Re: [CGUYS] What to charge for contract to develop web content?
Thanks, Yes, I'm thinking a least double the salaried rate, though don't think I'll be able to go much beyond $30 to $35 for this contract. That'll be okay if I can keep down the number of uncompensated hours I'll have to put into it. Guess this 6 month contract will be a learning experience for, above all (at least for me), the time management aspects. Randall On Jan 19, 2008 11:03 PM, Kevin and Roni Breza [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I just caught the original thread about how much to charge a client. As a freelance graphic designer, I used to design the artwork for websites and sometimes I would work with writers and programers to create websites for various clients. At first I charged an hourly rate that was approximately double what my hourly pay would be at a full time position. I thought that would account for the non-billable hours of invoicing, phone calls, coordinating with the co-designers, and any unexpected difficulties. After doing this for a couple of years, I realized that my clients started requesting their artwork tomorrow, since I was only going to be spending seven hours on it, not realizing the scheduling aspects. If you have to submit an hourly rate, 2.5-3 times your hourly pay sounds about right, but if you don't have to, then a flat rate is the way to go. Usually, there are classes on how to bill your clients or deal with taxes that are sponsored by your local business development center. You can usually find them through the phone book or your local chamber of commerce. Roni -Original Message- From: Randy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Jan 19, 2008 12:00 AM To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] What to charge for contract to develop web content? Luckily, Maryland may be reconsidering this; according to a news report today On Jan 18, 2008 12:57 PM, Rev. Stewart Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Depends on state law. In the state of Alabama if have not been granted tax exempt status by the state legislature, you do not have it. There is a published list on who has been granted tax exempt status. But it must go before the legislature and voted on to be valid. When I lived in the state of Wisconsin, it was by category. If you fell into a category you had it by being a member of that category. Apply for a receive a tax number from the state and then fill in the paperwork at the business you bought from. Each state has different laws on how it is done. Stewart At 11:38 AM 1/18/2008, you wrote: Interestingly, the University of Washington... a state educational institution ... pays tax on all purchases. Not sure why... db Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands
Re: [CGUYS] What to charge for contract to develop web content?
Luckily, Maryland may be reconsidering this; according to a news report today On Jan 18, 2008 12:57 PM, Rev. Stewart Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Depends on state law. In the state of Alabama if have not been granted tax exempt status by the state legislature, you do not have it. There is a published list on who has been granted tax exempt status. But it must go before the legislature and voted on to be valid. When I lived in the state of Wisconsin, it was by category. If you fell into a category you had it by being a member of that category. Apply for a receive a tax number from the state and then fill in the paperwork at the business you bought from. Each state has different laws on how it is done. Stewart At 11:38 AM 1/18/2008, you wrote: Interestingly, the University of Washington... a state educational institution ... pays tax on all purchases. Not sure why... db Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] What to charge for contract to develop web content?
So if a client is going to pay, say, $50 an hour, I need to add 6% onto that for this tax? Who does it actually cover? The term computer consultant seems pretty vague and broad. Wouldn't call what I'll be doing that, though maybe someone else would. Randall On Jan 17, 2008 6:45 PM, Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You mean that all of the sudden in Maryland there is now a 6% tax on computer consulting earnings? How, btw, is this even considered a sales tax? That is not how a sales tax works. You just add 6% at the bottom of the bill and collect it. From time to time you send the money over to the government. It only becomes a problem if you fail to collect it. Then you get to pay the tax, plus fines, with your own money. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] What to charge for contract to develop web content?
Okay, but when the state of MD has this set amount of $ to pay for this contract and we are talking about getting paid X dollars per hour for a certain period, don't think they are thinking they have pay this extra 6%. But first I'll have to verify if this type of service would even be covered. That would jack up the price for $50/hour fee to $53. Randall On Jan 17, 2008 9:40 PM, Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So if a client is going to pay, say, $50 an hour, I need to add 6% onto that for this tax? Who does it actually cover? The term computer consultant seems pretty vague and broad. Wouldn't call what I'll be doing that, though maybe someone else would. How could it be that the concept of a sales tax escapes you? Do you live in New Hampshire? You just put a line at the bottom of the invoice MD Sales Tax 6%. Is that so hard? Hairdressers have to charge the tax too. Taxes are the fee we pay for civilization. It is a bargain. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] What to charge for contract to develop web content?
Good point, why would the state tax the same state? Randall On 1/17/08, Rev. Stewart Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Randall, I am not sure but I think a state entity (Anything run by the state) would be tax exempt. Check with them for sure. Stewart At 09:35 PM 1/17/2008, you wrote: Okay, but when the state of MD has this set amount of $ to pay for this contract and we are talking about getting paid X dollars per hour for a certain period, don't think they are thinking they have pay this extra 6%. But first I'll have to verify if this type of service would even be covered. That would jack up the price for $50/hour fee to $53. Randall Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace Ozark, AL SL 82 * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] What to charge for contract to develop web content?
I find this whole thing confusing. I took a workshop on consulting a few years ago. The teacher worked through a scenario in which a consultant wished to make $60k/year (or maintain that amount if coming from a salaried position). After going through all the added expenses and the reduced time (came out with about 1,000 billable hours in the year, as Tom suggested) her analysis was that to earn 60 K a contractor would have to charge about $105/hr, or about 3.5 times the equivalent hourly rate for a salaried position of that amount (appx $30 K/hr). If this multiplier is basically accurate, this would translate into needing to charge about $70/hr to make the equivalent of $40 K. This would seem to suggest that getting something like $30 or $35/hr would hardly be viable; be better off working at a regular job. Does anyone think this analysis (the teacher's, not mine) is off? Thanks, Randall On Jan 16, 2008 8:59 AM, David Turk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hope not too off-topic, but on the topic of salaries-- Why is it organizations are willing to pay a free-lance photographer $90-125/hour, but balk at paying a staff photographer $60K/year, which is only $30/hr? I know there's the whole benefits/pension issue, but the savings for the photography are huge. And I'm talking about places that use these photographers on a weekly basis. david -Original Message- From: Computer Guys Announcements and Discussion List [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Miles Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2008 11:38 PM To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] What to charge for contract to develop web content? Don't make the mistake I made when I was a beginning professional photographer. Don't think you're only worth what a burger flipper makes. Charge high, very high! Either get it or turn it down and keep your prices high. When they pay it, it will make up for the jobs you loose and the headaches from the nit pickers who want the world for a dime. If they want you, they obviously have a reason. Make sure they pay for what they want. Jeff M * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] What to charge for contract to develop web content?
I live and work in MD and the client is in MD (the state of MD, actually). What's the deal with this new tax? Not sure this would fall under the definition of computer consulting, so how strictly is this defined? Thanks Randall On Jan 16, 2008 11:49 AM, Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The OP made reference to the DC area. If this work is to take place in Maryland, or for a client in Maryland (not certain how the distinction would apply), it may be necessary to collect a new tax enacted during the recent special session of the Maryland legislature. This is potential trouble you fervently wish to avoid. Computer consulting has been subject to sales tax in DC for many years. MD is just catching up. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] What to charge for contract to develop web content?
You mean that all of the sudden in Maryland there is now a 6% tax on computer consulting earnings? How, btw, is this even considered a sales tax? Randall On Jan 16, 2008 11:49 AM, Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The OP made reference to the DC area. If this work is to take place in Maryland, or for a client in Maryland (not certain how the distinction would apply), it may be necessary to collect a new tax enacted during the recent special session of the Maryland legislature. This is potential trouble you fervently wish to avoid. Computer consulting has been subject to sales tax in DC for many years. MD is just catching up. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Blue tooth radiation?
I did hear her on a few show while on her book tour and noted her concern about the potential harm from cell phones and about the research on this to date. Re. bluetooth, is it definitely the case that it gives off much less radiation than cellphones? Even if so I wonder about the effect of something that close to the head, closer than even cellphones are held. But as far as the bigger picture, long-term risk, you are probably right in that cellphone use today probably wouldn't result in cancer for many years if not decades, though radiation damage is cumulative so who knows if there isn't some threshold tipping point. Randall On Dec 1, 2007 1:50 PM, Paul Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If anyone listened to the public health academic who wrote The Secret History of the War On Cancer some of the most quoted studies done on cell phone radiation have severe methodological flaws and even if they were good might been inadequate for assessing the brain cancer risk 20 or 30 years out (which is the appropriate scale for the development of brain cancer) One reason minors should not have cell phones except for emergency use. That said, bluetooth would seem to be a much less intense radiation source and if it had 10 times less of cancer risk than cell phones, I would not be surprised in the slightest. The same advice about avoiding cell phones for minors goes for aspartame. Randy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was in a store checking out bluetooth headsets for cell phone, ending up getting one on sale for $15. However another customer I was talking to about cell phones, etc. said that bluetooth headpieces deliver as much radiation to the head as using the cellphone directly, near your head, maybe more. Bluetooth is one thing, bluebrain is another; anyone know if this is true? If so I may well return the bluetooth and just stick to regular, corded headpiece, which is admittedly less convenient. I vaguely recall this coming up here before but can't locate the posts. Randall -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived Checkout One Laptop Per Child project laptop.org * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
[CGUYS] Blue tooth radiation?
