Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer creates a Big Opportunity

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

Ah, dworkinian fit

On Mon, Jul 26, 2021, 11:09 AM Aspen via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On Sun, Jul 25, 2021 at 6:06 AM Cuddle Beam via agora-business
>  wrote:
> >
> > I CFJ the following:
> >
> > "Be X the first Judge assigned to this CFJ, the entirety of the Ruleset
> > means the following:
> >
> > This is the Ruleset for the game of Agora nomic, and X is the sole player
> > of this game. X can change the Ruleset in any manner they desire by
> > publishing a sufficiently clear message detailing such changes to an
> Agoran
> > mailing list."
>
> Someone can say that the ruleset means whatever they like. It doesn't
> magically become true, even if they're a judge. A judgement has to be
> a plausible interpretation to have any precedential value.
>
> -Aspen
>

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer creates a Big Opportunity

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

this entire game operates under basic norms that enshrine a set of
fundamental premises. even i\f these premises are contestable, we all agree
to uphold them for the purpose of a commonly constructed game. among those
premises is that text is almost always unambiguous and has a shared and
objective meaning and that we ought to follow the rules. of course it's
possible to make good arguments about the nature of ambiguity, or good
arguments that we ought not to follow the rules. but making those arguments
isn't fun and it isn't useful - just like asking why monopoly shouldn't be
played under chess rules in the middle of a game of monopoly
On Sun, Jul 25, 2021 at 11:57 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> Is that your *interpretation* of it?
>
> On Sun, Jul 25, 2021 at 3:37 PM Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion <
> agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
> > On Sun, Jul 25, 2021 at 11:06 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-business <
> > agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> > > I CFJ the following:
> > >
> > > "Be X the first Judge assigned to this CFJ, the entirety of the Ruleset
> > > means the following:
> > >
> > > This is the Ruleset for the game of Agora nomic, and X is the sole
> player
> > > of this game. X can change the Ruleset in any manner they desire by
> > > publishing a sufficiently clear message detailing such changes to an
> > Agoran
> > > mailing list."
> > >
> >
> > The reason this doesn't work is because CFJs have no legal force
> whatsoever
> > under the ruleset - CFJs are just persuasive interpretations that are de
> > facto but not de jure binding.
> > --
> > From R. Lee
> >
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer creates a Big Opportunity

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Sun, Jul 25, 2021 at 11:06 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I CFJ the following:
>
> "Be X the first Judge assigned to this CFJ, the entirety of the Ruleset
> means the following:
>
> This is the Ruleset for the game of Agora nomic, and X is the sole player
> of this game. X can change the Ruleset in any manner they desire by
> publishing a sufficiently clear message detailing such changes to an Agoran
> mailing list."
>

The reason this doesn't work is because CFJs have no legal force whatsoever
under the ruleset - CFJs are just persuasive interpretations that are de
facto but not de jure binding.
-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: @Tailor: Ribbons and Glitter

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Sat, Jul 17, 2021 at 1:14 PM Rebecca Lee via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I have held the office of Referee for 1 month (since 17 June) without
> violating a time limit. I award myself a Green Ribbon.
> I have deputised for Registrar today (17 July). I award myself Cyan Glitter
> I have won an election for ADoP (on the 12th) and awarded myself Emerald
> Glitter on that date.
> I have passed a unanimous proposal amending a power 3 rule on July 15th and
> awarded myself a red ribbon and orange glitter on that date.
>
> I am therefore eligible for a Transparent ribbon. I award myself a
> Transparent Ribbon.
>
> --
> From R. Lee
>
My Emerald Glitter was awarded on the 11th UTC. This does not affect my
eligibility for a Transparent.

-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: Happy Tuesday!

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Mon, Jul 12, 2021 at 3:31 PM Trigon via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I call the following CFJ: This CFJ was called on 13 Jul 2021.
>
> Caller's Evidence: This message sure seems to think so.
>
> So as not to be dinged for No Faking, it is completely possible that
> nothing here worked.
>

My clear information that it is the 12th in all areas of the world (based
on multiple online clocks) means that, whatever the email header, this is
factually false.
-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [ADoP] Election updates

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

Registrar

On Mon, Jul 12, 2021, 7:06 AM Trigon via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 11/07/2021 20:40, Edward Murphy via agora-official wrote:
> > I initiate an Agoran decision to select the winner of the election for
> > Registrar.
> >
> >* The Vote Collector is the ADoP (me).
> >
> >* The valid options are ATMunn, Gaelan, and anyone else who becomes a
> >  candidate before voting ends.
> >
> >* The voting method is instant runoff.
>
> I believe Aspen already started an election for Referee, right before
> resigning. E did so in this message:
>
>
> https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2021-July/046948.html
>
> --
> Trigon
>
>   ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST
>
> I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
> I LOVE SPAGHETTI
> transfer Jason one coin
> nch was here
> I hereby
> don't... trust... the dragon...
> don't... trust... the dragon...
> Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this
>

Re: BUS: Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Stonemason] July Stone Auction

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

I bid 317 on that stone

On Wed, Jul 7, 2021, 10:47 AM Jason Cobb via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 7/6/21 7:57 PM, Rebecca Lee via agora-business wrote:
> > Ttttpf
> >
> > On Wed, Jul 7, 2021, 9:56 AM Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion <
> > agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> >> I bid 300 on concentration stone
>
>
> I bid 301 coins on the Concentration Stone in the ongoing stone auction.
>
> --
> Jason Cobb
>
> Assessor, Rulekeepor, S​tonemason
>
>

DIS: Re: OFF: [Stonemason] July Stone Auction

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

I bid 300 on concentration stone

On Wed, Jul 7, 2021, 2:08 AM Jason Cobb via agora-official <
agora-offic...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> Pursuant to Rule 2642, I initiate a stone auction with the following
> lots: [Sabotage Stone], [Concentration Stone], [Protection Stone].
>
> The method to be used for this auction is a Selective-bid Auction,
> defined jointly by regulations AM0 and AM5. In case of contradiction
> between either the latest published ACORN or the platonic set of auction
> regulations and the below text, the below text shall control.
>
>
> 
> Regulation AM0/2
> Generalized Auction
>
>   Generalized auctions exist to give context to the form of other
>   types of auctions. They CANNOT be held directly. Other auction
>   methods that use this type of auction as a starting point can
>   override attributes of generalized auctions except when it is
>   explicitly stated that that attribute is not able to be
>   overridden.
>
>   INITIATION: When a person CAN begin an auction by this or any
>   derivative method, e CAN only do so by specifying the type of
>   auction method to be held, a list of lots to be auctioned off, and
>   the currency for the auction in a public message (henceforth the
>   "initiation message"). The bidding period starts at this point.
>
>   BIDDING: Players CAN place a bid on an auction in its bidding
>   period by creating a public message (henceforth a "bid message")
>   specifying a number of the auction's currency as eir bid not equal
>   to the bid of another player. Players CAN withdraw from an open
>   auction by announcement.
>
>   TERMINATION: The bidding period ends four days after the final
>   instance of any of the following events' occurance:
> * the auction begins
> * a bid is placed
> * a player withdraws from the auction
>
>   RETRIEVAL: When the bidding period ends, the retrieval period
>   begins. During the retrieval period, bidders will be allowed to
>   retrieve the assets required to pay for their bid. The retrieval
>   period lasts three days. Failing to have the requisite assets when
>   the retrieval period for an auction ends constitutes the Class 1
>   Crime of Underfundedness.
>
>   AWARDING: For each auction, there are a number of awardees equal
>   to the number of lots. The Nth lot of an auction goes to the Nth
>   awardee of that auction. If the identity of an awardee is
>   undecidable, then that lot cannot be given away. Auction methods
>   specify how awardees are picked for auctions using that method.
>
>   PAYMENT AMOUNT: The amount that an awardee in an auction is
>   required to pay for eir lot is, unless otherwise specified, the
>   amount of the auction's curency specified in eir highest bid on
>   that auction.
>
>   FUNDED PLAYERS: Derivative auction methods should ensure that only
>   players who, at the end of an auction's retrieval period, have at
>   least as much of that auction's currency as the amount that e is
>   required to pay in that auction (hereafter "funded players") can
>   be selected as awardees for auctions using that auction method.
>
>   DISTRIBUTION: The auctioneer for an auction CAN and SHALL, within
>   seven days of the ending of that auction's retrieval period,
>   create a public message (henceforth the "distribution message")
>   that contains a full history of bids on the auction and
>   withdrawals from the auction. It must also clearly indicate each
>   awardee and the lot e recieves. In this message, the auctioneer
>   CAN and SHALL destroy the amount to be paid from the inventory
>   each awardee and transfer to that player (or create in eir
>   possession if the item is new) the set of assets associated with
>   the lot e won. Failing to publish a distribution message
>   constitutes the Class 3 Crime of Auction Abandonment.
>
>   ACTIVE BIDS: The set of active bids for an auction is the set of
>   all funded, non-withdrawn players' highest bids on that auction.
>
> History:
>
> Enacted by Trigon, 08 Aug 2020
> Amended(1) by Trigon, 28 Mar 2021
> Amended(2) by Trigon, 05 May 2021
>
> Annotations:
>
> 
> Regulation AM5/1
> Selective-bid Auctions
>
>   Selective-bit auctions function like generalized auctions except:
>
>   * Bidding messages on a selective-bid auction must also specify a
> lot that is preferred.
>   * The Nth awardee of a selective-bid auction is the player who
> placed the highest active bid whose preferred bid is the Nth
> lot.
>
> History:
>
> Enacted by Trigon, 08 Aug 2020
> Amended(1) by Trigon, 05 May 2021
>
> Annotations:
>
> 

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Slightly Inefficient Blot Removal Acquisition

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Mon, Jul 5, 2021 at 1:34 PM Gaelan Steele via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

>
>
> > On Jul 4, 2021, at 8:32 PM, Telna via agora-business <
> agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> > On 2021-07-05 10:57, Gaelan Steele via agora-business wrote:
> >> I create the following promise in the Library's possession: {
> >> Cashing conditions: The bearer has transferred to Gaelan, in the same
> message, two blot-be-gones.
> >> Gaelan transfers the bearer one justice card.
> >> }
> >> Gaelan
> > I perform the following actions if and only if they all succeed:
> > {
> > I take the quoted promise from the Library.
> > I transfer two blot-be-gones to Gaelan.
> > I cash the quoted promise, causing Gaelan to transfer one justice card
> to me.
> > }
>
> If doing so would be EFFECTIVE, I pay a fee of one blot-b-gone to expunge
> one blot.
> If doing so would be EFFECTIVE, I pay a fee of one blot-b-gone to expunge
> one blot.
>
> Gaelan


not to the public forum

-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: @Treasuror focus grant

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

Here, aris

On Thu, Jul 1, 2021, 12:54 PM Rebecca Lee  wrote:

>
>
> On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 12:33 PM Rebecca Lee via agora-business <
> agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
>> It's a new month! My focus is  now legislation. I claim a legislative
>> card.
>> I pay 2 legislative cards and combine them into 4 pendants.
>>
>> --
>> From R. Lee
>>
>
> I assume that failed (you get 3 pendants, not 4, from 2 cards). I pay 2
> legislative cards to gain 3 pendants.
> --
> From R. Lee
>

DIS: Re: BUS: Proposal

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Sat, Jul 3, 2021 at 1:30 PM OatmealSurprise via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I (Mask) hereby propose the following:
> """
> Reduce, Reuse, Recycle
> On successful repeal of a rule, the player who proposed the repeal gains 2
> Pendants.
> """


 A proposal needs to specify what it's doing, like creating a new rule,
amending an existing rule etc. So this proposal should say "create a new
rule called 'Reduce Reuse Recycle' with the following text". Also, any new
rule should have a power (a number between 1 and 4 that determines whether
it overrules other rules). This rule could probably be power 1. Also,
proposals should have a title and an adoption index (they don't have to,
but all of them tend to). Adoption index is a complicated concept, but
basically it's 1 if you're doing anything at power 1, 2 if you're doing
anything at power 2, and 3 for anything at power 3. Power is that weird
number that appears in brackets after each rule's title. A rule that does
things at a higher power needs more votes.

So essentially, a properly formatted version of this proposal would look
like this

"Title: Let's Repeal Stuff (or whatever other title)
AI: 1
Text: Create a new power-1 rule called "Reduce Reuse Recycle" with the text
"On successful repeal of a rule, the player who proposed the repeal gains 2
Pendants".


Obviously you don't have to use that exact formatting, just give  that
information.

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: [Herald] Scroll Stats

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

How about stats on most wins ignoring the fact that Jason and margauex had
to be annoying and win an arbitrary number of times

On Sat, Jul 3, 2021, 6:36 AM nix via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I've been meaning to get to this, but I don't have everything set up in
> a way to do as many categories as I'd like. However, I can at least
> start doing a few categories. Here's some stats/leaderboards for the
> scroll.
>
> Most Unique Win Types
> -
> 1. ais523 (10)
> 2. Alexis (9)
> 2. G. (9)
> 2. omd (9)
> 3. Murphy (6)
>
> Most Wins
> -
> 1. Jason (1006)*
> 2. D. Margaux (504)*
> 3. ais523 (17)
>
> *Includes multiple wins at once.
>
> Please give feedback on other things you'd like to see stats on.
>
> --
> nix
> Webmastor, Ministor, Herald
>
>

DIS: Re: BUS: [DoV] Happy birthday [attn. Tailor]

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

Happy Birthday agora, and nice job jason. I award myself magenta glitter.

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Referee] @Treasuror: Courtesy Notification of Fingers & VC Claim

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Mon, Jun 28, 2021 at 11:54 AM Telna via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 2021-06-28 11:09, Rebecca Lee via agora-official wrote:
> > The person who pointed the most fingers that led to a positive resolution
> > in the most recent agoran week may claim a Justice Card under R2478.
> >
> > Only one finger had such a resolution in the previous agoran week: my
> > finger at Gaelan (resolved by Telnaior). I am therefore able to claim a
> > Justice Card.
> >
> > I claim a Justice Card.
> >
> That's not true, my Unjustified Gesticulation resolved that week as well.
>
Oh TRUE. So I don't have a justice card, I have a BBG and 2 blots. Sorry
Treasuror!

-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: OFF: [ADoP] Voting for Prime Minister

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Mon, Jun 28, 2021, 7:03 AM Edward Murphy via agora-official <
agora-offic...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I initiate an Agoran decision to eslect the winner of the election for
> Prime Minister.
>
>* The Vote Collector is the ADoP (me).
>
>* The valid options are ais523, ATMunn, G., R. Lee, and anyone else
>  who becomes a candidate before voting ends.
>
>* The voting method is instant runoff.
>

I vote 1. Myself 2. Atmunn 3. G

>

DIS: Re: BUS: [proposal] generic

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Thu, Jun 24, 2021 at 3:24 AM Kerim Aydin via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

>
> I submit the following Proposal, "a new rule", AI-1:
>
> -
>
> Enact a Rule.
>
> -
>
> [I don't see anything to require a text in R105(1), and all the other
> properties have defaults - maybe a requirement can be inferred from R2141.]
>
> I don't think there's anything preventing a textless rule, and why should
there be? The rulekeepor could list it easily enough.

-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Goldmine of old (pre-2007/8) rules

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

https://www.fysh.org/~zefram/agora/rules_text.txt

If anyone wants to go back and fish for fun stuff to reenact, thatd be
cool. Being in touch with our long history is good.

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Test

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Mon, Jun 21, 2021 at 11:44 AM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I intend, without objection, to intend, without objection, to declare
> Apathy.
>
> [G. suggested the archives went down on Discord.]
>
> --
> Jason Cobb
>
> Assessor, Rulekeepor, Stonemason
>
> i object

-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: OFF: [Registrar] Agoran Directory

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Mon, Jun 21, 2021 at 9:29 AM Aris Merchant via agora-official <
agora-offic...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On Sun, Jun 20, 2021 at 3:58 PM Aris Merchant via agora-official
>  wrote:
> >
> > 
> >  The Agoran Directory
> > 
> >
> >
> > Date of last report: 2021-06-10
> > Date of this report: 2021-06-20
> > (all times UTC)
>
> CoE: This doesn't list Telna as a player.
>
> Accepted. Revision:
>
> 
>  The Agoran Directory
> 
>
>
> Date of last report: 2021-06-10
> Date of this report: 2021-06-20
> (all times UTC)
>
> Archive of reports on the web: https://agoranomic.org/Registrar/
>
>
> Recent events
> =
>
> 16-Mar-21 23:17  cuddlybanana registers.
> 16-Mar-21 23:42  Aenet registers.
> 21-Mar-21 03:06  Jumble registers.
> (time of last report)
> 10-Apr-21 19:00  Aris deactivates lucidiot with notice.
> 10-Apr-21 19:00  Aris deactivates JTAC with notice.
> 10-Apr-21 19:00  Aris deactivates Ubercrow with notice.
> 10-Apr-21 19:00  Aris deactivates Noah with notice.
> 10-Apr-21 19:00  Aris deactivates Slam_Joe_Jr_Supreme with notice.
> 17-Apr-21 05:18  seventeenMachine registers.
> 01-May-21 07:16  Nathan activates emself.
> 01-May-21 22:43  Aris deregisters grok without 3 objections.
> 01-May-21 22:43  Aris deregisters Shy Owl without 3 objections.
> 08-Jun-21 15:45  ais523 registers.
> 08-Jun-21 07:41  Aris deactivates Aenet.
> 08-Jun-21 07:41  Aris deactivates Jumble.
> 14-Jun-21 07:09  Telna registers.
> 20-Jun-21 02:17  surprise registers.
>
>
> Players, activity, and registration dates
> =
>
> The following information from this section is self-ratifying:
> - The value of each instance of the Citizenship switch (implied by the
>   list of players).
> - The value of each instance of the Activity switch.
>
> There are 25 Players. The below is a list of all players.
>
> Player   Registered  Activity  Last Changed  Notes
> --   --      -
> omd  03 Feb 11   Active03 Feb 21
> Aris 13 Sep 16   Active03 Feb 21
> Gaelan   15 May 17   Active03 Feb 21
> G.   25 Aug 17   Active03 Feb 21
> Cuddlebeam   25 Aug 17   Active03 Feb 21
> Trigon   24 Sep 17   Active03 Feb 21
> Murphy   17 Dec 17   Active03 Feb 21
> ATMunn   11 Mar 18   Active03 Feb 21
> Falsifian13 Feb 19   Active03 Feb 21
> Jason02 Jun 19   Active03 Feb 21
> nix  18 Oct 19   Active03 Feb 21
> R. Lee   30 Jun 20   Active03 Feb 21
> Nathan   19 Aug 20   Active01 May 21
> cuddlybanana 16 Mar 21   Active16 Mar 21
> seventeenMachine 17 Apr 21   Active17 Apr 21 seventeen for
> short
> ais523   08 Jun 21   Active08 Jun 21
> Telna14 Jun 21   Active14 Jun 21
> surprise 20 Jun 21   Active20 Jun 21
> lucidiot 08 Nov 20   Inactive  10 Apr 21
> JTAC 03 Jan 21   Inactive  10 Apr 21
> Ubercrow 11 Jan 21   Inactive  10 Apr 21
> Noah 14 Jan 21   Inactive  10 Apr 21
> Slam_Joe_Jr_Supreme  19 Jan 21   Inactive  10 Apr 21 Joe for short
> Aenet16 Mar 21   Inactive  10 Jun 21
> Jumble   21 Mar 21   Inactive  10 Jun 21
>
>
> Contact information
> ===
>
> (Required by rule 2139.)
>
> Player   Contact
> --   ---
> omd  comexk at gmail.com [0]
> Aris thoughtsoflifeandlight17 at gmail.com
> Gaelan   gbs at canishe.com
> G.   kerim at uw.edu
> Cuddlebeam   cuddlebeam at gmail.com
> Trigon   reuben.staley at gmail.com
> Murphy   murphy.agora at gmail.com [1]
> ATMunn   iamingodsarmy at gmail.com
> Falsifianagora at falsifian.org
> Jasonjason.e.cobb at gmail.com
> nix  nixnull+agora at protonmail.com [2]
> R. Lee   SarahEstrange0 at gmail.com [3]
> Nathan   nathans.agora.email at gmail.com
> lucidiot lucidiot at brainshit.fr
> JTAC hmcl.supv at gmail.com
> Ubercrow unicationsmith2009 at gmail.com
> Noah blackbeangirl919 at gmail.com
> Slam_Joe_Jr_Supreme  arran.soule at gmail.com
> cuddlybanana rose.strong42 at gmail.com
> Aenetaidananthony14 at gmail.com
> Jumble   notajumbleofnumbers at gmail.com
> seventeenMachine 17sagoranomicinbox at gmail.com
> ais523  

DIS: [Referee] Courtesy Flagging @Telna

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

Telna pointed 2 fingers that resulted in the CHOJ last Agoran week (E also
pointed a single finger that resulted in a warning that was just inside
this week by UTC). ATMunn pointed one such finger, nobody else pointed any.
Telna may grant emself a Justice Card by announcement.

