date:20060626

does anyone know if a regular 2'x1.5' satellite dish (primestar i think)
will work for a solar collector? i was thinking about using it to heat my BD
via exchanger. (maybe borrow the steam pump with check valves idea...) i am
going to try and layer it with tinfoil to begin with, then depending on
wether or not that works i want to drop a hot water coil into my little BD
reactor (1.5L)
Jason
ICQ#:  154998177
MSN:  [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me)



-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.4/375 - Release Date: 6/25/2006


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Class Warfare: The Minimum Wage Goes Down

2006-06-26 Thread Doug Younker

I just can't recall when, but the following was from an episode of the 
Religion and Ethics program aired on PBS during a past Congressional 
debate on the minimum wage.  I recall the term used was just wage. 
Problem is that here in the USA such criteria is labeled communist, 
instead of Christian.
-- 
Doug, N0LKK
Kansas USA inc.


 BUSINESS EXECUTIVES
  FOR ECONOMIC
  JUSTICE

   Criteria For Determining
   Whether A Wage Is Just


  1.You cannot assume a wage is just
because someone is willing to accept
it.

  2.The lowest full-time paid person at a
company ought to be properly
compensated to allow the person a
standard of living consistent with
human dignity.

  3.Your primary obligation is managing
the company as a going concern for
the benefit of all the stakeholders
(investors, employees, customers, and
community), recognizing that these
are not mutually exclusive.

  4.The right of all employees of the
company to earn a living wage is at
least as important as the right of
owners/investors to earn a reasonable
rate of return on their investment in
the company.

  5.If the above four criteria are met:
   Owners/investors, since they risk
   their capital, are justified in
   earning a higher level of
   compensation than generally
   prevails among their employees.
   Managers are also justified in
   earning a higher level of
   compensation, because of their
   assumed responsibility, level of
   talent, and experience.


 For more information, write to:
 Business Executives For Economic Justice
 711 W. Monroe St.
 Chicago, IL 60661



-- 
Doug, N0LKK
Kansas USA inc.

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Statistics

2006-06-26 Thread Angela Perez Linde

Hi Richard!
I`ve read that you knew some website about production and statistics of 
biodiesel in Europe. Could you help me and send me some of this website?
Thanks very much!
I`m sorry but Ì don`t know anything about this in USA.


From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Statistics
Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2006 23:20:21 -0400

Thanks, Fererico
 
  From: Centro de Asistencia Tecnica A. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Date: 2006/06/20 Tue PM 02:35:54 EDT
  To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Statistics
 
 
  Richard:
 
  Maybe you can find something on biodesel use in the USA at the
  Environmental Information Administration http://www.eia.doe.gov/
 
  Federico
 
  -Mensaje original-
  De: rradzik [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Enviado el: Martes, 20 de Junio de 2006 09:31 a.m.
  Para: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
  Asunto: [Biofuel] Statistics
 
  Can anyone direct me to a website that could provide biodiesel
  production
  and usage statistics for the USA?  I was able to locate information on
  Europe, but not the USA.
 
  Richard
 
 
 
 
  ___
  Biofuel mailing list
  Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
  http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.or
  g
 
  Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
  http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 
  Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
  messages):
  http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 
 
  ___
  Biofuel mailing list
  Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
  
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
  Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
  http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 
  Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
messages):
  http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 
 


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/


_
Descarga gratis la Barra de Herramientas de MSN 
http://www.msn.es/usuario/busqueda/barra?XAPID=2031DI=1055SU=http%3A//www.hotmail.comHL=LINKTAG1OPENINGTEXT_MSNBH


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Class Warfare: The Minimum Wage Goes Down

2006-06-26 Thread John Mullan

I believe that either economic model (communist or capitalist) is 
destined to collapse, sooner or later.  One of the main factors being 
greed.  Greed is what causes inflation.  Companies are driven to make 
more profit.  People need more income to purchase the higher priced 
items they need AND want (ie; form of greed).

In my area, I know many people earning minimum wage (Canada) and even 
simple one-room apartments tax their ability to have any disposable 
income.  But there are also many companies that would be hard pressed to 
increase their prices such as to pay significantly more than minimum 
wage and still have a decent customer base.

Add to the picture the coming death of cheap energy and the picture 
becomes even more bleak.

Economic crash and the re-issue of currency has happened before and has 
to happen again.  To survive, eliminate your debt and try desperately to 
own all your property out-right.

Just my two-cents worth.

Cheers,
John


Doug Younker wrote:

I just can't recall when, but the following was from an episode of the 
Religion and Ethics program aired on PBS during a past Congressional 
debate on the minimum wage.  I recall the term used was just wage. 
Problem is that here in the USA such criteria is labeled communist, 
instead of Christian.
  



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] satellite dish collectors

2006-06-26 Thread Ken Provost


On Jun 25, 2006, at 10:51 PM, Jason Katie wrote:

 does anyone know if a regular 2'x1.5' satellite dish
 (primestar i think) will work for a solar collector?


Pretty small -- 300 watts of insolation at best. Figure a typical
small stove burner  puts out 1000 watts at least. Now one of
those early satellite dishes five feet in diameter would catch
a LOT of rays

-K

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Never seen wash problem

2006-06-26 Thread Joe Street

Hi Andrew;

Is the water you used conditioned by a water softener?

Joe

Tonomár András wrote:

 Dear List members,
  
  
 I need your ideas of what went worng with my washing
 I make 45 l batches for almost a year now and I have only had minor 
 emulsion problems
 in the first wash that I could handle pretty good with hot water or some 
 vinegar.
  
 I make BD from WVO with 2 stage base - base, and I stir wash it all the 
 time.
  
 Today morning I started to do the 5th (last wash) on my batch.
 the previous (4th) wash water was see through but not chrystal clear.
 The fuel handeled stir washing very well - long time, and even high rpm.
  
 As I stired for the 5th what I got was a thick emulsion.
 I am shocked
  
 The wash water is from the household water heater, ph 7 and around 60 deg C
  
 Overall tempreture of the mix is around 35 - 40 deg C.
  
 The emulsion separated in a couple hours and as I drained the wash water
 a brown layer remained on the inside wall of the wash tank. This looks 
 like rust
 But it is not rust
  
 I just don't get it. Do you???
  
 Never ever had such a problem before.
 Any ideas?
  
 Thanks
 Andrew
 
 
 
 
 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 
 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Statistics

2006-06-26 Thread Lugano Wilson

hi Angela, try this EU page you find lots of policy on REs and country reports on the developments http://ec.europa.eu/energy/res/legislation/electricity_en.htmLuganoAngela Perez Linde [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  Hi Richard!I`ve read that you knew some website about production and statistics of biodiesel in Europe. Could you help me and send me some of this website?Thanks very much!I`m sorry but Ì don`t know anything about this in USA.From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Reply-To: biofuel@sustainablelists.orgTo: Subject: Re: [Biofuel] StatisticsDate: Tue, 20 Jun 2006
 23:20:21 -0400Thanks, Fererico   From: "Centro de Asistencia Tecnica A." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  Date: 2006/06/20 Tue PM 02:35:54 EDT  To:   Subject: Re: [Biofuel] StatisticsRichard:   Maybe you can find something on biodesel use in the USA at the  Environmental Information Administration http://www.eia.doe.gov/   Federico   -Mensaje original-  De: rradzik [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Enviado el: Martes, 20 de Junio de 2006 09:31 a.m.  Para: biofuel@sustainablelists.org  Asunto: [Biofuel] Statistics   Can anyone direct me to a website that could provide biodiesel  production  and usage statistics for the USA? I was able to locate information
 on  Europe, but not the USA.   Richard  ___  Biofuel mailing list  Biofuel@sustainablelists.org  http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.or  g   Biofuel at Journey to Forever:  http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html   Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000  messages):  http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/___  Biofuel mailing list  Biofuel@sustainablelists.org  http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org   Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
  http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html   Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):  http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/  ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/_Descarga gratis la Barra de Herramientas de MSN
 http://www.msn.es/usuario/busqueda/barra?XAPID=2031DI=1055SU=http%3A//www.hotmail.comHL=LINKTAG1OPENINGTEXT_MSNBH___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ 
		How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messengers low  PC-to-Phone call rates.___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil consumption seen soaring

The bottom line is that the world has to go Hydrogen.

Every once in a while we find a post that challenges years of research and 
discussion and asks everyone to take a giant step back and re-examine ideas on 
a particular issue long after a consensus has been reached, as if we've missed 
something.

Even though it's discouraging, I would be willing to re-examine an issue 
if new evidence reveals itself. In fact, I would consider it crucial.

But, what's most discouraging is when a forum discusses energy strategy 
for years, realizes that a comprehensive energy strategy will involve 
numerous schemes for renewable energy and biofuels, then finds a post in 
that forum that includes a statement to the effect of: The answer is

The oil industry has made us dependent on it, even when it's not the 
best source of energy for a given application. It has brought men to 
power who have influenced the highest levels of government to ensure 
that competitive alternatives are squashed. We've learned that a single 
energy source which fosters a dependence on it due to the exclusivity of 
the raw materials or technologies, provides a substitute for our current 
dependency on oil. At it's worst, we know that such a dependency brings 
to power those who will encourage a government to help them exploit or 
even militarily control other countries.

Although I keep an open mind toward all energy technologies (including 
hydrogen), I encourage you not to place all importance on one.


-Redler

Mike Weaver wrote:
 You all know perfectly well the answer is Dilithium Crystals.  No 
 arguments, please.

 robert and benita rabello wrote:

   
 chem.dd wrote:

  

 
 The bottom line is that the world has to go Hydrogen.



   
Are you SURE you want to go there in this forum?  I'd be laughing if 
 your proposition wasn't so sad.

 robert luis rabello
 The Edge of Justice
 Adventure for Your Mind
 http://www.newadventure.ca

 Ranger Supercharger Project Page
 http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/
 


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Help needed!

2006-06-26 Thread Thomas Kelly

Charles,
 I think an oil burner can tolerate impurities. The problem is that 
you may have to make some minor modifications. The problem I had, and, I 
think, you as well, was that we were burning inferior fuel w/o any 
modifications to the burner. I think that glycerides in the fuel (from 
incomplete reactions) at low temp and pressure can coke up nozzles and 
electrodes.

 I have a Beckett AF burner  --- baseboard hot water for heat  +  the 
furnace (boiler) has a coil that supplies domestic hot water. I think any 
burner can burn BD. I don't think it has to be the high quality BD I use in 
my car, but lower quality fuel may require some adjustments..
I put a T in my fuel line, as you have said you plan to do   be sure 
to use flare fittings rather than compression fittings. I've gone to all 
brass, heavy duty valves ... again flare fittings. I have a cartridge fuel 
filter in both the line from the main tank as well as in the line from the 
experimental (now 100% BD) tank.
***I ran about 1 foot (~30cm) of the copper tube from the BD tank up the 
pipe that carries hot water from the boiler to the circulator to heat my 
house. The copper tubing then runs down the same pipe back to the T in the 
line. I wrapped the tubing and pipe w. insulation. The water inside the pipe 
is 160 - 180F (71 - 82C). As long as my heat is on the BD is preheated 
passively.
 I put a pressure gauge on my pump and increased pressure from 100psi to 
125psi. I changed from a
1.0 gallon/hour nozzle to a 0.75 gph nozzle.
 Make sure that air cannot get in the furnace/boiler through any 
openings  use furnace cement if necessary. Ex: I could see light  (from 
the flame) coming out bolt holes in my burner gasket  sealed them shut. 
Don't seal inspection port  you'll want to check flame and for smoke.
  I also had to decrease air flow. On my burner there are two adjustment 
bands. One is closed for 100% BD while the other is partly open.
   I installed a Webster Bio Pump (viton seals -- BD compatible). The 
pump on the burner worked fine all winter, but I had concerns about 
biodiesel causing the seal to eventually leak. Bio-Pump   ~ $75 US; very 
easy to install on my burner (drop in).

 I recently made a batch of BD that failed the methanol quality test; 
about 75L (20 gal). It burned fine in the boiler with the above 
modifications (w/o the pre-heating).
 I have been experimenting with adding Free Fatty Acids (FFAs) to the BD 
in my heating system. They seemed to burn fine (~5% FFAs : 95%BD) until the 
warm weather came, my heating system was off, and the mix was no longer 
being pre-heated. I got some coking.

 My point is that for heating purposes you probably don't need high 
quality BD. You probably will have to make some minor adjustments to your 
system  ...  pre-heating the fuel and/or changing pressure/nozzles/air flow.
 Knowing how to test the quality of your fuel is still valuable. The 
methanol test is quick and cheap. That, along w. some tweaking of the 
process (increase temp  a few degrees/ time by 15 minutes) you will improve 
fuel quality. It is possible to make BD that passes the quality test w/o any 
serious inconvenience or increased cost. In the mean time less than perfect 
fuel should work fine in the boiler.
   Best of luck,
Tom
- Original Message - 
From: Charles List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Sunday, June 25, 2006 8:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Help needed!


