Re: 5.0 showstoppers - Hang on sendng mail - mail NOT sent
Hello Marek, Thursday, January 27, 2011, 7:30:02 PM, you wrote: Snip... > open account properties and in Transport section, enable SMTP protocol > logging, TB will log complete connection between client and server, You > will see everything there. Doh! I'll try that. -- Best regards, Tonymailto:t...@parkinch.co.uk The Bat! 5.0.0.132 BETA Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: 5.0 showstoppers - Hang on sendng mail - mail NOT sent
Hello all, Thursday, January 27, 2011, Tony Hoare wrote: > Hello Dwight, >> are you sure it was not sent? (Have you confirmed non-receipt with the >> intended recipient?) > I am waiting on his call. It's quite embarrassing to have to call a > person when you really would like to converse with them by email. open account properties and in Transport section, enable SMTP protocol logging, TB will log complete connection between client and server, You will see everything there. -- Bye Marek Mikus Czech support of The Bat! http://www.thebat.cz Using the best The Bat! 5.0.0.132 BETA under Windows 7 6.1 Build 7600 with MyMacros,XMP,AnotherMacros, AntispamSniper v 3.2.6.3 Notebook Thinkpad, Core2 Duo 2.40 GHz, 4 GB RAM Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0 showstoppers - Hang on sendng mail - mail NOT sent
Hello Dwight, > are you sure it was not sent? (Have you confirmed non-receipt with the > intended recipient?) > I am waiting on his call. It's quite embarrassing to have to call a person when you really would like to converse with them by email. The worry is that I have just assumed that previous emails have been sent but I am starting to have doubts especially emails to those people who you would like a response from but need to let them do it their own time. I hope RIT address some of these total showstoppers before rolling a nice-to-have extra feature. An email client that you cannot trust is useless. -- Best regards, Tonymailto:t...@parkinch.co.uk The Bat! 5.0.0.132 BETA Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0 showstoppers - Hang on sendng mail - mail NOT sent
On Thursday, January 27, 2011, 4:25:41 AM, Tony Hoare wrote: > OK, I now have the situation where the email was NOT sent. I can see > that this send do not have the log message expected; > 27/01/2011, 10:17:50: SEND - connection finished - 1 message(s) sent are you sure it was not sent? (Have you confirmed non-receipt with the intended recipient?) -- Dwight A. Corrin 316.303.9385 phone ahead to fax dcorrin at fastmail.fm photo galleries at http://dcorrin.smugmug.com photo blog at http://dcorrin.aminus3.com http://photos.vfxy.com/photoblogs/5882 Using IMAP with The Bat! 5.0.0.132 BETA on Windows Vista version 6,0 (Service Pack 2) Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0 showstoppers - Hang on sendng mail - mail NOT sent
Hello All, > Snip... > This is now URGENT as we cannot tolerate an email client that only > randomly sends mail. Another failed send. -- Best regards, Tonymailto:t...@parkinch.co.uk The Bat! 5.0.0.132 BETA Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0 showstoppers - Hang on sendng mail - mail NOT sent
Hello Dwight, Monday, January 17, 2011, 5:09:45 PM, you wrote: > On Monday, January 17, 2011, 6:32:37 AM, Tony Hoare wrote: > TB Connection Centre sometimes hangs on sending an email. The mail is actually sent but CS shows as still sending. >>> Confirmed. You can't close TB! in that case and after killing it and >>> restarting it still shows the task for sending. >> Reported: https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=8350 > > I believe that is the same problem as > https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=8285 > OK, I now have the situation where the email was NOT sent. I can see that this send do not have the log message expected; 27/01/2011, 10:17:50: SEND - connection finished - 1 message(s) sent Can anyone confirm this? This is now URGENT as we cannot tolerate an email client that only randomly sends mail. -- Best regards, Tonymailto:t...@parkinch.co.uk The Bat! 5.0.0.132 BETA Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Connection Center Hang on Gmail
11/1/2007 8:53 AM Connection Center Hang on Gmail Hi Max Frequently, the Connection Center hangs after checking for mail on the gmail thebat.net account. I am simultaneously checking 4 POP accounts. Two on my domain and one on InMail24. This does not happen with the other accounts. There are no entries showing in the log regarding this. BTW, the testing of the InMail24 account has been flawless. http://inmail24.com/Login.aspx -- Take Care, Paul The Bat! v.3.99.4 on Win2k SP4-Rollup1 5.0.2195 No IMAP No OTFE Current beta is 3.99.29 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: hang on
