[Python-Dev] Re: Small lament...

[Mariatta]

Last I heard is that some core devs are forming the duo PEP Shop Boys.
Their debut album will be titled "Please merge".


On Sat, Apr 1, 2023, 11:22 AM Skip Montanaro 
wrote:

> Just wanted to throw this out there... I lament the loss of waking up on
> April 1st to see a creative April Fool's Day joke on one or both of these
> lists, often from our FLUFL... Maybe such frivolity still happens, just not in
> the Python ecosystem? I know you can still import "this" or
> "antigravity", but those are now old (both introduced before 2010). When
> was the last time a clever easter egg was introduced or an April Fool's Day
> joke played?
>
> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
>
> Skip
>
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[Python-Dev] Re: Switching to Discourse

[Mariatta]

On Thu, Jul 21, 2022 at 10:20 AM Samuel Colvin  wrote:

>
> If discord is not finalised, we might also consider https://zulip.com/
> which rust uses  and would (based on a
> very quick look) appear to be more appropriate for python development's use
> case?
>
>
>
We tried zulip in the past, it never got traction. I believe there was an
email saying that it's no longer monitored by core devs. We also removed it
from devguide.

For the core devs, Discord was chosen after discussions in the
python-committers:
https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-committ...@python.org/thread/BVPITIYRECSGCX2JUTMT7F7CCCYQSK4K/#BVPITIYRECSGCX2JUTMT7F7CCCYQSK4K
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[Python-Dev] Re: Switching to Discourse

[Mariatta]

On Thu, Jul 21, 2022 at 10:05 AM Skip Montanaro 
wrote:

> I have a perhaps stupid question. Is Discord the same as
> discuss.python.org, just by another name? I find the similarity in
> names a bit confusing.
>
>
It's not the same. discuss.python.org is an instance of Discourse.

Discord is something completely something else.
 Indeed the similarity is confusing.
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[Python-Dev] Re: Switching to Discourse

[Mariatta]

I think this is a great change, one I've been looking forward to myself.

For authors of PEPs and discussion topics, Discourse provides better
authoring experience, allowing for typo fixes and small edits.
For moderators, Discourse also provides the toolings to make their jobs
easier, which is definitely lacking in mailing list.
For the readers, we get the choice of receiving emails via mailing list
mode, or via rss, or by actually going to the site.

I think it's great that you've considered what's best for the different
types of users here.  So thank you Petr and SC for this decision.

On Fri, Jul 15, 2022 at 4:26 AM Petr Viktorin  wrote:

> Hello,
> Currently development discussions are split between multiple
> communication channels, for example:
> - python-dev and discuss.python.org for design discussions,
> - GitHub Issues and Pull Requests for specific changes,
> - IRC, Discord and private chats for real-time discussions,
> - Topic-specific channels like typing-sig.
>
> While most of these serve different needs, there is too much overlap
> between python-dev and discuss.python.org. It seems that for most
> people, this situation is worse than sticking to either one platform –
> even if we don't go with that person's favorite.
>
> The discuss.python.org experiment has been going on for quite a while,
> and while the platform is not without its issues, we consider it a
> success. The Core Development category is busier than python-dev.
> According to staff, discuss.python.org is much easier to moderate.. If
> you're following python-dev but not discuss.python.org, you're missing
> out.
>
> The Steering Council would like to switch from python-dev to
> discuss.python.org.
> Practically, this means:
> - Moving the required PEP announcements to discuss.python.org
> - Moving discuss.python.org up in the devguide communications page
> (https://devguide.python.org/communication/)
> - And that's it?
>
> I imagine that the mailing list will stay around for continuing past
> discussion threads and for announcements, eventually switching to
> auto-reject incoming messages with a pointer to discuss.python.org.
>
> To be clear, discuss.python.org allows editing posts, which is frankly
> handy for typos and clarifications. Editing alone should not be used for
> adding new info -- we should cultivate a culture of being friendly to
> mail users & notification watchers. This probably bears repeating in a
> few places.
>
> We're aware not everyone wants to use the discuss.python.org website,
> but there are some ways to avoid it:
>
> - For new PEPs, you can point your RSS client to
> https://www.python.org/dev/peps/peps.rss – it's not e-mail, but many
> email clients have RSS support. You can also watch the Steering Council
> issues on GitHub (https://github.com/python/steering-council/issues/)
> for important questions and discussions.
>
> - You can use discuss.python.org's “mailing list mode” (which subscribes
> you to all new posts), possibly with filtering and/or categorizing
> messages locally.
>
> However, we would like to know if this will pose an undue burden to
> anyone, if there are workflows or usage problems that we are not aware
> of. As mentioned, this is something the Steering Council thinks is a
> good idea, but we want to make sure we're aware of all the impact when
> we make the final decision.
>
>
>
> – Petr, on behalf of the Steering Council
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[Python-Dev] Announcing the Diátaxis Documentation Workshop

[Mariatta]

Diátaxis Documentation Workshop

The Python documentation community
<https://github.com/python/docs-community> will be hosting a free two-part
workshop by Daniele Procida <https://vurt.org/>, the creator of the Diátaxis
framework <https://diataxis.fr/>.

Each session will be two hours; including an introduction,
discussion/questions, and practical exercises in small groups; and will be
hosted on Zoom. There’s an *optional* take-home exercise after the first
session, which we’ll review during the second.

The second session builds upon the first, so we strongly prefer that you
attend both sessions to fully benefit from it. However, we may be able to
accommodate a limited number of people that can only make it to one. They
will be hands-on, so to get the most out of your attendance, be ready to
participate and interact with Daniele and your fellow attendees!

While the primary focus of the workshop is on contributors to the Python
documentation, they are open to anyone in the open source community
interested in writing better documentation, as long as space allows.

To attend the workshop, sign up using the registration form
<https://forms.gle/xQSZJ2Yf4Jjd27wf6>, and we’ll confirm your
attendance by August
1. We will try our best to fill any remaining slots on a rolling
space-available basis.

The presentation portion of the workshop will be recorded (though the
interactive aspect won’t be).
<https://discuss.python.org/t/announcing-the-diataxis-documentation-workshops/17075#workshop-agenda-2>Workshop
Agenda

Session 1: Introduction to Diátaxis
Tuesday, August 16 2022, 16:00-18:00 UTC (12 - 2 PM US Eastern / 9 - 11 AM
US Pacific)
<https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Di%C3%A1taxis+Workshop+Session+1%3A+Introduction+to+Di%C3%A1taxis=20220816T16=%3A=2>

   - The Diátaxis system and how it works
   - Using it for documentation in general
   - Applying it to the Python docs specifically

Session 2: Getting Things Done
Thursday, August 18 2022, 16:00-18:00 UTC (12 - 2 PM US Eastern / 9 - 11 AM
US Pacific)
<https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Di%C3%A1taxis+Workshop+Session+2%3A+Getting+Things+Done=20220818T16=%3A=2>

   - Authoring practices and approaches
   - Getting work started and keeping it going
   - Making life easy for ourselves

<https://discuss.python.org/t/announcing-the-diataxis-documentation-workshops/17075#about-daniele-procida-3>About
Daniele Procida

I’m a Director of Engineering at Canonical <https://canonical.com/>, where
I work to transform documentation practice across 40-plus engineering teams.

Ever since I’ve become involved in software in 2009, I’ve been involved in
its documentation too. I found my way to software through Python and
Django, so that’s where I’ve made most of my direct contributions: Django,
pytest, django CMS and others.

Through the international Python community, I’ve had the enormous pleasure
of taking part in numerous events and initiatives. The most important one
to me is the African Python movement: since 2015, I’ve attended multiple
editions of PyCon Namibia, PyCon Ghana and PyCon Africa.

In recent years, I’ve had the fortune of seeing the approaches I’ve
developed in my work in documentation adopted much more widely across the
software industry. I am always thrilled to have the opportunity to
contribute back through documentation to the same software communities that
have lifted me up in my own software journey.
<https://discuss.python.org/t/announcing-the-diataxis-documentation-workshops/17075#getting-in-touch-4>Getting
in Touch

If you have questions or concerns about the workshop, please post in the Docs
Community forum <https://discuss.python.org/c/documentation/26> on
Discourse.

For private communications, please get in touch with one of the
organizers: Mariatta, Ned Batchelder, and C.A.M. Gerlach
<https://discuss.python.org/t/announcing-the-diataxis-documentation-workshops/17075#acknowledgement-5>
Acknowledgement

Thanks to Canonical for their support and generosity in making Daniele’s
participation in this workshop series possible.
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[Python-Dev] Announcing the Python Language Summit 2022 blog posts

[Mariatta]

The blog posts about presentations and discussions from Python Language
Summit 2022 are now up for your enjoyment.

Main article:
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2022/05/the-2022-python-language-summit_01678898482.html

- Python without the GIL

, Sam Gross
- Reaching a per-interpreter GIL

, Eric Snow
- The “Faster CPython” project: 3.12 and beyond

, Mark Shannon
- WebAssembly: Python in the browser and beyond

, Christian Heimes
- F-strings in the grammar
,
Pablo Galindo Salgado
- Cinder Async Optimisations
,
Itamar Ostricher
- The issue and PR backlog
,
Irit Katriel
- The path forward for immortal objects
,
Eddie Elizondo and Eric Snow
- Lightning talks
,
short presentations by Carl Meyer, Thomas Wouters, Kevin Modzelewski, and
Larry Hastings

Thanks Alex Waygood for the write ups!

Also thank you to all presenters and attendees for great content and
discussions.

This is the fourth Language Summit that I co-chaired with Łukasz, and also
my last one. I’m stepping down from this responsibility to free up my time
to take on other responsibilities and challenges. I’m grateful to have been
given this opportunity to serve the Python community. This has been a great
privilege and valuable experience. Thank you Lukasz for working alongside
me the past four years, and Senthil for helping out this year.

Thank you!
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[Python-Dev] Re: Python Language Summit at PyCon 2022 in Salt Lake City

[Mariatta]

Last call!

Please sign up for the language summit before this Saturday.

We received a number of topic proposals in the last few days, and we still
have room for more, so don't delay.

Full details at: https://us.pycon.org/2022/events/language-summit/

When: Wednesday, April 27, 2022
Where: in person during PyCon US, Salt Palace Convention Center, room TBD

Sign up to attend:  https://forms.gle/CS8B6wJdcaN3rtWV8  (closes March 25
th, 2022 AoE)
Sign up to discuss a topic: https://forms.gle/LAFE6TTYi15jL5RaA (closes
March 25th, 2022 AoE)



On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 9:14 AM Mariatta  wrote:

> Hi everybody,
>
> Just sending out a reminder to sign up for the language summit. The
> signups are open until EOD Friday this week.
>
> *When:* Wednesday, April 27, 2022
> *Where:* in person during PyCon US, Salt Palace Convention Center, room
> TBD
>
> *Sign up to attend:*  https://forms.gle/CS8B6wJdcaN3rtWV8
> <https://forms.gle/CS8B6wJdcaN3rtWV8> (closes March 25 th, 2022 AoE)
> *Sign up to discuss a topic:* https://forms.gle/LAFE6TTYi15jL5RaA (closes
> March 25th, 2022 AoE)
>
> Currently the room is more than half full! We have close to 30
> attendees signing up, but we haven't received a lot of presentation
> proposals yet. (less than 5)
>
> From the signups, it seems like attendees are interested in discussing
> topics like: Cinder, Faster CPython, and various PEPs. So if you've been
> thinking about submitting a proposal, please do it soon!
>
> Thank you,
>
> Mariatta, Łukasz, & Senthil
>
>
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[Python-Dev] Re: Python Language Summit at PyCon 2022 in Salt Lake City

[Mariatta]

Hi everybody,

Just sending out a reminder to sign up for the language summit. The signups
are open until EOD Friday this week.

*When:* Wednesday, April 27, 2022
*Where:* in person during PyCon US, Salt Palace Convention Center, room TBD

*Sign up to attend:*  https://forms.gle/CS8B6wJdcaN3rtWV8
<https://forms.gle/CS8B6wJdcaN3rtWV8> (closes March 25 th, 2022 AoE)
*Sign up to discuss a topic:* https://forms.gle/LAFE6TTYi15jL5RaA (closes
March 25th, 2022 AoE)

Currently the room is more than half full! We have close to 30
attendees signing up, but we haven't received a lot of presentation
proposals yet. (less than 5)

>From the signups, it seems like attendees are interested in discussing
topics like: Cinder, Faster CPython, and various PEPs. So if you've been
thinking about submitting a proposal, please do it soon!

Thank you,

Mariatta, Łukasz, & Senthil
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[Python-Dev] Python Language Summit at PyCon 2022 in Salt Lake City

[Mariatta]

We're excited to announce that the signups for Python Language Summit at
PyCon 2022 are now open.

Full details at: https://us.pycon.org/2022/events/language-summit/

After two years of virtual/online summit, we will be returning to in-person
format. We will be following the health and safety guidelines at PyCon US:
https://us.pycon.org/2022/attend/health-safety-guidelines/

*TL;DR*

When: Wednesday, April 27, 2022
Where: Salt Palace Convention Center, room TBD

Sign up to attend:  https://forms.gle/CS8B6wJdcaN3rtWV8
<https://forms.gle/CS8B6wJdcaN3rtWV8> (closes March 25 th, 2022 AoE)
Sign up to discuss a topic: https://forms.gle/LAFE6TTYi15jL5RaA (closes
March 25th, 2022 AoE)

*Who can attend*

We welcome Python core developers and triage team members, active core
contributors to Python and alternative Python implementations, and anyone
else who has a topic to discuss with core developers.

*Who can propose a discussion topic*

If you have discussion items; seeking consensus; awaiting decision on a
PEP; needing help with your core dev work; or have specific questions that
need answers from core developers, please submit a proposal. According to
feedback, our audience prefers more discussions and shorter talks.

In your proposal, please include:
- why is this topic relevant to the core developers
- what is needed from core developers out of this topic

This year's event will be covered by Alex Waygood. Detailed summary of the
event will be published at The PSF's Blog.