I was in a store checking out bluetooth headsets for cell phone, ending up getting one on sale for $15. However another customer I was talking to about cell phones, etc. said that bluetooth headpieces deliver as much radiation to the head as using the cellphone directly, near your head, maybe more. Bluetooth is one thing, bluebrain is another; anyone know if this is true? If so I may well return the bluetooth and just stick to regular, corded headpiece, which is admittedly less convenient. I vaguely recall this coming up here before but can't locate the posts. Randall -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Black Monday - to shop online or not?
By sheer serendipity I recently discovered a nearby store that sells batteries and some other things quite cheap. Got 16 AA batteries for about $2, compared to maybe 4 times that much at, say, CVS. Store is called Dollar Power and much of the merchandise has only Chinese writing on it or the packaging (the owners and workers appear to be Asian, maybe Chinese). Somehow doubt they have website but can't hurt to check. Otherwise, next time I go by I could buy batteries and mail them. Maybe I should stock up and become a re-seller for all my friends and family. :) Randall On Nov 26, 2007 1:18 AM, b_s-wilk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Every day is Black Monday [or Friday] on the Internets. I'm buying 4 basic things tomorrow [batteries, charger, etc]--maybe, on eBay--but I didn't know about the Black Monday hype until my friend who almost never buys anything online told me about it. She asked me to find a camcorder. I didn't see anything that was any better deal for Monday compared to any other time. Anyone got any hot deals on an unlocked Moto L7 or Nokia 6120 [or Nokia 8800--gold]? Betty * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
[CGUYS] Black Monday - to shop online or not?
Attention K-MartI mean online shoppers! I hear that tomorrow is Black Monday, the Internet equivalent of brick and mortar's black Friday. I'm not much on conspicuous consumption, but do have a fair amount of pent-up need for this and that, aside from gift shopping. So wondering if anyone here is gearing up for this event and, if so, if there are any steps to take or tips for doing this as quickly, efficiently and economically as possible. I did see an interesting news item yesterday about a site called something like Mr. Rebates; promising to secure rebates from 1,000 or so stores online, quickly and automatically, without the usual hassle required to mail in for rebates. So if anyone here is going to venture forth to shop online tomorrow, happy e-trails. Randall -- Please use new email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Anecdotal Comparison of Broadband Service Worldwide
- Original Message - From: Eric S. Sande [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Sunday, October 21, 2007 8:20 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Anecdotal Comparison of Broadband Service Worldwide Hilton, I've found, is like MacDonalds. It may not be the best in town, and it may not be the least expensive, but you can count on it for a certain level of service.. Are you saying that Paris Hilton is not the best in town, not so cheap, but reliably provides pretty good service? Is this pre or post arrest Paris Hilton?? Randall * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Anecdotal Comparison of Broadband Service Worldwide
Reverend, Since you mentioned being in Houston and given your profession, just curious if you've ever been to Lakewood church or have met Joel Osteen? Just discovered his show by accident a few months ago and find myself watching it now rather than the political show I used to watch that is on the same time. Thanks, Randall - Original Message - From: Rev. Stewart Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Sunday, October 21, 2007 7:38 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Anecdotal Comparison of Broadband Service Worldwide Surprisingly the higher priced hotels/convention setups do not. This past summer I was in Houston for a convention and stayed at the Hilton's America Hotel which is next/connected to Brown Convention center. Cost was to be 8 or similar per 24 hour period. (Rooms were 100 a night convention rate!) It was free in the lobby/community area, but cost everywhere else. I kept my use to the workroom where we had setup a connection for the room. Yet I have stayed in 60 a night motels where it is free, and also stayed at one where it was free but worked like crap. It is all relative. Stewart At 07:14 PM 10/21/2007, you wrote: Interesting. In DC I pay US$30.00 per month for 3 mbps down, 768 kbps up. That's unlimited but that's as good as it gets on speed. No FiOS here yet. I know there's been a lot said on how other countries are better implementing broadband than the USA. Some of them have state monopoly telecom companies, almost all of them are smaller than the USA. When I was in France last July the broadband was fast as a greased gopher. But it was very expensive. OK I was in a hotel. But it was the first time I had to pay for it separately. In the USA if there's broadband in a hotel it's normally an included item. At some point the infrastructure buildout will be complete. Then we can all breathe freely and start complainung about how slow it is again. :-) Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace Ozark, AL SL 82 * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.15.5/1084 - Release Date: 10/21/2007 3:09 PM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] GoDaddy's registration agreement - speaking of priv
I would rather that, say, my home address and phone # not be plastered in a public database in the first place. If someone did post this or other harmful material about myself should still be possible to go to whoever manages the site and have them track down who did it, just as, say, Yahoo can track down who sends malicious emails, as happened to me. You could still have the person's name available which would enable tracking. Probably this alone could lead to a persistent party finding out their address or other info., but would at least require more steps and work and not just be there in WHOIS for sale, for instance. Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 10:17 AM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] GoDaddy's registration agreement - speaking of priv Using your logic we would all be wearing hoods or a chador when walking down the street. Don't you think you might have less of a problem with your privacy being invaded if you were able to readily discover who was doing the invading? Just the opposite of what you propose. Suppose making such info. so public led to a stalking situation, which led to some personal harm. Would the party who is harmed (from having their personal info. made so public) have any legal redress against ICAAN, the registration company, WHOIS or any other party? Just wondering. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.8/1066 - Release Date: 10/12/2007 11:10 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] GoDaddy's registration agreement - speaking of priv
Nothing, I suppose, unless you were to be caught if they check. This is what GoDaddy indicated. I would use a real address; maybe not my personal home address, but a real one ( and one not belonging to a current resident of a home). Randall - Original Message - From: db [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 12:07 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] GoDaddy's registration agreement - speaking of priv What happens if you weren't to give a real address or name ... gave fictitious ones instead? Tom Piwowar wrote: Using your logic we would all be wearing hoods or a chador when walking down the street. Don't you think you might have less of a problem with your privacy being invaded if you were able to readily discover who was doing the invading? Just the opposite of what you propose. Suppose making such info. so public led to a stalking situation, which led to some personal harm. Would the party who is harmed (from having their personal info. made so public) have any legal redress against ICAAN, the registration company, WHOIS or any other party? Just wondering. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.8/1066 - Release Date: 10/12/2007 11:10 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
Yep, and these all have in common the fact that they are not living or never existed. Could see making that distinction. Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 10:21 AM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? Unless you can tell me some legitimate purpose for registering and maybe using someone else's name without permission, there are too many ways this could exploit or hurt the person (as someone said, post things in the name of that person that would be embarrassing or worse). Happens all the time: George Washington, Robert E Lee, Uncle Ben, etc, * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.8/1066 - Release Date: 10/12/2007 11:10 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
Uncle Ben? I do a mean Darth Vader impression; maybe I should set up a Darth Vader podcast, if name isn't taken or protected by Lucas or others. Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 2:09 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? Which one never existed? That one would probably have the strongest IP rights. Yep, and these all have in common the fact that they are not living or . Could see making that distinction. Happens all the time: George Washington, Robert E Lee, Uncle Ben, etc, * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.8/1066 - Release Date: 10/12/2007 11:10 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] GoDaddy's registration agreement - speaking of priv
No, a residential address of a building I happen to know is unihabited; either that or take my chance with a fictitious address (unless someone can give me a good reason why they need a real home address, AND for this to be available to the public). I'm not going to use that other person's domain name for any site, but did register another domain for myself, which I will have a site, do already have a site (though still under construction). Guess my account has one set of personal info. for both (or any further) domain names registered, but will only affect the site or sites I create under my name, as other one will lie dormant until the person takes it. Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 4:39 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] GoDaddy's registration agreement - speaking of priv Nothing, I suppose, unless you were to be caught if they check. This is what GoDaddy indicated. I would use a real address; maybe not my personal home address, but a real one ( and one not belonging to a current resident of a home). You are going to register the a site named after a person who's permission you did not get using the address of another person who's permission you did not obtain. This gets worse and worse. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.8/1066 - Release Date: 10/12/2007 11:10 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
Not a great analogy. We are talking about people registering someone else's name to presumably use for commercial benefit, including, in effect, blackmailing them to pay to get a name that someone else has, as you say, cybersquatted. Unless you can tell me some legitimate purpose for registering and maybe using someone else's name without permission, there are too many ways this could exploit or hurt the person (as someone said, post things in the name of that person that would be embarrassing or worse). So why should this be legal, any more than identity theft is? Is there some societal purpose that is furthered by allowing this? Look at all the potential problems that have been pointed out if I were to create a site based on the person's name I registered, and I never intended to use this for commercial gain. For something like a fan website, those wanting to do this could seek and receive permission, could they not? Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 12:58 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? Well, only a few days ago, I knew virtually nothing about this domain registration business. Yet I rather quickly came to the tentative conclusion that it doesn't make sense that people are allowed to register other people's names... So if it's illegal or clearly unethical, why is is allowed, done apparently frequently... and not called into question very much? Why. Unless you have it trademarked, your name is not protected. Why should it be? Why do you think your name belongs to you? You probably did not even create your name, your parents did. You are memerly the object to which it applies. You are taking IP to new extremes. If you meet someone on the street and they greet you by name will you sue them for using your name? * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.8/1064 - Release Date: 10/11/2007 3:09 PM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] GoDaddy's registration agreement - speaking of priv
