Re: [Softwires] Softwire Interim Meeting in Beijing
Dear all, I fully agree with Rajiv. I would like to add to the list of stateless solutions the proposal specified in: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-boucadair-behave-ipv6-portrange-04 and its companion I-D: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-boucadair-dhcpv6-shared-address-option-01. Cheers, Med -Message d'origine- De : softwires-boun...@ietf.org [mailto:softwires-boun...@ietf.org] De la part de Rajiv Asati (rajiva) Envoyé : vendredi 19 août 2011 17:04 À : Alain Durand Cc : softwires@ietf.org; liziye; Yong Cui; iesg-secret...@ietf.org; Ralph Droms (rdroms) Objet : Re: [Softwires] Softwire Interim Meeting in Beijing It doesn't, IMO. In fact, I beg to say that it is unfair mention 'tunneling vs translating' as a blanket statement, since we have known all along that a sane 4v6 solution would likely involve translating (44), no matter what. Moreover, it is reasonable to call out all stateless 4v6 options, not just a particular solution. Cheers, Rajiv -Original Message- From: Alain Durand [mailto:adur...@juniper.net] Sent: Friday, August 19, 2011 9:44 AM To: Rajiv Asati (rajiva) Cc: Yong Cui; softwires@ietf.org; liziye; iesg-secret...@ietf.org; Ralph Droms (rdroms) Subject: Re: [Softwires] Softwire Interim Meeting in Beijing We mentioned 'tunneling vs translating'. This should cover it. Alain. Sent from my iPad On Aug 19, 2011, at 8:16 AM, Rajiv Asati (rajiva) raj...@cisco.com wrote: Yong, Why is dIVI not included In the discussion ? Could you please clarify? Cheers, Rajiv Sent from Phone On Aug 19, 2011, at 8:10 AM, Yong Cui cuiy...@tsinghua.edu.cn wrote: Hi folks, We, softwire wg chairs, in agreement with our ADs, are announcing an interim meeting in Beijing on September 26 27. The date has been chosen adjacent to the BBF meeting in Shangai to minimize travel and visa issues. The interim meeting will focus on 'stateless' solutions in general and 4rd in particular. Expected outcome includes progress on 4rd spec, packet format, where to put IPv4 bits, port indications, DHCP option, tunneling vs translation, coexistence with other technologies, etc... --- Meeting Location recommended hotels Meeting venue: FIT Building, Tsinghua University, Beijing FIT Building is the first left building inside of the East Gate of Tsinghua Univeristy http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=202779846620144871057.0004aad8ce367b 982 9372msa=0ll=39.996906,116.331664spn=0.004044,0.008798 Recommended hotels: 1. Uniscenter (4 stars, 3 min walk) http://en.uniscenter.com/newEbiz1/EbizPortalFG/portal/html/index.html 2. Wenjin Hotel (5 stars, 10 min walk) http://www.wenjin.com.cn/ 3. Royal King Hotel (5 stars, 10 min by car) http://www.royalkinghotel.com/ Invitation letter If you need an invitation letter, please send the following info to Ms. Ziye Li: liz...@csnet1.cs.tsinghua.edu.cn. Surname: Given Name: Company: Address: Phone: Passport Number: Passport Exp. Date: Passport Issuing Country: - Further contact information Please contact Ms. Ziye Li if you have any question about Beijing/Tsinghua/Hotel/Meeting venue/visa/tour... liz...@csnet1.cs.tsinghua.edu.cn -- Alain, Yong ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] New working group documents
I support to adopt all. Mingwei === 2011-08-20 22:21:16 您在来信中写道：=== Hi folks, Following our rough concensus during Quebec City meeting and according to our charter/milestones, the chairs would like to ask the mailing list for the confirmation to adopt the following drafts: 1. Deployment Considerations for Dual-Stack Lite http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-lee-softwire-dslite-deployment/ 2. Public IPv4 over Access IPv6 Network http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-cui-softwire-host-4over6/ 3. Softwire Mesh Multicast http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-xu-softwire-mesh-multicast/ 4. Multicast Extensions to DS-Lite Technique in Broadband Deployments http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-qin-softwire-dslite-multicast-04/ 5. Motivations for Stateless IPv4 over IPv6 Migration Solutions http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-operators-softwire-stateless-4v6-moti vation/ Please send your comments by 10am EDT on Aug 27. If you object to adoption, please also give the detailed reasons. --Alain Yong ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = 致 礼！ Mingwei Xu x...@cernet.edu.cn 2011-08-22 ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] New working group documents
