Re: Some Macros don't work when followed by %- then a line break and some text (Was: The Bat and Mac computing)
Hi On Friday 11 December 2009 at 9:07:46 PM, in mid:964479155.20091211210...@my_localhost, MFPA wrote: Hi On Tuesday 25 August 2009 at 6:50:01 PM, in mid:159424778.20090825195...@my_localhost, I wrote: Now reported at https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=7699 Since I was not the only person to observe this issue, I'm surprised to find nobody else has added any notes of confirmation to my bug report. Can anybody confirm whether versions other than 4.0.34 and 4.0.38 are affected? https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=7699 has now been flagged as RESOLVED in version 4.2.13.6. -- Best regards MFPA Don't ask me, I'm making this up as I go! Using The Bat! v4.0.38 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Current version is 4.2.12.4 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Some Macros don't work when followed by %- then a line break and some text (Was: The Bat and Mac computing)
Hi On Tuesday 25 August 2009 at 6:50:01 PM, in mid:159424778.20090825195...@my_localhost, I wrote: Now reported at https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=7699 Since I was not the only person to observe this issue, I'm surprised to find nobody else has added any notes of confirmation to my bug report. Can anybody confirm whether versions other than 4.0.34 and 4.0.38 are affected? -- Best regards MFPA Always be on the lookout for conspicuousness Using The Bat! v4.0.38 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Current version is 4.2.12.4 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hi On Sunday 23 August 2009 at 5:22:42 PM, in mid:6688229.20090823172...@my_localhost, MFPA wrote: I shall compare my reply templates for PGPNET and TBUDL. My TBUDL template that was/is working begins with:- %replyto=%fromname %fromaddr%- %- %SingleRe%- %SetHeader(X-Face,%QInclude='X-Face')%- %SetHeader(X-Rogue,%QInclude='X-Rogue')%- %SetHeader(From,MFPA %QInclude='MFPA@')%- %SetHeader(To,%QInclude='Reply_to_list')%- %- Hi My PGPNET template that was notworking began with:- %replyto=%fromname %fromaddr%- %- %SetHeader(X-Face,%QInclude='X-Face')%- %SetHeader(X-Rogue,%QInclude='X-Rogue')%- %SetHeader(From,MFPA %QInclude='MFPA@')%- %SetHeader(To,%QInclude='Reply_to_list')%- %SingleRe%- %- Hi Placing the line %SingleRe%- before instead of after the %SetHeader lines fixed the issue in my PGPNET reply template. The %SingleRe is no longer ignored and the Hi is no longer swallowed. Moving the %SingleRe%- to after the %SetHeader lines replicated the issue in my TBUDL reply template. -- Best regards, MFPA Volvo, Video, Velcro. (I came, I saw, I stuck around.) Using The Bat! v4.0.38 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Test for On--- On Sunday, August 23, 2009, at 12:17:12 PM, MFPA wrote: Placing the line %SingleRe%- before instead of after the %SetHeader lines fixed the issue in my PGPNET reply template. The %SingleRe is no longer ignored and the Hi is no longer swallowed. Moving the %SingleRe%- to after the %SetHeader lines replicated the issue in my TBUDL reply template. So the position of the %SingleRe%- line within the template IS critical to its operation. How do we go about reporting this as a replicable bug? More to the point, is it worthwhile doing so, since use of SingleRe is already deprecated? Would it be better to request addition of the checkbox for numbering to all of the Reply template dialogs? -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Some Macros don't work when followed by %- then a line break and some text (Was: The Bat and Mac computing)
Hi On Tuesday 25 August 2009 at 2:27:42 PM, in mid:1711693323.20090825082...@jimkyle.com, Jim Kyle wrote: So the position of the %SingleRe%- line within the template IS critical to its operation. Further investigation reveals an issue that affects a number of other macros in addition to %SingleRe. If one of the affected macros appears in the template followed /immediately/ (ie no space) by the %- macro and then on a new line by some text (not starting with a space) that should appear directly in the message body, the affected macro is not honoured and the first word of the text following the macro does not appear in the message. For example:- %SetHeader(Reply-to,%fromname %fromaddr)%- %Singlere%- This is my text The reply numbers Re[2]: etc appear. The message body contains is my text instead of This is my text If there is a space between the affected macro and the %- macro, this behaviour is not observed. If the text begins with a space, the behaviour is not observed and the space appears in the message. If the text is on the same line as the affected macro, after the %- macro, this behaviour is not observed. If the text is on the same line as the affected macro, without the %- macro, this behaviour is only observed if there is no space between the affected macro and the text. If the affected macro is not followed by %-, the behaviour is not observed but the message obviously contains an extra blank line. If there are multiple affected macros in a row, whether on the same line or not, the first word of the text is swallowed and all macros are actioned except the final one. Affected macros include:- Fromaddr Foldername SingleRe TEXT TOADDR WINDOWSPLATFORMNAME WINDOWSMINORVERSION WINDOWSMAJORVERSION WINDOWSCSDVERSION WINDOWSBUILDNUMBER The following show the behaviour of the first word of the text being swallowed