RE: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
-Original Message- From: Bastiaan Bergman it is said that the reason RM never actively pursues - or mentions the so-called deuterino (reduced orbital deuterium species) relates to potential weaponization. How can Deuterinos be weaponized? Let's be clear on this. It is most unlikely that they can be weaponized, but Mills' silence on the subject, combined with a former Military General on his Board, and funding from Pentagon contractors, makes the situation suspicious. Plus, many who are attracted to LENR either believe in, or have a tolerant attitude towards, any number of high level conspiracy theories. And why Deuterinos specifically? For that you need to understand the BEC and bosons in the context of a much denser starting molecule. Unlike the gaseous phase, any BEC can attain high density according to the theory. And that is on top of the natural density. In a BEC, immobile atoms or molecules share the same quantum state. A much denser bosonic starting molecule would likely form a Bose condensate more easily, and at higher temperature than near absolute zero, due to inherent restriction of degrees of freedom which is itself due to near-field and magnetic proximity effects. Even so, there is no experimental indication that a BEC of deuterons would fuse more easily on spherical implosion, AFAIK. Most experts assume this would be the case, but lacking proof, it is only a presumption. The liquid density of H2 is .07 gm/cc. Volume and density would have a cubic power law with radius. Based then on extending the H2 model, liquid n=1/3 hydrinos should weigh in at 1.89 gm/cc and n=1/4 would be 4.48 and n=1/7 would be over 24 gm/cc - higher than the density of any known element including osmium (the densest). Mills claimed years ago to have samples of n=1/7 but in the form of a salt (bound chemical hydride). IOW, if you believe and extend Mills CQM theory, then there is no reason that D2 at deep redundancy cannot exist as an ultra-dense liquid BEC. Note, this one important detail - that even though the density of shrunken di-deuterino molecules would be every high on paper, the same does not apply to hydrides (and to ionic bonding). This is because the shrunken variety would probably be nested (actually located most of the time *inside* the orbital cloud of the host cation or carrier), and perhaps thus could be even less dense than before. Deuterinos, like hydrinos should be found in ocean minerals, particularly the alkalis. Sodium (as the major cation in salt water) could be a deuterino carrier and it would collect those which are made in the Solar corona and arrive over the millennia in the Oceans of earth via solar wind. Once life evolved to use the anion (deuterino hydride) for energy in a deep cold lake, the carrier would shift from the salt to the lifeform. If deuterinos are used by any lifeform found in Lake Vostok, then they would eventually accumulate in proteins. So-called Zwitterions contain an anionic center and a cationic center in the same molecule, but are not considered to be salts. Examples include amino acids and proteins. The only imaginable way the I can see to weaponize whatever is found in Lake Vostok, is IF there is a species evolved to use deuterinos, and it is cloned to actually grow and be harvested in someplace like Siberia, and harvested deuterinos are thus produced in tonnage. This is extraordinarily unlikely - but cannot be overlooked as possible. And why would one who gets convinced about the existence of Hydrinos not make the step to Deuterinos? Indeed, why not - but for some nebulous risk factor related to international intrigue? Looks like you have your conspiracy theory 'credentials' in order. Proceed to checkout :) Jones
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Jones, Haven't been following long enough yet. it is said that RM never actively pursues - or mentions the so-called deuterino (reduced orbital deuterium species) relates to potential weaponization. How can Deuterino's be weaponized? And why Deuterino's specifically? And why would one who gets convinced about the existence of Hydrino's not make the step to Deuterino's? Thnx, Bastiaan. On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 10:16 AM, Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net wrote: -Original Message- From: Terry Blanton Then again, maybe the Ruskies are looking to weaponize the bugs. Funny you should mention that. But this thread might be more appropriate for the above top secret forum (if you don't mind being added to the list of those who are guaranteed a full body search on every airline flight). Anyone having followed Mills/BLP through the years- is probably aware that of one of the reasons it is said that RM never actively pursues - or mentions the so-called deuterino (reduced orbital deuterium species) relates to potential weaponization. IOW - It is rather obvious to anyone who thinks about the repercussions of having deuterinos at all, especially if they are mass-produced by a new kind of lifeform in tonnage (instead of the micrograms Mills has collected) that there is a strong military angle. Coulomb repulsion is the prime limitation on D+D fusion, and it is inverse square. Power laws are an amazing thing. A supply of deuterinos at deep redundancy - wow - that could drastically reduce the implosion energy necessary for fusion, on paper. This could push it into the level of triggering by conventional chemistry - especially if the stable hydride (extra electron) is included in a fraction of the mix, or especially if a nano-thermite is employed. Let's don't go there. In this case, the lesser of two evils for Lake Vostok is likely to be The Stuff ... :) mummm ... pass the Vanilla.
