RE: CHRISTMAS!

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

What kind of conflict are you having with reaper? Explain the conflict maybe I 
can solve it in windows10. Most stuff that works with win7 also works on win10 
no problems. 


Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: bj colt via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, December 26, 2017 08:49
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: bj colt
Subject: Re: CHRISTMAS!

Hi Carol,

I'm still using windows 7 and Firefox. I installed the extended edition and 
it works for me. It is slow though. I had my other pc refurbished and they 
put windows 10 on it. I use a program called Reaper for multi track 
recording and there is a conflict in windows 10. I have to get windows 7 
back on it.lol

I will give it a try before Isend it back.lol

I'm a bit like my African grey parrot. Slow to accept new things. I think if 
it works don't fix it.lol Good luck with windows 10. I was chatting to a 
friend and I think that technology is moving towards voice activation. Have 
you any thoughts on it? Like this Amazon Alexi. Think that's what it's 
called. Some of my blind friends love it. I'm not sure about it yet. At the 
moment I think it is too invasive.

Christmas Greetings, BJ

--
From: "Carol and Roger via Talk" 
Sent: Tuesday, December 26, 2017 12:18 PM
To: "Window-Eyes Discussion List" 
Cc: "Carol and Roger" 
Subject: Re: CHRISTMAS!

> Yes, Thank you.  I now have a very new and quite a bit daunting computer 
> with Windows 10.  I have installed Window-Eyes on it and am going to start 
> moving files over this week.  I am a bit behind on things like ribbons, so 
> it is taking a little longer for me to get my head wrapped around things. 
> Funny, but the old PC seems to be running a bit better, except, of course, 
> the browsers, grin.  I suppose I would get more familiar with the new one 
> if I would just stop using the other one.  Take care.
>
> Carol
>
>
> On 12/26/2017 5:52 AM, bj colt via Talk wrote:
>> Hi Carol,
>>
>> Thank you for your kind thoughts. I hope you too are well? Not doing 
>> great but have a battle to face in the new year. I will get through it 
>> though and come out the other side smiling.
>>
>> I'm still enjoying Christmas and like most over ate.lol
>>
>> Hope Santa was good to you as well.
>>
>> Christmas Wishes, BJ
>>
>> --
>> From: "Carol and Roger via Talk" 
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 26, 2017 1:07 AM
>> To: "Window-Eyes Discussion List" 
>> Cc: "Carol and Roger" 
>> Subject: Re: CHRISTMAS!
>>
>>> Hey BJ,
>>>
>>> It's been a long time.  Merry Christmas.  Hope you are well and wish you 
>>> a great New Year.
>>>
>>> Carol
>>>
>>> For the rest of us that are still celebraring, enjoy the rest of your 
>>> Christmas.
>>>
>>> Carol
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 12/25/2017 6:40 PM, bj colt via Talk wrote:
 Merry Christmas to everyone. I hope their is a light that shines in 
 everyones home today. The light of peace, friendship and love.

 Christmas
 Wishes John

 -Original Message- From: Norene Trappa via Talk
 Sent: Monday, December 25, 2017 10:41 PM
 To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
 Cc: Norene Trappa
 Subject: Re: CHRISTMAS!

 And a blessed Christmas to you also.

 Norene



 -Original Message- From: Bob Tinney via Talk
 Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2017 9:57 PM
 To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
 Cc: Bob Tinney
 Subject: CHRISTMAS!

 We wish you and yours a very Merry and joyful Christmas,

 and a very Happy, peaceful  and prosperous New Year!

>>>
>>> ___
>>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the 
>>> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>>
>>> For membership options, visit 
>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/bjcolt%40blueyonder.co.uk.
>>> For subscription options, visit 
>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>> List archives can be found at 
>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>
>> ___
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>> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
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>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/carogsmith%40embarqmail.com.
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>>
>
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RE: Win10 and WE

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

you keep getting bogged down in recent folders and stuff? 
1. Press windows I for settings.
2. Right arrow or tab into the list view tab works best.
3. Right arrow to personizalation in the list view sorry that is 
personalization…
4. Press enter on personalization.
5. Tab to the list iew view once more.
6. Down arrow to themes.
7. Hit enter to select themes.
8. Tab through themes till you get to the desktop icons link and hit enter.
9. Now you can customize your icons.
10. Once done, and you hit ok your new settings are saved.
11. To make your start menu less cluttered there is also a start menu 
customizer in the personalization section in windows10 settings.
12. Windows10 is excellent. And I would not ever go back to windows7, not even 
if you paid me to do so!!!

Josh
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RE: Win10 and WE

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

To see the size of the disk, if using NVDA first press insert n for NVDA menu, 
go into preferences, go down to  object presentation, press enter. Make sure 
show or read tooltips is checked and most other things in that dialog are 
checked. Tab to ok and hit enter then press control insert c to save settings. 
Now go into this pc. You’re in a list view. Hit the end key on the keyboard and 
you’ll be at the bottom of the list where your hard drives are at. Left arrow 
to the c: drive. NVDA will tell you the c: drive is highlighted, and if you 
stay there a second or two longer NVDA will read its tooltip and tell you how 
much of the drive is used, and how much is free. 


Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Carol and Roger via Talk
Sent: Sunday, December 17, 2017 21:42
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Carol and Roger
Subject: Win10 and WE

Hi,

My first question is a bit trivial.  In My Computer, I could arrow or 
tab to see the size of the disk and how much space was left. Is there a 
way to do this in Win10?

Also, Is there a way to get Win10 to behave more like Win7?  I keep 
getting bogged down in the recent folder and favorites and all I want to 
do is have things back like they used to be, grin. I know things will be 
different, but for now, it seems like there are way too many levels and 
to get where I want to be, I sometimes fine myself in level 5 or 6.  Can 
anyone give me any quick fixes to get myself organized?  Thanks lots.

Carol


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RE: 3 questions about knfb reader

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

Not sure about the first one, but IPhone and android phones do not have arrow 
keys. They mostly have touch screens. There are on screen buttons to let you 
read text that you have to double tap the screen to activate. You can save 
files in knfb’s own file format, and you can also save in html and txt or plain 
text, I think. And that is all. You can also sink knfb with dropbox and save 
your files to dropbox. 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: BK via Talk
Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2017 15:55
To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
Cc: BK
Subject: 3 questions about knfb reader

Hello, anyone know how to join the knfb reader mailing list? I tried to
join from the web page, but the link was dead. Also, can you read text
in knfb reader with the arrow keys, like you can in a word processor.
Finally, what formats can you save files in. Thank you
much.

Butch

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RE: Question About KNFB and camera.

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

To read pdf’s you do not need a camera. 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Robert Ringwald via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2017 12:25
To: Talk
Cc: Robert Ringwald
Subject: Question About KNFB and camera. 

I do not have a smart phone. In order to use the KNFB program to just read 
PDF's on the computer, do I need a camera? Or can it be done internally 
within the computer?

Windows 10.




Bob Ringwald piano, Solo, Duo, Trio, Quartet, Quintet
Fulton Street Jazz Band (Dixieland/Swing)
916/ 806-9551
Check out my performing schedule: www.ringwald.com/schedule.php
Amateur (ham) Radio Station K6YBV

“If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed,
if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed.” -- Mark Twain



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RE: camera for knfb reader

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

The hover cam and the Ziggy are two different products. You choose one or the 
other. 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Andre via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2017 11:14
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Andre
Subject: RE: camera for knfb reader

Has knfb reader changed? I thought it was a software program for your
computer or an app for your smart phone which would already have a built-in
camera.

How would this be able to be used with the ziggi cam or this thing called
the hover cam?

Are there better cameras than these that would give you even better results?


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+stepserve=comcast@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Monday, November 27, 2017 5:55 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: RE: camera for knfb reader

Just make sure it is an 8mp camera. That will give you good results. 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: BK via Talk
Sent: Monday, November 27, 2017 15:39
To: gw micro
Cc: BK
Subject: camera for knfb reader

Hello, I just downloaded the knfb reader. Now I am looking for
recommendations for a camera to use with it. Is there much difference
between the ziggi cam and the hover cam, and what about the price? I
hear one cost about 400 and the other about 100. Is the difference in
cost worth it? And where can I buy one? All suggestions are appreciated.

Butch

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RE: camera for knfb reader

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

Just make sure it is an 8mp camera. That will give you good results. 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: BK via Talk
Sent: Monday, November 27, 2017 15:39
To: gw micro
Cc: BK
Subject: camera for knfb reader

Hello, I just downloaded the knfb reader. Now I am looking for
recommendations for a camera to use with it. Is there much difference
between the ziggi cam and the hover cam, and what about the price? I
hear one cost about 400 and the other about 100. Is the difference in
cost worth it? And where can I buy one? All suggestions are appreciated.

Butch

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RE: need new PC recommendations

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

The Bose speakers are very good. 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Moe Adl via Talk
Sent: Saturday, November 25, 2017 10:18
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Moe Adl
Subject: RE: need new PC recommendations

Hello,
I  just recently bought a  new computer and looking for good external
speakers, based on what I  am reading below you seem to be very
knowledgeable in subject.  Would you please make a recommendations?
Thank you so much.

Moe 

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+madl=comcast@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Janet Brandly via Talk
Sent: Friday, November 24, 2017 9:28 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Janet Brandly 
Subject: Re: need new PC recommendations

David, thank you for such a thorough article.
Janet


-Original Message-
From: David via Talk
Sent: Friday, November 24, 2017 10:21 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: David
Subject: Re: need new PC recommendations

Basically, the more RAM, the better. Yet, to a certain degree, lack of RAM
can often be compensated by an SSD, instead of a harddisk. SSD in its very
basic form, is nothing but a huge RAM. And be fore anyone arrests me, I did
say in its basic terms, since there would be a whole article to be written,
in order for dealing with all the details of those choices.


Still, getting a computer with loads of RAM, and a slow harddisk, might turn
out to be just as bad as a computer with somehow less RAM, and an SSD. Guess
is that 12GB RAM with a harddisk, will perform much like an 8GB with SSD.


Now, this only took care of a third of the computer issue, seen from a
technical standpoint. Next comes the CPU speed, the question of whether the
computer has a dedicated Graphics card, which would unload the main CPU from
all that goes to the screen.


As a third issue to be considered, would be the sound. Since you are using
it as a blind person, you do not want to end up with speakers that sounds
like they had been dug out of the trash bin. Not sure how well sounding most
computers are now aday, since I personally prefer to buy second-hand
devices, a year or two old. This lets me often get hold of higher-class
devices, for the same price that I would have to pay for low-end stuff on
sale, while it is brand new. Business class models often has far better
components, are built with stronger materials, and might be less loaded with
clutter and silly-ware. Specially if you are looking for a portable unit,
you might want to look into the mid-classed, that is the beginning of the
business class in some cases, to get hold of a proper system.


I am currently running a Dell Latitude model myself, and have been really
well pleased with the performance. It still runs on its 4GB, and I took the
plunge and installed an SSD a couple of years ago. For differen reasons I
did have it running back on its original Hard disk, last year for a little
bit of time. The performance was afordable, but nothing more than that. The
day I re-inserted the SSD, the speed was like going from 10 to 50 miles an
hour, in less than the twinkle of an eye. That is why I do claim, that an
SSD might be a better go, than the higher RAM.


If you want to play safe, why not go for a system that easily can be
upgraded. Buy it with low RAM and an SSD now, and upgrade it with more RAM,
should you find the need. Just do make sure, as a number of modern computers
come fully loaded already, meaning that if they are sold with 8GB RAM, that
is the maximum of what they can ever take. Again, these are the models that
typically ends up on sale.


Sure, sale is a wonderful way of saving a few bugs. Unfortunately, often the
stuff that goes on the best-price sales, will be the low-end models, which
tends to be non-upgradable. I would be a bit sceptical to buy such models,
unless you are very eager on getting a new computer next time there is a
major upgrade to some software. Smiles. Do you have the money, go one or two
steps up, as it might give you a system that is going to serve you for the
next few many years.


And, don't forget! Please buy from sources that will accept returns. Even if
possible, buy from stores that can answer your questions - beforehand. Many
computers now aday do have silly keyboard layouts. Some models have even
changed the default behavior of the function keys, which is a real pain -
not only for you and I, but even for driven sighted users. You do want the
store to either guarantee you will have the standard function keys, or who
are willing to do the necessary modification in the BIOS, should you go for
one of the affected models.


OK, lot of this info is not fully relevant, if you are looking at desktop
models. They are often more upgradable, and will be less affected by things
like the function key issue.


As I am still hanging on to my Win7, I am not in a position to answer fully
your questions around Office. But I would have thought Office 2007 might
still be 

RE: need new PC recommendations

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

The windows10 laptop I got for $250 off amazon is very very fast for my needs. 
And I also suggested to Microsoft through their feedback hub to add touch 
braille input for both computer braille and grade2 braille so we can quickly 
write in braille on windows10 touch screen tablets and 2-in-1’s. 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Friday, November 24, 2017 12:25
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: RE: need new PC recommendations

Well, how about the Lenovo laptops on amazon.
Just go to amazon and type in: laptop with amd a12

You’ll find great deals now. 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: David via Talk
Sent: Friday, November 24, 2017 12:21
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: David
Subject: Re: need new PC recommendations

Basically, the more RAM, the better. Yet, to a certain degree, lack of RAM can 
often be compensated by an SSD, instead of a harddisk. SSD in its very basic 
form, is nothing but a huge RAM. And be fore anyone arrests me, I did say in 
its basic terms, since there would be a whole article to be written, in order 
for dealing with all the details of those choices.


Still, getting a computer with loads of RAM, and a slow harddisk, might turn 
out to be just as bad as a computer with somehow less RAM, and an SSD. Guess is 
that 12GB RAM with a harddisk, will perform much like an 8GB with SSD.


Now, this only took care of a third of the computer issue, seen from a 
technical standpoint. Next comes the CPU speed, the question of whether the 
computer has a dedicated Graphics card, which would unload the main CPU from 
all that goes to the screen.


As a third issue to be considered, would be the sound. Since you are using it 
as a blind person, you do not want to end up with speakers that sounds like 
they had been dug out of the trash bin. Not sure how well sounding most 
computers are now aday, since I personally prefer to buy second-hand devices, a 
year or two old. This lets me often get hold of higher-class devices, for the 
same price that I would have to pay for low-end stuff on sale, while it is 
brand new. Business class models often has far better components, are built 
with stronger materials, and might be less loaded with clutter and silly-ware. 
Specially if you are looking for a portable unit, you might want to look into 
the mid-classed, that is the beginning of the business class in some cases, to 
get hold of a proper system.


I am currently running a Dell Latitude model myself, and have been really well 
pleased with the performance. It still runs on its 4GB, and I took the plunge 
and installed an SSD a couple of years ago. For differen reasons I did have it 
running back on its original Hard disk, last year for a little bit of time. The 
performance was afordable, but nothing more than that. The day I re-inserted 
the SSD, the speed was like going from 10 to 50 miles an hour, in less than the 
twinkle of an eye. That is why I do claim, that an SSD might be a better go, 
than the higher RAM.


If you want to play safe, why not go for a system that easily can be upgraded. 
Buy it with low RAM and an SSD now, and upgrade it with more RAM, should you 
find the need. Just do make sure, as a number of modern computers come fully 
loaded already, meaning that if they are sold with 8GB RAM, that is the maximum 
of what they can ever take. Again, these are the models that typically ends up 
on sale.


Sure, sale is a wonderful way of saving a few bugs. Unfortunately, often the 
stuff that goes on the best-price sales, will be the low-end models, which 
tends to be non-upgradable. I would be a bit sceptical to buy such models, 
unless you are very eager on getting a new computer next time there is a major 
upgrade to some software. Smiles. Do you have the money, go one or two steps 
up, as it might give you a system that is going to serve you for the next few 
many years.


And, don't forget! Please buy from sources that will accept returns. Even if 
possible, buy from stores that can answer your questions - beforehand. Many 
computers now aday do have silly keyboard layouts. Some models have even 
changed the default behavior of the function keys, which is a real pain - not 
only for you and I, but even for driven sighted users. You do want the store to 
either guarantee you will have the standard function keys, or who are willing 
to do the necessary modification in the BIOS, should you go for one of the 
affected models.


OK, lot of this info is not fully relevant, if you are looking at desktop 
models. They are often more upgradable, and will be less affected by things 
like the function key issue.


As I am still hanging on to my Win7, I am not in a position to answer fully 
your questions around Office. But I would have thought Office 2007 might still 
be valid under Win10. A quick search on the net, might be a good lane to go. 
Why not search for something like:

running MSOffice under Win10

, and see what

RE: need new PC recommendations

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

Well, how about the Lenovo laptops on amazon.
Just go to amazon and type in: laptop with amd a12

You’ll find great deals now. 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: David via Talk
Sent: Friday, November 24, 2017 12:21
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: David
Subject: Re: need new PC recommendations

Basically, the more RAM, the better. Yet, to a certain degree, lack of RAM can 
often be compensated by an SSD, instead of a harddisk. SSD in its very basic 
form, is nothing but a huge RAM. And be fore anyone arrests me, I did say in 
its basic terms, since there would be a whole article to be written, in order 
for dealing with all the details of those choices.


Still, getting a computer with loads of RAM, and a slow harddisk, might turn 
out to be just as bad as a computer with somehow less RAM, and an SSD. Guess is 
that 12GB RAM with a harddisk, will perform much like an 8GB with SSD.


Now, this only took care of a third of the computer issue, seen from a 
technical standpoint. Next comes the CPU speed, the question of whether the 
computer has a dedicated Graphics card, which would unload the main CPU from 
all that goes to the screen.


As a third issue to be considered, would be the sound. Since you are using it 
as a blind person, you do not want to end up with speakers that sounds like 
they had been dug out of the trash bin. Not sure how well sounding most 
computers are now aday, since I personally prefer to buy second-hand devices, a 
year or two old. This lets me often get hold of higher-class devices, for the 
same price that I would have to pay for low-end stuff on sale, while it is 
brand new. Business class models often has far better components, are built 
with stronger materials, and might be less loaded with clutter and silly-ware. 
Specially if you are looking for a portable unit, you might want to look into 
the mid-classed, that is the beginning of the business class in some cases, to 
get hold of a proper system.


I am currently running a Dell Latitude model myself, and have been really well 
pleased with the performance. It still runs on its 4GB, and I took the plunge 
and installed an SSD a couple of years ago. For differen reasons I did have it 
running back on its original Hard disk, last year for a little bit of time. The 
performance was afordable, but nothing more than that. The day I re-inserted 
the SSD, the speed was like going from 10 to 50 miles an hour, in less than the 
twinkle of an eye. That is why I do claim, that an SSD might be a better go, 
than the higher RAM.


If you want to play safe, why not go for a system that easily can be upgraded. 
Buy it with low RAM and an SSD now, and upgrade it with more RAM, should you 
find the need. Just do make sure, as a number of modern computers come fully 
loaded already, meaning that if they are sold with 8GB RAM, that is the maximum 
of what they can ever take. Again, these are the models that typically ends up 
on sale.


Sure, sale is a wonderful way of saving a few bugs. Unfortunately, often the 
stuff that goes on the best-price sales, will be the low-end models, which 
tends to be non-upgradable. I would be a bit sceptical to buy such models, 
unless you are very eager on getting a new computer next time there is a major 
upgrade to some software. Smiles. Do you have the money, go one or two steps 
up, as it might give you a system that is going to serve you for the next few 
many years.


And, don't forget! Please buy from sources that will accept returns. Even if 
possible, buy from stores that can answer your questions - beforehand. Many 
computers now aday do have silly keyboard layouts. Some models have even 
changed the default behavior of the function keys, which is a real pain - not 
only for you and I, but even for driven sighted users. You do want the store to 
either guarantee you will have the standard function keys, or who are willing 
to do the necessary modification in the BIOS, should you go for one of the 
affected models.


OK, lot of this info is not fully relevant, if you are looking at desktop 
models. They are often more upgradable, and will be less affected by things 
like the function key issue.


As I am still hanging on to my Win7, I am not in a position to answer fully 
your questions around Office. But I would have thought Office 2007 might still 
be valid under Win10. A quick search on the net, might be a good lane to go. 
Why not search for something like:

running MSOffice under Win10

, and see what feedback people have on the matter. Even 10-15 minutes of quick 
reading, might give you a pretty good feeling on how smoothly people have found 
the experience.


As computers now aday are quite varying, if you have the time and chance, going 
to a store and get hands-on feeling with a couple of models, might be worth the 
trip. Even if you don't intend to buy from the store, do your research, make up 
your mind, and then go home and order over the net. Shipping a computer back 
and 

RE: What is a KNFB Reader?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

Touch screens are easy to use. And if your ipod is 3 or 4 years old its camera 
probably is not good enough for knfb reader. You need a new one. A new ipod 
touch 6th gen. 


Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Butch Bussen
Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2017 14:08
To: Josh Kennedy
Cc: Josh Kennedy via Talk
Subject: RE: What is a KNFB Reader?

How would I know.  I think it is an ipod touch, five I think.  I've had 
it 3 or 4 years I think.  I don't use it much at all, can't get use to 
touch screens.
73
Butch
WA0VJR
Node 3148
Wallace, ks.


