Re: makeing the switch

[Tony C via Talk]

There's no oneperfect system out there that works perfectly with every web 
page and every program. In a "perfect" world they would, but then in a 
perfect world no one would need a screen reader cuz noone would be blind.


-Original Message- 
From: Tom Kingston via Talk

Sent: Wednesday, April 5, 2017 9:39 AM
To: Rod Hutton ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: FW: makeing the switch

I agree, Rod. If an iPad or Mac can do everything one wants then it's
certainly a viable option. And that's the only point I'm trying to
stress: make sure it can do what you want before you run out and buy one
soli because someone said they never have any problems with web pages.

Regards,
Tom


On 4/5/2017 8:42 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:

Hi Tom,

Since you had intended your post for the list, I'm forwarding my reply, 
which just went to you, to the list too. (smile)


All the best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Rod Hutton
Sent: Wednesday, April 5, 2017 8:26 AM
To: Tom Kingston <tom.kings...@charter.net>
Subject: RE: makeing the switch

Hi Tom,

I totally agree with your intention to tone down the enthusiasm to make an 
unwarranted switch.
And yet, depending on what they want or need to do, it can be a viable 
option to switch, or at least use IOS for the majority of their computer 
work.
However, nothing will ever replace the ease of browsing the web with 
Windows, I think.


Take care,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Tom Kingston [mailto:tom.kings...@charter.net]
Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 11:50 PM
To: Rod Hutton <rod_hut...@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

Yes Rod. But this is very very dependent on what you need to do and what
you want in a screen reader. iOS and VoiceOver don't cut it either way
for me. It's a convenient little access point for some things. That's
all it is to me. But that's me. I'm sure for some it's great. I just
don't want eagerness and wishful thinking landing people where I am. I
paid the typical ridiculous Apple price and would have been much better
off buying a new Windows laptop. But again, that's just me and my needs.
Regards,
Tom


On 4/4/2017 10:53 PM, Rod Hutton wrote:

Hi Tom,

Yes, and yet some have migrated to IOS:

https://www.macstories.net/stories/one-year-of-ipad-pro/2/#content

Happy trails,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 10:45 PM
To: Loy <loyrg2...@gmail.com>; Window-Eyes Discussion List 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>

Subject: Re: makeing the switch

Loy,
Yes. Mac OS is a full blown operating system like Windows while iOS is a
slimmed down mobile OS designed to run on the mini computers it's
designed for.
Regards,
Tom


On 4/4/2017 5:59 PM, Loy via Talk wrote:

Is A desk top Mac OS different that on an IPad?
  - Original Message -
  From: Butch Bussen via Talk
  To: Janet Brandly ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
  Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 2:24 PM
  Subject: Re: makeing the switch


  I actually bought a used mac mini a couple years ago, maybe 3 or 4. 
It

  was all just to foreign to me.  Not only is the o s different, but
  screen reader commands as well.  With no help at all, it was just to
  much for me these days to start from scratch.  It isn't at all like
  windows, so you're starting from the ground up.  I'm to old, fat, and
  lazy to do that these days.
  73
  Butch
  WA0VJR
  Node 3148
  Wallace, ks.


  On Tue, 4 Apr 2017, Janet Brandly via Talk
  wrote:

  > Hi Tony,
  > I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely 
nearing
  > the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an 
Apple
  > product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your 
experiences

  > as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, I'd be
  > interested in following your adventures.
  >
  >
  > Janet
  >
  > -Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
  > Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
  > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
  > Subject: makeing the switch
  >
  > Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for
  > several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent 
demise of
  > Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be 
making the
  > switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s 
time
  > to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I 
pad mini
  > and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other 
websites
  > using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites 
aren’t
  > accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it 
just
  > so I can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be 
left with my
  > thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve 

Fwd: Re: makeing the switch

[Tom Kingston via Talk]

For some reason this reply went only to Rod.

Yes Rod. But this is very very dependent on what you need to do and what 
you want in a screen reader. iOS and VoiceOver don't cut it either way 
for me. It's a convenient little access point for some things. That's 
all it is to me. But that's me. I'm sure for some it's great. I just 
don't want eagerness and wishful thinking landing people where I am. I 
paid the typical ridiculous Apple price and would have been much better 
off buying a new Windows laptop. But again, that's just me and my needs.

Regards,
Tom


On 4/4/2017 10:53 PM, Rod Hutton wrote:

Hi Tom,

Yes, and yet some have migrated to IOS:

https://www.macstories.net/stories/one-year-of-ipad-pro/2/#content

Happy trails,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 10:45 PM
To: Loy <loyrg2...@gmail.com>; Window-Eyes Discussion List 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

Loy,
Yes. Mac OS is a full blown operating system like Windows while iOS is a
slimmed down mobile OS designed to run on the mini computers it's
designed for.
Regards,
Tom


On 4/4/2017 5:59 PM, Loy via Talk wrote:

Is A desk top Mac OS different that on an IPad?
  - Original Message -
  From: Butch Bussen via Talk
  To: Janet Brandly ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
  Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 2:24 PM
  Subject: Re: makeing the switch


  I actually bought a used mac mini a couple years ago, maybe 3 or 4.  It
  was all just to foreign to me.  Not only is the o s different, but
  screen reader commands as well.  With no help at all, it was just to
  much for me these days to start from scratch.  It isn't at all like
  windows, so you're starting from the ground up.  I'm to old, fat, and
  lazy to do that these days.
  73
  Butch
  WA0VJR
  Node 3148
  Wallace, ks.


  On Tue, 4 Apr 2017, Janet Brandly via Talk
  wrote:

  > Hi Tony,
  > I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely nearing
  > the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an Apple
  > product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your 
experiences
  > as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, I'd be
  > interested in following your adventures.
  >
  >
  > Janet
  >
  > -Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
  > Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
  > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
  > Subject: makeing the switch
  >
  > Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for
  > several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise 
of
  > Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the
  > switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time
  > to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini
  > and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites
  > using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t
  > accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just
  > so I can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left with 
my
  > thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen
  > reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all
  > those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes
  > “inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the
  > truth none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on
  > Screen readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who they
  > are and who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW
  > back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and 
myself
  > started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t
  > do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told
  > me it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my
  > buddy with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the 
website
  > and as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other things. I
  > found that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did.
  > So, in 2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same
  > type of thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes Windows
  > and Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months
  > and telling WE and Windows goodby.
  > ___
  > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author
  > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
  >
  > For memb

RE: makeing the switch

[Rod Hutton via Talk]