Hi, I support the adoption for draft 1, 2, 3, 5 to WG items. Regards, Yu -Original Message- From: softwires-boun...@ietf.org [mailto:softwires-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Yong Cui Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2011 10:21 PM To: softwires@ietf.org Cc: Yong Cui Subject: [Softwires] New working group documents Hi folks, Following our rough concensus during Quebec City meeting and according to our charter/milestones, the chairs would like to ask the mailing list for the confirmation to adopt the following drafts: 1. Deployment Considerations for Dual-Stack Lite http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-lee-softwire-dslite-deployment/ 2. Public IPv4 over Access IPv6 Network http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-cui-softwire-host-4over6/ 3. Softwire Mesh Multicast http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-xu-softwire-mesh-multicast/ 4. Multicast Extensions to DS-Lite Technique in Broadband Deployments http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-qin-softwire-dslite-multicast-04/ 5. Motivations for Stateless IPv4 over IPv6 Migration Solutions http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-operators-softwire-stateless-4v6-moti vation/ Please send your comments by 10am EDT on Aug 27. If you object to adoption, please also give the detailed reasons. --Alain Yong ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
[Softwires] 答复: New working group documents
I support all of them. Jie Hu -邮件原件- 发件人: softwires-boun...@ietf.org [mailto:softwires-boun...@ietf.org] 代表 Eleven Fu(Yu) 发送时间: 2011年8月22日 16:33 收件人: Yong Cui; softwires@ietf.org 主题: Re: [Softwires] New working group documents Hi, I support the adoption for draft 1, 2, 3, 5 to WG items. Regards, Yu -Original Message- From: softwires-boun...@ietf.org [mailto:softwires-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Yong Cui Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2011 10:21 PM To: softwires@ietf.org Cc: Yong Cui Subject: [Softwires] New working group documents Hi folks, Following our rough concensus during Quebec City meeting and according to our charter/milestones, the chairs would like to ask the mailing list for the confirmation to adopt the following drafts: 1. Deployment Considerations for Dual-Stack Lite http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-lee-softwire-dslite-deployment/ 2. Public IPv4 over Access IPv6 Network http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-cui-softwire-host-4over6/ 3. Softwire Mesh Multicast http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-xu-softwire-mesh-multicast/ 4. Multicast Extensions to DS-Lite Technique in Broadband Deployments http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-qin-softwire-dslite-multicast-04/ 5. Motivations for Stateless IPv4 over IPv6 Migration Solutions http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-operators-softwire-stateless-4v6-moti vation/ Please send your comments by 10am EDT on Aug 27. If you object to adoption, please also give the detailed reasons. --Alain Yong ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
[Softwires] 答复: New working group documents
Hi, I support the adoption of multicast and stateless motivation drafts: 3, 4 and 5. Cheers, Gao feng Yong Cui cuiy...@tsinghua.edu.cn 发件人: softwires-boun...@ietf.org 2011-08-20 22:21 收件人 softwires@ietf.org 抄送 Yong Cui cuiy...@tsinghua.edu.cn 主题 [Softwires] New working group documents Hi folks, Following our rough concensus during Quebec City meeting and according to our charter/milestones, the chairs would like to ask the mailing list for the confirmation to adopt the following drafts: 1. Deployment Considerations for Dual-Stack Lite http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-lee-softwire-dslite-deployment/ 2. Public IPv4 over Access IPv6 Network http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-cui-softwire-host-4over6/ 3. Softwire Mesh Multicast http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-xu-softwire-mesh-multicast/ 4. Multicast Extensions to DS-Lite Technique in Broadband Deployments