-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: OFF: [Assessor] Resolution(?) of Proposal 8573

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

Given G. Has pledged not to moot this, we should all act as though it
doesn't exist.
On Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 9:50 AM Jason Cobb via agora-official <
agora-offic...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I perform the following actions if the referenced referendum exists:
>
> RESOLUTION OF PROPOSALS 8573
> 
>
> IDTitle   Result
> -
> 8573  The Device  ADOPTED
>
> I hereby resolve the Agoran decisions to adopt the below proposals.
>
> The quorum for all below decisions was 3.
>
> VOTING STRENGTHS
> 
>
> Strength is 3 unless otherwise noted.
> *: player has voting strength 8
> <: player has voting strength 13
>
> PROPOSALS
> =
>
> PROPOSAL 8573 (The Device)
> AUTHOR: G.
> CLASS: ORDINARY
> FOR (5): G.*, Jason, Murphy, R. Lee, Trigon
> AGAINST (1): Falsifian
> PRESENT (0):
> BALLOTS: 6
> AI (F/A): 20/3 (AI=1)
> POPULARITY: 0.667
> OUTCOME: ADOPTED
> [
> Trigon: Endorsement of G.
> ]
>
> The full text of each ADOPTED proposal is included below:
>
> //
> ID: 8573
> Title: The Device
> Adoption index: 1
> Author: G.
> Co-authors: Murphy
>
>
> [inspired by Rules 2192-2193, "The Monster", by Murphy]
>
>
> Enact a Rule "The Device" with the following text:
>
>   When the device is on:
> * click - hummm
>
>   When the device is off:
> * whirr - THUNK
>
>
> Enact a Rule "The Mad Engineer" with the following text:
>
>   The Mad Engineer is an office; its holder is responsible for
>   building and maintaining the Device.  The device is a
>   singleton switch with values off (default) and on.  The Mad
>   Engineer CAN flip the device to either on or off with Agoran
>   Consent; any other player CAN do so with 2 Agoran Consent.
>
>   The Mad Engineer CAN act on behalf of
>   the device to take any action that the device may take, and
>   SHALL act on behalf of the device to ensure that the device
>   fulfills all of its duties.
>
>   The Mad Engineer's weekly duties include the performance of the
>   following tasks, in order:
>
>   a) Randomly select exactly one rule.  If the selected rule is
>  either this rule or the rule "The Device", then
>  007 has been spotted near the self-destruct button; skip
>  directly to proposal submission.
>
>   b) Select one or more contiguous sentences from the selected
>  rule.
>
>   c) Select exactly one noun from the selected text, and replace
>  each instance of that noun with "Device" (including
>  grammatical variations, e.g. replacing "'s" with
>  "Device's").
>
>   d) Announce intent to, with Agoran Consent, cause this rule
>  to amend the rule "The Device" by inserting the modified
>  text as the last list item in either the "device on" or
>  "device off" lists in that rule (or, if 007 has been
>  spotted, to repeal both that rule and this one).
>  This intent announcement counts as the Mad Engineers's weekly
>  report.
>
>   If the announcement of intent above is made with the procedure
>   described above, the Mad Engineer CAN, with Agoran Consent, cause
>   this rule to amend the rule "The Device" as indicated, and SHALL
>   do so if the intent receives sufficient support.
>
>
> G. becomes the holder of the office of Mad Engineer.
>
> An election for Mad Engineer is initiated.
>
> //
>
>

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] [Victory Auction] First Victory Auction of June 2021

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

I bid 661

On Fri, Jun 18, 2021, 1:41 PM Falsifian via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On Wed, Jun 16, 2021 at 11:16:14AM +1000, N. S. via agora-business wrote:
> > I bid 502 (sorry for top text)
>
> I bid 600.
>
> --
> Falsifian
>

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Promotor] Distribution of Proposals 8574-8592

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

Me too

On Fri, Jun 18, 2021, 2:22 PM ais523 via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On Fri, 2021-06-18 at 00:20 -0400, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:
> > On 6/17/21 3:38 PM, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:
> > > > 8586*   Murphy  3.0   Clarify deputisation
> > > FOR
> > >
> > I change this vote to AGAINST, per Falsifian.
>
> I also change my vote on this proposal to AGAINST.
>
> --
> ais523
>
>

DIS: Re: OFF: [Herald] The Scroll of Agora

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 4:25 PM Rebecca Lee 
wrote:

>
>
> On Wed, Jun 16, 2021 at 7:46 AM nix via agora-official <
> agora-offic...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
>> ===
>>   THE SCROLL OF AGORA
>> ===
>>
>> Herald's Monthly Report
>> June 15, 2021
>>
>>   ---
>>  NEWS
>>   ---
>>
>> Falsifian has won by collecting 5 stones and wielding the
>>   gauntlet. Recorded here as via Gauntlet.
>>
>> Falsifian has won by Economic Takeover.
>>
>>   Gaelan has won by transcending logic, recorded here
>>  as Paradox.
>>
>> Aris has won by Proposal.
>>
>> nix has been awarded a Silver Quill for the year 2020, for
>>proposal 8408 (Sets v1.4).
>>
>> Aris has been awarded a Silver Quill for the year 2020, for
>> proposal 8514 (The Buoyant Economy).
>>
>>   ---
>>   CHAMPION by
>>   ---
>>   Anarchy: Alexis
>>Apathy: ais523, Aris, babelian, Bayushi, D. Margaux,
>>Gaelan (x2), grok, Ienpw III, Murphy, nix, o,
>>omd, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus, Quazie,
>>R. Lee, Sprocklem, tmanthe2nd, twg, Veggiekeks,
>>Warrigal, 天火狐
>> Cards: G., Murphy, OscarMeyr, root, Taral
>>   Champion*(11/6): Kelly
>>Champion*(3/2): Chuck, Kelly, Steve
>>Champion*(4/3): Chuck, Kelly, KoJen, Steve,
>>Troublemaker at Large, Wes
>>Champion*(5/3): Kelly, Steve
>>Champion*(7/6): Chuck, elJefe, Kelly, KoJen, Morendil, Steve,
>>Swann, Troublemaker at Large
>> Clout: ais523, Alexis
>> Economic Takeover: Cuddlebeam, Falsifian
>>  Election: G.
>>Escape: omd
>>  Gauntlet: Falsifian
>>High Score: ais523 (x3), Alexis (x2), BobTHJ, Cuddlebeam,
>>Elysion, Falsifian, G. (x2), Jason, Levi,
>>Murphy (x3), omd (x4), Pavitra, root, Steve,
>>Tiger, Trigon, twg (x2), Walker, Wooble
>> Junta: ais523 (x2), Alexis, G., nix, omd (x2),
>>OscarMeyr, the AFO
>>Leadership: ais523
>> Lotto: Alexis, omd
>>Maniac: Craig, root
>>  Musicianship: ais523, omd, Tiger, Wooble, Zefram
>>   Paradox: ais523, Alexis, BobTHJ (x2), Bucky (x2), ehird,
>>G. (x2), Gaelan, Murphy, omd, root
>>  Politics: Aris, D. Margaux (x2)
>>  Proposal: ais523 (x4), Alexis (x3), allispaul, Andon,
>>Andre (x3), Aris, BobTHJ, Bucky, Canada,
>>Cuddlebeam, D. Margaux (x501), G. (x2),
>>Human Point Two, Morendil, Murphy, omd (x2),
>>Spitemaster, Steve (x3), Tiger, Trigon, twg,
>>woggle, Yally
>>   Renaissance: ais523, Alexis (x3), G. (x3), Jason, Murphy, twg
>>   Rulebending: G., Jason, nix
>>  Solitude: ais523 (x2), Alexis (x2), omd
>>   Spaaace: Falsifian, Jason (x1000)
>>Tournament: Aris, ATMunn, G., grok, Jason (x2), OscarMeyr,
>>Publius Scribonius Scholasticus, root, Taral,
>>Wooble
>>   Unspecified: Blob, Chuck, Dave Bowen, elJefe, favor, Garth,
>>General Chaos, Ian, Jeffrey, KoJen, Michael,
>>Ørjan, Steve, Swann, t, Timothy,
>>Troublemaker at Large, Vanyel (x2), Wes (x2)
>>  Via Ratification: The President
>>
>>
>>  
>>  ORDER OF THE HERO OF AGORA NOMIC
>>  
>>  GRAND HERO OF AGORA NOMI

Re: DIS: [Proto] Ribbons are not switches

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 3:35 PM Trigon via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 17/06/2021 05:30, Gaelan Steele via agora-discussion wrote:
> >
> >> On Jun 16, 2021, at 10:05 PM, Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion <
> agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >>
> >> Ribbons being switches is very dumb. Read this sentence and weep: "For
> each
> >> type of Ribbon,  Ribbon Ownership is a secured negative boolean
> >> person switch, tracked by the Tailor in eir monthly report.". It makes
> >> ribbons seem very complicated but actually they're really simple.
> >
> > I'd argue that ribbons are actually a lot more like switches than assets:
> > - You either have one or you don't
> > - You can't have multiple of a ribbon
> > - You can't transfer ribbons
> >
> > They're obviously not a perfect fit for either, so you have to do a bit
> > of shoehorning either way, but I think switches are a simpler mapping
> > than assets are.
> >
> > Gaelan
>
> Ribbons are currently tied to the switch system because it is seen as a
> stable way to do things. Assets have been repealed since ribbons were
> enacted but switches haven't. My personal opinion is that it isn't a
> great fit for either and would probably be more enduring as just
> property of persons, though there may be issues in making that look
> elegant.
>
> --
> Trigon
>
>   ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST
>
> I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
> I LOVE SPAGHETTI
> transfer Jason one coin
> nch was here
> I hereby
> don't... trust... the dragon...
> don't... trust... the dragon...
> Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this
>
I looked and it actually turns out I co-authored a proposal (8487) that
instituted the current wording.

Yeah, probably not going to pend this one.
-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Cleaning Up a Typo

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 3:28 PM Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 3:20 PM Telna via agora-business <
> agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
> > I intend without objection to clean Rule 2635 "Floating Rate Fleet" by
> > correcting the word "Floatation" to "Flotation".
> >
> > (Wait, does Rule 2221 "Cleanliness and Tidy Filing" even work? Rule 105
> > "Rule Changes" says that no other rule can provide a mechanism to modify
> > rules, and they're both the same power + the latter has a lower ID
> > number. I make the intent regardless, though.)
> >
>
> . First words of 105 "When the rules provide that an instrument takes
> effect, it can generally [change the rules]". Rule 2221 allows players to
> change the rules, but it does not provide that an instrument takes effect.
> Players are not instruments (an instrument is an entity with positive
> power, players do not have power)\.  As you note 105 says " This rule
> provides the only mechanism by which rules can be created, modified, or
> destroyed, or by which an entity can become a rule or cease to be a rule."
> 105 takes precedence due to its ID number.
>
> Yep, it seems very clear to me that rule 2221 does not provide a mechanism
> for changing the rules. It needs to be amended to state that it takes
> precedence.
>
> This has the following additional consequence: Any rule changes under 2221
> since the last SLR ratification must be reversed.
>
>
> --
> From R. Lee
>

Ignore this email, I was talking nonsense. Rule 2221 says that the cleaning
amends things "by this rule". Rule 2221 is an instrument so it can make
changes as long as it fits under the specifications of rule 105.

The old version of 2221 which had the player emself amend the rule was held
invalid by CFJ 2494, immediately after which the "by this rule" clause was
inserted.


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: Cleaning Up a Typo

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 3:20 PM Telna via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I intend without objection to clean Rule 2635 "Floating Rate Fleet" by
> correcting the word "Floatation" to "Flotation".
>
> (Wait, does Rule 2221 "Cleanliness and Tidy Filing" even work? Rule 105
> "Rule Changes" says that no other rule can provide a mechanism to modify
> rules, and they're both the same power + the latter has a lower ID
> number. I make the intent regardless, though.)
>

. First words of 105 "When the rules provide that an instrument takes
effect, it can generally [change the rules]". Rule 2221 allows players to
change the rules, but it does not provide that an instrument takes effect.
Players are not instruments (an instrument is an entity with positive
power, players do not have power)\.  As you note 105 says " This rule
provides the only mechanism by which rules can be created, modified, or
destroyed, or by which an entity can become a rule or cease to be a rule."
105 takes precedence due to its ID number.

Yep, it seems very clear to me that rule 2221 does not provide a mechanism
for changing the rules. It needs to be amended to state that it takes
precedence.

This has the following additional consequence: Any rule changes under 2221
since the last SLR ratification must be reversed.


--
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: [Proto] Ribbons are not switches

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 3:14 PM Telna via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 2021-06-17 15:05, Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion wrote:
> > "Each type of ribbon is an indestructible fixed asset tracked by the
> > Tailor in eir monthly report. Other rules notwithstanding, no entity
> > other than a player can ever own a ribbon. If a non-player would own a
> > ribbon, that ribbon is destroyed."
> Be careful with who is allowed to own ribbons here; this would destroy
> all your ribbons when you deregister.
>

Thanks, should be person indeed.
-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: [Proto] Ribbons are not switches

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

Ribbons being switches is very dumb. Read this sentence and weep: "For each
type of Ribbon,  Ribbon Ownership is a secured negative boolean
person switch, tracked by the Tailor in eir monthly report.". It makes
ribbons seem very complicated but actually they're really simple.

Proto:

Title: Ribbons are assets
AI: 3
Text: In rule 2438 "Ribbons", replace

"For each type of Ribbon,  Ribbon Ownership is a secured
  negative boolean person switch, tracked by the Tailor in eir
  monthly report."

with

"Each type of ribbon is an indestructible fixed asset tracked by the
Tailor in eir monthly report. Other rules notwithstanding, no entity
other than a player can ever own a ribbon. If a non-player would own a
ribbon, that ribbon is destroyed."

In the same rule, replace

"When a person wins this way, for each type of Ribbon, that person's
 Ribbon Ownership is flipped to False."

with

"When a person wins this way, each of their ribbons is destroyed."