*Is this event recorded? Can I watch the livestream?*

No, there will be no recording and no livestream available. If you'd like
to participate in discussions, please sign up to attend. If you'd like to
listen in, please wait for Alex's blog posts after the summit.

Thank you,

Mariatta, Łukasz, & Senthil
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[Python-Dev] CPython is participating in hacktoberfest (with caveat)

[Mariatta]

Hello,

I'm happy to announce that CPython project is participating in
hacktoberfest.
I have just added the hacktoberfest topic to CPython's GitHub Repo (
https://github.com/python/cpython).

Caveat: if we end up receiving too many spammy, invalid, and low-quality
PRs which just adds burden to maintainers, we will opt-out of this
immediately. I will be watching incoming PRs for the next week to determine
whether we should opt-out.

If you're participating in hacktoberfest, your contribution to the repo
will count.
Instead of receiving a t-shirt, you can also choose to have a tree planted
on your behalf, which I personally recommend.

If you're a core dev, you can also participate and get rewarded by
reviewing and merging pull requests. If you spot spammy PRs, please add
either the "spam" or "invalid" label.

Another way to participate is by donating to participating open source
projects. You can donate to CPython development through GitHub Sponsors (
https://github.com/sponsors/python)

Hacktoberfest  is an annual event
organized by Digital Ocean, now in the 8th year, where aspiring
contributors are encouraged to contribute to open source projects.
I'm a member of the Hacktoberfest Advisory council
. If you have
concerns, feedback, and suggestions about this event, please do let me know
and I'll be sure to pass it along.

Thank you.
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[Python-Dev] Re: [python-committers] Re: Roundup to GitHub Issues migration

[Mariatta]

FWIW, GitHub announced new powerful Issues today.
> https://github.com/features/issues
>

I have asked GitHub to enable it for the Python org.



>
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[Python-Dev] Re: Roundup to GitHub Issues migration

[Mariatta]

My understanding is that Ezio is/will be working on updating PEP 588.
Last I heard from Ezio is that he would be co-author of PEP 588 and he
would be updating it/rewrite it to better match the current migration plan.

I will check with Ezio and the gh-migration group on the status.

Thanks.

On Wed, Jun 23, 2021 at 10:33 AM Barry Warsaw  wrote:

>
>
> Mariatta is the author of PEP 588 and I’m the delegate.  Given how old
> that PEP is and the fact that Ezio is managing the project elsewhere, I
> think rejection is appropriate.  However if we do that I think the PEP
> should at least be updated with references to Ezio’s project, with some
> verbiage added as to why these changes are being made.
>
> What do you think, Mariatta?
>
> -Barry
>
>
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[Python-Dev] Re: Can't sync cpython main to my fork

[Mariatta]

I also don't keep my fork in sync, and never needed to.

I use the same workflow as Jelle.


On Thu., May 6, 2021, 7:18 a.m. Jelle Zijlstra, 
wrote:

>
>
> El jue, 6 may 2021 a las 6:58, Skip Montanaro ()
> escribió:
>
>> > Your main branch in GitHub has some commits they are not in
>> python/cpython.
>> > https://github.com/smontanaro/cpython/commits/main
>>
>> Regarding this. How else am I to keep my fork in sync with
>> python/cpython other than by the occasional pull upstream/push origin
>> process? That's what all those merges are. Is that first commit
>> (Github (un)Dependabot) the culprit, or are all the other git merge
>> results also problematic?
>>
>
> Maybe others have different workflows, but I don't see much of a need for
> keeping your fork's main branch up to date. My workflow is something like
> this:
>
> % git remote -v
> origin g...@github.com:JelleZijlstra/cpython.git (fetch)
> origin g...@github.com:JelleZijlstra/cpython.git (push)
> upstream https://github.com/python/cpython.git (fetch)
> upstream https://github.com/python/cpython.git (push)
> % git checkout main
> Already on 'main'
> Your branch is up to date with 'upstream/main'.
> % git pull
> ... get new changes from upstream
> % git checkout -b myfeature
> ... write my code
> % git push -u origin myfeature
> ... open a pull request
>
> So my local main branch tracks upstream/main (the real CPython repo), not
> origin/main (my fork).
>
>
>>
>> Skip
>> ___
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[Python-Dev] Announcing the CPython Docs Workgroup

[Mariatta]

Thanks to everyone for your patience as we worked to get the Docs Workgroup
off the ground.

As you may have remembered, Carol Willing and Ned Batchelder brought
forward the topic of CPython Documentation
<https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/04/cpython-documentation-next-5-years.html>
at last year's Python Language Summit.

The topic has been further discussed at last year's virtual Python core
dev's sprint, and Carol has worked on the Docs WG charter
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/175bjJA7hKRaqvLjiRXSvUxKgGWGJ5RMuW-jYKUsXm8c/edit>.
Please see the group charter doc linked above to understand the purpose,
goals, group values, and guidelines of the Docs WG.

We've been working to move the Docs Workgroup forward. We'll share more
details at next month's Python Language Summit. For now, here's some high
level information:

   - The initial workgroup members are: Carol, Mariatta, Ned Batchelder,
   and Julien Palard. Additionally, the Python Steering Council are permanent
   members of the WG.
   - Work on this group will be organized on the python/docs-community
   GitHub repository. The charter information and meeting notes will be posted
   there.
   - The Documentation category on Discourse
   <https://discuss.python.org/c/core-dev/documentation/26> will be the
   main communication channel between the WG and the wider Python community
   - We will scheduling monthly meetings for the team to meet
   - We’re still working on the logistics on taking in new members to the
   group. We’ll keep you updated!

Mariatta & Carol
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[Python-Dev] Re: On the migration from master to main

[Mariatta]

The branch has not been renamed. It will be renamed after the release of
beta 1.

There is a pending PR on DevGuide on how to change your existing local
CPython repository to the new branch:
https://github.com/python/devguide/pull/662/files#diff-611263234e072dc403733b3dd46d0609cfe44b24d29f05841637b41d093adf0cR157

The details and timeline on the branch renaming can be read here:

https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-committ...@python.org/message/QWW7KGBW5UH2N5FOZOFXQBQPYELWQM3O/

On Fri., Mar. 26, 2021, 12:21 p.m. Skip Montanaro, 
wrote:

> Can I distract people for a moment to ask a couple procedural questions
> about this change? I maintain my own fork of
> https://github.com/python/cpython, but don't yet see a main branch on
> python/cpython.
>
>
>- When is the new main branch supposed to appear
>- Once it does, what will I need to do other than to update my fork?
>- I have a branch in my fork (register2) which is a branch from my
>fork's master. Not being a Git whiz, how will I switch so my register2
>branch has the new main as its upstream (I think that's the correct word)?
>- How long will master be around after the switch before going to that
>big branch in the sky?
>
> I was able to scrounge up the few commands necessary to make the change
> to one of my standalone projects and successfully move it from master to
> main. The several articles I at least peeked at all followed pretty much
> the same recipe as this one:
>
>
> https://stevenmortimer.com/5-steps-to-change-github-default-branch-from-master-to-main/
>
> None, however, discuss how the change will affect forks. I'm a bit
> unclear how that part is supposed to work. I thought I might find a process
> PEP about this change, but saw nothing obvious in PEP 0. I'm sure this is a
> trivial few git commands for those more familiar with the toolchain than I
> am, but I see over 18k forks of the repository. I suspect a few people out
> of that crowd will be in the same boat as me.
>
> Thx,
>
> Skip
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[Python-Dev] Re: Python Language Summit 2021 Signups Are Now Open

[Mariatta]

Last call for signing up for Python Language Summit. The forms will
automatically be closed at 6 AM Vancouver time tomorrow.

Currently we have 82 sign ups and 22 topic proposals.

Details: https://us.pycon.org/2021/summits/language/
Sign up stats: https://mariatta.ca/language_summit_data/
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[Python-Dev] Re: Python Language Summit 2021 Signups Are Now Open

[Mariatta]

The sign up for Python Language Summit is still open but only for 7 more
days!

We received a few more attendee sign ups since last time I posted here, but
we haven't received very many topic proposals yet.

If you've been thinking of proposing a discussion topic to the language
summit, now is the time.

Details: https://us.pycon.org/2021/summits/language/
Sign up stats: https://mariatta.ca/language_summit_data/


On Wed, Mar 3, 2021 at 12:31 PM Mariatta  wrote:

> Sign up to Python Language Summit is still open for about 3 more weeks.
>
> So far we received 32 sign ups, from 18 different regions, and 12 time
> zones to work with.
>
> We've only received 3 topics of discussions, and we definitely need more
> of those.
> If you have a topic to be discussed with Python core developers, please
> fill in the forms linked in Łukasz's post.
>
> I've made some infographics with these data, I will try to update it once
> a day: https://mariatta.ca/language_summit_data/
>
> We also have a page on PyCon US's website now:
> https://us.pycon.org/2021/summits/language/
>
> Thanks.
>
> On Wed, Feb 24, 2021 at 9:54 AM Łukasz Langa  wrote:
>
>> I’m happy to announce that we’ve opened the sign-up forms for the 2021
>> Python Language Summit!
>> TL;DR
>>
>>- When: Tuesday, May 11, 2021 (4 hours) and Wednesday, May 12, 2021
>>(4 hours). Exact times TBD depending on attendee timezones.
>>- Where: Online via Zoom (link will be sent via email to attendees)
>>- Co-chairs: Mariatta Wijaya & Łukasz Langa
>>- Blogger: Joanna Jablonski
>>- Sign up to attend *and actively participate*:
>>https://forms.gle/cgmGnmQMDhD2mhHY8 (closes after March 22nd, 2021
>>AoE)
>>- Propose a topic: https://forms.gle/Jui9mxsHrB4fVvAB8 (closes after
>>March 22nd, 2021 AoE)
>>
>> To get an idea of past Python Language Summits, you can read these blog
>> posts:
>>
>>- 2020: Python Software Foundation News: The 2020 Python Language
>>Summit
>>
>> <https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/04/the-2020-python-language-summit.html>
>>- 2019:
>>http://pyfound.blogspot.com/2019/05/the-2019-python-language-summit.html
>>- 2018: The 2018 Python Language Summit [LWN.net]
>><https://lwn.net/Articles/754152/>
>>- 2017: The 2017 Python Language Summit [LWN.net]
>><https://lwn.net/Articles/723251/>
>>
>> Do I need to sign up if I’m a Python core developer?
>>
>> Yes please! While in the past we have limited attendance to 50 people,
>> this time, due to virtual format, we will be a bit more flexible, but will
>> still keep it small and manageable. We aren’t planning to go beyond 80
>> participants. Please register to reserve your space.
>> Can I sign up if I’m not a Python core developer?
>>
>> Yes you can. In the past, we had quite a number of participants who were
>> not Python core devs. Among them were maintainers and representatives from
>> BeeWare, CircuitPython, PSF board member, PyCharm, PyPA, etc. Register if
>> you want to participate. Note that until you hear back from us, your
>> attendance is not confirmed. As explained in the question above, our
>> “space” is more flexible than usual, but in the interest of maintaining a
>> vigorous discussion space, we might still be unable to invite everyone who
>> signs up.
>> What kind of topics are covered?
>>
>> Python Language Summit is a special event with very specific audience:
>> Python core developers. Ideally your topic is not an “announcement” or
>> “project status” but rather something that will encourage further
>> discussion and questions. The more controversial, the better. An open
>> issue, group of issues, or a PEP that is awaiting decision are all good
>> topics to propose. You can also further explain why this is better
>> discussed in person instead of online.
>>
>> According to last year’s feedback, our audience prefer more discussions
>> and shorter talks.
>> Who can present a talk?
>>
>> Anyone, even if you’re not a Python core developer. However, please
>> understand that we will have to be selective as space and time are limited.
>> In particular, we are prioritizing active core contributors, as well as
>> those who we believe will be able to improve the quality of the discussions
>> at the event and bring a more diverse perspective to core Python
>> developers. Note that your topic is not confirmed until you hear back from
>> us.
>> Code of Conduct
>>
>> PyCon’s Code of Conduct
>> <https://us.pycon.org/2020/about/code-of-conduc

[Python-Dev] Re: Steering Council update for February

[Mariatta]

>
> > The Steering Council discussed renaming the master branch to main
> > and the consensus was that we should do that.
> I did not that this was an issue.  This will break 4 of my .bat files
> (update repository and workspaces, build python.exes, run sphinx on
> docs,  run coverage.) and, I presume, many other workflow scripts and
> bots.  What is the upside?  ('next (version)' might be more accurately
> descriptive, but 'main' works as the 'main branch we are working on'.)
> Does 'master' confuse people?


I assume the change will not be abrupt, and people will be notified of the
change ahead of time, so we can adjust our scripts accordingly.

There are some info about branch renaming here:
https://github.com/github/renaming



On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 4:31 PM Terry Reedy  wrote:

> On 3/9/2021 3:27 PM, Pablo Galindo Salgado wrote:
>
> > The Steering Council just published the community update for February:
>
> Thank you for posting this.
>
> > The Steering Council discussed renaming the master branch to main
> > and the consensus was that we should do that.
>
> I did not that this was an issue.  This will break 4 of my .bat files
> (update repository and workspaces, build python.exes, run sphinx on
> docs,  run coverage.) and, I presume, many other workflow scripts and
> bots.  What is the upside?  ('next (version)' might be more accurately
> descriptive, but 'main' works as the 'main branch we are working on'.)
> Does 'master' confuse people?
>
> --
> Terry Jan Reedy
>
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[Python-Dev] Re: Python Language Summit 2021 Signups Are Now Open

[Mariatta]

Sign up to Python Language Summit is still open for about 3 more weeks.

So far we received 32 sign ups, from 18 different regions, and 12 time
zones to work with.

We've only received 3 topics of discussions, and we definitely need more of
those.
If you have a topic to be discussed with Python core developers, please
fill in the forms linked in Łukasz's post.