 Hi Tom

 As a further aside- I am, of course, trying to make the best
 biodiesel i can, but what % of impurities (ie methanol test failure)
 did you burner put up with? I'm down to 10% with my 1l trial runs now
 as I tweak the process for my creamy canola.

 Charles


 On 22/06/2006, at 12:20 AM, Thomas Kelly wrote:

 Charles,
 I did as you plan to   put a T in the line so I could have
 a small
 experimental tank, and gradually increased BD conc.  Had no
 problem until
 about 50 - 60% BD. Some minor adjustments to the burner at that point.
 An interesting development: The shut off valves in the line
 apparently
 have a rubber or plastic seal. The valve from the large tank (30%
 biodiesel
 : 70% petro) is fine. The valve from the smaller tank (100% BD) is
 dripping.
  gives me something to do this morning.
 Tom

 - Original Message -
 From: Charles List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 5:25 PM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Help needed!


 Hi Tom

 Many thanks for the advice. I will let you know how I get on.
 I intend (hopefully) to run B100 in my boiler. I was planning to ask
 about the adjustments I will have to make! I have set up a T-piece on
 the fuel feed so I can try small amount of different % to see how
 I go.

 Best

 Charles

 On 21/06/2006, at 2:30 AM, Thomas Kelly

Re: [Biofuel] Never seen wash problem

2006-06-26 Thread Tonomár András





  Hello Tom,
  
  Thanks for your ideas.
  I always do a wash test prior to the first wash. 
  I usea 0,5l pet bottle and half - half BD, water.
  I shake the hell out of it. Since my early test 
  batches, my fuel always passes the test with great result.
  
  the same was with this particular problem 
  batch.
  
  Since then I have finished the batch. Here are 
  the results:
  
  After that failed 5th wash I conducted 3 more 
  washes with excellent separation(intensive stir wash)
  But. on the wall of the wash thank there is some 
  kind of brown powder like layer which was not there before, and the wash water 
  is also clear but has a light brown color.
  
  I suspect it to be rust but how The wash 
  tank was neat and clean before.
  BD is a good anti rust anyway.
  
  After drying I cleand the wash tank and it is 
  shynie again. 
  My only thought is that there was too much 
  chlorid is the water system. 
  
  But what is the brown powder???
  
  I think I will not use this BD in my car (VW 
  PDTDI)rather I will put it into the forklift.
  
  My next batch is on the way I hope that there 
  will be no problems with that one.
  
  greetings,
  Andrew
  
  
  
  
  
  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Thomas 
  Kelly 
  To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  
  Sent: Saturday, June 24, 2006 4:04 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Never seen wash 
  problem
  
  Andrew,
   Did you do a wash 
  test ("shake test") before washing the biodiesel?
   Do you perform 
  quality tests on your biodiesel?
  (See JTF: "Quality Testing")
  
   An emulsion at any point 
  in the wash, even "minor emulsion problems in the 
  first wash that I could handle pretty good with hot water or some 
  vinegar." suggest processing problems. I lean towards incomplete 
  reactions, as glycerinecontamination and soaps produced during the 
  reaction would produce emulsions or a thick soap layerin the wash 
  test.
   I've only had emulsions 
  occur in the wash, after having good wash test results, when I've had 
  incomplete reactions (BD failed quality tests).
  
   The problem may be an incomplete reaction. 
  Quality test will tell.
   Why did it show up in 
  5th wash, not first or second 
  I could only speculate.
  
   Let me know how the 
  quality test goes, 
   
  Tom
  
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
Tonomár 
András 
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org 

Sent: Friday, June 23, 2006 12:58 
PM
Subject: [Biofuel] Never seen wash 
problem


Dear List members,
 I need your ideas of 
what went worng with my washing
I make 45 l batches for almost a year now and I 
have only had minor emulsion problems 
in the first wash that I could handle pretty 
good with hot water or some vinegar.
I make BD from WVO with 2 stage base - base, 
and I stir wash it all the time.

Today morning I started to do the 5th (last 
wash) on my batch.
the previous (4th) wash water was see through 
but not chrystal clear.
The fuel handeled stir washing very well - long 
time, and even high rpm.

As I stired for the 5th what I got was a thick 
emulsion.
I am shocked

The wash water is from the household water 
heater, ph 7 and around 60 deg C

Overall tempreture of the mix is around 35 - 40 
deg C.

The emulsion separated in a couple hours and as 
I drained the wash water 
a brown layer remained on the inside wall of 
the wash tank. This looks like rust
But it is not rust

I just don't get it. Do you???

Never ever had such a problem 
before.
Any ideas?

Thanks
Andrew



___Biofuel mailing 
listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel 
at Journey to 
Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the 
combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
  
  

  ___Biofuel mailing 
  listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel 
  at Journey to 
  Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the 
  combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
  messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

From memory this is the same basics as the
Daimler Puch system and has no injector pump. Please let me know if I am out
here. This engine was known as the Styre and mostly run in boats (14+ years of
operations in Australia) Macintyre engineering from memory were the Australian
agents for this engine in marine applications.

There are now many variants of this engine design.
The latest being two injections per firing stroke controlled by the many sensors
on the engine, all operated by a central PCM.

Doug

- Original Message -
From:
Kirk
McLoren
To: biofuel
Sent: Monday, June 26, 2006 11:20
AM
Subject: [Biofuel] diesel injector

http://www.rexresearch.com/kukler/kukler.htm
Ronald KUKLER
Diesel Injector

www.greendieselcorp.com
--- email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.tritonfoundation.org.au
---
A hydraulically operated, super-high pressure diesel
injector, installed in place of the standard injector, that produces 30%
higher pressure, consumes 30% less fuel, and reduces pollution. It is expected
to retail for ~ $1000.
Ron Kukler: "A 2-stage hydraulic/electronic fuel delivery
system creates extremely high injection pressures of 160,000 psi compared to
about 23,000 psi for traditional coon rail injection systems. Fuel-injected at
higher pressure results in a much cleaner combustion process and a multitude
of benefits evident in the much-improved engine performance figures".
The system has been tested for durability by Prof. Eric
Milkins (Dept. Mechanical Engineering, Melbourne University) for over 10,000
hours.
From www.greendieselcorp.com: "Existing diesel common rail
systems cost approx. 25% of engine cost. Green Diesel's fuel system costs
approx. 3% of engine cost. We do not use a complicated and expensive high
pressure pump, and our electrics are simple.
Existing engine management systmes will operate
satisfactorily with Green Diesel's fuel system. Millions of dollars and
thousands of professional man-hours have already been invested in our produce.
We have engaged university scholars, national award winning professionals,
engineers, doctors of mechanical engineering and experienced technicians
utilizing thermodynamic laboratory facilities, dynamometers, flue-gas
analyzers, particulate tunnel testing and wolf sensors in conjunction with
Melbourne University's own Combustion Analysis in Real Time (CART) computer
program.
Testing results to date: Dramatic increase in horse power,
dramatic increase in torque, band width, and durability, reduction in specific
fuel consumption and in all pollutants, and dramatic reduction in cost,
simplicity, noise, vibration, weight and size.

Want to be your own boss? Learn how on Yahoo!
Small Business.

___Biofuel mailing
listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel
at Journey to
Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the
combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Information from NOD32 This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus
System for Linux Mail Servers. - is OK part000.txt -
is OK part001.htm - is OK part001.txt - is
OKhttp://www.eset.com

Information from NOD32
This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus System for Linux Mail Servers.
part000.txt - is OK
part000.txt -> MIME -> part000.txt - is OK
part001.htm - is OK
http://www.eset.com

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil consumption seen soaring

Re: Nuclear Power

One aspect of nuclear power which concerns me (in addition to the 
overwhelming number of reasons not to support it) is the less publicized 
situation it creates in terms of ROI. There is a huge investment put 
into construction and decommission then, an equally huge amount of 
political pressure to keep it running as long as possible - not only to 
recover those investments but, to improve upon the the gains and 
advocate further use of that technology. That translates to risk vs. 
profit and forces the public to trust those who are making the decisions 
(i.e. those who are profiting).

- Redler


I am the decider
- G. W. Bush

Mike Weaver wrote:
 chem.dd,

 Have a look at what Chernobyl is like now.  It's not like you really get a 
 second chance when you screw up with nuclear.

 FWIW, I think if you had started your post with:  Here are examples of 
 nulclear power working successfully; the problems
 that caused Three Mile Island and Chernobyl are now solved - here's the 
 proof: (insert proof) perhaps it merits a second look for these reasons 
 1,2,3, you would have had a better response.  You mention 
 scientific and engineering but then no examples or research.  I think you set 
 yourself up to get hammered.
 And no, I personally don't think nuclear power is a good option, but would 
 read a well-constructed post as to why I'm wrong.

 -Weaver


 scientific and engineering, as opposed to the politically correct view, the
 use of nuclear energy is the solution. ( Please don't scream Three Mile
 Island and Chernobyl) Fission reactors will have to do until we develop a
 functional fusion reactor which is by its physics inherently safe.
 Please let me know your thoughts on this.





 jtcava wrote:

   
 I'm getting the idea that I wouldn't want many of the people here on 
 this online comunity anywhere near me when sh*t happens.
 It is my outlook that everybody has something to offer in a true 
 survival situation.

 John

 Keith Addison wrote:

 
 I would think this is the ideal forum for discussing any aspects and 
 options
 for reducing our dependence on fossil fuels, particularly in terms of
 sustainability.


 
 Indeed it is, as a great deal of previous discussion residing in the 
 list archives will attest, covering, I'm sure, all aspects of the 
 issue.

  

   
 What is truly sad is closed mindedness.


 
 Wouldn't you think, David, that's it's perhaps a little closed-minded 
 to arrive at a mature forum such as this and just naturally assume 
 such an obvious subject hasn't been dealt with here before in the 
 last six years? I think the reason Robert would be laughing if only 
 it wasn't so sad is that your argument has had all the substance shot 
 right out of it long ago.

 It's also a little closed-minded to to assume that it's Robert who's 
 being closed-minded, apparently without checking first to see what he 
 might have posted on the subject before, or even checking his 
 website, though he provides the url. This, eg:
 http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/p5.htm
 Ranger Supercharger Project

 Maybe you owe him an apology.

 I have to say the same for your views on nuclear power:

 From an objective
  

   
 scientific and engineering, as opposed to the politically correct view, the
 use of nuclear energy is the solution. ( Please don't scream Three Mile
 Island and Chernobyl) Fission reactors will have to do until we develop a
 functional fusion reactor which is by its physics inherently safe.
 Please let me know your thoughts on this.


 
 That argument has also been shot down thoroughly and many times.

 I find it a little sad the way you ascribe objections to nuclear 
 power to mere politically correctness. Not objective, eh, no facts?

 I suggest you go and do some reading, offlist, at the address listed 
 at the end of every message you receive from the list:

  

   
 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/


 
 When you've done that (make sure you do a thorough job), please come 
 back and offer some support for your view that objections to nuclear 
 power have only political correctness to support them.

 Thankyou.

 Best wishes

 Keith Addison
 Journey to Forever
 KYOTO Pref., Japan
 http://journeytoforever.org/
 Biofuel list owner


   


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

[Biofuel] Question about using WVO in Ethanol still

2006-06-26 Thread Dwight HoganCamp

I am planning to build a still to to fuel my gas powered vehicles.

Some of the material I have been reading talks about salvaging the 
burner from an old gas water heater to use gas as
a heat source for a still.

Is it possible to salvage the burner from an oil hot water heater, and 
fuel it with WVO?  What pitfalls would I encounter
with this approach?

Thanks in advance for any ideas you may have.

Dwight




___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

[Biofuel] Mailing in your vote

2006-06-26 Thread D. Mindock




http://eatthestate.org/10-20/MailingItDemocracy.htm

 You'd think that something as 
fundamental to democracy as honest elections
would not be placed in jeopardy, seemingly 
intentionally,with no input from the masses.
There is no voter in his right mind that'd be in favor of 
the systems that are so open to
fraud that arebeing forced onto us. The 
Repugs are institutionalizing the systems that
couldkeep them in power forever. They don't need to 
control all the votes, just enough to
always be able to give thema slightedge in the 
electoral college count. That way they can maintain
control,i.e. always win,and give an appearance 
of legitimacy. Of course, as the disparity
between exit polls and the final count continues, and 
perhaps even grows over the years, 
it'll become painfully apparent to every man, 
woman, and dog that there is pure fraud 
occurring. (Robert F Kennedy's studyclearly shows it 
already is.) By then the neo-con
Repugs won't even care, their control will be so 
overwhelming. Voter turnout will become 
virtually nonexistant. 
 The election in November could be the 
last gasp of democracy. Peace, D. Mindock
P.S. I saw part of Kennedy's "Who Owns Nature" talk. He 
reminds me a lot of Joseph
Campbell in his cadence, spirit,and instant recall. 
He scours the administration of Dubya and
cronies better than anyone I've seen so far. It's a 
must-see. He'd make an excellent
president! We progessives couldhave another great 
candidate, if he'd only run.