The GoDaddy guy said all that is required is a legitimate address; doesn't have to be your personal address. I would give a legitimate street address. If you can tell me what legitimate societal purpose is served by ICANN not only having my home address and other personal information but having this available in a public registry, available for sale, then I'll consider putting down my home address or paying the extra cost to keep these private (effectively more than doubling the domain registration cost if using the GoDaddy privacy option). Otherwise, I am put in a situation of either having this information available to anyone in the world, including for commercial exploitation, or have to pay additional money to preserve privacy. Perhaps if I was a business this might be considered a reasonable cost of business, this added cost might make sense. But why should an individual have to incur this added cost to maintain their privacy? Imagine if the burden and cost of preserving privacy always fell on the individual, such as having to pay doctor's offices an added fee to keep your records private or pay banks an extra fee not to make your credit card and other info. available to the world? The default burden should be the other way around, shouldn't it? Suppose making such info. so public led to a stalking situation, which led to some personal harm. Would the party who is harmed (from having their personal info. made so public) have any legal redress against ICAAN, the registration company, WHOIS or any other party? Just wondering. Wonder the same for other possible ways someone might be harmed by this info. becoming public. That is, is any of this regulated, e.g. what WHOIS or ICAAN or the GoDaddy's can or can't do or require, such as extra payment to preserve privacy, without a free opt-out? In terms of trying to close the digital divide, requiring extra payments simply to preserve one's privacy amounts to a very regressive, added fee, and yet another financial disincentive for crossing over the digital divide in this way. Anyone thinking about these things or regulating them at any level of government or is this (still) entirely the wild west of cyber space? Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 1:04 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] GoDaddy's registration agreement - speaking of priv Don't think I should have to pay extra to buy a post office box address or these privacy add-ons, so will have to have a new address and maybe new phone # and take my chances. Having an online presence via a domain name website shouldn't have to mean having personal info. made public unless one pays extra to keep it private. Maybe I'll try 1600 Penn. Ave, D.C. Gee. And I thought you were a good guy. Now you want to do the RIAA thing with your name and submit fraudulent information to ICANN. Ho boy! * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.8/1064 - Release Date: 10/11/2007 3:09 PM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] GoDaddy's registration agreement - speaking of priv
I have no problem with this private indentifying information being held by ICAAN or any other responsible party in case situations like this arise. However I don't see the added value in this regard of having this information made public to anyone. If a problem like this occurs, cannot ICANN or other entities involved trace the information? For example, I once was receiving threatening emails and the police got involved and worked with Yahoo to identify the person, who never disclosed his identity. Randy - Original Message - From: Vicky Staubly [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 5:09 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] GoDaddy's registration agreement - speaking of priv On Thu, 11 Oct 2007, Randy wrote: The GoDaddy guy said all that is required is a legitimate address; doesn't have to be your personal address. I would give a legitimate street address. If you can tell me what legitimate societal purpose is served by ICANN not only having my home address and other personal information but having this available in a public registry, available for sale, then I'll consider putting down my home address or paying the extra cost to keep these private (effectively more than doubling the domain registration cost if using the GoDaddy privacy option). About 10 years ago, my web server was broken into by some hooligans in (I think Sweden). I saw several connection attempts from some IP addresses in Sweden and England. I was able to look up the domain to which these IP addresses belonged (a University in England, and some ISP in Sweden). By looking up the owners of the domain, I was able to let the admin in England know that their system had been broken into, and let the ISP in Sweden know that some of their customers were breaking the law. -- Vicky Staubly http://www.steeds.com/vicky/[EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.8/1064 - Release Date: 10/11/2007 3:09 PM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
Well, only a few days ago, I knew virtually nothing about this domain registration business. Yet I rather quickly came to the tentative conclusion that it doesn't make sense that people are allowed to register other people's names (aside from cases of the same name, which could be worked around by assigning unique identifiers or in most cases, middle names) and that this should not be legal. Prior to that, I don't recall discussions here or anywhere else taking this position. This is why I came up with the tenative proposal that people have domains with their own name set aside for their own use; at birth or whenever this would take effect for those already here. So if it's illegal or clearly unethical, why is is allowed, done apparently frequently (even GoDaddy admitted this to me when someone from their called about other matters) and not called into question very much? Randall - Original Message - From: Eric S. Sande [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 11:16 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? Okay, here's an admittedly strange question: Is it always inherently wrong, improper or maybe even illegal to register someone else's name as a domain name, particularly if they are a prominent person? Without their explicit permission yes, in my opinion (obviously). Fourth Amendment of the Bill of Rights. Copyright law. Multiple court decisions concerning privacy rights. Ethical and moral considerations. Just not doing it if the person has no opportunity to object or consent. Suppose I registered randy.net and then posted pornographic material and claimed it was yours. Would that be legal? Maybe. Would it be right? No. If you can't see that then you haven't got a sense of basic fairness, which I got from the start. If you've got a sense of mission, please either engage this person in a collaborative effort or leave them alone. That is all I have to say on this topic. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? liability and consequences
Constance, For all of these sort of considerations I will not create a site for or based on this person, using her domain or otherwise. I think it would be, as Tom suggested, a good idea for her to have a website, but if she wants to do this at some point, she can do it. I'm sure Oprah, for examle, would give her all the advice and help she could want to develop a great site. At most, I might suggest that she might benefit by having a site and some ways it could be useful. I am working on ideas that may well involve creating many websites, so have plenty of work to do for this, without having to focus on a site for her, with all the sort of issues you bring up. I decided this shortly after registering her domain name (within a day, certainly). Hopefully, she will simply take the name (without charge or only what it cost me) from me and keep it until she might want to use it for a site. I will (and already have) be creating sites related to her area of expertise and might link to things she's said, written or clips from her Oprah appearances and other things like that. I don't need this person's name, expertise, ideas, etc. to further my own; I have enough potentially good ideas on my own to work on for the rest of my lifetime, not to mention the think tank I plan to create to further develop them and many more. Some of those ideas will be to advance interests and causes me and this person both care about, as advocates in this area, so whatever I do should complement and further whatever she is doing, even if on a different scale. Unfortunately, I've learned that she apparently doesn't have a clinical practice, which is the orginal, main reason I wanted to get in touch with her in the first place; to help someone out. Maybe I'll get some other referrals from her at some point. Randall - Original Message - From: Constance Warner [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 1:36 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? liability and consequences If the Mystery Person is something in the medical field, there may be serious liability and medical malpractices implications if there is a website that offers medical information IN HER NAME. You DEFINITELY need to consult a lawyer before you do a site for her; you could put her in serious financial and professional jeopardy with even a small mistake. (Hey, I work for an association of risk managers--this is not a joke or a trivial matter.) A website that features her as a personality may also damage her reputation with her peers and make it harder for her to get the grants she needs to do her work. As odd as it may seem, it can get you in trouble if you disseminate scientific or medical information IN THE POPULAR SPHERE unless you do it very carefully, in a manner that's acceptable in the world in which you do your work. Remember what happened to Carl Sagan, after he went on Johnny Carson, did a fancy TV series, and wrote those popular books? His career as a serious astronomer was over. On the other hand, Stephen Jay Gould managed his celebrity much more carefully, and remained a respected scientist until his death. In the website you want to make, can you manage her public image so that it doesn't damage her professional life? Do you know enough about the sociology of scientists and medical researchers to do this? (My husband used to be a scientist--they are a pretty strange lot sometimes!) If you really want to do something about the health problem that is the Mystery Person's field, why not do a website about that particular health problem, with links to some of her publications or articles about her on Oprah? You'll want to use the proper disclaimers, of course, to be legally safe yourself. But a person's image is valuable--the Mystery Person's image is valuable--and it can be easily damaged and used up. To use someone else's image, even in a good cause, is to take something that isn't really yours and that can damage that other person--and that can get in the way of any good that they may have been able to do. --Constance Warner * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
Good question! Whatever the original rationale, what is the point currently in having all these fine distinctions, most of which are either meaningless or which apparently not many people grasp anyway? Guess it does create more potential business for folks like GoDaddy and their ilk since they can urge that one buy multiple combinations of the same name, e.g. georgebush.com, georgebush.net, etc. What would happen if a given domain name could only be used with only one domain type, like .com OR .org, but not both? Would this create more problems than it might solve (such as less cost, less time, less complexity)? Currently registered domain names could be grandfathered in and ample notice could be built in to apprise people of this change. Either this or perhaps simply the categories and maybe only have, say, 3 or 4 mutually exclusive, clearly distinct domain categories or whatever the term is, so that everyone is clear (or much clearer) what each category is for and thus should include? Distinctions without differences just create confusion, unnecessary cost, complexity and inefficiency; though a few always benefit from this. And while we are at it, why not this: Every legal citizen would ( at birth or whenever this would be implemented for everyone else) be automatically registered with one domain based on their legal name, with some unique identifier to distinguish identical names. All domain names based on the name of a person would be required to use the unique identifier (whether middle name and/or an added number or symbol, etc.). It would then be illegal for anyone to use the unique domain name associated with another person (with possible exceptions, such as parents doing this for minor children) in any combination (.org, .com, etc.) without their explicit, written permission. Aside from militating against possible adverse outcomes, such as cyberpoaching, this could also serve several positive, desired societal goals. For one, encourage and help facilitate closing and crossing the digital divide. Going forward, most people might be expected to have their own personal website, to be used and useful to them in any number of ways, including ways currently unforeseen, as new technologies and thus new possibilities emerge. Just a thought. Sure a lot of laws would have to be changed and lot of details worked out, but looking for now at the overall idea. It would be voluntary, of course, if people wished to use their domain name to have a website. Randall Randall - Original Message - From: Janaki Kuruppu [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@listserv.aol.com Sent: Monday, October 08, 2007 9:07 AM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? On 10/7/07, Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I also sort of assumed that .org meant a real nonprofit. Otherwise, various unscrupulous outfits and organizations might simply pose as being non-profits. Could have the equivalent of, say, Microsoft.org Today anybody can get an org TLD. When the registrars went commercial any effort to enforce qualifications went out the window. The only thing you can't buy is gov and mil. so, can i ask, what's the point of all the different domain extensions at this point? is it like the propagation of area codes for phone lines because of the popularity of fax machines? if i register a domain name, does it matter if i use .net or .org or .com or .name, etc etc etc. in fact, looking on godaddy - it seems like i could buy a domain name with a .co.uk extension, and look as though i was located in England... also, in addition to .gov and .mil isn't .edu restricted - only educational institutions can own those?? janaki * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List?