Hi Tom,

Yes, and yet some have migrated to IOS:

https://www.macstories.net/stories/one-year-of-ipad-pro/2/#content

Happy trails,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 10:45 PM
To: Loy <loyrg2...@gmail.com>; Window-Eyes Discussion List 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

Loy,
Yes. Mac OS is a full blown operating system like Windows while iOS is a 
slimmed down mobile OS designed to run on the mini computers it's 
designed for.
Regards,
Tom


On 4/4/2017 5:59 PM, Loy via Talk wrote:
> Is A desk top Mac OS different that on an IPad?
>   - Original Message -
>   From: Butch Bussen via Talk
>   To: Janet Brandly ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
>   Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 2:24 PM
>   Subject: Re: makeing the switch
>
>
>   I actually bought a used mac mini a couple years ago, maybe 3 or 4.  It
>   was all just to foreign to me.  Not only is the o s different, but
>   screen reader commands as well.  With no help at all, it was just to
>   much for me these days to start from scratch.  It isn't at all like
>   windows, so you're starting from the ground up.  I'm to old, fat, and
>   lazy to do that these days.
>   73
>   Butch
>   WA0VJR
>   Node 3148
>   Wallace, ks.
>
>
>   On Tue, 4 Apr 2017, Janet Brandly via Talk
>   wrote:
>
>   > Hi Tony,
>   > I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely nearing
>   > the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an Apple
>   > product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your 
> experiences
>   > as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, I'd be
>   > interested in following your adventures.
>   >
>   >
>   > Janet
>   >
>   > -Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
>   > Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
>   > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>   > Subject: makeing the switch
>   >
>   > Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for
>   > several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent 
> demise of
>   > Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the
>   > switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time
>   > to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad 
> mini
>   > and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites
>   > using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t
>   > accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just
>   > so I can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left 
> with my
>   > thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a 
> screen
>   > reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with 
> all
>   > those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes
>   > “inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the
>   > truth none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on
>   > Screen readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who they
>   > are and who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW
>   > back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and 
> myself
>   > started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I 
> couldn’t
>   > do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told
>   > me it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my
>   > buddy with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the 
> website
>   > and as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other things. I
>   > found that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did.
>   > So, in 2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same
>   > type of thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes 
> Windows
>   > and Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of 
> months
>   > and telling WE and Windows goodby.
>   > ___
>   > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the 
> author
>   > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>   >
>   > For membership options, visit
>   > 
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/jbrandly%40shaw.ca.
>   > For subscription options, visit
>   > http://lists.w

Re: makeing the switch

[Tom Kingston via Talk]

Loy,
Yes. Mac OS is a full blown operating system like Windows while iOS is a 
slimmed down mobile OS designed to run on the mini computers it's 
designed for.

Regards,
Tom


On 4/4/2017 5:59 PM, Loy via Talk wrote:

Is A desk top Mac OS different that on an IPad?
  - Original Message -
  From: Butch Bussen via Talk
  To: Janet Brandly ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
  Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 2:24 PM
  Subject: Re: makeing the switch


  I actually bought a used mac mini a couple years ago, maybe 3 or 4.  It
  was all just to foreign to me.  Not only is the o s different, but
  screen reader commands as well.  With no help at all, it was just to
  much for me these days to start from scratch.  It isn't at all like
  windows, so you're starting from the ground up.  I'm to old, fat, and
  lazy to do that these days.
  73
  Butch
  WA0VJR
  Node 3148
  Wallace, ks.


  On Tue, 4 Apr 2017, Janet Brandly via Talk
  wrote:

  > Hi Tony,
  > I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely nearing
  > the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an Apple
  > product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your 
experiences
  > as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, I'd be
  > interested in following your adventures.
  >
  >
  > Janet
  >
  > -Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
  > Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
  > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
  > Subject: makeing the switch
  >
  > Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for
  > several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise 
of
  > Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the
  > switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time
  > to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini
  > and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites
  > using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t
  > accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just
  > so I can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left with 
my
  > thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen
  > reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all
  > those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes
  > “inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the
  > truth none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on
  > Screen readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who they
  > are and who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW
  > back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and 
myself
  > started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t
  > do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told
  > me it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my
  > buddy with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the 
website
  > and as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other things. I
  > found that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did.
  > So, in 2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same
  > type of thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes Windows
  > and Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months
  > and telling WE and Windows goodby.
  > ___
  > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author
  > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
  >
  > For membership options, visit
  > 
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/jbrandly%40shaw.ca.
  > For subscription options, visit
  > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
  > List archives can be found at
  > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
  > ___
  > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author
  > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
  >
  > For membership options, visit
  > 
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/butchb%40shellworld.net.
  > For subscription options, visit
  > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
  > List archives can be found at
  > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
  >
  ___
  Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author 
and do not necessarily represent those

RE: makeing the switch

[Rod Hutton via Talk]

Hi Andy,

Here's an Apple page about transferring PC data to the Mac:

https://support.apple.com/en-ca/HT201553

hth,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Andy Baracco via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 9:54 PM
To: Tony C <tch...@mediacombb.net>; Window-Eyes Discussion List 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

i have heard and read this argument before. It may have held some water in 
the past, but not today. For one thing, most of us already have a computer, 
and have likely already paid for a screen reader, or had one purchased for 
them. So that savings that would come from buying the Mac does not apply. 
Also, today we have a free screen reader available in NVDA. I replaced a 
computer in 2012, and again this year. In both instances I considered a Mac, 
but in both instances when I did the math, it came out the same. I would be 
spending double to get a Mac with the same specs as a Windows machine that 
would be to my liking. Even a Mac Mini with decent specs would run me almost 
$1200.
Also, i have read that Apple's development of Voiceover for the Mac has been 
lagging over the last few years, and many who switch to the Mac find that 
they either have to also maintain a Windows PC for some tasks, or they have 
to install Windows on their Mac and either run a dual boot system or run 
Windows under a virtual machine. Also, if, like me, you have large amounts 
of data stored on external hard drives that have been formatted under 
Windows, you will not be able to transfer files to and from those devices 
with your Mac, thus again having to maintain another windows machine or 
running Windows on your Mac.
So i again purchased a Windows PC.