> Maybe because they devoted much development effort to just fixing > bugs so it would be 'flawless' and not enough to new and apparently > useless features? I think Tony's point is that even with Mulberry's clear sense of direction, a structured and announced development vision and a willingness to interact with the company's customers (which included some sizeable academic institutions) it still couldn't find the volumes it needed to survive. On that basis it's difficult to see how Ritlabs could hope to achieve a dramatically increased market share for TB! -- Regards, Clive Taylor TheBat!:3.61.12 Echo (Beta) Windows XP: Service Pack 2 Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Tony, > Stick with it and see what happens. Mulberry is the definitive IMAP client, > absolutely flawless in it's ability as an IMAP client. It has (had) the best > support I've ever come across and it still went bankrupt, it is no more. > Maybe because they devoted much development effort to just fixing bugs so it would be 'flawless' and not enough to new and apparently useless features? ;-) -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain) Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on Windows XP 5.1 Service Pack 2 Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Tony Boom & everyone else, on 20-Okt-2005 at 18:31 you (Tony Boom) wrote: > Much better than not getting aroundtuit at all in favour of a new gold > plated four key combo dongle banger. But I want one! And I want it now, or I'll go and use another email client! ;-) -- Best regards, Alexander (http://www.neurowerx.de - ICQ 238153981) Deliplayer2 is playing: "Lost Eden" (6:02) by Asura from the album '3D Vision Relax Module 01' Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Alexander, A reminder of what Alexander S. Kunz on TBBETA typed on: Thursday, October 20, 2005 at 17:38:24 GMT +0200 > ...because as soon as that happens, someone else would ask "what about > (Unicode|HTML templates|anything) support, I've been waiting for this so > long!" Then RL would say... "We've only got as far as bug number 56, we'll get to your number 98 ASAP" Much better than not getting aroundtuit at all in favour of a new gold plated four key combo dongle banger. -- Tony. Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on a G5 iMac Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Stuart, A reminder of what Stuart Hemming on TBBETA typed on: Thursday, October 20, 2005 at 14:22:17 GMT +0100 >> This morning I've given up and installed ThunderBird. > If that's not an example of lost revenue (even if it's future revenue) > then I don't know what is. Exactly. How many multitudes that are not on this list that we don't hear about do the same? Fine if they don't like it and prefer lesser clients. But not fine for the sake of a proper debugging schedule. -- Tony. Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on a G5 iMac Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Richard, A reminder of what Richard Chamberlain on TBBETA typed on: Thursday, October 20, 2005 at 13:25:43 GMT +0100 > Obviously I should have spent longer with the demo than I did. Despite all I've said and at the risk of contradicting myself I would say no you shouldn't have. IMAP does not work for me but, because TB is so superior to everything else in all other areas I gave up on IMAP and reverted all my accounts to POP. There are still a plethora of bugs in all areas of TB workings but most don't affect me and the way I use TB. I still get the odd AV and no end of floating point errors but for the sake of microed and ALT+L I can live with them. Stick with it and see what happens. Mulberry is the definitive IMAP client, absolutely flawless in it's ability as an IMAP client. It has (had) the best support I've ever come across and it still went bankrupt, it is no more. If RitLabs continue with their money grabbing, bugger the users attitude then it can't be too long before they go the same way. Their product barely works and everyone on here will tell you support is all but non existent so something has to change. No business can survive with this much contempt for it's users... Well, maybe Microsoft :) -- Tony. Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on a G5 iMac Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Peter Fjelsten & everyone else, on 20-Okt-2005 at 13:02 you (Peter Fjelsten) wrote: >>> but only that fixing small bugs does not generate revenue. Fixing >>> larger bugs possibly only generates a little revenue). SH>> So it's OK to leave 'em in?!?!? > No it's not. Of course not. My statement was in the context of stopping > all development of new features and fixing bugs for 1 year. ...because as soon as that happens, someone else would ask "what about (Unicode|HTML templates|anything) support, I've been waiting for this so long!" ;-) -- Best regards, Alexander (http://www.neurowerx.de - ICQ 238153981) The major task of the twentieth century will be to explore the unconscious, to investigate the subsoil of the mind. -- Henri Bergson Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Peter Fjelsten & everyone else, on 20-Okt-2005 at 12:42 you (Peter Fjelsten) wrote: > While I would like Ritlabs to do this too, they have to generate revenue > and you get that through new features and not fixing (small) bugs (I am > not saying that the outstanding bugs are small, but only that fixing > small bugs does not generate revenue. Fixing larger bugs possibly only > generates a little revenue). Bugs in officially available software creates zero revenue. One or two months ago I tried Directory Opus for the PC. Version 8.something (I started using DOpus on the Amiga, I know what it can do, I know its theoretically the best filemanager thing thats available). I downloaded the demo, got the eval license key, installed it, played around with it a little bit. Well, I had two crashes during the first couple of hours. I uninstalled it and gave up. -- Best regards, Alexander (http://www.neurowerx.de - ICQ 238153981) Outer space is like Dolly Parton: you don't believe it, but there it is. -- Lorne Greene Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
> last night at 03:30 the scheduler took care of a perfect backup of thebat! > which it does every night. Congrats. -- Stuart Hemming Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Aided by BayesIt! 0.8.4, MyGate v1.0, rss2pop3 v1.2, SpamPal v1.70, MyMacros 1.11a. Do not meddle in the affairs of cats, for they are subtle and will piddle on your computer. pgpxjJkYHqHTV.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hi Cees, On Thursday, October 20, 2005, 4:03:58 PM: > last night at 03:30 the scheduler took care of a perfect backup of thebat! > which it does every night. The backup function itself is something that needs general overhaul ... Michael -- Jabber [EMAIL PROTECTED] - OpenPGP 0xE59FD50D TheBat! 3.61.13 Echo (Beta) - Windows XP (Service Pack 2 Build 2600) Das letzte Wort des Gastes in der Rocker-Kneipe: "Na, ihr Blödmänner!" pgp3wzlgYFmSu.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re[2]: hang on
Het was op donderdag 20 oktober 2005 om 15:20 uur dat jij iets schreef over 'hang on' : Hoi Stuart, >> But I wonder how many "ordinary" users (by ordinary I mean people who >> are disinterested in discussing software on mailing lists) feel that TB! >> is full of bugs. SH> Anyone who's tried to use IMAP? Anyone who's tried to make sense of SH> the UI configuration options. Anyone who's tried to get the scheduler SH> to work ... last night at 03:30 the scheduler took care of a perfect backup of thebat! which it does every night. -- groeten, Cees Orville's head whistles in a crosswind. __ The Bat! 3.61.13 Echo (Beta) [A12F0392] running on Windows XP 5.1 build 2600 Service Pack 2 smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Peter, A reminder of what Peter Fjelsten on TBBETA typed on: Thursday, October 20, 2005 at 14:17:05 GMT +0200 > But I wonder how many "ordinary" users (by ordinary I mean people who > are disinterested in discussing software on mailing lists) feel that TB! > is full of bugs. If the majority feel this, then you're right. This is something we'll never know for sure. As an "ordinary user" of loads of other software I know how I would and do react when trying new products. I doubt anyone joins a mailing list for every single piece of software they use. I would assume they download it, try it and after 30 days, if they persist with it that long, they buy it. If they don't like it or it's full of bugs after a few days they ditch it and try something else. When I first tried TB, v1.4 it worked like a dream, it didn't have fancy bells and gold knobs but it worked perfectly so I bought it. Should I find myself in the same situation today with AV's, floating point errors, no message loaded and such like popping up every time I boot it up I too wouldn't give it a second glance before moving on. To answer your question, how many people do we know of on these list that no longer use TB? And what's more, how many people would RL estimate download TB but never register it... How many of those people write to RL saying "I tried your software but I don't like it because..." RL must know how many copies of TB have been downloaded compared to how many of those copies have been registered. Provide a product that works far better than TB does now, a product that can be seen to be supported with a team that takes notice of it's beta testers and I bet that ratio will rise dramatically. Now you can answer me one question. Why are we wasting our time as beta testers if the development team are going to ignore 99% or our input? It seems like we're here just to test new functions, and when we tell them they don't work they ignore it and add something else new for us to test next beta release. -- Tony. Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on a G5 iMac Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