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
Yes, that's what I meant - the various things she has complement each other synergistically, leading to both more money, more influence and more power. I think she is at a point where making money is not the overwhelming goal, that having influence to do things is, including, now, via political influence, e.g. Obama campaign. Just a hunch and based on how her shows have changed and what she says. Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Monday, October 08, 2007 2:30 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? I guess this is why even Oprah herself has a site and magazine, etc., to complement her show. Oprah has them to make a lot of money. While Oprah does accomplish much that is good I expect that you could be mighty disillusioned to find out that she is a very good businesswoman first and foremost. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] born_with_it.??? [was: Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?]
there you go!so why not preserve one's name and some indentifier if necessary to distinguish them from anyone else with the same name, from being used by anyone else without their permission? Whether the person ever registers or uses it would be up to them. By the way, for those concerned about privacy, thought the terms of agreement on GoDaddy when registering a domain name had some possibly questionable language about use of your personal info. Will look for that passage and post it. May be safer in the long run to even have government automatically give you a unique domain name at birth than to have corporations do this, with all the financial incentives to commercialize on one's information. My idea was to partly address a problem (among other things) that may presently be causing problems because of people poaching other's names and using it for commercial purposes. Someone with a name like John or Mary Smith who is a child now would probably have no chance of having their name available by the time they are a teenager, unless they paid ransom to some cybersquatter or something. Why not ban this sort of thing, to preserve people's cyber identity, which may be increasingly important in the future? Randall Randall - Original Message - From: Vicky Staubly [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Monday, October 08, 2007 6:05 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] born_with_it.??? [was: Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?] On Mon, 8 Oct 2007, b_s-wilk wrote: And while we are at it, why not this: Every legal citizen would ( at birth or whenever this would be implemented for everyone else) be automatically registered with one domain based on their legal name, with some unique identifier to distinguish identical names. This would be creepy. The birth domain name will be placed on an RFID tag injected into all newborns, until humans can be genetically modified to have domain names built into our DNA. Would that mean that I wouldn't be allowed to have my *.es *.ca and *.co.uk addresses or domains? Bad enough having spy cameras everywhere. Double creepy. Triple creepy. Apparently, some parents out there are picking baby names based on whether that domain name is available: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20378395/ -- Vicky Staubly http://www.steeds.com/vicky/[EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
[CGUYS] GoDaddy's registration agreement - speaking of privacy issues
Here is the portion of the GoDaddy registration agreement (for registering a domain name) that gave me pause when I went to register my first name. Does this mean what it appears to me to mean - that if you only have a residential address this will be put in a public directory and can even be sold? When filling out the form to get a domain I believe things like address and phone # were required fields. So in order to register a domain name you have to be willing to make all of this information available basically to anyone and maybe available for being sold? This seems more intrusive and underming of one's privacy than my suggestion. I almost didn't go ahead with the registration when I read this part. Maybe I should have given them a fake mailing address! Randall GoDaddy's domain registration agreement You acknowledge and agree that domain name registration requires that this contact information, in whole or in part, be shared with the registry operator. As required by ICANN, this information must also be made publicly available by means of Whois, and that the registry operator may also be required to make this information publicly available by Whois. Both Go Daddy and the registry operator may be required to archive this information with a third party escrow service. You hereby consent and give permission for all such requirements and disclosures. Further, You represent and warrant that, if You are providing information about a third party, You have notified the third party of the disclosure and the purpose for the disclosure and You have obtained the third party's consent to such disclosure. You agree that for each domain name registered by You the following information will be made publicly available in the Whois directory as determined by ICANN Policy and may be sold in bulk as set forth in the ICANN agreement: a.. The domain name b.. Your name and postal address c.. The email address, postal address, voice and fax numbers for technical and administrative contacts d.. The Internet protocol numbers for the primary and secondary name servers e.. The corresponding names of the name servers f.. The original date of registration and expiration date You agree that, to the extent permitted by ICANN, Go Daddy may make use of the publicly available information You provided during the registration process. If You engage in the reselling of domain names You agree to provide any individuals whose personal information You've obtained, information about the possible uses of their personal information pursuant to ICANN policy. You also agree to obtain consent, and evidence of consent, from those individuals for such use of the personal information they provide. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
Okay, thanks...didn't see this post before I wrote my most recent one. Can I easily and cheaply transfer the name to her? The only reason for possibly not telling her about the name or any site based on it would be to surprise her with it, as a gift, but maybe that wouldn't be practical or something she'd want to really be surprised with (unless, maybe, the Oprah show was in on the surprise, for example; since Oprah seems to do this a lot). I don't want to cause this person any hassle or problems or added stress or concerns, which is why I am raising some of these possible concerns here and will also get advice elsewhere. Don't know anything about her arrangements, as far as having a publicist, etc., so would have to find out. Since she's written a few well-known books, guess she must have had this at some point. Right now, though, all I know is that she has a University affiliation, and they are being swamped with calls since the show. Incidentally, this University (the Med school, actually) has about the worst, most user-unfriendly website I've ever seen, which is how I ended up having to call and speak to someone who works with this women at the school; simply to get basic contact info. for her and one or two others who work there). Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007 11:11 AM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? Well, ended up buying the .com domain for this person's name. Maybe I'll just hold it for awhile and just see if she wants the name. If I do this or go beyond this and start creating a website around the themes associated with her name, just hope she sees this as neutral or positive rather than creepy or causing hassles. If you are going to meet her then you can ask for her blessing. Let her know that if she ever wants to post anything you will do it right away. And if she ever has a problem with anything you will fix it right away. Let her know that legally she can ask for the domain to be transferred to her any time she wants so you can really only do this with her blessing. If she has a publicist you should ask to be added to their press list. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
Trying not to say too much about this person to give away her identity (at least easily), but she is a renowned expert on a very serious problem in the mental health arena that causes a tremendous amount of pain, suffering and even death to millions of people, here and everywhere. So she (and others) have a message that could certainly benefit far more people than have probably even heard of her or even of Oprah (though guess most people in the world have heard of Oprah). Maybe, for instance, someone in India is suffering needlessly with these sort of conditions and stumbling on this woman's work or her website might give them a sliver of hope that they don't have to live in psychological (and often physical) hell. Maybe it would be someone who has no concept of things like mental health disorders or, as someone from India recently told me, that maybe their troubles are a result of not having enough religious faith or some other dubious and ultimately harmful thoughts about their problem. Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007 1:21 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? I bet if she wanted to do this, she would have by now. Why do you think she needs your help? 30 million people watching Oprah isn't enough exposure for you? She's inundated with calls. I think everyone else interested is on to it. Typical Windows-style nails that stick out get hammered down mindset. Now that is creepy. A web site is a perfect way to answer people's questions without having a large staff. If her popularity is about to skyrocket, a web site will be essential. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
Betty, Yes, the final logic was that if she doesn't want the name or a site and doesn't want me or anyone else to use her name or put a site up using it, I would then at least be able to sit on her name and it would be safe from the cybersquatters Tom mentioned. This person isn't really, exactly a celebrity. She was on Oprah because she is, as Oprah said, considered the leading expert (Oprah's words) on a very serious mental health problem and is an inspiring person and writer who has written and spoken eloquently about her own personal experience with this disorder. She is mostly, at this point, an academic (apparently doesn't even see patients anymore, from what I recently learned), writer, etc. She may not be all that well known outside of mental health circles, like your usual celebrity. However, she is very well known in mental health circles, and undoubtedly, the great majority of people calling since her recent Oprah appearances (on shows about this problem) are for or about people who are dealing, directly or indirectly, with this thing. Of course, being on Oprah twice in a week (and maybe before at some point, as well as other, previous media exposure) makes anyone much more of a celebrity, but this would probably still be within a pretty narrow slice of the overall population. So I don't consider myself a fan in that sense; I am an admirer who is inspired by her and was looking to her as a possible source of expert opinion in her field, to help someone. And since she is a mental health advocate, as am I (though obviously not on the same scale), I also see her, in this sense, as a potential colleague and fellow traveler of sorts. In this same sense, I am increasingly becoming a fan of Oprah, but probably not for the same reason that so many of her followers live or die on her every word. My admiration is quite different - it is because Oprah has shifted what she is doing on her show in recent years (especially the past year or so) and is doing many shows to help overcome various prejudices and deal with various societal problems, from global warming to people who are shunned because they are different in some way, such