[Note that an "indestructible asset" can still be destroyed by its
backing document, just not in any other way]

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Referee] Investigation of Trigon

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 2:46 PM Trigon via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 17/06/2021 04:41, Trigon via agora-discussion wrote:
> > On 17/06/2021 04:15, Rebecca Lee via agora-official wrote:
> >> On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 2:08 PM Telna via agora-business <
> >> agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >>> *sigh*
> >>> I Point my Finger at Trigon for not tracking the Unit of Flotation in
> >>> eir weekly report for the week beginning June 7th as directed by Rule
> >>> 2635 "Floating Rate Fleet".
> >>> I Point my Finger at Trigon for not tracking the Unit of Flotation in
> >>> eir weekly report for the week beginning May 31st as directed by Rule
> >>> 2635 "Floating Rate Fleet".
> >>>
> >>
> >> I hereby investigate both of these finger pointings.
> >>
> >> Trigon did indeed violate rule 2635 (implemented in rule 2143) by
> failing
> >> to track this information in documents that purported to be Treasuror's
> >> reports. E did so in both weeks, which are within the statute of
> >> limitations (the deadline for the week of May 31 expired 12 days ago on
> >> June 6).
> >>
> >> I impose the Cold Hand of Justice on Trigon for not tracking the Unit of
> >> Flotation for the week of May 31st. Although there's no Class of crime
> >> here
> >> I find it exceedingly similar to the Class-2 crime of Tardiness. The
> >> crime
> >> is inadvertent and appears to be a simple lack of knowledge of exactly
> >> what
> >> e had to track (Trigon has generally done a great job of officer
> accuracy
> >> and timeliness). I impose a 1 blot fine on Trigon.
> >>
> >> I impose the Cold Hand of Justice on Trigon for not tracking the Unit of
> >> Flotation for the week of June 7th. I levy a 1 blot fine on Trigon, see
> >> above.
> >>
> >
> > Actually, the Unit of Flotation is tracked in the Treasuror's weekly
> > report. Admittedly, it's not next to the Total Buoyancy, as one might
> > expect, but it is in there, in the History section, at the beginning of
> > each month:
> >
> >> *** Tue 1 June 2021 ...
> >> [00:00]   RELEVELING: TB=35779, UF=14.
> >
> > This might not be enough, however, since this is the History section's
> > header:
> >
> >> RECENT HISTORY(does not self-ratify)
> >> 
> >
> > The labels on the right side have always been intended to be
> > informational; however, I admit that it's not one hundred percent clear
> > what these do legally.
> >
> > I accept that I should put these things in a better location, and I
> > apologize for the elision of the information. I will include it in
> > future reports. In my defense, the bit requiring that I track the UF is
> > in a weird place.
> >
>
> I'm going to go ahead and CFJ this.
>
> CFJ: Trigon fulfilled eir obligation to track the Unit of Flotation for
> the weeks of 31 May and 7 Jun.
>
> Arguments: the portion of the text quoted above written by Trigon.
>
> --
> Trigon
>
>   ¸¸.•*¨*• Play AGORA QUEST
>
> I’m always happy to become a party to contracts.
> I LOVE SPAGHETTI
> transfer Jason one coin
> nch was here
> I hereby
> don't... trust... the dragon...
> don't... trust... the dragon...
> Do not Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this
>

Argument: Trigon is essentially saying "at 0:00 on this date, the UF was
set  to 14" which doesn't satisfy eir obligation to publish the current  UF
weekly (it's merely making a historical statement). Furthermore, everything
in a history section is implied to consist of historical statements, not
current tracking.
-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: OFF: [Deputy Referee] (sorry Gaelan <3) Crime Time (weekly report) [Attn. Arbitor - Pending Fingers]

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 1:07 PM Rebecca Lee via agora-official <
agora-offic...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

>
> 16/06/2021 - Telnaior points finger at twg for omitting report information
>
>
This is in a non-self-ratifying section but for clarity - Telnaior pointed
eir finger at trigon, not twg.
-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Proto: Cabals

[Rebecca Lee via agora-discussion]

On Wed, Jun 16, 2021 at 6:38 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I don't believe we have enough players to make this work.
>
> BUT! What if we made this a Tournament! Compressing participation into a
> single hyped moment should be enough to make it work.
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jun 16, 2021 at 2:36 AM nix via agora-discussion <
> agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > On 6/15/21 7:13 PM, ais523 via agora-discussion wrote:
> > > The basic idea is to add an asymmetrical/political resource
> > > distribution mechanism with lots of tension (being in a large Cabal
> > > means it gets Cards to hand out, but it'll have to try to split them
> > > more ways; and different Cabals get to try out different ways to
> > > distribute the Cards they get, competing to try to attract players).
> > >
> > > We might want to remove some resource distribution mechanisms, or
> > > increase the cost in Products of some actions, in order to balance out
> > > the increased Card supply.
> >
> > Love this proto already. Assorted thoughts:
> >
> > Agree we might have to rethink how cards are gained if we do this.
> >
> > Players not in the cabalogarchy should get compensation, such as a
> > monthly product.
> >
> > I would tie the cabal award to the month rather than 30 days. That
> > matches with some other mechanical trends we have currently.
> >
> > Not sure what, if anything, discourages two cabals from cooperating here
> > to get more cards.
> >
> > Do we have enough active players to maintain 3 cabals and make them
> > dynamic?
> >
> > --
> > nix
> > Webmastor, Ministor, Herald
> >
> >
> >
>

I wonder if we made three pre-existing teams like Red Yellow Blue and then
allowed players to choose their team would it be more easy to maintain
three teams with a small player base? Or would everyone just join the same
team.
-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: How to keep up

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

most of the messages are boring and worthless and just going through the
motions. try to ignore everything in A-D, just check important stuff on A-B
like proposals and contracts and things like that, thats where actual
gameplay happens.

Also join this discord: https://discord.gg/FwmJW8 and we will answer any
questions you may have. This discord is new and will hopefully decerase the
amount of spam.

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 1:16 PM Zyborg Mao via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I just signed up and already have 50+ messages. I'm not sure how to deal
> with this. Any hints/tips?
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: Put the discord on the agora home page

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

https://discord.gg/FwmJW8

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 1:12 PM Rebecca via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> See title
>
> Also all should join it, it has been a fun and very active atmosphere,
> although too small.
>
> --
> From R. Lee
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: TRIGON

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

call a cfj

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 12:58 PM Reuben Staley via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 2020-06-21 20:55, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:
> > Construe this message as extending Trigon's latest public message.
> >
> > I, Trigon, transfer 20 coins to Jason.
>
> I note that the Subject of this message is "BUS: TRIGON" and not "TRIGON"
>
> --
> Trigon
>
> transfer Jason one coin
> nch was here
> I hereby
> don't... trust... the dragon...
> don't... trust... the dragon...
> Construe Jason's message with subject TRIGON as extending this
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: OFF: [ADOP] Metareport Revision 1

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

The below document is my revised Metareport (ADoP weekly) valid as of 4:12
am UTC on the 21st of June 2020. The only difference is that Aris is
correctly listed as Prime Minister.

=Metareport=
>
> This is the ADoP’s weekly report
>
> Date of last report: 2020-06-13
>
> Date of this report: 2020-06-21
>
>
> MISCELLANEOUS INFO
>
> --
>
> Filled offices: 15/15 (100%, 0 interim)
>
> Total officers: 10
>
> Consolidation[1]: 1.5
>
> Late reports: 0%
>
> --
>
> [1] This is the number of filled offices divided by the number of
>
> officers. Each officer, on average, holds this many offices.
>
> OFFICES
>
> Office Holder Since Last Election
>
> --
>
> ADoP   R. Lee 2020-06-072020-06-13
>
> ArbitorG. 2019-06-112019-11-23
>
> Assessor   Jason  2019-07-092019-11-11
>
> Distributoromd2018-06-15imposed
>
> Herald PSS2020-05-032020-05-16
>
> Notary ATMunn 2020-06-152020-06-15
>
> Prime Minister Aris   2020-03-072020-03-07
>
> Promotor   Aris   2016-10-212017-09-21
>
> RefereePSS2020-03-292020-04-19
>
> Registrar  Falsifian  2019-05-042020-02-26
>
> Rulekeepor Jason  2019-12-062020-03-07
>
> SpeakerG. 2020-06-15imposed
>
> Tailor PSS2020-04-192020-04-19
>
> Treasuror  Trigon 2020-05-012020-05-01
>
> Webmastor  nch2020-06-032020-06-13
>
> --
>
> * = Interim elected office (vacant or holder not elected)
>
>
> WEEKLY REPORTS
>
> Office Report   Last Published Late[1]
>
> --
>
> ADoP   Offices  2020-06-13[2]
>
> ArbitorJudicial matters 2020-06-20
>
> Herald Matters of Honour2020-06-14
>
> Notary Contracts2020-06-15
>
> Promotor   Proposal pool2020-06-10
>
> RefereeRule violations  2020-06-14
>
> Registrar  Players, Fora2020-06-16
>
> Rulekeepor Short Logical Ruleset2020-06-18
>
> Treasuror  Coins, other currencies  2020-06-19
>


> Tailor Glitter Prices   never
>
> --
>
> [1] ! = 1 period missed, !! = 2, !!! = 3+
>
> [2] Not including this report
>
> MONTHLY REPORTS
>
> Office ReportLast Published Late
>
> --
>
> Herald Patent titles 2020-05-31
>
> Registrar  Player history2020-06-16
>
> Rulekeepor Full Logical Ruleset  2020-05-24
>
> Tailor Ribbons   2020-05-31
>
> Webmastor  Web resources 2020-06-03
>
> --
>
> ELECTIONS
>
> Office Initiated   Phase   Candidates
>
> --
>
> ADoP   2020-06-15  Voting  R. Lee, Murphy
>
> --
>
> STARTABLE ELECTIONS[1]
>
> Office   Last Election
>
> --
>
> Promotor 2017-09-21
>
> Assessor 2019-11-11
>
> Arbitor  2019-11-23
>
> Registrar2020-02-26
>
> Rulekeepor   2020-03-07
>
> --
>
> [1] Anyone can start an election (with 2 support and also becoming a
>
> candidate) 90 days after the previous one (or if it's interim and no
>
> election is ongoing). This section lists the offices for which anyone could
> start an election this way.
>
>
> INTERESTS
>
> -
>
> Office Interest
>
> --
>
> ADoP   Efficiency
>
> ArbitorJustice
>
> Assessor   Efficiency, Legislation
>
> DistributorParticipation
>
> Herald Participation
>
> Notary Economy
>
> Prime Minister Every Ministry
>
> Promotor   Legislation
>
> RefereeJustice
>
> Registrar  Efficiency
>
> Rulekeepor Legislation, Participation
>
> SpeakerEvery Ministry
>
> Tailor Participation
>
> Treasuror  Economy, Economy
>
> Web

DIS: Re: BUS: is this too morbid?

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3411

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 12:00 PM ATMunn via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I feel like I vaguely recall this being discussed at some point
> previously, but I thought I would go for it anyways.
>
> I initiate a Call for Judgement on the following statement: "If a player
> dies unbeknownst to all persons involved in Agora, e is still a person."
>
> Rule 869 states that
>Any organism that is generally capable of freely originating and
>communicating independent thoughts and ideas is a person. Rules to
>the contrary notwithstanding, no other entities are persons.
>
> If someone dies, e is no longer capable of freely originating and
> communicating independent thoughts and ideas; therefore, e is not a
> person. FALSE.
>
> ...but if nobody knows that e died, then e has to still be a person. We
> can't assume without proof that anyone is dead and declare em not a
> person. So PARADOXICAL? Maybe?
>
> --
> ATMunn
> friendly neighborhood notary here :)
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: [Proto] Powerful Contracts

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

this proposal is fine except it better not ues the word "power"

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 11:50 AM Reuben Staley via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 2020-06-21 19:45, Jason Cobb via agora-discussion wrote:
> > On 6/21/20 9:42 PM, Reuben Staley via agora-discussion wrote:
> >> And that's a problem because...? If players consent to such a contract,
> >> they obviously must be getting something out of it. That shouldn't even
> >> prevent other contracts/players from being empowered.
> >
> > Why wouldn't it prevent other contracts?
> >
> >> If their is a single contract that is the value of at least 5 Power
> >> Target switches and is the target of the most Power Target switches, it
> >> is Empowered.
> >
> > [also, typo "their" should be "there"]
> >
> > There can only be one that is Empowered.
>
> Ah, I guess you're right. Still, if someone can monetize Empowerment in
> a way that players feel like they gain something from Empowerment, I
> think that contract deserves to be Empowered.
>
> --
> Trigon
>
> nch was here
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: OFF: [Promotor] Distribution of Proposals 8442-8457

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

I vote like this (despite the large number of AGAINST votes, I am voting
genuinely)

ID Author(s)AITitle
---
8442e  G.   1.0   Barrel Barrel Badger Barrel
AGAINST
8443f  G.   2.0   Term Limit
AGAINST
8444f  Aris 2.0   Sedate Officiation
AGAINST
8445*  Aris 3.0   Easier Retitling
AGAINST
8446e  G., nch  1.0   Victory Auction
FOR
8447p  CB   1.0   Rule Infancy
AGAINST
8448*  Aris, Alexis, Falsifian  3.0   Populist Administration
AGAINST
8449p  Aris, [1]1.5   Simpler Heraldry
AGAINST
8450j  G.   1.7   CFJ extensions
AGAINST
8451p  CB   1.0   HUMBLE AGORAN FARMER WINS THE GAME
AGAINST
8452j  P.S.S., Jason, Trigon1.0   Indictment Fixes
FOR
8453p  G.   1.0   win indirection
FOR
8454j  G., Jason, P.S.S.2.0   Judicial non-person fixes
FOR
8455j  G., Jason2.0   old judgements are good judgements
FOR
8456p  G.   1.0   namings
aGAINST
8457f  R. Lee, P.S.S.   2.0   CHILL BRO
FOR

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Registration

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

interesting, i think the moral of the story is that reading is for suckers

On Sun, Jun 21, 2020 at 4:33 PM Aris Merchant via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 11:25 PM Rebecca via agora-discussion
>  wrote:
> >
> > Welcome! My advice is just do stuff when you feel like it, no need to
> read
> > every message, rule or CFJ
>
> I on the other hand would advise reading all of the rules and
> messages. Reading all of the CFJs... I'm not sure if that's humanly
> possible? But I read the FLR before I registered, which put me in a
> pretty good position as a player. Message traffic is... a lot higher
> now than it was when I joined.
>
> I think the moral of the story here is that there are several valid
> approaches, and which one you should take depends on your inclinations
> and circumstances.
>
> -Aris
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: Registration

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

Welcome! My advice is just do stuff when you feel like it, no need to read
every message, rule or CFJ

On Sun, Jun 21, 2020 at 4:14 PM Zyborg Mao via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I, Zyborg, an Unregistered Person, wish to Register as a Player.
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: A logo for Agora

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

PSS this is kind of unrelated (but related to herald) but your last report
omitted some hard labor titles, the next one will have them right?

On Sun, Jun 21, 2020 at 12:54 PM Publius Scribonius Scholasticus via
agora-discussion  wrote:

> I’ve got the rules coming although there are a lot of edge cases. I should
> have a draft in the next week.
>
> > On Jun 20, 2020, at 21:20, Kerim Aydin via agora-discussion <
> agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> > 
> >>>>> On 6/20/2020 6:03 PM, Rebecca via agora-discussion wrote:
> >> Free Tournament? Free Tournament? Free Tournament?
> >
> > Suggestion for tournament rule:  Anyone can submit a design wholly
> > described in text.  Anyone else can try to draw that based on the text.
> > co-winners for the best pair, judged both for overall good looks but also
> > match between text and drawing (by popular vote).  secret collaboration
> > strongly discouraged.
> >
> > Publius, I don't know how the Diplonomic is coming along, but this (or a
> > variation) is a simple tournament that goes along with the "birthday"
> theme.
> >
> > -G.
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: A logo for Agora

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

Free Tournament? Free Tournament? Free Tournament?

On Sun, Jun 21, 2020 at 11:00 AM Kerim Aydin via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

>
> On 6/20/20 6:10 PM, Reuben Staley via agora-discussion wrote:
> > Due to a multitude of factors, I've noticed a lot of sentiment to
> "rebrand"
> > a bit. Along with this, I would like to raise the discussion of
> potentially
> > creating a new logo of sorts for Agora. The coat-of-arms has stood as our
> > de-facto logo for years (on the website as well as in other places) but
> its
> > grays and browns are admittedly rather boring. I think a new logo could
> do
> > a lot for the way we're seen. Thoughts?
> >
> > --
> > Trigon
>
> I've always been a bit meh on its appearance personally.  But I liked the
> fact that, apropos to Agora, it could be formally defined in a specialized
> language:
>
> Rule 2151/1 (Power=1)
> Agoran Arms
>
>   The escutcheon of Agora is defined by the following blazon:
>   Tierced palewise sable, argent, and sable, charged with a quill
>   and an axe in saltire, proper, and in the chief a capital letter
>   A, gules.
>
>   Agora's adopted motto is "Agora n'est pas une fontaine."
>
> [Note (9 January 2009): A rendering of the escutcheon of Agora is at
> .]
>
> History:
> Created by Proposal 5037 (Zefram, GreyKnight), 28 June 2007
> Amended(1) by Proposal 5285 (Goethe), 7 November 2007
> Repealed by Proposal 6392 (allispaul) 10 July 2009
>
>
> The Repeal Proposal beleow was interesting in terms of our conversation
> now.  It was controversial (6 voters FOR repeal, 6 voters AGAINST, carried
> 17/14 due to voting strength).  But its passage (and the tone of the
> proposal) implies that it's no longer our coat of arms, and Agoranomic.org
> is actually run by rogue monarchists:
>
> }{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{
> Proposal 6392 (Ordinary, AI=1.0, Interest=0) by allispaul
> Arms Anarchy
>
> WHEREAS Agora has graced the world of Nomic with its presence for
> nearly 16 years (1600 in Nomic years), and
>
> WHEREAS such a long-running Nomic SHOULD leave behind medieval
> trappings, and SHOULD adopt a more modern culture, and
>
> WHEREAS Agora has a responsibility to the lesser Nomics to remove them
> from the plagued darkness that now, even now, permeates the very cores
> of their beings, and CAN only avail itself of this responsibility
> through leadership, and CAN only lead by example, and
>
> WHEREAS nobody even uses shields anymore,
>
> Repeal Rule 2151 (Agoran Arms).
> }{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: My Piratehood

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

automatically. it's all good.


also for what it's worth, i've almost literally never known this game to be
this active/spammy before so maybe you can return when it's quieter, haha

On Sun, Jun 21, 2020 at 7:43 AM Stefan Fjellander via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> Save for the piracy thing, i don't think i'm in any other contract. Do i
> have to terminate the piracy contract manually, or is it automatically
> terminated when i deregister?
>
> Bögtil
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: CFJ 3846 Judged FALSE

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

>To be honest, I'm pretty sure
>that most of Agora's interpretative woes could be solved by rigorous
>application of the principle that language means what people think it means
>coupled with rigorous adherence to the text of the rules

Yep, I've always tried to (sometimes covertly) judge CFJs in precisely this
manner. Your judgements are both obviously correct and basically are the
same as I would have judged them (except you are more eloquent)

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 3:36 PM Aris Merchant via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> These judgments are basically drafts. I'm assigning them because I've
> got to assign something, but I'm happy to reconsider as appropriate. I
> think the core of the arguments should be good though.
>
> BTW, the big exciting part got cut due to time constraints, but I've
> hinted at what it is, just not shown all of the details.]
>
> Judge's Arguments in CFJ 3846
>
> The former of the caller's arguments, regarding Rule 2162, has already been
> dealt with in CFJ 3845.
>
> That leaves eir second argument, which is as follows:
>
> 1. A CFJ with a judge switch set to "unassigned" is unassigned.
> 2. The reason for this is that any entity "is" any the current value
>of each of that entity's switches.
> 3. Therefore, CFJ 3835 is G.
>
> I think we can all agree with #1. The weak step in this argument is #2.
> The argument fails if the reason for #1 is something other than #2.
>
> First, and most obviously, the word unassigned has a meaning
> Without even having to look it up, I can tell you it means "not assigned".
> It could mean "not assigned ever" or "not assigned right now", but it darn
> well means one of those things. One of the values of a CFJ's judge switch
> is "unassigned". That clarifies which of the two senses of the natural
> language word "unassigned" is meant: the one that accords with the
> value of the switch. Incidentally, this works much the same way for
> offices being vacant.
>
> That explanation is enough to resolve the argument set forth by the caller.
> However, there is another argument that could be produced.
>
> Imagine a rule that stated "Exploded is a negative boolean proposal
> switch."
> Perhaps exploding a proposal is method of disabling it, and exploded
> proposals
> CANNOT be adopted.
>
> People might begin to refer to exploded proposals as "exploded proposals",
> as
> I've already been doing. If you're an average Agoran, I'll bet you didn't
> even
> notice me referring to proposals with an exploded switch set to true as
> "exploded proposals" until I pointed it out. It just makes sense. What else
> would anyone mean by an "exploded" proposal? And once you've gone that
> far, why not start referring to proposals that have their exploded switch
> set
> to false as "unexploded"? After all, unexploded means "not exploded", so it
> seems like a sensible enough conversion. It would be just as sensible to do
> the same if the proposal switch was "explodedness" and the values were
> "exploded" and "unexploded". So what's going on here?
>
> I don't have a tidy explanation for this. The best I have is this: language
> means what people think it means. We've gotten so used to using adjectives
> to describe nouns that if we see something that looks adjectival being
> a property of something that looks nounish, we just naturally speak with
> the adjective describing the noun. This is how our language works. Because
> everyone understands it, it's meaningful. To be honest, I'm pretty sure
> that most of Agora's interpretative woes could be solved by rigorous
> application of the principle that language means what people think it means
> coupled with rigorous adherence to the text of the rules, but that's a
> matter for another day (I may write a thesis).
>
> The same principle, if applied to this case, resolves the matter
> conclusively.
> No Agoran would say that CFJ 3846 is G., just because e is its judge.
> The adjectival principle I mentioned above does not apply to nouns. Making
> it
> apply to nouns would like require a major change in Agoran language, rather
> than a mere shift in usage.
>
> The long and the short of it is, no matter how one explains the fact that
> a CFJ can be unassigned, CFJ 3846 doesn't come even remotely close to being
> G. FALSE.
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: actually fuck it