I've made some infographics with these data, I will try to update it once
a day: https://mariatta.ca/language_summit_data/

We also have a page on PyCon US's website now:
https://us.pycon.org/2021/summits/language/

Thanks.

On Wed, Feb 24, 2021 at 9:54 AM Łukasz Langa  wrote:

> I’m happy to announce that we’ve opened the sign-up forms for the 2021
> Python Language Summit!
> TL;DR
>
>- When: Tuesday, May 11, 2021 (4 hours) and Wednesday, May 12, 2021 (4
>hours). Exact times TBD depending on attendee timezones.
>- Where: Online via Zoom (link will be sent via email to attendees)
>    - Co-chairs: Mariatta Wijaya & Łukasz Langa
>- Blogger: Joanna Jablonski
>- Sign up to attend *and actively participate*:
>https://forms.gle/cgmGnmQMDhD2mhHY8 (closes after March 22nd, 2021 AoE)
>- Propose a topic: https://forms.gle/Jui9mxsHrB4fVvAB8 (closes after
>March 22nd, 2021 AoE)
>
> To get an idea of past Python Language Summits, you can read these blog
> posts:
>
>- 2020: Python Software Foundation News: The 2020 Python Language
>Summit
><https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/04/the-2020-python-language-summit.html>
>- 2019:
>http://pyfound.blogspot.com/2019/05/the-2019-python-language-summit.html
>- 2018: The 2018 Python Language Summit [LWN.net]
><https://lwn.net/Articles/754152/>
>- 2017: The 2017 Python Language Summit [LWN.net]
><https://lwn.net/Articles/723251/>
>
> Do I need to sign up if I’m a Python core developer?
>
> Yes please! While in the past we have limited attendance to 50 people,
> this time, due to virtual format, we will be a bit more flexible, but will
> still keep it small and manageable. We aren’t planning to go beyond 80
> participants. Please register to reserve your space.
> Can I sign up if I’m not a Python core developer?
>
> Yes you can. In the past, we had quite a number of participants who were
> not Python core devs. Among them were maintainers and representatives from
> BeeWare, CircuitPython, PSF board member, PyCharm, PyPA, etc. Register if
> you want to participate. Note that until you hear back from us, your
> attendance is not confirmed. As explained in the question above, our
> “space” is more flexible than usual, but in the interest of maintaining a
> vigorous discussion space, we might still be unable to invite everyone who
> signs up.
> What kind of topics are covered?
>
> Python Language Summit is a special event with very specific audience:
> Python core developers. Ideally your topic is not an “announcement” or
> “project status” but rather something that will encourage further
> discussion and questions. The more controversial, the better. An open
> issue, group of issues, or a PEP that is awaiting decision are all good
> topics to propose. You can also further explain why this is better
> discussed in person instead of online.
>
> According to last year’s feedback, our audience prefer more discussions
> and shorter talks.
> Who can present a talk?
>
> Anyone, even if you’re not a Python core developer. However, please
> understand that we will have to be selective as space and time are limited.
> In particular, we are prioritizing active core contributors, as well as
> those who we believe will be able to improve the quality of the discussions
> at the event and bring a more diverse perspective to core Python
> developers. Note that your topic is not confirmed until you hear back from
> us.
> Code of Conduct
>
> PyCon’s Code of Conduct <https://us.pycon.org/2020/about/code-of-conduct/>
> applies and will be enforced.
>
> Thanks!
>
> @mariatta <https://discuss.python.org/u/mariatta> & @ambv
> <https://discuss.python.org/u/ambv>
>
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[Python-Dev] Re: Please explain how to migrate when a function is removed, thanks ;-)

[Mariatta]

I opened an issue on Devguide: https://github.com/python/devguide/issues/655



On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 11:37 AM Kyle Stanley  wrote:

> On Jan 20, 2021 at 9:51 PM Chros Jerdonek 
> wrote:
>
>> Is there / would it make sense to have a section analogous to "Porting to
>> Python X" that covers "Make All DeprecationWarnings Go Away in X"? If we
>> had such a section, the "Porting to" section could be constructed by
>> copying the relevant bits from that section in the previous release.
>
>
> +1 from me to include this section in 3.10 and future whatsnew.
>
> On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 2:17 PM Mariatta  wrote:
>
>> I agree that when we land a feature that introduces incompatible change
>> like this, as part of the PR it should also include updating the
>> documentation on how to migrate.
>> I would think that the feature should not be merged unless the doc has
>> been updated too.
>>
>> Perhaps we should include this explicitly in devguide, as one of the
>> things to consider when reviewing pull requests.
>> Do we have such a guide/doc yet, on how to review CPython pull requests?
>>
>
> This seems like it would be a good location to include that information:
> https://devguide.python.org/pullrequest/#how-to-review-a-pull-request
>
> Maybe also a brief mention in the checklist for
> https://devguide.python.org/committing/#is-the-pr-ready-to-be-accepted.
> Step 9 currently has: "Was “What’s New” updated (as appropriate)?", which
> could have a sub-point to mention "Incompatible changes should include
> migration information in their respective "What's New".".
>
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[Python-Dev] Re: Please explain how to migrate when a function is removed, thanks ;-)

[Mariatta]

I agree that when we land a feature that introduces incompatible change
like this, as part of the PR it should also include updating the
documentation on how to migrate.
I would think that the feature should not be merged unless the doc has been
updated too.

Perhaps we should include this explicitly in devguide, as one of the things
to consider when reviewing pull requests.
Do we have such a guide/doc yet, on how to review CPython pull requests?


On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 2:49 AM Victor Stinner  wrote:

> Currently, we wait until the first user complains, sometimes after a
> 3.x.0 final release, before starting to document how to port existing
> code. I agree that it should be done earlier.
>
> I suggest that developers who want to introduce an incompatible change
> think about how to port existing code, especially if it's possible to
> write code compatible with the old and the new behavior. It should be
> done while the incompatible change is designed.
>
> I also agree that we document how to port code in the change which
> introduce the deprecation, not when we introduce the incompatible
> change (ex: remove a function).
>
> I also suggest to communicate on future incompatible changes ;-)
>
> Victor
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[Python-Dev] Re: Python.org downloads page and javascript

[Mariatta]

Thanks for the report. Can you please open an issue in
https://github.com/python/pythondotorg ?

Thanks.

On Thu, Nov 12, 2020, 5:18 AM Michael Felt  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Not clear on where to report this - so I hope someone else sees the same
> and can notify whoever needs to be notified.
>
> The main URL for downloads: https://www.python.org/downloads/ Opens with
> message :
>
> *Notice:* While Javascript is not essential for this website, your
> interaction with the content will be limited. Please turn Javascript on for
> the full experience.
>
> However, javascript is enabled in my browser (FF latest). Also tried with
> Chrome - same (messy) layout.
>
> The main page, and selected pages (e.g., https://www.python.org/doc/)
> work as expected.
>
> Hope this helps!,
>
> Michael
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[Python-Dev] Re: [python-committers] Thank you Larry Hastings!

[Mariatta]

Thank you, Larry!

On Mon, Oct 5, 2020, 11:39 AM Barry Warsaw  wrote:

> They say being a Python Release Manager is a thankless job, so the Python
> Secret Underground (PSU), which emphatically does not exist, hereby
> officially doesn’t thank Larry for his years of diligent service as the
> Python 3.4 and 3.5 release manager.
>
> On the other hand, the Python Steering Council, Python Software
> Foundation, and worldwide Python community, all of which emphatically *do*
> exist, all extend our heartfelt thanks to Larry for his excellent
> stewardship of Python 3.4 and 3.5!
>
> Python 3.4 and 3.5 were both pivotal releases.  While the features of
> these two releases are too numerous to mention here, they introduced such
> staples as:
>
> * asyncio
> * enum
> * pathlib
> * async and await keywords
> * matrix multiplication operators
> * typing and zipapp modules
>
> and so much more.  For details, see:
>
> * https://docs.python.org/3/whatsnew/3.4.html
> * https://docs.python.org/3/whatsnew/3.5.html
>
> Larry’s first official release of 3.4.0a1 was on 2013-08-03 and his last
> Python 3.5.10 release was 2020-09-05.  That’s 7 years of exemplary release
> managing!
>
> Larry, from all of us, and from me personally, thank you so much for your
> invaluable contributions to Python.  Enjoy your retirement!
>
> Cheers,
> -Barry (on behalf of the PSC and PSF)
>
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[Python-Dev] Re: PR checks hang because travis does not report back to github

[Mariatta]

This is a known issue and I have brought it up in GitHub OS Maintainers
Feedback Group. It happens to other projects as well.

Currently we have branch protection rule where even administrators couldnt
merge the PR unless all the required checks passed.

Perhaps we can relax the rule to allow administrators to merge the stuck
PRs. At least temporarily until Travis/GitHub fixes it. Does this sound
okay?


On Sun, Oct 4, 2020, 10:44 AM Stefan Behnel  wrote:

> Hi devs,
>
> I have a trivial documentation PR
>
> https://github.com/python/cpython/pull/22464
>
> for which travis (unsurprisingly) had a successful run,
>
> https://travis-ci.com/github/python/cpython/builds/187435578
>
> but github lists the travis build as "created" instead of "passed".
>
> https://github.com/python/cpython/pull/22464/checks?check_run_id=1188595760
>
> I already tried closing the PR and reopening it, and also triggering the
> build again on travis side, but github still fails to pick up the build
> status.
>
> I tried creating a new PR, but it seems that github (or travis) deduplicate
> the build requests and still refer to the original build, so that there is
> still no response from travis.
>
> I also cannot find a way to terminate the checks process in github, or
> otherwise make it stop waiting for Godot.
>
> Is this a known issue? Is there anything I can do about it?
>
> Thanks,
> Stefan
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[Python-Dev] Ask a Core Dev Anything! (You can even ask Guido!)

[Mariatta]

Made you look! [image: :smile:]

Hello Python community!

Next month, from October 19-23, Python core developers will be
participating in our annual weeklong core dev sprint. As part of the
sprint, we will be hosting a Q session with participating Python core
developers as a way for us to connect and engage with the wider Python
community.

We would like the wide Python community members (you) to participate and
ask a core dev any questions about Python. https://app.sli.do/event/d4ifvw2o

Please submit your question before using the link above before September 30.

On Tuesday, October 20th, 3 PM US Central time, Python core developers will
get together (online) and answer your questions. The session will be
recorded and will be posted to The PSF’s YouTube channel.

You can see the list of participating core developers here:
https://python-core-sprint-2020.readthedocs.io/community_qa.html#core-devs-participating-in-the-community-q-a

If you have general question about the sprint itself, please either open an
issue or a discussion item in the core-sprint repository:
https://github.com/python/core-sprint

Thanks for being part of this community.
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[Python-Dev] Re: unable to create PR on github

[Mariatta]

Is this still  problem? Which fork/branch did you did you want to create to
the PR with?



On Mon, Sep 21, 2020, 6:14 PM Ethan Furman  wrote:

> The green "create pull request" button is greyed out.
>
> I've tried reselecting the repos and branches, logging out and in,
> navigating to that screen via my own repository -- nothing is working.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> Thanks.
>
> --
> ~Ethan~
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[Python-Dev] Re: Python-checkins mailing list broken?

[Mariatta]

On Mon, Sep 14, 2020 at 12:49 PM Jeremy Kloth 
wrote:

> It seems that python-checkins isn't receiving any new commits since
> the 8th of September.  A quick check of the github page shows activity
> since then, as do the buildbots.
>
> Just a heads up.


Does anyone know whether the python-checkins list depends on
cpython-mailer webhook? When I look at the webhook deliveries (from
GitHub), it has been erroring out since September 8.

The webhook error message:
We couldn’t deliver this payload: timed out

I think one of the webhook maintainers should look into it. (I'm not the
maintainer)
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[Python-Dev] Re: [python-committers] RSVP: 2020 Python Core Dev Sprint

[Mariatta]

As an update, I've created  https://python-core-sprint-2020.readthedocs.io/
with some details about the schedule, participants, and sprint projects, to
give you a better idea of what to expect during the sprint.

If you're planning to participate, please fill in this form:
https://forms.gle/84NkyYt5g616fs1r5 so we have your contact info and can
add you to the participant list. (
https://python-core-sprint-2020.readthedocs.io/participants.html)

If you have questions about the sprint, please open an issue or a
discussion item in the core-sprint repo:
https://github.com/python/core-sprint

Thanks!

On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 1:10 PM Kyle Stanley  wrote:

> Hey all,
>
> We just recently finished working on the signup form for the upcoming 2020
> Python Core Dev Sprint on Oct. 19th - 23rd. In addition to getting an
> general idea of (virtual) attendance, this is being used to assess the
> topics covered, optimal start/end times for each day, and preferred social
> activities.
>
> Anyone who is a CPython core developer, engaged in a core dev mentorship,
> or a member of the Python triage team is welcome to attend!
>
> Sign up to attend here: https://forms.gle/84NkyYt5g616fs1r5
>
> We will be accepting late sign ups for this event since capacity is not a
> significant limitation, but for the purposes of scheduling the best
> possible times for everyone, it is requested that participants do so at
> their earliest convenience.
>
> Regards,
> Kyle Stanley
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[Python-Dev] Re: Procedure for trivial PRs

[Mariatta]

>
>  when landed remove the
> "need backport tags" you added...


If done correctly, the "needs backport .." labels got removed
automatically. We have detailed info here:
https://devguide.python.org/committing/#backporting-changes-to-an-older-version

 a) is it ok to touch 3.9, as it's in rc1?


Yeah bug fixes are accepted to the maintenance branches. I think your PR
does count as documentation bug fix, so it should be ok to backport to 3.9

>
> b) shall I create two brand new branches for those PRs, or there's
> some way in github/git to "just propose this same change to the other
> branches"?


