separation of data/presentation etc (layers) 5. Scale to a hospital/region/country/world! 6. Standardized nomencalture but ability to understand that often things are seen which do not fit in or surgery that is non-standard performed for unusual conditions. (if not standardization will provide and force incorrect data) 7.Consider the separate needs of data collection in preventive health/curative health/investigational facilities/researchers/audit of individual work/unit/hospital/nation 8. Language differences 9. Drug databases with hundreds of different names for the same generic drugs, doses dependent on weight/age, sex, BMI, frequency that is aceptable/side effects and hundreds of possible drug interactions that need warning for safe paractices 10.Security issues, accesibility issues etc. ... 28. Nandalal - thomas - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Bring words and photos together (easily) with PhotoMail - it's free and works with Yahoo! Mail. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Resurrecting OSHCA - updates so far....
Dr Molly Cheah [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Molly, I have made some changes/suggestions to your excellent draft. But is the mission statement too long? I think about 5-7 points would suffice. Nandalal Hi everyone, I've tried to put together views expresed so far, but runs into difficulty at some points. The Mission statements are a bit unruly. Needs help. Vision: Free and Open Source Health Care Software will provide a better worlwide collaborative environment for developing a viable and sustainable alternative in mainstream ICT for positive impact in health outcomes as adjunct to building a global knowledge society. (I'm quite comfortable in not using the word solidarity. The only reason I considered it was because the UN's Louis-Dominique Ouedraogo of the Joint Inspection Unit used the terms freedom, solidarity, sustainable development during the workshop in Tunisia recently titled Software for development: Are Free/open source software the answer?. Incidently his answer to that question is yes based on 2 reports on open source that will be tabled at the UN General Assembly this year. Hope the reports don't don't get derailed :)) Mission: 1. Advocacy role to promote to policy makers the concept of open standards and open source in healthcare so as to adopt or give equal opportunity to such solutions 2. Provide leadership role in refining the FOSS concepts as applied to healthcare to ensure best practices and patient safety are not compromised 3. Make recommendations on Guidelines on Health Information Standards and commit/coax/advocate? adherence to them 4. Provides Guidelines for Quality Control on open source software develpment 5. Assist in finding/prioritizing funding for projects to reach critical mass 6. Promotes and helps the formation of development consortia for health care related projects 7. Solicits membership from strategic organizations (help is welcomed to consolidate the mission statements) Principles 1. Promote a globally sustainable approach Open source software development encourages global collaboration. OSHCA will encourage approaches that seek active participation by users, developers, and policy makers from all parts of the world. 2. Stay lightweight and flexible In the spirit of open source where development is user and needs driven, facilitation needs to support highly desirable dynamism, adaptability, and flexibility. This approach seeks to facilitate natural processes that produce unprecedented quality, usability, and cost effectiveness. 3. Be open to diverse opinions and technologies OSHCA is inclusive of all health care-related open source activities. In an open source world, the success of an idea, standard, or product is measured by its practical use. (I have difficulty trying to relate the second to the first statements, as pointed out by Thomas. Any help here?) 4. Ethical Deployment OSHCA's focus is the legal and ethical deployment of reliable and robust open source systems in all areas of health care. This means taking leadership role to ensure standards are maintained and working with legislative and standards bodies to encourage the inclusion of open source principals in their policies. Activities 1. OSHCA Conference 2. Maintain OSHCA web-portal 3. Maintain database of open source health care softwares 4. Maintain database of open source programmers 5. Maintain database of individuals, non-profits and commercial enterprises supporting and maintaining open source health care softwares 6. Form groups on developing guidelines on health information standards, quality control on open source software development, etc. Molly SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! Photos Ring in the New Year with Photo Calendars. Add photos, events, holidays, whatever. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
Re: [openhealth] RE: The Question
--- William Lester [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Where can I get more info? The website www.engenderhealth.org does not give any clues. NPOKI gives nothing much on a google search. Nandalal Collectively we work in over 160 countries. I won't list them all, but here's a short list of the countries where our member organizations work: AzerbaijanBahamasBangladeshBelizeBeninBoliviaBrazilBurkina FasoCambodiaCameroonChileChinaColombiaCosta RicaCôte d'IvoireDominican Republic EcuadorEl SalvadorEthiopiaGhanaGuatemalaGuineaGuyanaHaitiHondurasIndiaIndonesiaJordanKenyaMadagascarMalawiMauritaniaMexicoMongoliaMozambiqueMyanmarNepalNicaraguaNigeriaPakistanPanamaParaguayPeruPhilippinesRussiaRwandaSenegalSomaliaSouth AfricaSudanTanzaniaTogoTurkeyUgandaUkraineUnited StatesUruguayVenezuelaVietnamZambia [EMAIL PROTECTED] 1/9/2006 7:08 PM Hi William, In which countries are they active? Nandalal --- William Lester [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: RE: ...when will more not-for-profit medical organizations band together... Not such a dangerous