Andy

- Original Message - 
From: "Tony C via Talk" <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
To: "Evan Reese" <ment...@dslextreme.com>; "Window-Eyes Discussion List" 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 3:15 PM
Subject: Re: makeing the switch


>I just priced an I Mac at $1099. Hell, Jaws will cost you more than that, 
>and then try and get tech support without being made to feel like you’re an 
>idiot by their people. Thanks but no thanks
>
> -Original Message- 
> From: Evan Reese via Talk
> Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 12:02 PM
> To: Charles Adkins ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Subject: Re: makeing the switch
>
> For me at least, the expense of a new PC plus the expense of having to
> switch to JAWS if WE goes under, might very well equal or exceed the 
> expense
> of a new Mac.
> Evan
>
> -Original Message- 
> From: Charles Adkins via Talk
> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 12:51 PM
> To: Janet Brandly ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Subject: Re: makeing the switch
>
> The only thing  that keeps me from switching is the expense of a mac and I
> am obligated to use Windows at work at the radio station. I must admit
> though that I use my desktops less and do most things on my Iphone. Again
> its the big expense with Macs that does not make it easier to switch for 
> me.
> in fact, I'm using my iPhone to type this message.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Apr 4, 2017, at 12:14 PM, Janet Brandly via Talk 
>> <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Tony,
>>
>> I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely 
>> nearing the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to 
>> an Apple product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about 
>> your experiences as you adjust to doing tasks with a different 
>> screen-reader, I'd be interested in following your adventures.
>>
>>
>> Janet
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Subject: makeing the switch
>>
>> Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for 
>> several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent 
>> demise of Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be 
>> making the switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems 
>> that it’s time to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone 
>> or my I pad mini and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, 
>> and other websites using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t 
>> because the sites aren’t accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows 
>> PC’s with WE on it just so I can look back and think of all the money I 
>> spent just to be left with my thumb up my nose. When I think of the money 
>> I’ve spent maintaining a screen reader, and now the buil

Re: makeing the switch

[net bat via Talk]

if things are still the same apple can read a windows formatted drive if you 
use fat32 instead of the ntfs? format.


-Original Message- 
From: Andy Baracco via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 6:54 PM
To: Tony C ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

i have heard and read this argument before. It may have held some water in
the past, but not today. For one thing, most of us already have a computer,
and have likely already paid for a screen reader, or had one purchased for
them. So that savings that would come from buying the Mac does not apply.
Also, today we have a free screen reader available in NVDA. I replaced a
computer in 2012, and again this year. In both instances I considered a Mac,
but in both instances when I did the math, it came out the same. I would be
spending double to get a Mac with the same specs as a Windows machine that
would be to my liking. Even a Mac Mini with decent specs would run me almost
$1200.
Also, i have read that Apple's development of Voiceover for the Mac has been
lagging over the last few years, and many who switch to the Mac find that
they either have to also maintain a Windows PC for some tasks, or they have
to install Windows on their Mac and either run a dual boot system or run
Windows under a virtual machine. Also, if, like me, you have large amounts
of data stored on external hard drives that have been formatted under
Windows, you will not be able to transfer files to and from those devices
with your Mac, thus again having to maintain another windows machine or
running Windows on your Mac.
So i again purchased a Windows PC.

Andy

- Original Message - 
From: "Tony C via Talk" <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>

To: "Evan Reese" <ment...@dslextreme.com>; "Window-Eyes Discussion List"
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 3:15 PM
Subject: Re: makeing the switch


I just priced an I Mac at $1099. Hell, Jaws will cost you more than that, and 
then try and get tech support without being made to feel like you’re an idiot 
by their people. Thanks but no thanks


-Original Message- 
From: Evan Reese via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 12:02 PM
To: Charles Adkins ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

For me at least, the expense of a new PC plus the expense of having to
switch to JAWS if WE goes under, might very well equal or exceed the expense
of a new Mac.
Evan

-Original Message- 
From: Charles Adkins via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 12:51 PM
To: Janet Brandly ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

The only thing  that keeps me from switching is the expense of a mac and I
am obligated to use Windows at work at the radio station. I must admit
though that I use my desktops less and do most things on my Iphone. Again
its the big expense with Macs that does not make it easier to switch for me.
in fact, I'm using my iPhone to type this message.

Sent from my iPhone

On Apr 4, 2017, at 12:14 PM, Janet Brandly via Talk 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:


Hi Tony,

I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely nearing 
the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an Apple 
product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your 
experiences as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, I'd 
be interested in following your adventures.



Janet

-Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: makeing the switch

Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for several 
years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise of Window 
Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the switch. 
I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time to teach 
an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini and have 
no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites using 
Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t 
accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I 
can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left with my 
thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen 
reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all 
those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes 
“inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the truth 
none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen 
readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who they are and 
who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 
1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and myself 
started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t 
d

Re: makeing the switch

[Andy Baracco via Talk]

i have heard and read this argument before. It may have held some water in 
the past, but not today. For one thing, most of us already have a computer, 
and have likely already paid for a screen reader, or had one purchased for 
them. So that savings that would come from buying the Mac does not apply. 
Also, today we have a free screen reader available in NVDA. I replaced a 
computer in 2012, and again this year. In both instances I considered a Mac, 
but in both instances when I did the math, it came out the same. I would be 
spending double to get a Mac with the same specs as a Windows machine that 
would be to my liking. Even a Mac Mini with decent specs would run me almost 
$1200.
Also, i have read that Apple's development of Voiceover for the Mac has been 
lagging over the last few years, and many who switch to the Mac find that 
they either have to also maintain a Windows PC for some tasks, or they have 
to install Windows on their Mac and either run a dual boot system or run 
Windows under a virtual machine. Also, if, like me, you have large amounts 
of data stored on external hard drives that have been formatted under 
Windows, you will not be able to transfer files to and from those devices 
with your Mac, thus again having to maintain another windows machine or 
running Windows on your Mac.

So i again purchased a Windows PC.

Andy

- Original Message - 
From: "Tony C via Talk" <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
To: "Evan Reese" <ment...@dslextreme.com>; "Window-Eyes Discussion List" 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 3:15 PM
Subject: Re: makeing the switch


I just priced an I Mac at $1099. Hell, Jaws will cost you more than that, 
and then try and get tech support without being made to feel like you’re an 
idiot by their people. Thanks but no thanks


-Original Message- 
From: Evan Reese via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 12:02 PM
To: Charles Adkins ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

For me at least, the expense of a new PC plus the expense of having to
switch to JAWS if WE goes under, might very well equal or exceed the 
expense

of a new Mac.
Evan

-Original Message- 
From: Charles Adkins via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 12:51 PM
To: Janet Brandly ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

The only thing  that keeps me from switching is the expense of a mac and I
am obligated to use Windows at work at the radio station. I must admit
though that I use my desktops less and do most things on my Iphone. Again
its the big expense with Macs that does not make it easier to switch for 
me.

in fact, I'm using my iPhone to type this message.

