Re: [PEDA] Dxp forum
Thanks to all that posted the DXP link. I'm going to monitor DXP forum until all of the OS bugs are worked out. The DXP release looks like it was released too early and with too many bugs to be a useful tool, much like 99 was released then a year later 99SE was released. So Ill monitor activity there without my two cents See you guys there Mike Reagan - Original Message - From: Tony Karavidas [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Protel EDA Forum' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 7:45 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Dxp forum Nah, we're just all so smart with 99SE that we now don't have much to say about it. (other than the I forgot if it does this...can someone tell me? or the newbie questions which have been answered pretty darn fast. You take it easy Mike. Maybe we'll see ya on the DXP forum someday. -Original Message- From: Michael Reagan (EDSI) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 7:51 PM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: Re: [PEDA] Dxp forum This forum has really gone downhill I think its time to bail this forum and see what is happening in the DXP forum. Can anyone post the link for the DXP forum Frankly Im tired of hearing , My protel doesnt work with SCSI, or cd rom , or doesnt run nwhen I listen to nSync in the backround on my Linux system Probahly my last posting on here because there are no new issues here Mike Reagan EDSI ** ** * Tracking #: B613DACD1BAE614C8AAB58EC8200A129BD127FBC * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] test
I haven't received any PEDA mail in several days, and the DXP has slowed to a trickle. So please ignore this minor annoyance (I may not even get it!). thanks, Richard Cheesecote Mountain CAMAC, 24 Halley Drive; Pomona, NY 10970 voice: 845 364 0211, fax: 845 362 6947, www.cmcamac.com * Tracking #: 95581B4AC5C3164B9ACC741A65031483284D3853 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] SCSI v IDE IBM Deathstars (was Protel vs. DirectCD)
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Re: [PEDA] Slow Performance of Protel 99SE
I've had this problem before also with many posts to this forum. The best single action to speed things up was to change the polygon repour to never. I've done other things with rules and optimizing the computer but this seems to be the biggest problem. - Original Message - From: Adeel Malik [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Protel EDA Forum' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 24, 2002 8:58 AM Subject: [PEDA] Slow Performance of Protel 99SE Hi All, I have P-3 with 256MB RAM and quite a lot of space on Hard Disk but still sometimes the Protel seems to be crawling rather than running when the Net Count or component count exceeds 2000. I also perform Compact After Close option when exiting. Can someone give me generic guidelines as to how to increase the performance of Portel 99SE. Regards, Adeel Malik * Tracking #: 42AB61E38B690F459CD0D517F3829712A681FFCB * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] SCSI v IDE IBM Deathstars (was Protel vs. DirectCD)
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Re: [PEDA] Copper fill for thermal reason.
Can't wave solder as the thermal contact areas need to be flat with gold over nickel plating. Also got BGA. Examples of copper flood fill for thermal cooling can be seen here:- http://www.radstone.co.uk/html/PRODUCTS/pmcfa1r.html Regards Ian -Original Message- From: Danny Bishop [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: 25 August 2002 23:27 To: 'Protel EDA Forum' Subject: Re: [PEDA] Copper fill for thermal reason. hi Ian interesting requirements. What is the application, and what sort of temperature levels and stability do you require? Why do you need to connect the thermal areas to system EARTH (is this power earth, if so you will be trying to cool rather a large thermal mass!) I will be monitoring to see what people say about the EMC implications - much of it will come down to how noisy the two earths are, and the implications of the extra capacitive coupling that you will get. Are you thickening up the copper on the outside layers (where you require good thermal conduction)? I have done a bit of this, in both a highly critical scientific application, as well as in a mainstream industrial application where we just had to keep things cool (under difficult design constraints) It may be useful also for you to wave solder the board, as this will fill up untented vias and greatly increase thermal conduction. I may also be tempting to investigate leaving some or all of the thermal areas un-masked to thicken up these areas with solder, again to provide better thermal conductivity. cheers -Original Message- From: Ian Middleton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, 23 August 2002 10:46 PM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: [PEDA] Copper fill for thermal reason. I have a 6 layer board (S-P-S-S-P-S) that is to be used in a conduction cooled environment. It has heat thermal interface areas on the component side that mate with heat spreaders in the system. These