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

oh chill, that makes a lot of sense actually

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 11:48 AM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/19/20 9:44 PM, Rebecca via agora-discussion wrote:
> > well i also just created a proposal to remove the crime of "Uncertain
> > Certification" from existence, so maybe not?
>
>
> There are effectively no protections for indictments. If a finger has
> been pointed, then an indictment can be issued, and the alleged
> perpetrator can be punished by supermajority vote; the text of the rules
> doesn't seem to really care what happened in the meantime (including the
> crime being repealed).
>
> --
> Jason Cobb
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: How and Whether to Change Patch Certification

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

i actually genuinely think that the proposal i created is probably the best
fix for this, it means you can certify a proposal but you accept the risk
of a massive fine (and that fine will be nominal if it's actually,
manifestly, incredibly necessary or whatever)

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 11:45 AM Aris Merchant via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I think we need a free way of pending patch proposals. The voters appear to
> agree with me. I know some prominent and respected voices disagree, but the
> proposal passed, so clearly public sentiment presently favors something
> along these lines.
>
> However, the mechanism I proposed might have been messy. There are
> alternative ideas that would cause fewer CFJs. This gets a bit logistically
> interesting though because it's preferable for any such mechanism to be a)
> fast, and b) discourage abuse. Unfortunately, those things go against each
> other. This is why I suggested a criminal mechanism, which punishes abuse
> after the fact. The obvious alternative is a dependent action. 2 Agoran
> Consent works pretty well as a cure to abuse of anything. It also takes 4
> days, which is too long for patches IMO. That leaves with N support. The
> problem with actions taken with N support is that you've gotta pick a value
> of N that is high enough to stop a cabal of taking advantage of it and low
> enough to be easily achievable. That being said, something like with 5
> support backed by a SHOULD might do it.
>
> A final solution, which I'm tossing in mostly as a joke, would be to just
> take the once a week limitation off my emergency pending powers.
>
> Or, of course, we could just repeal it. A repeal does remove the problem,
> though at the cost of also removing a mechanism that we've collectively
> agreed is a good idea.
>
> Thoughts?
>
> -Aris
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: actually fuck it

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

well i also just created a proposal to remove the crime of "Uncertain
Certification" from existence, so maybe not?

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 11:42 AM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/19/20 9:31 PM, Aris Merchant via agora-discussion wrote:
> > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 6:28 PM Rebecca via agora-business
> >  wrote:
> >> I certify every proposal in the proposal pool. I wasn't going to win in
> >> this system anyway (and i dont really care about winning) and this
> gives me
> >> an amount of Blots truly coinciding with my self-image.
> >>
> >> I point fingers at myself for Uncertain Certification, once for each
> >> proposal I just certified.
> >>
> >> Also good luck punishing me in time for the statute of limitations given
> >> that you guys just basically made it impossible to punish class 4
> crimes.
> > You do realize you can be deregistered if you wrack up 40 blots, right?
> >
> > I note that this is both willful and egregious.
> >
> > -Aris
>
>
> H. Referee, you may wish to delay issuing an indictment as long as
> possible so that you will be ENABLED to initiate the relevant decisions
> once the fix proposal is resolved.
>
> --
> Jason Cobb
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: actually fuck it

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

sure, i realize

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 11:32 AM Aris Merchant via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 6:28 PM Rebecca via agora-business
>  wrote:
> >
> > I certify every proposal in the proposal pool. I wasn't going to win in
> > this system anyway (and i dont really care about winning) and this gives
> me
> > an amount of Blots truly coinciding with my self-image.
> >
> > I point fingers at myself for Uncertain Certification, once for each
> > proposal I just certified.
> >
> > Also good luck punishing me in time for the statute of limitations given
> > that you guys just basically made it impossible to punish class 4 crimes.
>
> You do realize you can be deregistered if you wrack up 40 blots, right?
>
> I note that this is both willful and egregious.
>
> -Aris
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Arbitor] Court Gazette

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

yeah im probably just mad because the number of CFJs called worked out to
give CFJs throughout the rotation except to myself, just luck on that one
(and i do call plenty of CFJs)

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 11:16 AM Kerim Aydin via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

>
> On 6/19/2020 6:06 PM, Rebecca via agora-discussion wrote:
> > I always seem to get the least CFJs :(
>
> Hmmm... I think I've rotated pretty equally but maybe I'm wrong.  I
> noticed a couple weeks ago I had to skip you when you were on top (just
> for one set of cfjs) because most of the cases were called by you or you
> had a strong self-interest in or something.  But that was the only time
> I've noticed a skip there.  You're on the top of the list now anyway.
>
> I have a bunch of informal heuristics for assigning cases (not just
> popping off the top) that I'm happy to detail for anyone if they care.
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Arbitor] CFJ 3853 Assigned to nch

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

true but you have to articulate a reasonable chain of reasoning for it to
be plausible, not just have a gut feeling of unsureness or whatever. but i
agree with you, it's probable that Jason didn't commit the crime, at least
from the Rulekeepor angle. I'm not sure if it actually does fix a bug.

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 11:09 AM Aris Merchant via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 6:06 PM Rebecca via agora-discussion
>  wrote:
> >
> > plausible means something akin to "there is a colorable argument that it
> is
> > true". if you are convinced that there is a reasonable argument that it's
> > related to the Rulekeepor's duties, that's probably enough. However, mere
> > ambiguity or unsureness isn't.
>
> I find that a perfectly reasonable definition too. I'm not sure I see
> the gap between "a colorable argument" and "ambiguity or unsureness".
> If there isn't any colorable argument for something, I tend not to be
> unsure of it.
>
> -Aris
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: OFF: [Arbitor] Court Gazette

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

I always seem to get the least CFJs :(

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 11:04 AM Kerim Aydin via agora-official <
agora-offic...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> Arbitor's Weekly Report
>
> DEADLINES (details below)
> ---
> 3845 Assigned to ArisDue Sat 20 Jun 2020 18:30:18
> 3846 Assigned to ArisDue Sat 20 Jun 2020 18:35:47
> 3848 Assigned to grokDue Sat 27 Jun 2020 00:24:39
> 3849 Assigned to G.  Due Sat 27 Jun 2020 00:25:13
> 3850 Assigned to G.  Due Sat 27 Jun 2020 00:25:38
> 3851 Assigned to Publius Due Sat 27 Jun 2020 00:26:04
> 3852 Assigned to Jason   Due Sat 27 Jun 2020 00:26:31
> 3853 Assigned to nch Due Sat 27 Jun 2020 00:26:56
>
>
> INTERESTED JUDGES AND THEIR MOST RECENT CASE
> ---
> 3842 R. Lee
> 3844 Murphy
> 3846 Aris
> 3847 ATMunn
> 3848 grok
> 3850 G.
> 3851 Publius Scribonius Scholasticus
> 3852 Jason
> 3853 nch
>
> (Occasional)
> 3797 Falsifian
> 3807 Warrigal
> 3815 Cuddlebeam
>
> Penalty box:  D. Margaux, omd, Gaelan.
>
>
> OPEN CASES
> ---
> 3853 Assigned to nch [Due Sat 27 Jun 2020 00:26:56]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3853
>  Within the past week, Jason committed the crime of Uncertain
>  Certification.
>
> 3852 Assigned to Jason [Due Sat 27 Jun 2020 00:26:31]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3852
>  If the indicated text in evidence were part of a rule, every
>  talisman would be its own class.
>
> 3851 Assigned to Publius [Due Sat 27 Jun 2020 00:26:04]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3851
>  R. Lee attempted to perform a forbidden action in the message in
>  evidence.
>
> 3850 Assigned to G. [Due Sat 27 Jun 2020 00:25:38]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3850
>  The Plunder Partnership as it existed on June 15, 2020 could be
>  joined by other players.
>
> 3849 Assigned to G. [Due Sat 27 Jun 2020 00:25:13]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3849
>  A contract which has no explicit mechanism for joining may still
>  be joined by other parties in some cases.
>
> 3848 Assigned to grok [Due Sat 27 Jun 2020 00:24:39]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3848
>  G. is a party to the Groucho Marx Club.
>
> 3846 Assigned to Aris [Due Sat 20 Jun 2020 18:35:47]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3846
>  CFJ 3835 is G.
>
> 3845 Assigned to Aris [Due Sat 20 Jun 2020 18:30:18]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3845
>  On or about 16 May 2020, CFJ 3835 became G.
>
> RECENTLY-JUDGED CASES
> ---
> 3847 Judged TRUE by ATMunn [Sun 14 Jun 2020]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3847
>  If an impure person Raises a Banner, eir Ribbon Ownership becomes
>  the empty set but e does not win the game.
>
> 3844 Judged DISMISS by Murphy [Sun 14 Jun 2020]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3844
>  The destruction of the Bazinga asset would lead to the destruction
>  of one or more rules, but for the Rule 'Agora is a Nomic'
>
> 3843 Judged FALSE by Murphy [Sun 14 Jun 2020]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3843
>  The Bazinga is a destructible private asset.
>
> 3842 Judged FALSE by R. Lee [Sat 13 Jun 2020]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3842
>  In the message quoted above, Cuddle Beam altered the part of eir
>  MYSTICAL MENAGERIE contract describing "Scam Banishment Ritual"
>  (where for this purpose, deleting that section or destroying the
>  whole contract count as altering that part).
>
> 3841 Judged TRUE by Jason [Thu 11 Jun 2020]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3841
>  In the above statement, I issued a Call for Judgement on whether I
>  transferred a coin to Agora in the statement preceding that one.
>
> 3840 Judged TRUE by G. [Fri 12 Jun 2020]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3840
>  En la declaración anterior, transferí una moneda a Agora.
>
> 3839 Judged DISMISS by nch [Sun 14 Jun 2020]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3839
>  The game of Agora will never end.
>
> 3838 Judged TRUE by Publius Scribonius Scholasticus [Sat 13 Jun 2020]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3838
>  Grok transferred one coin to me in the above quoted message.
>
> 3837 Judged IRRELEVANT by grok [Sat 06 Jun 2020]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3837
>  Falsifian owns at least one blot if and only if English Wikipedia
>  has an article titled "Sponge".
>
> 3836 Judged TRUE by Murphy [Fri 22 May 2020]
>  https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3836
>  The above CFJ stateme

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Arbitor] CFJ 3853 Assigned to nch

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

plausible means something akin to "there is a colorable argument that it is
true". if you are convinced that there is a reasonable argument that it's
related to the Rulekeepor's duties, that's probably enough. However, mere
ambiguity or unsureness isn't.

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 11:00 AM Kerim Aydin via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

>
>
> On 6/19/2020 5:49 PM, Aris Merchant via agora-discussion wrote:
> > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 5:35 PM nch via agora-discussion <
> > agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> >> On 6/19/20 7:26 PM, Kerim Aydin via agora-official wrote:
> >>> The below CFJ is 3853.  I assign it to nch.
> >>>
> >>> status:https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/#3853
> >>>
> >>> ===  CFJ 3853
> >> ===
> >>>
> >>>Within the past week, Jason committed the crime of Uncertain
> >>>Certification.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> ==
> >>
> >> As someone who strongly opposed the relevant rule, specifically because
> >> of its ambiguity, I feel like I've been Cassandra'd.
> >>
> >
> >
> > Gratuitous:
> >
> > Plausibly is the opposite of manifestly. If you ask whether something is
> > manifestly X, then if you're not sure the thing is X, the answer is no.
> > When you ask whether something is plausibly X, if you're not sure if it's
> > X, the answer is yes. So if you're sure it isn't related to Rulekeepor
> this
> > is TRUE, otherwise it is FALSE. This part of the rule was deliberately
> > written in such a way as to minimize the ambiguity that would otherwise
> > result.
>
> Something of a counter:
>
> "Plausible:  reasonable or probable".  That doesn't sound to me like
> "ambiguity = yes" it sounds to me like preponderance of the logic/reason,
> and reasonableness can take into account things like good of the game and
> so forth.  (By your definition, it's plausible that the Arbitor can do
> this with any bug, because someone might call a cfj about it.  But that
> doesn't seem "reasonable" so seems against the actual dictionary
> definition of the term).
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposal] Black ribbon patch

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

goddamn you guys are so bad at making rules that are good, its lucky i
rarely care about the rules

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 1:35 AM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/19/20 11:33 AM, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus via
> agora-discussion wrote:
> > On 6/19/20 11:31 AM, Jason Cobb via agora-discussion wrote:
> >> On 6/19/20 11:21 AM, Kerim Aydin via agora-business wrote:
> >>> Not part of arguments:  lol when I voted against this it was because it
> >>> lacked the basic checks (e.g. dependent action or something).
> Regardless
> >>> of CFJ outcome you all have now fixed the price of pending at 4 blots
> >>> (more or less).  Another economic nerf out of the gate because Agorans
> are
> >>> terrified of gaming actual scarcity ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
> >>
> >> Right now it's fixed at 0 blots because, even if you do commit the
> >> crime, we still haven't fixed the Indictment process, so...
> >>
> >> I think PSS submitted a proposal with fixes, but I don't see it in the
> >> recent proposal pool reports, so it might have self-ratified out of
> >> existence by now.
> >>
> > I believe it was after the last Distribution, so it should appear in the
> > next one.
> >
>
> Oh, my bad, then.
>
> --
> Jason Cobb
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposal] Black ribbon patch

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

yeah it probably has to be the same message now

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 1:00 AM Kerim Aydin via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

>
> On 6/19/2020 7:40 AM, Rebecca via agora-discussion wrote:
> > i remember someone called that CFJ in response to the first CFJ i ever
> > called
> > https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3523
>
> Thanks, I didn't remember that!  The rule language has changed, though,
> from (according to those CFJ arguments):
>
>   Any person (the initiator) can initiate a Call for Judgement
>   (CFJ, syn. Judicial Case) by announcement, specifying a statement
>   to be inquired into. E may optionally bar one person from the case.
>
> to:
>
>   When a person initiates a Call for Judgement, e CAN optionally bar
>   one person from the case by announcement.
>
> The addition of "When" definitely implies "at the same time" more strongly
> than the previous wording.  Though it doesn't explicitly say "in the same
> message", and "when" could also be "immediately after" in common usage
> ("when you do that, I'll do this").
>
> -G.
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposal] Black ribbon patch

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

i remember someone called that CFJ in response to the first CFJ i ever
called
https://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/cases/?3523

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 12:28 AM Kerim Aydin via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

>
> On 6/19/2020 7:18 AM, Rebecca via agora-discussion wrote:
> > there is a precedent actually that you can bar in a later message without
> > recalling the CFJ if its "reasonably continuous" or something.
>
> Can you point me to that doesn't ring a bell.
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: [Proposal] Black ribbon patch

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

there is a precedent actually that you can bar in a later message without
recalling the CFJ if its "reasonably continuous" or something.

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 12:09 AM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/19/20 10:06 AM, Kerim Aydin via agora-discussion wrote:
> > On 6/19/2020 7:03 AM, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:
> >> I CFJ: "Within the past week, Jason committed the crime of Uncertain
> >> Certification."
> > thanks!  (the reason I didn't right away is I've lost count this week I
> > think I'm getting close to excess cfj territory).
>
>
> Oh, I didn't even realize. No problem!
>
> --
> Jason Cobb
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Minor cleaning

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

never mind, cant read. rest of argument still stands on ordinary meaning of
attempt in a criminal context. new common sense arguments: rules tend to
think intending anything you want is okay and criminalizing formal intent
is bad, see the No Faking rule (exempting intent)

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 1:48 PM Kerim Aydin via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

>
> On 6/18/2020 8:02 PM, Rebecca via agora-discussion wrote:
> > Merely thinking and planning to commit murder isn't attempted murder, the
> > acts carried out have to be "more than merely preparatory" (under English
> > law). The same applies to this analogous crime, merely preparing to take
> > the ossifying action is not an attempt; attempt is actually doing an
> action
> > (even if that action fails, as it would ossify Agora).
> >
> > The thing my proposal had to do with it was that it removed the bit that
> > said "intending to do a forbidden art is a crime" (or whatever). For what
> > it's worth under the common sense factors, the fact that making a formal
> > intent to do an action that would ossify the game was specifically
> removed
> > from the rule means that it is unlikely the rule is meant to still
> > criminalize it.
> >
>
> Where's the "intent" bit in Rule 2617/0 I'm completely missing it:
>
> Rule 2617/0 (Power=1.0)
> Defense Against the Dark Arts
>
>   A proposal is forbidden if it would, upon successfully taking
>   effect, cause Agora to be ossified or to cease to exist.  An
>   action is forbidden if it would, upon its successful occurrence,
>   cause Agora to be ossified or to cease to exist.
>
>   Attempting a forbidden action is PROHIBITED, and is the Class-4
>   Crime of Engaging in Forbidden Arts.
>
>   Submitting a forbidden proposal is PROHIBITED, and is the Class-1
>   Crime of Contemplating Forbidden Arts.
>
>   Being the author of an adopted forbidden proposal is PROHIBITED,
>   and is the Class-2 Crime of Suborning Forbidden Arts.
>
>   Having a final ballot that evaluates to FOR in the Agoran decision
>   on whether to adopt a forbidden proposal is PROHIBITED, and is the
>   Class-1 Crime of Abetting Forbidden Arts.
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Minor cleaning

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 12:52 PM Kerim Aydin via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

>
> CFJ:  R. Lee attempted to perform a forbidden action in the message in
> evidence.
>
> Barred: R. Lee
>
> Arguments:
>
> In reference to:
>   Attempting a forbidden action is PROHIBITED, and is the Class-4
>   Crime of Engaging in Forbidden Arts.
>
> We never really define "attempt" though we use it a lot in the rules.
> Generally, if you begin the prerequisites of a process to do something
> (i.e. announcing intent to perform an action in a legal way that begins a
> waiting period) a person would say you're "attempting" to do it.  ("What
> was that announcement for?"  "oh, e's attempting to win by apathy").
>
>
> [not part of the arguments:  you're probably right, but I think it's
> enough of a possibility to call the case and it would be good to get a
> definition of "attempt" out of it - also I don't see what the proposal had
> to do with it you didn't amend that part, that I can see, maybe I'm being
> blind?].
>
> On 6/18/2020 7:34 PM, Rebecca via agora-discussion wrote:
> > Lol, I just amended the forbidden arts rule to allow me to do this, so
> nice
> > try. It would require me to actually do the action (or attempt it) which
> I
> > can't do due to the objection.
> >
> > I didn't have any overarching objective with this message lol it was
> mainly
> > a Beaker joke.
> >
> > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 12:04 PM Kerim Aydin via agora-business <
> > agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> I point the finger at R. Lee something something forbidden arts.
> >>
> >> (I may see something that you're up to waiting to see tho).
> >>
> >> Also, I object.
>
> Evidence:
> >>> I intend, without objection, to amed the rules in the following
> >>> inconsequential way:
> >>> Amend every word in the ruleset except the rules at power 4 to read
> >> "Meep"
> >>>
> >>
> >
> >
>
Merely thinking and planning to commit murder isn't attempted murder, the
acts carried out have to be "more than merely preparatory" (under English
law). The same applies to this analogous crime, merely preparing to take
the ossifying action is not an attempt; attempt is actually doing an action
(even if that action fails, as it would ossify Agora).