Sent from my iPhone

On Apr 4, 2017, at 12:14 PM, Janet Brandly via Talk 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:


Hi Tony,

I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely 
nearing the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to 
an Apple product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about 
your experiences as you adjust to doing tasks with a different 
screen-reader, I'd be interested in following your adventures.



Janet

-Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: makeing the switch

Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for 
several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent 
demise of Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be 
making the switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems 
that it’s time to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone 
or my I pad mini and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, 
and other websites using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t 
because the sites aren’t accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows 
PC’s with WE on it just so I can look back and think of all the money I 
spent just to be left with my thumb up my nose. When I think of the money 
I’ve spent maintaining a screen reader, and now the built in screen 
reader with the IOS works great with all those websites that were called 
by tech support for Jaws and window eyes “inaccessible”.. I know I may 
catch some flack for this, but it’s the truth none the less.I guess VFO 
thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen readers, but I refuse to do 
business with them, because of who they are and who they are connected 
with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 1995, and I used Jaws 
up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and myself started building a web 
site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t do some of the thing 
with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told me it was because 
the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my buddy with Window 
eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the website and as I got 
used to it I began usi

Re: makeing the switch

[Tony C via Talk]

yes, it is different, but there is a pretty good built in tutorial, that my 
friend used and in less than 3 weeks she I pretty proficient with her Mac 
book aire.


-Original Message- 
From: Loy via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 4:59 PM
To: Butch Bussen ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

Is A desk top Mac OS different that on an IPad?
 - Original Message - 
 From: Butch Bussen via Talk

 To: Janet Brandly ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
 Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 2:24 PM
 Subject: Re: makeing the switch


 I actually bought a used mac mini a couple years ago, maybe 3 or 4.  It
 was all just to foreign to me.  Not only is the o s different, but
 screen reader commands as well.  With no help at all, it was just to
 much for me these days to start from scratch.  It isn't at all like
 windows, so you're starting from the ground up.  I'm to old, fat, and
 lazy to do that these days.
 73
 Butch
 WA0VJR
 Node 3148
 Wallace, ks.


 On Tue, 4 Apr 2017, Janet Brandly via Talk
 wrote:

 > Hi Tony,
 > I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely 
nearing
 > the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an 
Apple
 > product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your 
experiences

 > as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, I'd be
 > interested in following your adventures.
 >
 >
 > Janet
 >
 > -Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
 > Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
 > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
 > Subject: makeing the switch
 >
 > Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for
 > several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent 
demise of
 > Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making 
the
 > switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s 
time
 > to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad 
mini
 > and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other 
websites

 > using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t
 > accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just
 > so I can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left 
with my
 > thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a 
screen
 > reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with 
all

 > those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes
 > “inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the
 > truth none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on
 > Screen readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who 
they
 > are and who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and 
JFW
 > back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and 
myself
 > started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I 
couldn’t
 > do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support 
told

 > me it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my
 > buddy with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the 
website
 > and as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other things. 
I

 > found that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did.
 > So, in 2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the 
same
 > type of thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes 
Windows
 > and Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of 
months

 > and telling WE and Windows goodby.
 > ___
 > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the 
author

 > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
 >
 > For membership options, visit
 > 
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/jbrandly%40shaw.ca.

 > For subscription options, visit
 > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
 > List archives can be found at
 > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
 > ___
 > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the 
author

 > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
 >
 > For membership options, visit
 > 
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/butchb%40shellworld.net.

 > For subscription options, visit
 > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
 > List archives can be found at
 > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
 >
 ___
 Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely tho

Re: makeing the switch

[Tony C via Talk]

I just priced an I Mac at $1099. Hell, Jaws will cost you more than that, 
and then try and get tech support without being made to feel like you’re an 
idiot by their people. Thanks but no thanks


-Original Message- 
From: Evan Reese via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 12:02 PM
To: Charles Adkins ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

For me at least, the expense of a new PC plus the expense of having to
switch to JAWS if WE goes under, might very well equal or exceed the expense
of a new Mac.
Evan

-Original Message- 
From: Charles Adkins via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 12:51 PM
To: Janet Brandly ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

The only thing  that keeps me from switching is the expense of a mac and I
am obligated to use Windows at work at the radio station. I must admit
though that I use my desktops less and do most things on my Iphone. Again
its the big expense with Macs that does not make it easier to switch for me.
in fact, I'm using my iPhone to type this message.

Sent from my iPhone

On Apr 4, 2017, at 12:14 PM, Janet Brandly via Talk 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:


Hi Tony,

I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely nearing 
the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an Apple 
product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your 
experiences as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, 
I'd be interested in following your adventures.



Janet

-Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: makeing the switch

Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for 
several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise 
of Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making 
the switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s 
time to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I 
pad mini and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other 
websites using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the 
sites aren’t accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE 
on it just so I can look back and think of all the money I spent just to 
be left with my thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent 
maintaining a screen reader, and now the built in screen reader with the 
IOS works great with all those websites that were called by tech support 
for Jaws and window eyes “inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack 
for this, but it’s the truth none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve 
cornered the market on Screen readers, but I refuse to do business with 
them, because of who they are and who they are connected with. I started 
out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 
when a friend of mine and myself started building a web site, he was a WE 
user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t do some of the thing with jaws and 
Freedom Scientific’s tech support told me it was because the page builder 
I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my buddy with Window eyes could do it. 
I started using WE to work on the website and as I got used to it I began 
using is more and more for other things. I found that WE worked “out of 
the box” with more programs than Jaws did. So, in 2004 I became a Window 
eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same type of thing has happened, 
except this time is between Window eyes Windows and Voice Over and Mac. I 
will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months and telling WE and 
Windows goodby.

___
Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the 
author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.


For membership options, visit 
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/jbrandly%40shaw.ca.
For subscription options, visit 
http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
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http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com

___
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author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.


For membership options, visit 
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/cadkins6739%40gmail.com.
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___
Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author
and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.