On Thu, 23 Nov 2017, Josh Kennedy wrote:

> Yes if the ipod has 8mp camera with flash then it will work fine.
>
>
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>
> From: Butch Bussen
> Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2017 09:56
> To: Josh Kennedy via Talk
> Cc: Josh Kennedy
> Subject: RE: What is a KNFB Reader?
>
> I don't have an i phone, will it work with an i pod?  Not sure what
> version of firmware I have.
> On Wed, 22 Nov 2017, Josh Kennedy via Talk
> wrote:
>
>> Ok here is how you use knfb reader this is just an example.
>> Imagine you are a student in college. You have some paper handouts that you 
>> got from class that you cannot read, you also have  a print textbook. So how 
>> do you read it? First you unlock your android phone or your iPhone. Then you 
>> go into the knnfb reader app. And then you hold the phone a foot above the 
>> page. And then you press the field of view report button first making sure 
>> you are pointing the camera on the bottom of the phone down towards the 
>> page. Then you hit field of view report button you double tap it on the 
>> phone’s touch screen. You hear your phone say outloud with its screen 
>> reader:
>>
>> All four corners of the page are visible.
>>
>> Then holding the phone as steady as you can, you double tap the take picture 
>> button. The phone snaps a photo of the page, does OCR on the text, and reads 
>> the text out loud to you. And you can scan whole entire books very very fast 
>> with just the 8mp camera on your smartphone.
>>
>>
>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>>
>> From: Robert Ringwald via Talk
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 19:18
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Cc: Robert Ringwald
>> Subject: Re: What is a KNFB Reader?
>>
>> But what does it do?
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 4:05 PM
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Cc: Josh Kennedy
>> Subject: RE: What is a KNFB Reader?
>>
>> I have knfb reader on my android phone and it works great.
>>
>>
>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>>
>> From: Tom Kingston via Talk
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 16:03
>> To: Josh Kennedy via Talk
>> Cc: Tom Kingston
>> Subject: Re: What is a KNFB Reader?
>>
>> And it's a fabulous OCR which is how it started. I have it on my iPhone
>> and can read just about anything imaginable. Think beyond a document
>> reader. I've read food boxes, cans, button labels and serial numbers on
>> gadgets, etc. It also works pretty good when you have to read your
>> computer screen or any other kind of display.
>> There's also a free one from Microsoft called seeing AI. It's useful but
>> doesn't compare to KNFB when it comes right down to it.
>> Regards,
>> Tom
>>
>>
>> On 11/22/2017 2:01 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:
>>> Yes you can read pdfs with it. It works on iPhone and android and on
>>> windows10 devices.
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>>>
>>> From: Robert Ringwald via Talk
>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 13:12
>>> To: Talk
>>> Cc: Robert Ringwald
>>> Subject: What is a KNFB Reader?
>>>
>>> I see it is on sale.
>>>
>>> Can you read PDFs with it?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Bob Ringwald piano, Solo, Duo, Trio, Quartet, Quintet
>>> Fulton Street Jazz Band (Dixieland/Swing)
>>> 916/ 806-9551
>>> Amateur (ham) Radio Station K6YBV
>>>
>>> “If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed,
>>> if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed.” -- Mark Twain
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---
>>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>>>
>>> ___
>>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely thos

RE: What is a KNFB Reader?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

Yes if the ipod has 8mp camera with flash then it will work fine. 


Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Butch Bussen
Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2017 09:56
To: Josh Kennedy via Talk
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: RE: What is a KNFB Reader?

I don't have an i phone, will it work with an i pod?  Not sure what 
version of firmware I have.
On Wed, 22 Nov 2017, Josh Kennedy via Talk 
wrote:

> Ok here is how you use knfb reader this is just an example.
> Imagine you are a student in college. You have some paper handouts that you 
> got from class that you cannot read, you also have  a print textbook. So how 
> do you read it? First you unlock your android phone or your iPhone. Then you 
> go into the knnfb reader app. And then you hold the phone a foot above the 
> page. And then you press the field of view report button first making sure 
> you are pointing the camera on the bottom of the phone down towards the page. 
> Then you hit field of view report button you double tap it on the phone’s 
> touch screen. You hear your phone say outloud with its screen reader:
>
> All four corners of the page are visible.
>
> Then holding the phone as steady as you can, you double tap the take picture 
> button. The phone snaps a photo of the page, does OCR on the text, and reads 
> the text out loud to you. And you can scan whole entire books very very fast 
> with just the 8mp camera on your smartphone.
>
>
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>
> From: Robert Ringwald via Talk
> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 19:18
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Robert Ringwald
> Subject: Re: What is a KNFB Reader?
>
> But what does it do?
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 4:05 PM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Josh Kennedy
> Subject: RE: What is a KNFB Reader?
>
> I have knfb reader on my android phone and it works great.
>
>
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>
> From: Tom Kingston via Talk
> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 16:03
> To: Josh Kennedy via Talk
> Cc: Tom Kingston
> Subject: Re: What is a KNFB Reader?
>
> And it's a fabulous OCR which is how it started. I have it on my iPhone
> and can read just about anything imaginable. Think beyond a document
> reader. I've read food boxes, cans, button labels and serial numbers on
> gadgets, etc. It also works pretty good when you have to read your
> computer screen or any other kind of display.
> There's also a free one from Microsoft called seeing AI. It's useful but
> doesn't compare to KNFB when it comes right down to it.
> Regards,
> Tom
>
>
> On 11/22/2017 2:01 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:
>> Yes you can read pdfs with it. It works on iPhone and android and on
>> windows10 devices.
>>
>>
>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>>
>> From: Robert Ringwald via Talk
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 13:12
>> To: Talk
>> Cc: Robert Ringwald
>> Subject: What is a KNFB Reader?
>>
>> I see it is on sale.
>>
>> Can you read PDFs with it?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Bob Ringwald piano, Solo, Duo, Trio, Quartet, Quintet
>> Fulton Street Jazz Band (Dixieland/Swing)
>> 916/ 806-9551
>> Amateur (ham) Radio Station K6YBV
>>
>> “If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed,
>> if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed.” -- Mark Twain
>>
>>
>>
>> ---
>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>>
>> ___
>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the
>> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
>> For membership options, visit
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/joshuakennedy201%40comcast.net.
>> For subscription options, visit
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>> List archives can be found at
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>
>> ___
>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the
>> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
>> For membership options, visit
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tom.kingston%40charter.net.
>> For subscription options, visit
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>> List archives can be found at
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
&g

RE: What is a KNFB Reader?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

Ok here is how you use knfb reader this is just an example. 
Imagine you are a student in college. You have some paper handouts that you got 
from class that you cannot read, you also have  a print textbook. So how do you 
read it? First you unlock your android phone or your iPhone. Then you go into 
the knnfb reader app. And then you hold the phone a foot above the page. And 
then you press the field of view report button first making sure you are 
pointing the camera on the bottom of the phone down towards the page. Then you 
hit field of view report button you double tap it on the phone’s touch screen. 
You hear your phone say outloud with its screen reader:

All four corners of the page are visible.

Then holding the phone as steady as you can, you double tap the take picture 
button. The phone snaps a photo of the page, does OCR on the text, and reads 
the text out loud to you. And you can scan whole entire books very very fast 
with just the 8mp camera on your smartphone. 


Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Robert Ringwald via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 19:18
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Robert Ringwald
Subject: Re: What is a KNFB Reader?

But what does it do?



-Original Message- 
From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 4:05 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: RE: What is a KNFB Reader?

I have knfb reader on my android phone and it works great.


Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 16:03
To: Josh Kennedy via Talk
Cc: Tom Kingston
Subject: Re: What is a KNFB Reader?

And it's a fabulous OCR which is how it started. I have it on my iPhone
and can read just about anything imaginable. Think beyond a document
reader. I've read food boxes, cans, button labels and serial numbers on
gadgets, etc. It also works pretty good when you have to read your
computer screen or any other kind of display.
There's also a free one from Microsoft called seeing AI. It's useful but
doesn't compare to KNFB when it comes right down to it.
Regards,
Tom


On 11/22/2017 2:01 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:
> Yes you can read pdfs with it. It works on iPhone and android and on 
> windows10 devices.
>
>
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>
> From: Robert Ringwald via Talk
> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 13:12
> To: Talk
> Cc: Robert Ringwald
> Subject: What is a KNFB Reader?
>
> I see it is on sale.
>
> Can you read PDFs with it?
>
>
>
>
>
> Bob Ringwald piano, Solo, Duo, Trio, Quartet, Quintet
> Fulton Street Jazz Band (Dixieland/Swing)
> 916/ 806-9551
> Amateur (ham) Radio Station K6YBV
>
> “If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed,
> if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed.” -- Mark Twain
>
>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>
> ___
> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the 
> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>
> For membership options, visit 
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/joshuakennedy201%40comcast.net.
> For subscription options, visit 
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
> List archives can be found at 
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>
> ___
> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the 
> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>
> For membership options, visit 
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tom.kingston%40charter.net.
> For subscription options, visit 
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
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> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>
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RE: What is a KNFB Reader?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

I have knfb reader on my android phone and it works great. 


Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 16:03
To: Josh Kennedy via Talk
Cc: Tom Kingston
Subject: Re: What is a KNFB Reader?

And it's a fabulous OCR which is how it started. I have it on my iPhone 
and can read just about anything imaginable. Think beyond a document 
reader. I've read food boxes, cans, button labels and serial numbers on 
gadgets, etc. It also works pretty good when you have to read your 
computer screen or any other kind of display.
There's also a free one from Microsoft called seeing AI. It's useful but 
doesn't compare to KNFB when it comes right down to it.
Regards,
Tom


On 11/22/2017 2:01 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:
> Yes you can read pdfs with it. It works on iPhone and android and on 
> windows10 devices.
> 
> 
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
> 
> From: Robert Ringwald via Talk
> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 13:12
> To: Talk
> Cc: Robert Ringwald
> Subject: What is a KNFB Reader?
> 
> I see it is on sale.
> 
> Can you read PDFs with it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bob Ringwald piano, Solo, Duo, Trio, Quartet, Quintet
> Fulton Street Jazz Band (Dixieland/Swing)
> 916/ 806-9551
> Amateur (ham) Radio Station K6YBV
> 
> “If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed,
> if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed.” -- Mark Twain
> 
> 
> 
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
> 
> ___
> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author 
> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
> 
> For membership options, visit 
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/joshuakennedy201%40comcast.net.
> For subscription options, visit 
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
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> 
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> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
> 
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RE: Program to reset (if necessary( the Windows screen reader flag.

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

What? Is someone gunna make a new window eyes screen reader? 


Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD,Inc. via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 08:08
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc.
Subject: RE: Program to reset (if necessary( the Windows screen reader flag.

Tom, if you resurrect Window-Eyes, I'll pull back my plans for ditching
Windows.  Why?  Because you'll save me from nagging headaches for which I
keep refusing to gulp ibuprofen, 

Sincerely,
Olusegun
Denver, Colorado


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RE: What is a KNFB Reader?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

Yes you can read pdfs with it. It works on iPhone and android and on windows10 
devices. 


Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Robert Ringwald via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2017 13:12
To: Talk
Cc: Robert Ringwald
Subject: What is a KNFB Reader? 

I see it is on sale.

Can you read PDFs with it?





Bob Ringwald piano, Solo, Duo, Trio, Quartet, Quintet
Fulton Street Jazz Band (Dixieland/Swing)
916/ 806-9551
Amateur (ham) Radio Station K6YBV

“If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed,
if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed.” -- Mark Twain



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window eyes and logger pro

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

Now that window eyes has pretty much gone away, it took something 
important along with it. see this website for more info. my question is 
this, could an addon be made for NVDA so students could use NVDA with 
logger pro and other science technology engineering and math solutions 
in the stem field? website is when vfo got rid of window eyes they also 
got rid of the ability of students to learn and work in stem fields. 
Perhaps crowd funding could fund a project to give NVDA similar 
functionality?



http://www.gwmicro.com/Window-Eyes/Sci_Voice_Lab/



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Re: off topic help with Chromebook

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

search key should be to the left of the space bar.



On 10/21/2017 6:05 PM, Carol and Roger via Talk wrote:
Please excuse my going off topic, but my brother now has a new 
Chromebook and needs help getting it set up.  He knows that 
control-alt-z starts speech, but that is all.  He saw on YouTube that 
the search key is used for navigation, but he has no idea where to 
find said search key.  Can anyone on this group give me any ideas that 
help him?  I have no idea about Chromebooks.  Thank you very much and 
sorry to post here.


Carol


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Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

I could not switch to a mac all the time. I would miss my favorite audio 
games such as eurofly flight simulator, survive the wild by Sam Tupy, 
and RedSpot audio game among others. so I need windows.




On 10/11/2017 6:01 PM, David Moore via Talk wrote:

Hi Rod!
I really want to try one, because I only know Windows. I like trying something 
new all of the time. Where can you play around with one in a store or somewhere 
else? Now, is Voice over the same on the MacBook as it is on the iPhone? Do you 
have a desktop with icons on it like with Windows? How is the contents arranged 
compared to Windows?
I would really like to hear more about the MacBook!
Is it a laptop, tablet, or another type of device altogether? Is a MacBook the 
size of most laptops, or smaller or what? How much is it, because I heard they 
are expensive. How does it compare to a ChromeBook. Is a ChromeBook as 
accessible? Google says they are accessible.
This is so great to be able to talk all technology on here!
David Moore
Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2017 5:46 PM
To: bjn...@windstream.net; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: RE: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

Hi Brenda,

Starting to hate computers is the main reason why I decided to buy a MacBook 
Pro a few weeks bac,.
The way Apple designs their operating systems, making them more human< I would 
say, it is actually a pleasure to use them.
In particular, once you see how the macOS works, it is truly fun, very 
accessible, and, oddly enough, you seem to be led to focus on what you need.
You really have to try one to see what I mean.
If you get the chance, try one out.

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Brenda via Talk
Sent: October 11, 2017 3:02 PM
To: Nick Sarames via Talk 
Cc: Brenda 
Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

I think crawling into a hole is a great idea. I'm really starting to
hate computers.
Brenda

On 10/10/2017 1:38 PM, Nick Sarames via Talk wrote:

The consensus seems to be that WE, overall, is better.  I have yet to
use Jaws, but the more I read here, the more I realize that we each have
different systems and needs.  So while you can't seem to pay your credit
card, others can.  And while you can do certain things, others can't.  I
think I'll just craw into a hole.

On 10/10/2017 1:33 PM, net bat via Talk wrote:

you might as well junk it now.
2018 release will be in about 2 weeks.
f s has had the same 27 years as window eyes had  and it still doesn't
work as good.
i can't even pay my credit card with it. a web page that is suppose to
be jaws compatible doesn't work.
window eyes works fine.
money talks. if gwmicro was the one that had all the money it would of
been f s that would be out of business now.

-Original Message- From: Bob Tinney via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 7:01 AM
To: Chuck Adkins via Talk
Cc: Bob Tinney
Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

Chuck,


I agree with you!  My s m as were carried over from W E, but when I have
to pay for an upgrade, Jaws will disappear from my computer.

Bob, K8LR, tinn...@charter.net

On 10/10/2017 8:33 AM, Chuck Adkins via Talk wrote:

Well, I've been using Jaws for a while now and I must confess the
Window-eyes was the much better product both in speed, browsing,
usability, layout, and so much more. Like on the Ohio Lottery Website,
when reading the pick 5 Jaws will not scroll down continuously down
the page like NVDA, Narrator, and Window-eyes do. I also find
Window-eyes synthesizer support was much better. I am not whining, I
am just bemoaning the fact that a company got by with trashing a
product completely, borrowing or using nothing from the product they
trashed and acting like Window-eyes never existed, not to mention
charging so much for the product. Don't give me that similar stuff,
because I've found webpages where Jaws just doesn't work and NVDA and
Narrator do.

So why won't I just shut up? I will, just wanted to point out in my
view what I've realized, and hopefully NVDA, Narrator and others will
be able to say Thank You to VFO for pushing us to a day when a 2
thousand dollar screen reader is no longer need.

Thanks for reading, I'm now shutting up.
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Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

now they just have to make that $120 jaws a publically available 
purchase option, available to be taken advantage of all the time.



On 10/11/2017 3:22 PM, Brenda via Talk wrote:
VFO made a proposal to AI Squared AFTER AI Squared had acquired 
GW-Micro.  I kinda wonder if AI Squared was told by VFO to get GW 
first in order to become a part of the VFO family. Nothing will ever 
be proven


As for jaws being better than NVDA, that may be a matter of opinion. I 
know an adaptive tech person that liked NVDA before Window-eyes was 
eliminated.  Maybe he suspected W-e was on the way out. Nonetheless he 
said positive things about NVDA not jaws.


As pointed out before it is good to have multiple screen readers. This 
is probably more necessary since Window-Eyes is waning.


. Brenda
On 10/11/2017 2:47 AM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
Jaws is a very good screen reader and it's better than NVDA 
unfortunately one of the two products had to go.  VFO made a proposal 
to AI Squared to merge they didn't have to do that they chose to so 
being bitter to the makers of Jaws really serves nothing.

-Original Message-
From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Jim via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 6:11 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Jim
Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

Hi THERE!

While I agree that Jaws could do more especially now that they have 
acquired Window-Eyes I haven't had a real issue with Jaws. I can read 
from the current line to the end of a document simply by pressing the 
'insert+the down arrow key.  I wonder what programs you are actually 
having issues with using Jaws? Yes, I use W.E. for many years and was 
sad to see it go, but I haven't really found any major issues with 
Jaws either. Wonder if you might give some specifics as to where your 
issues have been? I use Thunderbird, Office 2007 notepad, Internet 
Explorer, Firefox, Chrome  and several other programs regularly and I 
really don't seem to have any real problems with.  Of course, I kept 
Window-Eyes on my computer a long with Narrator and NVDA so if I have 
issues with one screen reader I can fall back onto another that will 
more than likely work.  As I have already said, I probably liked 
Window-Eye the best of all of them, but since Window-Eyes appears to 
be gone for the most part, I will simply have to make do with 
whatever I can use and the best of the remaining screen readers is 
still Jaws at least that is my opinion and everyone is entitled to 
their own opinion.  I will continue to use Window-Eyes when I 
need to, at least until the windows updates render it unusable.  Have 
A good 1! de


.s


On 10-Oct-17 15:00, Charles Adkins via Talk wrote:

it doesn’t seem like they affect products for the disabled does it?

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 10, 2017, at 2:58 PM, Tony C via Talk 
 wrote:


No, but maybe Brainwashed. I quit using Jawws in 2004 because WE 
worked better with stuff I needed. Now Jaws still doesn't work well 
with a lot of very common programs.


-Original Message- From: Nick Sarames via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 12:42 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Nick Sarames
Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

While I believe what you say, why are there so many Jaws users, even
some here, who swear by Jaws?  They can't all be ignorant, can they?
What I am guessing is happening is, each screen reader has its issues
and some websites work better on WE, and other websites work better
on Jaws.  Of course, that is a separate issue from other issues
involving the overall stability of each reader.


On 10/10/2017 8:33 AM, Chuck Adkins via Talk wrote:
Well, I've been using Jaws for a while now and I must confess the
Window-eyes was the much better product both in speed, browsing,
usability, layout, and so much more. Like on the Ohio Lottery
Website, when reading the pick 5 Jaws will not scroll down
continuously down the page like NVDA, Narrator, and Window-eyes do.
I also find Window-eyes synthesizer support was much better. I am
not whining, I am just bemoaning the fact that a company got by with
trashing a product completely, borrowing or using nothing from the
product they trashed and acting like Window-eyes never existed, not
to mention charging so much for the product. Don't give me that
similar stuff, because I've found webpages where Jaws just doesn't
work and NVDA and Narrator do.

So why won't I just shut up? I will, just wanted to point out in my
view what I've realized, and hopefully NVDA, Narrator and others
will be able to say Thank You to VFO for pushing us to a day when a
2 thousand dollar screen reader is no longer need.

Thanks for reading, I'm now shutting up.
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Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

they also need to make that $120 full copy of jaws for people on fixed 
incomes, something publically available on their website.



On 10/10/2017 7:07 PM, Tony C via Talk wrote:
Hi, Yes, I know. I do believe however that since they killed WE, they 
really need to focus hard on making Jaws work with alll the different 
programs that WE did/does. There's a few things that Jaws does better 
than WE, but there's quite a bit that WE does better than Jaws. I'm 
getting used to Jaws, but I still find myself going back to WE for a 
lot of things. I'm gonna be sad when WE no longer works.


-Original Message- From: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, 
Inc. via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 4:14 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc.
Subject: RE: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

Tony, I seriously doubt that the law against monopoly apply in the access
technology industry.  If it does, it is a bit too late now.  GW Micro is
gone and I doubt if it can be revived.  Besides, who truly want to spend
endless hours in court?  GW Micro went through that once, and I don't
believe Doug wants to come out of hiding to try again.

As I once opined, that which Freedom Scientific DID NOT win in the 
courts,
it got back by a series of tricks and arm twisting.  Its aim and 
objective
had been to figure out a way of running GW Micro into the ground as it 
did

FreedomBox, now SeroTech!

The two elephants had a good fight, the ground got terribly too hot, 
and the

weak one threw up its hands and walked away accepting defeat.

Anyway, back to my quest for complete and full deployment of Android!

Sincerely,m
Olusegun
Denver, Colorado


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Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

oh  well then maybe I will just stay with NVDA and I may not bother 
buying jaws, not sure yet. I heard jaws has better microsoft office 
support than NVDA does. But maybe that is no longer true?




On 10/10/2017 1:33 PM, net bat via Talk wrote:

you might as well junk it now.
2018 release will be in about 2 weeks.
f s has had the same 27 years as window eyes had  and it still doesn't 
work as good.
i can't even pay my credit card with it. a web page that is suppose to 
be jaws compatible doesn't work.

window eyes works fine.
money talks. if gwmicro was the one that had all the money it would of 
been f s that would be out of business now.


-Original Message- From: Bob Tinney via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 7:01 AM
To: Chuck Adkins via Talk
Cc: Bob Tinney
Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

Chuck,


I agree with you!  My s m as were carried over from W E, but when I have
to pay for an upgrade, Jaws will disappear from my computer.

Bob, K8LR, tinn...@charter.net

On 10/10/2017 8:33 AM, Chuck Adkins via Talk wrote:

Well, I've been using Jaws for a while now and I must confess the
Window-eyes was the much better product both in speed, browsing,
usability, layout, and so much more. Like on the Ohio Lottery Website,
when reading the pick 5 Jaws will not scroll down continuously down
the page like NVDA, Narrator, and Window-eyes do. I also find
Window-eyes synthesizer support was much better. I am not whining, I
am just bemoaning the fact that a company got by with trashing a
product completely, borrowing or using nothing from the product they
trashed and acting like Window-eyes never existed, not to mention
charging so much for the product. Don't give me that similar stuff,
because I've found webpages where Jaws just doesn't work and NVDA and
Narrator do.

So why won't I just shut up? I will, just wanted to point out in my
view what I've realized, and hopefully NVDA, Narrator and others will
be able to say Thank You to VFO for pushing us to a day when a 2
thousand dollar screen reader is no longer need.