  
  
Mailing It 
  In: Democracy in the Age of Convenience and 
  Technologyby Gentry Lange 
  By the time you read this, the King County Council will have 
  fundamentally altered the way we vote as a county. The proposal to change 
  our voting system, put forth by Council Executive Ron Sims, will close all 
  but a handful of the poll sites around the county, forcing most voters to 
  vote by mail (VBM). On Election Day, if you do go to one 
  of the few polls left open, you will find that you are voting on a brand 
  new Diebold TSX touch screen voting machine.
  Many readers are probably aware of the controversy surrounding 
  Diebold's voting machines, also called Direct Recording Electronic (DRE) 
  machines. For several years, thousands of activists across the nation have 
  worked to document the problems encountered with DREs, and there is a 
  massive amount of evidence that these machines are insecure and 
  unreliable. But more alarmingly, due to the network capability of 
  computers, DREs enable vote fraud on a scale never before possible.
  Fundamentally, the problem with touch screen voting machines is not 
  just that they suck at accurately counting votes. The deeper problem is 
  these machines remove the voting process from public control by making the 
  computer software that counts votes into a trade secret owned by private 
  companies and never inspected by public eyes.
  Absentee voting systems encounter this same problem in a different 
  form. Voting by mail removes the physical control over the ballots from 
  "the people"; voting on computers removes the ethereal control of the 
  software counting the votes. The underlying problem in both systems is 
  really that corporations are given far too much control of our election 
  system.
  However, the solution to this controversy is simple. We need to return 
  to the system of precinct-level hand-audited elections using paper 
  ballots. The precinct system has always proven to be the least prone to 
  fraud. It doesn't take a mathematical genius or a computer programmer to 
  understand, and it builds democracy and community through civic 
  interaction with your neighbors. In fact, many nations still hand count 
  entire national elections, including Germany, Switzerland and Canada.
  The precinct system uses low-tech means to run highly accurate and 
  publicly trusted elections. When I go to a polling place, I sign in, then 
  I vote in private, in a booth or behind a curtain, and then I deposit my 
  ballot into a ballot box. Anyone who wishes to witness the process is 
  allowed to, provided there is enough space in the room, and after the 
  polls close the ballots are then counted on-site. Then the results are 
  posted publicly at the precinct before totals are submitted to the county 
  or state.
  It is not just the secret ballot that is secret. The whole process is 
  made secret using a poll-based voting system. The polling place makes the 
  secret ballot possible and discourages other types of fraud. This system 
  discourages vote rigging, and greatly reduces potential electioneering by 
  corporate or private interests. It is much harder to fake your identity in 
  person in

Re: [Biofuel] satellite dish collectors

Yeah, I'd go for a larger one -- more energy collection. I think the larger ones are also tracking? wherease the current generation satellit dishes are fixed.On 6/26/06, 
Ken Provost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Jun 25, 2006, at 10:51 PM, Jason Katie wrote: does anyone know if a regular 2'x1.5' satellite dish (primestar i think) will work for a solar collector?Pretty small -- 300 watts of insolation at best. Figure a typical
small stove burnerputs out 1000 watts at least. Now one ofthose early satellite dishes five feet in diameter would catcha LOT of rays-K___Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
Biofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] satellite dish collectors

2006-06-26 Thread lres1

It may be of interest to do a search on low heat transfer generators. Also
Solar ponds. This is where a very heavy brine is in the bottom layers of a
square sided pond and very fresh water is on top, that is about a meter per
layer. Under the brine layer is laid black alkathine pipes and black heat
absorption material to transfer the heat to the tubes. A very effective
solar collector of heat and no conversion as the heat is there.

http://www.members.optusnet.com.au/~cliff.hignett/solar/

Was so easy to make and run but it needed more funding, guess what got in
the way as with so many alternative fuels. The particular pond I was
fleetingly associated with ran part of the vineyard at times.

The heat exchanger on the ponds was a real marvel and for such large ponds
was very small, could all but easily be carried by one person. I was to
believe that the money was in the sale of the exchanger in the end not the
ponds. However as time goes by and Israel and other countries that were
developing such ponds might be back on line.

Initially for generation of power the ponds were using a CFC, thus the low
boiling point for equivalent in super steam power. As to heating systems,
there is no reason why these ponds can not be used for heat generation using
water with an anti freeze/lubricant as the basis.

Doug

- Original Message - 
From: Jason Katie [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Monday, June 26, 2006 12:51 PM
Subject: [Biofuel] satellite dish collectors


 does anyone know if a regular 2'x1.5' satellite dish (primestar i think)
 will work for a solar collector? i was thinking about using it to heat my
BD
 via exchanger. (maybe borrow the steam pump with check valves idea...) i
am
 going to try and layer it with tinfoil to begin with, then depending on
 wether or not that works i want to drop a hot water coil into my little BD
 reactor (1.5L)
 Jason
 ICQ#:  154998177
 MSN:  [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me)



 -- 
 No virus found in this outgoing message.
 Checked by AVG Free Edition.
 Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.4/375 - Release Date: 6/25/2006


 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/



  Information from NOD32 
 This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus System for Linux Mail Servers.
   part000.txt - is OK
 http://www.eset.com



 Information from NOD32 
This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus System for Linux Mail Servers.
  part000.txt - is OK
http://www.eset.com

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

[Biofuel] An Inconvenient Truth

2006-06-26 Thread Joe Street

I saw the movie on Friday evening. Lots of great factoids for those who 
are not in the know about global warming.  The presentation is such that 
I don't see how anyone could not be persuaded.  I thought that was very 
encouraging.  Al Gore has so much of an opportunity to reach a large 
audience.

Joe


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Biofuel International seminar In BRASIL :Food Vs Fuel.

2006-06-26 Thread Juan Boveda

Hello Pannirselvam.
I went to that page using the link you gave us.
It has links to some acrobat files after I downloaded I discovered they 
were the programs for the conference.
Some of them I find interesting.
Unluckily, I could not find the works published there.
Do you know if there will be some of the lectures or works available in the 
near future for online downloading?
I do not have much trouble with Portuguese as I discovered, it is ease to 
read for me since Spanish is very similar
Best Regards.

Juan
Pilar - Paraguay


-Mensaje original-
De: pan ruti [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Enviado el: viernes 23 de junio de 2006 9:08
Para:   biofuel@sustainablelists.org; gpecufrn
Asunto: [Biofuel] Biofuel International seminar In BRASIL :Food Vs Fuel.

   I have participated  6 -8 July  very well organized seminar  on the 
distributed energy system and biofuel .The  conference proceeding are 
available  in Portuguese language in the following  links..
  http://www.nipeunicamp.org.br/agrener2006/tematicas.htm

  Mostly the developed world has participated , mainly from Europe also 
from south and Central America , Venezuela, Cuba.

  Even though it is possible the less developed country can produce  the 
bio ethanol , half the price , some country in the the Europe is making 
this from wheat  and  beet sugar.The same is also the case for the BioD, 
making fuel from food  soya beans and canola


  The true sustainable small scale biofuel is an experimental stages for 
the Amazonian areas. There is found to be lack of  not only biofuel , but 
also the food.The rich place need an integrated food , feed and biofuel.

 Any of the  conventional  electrical system is found to be not 
 sustainable to the areas. Biomass energy  can be the system appropriate to 
this areas.The Brazilian  EMBRAPA, the agroresearch center has come up 
using novel , simple pyrolysis  of vegetable oils  to make biofuel  and has 
shown to be more  appropriate to this areas.

If any in remote rural area like Amazonian rain forest is from our 
Biofuel list members , it is possible we can  come out all together  to 
make  some new biofuel , which  need to be very simple and practical , as 
the aces to this place are very difficult and the value of the fuel are 10 
time more  normal price and yet not available.
  I expect help from our list members from Malaysia and other remote place.

  sd
  Pannirselvam P.V
  www.gpechp.cjb.net





___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] satellite dish collectors

2006-06-26 Thread Dwight HoganCamp

Zeke Yewdall wrote:
 Yeah, I'd go for a larger one -- more energy collection.  I think the 
 larger ones are also tracking?  wherease the current generation 
 satellit dishes are fixed.

Yeah, but they tracked the satellite, not the sun.


Dwight

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] satellite dish collectors

a little reprogramming of the tracking software should fix that, right?On 6/26/06, Dwight HoganCamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:Zeke Yewdall wrote: Yeah, I'd go for a larger one -- more energy collection.I think the
 larger ones are also tracking?wherease the current generation satellit dishes are fixed.Yeah, but they tracked the satellite, not the sun.Dwight___
Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
Biofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] An Inconvenient Truth

2006-06-26 Thread Paul S Cantrell

Joe,
I saw it yesterday and I concur completely...Everyone go see it and
take 3 people with you!

I encourage everyone to go see it, if nothing else to make me (us)
seem less nutty!  lol  been talkin' about this since high school...

On 6/26/06, Joe Street [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I saw the movie on Friday evening. Lots of great factoids for those who
 are not in the know about global warming.  The presentation is such that
 I don't see how anyone could not be persuaded.  I thought that was very
 encouraging.  Al Gore has so much of an opportunity to reach a large
 audience.

 Joe


 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/




-- 
Thanks,
PC

He's the kind of a guy who lights up a room just by flicking a switch

We don't know a millionth of one percent about anything. - Thomas A Edison

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] satellite dish collectors

2006-06-26 Thread Jeromie Reeves

Depends on the tracking unit. Most were setup and knew about where the 
sat should be located then used a AGC
loop to to fine tracking. A easy sun tracker would do about the same 
using some photo diodes or small solar cells at
4 points on the dish wired to just balance the readings from opposing 
units. It is trivial to use a embedded setup to track
the sun. Interfacing that to your tracker could be a issue. If you send 
me specs on what you have I would be happy to see
what could be done.


Zeke Yewdall wrote:

 a little reprogramming of the tracking software should fix that, right?

 On 6/26/06, *Dwight HoganCamp* [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Zeke Yewdall wrote:
  Yeah, I'd go for a larger one -- more energy collection.  I
 think the
  larger ones are also tracking?  wherease the current generation
  satellit dishes are fixed.
 
 Yeah, but they tracked the satellite, not the sun.


 Dwight

 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/




___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

  



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] satellite dish collectors

I'm not sure exactly how the satelite dishes are set up mechanically. Solar tracking is easiest if you have a tilted NS axis, around which it can rotate. That way the tilt of the NS axis can be adjusted daily, but during the day, you only have to rotate about that axis from east to west, rather than controlling two motors throughout the day. The accuracy you need would vary depending on how tight of focus you were trying to get with the concentrator. 
On 6/26/06, Jeromie Reeves [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Depends on the tracking unit. Most were setup and knew about where thesat should be located then used a AGCloop to to fine tracking. A easy sun tracker would do about the sameusing some photo diodes or small solar cells at
4 points on the dish wired to just balance the readings from opposingunits. It is trivial to use a embedded setup to trackthe sun. Interfacing that to your tracker could be a issue. If you sendme specs on what you have I would be happy to see
what could be done.Zeke Yewdall wrote: a little reprogramming of the tracking software should fix that, right? On 6/26/06, *Dwight HoganCamp* 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Zeke Yewdall wrote:  Yeah, I'd go for a larger one -- more energy collection.I
 think the  larger ones are also tracking?wherease the current generation  satellit dishes are fixed.  Yeah, but they tracked the satellite, not the sun.
 Dwight ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] satellite dish collectors

2006-06-26 Thread doug swanson

I got the tracking sensor for my 10' dish from Duane Johnson, his site 
is at http://www.redrok.com/main.htm
You can read how to make your own, or do the lazy thing and just buy the 
ready-made module.  It would have cost me as much to buy the parts as 
the ready made one he sells.  Then it's just a matter of aligning the 
module with the dish, run 12-24 V (I think it is, I use 12)into the 
module, and use the outputs to run to the servo motor that pushes the 
dish around.  And yes the dish will align differently for solar use than 
it did for satellites.  North / south adjustments are done occasionally 
by hand to keep it within range throughout the year.

doug swanson


Zeke Yewdall wrote:

 I'm not sure exactly how the satelite dishes are set up mechanically.  
 Solar tracking is easiest if you have a tilted NS axis, around which 
 it can rotate.  That way the tilt of the NS axis can be adjusted 
 daily, but during the day, you only have to rotate about that axis 
 from east to west, rather than controlling two motors throughout the 
 day.  The accuracy you need would vary depending on how tight of focus 
 you were trying to get with the concentrator. 