For membership options, visit
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/mentat1%40dslextreme.com.
For subscription options,

Re: makeing the switch

[Loy via Talk]

Is A desk top Mac OS different that on an IPad?
  - Original Message - 
  From: Butch Bussen via Talk 
  To: Janet Brandly ; Window-Eyes Discussion List 
  Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 2:24 PM
  Subject: Re: makeing the switch


  I actually bought a used mac mini a couple years ago, maybe 3 or 4.  It 
  was all just to foreign to me.  Not only is the o s different, but 
  screen reader commands as well.  With no help at all, it was just to 
  much for me these days to start from scratch.  It isn't at all like 
  windows, so you're starting from the ground up.  I'm to old, fat, and 
  lazy to do that these days.
  73
  Butch
  WA0VJR
  Node 3148
  Wallace, ks.


  On Tue, 4 Apr 2017, Janet Brandly via Talk 
  wrote:

  > Hi Tony,
  > I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely nearing 
  > the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an Apple 
  > product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your 
experiences 
  > as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, I'd be 
  > interested in following your adventures.
  >
  >
  > Janet
  >
  > -Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
  > Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
  > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
  > Subject: makeing the switch
  >
  > Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for 
  > several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise 
of 
  > Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the 
  > switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time 
  > to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini 
  > and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites 
  > using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t 
  > accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just 
  > so I can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left with 
my 
  > thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen 
  > reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with 
all 
  > those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes 
  > “inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the 
  > truth none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on 
  > Screen readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who they 
  > are and who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW 
  > back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and 
myself 
  > started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t 
  > do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told 
  > me it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my 
  > buddy with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the 
website 
  > and as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other things. I 
  > found that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did. 
  > So, in 2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same 
  > type of thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes Windows 
  > and Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months 
  > and telling WE and Windows goodby.
  > ___
  > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the 
author 
  > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
  >
  > For membership options, visit 
  > 
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/jbrandly%40shaw.ca.
  > For subscription options, visit 
  > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
  > List archives can be found at 
  > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com 
  > ___
  > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the 
author 
  > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
  >
  > For membership options, visit 
  > 
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/butchb%40shellworld.net.
  > For subscription options, visit 
  > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
  > List archives can be found at 
  > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
  >
  ___
  Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author 
and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.

  For membership options, visit 
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/loyrg2845%40gmail.com.
  F

Re: makeing the switch

[Tony C via Talk]

I'm going to keep my windows 10 PC, but I'm getting rid of my windows 8.1 
PC.


-Original Message- 
From: Bob Tinney via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 10:03 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

I'm not making the switch.  I use WE, NVDA, and Narrator.  I'm also
waiting to see what WE will do with the Creators edition.

Bob, K8LR, tinn...@charter.net

On 4/4/2017 10:17 AM, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote:
The big test will be when windows 10 Creators update is released.  Will 
window-eyes work with it?


-Original Message- From: Loy via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 5:16 AM
To: Tony C ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

WE is not dead yet. It still works great for me  and they still respond to 
a support question, although this is not as good as it used to be.

 - Original Message -  From: Tony C via Talk
 To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
 Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 6:04 AM
 Subject: makeing the switch


 Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for 
several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise 
of Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making 
the switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s 
time to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I 
pad mini and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other 
websites using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the 
sites aren’t accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE 
on it just so I can look back and think of all the money I spent just to 
be left with my thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent 
maintaining a screen reader, and now the built in screen reader with the 
IOS works great with all those websites that were called by tech support 
for Jaws and window eyes “inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack 
for this, but it’s the truth none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve 
cornered the market on Screen readers, but I refuse to do business with 
them, because of who they are and who they are connected with. I started 
out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 
when a friend of mine and myself started building a web site, he was a WE 
user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t do some of the thing with jaws and 
Freedom Scientific’s tech support told me it was because the page builder 
I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my buddy with Window eyes could do it. 
I started using WE to work on the website and as I got used to it I began 
using is more and more for other things. I found that WE worked “out of 
the box” with more programs than Jaws did. So, in 2004 I became a Window 
eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same type of thing has happened, 
except this time is between Window eyes Windows and Voice Over and Mac. I 
will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months and telling WE and 
Windows goodby.

 ___
 Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the 
author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.


 For membership options, visit 
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/loyrg2845%40gmail.com.
 For subscription options, visit 
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Re: makeing the switch

[Butch Bussen via Talk]

I actually bought a used mac mini a couple years ago, maybe 3 or 4.  It 
was all just to foreign to me.  Not only is the o s different, but 
screen reader commands as well.  With no help at all, it was just to 
much for me these days to start from scratch.  It isn't at all like 
windows, so you're starting from the ground up.  I'm to old, fat, and 
lazy to do that these days.

73
Butch
WA0VJR
Node 3148
Wallace, ks.


On Tue, 4 Apr 2017, Janet Brandly via Talk 
wrote:



Hi Tony,
I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely nearing 
the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an Apple 
product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your experiences 
as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, I'd be 
interested in following your adventures.



Janet

-Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: makeing the switch

Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for 
several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise of 
Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the 
switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time 
to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini 
and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites 
using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t 
accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just 
so I can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left with my 
thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen 
reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all 
those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes 
“inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the 
truth none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on 
Screen readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who they 
are and who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW 
back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and myself 
started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t 
do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told 
me it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my 
buddy with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the website 
and as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other things. I 
found that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did. 
So, in 2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same 
type of thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes Windows 
and Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months 
and telling WE and Windows goodby.

___
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and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.


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Re: makeing the switch

[Nick Sarames via Talk]

Charles, can you e-mail me off list, regarding your work? Thanks.

Nick Sarames

On 4/4/2017 12:51 PM, Charles Adkins via Talk wrote:
> The only thing  that keeps me from switching is the expense of a mac and I am 
> obligated to use Windows at work at the radio station. I must admit though 
> that I use my desktops less and do most things on my Iphone. Again its the 
> big expense with Macs that does not make it easier to switch for me. in fact, 
> I'm using my iPhone to type this message.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Apr 4, 2017, at 12:14 PM, Janet Brandly via Talk 
>>  wrote:
>>
>> Hi Tony,
>>
>> I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely nearing 
>> the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an Apple 
>> product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your 
>> experiences as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, I'd 
>> be interested in following your adventures.
>>
>>
>> Janet
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Subject: makeing the switch
>>
>> Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for several 
>> years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise of Window 
>> Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the switch. 
>> I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time to teach 
>> an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini and have 
>> no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites using 
>> Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t 
>> accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I 
>> can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left with my 
>> thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen 
>> reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all 
>> those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes 
>> “inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the truth 
>> none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen 
>> readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who they are and 
>> who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 
>> 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and myself 
>> started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t 
>> do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told me 
>> it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my buddy 
>> with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the website and 
>> as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other things. I found 
>> that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did. So, in 
>> 2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same type of 
>> thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes Windows and 
>> Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months and 
>> telling WE and Windows goodby.
>> ___
>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author 
>> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
>> For membership options, visit 
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/jbrandly%40shaw.ca.
>> For subscription options, visit 
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>> List archives can be found at 
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>> ___
>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author 
>> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
>> For membership options, visit 
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/cadkins6739%40gmail.com.
>> For subscription options, visit 
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>> List archives can be found at 
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
> ___
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> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>
> For membership options, visit 
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/nicksarames%40msn.com.
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Re: makeing the switch

[Evan Reese via Talk]

For me at least, the expense of a new PC plus the expense of having to 
switch to JAWS if WE goes under, might very well equal or exceed the expense 
of a new Mac.