http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-qin-softwire-dslite-multicast-04/ 5. Motivations for Stateless IPv4 over IPv6 Migration Solutions http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-operators-softwire-stateless-4v6-moti vation/ Please send your comments by 10am EDT on Aug 27. If you object to adoption, please also give the detailed reasons. --Alain Yong ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ZTE Information Security Notice: The information contained in this mail is solely property of the sender's organization. This mail communication is confidential. Recipients named above are obligated to maintain secrecy and are not permitted to disclose the contents of this communication to others. This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the originator of the message. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender. This message has been scanned for viruses and Spam by ZTE Anti-Spam system. ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] New working group documents
+1, support adopting all. Xiaohong |-Original Message- |From: Mingwei Xu [mailto:x...@cernet.edu.cn] |Sent: Monday, August 22, 2011 2:34 PM |To: Yong Cui; softwires@ietf.org |Cc: Yong Cui |Subject: Re: [Softwires] New working group documents | |I support to adopt all. | |Mingwei | | | |=== 2011-08-20 22:21:16 您在来信中写道：=== | |Hi folks, | |Following our rough concensus during Quebec City meeting and |according |to our charter/milestones, the chairs would like to ask the mailing |list for the confirmation to adopt the following |drafts: | |1. Deployment Considerations for Dual-Stack Lite |http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-lee-softwire-dslite-deployment/ | | |2. Public IPv4 over Access IPv6 Network |http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-cui-softwire-host-4over6/ | |3. Softwire Mesh Multicast |http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-xu-softwire-mesh-multicast/ | |4. Multicast Extensions to DS-Lite Technique in Broadband Deployments |http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-qin-softwire-dslite-multicast-04/ | |5. Motivations for Stateless IPv4 over IPv6 Migration Solutions |http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-operators-softwire-state |less-4v6- |moti |vation/ | |Please send your comments by 10am EDT on Aug 27. If you object to |adoption, please also give the detailed reasons. | | | |--Alain Yong | | |___ |Softwires mailing list |Softwires@ietf.org |https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires | | |= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = | | |致 |礼！ | | |Mingwei Xu |x...@cernet.edu.cn | 2011-08-22 | ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] New working group documents
Dear all, I'm in favor of adopting the 5 drafts listed below as softwire WG documents. Cheers, Christian. -Message d'origine- De : softwires-boun...@ietf.org [mailto:softwires-boun...@ietf.org] De la part de Yong Cui Envoyé : samedi 20 août 2011 16:21 À : softwires@ietf.org Cc : Yong Cui Objet : [Softwires] New working group documents Hi folks, Following our rough concensus during Quebec City meeting and according to our charter/milestones, the chairs would like to ask the mailing list for the confirmation to adopt the following drafts: 1. Deployment Considerations for Dual-Stack Lite http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-lee-softwire-dslite-deployment/ 2. Public IPv4 over Access IPv6 Network http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-cui-softwire-host-4over6/ 3. Softwire Mesh Multicast http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-xu-softwire-mesh-multicast/ 4. Multicast Extensions to DS-Lite Technique in Broadband Deployments http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-qin-softwire-dslite-multicast-04/ 5. Motivations for Stateless IPv4 over IPv6 Migration Solutions http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-operators-softwire-stateless-4v6-moti vation/ Please send your comments by 10am EDT on Aug 27. If you object to adoption, please also give the detailed reasons. --Alain Yong ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires IMPORTANT.Les informations contenues dans ce message electronique y compris les fichiers attaches sont strictement confidentielles et peuvent etre protegees par la loi. Ce message electronique est destine