Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Kerim Aydin]

That's fine - I'm going to keep using papers, given that's the literal
use in legislature, and it makes more sense that a legislative body
is lacking papers, not lacking paper:

white pa·per noun; plural noun: White Papers;
   a government or other authoritative report giving information or
   proposals on an issue.


On Mon, 2 Apr 2018, Corona wrote:
> ​I prefer my uncountable paper, thank you very much.​
> 
> On Mon, Apr 2, 2018 at 8:55 AM, Kerim Aydin  wrote:
> 
> >
> >
> > On Mon, 2 Apr 2018, Aris Merchant wrote:
> > > Also, how often do you say "Bring me two papers"? It's
> > > usually pieces or sheets, but not papers. The main time you'd hear a
> > number
> > > of papers is when talking about papers submitted to a conference or
> > > journal, not for mere physical sheets.
> >
> > What if each Paper is actually a Government White Paper describing why
> > the proposed legislation is necessary?
> >
> >
> >
>

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Corona]

​I prefer my uncountable paper, thank you very much.​

On Mon, Apr 2, 2018 at 8:55 AM, Kerim Aydin  wrote:

>
>
> On Mon, 2 Apr 2018, Aris Merchant wrote:
> > Also, how often do you say "Bring me two papers"? It's
> > usually pieces or sheets, but not papers. The main time you'd hear a
> number
> > of papers is when talking about papers submitted to a conference or
> > journal, not for mere physical sheets.
>
> What if each Paper is actually a Government White Paper describing why
> the proposed legislation is necessary?
>
>
>

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Kerim Aydin]

On Mon, 2 Apr 2018, Aris Merchant wrote:
> Also, how often do you say "Bring me two papers"? It's
> usually pieces or sheets, but not papers. The main time you'd hear a number
> of papers is when talking about papers submitted to a conference or
> journal, not for mere physical sheets.

What if each Paper is actually a Government White Paper describing why
the proposed legislation is necessary?

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Gaelan Steele]

Good point. We should probably change paper to be singular to be consistent 
with the other uncountable currencies, then. 

Gaelan 

> On Apr 1, 2018, at 10:56 PM, Aris Merchant 
>  wrote:
> 
> Need was inaccurate. TBH, I'm not sure how often we'd use them. But it
> would be a nice touch if the system is going to last a while, which it
> looks like it will. Also, how often do you say "Bring me two papers"? It's
> usually pieces or sheets, but not papers. The main time you'd hear a number
> of papers is when talking about papers submitted to a conference or
> journal, not for mere physical sheets.
> 
> -Aris
> 
>> On Sun, Apr 1, 2018 at 7:08 PM Gaelan Steele  wrote:
>> 
>> Papers are already defined as plural in the rules, so probably don’t need
>> the count noun. As for the rest, they make sense (although I’m not sure how
>> often we’d actually need them—“I transfer 3 fabric” works fine)
>> 
>> Gaelan
>> 
>>> On Apr 1, 2018, at 6:07 PM, Aris Merchant <
>> thoughtsoflifeandligh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
 
 The following abbreviations are used in the table above:
 Ston = stone
 Appl = apples
 Lmbr = lumber
 Cotn = cotton
 Coin = coins
 Papr = papers
 Fabr = fabric
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Some of these probably need (or could use) count nouns. Proto:
>>> 
>>> Shards of stone
>>> Logs of lumber
>>> Bales of cotton
>>> Sheets of paper
>>> Rolls of fabric
>>> 
>>> -Aris
>>> 
 
>> 
>> 

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Aris Merchant]

Need was inaccurate. TBH, I'm not sure how often we'd use them. But it
would be a nice touch if the system is going to last a while, which it
looks like it will. Also, how often do you say "Bring me two papers"? It's
usually pieces or sheets, but not papers. The main time you'd hear a number
of papers is when talking about papers submitted to a conference or
journal, not for mere physical sheets.