In most cases the bot can handle it simply by adding the "needs backport "
label. But for more complicated situations, please use the cherry_picker.py
command line tool.
The documentation on how to do it is here:
https://github.com/python/cherry-picker#cherry-picking
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[Python-Dev] Re: Procedure for trivial PRs

[Mariatta]

On Thu, Aug 13, 2020 at 12:51 PM Facundo Batista 
wrote:

> It's waiting for a "core review", which is a good thing (and by all
> means welcomed). But as we're saturated of PRs, the fix is small, and
> I'm a core developer myself... shall I wait for a review from another
> core developer, or should I just land it?
>
>
As a core dev you can still merge it yourself without needing to wait for
review, even when it has the "awaiting core review" label.
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[Python-Dev] Core Workflow change: new commit to previously approved PR now requires re-review

[Mariatta]

X-post to python-committers, python-dev, and core-workflow mailing list

I have just deployed a change to bedevere-bot to address the security
concern related to automerging.(
https://github.com/python/core-workflow/issues/325)

Previously, if core dev has approved the PR and applied the "automerge"
label, the PR will be automatically merged as soon as all the required CI
checks passed. If the PR author added another commit after the PR has been
approved but before the automerge happened, the additional commit will get
merged in without additional review.

Now, if there is a new commit after the PR has been approved, it will not
be automerged until the the core dev re-reviews it. bedevere will remove
the "awaiting merge" label and apply the "awaiting core review" label.

Hope this all makes sense. And if you see any of the bot misbehaving,
please open a ticket either in core-workflow repo or in the bot's own repo.

Thanks.
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[Python-Dev] Re: Python Language Summit 2020 blog posts

[Mariatta]

The rest of Python Language Summit articles are now out:

Property-Based Testing for Python Builtins and the Standard Library, Zac
Hatfield-Dodds:
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/05/property-based-testing-for-python.html

Core Workflow Updates, Mariatta Wijaya:
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/05/core-workflow-updates-python-language.html

CPython on Mobile Platforms, Russell Keith-Magee:
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/05/cpython-on-mobile-platforms.html

Lightning talks: (
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/05/lightning-talks-part-2.html)
- Teaching Python with Errors by Zac Hatfield-Dodds
- State of Jython by Jim Baker
- Read the Docs features of interest by Eric Holscher
<https://t.co/2IriYhh6N3?amp=1>
Enjoy!

On Fri, May 1, 2020 at 10:02 AM Mariatta  wrote:

> Few more lightning talks from Eric Holscher and Zac Hatfield-Dodds
>>
>>
> ... and Jim Baker
>
> 
>
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[Python-Dev] Re: Python Language Summit 2020 blog posts

[Mariatta]

>
> Few more lightning talks from Eric Holscher and Zac Hatfield-Dodds
>
>
... and Jim Baker


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[Python-Dev] Python Language Summit 2020 blog posts

[Mariatta]

(x-posting to python-dev and python-committters)

Just wanted to share that the first 7 of 11 blog posts about presentations
and discussions from Python Language Summit are now up for your enjoyment.

Main article:
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/04/the-2020-python-language-summit.html

Day 1:

All strings become f-strings, Eric V Smith:
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/04/all-strings-become-f-strings-python.html

Replacing CPython’s Parser with a PEG-based parser, Pablo Galindo,
Lysandros Nikolaou, Guido van Rossum:
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/04/replacing-cpythons-parser-python.html

A Formal Specification for the (C)Python Virtual Machine, Mark Shannon:
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/04/a-formal-specification-for-cpython.html

HPy: a Future-Proof Way of Extending Python?, Antonio Cuni:
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/04/hpy-future-proof-way-of-extending.html

CPython Documentation: The Next 5 Years, Carol Willing, Ned Batchelder:
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/04/cpython-documentation-next-5-years.html


Day 2:

Lightning talks: (
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/04/lightning-talks-part-1.html)
- What do you need from pip, PyPI, and packaging?, Sumana Harihareswara
- A Retrospective on My "Multi-Core Python" Project, Eric Snow

The Path Forward for Typing, Guido van Rossum:
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2020/04/the-path-forward-for-typing-python.html

Stay tuned for more posts!

Property-Based Testing for Python Builtins and the Standard Library, Zac
Hatfield-Dodds

Core Workflow Updates, Mariatta Wijaya

CPython on Mobile Platforms, Russell Keith-Magee

Few more lightning talks from Eric Holscher and Zac Hatfield-Dodds

Enjoy!
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[Python-Dev] Re: new syntax

[Mariatta]

-1 from me.

Seems unintuitive and I don't think it's all that obvious what
intput/floatput would mean without first reading the docs. It adds
maintenance burden while accomplishing little value.

You might be able to just create your own third party library though.



On Mon, Mar 2, 2020, 1:11 PM Luca Wolf  wrote:

> Dear Python Team,
>
> I have a good idea for a new comand in Python.
>
> It’s „intput()“ for numbers. So you don’t have to write „int(Input())“.
>
> It’s much easier to write and it’s faster too.
>
> You can use the same for „floatput()“, so don’t have to write
> „float(Input())“.
>
>
>
> I hope you can make something good with this idea.
>
> LG: Wolf Luca
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[Python-Dev] Re: Merging PRs without CLA signed

[Mariatta]

don't remember if there's a magic comment that contributors can
leave to get the bot to check again on its own, but the usual trigger
for this is the submitter posting to say they've signed it, a core dev
or triager seeing that and removing the "CLA Not Signed" label,



There is no magic comment, and to reduce work from core dev/triager,
contributors can use this to update their own PRs
https://check-python-cla.herokuapp.com/

Being able to update the CLA as soon as it gets signed instead of waiting a
couple days, is on top of my wishlist:

https://github.com/python/core-workflow/issues/360
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[Python-Dev] Re: Merging PRs without CLA signed

[Mariatta]

FWIW, I'm also one of the few core devs who won't merge a PR unless CLA is
signed.
Such PRs (and the backports) can't be automerged, creating manual work.

I find the "triviality" is subjective. One line change in documentation is
maybe trivial. One line change in the code is probably not as trivial.
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[Python-Dev] Re: Python Language Summit at PyCon 2020

[Mariatta]

Just to remind everyone that signup to the language summit is still open
for another 11 days.

So far folks have proposed topic like: f-strings, CPython’s documentation,
PEG parser, property-based testing, and more!

We’ve received a number inquiries about the language summit, so here are
some Q:

1. Do I need to sign up if I’m a Python core developer?

Yes please! Attendance is limited to 50 people. Please register to reserve
your seat in the room.

2. Can I sign up if I’m not a Python core developer?

Yes you can. Last year we had 15 participants (out of 50) who were not
Python core devs. Among them were maintainers and representatives from
BeeWare, CircuitPython, PSF board member, PyCharm, etc.

Full details at: https://us.pycon.org/2020/events/languagesummit/


On Tue, Jan 28, 2020 at 1:07 PM Mariatta  wrote:

> (cross posting to python-committers and python-dev)
>
> I'm happy to announce that the signups for Python Language Summit at PyCon
> 2020 is now open.
>
> Full details at: https://us.pycon.org/2020/events/languagesummit/
>
> *TL;DR*
>
> When: Wednesday, April 15, 2020, 9am–4pm (Note, we’re starting 1 hour
> earlier than usual!)
> Where: David L. Lawrence Convention Center, Pittsburgh, PA, room TBD
>
> Sign up to attend: https://forms.gle/Fg7ayhYTaY75J1r7A (closes Feb 29th,
> 2020 AoE)
> Sign up to discuss a topic: https://forms.gle/g4BXezH1Vcn7tLds5 (closes
> Feb 29th, 2020 AoE)
>
> *Who can attend*
>
> We welcome Python core developers, active core contributors to Python and
> alternative Python implementations, and anyone else who has a topic to
> discuss with core developers.
>
> *Who can propose a discussion topic*
>
> If you have discussion items; seeking consensus; awaiting decision on a
> PEP; needing help with your core dev work; or have specific questions that
> need answers from core developers, please submit a proposal. According to
> last year’s feedback, our audience prefer more discussions and shorter
> talks.
>
> To get an idea of past language summits, you can read past years' coverage:
> 2019:
> http://pyfound.blogspot.com/2019/05/the-2019-python-language-summit.html
> 2018: https://lwn.net/Articles/754152/
> 2017: https://lwn.net/Articles/723251/
>
> This year's event will be covered by A. Jesse Jiryu Davis again, and will
> be posted on PSF's blog.
> <https://us.pycon.org/2020/events/languagesummit/>
>
> Some changes to note this year:
> 1) We plan to start 1 hour earlier (9AM)
> 2) The room will have U-shaped table layout
>
> Thanks!
>
>
> Mariatta & Łukasz
>
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[Python-Dev] Re: vtk

[Mariatta]

vtk is a third party Python library. It's best to ask that you vtk's
developers, not here. In this mailing list we focus on issues related to
the development of core Python, not third party libraries. You might be
able to find info about who maintains vtk library here
https://pypi.org/project/vtk/

On Mon, Feb 10, 2020, 7:39 AM  wrote:

> hi
> i need VtkCollisionDetectionFilter class.
> But this class is in vtk 8.2.0.
> when an updated VTK python wheel will be released?
> i can't compile vtk withe cmake an vs2017.
> thanks for your help.
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[Python-Dev] Re: Python Language Summit at PyCon 2020

[Mariatta]

Thank you! Yes the right url is:
https://us.pycon.org/2020/events/languagesummit/

On Tue, Jan 28, 2020 at 4:32 PM Kyle Stanley  wrote:

> On the attendance application, there is currently an incorrect link to the
> informational page for the Language Summit: "
> https://us.pycon.org/2020/events/language-summit/;.
>
> Either the link could be changed to "
> https://us.pycon.org/2020/events/languagesummit/; or "
> https://us.pycon.org/2020/events/language-summit/; could be configured to
> redirect towards the correct page.
>
> On Tue, Jan 28, 2020 at 4:17 PM Mariatta  wrote:
>
>> (cross posting to python-committers and python-dev)
>>
>> I'm happy to announce that the signups for Python Language Summit at
>> PyCon 2020 is now open.
>>
>> Full details at: https://us.pycon.org/2020/events/languagesummit/
>>
>> *TL;DR*
>>
>> When: Wednesday, April 15, 2020, 9am–4pm (Note, we’re starting 1 hour
>> earlier than usual!)
>> Where: David L. Lawrence Convention Center, Pittsburgh, PA, room TBD
>>
>> Sign up to attend: https://forms.gle/Fg7ayhYTaY75J1r7A (closes Feb 29th,
>> 2020 AoE)
>> Sign up to discuss a topic: https://forms.gle/g4BXezH1Vcn7tLds5 (closes
>> Feb 29th, 2020 AoE)
>>
>> *Who can attend*
>>
>> We welcome Python core developers, active core contributors to Python and
>> alternative Python implementations, and anyone else who has a topic to
>> discuss with core developers.
>>
>> *Who can propose a discussion topic*
>>
>> If you have discussion items; seeking consensus; awaiting decision on a
>> PEP; needing help with your core dev work; or have specific questions that
>> need answers from core developers, please submit a proposal. According to
>> last year’s feedback, our audience prefer more discussions and shorter
>> talks.
>>
>> To get an idea of past language summits, you can read past years'
>> coverage:
>> 2019:
>> http://pyfound.blogspot.com/2019/05/the-2019-python-language-summit.html
>> 2018: https://lwn.net/Articles/754152/
>> 2017: https://lwn.net/Articles/723251/
>>
>> This year's event will be covered by A. Jesse Jiryu Davis again, and will
>> be posted on PSF's blog.
>> <https://us.pycon.org/2020/events/languagesummit/>
>>
>> Some changes to note this year:
>> 1) We plan to start 1 hour earlier (9AM)
>> 2) The room will have U-shaped table layout
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>>
>> Mariatta & Łukasz
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>>
>
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[Python-Dev] Python Language Summit at PyCon 2020

[Mariatta]

(cross posting to python-committers and python-dev)

I'm happy to announce that the signups for Python Language Summit at PyCon
2020 is now open.

Full details at: https://us.pycon.org/2020/events/languagesummit/

*TL;DR*

When: Wednesday, April 15, 2020, 9am–4pm (Note, we’re starting 1 hour
earlier than usual!)
Where: David L. Lawrence Convention Center, Pittsburgh, PA, room TBD

Sign up to attend: https://forms.gle/Fg7ayhYTaY75J1r7A (closes Feb 29th,
2020 AoE)
Sign up to discuss a topic: https://forms.gle/g4BXezH1Vcn7tLds5 (closes Feb
29th, 2020 AoE)

*Who can attend*

We welcome Python core developers, active core contributors to Python and
alternative Python implementations, and anyone else who has a topic to
discuss with core developers.

*Who can propose a discussion topic*

If you have discussion items; seeking consensus; awaiting decision on a
PEP; needing help with your core dev work; or have specific questions that
need answers from core developers, please submit a proposal. According to
last year’s feedback, our audience prefer more discussions and shorter
talks.

To get an idea of past language summits, you can read past years' coverage:
2019:
http://pyfound.blogspot.com/2019/05/the-2019-python-language-summit.html
2018: https://lwn.net/Articles/754152/
2017: https://lwn.net/Articles/723251/

This year's event will be covered by A. Jesse Jiryu Davis again, and will
be posted on PSF's blog.
<https://us.pycon.org/2020/events/languagesummit/>

Some changes to note this year:
1) We plan to start 1 hour earlier (9AM)
2) The room will have U-shaped table layout

Thanks!


Mariatta & Łukasz
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[Python-Dev] Re: Something wrong with the bug tracker?