exclusivement au(x) destinataire(s) mentionne(s) ci-dessus. Si vous avez recu ce message par erreur ou s il ne vous est pas destine, veuillez immediatement le signaler a l expediteur et effacer ce message et tous les fichiers eventuellement attaches. Toute lecture, exploitation ou transmission des informations contenues dans ce message est interdite. Tout message electronique est susceptible d alteration. A ce titre, le Groupe France Telecom decline toute responsabilite notamment s il a ete altere, deforme ou falsifie. De meme, il appartient au destinataire de s assurer de l absence de tout virus. IMPORTANT.This e-mail message and any attachments are strictly confidential and may be protected by law. This message is intended only for the named recipient(s) above. If you have received this message in error, or are not the named recipient(s), please immediately notify the sender and delete this e-mail message. Any unauthorized view, usage or disclosure ofthis message is prohibited. Since e-mail messages may not be reliable, France Telecom Group shall not be liable for any message if modified, changed or falsified. Additionally the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free. ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] New working group documents
I'm in favour adopting 1, 4 and 5. No opinion at the moment regarding 2 and 3. Thx Olaf -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: softwires-boun...@ietf.org [mailto:softwires-boun...@ietf.org] Im Auftrag von Yong Cui Gesendet: Samstag, 20. August 2011 16:21 An: softwires@ietf.org Cc: Yong Cui Betreff: [Softwires] New working group documents Hi folks, Following our rough concensus during Quebec City meeting and according to our charter/milestones, the chairs would like to ask the mailing list for the confirmation to adopt the following drafts: 1. Deployment Considerations for Dual-Stack Lite http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-lee-softwire-dslite-deployment/ 2. Public IPv4 over Access IPv6 Network http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-cui-softwire-host-4over6/ 3. Softwire Mesh Multicast http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-xu-softwire-mesh-multicast/ 4. Multicast Extensions to DS-Lite Technique in Broadband Deployments http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-qin-softwire-dslite-multicast-04/ 5. Motivations for Stateless IPv4 over IPv6 Migration Solutions http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-operators-softwire-state less-4v6-moti vation/ Please send your comments by 10am EDT on Aug 27. If you object to adoption, please also give the detailed reasons. --Alain Yong ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] Softwire Interim Meeting in Beijing
Dear Chairs, I suggest including draft-murakami-softwire-4v6-translation-00 into the agenda as well. We already had a presentation in last softwire meeting. It's reasonable to continue the discussion in the interim meeting Many thanks Gang 2011/8/19, Yong Cui cuiy...@tsinghua.edu.cn: Hi folks, We, softwire wg chairs, in agreement with our ADs, are announcing an interim meeting in Beijing on September 26 27. The date has been chosen adjacent to the BBF meeting in Shangai to minimize travel and visa issues. The interim meeting will focus on 'stateless' solutions in general and 4rd in particular. Expected outcome includes progress on 4rd spec, packet format, where to put IPv4 bits, port indications, DHCP option, tunneling vs translation, coexistence with other technologies, etc... --- Meeting Location recommended hotels Meeting venue: FIT Building, Tsinghua University, Beijing FIT Building is the first left building inside of the East Gate of Tsinghua Univeristy http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=202779846620144871057.0004aad8ce367b982 9372msa=0ll=39.996906,116.331664spn=0.004044,0.008798 Recommended hotels: 1. Uniscenter (4 stars, 3 min walk) http://en.uniscenter.com/newEbiz1/EbizPortalFG/portal/html/index.html 2. Wenjin Hotel (5 stars, 10 min walk) http://www.wenjin.com.cn/ 3. Royal King Hotel (5 stars, 10 min by car) http://www.royalkinghotel.com/ Invitation letter If you need an invitation letter, please send the following info to Ms. Ziye Li: liz...@csnet1.cs.tsinghua.edu.cn. Surname: Given Name: Company: Address: Phone: Passport Number: Passport Exp. Date: Passport Issuing Country: - Further contact information Please contact Ms. Ziye Li if you have any question about Beijing/Tsinghua/Hotel/Meeting venue/visa/tour... liz...@csnet1.cs.tsinghua.edu.cn -- Alain, Yong ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] 4rd mapping rule separation