-Aris

On Sun, Apr 1, 2018 at 7:08 PM Gaelan Steele  wrote:

> Papers are already defined as plural in the rules, so probably don’t need
> the count noun. As for the rest, they make sense (although I’m not sure how
> often we’d actually need them—“I transfer 3 fabric” works fine)
>
> Gaelan
>
> > On Apr 1, 2018, at 6:07 PM, Aris Merchant <
> thoughtsoflifeandligh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> The following abbreviations are used in the table above:
> >> Ston = stone
> >> Appl = apples
> >> Lmbr = lumber
> >> Cotn = cotton
> >> Coin = coins
> >> Papr = papers
> >> Fabr = fabric
> >
> >
> > Some of these probably need (or could use) count nouns. Proto:
> >
> > Shards of stone
> > Logs of lumber
> > Bales of cotton
> > Sheets of paper
> > Rolls of fabric
> >
> > -Aris
> >
> >>
>
>

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Gaelan Steele]

Papers are already defined as plural in the rules, so probably don’t need the 
count noun. As for the rest, they make sense (although I’m not sure how often 
we’d actually need them—“I transfer 3 fabric” works fine)

Gaelan

> On Apr 1, 2018, at 6:07 PM, Aris Merchant 
>  wrote:
> 
>> 
>> The following abbreviations are used in the table above:
>> Ston = stone
>> Appl = apples
>> Lmbr = lumber
>> Cotn = cotton
>> Coin = coins
>> Papr = papers
>> Fabr = fabric
> 
> 
> Some of these probably need (or could use) count nouns. Proto:
> 
> Shards of stone
> Logs of lumber
> Bales of cotton
> Sheets of paper
> Rolls of fabric
> 
> -Aris
> 
>> 

DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Aris Merchant]

>
> The following abbreviations are used in the table above:
> Ston = stone
> Appl = apples
> Lmbr = lumber
> Cotn = cotton
> Coin = coins
> Papr = papers
> Fabr = fabric


Some of these probably need (or could use) count nouns. Proto:

Shards of stone
Logs of lumber
Bales of cotton
Sheets of paper
Rolls of fabric

-Aris

>

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Aris Merchant]

Proposal 7941, "HTML Scrubbing", by Alexis. [1] It passed [2], and was
implemented. [3]

I seem to be digging through my proposal archives a lot lately. I
haven't published them, partly because the proposals aren't in a
structured format. Would it be helpful if I published the raw archive
somewhere? I probably wouldn't update it all that often, and I
wouldn't be able to guaranty accuracy, but at least the data would be
available for the historical record.

-Aris

[1] It was part of that one 20+ plus item distribution.
https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg08449.html
[2] https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg08503.htm
[3] https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-discussion@agoranomic.org/msg40722.html

On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 5:58 PM, Ned Strange  wrote:
> *Is that so? I think I do remember that, actually.*
>
> On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 12:24 PM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Gaelan Steele wrote:
>>
>> Side note: would anybody be against my report being formatted as an HTML
>>> table, as long as I also provided a plain text version of the email (as a
>>> MIME alternative)? The rules require my report to be in plain text, but one
>>> could argue it doesn't prohibit the report from being in another format as
>>> well. I won't do it if people are against it, but I think it would help the
>>> people who view Agora in an email client with a fixed with font. (Side side
>>> note: if you have this problem or want more up-to-date information, use the
>>> online report!)
>>>
>>
>> I don't think you can.  Some time last year (or was it the previous),
>> people got so fed up with messages looking extremely different for
>> different people that a proposal was voted through to ask the Distributor
>> to strip away HTML alternatives and auto-convert to plain text if there
>> wasn't any already.
>>
>> Greetings,
>> Ørjan.
>>
>
>
>
> --
> From V.J. Rada

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Ned Strange]

*Is that so? I think I do remember that, actually.*

On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 12:24 PM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:

> On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Gaelan Steele wrote:
>
> Side note: would anybody be against my report being formatted as an HTML
>> table, as long as I also provided a plain text version of the email (as a
>> MIME alternative)? The rules require my report to be in plain text, but one
>> could argue it doesn't prohibit the report from being in another format as
>> well. I won't do it if people are against it, but I think it would help the
>> people who view Agora in an email client with a fixed with font. (Side side
>> note: if you have this problem or want more up-to-date information, use the
>> online report!)
>>
>
> I don't think you can.  Some time last year (or was it the previous),
> people got so fed up with messages looking extremely different for
> different people that a proposal was voted through to ask the Distributor
> to strip away HTML alternatives and auto-convert to plain text if there
> wasn't any already.
>
> Greetings,
> Ørjan.
>



-- 
>From V.J. Rada

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Ørjan Johansen]

On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Gaelan Steele wrote:

Side note: would anybody be against my report being formatted as an HTML 
table, as long as I also provided a plain text version of the email (as 
a MIME alternative)? The rules require my report to be in plain text, 
but one could argue it doesn't prohibit the report from being in another 
format as well. I won't do it if people are against it, but I think it 
would help the people who view Agora in an email client with a fixed 
with font. (Side side note: if you have this problem or want more 
up-to-date information, use the online report!)


I don't think you can.  Some time last year (or was it the previous), 
people got so fed up with messages looking extremely different for 
different people that a proposal was voted through to ask the Distributor 
to strip away HTML alternatives and auto-convert to plain text if there 
wasn't any already.


Greetings,
Ørjan.

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Ørjan Johansen]

On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Kerim Aydin wrote:


I'm using a monospace font (and using Alpine, if you're using pine) and
it's not lining up for me either.


I'm using Alpine in a (PuTTY) terminal, while you're using Web Alpine, so 
presumably it's precisely the terminal vs. browser difference Gaelan 
pointed out.


I'm guessing browsers etc. get it wrong because they don't actually have a 
singly-designed monospaced font that covers all the characters, so 
substitutes fonts with incompatible metrics for different subsets.  Then 
they lay out the text with no further consideration that it's monospaced, 
giving each character the width given by its metrics.


Meanwhile, terminals probably don't have a single well-designed font 
either, but presumably make sure to place each character in a precise spot 
in the window - I've noticed that all characters generally line up in the 
terminal, but some of the emoji ones actually get clipped so only the left 
part shows.


Greetings,
Ørjan.

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Gaelan Steele]

Technically, Asian characters are supposed to be two monospace characters wide. 
In my experience, things that are monospaced by design (terminals, text 
editors) do this right; things that are just set to a monospaced font, such as 
browsers or email clients, don't. 

Side note: would anybody be against my report being formatted as an HTML table, 
as long as I also provided a plain text version of the email (as a MIME 
alternative)? The rules require my report to be in plain text, but one could 
argue it doesn't prohibit the report from being in another format as well. I 
won't do it if people are against it, but I think it would help the people who 
view Agora in an email client with a fixed with font. (Side side note: if you 
have this problem or want more up-to-date information, use the online report!)

Gaelan 

> On Mar 7, 2018, at 12:16 AM, Cuddle Beam  wrote:
> 
> It doesn't line up to me...
> 
> Do you mean like, graphically lining up or?
> 
>> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:03 AM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:
>> 
>> On Tue, 6 Mar 2018, Gaelan Steele wrote:
>> 
>> +---++++---++---
>>> -++++
>>> |Entity |Ston|Appl|Corn|Ore|Lmbr|
>>> Cotn|Coin|Papr|Fabr|
>>> +---++++---++---
>>> -++++
>>> |天火狐 |   5|  15|   0|  0|   5|   0|  20|   5|   0|
>>> |Aris   |   5|  15|   2|  0|   5|   0|  30|   5|
>>> 0|
>>> 
>> 
>> What, it lines up! What magic is this?
>> 
>> Greetings,
>> Ørjan.
>> 

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Kerim Aydin]

On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Ørjan Johansen wrote:
> On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Cuddle Beam wrote:
> 
> > Welp: https://i.gyazo.com/e6839dd6c86561d96c1c2f1cfe22eb61.png
> 
> You're not using a monospace font.
> 
> Greetings,
> Ørjan.