but I did not test further to check whether or not they were actioned:- NOSPLIT nousepgp NOUSESMIME USEPGP USESMIME WRAPPED WRAPJUSTIFY Can anybody else replicate this? How do we go about reporting this as a replicable bug? https://www.ritlabs.com/bt More to the point, is it worthwhile doing so, since use of SingleRe is already deprecated? Not deprecated - just 'largely superseded by the option Use reply numbering in the subject line.' As the issue looks like it affects some other macros as well, it is definitely worthwhile. I was just seeing whether others can replicate first. (-; Would it be better to request addition of the checkbox for numbering to all of the Reply template dialogs? That wish could be requested separately - don't forget the sorting office templates for auto-replies as well as all the other places to set up reply templates. -- Best regards MFPA ETHERNET(n): device used to catch the Ether bunny Using The Bat! v4.0.38 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hello Jim, Tuesday, August 25, 2009, at 8:27:42 PM, Jim Kyle wrote: . JK So the position of the %SingleRe%- line within the template IS critical JK to its operation. How do we go about reporting this as a replicable bug? JK More to the point, is it worthwhile doing so, since use of SingleRe is JK already deprecated? Would it be better to request addition of the checkbox JK for numbering to all of the Reply template dialogs? Thats probably the best solution... -- tracer Using The Bat! v4.2.9.1 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 with AntiSpamSniper Version Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hi On Tuesday 25 August 2009 at 6:52:21 PM, in mid:1196792640.20090826005...@gmail.com, tracer wrote: Thats probably the best solution... Except that the same problem afflicts several other macros. -- Best regards MFPA Life is a holiday. In the same way that glass is a liquid Using The Bat! v4.0.38 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Some Macros don't work when followed by %- then a line break and some text (Was: The Bat and Mac computing)
Hi On Tuesday 25 August 2009 at 4:25:25 PM, in mid:1994607676.20090825162...@my_localhost, I wrote: Further investigation reveals an issue that affects a number of other macros in addition to %SingleRe. Now reported at https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=7699 -- Best regards MFPA Ultimate consistency lies in being consistently inconsistent Using The Bat! v4.0.38 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hi On Thursday 20 August 2009 at 9:35:48 PM, in mid:43201374.20090820153...@jimkyle.com, Jim Kyle wrote: Charles found an interesting anomaly that I'm now exploring, implying that the %- macro might be involved since the On of the first line was getting suppressed. I've got to plan out a series of experiments to pin it down and allow others to try to replicate the problem, though, since it's so extremely subtle... I also need to look into that, since I have spotted that my reply template for the PGPNET group has recently started ignoring the %singlere and also swallowing the Hi at the beginning of my replies. I shall compare my reply templates for PGPNET and TBUDL. -- Best regards, MFPA Zorba the Greek - before he zorbas you Using The Bat! v4.0.38 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hi On Wednesday 19 August 2009 at 5:55:07 PM, in mid:161478364.20090819115...@jimkyle.com, Jim Kyle wrote: Wednesday, August 19, 2009, at 11:40:00 AM, Jim Kyle wrote: This is a test from the brand new account created for use only with this list. Apparently this is going to work, if this message makes it into the servers... It's not feasible; since both this new account and the older web account are accessing the same POP3 mailbox, whichever one gets there first grabs all the traffic and the other never sees it. The easy answer to that is for the new account to never check for incoming mail. I have some accounts set up like that, with no receive mail settings at all. Also make sure that mailbox checking has both boxes unticked and ignore 'check all accounts' request is ticked. -- Best regards, MFPA Lack of money is no obstacle. Lack of an idea is an obstacle. Using The Bat! v4.0.38 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hi On Wednesday 19 August 2009 at 3:15:42 PM, in mid:87785275.20090819091...@jimkyle.com, Jim Kyle wrote: Yes, I am. Could that be the problem? I'll try changing the sequence just in case it makes a difference. It might well be, since the %Account= macro might take effect AFTER the %SingleRe one and thus override it because of the tick mark... This is indeed a mystery. I tried adding the %Account macro into my AB template in every conceivable position and creating a reply to a TBUDL message I had copied to a common folder and to folders in various other accounts. None of this caused the %SingleRe macro to stop working for me. When I deleted my %SingleRe and created replies, the little numbers appeared. -- Best regards, MFPA Greater than being great is being grateful. Using The Bat! v4.0.38 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