> This morning I've given up and installed ThunderBird. If that's not an example of lost revenue (even if it's future revenue) then I don't know what is. -- Stuart Hemming Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Aided by BayesIt! 0.8.4, MyGate v1.0, rss2pop3 v1.2, SpamPal v1.70, MyMacros 1.11a. The Benefits of Being Over Sixty ( 3) : Your joints are more accurate meteorologists than the national weather service. pgpksF6XNx5jX.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
> But I wonder how many "ordinary" users (by ordinary I mean people who > are disinterested in discussing software on mailing lists) feel that TB! > is full of bugs. Anyone who's tried to use IMAP? Anyone who's tried to make sense of the UI configuration options. Anyone who's tried to get the scheduler to work ... -- Stuart Hemming Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Aided by BayesIt! 0.8.4, MyGate v1.0, rss2pop3 v1.2, SpamPal v1.70, MyMacros 1.11a. A successful man is one who makes more money than his wife can spend. A successful woman is one who can find such a man. pgpnWM65RNAQn.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello, Peter Fjelsten wrote: Tony, On 20-10-2005 14:00, you [TB] wrote in : TB> And if they keep trying to sell something that don't work properly TB> no one will buy it and they still won't need anybody to fix the bugs TB> or add new features. True. But I wonder how many "ordinary" users (by ordinary I mean people who are disinterested in discussing software on mailing lists) feel that TB! is full of bugs. If the majority feel this, then you're right. This has been quite an enlightening discussion for me. I've only fairly recently purchased the bat and because of some bugs I was suffering decided to join the beta list to see if that resolved any. I am using imap and as I understand it that is probably about the worse thing you can do with the bat. The feature set is fantastic but as others have mentioned a lot of it is buggy. I found myself having to drag to the trash, instead of just hitting the delete key because that didn't work, having to deal with duplicate mail, having read mail re-appear as unread, etc. etc. This morning I've given up and installed ThunderBird. Obviously I should have spent longer with the demo than I did. Richard Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Tony, On 20-10-2005 14:00, you [TB] wrote in : TB> And if they keep trying to sell something that don't work properly TB> no one will buy it and they still won't need anybody to fix the bugs TB> or add new features. True. But I wonder how many "ordinary" users (by ordinary I mean people who are disinterested in discussing software on mailing lists) feel that TB! is full of bugs. If the majority feel this, then you're right. -- Best regards Peter Fjelsten 3.61.12 Echo (Beta) Pro ~4 POP3, 7 IMAP (UW IMAP 2002e) & 1 IMAP (Exchange 6.5), 175K msgs. Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1 Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Peter, A reminder of what Peter Fjelsten on TBBETA typed on: Thursday, October 20, 2005 at 13:31:13 GMT +0200 > If they don't make any revenue there is definitely nobody to fix bugs. And if they keep trying to sell something that don't work properly no one will buy it and they still won't need anybody to fix the bugs or add new features. -- Tony. Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on a G5 iMac Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Stuart, A reminder of what Stuart Hemming on TBBETA typed on: Thursday, October 20, 2005 at 12:17:57 GMT +0100 > one that allows the RL team to focus on all of the bugs > related to a given set of functionality; IMAP, UI, filters, etc and > fixing 'em all, Like when they promised a whole beta cycle dedicated to IMAP? Can't stop, Catherine Zeta Jones has just turned up and I got to make her a cuppa tea... -- Tony. Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on a G5 iMac Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hi Peter, On Thursday, October 20, 2005, 12:42:17 PM: > I don't think this is fair. > While I would like Ritlabs to do this too, they have to generate revenue > and you get that through new features and not fixing (small) bugs (I am > not saying that the outstanding bugs are small, but only that fixing > small bugs does not generate revenue. Fixing larger bugs possibly only > generates a little revenue). No. You get revenue from satisfied customers. You get revenue from good reviews and from customers who like your product and promote it. Especially this kind of software and its niche on the market. And to be honest... can you recommend TheBat! at this moment to your friends and colleagues? I can't. If I haven't worked with TheBat! since many years and I would now get in touch with it for the first time ... no chance of buying a licence. Not stable, dozens of functions, all of them useful but most of them not really working or thought-out till the end. And a bunch of bugs that are being carried with the program since x versions. The impression that's being drawn in your mind: a gigantic construction site which let you anticipate what there will be in the future. But nothing more. Just my opinion. If you compare the development of TheBat! with other products, you will see main differences: - noticeable higher release cycles - much more new functions in each release - lower priority of stabilising the product - no bugfix-only releases - parallel release of new functions and fixes which often causes new problems - the developers seem to be unfamiliar with the development-status "feature freeze" ... TheBat! is so full of functions which most of us never conceived of. Now it's time to take a rest and think about how to reorganize some things (like contact to the costumers or giving themselves a clear roadmap of the future - which seems to not exist?!) and concentrate on bringing this awesome product forward - relating to getting it reliable. I don't need 4 or 5 new versions a year (some of them wouldn't even get the beta-status at other companies). I need one or perhaps two. But these have to be "rock-stable"! That would be normal, that would be welcome. If necessary some patches for important fixes. But that's all. This would get some calmness into the TheBat!-"Community" and bring back confidence into Ritlabs. After that: get on with new ideas and test them for a more bigger period than now. If internal test and the open beta signalise, that everything works fine, every new function is working properly ... bring on the new final. And so on. Step by step. regards, Michael -- Jabber [EMAIL PROTECTED] - OpenPGP 0xE59FD50D TheBat! 3.61.13 Echo (Beta) - Windows XP (Service Pack 2 Build 2600) Filmgesetz 67: Wenn man mit dem Auto ins Wasser fällt, hat man immer noch genug Zeit, unter einen Steg zu tauchen, bevor die bösen Jungs kommen. pgpX4HnBoVgFB.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Tony, On 20-10-2005 13:26, you [TB] wrote in : >> While I would like Ritlabs to do this too, they have to generate >> revenue and you get that through new features and not fixing (small) >> bugs TB> So it doesn't matter if the product works or not, just as long as they can TB> grab your money and run! Did you not read my response to Stuart? If they don't make any revenue there is definitely nobody to fix bugs. For the record: Also I would prefer RL fixed bugs rather than adding new stuff. I am running IMAP - so that should give you an idea! -- Best regards Peter Fjelsten 3.61.12 Echo (Beta) Pro ~4 POP3, 7 IMAP (UW IMAP 2002e) & 1 IMAP (Exchange 6.5), 175K msgs. Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1 Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Peter, A reminder of what Peter Fjelsten on TBBETA typed on: Thursday, October 20, 2005 at 13:02:52 GMT +0200 > My statement was in the context of stopping > all development of new features and fixing bugs for 1 year. Suppose you bought a new house and the roof leaked. Would you expect the builder to forget about you and carry on building new houses just so he could get more money? Whatever you call it, it's commonly known as sub standard workmanship be it houses, cars or software. And as soon as you get that reputation people will stop buying from you. So creating revenue isn't a valid argument for not fixing bugs. -- Tony. Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on a G5 iMac Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Peter, A reminder of what Peter Fjelsten on TBBETA typed on: Thursday, October 20, 2005 at 12:42:17 GMT +0200 > While I would like Ritlabs to do this too, they have to generate revenue > and you get that through new features and not fixing (small) bugs So it doesn't matter if the product works or not, just as long as they can grab your money and run! -- Tony. Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on a G5 iMac Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
