Re[3]: The Bat! 4.0
Hello Gleason, Saturday, October 13, 2007, 3:08:11 AM, you wrote: Gary, my definition of a production environment is that of using a software product day in and day out individually or within or upon a network of computers *without* problems. Yes, that is what IT types want. I understand that Thunderbird gives you that. That is not the way most people use an email client. It is not the way I use it for that matter. It is the way IT managers use it. Anyone of any type wants or should want a programme that just works. Yes, your support costs should be your largest concern. Ritlabs and other developers should feel free to not consider this when they make decisions. To not consider your customers costs in using your product comes under the heading of commercial suicide. -- Best regards, Xav Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat! 4.0
Hello TheBat Beta List Members!!! Someday, and that was in evening, Marek wrote something like this: So 1. GUI - like in v3 upgrade afaik we can expect huge change in V4, nothing small as themes in V3 OK, but this is still only GUI - maybe big changes but this is still cosmetic thing for me. TB will look nicer. 2. Account wizard - it works now? .dsi files hmmm … 3. message labels For me nothing special. I forgot! I can add: gmail aka theba.net. But still for me that is not major version. do You really expect all features in 4.0? Do You expect major changes between 3.99 and 4.00? When version change and you must pay for new licence? Yes, I expect really big changes and privately one little bugfix (regression fix) - https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=5690. What normal user expect is: 1. HTML templates afaik we can expect them next year in 4.x 2. HTML pictures I hope we will see it in 4.0 already. Why not wait when this two things are ready and then give users v4? 3. Account like in OE (example: one Incoming folder for couple Accounts) nice, but I do not expect this. And You can use common filters, do not You? Yes, I know how to cheat this behavior, but this is not 100% OE style. All wishes from list you can find here: http://thebat.pl/forum/ This is not my wishes. 4. Improved backup and folder/message maintenance (.bin files problems) 5. RSS native support 6. better IMAP 7. better calendar and exchange support afaik all were planned for 4.x, but do not expect them in 4.0. For V4, new Microed with Unicode support is developed, as I expect, it will be introduced in 4.x too. We can not wait? Or RITs can not wait to add really big changes and then go to v4? Major version comes with major improvements/changes. From this list for me (Im moderator on polish TB forum) it is very important number 4. There is very big problem with .bin files. When in normal TB installation we can try to import messages from this files, with OTFE it looks like mission impossible. For me this looks like huge problem, and I really do not want once again answer users to question about .bin files. 8. Linux version I do not think, we will ever see The Bat! under Linux, if will be developed in Delphi. And really do not think, You can do business in this platform, nobody wants to pay for apps, because everything is free. I will be first that pay for The Bat when it will be on this platform. BTW I paid for v2 and v3. Now I will consider to buy v4 in one polish newspaper (Komputer Swiat) that offers TB full license (without update) for 2,5 Euro. List with full versions are here: http://www.ks-ekspert.pl/archiwum/info/pne/index.html -- Thanks and best regards, Sebastian Murawski Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat! 4.0
Sveiki, Vilius, I guess I am going to have to disagree with that. TB Imap is not perfect, but it is the pick of my list which includes: Execuse me, but TB!'s IMAP is a crap. It's not even in alpha stage. In fact I haven't seen worse IMAP implementation. My students at university write better IMAP code in 4 to 6 weeks than Ritlabs did it in 4 years. Interesting. What I see is that every single Imap client out there is either incomplete (like Thunderbird) or has problems worse than TB. I have heard from a well known email client programmer that this probably has something to do with the fact that the Imap specification is enormous. Actually it's not. If you want to implement simple pure IMAP4 without any extensions (such as sieve, ACL's, list extensions, etc.) you can do it in couple of weeks. I already told you that _students_ does it in 6. And by the way I'm using Office 2007 and Outlook Express at work at the moment and as a long time IMAP user (like 7 years), I still think that their IMAP is superior (I'm not talking about other their stuff though). Thunderbird is incomplete, but the commands implemented there works like a sharm. I don't have to swich through folders or clear the cache everytime I want to see the message at least. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[4]: The Bat! 4.0