Thanks for reading, I'm now shutting up.
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Re: My SMA purchase experience

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

can you buy more than one sma? Say I wanted to buy 2 or 3 smas then I 
could have 4 or 6 sma upgrades and be good for several years? is this 
possible?




On 10/4/2017 5:03 PM, Carol and Roger via Talk wrote:
Well, of course, there could have been a real bottleneck back when the 
migration was taking place.  After all, I wonder how many WE users 
took advantage of the offer during those couple of months.  And, of 
course, there was still the normal amount of Jaws, etc. business.


Carol


On 10/4/2017 3:50 PM, Joseph Norton via Talk wrote:

Hi listers:

This is the first (and probably only) time I get to use an SMA, but, 
I took the plunge and ordered it.


I have to say VFO is pretty quick when upgrading to an SMA.  I 
ordered it yesterday and within a few minutes, the activation server 
showed the change to version 18.0 plus 2.


This certainly seems quicker than the migration purchases.

One has to wonder why the migration purchases  couldn't be executed 
in the same amount of time.


Anyway, I am covered for the next 2 years, if needed.

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

NVDA is working very good with the latest firefox.



On 9/30/2017 10:23 PM, Ian Westerland via Talk wrote:




Lloyd, I don't use Firefox very much but am wondering if NVDA is 
handling the newer versions better.
Window-Eyes seems to be working ok with Internet Explorer so I can 
keep going with it for a while yet.


Cheers.


Ian Westerland




ian Westerland



On 10/1/2017 1:16 PM, Lloyd Rasmussen via Talk wrote:
    Version 56 has come out in the last few days. VFO said in their 
release notes that they had done some work to prepare for version 57, 
which comes out some time in November.
I thought I had been successfully running version 56 on a couple of 
other computers, but now I'm not quite so sure. Tonight I updated my 
Windows 7 laptop to version 56. At first, no SET file was being 
loaded; Window-Eyes didn't seem to recognize the correct file 
association for Firefox. Then, reading in the Control Panel and back 
out to Firefox, it began to associate with Firefox.set. But this 
didn't seem to help. I can still read the items in the tab order if 
MSAA mode is off, but this isn't helpful in reading the full contents 
of a page. More investigation is called for, but this may be an early 
warning sign of the lack of support for Window-Eyes. I'm not giving 
up yet, but passing along my findings.




Lloyd Rasmussen, Kensington, MD
http://lras.home.sprynet.com
-Original Message- From: Matthew Chao via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 9:37 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Matthew Chao
Subject: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi, any Window-Eyes Users Still Out There.  I just updated Firefox, and
when I try to navigate with MSAA mode on, I just get a ding where before
I could go up and down the page.  How can I change it so it works?  What
happened?--Matthew Chao.
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Re: low cost jaws it does exist

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

you can get the low cost jaws by calling 1-800-444-4443 extension 1101 
and asking to buy jaws through the jaws for fixed income program.




On 9/15/2017 3:29 PM, mr. Chikodinaka Nickarandidum Oguledo via Talk wrote:

how do I get it?
my wife is giving birth for the first time  hour first child

On 9/15/17, lynn white via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

That's clever.


On 9/15/2017 12:32 PM, Nick Sarames via Talk wrote:

Actually we don't know that - you could be a VFO bot, or perhaps you
might want another life?  Maybe she should've written:

"get another life!"

On 9/15/2017 10:47 AM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:

Don't you think that statement of get a life is contradicting itself?
How can I get a life when I already have a life? And I already have a
life because I am alive. And you know I am alive because I am sitting
here typing this message. If I did not get or have a life already, then
I could not be sitting here and typing this message to you, now could I?
Because I would not be alive in the first place.


On 9/15/2017 12:48 AM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:

Get a life and hope for the bonus of compassion and empathy for
others. You'll be much happier.

On 9/14/2017 6:33 PM, Reeva Webb via Talk wrote:

...get a job and stop bothering people for hand outs.

On Sep 14, 2017 9:35 AM, "Josh Kennedy via Talk"
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
wrote:


hello


I just talked to Hal from VFO. He called me and left me a message.
Anyway
he told me about a program that VFO already has in place for people
who
need low-cost jaws. He told me this is a special program and for some
reason its not advertised on their website but he said he would make
a note
to at least get information about it posted up there. So here is
what he
said. For people who cannot afford jaws, you call in and through
this jaws
affordability program for $125 you get jaws home version with 0
smas. But
if you pay $225 you get jaws home version with two smas. When I am
done
with Christmas and stuff I'm gunna take advantage of this for sure!
I also
suggested to hal about a program to activate jaws on a monthly
basis, $225
comes down to $12 per month. He said he would make a note of that
also. So
yes folks low cost jaws does exist. get more info by calling:

1-800-444-4443 extension 1101


This news is very exciting! in a year or so my son will probably be
doing
more advances stuff with microsoft office and Jaws will probably be
needed
because it works good with that office suite. I am glad that low
cost jaws
really exists.


Josh


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Re: low cost jaws it does exist

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

To get another life I first have to earn 200 points so I can then gain 
one more life. I'll work on that.




On 9/15/2017 1:32 PM, Nick Sarames wrote:

Actually we don't know that - you could be a VFO bot, or perhaps you
might want another life?  Maybe she should've written:

"get another life!"

On 9/15/2017 10:47 AM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:

Don't you think that statement of get a life is contradicting itself?
How can I get a life when I already have a life? And I already have a
life because I am alive. And you know I am alive because I am sitting
here typing this message. If I did not get or have a life already, then
I could not be sitting here and typing this message to you, now could I?
Because I would not be alive in the first place.


On 9/15/2017 12:48 AM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:

Get a life and hope for the bonus of compassion and empathy for
others. You'll be much happier.

On 9/14/2017 6:33 PM, Reeva Webb via Talk wrote:

...get a job and stop bothering people for hand outs.

On Sep 14, 2017 9:35 AM, "Josh Kennedy via Talk"
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
wrote:


hello


I just talked to Hal from VFO. He called me and left me a message.
Anyway
he told me about a program that VFO already has in place for people who
need low-cost jaws. He told me this is a special program and for some
reason its not advertised on their website but he said he would make
a note
to at least get information about it posted up there. So here is
what he
said. For people who cannot afford jaws, you call in and through
this jaws
affordability program for $125 you get jaws home version with 0
smas. But
if you pay $225 you get jaws home version with two smas. When I am done
with Christmas and stuff I'm gunna take advantage of this for sure!
I also
suggested to hal about a program to activate jaws on a monthly
basis, $225
comes down to $12 per month. He said he would make a note of that
also. So
yes folks low cost jaws does exist. get more info by calling:

1-800-444-4443 extension 1101


This news is very exciting! in a year or so my son will probably be
doing
more advances stuff with microsoft office and Jaws will probably be
needed
because it works good with that office suite. I am glad that low
cost jaws
really exists.


Josh


--
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Re: low cost jaws it does exist

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

If you are patient, you will get your hand-outs in a few hours when I 
see you in detention after school. That is, when I hand them out to you.




On 9/15/2017 12:48 AM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:
Get a life and hope for the bonus of compassion and empathy for 
others. You'll be much happier.


On 9/14/2017 6:33 PM, Reeva Webb via Talk wrote:

...get a job and stop bothering people for hand outs.

On Sep 14, 2017 9:35 AM, "Josh Kennedy via Talk" 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>

wrote:


hello


I just talked to Hal from VFO. He called me and left me a message. 
Anyway

he told me about a program that VFO already has in place for people who
need low-cost jaws. He told me this is a special program and for some
reason its not advertised on their website but he said he would make 
a note
to at least get information about it posted up there. So here is 
what he
said. For people who cannot afford jaws, you call in and through 
this jaws
affordability program for $125 you get jaws home version with 0 
smas. But

if you pay $225 you get jaws home version with two smas. When I am done
with Christmas and stuff I'm gunna take advantage of this for sure! 
I also
suggested to hal about a program to activate jaws on a monthly 
basis, $225
comes down to $12 per month. He said he would make a note of that 
also. So

yes folks low cost jaws does exist. get more info by calling:

1-800-444-4443 extension 1101


This news is very exciting! in a year or so my son will probably be 
doing
more advances stuff with microsoft office and Jaws will probably be 
needed
because it works good with that office suite. I am glad that low 
cost jaws

really exists.


Josh


--
sent with mozilla thunderbird

--
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Re: low cost jaws it does exist

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

Don't you think that statement of get a life is contradicting itself? 
How can I get a life when I already have a life? And I already have a 
life because I am alive. And you know I am alive because I am sitting 
here typing this message. If I did not get or have a life already, then 
I could not be sitting here and typing this message to you, now could I? 
Because I would not be alive in the first place.



On 9/15/2017 12:48 AM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:
Get a life and hope for the bonus of compassion and empathy for 
others. You'll be much happier.


On 9/14/2017 6:33 PM, Reeva Webb via Talk wrote:

...get a job and stop bothering people for hand outs.

On Sep 14, 2017 9:35 AM, "Josh Kennedy via Talk" 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>

wrote:


hello


I just talked to Hal from VFO. He called me and left me a message. 
Anyway

he told me about a program that VFO already has in place for people who
need low-cost jaws. He told me this is a special program and for some
reason its not advertised on their website but he said he would make 
a note
to at least get information about it posted up there. So here is 
what he
said. For people who cannot afford jaws, you call in and through 
this jaws
affordability program for $125 you get jaws home version with 0 
smas. But

if you pay $225 you get jaws home version with two smas. When I am done
with Christmas and stuff I'm gunna take advantage of this for sure! 
I also
suggested to hal about a program to activate jaws on a monthly 
basis, $225
comes down to $12 per month. He said he would make a note of that 
also. So

yes folks low cost jaws does exist. get more info by calling:

1-800-444-4443 extension 1101


This news is very exciting! in a year or so my son will probably be 
doing
more advances stuff with microsoft office and Jaws will probably be 
needed
because it works good with that office suite. I am glad that low 
cost jaws

really exists.


Josh


--
sent with mozilla thunderbird

--
sent with mozilla thunderbird

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Re: low cost jaws it does exist

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

to get the low cost jaws, call 1-800-444-4443 extension 1101 and ask if 
you qualify.




On 9/14/2017 10:34 PM, mr. Chikodinaka Nickarandidum Oguledo wrote:

how do I get this lo caust job access with speech! JAWS?

On 9/14/17, Josh Kennedy via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

I guess when some big volcano erupts that never erupted before you'll
know I have a job. But it may then make the whole earth unstable and
implode then fly into the sun and melt and then re-freeze back in space.
Then the only ones left alive sort of will be the zombies.




On 9/14/2017 9:12 PM, Joseph Norton via Talk wrote:

You hit the nail on the head.

Telling anyone to go get a job when you know absolutely nothing about
their circumstances is extremely callous.

There are a lot of us who want jobs and have a lot of trouble getting one,
usually because of ignorance on the part of potential employers.  On the
other hand, I have a nephew, who is sighted, and who has had job after
job, only to get in some kind of altercation with someone, or, just would
get lazy and decide he didn’t want to go to work, and get fired, then
blame everyone else for his situation—he’s in jail right now, saying it’s
everyone else’s fault.  If I’d had as many jobs as he has had… well,
anyway, enough said.

Some of us who have jobs may have forgotten the struggle to get where we
are, or, maybe we just knew the right person.  Whatever the case, this
kind of thing gets no one anywhere.

Shucks, even with a job, who would not want to get a deep discount on a
blindness product, since most of them are overpriced anyway?

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: lynn white via Talk
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 7:00 PM
To: Reeva Webb via Talk
Cc: lynn white
Subject: Re: low cost jaws it does exist

That's just plain cruel.  I'm sorry but that just shows no heart
whatsoever.


I happen to be fortunate enough that I can buy products.  So, my comment
is not meant to be self serving.


I know that there are people within our community with their hands out.
But, telling someone to get a job and stop bothering people for handouts
is just insensitive and errogant.


On 9/14/2017 5:33 PM, Reeva Webb via Talk wrote:

...get a job and stop bothering people for hand outs.

On Sep 14, 2017 9:35 AM, "Josh Kennedy via Talk"
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
wrote:


hello


I just talked to Hal from VFO. He called me and left me a message.
Anyway
he told me about a program that VFO already has in place for people who
need low-cost jaws. He told me this is a special program and for some
reason its not advertised on their website but he said he would make a
note
to at least get information about it posted up there. So here is what he
said. For people who cannot afford jaws, you call in and through this
jaws
affordability program for $125 you get jaws home version with 0 smas.
But
if you pay $225 you get jaws home version with two smas. When I am done
with Christmas and stuff I'm gunna take advantage of this for sure! I
also
suggested to hal about a program to activate jaws on a monthly basis,
$225
comes down to $12 per month. He said he would make a note of that also.
So
yes folks low cost jaws does exist. get more info by calling:

1-800-444-4443 extension 1101


This news is very exciting! in a year or so my son will probably be
doing
more advances stuff with microsoft office and Jaws will probably be
needed
because it works good with that office suite. I am glad that low cost
jaws
really exists.


Josh


--
sent with mozilla thunderbird

--
sent with mozilla thunderbird

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author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.

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List archive

Re: low cost jaws it does exist

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

and I was just joking about the whole volcanos thing for something to do.



On 9/14/2017 10:34 PM, mr. Chikodinaka Nickarandidum Oguledo wrote:

how do I get this lo caust job access with speech! JAWS?

On 9/14/17, Josh Kennedy via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

I guess when some big volcano erupts that never erupted before you'll
know I have a job. But it may then make the whole earth unstable and
implode then fly into the sun and melt and then re-freeze back in space.
Then the only ones left alive sort of will be the zombies.




On 9/14/2017 9:12 PM, Joseph Norton via Talk wrote:

You hit the nail on the head.

Telling anyone to go get a job when you know absolutely nothing about
their circumstances is extremely callous.

There are a lot of us who want jobs and have a lot of trouble getting one,
usually because of ignorance on the part of potential employers.  On the
other hand, I have a nephew, who is sighted, and who has had job after
job, only to get in some kind of altercation with someone, or, just would
get lazy and decide he didn’t want to go to work, and get fired, then
blame everyone else for his situation—he’s in jail right now, saying it’s
everyone else’s fault.  If I’d had as many jobs as he has had… well,
anyway, enough said.

Some of us who have jobs may have forgotten the struggle to get where we
are, or, maybe we just knew the right person.  Whatever the case, this
kind of thing gets no one anywhere.

Shucks, even with a job, who would not want to get a deep discount on a
blindness product, since most of them are overpriced anyway?

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: lynn white via Talk
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 7:00 PM
To: Reeva Webb via Talk
Cc: lynn white
Subject: Re: low cost jaws it does exist

That's just plain cruel.  I'm sorry but that just shows no heart
whatsoever.


I happen to be fortunate enough that I can buy products.  So, my comment
is not meant to be self serving.


I know that there are people within our community with their hands out.
But, telling someone to get a job and stop bothering people for handouts
is just insensitive and errogant.


On 9/14/2017 5:33 PM, Reeva Webb via Talk wrote:

...get a job and stop bothering people for hand outs.

On Sep 14, 2017 9:35 AM, "Josh Kennedy via Talk"
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
wrote:


hello


I just talked to Hal from VFO. He called me and left me a message.
Anyway
he told me about a program that VFO already has in place for people who
need low-cost jaws. He told me this is a special program and for some
reason its not advertised on their website but he said he would make a
note
to at least get information about it posted up there. So here is what he
said. For people who cannot afford jaws, you call in and through this
jaws
affordability program for $125 you get jaws home version with 0 smas.
But
if you pay $225 you get jaws home version with two smas. When I am done
with Christmas and stuff I'm gunna take advantage of this for sure! I
also
suggested to hal about a program to activate jaws on a monthly basis,
$225
comes down to $12 per month. He said he would make a note of that also.
So
yes folks low cost jaws does exist. get more info by calling:

1-800-444-4443 extension 1101


This news is very exciting! in a year or so my son will probably be
doing
more advances stuff with microsoft office and Jaws will probably be
needed
because it works good with that office suite. I am glad that low cost
jaws
really exists.


Josh


--
sent with mozilla thunderbird

--
sent with mozilla thunderbird

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List archives can be found 

Re: low cost jaws it does exist

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

I guess when some big volcano erupts that never erupted before you'll 
know I have a job. But it may then make the whole earth unstable and 
implode then fly into the sun and melt and then re-freeze back in space. 
Then the only ones left alive sort of will be the zombies.





On 9/14/2017 9:12 PM, Joseph Norton via Talk wrote:

You hit the nail on the head.

Telling anyone to go get a job when you know absolutely nothing about their 
circumstances is extremely callous.

There are a lot of us who want jobs and have a lot of trouble getting one, 
usually because of ignorance on the part of potential employers.  On the other 
hand, I have a nephew, who is sighted, and who has had job after job, only to 
get in some kind of altercation with someone, or, just would get lazy and 
decide he didn’t want to go to work, and get fired, then blame everyone else 
for his situation—he’s in jail right now, saying it’s everyone else’s fault.  
If I’d had as many jobs as he has had… well, anyway, enough said.

Some of us who have jobs may have forgotten the struggle to get where we are, 
or, maybe we just knew the right person.  Whatever the case, this kind of thing 
gets no one anywhere.

Shucks, even with a job, who would not want to get a deep discount on a 
blindness product, since most of them are overpriced anyway?

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: lynn white via Talk
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 7:00 PM
To: Reeva Webb via Talk
Cc: lynn white
Subject: Re: low cost jaws it does exist

That's just plain cruel.  I'm sorry but that just shows no heart whatsoever.


I happen to be fortunate enough that I can buy products.  So, my comment
is not meant to be self serving.


I know that there are people within our community with their hands out.
But, telling someone to get a job and stop bothering people for handouts
is just insensitive and errogant.


On 9/14/2017 5:33 PM, Reeva Webb via Talk wrote:

...get a job and stop bothering people for hand outs.

On Sep 14, 2017 9:35 AM, "Josh Kennedy via Talk" <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
wrote:


hello


I just talked to Hal from VFO. He called me and left me a message. Anyway
he told me about a program that VFO already has in place for people who
need low-cost jaws. He told me this is a special program and for some
reason its not advertised on their website but he said he would make a note
to at least get information about it posted up there. So here is what he
said. For people who cannot afford jaws, you call in and through this jaws
affordability program for $125 you get jaws home version with 0 smas. But
if you pay $225 you get jaws home version with two smas. When I am done
with Christmas and stuff I'm gunna take advantage of this for sure! I also
suggested to hal about a program to activate jaws on a monthly basis, $225
comes down to $12 per month. He said he would make a note of that also. So
yes folks low cost jaws does exist. get more info by calling:

1-800-444-4443 extension 1101


This news is very exciting! in a year or so my son will probably be doing
more advances stuff with microsoft office and Jaws will probably be needed
because it works good with that office suite. I am glad that low cost jaws
really exists.


Josh


--
sent with mozilla thunderbird

--
sent with mozilla thunderbird

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For membershi

Re: low cost jaws it does exist

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

I will hand out your homework assignments tomorrow about jet drills and 
turning boring regular mountains into volcanos.




On 9/14/2017 6:39 PM, Nick Sarames via Talk wrote:

Well, at least you're being constructive.

On 9/14/2017 6:33 PM, Reeva Webb via Talk wrote:

...get a job and stop bothering people for hand outs.

On Sep 14, 2017 9:35 AM, "Josh Kennedy via Talk" <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
wrote:


hello


I just talked to Hal from VFO. He called me and left me a message. Anyway
he told me about a program that VFO already has in place for people who
need low-cost jaws. He told me this is a special program and for some
reason its not advertised on their website but he said he would make a note
to at least get information about it posted up there. So here is what he
said. For people who cannot afford jaws, you call in and through this jaws
affordability program for $125 you get jaws home version with 0 smas. But
if you pay $225 you get jaws home version with two smas. When I am done
with Christmas and stuff I'm gunna take advantage of this for sure! I also
suggested to hal about a program to activate jaws on a monthly basis, $225
comes down to $12 per month. He said he would make a note of that also. So
yes folks low cost jaws does exist. get more info by calling:

1-800-444-4443 extension 1101


This news is very exciting! in a year or so my son will probably be doing
more advances stuff with microsoft office and Jaws will probably be needed
because it works good with that office suite. I am glad that low cost jaws
really exists.


Josh


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Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

no need. now that I know about VFO's jaws for fixed incomes program. 
jaws for $120 with 0 smas or jaws for $225 with 2 smas.




On 9/14/2017 10:41 AM, Kevin Huber via Talk wrote:

Hi:
Also, if you wanted to make the Window-eyes code open source, you
would have to wait 5 or 10 years until the copywright expires,
assuming there is a copywright, but by that time, the code would be so
old that it would probably be totally useless.
Kevin Huber

On 9/12/17, Dennis Long via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

Get real that wouldn't be able to be done!  They couldn't afford to pay
staff!

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2017 7:33 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

But for those who cannot afford Jaws they are left out. That is why FS
should make a low cost jaws rental program for maybe the price of a netflix
subscription, and the more you pay then you can add friends onto your jaws
account and let close friends use jaws, like I let one or two other family
members use my netflix account.



On 9/11/2017 7:53 PM, David Moore via Talk wrote:

Hi all!
I am starting to say this to everyone.
You must use more than one screen reader to access everything. I could
tell you many examples of when NVDA accesses things and JAWS does not at
all.
On the other hand, I could give you many examples of when JAWS accesses
what I need, and NVDA does not. Narrator is no slouch in Windows 10. I use
Narrator in many of Windows 10 universal apps.
I watch TV on a web site, where I need NVDA.
JAWS cannot access that site at all.
On my mobile Facebook page, JAWS does a much better job than NVDA.
So, here is my recommendation:
You need to be very fluent in JAWS, NVDA, and Narrator, and you will be
able to access almost everything that a sighted person does.
With JAWS, you must be comfortable with using the touch cursor, because it
memics swiping and tapping the screen with the keyboard. That is what you
need to use many of the Windows 10 universal apps.
NVDA, has the great option of being able to route the mouse pointer right
to where the focus is. JAWS has no command to do that. Routing the JAWS
cursor to the PC cursor works for me, about 10 percent of the time. NVDA
is much different, because you can move the pointer with your mouse, and
route the pointer right to where you are at on any object. NVDA allows you
to route the mouse pointer to where you are, and then you can do a click
with your mouse. That is the only way I can interact with many controls on
media pages and the like.
Please let me know what I can do for you, because I have many tutorials on
using NVDA, and JAWS with Windows 10.
You need to use three browsers as well.
Chrome is the best, then Firefox, and IE 11, should be your very last
choice, because it is very insecure. IE 11, should only be used if it is
an emergency!
Have a great one!
David Moore
Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: David via Talk
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2017 6:29 PM
To: mcommerf...@comcast.net; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: David
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

Could be a number of reasons, why the one screen reader works better
than the other, in a given situation. And without knowing more than
anyone else, it might all be guessing, should we claim to know the
reasons.