The thing my proposal had to do with it was that it removed the bit that
said "intending to do a forbidden art is a crime" (or whatever). For what
it's worth under the common sense factors, the fact that making a formal
intent to do an action that would ossify the game was specifically removed
from the rule means that it is unlikely the rule is meant to still
criminalize it.

-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: Minor cleaning

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

Lol, I just amended the forbidden arts rule to allow me to do this, so nice
try. It would require me to actually do the action (or attempt it) which I
can't do due to the objection.

I didn't have any overarching objective with this message lol it was mainly
a Beaker joke.

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 12:04 PM Kerim Aydin via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

>
> I point the finger at R. Lee something something forbidden arts.
>
> (I may see something that you're up to waiting to see tho).
>
> Also, I object.
>
> On 6/18/2020 6:50 PM, Rebecca via agora-business wrote:
> > I intend, without objection, to amed the rules in the following
> > inconsequential way:
> > Amend every word in the ruleset except the rules at power 4 to read
> "Meep"
> >
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Cleaning [attn. Rulekeepor]

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

Meh, I don't see any difference between cleaning platonic typos and
Rulekeepor typos. Remove them all without mercy!!

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 6:11 AM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/18/20 4:06 PM, ATMunn via agora-business wrote:
> > I intend to clean Rule 2576 "Ownership" without objection, replacing
> > "Department.." with "Department." [first sentence of the second
> paragraph]
> >
>
> I can confirm that the platonic ruleset does have the double period
> (unlike some previous attempted cleanings, which were application
> errors). It was introduced in Proposal 8366 [0], which replaced text not
> ending in a period with new text that ended in a period.
>
> [0]:
>
> https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-official/2020-April/013590.html
>
> --
> Jason Cobb
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: [proposal] Re: DIS: Re: BUS: re-tailor

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

well it's usually almost impossible to win the game another way

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:06 PM Kerim Aydin via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

>
> On 6/17/2020 8:08 PM, Alex Smith wrote:
> >  On Thursday, 18 June 2020, 01:08:09 GMT+1, Kerim Aydin wrote:
> >> I award myself the following ribbons:
> > [snip]
> >> - Platinum (Speaker)
> >> - Ultraviolet (Champion)
> > These two work, but it feels like a bug that you should be able to get
> Ribbons off a Ribbon victory.
> > Maybe the lockout should be two weeks? That would prevent recursive
> Ultraviolets, at least.
> >
>
> I was going to ask that too - it seems like ultraviolet being essentially
> permanent after the first ribbon win isn't a great feature.  Don't think a
> full two-week lockout for all ribbons is needed (it's not like the
> proposal ones are unfair) but maybe explicitly deny ultraviolet if
> champion was the result of a ribbon win?
>
> I submit the following Proposal, "UV Sunblock" AI-3, co=author ais523:
> 
>
> Amend Rule 2438 (Ribbons) by replacing:
>   Ultraviolet (U): When a person is awarded the Patent Title
>   Champion, that person earns an Ultraviolet Ribbon.
> with:
>   Ultraviolet (U): When a person is awarded the Patent Title
>   Champion, that person earns an Ultraviolet Ribbon, unless
>   the Champion title was awarded as the result of winning
>   the game via this rule.
>
> 
>
> -G.
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: OFF: [ADoP] Resolving Prime Minister Election

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

congrats!

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 11:11 AM Rebecca via agora-official <
agora-offic...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I resolve the Agoran Decision for the election of the Prime Minister. The
> quorum was 7 voting system was IRV.
>
> First Preference Votes
>
> R. Lee (1): R. Lee
>
> ATMunn (3): Aris, Jason, ATMunn
>
> Nch (4): Falsifian, PSS, nch, Trigon
>
> R. Lee is eliminated with the least votes. Eir one vote is distributed to
> nch
>
> Second Round
>
> ATMunn (3): Aris, Jason, ATMunn
>
> Nch (5): Falsifian, PSS, nch, Trigon, R. Lee
>
> Nch is therefore the winner of this election in the second round. Nch is
> installed as Prime Minister.
>
>
> --
> From R. Lee
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: Humble Agoran farmer offers wood for sheep

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 11:40 AM Edward Murphy via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I consent to the following contract and transfer all my Cards to it.
>
> Administrivia:
>
>1) The name of this contract is Card Collective Contract, Agoran
>   (abbr. CCCA).
>
>2) Any player CAN join or leave CCCA by announcement. Members of CCCA
>   are known as Collectors.
>
>3) Any Collector CAN amend CCCA with Agoran consent of Collectors.
>
>4) The Secretary General is Murphy.
>
>5) A Person of Interest is a player or former player.
>
> Balances:
>
>1) Each type of Card has a corresponding List, which is an ordered
>   sequence of Persons of Interest (who may appear multiple times),
>   initially empty.
>
>2) When a player transfers N instances of one type of Card to this
>   contract, e is added N times to the end of that type's List.
>
>3) To perform Collection for N instances of one type of Card is to do
>   the following:
>
> a) Transfer that many instances from CCCA to oneself.
>
> b) Pay that many instances as a single set to earn Products.
>
> c) The Comrades are the first entries (up to N) in that type's
>List who are players. Transfer one Product earned in the
>previous step to the first Comrade (or keep it if that Comrade
>is the performer), then one to the second, etc., returning to
>the last Comrade after the first, until all those Products are
>transferred. Then remove those entries from that List.
>
>   Other clauses notwithstanding, Collection may only be performed if
>   it fully succeeds in one message and has at least one Comrade.
>
>4) Any Collector CAN perform Collection for N instances of one type of
>   Card with Agoran consent of Collectors.
>
>5) If CCCA has at least as many instances of one type of Card as the
>   largest single set that can be paid to earn Products, then the
>   Secretary General CAN and SHALL perform Collection for such a
>   maximal set of that type.
>
> Non-binding notes
>
>The Collectors SHOULD update these as needed for accuracy.
>
>Example:
>
>* Legislative Cards are deposited by (in order) A, B, C, A, D, E
>* LC List is now {A, B, A, C, D, E}
>* A performs Collection (4 LCs for 10 Pendants)
>* Comrades are A, B, A, C
>* A transfers those 10 Pendants as follows: keep, B, C, keep,
>(back to start) keep, B, C, keep, (back to start) keep, B
>* LC List is now {D, E}
>
>If B deregistered prior to this Collection, then instead:
>
>* Comrades are A, C, A, D
>* A transfers (total of) 3 to C, 2 to D, keeps other 5
>* LC List is now {B, E}
>
>Non-players can't own assets, but remain on Lists in case they
>re-register. Non-Collector players can deposit and benefit, but
>can't influence the timing of voluntary payouts.
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: CFJs 3831 and 3838 judged TRUE

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

At least for me personally, I've never (earnestly) used the four factors in
my life. For us the text is the law, and there is 99% of the time a common
sense way to grapple with the text.

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 10:02 AM Aris Merchant via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 12:41 PM Aris Merchant <
> thoughtsoflifeandligh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Sat, Jun 13, 2020 at 10:20 AM Kerim Aydin via agora-business
> >  wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > On 6/13/2020 10:07 AM, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus wrote:
> > > > On Sat, Jun 13, 2020 at 1:04 PM Kerim Aydin wrote:
> > > >> On 6/13/2020 9:52 AM, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus wrote:
> > > >>> In CFJ 1500, the Court found that words should be
> > > >>> interpreted by their common language definition after a definition
> in
> > > >>> the rules has been overturned. The Court presently believes that
> this
> > > >>> is somewhat misguided: while the common language definition should
> be
> > > >>> used in any interpretation, the past definition in the rules and
> its
> > > >>> historical usage within Agora should also be looked at, where
> > > >>> reasonable, as part of the game custom criterion.
> > > >>
> > > >> I'm very concerned about this bit and considering a motion.  This
> > greatly
> > > >> expands the scope of what we have to remember about past rules,
> > greatly
> > > >> reduces clarity to new players, and considering there's many common
> > terms
> > > >> that we drag into rules-definitions (e.g. "refer" or whatever) they
> > should
> > > >> revert really quickly to common definitions when removed from the
> > rules.
> > > >>
> > > >> Shiny was removed from the ruleset in early 2018.  That's two years.
> > > >> What's the limit?
> > > >>
> > > >> -G.
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > > I thought that might be controversial. I think that the limit is the
> > > > point at which almost no one remembers the definition. Here, the
> > > > context and the recency both implied the definition. In the instance
> > > > of "refer", as long as we don't leave the mechanic after returning
> the
> > > > definition, it will almost immediately return to solely its common
> > > > language definition.
> >
> > I may end up overturning this to some extent in CFJ 3846. I think
> > there's a better way of handling language interpetation than a case by
> > case full four factors analysis. I'm not sure whether we want to move
> > to reconsider.
>
>
> Aris: *plans to fundamentally rethink the way Agorans look at language*
> Aris: "Gee, I wonder if this is going to be controversial?"
>
> -Aris
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: CoE question

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

either choice is perfectly valid and fine, but given that stuff is always
changing, you may make a mistake with the new stuff and get caught in an
infinite chain at that point lol

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 9:28 AM ATMunn via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> so I, as I imagine others do, keep an always-current version of my
> report, in addition to the actual published reports. However, my
> question is this: If I publish a report, then more stuff happens (e.g. a
> new contract is created), and then someone makes a CoE, is it *wrong* to
> include that new stuff? i.e., does the revision have to be accurate to
> the original time of publishing and nothing after, or can it (or should
> it) be accurate to the time of publishing of the revision?
>
> --
> ATMunn
> friendly neighborhood notary here :)
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Fine, I destroy "Combinotron"

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

Just join the plunder partnership, anyone can and it'll give you a cut

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 10:14 AM Edward Murphy via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> R. Lee wrote:
>
> > Once again, I intend to transfer a victory card and a legislative card
> from
> > the L&F department to me, without objection.
>
> Right, IIRC this is just recovery from Combinotron.
>
> > I intend to transfer 500 coins from the L&F department to the plunder
> > partnership, without objection
>
> This one, though, is it just 'because we can, if no one stops us'? Which
> of course is what you'd expect the Plunder Partnership to do, but you'd
> also expect others to want to be cut in on the take. (I really should
> go through these contracts and see about joining one or two.)
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Tarot

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

I was going to buy all of them, but I dont have enough coins

On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 11:10 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> Maybe one of the others has what you're looking for...
>
> On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 3:07 PM Rebecca via agora-discussion <
> agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
> > damn i was sure these would actually be important in some way but they're
> > even lamer than the other ones. this is a sad day.
> >
> > On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 10:20 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-business <
> > agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> > > I transfer 50 coins to my locker.
> > >
> > > I then Fortunetell each of these cards! Here is your fortune, R.Lee!
> (The
> > > hashes are SHA-256, done with this:
> > > https://emn178.github.io/online-tools/sha256.html)
> > >
> > >
> > > I - THE PLAYER: you will have good luck with proposals
> > >
> > > II - THE ANNOUNCEMENT: if you are smart about it you will earn a lot of
> > > money
> > >
> > > III - THE JUDGE: a scam is looming close to you so be careful or take
> > > the opportunity
> > >
> > > IV - THE SCAM: fortune will smile upon you if you do what needs to be
> > done
> > >
> > > V - THE RIBBON: you are forgetting something important
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 1:53 PM Rebecca via agora-business <
> > > agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > > I transfer 50 coins to cuddlebeam in order to do so.
> > > >
> > > > On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 9:26 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-discussion <
> > > > agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > I think you need to make an explicit transfer
> > > > >
> > > > > On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 12:25 PM Rebecca via agora-business <
> > > > > agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > I buy each of the first five listed tarot cards in Cuddlebeam's
> > > > > > mystical contract
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > From R. Lee
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > From R. Lee
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 1:53 PM Rebecca via agora-business <
> > > agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > > I transfer 50 coins to cuddlebeam in order to do so.
> > > >
> > > > On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 9:26 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-discussion <
> > > > agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > I think you need to make an explicit transfer
> > > > >
> > > > > On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 12:25 PM Rebecca via agora-business <
> > > > > agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > I buy each of the first five listed tarot cards in Cuddlebeam's
> > > > > > mystical contract
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > From R. Lee
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > From R. Lee
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > From R. Lee
> >
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Attempt To Amend Codependancy Contract

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

while you're at it, can you have arbitrators order other things too, like
transferring assets?

On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 10:52 PM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/16/20 6:25 AM, nch via agora-business wrote:
> > On 6/15/20 10:59 PM, Rebecca via agora-business wrote:
> >> I want to amend (if nch agrees) the contract Co Dependants by adding on
> the
> >> end
> >>
> >> "All members to this contract shall be members of and be bound by the
> >> Agoran Arbitration Association contract"
> >>
> >> I consent to this amendment and become a party to the AAA
> >>
> >> --
> >>  From R. Lee
> > I consent to this change and become a party to the AAA.
> >
>
> Thanks for joining, but AAA won't work on your current setup because a
> SHALL violation causes the responsible party to cease being a party. Let
> me do some drafting and see if I can amend AAA to make it work...
>
> --
> Jason Cobb
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Tarot

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

damn i was sure these would actually be important in some way but they're
even lamer than the other ones. this is a sad day.

On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 10:20 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I transfer 50 coins to my locker.
>
> I then Fortunetell each of these cards! Here is your fortune, R.Lee! (The
> hashes are SHA-256, done with this:
> https://emn178.github.io/online-tools/sha256.html)
>
>
> I - THE PLAYER: you will have good luck with proposals
>
> II - THE ANNOUNCEMENT: if you are smart about it you will earn a lot of
> money
>
> III - THE JUDGE: a scam is looming close to you so be careful or take
> the opportunity
>
> IV - THE SCAM: fortune will smile upon you if you do what needs to be done
>
> V - THE RIBBON: you are forgetting something important
>
>
> On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 1:53 PM Rebecca via agora-business <
> agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
> > I transfer 50 coins to cuddlebeam in order to do so.
> >
> > On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 9:26 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-discussion <
> > agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> > > I think you need to make an explicit transfer
> > >
> > > On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 12:25 PM Rebecca via agora-business <
> > > agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > > I buy each of the first five listed tarot cards in Cuddlebeam's
> > > > mystical contract
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > From R. Lee
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > From R. Lee
>
>
> On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 1:53 PM Rebecca via agora-business <
> agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
> > I transfer 50 coins to cuddlebeam in order to do so.
> >
> > On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 9:26 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-discussion <
> > agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> > > I think you need to make an explicit transfer
> > >
> > > On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 12:25 PM Rebecca via agora-business <
> > > agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > > I buy each of the first five listed tarot cards in Cuddlebeam's
> > > > mystical contract
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > From R. Lee
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > From R. Lee
> >
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [ADoP] Interest intent

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

ugh, voting cards are so useless. you can't even game the popularity index
with them now because of aris's recent amendment. sad!!

On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 1:44 PM nch via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/15/20 9:52 PM, Rebecca via agora-official wrote:
> > Being without objection, I flip the interest switch of the webmaster to
> > participation
>
> As Webmastor I grant R. Lee a Voting Card.
>
> --
> nch
> Webmastor, NAX Exchange Manager, Pirate
>
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: BUS: Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [ADoP ] Salaries - also [Treasuror CoE]

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

I'll pay you then (or Murphy will, depending on the will of the people). So
unless anyone wants to point a finger at me for doing it untimely after
June 1, it will be fine, yep.