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Reading Larsen Slides, he cite possibilities that some non hydrides environments trigger LENR. carbon cycles : polycyclic hydrocarbons, graphènes , carbons nanotubes, footbalène... carbon cycles on hydrides, or on other metal... also maybe collective electrons in beam (citing old 192x experiments with Xray generator in H atmosphere) for biology, hydride capable metals particles, and carbon cycles are credible environments. enzymes can also inject protons, photons, prepare carbon cycle (like catalyst metal can), helping protons and electrons collectivization, and electrons energizing but from possible to real, there is a step. now that we know LENR work, we should redo all strange experiments of the past to check is LENR can explain now. 2012/2/8 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com Rossi's results and the other Ni-H results make me think cold fusion must be possible with many metals, but that does not mean it is necessarily possible in biology, or that it can happen spontaneously in nature as in the Oklo fission reactor. There are many phenomena that cannot occur in biology. There are biological batteries in electric eels, and light receivers such as the eye, but I doubt there are any biological radio detectors, or radars. ...
RE: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
From: Alain Sepeda some non hydrides environments trigger LENR. carbon cycles : polycyclic hydrocarbons, graphènes , carbons nanotubes, footbalène... This field of polycyclic catalysts is based primarily on the important Mizuno experiments with phenanthrene, which is an extract of coal. This is must read in importance to LENR also the work of Les Case and others with various forms of charcoal. Anomalous Heat Generation during Hydrogenation of Carbon ... www.lenr-canr.org/acrobat/ http://www.lenr-canr.org/acrobat/MizunoTanomaloushb.pdf MizunoTanomaloushb.pdf If the earth under Lake Vostok is typical of sedimentary deposits over much of the rest of the world, there will be coal or other forms of cyclic carbon which will be available as a catalyst. D2O may not be needed for this process. No carbon source would be of use to evolving lifeforms, without an energy source under 2 miles of ice either heat or light. Light doesnt get there and the heat is too minimal to split water. But it could have been barely enough 20 million years ago - to give single-celled life or even non-cellular life a good start down an evolutionary pathway. Importantly, the T-effect of Mills, Thermacore, et al produces both UV light and heat with no toxic radiation. Viral self-assembly comes to mind as possibility here. This goes along with more general hypothesis that life 3 billion years ago could have started out as self-assembling organic molecules, which later became viruses, and then single cells. Viruses are less complex than cellular life and some can arguably reproduce on their own. In 2003 it was discovered that the complex Mimi-virus can make proteins. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mimivirus With no competition any such organism (minimal lifeform) which could extract the phenanthrene from coal and use it as a catalyst for a self-contained energy source, would then have a free path and millions of years to evolve in unusual ways. This could open up a certain category of risk to the rest or us, and it is doubtful that proper precautions are being taken. Russians on a tight budget is a guaranteed disaster - as we have seen recently in their space program. This risk of escaping stuff has been explored in legitimate Sci-Fi - and is not too different in concept from The Stuff of the horror film genre Maybe Daniel is correct, after all, in his observation I hope whatever comes out of the bore hole does not taste too much like Häagen-Dazs to a cadre of hungry deep drillers (Bruce Willis wannabes) or else we are in for another episode of life imitating art.