For one thing, the commercial screen readers, are being developed by
ingeneers who are on some kind of payment. The longer they take, the
more a certain feature development costs. In reality, this will mean
that unless we want to fork out a thousand dollar extra for the next
update to the screen reader, they have to somehow limit how much time
they invest in one particular area of the development.
NVDA, being a more or less volunteer product, will not have this
economic barrier, hence the developers can take the time they need, to
have the feature in place properly.

Next, any developer is only a human. We all tend to do things a
certain way, and sometimes might not have the full expertise in
understanding other ways to perform the same task. Most ingeneers are
stationed in an Office, at a fixed location. They only have access to
what the company lets them have access to, when comes to third-party
software, Websites and computer material.
NVDA, being an Internationally decentralized project, with several
developers spread out across boarders and facilities, will have access
to far more examples close to everyday life. Many of the developers
might be blind people, who finds it tricky to handle a certain task.
They can develop their new feature, or (du to the open-sourcing,)
modify an existing one. And, they can do so DIRECTLY on the very
website, machine or software, posing the problem. They don't have to
write any hour-list, hoping for their boss to pay them at the end of the
month.

Since the ingeneers of the comm

Re: low cost jaws it does exist

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

I am not sure. call VFO talk to Hal, and ask him. his extension is 1101.



On 9/14/2017 10:44 AM, Kevin Huber via Talk wrote:

Hi:
Is it available internationally?
Kevin Huber

On 9/14/17, Josh Kennedy via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

hello


I just talked to Hal from VFO. He called me and left me a message.
Anyway he told me about a program that VFO already has in place for
people who need low-cost jaws. He told me this is a special program and
for some reason its not advertised on their website but he said he would
make a note to at least get information about it posted up there. So
here is what he said. For people who cannot afford jaws, you call in and
through this jaws affordability program for $125 you get jaws home
version with 0 smas. But if you pay $225 you get jaws home version with
two smas. When I am done with Christmas and stuff I'm gunna take
advantage of this for sure! I also suggested to hal about a program to
activate jaws on a monthly basis, $225 comes down to $12 per month. He
said he would make a note of that also. So yes folks low cost jaws does
exist. get more info by calling:

1-800-444-4443 extension 1101


This news is very exciting! in a year or so my son will probably be
doing more advances stuff with microsoft office and Jaws will probably
be needed because it works good with that office suite. I am glad that
low cost jaws really exists.


Josh


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Re: webaim screen reader survey

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

that is strange. I just took the survey 2 days ago. yes now I am seeing 
that when i open the website as well.




On 9/14/2017 10:32 AM, Kevin Huber via Talk wrote:

Hi Josh:
I opened the link to the Webaim survey and all it said was, "the
survey will soon be available".

Kevin Huber


On 9/12/17, Josh Kennedy via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

hi

the new webaim screen reader survey is out if you want to take it.


http://webaim.org/projects/screenreadersurvey7/



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low cost jaws it does exist

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

hello


I just talked to Hal from VFO. He called me and left me a message. 
Anyway he told me about a program that VFO already has in place for 
people who need low-cost jaws. He told me this is a special program and 
for some reason its not advertised on their website but he said he would 
make a note to at least get information about it posted up there. So 
here is what he said. For people who cannot afford jaws, you call in and 
through this jaws affordability program for $125 you get jaws home 
version with 0 smas. But if you pay $225 you get jaws home version with 
two smas. When I am done with Christmas and stuff I'm gunna take 
advantage of this for sure! I also suggested to hal about a program to 
activate jaws on a monthly basis, $225 comes down to $12 per month. He 
said he would make a note of that also. So yes folks low cost jaws does 
exist. get more info by calling:


1-800-444-4443 extension 1101


This news is very exciting! in a year or so my son will probably be 
doing more advances stuff with microsoft office and Jaws will probably 
be needed because it works good with that office suite. I am glad that 
low cost jaws really exists.



Josh


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Re: webaim screen reader survey

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

yes the survey is accessible. it works perfectly fine.



On 9/12/2017 11:17 PM, mr. Chikodinaka Nickarandidum Oguledo via Talk wrote:

the servay is not accessibilible call 301-388-0136 I nnneed to do it
over thwe telephone

On 9/12/17, Josh Kennedy via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

http://webaim.org/projects/screenreadersurvey7/




On 9/12/2017 6:49 PM, mr. Chikodinaka Nickarandidum Oguledo via Talk wrote:

I need the link 2the servay

On 9/12/17, Josh Kennedy via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

hi

the new webaim screen reader survey is out if you want to take it.


http://webaim.org/projects/screenreadersurvey7/



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Re: webaim screen reader survey

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

http://webaim.org/projects/screenreadersurvey7/




On 9/12/2017 6:49 PM, mr. Chikodinaka Nickarandidum Oguledo via Talk wrote:

I need the link 2the servay

On 9/12/17, Josh Kennedy via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

hi

the new webaim screen reader survey is out if you want to take it.


http://webaim.org/projects/screenreadersurvey7/



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Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

route mouse to object, insert shift m.

read the current line, numPad 8, or capslock shift period.



On 9/12/2017 5:51 PM, BK via Talk wrote:

David, please let me know what the NVDA keyboard command is to route the
mouse to the focused object is, and also the command to read the line
under the mouse? thank you much.

Butch


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webaim screen reader survey

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

hi

the new webaim screen reader survey is out if you want to take it.


http://webaim.org/projects/screenreadersurvey7/



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Re: Jaws and Excel

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

NVDA can also do this. the info is below.

10.2. Microsoft Excel
10.2.1. Automatic Column and Row Header Reading
NVDA is able to automatically announce appropriate row and column 
headers when navigating around Excel worksheets. This firstly requires 
that the Report Table row / column headers option In NVDA's Document 
Formatting dialog be turned on. Secondly, NVDA needs to know which row 
or column contains the headers. After moving to the first cell in the 
column or row containing the headers, use one of the following commands:

Name
Key
Description
Set column headers
NVDA+shift+c
Pressing this once tells NVDA this is the first header cell in the row 
that contains column headers, which should be automatically announced 
when moving between columns below this row. Pressing twice will clear 
the setting.

Set row headers
NVDA+shift+r
Pressing this once tells NVDA this is the first header cell in the 
column that contains row headers, which should be automatically 
announced when moving between rows after this column. Pressing twice 
will clear the setting.
These settings will be stored in the workbook as defined name ranges 
compatible with other screen readers such as Jaws. This means that users 
of other screen readers who open this workbook at a later date will 
automatically have the row and column headers already set.

10.2.2. The Elements List
Similar to the web, NVDA has an Elements List for Microsoft Excel that 
allows you to list and access several different types of information. To 
access the Elements List in Excel, press NVDA+f7. The various types of 
information available in the Elements List are:
• Charts: This lists all charts in the active worksheet. Selecting a 
chart and pressing enter or the Move to button focuses the chart for 
navigating and reading with the arrow keys.
• Comments: This lists all cells in the active worksheet containing 
comments. The cell address along with its comments are shown for each 
cell. Pressing enter or the Move To button when on a listed comment will 
move directly to that cell.
• Formulas: This lists all cells in the worksheet containing a formula. 
The cell address along with its formula are shown for each cell. 
Pressing enter or the Move To button on a listed formula will move 
directly to that cell.
• Sheets: This lists all sheets in the workbook. Pressing f2 when on a 
listed sheet allows you to rename the sheet. Pressing enter or the Move 
To button while on the listed sheet will switch to that sheet.
• Form fields: This lists all form fields in the active worksheet. For 
each form field, the Elements List shows the alternative text of the 
field along with the addresses of the cells it covers. Selecting a form 
field and pressing enter or the Move to button moves to that field in 
browse mode.

10.2.3. Reporting Comments
To report any comments for the currently focused cell, press NVDA+alt+c. 
All comments for the worksheet can also be listed in the NVDA Elements 
List.

10.2.4. Reading Protected Cells
If a workbook has been protected, it may not be possible to move focus 
to particular cells that have been locked for editing. To allow moving 
to locked cells, switch to Browse Mode by pressing NVDA+space, and then 
use standard Excel movement commands such as the arrow keys to move 
around all cells on the current worksheet.

10.2.5. Form Fields
Excel worksheets can include form fields. You can access these using the 
Elements List or the f and shift+f form field single letter navigation 
keys. Once you move to a form field in browse mode, you can press enter 
or space to either activate it or switch to focus mode so you can 
interact with it, depending on the control. For further information 
about Browse mode and single letter navigation, see the Browse Mode 
section.



On 9/12/2017 7:07 AM, Carol and Roger via Talk wrote:

Hi David,
You can do this.  Place your cursor in the header row, i.e., a4.
If you have more than one row in the header, press shift and arrow 
down to include all header rows.  I have a3 and a4, so I down arrow 
with shift once.

Press ctrl-alt-jawskey -c to label columns

For rows, select the row header you want spoken and press 
alt-cntrl-jawskey-r.


Save your file before closing it and your new settings should carry 
over each time you open the file.


Carol



On 9/12/2017 4:49 AM, David via Talk wrote:

Trying to wrap my brain cells around the usage of Jaws. Those of you who
are more driven in using Jaws with Excel, maybe you can give me some
directions here, please. OK, I am using Excel 2007, but think my issue
would be similarly worked out under  any later version of Excel. So all
feedback is welcome.


Under WinEyes, it is possible to define a column, that should be read,
whenever you land on a row. You defined it under the hotkey of
Ctrl-Shift-H, if memory serves me right. What it does, is this:


I have a spreadsheet, holding a list of products, prices and amounts.
The amount column is the first of each row, 

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

old two fingers anywhere on the screen, and your device is fully
  >> loaded with a screen reader, in less than five minutes. Just HOW well
  >> will Jaws face that figure? Buy yourself a computer for anything from
  >> 300 to 1500 dollars, invest another 1200 dollars of software, add on
  >> 1200 for the screen reader; spend an hour or two in installing,
  >> licensing and updating your brand new pet. Guess you see my point. You
  >> do all of this, should you need to. But for the user who doesn't
need to?
  >>
  >>
  >> Further, keep in mind, that many who turns blind today, already are
  >> quite familiar with Android and Phone/Ipad products. Being the kind of
  >> equipment many - even school kids - now aday are acquainted with, they
  >> might not even have the skills needed for starting out with a computer.
  >> Turning blind today, you don't have one or two years to spend in a
  >> special institution for the blind, hoping to learn something
  >> old-fashioned, then imagining yourself getting back into some kind of a
  >> daily living. You simply HAVE TO get going more or less right away. And
  >> since you already own the mobile device, and all you need is to activate
  >> the screen reader pre-installed on it, you soon enough will choose that
  >> avenue. Should you now, in addition want to get your computer going for
  >> certain tasks, why go through all the hazzle of raising the 1200
  >> dollars, when you can be in business simply by downloading and
  >> installing NVDA, and be up running in less than ten minutes? You know,
  >> you don't even need two eyes to download it for you; you've got Narrator
  >> for that part of the job.
  >>
  >>
  >> Again, Jaws might be well enough for those of us who have more heavy
  >> needs on the Windows-based systems. But as time moves on, we likely will
  >> slide in the background. Tomorrow's user, likely won't need Jaws, and
  >> can enjoy a heavy good load of donuts and coffee, for the 1200 saved. :)
  >>
  >>
  >> David
  >>
  >> On 9/11/2017 12:54 AM, Loy via Talk wrote:
  >>> NVDA is not far from being as good as JAWS and  I can see it
happening that people will download the free program instead of paying
hundreds of dollars for a very similar program.
  >>> - Original Message -
  >>> From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
  >>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
  >>> Cc: Josh Kennedy
  >>> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 4:23 PM
  >>> Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
  >>>
  >>>
  >>> Why couldn't it happen?
  >>>
  >>>
  >>>
  >>> On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
  >>> > I don't see that happening.
  >>> >
  >>> > -Original Message-
  >>> > From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
  >>> > Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
  >>> > To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
  >>> > Cc: Josh Kennedy
  >>> > Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
  >>> >
  >>> > I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their
business profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more popular
than jaws and would still be open source?
  >>> >
  >>> >
  >>> >
  >>> >
  >>> > On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:
  >>> >> Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days
after the
  >>> >> anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I
will get
  >>> >> back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a
quick look at facts.
  >>> >>
  >>> >> Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone
software,
  >>> >> with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been
pretty easy.
  >>> >> And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to
develop
  >>> >> the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.
  >>> >>
  >>> >> Things are not that easy!
  >>> >> First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
  >>> >> functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain
agreements with -
  >>> >> for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software,
kind of
  >>> >> behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these
techni

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

ot even WinEyes did always work right
  >> out of the box; or why did we get the app feature of WinEyes, do you
think?
  >>
  >> But for the general home user, who wants to write and read emails, who
  >> has already invested in a scanner and OCR software, and who needs to
  >> perform general activities on the net (paying bills, checking the weekly
  >> offer of their favorite store, and lookup something on Yahoo or
  >> Google)... For those users, I am ready to say NVDA already will be close
  >> to good enough. I don't really see too much that Jaws performs, or does
  >> better, than NVDA on that front.
  >>
  >>
  >> VFO bought AISquared, and in effect GWMicro. Since the agreement of the
  >> merge is not publicly known, we do not know how that all came around, or
  >> what was the thought behind. Who initiated and so forth.
  >>
  >> <    IF
  >>
  >> the intension was to grow bigger, they really managed; for the time
  >> being. Was the idea of it all to control the market? Well, somehow maybe
  >> they have currently managed. But there is something about being the
  >> biggest and only one in town. You also will have to deal with ALL the
  >> queries. And, though the world map looks far more International today
  >> than two decades ago, many customers are facing ecconomic issues that
  >> might affect their chances of buying a wildly priced product. Somehow,
  >> we could think this to be some of the consequences of the WEForOffice
  >> program, which did open up for even the less bolstered wallet to provide
  >> the needy one with a full-fledged screen reader. Now that this program
  >> eventually will be obsolete, NVDA might be the choice -even the ONLY
  >> choice - for many a private user. Or, they might - if their activity
  >> does not rely solely on Windows - leave the whole computer world
  >> together, and go mobile.
  >>
  >>
  >> The somehow dominant position VFO has taken at the moment, might hence
  >> not be the fact we see tomorrow. That will all depend much on what
  >> happens in the electronic world all generally. A decade ago, prior to
  >> the first IPhone, everyone would have claimed that Windows was here to
  >> stay. Then came the first IPhone, then the IPad, and today many a user
  >> does not even own a computer any longer. Recently, I did see a
  >> relatively up-to-date Android device, straight from the store shelf,
  >> with all warrantees intact, advertised well under 100 dollars. Turn it
  >> on, hold two fingers anywhere on the screen, and your device is fully
  >> loaded with a screen reader, in less than five minutes. Just HOW well
  >> will Jaws face that figure? Buy yourself a computer for anything from
  >> 300 to 1500 dollars, invest another 1200 dollars of software, add on
  >> 1200 for the screen reader; spend an hour or two in installing,
  >> licensing and updating your brand new pet. Guess you see my point. You
  >> do all of this, should you need to. But for the user who doesn't
need to?
  >>
  >>
  >> Further, keep in mind, that many who turns blind today, already are
  >> quite familiar with Android and Phone/Ipad products. Being the kind of
  >> equipment many - even school kids - now aday are acquainted with, they
  >> might not even have the skills needed for starting out with a computer.
  >> Turning blind today, you don't have one or two years to spend in a
  >> special institution for the blind, hoping to learn something
  >> old-fashioned, then imagining yourself getting back into some kind of a
  >> daily living. You simply HAVE TO get going more or less right away. And
  >> since you already own the mobile device, and all you need is to activate
  >> the screen reader pre-installed on it, you soon enough will choose that
  >> avenue. Should you now, in addition want to get your computer going for
  >> certain tasks, why go through all the hazzle of raising the 1200
  >> dollars, when you can be in business simply by downloading and
  >> installing NVDA, and be up running in less than ten minutes? You know,
  >> you don't even need two eyes to download it for you; you've got Narrator
  >> for that part of the job.
  >>
  >>
  >> Again, Jaws might be well enough for those of us who have more heavy
  >> needs on the Windows-based systems. But as time moves on, we likely will
  >> slide in the background. Tomorrow's user, likely won't need Jaws, and
  >> can enjoy a heavy good load of donuts and coffee, for the 1200 saved. :)
  >>
  >>
  >> David
  >>
  >> On 9/11/2017 12:54 AM, Loy via Talk wro

Re: question about re installing wineyes

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

yes, NVDA remote is a remote support addon and it works very good.



On 9/11/2017 10:52 AM, Iaen Cordell via Talk wrote:

What about NVDA remote?
 From a bad memory I thought it was a remote desktop support add-on for NVDA.
Cheers
IC

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+ianc=optusnet.com...@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2017 12:43 AM
To: Russ Kiehne <russ94...@gmail.com>; Window-Eyes Discussion List 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Cc: Josh Kennedy <joshuakennedy...@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

there was a ticket raised about it but so far nobody has made such addons.



On 9/11/2017 9:17 AM, Russ Kiehne wrote:

It's my understanding there is a NVDA list?  Has anyone on that list
ask about a addon to give NVDA citrix and network installation server
client support?

-Original Message- From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 10:10 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

NVDA just needs network and citrix support and it will be able to
really hurt the sales of jaws. It would be great if someone would make
an NVDA addon to give NVDA citrix and network installation server client 
support.


On 9/10/2017 9:29 AM, Loy via Talk wrote:

It would hurt the sales of JAWS.
- Original Message -
From: Russ Kiehne via Talk
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Russ Kiehne
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 9:23 AM
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes


Why doesn't the vfo group put out a working copy of window eyes in
the
public domain?  This is what Freedom Scientific did with jaws for
dos.

-Original Message-
From: Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 9, 2017 11:33 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes

Thanks, Carol.

That's what I assume, and so why I'm counselling caution about
distributing
Window-Eyes even though VFO claims that it will no longer be
developed.
Besides, being their product, they can do whatever they want with
Window-Eyes in the future, even resurrect it, should they choose
to do so.

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf
Of Carol and Roger via Talk
Sent: September 9, 2017 2:13 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Cc: Carol and Roger <carogsm...@embarqmail.com>
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

Hi Rod,

Yes, you are correct.  Even if the company is gone, the copywright
is
still there.  It is the same as a person writing a book.  The book
can
be copywrighted for as long as someone wishes to keep it going.
So, AI
may have forwarded the copywright which would now fall on VFO to
continue to maintain that, even though the product is no longer
being
distributed.

Carol


On 9/9/2017 12:47 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:
> Hi Russ and all,
>
> As memory serves, you do have to enter the correct name when you
install
> Window-Eyes.
> Regardless whether I'm right about that point, as much as this
thread
> seems to entertain the idea of sharing retail copies of
Window-Eyes, I
> think you'll run into copyright infringement if you do this.
>
> Hth,
>
> Rod
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk
>
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
> Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk
> Sent: September 9, 2017 9:23 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
> Cc: Russ Kiehne <russ94...@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
>
> It's my understanding it doesn't matter what name you put in,
it's the
> serial number that matters.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Carol and Roger via Talk
> Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:38 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Carol and Roger
> Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
>
> Only sort of.  The serial number is assigned to a specific
person, so
> the name and any other information that is asked for during
installation
> would need to be the same for both people. So, if you gave me
your copy
> and did not tell me your information, your copy, on my PC would
still be
> a demo copy.
>
>
> On 9/8/2017 12:44 PM, brice Mijares via Talk wrote:
>> If I sent someone a copy of my last installation copy, that
person would
>> still need an activation code or it would go into demo mode.
Isn't 

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

NVDA probably has to be scripted for that program then.



On 9/11/2017 9:35 AM, Russ Kiehne wrote:
Here's some thing I noticed about NVDA.  When arrowing up and down the 
message list in windows live mail 2012, NVDA doesn't say things like 
replied to, forwarded, attachment like window eyes.


-Original Message- From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 5:05 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

yes, and as far as donating I would rather donate my money to the NVDA
project rather than giving it to VFO and spend money on tons of jaws
bells and whistles I'll mostly never use.



On 9/10/2017 6:54 PM, Loy via Talk wrote:
NVDA is not far from being as good as JAWS and  I can see it 
happening that people will download the free program instead of 
paying hundreds of dollars for a very similar program.

   - Original Message -
   From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Cc: Josh Kennedy
   Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 4:23 PM
   Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?


   Why couldn't it happen?



   On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
   > I don't see that happening.
   >
   > -Original Message-
   > From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk

   > Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
   > To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
   > Cc: Josh Kennedy
   > Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
   >
   > I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their 
business profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more 
popular than jaws and would still be open source?

   >
   >
   >
   >
   > On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:
   >> Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after 
the

   >> anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get
   >> back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a 
quick look at facts.

   >>
   >> Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone 
software,
   >> with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been 
pretty easy.
   >> And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to 
develop

   >> the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.
   >>
   >> Things are not that easy!
   >> First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
   >> functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements 
with -
   >> for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, 
kind of
   >> behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these 
techniques

   >> might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
   >> third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to
   >> people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold 
of the
   >> key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for 
unwanted

   >> activity, or even malware development.
   >>
   >> Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. 
Many of

   >> them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app
   >> developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. 
This
   >> was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a 
server, and

   >> maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity.
   >> Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like
   >> WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather 
details, and process them for you.