as having a mental illness, gender identity issues, bullying, etc. She has an amazing platform to reach a lot of people who otherwise would not be easily reached, to inform and especially inspire and empower them. This is what the 2 recent appearances of this psychologist were about. Randall - Original Message - From: b_s-wilk [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007 11:31 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? I'm constantly amazed and pleased at the kindness and generosity of strangers here, and around the world. Jeff, you miss so much by assuming the worst when most likely the outcome will be neutral or positive. Randy, there's a fine line between being a fanboy and being a stalker. You seem to have stayed on the fan side so far. It's possible that the person for whom you grabbed the eponymous site is too busy to do it on her own. Or perhaps if she is famous, but tied to research or a profession other than entertainment, she may prefer a business, group or themed site rather than one in her own name. If you have registered her name for a domain, and GoDaddy is annoying, I think you can transfer it to another more friendly host. And, Randy, even if you contact that person and she's not interested in the domain, at least you tried. When you don't try, the answer is always no. Betty Ye-e-e-es, Thomas, hence if *she* wanted it by now, *she* would have done it. Maybe she's doing it as we speak, so it can be done right. I don't think I'd want someone I didn't know doing that on my behalf, without my permission. Poor Jeffrey. So used to having people obey senseless rules that he can no longer come up with reasonable justifications. I can see the people in your organization. Another crazy rule from IT. Oh well, I guess we are used to it by now. Clearly, no one famous or about to be famous would recommend someone unknown do something for him/her. OTOH, looking at what Randy is proposing, he is clearly doing the right thing by any reasonable person's standards. There are dozens (that I have heard of) of well-run fan sites that the famous person endorses. There are also many where the fan set up the site and gave it to the famous person later when asked. There are a handful where there was some sort of legal fight. Somehow, given the evidence, I suspect that Randy is not the one to start such a thing. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET
[CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
Okay, here's an admittedly strange question: Is it always inherently wrong, improper or maybe even illegal to register someone else's name as a domain name, particularly if they are a prominent person? By chance, discovered that a rather hot and prominent person (whose been on Oprah twice fairly recently) actually does not have a website, at least not one that shows up on GoDaddy, using the name and .com or .net. This is someone I have been trying to get in touch with and likely will be meeting fairly shortly. Was thinking, for various reasons I won't go into, of grabbing this domain name and later letting them know. I would not ever charge them anything and would happily give them the name should they want it themselves, and will, if I have a chance, encourage them to get a site up, because this is someone who could do a lot of good for a lot of suffering people if they had a site (including clips from their Oprah appearances). One thing I'm thinking of is creating a site for or related to them or their interests, partly as a way of showing them the potential benefits of having their own site, and thus potentially reaching so many people. So given this context, would it still always be inappropriate to appropriate someone's name as a domain name? One other reason for doing this is to prevent someone else from scooping it up, simply to sell, sit on or otherwise exploit financially. Have to admit, if I did this, would probably also be tempted to use it to direct interest and traffic, which I might then redirect to my own site or blog (still not created yet) but if I did this it would be to promote, as an advocate, the same sort of things this person promotes, such as when she goes on Oprah. Am I low-life, unscrupulous, morally-defective scum for even considering this? If so, and I can buy this, what about all these people and companies maybe that seem to simply snatch up domain names, to be used commercially in various ways, beyond really creating any real content ( such as reselling domain names to simply profit on giving someone one they really want). Should only people with a specific name be allowed to get sites using their name or have to approve of giving it to someone else? Why isn't or shouldn't a name considered legally as if it was private property for certain purposes, including commercializing it? Randall * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
[CGUYS] Printing pains and computer-induced sleep disorder (CISD)
Well, was up more than half the night trying to negotiate GoDaddy, for getting first Domain and also website, wordtracker sites for websites, and finally, fiddling with trying to print out business cards on old HP LaserJet printer (bought in 94, still kicking!). Why would a sane person do all this? Well, in order to have business cards to take for networking purposes to the Greenfestival in D.C. today and tomorrow. And, of course, if one is going to update business cards (old ones are so old they don't even have email address) then, of course, one would like to have their blog and website on them, which, of course, means first getting the blog up (sort of did that a few days ago) and a website up and domain name registered, right? And, of course, having learned, from recent seminars on websites business (including one at CPUG meeting a month ago) about the importance of key words, certainly have to fool around with these key word sites, right? And, just when you think you've figured out a solution for how to get some business cards together on very short notice (without spending much moola) by learning how to print them yourself, of course the printer or something or many things involved decide not to cooperate, and even play a bad joke, by making it almost appear at one point that its actually working. But, alas, on more careful inspection, the wording on the cards is all off, enough to ruin the whole deal, like having your phone number show up on another card. Curiously, does work with plain paper or printing one card at time, but printing 10 at a time on the cardstock just leads to these fatal misalignments. So, this far in to my sad tale (or rant, take your pick), here's maybe my main question: Any ideas WHY the printer gods are punishing me thus, however subtly? Could it be an outdated printer driver? Tried to update it, at the end of all of this, but can't even tell if this actually occurred. But I digress from the kicker to this tale of self-inflicted woeAs a result of being up half the night fiddling with all of this and a good part of the remainder of the night just not being able to sleep (so what the hell, get up at 5, after maybe 2 hrs sleep, and fiddle some more, right?!), I ended up blowing off the Greenfestival entirely, which was the very impetus for all this last minute urgency and scrambling! So much for the best laid plans of a misguided man! But, as they say, there's always tomorrow, and maybe by then I'll have a card or two, say, to hand to Ralph Nader after his closing talk. And at least I like irony. Where's Nader been, anyway, when it comes to all the problems with high tech so many of us seem to be increasingly having (not even counting this experience as part of that)? Maybe he'll surprise and announce that he's joining the fray we call Presidential elections. At least it would add some real entertainment, to go along with a weekend full of green. In fact, Nader once ran as a Green, now he's speaking to the Greenies; no doubt about the problems caused by all those who are consumed by green of another sort. And, while being green when it comes to things like computers and printing cards or creating websites is not generally a desirable thing to be, when it comes to becoming the world's most consequential person, being green doesn't seem to be all that bad a thing; maybe even a good thing, actually, by some accounts. But, of course, green or not, anyone wanting to seriously play the Presidential game sure needs a lot of the green stuff. Agreed? There will be, as they say, a second chance tomorrow - so long as I don't repeat the whole thing tonight, toiling into the wee hours again, trying to print cards that line up right, figure out how to do this or that in setting up a website, figuring out what happened to GoDaddy's wonderful-sounding promises of free blogging, etc. So going to have to do the hardest thing of all related to computers (at least for me) - turn the damn thing off and keep it off at some reasonable hour!! :) Why, oh why, can't someone invent a timed lock for a computer, like a bank lock, or a lock which someone at a remote location has control over? We don't ask alcoholics to hang around in bars for hours a day, then also be their own bartenders or bouncers, do we?! As far as Go Daddy, so far my experience with them has been more like, Yo, Your Mamma! Hopefully, this will just be a bad, passing first impression someday. You go, daddy; I'm either going to sleep or going to go bananas. Now maybe if I can crash as easily tonight as many computers seem so able to do! Randy * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command
Re: [CGUYS] Printing pains and computer-induced sleep disorder (CISD)
, etc. So going to have to do the hardest thing of all related to computers (at least for me) - turn the damn thing off and keep it off at some reasonable hour!! :) Why, oh why, can't someone invent a timed lock for a computer, like a bank lock, or a lock which someone at a remote location has control over? We don't ask alcoholics to hang around in bars for hours a day, then also be their own bartenders or bouncers, do we?! As far as Go Daddy, so far my experience with them has been more like, Yo, Your Mamma! Hopefully, this will just be a bad, passing first impression someday. You go, daddy; I'm either going to sleep or going to go bananas. Now maybe if I can crash as easily tonight as many computers seem so able to do! Randy * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.2/1053 - Release Date: 10/6/2007 10:18 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
- Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2007 2:10 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? There is a good chance that a cybersquatter has grabbed it as a consequence of your search. There are bunches of sites that offer to check domain names, but are really gathering information for cybersquatters. Some people have claimed that this happens with GoDaddy's domain name check. Best policy is to never check unless you intend to register an available name immediately. H'notice they have popups telling you that your name is available and that you should snap it up (if nothing else, than I guess just to keep others from doing so). So maybe I better snap up my own name now, before I become famous and then find out that it ain't available. Using it for a fan site would be a very appropriate thing to do. It could sort of be like that, though this is not exactly a traditional fan situation. Is it easy to relinquish a name to someone once you squat on their name? This person I'm talking about is one of those amazing people who has so much to offer so many people, which is why I am so glad Oprah had her on twice in the space of weeks. She is a renowned psychologist and writer and when I heard she didn't have a website, it occurred that a website could help disseminate her very needed message to far, far more people than will otherwise ever get it, including internationally. In fact, she could, of course, upload her appearances on Oprah and cross-list on Oprah's site, which, I bet, would produce even more synergistic benefit. In fact, if I do go ahead and try to grab her name for a domain, it will be pretty interesting to see how many hits it gets in a short period, given that the place she works at has been inundated with calls since her earlier Oprah appearance. I've never met this person, but will probably get a chance to do so in the pretty near future (by coincidence, she is being honored by a local mental health advocacy organization in a few weeks; planned well before Oprah. I think meeting her will be one of the real highlights of my life; not because of her celebrity, but because this is one amazing, inspiring person, an advocate and expert at the top of her field, who has helped so many and can help far more with all of this publicity, etc. One thought might be to go ahead and try to squat on her name - if nothing else, again, to protect it from unscrupulous squatters - and maybe start putting together a website as sort of a fan site, related to her work, and if I get to meet her at this event or subsequently (pretty sure I'll be meeting her fairly soon, one way or the other), I could present the site to her as sort of a gift and thank you, along with her name (however one does this; hopefully without much cost). This way, too, the site and all those who might benefit from it can start capitalizing on all this publicity and momentum. Maybe I can even get Oprah to go in on this as a surprise and post something, along with clips from the show! BTW, would this sort of situation ideally call for a .com, or would it matter much? Is there really much difference between .com, .net, .org or maybe some of the others? And if anyone, including Oprah, ever questions me about whether having done this was appropriate or legal, I'll just tell them that this expert who used to speak his mind a lot on a local radio show said its cool to do this for purposes of a fan site and I have it in writing! :) Why isn't or shouldn't a name considered legally as if it was private property for certain purposes, including commercializing it? Many people share the same name. Some people apply for trademarks on their names. True; used to work with a guy who trademarked both his name and his cat's name, as entertainers. Not his real name. But that's one way around losing your domain name; take a new name! The more I think about the idea of creating a fan site for this person, the more possibilities I can see and the more intriguing it seems, assuming the person the site is for wouldn't be upset by it, say because it leads to even more demands on her time, travel, etc. From someone she works with, I heard the other day that her life has been pretty hectic - not that it wasn't before, probably, but a few Oprah appearances probably increase this by a few orders of magnitude - as far as media requests, travel, etc. H'Anyone here ever dealt with a situation like this? - as far as whether the added exposure of a website causes a lot of extra pressure, etc.? I'm guessing that most of us would think we'd die for that kind of exposure and web traffic, and maybe she would too, but she's not exactly a businessperson in that sense, though guess it could never hurt to promote her books, appearances, etc. Any thoughts on whether
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
I spent a fair amount of time last night checking out various name combinations and many of my top picks were taken as .com but available as .net or others. Do you or anyone else who might know think it matters that much at this point between .net and .com? I settled for a second choice name (probably too long as well) in order to get .com. Unnecessary move? Randall - Original Message - From: Rev. Stewart Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2007 9:34 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? At 09:21 PM 10/6/2007, you wrote: BTW, would this sort of situation ideally call for a .com, or would it matter much? Is there really much difference between .com, .net, .org or maybe some of the others? There used to be a lot of difference but they have relaxed the rules ALOT! .com was commercial .net was network .org was a non profit. However you no longer need to show proof of this to get that extension. Plus with all the added extensions out there you can get a lot of bang for your buck. (I have heard of folks registering all extensions to keep someone else from getting it.) Still I would expect a .org would be a non profit group. Stewart Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace Ozark, AL SL 82 * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.2/1053 - Release Date: 10/6/2007 10:18 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
[CGUYS] Fw: [CGUYS] Printing pains and computer-induced sleep disorder (CISD)
From: Randy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Computer Guys Announcements and Discussion List COMPUTERGUYS-L@listserv.aol.com Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2007 9:27 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Printing pains and computer-induced sleep disorder (CISD) The deal I got from GoDaddy is webhosting (though just got it for one month, to see) with ability to have unlimited websites (which I find appealing, as have several, very different types of websites and audiences in mind, though I noticed that you still have the same total disk space, if that will end up mattering) for only about $7. Plus, this includes getting one domain name for $2 instead of the usual $7or so. Plus think its supposed to include blogging capability. BTW, are you or any of your colleagues that you know of getting into things like internet radio or podcasting? Reminded of this because GoDaddy offers some of this as well. You know, virtual sermons or services or stuff like that. Wonder if any preaching or praying going on in Second Life - could be the next frontier for religious expansion - virtual religion. :) Randall - Original Message - From: Rev. Stewart Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2007 8:47 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Printing pains and computer-induced sleep disorder (CISD) Not that I know of. It was $15 a year which is pretty standard. Rates went up this year. (We reupped before the increase.) Part of the benefit of registering with them is you get web space. Stewart * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons?
I also sort of assumed that .org meant a real nonprofit. Otherwise, various unscrupulous outfits and organizations might simply pose as being non-profits. Could have the equivalent of, say, Microsoft.org Randall - Original Message - From: Rev. Stewart Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2007 9:34 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Grabbing domain names of well-known persons? At 09:21 PM 10/6/2007, you wrote: BTW, would this sort of situation ideally call for a .com, or would it matter much? Is there really much difference between .com, .net, .org or maybe some of the others? There used to be a lot of difference but they have relaxed the rules ALOT! .com was commercial .net was network .org was a non profit. However you no longer need to show proof of this to get that extension. Plus with all the added extensions out there you can get a lot of bang for your buck. (I have heard of folks registering all extensions to keep someone else from getting it.) Still I would expect a .org would be a non profit group. Stewart Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace Ozark, AL SL 82 * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.2/1053 - Release Date: 10/6/2007 10:18 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] OT:Cell phone do not call
Yes, with increasing use of cell phones, especially by those who have no other phones (disproportionately younger folks so far) polling sampling accuracy is becoming more problematic. Maybe this will ultimately be a good thing, since polling now drives the political process as much as reflecting it. Randall - Original Message - From: Rev. Stewart Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 3:40 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] OT:Cell phone do not call I was listening to NPR last night and they were discussing polls and how accurate they are as they do not call those who have only a cell phone. They mentioned that many pollsters do not call Cell phones as they ARE NOT ALLOWED TO USE AUTOMATIC Dialers on cell phones and it is not worth their time or effort to manually dial cell phone numbers. Believe me telemarketers are not going to take the time to manually dial your cell phone number to sell you something. It is not cost effective. Stewart At 03:24 PM 10/2/2007, you wrote: From the FTC website http://www.ftc.gov/donotcall Did you get an email claiming that your cell phone is about to be assaulted by telemarketing calls because of a new cell phone number database? Those claims are not true. In fact, federal law prohibits telemarketers from using automated dialers to call cell phones. You may place your personal cell phone number on the National Do Not Call Registry, but there is generally no reason to do so. For more information, see the FTC's press release The Truth about Cell Phones and the Do Not Call Registry. http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2007/02/dnccellphones.htm Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace Ozark, AL SL 82 * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.39/1044 - Release Date: 10/2/2007 11:10 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] MacMini: [Was: XP Gets Life Extension]
Well, sounds like Macs would be perfectly suited to build in a back up device (or provide an external one) to make backing up as easy and automatic as possible, with options for manual control for those who want or need that. Since Apple has control over the hardware and the software, why not have this? Too much added cost, so may not see competitive? Those who can think beyond their nose might appreciate not having to fool with buying aftermarket devices for this. Maybe someday, when I could afford to, I'd even buy one! Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 11:35 AM Subject: [CGUYS] MacMini: [Was: XP Gets Life Extension] As much as I like my macmini, computers won't be completely tinker free until they come with 1)UPS 2) Internet connection 3)Automated backup. #1 is essential if you live with iffy power, (which means me even though this is southern Montgomery Co) #3 you need everywhere I guess everyone does get #2 if you include crappy dialup. 1) A few months ago I removed a client's UPS and their frequent calls for service dropped to zero. Since most people do not have iffy power making a UPS a standard part of a computer would not be a good move. As their UPS aged they would have more and more problems and no easy way to fix them. An external UPS can be easily removed or replaced and the majority of us who do not need a UPS won't have to fuss with one. 2) The computer automatically configures your Internet connection the first time it is turned on. It covers many options and I have never seen it do a bad job at this. If you get the dot-Mac service your get configured for lots of other goodies. What more could you want? 3) If you got the dot-Mac service, this is one of the services that came with it. Since the OS keeps your user files neatly organized in a user domain, backing up user files is greatly simplified. What's not to like? Are you perhaps running Vista on your Intel-based MacMini? * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.35/1039 - Release Date: 9/29/2007 9:46 PM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] MacMini: [Was: XP Gets Life Extension]