10/13/2007 6:56 AM Hi Xav, On 10/13/2007 Xav wrote: X Anyone of any type wants or should want a programme that just works. ALL software has some type of limitations, even SecondCopy and Irfanview, two of the best written programs of all time. It is our responsibility to recognize it and set up our customers to work within the limitations instead of exposing them to our prejudices. Learning to work with what is is a most valuable position to take in life. X To not consider your customers costs in using your product comes under X the heading of commercial suicide. My customers have been using TB since 1999. Many of them are still using v. 2.12 because it provides all their needs. I only expose my customers to versions that suit their needs. I also do not use versions with bugs that negatively affect them. I keep copies of several versions' installation files. Most of these people were OE or Outlook users. None have ever asked to go back. All of this is _my_ responsibility, not Ritlabs, or any other publisher. It is your responsibility to find the best combination of features and functionality for your customers and it is your responsibility to acknowledge the limitations and learn to work within them. BTW, this is my 20th year as a consultant and database application developer. Some of my customers are using a DOS database application in Win98SE because that is what works best for them. It is absurd to force them to upgrade to something that will do less for them! I recently built a Win2K machine for a new customer who had purchased a Vista machine prior to contacting me. They thank me over and over and I received additional customer referrals from them because of it. All of my business is received by word of mouth from a satisfied customer and I have more than I want. -- Take Care, Paul Voyager v.3.99.4 on Win2k SP4-Rollup1 5.0.2195 No IMAP OTFE Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[5]: The Bat! 4.0
Paul, It is your responsibility to find the best combination of features and functionality for your customers and it is your responsibility to acknowledge the limitations and learn to work within them. BTW, this is my 20th year as a consultant and database application developer. Some of my customers are using a DOS database application in Win98SE because that is what works best for them. It is absurd to force them to upgrade to something that will do less for them! I recently built a Win2K machine for a new customer who had purchased a Vista machine prior to contacting me. They thank me over and over and I received additional customer referrals from them because of it. All of my business is received by word of mouth from a satisfied customer and I have more than I want. And that was all well said. Peace to all deceased horses. -- Gleason Using 3.99.24 on Windows XP, 5.1, Build 2600. IMAP email provider is Fastmail, which uses Cyrus server software. Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
TB Simple MAPI and ActiveSync broken
Hello TheBat Beta List Members!!! When I install TB Simple MAPI I can not open Active Sync Manager, and use internet connection throgh AS and PPC. There is problem with WCESMgr.exe that cant find ordinal number 23 in MAPI32.dll. German WinXP sp2 AS 4.5 -- Thanks and best regards, Sebastian Murawski Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: thebat.net connection- STARTTLS command
Hello Peter, Thursday, October 11, 2007, 7:22:14 PM, you wrote: Peter Hello, Peter I set up an account with thebat.net - I think - successfully. I could send Peter a mail from Peter my personal account through my IP to bat.net. However cannot Peter receive/send mail from the BATNETaccount established in BAT. I succeeded to receive my messages from @thebat.net to the BAT mail client. Therefore I can send mail from my mail client BAT to @thebat.net address and forward it to my mail client (BAT). However I cannot send a message from the BAT to the @thebat.net. I set up the bat.net as a new account and tried to to send, but it doesn't go. It appears that I should use STARTTLS, but have no idea what this is. Hope someone can help me in this. I tried to search this list but did not find any solution. The smtp.log file shows the following: C: Connected to smtp.gmail.com, port 25 [09:52:19] S: 220 mx.google.com ESMTP h35sm4759640wxd [09:52:19] C: EHLO nc6230 [09:52:19] S: 250-mx.google.com at your service, [206.126.83.129] [09:52:19] S: 250-SIZE 28311552 [09:52:19] S: 250-8BITMIME [09:52:19] S: 250-STARTTLS [09:52:19] S: 250 ENHANCEDSTATUSCODES [09:52:19] C: MAIL FROM:[EMAIL PROTECTED] SIZE=432 [09:52:19] S: 530 5.7.0 Must issue a STARTTLS command first h35sm4759640wxd [09:52:19] C: RSET [09:52:19] S: 250 2.1.0 Flushed h35sm4759640wxd [09:52:19] C: RSET [09:52:20] S: 250 2.1.0 Flushed h35sm4759640wxd [09:52:20] C: QUIT [09:52:20] S: 221 2.0.0 mx.google.com closing connection h35sm4759640wxd -- Best regards, Peter The BAT 3.99.24, Windows XP, Service Pack 2 Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: thebat.net connection- STARTTLS command
Hi Peter, Saturday, October 13, 2007, 10:04:35 AM, you wrote: PK Connected to smtp.gmail.com, port 25 The SMTP settings I use are Secure to regular port (StartTLS) and port 587, and I can send from my account. You might try that. -- Regards, Perry Using The Bat! v3.99.24 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[5]: The Bat! 4.0
Hello Paul, Saturday, October 13, 2007, 12:22:57 PM, you wrote: 10/13/2007 6:56 AM Hi Xav, On 10/13/2007 Xav wrote: X Anyone of any type wants or should want a programme that just works. ALL software has some type of limitations, even SecondCopy and Irfanview, two of the best written programs of all time. It is our responsibility to recognize it and set up our customers to work within the limitations instead of exposing them to our prejudices. Learning to work with what is is a most valuable position to take in life. Not if there is a better alternative, in your case that being not upgrading to later versions. X To not consider your customers costs in using your product comes under X the heading of commercial suicide. My customers have been using TB since 1999. Many of them are still using v. 2.12 because it provides all their needs. I only expose my customers to versions that suit their needs. I also do not use versions with bugs that negatively affect them. I keep copies of several versions' installation files. Most of these people were OE or Outlook users. None have ever asked to go back. All of this is _my_ responsibility, not Ritlabs, or any other publisher. Then you are fortunate in being able to influence your customers so much. It is your responsibility to find the best combination of features and functionality for your customers and it is your responsibility to acknowledge the limitations and learn to work within them. We are at cross-purposes. If a company produces a product that requires too much support, it will lose out - customers (whether they be the IT department or end users) will go elsewhere. In your case this has been accomplished by not upgrading to later versions. BTW, this is my 20th year as a consultant and database application developer. Some of my customers are using a DOS database application in Win98SE because that is what works best for them. It is absurd to force them to upgrade to something that will do less for them! I fully agree with you. I recently built a Win2K machine for a new customer who had purchased a Vista machine prior to contacting me. They thank me over and over and I received additional customer referrals from them because of it. Out of curiosity - why not XP? All of my business is received by word of mouth from a satisfied customer and I have more than I want. Nice to hear that. -- Best regards, Xav Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: thebat.net connection- STARTTLS command
Hello Peter, On 2007-10-13 you wrote: PK However I cannot send a message from the BAT to the @thebat.net. I set up PK the bat.net as a new account and tried to to send, but it doesn't go. It PK appears that I should use STARTTLS, but have no idea what this is. In addition to Perry's solution you may try secure to dedicated port (TLS) which switches to port 465 automatically. This works fine for my regular gmail account. -- Regards, Uwe Using The Bat! v3.99.8 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[6]: The Bat! 4.0