 On 6/26/06, *Jeromie Reeves* [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Depends on the tracking unit. Most were setup and knew about
 where the
 sat should be located then used a AGC
 loop to to fine tracking. A easy sun tracker would do about the same
 using some photo diodes or small solar cells at
 4 points on the dish wired to just balance the readings from opposing
 units. It is trivial to use a embedded setup to track
 the sun. Interfacing that to your tracker could be a issue. If you
 send
 me specs on what you have I would be happy to see
 what could be done.


 Zeke Yewdall wrote:

  a little reprogramming of the tracking software should fix that,
 right?
 
  On 6/26/06, *Dwight HoganCamp*  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:
 
  Zeke Yewdall wrote:
   Yeah, I'd go for a larger one -- more energy collection.  I
  think the
   larger ones are also tracking?  wherease the current
 generation
   satellit dishes are fixed.
  
  Yeah, but they tracked the satellite, not the sun.
 
 
  Dwight
 
  ___
  Biofuel mailing list
  Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
 
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
  Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
  http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 
  Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives
 (50,000
  messages):
  http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 
 
 

 
 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 
 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives
 (50,000 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 
 
 


 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/




___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

  


-- 
Contentment comes not from having more, but from wanting less.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

This email is

[Biofuel] Biodiesel from Algae

2006-06-26 Thread balajit

Hello Doug, 

- Original Message - 
From: doug swanson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Sunday, June 25, 2006 12:33 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil consumption seen soaring

 When we first started hearing about Hydrogen, there had been relatively 
 little research done on the difficulties that we are faced with when 
 considering Hydrogen.  Since then, there have been remarkable 
 discoveries in the use of catalysts for brreaking the water molecule 
 that assist in providing more bang for the buck.  This reduces some of 
 the energy in vs. the energy out equation, which still isn't as energy 
 effective as fuels for which we already have infrastructure in place.

TiO2 comes readily to mind. One way out, particularly for bypassing the low 
volumeteric energy 
density of H2 and hence the need for very storage pressures, is to use direct 
methanol fuel cells.

 I think nuclear has its place.  And if you look up on a sunny day, 
 you'll see the place I'm talking about.  I feel that there will likely 
 be some thinking outside the box discoveries (or in some cases, old 
 ideas revisited) that will enable a more efficient conversion from solar 
 nuclear to a transportable fuel in the future. 

 To my way of thinking, biofuels are a stepping stone out of the stone 
 age, where we will no longer depend on combustion for travel.  A hundred 
 years from now, our current hopes and designs for Hydrogen will probably 
 be seen as yet another of those stepping stones to an efficient 
 transportation system that doesn't leave behind toxins that generations 
 for the rest of time will bear the consequences of.

 One of the cleanest and most effective transformations I can think of 
 between the solar nuclear source, and the transportable fuel we use is 
 photosynthesis, and nature has experience doing this...  Waste 
 products are used and recycled in the natural cycle.  Imagine if we 
 could duplicate the process...  Carbon dioxide and water go in, solar 
 energy is applied, and hydrocarbons and oxygen come out.

This is exactly what goes on in an open pond/photobioreactor when assisted by  
CO2 supply. 
http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0111/p01s03-sten.html
Building on NREL's Aquatic Species Programme, Dr. Isaac Berzin, an ex-MIT 
chemical engineer and CTO of Greenfuels Corp,. has estabished a 30 tube 
photobioreactor at MIT's 20 MW NG based cogen Power plant to convert CO2 in the 
flue gases into microalgae in the presence of sunlight (from the original 
nuclear reactor, Surya). He is now conducting scale up studies at  1000 MW 
plant..
He is not alone in this, others like Dr, Bayless of Greenshift Corp.  Ohio 
University 
are working on more cost effective alternatives to achieve the same purpose.

http://www.irccm.de/greenhouse/project.html
The Universtiy of Bremen, alongwith Blue BioTech  is also conducting similar 
studies on a 300 MW
Power plant.

The idea seems to particularly appeal to the pertroleum industry which is now 
faced with the inevitable. 
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2006/06/petrosun_drilli.html
PetroSun Drilling, an emerging provider of oilfield services to major
and independent producers of oil and natural gas, has formed Algae
BioFuels Inc. as a wholly-owned subsidiary.

All these efforts are predicated on the much higher photosynthetic efficiency 
of microalgae (~ 5%) 
leading to much higher oil yields per acre @ 20-30 times compared to Tree Borne 
Oilseeds.

Algae seem to be slowly coming out of the pond slime into the mainstream to 
claim their rightful place in the sun ;-)

 Someone will figure it out, probably even get a patent on something 
 nature has been doing forever, a tree in your front yard will be seen as 
 a patent infringement...  LOL

 doug swanson

snip
Regards
balaji

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel from Algae

2006-06-26 Thread Mike Weaver

Huh, that's funny, I have been very successful making algae from 
biodiesel, especially in the Summer.

-Weaver

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Hello Doug, 

- Original Message - 
From: doug swanson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Sunday, June 25, 2006 12:33 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil consumption seen soaring


  

When we first started hearing about Hydrogen, there had been relatively 
little research done on the difficulties that we are faced with when 
considering Hydrogen.  Since then, there have been remarkable 
discoveries in the use of catalysts for brreaking the water molecule 
that assist in providing more bang for the buck.  This reduces some of 
the energy in vs. the energy out equation, which still isn't as energy 
effective as fuels for which we already have infrastructure in place.



TiO2 comes readily to mind. One way out, particularly for bypassing the low 
volumeteric energy 
density of H2 and hence the need for very storage pressures, is to use direct 
methanol fuel cells.

  

I think nuclear has its place.  And if you look up on a sunny day, 
you'll see the place I'm talking about.  I feel that there will likely 
be some thinking outside the box discoveries (or in some cases, old 
ideas revisited) that will enable a more efficient conversion from solar 
nuclear to a transportable fuel in the future. 


 
  

To my way of thinking, biofuels are a stepping stone out of the stone 
age, where we will no longer depend on combustion for travel.  A hundred 
years from now, our current hopes and designs for Hydrogen will probably 
be seen as yet another of those stepping stones to an efficient 
transportation system that doesn't leave behind toxins that generations 
for the rest of time will bear the consequences of.

One of the cleanest and most effective transformations I can think of 
between the solar nuclear source, and the transportable fuel we use is 
photosynthesis, and nature has experience doing this...  Waste 
products are used and recycled in the natural cycle.  Imagine if we 
could duplicate the process...  Carbon dioxide and water go in, solar 
energy is applied, and hydrocarbons and oxygen come out.



This is exactly what goes on in an open pond/photobioreactor when assisted by  
CO2 supply. 
http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0111/p01s03-sten.html
Building on NREL's Aquatic Species Programme, Dr. Isaac Berzin, an ex-MIT 
chemical engineer and CTO of Greenfuels Corp,. has estabished a 30 tube 
photobioreactor at MIT's 20 MW NG based cogen Power plant to convert CO2 in 
the flue gases into microalgae in the presence of sunlight (from the original 
nuclear reactor, Surya). He is now conducting scale up studies at  1000 MW 
plant..
He is not alone in this, others like Dr, Bayless of Greenshift Corp.  Ohio 
University 
are working on more cost effective alternatives to achieve the same purpose.

http://www.irccm.de/greenhouse/project.html
The Universtiy of Bremen, alongwith Blue BioTech  is also conducting similar 
studies on a 300 MW
Power plant.

The idea seems to particularly appeal to the pertroleum industry which is now 
faced with the inevitable. 
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2006/06/petrosun_drilli.html
PetroSun Drilling, an emerging provider of oilfield services to major
and independent producers of oil and natural gas, has formed Algae
BioFuels Inc. as a wholly-owned subsidiary.

All these efforts are predicated on the much higher photosynthetic efficiency 
of microalgae (~ 5%) 
leading to much higher oil yields per acre @ 20-30 times compared to Tree 
Borne Oilseeds.

Algae seem to be slowly coming out of the pond slime into the mainstream to 
claim their rightful place in the sun ;-)

  

Someone will figure it out, probably even get a patent on something 
nature has been doing forever, a tree in your front yard will be seen as 
a patent infringement...  LOL

doug swanson



snip
Regards
balaji



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

  



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

[Biofuel] 6kW solar tracker - was satellite dish collectors

2006-06-26 Thread Kirk McLoren

http://www.ida.net/users/tetonsl/solar/solarhom.htm   
		Do you Yahoo!? Next-gen email? Have it all with the  all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta.___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil consumption seen soaring

2006-06-26 Thread Kirk McLoren

WHy would you advocate hydrogen with all its losses. Supercaps are the perfect battery for transportation. More efficient than lead acid too (and no lead) - as for hydrogen who needs 25% system efficiency? KirkMike Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: "The bottom line is that the world has to go Hydrogen."Every once in a while we find a post that challenges years of research and discussion and asks everyone to take a giant step back and re-examine ideas on a particular issue long after a consensus has been reached, as if we've missed something.Even though it's discouraging, I would be willing to re-examine an issue if new evidence reveals itself. In fact, I would consider it crucial.But, what's most discouraging is when a forum discusses energy strategy for years, realizes that a
comprehensive energy strategy will involve numerous schemes for renewable energy and biofuels, then finds a post in that forum that includes a statement to the effect of: "The answer is...".The oil industry has made us dependent on it, even when it's not the best source of energy for a given application. It has brought men to power who have influenced the highest levels of government to ensure that competitive alternatives are squashed. We've learned that a single energy source which fosters a dependence on it due to the exclusivity of the raw materials or technologies, provides a substitute for our current dependency on oil. At it's worst, we know that such a dependency brings to power those who will encourage a government to help them exploit or even militarily control other countries.Although I keep an open mind toward all energy technologies (including hydrogen), I encourage you not to place all importance on
one.-RedlerMike Weaver wrote: You all know perfectly well the answer is Dilithium Crystals. No arguments, please. robert and benita rabello wrote: chem.dd wrote: The bottom line is that the world has to go Hydrogen. Are you SURE you want to go there in this forum? I'd be laughing if your proposition wasn't so sad. robert luis rabello "The Edge of Justice" Adventure for Your Mind http://www.newadventure.ca Ranger Supercharger Project Page http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/ ___Biofuel mailing
listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Ring'em or ping'em. Make PC-to-phone calls as low as 1¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.
Ring'em or ping'em. Make PC-to-phone calls as low as 1¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] satellite dish collectors




tracking is easy, even on 2 axes, but i was curious 
to know if it would be effective for an exchange heater. i have a dish, but was 
worried it wouldnt be of any use to me.

JasonICQ#: 154998177MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to 
get me)

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Zeke Yewdall 
  
  To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  
  Sent: Monday, June 26, 2006 10:34 
AM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] satellite dish 
  collectors
  Yeah, I'd go for a larger one -- more energy collection. 
  I think the larger ones are also tracking? wherease the current 
  generation satellit dishes are fixed.
  On 6/26/06, Ken 
  Provost [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  On 
Jun 25, 2006, at 10:51 PM, Jason Katie wrote: does anyone 
know if a regular 2'x1.5' satellite dish (primestar i think) will 
work for a solar collector?Pretty small -- 300 watts of 
insolation at best. Figure a typical small stove burnerputs 
out 1000 watts at least. Now one ofthose early satellite dishes five 
feet in diameter would catcha LOT of 
rays-K___Biofuel 
mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org 
Biofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch 
the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): 
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
  
  

  ___Biofuel mailing 
  listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel 
  at Journey to 
  Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the 
  combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
  messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
  
  

  No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free 
  Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.4/375 - Release Date: 
  6/25/2006
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.4/375 - Release Date: 6/25/2006
___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil consumption seen soaring

2006-06-26 Thread robert and benita rabello

Kirk McLoren wrote:

 WHy would you advocate hydrogen with all its losses. Supercaps are the 
 perfect battery for transportation. More efficient than lead acid too 
 (and no lead)
 - as for hydrogen who needs 25% system efficiency?


Only people building nuclear power plants who think they've got 
enough energy to throw away . . .

Seriously though, because electrolysis is endothermic, it's POSSIBLE 
to build an electrolyzer that uses process heat as part of its input.  
That's what most nuclear / hydrogen advocates fall back on when the 
efficiency question comes up.


robert luis rabello
The Edge of Justice
Adventure for Your Mind
http://www.newadventure.ca

Ranger Supercharger Project Page
http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Castor oil

if im reading this right, castor shells can be distilled and the ethanol be 
introduced into the BD to thin it? the heat from distilling the mash should 
damage the ricin, and even if it cant be composted immediately, it could be 
digested for methane energy output and the sludge could/should be composted 
for maximum effect in the field. this eliminates the need for tight security 
and disposes of a hazardous material all at once. brilliant work everyone, 
thank you!!!

Jason
ICQ#:  154998177
MSN:  [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me)

- Original Message - 
From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Thursday, June 22, 2006 12:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Castor oil


Hello

I would like to know if it´s posible to make biodiesel from castor oil.