On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 10:51 AM Publius Scribonius Scholasticus via
agora-discussion  wrote:

> On 6/15/20 8:45 PM, Edward Murphy via agora-discussion wrote:
> > R. Lee wrote:
> >
> >> Okay, you're right about the first one (side-eye @ falsifian) but the
> >> second one is surely just a response to a COE and republishing the first
> >> report, not a new monthly report right?
> >
> > idk, it may be worth a CFJ. Most corrections probably fall within the
> > same reporting period as the original report, in which case that alone
> > is enough to prevent double salary.
> >
> > Regardless of how that shakes out, there's definitely value in recording
> > corrections, as it allows for a quick check of whether a report was
> > published within a given time period and may have self-ratified. (Also
> > why I retained the practice of recording CoEs in the report; though
> > thinking about that, maybe the report should also list denials, since
> > they turn the self-ratification timer back on.)
>
> Just informationally, I plan to complete my June report on time, so I
> think this won't matter in the end.
>
> --
> 
> Publius Scribonius Scholasticus, Herald, Referee, Tailor, Pirate
> Champion, Badge of the Great Agoran Revival, Badge of the Salted Earth
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Draft report feedback

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

I already did intend to do that somewhere else

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 7:36 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I'll give you 72 hours to intend without objection to transfer those cards
> (I don't know which they are) in the Lost and Found back to yourself (I
> won't object, because I do want you to have them back). Otherwise I'll
> consider them abandoned and I'll go for them myself (most likely with the
> Plunder Partnership and Parley-ing what should happen with them).
>
> On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 10:44 AM Rebecca via agora-discussion <
> agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
> > I actually have 0 cards of any type. I transferred 2 to Aris's lottery
> and
> > the other 2 to my now-destroyed contract, they reside in the Lost and
> Found
> > department now.
> >
> > On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 6:42 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-discussion <
> > agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> > > >can we try to remember signalling
> > >
> > > What is signalling? The "[Attn. Treasuror]" thing, yes?
> > >
> > > On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 10:30 AM Reuben Staley via agora-discussion <
> > > agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > > It's me again! Just popping in to ask everyone's thoughts on this. I
> > > > usually do the Treasuror stuff around Wednesday but there's been a
> bit
> > > > of extra work this past week so I'm putting out a mid-week draft
> > report.
> > > > I think I did a pretty good job, but there were so many messages
> that I
> > > > probably missed something.
> > > >
> > > > I don't like asking people to go out of their way for me, but
> *please*
> > > > can we try to remember signalling? It makes everyone's transactions
> > *so*
> > > > much more visible.
> > > >
> > > > This is also feedback for the new report style. I'm not fully
> satisfied
> > > > with the way it is now, so I absolutely *need* everyone's feedback on
> > > > how everything looks. I'm ready to change lots.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks!
> > > >
> > > >
> > 
> > > >  FORBES FOUR HUNDRED NINETY-THREE
> > > >    or
> >  
> > > > TREASUROR'S WEEKLY REPORT
> > > >
> > 
> > > >
> > > > Date of last official report:  11 Jun 2020
> > > > Date of this report:   whenever
> > > >
> > > > (all times and dates in UTC)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > NOTES ON REPORT   (contains no
> > data)
> > > >
> > 
> > > >
> > > > * As always, please check the accuracy of this report.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ASSET INDEX   (does not
> > self-ratify)
> > > >
> > 
> > > >
> > > > +-+--+---+
> > > > | Asset class | Recordkeepor | Ownership |
> > > > +=+==+===+
> > > > | Coins   | Treasuror| Agora, players, contracts |
> > > > | Cards   | Treasuror| Agora, players, contracts |
> > > > | Products| Treasuror| Agora, players, contracts |
> > > > | Blots   | Referee  | Persons   |
> > > > +-+--+---+
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ASSET BALANCES
> >  (self-ratifies)
> > > >
> > 
> > > >
> > > > +--++++++++++
> > > > |  Player  |Coin|VcC.|JsC.|LgC.|VtC.|VPt.|BBG.|Pdt.|XVt.|
> > > > +==++++++++++
> > > > |Aris  | 700|   0|   0|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > > > |ATMunn|  89|   1|   0|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0| 

Re: BUS: Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [ADoP ] Salaries - also [Treasuror CoE]

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

Also the re-done report was published to A-B which is also probably why I
missed it, but I am sorry for making the first mistake

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 6:49 PM Rebecca  wrote:

> Okay, you're right about the first one (side-eye @ falsifian) but the
> second one is surely just a response to a COE and republishing the first
> report, not a new monthly report right?
>
> On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 1:30 PM Edward Murphy via agora-business <
> agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
>> R. Lee wrote:
>>
>> > On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 7:04 AM Edward Murphy via agora-discussion <
>> > agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>> >
>> >> R. Lee wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> Salaries
>> >>>
>> >>> I award the following players the following amount of money for their
>> >>> officer reports and assessor resolutions (since Murphy last paid
>> salary).
>> >>> For more information, see the recent events section of my last weekly
>> >>> report. For anyone worried about some players having filed more weekly
>> >>> reports than others in this period, don’t worry, everyone below has
>> >> filed 1
>> >>> per Agoran week in that time, the pay will all be the same in the end.
>> >>>
>> >>> R. Lee: 15 coins (Notary weekly x2, ADoP weekly x1)
>> >>>
>> >>> Murphy: 5 coins (ADoP weekly x1)
>> >>> Aris: 10 coins (Promotor weekly x2)
>> >>>
>> >>> Falsifian: 20 coins (Registrar weekly x3, Registrar monthly x1)
>> >>>
>> >>> PSS: 20 coins (Tailor monthly x1, Referee weekly x1, Herald monthly
>> x1,
>> >>> Herald weekly x1)
>> >>>
>> >>> G.: 5 coins (Arbitor weekly x1)
>> >>>
>> >>> Jason: 10 coins (Assessor Assessments x1, SLR x1)
>> >>>
>> >>> Trigon: 10 coins (Treasuror weekly x2)
>> >>>
>> >>> Nch: 5 coins (Webmastor monthly x1)
>> >>
>> >> Having mostly caught up on my own records, my salary automation script
>> >> picked up the following. Differences (which might be recording errors
>> >> on my part or R. Lee's, I haven't hit up the archives to check):
>> >> * I recorded Falsifian as publishing Registrar weekly x2, not x3
>> >> * I recorded PSS as publishing Tailor monthly x2, not x1
>> >>
>> >> (weekly)
>> >>
>> >> Sun, May 24 2020 (18:00:24) - Murphy published the ADoP's weekly report
>> >> Mon, May 25 2020 (22:01:05) - Aris published the proposal pool
>> >> Tue, May 26 2020 (02:59:08) - R. Lee published the Notary's weekly
>> report
>> >> Sat, May 30 2020 (04:42:24) - Falsifian published the Registrar's
>> weekly
>> >> report
>> >> Sun, May 31 2020 (10:41:22) - PSS published the Referee's weekly report
>> >> Sun, May 31 2020 (10:46:23) - PSS published the Herald's weekly report
>> >> Sun, May 31 2020 (19:23:25) - G. published the Arbitor's weekly report
>> >> Sun, May 31 2020 (22:13:50) - Trigon published the Treasuror's weekly
>> >> report
>> >> Tue, Jun 02 2020 (19:23:30) - Falsifian published the Registrar's
>> weekly
>> >> report
>> >> Wed, Jun 03 2020 (01:48:29) - Aris published the proposal pool
>> >> Wed, Jun 03 2020 (03:05:57) - R. Lee published the Notary's weekly
>> report
>> >> Thu, Jun 04 2020 (23:48:17) - Jason published the Short Logical Ruleset
>> >> Fri, Jun 05 2020 (05:57:47) - Trigon published the Treasuror's weekly
>> >> report
>> >> Sun, Jun 07 2020 (10:07:36) - R. Lee published the ADoP's weekly report
>> >>
>> >> plus the Assessor's first proposal resolution per week since 2020-05-24
>> >> 18:00:24 (patched in manually, not tracked in database)
>> >>
>> >> (monthly)
>> >>
>> >> Sat, May 30 2020 (05:04:28) - Falsifian published the Registrar's
>> >> monthly report
>> >> Sun, May 31 2020 (10:40:06) - PSS published the Herald's monthly report
>> >> Sun, May 31 2020 (10:51:45) - PSS published the Tailor's monthly report
>> >> Mon, Jun 01 2020 (00:32:34) - PSS published the Tailor's monthly report
>> >> Wed, Jun 03 2020 (05:02:09) - nch published the Webmastor's monthly
>> report
>> >>
>> >>
>> >

Re: BUS: Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [ADoP ] Salaries - also [Treasuror CoE]

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

Okay, you're right about the first one (side-eye @ falsifian) but the
second one is surely just a response to a COE and republishing the first
report, not a new monthly report right?

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 1:30 PM Edward Murphy via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> R. Lee wrote:
>
> > On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 7:04 AM Edward Murphy via agora-discussion <
> > agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> >> R. Lee wrote:
> >>
> >>> Salaries
> >>>
> >>> I award the following players the following amount of money for their
> >>> officer reports and assessor resolutions (since Murphy last paid
> salary).
> >>> For more information, see the recent events section of my last weekly
> >>> report. For anyone worried about some players having filed more weekly
> >>> reports than others in this period, don’t worry, everyone below has
> >> filed 1
> >>> per Agoran week in that time, the pay will all be the same in the end.
> >>>
> >>> R. Lee: 15 coins (Notary weekly x2, ADoP weekly x1)
> >>>
> >>> Murphy: 5 coins (ADoP weekly x1)
> >>> Aris: 10 coins (Promotor weekly x2)
> >>>
> >>> Falsifian: 20 coins (Registrar weekly x3, Registrar monthly x1)
> >>>
> >>> PSS: 20 coins (Tailor monthly x1, Referee weekly x1, Herald monthly x1,
> >>> Herald weekly x1)
> >>>
> >>> G.: 5 coins (Arbitor weekly x1)
> >>>
> >>> Jason: 10 coins (Assessor Assessments x1, SLR x1)
> >>>
> >>> Trigon: 10 coins (Treasuror weekly x2)
> >>>
> >>> Nch: 5 coins (Webmastor monthly x1)
> >>
> >> Having mostly caught up on my own records, my salary automation script
> >> picked up the following. Differences (which might be recording errors
> >> on my part or R. Lee's, I haven't hit up the archives to check):
> >> * I recorded Falsifian as publishing Registrar weekly x2, not x3
> >> * I recorded PSS as publishing Tailor monthly x2, not x1
> >>
> >> (weekly)
> >>
> >> Sun, May 24 2020 (18:00:24) - Murphy published the ADoP's weekly report
> >> Mon, May 25 2020 (22:01:05) - Aris published the proposal pool
> >> Tue, May 26 2020 (02:59:08) - R. Lee published the Notary's weekly
> report
> >> Sat, May 30 2020 (04:42:24) - Falsifian published the Registrar's weekly
> >> report
> >> Sun, May 31 2020 (10:41:22) - PSS published the Referee's weekly report
> >> Sun, May 31 2020 (10:46:23) - PSS published the Herald's weekly report
> >> Sun, May 31 2020 (19:23:25) - G. published the Arbitor's weekly report
> >> Sun, May 31 2020 (22:13:50) - Trigon published the Treasuror's weekly
> >> report
> >> Tue, Jun 02 2020 (19:23:30) - Falsifian published the Registrar's weekly
> >> report
> >> Wed, Jun 03 2020 (01:48:29) - Aris published the proposal pool
> >> Wed, Jun 03 2020 (03:05:57) - R. Lee published the Notary's weekly
> report
> >> Thu, Jun 04 2020 (23:48:17) - Jason published the Short Logical Ruleset
> >> Fri, Jun 05 2020 (05:57:47) - Trigon published the Treasuror's weekly
> >> report
> >> Sun, Jun 07 2020 (10:07:36) - R. Lee published the ADoP's weekly report
> >>
> >> plus the Assessor's first proposal resolution per week since 2020-05-24
> >> 18:00:24 (patched in manually, not tracked in database)
> >>
> >> (monthly)
> >>
> >> Sat, May 30 2020 (05:04:28) - Falsifian published the Registrar's
> >> monthly report
> >> Sun, May 31 2020 (10:40:06) - PSS published the Herald's monthly report
> >> Sun, May 31 2020 (10:51:45) - PSS published the Tailor's monthly report
> >> Mon, Jun 01 2020 (00:32:34) - PSS published the Tailor's monthly report
> >> Wed, Jun 03 2020 (05:02:09) - nch published the Webmastor's monthly
> report
> >>
> >>
> > I checked the archives, I am 100% certain that for both differences mine
> > were correct. For the registrar, Falsifian published the weekly report
> on a
> > sunday, a saturday, and then tuesday.
>
> Both of these turn out to be obscure boundary cases, so the confusion is
> understandable. For Registrar, checking a-o, I found the following:
>
> 1) Mon 18 May, Falsifian published RWR
> 2) Sun 24 May, I paid salaries which included #1
> 3) Sun 24 May, Falsifian published RWR
> 4) Sat 30 May, Falsifian published RWR
> 5) Tue  2 Jun, Falsifian published RWR
>
> So e did do #3 #4 #5, however #3 shouldn't have counted toward salary
> because e already got salary for #1 which was earlier in the same week.
>
> CoE on the latest Treasuror's report (published 11 Jun so not yet
> ratified: Only two of the three entries
> "Falsifian  +   5c.   07 Jun 2020 10:10   Reward (Registrar weekly)"
> were effective.
>
> > For the Tailor PSS didn't publish
> > reports on both May 31 and Jun 1, because lol
>
> lol indeed, but actually e did. May 31, 10:51:45 UTC:
>
> https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-official/2020-May/013707.html
> then a correction to it to a-b, Jun 1 00:32:34 UTC:
>
> https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2020-June/042975.html
> so by the letter of the rules, the latter fulfilled eir duty to
> publish the report in June, and e is due a sala

Re: DIS: Draft report feedback

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

I also transferred 50 coins to that contract as well, they are now in the
department. a,ll these events are actually listed in teh "recent events"
section but not in the self-ratifying body

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 6:44 PM Reuben Staley via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 2020-06-15 02:41, Cuddle Beam via agora-discussion wrote:
> > What is signalling? The "[Attn. Treasuror]" thing, yes?
>
> That is correct.
>
> --
> Trigon
>
> Speaker and Treasuror of Agora; Former Rulekeepor (12 months) and
> Cartographor (8 months) of Agora; Champion of Agora by High Score and
> Proposal; Bearer of the Badge of the Salted Earth; Founder of the League
> of Agorans Facilitating Effective Recordkeeping; Arcadian Revivalist;
> Sixth-Longest Continually Registered Player of Agora; Player and former
> Emperor of BlogNomic; Player, Book-keeper, and Originator of the
> Metaruleset of Infinite Nomic; Contributor to the nomic.club wiki and
> the Talk:Nomic page on Wikipedia.
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Draft report feedback

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

I actually have 0 cards of any type. I transferred 2 to Aris's lottery and
the other 2 to my now-destroyed contract, they reside in the Lost and Found
department now.

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 6:42 PM Cuddle Beam via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> >can we try to remember signalling
>
> What is signalling? The "[Attn. Treasuror]" thing, yes?
>
> On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 10:30 AM Reuben Staley via agora-discussion <
> agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
> > It's me again! Just popping in to ask everyone's thoughts on this. I
> > usually do the Treasuror stuff around Wednesday but there's been a bit
> > of extra work this past week so I'm putting out a mid-week draft report.
> > I think I did a pretty good job, but there were so many messages that I
> > probably missed something.
> >
> > I don't like asking people to go out of their way for me, but *please*
> > can we try to remember signalling? It makes everyone's transactions *so*
> > much more visible.
> >
> > This is also feedback for the new report style. I'm not fully satisfied
> > with the way it is now, so I absolutely *need* everyone's feedback on
> > how everything looks. I'm ready to change lots.
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> > 
> >  FORBES FOUR HUNDRED NINETY-THREE
> >    or   
> > TREASUROR'S WEEKLY REPORT
> > 
> >
> > Date of last official report:  11 Jun 2020
> > Date of this report:   whenever
> >
> > (all times and dates in UTC)
> >
> >
> > NOTES ON REPORT   (contains no data)
> > 
> >
> > * As always, please check the accuracy of this report.
> >
> >
> > ASSET INDEX   (does not self-ratify)
> > 
> >
> > +-+--+---+
> > | Asset class | Recordkeepor | Ownership |
> > +=+==+===+
> > | Coins   | Treasuror| Agora, players, contracts |
> > | Cards   | Treasuror| Agora, players, contracts |
> > | Products| Treasuror| Agora, players, contracts |
> > | Blots   | Referee  | Persons   |
> > +-+--+---+
> >
> >
> > ASSET BALANCES   (self-ratifies)
> > 
> >
> > +--++++++++++
> > |  Player  |Coin|VcC.|JsC.|LgC.|VtC.|VPt.|BBG.|Pdt.|XVt.|
> > +==++++++++++
> > |Aris  | 700|   0|   0|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |ATMunn|  89|   1|   0|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |Baron | 115|   1|   1|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |Cuddlebeam|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |D. Margaux|1259|   1|   1|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |Falsifian | 141|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |G.| 928|   1|   1|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |Gaelan|  58|   1|   1|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |grok  |  35|   1|   1|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |Jason | 682|   1|   1|   2|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |Murphy| 235|   1|   1|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |omd   | 286|   1|   1|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |nch   |  89|   1|   1|   2|   2|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |Publius   | 156|   1|   1|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |R. Lee| 128|   1|   1|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |sukil |  35|   1|   1|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |Trigon|  90|   1|   1|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > +--++++++++++
> >
> > +--++++++++++
> > |  Entity  |Coin|VcC.|JsC.|LgC.|VtC.|VPt.|BBG.|Pdt.|XVt.|
> > +==++++++++++
> > |Agora |2300|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |CB Locker | 116|   1|   1|   1|   1|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |D. Corp.  | 495|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |DracoLotto|   0|   3|   3|   1|   3|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |L&F Dept. | 575|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > |NAX   |  15|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|   0|
> > +--++++++++++
> >
> > All other Entities have 0 of all enumerated assets.
> >
> >
> > RECENT HISTORY(does not self-ratify)
> > 
> >
> > Abbreviations used:
> >
> > +--+-+
> > | Ab

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: DracoLotto

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

the voting card failed, not necessarily the victory card

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 5:45 PM Reuben Staley via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 2020-06-13 15:23, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:
> > On 6/13/20 5:21 PM, Aris Merchant via agora-business wrote:
> >> On Sat, Jun 13, 2020 at 1:36 PM James Cook via agora-business <
> >> agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >>
>  I amend this contract to read as follows (just a few bug fixes):
> 
>  DracoLotto
> >>> I join DracoLotto and transfer to it one card of each of the four
> types.
> >>>
> >>> - Falsifian
> >>
> >> I transfer the DracoLotto one justice card, one voting card, and one
> >> victory card.
> >>
> >> -Aris
> >>
> >>>
> >
> > I become party to DracoLotto and transfer it one voting card and one
> > victory card.
> >
>
> This failed since you already transferred your voting card to the NAX.
>
> --
> Trigon
> Speaker and Treasuror of Agora; Former Rulekeepor (12 months) and
> Cartographor (8 months) of Agora; Champion of Agora by High Score and
> Proposal; Bearer of the Badge of the Salted Earth; Founder of the League
> of Agorans Facilitating Effective Recordkeeping; Arcadian Revivalist;
> Sixth-Longest Continually Registered Player of Agora; Player and former
> Emperor of BlogNomic; Player, Book-keeper, and Originator of the
> Metaruleset of Infinite Nomic; Contributor to the nomic.club wiki and
> the Talk:Nomic page on Wikipedia.
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: [NoH] Re: BUS: Agora Birthday

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

Welcome to honourless wormhood

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 1:09 PM James Cook via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On Sun, 14 Jun 2020 at 01:25, Jason Cobb via agora-business
>  wrote:
> > On 6/13/20 9:22 PM, Rebecca via agora-business wrote:
> > > I have no idea what exact day I registered for Agora, but I know with
> > > certainty that it was mid-June, 2017 (under the name V.J. Rada). I
> intend
> > > with agoran consent to set my Agoran Birthday at 19 June.
> > >
> >
> > I object. It is known that you registered with message [0], which would
> > set your date of registration to 7 Jun 2017.
> >
> > [0]:
> >
> https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2017-June/035041.html
> >
> > --
> > Jason Cobb
>
> Thanks for digging that up. It turns out that was missing from my
> monthly report. I guess it is because this deregistration was not
> recorded there:
>
>
> https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2017-August/035517.html
>
> Notice of Honour:
> +1 Jason for setting the record straight.
> -1 Falsifian, on behalf of the office of the Registrar, for bad
> recordkeeping in August 2017.
>
> - Falsifian
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [ADoP] Election Initiations, also [attn Herald] Notice of Honour

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

It was already resolved, sorry!