10/13/2007 11:30 AM Hi Xav, On 10/13/2007 Xav wrote: X Not if there is a better alternative, in your case that being not X upgrading to later versions. There are many alternatives including other programs. For example, I will use Foxmail in certain circumstances for specific reasons. X Then you are fortunate in being able to influence your customers so X much. I spend considerable time and effort to educate and enable them so that I do not have to influence them. Decisions are made collectively rather than dictated by me. X We are at cross-purposes. If a company produces a product that X requires too much support, it will lose out - customers (whether they X be the IT department or end users) will go elsewhere. In your case X this has been accomplished by not upgrading to later versions. Or choosing the most appropriate product and educating the customer. I have many customers using various flavors of TB V3 as well. Some are upgraded to the latest MSI and others are on earlier releases. X Out of curiosity - why not XP? Because 2K had all the functionally needed by this customer and it does more, faster, at a given time with 512k RAM than XP with 1 gig. Also, no forced installation of WGA and IE7! And it behaves _much_ better on a network, especially with mixed OSs. -- Take Care, Paul Voyager v.3.99.4 on Win2k SP4-Rollup1 5.0.2195 No IMAP OTFE Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: thebat.net connection- STARTTLS command
10/13/2007 10:15 AM Hi Peter, On 10/13/2007 Peter Kerekes wrote: PK Hope someone can help me in this. I tried to search this list but did not PK find any solution. See attached screenshot. You must enable SMTP authentication. Set your username as shown and then go the the webmail and re-enable POP. -- Take Care, Paul Voyager v.3.99.4 on Win2k SP4-Rollup1 5.0.2195 No IMAP OTFEattachment: TB Gmail.jpg Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: TB Simple MAPI and ActiveSync broken
Hello Sebastian, hello The Bat! - Betalist, * Sebastian Murawski wrote: When I install TB Simple MAPI I can not open Active Sync Manager, and use internet connection throgh AS and PPC. There is problem with WCESMgr.exe that cant find ordinal number 23 in MAPI32.dll. German WinXP sp2 AS 4.5 Try START - RUN - FIXMAPI.EXE -- cheers Frank Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[3]: The Bat! 4.0
Guten Morgen, GP Again, I don't say that TB's Imap is perfect, just a respectable GP effort compared to how others have done. And Ritlabs remains GP commercially viable. I'm impressed. Indeed. So am I, considering what they are offering as a product. -- MfG, Altomailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] pgpKG65Xb6Cox.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat! 4.0
Hello all, Saturday, October 13, 2007, Sebastian Murawski wrote: do You really expect all features in 4.0? Do You expect major changes between 3.99 and 4.00? When version change and you must pay for new licence? Yes, I expect really big changes and privately one little bugfix (regression fix) - https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=5690. did You paid for upgrade from 3.0 to 3.0.1, from 3.0.1 to 3.5, from 3.5 from 3.7 etc? V3 was developed more than 3 years and You paid once only. Why You expect, all things will be introduced in 4.0? What normal user expect is: 1. HTML templates afaik we can expect them next year in 4.x 2. HTML pictures I hope we will see it in 4.0 already. Why not wait when this two things are ready and then give users v4? because downloading images to HTML messages is much easier and is almost finished, templates affects more parts of program. 8. Linux version I do not think, we will ever see The Bat! under Linux, if will be developed in Delphi. And really do not think, You can do business in this platform, nobody wants to pay for apps, because everything is free. I will be first that pay for The Bat when it will be on this platform. OK, how much licences can be sold? thousand? ten thousand? This is not enough to rewrite whole code, hire new developers and have two development branches, hire new people for support etc. etc. BTW I paid for v2 and v3. Now I will consider to buy v4 in one polish newspaper (Komputer Swiat) that offers TB full license (without update) for 2,5 Euro. List with full versions are here: http://www.ks-ekspert.pl/archiwum/info/pne/index.html hmm, interesting, who subsidizes full price of licence? -- Bye Marek Mikus Czech support of The Bat! http://www.thebat.cz Using the best The Bat! 3.99.24 under Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 with MyMacros,XMP,AnotherMacros, NOD32 Antivirus plugin and AntispamSniper v 2.6.1.5 Notebook Toshiba, Core2 Duo 1.83 GHz, 1 GB RAM Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: thebat.net connection- STARTTLS command
Hello Perry, Saturday, October 13, 2007, 10:35:04 AM, you wrote: Perry Hi Peter, Perry Saturday, October 13, 2007, 10:04:35 AM, you wrote: PK Connected to smtp.gmail.com, port 25 Perry The SMTP settings I use are Secure to regular port (StartTLS) and port Perry 587, and I can send from my account. You might try that. Thank you for the help. It works now both ways. Thanks all, Paul and Uwe and Henry -- Best regards, Peter The BAT 3.99.24, Windows XP, Service Pack 2 Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Beta testing TB