[Mariatta]

I think this issue is being addressed here:
https://github.com/python/bugs.python.org/issues/41

On Sun, Dec 22, 2019, 9:23 AM Ivan Pozdeev via Python-Dev <
python-dev@python.org> wrote:

>
> On 22.12.2019 18:21, Martin (gzlist) via Python-Dev wrote:
> > Logging in with openid using launchpad just worked for me, so
> > transient or related to google's openid support presumably.
>
> I have been unable to log in with google for a long time; had to reset the
> password to be able to log in without it.
>
> So it's definitely not "transient".
>
> > Martin
> >
> > On Sun, 22 Dec 2019 at 15:13, Mark Shannon  wrote:
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> For some reason I can't log into the bug tracker with Google.
> >> I just get the error message:
> >>
> >> """
> >> An error has occurred
> >>
> >> A problem was encountered processing your request.
> >> The tracker maintainers have been notified of the problem.
> >> """
> >>
> >> Whether I'm logged in or out of Google, or using a private tab, it makes
> >> no difference.
> >>
> >> Anyone else having problems?
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Mark.
> >> ___
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> >> Code of Conduct: http://python.org/psf/codeofconduct/
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> > Code of Conduct: http://python.org/psf/codeofconduct/
>
> --
> Regards,
> Ivan
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[Python-Dev] PEP 581/588 RFC: Collecting feedback about GitHub Issues

[Mariatta]

(cross posting to python-committers, python-dev, core-workflow)

PEP 581: Using GitHub Issues has been accepted by the steering council, but
PEP 588: GitHub Issues Migration plan is still in progress.

I'd like to hear from core developers as well as heavy b.p.o users, the
following:

   1. what features do they find lacking from GitHub issues, or
   2. what are the things you can do in b.p.o but not in GitHub, or
   3. Other workflow that will be blocked if we were to switch to GitHub
   today

By understanding your needs, we can be better prepared for the migration,
and we can start looking for solutions.


In addition, I received tip that the GitHub team is very motivated to help
us, and if we can give them some of our most wanted features, they *might* be
able to accommodate us. But first we need to tell them what we need.
They're not promising anything, but I'd like to at least try and give them
these suggestions.

Action items:

1. Please leave your comment in this issue:
https://github.com/python/core-workflow/issues/359

2. Leave your +1 by reacting  to suggested feature by others

3. Please do this before October 1, 2019 (not a hard deadline)


Thanks
ᐧ
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[Python-Dev] Re: Announcing the new Python triage team on GitHub

[Mariatta]

>
> That was my previous impression, but then I saw that Brett applied it
> manually in this older PR to check if the author was still active:
> https://github.com/python/cpython/pull/117#issuecomment-367187316.


That was Brett's bot for backfilling the "awaiting ..." label to PRs
created before we had any "awaiting .." label. A script was used to
automatically determine the stage of the PR and apply appropriate label.


https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/thread/UYMPA4OFWCJPFPASDUZYGXTH6ZGM6RJZ/


ᐧ
>>
> ᐧ
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[Python-Dev] Re: Announcing the new Python triage team on GitHub

[Mariatta]

>
> The capabilities of a triager mostly look good except for "closing PRs and
> issues".  This is a superpower that has traditionally been reserved for
> more senior developers because it grants the ability to shut-down the work
> of another aspiring contributor.  Marking someone else's suggestion as
> rejected is the most perilous and least fun aspect of core development.
> Submitters tend to expect their idea won't be rejected without a good deal
> of thought and expert consideration.


If most core devs prefer that triagers don't ever close PR/issue, then
let's document that and let the triagers know of these boundaries. I'd like
to be able to trust the triagers and let them help us, instead of
restricting their movement.

Personally I think it's ok for them to close PR/issue, especially invalid
ones. That's why we need help.
If a core dev disagree with the decision, it is easy enough to re-open the
PR.

Anyways, I have created a devguide issue for documenting the
guidelines/ethiquette for closing PR/issue:
https://github.com/python/devguide/issues/527

Our bar for becoming a triager is somewhat low,


 It still requires earning trust from at least one core developer who will
approve their request, which I don't actually believe is an easy thing to
do.

is it possible to adjust permissions in
> the Python project?


Nothing we can do. You can try contacting GitHub about it.

My worry is that it *might* require more trust in a
> contributor before giving them the triager role.


Yes, but I don't see this as a bad thing. If we want to make it more strict
by saying at least 2 or more core devs approving, that's ok with me too.

We could, if we really really really wanted to. Any of the bots can
> be programmed to look for closed PRs from people in triage team (and
> not the author of the PR) and make policy decision to re-open, ping
> the relevant core dev, remind the person who did it not do it.
>
> I don't think we should though do it though.


I also don't think we should do it.

would it be okay for triagers to manually add the "awaiting changes" label
> on PRs that are suspected to be stale?


All "awaiting ..." labels are meant to be added automatically by
bedevere-bot. Even core devs should not try adding/removing them manually.
The "awaiting change" is meant to be added only after core devs reviewed
the PR and requested change to it, so it doesn't make sense for a triager
to add this label. It requires a core dev's decision.


ᐧ
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[Python-Dev] Announcing the new Python triage team on GitHub

[Mariatta]

We have a new Python triage team on GitHub to help improve our workflow.

GitHub has a nice table that shows what a triager can or cannot do in
general:
https://help.github.com/en/articles/repository-permission-levels-for-an-organization#repository-access-for-each-permission-level

More specific roles and responsibilities of the Python triage team are
described in devguide:
https://devguide.python.org/triaging/#python-triage-team

The responsibilities are a little different than the Developer role that we
currently have on b.p.o. On GitHub, triage team members have access to
triage issues and pull requests not only in CPython repo, but also all the
repositories owned by Python core team, including: devguide repo and all
the bots' repos.

Existing b.p.o Developers are not automatically added to Python triage
team, but they can opt-in and request membership. Several reasons:
- we don't know if the triager is still active or not
- we don't know if the triager wants the added responsibilities or not

Other contributors are also welcome to request the Python triage
membership. All it takes is one core developer to approve the request.

The process is fully documented in
https://devguide.python.org/triaging/#becoming-a-member-of-the-python-triage-team,
and there is an issue template for requesting membership in core-workflow
https://github.com/python/core-workflow/issues/new/choose

The first two triage team members are Kyle Stanley and Jeroen Demeyer.
Their requests were handled in:
https://github.com/python/core-workflow/issues/353
https://github.com/python/core-workflow/issues/354

If you'd like more background on Python triage team and how we came to this
stage, all of these have been discussed in discourse:
- https://discuss.python.org/t/proposal-create-bug-triage-team-on-github/
- https://discuss.python.org/t/creating-the-python-triage-team-on-github/
-
https://discuss.python.org/t/criteria-for-promoting-people-to-the-python-triage-team/
-
https://discuss.python.org/t/who-should-be-able-to-change-what-labels-on-github/2000

We also have a project board in core-workflow:
https://github.com/python/core-workflow/projects/3

This is a new thing for us, and we're all still learning and getting use to
it. Suggestions and ideas for improving the workflow can be discussed in
Core Workflow category in discourse. Devguide improvements are also welcome.

Thanks contributors, core devs, and The PSF infra team for all the help in
getting this off the ground. And also thanks GitHub for giving us early
access to the beta triage role!


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[Python-Dev] Re: Inline links in Misc/NEWS entries

[Mariatta]

> I would like to understand why some developers dislike including it, even
when the reST syntax is provided.

This has something to do with the use of blurb/blurb-it. Both tools
specifically say "single paragraph with simple ReST markup".

Further reading blurb's source code, it says the format of the news blurb
should be as follows:

  * The BODY section should be a single paragraph of English text
in ReST format.  It should not use the following ReST markup
features:
  * section headers
  * comments
  * directives, citations, or footnotes
  * Any features that require significant line breaks,
like lists, definition lists, quoted paragraphs, line blocks,
literal code blocks, and tables.


Perhaps Larry has more context on why the news entry should be "simple"?
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[Python-Dev] Re: Can someone please finish merging GH-13482?

[Mariatta]

>
> - Does something special need to be done for doc changes?


Nothing special.

- Since this is a 1st-time contributor, does it need a change to the ACKS
> file?


I think the change is trivial enough, the misc/acks is not necessary.

- Anything else?


1. Does it need to be backported? If so, please add the "needs backport to
.." label.

2. Add the "烙 automerge" label. The bot will take care of merging. It will
use the PR title and description as commit message.
If the PR title/ description is not good enough as commit message, edit it
first before adding the "烙 automerge" label.

So I'll watch and do it myself next time ;-)


Hopefully the above instructions are clear and simple enough, so I'll let
you trigger the automerge this time.


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[Python-Dev] PEP 588 updates

[Mariatta]

I've updated the text of PEP 588 (https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0588/)
with several items under "Migration Plan" section:

- Hire a professional project manager to help ensure the success of the
project.
- Create a playground issue tracker on GitHub to experiment and test the
new workflow
- The work on new CLA host is currently stalled. (more details:
https://discuss.python.org/t/cla-assistant-is-no-go/2066)
- We've created a new Python Triage team, taking advantage of GitHub's beta
Triage role. We need a better guideline/criteria on how to promote people
to the Python triage team.
- A test repo containing proposed GitHub labels have been created by Carol
Willing. It can be reviewed at:
https://github.com/willingc/test-581/labels Feedback
are welcome. I would suggest discussing the labels in Discourse
<https://discuss.python.org/> under core-workflow category.
- we should create a separate branch on GitHub with info about the new
workflow. This should be done ahead of the actual migration, not after.

Please re-read PEP 588 in its entirety. Any questions or concerns about PEP
588 can be discussed here in python-dev, or Discourse under core-workflow
category. (https://discuss.python.org/c/core-workflow)

Thanks.

Mariatta
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[Python-Dev]  New keyword in bpo: `newcomer friendly`

[Mariatta]

 copy-pasta from core-mentorship mailing list.

There is now a “newcomer friendly” keyword in bpo.

My hope is that going forward, we can tag issues that are suitable for
first time contributors with this keyword.

It would be great for experienced contributors already familiar with our
workflow to not work on issues tagged with newcomer friendly and leave that
to new contributors.

I’ve added the keyword to Devguide’s Triaging section, with additional
guideline of what can be tagged as newcomer friendly. Typically it should
be straightforward, well-defined issue, and low-risk.

https://devguide.python.org/triaging.html#keywords

Thanks.
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[Python-Dev] Re: PEP 581 has been updated with "Downsides of GitHub" section

[Mariatta]

If loading GitHub website is a technical problem, then it is a pre-existing
condition not caused by PEP 581.

On Sat, Jun 29, 2019, 12:47 AM Steven D'Aprano  wrote:

> You have missed at least one: the minimum technology requirement for
> using Github is a lot more stringent than for Roundup. Github's minimum
> system requirements are higher, and it doesn't degrade as well, so
> moving to Github will make it much harder for those who are using older
> technology. If not exclude them altogether.
>
> I'd submit a PR for this except, well, see above...
>
>
> ᐧ
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[Python-Dev] Re: Annoying user on GitHub

[Mariatta]

I've used the "Report abuse" feature on GitHub for such situations. Most of
the time I see the user suspended, and the associated comments deleted.
Our GitHub admins can delete comments too.

On Tue, Jul 2, 2019, 1:42 AM Victor Stinner  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Sometimes, I get an email notification about strange comments (unrelated
> or make no sense) on commits made 6 months ago if not longer. Usually, I
> go to the user profile page and I click on "Block or report user":
> "Report abuse". I'm not sure what happens in this case. I never checks
> if these strange comments are removed by GitHub.
>
> Victor
>
> Le 02/07/2019 à 03:26, Mariatta a écrit :
> > I've reported the user to GitHub. Ticket ID: 297185
> >
> > On Mon, Jul 1, 2019, 5:40 PM Guido van Rossum  > <mailto:gu...@python.org>> wrote:
> >
> > There's a user on GitHub ('experimentalles') who has created random
> > PRs on several projects (e.g.
> > https://github.com/python/peps/pull/1116). Can we ban them? The PRs
> > look the work of a vandal or a bot, not of a clueless human.
> >
> > --
> > --Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido <http://python.org/~guido>)
> > /Pronouns: he/him/his //(why is my pronoun here?)/
> > <
> http://feministing.com/2015/02/03/how-using-they-as-a-singular-pronoun-can-change-the-world/
> >
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> >
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> >
> >
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> >
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[Python-Dev] Re: PEP 581 has been updated with "Downsides of GitHub" section

[Mariatta]

That's being considered in PEP 588:
https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0588/#a-github-account-should-not-be-a-requirement

It was a consideration since PEP 581 was written, but got moved to 588.


On Tue, Jul 2, 2019, 8:13 AM Baptiste Carvello <
devel2...@baptiste-carvello.net> wrote:

> Le 28/06/2019 à 18:56, Mariatta a écrit :
> > Hi,
> >
> > I've updated PEP 581 yesterday, adding the "Downsides of GitHub" section.
> >
> > https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0581/#downsides-of-github
>
> Hi,
>
> another missing point: the necessity to register an account with a third
> party's social network, and accept their terms of service. For this
> matter, a GH account is different from a BPO account because it is not
> controlled by the PSF, and must be unique across projects. While I
> understand this privacy concern is not shared by most core devs, it
> should still be acknowledged.
>
> Cheers,
> Baptiste
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[Python-Dev] Re: Annoying user on GitHub

[Mariatta]

I've reported the user to GitHub. Ticket ID: 297185

On Mon, Jul 1, 2019, 5:40 PM Guido van Rossum  wrote:

> There's a user on GitHub ('experimentalles') who has created random PRs on
> several projects (e.g. https://github.com/python/peps/pull/1116). Can we
> ban them? The PRs look the work of a vandal or a bot, not of a clueless
> human.
>
> --
> --Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
> *Pronouns: he/him/his **(why is my pronoun here?)*
> 
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[Python-Dev] PEP 581 has been updated with "Downsides of GitHub" section

[Mariatta]

Hi,

I've updated PEP 581 yesterday, adding the "Downsides of GitHub" section.

https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0581/#downsides-of-github

Other parts of the PEP has also been updated to reflect recent changes to
roundup/bpo that happened after PEP 581's acceptance, for example:

- ability to automatically close issues when a PR has been merged. This was
added to bpo after PEP 581's acceptance. I've also created an issue in
devguide so that this can be documented:
https://github.com/python/devguide/issues/502

- Availability of REST API in Roundup/bpo. REST API has been requested in
Roundup for several years, and there was no activity on it since 2016. REST
API has been incorporated to Roundup in February 2019, but it is not yet
incorporated to bpo.