Hi Andrés

Certainly it's possible. I think you can just make it the same way as
with any other oil.

Castor beans can yield three times as much oil as soybeans, averaging
1,413 litres of oil per hectare or 151 US gal per acre or more. The
plant often grows as a weed on waste land and doesn't need much or
any care and attention.

 From previous messages:

I have had some experience in growing the plant a few years ago. The
plant grows into a stalk approximately 5-7' tall with a diameter of
approximately 4', it will continue to produce seeds continuely for
several months. The seeds grow from bunches with approximately 6-8
seed pods per bunch, with each pod containing 3 seeds encased in a
hard shell. -- Addison Griffith

In Chile, castor bean is a serious weed. It grows extremely fast,
reaching over two meters height and diameter within 8 months. If you
have moisture, as near an irrigation canal, you can collect many
hundreds of seeds, even perhaps a thousand or more from each plant.
It thrives on no management or additional fertilization. Roadsides
are a good place to find them. I considered them, together with
jojoba, as an oil seed crop, before selling out and moving to
Argentina. I crushed one, yes one, plant's worth in a primitive
homemade press and got about a liter of oil. -- Andres Yver

The oil has a lower Iodine Value (85) than either soy or rapeseed oil
so it won't oxidise and polymerise as easily and can be stored for
years without deteriorating. Unlike palm oil it also has a low
melting point (-18 deg C), making it a good winter fuel.

The seed contains ricin, which is highly toxic, but it's in the seed
husk and remains in the seedcake, there isn't any in the oil. The
seedcake is said to be suitable for use as an organic fertiliser (but
it isn't easily composted). But it is a disadvantage that the
seedcake cannot be fed to livestock.

James Duke says: Although it is highly toxic due to the ricin, a
method of detoxicating the meal has now been found, so that it can
safely be fed to livestock. See: Ricinus communis, Handbook of
Energy Crops, James A. Duke, 1983
http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/duke_energy/Ricinus_communis.html

Pannirselvam in Brazil discussed a direct process, without extracting
the oil from the crushed seeds first: ...one step simultaneous
extraction and esterification, the patented process use crushed seeds
to make four products, the biodiesel, the glycerol, the protein,
carbohydrate that seem to be deintoxicated for animal feed.

Bob Allen said: I interpreted this to mean that the crushed seeds
are subjected to the alkali catalyst/methanol hence the seedcake is
exposed to the reaction... Ricin is a protein which would be
denatured by the reaction conditions. Denaturation just means
changing the shape of the protein, thus inactivating it.

But we don't know the details of the process Pannirselvam mentioned.
He also said One main problem with castor oil BioD is the viscosity
that can be easily solved. But he didn't say how.

Castor oil is much more viscous than other vegetable oils, and 100
times more viscous than petroleum diesel fuel. As with all oils, it's
much less viscous once turned into biodiesel, but the viscosity is
still higher than the limits allowed by the national biodiesel
standards.

Blending it with some ethanol might be a solution. Unlike most other
vegetable oils, castor oil is ethanol soluble. Pannirselvam also
mentioned producing ethanol from the carbohydrate portion of the
seedcake, leaving just the protein for the livestock feed.

This paper in the Biofuels online library discusses using castor oil
to separate  anhydrous ethanol, which could be used instead of
methanol in the biodiesel process.

Separating Ethanol From Water -- by Renaldo V. Jenkins of Langley
Research Center, Hampton, Virginia, USA. More economical methods of
separating water from ethanol to produce anhydrous ethanol:
2. using castor oil.
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/eth_separate.html#castoil

This is an informative website about castor oil, and biodiesel generally:

http://www.castoroil.in/uses/fuel/castor_oil_fuel.html
Castor Oil as Biofuel  Biodiesel - Info, WWW Resources on

Re: [Biofuel] castorbeans




i wanted to try this also, i have a mostly scrap 
lawnmower engine that is good for experiments of this nature.

JasonICQ#: 154998177MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to 
get me)

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  lres1 
  To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 10:37 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] castorbeans
  
  Have had many years ago engines like steam driven 
  units that used good castor oil as their engine lubricants. Some of this was 
  fed through adjustable sight feed lubricators to open shafts and some was in 
  dip pans where a ring was inserted to the centre of a bearing but of large 
  diameter and thus the ring was in the oil and slowly picked up the oil and 
  dropped it to the shafts.
  
  A similar system was used in Comet and Southern 
  Cross wind pumps running on white metal bearings and or hard wood bearings. 
  The oil for the later being of many mixed varieties of what could be 
  had.
  
  Has any one run straight castor oil as stand 
  alone engine oil in the sump of an engine without using any other additives? I 
  have used it but only in small model engines and not as a fully synthetic 
  stand alone in a car or SUV. Any ideas?
  
  Doug 
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
Mike Redler 

To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org 

Sent: Saturday, June 17, 2006 5:06 
AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] 
castorbeans
Hi Juan,I saw the word "beans" and thought of a 
climbing plant, like a string beanbad assumption. I'm definitely 
NOT a farmer.Anyway, I'll check Keith's 
links.Thanks.-RedlerJuan Boveda wrote: 
Hello Mike Redler.
That crop is like a big bush, in this subtropical country it grows like a 
weed (no insecticides needed) but it needs a fertile dirt, water and a 
half-squared meter for its deep roots. I does not climbs, more likely it 
can be used for the urban farmer as a shadow for parking lots if they are 
planted in groups. It was discussed the production of biodiesel from castor 
and Keith sent to the list the following message that has many links.
Best Regards.

Juan Boveda
Paraguay


-original-
From:	Keith Addison [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent:	3/30/ 2006 5:38
For:	Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Subject:	Re: [Biofuel] Seeking experience to produce biodiesel from Castor

  
  Anyone care to share any experiences with castor oil based biodiesel
brewing using small-scale plants?  I am told that castor oil dissolves
in alcohols and external heating is eliminated from the process.  I'm
also hearing conjectures that castor based biodiesel will not freeze
even below -20 deg C.  Any pointers to more specific info along these 
lines?
  
  I'll get to my own brewing/learning experiments soon (and I'll start
with proven processes and materials described on J2FE), but we could do
with as much existing wisdom as  we can get our hands on, especially
because what we want to get into out here is not only for our personal
consumption.  Many thanks in advance for any help.

Chandan

Hi Chandan

I can't share any experience of using castor oil but I can offer some
information which might help. It's been discussed a few times before,
I think other list members may have direct experience of it.

List archives:
http://snipurl.com/oeit
Search results for 'castor'

The one disadvantage mentioned, that I haven't seen an answer to, was
that crushing the seeds creates a seriously bad odour, enough to put
people off. Also the cake is poinsonous, but James Duke says:
"Although it is highly toxic due to the ricin, a method of
detoxicating the meal has now been found, so that it can safely be
fed to livestock.MailScanner has detected a possible fraud attempt from "www.hort.purdue.edu" claiming to be "

http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/duke_energy/Ricinus_communis.html
Ricinus communis

The toxic principle is water-soluble so is not found in the oil. It's
also said to be a drying oil, the equal of tung oil, yet it has a
much lower Iodine Value, though Iodine Value is quite a crude
indicator of whether oils will polymerise or not and castor oil seems
to be an exception. On the other hand it has a longstanding
reputation of being an excellent motor oil.

This is an informative website about castor oil, and biodiesel generally:

http://www.castoroil.in/uses/fuel/castor_oil_fuel.html
Castor Oil as Biofuel  Biodiesel - Info, WWW Resources on Castoroil
as Bio-fuel, Bio-diesel

Others:

http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/afcm/castor.html
Castorbeans

http://www.ibiblio.org/pfaf/cgi-bin/arr_html?Ricinus+communis
Ricinus communis

http://snipurl.com/oeiu
The Hindu Business Line : Gujarat Oleo Chem bags Rs 25-cr biodiesel
order from IOC
Gujarat Oleo Chem bags Rs 25-cr biodiesel order from IOC
Mumbai , Aug 3

http://www.tierramerica.net/2003/0526/ianalisis.shtml
Energy in a Castor Bean
The castor-oil plant, ricinus communis, is the best source for
creating "biodiesel", say

Re: [Biofuel] Never seen wash problem

2006-06-26 Thread Tonomár András

Joe,

the water is from the household water heater
and is not conditioned.
It sounds stupid but my first idea was that the water was too hot

than I added 0,1l vinegar to break the emulsion.
Is this a reason for the brown powder?

Andrew


- Original Message -
From: Joe Street [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Monday, June 26, 2006 4:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Never seen wash problem


Hi Andrew;

Is the water you used conditioned by a water softener?

Joe

Tonomár András wrote:

 Dear List members,


 I need your ideas of what went worng with my washing
 I make 45 l batches for almost a year now and I have only had minor
 emulsion problems
 in the first wash that I could handle pretty good with hot water or some
 vinegar.

 I make BD from WVO with 2 stage base - base, and I stir wash it all the
 time.

 Today morning I started to do the 5th (last wash) on my batch.
 the previous (4th) wash water was see through but not chrystal clear.
 The fuel handeled stir washing very well - long time, and even high rpm.

 As I stired for the 5th what I got was a thick emulsion.
 I am shocked

 The wash water is from the household water heater, ph 7 and around 60 deg
C

 Overall tempreture of the mix is around 35 - 40 deg C.

 The emulsion separated in a couple hours and as I drained the wash water
 a brown layer remained on the inside wall of the wash tank. This looks
 like rust
 But it is not rust

 I just don't get it. Do you???

 Never ever had such a problem before.
 Any ideas?

 Thanks
 Andrew


 

 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] The Death of US Engineering

Maybe now isn't that best time to get an electrical engineering degree :-/Will KOn 6/23/06, D. Mindock 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:






The Death of US 
EngineeringBy Paul Craig RobertsThe 
May payroll jobs report released June 2 by the Bureau of LaborStatistics 
confirms the jobs pattern for the 21st century US economy:employment growth 
is limited to domestic services.In May the economy created only 67,000 
private sector jobs. Jobestimates for the previous two months were reduced 
by 37,000.The new jobs are as follows: professional and business 
services, 27,000;education and health services, 41,000; waitresses and 
bartenders,10,000. Manufacturing lost 14,000 jobs.Total hours worked 
in the private sector declined in May.Manufacturing hours worked are 6.6 
percent less than when the recoverybegan four and one-half years 
ago.American economists and policymakers are in denial about the effect 
ofjobs offshoring on US employment. Corporate lobbyists have 
purchasedfraudulent studies from economists that claim offshoring results in 
moreUS employment rather than less. The same lobbyists have 
spreaddisinformation that the US does not graduate enough engineers and 
thatthey must import foreigners on work visas.Lobbyists are 
currently pushing, as part of the immigration bill, anexpansion in annual 
H-1B work visas from 65,000 to 115,000.The alleged shortage of US 
engineering graduates is inconsistent withreports from Duke University that 
30 to 40 percent of students in itsmaster's of engineering management 
program accept jobs outside theprofession. About one-third of engineering 
graduates from MIT go intocareers outside their field. Job outsourcing and 
work visas for foreignengineers are reducing career opportunities for 
American engineeringgraduates and, also, reducing salary scales.When 
employers allege a shortage of engineers, they mean that there is ashortage 
of American graduates who will work for the low salaries thatforeigners will 
accept. Americans are simply being forced out of theengineering professions 
by jobs outsourcing and the importation offoreigners on work visas. 
Corporate lobbyists and their hired economistsare destroying the American 
engineering professions.American engineering is also under pressure 
because corporations havemoved manufacturing offshore. Design, research and 
development are nowfollowing manufacturing offshore. A country that doesn't 
make thingsdoesn't need engineers and designers. Corporations that have 
movedmanufacturing offshore fund RD in the countries where their plants 
havebeen relocated.Engineering curriculums are demanding. The 
rewards to the effort arebeing squeezed out by jobs offshoring and work 
visas. If the currentpolicy continues of substituting foreign engineers for 
Americanengineers, the profession will die in the 
US.---Paul Craig Roberts was Assistant Secretary of the 
Treasury in the Reaganadministration. He was Associate Editor of the Wall 
Street Journaleditorial page and Contributing Editor of National Review. He 
iscoauthor of The Tyranny of Good Intentions.He can be reached 
at:[EMAIL PROTECTED]


___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
Biofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Roger Sanders' Waste Oil Heater

put a methane gas ring under the flashpan for a preheater/pilot light with 
one of those static electric pushbutton grill starters maybe? hit the button 
to preheat with methane, then start the oil drip?
Jason
ICQ#:  154998177
MSN:  [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me)

- Original Message - 
From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Wednesday, June 21, 2006 1:13 AM
Subject: [Biofuel] Roger Sanders' Waste Oil Heater

 Roger's done a great job with this. Waste motor oil or WVO, doesn't
 need a blower.