Hello Max, we know each other since many years now and I have a great respect and honour for your work. So, may I take the liberty to ask whether there is a REAL beta test team for TB, other than the open pubic one? You are developing v4 right now - and I guess there must be some people testing this *before* you release it to the public beta guys. Or are you doing all the tests yourself and are relying to the tbbeta-members afterwards? (Something that I cannot believe...) Is there anything like an alpha/beta policy for upcoming versions in progress? If so, is there any chance to paticipate? Please don't get me wrong, but I am tired of reading all this green statements in tbbeta. As you know, I have developed software myself in the past. Nowadays I cannot do this due to lack of time, but one of my main efforts is checking and testing the *really* good software (e.g. TB, Netcontrol2, TotalCommander, Dekart), translating GUI and documentations (Dekarts GUI and german Website, Netcontrol2) and giving ideas; allways with the background of a then programmer. Can you give me some input, please? ;) -- Best regards, Peter mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: thebat.net connection- STARTTLS command
10/13/2007 2:47 PM Hi Peter, On 10/13/2007 Peter Hampf wrote: PVN Set your username as shown PH just curious, I haven't seen this before: What is the meaning of the PH recent: part in your username? I just tried it and paced bla: in front PH of my GMail username. It works. ?? PH Can you enlighten me? Krzysztof Trybowski explained it well in [EMAIL PROTECTED] . If you can't find this let me know and I will send the info via PM since it has already been explained here. -- Take Care, Paul Voyager v.3.99.4 on Win2k SP4-Rollup1 5.0.2195 No IMAP OTFE Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat! 4.0
Hi Paul! I don't get IMAP calls when they use other email clients. Seems you have already found the answer to your problem. ...which comes back to the bottom line of my post which started this subthread: Ritlabs, please add long promised and paid state of the art features MOST mail client big players offer smootly to your planned state of the art interface! Or let me say it different: Focus on long promised stuff instead of talking to some kind of design bureau for a interface nobody here really needs. See, people go mad the same way with e.g. IMAP issues with fancy interface which shows the errors and a classic interface. -- Regards, Martin The Bat! v3.99.24 powered by Windows Server 2003 R2 Standard Edition 5.2 Build 3790 Service Pack 2 ConCarne cooks best since 1998 http://www.concarne.org smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat! 4.0
10/13/2007 3:16 PM Hi Martin, On 10/13/2007 Martin Sebald wrote: Seems you have already found the answer to your problem. MS Ritlabs, please add long promised and paid state of the art features MOST MS mail client big players offer smootly to your planned state of the art MS interface! I am confused, you said, please add...state of the art features MOST mail client big players offer... I do not understand why you are not using one of the big players if they are giving you what you are looking for. -- Take Care, Paul Voyager v.3.99.4 on Win2k SP4-Rollup1 5.0.2195 No IMAP OTFE Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat! 4.0
Hi Paul! Seems you have already found the answer to your problem. Ritlabs, please add long promised and paid state of the art features MOST mail client big players offer smootly to your planned state of the art interface! I am confused, you said, please add...state of the art features MOST mail client big players offer... I do not understand why you are not using one of the big players if they are giving you what you are looking for. Because I like TheBat most of the time and for most of its features. Also because I'm from the southern part of Germany, to be exactly I'm a Swabian. Maybe you heard what is told about us: We look after our money and what we paid we want to have. -- Regards, Martin The Bat! v3.99.24 powered by Windows Server 2003 R2 Standard Edition 5.2 Build 3790 Service Pack 2 ConCarne cooks best since 1998 http://www.concarne.org smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: thebat.net connection- STARTTLS command