thermal areas are electrically connected to system EARTH and not the PCB electical GND. We have been recommended to flood copper fill the component and solder side (connected to EARTH, using a generous 10mil gap) to ensure greater thermal conductivity and to connect the two fills with many vias. Obviously there are going to be areas of copper that are dead and will be removed by the Remove dead copper option on the Polygon Plane Options. Can anyone suggest any problems (EMC, signal integrity etc) with adding extra tracks (and polygons) on other PCB layers to connect these dead areas to the EARTH net thus stoping them being removed ? Ian ** ** * Tracking #: ECAA00D1A8D2584D86EE4B9D0C52A2AE0F0B998E * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] SCSI v IDE IBM Deathstars (was Protel vs. DirectCD)
i have never had an IDE die (knock on wood) My experience also. at one point i got a scsi scanner (HP) it wouldn't run on my scsi system (built by MICRON for $5K) it insisted on ONLY running on the crappy scsi controller they packaged with it after plugging that in i got it running, but there were still issues ... My experience also. I had to replace the el-crappo (8-bit ISA) SCSI card with another el-crappo one when the first one died. That was for a circa 1993 UMAX Vista T-630 scanner (bulky by today's standard, but it still works and produces beautiful results). Best regards, Ivan Baggett Bagotronix Inc. website: www.bagotronix.com - Original Message - From: Dennis Saputelli [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 7:32 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] SCSI v IDE IBM Deathstars (was Protel vs. DirectCD) without disputing any of your assertions which may be entirely correct, my personal experience has been different every scsi drive i ever had died on me (4 or 5 of them, different eras and makers) i have never had an IDE die (knock on wood) also there is another layer to scsi which has given me trouble, the controller/driver layer which are more complex than IDE on various systems at various times with various controllers sometimes it was a hope and a prayer that it would boot on first try at one point i got a scsi scanner (HP) it wouldn't run on my scsi system (built by MICRON for $5K) it insisted on ONLY running on the crappy scsi controller they packaged with it after plugging that in i got it running, but there were still issues ... scsi did allow me to pile a bunch of drives in one box achieving more storage than i otherwise could have gotten, but that is all moot now for many (most?) of us Dennis Saputelli * Tracking #: 23988BA856F0CF469FE8CD96DBFA1C7EBAFFAE6A * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
[PEDA] Re[2]: AW: DXP and Specctra
I spoke with a member of Altium's tech support staff the other day to inquire if a past problem I had under P99SE SP6 had been fixed. The problem had to do with the y location of netnames not attaching properly to the wires when the .dsn was imported into Protel. I was told that the Orcad translator was not currently present in DXP, but should appear in a later service pack. I haven't checked for it myself, but that's what he told me. ---Phil DS where did you find export to DSN ? DS i couldn't' find it DS neither was a question about this answered on the DXP list DS Dennis Saputelli DS Georg Beckmann wrote: Hi Gisbert, you can export a *.dsn file. But till now, I didn't try it, because about other problems. Georg -Urspr ngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Gesendet: Dienstag, 27. August 2002 14:56 An: Protel EDA Forum Betreff: [PEDA] DXP and Specctra Hello, just a short question, as I did not have the time to evaluate the DXP trial so far: In the documentation/tutorials Altium placed on their website concerning DXP I did not find a single word about a Specctra interface. Does DXP have such an interface like 99SE or not, and did anyone test it? Mit freundlichem Gru Kind regards Gisbert Auge N.A.T. GmbH www.nateurope.com * Tracking #: 9D4B1D0532A03D418FB343079AD700224F27D02D * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
[PEDA] Re[2]: Protel vs. DirectCD
FYI- The latest Issue of Maximum PC (Sept) is reporting a performance issue under XP with SCSI drives. The problem seems related to historic recommendations of the mode that a file should be opened with. There was a mention that under certain conditions, this problem could occur in W2K also. MS is supposedly working on a patch for it. I've got 98 and IDE myself, so I wasn't paying full attention. ---Phil MD You should invest in SCSI I/O if you have a lot of throughput problems to MD cause buffer underruns. I can defrag a partition while burning from the MD other without underrun issues and without burnproof. Most of the problems MD arise with all IDE based systems that use 100% CPU to burn CDs and MUST use MD burnproof or else you get a coaster. With a SCSI based system you'd see MD about a 1-2% CPU hit while burning. I have a 200Mhz Pentium Pro machine that MD I used to use to duplicate CDs that can copy a CD to five burners at 8X at MD once w/o any underrun issues. IDE couldn't even dream of that... MD I cant really stress