 Best

 Keith

 Roger Sanders' Waste Oil Heater

 Roger Sanders has solved all the problems that make Mother Earth News
 waste oil heaters difficult to use. His new MEN heater design is
 simple, reliable and easy to use, it's quiet and uses no electricity,
 it has reliable oil flow and a wide heat range, it's easy to light
 and easy to clean.

 In other words, it is a practical design that you can use day in and
 day out for seriously heating your dwelling or workshop without
 costing you a lot of time and frustration.

 Click here for a full description of Roger's heater, how he solved
 the problems he encountered with the traditional design, and the
 revolutionary but simple burner (left) that's the key to easy control
 over a wide heat range and oil flow rate.

 With photographs and design drawings.

 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethanol_motherearth/me11.html
 Roger Sanders' Waste Oil Heater

 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

 -- 
 No virus found in this incoming message.
 Checked by AVG Free Edition.
 Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.1/369 - Release Date: 6/19/2006

-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.4/375 - Release Date: 6/25/2006

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] The Death of US Engineering





Engineers have been saying this for years.

I'm the chair of a local ASME chapter so, I hear it a lot. In fact I'm
representative of the lost jobs mentioned in the article, having lost
my last engineering job in September.

I forwarded the article to my ASME chapter and received the following
[excerpt] comments:

 "The alarming fact is the exorbitant incomes of
CEO's!  These folks are not worth
 millions and more millions atop that.  My son,
who is a businessman, believes
 America is sleepwalking.  And will be facing
economic realities that will send us
 reeling.  What to do?...just what you are
encouraging...discuss and plan upon
 this subject."  


I think it will take at least a generation to build back the
competitive talent pool which was thrown away over the past decade.

-Redler
 

D. Mindock wrote:

  
   The Death of US Engineering
  
By Paul Craig Roberts 
  
The May payroll jobs report released June 2 by the Bureau of Labor
Statistics confirms the jobs pattern for the 21st century US economy:
employment growth is limited to domestic services.
  
In May the economy created only 67,000 private sector jobs. Job
estimates for the previous two months were reduced by 37,000.
  
The new jobs are as follows: professional and business services, 27,000;
education and health services, 41,000; waitresses and bartenders,
10,000. Manufacturing lost 14,000 jobs.
  
Total hours worked in the private sector declined in May.
Manufacturing hours worked are 6.6 percent less than when the recovery
began four and one-half years ago.
  
American economists and policymakers are in denial about the effect of
jobs offshoring on US employment. Corporate lobbyists have purchased
fraudulent studies from economists that claim offshoring results in more
US employment rather than less. The same lobbyists have spread
disinformation that the US does not graduate enough engineers and that
they must import foreigners on work visas.
  
Lobbyists are currently pushing, as part of the immigration bill, an
expansion in annual H-1B work visas from 65,000 to 115,000.
  
The alleged "shortage" of US engineering graduates is inconsistent with
reports from Duke University that 30 to 40 percent of students in its
master's of engineering management program accept jobs outside the
profession. About one-third of engineering graduates from MIT go into
careers outside their field. Job outsourcing and work visas for foreign
engineers are reducing career opportunities for American engineering
graduates and, also, reducing salary scales.
  
When employers allege a shortage of engineers, they mean that there is a
shortage of American graduates who will work for the low salaries that
foreigners will accept. Americans are simply being forced out of the
engineering professions by jobs outsourcing and the importation of
foreigners on work visas. Corporate lobbyists and their hired economists
are destroying the American engineering professions.
  
American engineering is also under pressure because corporations have
moved manufacturing offshore. Design, research and development are now
following manufacturing offshore. A country that doesn't make things
doesn't need engineers and designers. Corporations that have moved
manufacturing offshore fund RD in the countries where their plants
have
been relocated.
  
Engineering curriculums are demanding. The rewards to the effort are
being squeezed out by jobs offshoring and work visas. If the current
policy continues of substituting foreign engineers for American
engineers, the profession will die in the US. 
  
---
Paul Craig Roberts was Assistant Secretary of the Treasury in the Reagan
administration. He was Associate Editor of the Wall Street Journal
editorial page and Contributing Editor of National Review. He is
coauthor of The Tyranny of Good Intentions.He can be reached at:
   paulcraigroberts@
yahoo.com 
  



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

[Biofuel] Elsbett SVO Workshop

2006-06-26 Thread Rachel Burton

Anyone in the US, interested in an SVO workshop?

Central Carolina Community College, and Piedmont Biofuels are pleased  
to announce they will co-host their third Elsbett Straight Vegetable  
Oil Conversion Workshop.

The dates have been set for July 14th-16th 2006 from 9 a.m. to 5 P.M.  
each day.

The workshop will be held at Central Carolina Community College, in  
Pittsboro, and is part of the Biofuels Program.

Straight Vegetable Oil (SVO) enthusiasts typically converge on  
Chatham County from all over the eastern seaboard to participate in  
these workshops. It is a hands-on affair, where participants are  
turning their own wrenches and learning how to reconfigure their  
injectors so that their diesel powered vehicles can run on SVO.

Space is limited, and preference will be given to those who will be  
installing Elsbett Conversion kits. Shop space and availability of  
tools limits the workshop size, so those wishing to enroll should do  
so ASAP.

Participant kits must be pre-ordered by June 29th.

For more information about the Elsbett system, conversion kits  
details, costs, and past workshops, see http://www.biofuels.coop/ 
elsbett.shtml.



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] castorbeans

I tried using biodiesel (probably about 25% biodiesel/75% gasoline) in a lawnmower. Smokey startup, and stalled right away. I think the primitive lawnmower carb couldn't vaporize the biodiesel effectively -- relying on the vaccuum from the engine to suck the fuel out of the tank into the carb probably didn't help either (it would start every time when you used the primer bulb, but stall right out). Makes me want to try it on a fuel injected gas engine that could probably manage to actually get the biodiesel mix into the cylinders though.
On 6/26/06, Jason Katie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:







i wanted to try this also, i have a mostly scrap 
lawnmower engine that is good for experiments of this nature.

JasonICQ#: 154998177MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to 
get me)

  - Original Message - 
  
From: 
  lres1 
  To: 
biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 10:37 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] castorbeans

  
  Have had many years ago engines like steam driven 
  units that used good castor oil as their engine lubricants. Some of this was 
  fed through adjustable sight feed lubricators to open shafts and some was in 
  dip pans where a ring was inserted to the centre of a bearing but of large 
  diameter and thus the ring was in the oil and slowly picked up the oil and 
  dropped it to the shafts.
  
  A similar system was used in Comet and Southern 
  Cross wind pumps running on white metal bearings and or hard wood bearings. 
  The oil for the later being of many mixed varieties of what could be 
  had.
  
  Has any one run straight castor oil as stand 
  alone engine oil in the sump of an engine without using any other additives? I 
  have used it but only in small model engines and not as a fully synthetic 
  stand alone in a car or SUV. Any ideas?
  
  Doug 
  
- Original Message - 

From: 
Mike Redler 

To: 
biofuel@sustainablelists.org 

Sent: Saturday, June 17, 2006 5:06 
AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] 
castorbeans
Hi Juan,I saw the word beans and thought of a 
climbing plant, like a string beanbad assumption. I'm definitely 
NOT a farmer.Anyway, I'll check Keith's 
links.Thanks.-RedlerJuan Boveda wrote: 
Hello Mike Redler.That crop is like a big bush, in this subtropical country it grows like a weed (no insecticides needed) but it needs a fertile dirt, water and a 
half-squared meter for its deep roots. I does not climbs, more likely it can be used for the urban farmer as a shadow for parking lots if they are planted in groups. It was discussed the production of biodiesel from castor 
and Keith sent to the list the following message that has many links.Best Regards.Juan BovedaParaguay-original-From:	Keith Addison [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
]Sent:	3/30/ 2006 5:38For:	Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Subject:	Re: [Biofuel] Seeking experience to produce biodiesel from Castor

  
  Anyone care to share any experiences with castor oil based biodieselbrewing using small-scale plants?  I am told that castor oil dissolvesin alcohols and external heating is eliminated from the process.  I'm
also hearing conjectures that castor based biodiesel will not freezeeven below -20 deg C.  Any pointers to more specific info along these lines?  
  I'll get to my own brewing/learning experiments soon (and I'll startwith proven processes and materials described on J2FE), but we could dowith as much existing wisdom as  we can get our hands on, especially
because what we want to get into out here is not only for our personalconsumption.  Many thanks in advance for any help.ChandanHi ChandanI can't share any experience of using castor oil but I can offer some
information which might help. It's been discussed a few times before,I think other list members may have direct experience of it.List archives:
http://snipurl.com/oeit
Search results for 'castor'

The one disadvantage mentioned, that I haven't seen an answer to, was
that crushing the seeds creates a seriously bad odour, enough to put
people off. Also the cake is poinsonous, but James Duke says:
Although it is highly toxic due to the ricin, a method of
detoxicating the meal has now been found, so that it can safely be
fed to livestock.
MailScanner has detected a possible fraud attempt from www.hort.purdue.edu claiming to be http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/duke_energy/Ricinus_communis.htmlRicinus communis
The toxic principle is water-soluble so is not found in the oil. It'salso said to be a drying oil, the equal of tung oil, yet it has amuch lower Iodine Value, though Iodine Value is quite a crudeindicator of whether oils will polymerise or not and castor oil seems
to be an exception. On the other hand it has a longstandingreputation of being an excellent motor oil.This is an informative website about castor oil, and biodiesel generally:http://www.castoroil.in/uses/fuel/castor_oil_fuel.html
Castor Oil as Biofuel  Biodiesel - Info, WWW

Re: [Biofuel] alledged cosmic energy electricity generator

this is strange. if there is a force input, even though it is pulsed it is 
still not free. it may be insanely efficient, but so were the old kerosene 
popper motors that used ungainly huge flywheels to produce steady power from 
pulses. this is not a new technique by any means.

Jason
ICQ#:  154998177
MSN:  [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me)

- Original Message - 
From: AltEnergyNetwork [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Friday, June 23, 2006 6:40 PM
Subject: [Biofuel] alledged cosmic energy electricity generator


 Don't really know what to think of this yet.



 Cosmic Energy Electricity Generators

  http://www.alternate-energy.net/R/news.php?detail=n1151100689.news 
















 Get your daily alternative energy news

 Alternate Energy Resource Network
  1000+ news sources-resources
updated daily

 http://www.alternate-energy.net






 Next Generation Grid
 http://groups.yahoo.com/group/next_generation_grid/


 Tomorrow-energy
 http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tomorrow-energy/


 Alternative Energy Politics
 http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Alternative_Energy_Politics/



 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/


 -- 
 No virus found in this incoming message.
 Checked by AVG Free Edition.
 Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.4/375 - Release Date: 6/25/2006

 



-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.4/375 - Release Date: 6/25/2006


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil consumption seen soaring





I didn't.

Kirk McLoren wrote:

  
  WHy would you advocate hydrogen with all its losses. Supercaps
are the perfect battery for transportation. More efficient than lead
acid too (and no lead)
  - as for hydrogen who needs 25% system efficiency?
  Kirk
  
  Mike Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  "The bottom line is that the world has to go Hydrogen."

Every once in a while we find a post that challenges years of research
and discussion and asks everyone to take a giant step back and
re-examine ideas on a particular issue long after a consensus has been
reached, as if we've missed something.

Even though it's discouraging, I would be willing to re-examine an
issue 
if new evidence reveals itself. In fact, I would consider it crucial.

But, what's most discouraging is when a forum discusses energy strategy

for years, realizes that a comprehensive energy strategy will involve 
numerous schemes for renewable energy and biofuels, then finds a post
in 
that forum that includes a statement to the effect of: "The answer
is...".

The oil industry has made us dependent on it, even when it's not the 
best source of energy for a given application. It has brought men to 
power who have influenced the highest levels of government to ensure 
that competitive alternatives are squashed. We've learned that a single

energy source which fosters a dependence on it due to the exclusivity
of 
the raw materials or technologies, provides a substitute for our
current 
dependency on oil. At it's worst, we know that such a dependency brings

to power those who will encourage a government to help them exploit or 
even militarily control other countries.

Although I keep an open mind toward all energy technologies (including 
hydrogen), I encourage you not to place all importance on one.


-Redler

Mike Weaver wrote:
 You all know perfectly well the answer is Dilithium Crystals. No 
 arguments, please.

 robert and benita rabello wrote:

 
 chem.dd wrote:

 

 
 The bottom line is that the world has to go Hydrogen.