   >> Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
   >> weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, 
under the
   >> condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in 
trouble

   >> in open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the
   >> cryptizing code, opening up for people to break the cryptized 
code of

   >> the app, get to the credencials, and then misuse it.
   >>
   >> Part of the agreement GW made with their app developers, by 
providing
   >> the cryptizing feature, was to keep the app code an enclosed 
program.
   >> They might get into legal issues, should they disclose the 
cryptizer,
   >> thereby lay bare the very code of the app developer, who in 
turn might

   >> sue GW for breaking the agreement. This is kind of backed up, by a
   >> message Doug posted several years back, when someone claimed 
they had

   >> broken the cryptizer.
   >>
   >> Furthermore, it has been confirmed from Aaron, that some of the 
apps
   >> directly from GW, like AppGet, do hold credencials for 
accessing the
   >> servers of GW. It is unlikely that the

Re: question about re installing wineyes

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

there was a ticket raised about it but so far nobody has made such addons.



On 9/11/2017 9:17 AM, Russ Kiehne wrote:
It's my understanding there is a NVDA list?  Has anyone on that list 
ask about a addon to give NVDA citrix and network installation server 
client support?


-Original Message- From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 10:10 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

NVDA just needs network and citrix support and it will be able to really
hurt the sales of jaws. It would be great if someone would make an NVDA
addon to give NVDA citrix and network installation server client support.


On 9/10/2017 9:29 AM, Loy via Talk wrote:

It would hurt the sales of JAWS.
   - Original Message -
   From: Russ Kiehne via Talk
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Cc: Russ Kiehne
   Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 9:23 AM
   Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes


   Why doesn't the vfo group put out a working copy of window eyes in 
the
   public domain?  This is what Freedom Scientific did with jaws for 
dos.


   -Original Message-
   From: Rod Hutton via Talk
   Sent: Saturday, September 9, 2017 11:33 AM
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Cc: Rod Hutton
   Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes

   Thanks, Carol.

   That's what I assume, and so why I'm counselling caution about 
distributing
   Window-Eyes even though VFO claims that it will no longer be 
developed.

   Besides, being their product, they can do whatever they want with
   Window-Eyes in the future, even resurrect it, should they choose 
to do so.


   Best,

   Rod

   -Original Message-
   From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf

   Of Carol and Roger via Talk
   Sent: September 9, 2017 2:13 PM
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
   Cc: Carol and Roger <carogsm...@embarqmail.com>
   Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

   Hi Rod,

   Yes, you are correct.  Even if the company is gone, the copywright is
   still there.  It is the same as a person writing a book.  The book 
can
   be copywrighted for as long as someone wishes to keep it going.  
So, AI

   may have forwarded the copywright which would now fall on VFO to
   continue to maintain that, even though the product is no longer being
   distributed.

   Carol


   On 9/9/2017 12:47 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:
   > Hi Russ and all,
   >
   > As memory serves, you do have to enter the correct name when you 
install

   > Window-Eyes.
   > Regardless whether I'm right about that point, as much as this 
thread
   > seems to entertain the idea of sharing retail copies of 
Window-Eyes, I

   > think you'll run into copyright infringement if you do this.
   >
   > Hth,
   >
   > Rod
   >
   > -Original Message-
   > From: Talk
   > 
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On

   > Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk
   > Sent: September 9, 2017 9:23 AM
   > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
   > Cc: Russ Kiehne <russ94...@gmail.com>
   > Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
   >
   > It's my understanding it doesn't matter what name you put in, 
it's the

   > serial number that matters.
   >
   > -Original Message-
   > From: Carol and Roger via Talk
   > Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:38 AM
   > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   > Cc: Carol and Roger
   > Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
   >
   > Only sort of.  The serial number is assigned to a specific 
person, so
   > the name and any other information that is asked for during 
installation
   > would need to be the same for both people. So, if you gave me 
your copy
   > and did not tell me your information, your copy, on my PC would 
still be

   > a demo copy.
   >
   >
   > On 9/8/2017 12:44 PM, brice Mijares via Talk wrote:
   >> If I sent someone a copy of my last installation copy, that 
person would
   >> still need an activation code or it would go into demo mode. 
Isn't this

   >> correct?
   >>
   >> On 9/8/2017 8:57 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk]
   >>
   >>   wrote:
   >>> Hi Loy,
   >>>
   >>> Sorry, I wasn't clear.  I was referring to why you thought it 
would be
   >>> okay for someone to use someone else's copy of WE simply 
because it was

   >>> no longer being developed.
   >>> I would think it is still the property of VFO, and, therefore,
   >>> infringement of copyright to let someone else use it.
   >>>
   >>> Thanks,
   >>>
   >>> Rod
   >>>
   >>> -Original Message-
   >&g

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

let me correct myself here. the j-say product costs around $400 or $300. 
that is for jaws. dictation bridge for all screen readers costs, and 
will cost, $0.




On 9/11/2017 8:27 AM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:

No you don't dictation bridge is being developed for jaws it won't cost
$400.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2017 7:42 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

NVDA works with dragon naturally speaking, and windows speech recognition,
and it does it for free, with an addon called dictation bridge. with jaws
you have to pay an extra $400 or so for that functionality.



On 9/10/2017 11:51 PM, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote:

The problem is that FS has too much of a monopoly in the paid market.
Monopolies are illegal.
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 8:51 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: window-eyes open source?

It is far from being as good as jaws!

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Loy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 6:55 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Loy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

NVDA is not far from being as good as JAWS and  I can see it happening
that people will download the free program instead of paying hundreds
of dollars for a very similar program.
- Original Message -
From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 4:23 PM
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?


Why couldn't it happen?



On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
> I don't see that happening.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
> To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Josh Kennedy
> Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
>
> I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their
business profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more
popular than jaws and would still be open source?
>
>
>
>
> On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:
>> Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the
>> anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get
>> back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a
quick look at facts.
>>
>> Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone

software,

>> with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been
pretty easy.
>> And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop
>> the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.
>>
>> Things are not that easy!
>> First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
>> functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with

-

>> for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of
>> behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these

techniques

>> might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
>> third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to
>> people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of

the

>> key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for

unwanted

>> activity, or even malware development.
>>
>> Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many

of

>> them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app
>> developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This
>> was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and
>> maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity.
>> Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like
>> WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather
details, and process them for you.
>> Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
>> weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under

the

>> condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble
>> in open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the
>> cryptizing code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code

of

>> the app, get to the credencials, and

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

ser, likely won't need Jaws, and
can enjoy a heavy good load of donuts and coffee, for the 1200 saved. :)


David

On 9/11/2017 12:54 AM, Loy via Talk wrote:

NVDA is not far from being as good as JAWS and  I can see it happening that 
people will download the free program instead of paying hundreds of dollars for 
a very similar program.
- Original Message -
From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 4:23 PM
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?


Why couldn't it happen?



On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
> I don't see that happening.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
Josh Kennedy via Talk
> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
> To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Josh Kennedy
> Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
>
> I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their business 
profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more popular than jaws and 
would still be open source?
>
>
>
>
> On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:
>> Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the
>> anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get
>> back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a quick look 
at facts.
>>
>> Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone software,
>> with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been pretty easy.
>> And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop
>> the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.
>>
>> Things are not that easy!
>> First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
>> functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with -
>> for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of
>> behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these techniques
>> might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
>> third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to
>> people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of the
>> key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for unwanted
>> activity, or even malware development.
>>
>> Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many of
>> them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app
>> developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This
>> was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and
>> maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity.
>> Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like
>> WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather details, 
and process them for you.
>> Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
>> weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under the
>> condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble
>> in open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the
>> cryptizing code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code of
>> the app, get to the credencials, and then misuse it.
>>
>> Part of the agreement GW made with their app developers, by providing
>> the cryptizing feature, was to keep the app code an enclosed program.
>> They might get into legal issues, should they disclose the cryptizer,
>> thereby lay bare the very code of the app developer, who in turn might
>> sue GW for breaking the agreement. This is kind of backed up, by a
>> message Doug posted several years back, when someone claimed they had
>> broken the cryptizer.
>>
>> Furthermore, it has been confirmed from Aaron, that some of the apps
>> directly from GW, like AppGet, do hold credencials for accessing the
>> servers of GW. It is unlikely that they want to have these credencials
>> open-sourced. In particular so, if you remember the attack someone
>> gave them a few years back, when the code of the GWToolkit was hacked,
>> and gave many a WinEyes user quite a shock the morning they turned on
>> their computer, and got a threatening message on their screen.
>>
>> Mind you, GW got into a cooperation with Microsoft, when they
>> introduced the WEForOffice program. Even here, they told that this

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

NVDA works with dragon naturally speaking, and windows speech 
recognition, and it does it for free, with an addon called dictation 
bridge. with jaws you have to pay an extra $400 or so for that 
functionality.




On 9/10/2017 11:51 PM, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote:

The problem is that FS has too much of a monopoly in the paid market.
Monopolies are illegal.
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 8:51 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: window-eyes open source?

It is far from being as good as jaws!

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Loy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 6:55 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Loy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

NVDA is not far from being as good as JAWS and  I can see it happening that
people will download the free program instead of paying hundreds of dollars
for a very similar program.
   - Original Message -
   From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Cc: Josh Kennedy
   Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 4:23 PM
   Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?


   Why couldn't it happen?



   On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
   > I don't see that happening.
   >
   > -Original Message-
   > From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf
Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
   > Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
   > To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
   > Cc: Josh Kennedy
   > Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
   >
   > I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their business
profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more popular than jaws
and would still be open source?
   >
   >
   >
   >
   > On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:
   >> Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the
   >> anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get
   >> back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a quick look
at facts.
   >>
   >> Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone software,
   >> with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been pretty
easy.
   >> And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop
   >> the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.
   >>
   >> Things are not that easy!
   >> First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
   >> functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with -
   >> for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of
   >> behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these techniques
   >> might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
   >> third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to
   >> people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of the
   >> key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for unwanted
   >> activity, or even malware development.
   >>
   >> Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many of
   >> them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app
   >> developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This
   >> was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and
   >> maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity.
   >> Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like
   >> WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather details,
and process them for you.
   >> Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
   >> weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under the
   >> condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble
   >> in open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the
   >> cryptizing code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code of
   >> the app, get to the credencials, and then misuse it.
   >>
   >> Part of the agreement GW made with their app developers, by providing
   >> the cryptizing feature, was to keep the app code an enclosed program.
   >> They might get into legal issues, should they disclose the cryptizer,
   >> thereby lay bare the very code of the app developer, who in turn might
   >> sue GW for breaking the agreement. This is kind of backed up, by a
   >> message Doug posted several years back, when someone claimed they had
   >> broken the cryptizer.
   >>
   >> Furthermore, it has been confirmed from Aaron, that som

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

if you install NVDA addons and voices then, NVDA, becomes almost as good 
as jaws.




On 9/10/2017 11:50 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:

It is far from being as good as jaws!

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Loy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 6:55 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Loy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

NVDA is not far from being as good as JAWS and  I can see it happening that
people will download the free program instead of paying hundreds of dollars
for a very similar program.
   - Original Message -
   From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Cc: Josh Kennedy
   Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 4:23 PM
   Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?


   Why couldn't it happen?



   On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
   > I don't see that happening.
   >
   > -Original Message-
   > From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf
Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
   > Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
   > To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
   > Cc: Josh Kennedy
   > Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
   >
   > I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their business
profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more popular than jaws
and would still be open source?
   >
   >
   >
   >
   > On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:
   >> Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the
   >> anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get
   >> back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a quick look
at facts.
   >>
   >> Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone software,
   >> with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been pretty
easy.
   >> And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop
   >> the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.
   >>
   >> Things are not that easy!
   >> First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
   >> functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with -
   >> for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of
   >> behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these techniques
   >> might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
   >> third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to
   >> people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of the
   >> key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for unwanted
   >> activity, or even malware development.
   >>
   >> Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many of
   >> them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app
   >> developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This
   >> was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and
   >> maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity.
   >> Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like
   >> WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather details,
and process them for you.
   >> Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
   >> weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under the
   >> condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble
   >> in open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the
   >> cryptizing code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code of
   >> the app, get to the credencials, and then misuse it.
   >>
   >> Part of the agreement GW made with their app developers, by providing
   >> the cryptizing feature, was to keep the app code an enclosed program.
   >> They might get into legal issues, should they disclose the cryptizer,
   >> thereby lay bare the very code of the app developer, who in turn might
   >> sue GW for breaking the agreement. This is kind of backed up, by a
   >> message Doug posted several years back, when someone claimed they had
   >> broken the cryptizer.
   >>
   >> Furthermore, it has been confirmed from Aaron, that some of the apps
   >> directly from GW, like AppGet, do hold credencials for accessing the
   >> servers of GW. It is unlikely that they want to have these credencials
   >> open-sourced. In particular so, if you remember the attack someone
   >> gave them a few years back, when the code of the GWToolkit was hacked,
   >> and gave many a WinEyes user quite a shock the morning they turned on
   >> their computer, and got a threatening messa

Re: question about re installing wineyes

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

you know what? The only other screen reader that comes close, 
historically-speaking, to NVDA's power, flexibility, and affordability, 
in my opinion, would have to be the old ASAP screen reader and tinyTalk 
screen readers for ms-DOS. Both NVDA and ASAP and tinyTalk for ms-dos 
dos can do stuff that no other screen reader can do.



On 9/10/2017 1:34 PM, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote:

I can assure you that that is on the list of things for NVAccess.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 10:11 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

NVDA just needs network and citrix support and it will be able to really
hurt the sales of jaws. It would be great if someone would make an NVDA
addon to give NVDA citrix and network installation server client support.


On 9/10/2017 9:29 AM, Loy via Talk wrote:

It would hurt the sales of JAWS.
- Original Message -
From: Russ Kiehne via Talk
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Russ Kiehne
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 9:23 AM
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes


Why doesn't the vfo group put out a working copy of window eyes in the
public domain?  This is what Freedom Scientific did with jaws for dos.

-Original Message-
From: Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 9, 2017 11:33 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes

Thanks, Carol.

That's what I assume, and so why I'm counselling caution about

distributing

Window-Eyes even though VFO claims that it will no longer be developed.
Besides, being their product, they can do whatever they want with
Window-Eyes in the future, even resurrect it, should they choose to do

so.

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On

Behalf

Of Carol and Roger via Talk
Sent: September 9, 2017 2:13 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Cc: Carol and Roger<carogsm...@embarqmail.com>
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

Hi Rod,

Yes, you are correct.  Even if the company is gone, the copywright is
still there.  It is the same as a person writing a book.  The book can
be copywrighted for as long as someone wishes to keep it going.  So, AI
may have forwarded the copywright which would now fall on VFO to
continue to maintain that, even though the product is no longer being
distributed.

Carol


On 9/9/2017 12:47 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:
> Hi Russ and all,
>
> As memory serves, you do have to enter the correct name when you

install

> Window-Eyes.
> Regardless whether I'm right about that point, as much as this thread
> seems to entertain the idea of sharing retail copies of Window-Eyes,

I

> think you'll run into copyright infringement if you do this.
>
> Hth,
>
> Rod
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk
> [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
> Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk
> Sent: September 9, 2017 9:23 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
> Cc: Russ Kiehne<russ94...@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
>
> It's my understanding it doesn't matter what name you put in, it's

the

> serial number that matters.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Carol and Roger via Talk
> Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:38 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Carol and Roger
> Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
>
> Only sort of.  The serial number is assigned to a specific person, so
> the name and any other information that is asked for during

installation

> would need to be the same for both people. So, if you gave me your

copy

> and did not tell me your information, your copy, on my PC would still

be

> a demo copy.
>
>
> On 9/8/2017 12:44 PM, brice Mijares via Talk wrote:
>> If I sent someone a copy of my last installation copy, that person

would

>> still need an activation code or it would go into demo mode. Isn't

this

>> correct?
>>
>> On 9/8/2017 8:57 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk]
>>
>>   wrote:
>>> Hi Loy,
>>>
>>> Sorry, I wasn't clear.  I was referring to why you thought it would

be

>>> okay for someone to use someone else's copy of WE simply because i

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

where did you hear that from? and how can they purchase an open source 
product under the gpl?




On 9/10/2017 7:15 PM, ratshtron via Talk wrote:
don't push it! i have heard that they are wanting to purchase nvda and 
thus killing it as well.



Legend has it that on Sunday 9/10/2017 12:07 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk 
said:


I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their 
business profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more 
popular than jaws and would still be open source? On 9/10/2017 2:54 
AM, David wrote: > Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple 
of days after the > anouncement of the discontinued development of 
WinEyes. I will get back > to what Doug said back then. First of all, 
let's take a quick look at facts. > > Had it been as easy as WinEyes 
would have been a stand-alone software, > with all its coding done 
'in-house', things would have been pretty easy. > And had it been 
that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop the > software, 
they could have decided whatever they wanted. > > Things are not that 
easy! > First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the 
better > functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain 
agreements with - > for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party 
software, kind of > behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, 
now these techniques > might be disclosed to the public, threatening 
the products of the > third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of 
course would lead to people, > not working on assistive technology at 
all, to get hold of the key for > the backdoor of - say Adobe's 
reader - and use it for unwanted activity, > or even malware 
development. > > Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you 
loads of apps. Many of > them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a 
chance for the app developer > to cryptize his code, for protecting 
against peekers. This was a > benefit, for instance when the app has 
to access a server, and maybe > even use some login credencials, to 
perform the activity. Without me > knowing for sure, we could think 
of an app like WeatherOrNot, which has > to access a server, retrieve 
weather details, and process them for you. > Now if the developer has 
reached a given agreement with the > weather-server provider, that 
his app will gain free access, under the > condition of not 
disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble in > 
open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the cryptizing 
> code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code of the app, 
get > to the credencials, and then misuse it. > > Part of the 
agreement GW made with their app developers, by providing > the 
cryptizing feature, was to keep the app code an enclosed program. > 
They might get into legal issues, should they disclose the cryptizer, 
> thereby lay bare the very code of the app developer, who in turn 
might > sue GW for breaking the agreement. This is kind of backed up, 
by a > message Doug posted several years back, when someone claimed 
they had > broken the cryptizer. > > Furthermore, it has been 
confirmed from Aaron, that some of the apps > directly from GW, like 
AppGet, do hold credencials for accessing the > servers of GW. It is 
unlikely that they want to have these credencials > open-sourced. In 
particular so, if you remember the attack someone gave > them a few 
years back, when the code of the GWToolkit was hacked, and > gave 
many a WinEyes user quite a shock the morning they turned on their > 
computer, and got a threatening message on their screen. > > Mind 
you, GW got into a cooperation with Microsoft, when they introduced > 
the WEForOffice program. Even here, they told that this agreement 
would > put them in specially close relationship with the ingeneers 
of > Microsoft. Who knows what closures might be involved there, and 
which > would be broken, had WE got open-sourced. > > Now let's move 
back to the answer Doug gave back in the spring this > year. The 
above is a bit of an elaboration of what he said. You will > find his 
answer in the archives, but in very short terms: >     NOPE! 
WinEyes code CANNNOT go open-source; If for no other reasons, > due 
to the infringement of third-party agreements involved. > > All of 
this, actually leads me to once again raising the very question: >   
    Does VFO even have access to the WinEyes code? > VFO might 
have bought AISquared, thereby also the former GWMicro. But > they 
might not have bought the copyright of the source-code. And perhaps > 
that was never intended either. Seems all they wanted, was to rid the 
> market of any competition, period. Who knows, maybe Doug simply hit 
the > Delete-key, the last thing before he handed in the 

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

yes, and as far as donating I would rather donate my money to the NVDA 
project rather than giving it to VFO and spend money on tons of jaws 
bells and whistles I'll mostly never use.




On 9/10/2017 6:54 PM, Loy via Talk wrote:

NVDA is not far from being as good as JAWS and  I can see it happening that 
people will download the free program instead of paying hundreds of dollars for 
a very similar program.
   - Original Message -
   From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Cc: Josh Kennedy
   Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 4:23 PM
   Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?


   Why couldn't it happen?



   On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
   > I don't see that happening.
   >
   > -Original Message-
   > From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
Josh Kennedy via Talk
   > Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
   > To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
   > Cc: Josh Kennedy
   > Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
   >
   > I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their business 
profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more popular than jaws and 
would still be open source?
   >
   >
   >
   >
   > On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:
   >> Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the
   >> anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get
   >> back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a quick look 
at facts.
   >>
   >> Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone software,
   >> with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been pretty easy.
   >> And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop
   >> the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.
   >>
   >> Things are not that easy!
   >> First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
   >> functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with -
   >> for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of
   >> behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these techniques
   >> might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
   >> third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to
   >> people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of the
   >> key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for unwanted
   >> activity, or even malware development.
   >>
   >> Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many of
   >> them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app
   >> developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This
   >> was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and
   >> maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity.
   >> Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like
   >> WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather details, and 
process them for you.
   >> Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
   >> weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under the
   >> condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble
   >> in open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the
   >> cryptizing code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code of
   >> the app, get to the credencials, and then misuse it.
   >>
   >> Part of the agreement GW made with their app developers, by providing
   >> the cryptizing feature, was to keep the app code an enclosed program.
   >> They might get into legal issues, should they disclose the cryptizer,
   >> thereby lay bare the very code of the app developer, who in turn might
   >> sue GW for breaking the agreement. This is kind of backed up, by a
   >> message Doug posted several years back, when someone claimed they had
   >> broken the cryptizer.
   >>
   >> Furthermore, it has been confirmed from Aaron, that some of the apps
   >> directly from GW, like AppGet, do hold credencials for accessing the
   >> servers of GW. It is unlikely that they want to have these credencials
   >> open-sourced. In particular so, if you remember the attack someone
   >> gave them a few years back, when the code of the GWToolkit was hacked,
   >> and gave many a WinEyes user quite a shock the morning they turned on
   >> their computer, and got a threatening message on their screen.
   >>
   >> Mind you, GW got into a cooperation with Microsoft, when they
   >> introduced the WEForOffice program. Even here, they told that this
 

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

linux has done excellent penetrating the market, the mobile market that 
is. linux is on every android phone. and iPhones run a unixLike kernel. 
androids run a version of the linux kernel. on desktops linux is stuck 
in the past due to many more advanced things still making you need to 
use command line options. and linux is very fragmented on the desktop. 
linux is fragmented, NVDA is not fragmented with over 300 different 
versions out there. you cannot compare linux to NVDA, two different things.