- Availability of CI for Roundup/bpo. There is CI running on Roundup's
unofficial GitHub mirror. But pull requests aren't happening
there. Mercurial patches are still how you would contribute to it.

Please re-read PEP 581 in its entirety.

I plan to update PEP 588 sometime this weekend or next, to incorporate the
discussions and suggestions brought up in Python Language Summit 2019:(
http://pyfound.blogspot.com/2019/05/mariatta-wijaya-lets-use-github-issues.html
)

Some of the items brought up during the language summit:
- we're talking with The PSF to get a professional PM to handle the
migration (mentioned by steering council members).
- we should create a playground GitHub issue tracker and copy 100s of
tickets from bpo to there (suggested by Barry Warsaw)
- we should be updating devguide ahead of the actual migration, so core
developers and release managers have time to review and learn the new
workflow. (suggested by Ned Deily)
- Devguide should have a section for "how to triage issues on GitHub"
(sorry I forgot who said this, but it is in my note)
- Some people liked having screencast of "how to do X on GitHub" (similar
to miss-islington's Youtube demo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p85YtKKLNno).
It would be good if we can do more of them. (suggested by Davin Potts)


Thanks.

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[Python-Dev] Re: EuroPython 2019 sprints

[Mariatta]

There were some easy issues assigned to me, that were set aside for the
mentored sprint.

They can be worked on by new contributors during the Euro Python sprint.
ᐧ

On Thu, Jun 13, 2019 at 9:37 AM Steve Dower  wrote:

> Hi all
>
> Just letting everyone know that I signed up any core devs who are going
> to be at EuroPython to run sprints :) (including myself, since I'll be
> there)
>
> Like PyCon US, the sprints at EuroPython will attract many first-time
> contributors, so it will be helpful to have as many people who
> understand our workflow around to help out. We might also be able to get
> some of our own contributions done.
>
> For those who didn't hear, the EuroPython Society is offering a grant
> for core developers to get free attendance at EuroPython (see
> https://www.europython-society.org/core-grant). If you take this, it
> would be a nice gesture of thanks to help support the sprints!
>
> And in the meantime, if you see an easy bug on the tracker, please mark
> it as "Easy" or "Easy (C)" and post an explanation of how to fix it.
> That way we will have a good supply of tasks for new contributors.
>
> Cheers,
> Steve
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[Python-Dev] Re: 1 PR, multiple issues

[Mariatta]

Thanks Jeffrey Kintscher for asking this question.
It is one of those "less obvious way to triage CPython issues" kind of
thing.
I think it would be great if this workflow can be documented and clarified
in the devguide.
I've opened https://github.com/python/devguide/issues/494
ᐧ
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[Python-Dev] Re: 1 PR, multiple issues

[Mariatta]

Hmm, I personally would still consider the additional issues as duplicates.
So I would make note in each of the duplicate issue saying "this is caused
by the same problem as bpo-X", and close them, and attach the PR only to
one bpo ticket.
To decide which one I would keep open, perhaps the oldest one, but maybe it
depends. Perhaps whichever that seems to contain most detailed info?

Maybe other core devs have other preferences?

On Mon, Jun 10, 2019 at 8:19 PM Jeffrey Kintscher 
wrote:

> A hypothetical example would be two different issues whose descriptions
> appear to be for different behaviors, but are actually caused by the same
> underlying chunk of problematic code being called in different ways. It
> could be something trivial like a corner case not being handled.
>
> //Jeff
>
> ᐧ
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[Python-Dev] Re: 1 PR, multiple issues

[Mariatta]

Usually we prefer 1 PR per 1 bpo ticket. The smaller the PR is, the easier
it is for us to review, and less likely to cause conflict when it comes to
auto-backporting.

When you say it resolves multiple issues, are these the same issue reported
multiple times?
ᐧ

On Mon, Jun 10, 2019 at 7:52 PM Jeffrey Kintscher 
wrote:

> When I create a PR that resolves multiple issues, should I add it to each
> issue, or just to one issue and add relevant comments to the others?
>
> //Jeff
>
> --
> -
> From there to here, from here to there,
> funny things are everywhere.
>-- Theodore Geisel
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] Unrelated PRs linked to issues on bugs.python.org

[Mariatta]

One possible reason is when we wrote the wrong boo number in the PR, and
then changed it to the correct one. Not sure if this was the case.

The linking of PR number in boo is done in bpo. There was a similar issue:
https://github.com/python/bugs.python.org/issues/25

On Wed, May 22, 2019, 12:21 AM Victor Stinner  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Since one or two weeks, I noticed that the bot which links GitHub pull
> requests to bugs.python.org issues started to link PRs to unrelated
> issues.
>
> Example: https://github.com/python/cpython/pull/13148 (merged 2 hours
> ago) just added to https://bugs.python.org/issue35363 (closed at the
> end of last year).
>
> I cannot find "35363" (bpo number) in
> https://github.com/python/cpython/pull/13148 nor in
> https://github.com/python/cpython/pull/13148/files
>
> Does anyone have an idea why unrelated PRs are added to issues?
>
> I don't know which bot is responsible for this task, nor who operates
> this bot. So in case of doubt, I chose to send a message to
> python-dev.
>
> Victor
> --
> Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death.
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[Python-Dev] Python Language Summit 2019 blog posts

[Mariatta]

If you have FOMO (fear of missing out) of Python Language Summit 2019,
worry no more.

We invited A. Jesse Jiryu Davis to cover for the language summit, and the
blog posts are starting to appear in The PSF's official blog.

Starts here:
http://pyfound.blogspot.com/2019/05/the-2019-python-language-summit.html

More links will be added as they become available.

Currently available posts:

- Russell Keith-Magee: Python On Other Platforms
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2019/05/russell-keith-magee-python-on-other.html

- Paul Ganssle: Time Zones In The Standard Library
https://pyfound.blogspot.com/2019/05/paul-ganssle-time-zones-in-standard.html

Thank you Jesse for writing up these posts, and thanks to all language
summit presenters and attendees.

ᐧ
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[Python-Dev] Reminder: Python Language Summit 2019 Signup

[Mariatta]

Just another reminder that sign up is still open for Python Language Summit
(until March 21st, 2019)

TL;DR:

When: Wednesday, May 1, 2019, 10am–4pm
Where: Huntington Convention Center, Cleveland, Ohio
Apply: Attendance sign up form <https://goo.gl/forms/pexfOGDjpV0BWMer2>
(before March 21, 2019)
Speak: Topic submission form <https://goo.gl/forms/8l7ITEKOjlWkBjcl1>
(before March 21, 2019)
You will be notified by April 15, 2019
Co-chairs: Mariatta and Łukasz
Blogger: A. Jesse Jiryu Davis

All language summit attendees are also invited for dinner with PyCon staff
and volunteers right after the summit. Details will be forwarded once we
confirm your attendance. Since I don't want to miss the dinner, we will be
more strict with timing and not go overtime.

So far, we have a number of interesting topics proposed by core developers
as well as by members of the wider Python community. Some of the proposed
topic are: PEP 581, async REPL, Python 3.9 release cadence, core Python
mentorship, manylinux, etc.

If you have any questions, the Users section of our Discourse
instance (https://discuss.python.org/c/users) is the best place to ask.
For private communication, write to maria...@python.org and/or
luk...@python.org.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Using CLA assistant for Python contributions

[Mariatta]

On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 11:25 PM Paul Moore  wrote:

>
> My preference would be to just re-sign the CLA *immediately*, and not
> wait for when I have a PR - I presume that would be
> possible/supported.
>

Yes this is possible, and once the switchover happens, I will post the link
with instructions on how to do that.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Using CLA assistant for Python contributions

[Mariatta]

Thought I'll be a little more clearer: you'll need to re-sign the CLA only
for your future contributions (aka when you make new pull request to
Python).

Your previous CLA record are still available for The PSF, we're just not
going to export over data from existing CLA host to CLA assistant.
ᐧ
ᐧ
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Re: [Python-Dev] Using CLA assistant for Python contributions

[Mariatta]

>
> I plan to
> > switch us over to to CLA assistant in the coming week (before my OOOS of
> > March 18)
> OOOS?


My Out Of Open Source aka I'm not doing any volunteer activities for 6
weeks (details:
https://discuss.python.org/t/mariatta-will-be-ooos-out-of-open-source-starting-march-18-may-9th-2019/973/3
)



> - the signing process is straight-forward and easy;


Yes it really is straight forward and easy. Everything happens on the
browser on GitHub. If you can open GitHub webpage then you can sign the CLA
via CLA assistant, no additional program/downloading/command line is
needed. It can be done with computer or your modern smartphone or
tablet/iPad with internet connection.


ᐧ
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Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 581: Using GitHub Issues for CPython

[Mariatta]

I've made the PR about "not closing all issues":
https://github.com/python/peps/pull/917/files


ᐧ
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Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 581: Using GitHub Issues for CPython

[Mariatta]

On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 2:02 PM Skip Montanaro 
wrote:

>  I think it would be worthwhile to mention a couple
> reasons, when the decision was made to use Roundup, etc. Without it, a
> casual reader might think the core devs made a horrible mistake way
> back when, and are only now getting around to correcting it.
>

I was not involved in core Python development back then, so if it is really
important and if people think such paragraph needs to be part of the PEP,
then perhaps someone else more knowledgeable will need to help with this.

Personally, I don't think it was a horrible mistake. I believe the core
devs back then carefully considered all options and decided that
bpo/roundup was the way to go. And I really don't want to give that
impression to the readers of this PEP that "I" or "core devs" now think it
was a horrible mistake. If there is specific parts of the PEP that gives
people that impression, then I'd definitely want to work and improve that.

ᐧ
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Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 581: Using GitHub Issues for CPython

[Mariatta]

On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 12:36 PM Manuel Cerón  wrote:

>
> After some frustration with bpo, I decided to file some issues into the
> meta tracker, just to find out that the link [1] provided by the Python
> Developer's Guide [2] is broken, giving a connection timeout.
>
>
Sometime ago we've started experimenting moving the meta tracker to GitHub.
https://github.com/python/bugs.python.org I don't know whether this is now
the "official" place for it, but I've definitely been referring people to
this repo if they need to file issue about bpo.

Again I don't know if this is now official or not, and should we start
updating all documentations accordingly?

ᐧ
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Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 581: Using GitHub Issues for CPython

[Mariatta]

On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 12:35 PM Matthew Woodcraft 
wrote:

>
> One part of this PEP stands out to me:
>
> | We should not be moving all open issues to GitHub. Issues with little
> | or no activity should just be closed. Issues with no decision made for
> | years should just be closed.
>
> I strongly advise against closing bug reports just because they're old.
>
> I know that the Python developers value trying to be a welcoming
> community. To many people, having a bug report that they put some effort
> into closed for no reason other than the passage of time feels like a
> slap in the face which stings harder than, for example, intemperate
> words on a mailing list.
>
> This is even more true if there won't be an option to re-open the bug,
> which seems to be what the PEP is saying will be the case.
>
> If a bug has been around for a long time and hasn't been fixed, the most
> useful information for the bug tracker to contain is "this bug has been
> around for a long time and it hasn't been fixed". Leaving the bug open
> is the simplest way to achieve that.
>
> (I think the above only goes for issues which are actually reporting
> bugs. Wishlist items are a different matter.)
>
> -M-
>


Thanks. A similar argument had been made by several other core devs in
person during Language summit 2018 as well as during the drafting of PEP
581, that we shouldn't be closing issues blindly.

I hear you (all) and I see the point. I agree that we shouldn't just be
closing all issues. I will edit the PEP sometime later today (or later this
weekend).


ᐧ
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[Python-Dev] PEP 581: Using GitHub Issues for CPython

[Mariatta]

I'd like to formally present to Python-dev PEP 581: Using GitHub Issues for
CPython

Full text: https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0581/

This is my first PEP, and in my opinion it is ready for wider discussion. I
don't know if it is "ready for pronouncement" so I'm hoping to get more
guidance about it from other experienced core devs and steering council.

I also plan to open discussion about PEP 581 at Python Language Summit, and
since I'm one-half of the language summit chairs, it is quite likely this
discussion will happen.

On that note, you can still sign up for the language summit here:
https://us.pycon.org/2019/events/language-summit/

Note that unlike previous years, you do not need to be invited by a core
developer. Łukasz and I will be curating the content, and we want to
include more diverse perspectives into language summit discussions.

Thanks.

ᐧ
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[Python-Dev] Using CLA assistant for Python contributions

[Mariatta]

I've posted in Discourse under core-workflow category
, and this
has been previously discussed on the core-workflow mailing list
,
but I feel this affects the wider contributors to Python, so wanted to
share it here for more visibility.

TL;DR:

We'd like to start using CLA assistant for contributions to Python
(including CPython, devguide, PEPs, all the bots etc). Ernest had set up
our own instance of CLA assistant, and it had been tested by several core
developers. We've also consulted The PSF and Van Lindberg for legal advice.

Unless I hear strong opposition (with reasons) from Python Steering
Council, Python core developers, and active core contributors, I plan to
switch us over to to CLA assistant in the coming week (before my OOOS of
March 18)

How this will affect all contributors to Python old and new:

- you will need to sign the CLA again, even if you've signed it before (in
bpo). It will take you several clicks, but then you'll do this only once,
and it takes effect immediately. (instead of waiting for a PSF staff to
check for it)

- bpo username will no longer be required when signing the CLA

- CLA will be accepted under Apache v2 only (no more Academic Free license)

For even more details, please follow the discourse post and the
core-workflow mailing list linked above, as well as the "CLA" section of my
blog post about Core Python sprint 2018
.