 

 
 Are you SURE you want to go there in this forum? I'd be
laughing if 
 your proposition wasn't so sad.

 robert luis rabello
 "The Edge of Justice"
 Adventure for Your Mind
 http://www.newadventure.ca

 Ranger Supercharger Project Page
 http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/
 
  




___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] car advertisement from Great Britain

2006-06-26 Thread Alon






  What's that Kirk ?
  Sending your homemade videos ? 
;-)
___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] water-fuel system

Hello,I always thought it would be really cool to power an internal combustion engine with hydrogen derived from electrolysis powered by the engine itself, but doesn't it take more energy to split the hydrogen/oxygen that the hydrogen is able to produce when combusted? I guess that's why this particular device requires 20% gasoline fuel. Could that 20% be obtained from solar energy and just pumped into the electrolysis to produce enough hydrogen to run the engine? Also, what if the engine was run on a mix of hydrogen and oxygen? Would that be more powerful? 
Will KelleherOn 6/25/06, Kirk McLoren [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
http://www.rexresearch.com/teves/teves.htm 
	
	
		Want to be your own boss? Learn how on  Yahoo! Small Business.
 

___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
Biofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Class Warfare: The Minimum Wage Goes Down

Hi John,I don't mean to be a pain in the ass but, your focus is on company profits, re-issue of currency, and monetary greed- not a common denominatorin an explanation on why both capitalist and communist societies would fail.At least for now, it's not an explanation that makes sense to me.More to the point, governments irrespective of the model they follow, fail because citizens do not realize the importance of participation (IMHO).- Redler  John Mullan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  I believe that either economic model (communist or capitalist) is destined to collapse, sooner or later. One of the main factors being greed. Greed is what causes inflation. Companies are driven to make
 more profit. People need more income to purchase the higher priced items they need AND "want" (ie; form of greed).In my area, I know many people earning minimum wage (Canada) and even simple one-room apartments tax their ability to have any disposable income. But there are also many companies that would be hard pressed to increase their prices such as to pay significantly more than minimum wage and still have a decent customer base.Add to the picture the coming "death" of cheap energy and the picture becomes even more bleak.Economic crash and the re-issue of currency has happened before and has to happen again. To survive, eliminate your debt and try desperately to own all your property out-right.Just my two-cents worth.Cheers,John[snip]___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] castorbeans




sorry, bad explanation again. i meant as a 
lubricant not a fuel, i believe it was kieth who pointed me at information about 
castor oil. it breaks down under heat and pressureand the lubricative 
properties are enhanced after a period of use. the problem is if it breaks down 
too far, it turns to a thick messy sludge with little or no continuing benefit 
as a lubricant.

JasonICQ#: 154998177MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to 
get me)

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Zeke Yewdall 
  
  To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  
  Sent: Monday, June 26, 2006 7:51 PM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] castorbeans
  I tried using biodiesel (probably about 25% biodiesel/75% 
  gasoline) in a lawnmower. Smokey startup, and stalled right away. 
  I think the primitive lawnmower carb couldn't vaporize the biodiesel 
  effectively -- relying on the vaccuum from the engine to suck the fuel out of 
  the tank into the carb probably didn't help either (it would start every time 
  when you used the primer bulb, but stall right out). Makes me want to 
  try it on a fuel injected gas engine that could probably manage to actually 
  get the biodiesel mix into the cylinders though. 
  On 6/26/06, Jason 
  Katie [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  


i wanted to try this also, i have a mostly 
scrap lawnmower engine that is good for experiments of this 
nature.


JasonICQ#: 154998177MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get 
me)



- 
Original Message - 
From: 
lres1 
To: 
biofuel@sustainablelists.org 

Sent: 
Tuesday, June 20, 2006 10:37 PM
Subject: 
Re: [Biofuel] castorbeans 


Have had many years ago engines like steam 
driven units that used good castor oil as their engine lubricants. Some of 
this was fed through adjustable sight feed lubricators to open shafts and 
some was in dip pans where a ring was inserted to the centre of a bearing 
but of large diameter and thus the ring was in the oil and slowly picked up 
the oil and dropped it to the shafts.

A similar system was used in Comet and Southern 
Cross wind pumps running on white metal bearings and or hard wood bearings. 
The oil for the later being of many mixed varieties of what could be 
had.

Has any one run straight castor oil as stand 
alone engine oil in the sump of an engine without using any other additives? 
I have used it but only in small model engines and not as a fully synthetic 
stand alone in a car or SUV. Any ideas?

Doug 

  - 
  Original Message - 
  From: 
  Mike Redler 
  To: 
  biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  Sent: 
  Saturday, June 17, 2006 5:06 AM
  Subject: 
  Re: [Biofuel] castorbeans
  Hi Juan,I saw the word "beans" and thought of a 
  climbing plant, like a string beanbad assumption. I'm 
  definitely NOT a farmer.Anyway, I'll check Keith's 
  links.Thanks.-RedlerJuan Boveda wrote: 
  Hello Mike Redler.That crop is like a big bush, in this subtropical country it grows like a weed (no insecticides needed) but it needs a fertile dirt, water and a 
half-squared meter for its deep roots. I does not climbs, more likely it can be used for the urban farmer as a shadow for parking lots if they are planted in groups. It was discussed the production of biodiesel from castor 
and Keith sent to the list the following message that has many links.Best Regards.Juan BovedaParaguay-original-From:	Keith Addison [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
]Sent:	3/30/ 2006 5:38For:	Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Subject:	Re: [Biofuel] Seeking experience to produce biodiesel from Castor

  
Anyone care to share any experiences with castor oil based biodieselbrewing using small-scale plants?  I am told that castor oil dissolvesin alcohols and external heating is eliminated from the process.  I'm
also hearing conjectures that castor based biodiesel will not freezeeven below -20 deg C.  Any pointers to more specific info along these lines?  
I'll get to my own brewing/learning experiments soon (and I'll startwith proven processes and materials described on J2FE), but we could dowith as much existing wisdom as  we can get our hands on, especially
because what we want to get into out here is not only for our personalconsumption.  Many thanks in advance for any help.ChandanHi ChandanI can't share any experience of using castor oil but I can offer some
information which might help. It's been discussed a few times before,I think other list members may have direct experience of it.List archives:
http://snipurl.com/oeit
Search results for 'castor'

The one disadvantage mentioned, that I haven't seen an answer to, was
that crushing the seeds creates a seriously bad odour, enough to put
people off. Also the cake is poinsonous, but James Duke says:
"Although it is highly toxic due to the

Re: [Biofuel] Class Warfare: The Minimum Wage Goes Down

"...do we really think if companies are forced to pay their workers more that they'll just suck up the extra cost and not raise prices?"Sure...when they are employee owned.The salaries of CEO's are hundreds of times more than their employees. That sucking sound youmighthave heardis the cost of feeding the parasites at the top of the food chain.- RedlerKurt Nolte [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Keith Addison wrote: The GOP just shafted the working people of America. By rejecting an attempt to raise the minimum wage, the Republican-controlled Senate showed that it is far more interested in lining the pockets of its campaign contributors than - as Paul Krugman wrote in a New York
Times op-ed on Monday - arriving at a "new New Deal" and working to "rebuild our middle class." The 52-46 vote was eight short of the 60 needed for approval. (The measure drew the support of eight Republicans --four of these are up for reelection in the fall.) Why does this not surprise me? Sen. Edward Kennedy's amendment would have raised the wage from the current $5.15 an hour to $7.25 - the first raise in a decade. "The minimum wage," as economist Gwendolyn Mink, makes clear, is supposed to guarantee an income floor to keep full-time wage-earners out of poverty. But today, the federal minimum wage guarantees abject poverty for workers... nearly $6,000 per year below the federal poverty line for a family of three." I'm all for a minimum wage increase, but do we really think if companies are forced to pay their workers more that they'll
just suck up the extra cost and not raise prices? I have a feeling prices would have skyrocketed if this had gone through. It would have put my present wage at under minimum. [snip]___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] water-fuel system

2006-06-26 Thread robert and benita rabello

Will Kelleher wrote:

 Hello,

 I always thought it would be really cool to power an internal 
 combustion engine with hydrogen derived from electrolysis powered by 
 the engine itself, but doesn't it take more energy to split the 
 hydrogen/oxygen that the hydrogen is able to produce when combusted? I 
 guess that's why this particular device requires 20% gasoline fuel.  
 Could that 20% be obtained from solar energy and just pumped into the 
 electrolysis to produce enough hydrogen to run the engine?  Also, what 
 if the engine was run on a mix of hydrogen and oxygen?  Would that be 
 more powerful? 

 Will Kelleher

The system described is known as hy-boost.  In essence, the 
fast-burning hydrogen acts like a catalyst that speeds the combustion of air / 
fuel and produces full expansion earlier in the power stroke.  It also serves 
to burn the fuel completely, so there are fewer combustion by-products that 
need to be handled in the catalytic converter.

This technique can be used to burn fuels that are less highly refined 
than modern gasoline.  Further, because hydrogen has such wide flammability 
limits, the engine can run VERY lean without the danger of burned valves and 
pistons.  It's an interesting technique, really, and one of the few practical 
uses for hydrogen in a transportation application that I can think of.  I'd 
like to try it in my truck when I get my Megasquirt computer up and running.

As far as the self-powering engine is concerned, you're right--it isn't 
going to happen.  Most of the best commercial electrolyzers operate somewhere 
in the 50 - 70 % efficiency range, unless you include process heat (which they 
often do) to bolster efficiency figures.


robert luis rabello
The Edge of Justice
Adventure for Your Mind
http://www.newadventure.ca

Ranger Supercharger Project Page
http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Class Warfare: The Minimum Wage Goes Down

2006-06-26 Thread John Mullan

No problems Michael.  It's just the overly simplistic way I see it.  It 
may very well be totally inaccurate and most certainly an 
over-simplification.

And you make a very good regarding participation.

Cheers,
John

Michael Redler wrote:

 Hi John,
  
 I don't mean to be a pain in the ass but, your focus is on company 
 profits, re-issue of currency, and monetary greed - not a common 
 denominator in an explanation on why both capitalist and communist 
 societies would fail.
  
 At least for now, it's not an explanation that makes sense to me.
  
 More to the point, governments irrespective of the model they follow, 
 fail because citizens do not realize the importance of participation 
 (IMHO).
  
 - Redler



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil consumption seen soaring

Everyone,The only reasonable solution to the energy crisis is solar! It's free and basically infinite. All we have to do is develop some better solar cells and batteries (or those new capacitors that everyone is talking about) to power our electric engines! 
Will KOn 6/26/06, Mike Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The bottom line is that the world has to go Hydrogen.Every once in a while we find a post that challenges years of research and discussion and asks everyone to take a giant step back and re-examine ideas on a particular issue long after a consensus has been reached, as if we've missed something.
Even though it's discouraging, I would be willing to re-examine an issueif new evidence reveals itself. In fact, I would consider it crucial.But, what's most discouraging is when a forum discusses energy strategy
for years, realizes that a comprehensive energy strategy will involvenumerous schemes for renewable energy and biofuels, then finds a post inthat forum that includes a statement to the effect of: The answer is
The oil industry has made us dependent on it, even when it's not thebest source of energy for a given application. It has brought men topower who have influenced the highest levels of government to ensure
that competitive alternatives are squashed. We've learned that a singleenergy source which fosters a dependence on it due to the exclusivity ofthe raw materials or technologies, provides a substitute for our current
dependency on oil. At it's worst, we know that such a dependency bringsto power those who will encourage a government to help them exploit oreven militarily control other countries.Although I keep an open mind toward all energy technologies (including
hydrogen), I encourage you not to place all importance on one.-RedlerMike Weaver wrote: You all know perfectly well the answer is Dilithium Crystals.No arguments, please.
 robert and benita rabello wrote: chem.dd wrote: The bottom line is that the world has to go Hydrogen.
Are you SURE you want to go there in this forum?I'd be laughing if your proposition wasn't so sad. robert luis rabello The Edge of Justice
 Adventure for Your Mind http://www.newadventure.ca Ranger Supercharger Project Page 
http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Tanks for storing Biodiesel

Tom,I know that some drum manufacturors sell 55 gallon steel drums with an epoxy lining. This could be the case with your methanol drum. I don't think the biodiesel will dissolve the epoxy, but I don't know for sure. Hope that helps.
Will KelleherOn 6/18/06, Thomas Kelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Hello to all,
I would like to start
storing some biodiesel to be used as heating fuel this winter.
I have two 55 gallon
(209L)drumsthat methanol came in. They are blue tanks with VP
Racing on them. I was told that they are only used for methanol and are lined
with something. I plan to tee them into my heating fuel line.
Will they make suitable
tanks for storing biodiesel? I'm a bit concerned about the lining. It is
apparently a feature that makes them more valuable for methanol storage, but
will biodiesel dissolve it?

Tom

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] An Inconvenient Truth

2006-06-26 Thread Sarath G


I saw the movie this weekend and I was very impressed by the story and facts. Not that this is a new topic to any of the members on this list, but the portrayal of clear and present dangers of looming climate change are well illustrated and makes an extra effort to bring this issue to public focus.

Sarath

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil consumption seen soaring




acually the "supercap battery" that fits a 9V 
package is all about space efficiency, if you wanted to, you could build a 
multifarad capacitor out of tinfoil andplastic wrapin a 5 gallon 
bucket for a similar effect with lower cost, justWAAAY too big for a 9V 
package, and heavy-heavy. (i spent all too much time in the electronics lab in 
college...)