Mark Townsley wrote, on 08/21/2011 10:19 AM: It takes me about 30 seconds to describe at a high-level what 4rd is to someone who already understands ds-lite by referring to it as a stateless version of ds-lite. That's a good thing. To someone who already understands 6rd: 4rd is to IPv4 what 6rd is to IPv6. Simon -- DTN made easy, lean, and smart -- http://postellation.viagenie.ca NAT64/DNS64 open-source-- http://ecdysis.viagenie.ca STUN/TURN server -- http://numb.viagenie.ca ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] draft-murakami-softwire-4v6-translation
Dear Brian, Ahah, you seem to assume that A+P will solve the ISP's shortage of IPv4 addresses. That may be true for a year or three, but after that they will discover that they have to CGN their A+P customers, and then you have NAT444 after all, IMHO. I don't assume A+P an ultimate solution for IPv4 address sharing. I just think that certain ISPs will (be able) to use it. After all, considering 1024 ports per user, this means 1:64 sharing ratio, which is a lot compared to 1 IP per customer. If we forget about Internet of things, which will not be based on IPv4 anyway, I don't know many ISPs who could make their user base 64 times the size it is now. Of course, some will do, but they can then use dynamic port allocation. Also, even the userbase for an ISP gets this big, there is still no need for NAT444 in long term with careful planning. A CPE can support DS-Lite as well as stateless A+P mechanisms at the same time. It's not that complex to do this. And if it turns out A+P is not an option (any more), customer-by-customer migration to DS-Lite could be considered. Nejc ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] Softwire Interim Meeting in Beijing
Are there any plans to discuss solutions for multicast at the interim meeting? Thanks, Greg On Mon, Aug 22, 2011 at 3:57 AM, GangChen phdg...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Chairs, I suggest including draft-murakami-softwire-4v6-translation-00 into the agenda as well. We already had a presentation in last softwire meeting. It's reasonable to continue the discussion in the interim meeting Many thanks Gang 2011/8/19, Yong Cui cuiy...@tsinghua.edu.cn: Hi folks, We, softwire wg chairs, in agreement with our ADs, are announcing an interim meeting in Beijing on September 26 27. The date has been chosen adjacent to the BBF meeting in Shangai to minimize travel and visa issues. The interim meeting will focus on 'stateless' solutions in general and 4rd in particular. Expected outcome includes progress on 4rd spec, packet format, where to put IPv4 bits, port indications, DHCP option, tunneling vs translation, coexistence with other technologies, etc... --- Meeting Location recommended hotels Meeting venue: FIT Building, Tsinghua University, Beijing FIT Building is the first left building inside of the East Gate of Tsinghua Univeristy http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=202779846620144871057.0004aad8ce367b982 9372msa=0ll=39.996906,116.331664spn=0.004044,0.008798 Recommended hotels: 1. Uniscenter (4 stars, 3 min walk) http://en.uniscenter.com/newEbiz1/EbizPortalFG/portal/html/index.html 2. Wenjin Hotel (5 stars, 10 min walk) http://www.wenjin.com.cn/ 3. Royal King Hotel (5 stars, 10 min by car) http://www.royalkinghotel.com/ Invitation letter If you need an invitation letter, please send the following info to Ms. Ziye Li: liz...@csnet1.cs.tsinghua.edu.cn. Surname: Given Name: Company: Address: Phone: Passport Number: Passport Exp. Date: Passport Issuing Country: - Further contact information Please contact Ms. Ziye Li if you have any question about Beijing/Tsinghua/Hotel/Meeting venue/visa/tour... liz...@csnet1.cs.tsinghua.edu.cn -- Alain, Yong ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
[Softwires] Call for presentations for the interim meeting
As we mentioned earlier, the softwire interim meeting will focus on 'stateless solutions'. If you'd like to present there, please send the chairs a note by Friday this week. Alain. ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] draft-murakami-softwire-4v6-translation