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 7:07 AM Edward Murphy via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> R. Lee wrote:
>
> > I, the ADoP, initiate elections for the interim offices of ADoP and
> > Webmastor. I become a candidate for ADoP.
>
> I become a candidate for ADoP. (Ineffective if election has already been
> resolved; I still have about a week's worth of a-o to catch up on.)
>
> Notice of Honour:
> -1 Murphy (falling behind again)
> +1 R. Lee (picking up the slack)
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: [Ribbons and Glitter] Question about Transparent Ribbons AND Re: OFF: [Assessor] Resolution of Proposals 8409-8430

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

It says "the number of other types of ribbons", which for sure means 5
different unique ribbons

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 4:59 AM Publius Scribonius Scholasticus via
agora-business  wrote:

> On 6/14/20 1:39 PM, Jason Cobb via agora-official wrote:
> > RESOLUTION OF PROPOSALS 8409-8430
> > =
>
> I earn a Red Ribbon for Proposal 8422. I award myself Orange Glitter for
> Proposal 8422. I earn an Orange Ribbon for Proposal 8430. Ι earn a Lime
> Ribbon for Proposal 8408, 8416, and 8424.
>
> Also, a question about Transparent Ribbons: Does it have to be five
> unique ribbons or could it be five instances of qualification?
>
> --
> 
> Publius Scribonius Scholasticus, Herald, Referee, Tailor, Pirate
> Champion, Badge of the Great Agoran Revival, Badge of the Salted Earth
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: ATTN ADoP

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

I literally did as soon as I was allowed to and I woke up, chill

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 5:03 AM ATMunn via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> hi its been 7 days can the notary election please be resolved thanks
>
> --
> ATMunn
> future notary here :)
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [ADoP ] Salaries

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 7:04 AM Edward Murphy via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> R. Lee wrote:
>
> > Salaries
> >
> > I award the following players the following amount of money for their
> > officer reports and assessor resolutions (since Murphy last paid salary).
> > For more information, see the recent events section of my last weekly
> > report. For anyone worried about some players having filed more weekly
> > reports than others in this period, don’t worry, everyone below has
> filed 1
> > per Agoran week in that time, the pay will all be the same in the end.
> >
> > R. Lee: 15 coins (Notary weekly x2, ADoP weekly x1)
> >
> > Murphy: 5 coins (ADoP weekly x1)
> > Aris: 10 coins (Promotor weekly x2)
> >
> > Falsifian: 20 coins (Registrar weekly x3, Registrar monthly x1)
> >
> > PSS: 20 coins (Tailor monthly x1, Referee weekly x1, Herald monthly x1,
> > Herald weekly x1)
> >
> > G.: 5 coins (Arbitor weekly x1)
> >
> > Jason: 10 coins (Assessor Assessments x1, SLR x1)
> >
> > Trigon: 10 coins (Treasuror weekly x2)
> >
> > Nch: 5 coins (Webmastor monthly x1)
>
> Having mostly caught up on my own records, my salary automation script
> picked up the following. Differences (which might be recording errors
> on my part or R. Lee's, I haven't hit up the archives to check):
>* I recorded Falsifian as publishing Registrar weekly x2, not x3
>* I recorded PSS as publishing Tailor monthly x2, not x1
>
> (weekly)
>
> Sun, May 24 2020 (18:00:24) - Murphy published the ADoP's weekly report
> Mon, May 25 2020 (22:01:05) - Aris published the proposal pool
> Tue, May 26 2020 (02:59:08) - R. Lee published the Notary's weekly report
> Sat, May 30 2020 (04:42:24) - Falsifian published the Registrar's weekly
> report
> Sun, May 31 2020 (10:41:22) - PSS published the Referee's weekly report
> Sun, May 31 2020 (10:46:23) - PSS published the Herald's weekly report
> Sun, May 31 2020 (19:23:25) - G. published the Arbitor's weekly report
> Sun, May 31 2020 (22:13:50) - Trigon published the Treasuror's weekly
> report
> Tue, Jun 02 2020 (19:23:30) - Falsifian published the Registrar's weekly
> report
> Wed, Jun 03 2020 (01:48:29) - Aris published the proposal pool
> Wed, Jun 03 2020 (03:05:57) - R. Lee published the Notary's weekly report
> Thu, Jun 04 2020 (23:48:17) - Jason published the Short Logical Ruleset
> Fri, Jun 05 2020 (05:57:47) - Trigon published the Treasuror's weekly
> report
> Sun, Jun 07 2020 (10:07:36) - R. Lee published the ADoP's weekly report
>
> plus the Assessor's first proposal resolution per week since 2020-05-24
> 18:00:24 (patched in manually, not tracked in database)
>
> (monthly)
>
> Sat, May 30 2020 (05:04:28) - Falsifian published the Registrar's
> monthly report
> Sun, May 31 2020 (10:40:06) - PSS published the Herald's monthly report
> Sun, May 31 2020 (10:51:45) - PSS published the Tailor's monthly report
> Mon, Jun 01 2020 (00:32:34) - PSS published the Tailor's monthly report
> Wed, Jun 03 2020 (05:02:09) - nch published the Webmastor's monthly report
>
>
I checked the archives, I am 100% certain that for both differences mine
were correct. For the registrar, Falsifian published the weekly report on a
sunday, a saturday, and then tuesday. For the Tailor PSS didn't publish
reports on both May 31 and Jun 1, because lol
-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: [Treasuror] New Report Format

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 11:14 PM lucidiot via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On Sunday 14 June 2020 09:00, Reuben Staley via agora-discussion wrote:
>
> > On 2020-06-13 21:53, Jason Cobb via agora-discussion wrote:
> >
> > > On 6/13/20 11:48 PM, lucidiot via agora-discussion wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Sunday 14 June 2020 05:33, Reuben Staley via agora-discussion
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > On 2020-06-13 21:32, Jason Cobb via agora-discussion wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > > -- Trigon Speaker and Treasuror of Agora; Former Rulekeepor (12
> > > > > > > months) and Cartographor (8 months) of Agora; Champion of
> Agora by
> > > > > > > High Score and Proposal; Badge of the Salted Earth;
> Sixth-Longest
> > > > > > > Continually Registered Player of Agora; Player and former
> Emperor of
> > > > > > > BlogNomic; Player, Book-keeper, and originator of the
> Metaruleset of
> > > > > > > Infinite Nomic.
> > > > > > > And I thought this was going to be a temporary joke. How
> foolish of me.
> > > > > > > I'm going to keep it until someone has to come to me in
> desperation and
> > > > > > > beg me to remove it.
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Trigon
> > > > > Speaker and Treasuror of Agora; Former Rulekeepor (12 months) and
> > > > > Cartographor (8 months) of Agora; Champion of Agora by High Score
> and
> > > > > Proposal; Badge of the Salted Earth; Sixth-Longest Continually
> > > > > Registered Player of Agora; Player and former Emperor of BlogNomic;
> > > > > Player, Book-keeper, and originator of the Metaruleset of Infinite
> Nomic.
> > > > > You might want to squeeze "Founder of the League of Agorans
> Facilitating Effective Recordkeeping" in there
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > ~lucidiot
> > >
> > > Also. "contributor to the Talk:Nomic page on Wikipedia".
> >
> > Welcome, lucidiot! It's always great to see new people who show interest
> > in our weird game.
> >
> > And thank you both for your wonderful contributions. I've added a few
> > new ones of my own as well. You are contributing to an important cause.
> >
> >
> -
> >
> > Trigon
> >
> > Speaker and Treasuror of Agora; Former Rulekeepor (12 months) and
> > Cartographor (8 months) of Agora; Champion of Agora by High Score and
> > Proposal; Bearer of the Badge of the Salted Earth; Founder of the League
> > of Agorans Facilitating Effective Recordkeeping; Arcadian Revivalist;
> > Sixth-Longest Continually Registered Player of Agora; Player and former
> > Emperor of BlogNomic; Player, Book-keeper, and Originator of the
> > Metaruleset of Infinite Nomic; Contributor to the nomic.club wiki and
> > the Talk:Nomic page on Wikipedia.
>
> Mmmhhh, could that turn into a Signature Length Tournament‽
>
> --
> ~lucidiot, far from winning the tournament
>

you could just put any old text in there though lol
-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: [Treasuror] New Report Format

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 5:21 PM Aris Merchant via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On Sat, Jun 13, 2020 at 11:30 PM Reuben Staley via agora-discussion
>  wrote:
> >
> > On 2020-06-13 22:55, Reuben Staley wrote:
> > > On 2020-06-13 22:27, Rebecca via agora-discussion wrote:
> > >> I personally dislike the new format as gmail does NOT give agoran
> > >> messages
> > >> to me in fixed width, thus I need to access the archives to read
> messages
> > >> like this (which I forgot my password to years ago). I overall prefer
> > >> less
> > >> compactness in reports as I don't like the extreme misalignment that
> > >> everything comes into my client with. But I'm aware that there's
> > >> probably a
> > >> way to fix this and it's just a me problem.
> > > I am open to suggestions if you have a different way to display this.
> > > I'm not going to have nine tables as big as the current one, but I am
> > > open to suggestions.
> >
> > Okay, so after I complained at you guys I realized that my table system
> > is really similar to markdown's, which GitHub pages can interpret and
> > turn into HTML.
> >
> > I wasn't planning on doing HTML reports for this office, but I had
> > finally found an excuse to use awk for something, so whatever.
> >
> > Wow, that was a lot of boring words.
> >
> > TL;DR: https://agoranomic.org/Treasuror/test
> >
> > Tell me that's not beautiful. You can't!
>
> It is beautiful. It's a lot easier to read too. I was going to tell em
> how to make gmail do that tomorrow when I had energy, but this is so
> good I'll probably be using instead of the email version.
>
> -Aris
>
its very nice

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: [Webmastor] Informal Polling

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

we can be a little overly rude to people who misinterpret the rules or
forget about a rule or two but if anyone actually tries to tell you they've
never made a similar mistake or that they actually understand and remember
all the rules, they are lying.

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 2:41 PM Rebecca  wrote:

> Welcome lucidiot as well. We have treated some new players poorly in the
> past (we were awful to Cuddlebeam when e first joined) but I'd like to
> think we are relatively welcoming. Expectations might be high (maybe too
> high) for someone like PSS who holds like a million offices. I think what
> would be most useful to say and understand is that Agora is multifaceted
> enough that you can put in as much or as little effort as you like. You can
> hold a million offices and try hard to win every subgame, or you can just
> vote on proposals and judge a CFJ or two, or you can take no game actions
> at all and just offer your opinions/discuss things and those are all valid
> ways to play.
>
> On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 2:37 PM Rebecca  wrote:
>
>> * What should be on the main page? [it's pretty outdated now, and I feel
>> like it could use a facelift and some new copy]
>> The Ruleset should have more prominent links and be updated to remove
>> outdated info and with the current name of the Rulekeepor. "As of May 2017"
>> should obviously be updated periodically to the current month. G. should
>> fix the gaps in eir CFJ database and I have pledged to give em all my
>> assets if e does so, so that's pretty cool.
>> * What kinds of tips should go on a New Player page?
>> I honestly think not much, maybe a few more tips on the technical side of
>> things (mailing lists are an old technology  that it is more likely to not
>> be understood than was the case a long time ago). Some appealing events
>> from our history, maybe
>> * What online resources do you use the most?
>> The ruleset I always use from the weblink, sometimes CFJ databases, and I
>> really like and often read Falsifian's reportor reports: we really need to
>> start compensating em with game assets for those reports/
>> * What resources do you wish were online?
>> Updated stuff for every office. HOWEVER i have no idea how to edit a
>> website or make my own office page or update it, so it's hypocritical from
>> me I guess.
>> * How do you access Agora? [your email's web client, a desktop client,
>> phone client]
>> gmail.com which is kind of bad.
>> * Any tips or tricks that you use on the devices/software that you
>> access Agora through that you find indispensable?
>> Gmail's search function is excellent and usually dispenses with the need
>> to use the archives for me.
>> * Anything else that you think would help improve the web content?
>> Idk
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 2:16 PM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
>> agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On 6/13/20 11:43 PM, lucidiot via agora-discussion wrote:
>>> > Hello there!  First time posting here!
>>>
>>> Welcome!
>>>
>>>
>>> > On Sunday 14 June 2020 03:27, nch via agora-discussion wrote:
>>> >> Some questions to help me plan some improvements to the web content.
>>> >>
>>> >> * What should be on the main page? [it's pretty outdated now, and I
>>> feel
>>> >> like it could use a facelift and some new copy]
>>> > Falsifian's weekly reports have been very helpful to keep up on the
>>> general state of the game (thank you so much!) and sometimes bring
>>> interpretations of the discussions that I had not understood while
>>> binge-reading through all the emails.
>>> >
>>> > The site could turn into a blog and show those reports (maybe along
>>> other 'articles' like theses or anything Agorans want to publish?), making
>>> the homepage get updated regularly and allowing new visitors to see that
>>> the game is still quite active and the type of play to expect.
>>>
>>>
>>> +1 on keeping it updated; when I was looking at before joining, I
>>> thought "oh no, is this dead?", at least until looking at the public
>>> archives.
>>>
>>>
>>> >> * What kinds of tips should go on a New Player page?
>>> > I haven't been sending anything on the lists for a while because I do
>>> not feel confident at all!  There is a lot to learn and a lot of history to
>>> uncover, and archives, sites, repos are quite scattered.
>>>
>>>
>>

Re: DIS: [Webmastor] Informal Polling

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

Welcome lucidiot as well. We have treated some new players poorly in the
past (we were awful to Cuddlebeam when e first joined) but I'd like to
think we are relatively welcoming. Expectations might be high (maybe too
high) for someone like PSS who holds like a million offices. I think what
would be most useful to say and understand is that Agora is multifaceted
enough that you can put in as much or as little effort as you like. You can
hold a million offices and try hard to win every subgame, or you can just
vote on proposals and judge a CFJ or two, or you can take no game actions
at all and just offer your opinions/discuss things and those are all valid
ways to play.

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 2:37 PM Rebecca  wrote:

> * What should be on the main page? [it's pretty outdated now, and I feel
> like it could use a facelift and some new copy]
> The Ruleset should have more prominent links and be updated to remove
> outdated info and with the current name of the Rulekeepor. "As of May 2017"
> should obviously be updated periodically to the current month. G. should
> fix the gaps in eir CFJ database and I have pledged to give em all my
> assets if e does so, so that's pretty cool.
> * What kinds of tips should go on a New Player page?
> I honestly think not much, maybe a few more tips on the technical side of
> things (mailing lists are an old technology  that it is more likely to not
> be understood than was the case a long time ago). Some appealing events
> from our history, maybe
> * What online resources do you use the most?
> The ruleset I always use from the weblink, sometimes CFJ databases, and I
> really like and often read Falsifian's reportor reports: we really need to
> start compensating em with game assets for those reports/
> * What resources do you wish were online?
> Updated stuff for every office. HOWEVER i have no idea how to edit a
> website or make my own office page or update it, so it's hypocritical from
> me I guess.
> * How do you access Agora? [your email's web client, a desktop client,
> phone client]
> gmail.com which is kind of bad.
> * Any tips or tricks that you use on the devices/software that you
> access Agora through that you find indispensable?
> Gmail's search function is excellent and usually dispenses with the need
> to use the archives for me.
> * Anything else that you think would help improve the web content?
> Idk
>
> On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 2:16 PM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
> agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
>> On 6/13/20 11:43 PM, lucidiot via agora-discussion wrote:
>> > Hello there!  First time posting here!
>>
>> Welcome!
>>
>>
>> > On Sunday 14 June 2020 03:27, nch via agora-discussion wrote:
>> >> Some questions to help me plan some improvements to the web content.
>> >>
>> >> * What should be on the main page? [it's pretty outdated now, and I
>> feel
>> >> like it could use a facelift and some new copy]
>> > Falsifian's weekly reports have been very helpful to keep up on the
>> general state of the game (thank you so much!) and sometimes bring
>> interpretations of the discussions that I had not understood while
>> binge-reading through all the emails.
>> >
>> > The site could turn into a blog and show those reports (maybe along
>> other 'articles' like theses or anything Agorans want to publish?), making
>> the homepage get updated regularly and allowing new visitors to see that
>> the game is still quite active and the type of play to expect.
>>
>>
>> +1 on keeping it updated; when I was looking at before joining, I
>> thought "oh no, is this dead?", at least until looking at the public
>> archives.
>>
>>
>> >> * What kinds of tips should go on a New Player page?
>> > I haven't been sending anything on the lists for a while because I do
>> not feel confident at all!  There is a lot to learn and a lot of history to
>> uncover, and archives, sites, repos are quite scattered.
>>
>>
>> There's no reason to be scared of sending mail to the lists; most people
>> try to be as forgiving as reasonable, especially for new players :).
>> That was my experience, at least.
>>
>> Also, we try to keep a lot of the code and reports on the AgoraNomic
>> Github org [0].
>>
>>
>> > This just leads me to suggest to have reminders in this page that it is
>> okay to start small, to ask questions, that the expectations are lower than
>> they seem to be, or that everyone is always friendly and welcoming (even
>> during hard times); those are what I have been

Re: DIS: [Webmastor] Informal Polling

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

* What should be on the main page? [it's pretty outdated now, and I feel
like it could use a facelift and some new copy]
The Ruleset should have more prominent links and be updated to remove
outdated info and with the current name of the Rulekeepor. "As of May 2017"
should obviously be updated periodically to the current month. G. should
fix the gaps in eir CFJ database and I have pledged to give em all my
assets if e does so, so that's pretty cool.
* What kinds of tips should go on a New Player page?
I honestly think not much, maybe a few more tips on the technical side of
things (mailing lists are an old technology  that it is more likely to not
be understood than was the case a long time ago). Some appealing events
from our history, maybe
* What online resources do you use the most?
The ruleset I always use from the weblink, sometimes CFJ databases, and I
really like and often read Falsifian's reportor reports: we really need to
start compensating em with game assets for those reports/
* What resources do you wish were online?
Updated stuff for every office. HOWEVER i have no idea how to edit a
website or make my own office page or update it, so it's hypocritical from
me I guess.
* How do you access Agora? [your email's web client, a desktop client,
phone client]
gmail.com which is kind of bad.
* Any tips or tricks that you use on the devices/software that you
access Agora through that you find indispensable?
Gmail's search function is excellent and usually dispenses with the need to
use the archives for me.
* Anything else that you think would help improve the web content?
Idk