On Thursday, August 20, 2009, at 12:57:25 PM, MFPA wrote: The easy answer to that is for the new account to never check for incoming mail. I have some accounts set up like that, with no receive mail settings at all. Also make sure that mailbox checking has both boxes unticked and ignore 'check all accounts' request is ticked. That's what I came up with, more or less by accident. Now the outgoing replies are sent from the new account, but it never checks for new mail and leaves that for the old one to deal with. Charles found an interesting anomaly that I'm now exploring, implying that the %- macro might be involved since the On of the first line was getting suppressed. I've got to plan out a series of experiments to pin it down and allow others to try to replicate the problem, though, since it's so extremely subtle... -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hallo Jim, On Tue, 18 Aug 2009 19:43:52 -0500GMT (19-8-2009, 2:43 +0200, where I live), you wrote: JK Here's the template, just copied (of course the signature break is part of JK the template). Still the numbers are getting added, even though I shut down JK TB! and restarted it just in case the template was being held in RAM rather JK than read from disk anew for each message. Perchance a bug? The most common reason for AB templates that aren't used is that you've got multiple address book entries for the same address. -- Groetjes, Roelof The longer the title, the less important the job. http://www.voormijalleen.nl/ The Bat! 4.2.10.1 Windows Vista 6.0 Build 6001 Service Pack 1 6 pop3 accounts, 1 imap account OTFE enabled Quad Core 2.4GHz 4 GB RAM pgphLomVWGL8Y.pgp Description: PGP signature Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing
Wednesday, August 19, 2009, at 1:37:03 AM, Roelof Otten wrote: The most common reason for AB templates that aren't used is that you've got multiple address book entries for the same address. So I searched the AB for tbudl and got two entries. I then deleted one of them and searched again to make certain there was only one. Next I restored the tick mark for numbering on the account, after modifying the reply template in the AB to indicate that it's indeed the AB template (as you can see in the signature) -- and behold, the numbering in the subject line is back again despite the %SingleRe%- line in the template! Could it be the positioning of the macro within the template? Should it be somewhere else, possibly before the account one? The puzzle is getting interesting even though it's somewhat off topic for the original thread... -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 (AB template for TBUDL entry) Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, at 10:15:27 PM, tracer wrote: For this msg I am partly using that macro you posted. I don't see any number in the subject and also in my tail of the msg for Antispamsniper which is installed (free one) the version isn't mentioned. When you edit the templates I assume you have noticed you can if you want set a tick mark to get or not get numbers. See my reply to Roelof for details of the current test. The bottom group of lines in the template I posted earlier produce the version numbers, but I'm using the paid version of the sniper and the free version may not include the version macros (which come from the sniper, not from TB!). I see the checkbox on the template dialog for the entire account, but it's not there on the dialog to set a template for either the folder or the AB. If it were, that would solve the whole problem! -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 (AB template for TBUDL entry) Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hallo Jim, On Wed, 19 Aug 2009 07:26:26 -0500GMT (19-8-2009, 14:26 +0200, where I live), you wrote: JK Next I restored the tick mark for numbering on the account, after JK modifying the reply template in the AB to indicate that it's JK indeed the AB template (as you can see in the signature) -- and JK behold, the numbering in the subject line is back again despite JK the %SingleRe%- line in the template! My tb-groups template uses %singlere and my account properties have numbering enabled (just for testing purposes) and that's working for replies without an address book template. So the macro does its work. JK Could it be the positioning of the macro within the template? Should it be JK somewhere else, possibly before the account one? The puzzle is getting JK interesting even though it's somewhat off topic for the original thread... I haven't got any address book templates that use the %Account= macro Why are you using it, do you filter your tbudl messages to a common filter? -- Groetjes, Roelof Postscript: The only thing of interest in some letters. http://www.voormijalleen.nl/ The Bat! 4.2.10.1 Windows Vista 6.0 Build 6001 Service Pack 1 6 pop3 accounts, 1 imap account OTFE enabled Quad Core 2.4GHz 4 GB RAM pgpfCCkfCunV3.pgp Description: PGP signature Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing
Wednesday, August 19, 2009, at 8:10:05 AM, Roelof Otten wrote: I haven't got any address book templates that use the %Account= macro Why are you using it, do you filter your tbudl messages to a common filter? Yes, I am. Could that be the problem? I'll try changing the sequence just in case it makes a difference. It might well be, since the %Account= macro might take effect AFTER the %SingleRe one and thus override it because of the tick mark... -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 (AB template for TBUDL entry) Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing
Wednesday, August 19, 2009, at 8:10:05 AM, Roelof Otten wrote: I haven't got any address book templates that use the %Account= macro Why are you using it, do you filter your tbudl messages to a common filter? I've moved the list's folder over to be under the web account, and the filter also from common to web but as you can see the numbering is still there. A true puzzlement; perhaps I'll have to wipe out the whole folder and create it anew under the web account -- but if I'm going to do that I might as well create a separate account for the list. I guess that's the next thing to try... -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 (AB template for TBUDL entry, no ACCOUNT= macro now) Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Wednesday, August 19, 2009, at 8:10:05 AM, Roelof Otten wrote: I haven't got any address book templates that use the %Account= macro Why are you using it, do you filter your tbudl messages to a common filter? This is a test from the brand new account created for use only with this list. Apparently this is going to work, if this message makes it into the servers... -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 (AB template for TBUDL entry, no ACCOUNT= macro now) Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Wednesday, August 19, 2009, at 11:40:00 AM, Jim Kyle wrote: This is a test from the brand new account created for use only with this list. Apparently this is going to work, if this message makes it into the servers... It's not feasible; since both this new account and the older web account are accessing the same POP3 mailbox, whichever one gets there first grabs all the traffic and the other never sees it. I could probably do some complicated things with the Sorting Office to route everything where it should go, but it's really not worth the effort to do so since I don't post here all that often. This thread probably has more messages from me, than does the entire rest of the list for the years I've been subscribed! For now, I'll just go back to my original setup. Thanks for all the comments; I've learned a lot about some of the features. -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 (AB template for TBUDL entry, no ACCOUNT= macro now) Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: The Bat and Mac computing
From: j...@jimkyle.com Subject: Re: The Bat and Mac computing For now, I'll just go back to my original setup. Thanks for all the comments; I've learned a lot about some of the features. Jim, I know you put a stone over the subject, but just out of curiosity: you posted a copy of your template some messages ago... is it just me or you had an On word on your template, but not on your reply? I'd have to TBUDL archives right now to be sure, but I could swear I saw your template like On , but on the first line of your replies, it's started right with just the week day name. Check that... it seems you're not seeing the real involved template. Add any dummy words to that one you posted here for us, so you can check you're looking at the right one. []s, Charles. _ Conheça os novos produtos Windows Live! Clique aqui. http://www.windowslive.com.br Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Test for On--- On Wednesday, August 19, 2009, at 12:16:04 PM, Charles Canato wrote: I'd have to TBUDL archives right now to be sure, but I could swear I saw your template like On , but on the first line of your replies, it's started right with just the week day name. Check that... it seems you're not seeing the real involved template. Add any dummy words to that one you posted here for us, so you can check you're looking at the right one. Great catch and I'll have to follow up with more testing. It looks as if the %- macro may have been a cause of the problem; I took it out and added a few words, and On returned! Here's the AB template used for this reply. Gotta leave right now but I'll check this out some more since there may be a possibly serioud bug hiding under all this: %SingleRe Test for On--- On %ODateEn, at %OTimeLongEn, %OFromName wrote: %Quotes %Cursor -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v%THEBATVERSION on %WINDOWSPLATFORMNAME %- %WINDOWSMAJORVERSION.%WINDOWSMINORVERSION Build %WINDOWSBUILDNUMBER %WINDOWSCSDVERSION on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version %ANTISPAMSNIPER_VERSION -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hello Jim, Wednesday, August 19, 2009, at 7:32:15 PM, Jim Kyle wrote: JK See my reply to Roelof for details of the current test. The bottom group of JK lines in the template I posted earlier produce the version numbers, JK but I'm using the paid version of the sniper and the free version may not JK include the version macros (which come from the sniper, not from TB!). JK I see the checkbox on the template dialog for the entire account, but it's JK not there on the dialog to set a template for either the folder or the AB. JK If it were, that would solve the whole problem! I agree. Maybe then needs a problem-report -- tracer Using The Bat! v4.2.9.1 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 with AntiSpamSniper Version Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
On 17 August 2009, 21:51, Jens Franik wrote: I wouldn't do this, check out http://www.virtualbox.org which is smaller, easier, faster and more stable (my opinion). The exported Machines can be run on other Platforms too. It's availiable for Win, Linux, Unix, Mac. ~~~ FWIW I've switched from MS Virtual Server to Sun VirtualBox. VirtualBox is simple to use and a lot more stable than the MS product. I've run it under Linux (Ubuntu 8.10 and 9.04) and Windows XP Pro and found it lets me run Windows Server 2000 continually for months without requiring reboot. However, I do have one issue with VirtualBox, which is that I have to keep the user account on the host machine logged in. There are allegedly two ways around this: - Use srvany if running under Windows - Run the virtual machines in headless mode Unfortunately, I've not got either method to work for me. -- Geoff Lane Cornwall, UK -- Using The Bat! v1.62r on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing
On Tuesday, August 18, 2009, at 3:07:30 AM, Geoff Lane wrote: However, I do have one issue with VirtualBox, which is that I have to keep the user account on the host machine logged in. I've not had that problem with VMWare Server at either version 1.5 or 2; it runs round the clock here with no users logged into the host system. My two VirtualBox installations run only on a test basis, so have not seen this situation but it would be a killer for me. Both VMWare and Sun's Virtualbox are free downloads with no major use restrictions so the choice should be made on the basis of features and performance. The open source version of Virtualbox does have one serious limitation: it doesn't support USB peripherals. However Sun's non-open version does, and that's the one I've installed here. With all these programs it's necessary to install their accessory packages into the VM itself in order to get full functionality. -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Guten Tag Jim Kyle, am Dienstag, 18. August 2009 um 16:14 schrieben Sie: I've not had that problem with VMWare Server at either version 1.5 or 2; it runs round the clock here with no users logged into the host system. And with which System do you access to the Virtual Machine? There is no Operating System running and no User logged in? The Difference between an Server and an Workstation Solution is, that on a Server the Daemon runs and a workstation accesses the VM. With the Workstation solution, both runs on the Workstation. In any Case you need a System running with a User logged in to display the Virtual Machine's Screen to work with. Regardless where you need that. -- Mit freundlichen Grüßen Jens Franik mailto:je...@gmx.de The Bat! 4.2.10.1 + AntiSpamSniper 3.2.1.1 + Gaijin XMP Makro Plugin 1.2 Language-File-Checksum: F49817DD Windows XP 5.1 build 2600 Service Pack 2 AMD Athlon Dual Core 4850e 2,50 GHz, 4 GB RAM Debian Lenny + Windows XP @VirtualBox 3.0.4 r50677 non-OSE 8 POP3 Accounts - 1 IMAP - 170 (Common) Folders - about 10 Messages Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing
On Tuesday, August 18, 2009, at 9:27:15 AM, Jens Franik wrote: And with which System do you access to the Virtual Machine? There is no Operating System running and no User logged in? The host system is running with no users logged in; it's sitting at the login screen. The VM, of course, is running with my single user logged in, and TB! running as is normal. So there are two operating systems running: the host is sitting at its login screen but VMWare Server is running as a daemon in background, while the VM is running XP with my user logged in. The difference you cite between server and workstation implementation may explain why I have no problem with VMWare Server; I've not attempted to use VMWare's Workstation package. Virtualbox may well be simply a workstation implementation. That difference is good to have pointed out! -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Guten Tag Jim Kyle, am Dienstag, 18. August 2009 um 16:37 schrieben Sie: The host system is running with no users logged in; it's sitting at the login screen. The VM, of course, is running with my single user logged in, and TB! running as is normal. And who gives the Virtual Machine access to the Graphic Card and Screen? If there is an X System running, this needs to be started with an Account - even if it is unprivileged. The difference you cite between server and workstation implementation may explain why I have no problem with VMWare Server; I've not attempted to use VMWare's Workstation package. VM Workstation - as far as i know - takes a lot of resources of the System to run the VM on the same System - true. Virtualbox may well be simply a workstation implementation. That difference is good to have pointed out! To use a System for Multiuser and Server i would probably take the VM or Citrix Solution too... But not only for to run The Bat! :-) So, i am glad that we figured out and i learned a lot, i will have a look at the VMserver too - maybe i will report what experience i made with it. -- Mit freundlichen Grüßen Jens Franik mailto:je...@gmx.de The Bat! 4.2.10.1 + AntiSpamSniper 3.2.1.1 + Gaijin XMP Makro Plugin 1.2 Language-File-Checksum: F49817DD Windows XP 5.1 build 2600 Service Pack 2 AMD Athlon Dual Core 4850e 2,50 GHz, 4 GB RAM Debian Lenny + Windows XP @VirtualBox 3.0.4 r50677 non-OSE 8 POP3 Accounts - 1 IMAP - 170 (Common) Folders - about 10 Messages Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
On 18 August 2009, 15:37, Jim Kyle wrote: The difference you cite between server and workstation implementation may explain why I have no problem with VMWare Server; I've not attempted to use VMWare's Workstation package. Virtualbox may well be simply a workstation implementation. That difference is good to have pointed out! VirtualBox is used extensively by hosting companies to provide virtual servers. They're usually run under Linux in headless mode - that is with no primary console - and can be accessed via RDP (remote desktop protocol). However, the two virtual machines I have constantly up are running under Windows XP Pro - and I've never got headless mode working on an XP host. All other virtualized machines I have are demo and/or development servers that I only run when I need to use their consoles. So it wouldn't make sense to run those in headless mode even if I could. Hopefully, this explains things a little better. -- Geoff Lane Cornwall, UK -- Using The Bat! v1.62r on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing
On Tuesday, August 18, 2009, at 10:01:10 AM, Jens Franik wrote: And who gives the Virtual Machine access to the Graphic Card and Screen? If there is an X System running, this needs to be started with an Account - even if it is unprivileged. I didn't mention that the host system uses GDM, the Gnome Display Manager, to log into the gui automagically. I think it runs as root, as the final stage of the init process. VMWare Server includes its own VNC server, not well documented at all, but that makes it possible for me to access the VM from any other machine on my LAN just as if I were at the host itself, even with nobody logged into the host. That's a definite plus, to me. Right now I'm at the host, but earlier in the thread I was accessing from another box entirely... -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hi On Tuesday 18 August 2009 at 4:11:06 PM, in mid:309835686.20090818101...@jimkyle.com, Jim Kyle wrote: Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing You could avoid those untidy little numbers in your subject lines by including in your reply template for TBUDL the following line:- %SingleRe%- -- Best regards, MFPA Confusion is always the most honest response Using The Bat! v4.0.38 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hallo MFPA, On Tue, 18 Aug 2009 17:34:42 +0100GMT (18-8-2009, 18:34 +0200, where I live), you wrote: M You could avoid those untidy little numbers in your subject lines by M including in your reply template for TBUDL the following line:- M %SingleRe%- Or by unchecking the matching option below the reply template at the account properties. -- Groetjes, Roelof Taglines: bumper stickers for computer nerds. http://www.voormijalleen.nl/ The Bat! 4.2.10.1 Windows Vista 6.0 Build 6001 Service Pack 1 6 pop3 accounts, 1 imap account OTFE enabled Quad Core 2.4GHz 4 GB RAM pgpNbEgWSUJw5.pgp Description: PGP signature Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, at 11:34:42 AM, MFPA wrote: You could avoid those untidy little numbers in your subject lines by including in your reply template for TBUDL the following line:- Thanks for reminding me! I keep the numbers in most of my messages, because so many of my correspondents use Outlook and other programs that do not provide proper threading data and the numbers help me manually restore threading in my archives... This reply uses the new template but probably still has the old number from my previous one. -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hi On Tuesday 18 August 2009 at 6:33:11 PM, in mid:638133103.20090818123...@jimkyle.com, Jim Kyle wrote: I keep the numbers in most of my messages, because so many of my correspondents use Outlook and other programs that do not provide proper threading data and the numbers help me manually restore threading in my archives... How difficult can it be for an email client to send the message-id of the email it replies to in a follow-up header? And does that mean you get messages with subjects starting, Re: Re[2]: (-; This reply uses the new template but probably still has the old number from my previous one. Not sure I understand how a reply created with a new template has something from the previous template. -- Best regards, MFPA When you're through changing, you're through Using The Bat! v4.0.38 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, at 1:05:18 PM, MFPA wrote: How difficult can it be for an email client to send the message-id of the email it replies to in a follow-up header? And does that mean you get messages with subjects starting, Re: Re[2]: (-; Not difficult at all, but it's all up to the folk who write the program and my experience is that most Microsoft mail programs omit this vital threading data. Yes, I do get such messages, and drag them to the proper spot for re-threading in the message list. As for what is happening with the header in this message, my best guess is that the whole subject line of your message is being copied, including the [2]. If the old template were still being used, the number would have incremented to 4 on my previous reply, and thence to 6 for this one. The absence of any increment tells me that the new template is working as expected; the unexpected part is that the old [2] addition didn't get erased from the previous reply! -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hi On Tuesday 18 August 2009 at 7:50:10 PM, in mid:1112923263.20090818135...