I'm using a monospace font (and using Alpine, if you're using pine) and
it's not lining up for me either.

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Ned Strange]

Yes, you're supposed to have reports line up in monospace, for the
archives. Thing is, the Japanese characters mess up the font usually.

On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 7:30 PM, Cuddle Beam  wrote:
> Ah, true lol. It does look better in the archives (which I think uses
> monospace): https://i.gyazo.com/90a3f08fea0896c5ee9b09fbbab913da.png
>
> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:23 AM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Cuddle Beam wrote:
>>
>> Welp: https://i.gyazo.com/e6839dd6c86561d96c1c2f1cfe22eb61.png
>>>
>>
>> You're not using a monospace font.
>>
>>
>> Greetings,
>> Ørjan.
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:20 AM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:
>>>
>>> On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Cuddle Beam wrote:

 It doesn't line up to me...

>
> Do you mean like, graphically lining up or?
>
>
 I mean like, all the columns line up perfectly in my terminal window,
 including the row with 天火狐's name.

 Greetings,
 Ørjan.


 On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:03 AM, Ørjan Johansen 
 wrote:

>
> On Tue, 6 Mar 2018, Gaelan Steele wrote:
>
>>
>> +---++++---++---
>>
>> -++++
>>> |Entity |Ston|Appl|Corn|Ore|Lmbr|
>>> Cotn|Coin|Papr|Fabr|
>>> +---++++---++---
>>> -++++
>>> |天火狐 |   5|  15|   0|  0|   5|   0|  20|   5|
>>>  0|
>>> |Aris   |   5|  15|   2|  0|   5|   0|  30|
>>>  5|
>>>  0|
>>>
>>>
>>> What, it lines up! What magic is this?
>>
>> Greetings,
>> Ørjan.
>>
>>
>>
>
>>>



-- 
>From V.J. Rada

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Cuddle Beam]

Ah, true lol. It does look better in the archives (which I think uses
monospace): https://i.gyazo.com/90a3f08fea0896c5ee9b09fbbab913da.png

On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:23 AM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:

> On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Cuddle Beam wrote:
>
> Welp: https://i.gyazo.com/e6839dd6c86561d96c1c2f1cfe22eb61.png
>>
>
> You're not using a monospace font.
>
>
> Greetings,
> Ørjan.
>
> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:20 AM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Cuddle Beam wrote:
>>>
>>> It doesn't line up to me...
>>>

 Do you mean like, graphically lining up or?


>>> I mean like, all the columns line up perfectly in my terminal window,
>>> including the row with 天火狐's name.
>>>
>>> Greetings,
>>> Ørjan.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:03 AM, Ørjan Johansen 
>>> wrote:
>>>

 On Tue, 6 Mar 2018, Gaelan Steele wrote:

>
> +---++++---++---
>
> -++++
>> |Entity |Ston|Appl|Corn|Ore|Lmbr|
>> Cotn|Coin|Papr|Fabr|
>> +---++++---++---
>> -++++
>> |天火狐 |   5|  15|   0|  0|   5|   0|  20|   5|
>>  0|
>> |Aris   |   5|  15|   2|  0|   5|   0|  30|
>>  5|
>>  0|
>>
>>
>> What, it lines up! What magic is this?
>
> Greetings,
> Ørjan.
>
>
>

>>

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Ørjan Johansen]

On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Cuddle Beam wrote:


Welp: https://i.gyazo.com/e6839dd6c86561d96c1c2f1cfe22eb61.png


You're not using a monospace font.

Greetings,
Ørjan.


On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:20 AM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:


On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Cuddle Beam wrote:

It doesn't line up to me...


