This is similar to the thread I was workign on recently about Goals that
didnt get quite as far as I would have liked either.
1. For use as testing metrics or for our personal goals of What an AGI should
achieve, or what is important these goals or classes of problems should be
defined as
2. More specific for your AGI,
What do you see the virtual pets doing? Specifically as end user
functions for the consumer, the selling points you would give them, and how
the AGI would help these functions.
Is it going to be a rich enough situation in general to display more
than just a
Ben Goertzel writes:
Well, it's a commercial project so I can't really talk about what the
capabilities of the version 1.0 virtual pets will be.
I did spend a few evenings looking around Second Life. From
that experience, I think that virtual protitutes would be
a more profitable product :)
Second Life also has a teen grid, by the way, which is not very
active right now, but which virtual pets could enhance significantly.
Virtual prostitutes are not in the plans anytime soon ;-)
On 5/4/07, Derek Zahn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Ben Goertzel writes:
Well, it's a commercial project
Is there any already existing competition in this area - virtual adaptive pets
- that we can look at?
- Original Message -
From: Benjamin Goertzel
To: agi@v2.listbox.com
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 4:46 PM
Subject: Re: [agi] The role of incertainty
2. More specific
On a less joking note, I think your ideas about applying your
cognitive engine to NPCs in RPG type games (online or otherwise)
could work out really well. The AI behind the game entities
that are supposedly people is depressingly stupid, and games
are a bazillion-dollar business.
I hope your
.listbox.com
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 11:46 AM
Subject: Re: [agi] The role of incertainty
2. More specific for your AGI,
What do you see the virtual pets doing? Specifically as end user
functions for the consumer, the selling points you would give them, and how the
AGI would
. re AI./AGI - this is well worth pursuing
and elaborating.
- Original Message -
From: Richard Loosemore [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: agi@v2.listbox.com
Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 3:31 PM
Subject: [agi] The role of incertainty
The discussion of uncertainty reminds me of a story about
: Pei Wang [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: agi@v2.listbox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 12:50 PM
Subject: Re: [agi] The role of incertainty
You can take NARS (http://nars.wang.googlepages.com/) as an example,
starting at http://nars.wang.googlepages.com/wang.logic_intelligence.pdf
Pei
On 5/1/07
it is not an expert system. Can you be more specific?
Pei
P.S. Minsky is much the same.
- Original Message -
From: Pei Wang [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: agi@v2.listbox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 12:50 PM
Subject: Re: [agi] The role of incertainty
You can take NARS (http
However, reading your papers Ben's, it's becoming clear that there may
well be an industry-wide bad practice going on here. You guys all focus on
how your systems WORK... The first thing anyone trying to understand
your
or any other system must know is what does it DO? What are the problems
: [agi] The role of incertainty
On 5/1/07, Mike Tintner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Pei,
Glad to see your input. I noticed NARS quite by accident many years ago
remembered it as pos. v. important.
You certainly are implementing the principles we have just been
discussing -
which is exciting
On 5/1/07, Mike Tintner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Well, that really frustrates me. You just can't produce a machine that's
going to work, unless you start with its goal/function.
I think you are making an error of projecting the methodologies that are
appropriate for narrow-purpose-specific
they
should. Life's short.
- Original Message -
From: Benjamin Goertzel
To: agi@v2.listbox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 2:39 PM
Subject: Re: [agi] The role of incertainty
However, reading your papers Ben's, it's becoming clear that there may
well be an industry
P.S. This is a truly weird conversation. It's like you're saying..Hell
it's a box, why should I have to tell you what my box does? Only insiders
care what's inside the box. The rest of the world wants to know what it does
- and that's the only way they'll buy it and pay attention to it - and
: Benjamin Goertzel
To: agi@v2.listbox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 5:57 PM
Subject: Re: [agi] The role of incertainty
P.S. This is a truly weird conversation. It's like you're saying..Hell
it's a box, why should I have to tell you what my box does? Only insiders care
what's inside
Not much point in arguing further here - all I can say now is TRY it - try
focussing your work the other way round - I'm confident you'll find it makes
life vastly easier and more productive. Defining what it does is just as
essential for the designer as for the consumer.
Focusing on
it does is just as
essential for the designer as for the consumer.
- Original Message -
From: Benjamin Goertzel
To: agi@v2.listbox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 5:57 PM
Subject: Re: [agi] The role of incertainty
P.S. This is a truly weird conversation. It's like you're saying
distinct kinds.
It's interesting - I'm not being in any way critical - that this isn't
getting through.
- Original Message -
From: Benjamin Goertzel
To: agi@v2.listbox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 7:04 PM
Subject: Re: [agi] The role of incertainty
Not much point
On 5/1/07, Mike Tintner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
No, I keep saying - I'm not asking for the odd narrowly-defined task -
but rather defining CLASSES of specific problems that your/an AGI will be
able to tackle.
Well, we have thought a lot about
-- virtual agent control in simulation worlds
On 5/1/07, Benjamin Goertzel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On 5/1/07, Mike Tintner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
No, I keep saying - I'm not asking for the odd narrowly-defined task -
but rather defining CLASSES of specific problems that your/an AGI will be
able to tackle.
Well, we have thought
Wang [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: agi@v2.listbox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 7:08 PM
Subject: Re: [agi] The role of incertainty
On 5/1/07, Mike Tintner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The difficulty here is that the problems to be solved by an AI or AGI
machine are NOT accepted, well-defined. We cannot
On 5/1/07, Mike Tintner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
No, I keep saying - I'm not asking for the odd narrowly-defined task -
but rather defining CLASSES of specific problems that your/an AGI will be
able to tackle. Part of the definition task should be to explain how if you
can solve one kind of
should try to see why I take
this position before claiming it to be wrong for obvious reasons.
Pei
- Original Message -
From: Pei Wang [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: agi@v2.listbox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 7:08 PM
Subject: Re: [agi] The role of incertainty
On 5/1/07, Mike Tintner [EMAIL
I'm saying you do have to define what your AGI will do - but define it as
a
tree - 1) a general class of problems - supported by 2) examples of
specific types of problem within that class. I'm calling for something
different to the traditional alternatives here.
I doubt that anyone is doing
this further - although if you do want to explore actual
classes of problems further as such, I'm still open to that.
Been good talking to you.
- Original Message -
From: Benjamin Goertzel
To: agi@v2.listbox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 7:32 PM
Subject: Re: [agi] The role
On 5/1/07, Mike Tintner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Well, you see I think only the virtual agent problems are truly
generalisable. The others it strikes me, haven't got a hope of producing
AGI, and are actually narrow.
I think they are all generalizable in principle, but the virtual agents
The discussion of uncertainty reminds me of a story about Piaget that
struck a chord with me.
Apparently, when Piaget was but a pup, he had the job of scoring tests
given to kids. His job was to count the correct answers, but he started
getting interested in the wrong answers. When he
, April 30, 2007 3:31 PM
Subject: [agi] The role of incertainty
The discussion of uncertainty reminds me of a story about Piaget that
struck a chord with me.
Apparently, when Piaget was but a pup, he had the job of scoring tests
given to kids. His job was to count the correct answers, but he
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