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 11:12 AM, Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net wrote: This could open up a certain category of risk to the rest or us, and it is doubtful that proper precautions are being taken. As I understand it, there was an agreed protocol for extracting samples. The idea was not to kill us or them (whatever might lurk in the depths of the deep). Then again, maybe the Ruskies are looking to weaponize the bugs. T
RE: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
-Original Message- From: Terry Blanton Then again, maybe the Ruskies are looking to weaponize the bugs. Funny you should mention that. But this thread might be more appropriate for the above top secret forum (if you don't mind being added to the list of those who are guaranteed a full body search on every airline flight). Anyone having followed Mills/BLP through the years- is probably aware that of one of the reasons it is said that RM never actively pursues - or mentions the so-called deuterino (reduced orbital deuterium species) relates to potential weaponization. IOW - It is rather obvious to anyone who thinks about the repercussions of having deuterinos at all, especially if they are mass-produced by a new kind of lifeform in tonnage (instead of the micrograms Mills has collected) that there is a strong military angle. Coulomb repulsion is the prime limitation on D+D fusion, and it is inverse square. Power laws are an amazing thing. A supply of deuterinos at deep redundancy - wow - that could drastically reduce the implosion energy necessary for fusion, on paper. This could push it into the level of triggering by conventional chemistry - especially if the stable hydride (extra electron) is included in a fraction of the mix, or especially if a nano-thermite is employed. Let's don't go there. In this case, the lesser of two evils for Lake Vostok is likely to be The Stuff ... :) mummm ... pass the Vanilla.
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Von: Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net An: vortex-l@eskimo.com Gesendet: 19:16 Mittwoch, 8.Februar 2012 Betreff: RE: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake Jones, Anyone having followed Mills/BLP through the years- is probably aware that of one of the reasons it is said that RM never actively pursues - or mentions the so-called deuterino (reduced orbital deuterium species) relates to potential weaponization. Well, this could possibly explain a bit, but is too much of a conspiracy for my taste. The military has more control over the scientific progress than science itself, by filtering the 'pearls' out, and coopting them by boatloads of money. What's your basic take on Randall Mills? For me he is enough of a character bold enough trying to basically rewrite nuclear physics. 2000 pages, as far I remember. There is enough similarity to LENR, that I would be surprised that there is no connection. But on the other hand, there seems to be not much progress the last 2 years in BLP.
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
In reply to Jones Beene's message of Wed, 8 Feb 2012 10:16:43 -0800: Hi, [snip] Let's don't go there. ...you just did. :) Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Have you see The Stuff? 2012/2/7 Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net Antarctica's buried Lake Vostok has supposedly been breached by a Russian team, following an arduous and very expensive effort. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-205_162-57372465/russian-team-reaches-antarctica s-buried-lake-vostok-say-reports/ Hold the presses. Here is a prediction on what they will find ... and if true, this little detail may uncover why the Russians spent so many petrodollars on what appears to be science only, ostensibly with no commercial impact. Now, it is true that Russia does and has done meaningful basic scientific research over the years - defined as that which is not aimed at immediate financial success. However, it is easy to see why one would be a bit cynical of the ultimate motivations of Putin Co - in recent years. The New Russia is essentially closer to a criminal enterprise than to a democracy, No? Anyway, onto the cynical prediction. Lake Vostok, which about the size of Lake Ontario contains water that is roughly 1 to 20 million years old at a temperature that that would freeze all the way down - were it not for the high pressure and a small amount of interior heat from the core of earth - heat that is filtering up in a way that keeps the lake liquid at the bottom, even with two miles of solid ice above it. This dynamic mechanism can be described as a cold reflux conditions, and it is why I predict that they Russians will discover that the lake contains heavy water in a high percentage! There is a known method for low temperature enrichment of heavy water, that would be slow - but a million years minimum is long enough to make a this kind of thing happen. Depending on the level of enrichment, the value of the water in the lake, based on the present cost of heavy water could be over $100 trillion if the demand were there. Of course, that never happens - since supply and demand would lower the price by many orders of magnitude. However, if there were a large market for heavy water at a hundred times less per gallon, the Russian effort could still be a winner and Putin's new company will take your order now. Deuterium oxide is about 11 % denser than H2O and freezes at 3.8 °C, 277 K, 39 °F, following which it sinks. That's right - deuterium ice sinks at a rapid rate in cold water, as is often demonstrated in first year physics. The column of ice above lake Vostok is not solid and is always in a state of a slow-motion version of this dynamic effect, since the ice is under pressure. Importantly, deuterium will also gradually jump around to replace protium in adjacent water molecules to form heavy water (D2O) preferentially over DHO in a process of self-enrichment, due to QM and other factors. But the fact that D2O ice sinks preferentially, even in the mixed solid, provides a possible mechanism to enrich in a pressurized cold environment, over millions of years - where heavy ice is denser and has a bosonic nucleus. The slight affinity of bosons for absorbing IR over fermions could be the final piece of the puzzle - one that will only be apparent when we see the Russians constructing a pipeline to get the heavy water to market :-) You heard it first on Vo... Jones -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 5:14 PM, Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote: Have you see The Stuff? Did you mean The Thing ? Rob