Evan

-Original Message- 
From: Charles Adkins via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 12:51 PM
To: Janet Brandly ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

The only thing  that keeps me from switching is the expense of a mac and I 
am obligated to use Windows at work at the radio station. I must admit 
though that I use my desktops less and do most things on my Iphone. Again 
its the big expense with Macs that does not make it easier to switch for me. 
in fact, I'm using my iPhone to type this message.


Sent from my iPhone

On Apr 4, 2017, at 12:14 PM, Janet Brandly via Talk 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:


Hi Tony,

I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely nearing 
the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an Apple 
product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your 
experiences as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, 
I'd be interested in following your adventures.



Janet

-Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: makeing the switch

Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for 
several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise 
of Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making 
the switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s 
time to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I 
pad mini and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other 
websites using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the 
sites aren’t accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE 
on it just so I can look back and think of all the money I spent just to 
be left with my thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent 
maintaining a screen reader, and now the built in screen reader with the 
IOS works great with all those websites that were called by tech support 
for Jaws and window eyes “inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack 
for this, but it’s the truth none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve 
cornered the market on Screen readers, but I refuse to do business with 
them, because of who they are and who they are connected with. I started 
out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 
when a friend of mine and myself started building a web site, he was a WE 
user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t do some of the thing with jaws and 
Freedom Scientific’s tech support told me it was because the page builder 
I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my buddy with Window eyes could do it. 
I started using WE to work on the website and as I got used to it I began 
using is more and more for other things. I found that WE worked “out of 
the box” with more programs than Jaws did. So, in 2004 I became a Window 
eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same type of thing has happened, 
except this time is between Window eyes Windows and Voice Over and Mac. I 
will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months and telling WE and 
Windows goodby.

___
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author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.


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Re: makeing the switch

[Charles Adkins via Talk]

The only thing  that keeps me from switching is the expense of a mac and I am 
obligated to use Windows at work at the radio station. I must admit though that 
I use my desktops less and do most things on my Iphone. Again its the big 
expense with Macs that does not make it easier to switch for me. in fact, I'm 
using my iPhone to type this message. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 4, 2017, at 12:14 PM, Janet Brandly via Talk 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Tony,
> 
> I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely nearing 
> the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an Apple 
> product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your experiences 
> as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, I'd be 
> interested in following your adventures.
> 
> 
> Janet
> 
> -Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Subject: makeing the switch
> 
> Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for several 
> years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise of Window 
> Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the switch. 
> I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time to teach an 
> old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini and have no 
> problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites using Voice 
> Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t accessible. I 
> think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I can look back 
> and think of all the money I spent just to be left with my thumb up my nose. 
> When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen reader, and now the 
> built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all those websites that 
> were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes “inaccessible”.. I know 
> I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the truth none the less.I guess VFO 
> thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen readers, but I refuse to do 
> business with them, because of who they are and who they are connected with. 
> I started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 
> 2004 when a friend of mine and myself started building a web site, he was a 
> WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t do some of the thing with jaws and 
> Freedom Scientific’s tech support told me it was because the page builder I 
> was usin was “inaccessible”, but my buddy with Window eyes could do it. I 
> started using WE to work on the website and as I got used to it I began using 
> is more and more for other things. I found that WE worked “out of the box” 
> with more programs than Jaws did. So, in 2004 I became a Window eyes user. 
> now I’m sad to say that the same type of thing has happened, except this time 
> is between Window eyes Windows and Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my 
> first Mac in a couple of months and telling WE and Windows goodby.
> ___
> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author 
> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
> 
> For membership options, visit 
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/jbrandly%40shaw.ca.
> For subscription options, visit 
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
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> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com 
> ___
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> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
> 
> For membership options, visit 
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/cadkins6739%40gmail.com.
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Re: makeing the switch

[bj colt via Talk]

Hi Janis,

I would hold off going to mac just yet. I read a few minutes ago that Apple 
are going to be bringing out new apple products, pc, laptop etc. My 
information came from a reputable source. The Guardian newspaper


Live long and prosper, John

-Original Message- 
From: Janet Brandly via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 5:14 PM
To: Tony C ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

Hi Tony,

I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely nearing
the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an Apple
product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your
experiences as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, I'd
be interested in following your adventures.


Janet

-Original Message- 
From: Tony C via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: makeing the switch

Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for several
years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise of Window
Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the switch.
I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time to teach
an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini and have
no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites using
Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t
accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I
can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left with my
thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen
reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all
those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes
“inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the truth
none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen
readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who they are and
who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in
1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and myself
started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t
do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told me
it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my buddy
with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the website and
as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other things. I found
that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did. So, in
2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same type of
thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes Windows and
Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months and
telling WE and Windows goodby.
___
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and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.

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Re: makeing the switch

[Janet Brandly via Talk]

Hi Tony,

I totally agree and am in a similar situation. My laptop is likely nearing 
the end of its lifes'an and I'm seriously considering changing to an Apple 
product for those exact reasons. If you decide to blog about your 
experiences as you adjust to doing tasks with a different screen-reader, I'd 
be interested in following your adventures.



Janet

-Original Message- 
From: Tony C via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 4:04 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: makeing the switch

Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for several 
years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise of Window 
Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the switch. 
I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time to teach 
an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini and have 
no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites using 
Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t 
accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I 
can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left with my 
thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen 
reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all 
those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes 
“inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the truth 
none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen 
readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who they are and 
who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 
1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and myself 
started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t 
do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told me 
it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my buddy 
with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the website and 
as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other things. I found 
that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did. So, in 
2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same type of 
thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes Windows and 
Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months and 
telling WE and Windows goodby.

___
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and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.


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Re: makeing the switch

[Singing Sparrow via Talk]

To be honest with you I feel the same way.