idea. A group of international nonprofit health agencies has recently formed a collaborative called NPOKI (nonprofit organizations knowledge initiative). The purpose of the group is to ...collaborate in the formation and use of tools for knowledge creation and sharing within and among organizations world-wide... These are the folks who are already working in health facilities in the developing world helping to strengthen the infrastructure, build capacity, train physicians and medical staff, and improve the delivery of health services to the underserved. One of the tools that they are looking at are medical records systems appropriate for low resource clinical settings. At their December meeting, there was a strong commitment to open source solutions, with a realization that many tools already exist that may meet their needs, some of which are in use even today. They look to be a trusted source of information about these systems, helping the membership to evaluate the existing resources and build/customize features needed for successful implementation. The good news is that this is actually happening, and that the folks sitting at the table include the implementing agencies, their grantees, and their funders. I'll report back more information as the group continues to organize and decide on their priority projects. Bill Lester -- William A. Lester CIO/Director of Technology EngenderHealth 440 Ninth Avenue New York, NY 10001 (Office) 212.561.8002 (e-Mail) [EMAIL PROTECTED] (URL) www.engenderhealth.org The future is here. It's just not widely distributed yet. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 1/8/2006 12:26 AM Great topic! Here's one- When will more not-for-profit medical organizations band together and share in the development of open source software for their common interests? Dangerous in that I think it is disruptive and inevitable. John * Art, Information, and Ceramics. http://www.john-norris.net * YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] __ Yahoo! DSL * Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] __ Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] OSS collections
is also useful for this purpose. However one really good site with descriptions, reviews and classifications would be nice. You are aware of the excellent state of the art, OSCAR project in Canada, based on JAVA which plans to cover almost everything in health care, eventually? (with apologies to David Chan if i am wrong :-) ) Nandalal --- Benjamin Jung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: www.linuxmednews.com Hello, I was trying to find a website that lists Open Source Applications used in Healthcare and their status, e.g. obsolete, beta, stable,... A quick Google search returned some pages that list applications, but they do not go into more details. Additionally, most of these 'link collection pages' have been updated only a couple of years ago. Are you aware of any such websites that give up-to-date information? If not: Do you think such a site would be beneficial to market OSS in healthcare in one single place? Anybody interested in some initial email brain storming? Imagine a physician/hospital/lab that is looking for an Open Source application for a specific purpose. Where do they get comprehensive, comparable information? Some applications are hosted on sites such as sourceforge and freshmeat; others aren't. Some applications are mentioned regularily in News and Blogs; others aren't. Some applications are being taught and introduced at university; others aren't. Benjamin -- Benjamin Jung Health Information Science University of Victoria __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] RE: The Question
Hi William, In which countries are they active? Nandalal --- William Lester [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: RE: ...when will more not-for-profit medical organizations band together... Not such a dangerous idea. A group of international nonprofit health agencies has recently formed a collaborative called NPOKI (nonprofit organizations knowledge initiative). The purpose of the group is to ...collaborate in the formation and use of tools for knowledge creation and sharing within and among organizations world-wide... These are the folks who are already working in health facilities in the developing world helping to strengthen the infrastructure, build capacity, train physicians and medical staff, and improve the delivery of health services to the underserved. One of the tools that they are looking at are medical records systems appropriate for low resource clinical settings. At their December meeting, there was a strong commitment to open source solutions, with a realization that many tools already exist that may meet their needs, some of which are in use even today. They look to be a trusted source of information about these systems, helping the membership to evaluate the existing resources and build/customize features needed for successful implementation. The good news is that this is actually happening, and that the folks sitting at the table include the implementing agencies, their grantees, and their funders. I'll report back more information as the group continues to organize and decide on their priority projects. Bill Lester -- William A. Lester CIO/Director of Technology EngenderHealth 440 Ninth Avenue New York, NY 10001 (Office) 212.561.8002 (e-Mail) [EMAIL PROTECTED] (URL) www.engenderhealth.org The future is here. It's just not widely distributed yet. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 1/8/2006 12:26 AM Great topic! Here's one- When will more not-for-profit medical organizations band together and share in the development of open source software for their common interests? Dangerous in that I think it is disruptive and inevitable. John * Art, Information, and Ceramics. http://www.john-norris.net * YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] __ Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Re: Takin' it serious...