Thanks.
ᐧ
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Re: [Python-Dev] "Good first issues" on the bug tracker

[Mariatta]

Cheryl, thanks for starting this thread and for helping to find easy issues
to be worked on.

I'm sympathetic to wanting to have tasks for the PyCon sprints, but at
> the same time it feels exclusionary to "save" them from people who want
> to volunteer at other times. Having paid to attend PyCon shouldn't be a
> barrier or a privilege for contributing (though it's certainly a
> smoother road by having contributors there to assist, which is why other
> conferences/sprints are keen to have core developers attend as mentors).


I understand your concern, but I hope people understand that the mentored
sprint is a little bit different than the regular sprint days.
The target audience of the mentored sprint are folks who are
underrepresented minorities, in my personal experience, they are less
privileged to begin with.
We want to be inclusive, and therefore we're encouraging those who are not
from underrepresented group to bring along someone else from
underrepresented group with them.

The mentored sprint is taking place during the main conference days, and
looking at the signups, most of the participants have told us they want to
sprint for 4 hours on Saturday afternoon.
This means they will be missing out on lots of quality talks happening at
the same time which they paid for.
Our goal is really to make contributing more accessible by paring them up
with mentors, but without straightforward issues to be worked on, they
can't continue effectively.

The issues that's been earmarked for the mentored sprint are so far
documentation and typo fixes and not urgent issues.
I don't believe that we're "stealing away" opportunity to contribute from
those who weren't able to come to PyCon, but I understand that point of
view.

In any case, I'm appreciative to those who have helped find issues to be
worked on the mentored sprint, and I also understand that I can't (and
won't) stop other people from working on these issues before the sprint at
PyCon.

While I'm here, I'd like to invite you all to participate in the mentored
sprint if you can. Help spread the word, or sign up to mentor.
Any open source project is welcome to sign up! Check the page for more
details. https://us.pycon.org/2019/hatchery/mentoredsprints/

I'm a little busy with PyCascades until next Monday, but after that I'll be
happy to answer any questions about the mentored sprint.


ᐧ
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Re: [Python-Dev] Lost sight

[Mariatta Wijaya]

Sorry to hear that. Please take care.

On Sat, Jan 19, 2019, 4:15 AM Serhiy Storchaka  I have virtually completely lost the sight of my right eye (and the loss
> is quickly progresses) and the sight of my left eye is weak. That is why
> my activity as a core developer was decreased significantly at recent
> time. My apologies to those who are waiting for my review. I will do it
> slowly.
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] any way to subscribe to bugs and PRs on a particular topic?

[Mariatta Wijaya]

For GitHub PRs, you can add yourself to CODEOWNERS file, so you will be
automatically requested review if a PR contains changes to unittest.mock.
(and you'll receive review-request notification)
https://github.com/python/cpython/blob/master/.github/CODEOWNERS

When GitHub sends you review request notification email, it will cc
review_reques...@noreply.github.com, so you can create a filter based on
that.
ᐧ

On Tue, Dec 4, 2018 at 11:21 AM Chris Withers  wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I'd like to see if I can help with unittest.mock, but don't have a huge
> amount of bandwidth and can't even parse let alone process the whole
> firehose of bpo and GH PRs.
>
> Is there  any way I can get bugs.python.org and github PRs to only tell
> me about things, preferably by email, that affect or involve unittest.mock?
>
> cheers,
>
> Chris
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Re: [Python-Dev] Get a running instance of the doc for a PR.

[Mariatta Wijaya]

I think the intent is just uploading the output HTML and static assets.

I agree having the temporary output of PR docs build is useful, but I don't
think a python.org domain is necessary. If it can be uploaded to any cloud
storage service then that's good enough, just provide the link in the
status check. The output can be cleared after it receive the PR closed
webhook.

On Sun, Nov 4, 2018, 7:43 AM Serhiy Storchaka  04.11.18 17:00, Julien Palard via Python-Dev пише:
> > Considering feedback from Ned, what about building this as an
> independent service? We don't really need to interface with python.org at
> all, we just need some hardware, a domain, some code to interface with
> github API and... to start it's probably enough? It would be a usefull POC.
>
> This will just move risks to this service.
>
> Ned mentioned potential abuse. We will host unchecked content. Malicious
> user can create a PR which replaces Python documentation with malicious
> content.
>
> The Doc/ directory includes Python scripts and Makefile which are used
> for building documentation. Malicious user can use this for executing
> arbitrary code on our server.
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] Get a running instance of the doc for a PR.

[Mariatta Wijaya]

This will make review turnout quicker, since I can potentially review and
view the output from anywhere (phone while on a beach) instead of waiting
until I'm back home, open a computer, and then verify the output myself.

On Sun, Nov 4, 2018, 7:56 AM Steven D'Aprano  On Sun, Nov 04, 2018 at 04:12:39PM +0100, Stephane Wirtel wrote:
>
> > My workflow is the following steps:
> >
> > git wpr XYZ
> > cd ../cpython-XYZ
> > ./configure --prefix=$PWD-build --with-pydebug --silent
> > make -j 4 -s
> > make PYTHON=../python -C Doc/ venv
> > make -C Doc/ check suspicious html serve
> >
> > and run the browser on http://localhost:8000/ and check the result.
> >
> >
> > 1. Because I am a dev I can do it easily
> > 2. If you are not a dev, you have to learn a new step (download sources,
> > compile sources, compile doc and check the result)
>
> If I am making doc patches, shouldn't I be doing that *before* I
> submit the PR? How else will I know that my changes haven't broken the
> docs?
>
> So surely I need to learn those steps regardless?
>
> (Not a rhetorical question.)
>
>
> > I think this feature would be really useful for the contributors, the
> > reviewers and you, the core-dev.
>
> Sure. But the usefulness has to be weighed against the extra complexity,
> the extra "one more thing that can break and needs to be maintained",
> and the risk of abuse.
>
> I have no opinion on whether the pluses outweigh the minuses.
>
>
> --
> Steve
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Re: [Python-Dev] Stop automerging

[Mariatta Wijaya]

Thanks Zach for fixing it quickly.

Even if that bug has been fixed, per my instructions to python-committers,
core devs should still edit the PR title and PR description *before* adding
the '烙 automerge' label.

The YouTube video (link in python-committers  email) shows to edit those.

The PR title and body will be used as the squashed commit message.

And remember, you can still merge the PR manually. Just don't apply the  '烙
automerge' label.

On Wed, Sep 12, 2018, 2:09 AM Zachary Ware 
wrote:

> It is still up to the core dev to set the message properly, but the HTML
> comments are invisible on GitHub until you edit the message. That bug is
> now fixed, though; HTML comments are stripped from the message before
> creating the commit.
>
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] make patchcheck and git path

[Mariatta Wijaya]

I don't quite understand the problem you're facing with git and make
patchcheck?

Also, perhaps this is more for core-workflow instead of python-dev.

Mariatta

ᐧ

On Fri, Aug 24, 2018 at 3:20 AM Michael  wrote:

> I am trying to be a 'good scout' and run "make patchcheck" more
> regularly. However, I generally am not successful because I build and
> test in separate directories.
>
> There is access to git! just no ready reference in the build area.
>
> So, not calling it a bug - but if someone else also experiences this,
> and feels capable of makeing it more flexible - you will get thanks from
> me, in any case!
>
> Michael
>
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] Python 2.7 EOL date

[Mariatta Wijaya]

No more security fixes after Jan 1, 2020.
It is the end of Python 2.7.



On Thu, Aug 23, 2018, 12:47 PM Collin Anderson  wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> Sorry if this has been mentioned before, but I noticed the Python 2.7 EOL
> date was recently set to Jan 1st, 2020.
>
> My understanding was Python releases get 5 years of support from their
> initial release, and Python 2.7 was extended an additional 5 years.
>
> Python 2.7 was originally released on 2010-07-03, and with an original EOL
> of 2015-07-03. Extended 5 years, shouldn't the EOL be 2020-07-03?
>
> Also, this statement is a little unclear to me:
>
> > Specifically, 2.7 will receive bugfix support until January 1, 2020. All
> 2.7 development work will cease in 2020.
>
> This statement makes it sound like bugfixes end on Jan 1st, but seems to
> leave open the possibility that security fixes could continue through the
> year.
>
> Thanks!
> Collin
>
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] Problem in importing python packages under python 3.6 environment

[Mariatta Wijaya]

Hi Poornima,

Your question is more appropriate for the python-list mailing list (
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list) or python-tutors
mailing list (https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor).



On Thu, Aug 9, 2018, 8:30 AM Poornima .D.  wrote:

> Hi All,
>
>
> I have limited knowledge on python development.  I am trying to write a
> test application which needs to import from many packages across
> mutliple directories.
>
>
> I tried using an environment variable and appending to sys.path variable
> so that import Class methods works.
>
>
> I am trying to replace the above logic by below syntax.
>
>
> from directory.fileName import ClassName
>
>
> But this syntax does not work.  Please let me know any solution for this
> issue.
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] Refactor __get_builtin_constructor on hasklib.py

[Mariatta Wijaya]

2.7 is for bug fixes only. Unless there is a bug to be fixed, I would leave
the code as is.

Mariatta


On Tue, Aug 7, 2018 at 8:14 AM 蔡銘峯  wrote:

> Hello everybody,
> I am Park Tsai. I want to refactor __get_builtin_constructor on hasklib.py
> of python 2.7 (
> https://github.com/python/cpython/blob/2.7/Lib/hashlib.py#L72).
> This is the first time that I try to refactor code of CPython on GitHub,
> so I am very excited.
>
> This is __get_builtin_constructor code on hasklib.py ,as follows.
>
> def __get_builtin_constructor(name):
> try:
> if name in ('SHA1', 'sha1'):
> import _sha
> return _sha.new
> elif name in ('MD5', 'md5'):
> import _md5
> return _md5.new
> elif name in ('SHA256', 'sha256', 'SHA224', 'sha224'):
> import _sha256
> bs = name[3:]
> if bs == '256':
> return _sha256.sha256
> elif bs == '224':
> return _sha256.sha224
> elif name in ('SHA512', 'sha512', 'SHA384', 'sha384'):
> import _sha512
> bs = name[3:]
> if bs == '512':
> return _sha512.sha512
> elif bs == '384':
> return _sha512.sha384
> except ImportError:
> pass  # no extension module, this hash is unsupported.
>
> raise ValueError('unsupported hash type ' + name)
>
>
> When I read this code, it looks messy, so I want to refactor it and make
> it become more clearly .
>
> Then, it will be like this
>
> def get_builtin_constructor(name):
> try:
> if name[:3] in ('SHA','sha'):
>if(name[3:]=='1'):
>import _sha
>return _sha.new
>
>elif (name[3:] == '224'):
>import _sha256
>return _sha256.sha224
>
>elif (name[3:] == '256'):
>import _sha256
>return _sha256.sha256
>
>elif (name[3:] == '384'):
>import _sha512
>return _sha512.sha384
>
>elif (name[3:] == '512'):
>import _sha512
>return _sha512.sha512
> elif name in ('MD5', 'md5'):
> import _md5
> return _md5.new
>
> except ImportError:
> pass # no extension module, this hash is unsupported.
>
> raise ValueError('unsupported hash type ' + name)
>
> I will be grateful for any help you can provide. I really appreciate any
> feedback you can offer!
>
> Best regards,
> Park Tsai !!
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Re: [Python-Dev] Microsoft to acquire GitHub for $7.5 b

[Mariatta Wijaya]

Backing up GitHub data has been brought up since the time we migrated to
GitHub, and being tracked here: https://github.com/pytho
n/core-workflow/issues/20

TL;DR We'll be using GitHub's new Migrations API
<https://developer.github.com/v3/migrations/orgs/> to download archived
GitHub data of CPython. Ernest is helping us get set up with daily backups
of CPython repo to be stored within The PSF's infrastructure.

Mariatta

On Thu, Jun 7, 2018 at 11:24 AM, Chris Angelico  wrote:

> On Fri, Jun 8, 2018 at 3:33 AM, Chris Barker - NOAA Federal via
> Python-Dev  wrote:
> > Any service could change or fail. Period.
> >
> > So we shouldn’t want valuable information about Python development
> > only in gitHub.
> >
> > I don’t know how hard it is to backup / mirror an entire repo — but it
> > sure seems like a good idea.
>
> There are two separate concerns here:
>
> 1) How do we get a full copy of all of CPython and its change history?
>
> 2) How do we get all the non-code content - issues, pull requests,
> comments?
>
> The first one is trivially easy. *Everyone* who has a clone of the
> repository [1] has a full copy of the code and all history, updated
> every time 'git pull' is run.
>
> The second one depends on GitHub's exporting facilities; but it also
> depends on a definition of what's important. Maybe the PSF doesn't
> care if people's comments at the bottoms of commits are lost (not to
> be confused with commit messages themselves, which are part of the
> repo proper), so it wouldn't matter if they're lost. Or maybe it's
> important to have the contents of such commits, but it's okay to
> credit them to an email address rather than linking to an actual
> username. Or whatever. Unlike with the code/history repo, an imperfect
> export is still of partial value.
>
> ChrisA
>
> [1] Barring shallow clones, but most people don't do those
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Re: [Python-Dev] Keeping an eye on Travis CI, AppVeyor and buildbots: revert on regression

[Mariatta Wijaya]

Are there APIs we can use to check the status of builbots?
Maybe we can have the our bots check for the buildbot status in backport
PRs.

On Wed, May 30, 2018, 2:33 AM Victor Stinner  wrote:

>
> Buildbots only send email notifications to buildbot-sta...@python.org
> when the state changes from success (green) to failure (red). It's
> much simpler for me to spot a regression when most buildbots are
> green.
>
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] Keeping an eye on Travis CI, AppVeyor and buildbots: revert on regression

[Mariatta Wijaya]

Activating Travis CI GitHub app is being tracked in
https://github.com/python/core-workflow/issues/255

Let's not press the button until after the 3.7 release.