Think the goal should be to make the experience of using a computer, at least for the average or below average user, as much like the experience of driving a new or late model, good-shape car as possible. My overall impression is that those designing hardware and software, except maybe for Apple, which I don't know much about, aren't really thinking in these terms. There is way too much complexity, fragmentation, lack of integration, break downs, glitches, things to be aware of, things to know, etc. While all of this keeps business hopping for those in the field (anyone see the 60 minutes show on Geeks and high tech a few weeks ago?) it is not a way to maximize the potential of computers, the internet and related technology, for the maximum number of people. Ultimately, this limits the overall creativity and productivity of the country, just as not having a good high-speed infrastructure does. I'm increasingly becoming convinced that the internet has amazing potential, limited only by our imagination, and by the ease of use of all the involved technology. Randall - Original Message - From: Paul Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 3:05 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] MacMini: [Was: XP Gets Life Extension] Well, I understand that battery technology (in a UPS) is problematic on a variety of fronts (weight, reliability, etc) but apparently necessary (for some people) until the circuitry, power supplies and hard drives in PC's become more robust. The internect connection configuration in OSX is absolutely cool compared to Windows networking. Extremely intuitive and simple. Configuration is only part of the internet functionality, obviously. Though the bluetooth connection to a cell phone so that it can be used as reasonably speedy modem is cool, and could be part of utopian, tweak-free PC experience. User file backups are obviously a nice thing, but I would be more impressed if I didn't have to pay extra for them. Given that OSX updates can stop one dead in the water, isn't a disk image backup still a good idea? Also, are internet backups reasonable in the age of Gigabytes of user data (photos, MP3). On the same topic, is there an app that can log your software installations (and their source, if downloads) so that during recovery you get back your configuration as closely as possible or is this built into OSX? PC be sold bundled in a home network with dedicated backup servers, routers, ups (dancing girls/boys and beer would be nice too). - Original Message From: Randy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 2:43:45 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] MacMini: [Was: XP Gets Life Extension] Well, sounds like Macs would be perfectly suited to build in a back up device (or provide an external one) to make backing up as easy and automatic as possible, with options for manual control for those who want or need that. Since Apple has control over the hardware and the software, why not have this? Too much added cost, so may not see competitive? Those who can think beyond their nose might appreciate not having to fool with buying aftermarket devices for this. Maybe someday, when I could afford to, I'd even buy one! Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 11:35 AM Subject: [CGUYS] MacMini: [Was: XP Gets Life Extension] As much as I like my macmini, computers won't be completely tinker free until they come with 1)UPS 2) Internet connection 3)Automated backup. #1 is essential if you live with iffy power, (which means me even though this is southern Montgomery Co) #3 you need everywhere I guess everyone does get #2 if you include crappy dialup. 1) A few months ago I removed a client's UPS and their frequent calls for service dropped to zero. Since most people do not have iffy power making a UPS a standard part of a computer would not be a good move. As their UPS aged they would have more and more problems and no easy way to fix them. An external UPS can be easily removed or replaced and the majority of us who do not need a UPS won't have to fuss with one. 2) The computer automatically configures your Internet connection the first time it is turned on. It covers many options and I have never seen it do a bad job at this. If you get the dot-Mac service your get configured for lots of other goodies. What more could you want? 3) If you got the dot-Mac service, this is one of the services that came with it. Since the OS keeps your user files neatly organized in a user domain, backing up user files is greatly simplified. What's not to like? Are you perhaps running Vista on your Intel-based MacMini? * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body
Re: [CGUYS] MacMini: [Was: XP Gets Life Extension]
Well, there you go! Wonder about cost, naturally. So any chance of this ever coming to the PC world, where I am currently mired? Randall - Original Message - From: b_s-wilk [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 10:28 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] MacMini: [Was: XP Gets Life Extension] Backup device will arrive in a few weeks - http://www.apple.com/macosx/leopard/features/timemachine.html Randy [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Well, sounds like Macs would be perfectly suited to build in a back up device (or provide an external one) to make backing up as easy and automatic as possible, with options for manual control for those who want or need that. Since Apple has control over the hardware and the software, why not have this? Too much added cost, so may not see competitive? Those who can think beyond their nose might appreciate not having to fool with buying aftermarket devices for this. Maybe someday, when I could afford to, I'd even buy one! * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.35/1039 - Release Date: 9/29/2007 9:46 PM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Rename the List?
I'm thinking of something like this: when a person is curious or has a question about something they can go out in the world - to other persons, the internet, a book, database, etc. - and acquire new information, which would then answer their question or questions or lead to additional questions or thoughts or other answers. This could be part of a process of problem-solving or making a decision (with both decisions and problems being questions or perhaps sets of questions). So wondering if computers could be developed to simulate this process, i.e. the natural process of how the human mind works when it plans, etc. (as described, for instance, by David Allen, in Getting Things Done, chapter 3 on the natural planning process). And could computers have more choices than the two they now have in answering every question, i.e. operate on something other than binary? Randall - Original Message - From: Eric S. Sande [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Friday, September 28, 2007 9:11 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Rename the List? Since human thinking can essentially mimic that of computers, albeit at far slower speeds, I'm now wondering whether and how computers can be designed to more closely mimic how humans learn. For anyone who might know, have they got very far with this in AI? Randy, computers can't think as we do as human beings. Not yet and maybe never, but never say never... Computer programs and instrumentalites can be designed to adapt to circumstances within rule sets. If we want say a terrain following flying device that can go to waypoints and choose action based on a set of decision rules, we can make it. But the cruise missile doesn't have free will. It can't decide that the action is desirable, or (with apologies to the Reverend) ethical. There is pretty good AI out there in games, but it is all rule based. Computers at this point literally CAN'T think outside the box. But within the box, depending on how we define it, they can blow the doors off human beings with regard to what we consider genius. They do it, in chess for example, by brute force with deep analysis of probable outcomes. Chess is simple, though, compared to say deciding whether to program a computer to PLAY chess. No computer has yet passed the Turing test. Google this and you will have a better answer than I can give you. If we create self-aware (conscious) computers, and I'm not sure we should, what are the possible outcomes? 1) The HAL 9000 scenario. The computer not only is smart and passes the Turing test, but also is emotional, learns fear and becomes insane. Bad news if you are depending on it to run your infrastructure. 2) The Colossus/Terminator scenario. The computer is smart but completely amoral. But it wants to preserve itself at all cost. You lose. 3) The Mike scenario (_The Moon is a Harsh Mistress_, Heinlein). The computer is self aware and has a sense of humor, sort of. Luckily it dies before it figures out that it's being manipulated. Don't know if this was a good answer, but I hope food for thought. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.33/1034 - Release Date: 9/27/2007 5:00 PM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] [Fwd: XP Gets Life Extension]
Yep, right on! - automated backup - why not?! Randall - Original Message - From: Paul Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2007 5:16 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] [Fwd: XP Gets Life Extension] As much as I like my macmini, computers won't be completely tinker free until they come with 1)UPS 2) Internet connection 3)Automated backup. #1 is essential if you live with iffy power, (which means me even though this is southern Montgomery Co) #3 you need everywhere I guess everyone does get #2 if you include crappy dialup. - Original Message From: mike [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2007 3:46:38 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] [Fwd: XP Gets Life Extension] I could hear music playing, little apple flags waving...rows and rows of imacs standing at attention. Mike On 9/29/07, Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Getting her a Windows computer would be a triumph of ideology over good sense (leave that to the politicians). An iMac 20 would be perfect. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.33/1037 - Release Date: 9/29/2007 1:32 PM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] rename the list ...naaaah!
Absolutely; I fully agree - just ignore the various asides, like my commentary about the fundamental problem of humanity, in response to Betty's observation about people not considering consequences. Computers, of course, are products of people asking questions, including about implications, consequences and proper (critical) distinctions), i.e. critical thinking, and the lack of such critical thinking (really critical questioning) characterizes virtually all important public discourse. So computers are related in that way to societal problems and our thinking about them - they are both products of processes that are essentially epistemologically opposite of each other. And, of course, the problem solving that goes into figuring out what is wrong with a computer, etc. is also essentially the same Furthermore, at a deep level, what gives computers their power to do all the things they do is most fundamentally the same thing that is at the root of both troubleshooting computers and the processes of the development of reason, science and technology that led to their creation and ongoing development. So, as the Philosopher Hegel showed some centuries ago, its all really related, and in that broad sense, on point and on topic, even if it doesn't appear to be perhaps at first glance or to most people. But I, too, am really here, at least originally and mostly, to tap into the collective experience and knowledge about computers and other related matters, because, as someone once said - and which is nicely expresses my theory, in its purely secular meaning - Ask and Ye Shall Receive. And there's no better way of receiving a desired or needed answer than by asking! Randall - Original Message - From: rlsimon [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 11:50 AM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] rename the list ...nh! anyone who screws with this list is gonna hafta deal with me ...it's the only place to get some solid advice about computer issues from people who know something!! I have saved hundreds of dollars and hours from answers posted here by knowledgeable members for which I am grateful ...furthermore, I have evolved from newbie to minor geek from what I have learned here over the years...LEAVE IT ALONE, IT'S GREAT LIKE IT IS !! * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.32 - Release Date: 9/26/2007 12:00 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] [ OT WARNING!!!!