Since we started off with dangerous questions, aren't everyone taking things too seriously? The more dangerous the suggestions, the better? ;-) Nandalal --- Peter Holt Hoffman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Tim, I believe you're being trolled. -- Peter. Always do right. This will gratify some people and astonish the rest. -- Mark Twain. - Original Message From: Koray Atalag [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: openhealth@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, January 08, 2006 9:06:11 AM Subject: [openhealth] Re: Takin' it serious... Sorry if I offended you - it's these annoying cultural differences, you know. It'll be so much easier in another decade or so when we all think and act like Americans. Until then... Tim C Hi Tim, You really put a big smile on my face that I can not stopin this beautiful Sunday...I did't quite get what you really meant by thinking and acting like Americans...I hope you do not refer to the kind of thinking and acting that resulted in Hiroshima/Nagasaki and more recently the misery in Iraq...Unfortunately the Bush administration has proven that the World would be a better and more peaceful place with less Americans! I have many good friends with US nationality and also I had spent a year in US-Canada so this has nothing to with nationality or culture...It is the human nature and human character does not have nationality... I hope someday we will all get rid of our prejudice and discriminative thoughts...Only then... Dr. Koray Atalag SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] __ Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] The Question
Accept impermanance as the universal truth in our daily living, and that helping others is what really helps you. Nandalal --- Tim Cook [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If any of you read The Edge ( http://www.edge.org/ ) you'll be familiar with John Brockman's annual big question to a chosen group of leading thinkers. Many on this mailing list have been working together since 1999 or before in some cases. I am wondering..in the context of open source healthcare IT lessons learned so far. What is your dangerous idea? Cheers, -- Tim Cook [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] __ Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] Framework for interoperability between existing softwares
Thomas Beale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Thomas, As a member of RACS, I was interested in what Australia is planning in Health IT. I even wrote to a professor who was interested in implementing something for surgical audit and electronic log books. I mentioned that it is in the best interests of Australia to use open standards and remain independent of US based software and standards unless absolutely necessary. I did not receive a reply yet. I do hope that FOSS and open standards and OpenEHR and archetypes will be used from the onset. If there is cross state agreement, they could pulll off something workable without the huge financial input made by the British. Nandalal Nandalal Gunaratne wrote: Koray Atalag [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: namely CEN TC251, is centered around openEHR metholodologies and artifacts...Also as far as I know it is selected as a national standard in Australia - What is? OpenEHR or CEN TC251? The National e-Health Transition Authority (nehta.gov.au) is considering standards for the future e-Health framework for Australia. openEHR is probably the major contender in the EHR space. You can see some commentary about openEHR, archetypes, HL7 from the earlier CIP project in HealthConnect (Australia). Clinical Information Project Phase 1 Report, PART A Stream 1: Clinical Information Framework. 2004. Available at http://www.healthconnect.gov.au/pdf/cipp1pa.pdf Archetypes are more or less a given in Australia, we know that much. Some announcement by NeHTA on other standards will be made http://www.healthconnect.gov.au/pdf/cipp1pa.pdf early 2006 I believe. Apart from that, openEHR 0.9 is already in use in the Queensland Health clinical data repository, and many applications are going to be converted to talking openEHR. There are also other implementations underway in Australia. Not much information is published about these projects so far. Here is one paper: http://titanium.dstc.edu.au/papers/HIC_2004.pdf - thomas beale SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back! http://us.click.yahoo.com/2jUsvC/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/W4wwlB/TM ~- Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [openhealth] OSCAR passed!
Hooray! Cheers to OSCAR team! Nandalal David Chan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: *** It's official! *** OSCAR has been certified by OntarioMD under the Physician IT Program. The list of certified products will be published at www.ontariomdtsp.ca. From OntarioMD: Certification means that the product has passed a set of requirements to ensure that the product can support defined standards for clinical and practice management software. Ontario physicians helped define these standards. More information on the standards and the certification process is available on the OntarioMD website at www.ontariomd.com/en/services/cycle3.jsp. On another note: * oscarFax is now available in SourceForge CVS Repository * This release has been used in our clinics for the last two years. The CAISI team is working on improving it for faxing prescriptions. Please communicate via our Forum in the Developers Corner topic if you are interested in using it or joining CAISI to improve it (i.e. don't email us :-) David David H Chan, MD, CCFP, MSc, FCFP Associate Professor Department of Family Medicine McMaster University __ Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click. http://farechase.yahoo.com SPONSORED LINKS Software distribution Salon software Medical software Software association Software jewelry Software deployment - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group openhealth on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. - - Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/W4wwlB/TM ~- Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/openhealth/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/