On 9/10/2017 6:16 PM, Nick Sarames wrote:

How well has Linux done in terms of penetrating the market?

On 9/10/2017 4:23 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:

Why couldn't it happen?



On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:

I don't see that happening.

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their business
profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more popular than
jaws and would still be open source?




On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:

Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the
anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get
back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a quick
look at facts.

Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone software,
with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been pretty easy.
And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop
the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.

Things are not that easy!
First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with -
for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of
behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these techniques
might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to
people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of the
key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for unwanted
activity, or even malware development.

Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many of
them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app
developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This
was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and
maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity.
Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like
WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather details,
and process them for you.
Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under the
condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble
in open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the
cryptizing code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code of
the app, get to the credencials, and then misuse it.

Part of the agreement GW made with their app developers, by providing
the cryptizing feature, was to keep the app code an enclosed program.
They might get into legal issues, should they disclose the cryptizer,
thereby lay bare the very code of the app developer, who in turn might
sue GW for breaking the agreement. This is kind of backed up, by a
message Doug posted several years back, when someone claimed they had
broken the cryptizer.

Furthermore, it has been confirmed from Aaron, that some of the apps
directly from GW, like AppGet, do hold credencials for accessing the
servers of GW. It is unlikely that they want to have these credencials
open-sourced. In particular so, if you remember the attack someone
gave them a few years back, when the code of the GWToolkit was hacked,
and gave many a WinEyes user quite a shock the morning they turned on
their computer, and got a threatening message on their screen.

Mind you, GW got into a cooperation with Microsoft, when they
introduced the WEForOffice program. Even here, they told that this
agreement would put them in specially close relationship with the
ingeneers of Microsoft. Who knows what closures might be involved
there, and which would be broken, had WE got open-sourced.

Now let's move back to the answer Doug gave back in the spring this
year. The above is a bit of an elaboration of what he said. You will
find his answer in the archives, but in very short terms:
    NOPE! WinEyes code CANNNOT go open-source; If for no other
reasons, due to the infringement of third-party agreements involved.

All of this, actually leads me to once again raising the very question:
    Does VFO even have access to the WinEyes code?
VFO might have bought AISquared, thereby also

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

like comparing appples and oranges, linux is fragmented, NVDA is not, 
two different things.




On 9/10/2017 6:16 PM, Nick Sarames wrote:

How well has Linux done in terms of penetrating the market?

On 9/10/2017 4:23 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:

Why couldn't it happen?



On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:

I don't see that happening.

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their business
profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more popular than
jaws and would still be open source?




On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:

Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the
anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get
back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a quick
look at facts.

Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone software,
with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been pretty easy.
And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop
the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.

Things are not that easy!
First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with -
for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of
behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these techniques
might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to
people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of the
key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for unwanted
activity, or even malware development.

Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many of
them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app
developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This
was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and
maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity.
Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like
WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather details,
and process them for you.
Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under the
condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble
in open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the
cryptizing code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code of
the app, get to the credencials, and then misuse it.

Part of the agreement GW made with their app developers, by providing
the cryptizing feature, was to keep the app code an enclosed program.
They might get into legal issues, should they disclose the cryptizer,
thereby lay bare the very code of the app developer, who in turn might
sue GW for breaking the agreement. This is kind of backed up, by a
message Doug posted several years back, when someone claimed they had
broken the cryptizer.

Furthermore, it has been confirmed from Aaron, that some of the apps
directly from GW, like AppGet, do hold credencials for accessing the
servers of GW. It is unlikely that they want to have these credencials
open-sourced. In particular so, if you remember the attack someone
gave them a few years back, when the code of the GWToolkit was hacked,
and gave many a WinEyes user quite a shock the morning they turned on
their computer, and got a threatening message on their screen.

Mind you, GW got into a cooperation with Microsoft, when they
introduced the WEForOffice program. Even here, they told that this
agreement would put them in specially close relationship with the
ingeneers of Microsoft. Who knows what closures might be involved
there, and which would be broken, had WE got open-sourced.

Now let's move back to the answer Doug gave back in the spring this
year. The above is a bit of an elaboration of what he said. You will
find his answer in the archives, but in very short terms:
    NOPE! WinEyes code CANNNOT go open-source; If for no other
reasons, due to the infringement of third-party agreements involved.

All of this, actually leads me to once again raising the very question:
    Does VFO even have access to the WinEyes code?
VFO might have bought AISquared, thereby also the former GWMicro. But
they might not have bought the copyright of the source-code. And
perhaps that was never intended either. Seems all they wanted, was to
rid the market of any competition, period. Who knows, maybe Doug
simply hit the Delete-key, the last thing before he handed in the key
for the Office front-door?

And to assume that VFO's tech personel would bother to plow the
thousands of lines of coding

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

Why couldn't it happen?



On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:

I don't see that happening.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their business profits? 
If free open source NVDA would become way more popular than jaws and would 
still be open source?




On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:

Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the
anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get
back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a quick look at 
facts.

Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone software,
with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been pretty easy.
And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop
the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.

Things are not that easy!
First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with -
for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of
behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these techniques
might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to
people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of the
key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for unwanted
activity, or even malware development.

Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many of
them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app
developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This
was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and
maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity.
Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like
WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather details, and 
process them for you.
Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under the
condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble
in open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the
cryptizing code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code of
the app, get to the credencials, and then misuse it.

Part of the agreement GW made with their app developers, by providing
the cryptizing feature, was to keep the app code an enclosed program.
They might get into legal issues, should they disclose the cryptizer,
thereby lay bare the very code of the app developer, who in turn might
sue GW for breaking the agreement. This is kind of backed up, by a
message Doug posted several years back, when someone claimed they had
broken the cryptizer.

Furthermore, it has been confirmed from Aaron, that some of the apps
directly from GW, like AppGet, do hold credencials for accessing the
servers of GW. It is unlikely that they want to have these credencials
open-sourced. In particular so, if you remember the attack someone
gave them a few years back, when the code of the GWToolkit was hacked,
and gave many a WinEyes user quite a shock the morning they turned on
their computer, and got a threatening message on their screen.

Mind you, GW got into a cooperation with Microsoft, when they
introduced the WEForOffice program. Even here, they told that this
agreement would put them in specially close relationship with the
ingeneers of Microsoft. Who knows what closures might be involved
there, and which would be broken, had WE got open-sourced.

Now let's move back to the answer Doug gave back in the spring this
year. The above is a bit of an elaboration of what he said. You will
find his answer in the archives, but in very short terms:
   NOPE! WinEyes code CANNNOT go open-source; If for no other
reasons, due to the infringement of third-party agreements involved.

All of this, actually leads me to once again raising the very question:
   Does VFO even have access to the WinEyes code?
VFO might have bought AISquared, thereby also the former GWMicro. But
they might not have bought the copyright of the source-code. And
perhaps that was never intended either. Seems all they wanted, was to
rid the market of any competition, period. Who knows, maybe Doug
simply hit the Delete-key, the last thing before he handed in the key
for the Office front-door?

And to assume that VFO's tech personel would bother to plow the
thousands of lines of coding for WinEyes, in hope of hitting the
technique used to perform a simple task, is out of range. It would
take hours, days or even weeks, to figure why things have been done
the way they were. Or, to find the part of a signed contract, that
possibly could

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

NVDA doesn't have to market its product very much these days, social 
media and things like that probably get the product out there.




On 9/10/2017 2:38 PM, Nick Sarames wrote:

That's a lot to ask of a non-profit making institution which likely does
not have the budget to market its product.

On 9/10/2017 1:07 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:

I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their business
profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more popular than
jaws and would still be open source?




On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:

Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the
anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get back
to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a quick look at
facts.

Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone software,
with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been pretty easy.
And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop the
software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.

Things are not that easy!
First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with -
for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of
behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these techniques
might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to people,
not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of the key for
the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for unwanted activity,
or even malware development.

Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many of
them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app developer
to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This was a
benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and maybe
even use some login credencials, to perform the activity. Without me
knowing for sure, we could think of an app like WeatherOrNot, which has
to access a server, retrieve weather details, and process them for you.
Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under the
condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble in
open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the cryptizing
code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code of the app, get
to the credencials, and then misuse it.

Part of the agreement GW made with their app developers, by providing
the cryptizing feature, was to keep the app code an enclosed program.
They might get into legal issues, should they disclose the cryptizer,
thereby lay bare the very code of the app developer, who in turn might
sue GW for breaking the agreement. This is kind of backed up, by a
message Doug posted several years back, when someone claimed they had
broken the cryptizer.

Furthermore, it has been confirmed from Aaron, that some of the apps
directly from GW, like AppGet, do hold credencials for accessing the
servers of GW. It is unlikely that they want to have these credencials
open-sourced. In particular so, if you remember the attack someone gave
them a few years back, when the code of the GWToolkit was hacked, and
gave many a WinEyes user quite a shock the morning they turned on their
computer, and got a threatening message on their screen.

Mind you, GW got into a cooperation with Microsoft, when they introduced
the WEForOffice program. Even here, they told that this agreement would
put them in specially close relationship with the ingeneers of
Microsoft. Who knows what closures might be involved there, and which
would be broken, had WE got open-sourced.

Now let's move back to the answer Doug gave back in the spring this
year. The above is a bit of an elaboration of what he said. You will
find his answer in the archives, but in very short terms:
       NOPE! WinEyes code CANNNOT go open-source; If for no other reasons,
due to the infringement of third-party agreements involved.

All of this, actually leads me to once again raising the very question:
       Does VFO even have access to the WinEyes code?
VFO might have bought AISquared, thereby also the former GWMicro. But
they might not have bought the copyright of the source-code. And perhaps
that was never intended either. Seems all they wanted, was to rid the
market of any competition, period. Who knows, maybe Doug simply hit the
Delete-key, the last thing before he handed in the key for the Office
front-door?

And to assume that VFO's tech personel would bother to plow the
thousands of lines of coding for WinEyes, in hope of hitting the
technique used to perform a simple task, is out of range. It would take
hours, days or even weeks, to figure why things have been done the way
they were. Or, to find the part of a signed contract, that possibly
could be renewed in VFO's favor. Far more cost

Re: question about re installing wineyes

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

you know what? The only other screen reader that comes close, 
historically-speaking, to NVDA's power, flexibility, and affordability, 
in my opinion, would have to be the old ASAP screen reader and tinyTalk 
screen readers for ms-DOS. Both NVDA and ASAP and tinyTalk for ms-dos 
dos can do stuff that no other screen reader can do.



On 9/10/2017 1:34 PM, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote:

I can assure you that that is on the list of things for NVAccess.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 10:11 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

NVDA just needs network and citrix support and it will be able to really
hurt the sales of jaws. It would be great if someone would make an NVDA
addon to give NVDA citrix and network installation server client support.


On 9/10/2017 9:29 AM, Loy via Talk wrote:

It would hurt the sales of JAWS.
- Original Message -
From: Russ Kiehne via Talk
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Russ Kiehne
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 9:23 AM
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes


Why doesn't the vfo group put out a working copy of window eyes in the
public domain?  This is what Freedom Scientific did with jaws for dos.

-Original Message-
From: Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 9, 2017 11:33 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes

Thanks, Carol.

That's what I assume, and so why I'm counselling caution about

distributing

Window-Eyes even though VFO claims that it will no longer be developed.
Besides, being their product, they can do whatever they want with
Window-Eyes in the future, even resurrect it, should they choose to do

so.

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On

Behalf

Of Carol and Roger via Talk
Sent: September 9, 2017 2:13 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Cc: Carol and Roger <carogsm...@embarqmail.com>
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

Hi Rod,

Yes, you are correct.  Even if the company is gone, the copywright is
still there.  It is the same as a person writing a book.  The book can
be copywrighted for as long as someone wishes to keep it going.  So, AI
may have forwarded the copywright which would now fall on VFO to
continue to maintain that, even though the product is no longer being
distributed.

Carol


On 9/9/2017 12:47 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:
> Hi Russ and all,
>
> As memory serves, you do have to enter the correct name when you

install

> Window-Eyes.
> Regardless whether I'm right about that point, as much as this thread
> seems to entertain the idea of sharing retail copies of Window-Eyes,

I

> think you'll run into copyright infringement if you do this.
>
> Hth,
>
> Rod
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk
> [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
> Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk
> Sent: September 9, 2017 9:23 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
> Cc: Russ Kiehne <russ94...@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
>
> It's my understanding it doesn't matter what name you put in, it's

the

> serial number that matters.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Carol and Roger via Talk
> Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:38 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Carol and Roger
> Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
>
> Only sort of.  The serial number is assigned to a specific person, so
> the name and any other information that is asked for during

installation

> would need to be the same for both people. So, if you gave me your

copy

> and did not tell me your information, your copy, on my PC would still

be

> a demo copy.
>
>
> On 9/8/2017 12:44 PM, brice Mijares via Talk wrote:
>> If I sent someone a copy of my last installation copy, that person

would

>> still need an activation code or it would go into demo mode. Isn't

this

>> correct?
>>
>> On 9/8/2017 8:57 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk]
>>
>>   wrote:
>>> Hi Loy,
>>>
>>> Sorry, I wasn't clear.  I was referring to why you thought it would

be

>>> okay for someone to use someone else's copy of WE simply because i

Re: question about re installing wineyes

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

NVDA just needs network and citrix support and it will be able to really 
hurt the sales of jaws. It would be great if someone would make an NVDA 
addon to give NVDA citrix and network installation server client support.



On 9/10/2017 9:29 AM, Loy via Talk wrote:

It would hurt the sales of JAWS.
   - Original Message -
   From: Russ Kiehne via Talk
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Cc: Russ Kiehne
   Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 9:23 AM
   Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes


   Why doesn't the vfo group put out a working copy of window eyes in the
   public domain?  This is what Freedom Scientific did with jaws for dos.

   -Original Message-
   From: Rod Hutton via Talk
   Sent: Saturday, September 9, 2017 11:33 AM
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Cc: Rod Hutton
   Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes

   Thanks, Carol.

   That's what I assume, and so why I'm counselling caution about distributing
   Window-Eyes even though VFO claims that it will no longer be developed.
   Besides, being their product, they can do whatever they want with
   Window-Eyes in the future, even resurrect it, should they choose to do so.

   Best,

   Rod

   -Original Message-
   From: Talk
   [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf
   Of Carol and Roger via Talk
   Sent: September 9, 2017 2:13 PM
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
   Cc: Carol and Roger 
   Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

   Hi Rod,

   Yes, you are correct.  Even if the company is gone, the copywright is
   still there.  It is the same as a person writing a book.  The book can
   be copywrighted for as long as someone wishes to keep it going.  So, AI
   may have forwarded the copywright which would now fall on VFO to
   continue to maintain that, even though the product is no longer being
   distributed.

   Carol


   On 9/9/2017 12:47 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:
   > Hi Russ and all,
   >
   > As memory serves, you do have to enter the correct name when you install
   > Window-Eyes.
   > Regardless whether I'm right about that point, as much as this thread
   > seems to entertain the idea of sharing retail copies of Window-Eyes, I
   > think you'll run into copyright infringement if you do this.
   >
   > Hth,
   >
   > Rod
   >
   > -Original Message-
   > From: Talk
   > [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
   > Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk
   > Sent: September 9, 2017 9:23 AM
   > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
   > Cc: Russ Kiehne 
   > Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
   >
   > It's my understanding it doesn't matter what name you put in, it's the
   > serial number that matters.
   >
   > -Original Message-
   > From: Carol and Roger via Talk
   > Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:38 AM
   > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   > Cc: Carol and Roger
   > Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
   >
   > Only sort of.  The serial number is assigned to a specific person, so
   > the name and any other information that is asked for during installation
   > would need to be the same for both people. So, if you gave me your copy
   > and did not tell me your information, your copy, on my PC would still be
   > a demo copy.
   >
   >
   > On 9/8/2017 12:44 PM, brice Mijares via Talk wrote:
   >> If I sent someone a copy of my last installation copy, that person would
   >> still need an activation code or it would go into demo mode. Isn't this
   >> correct?
   >>
   >> On 9/8/2017 8:57 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk]
   >>
   >>   wrote:
   >>> Hi Loy,
   >>>
   >>> Sorry, I wasn't clear.  I was referring to why you thought it would be
   >>> okay for someone to use someone else's copy of WE simply because it was
   >>> no longer being developed.
   >>> I would think it is still the property of VFO, and, therefore,
   >>> infringement of copyright to let someone else use it.
   >>>
   >>> Thanks,
   >>>
   >>> Rod
   >>>
   >>> -Original Message-
   >>> From: Talk
   >>> [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
   >>> Behalf Of Loy via Talk
   >>> Sent: September 8, 2017 11:37 AM
   >>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
   >>> Cc: Loy 
   >>> Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
   >>>
   >>> If you are in the US, you never had to activate WE. I think in some
   >>> countries you had to have a dongle.
   >>> - Original Message -
   >>> From: Rod Hutton via Talk
   >>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   >>> Cc: Rod Hutton
   >>> Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 11:01 AM
   >>> Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> Hi Loy,
   >>>
   >>> If you truly know this, then, that's fine.
   >>> 

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

, and never did. They needed the
market, and that is what they've currently got.


On 9/10/2017 3:01 AM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:
  > hi
  >
  > Is there any possibility since window eyes is no longer supported to
get the window-eyes source code make it open source and put it up on the
github website? then other developers could keep developing window eyes.
  >
  >




--
sent with mozilla thunderbird

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Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

What about termites that live in the court room? is that what you said? 
I guess termites could live in courtrooms, couldn't they?




On 9/9/2017 10:37 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:
NVDA is fine to use. I like its business model better than VFO's 
business model.




On 9/9/2017 10:14 PM, mr. Chikodinaka Nickarandidum Oguledo via Talk 
wrote:

your brakeing the law! you court room jude judy or juje patricia
dimigao in the court room

On 9/9/17, Tom Kingston via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

Your question makes absolutely no sense in the context of this
discussion. NVDA's business model has no correlation to VFO's ownership
of Window-Eyes.


On 9/9/2017 9:40 PM, Josh Kennedy wrote:

then how does NVDA work the way it does? and how is it so successful?



On 9/9/2017 9:37 PM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:

Your board of directors would not allow you to spend a pile of money
to purchase your competitor and then allow you to put that competitor
right back in business against you. And no business owner with a drop
of sense would want to do it anyway. Businesses like Apple, google,
and Microsoft buy a heap of smaller businesses every year. They don't
do so to turn around and give them away. FS is no doubt picking
through the Window-Eyes code looking for ways to improve JAWS or
features to add.

On 9/9/2017 9:19 PM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
if I no longer cared about the product then yes I probably would 
turn

around and just open source it. if the product was no longer
supported by my business I'd just tell people do what you want with
it, we moved on. take it apart, open source it, whatever. we do not
care.



On 9/9/2017 9:14 PM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:

No. Think about it. If you were in business and bought your number
one competitor would you turn around and give it away for someone
else to continue its development?


On 9/9/2017 9:01 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:

hi

Is there any possibility since window eyes is no longer supported
to get the window-eyes source code make it open source and put it
up on the github website? then other developers could keep
developing window eyes.



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Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

NVDA is fine to use. I like its business model better than VFO's 
business model.




On 9/9/2017 10:14 PM, mr. Chikodinaka Nickarandidum Oguledo via Talk wrote:

your brakeing the law! you court room jude judy or juje patricia
dimigao in the court room

On 9/9/17, Tom Kingston via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

Your question makes absolutely no sense in the context of this
discussion. NVDA's business model has no correlation to VFO's ownership
of Window-Eyes.


On 9/9/2017 9:40 PM, Josh Kennedy wrote:

then how does NVDA work the way it does? and how is it so successful?



On 9/9/2017 9:37 PM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:

Your board of directors would not allow you to spend a pile of money
to purchase your competitor and then allow you to put that competitor
right back in business against you. And no business owner with a drop
of sense would want to do it anyway. Businesses like Apple, google,
and Microsoft buy a heap of smaller businesses every year. They don't
do so to turn around and give them away. FS is no doubt picking
through the Window-Eyes code looking for ways to improve JAWS or
features to add.

On 9/9/2017 9:19 PM, Josh Kennedy wrote:

if I no longer cared about the product then yes I probably would turn
around and just open source it. if the product was no longer
supported by my business I'd just tell people do what you want with
it, we moved on. take it apart, open source it, whatever. we do not
care.



On 9/9/2017 9:14 PM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:

No. Think about it. If you were in business and bought your number
one competitor would you turn around and give it away for someone
else to continue its development?


On 9/9/2017 9:01 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:

hi

Is there any possibility since window eyes is no longer supported
to get the window-eyes source code make it open source and put it
up on the github website? then other developers could keep
developing window eyes.



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Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

then how does NVDA work the way it does? and how is it so successful?



On 9/9/2017 9:37 PM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:
Your board of directors would not allow you to spend a pile of money 
to purchase your competitor and then allow you to put that competitor 
right back in business against you. And no business owner with a drop 
of sense would want to do it anyway. Businesses like Apple, google, 
and Microsoft buy a heap of smaller businesses every year. They don't 
do so to turn around and give them away. FS is no doubt picking 
through the Window-Eyes code looking for ways to improve JAWS or 
features to add.


On 9/9/2017 9:19 PM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
if I no longer cared about the product then yes I probably would turn 
around and just open source it. if the product was no longer 
supported by my business I'd just tell people do what you want with 
it, we moved on. take it apart, open source it, whatever. we do not 
care.




On 9/9/2017 9:14 PM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:
No. Think about it. If you were in business and bought your number 
one competitor would you turn around and give it away for someone 
else to continue its development?



On 9/9/2017 9:01 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:

hi

Is there any possibility since window eyes is no longer supported 
to get the window-eyes source code make it open source and put it 
up on the github website? then other developers could keep 
developing window eyes.




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Re: question about re installing wineyes

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

thing is they can't kill window eyes as long as people choose to use it. 
and if people keep sharing and passing it around then it won't die. if 
NVDA can only get network installs and citrix support it'll really cut 
into the jaws profits.