enough how important I/O is to system performance MD independent of CPU and memory size. A single Ultra160 15K disk will MD outperform two ATA100 disks in a RIAD 0 stripe. Also when putting a SCSI MD disk under full throughput stress it doesn't use 100% of the CPU like all IDE MD based systems. Not to mention the reliability and increased cache sizes you MD get with most server-class SCSI disk. SCSI disks have no where near the high MD failure rates of IDE disks because you are buying a enterprise solution. MD Prices have really come down as well.. you can get a 73GB 10k RPM Ultra160 MD disk for about $320 now...that's really cheap! MD Anyhow, back to Protel... MD -Original Message- MD From: Dennis Saputelli [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] MD Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 12:53 PM MD To: Protel EDA Forum MD Subject: Re: [PEDA] Protel vs. DirectCD MD it works for me (new roxio) MD i have had far less coasters w/ roxio than nero and i find it much MD easier to use MD but i usually close all other apps while burning and don't do other MD tasks at the same time MD Dennis Saputelli MD mariusrf wrote: if you Google rec.video.desktop you will see the vast majority of people had problems with roxio and switched to ahead nero for cd burning . MD directcd and easy cd creator historically had tons of issues with the most diverse MD pc configurations . Matt Tudor , MSEE http://www.gigahertzelectronics.com - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 11:33 AM Subject: [PEDA] Protel vs. DirectCD I've just encountered a problem which essentially crashes my machine (W2K P99SE SP6) when I try to run Protel while Roxio's Easy CD Creator v 5.01_E2 is running. I think it's just a shell for DirectCD; it came bundled with my Dell, but is actually just crippleware (lowering my opinion of Dell; they promised a CDRW with supporting software, but this comes with ads to buy the full software). Has anyone else seen this? Is there anything specific I can do to alow continuing to at least view schematics in Protel while writing a CD of unrelated files? Steve Hendrix MD MD * Tracking #: 79CB9D5E956ED94B9A4A281EF20A5D3A14E050EF MD * MD * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Dxp forum
Probahly my last posting on here because there are no new issues here Don't trip on the pile of dead hard drives buggy video cards, or the wheel mouse cords, or slip on the coaster CDs, on your way out! ;-) Best regards, Ivan Baggett Bagotronix Inc. website: www.bagotronix.com - Original Message - From: Michael Reagan (EDSI) [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 10:51 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Dxp forum This forum has really gone downhill I think its time to bail this forum and see what is happening in the DXP forum. Can anyone post the link for the DXP forum Frankly Im tired of hearing , My protel doesnt work with SCSI, or cd rom , or doesnt run nwhen I listen to nSync in the backround on my Linux system Probahly my last posting on here because there are no new issues here Mike Reagan EDSI * Tracking #: B613DACD1BAE614C8AAB58EC8200A129BD127FBC * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] SCSI v IDE IBM Deathstars (was Protel vs. DirectCD)
cards were adaptec HP scanner was mid to top of line at the time Dennis Saputelli Matt Daggett wrote: What kind of card was it? You cant really blame the SCSI interface itself if you were using an cheap/unsupported device. Just as in any computer hardware... its all worthless without good drivers. Most OS's have innate and very good driver support for the standard and popular SCSI cards on the market (Adaptec families, etc). Getting a scanner to work with a $10 bundled controller card is another story. If you bought the bottom-of-the-line model from KIA and it broke down you wouldn't draw the conclusion cars suck would you. But there is no point in continuing this thread really... I'm sure everyone could chime in with their $0.02 about their experience with every drive model/make/interface since they ever had a computer. Again, the initial thread was that slow I/O and CPU overhead due to a particular storage interface COULD have been one of the reasons certain list members couldn't complete CD burns without babying their machines or at all. There are significant hardware improvements in SCSI disks other than just a faster spindle speed. The materials used in the platters are much more advanced to minimized bad sectors and the servos on the heads are faster and more precise for continuous sustained read/seek performance. Not to mention all of the on-board logic to implement better data prefetch and location prediction. Increased MTBF and 100% duty cycles. The disks are made to hit two points within the professional and enterprise community: known reliability and high performance. IDE disks on the other had while embracing many of the same technical upgrades through the years as SCSI technology are made to provide the consumer market with: large storage density and cheap price. Even as the quality of the disks themselves increase there will still always be the CPU hit due to the