On Wed, Jun 6, 2018, 3:57 PM INADA Naoki  wrote:

> ​
> ​2018年6月7日(木) 2:44 Brett Cannon :
>
>>
>> On Wed, 6 Jun 2018 at 09:27 INADA Naoki  wrote:
>>
>>>  First I was also
 confused between travis-ci.com and travis-ci.org ... The documentation
 shows an example with .com, but Python organization uses .org.

 Victor

>>>
>>> .org is legacy.
>>>
>>> Open source projects can migrate to new .com.
>>>
>>
>> ... eventually: "existing user accounts and repositories will be migrated
>> over time." I have not seen any announcements or anything regarding how
>> when or how to migrate ourselves.
>>
>> -Brett
>>
>
> Before waiting notice from Travis-CI, we need to activate the repository
> on new site.
>
>
> https://docs.travis-ci.com/user/open-source-on-travis-ci-com/#Existing-Open-Source-Repositories-on-travis-ci.org
> > However, open source repositories will be migrated to travis-ci.com 
> > gradually,
> beginning at the end of Q2 2018. You will receive an email when the
> migration for a repository is complete. This is an opt-in process: to have
> a repository migrated over, it must first be activated on travis-ci.com.
>
> Could someone who is
> ​python org admin
> owner try activa
> ​​
> ting from here?
> https://travis-ci.com/profile/python
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Re: [Python-Dev] Microsoft to acquire GitHub for $7.5 billion

[Mariatta Wijaya]

I think we shouldn't be speculating or making guesses.
If people are concerned with how Microsoft will manage GitHub, please talk
to Microsoft or GitHub representative, and not gossip in python-dev.

If there is actual news or announcement of how GitHub will change, and how
it will affect our workflow, we'll discuss in core-workflow.


Mariatta

On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 10:02 AM, Antoine Pitrou  wrote:

>
> That's true, but Microsoft has a lot of stakes in the ecosystem.
> For example, since it has its own CI service that it tries to promote
> (VSTS), is it in Microsoft's best interest to polish and improve
> integrations with other CI services?
>
> Regards
>
> Antoine
>
ᐧ
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Re: [Python-Dev] How is the GitHub workflow working for people?

[Mariatta Wijaya]

Can any of these said linters analyze only the diff in the PR, instead of
the entire CPython codebase?

Mariatta Wijaya

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Re: [Python-Dev] How is the GitHub workflow working for people?

[Mariatta Wijaya]

>
> It's been a year and 10 days since we moved to GitHub, so I figured now is
> as good a time as any to ask people if they are generally happy with the
> workflow


It's been great! Thanks!


> Said PEP may also need to mention the possibility of exporting
> > the history of GitHub issues, in case CPython ever migrates away from
> > GitHub; I remember that concern being raised when the original
> > migration was discussed.
> There are tools for it (e.g., I wrote
> https://github.com/mcepl/github-issues-export to move issues to
> Bugzilla, yes I am weird) and it is not that difficult to write
> something just to get data from GitHub’s all embracing arms. Of
> course, I am not sure how it would work on really large number
> of bugs, and it would be necessary to do some postprocessing
> (changing issue numbers etc.).


It's really more complicated than just copying over text from the bpo to
GitHub. Can we preserve the history and the existing discussions?
What about existing patches currently attached to issues? Can the issue
number be preserved?
Everywhere in our commit message we reference bpo-. What will happen to
those?
We'll need to come up with new workflow. How do we want to triage the
issues? And what does it mean to current bug tracker triage permission?

The recent
> improvements to @miss-islington (kudos to Mariatta!) allowing her to
> auto-backport PRs and commit them is a big time saver.


Thanks! I can't take all credit. The bots are easy to build and maintain
mainly because of Brett Cannon's gidgethub [1] library. Thanks Brett!
Also... is this a good time to advertise my PyCon tutorial [2] about
building GitHub bots?

 I still miss my “commit when CI completes” button, but oh well.


It is in my todo list, to at least notify when all CI completed so we can
go back and merge it.
I'll have time to think about this after PyCon US.

if there is a particular sticking point to please bring it up


This has been brought up several times in different mailing lists: Please
clean up the commit message before merging.

1. Ensure bpo-N is included.
If the bpo-N is not included, the commit doesn't get linked to the
issue in the b.p.o.

2. Ensure that the GitHub PR number is replaced, from (#12345) to (GH-12345)
In the b.p.o,  (#12345) links to bugs.python.org/issue12345 instead of
linking to GitHub PR number 12345.

3. Don't reference bpo-N as #N in the commit message.
tl;dr it breaks the bots. See [3] and [4]

One improvement I've been thinking about is related to the way we add news
entry using "blurb add" on the command line.
I wish there's a web UI for doing it. A place where I can type in the news
entry, give it the GitHub PR number, the bpo number, and with a button
click the News.d file magically created and added to the PR. Any thoughts
about this?


Mariatta Wijaya

[1] https://gidgethub.readthedocs.io/en/stable/
[2] https://us.pycon.org/2018/schedule/presentation/41/
[3] https://github.com/python/bedevere/issues/95#issuecomment-366570410
[4] https://github.com/python/bedevere/issues/97



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Re: [Python-Dev] GH-NNNN vs #NNNN in merge commit

[Mariatta Wijaya]

No problem :) It's been deployed.

Mariatta Wijaya

On Fri, Jan 26, 2018 at 9:48 AM, Eric V. Smith <e...@trueblade.com> wrote:
>
>
> It works for me: I think this is very helpful. Thanks for coding it up so
> quickly!
>
> Eric
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] GH-NNNN vs #NNNN in merge commit

[Mariatta Wijaya]

>
> I believe https://github.com/python/bedevere/pull/82 will add a comment,
> which will get emailed to everyone nosy on the PR.

Yes, and I've just updated my PR description:

If a PR was merged and the commit message was not changed from # to
GH-, bedevere-bot will leave a comment to remind the core dev to update
it next time.
For example:
```
@Mariatta: Please replace # with GH- in the commit message next time.
Thanks!
```

Does that work for everyone?

Mariatta Wijaya
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Re: [Python-Dev] GH-NNNN vs #NNNN in merge commit

[Mariatta Wijaya]

I think we're starting to deviate from the original topic here which is:
please replace # with GH- when you click Squash & Merge button.

The idea of the mergebot (by issuing a command) was brought up for a
different purpose: to automate the merging of a PR after all CI passes
(which can take time) and an approval by a core dev.
I still like that idea, if we can figure out a way to supply a commit
message we really want, before the bot merges the PR. It might be a
separate discussion for core-workflow or python-committers?

In my mind, even if we have such mergebot implemented, core devs can still
merge using the UI if they want to.
(Remember to replace the # with GH-)


Mariatta Wijaya
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Re: [Python-Dev] GH-NNNN vs #NNNN in merge commit

[Mariatta Wijaya]

>
> Why not just auto merge if the PR is approved, CI is all green, and no
> additional commits have been pushed?


My problem has been that I almost always still need to rewrite the commit
message.
Especially when someone wrote "fix a typo" or "fix several typos".

If it automatically merges, then there's no opportunity to adjust the
commit message.
So I suggest the option to provide the proper commit message to the
mergebot.
If not provided, I guess we'll use the GitHub PR title and description.

Mariatta Wijaya
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Re: [Python-Dev] GH-NNNN vs #NNNN in merge commit

[Mariatta Wijaya]

>
> That would be best solution (I think it would solve
> https://github.com/python/miss-islington/issues/16 too) but it's more
> complicated than the extension idea :) I have some time work on it if
> you'd like to implement the mergebot idea.


+1 for the mergebot! :)

New bot or miss-islington's new job?

Still +1 either way, as long as other core devs are fine with it too :)


Mariatta Wijaya
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Re: [Python-Dev] GH-NNNN vs #NNNN in merge commit

[Mariatta Wijaya]

>
> Of course, we would still need to convince people to install it :)


Right, that's the challenge :)
I personally use Chrome (!) and I've been using your Chrome extension, so
thank you!
However, I don't feel comfortable making this available only for a specific
browser user, feels exclusionary to me.
Also, sometimes I merge from my phone where there's no chrome extension,
(maybe I really shouldn't be doing that?).

I think the solution should be something not webbrowser specific.

One idea is maybe have a bot to do the squash commit, for example by
commenting on GitHub:
@merge-bot merge  

So core devs can do the above instead of pressing the commit button. Any
thoughts on this?

In the meantime, committers, please try to remember and change the # into
GH- :)
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Re: [Python-Dev] GH-NNNN vs #NNNN in merge commit

[Mariatta Wijaya]

It has to be manually edited right before you commit/merge on GitHub.
I don't think it can be automatically changed? Unless we have some kind of
post commit hook to amend the commit message.

I've been changing it to GH- , so does miss-islington when she backports.

If you see the mixed GH- and # in the backports PR, it's because
miss-islington converted the first one.

On Jan 25, 2018 4:21 AM, "Berker Peksağ"  wrote:

> On Thu, Jan 25, 2018 at 1:42 PM, INADA Naoki 
> wrote:
> > Hi.
> >
> > Devguide says:
> >
> > """
> > Replace the reference to GitHub pull request # with GH-. If
> > the title is too long, the pull request number can be added to the
> > message body.
> > """
> >
> > https://devguide.python.org/gitbootcamp/#accepting-and-
> merging-a-pull-request
> >
> > But there are more # than GH- in commit log.
> > https://github.com/python/cpython/commits/master
> >
> > Where should we go?
> > Encourage GH-? or abandon it and use default #?
>
> I'd personally drop both GH- and # markers. The number of the
> PR is already linked to the commit on GitHub:
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/zzm9f56485pbl1v/Screenshot%
> 20from%202018-01-25%2015%3A14%3A28.png?dl=0
>
> You can even see both styles in the same commit (especially in backport
> PRs)
>
>  bpo-42: Fix spam eggs (GH-2341) (#2211)
>
> --Berker
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Re: [Python-Dev] f-strings

[Mariatta Wijaya]

I agree it's useful info :)

I went ahead and made a PR [1].
In my PR, I simply linked to the Format Specification Mini Language[2] from
f-strings documentation[3].

Not sure about updating PEP 498 at this point..

[1] https://github.com/python/cpython/pull/4888

[2] https://docs.python.org/3.6/library/string.html#format-s
pecification-mini-language

[3]  https://docs.python.org/3/reference/lexical_analysis.html#f-strings
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Re: [Python-Dev] f-strings

[Mariatta Wijaya]

That's covered under "format specifiers" I think.
The PEP mentions this:
https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0498/#format-specifiers

That specific example is not mentioned in the docs, but there other
examples of using format specifiers with f-strings.
https://docs.python.org/3/reference/lexical_analysis.html#formatted-string-literals


On Dec 15, 2017 7:39 AM, "Wagner Herculano" <waghercul...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> Good evening,
> I'm Wagner Herculano from Brazil.
> I was trying to do a table exercise with number 5 and tried formatting
> spaces and did not find it in PEP 498 documentation.
> Finally I found a way, if possible, include this example in the
> documentation please.
>
> Below is my script with the desired formatting about table of 5.
>
> *n = 5*
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *for i in range(1,11): print(f'{n} x {i:>2} = {n*i:>2}') Result5
> x  1 =  5 5 x  2 = 10 5 x  3 = 15 5 x  4 = 20 5 x  5 = 25 5 x  6 = 30 5 x
> 7 = 35 5 x  8 = 40 5 x  9 = 45 5 x 10 = 50*
> *---*
> *Sorry my English, I needed to use Google Translate*
>
> Best Regards,
> Wagner Herculano
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] "CPython loves your Pull Requests" talk by Stéphane Wirtel

[Mariatta Wijaya]

I saw the talk in person :) Congrats Stéphane!

You can get the reviews from a specific PR using the API:
https://developer.github.com/v3/pulls/reviews/#list-reviews-on-a-pull-request

For example, for reviews made to CPython PR number 1:

https://api.github.com/repos/python/cpython/pulls/1/reviews

* Time to merge a PR: 3 days in average, good!


Regarding the average time to merge PR, I'm interested to know the average
time to merge for PRs not made by Python Core Devs.


Mariatta Wijaya
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Re: [Python-Dev] PEPs: ``.. code:: python`` or ``::`` (syntaxhighlighting)

[Mariatta Wijaya]

If we were to add Pygments support, it is to be done in pythondotorg
project.

I recalled the decision was to get PEPs rendered using Sphinx and host it
at Read The Docs, so we don't have to worry about updating pythondotorg.

Mariatta Wijaya
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Re: [Python-Dev] What's the status of PEP 505: None-aware operators?

[Mariatta Wijaya]

-1 from me too.

Mariatta Wijaya

On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 12:38 PM, Barry Warsaw <ba...@python.org> wrote:

> On Nov 28, 2017, at 15:31, Raymond Hettinger <raymond.hettin...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Put me down for a strong -1.   The proposal would occasionally save a
> few keystokes but comes at the expense of giving Python a more Perlish look
> and a more arcane feel.
>
> I am also -1.
>
> > One of the things I like about Python is that I can walk non-programmers
> through the code and explain what it does.  The examples in PEP 505 look
> like a step in the wrong direction.  They don't "look like Python" and make
> me feel like I have to decrypt the code to figure-out what it does.
>
> I had occasional to speak with someone very involved in Rust development.
> They have a process roughly similar to our PEPs.  One of the things he told
> me, which I found very interesting and have been mulling over for PEPs is,
> they require a section in their specification discussion how any new
> feature will be taught, both to new Rust programmers and experienced ones.
> I love the emphasis on teachability.  Sometimes I really miss that when
> considering some of the PEPs and the features they introduce (look how hard
> it is to teach asynchronous programming).
>
> Cheers,
> -Barry
>
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] Migrate python-dev to Mailman 3?

[Mariatta Wijaya]

Starting with core-mentorship and then core-workflow sounds good.

Let me first find out what it's going to take to do the migration. (I
actually have no idea!)
I've sent an email to postmaster and asked for more details :)

Hope it's not too complicated...

Mariatta Wijaya
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