On 9/9/2017 9:20 PM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:
Businesses buy other businesses every day to either kill the 
competition or incorporate the technology into their own product 
lines. VFO bought AI Squared to kill Window-Eyes and replace their bad 
screen magnification program with the best selling ZoomText.


On 9/9/2017 9:11 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:
when stuff is no longer supported it should really be open source 
otherwise it will be lost to time.


On 9/9/2017 12:47 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:

Hi Russ and all,

As memory serves, you do have to enter the correct name when you 
install Window-Eyes.
Regardless whether I'm right about that point, as much as this 
thread seems to entertain the idea of sharing retail copies of 
Window-Eyes, I think you'll run into copyright infringement if you 
do this.


Hth,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk

Sent: September 9, 2017 9:23 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Cc: Russ Kiehne <russ94...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

It's my understanding it doesn't matter what name you put in, it's the
serial number that matters.

-Original Message-
From: Carol and Roger via Talk
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:38 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Carol and Roger
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

Only sort of.  The serial number is assigned to a specific person, so
the name and any other information that is asked for during 
installation

would need to be the same for both people. So, if you gave me your copy
and did not tell me your information, your copy, on my PC would 
still be

a demo copy.


On 9/8/2017 12:44 PM, brice Mijares via Talk wrote:
If I sent someone a copy of my last installation copy, that person 
would
still need an activation code or it would go into demo mode. Isn't 
this

correct?

On 9/8/2017 8:57 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk]

  wrote:

Hi Loy,

Sorry, I wasn't clear.  I was referring to why you thought it 
would be
okay for someone to use someone else's copy of WE simply because 
it was

no longer being developed.
I would think it is still the property of VFO, and, therefore,
infringement of copyright to let someone else use it.

Thanks,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Loy via Talk
Sent: September 8, 2017 11:37 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Cc: Loy <loyrg2...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

If you are in the US, you never had to activate WE. I think in some
countries you had to have a dongle.
    - Original Message -
    From: Rod Hutton via Talk
    To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
    Cc: Rod Hutton
    Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 11:01 AM
    Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes


    Hi Loy,

    If you truly know this, then, that's fine.
    I don't feel as certain about this as you seem to be.
    If you can explain this a bit, I'd appreciate it.

    Best,

    Rod

    -Original Message-
    From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Loy via Talk
    Sent: September 8, 2017 10:40 AM
    To: Window-Eyes Discussion List <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
    Cc: Loy <loyrg2...@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

    There has never been an online activation. I doubt that you 
can get a
downloadable copy from VFO now, but if you can get a copy from 
someone

else then you could install it. Being it is no longer being sold or
developed then using some one else's copy would not matter.
  - Original Message -
  From: Micallef Michael at FITA via Talk
  To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
  Cc: Micallef Michael at FITA
  Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:24 AM
  Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes


  And then after installation of WE how about the online 
activation?


  -Original Message-
  From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+michael.micallef=gov...@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On

Behalf Of aad leeflang via Talk
  Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 12:07 PM
  To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
  Cc: aad leeflang
  Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

  ok thanks
  i used window eyes 9.4 on my old pc but i did not get a cd 
newer

than 9.0.
  i downloadee most versions.
  but how do i get a more acurate version though?
  or is there a way to copy the files from my old pc to my new 
pc.

  i guess not.

Re: window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

if I no longer cared about the product then yes I probably would turn 
around and just open source it. if the product was no longer supported 
by my business I'd just tell people do what you want with it, we moved 
on. take it apart, open source it, whatever. we do not care.




On 9/9/2017 9:14 PM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:
No. Think about it. If you were in business and bought your number one 
competitor would you turn around and give it away for someone else to 
continue its development?



On 9/9/2017 9:01 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:

hi

Is there any possibility since window eyes is no longer supported to 
get the window-eyes source code make it open source and put it up on 
the github website? then other developers could keep developing 
window eyes.




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Re: question about re installing wineyes

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

hey olusegun, any chance of getting the window eye source code?



On 9/9/2017 3:20 PM, Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk 
wrote:

Copyrights can, and do expire!  That's why there are so many free books out
there in the wilderness!  Since V F O or whatever name it calls itself no
longer supports or develops Window-Eyes, any copyright it may claim, if not
now, will eventually become useless and worthless!

Have you heard of Just Click?  Well, Amazon patented it almost forever.
This patent just expired and Amazon can't stop anyone from using or
modifying it for use on any product including the world wide web.

A good question for V F O or its functionaries will be how to convince a
court that its copyright of Window-Eyes is still valid when the product is
NO LONGER being developed.  Should be interesting, but I believe they'll
lose their teeth in the process!

Sincerely,
Olusegun
Denver, Colorado


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Re: question about re installing wineyes

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

I installed jaws today to check out what's new. was not impressed, 
uninstalled it. Whenever I get the money saved up I'd rather donate that 
$1200 to NVDA.




On 9/9/2017 2:33 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:

Thanks, Carol.

That's what I assume, and so why I'm counselling caution about distributing 
Window-Eyes even though VFO claims that it will no longer be developed.
Besides, being their product, they can do whatever they want with Window-Eyes 
in the future, even resurrect it, should they choose to do so.

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Carol and Roger via Talk
Sent: September 9, 2017 2:13 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Carol and Roger 
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

Hi Rod,

Yes, you are correct.  Even if the company is gone, the copywright is
still there.  It is the same as a person writing a book.  The book can
be copywrighted for as long as someone wishes to keep it going.  So, AI
may have forwarded the copywright which would now fall on VFO to
continue to maintain that, even though the product is no longer being
distributed.

Carol


On 9/9/2017 12:47 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:

Hi Russ and all,

As memory serves, you do have to enter the correct name when you install 
Window-Eyes.
Regardless whether I'm right about that point, as much as this thread seems to 
entertain the idea of sharing retail copies of Window-Eyes, I think you'll run 
into copyright infringement if you do this.

Hth,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk
Sent: September 9, 2017 9:23 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Russ Kiehne 
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

It's my understanding it doesn't matter what name you put in, it's the
serial number that matters.

-Original Message-
From: Carol and Roger via Talk
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:38 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Carol and Roger
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

Only sort of.  The serial number is assigned to a specific person, so
the name and any other information that is asked for during installation
would need to be the same for both people. So, if you gave me your copy
and did not tell me your information, your copy, on my PC would still be
a demo copy.


On 9/8/2017 12:44 PM, brice Mijares via Talk wrote:

If I sent someone a copy of my last installation copy, that person would
still need an activation code or it would go into demo mode. Isn't this
correct?

On 9/8/2017 8:57 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk]

   wrote:

Hi Loy,

Sorry, I wasn't clear.  I was referring to why you thought it would be
okay for someone to use someone else's copy of WE simply because it was
no longer being developed.
I would think it is still the property of VFO, and, therefore,
infringement of copyright to let someone else use it.

Thanks,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Loy via Talk
Sent: September 8, 2017 11:37 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Loy 
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

If you are in the US, you never had to activate WE. I think in some
countries you had to have a dongle.
 - Original Message -
 From: Rod Hutton via Talk
 To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
 Cc: Rod Hutton
 Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 11:01 AM
 Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes


 Hi Loy,

 If you truly know this, then, that's fine.
 I don't feel as certain about this as you seem to be.
 If you can explain this a bit, I'd appreciate it.

 Best,

 Rod

 -Original Message-
 From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Loy via Talk
 Sent: September 8, 2017 10:40 AM
 To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
 Cc: Loy 
 Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

 There has never been an online activation. I doubt that you can get a
downloadable copy from VFO now, but if you can get a copy from someone
else then you could install it. Being it is no longer being sold or
developed then using some one else's copy would not matter.
   - Original Message -
   From: Micallef Michael at FITA via Talk
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Cc: Micallef Michael at FITA
   Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:24 AM
   Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes


   And then after installation of WE how about the online activation?

   -Original Message-
   From: Talk

Re: question about re installing wineyes

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

once NVDA has network install and remote citrix support it will probably 
put the high priced jaws and others out of business. free with donations 
is best.




On 9/9/2017 2:33 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:

Thanks, Carol.

That's what I assume, and so why I'm counselling caution about distributing 
Window-Eyes even though VFO claims that it will no longer be developed.
Besides, being their product, they can do whatever they want with Window-Eyes 
in the future, even resurrect it, should they choose to do so.

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Carol and Roger via Talk
Sent: September 9, 2017 2:13 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Carol and Roger 
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

Hi Rod,

Yes, you are correct.  Even if the company is gone, the copywright is
still there.  It is the same as a person writing a book.  The book can
be copywrighted for as long as someone wishes to keep it going.  So, AI
may have forwarded the copywright which would now fall on VFO to
continue to maintain that, even though the product is no longer being
distributed.

Carol


On 9/9/2017 12:47 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:

Hi Russ and all,

As memory serves, you do have to enter the correct name when you install 
Window-Eyes.
Regardless whether I'm right about that point, as much as this thread seems to 
entertain the idea of sharing retail copies of Window-Eyes, I think you'll run 
into copyright infringement if you do this.

Hth,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk
Sent: September 9, 2017 9:23 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Russ Kiehne 
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

It's my understanding it doesn't matter what name you put in, it's the
serial number that matters.

-Original Message-
From: Carol and Roger via Talk
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:38 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Carol and Roger
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

Only sort of.  The serial number is assigned to a specific person, so
the name and any other information that is asked for during installation
would need to be the same for both people. So, if you gave me your copy
and did not tell me your information, your copy, on my PC would still be
a demo copy.


On 9/8/2017 12:44 PM, brice Mijares via Talk wrote:

If I sent someone a copy of my last installation copy, that person would
still need an activation code or it would go into demo mode. Isn't this
correct?

On 9/8/2017 8:57 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk]

   wrote:

Hi Loy,

Sorry, I wasn't clear.  I was referring to why you thought it would be
okay for someone to use someone else's copy of WE simply because it was
no longer being developed.
I would think it is still the property of VFO, and, therefore,
infringement of copyright to let someone else use it.

Thanks,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Loy via Talk
Sent: September 8, 2017 11:37 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Loy 
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

If you are in the US, you never had to activate WE. I think in some
countries you had to have a dongle.
 - Original Message -
 From: Rod Hutton via Talk
 To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
 Cc: Rod Hutton
 Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 11:01 AM
 Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes


 Hi Loy,

 If you truly know this, then, that's fine.
 I don't feel as certain about this as you seem to be.
 If you can explain this a bit, I'd appreciate it.

 Best,

 Rod

 -Original Message-
 From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Loy via Talk
 Sent: September 8, 2017 10:40 AM
 To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
 Cc: Loy 
 Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

 There has never been an online activation. I doubt that you can get a
downloadable copy from VFO now, but if you can get a copy from someone
else then you could install it. Being it is no longer being sold or
developed then using some one else's copy would not matter.
   - Original Message -
   From: Micallef Michael at FITA via Talk
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Cc: Micallef Michael at FITA
   Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:24 AM
   Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes


   And then after installation of WE how about the online activation?

   -Original Message-
   From: Talk

Re: question about re installing wineyes

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

when stuff is no longer supported it should really be open source 
otherwise it will be lost to time.


On 9/9/2017 12:47 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:

Hi Russ and all,

As memory serves, you do have to enter the correct name when you install 
Window-Eyes.
Regardless whether I'm right about that point, as much as this thread seems to 
entertain the idea of sharing retail copies of Window-Eyes, I think you'll run 
into copyright infringement if you do this.

Hth,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk
Sent: September 9, 2017 9:23 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Russ Kiehne 
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

It's my understanding it doesn't matter what name you put in, it's the
serial number that matters.

-Original Message-
From: Carol and Roger via Talk
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:38 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Carol and Roger
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

Only sort of.  The serial number is assigned to a specific person, so
the name and any other information that is asked for during installation
would need to be the same for both people. So, if you gave me your copy
and did not tell me your information, your copy, on my PC would still be
a demo copy.


On 9/8/2017 12:44 PM, brice Mijares via Talk wrote:

If I sent someone a copy of my last installation copy, that person would
still need an activation code or it would go into demo mode. Isn't this
correct?

On 9/8/2017 8:57 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk]

  wrote:

Hi Loy,

Sorry, I wasn't clear.  I was referring to why you thought it would be
okay for someone to use someone else's copy of WE simply because it was
no longer being developed.
I would think it is still the property of VFO, and, therefore,
infringement of copyright to let someone else use it.

Thanks,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Loy via Talk
Sent: September 8, 2017 11:37 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Loy 
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

If you are in the US, you never had to activate WE. I think in some
countries you had to have a dongle.
- Original Message -
From: Rod Hutton via Talk
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 11:01 AM
Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes


Hi Loy,

If you truly know this, then, that's fine.
I don't feel as certain about this as you seem to be.
If you can explain this a bit, I'd appreciate it.

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Loy via Talk
Sent: September 8, 2017 10:40 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Loy 
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

There has never been an online activation. I doubt that you can get a
downloadable copy from VFO now, but if you can get a copy from someone
else then you could install it. Being it is no longer being sold or
developed then using some one else's copy would not matter.
  - Original Message -
  From: Micallef Michael at FITA via Talk
  To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
  Cc: Micallef Michael at FITA
  Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:24 AM
  Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes


  And then after installation of WE how about the online activation?

  -Original Message-
  From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+michael.micallef=gov...@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of aad leeflang via Talk
  Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 12:07 PM
  To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
  Cc: aad leeflang
  Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

  ok thanks
  i used window eyes 9.4 on my old pc but i did not get a cd newer
than 9.0.
  i downloadee most versions.
  but how do i get a more acurate version though?
  or is there a way to copy the files from my old pc to my new pc.
  i guess not.
  aad
  On Fri, 8 Sep 2017 09:46:16 +
  Rod Hutton via Talk  wrote:

  > Hi Aad,
  >
  > In order to install Window-Eyes for Windows 10, you require at
least version 9.2.
  >
  > Hth,
  >
  > Rod
  >
  > -Original Message-
  > From: Talk
  > [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On
  > Behalf Of aad leeflang via Talk
  > Sent: September 8, 2017 5:15 AM
  > To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
  > Cc: aad leeflang 
  > Subject: question about re installing wineyes
  >
  > hello all
  > i have 

Re: really impressed with Jaws2018

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

one thing I like about NVDA is it has a sort of app central website you 
just go there and every app and addon is in one place.




On 9/8/2017 10:07 PM, Debby Franson via Talk wrote:

Hi Darrell or anyone!

So, that means that I would have to know what script I am looking for 
exactly, or I wouldn't be able to find  it?


Is there a way to find out when a new script is released such as an FS 
news only list or if I supscribed to one of the JAWS lists?


App Central is great. It's too bad no one ever thought of having a 
scrip central for JAWS users.


Debby

At 09:07 PM 8/30/2017, Darrell Bowles via Talk wrote

No, the only way to get them is to go finding them on the internet.

-Original Message-
From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+dgbowles=msn@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Paulette Vickery via Talk

Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 10:06 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
Cc: Paulette Vickery 
Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018

Okay, but is there a list of scripts, free or for purchase, from 
which to make selections?


Paulette

-Original Message-
From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+paulette=evickery@lists.window-eyes.com]

On Behalf Of Darrell Bowles via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 9:23 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Darrell Bowles
Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018

Some scripts you have to pay for and some even are done in this SMA 
style of pricing.



-Original Message-
From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+dgbowles=msn@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Paulette Vickery via Talk

Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 9:19 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
Cc: Paulette Vickery 
Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018

Hi David,

Window Eyes had a heading or department known as APP CENTRAL. This is 
where you could find apps that had been developed for Window Eyes and 
I presume approved by the program developers for use by everyone.  It 
was easy to look through the collected apps and find ones that looked 
interesting and put them on your computer.
From what I understand, there is no such collection in what in JAWS 
is called scripts, which can be browsed through to find scripts that 
are interesting and can be installed on individual computers.
If this is true, what is the use in writing scripts if only a select 
few can find them. They should all be kept in one, easy to locate 
place for general use.

Thank you for answering my question.

Paulette

-Original Message-
From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+paulette=evickery@lists.window-eyes.com]

On Behalf Of David Moore via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 6:20 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: David Moore
Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018

Hi all!
I just listened to the latest FS Cast for JAWS 2018 as well, and it 
is the best version of JAWS that has come out in years. I have been a 
JAWS user since 2001 with version 3.7 LOL! I would say that the 
features that are being included in this 2018 version, are the best 
since version 12. That is a long time ago. JAWS will now do pretty 
much of what Open Book does, but just not advanced. You can use JAWS 
2018 to scan .JPG images, and JAWS will read any text to you that is 
in that image. You are in virtual PC cursor mode, so you can copy and 
paste the text into a Word document. The new installer will be very 
good as well. When JAWS updates throughout the year, only the new fix 
will be installed instead of an entire new copy of JAWS.

This will save a lot of time with a slow internet connection!
Give this FS Cast a listen!
I feel for all of you, but once you get used to this new version of 
JAWS, you will slowly forget Window Eyes. JAWS, and a laptop web cam, 
will now act like KNFB reader on the iPhone. You can just use the Web 
Cam on your laptop, take a picture of print, and JAWS will do the 
OCR. This is very powerful.

Take care, guys!
Please ask me any questions, because I even script for JAWS.
David Moore
Email:
jesusloves1...@gmail.com
Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 2:28 PM
To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: really impressed with Jaws2018

I just listened to the FS cast for Jaws 2018.  You can set verbosity 
levels for what is spoken on the web.  You can take a picture of a 
file and ocr it with Jaws very impressed.


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Re: question about re installing wineyes

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

if we is no longer sold supported or activated then maybe we should try 
and get its source code and put it up on github so others can develop 
window eyes as an open source project.




On 9/8/2017 12:55 PM, Loy via Talk wrote:

If you use a purchased fully downloaded copy of WE  or a CD that copy will have 
the Serial number included in the installation copy and there is not an 
activation. If you are talking about the Free for office version, I don't know 
how this was activated. But purchased copies never had to be activated, you 
could install on as many computers as you wish. WE is no longer sold, 
supported, updated.
   - Original Message -
   From: brice Mijares via Talk
   To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
   Cc: brice Mijares
   Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 12:44 PM
   Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes


   If I sent someone a copy of my last installation copy, that person would
   still need an activation code or it would go into demo mode. Isn't this
   correct?

   On 9/8/2017 8:57 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk]

 wrote:
   > Hi Loy,
   >
   > Sorry, I wasn't clear.  I was referring to why you thought it would be 
okay for someone to use someone else's copy of WE simply because it was no longer 
being developed.
   > I would think it is still the property of VFO, and, therefore, 
infringement of copyright to let someone else use it.
   >
   > Thanks,
   >
   > Rod
   >
   > -Original Message-
   > From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
Loy via Talk
   > Sent: September 8, 2017 11:37 AM
   > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
   > Cc: Loy 
   > Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
   >
   > If you are in the US, you never had to activate WE. I think in some 
countries you had to have a dongle.
   >- Original Message -
   >From: Rod Hutton via Talk
   >To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   >Cc: Rod Hutton
   >Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 11:01 AM
   >Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes
   >
   >
   >Hi Loy,
   >
   >If you truly know this, then, that's fine.
   >I don't feel as certain about this as you seem to be.
   >If you can explain this a bit, I'd appreciate it.
   >
   >Best,
   >
   >Rod
   >
   >-Original Message-
   >From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
Loy via Talk
   >Sent: September 8, 2017 10:40 AM
   >To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
   >Cc: Loy 
   >Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
   >
   >There has never been an online activation. I doubt that you can get a 
downloadable copy from VFO now, but if you can get a copy from someone else then 
you could install it. Being it is no longer being sold or developed then using 
some one else's copy would not matter.
   >  - Original Message -
   >  From: Micallef Michael at FITA via Talk
   >  To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   >  Cc: Micallef Michael at FITA
   >  Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:24 AM
   >  Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes
   >
   >
   >  And then after installation of WE how about the online activation?
   >
   >  -Original Message-
   >  From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+michael.micallef=gov...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
aad leeflang via Talk
   >  Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 12:07 PM
   >  To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   >  Cc: aad leeflang
   >  Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes
   >
   >  ok thanks
   >  i used window eyes 9.4 on my old pc but i did not get a cd newer than 
9.0.
   >  i downloadee most versions.
   >  but how do i get a more acurate version though?
   >  or is there a way to copy the files from my old pc to my new pc.
   >  i guess not.
   >  aad
   >  On Fri, 8 Sep 2017 09:46:16 +
   >  Rod Hutton via Talk  wrote:
   >
   >  > Hi Aad,
   >  >
   >  > In order to install Window-Eyes for Windows 10, you require at 
least version 9.2.
   >  >
   >  > Hth,
   >  >
   >  > Rod
   >  >
   >  > -Original Message-
   >  > From: Talk
   >  > [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On
   >  > Behalf Of aad leeflang via Talk
   >  > Sent: September 8, 2017 5:15 AM
   >  > To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
   >  > Cc: aad leeflang 
   >  > Subject: question about re installing wineyes
   >  >
   >  > hello all
   >  > i have moved to a new pc with windows 10.
   >  > i wanted to re-install window eyes but i get a message that it does
   >  > not work under windows 10.
   >  > i had the cd version 9.0.
   >  > is 

Re: question about re installing wineyes

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

you can still get window eyes from www.windoweyesforoffice.com



On 9/8/2017 10:40 AM, Loy via Talk wrote:

There has never been an online activation. I doubt that you can get a 
downloadable copy from VFO now, but if you can get a copy from someone else 
then you could install it. Being it is no longer being sold or developed then 
using some one else's copy would not matter.
   - Original Message -
   From: Micallef Michael at FITA via Talk
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Cc: Micallef Michael at FITA
   Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:24 AM
   Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes


   And then after installation of WE how about the online activation?