Dear Cameron, some pressure. IMHO, i believe that static over-subscription ratios required by A+P will not meaningfully keep pace with the rapid growth in the number of internet nodes. I would be very happy if you elaborated on this. Can you give something to support this belief? Thanks, Nejc ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] draft-murakami-softwire-4v6-translation
Sure. The question is really whether its market share would be enough to justify the effort. But how can you know what the market share is? I mean, it's a trade-off between having a smaller sharing ratio and having better end-to-end (perhaps), direct CPE-CPE communication ... I say let's give ISPs more solutions to avail, so they can adopt the solution that suits their needs. If an average IPv4 user is consuming 200 ports (or whatever value you prefer to assume) with their favourite p2p app, that is what sets the number of IPv4 users per shared address. It's the number of simultaneous ports, not the amount of traffic, that counts. There was a thread on this list recently, which discussed a research on port reusage by applications: | For example, BitTorrent established five hundreds of sessions while | the port consumption was under a hundred in the first minute of the | communication, because when BitTorrent initiates a downloading, it | first uses the same source port to connect to the different | destinations (destination IP and port) therefore one source port | multiplexing different sessions. Skype is another example that uses | one source port to multiplex different sessions thereby |saving source | port consumptions on NAT. So I guess we have some reserves here as well. Nejc ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] Softwire Interim Meeting in Beijing
Thanks. I won't add to the agenda. The first pass had mcast on the list so I carved out time to be there. If it comes up I will attend. Or I suppose more to the point, if you don't want me there keep mcast off of the agenda. :) Cheers, Greg On Mon, Aug 22, 2011 at 8:40 AM, Alain Durand adur...@juniper.net wrote: So far, I'd like the focus to be on stateless. We will see by the end of the week (end of the call for presentation) if we have time for multicast. Alain. Sent from my iPad On Aug 22, 2011, at 10:57 AM, Greg Shepherd gjs...@gmail.com wrote: Are there any plans to discuss solutions for multicast at the interim meeting? Thanks, Greg On Mon, Aug 22, 2011 at 3:57 AM, GangChen phdg...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Chairs, I suggest including draft-murakami-softwire-4v6-translation-00 into the agenda as well. We already had a presentation in last softwire meeting. It's reasonable to continue the discussion in the interim meeting Many thanks Gang 2011/8/19, Yong Cui cuiy...@tsinghua.edu.cn: Hi folks, We, softwire wg chairs, in agreement with our ADs, are announcing an interim meeting in Beijing on September 26 27. The date has been chosen adjacent to the BBF meeting in Shangai to minimize travel and visa issues. The interim meeting will focus on 'stateless' solutions in general and 4rd in particular. Expected outcome includes progress on 4rd spec, packet format, where to put IPv4 bits, port indications, DHCP option, tunneling vs translation, coexistence with other technologies, etc... --- Meeting Location recommended hotels Meeting venue: FIT Building, Tsinghua University, Beijing FIT Building is the first left building inside of the East Gate of Tsinghua Univeristy http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=202779846620144871057.0004aad8ce367b982 9372msa=0ll=39.996906,116.331664spn=0.004044,0.008798 Recommended hotels: 1. Uniscenter (4 stars, 3 min walk) http://en.uniscenter.com/newEbiz1/EbizPortalFG/portal/html/index.html 2. Wenjin Hotel (5 stars, 10 min walk) http://www.wenjin.com.cn/ 3. Royal King Hotel (5 stars, 10 min by car) http://www.royalkinghotel.com/ Invitation letter If you need an invitation letter, please send the following info to Ms. Ziye Li: liz...@csnet1.cs.tsinghua.edu.cn. Surname: Given Name: Company: Address: Phone: Passport Number: Passport Exp. Date: Passport Issuing Country: - Further contact information Please contact Ms. Ziye Li if you have any question about Beijing/Tsinghua/Hotel/Meeting venue/visa/tour... liz...@csnet1.cs.tsinghua.edu.cn -- Alain, Yong ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] draft-murakami-softwire-4v6-translation