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Not really! The stuff! Jones was talking about extracting something, lol. 2012/2/7 Robert McKay rob...@mckay.com On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 5:14 PM, Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote: Have you see The Stuff? Did you mean The Thing ? Rob -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com
RE: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Daniel, this particular stuff about D2O enrichment via a long-term density reflux mechanism is serious science. I realize that this is not always the case on vortex. No smiley this time. The Stuff . cough.cough . OTOH (as it appears on Wiki) seems to be a low budget horror flick made by the brother of that PR exec - Ronni something - who was murdered last year in Beverly Hills . or am I missing other stuff ? LOL. I did get a chuckle out of reading the plot-line, and the cast looks like a sleazy 'Law and Order' remake, but methinks your comment could be tacit payback for a certain tongue-in-cheek radiation sickness spoof of a few days ago, no? From: Daniel Rocha * Have you see The Stuff? * Antarctica's buried Lake Vostok has supposedly been breached by a Russian team, following an arduous and very expensive effort. Hold the presses. Here is a prediction on what they will find ... and if true, this little detail may uncover why the Russians spent so many petrodollars on what appears to be science only, ostensibly with no commercial impact.
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Von: Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net An: vortex-l@eskimo.com Gesendet: 17:51 Dienstag, 7.Februar 2012 Betreff: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake You heard it first on Vo... Jones --- Not to forget: The Russians are also strong in research on biological transmutations. http://www.iscmns.org/iccf16/course_on_transmutation.htm And: Those critters down there had a lot of time doing something useful. ;) Maybe the Russians just feel sympathetic for those super-Siberians.
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
I haven't thought of a payback! Just a funny thing that I thought :) But I am kind of annoyed by this cheap soap opera that never seem to end. I have hopes for DGT, but I lost on Rossi. His talk about robotic production line, his not talking anymore about wide sale 1MW units, his increasing anger, is assuring me that, FAPP, he has not one product which can be commercialized and is far from it. 2012/2/7 Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net LOL. I did get a chuckle out of reading the plot-line, and the cast looks like a sleazy ‘Law and Order’ remake, but methinks your comment could be tacit payback for a certain tongue-in-cheek “radiation sickness” spoof of a few days ago, no? ** ** ** ** *From:* Daniel Rocha ** ** **Ø **Have you see The Stuff? **Ø **Antarctica's buried Lake Vostok has supposedly been breached by a Russian team, following an arduous and very expensive effort. Hold the presses. Here is a prediction on what they will find ... and if true, this little detail may uncover why the Russians spent so many petrodollars on what appears to be science only, ostensibly with no commercial impact. -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
From what i have read so far they're not expecting much more than pure water, like really pure. They're supposed to be looking for some alien life form but seems to have found none so far. If they are really looking for heavy water, they've got quite a good cover but i don't really see how they could gain from it as Antarctica summer is really short so they only have a few months each year to work there (they've been digging for 30 years )
RE: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Yes, indeed. And this raises another issue, which may be what you are alluding to. What if the water in this lake does turn out to be heavily enriched in D2O and in addition, there is found to be an evolved lifeform which has “learned” (i.e. has evolved a biological mechanism) to metabolize the deuterium in a way that employs LENR for anomalous heat ? What a fortunate double discovery that would be. That biological mechanism, and being in sole possession of the genetic code for it - could be more valuable to Russia, in the long run, than the D2O. We have seen hints of this kind of biological LENR with Kervan, where potassium is said to be transmuted into calcium – but this new find would be for purposes of energy. Far more valuable, one would think. From: Günter Wildgruber You heard it first on Vo... --- Not to forget: The Russians are also strong in research on biological transmutations. http://www.iscmns.org/iccf16/course_on_transmutation.htm And: Those critters down there had a lot of time doing something useful. ;) Maybe the Russians just feel sympathetic for those super-Siberians. attachment: winmail.dat