> No it's not. Of course not. My statement was in the context of stopping > all development of new features and fixing bugs for 1 year. It doesn't have to be a year. I would suggest a slight modification to Tony's plan, one that allows the RL team to focus on all of the bugs related to a given set of functionality; IMAP, UI, filters, etc and fixing 'em all, or at least all those that can be fixed and properly reporting on the rest. -- Stuart Hemming Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Aided by BayesIt! 0.8.4, MyGate v1.0, rss2pop3 v1.2, SpamPal v1.70, MyMacros 1.11a. On the keyboard of life, always keep one finger on the escape key. pgp6Ko0aQloT7.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Stuart, On 20-10-2005 12:57, you [SH] wrote in : >> but only that fixing small bugs does not generate revenue. Fixing >> larger bugs possibly only generates a little revenue). SH> So it's OK to leave 'em in?!?!? No it's not. Of course not. My statement was in the context of stopping all development of new features and fixing bugs for 1 year. -- Best regards Peter Fjelsten 3.61.12 Echo (Beta) Pro ~4 POP3, 7 IMAP (UW IMAP 2002e) & 1 IMAP (Exchange 6.5), 175K msgs. Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1 Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
> but only that fixing small bugs does not generate revenue. Fixing > larger bugs possibly only generates a little revenue). So it's OK to leave 'em in?!?!? I work for a software company and I know exactly how our customer's would respond to /that/ as an argument. RL staffers have said openly that fixing bugs is boring and that they don't like doing it. Sadly, big bits of life is like that but it doesn't mean we can just avoid it (try it with your next Tax Return!). -- Stuart Hemming Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Aided by BayesIt! 0.8.4, MyGate v1.0, rss2pop3 v1.2, SpamPal v1.70, MyMacros 1.11a. Just think, if it weren't for marriage, men would go through life thinking they had no faults at all. pgpu9UxT1lufK.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Stuart, On 20-10-2005 12:05, you [SH] wrote in : SH> Get's my vote, but then it did the last time someone suggested it. SH> Sadly this kind of work is too dull for/beneath RL's programming SH> team. I don't think this is fair. While I would like Ritlabs to do this too, they have to generate revenue and you get that through new features and not fixing (small) bugs (I am not saying that the outstanding bugs are small, but only that fixing small bugs does not generate revenue. Fixing larger bugs possibly only generates a little revenue). -- Best regards Peter Fjelsten 3.61.12 Echo (Beta) Pro ~4 POP3, 7 IMAP (UW IMAP 2002e) & 1 IMAP (Exchange 6.5), 175K msgs. Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1 Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Stuart, A reminder of what Stuart Hemming on TBBETA typed on: Thursday, October 20, 2005 at 11:05:19 GMT +0100 > Sadly this kind of work is too dull for/beneath RL's programming team. Hunting down bugs may well be boring, I agree that implementing new ideas and features, getting them to work, *if* they can get them to work is infinitely more exciting. But surely it's a way of restoring confidence in the product, confidence in their programming ability, confidence that SO MANY people have lost and have voiced their opinion on. It's just my opinion but I feel it's time for them to stop and take stock of what they're trying to achieve, a good stable world class product or maybe they're content to settle for mediocrity. Because that's what it is, a mediocre email client (maybe marginally better than mediocre) full of fantastic functions very few of which work to their full potential. -- Tony. Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on a G5 iMac Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
> Not sure how many of you will agree with that Get's my vote, but then it did the last time someone suggested it. Sadly this kind of work is too dull for/beneath RL's programming team. -- Stuart Hemming Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 Aided by BayesIt! 0.8.4, MyGate v1.0, rss2pop3 v1.2, SpamPal v1.70, MyMacros 1.11a. Why is it that, no matter what colour of bubble bath you use, the bubbles are always white? pgpLywS95WTa1.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Roelof, A reminder of what Roelof Otten on TBBETA typed on: Thursday, October 20, 2005 at 11:10:19 GMT +0200 > Okay, I won't say that. But fact is that I'm having problems I think everyone has problems with TB! Some affecting people more than others depending on how they use TB! Umlauts, don't affect me, I don't use them. Virtual folders don't, I don't use them. IMAP... Affected me to the extent I gave up on it completely. I know this has been said time and time again but I'd like to see progress of TB! stop completely, no more additions, no more fancy bells, no more whistles, VF's, no more anything. I'd like to see RL start at the top of the bug list and fix each bug in turn. Not just random ones or ones that are easy to fix. Start with bug number one, fix the first 5 or 10 and then let us test them with a new beta. If my bug is number 197 then I'm more than happy to wait my turn as long as I can see things being fixed rather than a new function being added and consequently more bugs. Maybe even a separate branch of the beta cycle just so we can have at least one rock solid version. Once that's been accomplished they can then start at the top of the wish list and start adding the knobs either they want or people want. Not sure how many of you will agree with that but at the moment development chaos seems to reign supreme. -- Tony. Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on a G5 iMac Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Michael, A reminder of what Michael Schneider on TBBETA typed on: Thursday, October 20, 2005 at 11:00:33 GMT +0200 > Hey, that's equality. Why all the fun just for the IMAP-users? I had more than my share of that type of fun which is why I changed all my accounts back to POP. I just couldn't take all that joy and laughter any longer. -- Tony. Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on a G5 iMac Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hallo Tony, On Thu, 20 Oct 2005 09:54:36 +0100GMT (20-10-2005, 10:54 +0200, where I live), you wrote: >> I'm getting a 'no message displayed' message on screen (Should have 'loaded' instead of 'displayed') TB> Please don't say that the IMAP phenomenon is creeping into the POP scene as TB> well :) Okay, I won't say that. But fact is that I'm having problems with Cees' messages every once in a while, no matter what TB version I'm using. After I posted my complaint yesterday, (half an hour later) I was able to read his messages again without restarting TB. Tomorrow I booted the system, started TB and the problem was back again. Not only for all of Cees' messages, but also for one of Sean's too. I blamed the problem with Cees to his message body being base 64 encoded and S/MIME signed, but Sean only used the latter. Maybe it's just that Cees writes so much that it's always his messages that I encounter when I'm having this problems -- Groetjes, Roelof Conscience is the inner voice that warns us somebody is looking The Bat! 3.61.13 Echo (Beta) Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 1 pop3 account, server on LAN OTFE enabled P4 3GHz 2 GB RAM pgpTdlVIzbtBR.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hi Tony, On Thursday, October 20, 2005, 10:54:36 AM: >> I'm getting a 'no message displayed' message on screen > Please don't say that the IMAP phenomenon is creeping into the POP scene as > well :) Hey, that's equality. Why all the fun just for the IMAP-users? You have the right for a daily surprise also ;-) regads, Michael -- Jabber [EMAIL PROTECTED] - OpenPGP 0xE59FD50D TheBat! 3.61.13 Echo (Beta) - Windows XP (Service Pack 2 Build 2600) Es ist nicht der Fluss, der fliesst, sondern das Wasser. PGP oder S/MIME-Verschlüsselung erwünscht! pgpApZHhei228.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hello Roelof, A reminder of what Roelof Otten on TBBETA typed on: Wednesday, October 19, 2005 at 23:50:11 GMT +0200 > I'm getting a 'no message displayed' message on screen Please don't say that the IMAP phenomenon is creeping into the POP scene as well :) -- Tony. Using The Bat! v3.61.13 Echo (Beta) on a G5 iMac Current beta is 3.61.13 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
Re: hang on
Hallo Thomas, On Wed, 19 Oct 2005 23:23:39 +0700GMT (19-10-2005, 18:23 +0200, where I live), you wrote: TF> Hallo Rubeo, TF> On Sat, 8 Oct 2005 18:19:55 +0200 GMT (08/10/2005, 23:19 +0700 GMT), TF> Rubeo wrote: >> just a sec before anyone downloads I'll be rebooting to loosen up >> my system a bit so then it can be online again for days and days to >> come... ;) >> Back in a sec TF> OK, let's all send a message when we reboot. ;-) Anybody else having the same problem as I have? I can't read Rubeo's message at all, neither the start of this thread, neither his response to Thomas. Apparently Thomas can read it fine, but I'm getting a 'no message displayed' message on screen and when I reply I'm getting an empty message (Including empty From:, To: and Subject: headers) and an AV: --- The Bat! --- Access violation at address 00AA47F8 in module 'thebat.exe'. Read of address 00F8. --- OK --- as I'm CC-ing this to tbbeta, it concerns mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] and mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] on tbot -- Groetjes, Roelof The characters in this message are recyclable The Bat! 3.61.12 Echo (Beta) Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2 1 pop3 account, server on LAN OTFE enabled P4 3GHz 2 GB RAM pgpoHwYZvDkH9.pgp Description: PGP signature Current beta is 3.61.12 (Echo) | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