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 2:16 PM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/13/20 11:43 PM, lucidiot via agora-discussion wrote:
> > Hello there!  First time posting here!
>
> Welcome!
>
>
> > On Sunday 14 June 2020 03:27, nch via agora-discussion wrote:
> >> Some questions to help me plan some improvements to the web content.
> >>
> >> * What should be on the main page? [it's pretty outdated now, and I feel
> >> like it could use a facelift and some new copy]
> > Falsifian's weekly reports have been very helpful to keep up on the
> general state of the game (thank you so much!) and sometimes bring
> interpretations of the discussions that I had not understood while
> binge-reading through all the emails.
> >
> > The site could turn into a blog and show those reports (maybe along
> other 'articles' like theses or anything Agorans want to publish?), making
> the homepage get updated regularly and allowing new visitors to see that
> the game is still quite active and the type of play to expect.
>
>
> +1 on keeping it updated; when I was looking at before joining, I
> thought "oh no, is this dead?", at least until looking at the public
> archives.
>
>
> >> * What kinds of tips should go on a New Player page?
> > I haven't been sending anything on the lists for a while because I do
> not feel confident at all!  There is a lot to learn and a lot of history to
> uncover, and archives, sites, repos are quite scattered.
>
>
> There's no reason to be scared of sending mail to the lists; most people
> try to be as forgiving as reasonable, especially for new players :).
> That was my experience, at least.
>
> Also, we try to keep a lot of the code and reports on the AgoraNomic
> Github org [0].
>
>
> > This just leads me to suggest to have reminders in this page that it is
> okay to start small, to ask questions, that the expectations are lower than
> they seem to be, or that everyone is always friendly and welcoming (even
> during hard times); those are what I have been trying to tell myself to
> convince myself to reply, but reading them from someone else would
> definitely help.
> >
> > The page could also include a reference to a netiquette, or common
> practices for posting such as the DIS/BUS/OFF prefixes, referencing links
> with annotations like [0].  I had to explain what bottom-posting means to
> someone yesterday, on an unrelated project.
>
>
> The mailing lists should be adding the prefixes automatically, so long
> as you send it to the right list's email address.
>
>
> >> * What online resources do you use the most?
> > Since it is linked on the homepage, I had used the public archives at
> mail-archive.com quite a lot to get an overview of the game before
> subscribing to the lists.
> >
> > I no longer use this as I just get the emails, but I regularly use
> Gaelan's ruleset page [0]. It shows HTTP 502 errors half of the time, and
> right now it has HTTP 500, possibly due to recent changes in the FLR, but I
> still like it since it makes browsing the rules easier with hyperlinks on
> key concepts. That is a very welcome thing when you want to learn the rules!
>
>
> I've been considering rewriting the ruleset generation for a while, and
> that might permit a functional HTML ruleset viewer.
>
>
> > - A glossary of acronyms; I am still unsure about what CotC means, and
> it took me a while t

Re: DIS: [Treasuror] New Report Format

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

also if those are the actual current numbers you have, be aware that i
currently have no cards, the lottery has some cards, the L&F department has
two of my cards now, etc

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 1:53 PM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/13/20 11:48 PM, lucidiot via agora-discussion wrote:
> > On Sunday 14 June 2020 05:33, Reuben Staley via agora-discussion wrote:
> >
> >> On 2020-06-13 21:32, Jason Cobb via agora-discussion wrote:
> >>
>  -- Trigon Speaker and Treasuror of Agora; Former Rulekeepor (12
>  months) and Cartographor (8 months) of Agora; Champion of Agora by
>  High Score and Proposal; Badge of the Salted Earth; Sixth-Longest
>  Continually Registered Player of Agora; Player and former Emperor of
>  BlogNomic; Player, Book-keeper, and originator of the Metaruleset of
>  Infinite Nomic.
> >>> And I thought this was going to be a temporary joke. How foolish of me.
> >> I'm going to keep it until someone has to come to me in desperation and
> >> beg me to remove it.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Trigon
> >> Speaker and Treasuror of Agora; Former Rulekeepor (12 months) and
> >> Cartographor (8 months) of Agora; Champion of Agora by High Score and
> >> Proposal; Badge of the Salted Earth; Sixth-Longest Continually
> >> Registered Player of Agora; Player and former Emperor of BlogNomic;
> >> Player, Book-keeper, and originator of the Metaruleset of Infinite
> Nomic.
> > You might want to squeeze "Founder of the League of Agorans Facilitating
> Effective Recordkeeping" in there
> >
> > --
> > ~lucidiot
>
>
> Also. "contributor to the Talk:Nomic page on Wikipedia".
>
> --
> Jason Cobb
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: [Treasuror] New Report Format

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

I personally dislike the new format as gmail does NOT give agoran messages
to me in fixed width, thus I need to access the archives to read messages
like this (which I forgot my password to years ago). I overall prefer less
compactness in reports as I don't like the extreme misalignment that
everything comes into my client with. But I'm aware that there's probably a
way to fix this and it's just a me problem.

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 1:53 PM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/13/20 11:48 PM, lucidiot via agora-discussion wrote:
> > On Sunday 14 June 2020 05:33, Reuben Staley via agora-discussion wrote:
> >
> >> On 2020-06-13 21:32, Jason Cobb via agora-discussion wrote:
> >>
>  -- Trigon Speaker and Treasuror of Agora; Former Rulekeepor (12
>  months) and Cartographor (8 months) of Agora; Champion of Agora by
>  High Score and Proposal; Badge of the Salted Earth; Sixth-Longest
>  Continually Registered Player of Agora; Player and former Emperor of
>  BlogNomic; Player, Book-keeper, and originator of the Metaruleset of
>  Infinite Nomic.
> >>> And I thought this was going to be a temporary joke. How foolish of me.
> >> I'm going to keep it until someone has to come to me in desperation and
> >> beg me to remove it.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Trigon
> >> Speaker and Treasuror of Agora; Former Rulekeepor (12 months) and
> >> Cartographor (8 months) of Agora; Champion of Agora by High Score and
> >> Proposal; Badge of the Salted Earth; Sixth-Longest Continually
> >> Registered Player of Agora; Player and former Emperor of BlogNomic;
> >> Player, Book-keeper, and originator of the Metaruleset of Infinite
> Nomic.
> > You might want to squeeze "Founder of the League of Agorans Facilitating
> Effective Recordkeeping" in there
> >
> > --
> > ~lucidiot
>
>
> Also. "contributor to the Talk:Nomic page on Wikipedia".
>
> --
> Jason Cobb
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Agora Birthday

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

lol do u have any ribbons you need to combine?

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 11:44 AM Publius Scribonius Scholasticus via
agora-discussion  wrote:

> It’s news to me as well.
>
> >> On Jun 13, 2020, at 21:31, Rebecca via agora-discussion <
> agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> > On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 11:29 AM nch via agora-discussion <
> > agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> >>>> On 6/13/20 8:24 PM, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:
> >>> On 6/13/20 9:22 PM, Rebecca via agora-business wrote:
> >>>> I have no idea what exact day I registered for Agora, but I know with
> >>>> certainty that it was mid-June, 2017 (under the name V.J. Rada). I
> >> intend
> >>>> with agoran consent to set my Agoran Birthday at 19 June.
> >>> I object. It is known that you registered with message [0], which would
> >>> set your date of registration to 7 Jun 2017.
> >>> [0]:
> >>
> https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2017-June/035041.html
> >>> --
> >>> Jason Cobb
> >> While we're figuring these out, does anyone have any idea when I first
> >> registered? I'm not actually sure what my first username was. Possible
> >> nichdel.
> >>
> >> --
> >> nch
> >> Webmastor, NAX Exchange Manager, Pirate
> >>
> >>
> >> Oh i had no idea you were the same person as em
> >
> > --
> > From R. Lee
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Agora Birthday

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 11:29 AM nch via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/13/20 8:24 PM, Jason Cobb via agora-business wrote:
> > On 6/13/20 9:22 PM, Rebecca via agora-business wrote:
> >> I have no idea what exact day I registered for Agora, but I know with
> >> certainty that it was mid-June, 2017 (under the name V.J. Rada). I
> intend
> >> with agoran consent to set my Agoran Birthday at 19 June.
> >>
> > I object. It is known that you registered with message [0], which would
> > set your date of registration to 7 Jun 2017.
> >
> > [0]:
> >
> https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2017-June/035041.html
> >
> > --
> > Jason Cobb
> >
> While we're figuring these out, does anyone have any idea when I first
> registered? I'm not actually sure what my first username was. Possible
> nichdel.
>
> --
> nch
> Webmastor, NAX Exchange Manager, Pirate
>
>
> Oh i had no idea you were the same person as em

-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: Agora Birthday

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

Nooo i was afraid of this

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 11:25 AM Jason Cobb via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/13/20 9:22 PM, Rebecca via agora-business wrote:
> > I have no idea what exact day I registered for Agora, but I know with
> > certainty that it was mid-June, 2017 (under the name V.J. Rada). I intend
> > with agoran consent to set my Agoran Birthday at 19 June.
> >
>
> I object. It is known that you registered with message [0], which would
> set your date of registration to 7 Jun 2017.
>
> [0]:
>
> https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2017-June/035041.html
>
> --
> Jason Cobb
>
>

-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer now has a pegleg and an eyepatch

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

I even have a pun in my name

Aaaargh Lee

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 10:55 AM ATMunn via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> you're already a pirate
>
> On 6/13/2020 8:51 PM, Rebecca via agora-business wrote:
> > I become a Pirate and consent to Falsifian's Parley
> >
> > On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 10:50 AM James Cook via agora-business <
> > agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> >
> >>>
> >>> On Sat, Jun 13, 2020 at 4:49 PM Jason Cobb via agora-business
> >>>  wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> On 6/13/20 4:46 PM, James Cook via agora-business wrote:
> >>>>> On Fri, 12 Jun 2020 at 15:05, Cuddle Beam via agora-business
> >>>>>  wrote:
> >>>>>> Thanks for pointing that out! I amend "The Plunder Partnership" to
> >> read in
> >>>>>> full:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> -
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> The Plunder Partnership
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ‍☠️ WHO WE BE
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> The Plunder Partnership is also known as the Plundership. A party
> >> to this
> >>>>>> contract is known as a Pirate. Any person who is not in Davy Jones’
> >> Locker
> >>>>>> can become a Pirate. Any Pirate can make themselves cease to be one
> >> by
> >>>>>> announcement.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ‍☠️ NO TATTLE-TALES
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Any person who has objected to a transferral of coins from the Lost
> >> and
> >>>>>> Found Department to the Plundership are in Davy Jones’ Locker. A
> >> person in
> >>>>>> Davy Jones’ Locker cannot become a Pirate, and they immediately
> >> cease to be
> >>>>>> a Pirate if they already were one.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ‍☠️ DOUBLOONS
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Doubloons are a destructible asset that can only belong to Pirates.
> >> When an
> >>>>>> amount of coins is transferred to the Plundership, each Pirate
> >> gains an
> >>>>>> amount of Doubloons equal to the amount transferred divided by the
> >> amount
> >>>>>> of Pirates, rounded down. A Pirate with at least 1 Doubloon can
> >> transfer 1
> >>>>>> coin to themselves from the Plundership. Doing so destroys 1
> >> Doubloon in
> >>>>>> their possession.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ‍☠️ PARLEY
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Any Pirate can propose a Parley by announcement, which describes
> >> amendments
> >>>>>> to this contract. If at least 2/3rds (rounded up) of all Pirates
> >> consent to
> >>>>>> the Parley’s contents, this contract is amended according to the
> >> Parley.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> -
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I become a Pirate.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I propose the following Parley:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> {
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Replace the last sentence (under PARLEY) with:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> If a Parley was proposed at least 2 days ago, at least 2/3rds
> >> (rounded
> >>>>> up) of all Pirates consent to its contents, and it has not yet been
> >>>>> applied, then any Pirate can apply it by announcement, causing this
> >>>>> contract to be amended according to it.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> }
> >>>>>
> >>>>> (Motivation: give players a chance to escape if 2/3 try to bind the
> >>>>> remaining 1/3 to unfavourable terms. I'd prefer 4 days, but starting
> >>>>> with 2 since it's closer to the current situation.)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> - Falsifian
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> I consent.
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Jason Cobb
> >>
> >> On Sat, 13 Jun 2020 at 21:21, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus via
> >> agora-business  wrote:
> >>> As do I.
> >>
> >> I also consent to my Parley.
> >>
> >> - Falsifian
> >>
> >
> >
>
> --
> ATMunn
> future notary here :)
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: [Arbitor] CFJ 3842 Assigned to R. Lee

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

I had problems with the previous Tailor (circa 2017) where I claimed
several ribbons that I wasn't given credit for, but you're right that it's
an overreaction, I haven't claimed many ribbons since my return.

(but also remember to record my recent ribbon for winning the election, lol)

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 10:23 AM Publius Scribonius Scholasticus via
agora-discussion  wrote:

> On Sat, Jun 13, 2020 at 8:20 PM Rebecca via agora-business
>  wrote:
> >
> > I claim a blue ribbon for this judgement. I have done this a MILLION
> times
> > i am sure but the ribbon bar STILL doesn't credit me with a blue ribbon,
> so
> > PLEASE take notice of this one.
>
>
> I don't believe I understand the complaint because one has to claim
> the ribbon explicitly before one gets it, but I can assure you that
> this has been recorded.
>
>
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 9:38 AM Rebecca 
> wrote:
> >
> > > > Alright, I Fulfill the Spell! Here we go!
> > >> >
> > >> >  🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅
> > >> > EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA
> > >> > 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅
> > >> >
> > >> > AGORA SPIRIT OF THE GAME, I CALL UPON THEE, LISTEN TO ME EXCLAIM!!
> > >> >
> > >> >  🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅
> > >> > EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA
> > >> > 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅
> > >> >
> > >> > SCAMS BEGONE FROM THIS PLACE, I BANISH THEE TO THE DARK NETHER FROM
> THE
> > >> > WHICH YOU CAME!!
> > >> >
> > >> >  🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅
> > >> > EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA EYA
> > >> > 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅 🧅
> > >> >
> > >> > SCAMS BE GONE AND NEVER COME BACK, BURN FOREVER, DEPART WITH THIS
> > >> FLAME!
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > WOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOO - BOOOSHA!
> > >> >
> > >> > <https://emojipedia.org/open-hands/>
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > The ritual has been completed.
> > >> > The scams have been banished from THE MYSTICAL MENAGERIE.
> > >> >
> > >> > But, be careful, they may return. (In which case I recommend you buy
> > >> more
> > >> > banishment rituals).
> > >> >
> > >> > Thank you for your patronage!
> > >>
> > >>
> > > This one is easy. I judge CFJ 3842 FALSE. The question is whether the
> > > above message altered Cuddlebeam's contract "Mystical Menagerie". It
> could
> > > only have done so with eir consent which is defined under rule 2519.
> None
> > > of the four conditions apply, Cuddlebeam hasn't publicly stated that e
> > > agrees to amend Mystical Menagerie in the above message, the above
> message
> > > doesn't lead to an implication that e wanted to amend Mystical
> Menagerie,
> > > and the portion of that contract defining the "Scam Banishment Ritual"
> > > certainly doesn't "clearly and unambiguously" state a mechanism for
> > > amending itself.
> > >
> > > --
> > > From R. Lee
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > From R. Lee
>
>
>
> --
> 
> Publius Scribonius Scholasticus, Herald, Referee, Tailor, Pirate
> Champion, Badge of the Great Agoran Revival, Badge of the Salted Earth
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: Fine, I destroy "Combinotron"

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

this is a very characteristic story of failure

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 9:53 AM Rebecca  wrote:

> wait no i forgot it had 50 of my coins and my victory card and
> participation card, now i can't propose anything or win no!
>
> On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 9:52 AM Rebecca  wrote:
>
>> Oh I didn't say it in text, I destroy "Combinotron"
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 9:51 AM Rebecca via agora-business <
>> agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>>
>>> To absolutely nobody's surprise, I was planning to exploit a loophole to
>>> give me all of the assets anyway.
>>>
>>> --
>>> From R. Lee
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> From R. Lee
>>
>
>
> --
> From R. Lee
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Fine, I destroy "Combinotron"

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 9:53 AM Jason Cobb via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 6/13/20 7:50 PM, Rebecca via agora-business wrote:
> > To absolutely nobody's surprise, I was planning to exploit a loophole to
> > give me all of the assets anyway.
> >
>
> You can't take actions in the subject of a message. Also, I admit to not
> immediately seeing the exploit in the contract.
>
> --
> Jason Cobb
>
>
It didn't say I had to do all the actions in a Transmutocles (or whatever
the name was) in order, just in the same message. So I was just going to
transfer all the assets I'd gained first, which would be zero. Then keep
all your assets.
-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: Fine, I destroy "Combinotron"

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

wait no i forgot it had 50 of my coins and my victory card and
participation card, now i can't propose anything or win no!

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 9:52 AM Rebecca  wrote:

> Oh I didn't say it in text, I destroy "Combinotron"
>
> On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 9:51 AM Rebecca via agora-business <
> agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:
>
>> To absolutely nobody's surprise, I was planning to exploit a loophole to
>> give me all of the assets anyway.
>>
>> --
>> From R. Lee
>>
>
>
> --
> From R. Lee
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

DIS: Re: BUS: [Important and Very Cool Contract] Combinotron

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

Yeah I already fixed that

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 6:36 AM Reuben Staley via agora-business <
agora-busin...@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> On 2020-06-12 23:18, Rebecca via agora-business wrote:
> > 7. Post-Transmutoramas
> > After a Transmutorama has been performed, this contract automatically
> > transfers 2 corresponding Products to the owner of each card in that
> > Transmutorama.
>
> I believe this would fail because the owner of these assets would be
> this contract. Perhaps "the player who transferred the cards to this
> contract" or something along those lines?
>
> --
> Trigon
> Speaker and Treasuror of Agora; Former Rulekeepor (12 months) and
> Cartographor (8 months) of Agora; Champion of Agora by High Score and
> Proposal; Badge of the Salted Earth; Sixth-Longest Continually
> Registered Player.
>


-- 
>From R. Lee

Re: DIS: timestamps

[Rebecca via agora-discussion]

I am the dirty fool who removed the timestamps from the report, I tend to
do that with all my offices because it doesn't seem useful and I don't have
an automated way of collecting that information or anything.

On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 6:23 AM Cuddle Beam via agora-discussion <
agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:

> I don't see much immediate use to the exact timestamps, personally.
>
> El sáb., 13 jun. 2020 a las 22:21, Alex Smith via agora-discussion (<
> agora-discussion@agoranomic.org>) escribió:
>
> >  On Saturday, 13 June 2020, 19:06:17 GMT+1, ATMunn via agora-discussion <
> > agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote:
> > > hi, future notary here
> > >
> > > in the upcoming Notary reports, would it be useful to have exact
> > > timestamps (instead of just dates) for contract history? because of all
> > > the craziness with contracts that you guys have been doing, i would
> have
> > > to go back and find the exact timestamps for 36 different messages, but
> > > I would be willing to do that if a lot of people would find it useful.
> > > if not, though, I won't bother.
> >
> > Former Notary here. The information is slightly useful, but not very
> > useful. As such, I recommend recording it only when it's easy to record.
> >
> > Perhaps this implies that it's worth recording for future actions, but
> > there's insufficient evidence in trawling the archives for timestamps on
> > past actions.
> >
> > --
> > ais523
> >
>


-- 
>From R. Lee