fact that IDE cannot multitask. To each his own... if you don't want to pay more for hard drives, then don't. If you are pleased with your IDE reliability through the years, then keep using them. If you don't think there could possibly be any improvement in SCSI disks than IDE to warrant the higher price tag then continue to think that way. But there are clear cut technological and application differences for each of the storage technologies to meet a particular customer/price/performance. -Original Message- From: Dennis Saputelli [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 7:33 PM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: Re: [PEDA] SCSI v IDE IBM Deathstars (was Protel vs. DirectCD) without disputing any of your assertions which may be entirely correct, my personal experience has been different every scsi drive i ever had died on me (4 or 5 of them, different eras and makers) i have never had an IDE die (knock on wood) also there is another layer to scsi which has given me trouble, the controller/driver layer which are more complex than IDE on various systems at various times with various controllers sometimes it was a hope and a prayer that it would boot on first try at one point i got a scsi scanner (HP) it wouldn't run on my scsi system (built by MICRON for $5K) it insisted on ONLY running on the crappy scsi controller they packaged with it after plugging that in i got it running, but there were still issues ... scsi did allow me to pile a bunch of drives in one box achieving more storage than i otherwise could have gotten, but that is all moot now for many (most?) of us Dennis Saputelli Matt Daggett wrote: Its very noticeable... especially if you have any kind of disk caching. Also anytime you do anything I/O intensive you are taking a CPU hit which slows performance. SCSI is intended for servers and high end workstations where as IDE is more suited for the home PC user who is using AOL and Word. IDE hits a great price for large cheap storage but its hardly a reliability or performance solution. Also, I hope you have good luck with your new DEATHstar. To prove a point about the unreliability of IDE drives you should look into the ongoing major class action law suit against IBM over its Deskstar line of drives. Disks failing at abnormally high rates and IBM turning the blind eye. Most users have reported having a disk fail and then that replacement fail and the replacement for that failing. Something like that would be unheard of in the SCSI realm due to just plain higher quality drives. Another thing you should be aware of is that if you look in the IBM documentation the deskstar is described as having recommended power-on hours of 333 per month--about 11 hours a day. Drive reliability is typically measured with the assumption that the drive is on 60 percent of the time--somewhat higher than 46 percent of the time that 333 hours a month would mean. On laptops,
Re: [PEDA] SCSI v IDE IBM Deathstars (was Protel vs. DirectCD)
HP SCSI scanner cards were notorious for their compatibility problems. And for the fact that HP was dropping driver support as soon as they could, by just phasing out the product although the OS versions were still being sold. I remember a Symbios SCSI card myself which contributed to some white hair definitely . Matt Tudor , MSEE http://www.gigahertzlectronics.com - Original Message - From: Bagotronix Tech Support [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2002 12:00 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] SCSI v IDE IBM Deathstars (was Protel vs. DirectCD) at one point i got a scsi scanner (HP) it wouldn't run on my scsi system (built by MICRON for $5K) it insisted on ONLY running on the crappy scsi controller they packaged with it after plugging that in i got it running, but there were still issues ... My experience also. I had to replace the el-crappo (8-bit ISA) SCSI card with another el-crappo one when the first one died. That was for a circa 1993 UMAX Vista T-630 scanner (bulky by today's standard, but it still works and produces beautiful results). * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Tracking #: B96A8EB919FC5940B44C1C8561A48FD5FCE61FCF * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] SCSI v IDE IBM Deathstars (was Protel vs. DirectCD)
[PEDA] please unsubscribe me
Can the list manager or someone delete me from this mailing list? I have used the automated and correct web page interface and have requested to be removed many times over the last couple of weeks with no success. I might be doing something wrong but don't know what it would be. Thanks, [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Tracking #: D753A9EB4D678C4DA3420FFE2670330263142712 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Mentor to Cadence
In case you found nothing else; this is a commercial company who may be able to help you: http://www.confac.com/index.htm Cheers, Jan Martin Wagenaar At 15:14 (28-8-02), you wrote: Is any one know some who can translat Mentor file toCadence. Thanks Narinder * Tracking #: 2896AF8C94CF4A4DA046F981AD788C9E1D3A99C3 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