Hi Peter, Saturday, October 13, 2007, 2:20:15 PM, you wrote: PK Thank you for the help. It works now both ways. Great. Glad to hear it. -- Regards, Perry Using The Bat! v3.99.24 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat! 4.0
10/13/2007 3:33 PM Hi Martin, On 10/13/2007 Martin Sebald wrote: MS Also because I'm from the southern part of Germany, to be exactly I'm a MS Swabian. Maybe you heard what is told about us: We look after our money and MS what we paid we want to have. Caveat Emptor must have been left out of your heritage. I'm sure you were given the same 30-day trial period I received. http://m-w.com/dictionary/Caveat%20emptor For sure you are sweet folks. The Schwarzwälder Kirschtorte proves it! -- Take Care, Paul Voyager v.3.99.4 on Win2k SP4-Rollup1 5.0.2195 No IMAP OTFE Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: TB Simple MAPI and ActiveSync broken
Hello TheBat Beta List Members!!! Someday, and that was in evening, Frank wrote something like this: When I install TB Simple MAPI I can not open Active Sync Manager, and use internet connection throgh AS and PPC. There is problem with WCESMgr.exe that cant find ordinal number 23 in MAPI32.dll. German WinXP sp2 AS 4.5 Try START - RUN - FIXMAPI.EXE And old windows mapi is reverted. I can do this mit .dll name changing.TB rename Windows Mapi32.dll to Mapi32TB.dll. This not resolve problem, maybe only temporary when you want to use AS and not want to have TB Simple MAPI installed. -- Thanks and best regards, Sebastian Murawski Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat! 4.0
Hello TheBat Beta List Members!!! Someday, and that was in evening, Marek wrote something like this: do You really expect all features in 4.0? Do You expect major changes between 3.99 and 4.00? When version change and you must pay for new licence? Yes, I expect really big changes and privately one little bugfix (regression fix) - https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=5690. did You paid for upgrade from 3.0 to 3.0.1, from 3.0.1 to 3.5, from 3.5 from 3.7 etc? And what are major improvements, new major features in this v3 builds? I remember one feature that now not exists. V3 was developed more than 3 years and You paid once only. Why You expect, all things will be introduced in 4.0? I paid also for v2 and remember promise about newsgroup support. I paid for this promise to. What normal user expect is: 1. HTML templates afaik we can expect them next year in 4.x 2. HTML pictures I hope we will see it in 4.0 already. Why not wait when this two things are ready and then give users v4? because downloading images to HTML messages is much easier and is almost finished, templates affects more parts of program. You can say that for sure html templates will be available in v4 and this will be not next major version? Im not so sure. Maybe you understand me wrong (I know my english is bad). When I know myself, I will buy TB even without major improvements, features in v4. I only want that RITs give me something more than cosmetic things. I want macros that works, and not just are red or blue. I want features like smartspace that works with NFS filters that flags messages. 8. Linux version I do not think, we will ever see The Bat! under Linux, if will be developed in Delphi. And really do not think, You can do business in this platform, nobody wants to pay for apps, because everything is free. I will be first that pay for The Bat when it will be on this platform. OK, how much licences can be sold? thousand? ten thousand? This is not enough to rewrite whole code, hire new developers and have two development branches, hire new people for support etc. etc. Like you can se below TB can cost less then 5 USD, so maybe this work is not so expensive? BTW I paid for v2 and v3. Now I will consider to buy v4 in one polish newspaper (Komputer Swiat) that offers TB full license (without update) for 2,5 Euro. List with full versions are here: http://www.ks-ekspert.pl/archiwum/info/pne/index.html hmm, interesting, who subsidizes full price of licence? Ask RITLABS or Komputer Swiat. This version you can order online (delivery to all countries is possible) and use also in Czech - it is normal full licence only without updates. -- Thanks and best regards, Sebastian Murawski Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat! 4.0