JasonICQ#: 154998177MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to 
get me)

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Will 
  Kelleher 
  To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  
  Sent: Monday, June 26, 2006 3:54 PM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil 
  consumption seen soaring
  Everyone,The only reasonable solution to the energy 
  crisis is solar! It's free and basically infinite. All we have to 
  do is develop some better solar cells and batteries (or those new capacitors 
  that everyone is talking about) to power our electric engines! 
  Will K
  On 6/26/06, Mike 
  Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  "The 
bottom line is that the world has to go Hydrogen."Every once in a 
while we find a post that challenges years of research and discussion and 
asks everyone to take a giant step back and re-examine ideas on a particular 
issue long after a consensus has been reached, as if we've missed something. 
Even though it's discouraging, I would be willing to re-examine an 
issueif new evidence reveals itself. In fact, I would consider it 
crucial.But, what's most discouraging is when a forum discusses 
energy strategy for years, realizes that a comprehensive energy strategy 
will involvenumerous schemes for renewable energy and biofuels, then 
finds a post inthat forum that includes a statement to the effect of: 
"The answer is...". The oil industry has made us dependent on it, 
even when it's not thebest source of energy for a given application. It 
has brought men topower who have influenced the highest levels of 
government to ensurethat competitive alternatives are squashed. We've 
learned that a singleenergy source which fosters a dependence on it due 
to the exclusivity ofthe raw materials or technologies, provides a 
substitute for our current dependency on oil. At it's worst, we know 
that such a dependency bringsto power those who will encourage a 
government to help them exploit oreven militarily control other 
countries.Although I keep an open mind toward all energy 
technologies (including hydrogen), I encourage you not to place all 
importance on one.-RedlerMike Weaver wrote: You 
all know perfectly well the answer is Dilithium 
Crystals.No arguments, please. robert 
and benita rabello wrote: chem.dd 
wrote: The 
bottom line is that the world has to go 
Hydrogen. 
Are you 
SURE you want to go there in this forum?I'd be laughing 
if your proposition wasn't so sad. 
robert luis rabello "The Edge of Justice"  Adventure 
for Your Mind http://www.newadventure.ca 
Ranger Supercharger Project Page http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/___Biofuel 
mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel 
at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch 
the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
  
  

  ___Biofuel mailing 
  listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel 
  at Journey to 
  Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the 
  combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
  messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
  
  

  No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free 
  Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.4/375 - Release Date: 
  6/25/2006
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.4/375 - Release Date: 6/25/2006
___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] The Death of US Engineering

  Will,I earned my B.S. in mechanical engineering technology in 1992 and  worked as a mechanical design engineer for seven years. Frustrated by  the lack of legitimate and rewarding work, I earned a BSEE in 2000 with  the idea that you must apply theory to something which has no moving  parts. The math and applied science has to stay in tact. That turned  out to be partially true and I worked on analog circuit design and  motor controls for another seven years.Anyway, my advice to you is stay sharp, learn what you can and go for  that degree (if that's your ambition) because eventually, the  industries which were abandoned will need help in the coming recovery,  one which (IMO) will last a generation....an optimists point of view of one of the most destructive and incompetent US administrations ever.  -Redler  Will Kelleher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  Maybe now isn't that best time to get an electrical engineering degree :-/Will KOn 6/23/06, D. Mindock   [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  The Death of US   EngineeringBy Paul Craig RobertsThe   May payroll jobs report released June 2 by the Bureau of LaborStatistics   confirms the jobs pattern for the 21st century US economy:employment growth   is limited to domestic services.In May the economy created only
 67,000   private sector jobs. Jobestimates for the previous two months were reduced   by 37,000.The new jobs are as follows: professional and business   services, 27,000;education and health services, 41,000; waitresses and   bartenders,10,000. Manufacturing lost 14,000 jobs.Total hours worked   in the private sector declined in May.Manufacturing hours worked are 6.6   percent less than when the recoverybegan four and one-half years   ago.American economists and policymakers are in denial about the effect   ofjobs offshoring on US employment. Corporate lobbyists have   purchasedfraudulent studies from economists that claim offshoring results in   moreUS employment rather than less. The same lobbyists have   spreaddisinformation that the US does not graduate enough engineers and   thatthey must import foreigners on work
 visas.[snip]___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil consumption seen soaring

I'm with you on that one Will.   And if regenerative braking  becomes commonplace in electric vehicles, think of the energy savings  when the bulk of your off-highway miles comes from wind resistance and  not acceleration.Imagine the energy recycled from a 2000lb car accelerating from zero to sixty miles per hour in 10 seconds.Assuming a regenerative breaking system with an efficiency of 100% (for  the sake of conversation, electric motors/generators are pretty  efficient), I did some calculations and came up with approximately .01  gallons (1.28oz fl) of gasoline each time that car accelerates. That's  what's lost today and maybe gained repeatedly during every trip in  every car in the future.Something not taken into consideration by people like George Monbiot (Re: "Feeding Cars or People").Of course, cars may become lighter (with any luck) and the fuel saved  will be on the acceleration side instead of recycling
 energy during  braking.Even if the energy doesn't come from gasoline in the future, the same principle applies - significant energy savings.- Redler_  Calculations:60mph = 26.8m/sec  (26.8/10)ft/sec^22000lbs=907KgF=ma=907*2.6m/sec^2=2431Ndist= .5at^2 =.5*2.68*100=134mWork=Fd=2431N*134m=325788Nm=309Btu309Btu/(125,000Btu per gallon)=.00247 gallons.00247gal/(25% efficiency for internal combustion engines)=.01 gallons=1.28ozflWill Kelleher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  Everyone,The  only reasonable solution to the energy crisis is solar! It's free  and basically infinite. All we have to do is develop some better  solar cells and batteries (or
 those new capacitors that everyone is  talking about) to power our electric engines! Will KOn 6/26/06, Mike Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  "The bottom line is that the world has to go Hydrogen."Every  once in a while we find a post that challenges years of research and  discussion and asks everyone to take a giant step back and re-examine  ideas on a particular issue long after a consensus has been reached, as  if we've missed something. Even though it's discouraging, I would be willing to re-examine an issueif new evidence reveals itself. In fact, I would consider it crucial.But, what's most discouraging is when a forum discusses energy strategy  for years, realizes that a
 comprehensive energy strategy will involvenumerous schemes for renewable energy and biofuels, then finds a post inthat forum that includes a statement to the effect of: "The answer is...".  The oil industry has made us dependent on it, even when it's not thebest source of energy for a given application. It has brought men topower who have influenced the highest levels of government to ensure  that competitive alternatives are squashed. We've learned that a singleenergy source which fosters a dependence on it due to the exclusivity ofthe raw materials or technologies, provides a substitute for our current  dependency on oil. At it's worst, we know that such a dependency bringsto power those who will encourage a government to help them exploit oreven militarily control other countries.Although I keep an open mind toward all energy technologies (including  hydrogen), I encourage you not to place all importance on
 one.-RedlerMike Weaver wrote: You all know perfectly well the answer is Dilithium Crystals.No arguments, please.   robert and benita rabello wrote: chem.dd wrote: The bottom line is that the world has to go Hydrogen.  Are you SURE you want to go there in this forum?I'd be laughing if your proposition wasn't so sad. robert luis rabello "The Edge of Justice"   Adventure for Your Mind http://www.newadventure.ca Ranger Supercharger Project Page  
 http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org  http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html  Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to
 Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil consumption seen soaring

2006-06-26 Thread Kurt Nolte

Jason Katie wrote:
 acually the supercap battery that fits a 9V package is all about 
 space efficiency, if you wanted to, you could build a multifarad 
 capacitor out of tinfoil and plastic wrap in a 5 gallon bucket for a 
 similar effect with lower cost, just WAAAY too big for a 9V package, 
 and heavy-heavy. (i spent all too much time in the electronics lab in 
 college...)

Tell me more I have way, way too many 5-gallon buckets hanging 
around since I saved them from being thrown away, and the car has a 
#$*-ton of space in the back...  ;)

Be kinda cool to have the first diesel-electric hybrid Syncro.


-K

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] The Death of US Engineering

I agree. My engineering degree may not get me a job (well, it did, but it was lousy pay, and in a cube), but it (along with alot of hands on experience) will aid immensly when I need to deal with the crazy world we are entering when services such as electricity, food, heat, water, etc, are not just available for purchase, but when we must find our own ways of getting them.
On 6/26/06, Michael Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Will,I earned my B.S. in mechanical engineering technology in 1992 and  worked as a mechanical design engineer for seven years. Frustrated by  the lack of legitimate and rewarding work, I earned a BSEE in 2000 with  the idea that you must apply theory to something which has no moving  parts. The math and applied science has to stay in tact. That turned  out to be partially true and I worked on analog circuit design and  motor controls for another seven years.
Anyway, my advice to you is stay sharp, learn what you can and go for  that degree (if that's your ambition) because eventually, the  industries which were abandoned will need help in the coming recovery,  one which (IMO) will last a generation.
...an optimists point of view of one of the most destructive and incompetent US administrations ever.  -Redler  Will Kelleher 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  Maybe now isn't that best time to get an electrical engineering degree :-/
Will KOn 6/23/06, D. Mindock 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
The Death of US   EngineeringBy Paul Craig Roberts

The   May payroll jobs report released June 2 by the Bureau of LaborStatistics   confirms the jobs pattern for the 21st century US economy:employment growth   is limited to domestic services.
In May the economy created only
 67,000   private sector jobs. Jobestimates for the previous two months were reduced   by 37,000.The new jobs are as follows: professional and business   services, 27,000;education and health services, 41,000; waitresses and   bartenders,
10,000. Manufacturing lost 14,000 jobs.Total hours worked   in the private sector declined in May.Manufacturing hours worked are 6.6   percent less than when the recoverybegan four and one-half years   ago.
American economists and policymakers are in denial about the effect   ofjobs offshoring on US employment. Corporate lobbyists have   purchasedfraudulent studies from economists that claim offshoring results in   more
US employment rather than less. The same lobbyists have   spreaddisinformation that the US does not graduate enough engineers and   thatthey must import foreigners on work
 visas.[snip]

___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
Biofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] The Death of US Engineering




i believe any engineering degree would be needed 
for personal uses long before the "system" collapses. how else would the garage 
tinker, or the backyard designer survive the idiocy bestowed upon the people of 
america by decades of complacency and sheeple-ism?

JasonICQ#: 154998177MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to 
get me)

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Michael Redler 
  
  To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  
  Sent: Monday, June 26, 2006 9:00 PM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] The Death of US 
  Engineering
  Will,I earned my B.S. in mechanical engineering 
  technology in 1992 and worked as a mechanical design engineer for seven years. 
  Frustrated by the lack of legitimate and rewarding work, I earned a BSEE in 
  2000 with the idea that you must apply theory to something which has no moving 
  parts. The math and applied science has to stay in tact. That turned out to be 
  partially true and I worked on analog circuit design and motor controls for 
  another seven years.Anyway, my advice to you is stay sharp, learn what 
  you can and go for that degree (if that's your ambition) because eventually, 
  the industries which were abandoned will need help in the coming recovery, one 
  which (IMO) will last a generationan optimists point of view of 
  one of the most destructive and incompetent US administrations 
  ever.-RedlerWill Kelleher 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Maybe 
now isn't that best time to get an electrical engineering degree 
:-/Will K
On 6/23/06, D. 
Mindock  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  
  
  The Death of US 
  EngineeringBy Paul Craig RobertsThe May payroll jobs report released June 2 by the Bureau of 
  LaborStatistics confirms the jobs pattern for the 21st century US 
  economy:employment growth is limited to domestic services.In 
  May the economy created only 67,000 private sector jobs. Jobestimates 
  for the previous two months were reduced by 37,000.The new jobs 
  are as follows: professional and business services, 27,000;education 
  and health services, 41,000; waitresses and bartenders,10,000. 
  Manufacturing lost 14,000 jobs.Total hours worked in the private 
  sector declined in May.Manufacturing hours worked are 6.6 percent less 
  than when the recoverybegan four and one-half years 
  ago.American economists and policymakers are in denial about the 
  effect ofjobs offshoring on US employment. Corporate lobbyists have 
  purchasedfraudulent studies from economists that claim offshoring 
  results in moreUS employment rather than less. The same lobbyists have 
  spreaddisinformation that the US does not graduate enough engineers 
  and thatthey must import foreigners on work 
  visas.[snip]
  
  

  ___Biofuel mailing 
  listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel 
  at Journey to 
  Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the 
  combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
  messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
  
  

  No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free 
  Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.4/375 - Release Date: 
  6/25/2006
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.4/375 - Release Date: 6/25/2006
___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Worldwide oil consumption seen soaring