@jimkyle.com, Jim Kyle wrote: Yes, I do get such messages, and drag them to the proper spot for re-threading in the message list. I get a few, too. (-; As for what is happening with the header in this message, my best guess is that the whole subject line of your message is being copied, including the [2]. If the old template were still being used, the number would have incremented to 4 on my previous reply, and thence to 6 for this one. The absence of any increment tells me that the new template is working as expected; the unexpected part is that the old [2] addition didn't get erased from the previous reply! I suggest re-evaluating whether your new template is working as expected; my messages do not contain the [2] in their subject line. -- Best regards, MFPA We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars Using The Bat! v4.0.38 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, at 4:18:42 PM, MFPA wrote: I suggest re-evaluating whether your new template is working as expected; my messages do not contain the [2] in their subject line. Here's the template, just copied (of course the signature break is part of the template). Still the numbers are getting added, even though I shut down TB! and restarted it just in case the template was being held in RAM rather than read from disk anew for each message. Perchance a bug? %ACCOUNT=web%- %SingleRe%- On %ODateEn, at %OTimeLongEn, %OFromName wrote: %Quotes %Cursor -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v%THEBATVERSION on %WINDOWSPLATFORMNAME %- %WINDOWSMAJORVERSION.%WINDOWSMINORVERSION Build %WINDOWSBUILDNUMBER %WINDOWSCSDVERSION on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version %ANTISPAMSNIPER_VERSION -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, at 4:18:42 PM, MFPA wrote: I suggest re-evaluating whether your new template is working as expected; my messages do not contain the [2] in their subject line. No matter what I tried (putting in an address book template for the list, setting a folder template per my previous reply, closing TB! and re-starting it after each change) nothing would remove the numbers until I cleared the checkmark for the entire account. That did work as this post shows. Apparently if I want to have the numbers on most replies, but not on replies to the list, I'll have to set up a separate account for using the list! In such a case, why do we even keep the SingleRe macro at all? -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 on VMWare Server 2 under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hello Jim, Wednesday, August 19, 2009, at 8:23:18 AM, Jim Kyle wrote: JK Tuesday, August 18, 2009, at 4:18:42 PM, MFPA wrote: I suggest re-evaluating whether your new template is working as expected; my messages do not contain the [2] in their subject line. JK No matter what I tried (putting in an address book template for the list, JK setting a folder template per my previous reply, closing TB! and JK re-starting it after each change) nothing would remove the numbers until I JK cleared the checkmark for the entire account. That did work as this post JK shows. JK Apparently if I want to have the numbers on most replies, but not on JK replies to the list, I'll have to set up a separate account for using the JK list! In such a case, why do we even keep the SingleRe macro at all? For this msg I am partly using that macro you posted. I don't see any number in the subject and also in my tail of the msg for Antispamsniper which is installed (free one) the version isn't mentioned. When you edit the templates I assume you have noticed you can if you want set a tick mark to get or not get numbers. -- tracer Using The Bat! v4.2.9.1 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 with AntiSpamSniper Version Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing
Hello Regina, Monday, August 17, 2009, 12:53:28 AM, you wrote: RK Yes, I switched over to a Mac about a month ago with VMWare Fusion. RK Everything works great with thebat! and all your other windows-based RK programs. This sounds very encouraging. There is an additional component that I neglected to write about in my first post: I use The Bat in two locally networked computers. One is a pc desktop, that has the initial installation of The Bat. The second is a laptop on which I have loaded The Bat, but when The Bat is accessed, it reads mail off of the desktop. Mail can be downloaded and sent from either machine, and viewed simultaneously; however the mail actually resides on the desktop, with the laptop's registry files merely indicating that the actual mail files are residing on the desktop. Do you know if this type of network setup will work when running XP inside of VMware's Fusion? I expect the desktop will be switched to a Mac at some point, but not right away. -- Avi Avram Sacks Using The Bat 4.0.18 on Windows XP Pro sp3 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Re[2]: The Bat and Mac computing
I think this could work--- I haven't seen any limitations yet, however you may want to post your question to the VMWare forum: http://communities.vmware.com/community/vmtn/desktop/fusion or someone else here may chime in who may have some extra input as well. I hope all works out well for you. Regina (drking) On 8/17/09 1:50 AM, Achdut18 achdu...@gmail.com wrote: Hello Regina, Monday, August 17, 2009, 12:53:28 AM, you wrote: RK Yes, I switched over to a Mac about a month ago with VMWare Fusion. RK Everything works great with thebat! and all your other windows-based RK programs. This sounds very encouraging. There is an additional component that I neglected to write about in my first post: I use The Bat in two locally networked computers. One is a pc desktop, that has the initial installation of The Bat. The second is a laptop on which I have loaded The Bat, but when The Bat is accessed, it reads mail off of the desktop. Mail can be downloaded and sent from either machine, and viewed simultaneously; however the mail actually resides on the desktop, with the laptop's registry files merely indicating that the actual mail files are residing on the desktop. Do you know if this type of network setup will work when running XP inside of VMware's Fusion? I expect the desktop will be switched to a Mac at some point, but not right away. Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[3]: The Bat and Mac computing