Hello all, Sunday, October 14, 2007, Sebastian Murawski wrote: When version change and you must pay for new licence? Yes, I expect really big changes and privately one little bugfix (regression fix) - https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=5690. did You paid for upgrade from 3.0 to 3.0.1, from 3.0.1 to 3.5, from 3.5 from 3.7 etc? And what are major improvements, new major features in this v3 builds? I remember one feature that now not exists. new filtering system, new customiser, rewritten message list pane, Unicode in many parts, Vista support etc. I do not remember all, some things can be major for You, some for another, for example downloading images to HTML is major for You, not for me - I like filtering system a lot... V3 was developed more than 3 years and You paid once only. Why You expect, all things will be introduced in 4.0? I paid also for v2 and remember promise about newsgroup support. I paid for this promise to. I really do not remember, Ritlabs officialy promised this, are You really need this yet? What normal user expect is: 1. HTML templates afaik we can expect them next year in 4.x 2. HTML pictures I hope we will see it in 4.0 already. Why not wait when this two things are ready and then give users v4? because downloading images to HTML messages is much easier and is almost finished, templates affects more parts of program. You can say that for sure html templates will be available in v4 and this will be not next major version? Im not so sure. You have right, I do not know this for sure, but Max confirmed me, HTML templates are in list of planned features for V4 in 2008. -- Bye Marek Mikus Czech support of The Bat! http://www.thebat.cz Using the best The Bat! 3.99.24 under Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 with MyMacros,XMP,AnotherMacros, NOD32 Antivirus plugin and AntispamSniper v 2.6.1.5 Notebook Toshiba, Core2 Duo 1.83 GHz, 1 GB RAM Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat! 4.0
Hello TheBat Beta List Members!!! Someday, and that was in evening, Marek wrote something like this: do You really expect all features in 4.0? Do You expect major changes between 3.99 and 4.00? When version change and you must pay for new licence? Yes, I expect really big changes and privately one little bugfix (regression fix) - https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=5690. did You paid for upgrade from 3.0 to 3.0.1, from 3.0.1 to 3.5, from 3.5 from 3.7 etc? And what are major improvements, new major features in this v3 builds? I remember one feature that now not exists. V3 was developed more than 3 years and You paid once only. Why You expect, all things will be introduced in 4.0? I paid also for v2 and remember promise about newsgroup support. I paid for this promise to. What normal user expect is: 1. HTML templates afaik we can expect them next year in 4.x 2. HTML pictures I hope we will see it in 4.0 already. Why not wait when this two things are ready and then give users v4? because downloading images to HTML messages is much easier and is almost finished, templates affects more parts of program. You can say that for sure html templates will be available in v4 and this will be not next major version? Im not so sure. Maybe you understand me wrong (I know my english is bad). When I know myself, I will buy TB even without major improvements, features in v4. I only want that RITs give me something more than cosmetic things. I want macros that works, and not just are red or blue. I want features like smartspace that works with NFS filters that flags messages. 8. Linux version I do not think, we will ever see The Bat! under Linux, if will be developed in Delphi. And really do not think, You can do business in this platform, nobody wants to pay for apps, because everything is free. I will be first that pay for The Bat when it will be on this platform. OK, how much licences can be sold? thousand? ten thousand? This is not enough to rewrite whole code, hire new developers and have two development branches, hire new people for support etc. etc. Like you can se below TB can cost less then 5 USD, so maybe this work is not so expensive? BTW I paid for v2 and v3. Now I will consider to buy v4 in one polish newspaper (Komputer Swiat) that offers TB full license (without update) for 2,5 Euro. List with full versions are here: http://www.ks- ekspert.pl/archiwum/info/pne/index.html hmm, interesting, who subsidizes full price of licence? Ask RITLABS or Komputer Swiat. This version you can order online (delivery to all countries is possible) and use also in Czech - it is normal full licence only without updates. I am a registered user of The Bat! but also of Pocomail, try this program, has a lot of features, The Bat! does not have! Or try Mokum Mail, http://www.blokker.net/whatsnew.htm As a registered user I always use this very safe program Hans Current beta is 3.99.24 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