I have been a loyal jaws, and window eyes user for over a decade and I 
am finding that Voiceover handels web content better then the windows 
screen readers now a days.


Also the cost of the screen reader in a mac is free and is also 
constantly updated and when a new Mac OS comes out you don't have to pay 
for the upgrades for the screen reader.




On 4/4/2017 5:04 AM, Tony C via Talk wrote:

Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for several 
years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise of Window 
Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the switch. 
I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time to teach an 
old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini and have no 
problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites using Voice 
Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t accessible. I 
think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I can look back 
and think of all the money I spent just to be left with my thumb up my nose. 
When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen reader, and now the 
built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all those websites that 
were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes “inaccessible”.. I know I 
may catch some flack for this, but it’s the truth none the less.I guess VFO 
thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen readers, but I refuse to do 
business with them, because of who they are and who they are connected with. I 
started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 
2004 when a friend of mine and myself started building a web site, he was a WE 
user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom 
Scientific’s tech support told me it was because the page builder I was usin 
was “inaccessible”, but my buddy with Window eyes could do it. I started using 
WE to work on the website and as I got used to it I began using is more and 
more for other things. I found that WE worked “out of the box” with more 
programs than Jaws did. So, in 2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to 
say that the same type of thing has happened, except this time is between 
Window eyes Windows and Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a 
couple of months and telling WE and Windows goodby.
___
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Re: makeing the switch

[Bob Tinney via Talk]

I'm not making the switch.  I use WE, NVDA, and Narrator.  I'm also 
waiting to see what WE will do with the Creators edition.


Bob, K8LR, tinn...@charter.net

On 4/4/2017 10:17 AM, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote:
The big test will be when windows 10 Creators update is released.  
Will window-eyes work with it?


-Original Message- From: Loy via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 5:16 AM
To: Tony C ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

WE is not dead yet. It still works great for me  and they still 
respond to a support question, although this is not as good as it used 
to be.

 - Original Message -  From: Tony C via Talk
 To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
 Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 6:04 AM
 Subject: makeing the switch


 Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for 
several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent 
demise of Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to 
be making the switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it 
seems that it’s time to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take 
my I phone or my I pad mini and have no problem using programs like 
Netflix, Slink, and other websites using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws 
say hey can’t because the sites aren’t accessible. I think I’ll keep 
one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I can look back and think 
of all the money I spent just to be left with my thumb up my nose. 
When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen reader, and 
now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all those 
websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes 
“inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the 
truth none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on 
Screen readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who 
they are and who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 
95 and JFW back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend 
of mine and myself started building a web site, he was a WE user and I 
a Jaws user. I couldn’t do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom 
Scientific’s tech support told me it was because the page builder I 
was usin was “inaccessible”, but my buddy with Window eyes could do 
it. I started using WE to work on the website and as I got used to it 
I began using is more and more for other things. I found that WE 
worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did. So, in 2004 
I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same type of 
thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes Windows 
and Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of 
months and telling WE and Windows goodby.

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Re: makeing the switch

[Russ Kiehne via Talk]

The big test will be when windows 10 Creators update is released.  Will 
window-eyes work with it?


-Original Message- 
From: Loy via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 5:16 AM
To: Tony C ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: makeing the switch

WE is not dead yet. It still works great for me  and they still respond to a 
support question, although this is not as good as it used to be.
 - Original Message - 
 From: Tony C via Talk

 To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
 Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 6:04 AM
 Subject: makeing the switch


 Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for 
several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise 
of Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making 
the switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s 
time to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad 
mini and have no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other 
websites using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites 
aren’t accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it 
just so I can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left 
with my thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a 
screen reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great 
with all those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window 
eyes “inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the 
truth none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen 
readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who they are and 
who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 
1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and myself 
started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t 
do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told me 
it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my buddy 
with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the website and 
as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other things. I found 
that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did. So, in 
2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same type of 
thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes Windows and 
Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months and 
telling WE and Windows goodby.

 ___
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author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.


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Re: makeing the switch

[Kevin Huber via Talk]

Hi Tony:

I am not pulling the plug on Window-eyes just yet.  It works well for
me, and when it doesn't, I have played with JAWS enough to know that
it seems to have improved from years ago.  The only  thing is that I
do not feel justified in paying all that money for JAWS when NVDA is
free and works well for my purposes.
I, for one, can't wait to hear that announcement that Doug will make
with in the nest few month, even though it may not be anything to jump
up and down about.
Kevin Huber

On 4/4/17, Tony C via Talk  wrote:
> Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for several
> years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise of Window
> Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the switch.
> I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time to teach
> an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini and have
> no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites using
> Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t
> accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I
> can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left with my
> thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen
> reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all
> those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes
> “inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the truth
> none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen
> readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who they are and
> who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in
> 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and myself
> started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t
> do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told me
> it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my buddy
> with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the website and
> as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other things. I found
> that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did. So, in
> 2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same type of
> thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes Windows and
> Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months and
> telling WE and Windows goodby.
> ___
> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author
> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>
> For membership options, visit
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/huber.kevin7%40gmail.com.
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Re: makeing the switch

[Loy via Talk]

WE is not dead yet. It still works great for me  and they still respond to a 
support question, although this is not as good as it used to be.
  - Original Message - 
  From: Tony C via Talk 
  To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
  Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 6:04 AM
  Subject: makeing the switch


  Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for several 
years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise of Window 
Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the switch. 
I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time to teach an 
old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini and have no 
problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites using Voice 
Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t accessible. I 
think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I can look back 
and think of all the money I spent just to be left with my thumb up my nose. 
When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen reader, and now the 
built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all those websites that 
were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes “inaccessible”.. I know I 
may catch some flack for this, but it’s the truth none the less.I guess VFO 
thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen readers, but I refuse to do 
business with them, because of who they are and who they are connected with. I 
started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 
2004 when a friend of mine and myself started building a web site, he was a WE 
user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom 
Scientific’s tech support told me it was because the page builder I was usin 
was “inaccessible”, but my buddy with Window eyes could do it. I started using 
WE to work on the website and as I got used to it I began using is more and 
more for other things. I found that WE worked “out of the box” with more 
programs than Jaws did. So, in 2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to 
say that the same type of thing has happened, except this time is between 
Window eyes Windows and Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a 
couple of months and telling WE and Windows goodby. 
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Re: makeing the switch

[Lloyd Rasmussen via Talk]

Remember that VoiceOver for iOS and VoiceOver for the Mac are two different 
screen readers running with different constraints. Marco Zehe, a blind web 
developer who works for Mozilla, wrote a blog a year or so ago about why he 
was switching from the Mac back to Windows.
There are all sorts of opinions on this subject, and I don't think that any 
screader/browser combination is the best one for very long. Last summer one 
web tester I know said that the combination of NVDA with Firefox was the 
closes one could come to meeting the User Agent Accessibility Guidelines of 
the Worldwide Web Consortium. Of course that was last summer, but she was 
including Apple products in that statement.
I hope sombody fixes App Central. This is as important to the survival of 
Window-Eyes as anything else right now.