Do you mean like, graphically lining up or?



I mean like, all the columns line up perfectly in my terminal window,
including the row with 天火狐's name.

Greetings,
Ørjan.


On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:03 AM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:


On Tue, 6 Mar 2018, Gaelan Steele wrote:


+---++++---++---


-++++
|Entity |Ston|Appl|Corn|Ore|Lmbr|
Cotn|Coin|Papr|Fabr|
+---++++---++---
-++++
|天火狐 |   5|  15|   0|  0|   5|   0|  20|   5|
 0|
|Aris   |   5|  15|   2|  0|   5|   0|  30|   5|
 0|



What, it lines up! What magic is this?

Greetings,
Ørjan.

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Ørjan Johansen]

On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Cuddle Beam wrote:


It doesn't line up to me...

Do you mean like, graphically lining up or?


I mean like, all the columns line up perfectly in my terminal window, 
including the row with 天火狐's name.


Greetings,
Ørjan.


On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:03 AM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:


On Tue, 6 Mar 2018, Gaelan Steele wrote:

+---++++---++---

-++++
|Entity |Ston|Appl|Corn|Ore|Lmbr|
Cotn|Coin|Papr|Fabr|
+---++++---++---
-++++
|天火狐 |   5|  15|   0|  0|   5|   0|  20|   5|   0|
|Aris   |   5|  15|   2|  0|   5|   0|  30|   5|
 0|



What, it lines up! What magic is this?

Greetings,
Ørjan.

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Cuddle Beam]

Welp: https://i.gyazo.com/e6839dd6c86561d96c1c2f1cfe22eb61.png

On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:20 AM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:

> On Wed, 7 Mar 2018, Cuddle Beam wrote:
>
> It doesn't line up to me...
>>
>> Do you mean like, graphically lining up or?
>>
>
> I mean like, all the columns line up perfectly in my terminal window,
> including the row with 天火狐's name.
>
> Greetings,
> Ørjan.
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:03 AM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:
>>
>> On Tue, 6 Mar 2018, Gaelan Steele wrote:
>>>
>>> +---++++---++---
>>>
 -++++
 |Entity |Ston|Appl|Corn|Ore|Lmbr|
 Cotn|Coin|Papr|Fabr|
 +---++++---++---
 -++++
 |天火狐 |   5|  15|   0|  0|   5|   0|  20|   5|
  0|
 |Aris   |   5|  15|   2|  0|   5|   0|  30|   5|
  0|


>>> What, it lines up! What magic is this?
>>>
>>> Greetings,
>>> Ørjan.
>>>
>>>
>>

Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Cuddle Beam]

It doesn't line up to me...

Do you mean like, graphically lining up or?

On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 9:03 AM, Ørjan Johansen  wrote:

> On Tue, 6 Mar 2018, Gaelan Steele wrote:
>
> +---++++---++---
>> -++++
>> |Entity |Ston|Appl|Corn|Ore|Lmbr|
>> Cotn|Coin|Papr|Fabr|
>> +---++++---++---
>> -++++
>> |天火狐 |   5|  15|   0|  0|   5|   0|  20|   5|   0|
>> |Aris   |   5|  15|   2|  0|   5|   0|  30|   5|
>>  0|
>>
>
> What, it lines up! What magic is this?
>
> Greetings,
> Ørjan.
>

DIS: Re: OFF: [Treasuror] Currency Balances

[Ørjan Johansen]

On Tue, 6 Mar 2018, Gaelan Steele wrote:


+---++++---++++++
|Entity |Ston|Appl|Corn|Ore|Lmbr|Cotn|Coin|Papr|Fabr|
+---++++---++++++
|天火狐 |   5|  15|   0|  0|   5|   0|  20|   5|   0|
|Aris   |   5|  15|   2|  0|   5|   0|  30|   5|   0|


What, it lines up! What magic is this?

Greetings,
Ørjan.