   -Original Message-
   From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+michael.micallef=gov...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf 
Of aad leeflang via Talk
   Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 12:07 PM
   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Cc: aad leeflang
   Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

   ok thanks
   i used window eyes 9.4 on my old pc but i did not get a cd newer than 9.0.
   i downloadee most versions.
   but how do i get a more acurate version though?
   or is there a way to copy the files from my old pc to my new pc.
   i guess not.
   aad
   On Fri, 8 Sep 2017 09:46:16 +
   Rod Hutton via Talk  wrote:

   > Hi Aad,
   >
   > In order to install Window-Eyes for Windows 10, you require at least 
version 9.2.
   >
   > Hth,
   >
   > Rod
   >
   > -Original Message-
   > From: Talk
   > [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
   > Behalf Of aad leeflang via Talk
   > Sent: September 8, 2017 5:15 AM
   > To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
   > Cc: aad leeflang 
   > Subject: question about re installing wineyes
   >
   > hello all
   > i have moved to a new pc with windows 10.
   > i wanted to re-install window eyes but i get a message that it does
   > not work under windows 10.
   > i had the cd version 9.0.
   > is there a way to get an fresh installation cd for window eyes so that
   > i re install it?
   > there are still some issues with jaws that don't work well and could
   > work better with window eyes.
   > anyway i still don't understand why people think that jaws sould be
   > better tan window eyes anyway.
   > aad
   >
   > ___
   > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the 
author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
   >
   > For membership options, visit 
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/rod_hutton%40hotmail.com.
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author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
   >
   > For membership options, visit 
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window-eyes open source?

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

hi

Is there any possibility since window eyes is no longer supported to get 
the window-eyes source code make it open source and put it up on the 
github website? then other developers could keep developing window eyes.



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RE: braille displays and we

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

I cannot use orbit20 with window eyes. I can use orbit20 with NVDA, and I 
can use orbit20 with jaws. orbit20 works excellent with NVDA and it also 
works excellent with jaws also! the screen reader tells orbit20 to use dots 
7 and 8 as a cursor under the character you are currently editing.


Josh


Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com


On April 8, 2017 14:17:22 "Steve Jacobson"  wrote:


Joshua,

I have not seen the latest prototypes of the Orbit Reader, but I assume
there are still no cursor routing keys, is that correct?  You said you can't
use it with Window-Eyes, but have you used it with other screen readers?  If
so, what does it do when you have a cursor that moves when you are editing a
word?  In other words, how well does it show that a cursor moved but no
characters changed?

Best regards,

Steve Jacobson

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+steve.jacobson=visi@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Joshua Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2017 11:33 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
Subject: braille displays and we

also I am testing still the orbit reader20 prototype and it does not
work with window eyes even in rb18 emulation mode or refreshabraille18
emulation mode. the braille on the orbit20 is better than any other
braille display I have ever seen in my whole life. It feels like the
braille you see on elevator doors, hotel room doors, or ATM machine
signage quality firm durable braille. and it is liquid and dust
resistant also. I accidentally dropped the orbit reader 20 prototype
once and nothing happened, it fell upside down and i was able to pick it
up and it just keeps working, not a scratch on it at all and no pins
fell out at all. and its basic internal text or braille editor does not
care what braille code you write in. you can write any kind of braille
you wish whether its contracted braille ueb braille music or nemeth math
braille. just like a perkins brailler or slate and stylus, you can write
any braille code you wish, even make up your own or write grade3
shorthand if you want.


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RE: braille displays and we

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

the screen reader tells the orbit20 to show dots 7 and 8 directly 
underneath the letter you are editing. its just like a $4000 braille 
display it is exactly the same.


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On April 8, 2017 14:17:22 "Steve Jacobson"  wrote:


Joshua,

I have not seen the latest prototypes of the Orbit Reader, but I assume
there are still no cursor routing keys, is that correct?  You said you can't
use it with Window-Eyes, but have you used it with other screen readers?  If
so, what does it do when you have a cursor that moves when you are editing a
word?  In other words, how well does it show that a cursor moved but no
characters changed?

Best regards,

Steve Jacobson

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+steve.jacobson=visi@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Joshua Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2017 11:33 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
Subject: braille displays and we

also I am testing still the orbit reader20 prototype and it does not
work with window eyes even in rb18 emulation mode or refreshabraille18
emulation mode. the braille on the orbit20 is better than any other
braille display I have ever seen in my whole life. It feels like the
braille you see on elevator doors, hotel room doors, or ATM machine
signage quality firm durable braille. and it is liquid and dust
resistant also. I accidentally dropped the orbit reader 20 prototype
once and nothing happened, it fell upside down and i was able to pick it
up and it just keeps working, not a scratch on it at all and no pins
fell out at all. and its basic internal text or braille editor does not
care what braille code you write in. you can write any kind of braille
you wish whether its contracted braille ueb braille music or nemeth math
braille. just like a perkins brailler or slate and stylus, you can write
any braille code you wish, even make up your own or write grade3
shorthand if you want.


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RE: braille displays and we

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

yes that is correct, there are no cursor routing buttons at all. but that 
is ok I can do without cursor routing buttons.

when you are editing a word, the screen reader tells the orbit20

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On April 8, 2017 14:17:22 "Steve Jacobson"  wrote:


Joshua,

I have not seen the latest prototypes of the Orbit Reader, but I assume
there are still no cursor routing keys, is that correct?  You said you can't
use it with Window-Eyes, but have you used it with other screen readers?  If
so, what does it do when you have a cursor that moves when you are editing a
word?  In other words, how well does it show that a cursor moved but no
characters changed?

Best regards,

Steve Jacobson

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+steve.jacobson=visi@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Joshua Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2017 11:33 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
Subject: braille displays and we

also I am testing still the orbit reader20 prototype and it does not
work with window eyes even in rb18 emulation mode or refreshabraille18
emulation mode. the braille on the orbit20 is better than any other
braille display I have ever seen in my whole life. It feels like the
braille you see on elevator doors, hotel room doors, or ATM machine
signage quality firm durable braille. and it is liquid and dust
resistant also. I accidentally dropped the orbit reader 20 prototype
once and nothing happened, it fell upside down and i was able to pick it
up and it just keeps working, not a scratch on it at all and no pins
fell out at all. and its basic internal text or braille editor does not
care what braille code you write in. you can write any kind of braille
you wish whether its contracted braille ueb braille music or nemeth math
braille. just like a perkins brailler or slate and stylus, you can write
any braille code you wish, even make up your own or write grade3
shorthand if you want.


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RE: windows screen readers

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

NVDA has or has had video hooks since late 2010 if I remember correctly. 
you can use the golden cursor addon to mouse around like you can in jaws.



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On April 5, 2017 12:49:29 "Steve Nutt"  wrote:


Naah, no off screen model, no video hooks.  NVDA is not great if you have to
mouse around, where apps don't have keyboard access.  Yes, it has object
view, but that's pretty poor.

All the best

Steve

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+steve=comproom.co...@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Joshua Kennedy via Talk
Sent: 04 April 2017 23:26
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
Subject: windows screen readers

hey tony and all,


why not try the latest NVDA? also narrator in windows10 is quite good.
if you are tired of paying for screen readers then NVDA is a good choice.


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Re: making the switch

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

voice dream reader for the android works very very good. I like it a lot.


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On April 5, 2017 10:20:36 "Russ Kiehne"  wrote:


How well does the android version of voice dream reader work with it?  I
hear that the ios version is much better!

-Original Message-
From: Joshua Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 3:39 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Subject: making the switch

I am very happy making the switch for the most part to my $80 RCA
galileo pro android marshmallow tablet laptop hybrid. I love the fact I
can go almost anywhere on the web without fear of windows viruses taking
over the system. And I like playing with different apps from the app
store, using different voices such as acapela voices, playing games such
as crafting kingdom and pirates and traders, and pontes game zone and
watching netflix and using other tv apps. My tablet even interacts with
my apple tv box using a very nice app called tubio.


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Re: making the switch

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

yes talkback works with netflix very good and it also works with the app 
store very good also.



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On April 4, 2017 21:02:06 "net bat"  wrote:


does talkback work with netflix or the android app store?
i only tried it with the chrome browser last year and i couldn't evenuse the
app store to download apps.


-Original Message-
From: Joshua Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:05 PM
To: Charles Adkins ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: making the switch

it is an RCA galileo pro you can get at walmart for $80. It runs android
6.0. It runs the talkback screen reader. It has a physical keyboard you
can put the tablet on top of and then it becomes a hinged laptop.
talkback has a good number of keyboard commands.



On 4/4/2017 7:02 PM, Charles Adkins wrote:

just curious, what kind of tablet is this? I would be interested in learning
more about them.

Sent from my iPhone


On Apr 4, 2017, at 6:39 PM, Joshua Kennedy via Talk
 wrote:

I am very happy making the switch for the most part to my $80 RCA galileo
pro android marshmallow tablet laptop hybrid. I love the fact I can go
almost anywhere on the web without fear of windows viruses taking over the
system. And I like playing with different apps from the app store, using
different voices such as acapela voices, playing games such as crafting
kingdom and pirates and traders, and pontes game zone and watching netflix
and using other tv apps. My tablet even interacts with my apple tv box using
a very nice app called tubio.


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Re: making the switch

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

oh yes it is definitely worth it I think. in fact I am writing these emails 
to you using my tablet right now.




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On April 4, 2017 20:24:51 Portia Scott  wrote:

I know this topic is OT, but you can also pick this up at Amazon as well. 
Was going to get one, but wasn't sure if it was worth it.


Portia.
On Apr 4, 2017, at 4:05 PM, Joshua Kennedy via Talk 
 wrote:


it is an RCA galileo pro you can get at walmart for $80. It runs android 
6.0. It runs the talkback screen reader. It has a physical keyboard you can 
put the tablet on top of and then it becomes a hinged laptop. talkback has 
a good number of keyboard commands.




On 4/4/2017 7:02 PM, Charles Adkins wrote:
just curious, what kind of tablet is this? I would be interested in 
learning more about them.


Sent from my iPhone

On Apr 4, 2017, at 6:39 PM, Joshua Kennedy via Talk 
 wrote:


I am very happy making the switch for the most part to my $80 RCA galileo 
pro android marshmallow tablet laptop hybrid. I love the fact I can go 
almost anywhere on the web without fear of windows viruses taking over the 
system. And I like playing with different apps from the app store, using 
different voices such as acapela voices, playing games such as crafting 
kingdom and pirates and traders, and pontes game zone and watching netflix 
and using other tv apps. My tablet even interacts with my apple tv box 
using a very nice app called tubio.



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Re: making the switch

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

Hi Dave,
I am in fact, totally blind. Talkback is a great screen reader built into 
the RCA android tablets if you are, like me, totally blind. and if you have 
a braille display that is bluetooth you can install brailleback and use 
braille, and install soft braille keyboard and write braille on the touch 
screen. I really really like my $80 tablet a whole lot and it is the RCA 
galileo pro.


Josh


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On April 4, 2017 20:14:16 Dave  wrote:


Hello Joshua,

Are you Totally Blind, or are you able to use some vision while
operating your Android Tablet?

I keep thinking of getting a Tablet, mostly because Android systems seem
to be affordable, rather than something from Apple that isn't.What's
a New Apple I-Pad going for these days?More than $80.


Grumpy Dave


--
Dave 




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Re: laptop advice

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

nothing. you only need classic shell if you have windows 10. if you have 
windows7 you don't need classic shell.


if you have windows8 or 8.1 you may want classic shell.

if you have windows10 you may also want classic shell.


windows10 start menu sort of behaves like an iPhone's home screen.



On 10/26/2016 2:37 PM, geo...@optonline.net wrote:
I don't have any classic shell, but I seem to have a start menu.  What 
is the difference?  What don't you see if you don't have classic 
shell.  I have windows seven, by the way.  Pam.


-Original Message- From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2016 12:23 PM
To: Shannon ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Subject: Re: laptop advice

I am using windows10. It works great! It is lots better than windows7.
And faster also. If you want a windows7 start menu get the free classic
shell app from www.classicshell.net and you can get a regular windows7
or even a windows xp start menu if you do not like the windows10 start
menu.




On 10/26/2016 12:20 PM, Shannon wrote:

Thank you for the feed back.
Now I'll ask of you one more?
I was given the choice of win 7 or 10.
Are you using 10 and if so how is it working for you?
Thanks
Shannon

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+shannon=bartchroofing@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 24, 2016 8:13 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Subject: laptop advice

ok let me break all this down for you. beside each thing i will write
good or bad.

I have an opportunity to get one of these, only a re-ferb model,


Dell Latitude good brand

Intel Core i5 that is a fast processor for graphics intensive pc games
like grand theft auto five.

4GB 4gb of ram is very good.

128GB SSD ok the 128gb ssd means your pc will start up very very very
fast all the time and shut off very very fast and load everything very
very fast just like a braille note note taker does.

14" LED Ultrabook (6430U) that means it is a small and light weight 
laptop.









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Re: laptop advice

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

I am using windows10. It works great! It is lots better than windows7. 
And faster also. If you want a windows7 start menu get the free classic 
shell app from www.classicshell.net and you can get a regular windows7 
or even a windows xp start menu if you do not like the windows10 start 
menu.





On 10/26/2016 12:20 PM, Shannon wrote:

Thank you for the feed back.
Now I'll ask of you one more?
I was given the choice of win 7 or 10.
Are you using 10 and if so how is it working for you?
Thanks
Shannon

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+shannon=bartchroofing@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 24, 2016 8:13 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Subject: laptop advice

ok let me break all this down for you. beside each thing i will write
good or bad.

I have an opportunity to get one of these, only a re-ferb model,


Dell Latitude good brand

Intel Core i5 that is a fast processor for graphics intensive pc games
like grand theft auto five.

4GB 4gb of ram is very good.

128GB SSD ok the 128gb ssd means your pc will start up very very very
fast all the time and shut off very very fast and load everything very
very fast just like a braille note note taker does.

14" LED Ultrabook (6430U) that means it is a small and light weight laptop.






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Re: laptop advice

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

with all the refurbished machines I've had so far nothing has broken. I 
get all my laptops from newegg from their refurbished section.




On 10/24/2016 9:20 PM, Linette Sukup wrote:



This sounds like a nice little machine, but there's one problematic 
thing about Dells: if you want to add on any hardware, or something 
needs to be fixed, you can only use something from Dell. If that's not 
important to you, just disregard. (Grin.)


Peace.
Linette



On 10/24/2016 8:12 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:

ok let me break all this down for you. beside each thing i will write
good or bad.

I have an opportunity to get one of these, only a re-ferb model,


Dell Latitude good brand

Intel Core i5 that is a fast processor for graphics intensive pc games
like grand theft auto five.

4GB 4gb of ram is very good.

128GB SSD ok the 128gb ssd means your pc will start up very very very
fast all the time and shut off very very fast and load everything very
very fast just like a braille note note taker does.

14" LED Ultrabook (6430U) that means it is a small and light weight 
laptop.







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laptop advice

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

ok let me break all this down for you. beside each thing i will write 
good or bad.


I have an opportunity to get one of these, only a re-ferb model,


Dell Latitude good brand

Intel Core i5 that is a fast processor for graphics intensive pc games 
like grand theft auto five.


4GB 4gb of ram is very good.

128GB SSD ok the 128gb ssd means your pc will start up very very very 
fast all the time and shut off very very fast and load everything very 
very fast just like a braille note note taker does.


14" LED Ultrabook (6430U) that means it is a small and light weight laptop.




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Re: fire at blazie engineering

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

they don't exist anymore. that was back in the year 1990 coppied from an 
old newsletter.


that's why I asked if you remember when that event occurred.




On 10/23/2016 2:14 PM, Andy Baracco wrote:

Didn't know they still existed.


-Original Message- From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, October 23, 2016 11:07 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Subject: fire at blazie engineering

anyone remember this?


Fire at Blazie Engineering -- Deane Blazie
On Oct. 17, at 11:00 PM a fire broke out in the offices of Blazie
Engineering. Nobody was hurt. The building was badly damaged but most of
the important papers and stock were removed. Fortunately we are well
insured. We expect about a 2 week delay in shipments and we appreciate
your patience with this delay. We thank everyone for their concern. We
have received hundreds of phone calls with condolences and we are so
grateful to have such loyal and caring customers. Thank you.





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fire at blazie engineering

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

anyone remember this?


Fire at Blazie Engineering -- Deane Blazie
On Oct. 17, at 11:00 PM a fire broke out in the offices of Blazie 
Engineering. Nobody was hurt. The building was badly damaged but most of 
the important papers and stock were removed. Fortunately we are well 
insured. We expect about a 2 week delay in shipments and we appreciate 
your patience with this delay. We thank everyone for their concern. We 
have received hundreds of phone calls with condolences and we are so 
grateful to have such loyal and caring customers. Thank you.




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raised dot computing

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

and if anyone wants to use a demo of mega dots 2.4 i think it is you can 
just grab my copy of talking dos box and go relive the memories on 
modern day computers. to make it sound more real you can switch to 
decTalk first.




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Re: mega dots

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

if you still have it could you send it to me? maybe email it? then I can 
play with it in talking dos box.




On 10/21/2016 8:40 PM, he...@juno.com wrote:

Hi,

I have a copy of Hot Dots which I still use in a DOS shell.  I think it
came out befor MMega dots
On Fri, 21 Oct 2016 18:12:36 -0400 Josh Kennedy via Talk
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com> writes:

does anyone have a full copy of mega dots and also keynote gold
multimedia that i could use inside of talking dos box since mega
dots
and keynote multimedia are no longer supported? and also keysoft
gold
for win3.1? I love playing with the old stuff inside my accessible
talking dos box.



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'Legal Steroid' Turning Men Into Beasts
BodybuildingLife
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/580ab5b54ddd535b57620st02vuc


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mega dots

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

does anyone have a full copy of mega dots and also keynote gold 
multimedia that i could use inside of talking dos box since mega dots 
and keynote multimedia are no longer supported? and also keysoft gold 
for win3.1? I love playing with the old stuff inside my accessible 
talking dos box.




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history of screen readers

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

I wonder why vocal eyes demo won't work in talking dosbox with braille n 
speak driver using or talking through NVDA? if you need the link for 
talking dosbox it is


https://www.sendspace.com/file/pk2ni7


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Re: can you assist me

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

first go get decTalk for NVDA from this website link.


http://grossgang.com/tts/synthesizers%20for%20nvda/access32.nvda-addon


if it asks you what you want to do with it make sure the open with radio 
button is checked and it says nvda slave in the combo box then hit the 
ok button. when a dialog comes up asking if you want to install it 
answer yes. answer yes to restarting NVDA as well. then press control 
insert s for the synthesizer dialog, hit d for decTalk and enter. then 
press control insert c to save the configuration.




On 10/20/2016 1:59 AM, Micallef Michael at FITA wrote:

Dear Josh Kennedy,

I read your below email, and I'm wondering if you could assist me a little. My 
problem is that I'm trying to find a way how to use NVDA with a dectalk speech. 
Can you kingly give mesome clear step by step instructions how I can achieve 
this?  I highly prefer DEctalk speech, rather than eloquence or other voices. 
My ears are stricktly addicted to DECTALK speech.

Kind regards,

Michael





Michael Micallef
Officer in charge of ICT Accessibility Certification
and ICT Training for Persons with a Visual Impairment

Foundation for Information Technology Accessibility (FITA)

Email:
Office:
URL:
FB:
michael.mical...@gov.mt
+356 2599 2343
http://www.fitamalta.eu
http://on.fb.me/1hCRTAx

Kindly consider your environmental responsibility before printing this e-mail










-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+michael.micallef=gov...@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, 19 October 2016 23:54
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Subject: talking dos box

hey anyone on here used talking dos box except for me? the talking dos
box i sent up to the list has windows3.1 and keysoft 1 or 2 and keynote
gold multimedia install in win3.1. it also has a demo of mega dots2.0,
wordperfect 5.1 and lotus 123 along with lots of text games.

before you run it you can set NVDA to use decTalk access32 nvda addon
sorry does not work with window eyes requires nvda in sleep mode ... ...
from the grossgang.com  site ... asap screen reader works best. could
not get the vocal eyes demo to work.





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talking dos box

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

hey anyone on here used talking dos box except for me? the talking dos 
box i sent up to the list has windows3.1 and keysoft 1 or 2 and keynote 
gold multimedia install in win3.1. it also has a demo of mega dots2.0, 
wordperfect 5.1 and lotus 123 along with lots of text games.


before you run it you can set NVDA to use decTalk access32 nvda addon 
sorry does not work with window eyes requires nvda in sleep mode ... ... 
from the grossgang.com  site ... asap screen reader works best. could 
not get the vocal eyes demo to work.




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tiny talk and flipper

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

hi

no i also used or played aorund with tiny talk and flipper and smooth 
talker that used the sound blaster card as a tts sort of sounded like a 
double talk. yes its in talking dos box.




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reminiscing about old screen readers

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

I used keysoft version 1.33F in dos with a keynote gold SA external 
synthesizer. Then switched to windows95 with jaws3.2 and a braille 
blazer embosser for the synthesizer. then used a braille lite for the 
synthesizer until eloquence came out with jaws3.2. played around with 
window eyes demos during that time also and also keynote gold multimedia 
software for windows as well. sure wish that still existed.




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old dos synthesizers

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

hello

you can play around with dos again. here is a file that lets the asap 
screen reader speak through NVDA in sleep mode or any dos or windows3.1 
reader that supports braille n speak on com1 as its synthesizer. the link is


note you need to install com0com x86 for 32bit systems x64signed for 
64bit set virtual pair1 in its settings in first edit box put com8 in 
second, put com9. the link is


https://www.sendspace.com/file/pk2ni7




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help with orbit reader20 prototype

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

hello

I am testing a prototype of the new low cost refreshable braille 
display, orbit reader20. I am a beta tester of the product and 
representative of orbit research. I followed the directions putting 
orbit20 into remote serial mode it says it is on com4. so I chose baum 
vario connect on com4. Window eyes will not use orbit20. It won't 
connect. Can you please fix this? Please let window-eyes use orbit20 in 
remote usb HID mode appearing as orbit20 in the window eyes display 
list. or in the meantime if you could tell me how to get the display 
working so I can try it out and report back to the


o...@tech.aph.org and

or20-subscr...@tech.aph.org

email lists it would be appreciated. thanks.


Josh Kennedy



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window eyes with touch screens

[Josh Kennedy via Talk]

hi

Are there plans to make touch gestures for window-eyes so it can be used 
on a tablet? also can a touch cursor or keyboard touch simulator cursor 
be made for window-eyes to simulate swipes taps single and double taps 
and other gestures like jaws has the touch cursor? It would make it a 
lot easier then to use window eyes on an RCA windows 10 cambio tablet.





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