On Monday, August 17, 2009, at 1:50:23 AM, Achdut18 wrote: Mail can be downloaded and sent from either machine, and viewed simultaneously; however the mail actually resides on the desktop, with the laptop's registry files merely indicating that the actual mail files are residing on the desktop. Do you know if this type of network setup will work when running XP inside of VMware's Fusion? While I'm not using a Mac, I do run TB! in an XP virtual machine under VMWare Server version 2 on a Linux system, and have no problem accessing the message files from other machines on my LAN. I've set up the VM to use bridged networking rather than NAT, so that it has its own address on the LAN (separate from that of the host system). I would expect Fusion to have this capability also since it's a standard VMWare feature. -- Jim Kyle Using The Bat! v4.0.34 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 running in a VMWare virtual machine under Xubuntu 8.04.3 with AntiSpamSniper Version 3.0.1.2 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Guten Tag Achdut18, am Montag, 17. August 2009 um 07:34 schrieben Sie: so I would get something like VMware's Fusion that would allow me to do this. I wouldn't do this, check out http://www.virtualbox.org which is smaller, easier, faster and more stable (my opinion). The exported Machines can be run on other Platforms too. It's availiable for Win, Linux, Unix, Mac. -- Mit freundlichen Grüßen Jens Franik mailto:je...@gmx.de The Bat and Mac computingThe Bat! 4.2.9.7 + AntiSpamSniper 3.2.1.1 + Gaijin XMP Makro Plugin 1.2 Language-File-Checksum: F49817DD Windows XP 5.1 build 2600 Service Pack 2 AMD Athlon Dual Core 4850e 2,50 GHz, 4 GB RAM Debian Lenny + Windows XP @VirtualBox 3.0.4 r50677 non-OSE 8 POP3 Accounts - 1 IMAP - 170 (Common) Folders - about 10 Messages Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Hi Jens Franik, Monday, August 17, 2009 you let us know -possibly edited- : so I would get something like VMware's Fusion that would allow me to do this. I am quite happy with parallels desktop. The only reason to install Windows as a virtual machine is the bat! I still feel at home there and do not want so switch to apple mail (yet). Some stores offer parallels as a giveaway when you buy a Mac, some like Gravis store have a reduced price for it. The best way to run Windows -it's true- is on a Mac. Never had a bluescreen or was affected by the regular problems, btw. -- kind regards Charlene Ferrara mailto:charlene.ferr...@gmx.de Using The Bat! v4.2.10.1 on a virtualized Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: The Bat and Mac computing
Jens Franik Sent on Monday, August 17, 2009 3:52 PM so I would get something like VMware's Fusion that would allow me to do this. I wouldn't do this, check out http://www.virtualbox.org which is smaller, easier, faster and more stable (my opinion). Hi, Jens, Thanks. I will definitely look into this. -- Avi Avram L. Sacks Riverwoods, IL 60015 Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Guten Tag Charlene Ferrara, am Montag, 17. August 2009 um 23:02 schrieben Sie: The best way to run Windows -it's true- is on a Mac. Never had a bluescreen or was affected by the regular problems, btw. Try it with Linux Debian Lenny 5.0 :-) Since i switched from a Real Windows to a VirtualBox, i had no Problems any more. i can clone the Windows for testing and i can resize my Disk/partitions in any direction. -- Mit freundlichen Grüßen Jens Franik mailto:je...@gmx.de The Bat and Mac computingThe Bat! 4.2.10.1 + AntiSpamSniper 3.2.1.1 + Gaijin XMP Makro Plugin 1.2 Language-File-Checksum: B24464FD Windows XP 5.1 build 2600 Service Pack 2 AMD Athlon Dual Core 4850e 2,50 GHz, 4 GB RAM Debian Lenny + Windows XP @VirtualBox 3.0.4 r50677 non-OSE 8 POP3 Accounts - 1 IMAP - 170 (Common) Folders - about 10 Messages Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
The Bat and Mac computing
I am contemplating switching from a Windows machine to a Mac. However, I will need to run some windows-based software, so I would get something like VMware's Fusion that would allow me to do this. Has anyone used The Bat on a Mac, either directly, or using windows emulation software, such Fusion? If so, what has been your experience? Avi -- Avram Sacks Using The Bat! 4Ver. 4.0.18 with Windows XP Pro. Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat and Mac computing
Yes, I switched over to a Mac about a month ago with VMWare Fusion. Everything works great with thebat! and all your other windows-based programs. The only difference is that you are using Mac and Windows together, instead of only windows; to get into thebat! email, you simply click on the VMWare icon in the 'dock' which takes you directly to your windows desktop. I absolutely love it. drking On 8/17/09 12:34 AM, Achdut18 achdu...@gmail.com wrote: I am contemplating switching from a Windows machine to a Mac. However, I will need to run some windows-based software, so I would get something like VMware's Fusion that would allow me to do this. Has anyone used The Bat on a Mac, either directly, or using windows emulation software, such Fusion? If so, what has been your experience? Avi -- Regina King, RN, ND Best Health Care and Consulting, LLC www.besthealthcareconsulting.com Current version is 4.2.9.1 | 'Using TBUDL' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