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Von: Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net An: vortex-l@eskimo.com Gesendet: 19:37 Dienstag, 7.Februar 2012 Betreff: RE: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake Yes, indeed. And this raises another issue, which may be what you are alluding to. Jones, I admire your creativity. A couple of days ago I found this on a forum about Biological transmutation: A guy with nick 'JMJones0424' commented: ...I have raised chickens my entire life, excluding my time in the military, so I find any claim that chickens can somehow transform potassium into calcium as absurd. As I have stated before, I am not qualified, especially in the realm of physics, to properly debunk Kervran's claims. ... then ...Having fed various feed formulations over many years, I find it absurd that calcium deficient chickens can make their own calcium from any source. Anyone who has raised chickens will tell you the first sign a chicken is deficient in calcium is that it starts to peck its own eggs. If you are diligent, or your laying box is clever enough, you can prevent this, but the eggshells will soon be thin to transparent if the chicken's diet is not supplemented. ... Find this in http://scienceforums.com/topic/4369-biological-transmutation-is-true/ Russian science was (and still is) strange at times. See Ivanov: Stalin’s ape-man Superwarriors ...The report claimed that Stalin ordered Russia’s top animal-breeding scientist, Ilya Ivanov, to use his skills to produce a super warrior. ... http://creation.com/stalins-ape-man-superwarriors Or Lysenko ...Lysenkoism is used colloquially to describe the manipulation or distortion of the scientific process as a way to reach a predetermined conclusion as dictated by an ideological bias, often related to social or political objectives. ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysenkoism Russian science still is not completely cured from that. It is a bit similar with Indian or Chinese science. Eg: ... EVIDENCE THAT ATOMS BEHAVE DIFFERENTLY IN BIOLOGICAL SYSTEMS THAN OUTSIDE OF THEM Madhavendra Puri The Bhaktivedanta Institute ... Indian This may not be a totally bad thing (not Stalin’s influence, of course. Stalin sent the nonperformers into the Gulag, also a sort of -ahem- 'evolution'), but being aware of these differences between cultures' take on the scientific method, is definitely a good thing. Sorry. Long post.
RE: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
What a surprise. I was not aware that so many people were following this... most of whom, shall we say - already have a conspiracy theory slant. I waded through 20 pages of good and awful postings - without seeing any reference to heavy water, or to life evolved to use it. Have you seen this mentioned specifically? Many of the posters mention Smilla's Sense of Snow fabulous novel but weak movie. It is certainly possible that there is a meme out there (speaking of Rupert) and it would relate to the Lake, to special properties - and would be broader than merely D2O or a mysterious lifeform. Jones From: Joe Hughes Been following this for quite a few days over on this forum here - some really fascinating info and discussions. Initial thread and info: http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread804606/pg1 Latest thread started after reaching it: http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread806014/pg1 attachment: winmail.dat
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Yeah - some of those folks definitely go to sleep wearing their tin foil hats. ;) I was posting those links not directly in relation to the heavy water theory but in response to zer tte's: From what i have read so far they're not expecting much more than pure water, like really pure. They're supposed to be looking for some alien life form but seems to have found none so far. If they are really looking for heavy water, they've got quite a good cover but i don't really see how they could gain from it as Antarctica summer is really short so they only have a few months each year to work there (they've been digging for 30 years ) A post over their regarding the heavy water theory would probably yield some very interesting replies. On 02/07/2012 02:32 PM, Jones Beene wrote: What a surprise. I was not aware that so many people were following this... most of whom, shall we say - already have a conspiracy theory slant. I waded through 20 pages of good and awful postings - without seeing any reference to heavy water, or to life evolved to use it. Have you seen this mentioned specifically? Many of the posters mention Smilla's Sense of Snow fabulous novel but weak movie. It is certainly possible that there is a meme out there (speaking of Rupert) and it would relate to the Lake, to special properties - and would be broader than merely D2O or a mysterious lifeform. Jones From: Joe Hughes Been following this for quite a few days over on this forum here - some really fascinating info and discussions. Initial thread and info: http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread804606/pg1 Latest thread started after reaching it: http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread806014/pg1
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
1. Ice-nine. 2. A sleeping Kraken
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Von: Joe Hughes jhughe...@comcast.net An: vortex-l@eskimo.com Gesendet: 20:55 Dienstag, 7.Februar 2012 Betreff: Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake Yeah - some of those folks definitely go to sleep wearing their tin foil hats. ;) No tinfoil hats here. Here is the standard -take: http://www.spiegel.de/wissenschaft/natur/0,1518,813862,00.html (google etc translate) I stick to my take on that. This whole thing has a specific Russian bend. Russian Billionaires, including Putin, and the Poststalinists are not the brightest bulbs on the planet. This I am quite sure. Same with the american variant. Smelling money, fitting their belief, not the 'truth'. Oil and minerals are what they smell in the first place, then they get esoteric on short notice. Please calm down on this one.