2011/8/22 Nejc Škoberne n...@skoberne.net: Dear Cameron, some pressure. IMHO, i believe that static over-subscription ratios required by A+P will not meaningfully keep pace with the rapid growth in the number of internet nodes. I would be very happy if you elaborated on this. Can you give something to support this belief? Easy math version assuming the entire internet moves to this model of stateless address sharing: 50 Billion Internet nodes [1] 240 Million IPv4 addresses [2] 208.3 devices per IPv4 address -- by dividing the above numbers 312.5 ports per user -- by dividing by 65k ports Not a perfect guesstimate on several levels since the internet is not uniform and does move to anything in a uniform, the numbers used above are suspect, and this is not an internet wide solution, some nodes may go IPv6 only, and so on ... but sometimes looking at numbers like this in the macroscopic view helps us understand our little part of the internet that we are trying to design a solution for. As stated, some providers may find a benefit here... I believe that is clear. My understanding is that in North America many of the incumbent land line providers have fairly static subscriber bases, not a lot of growth in users demanding IPv4. In my world (mobile), AFAIK approximately half of the service providers globally already do NAT44 / LSN / CGN. Areas of the internet that are experiencing or anticipate rapid growth (mobile, cloud, new ventures) in address consumption will likely not extend their existing addresses far with a stateless solution. Regards, Cameron [1] http://www.ericsson.com/thecompany/press/releases/2010/04/1403231 [2] http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3194 Thanks, Nejc ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
Re: [Softwires] Softwire Interim Meeting in Beijing
Dear Chairs: Are there any plans to discuss the MIBs at the interim meeting? According to our softwire WG milestones, our MIBs also need more discussions. Best Regards Yu -Original Message- From: softwires-boun...@ietf.org [mailto:softwires-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Alain Durand Sent: Monday, August 22, 2011 11:40 PM To: gjs...@gmail.com Cc: liziye; Ralph Droms (rdroms); Yong Cui; iesg-secret...@ietf.org; softwires@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Softwires] Softwire Interim Meeting in Beijing So far, I'd like the focus to be on stateless. We will see by the end of the week (end of the call for presentation) if we have time for multicast. Alain. Sent from my iPad On Aug 22, 2011, at 10:57 AM, Greg Shepherd gjs...@gmail.com wrote: Are there any plans to discuss solutions for multicast at the interim meeting? Thanks, Greg On Mon, Aug 22, 2011 at 3:57 AM, GangChen phdg...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Chairs, I suggest including draft-murakami-softwire-4v6-translation-00 into the agenda as well. We already had a presentation in last softwire meeting. It's reasonable to continue the discussion in the interim meeting Many thanks Gang 2011/8/19, Yong Cui cuiy...@tsinghua.edu.cn: Hi folks, We, softwire wg chairs, in agreement with our ADs, are announcing an interim meeting in Beijing on September 26 27. The date has been chosen adjacent to the BBF meeting in Shangai to minimize travel and visa issues. The interim meeting will focus on 'stateless' solutions in general and 4rd in particular. Expected outcome includes progress on 4rd spec, packet format, where to put IPv4 bits, port indications, DHCP option, tunneling vs translation, coexistence with other technologies, etc... --- Meeting Location recommended hotels Meeting venue: FIT Building, Tsinghua University, Beijing FIT Building is the first left building inside of the East Gate of Tsinghua Univeristy http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=202779846620144871057.0004aad8ce367b982 9372msa=0ll=39.996906,116.331664spn=0.004044,0.008798 Recommended hotels: 1. Uniscenter (4 stars, 3 min walk) http://en.uniscenter.com/newEbiz1/EbizPortalFG/portal/html/index.html 2. Wenjin Hotel (5 stars, 10 min walk) http://www.wenjin.com.cn/ 3. Royal King Hotel (5 stars, 10 min by car) http://www.royalkinghotel.com/ Invitation letter If you need an invitation letter, please send the following info to Ms. Ziye Li: liz...@csnet1.cs.tsinghua.edu.cn. Surname: Given Name: Company: Address: Phone: Passport Number: Passport Exp. Date: Passport Issuing Country: - Further contact information Please contact Ms. Ziye Li if you have any question about Beijing/Tsinghua/Hotel/Meeting venue/visa/tour... liz...@csnet1.cs.tsinghua.edu.cn -- Alain, Yong ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