Lloyd Rasmussen, Kensington, MD
http://lras.home.sprynet.com
-Original Message- 
From: Tony C via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 6:04 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: makeing the switch

Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for several 
years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise of Window 
Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the switch. 
I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time to teach 
an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini and have 
no problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites using 
Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t 
accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I 
can look back and think of all the money I spent just to be left with my 
thumb up my nose. When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen 
reader, and now the built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all 
those websites that were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes 
“inaccessible”.. I know I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the truth 
none the less.I guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen 
readers, but I refuse to do business with them, because of who they are and 
who they are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 
1995, and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and myself 
started building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t 
do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told me 
it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my buddy 
with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the website and 
as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other things. I found 
that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than Jaws did. So, in 
2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say that the same type of 
thing has happened, except this time is between Window eyes Windows and 
Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a couple of months and 
telling WE and Windows goodby.

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Re: makeing the switch

[Chris G via Talk]

Hi,
What sites are accessible with VoiceOver that are not with the Windows 
screen readers? What browser were you using at the time? How long ago 
did you visit these sites?


I ran into a weird bug that apple knows about where specific links  that 
pull down information are not clickable with VoiceOver unless you 
double-tap and hold the link and select open.  Then the information 
dropps down as it should.  How many of us do that though.
This is only an issue on ios devices with VoiceOver.  The mac, Android, 
Chromebook and Windows all function as they should.


Just goes to show every screen reader has its issues.
Chris Grabowski
Mystic Access
Where the magic is in learning.
http://www.MysticAccess.com

Check out our eclectic and comprehensive assistive technology podcasts at:
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 Original Message 
From: Tony C via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, Apr 4, 2017 6:04 AM EST
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: makeing the switch

Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for 
several years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent 
demise of Window Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to 
be making the switch. I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems 
that it’s time to teach an old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I 
phone or my I pad mini and have no problem using programs like Netflix, 
Slink, and other websites using Voice Over, that WE and Jaws say hey 
can’t because the sites aren’t accessible. I think I’ll keep one of my 
Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I can look back and think of all the 
money I spent just to be left with my thumb up my nose. When I think of 
the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen reader, and now the built in 
screen reader with the IOS works great with all those websites that were 
called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes “inaccessible”.. I know 
I may catch some flack for this, but it’s the truth none the less.I 
guess VFO thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen readers, but I 
refuse to do business with them, because of who they are and who they 
are connected with. I started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 1995, 
and I used Jaws up untill 2004 when a friend of mine and myself started 
building a web site, he was a WE user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t do 
some of the thing with jaws and Freedom Scientific’s tech support told 
me it was because the page builder I was usin was “inaccessible”, but my 
buddy with Window eyes could do it. I started using WE to work on the 
website and as I got used to it I began using is more and more for other 
things. I found that WE worked “out of the box” with more programs than 
Jaws did. So, in 2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to say 
that the same type of thing has happened, except this time is between 
Window eyes Windows and Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first 
Mac in a couple of months and telling WE and Windows goodby.

___
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Re: makeing the switch

[John Covici via Talk]

You are comparing windows screen readers with the ios platform, very
different fish.  I would try the Mac before you buy, there is a 14 day
return period.  VO on the Mac is not the same as VO on an iphone, it
may or may not work depending on the website.

On Tue, 04 Apr 2017 06:04:43 -0400,
Tony C via Talk wrote:
> 
> Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for several 
> years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise of Window 
> Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the switch. 
> I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time to teach an 
> old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini and have no 
> problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites using Voice 
> Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t accessible. I 
> think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I can look back 
> and think of all the money I spent just to be left with my thumb up my nose. 
> When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen reader, and now the 
> built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all those websites that 
> were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes “inaccessible

Re: makeing the switch

[Matthew Chao via Talk]

Well, I started with Vocal-Eyes back in the good ol' DOS days, and have 
been with them ever since.  I have a Mac, but my problem is corporate 
world uses Microsoft products, and the Office stuff for the Mac isn't 
accessible enough for my taste.--Matthew Chao





On 4/4/2017 6:04 AM, Tony C via Talk wrote:

Well, I guess I’ve fought it for as long as I can. I’ve refused for several 
years to consider switching to a Mac, but with the apparent demise of Window 
Eyes, and Jaws sucking as it always has, I’m going to be making the switch. 
I’ve been a loyal WE user since 2004, but it seems that it’s time to teach an 
old dog new tricks. lol. I can take my I phone or my I pad mini and have no 
problem using programs like Netflix, Slink, and other websites using Voice 
Over, that WE and Jaws say hey can’t because the sites aren’t accessible. I 
think I’ll keep one of my Windows PC’s with WE on it just so I can look back 
and think of all the money I spent just to be left with my thumb up my nose. 
When I think of the money I’ve spent maintaining a screen reader, and now the 
built in screen reader with the IOS works great with all those websites that 
were called by tech support for Jaws and window eyes “inaccessible”.. I know I 
may catch some flack for this, but it’s the truth none the less.I guess VFO 
thinks they’ve cornered the market on Screen readers, but I refuse to do 
business with them, because of who they are and who they are connected with. I 
started out with Windows 95 and JFW back in 1995, and I used Jaws up untill 
2004 when a friend of mine and myself started building a web site, he was a WE 
user and I a Jaws user. I couldn’t do some of the thing with jaws and Freedom 
Scientific’s tech support told me it was because the page builder I was usin 
was “inaccessible”, but my buddy with Window eyes could do it. I started using 
WE to work on the website and as I got used to it I began using is more and 
more for other things. I found that WE worked “out of the box” with more 
programs than Jaws did. So, in 2004 I became a Window eyes user. now I’m sad to 
say that the same type of thing has happened, except this time is between 
Window eyes Windows and Voice Over and Mac. I will be buying my first Mac in a 
couple of months and telling WE and Windows goodby.
___
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