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Von: Alan J Fletcher a...@well.com An: vortex-l@eskimo.com Gesendet: 21:10 Dienstag, 7.Februar 2012 Betreff: Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake 1. Ice-nine. 2. A sleeping Kraken - Ah, had Vonnegut a scientific bend? Did not know that. ...Langmuir is said to have come up with an idea about a form of solid water that was stable at room temperature in the hopes that Wells might be inspired to write a story about it. Apparently, Wells was not inspired and neither he nor Langmuir ever published anything about it. After Langmuir and Wells had died, Vonnegut decided to use the idea in his book Cat's Cradle. ... Haha.
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Celani et al. already found species adapted to heavy water: Ralstonia detusculanense. http://www.uniprot.org/taxonomy/148618 And one other. See the papers at LENR-CANR.org. This stuff in the heavy water from Ontario Hydro (which I think has a new name). It adapted sometime in the last 50 years. Evolution works faster than you might think. - Jed
RE: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Good point. But this was 50 years to adapt chemically - in order to merely survive. It would surely take much longer to adapt in such a way as to actually derive excess energy from D2O, and almost all experts in biology would say it is impossible. Kervan is controversial and there is evidence both ways. He has been replicated by several, and vociferously belittled by others, but his results cannot be written off automatically. Surely, if biology can adapt to transmute one atom into another, then deriving energy from deuterium would be equally feasible . actually easier, given the ease with which the Oppenheimer-Philips reaction (neutron stripping) happens. I wonder if the Russians will share their findings . From: Jed Rothwell Celani et al. already found species adapted to heavy water: Ralstonia detusculanense. http://www.uniprot.org/taxonomy/148618 And one other. See the papers at LENR-CANR.org. This stuff in the heavy water from Ontario Hydro (which I think has a new name). It adapted sometime in the last 50 years. Evolution works faster than you might think. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 3:10 PM, Alan J Fletcher a...@well.com wrote: 1. Ice-nine. 2. A sleeping Kraken 3, Nazi's http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1034314/ T
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Von: Terry Blanton hohlr...@gmail.com An: vortex-l@eskimo.com Gesendet: 0:20 Mittwoch, 8.Februar 2012 Betreff: Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake -- 3, Nazi's http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1034314/ -- As a Nazi descendant I feel truly challenged. My priors were truly Geniuses! Now we are building BMWs and such crap. :)
Re: [Vo]:Prediction on Antarctica's buried Lake
Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net wrote: Good point. But this was 50 years to adapt chemically - in order to merely survive. ** ** It would surely take much longer to adapt in such a way as to actually derive excess energy from D2O. . . Sure. Millions of years, I suppose, assuming it can be done at all. Rossi's results and the other Ni-H results make me think cold fusion must be possible with many metals, but that does not mean it is necessarily possible in biology, or that it can happen spontaneously in nature as in the Oklo fission reactor. There are many phenomena that cannot occur in biology. There are biological batteries in electric eels, and light receivers such as the eye, but I doubt there are any biological radio detectors, or radars. But who knows? Biology is capable of amazing things that are still beyond our understanding. For example, coral reefs across the Pacific manage to coordinate the release of eggs and sperm to a single night. Mushrooms detect gravity. I have some edible mushrooms growing out of the side of a box that I got for Christmas. You have spray them every day. They grow out the side and then up. If you turn the box upside-down, they reverse direction, and grow up again. Even if our species lasts for millions of years into the future, I doubt that we will ever fully understand the workings of any species, even E. coli. - Jed