[Softwires] Comments on draft-qin-softwire-dslite-multicast-04
Hi all, In IETF-81, the chairs asked the authors of different drafts on multicast sit together to discuss and compromise. So we did. Here are some comments on draft-qin-softwire-dslite-multicast-04. Overall: if this is to be a Standards Track document, the whole document has to be reviewed, the normative parts identified, and requirements language substituted for the current descriptive language. Section 1: Editorial: at the end of the second paragraph, vastly consumed reads better in English as: consumed in vast quantities. Substantive: add the following to the sentence making up the third paragraph: ..., which prevents these consequences by making use of the native multicast capabilities of the intervening IPv6 network. Section 2: Terminology: Multicast AFTR has connotations (IPv4 NAT) that simply aren't there. Suggestion: Multicast Transitional Border Gateway (mTBG). Substantive(?): In the description of the Multicast B4, it would make more sense to change ... which is able to enforce ... to ... which implements Section 3.2: Bullet 1: the second sentence jams two unrelated ideas together. It needs a little expansion to read properly. The next sentence doesn't make sense within the stated scope of the bullet and shouldn't be there. The suggested changed text is thus: A viable scenario for this use case in DS-Lite environment: customers with legacy receivers must continue to access the IPv4-enabled multicast services. This means the traffic should be accessed through IPv4 and additional functions are needed to traverse the operator's IPv6- enabled network. It is the purpose of this document to describe those functions. Refer to [I-D.jaclee-behave- v4v6-mcast-ps] for the deployment considerations. Final paragraph: don't you need a final sentence saying something like: Depending on the specific details of the contract, this may mean that the specific framing of the content packets (as IPv4 packets) must be preserved along with the content within that framing. Section 4: First paragraph: the following sentences need to be added after the first one to give a full picture of what is required for a solution: For multicast, in contrast, separate mechanisms are required to process the outgoing multicast signalling packets and the incoming packets of content. The multicast signalling needs to be interworked to IPv6 and processed as IPv6 signalling. For incoming multicast content, this document defines ... Middle paragraph: why doesn't it simply read: See Section 4.3 for multicast distribution tree establishment and Section 4.4 for multicast traffic forwarding. Section 4.2 Third paragraph typo: mPrefixe64 - mPrefix64 Section 4.3 Bullets: it makes no sense to embed the mAFTR in the MLD Querier. That would cause the native IPv6 multicast infrastructure to be bypassed. It is also inconsistent with the architectural figure. Delete the first bullet and merge the second one with the next paragraph, like this: The mAFTR should process the received PIMv6 Join message for the IPv4-embedded IPv6 group and send the corresponding IPv4 PIM Join message. It creates an entry for the IPv6 multicast group address in its multicast Routing Information Base. This entry is used to forward ... Section 4.5 It is not clear whether the final paragraph is talking about the mB4+B4 or the mAFTR+AFTR or both. In fact, it makes good sense to combine the mB4 and the B4, but combining the AFTR and mAFTR would be questionable for reasons of scalability. There may be routing issues to sort out regarding reachability of the IPv4 prefix that is shared by the source -- the multicast routers should choose the path leading through the mAFTR rather than the one going through the AFTR. No more comments up to section 7. Maybe more comments from section 7 onwards in a separate E-mail. Regards, Tina ___ Softwires mailing list Softwires@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/softwires