What would be a real-world example of a government-run hospital, aside from the VA, maybe Childrens or NIH? Can't think of any in D.C. area, Boston area, Baltimore or otherwise, unless memory is failing me, which could always be the case. Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2007 10:05 AM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] [ OT WARNING A happy employee is worth a ton of money! They help recruit business. I know this as it is the same or similar model Churches use to grow. The idea that the government should respond to social problems was a product of the Reformation, part of the process of sidelining the church. Then the neo-cons decided that big business was a better substitute for big religion. Events have amply demonstrated that business is not suited to the task. Given the choice of three hospitals and knowing only that one was run by a government agency, one was run by a for-profit corporation, and one was run by a religious-charitable organization, which would your choose? * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.30/1030 - Release Date: 9/25/2007 8:02 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] India outsourcing tech jobs
Oh, I don't know about that; along with outsourcing other jobs, don't see why we can't outsource the Congress, Supreme Ct and maybe even the White House. After all, what can't you do from New Delhi that you can do from a ranch in Texas? Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2007 2:10 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] India outsourcing tech jobs Thousands of Indians report to Infosys Technologies' campus here to learn the finer points of programming. Lately, though, packs of foreigners have been roaming the manicured lawns, too. Many of them are recent American college graduates, A news report by somebody who does not follow world news. Lack of electricity and water, not to mention violent ethnic clashes in which 100s die, put a severe damper on what the Indians can deliver. They have taken in about as much outsourcing work as they are going to be able to handle. End of story. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.30/1030 - Release Date: 9/25/2007 8:02 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] [ OT WARNING!!!!
Supposedly the VA hospitals have improved greatly over their rather dismal past; however still hear tales of woe from a few vets who use the one in D.C., not to mention the various stories that broke last year about some VA or other vet facilities. Randall - Original Message - From: Robert [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2007 3:29 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] [ OT WARNING Tom Piwowar wrote: Given the choice of three hospitals and knowing only that one was run by a government agency, one was run by a for-profit corporation, and one was run by a religious-charitable organization, which would your choose? Depends on the government agency. If it is a hospital run by the Federal Emergency Management Agency or the Dept. of Homeland Security, I would choose either a religious or a for-profit hospital. If it is a teaching hospital run by a state university, I would choose the government agency. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.30/1030 - Release Date: 9/25/2007 8:02 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Fw: [CGUYS] [ OT WARNING!!!!
Imagine if they had gone with Gravenstein. So, how do you like your new Gravenstein? Would undoubtedly have been shortened to something like Grave, as in nice Grave you've got there! Randall - Original Message - From: John Duncan Yoyo [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@listserv.aol.com Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2007 6:56 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Fw: [CGUYS] [ OT WARNING No the vote on apple split three ways. Fuji, Granny Smith and Gravenstein with a few outliers for Winter Banana, Macoun and McIntosh On 9/26/07, mike [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or maybe the last guy with a question regarding apple stuff was refused an answer so everyone gave up. Mike On 9/26/07, Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think too many list members have switched to OS X. Now they don't have any computer problems to gripe about. The rest of you need to get to work -- install Vista or some other harebrained piece of software so we can ponder the consequences. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- John Duncan Yoyo ---o) * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.30/1030 - Release Date: 9/25/2007 8:02 AM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
[CGUYS] Bingo! - you hit on the fundamental problem of humanity, and its implied solution (was Re: [CGUYS] [ OT WARNING!!!!)
Trouble is that too many people--rich, middle class and poor--are too shortsighted/greedy/ignorant to figure that out. Thus they don't plan ahead and consider future consequences--truly penny-wise and pound-foolish' Bingo!...generalize the failure to consider consequences (and implications) to virtually all important issues, questions, domains and discourses and you've got the fundamental problem of humanity! Put differently, almost all of these are basically devoid of critical thinking, or more fundamentally, the failure to ask questions, and when we do, to almost always seek the quick, easy answers, which almost always turn out to be problematic, pseudo answers, partial answers or downright invalid ones. We are all guilty to some extent and to varying degrees of failing to ask about, and thus think through consequences and implications, if for no other reason than our limits of time, energy and knowledge. However, when it comes to the most important, pressing societal (and even personal) issues or questions, the discourse and the underlying thinking is, in virtually all cases, not informed or guided by such critical thinking, EVEN THOUGH history has proven repeatedly that this is both essential and the only epistemologically valid way to arrive at needed, new, good, valid answers! The sad but ultimately hopeful irony is that almost all of us (unless our cognitive capacity is no longer intact for some reason) are perfectly capable of asking the questions, including of implications and consequences. Moreover, virtually all of us are complicit in this state of affairs! Furthermore, this is not a problem that afflicts just one or some parts of the political spectrum or only certain groups, however construed. It is a deeper dynamic and phenomenon; one arises out a fundamental dilemma of the human species - a dilemma expressed by our fundamental ambivalence about the value and importance of truth, and which has been true throughout human history. So, there you have it - the fundamental problem of the species, with the implied solution to that problem! The solution being application of the innate capacity we all have to solve problems, engage in critical thinking (centrally including asking about consequences, implications and whether proper, critical distinctions need to be made or if improper ones are made) in evaluating truth-claims and all the ideas, theories, proposals, etc. that rest on such claims, and to engage in the creative, innovative, inventive, outside-the-box thinking and even moral reasoning that all stem from the same underlying mental process, which we all are capable of. And if we don't want to be bothered personally with doing all of this for all the important things in our collective lives, then the solution is to create the structures or mechanisms - which certainly might require fundamentally changing government or even society - to make sure that some others ARE doing this crucial questioning and thus thinking on our behalf. And the underlying, fundamental key to all of this is the simple QUESTION and the process of asking questions, since THE QUESTION is the single most powerful tool humanity has ever had, unless one believes that superior tools are provided by divine Providence or some supernatural source. But in purely human terms, the question is the fundamental unit that, in the process of asking them, gives rise to critical thinking, reason itself and all that follows from reason, including science, medicine and technology; but also to the creative modes of thinking I mentioned previously. As such, it is the key to possibility, empowerment, hope and change, and is why we are communicating on computers instead of living in caves or jungles, etc., as our ancestors did tens of thousands of years ago. There, brought it back to computers... BTW, to bring it back even more directly, here's a question for all the computer experts here, related directly to this: What is the real, underlying source of the amazing power or capacity of computers or, more specifically, microprocessors, and which power continues to grow with their increasing speed and memory, etc.? I now asked this of maybe 3 or 4 people who are pretty knowledgeable about computers, even work with them professionally,and surprisingly, so far, none of seemed either to have really thought about this obvious question or have a very good answer (an answer that doesn't, for instance, simply beg the question). One got to the heart of the matter pretty quickly, gently guided by some further questions. All of these people know much more about computers and technology than I do. So I'll ask the wise, knowledgeable folks here - what do you think is the real source of the power of the microprocessor/computer, and thus what is driving all of the technology that stems from this? The hint I'll give is one I already have given; the concept of the
Re: [CGUYS] [ OT WARNING!!!!
Only recently have I begun to appreciate or even watch or pay attention to religious figures as sources of great insight and wisdom; particularly these mega preachers. Saw TJ Jakes (may have his initials wrong) on a few shows, Dr. Phil yesterday, most recently. Also, recent shows of Joel Osteen (Sundays, on Fox), which I just stumbled on by accident. And other things, in various religions, that are simply deeply profound wisdom. Just tonight, I did the introductory class for a course I've devised on mental health recovery, and mentioned some of these very inspirational messages and messengers, and that if we continue to have this course, I would like and plan to bring in videos or books of some of these people or even live presenters (though probably not these folks :)). I can see why people are so drawn to these meg-preachers, and its not just because they are offering false hopes or dreams, a la some of the more notorious tv preachers in the past, like Jim and Tammy, etc. I think people are drawn to people like Osteen because they sense that is saying something that is true, even profound, and potentially of profound significance for their lives. The irony is that I am as much of a nonbeliever as one can be, and can probably out Hitchens or out Dawkins some of my critical analysis of religion and how it functions in the world. But I am only recently coming to see that there is a deeper, purely secular wisdom that these religions and religious figures (including Jesus, and I'm a non-believing Jew) say and said, even many millenia ago, that is still incredibly relevant as can be to our present situation. Now, since I had a secular epiphany some 8 months ago, I finally realize that amazing learning, insight and wisdom is to be found all around us and that anything or anyone can be a great teacher, starting, first and foremost, with young children, who are the most creative, most imaginative persons on the planet and the best questioners. And the questions, imagination and creativity are not all unrelated, either! Randall - Original Message - From: Rev. Stewart Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Monday, September 24, 2007 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] [ OT WARNING On that I see no disagreement. A happy employee is worth a ton of money! They help recruit business. I know this as it is the same or similar model Churches use to grow. Happy members pull other newer members in though the door thereby increasing numbers. How to keep them happy plus make your profit is the key to growing a good business. Stewart At 09:29 PM 9/24/2007, you wrote: About a year ago NPR interviewed the president of Costco and I was very impressed with his sense of responsibility. He insisted that by providing better conditions he could attract better employees and reduce turnover. He said that the incresed productivity would pay for the better conditions. He was specificially critical of the WalMart methods. Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace Ozark, AL SL 82 * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.30/1025 - Release Date: 9/23/2007 1:53 PM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Fw: [CGUYS] [ OT WARNING!!!!
I don't know that much about him, though he seems intriguing, from what the little I have heard. I am certainly troubled by the way the process essentially shuts someone like him out from real contention in many ways; a point made, ironically, by the Iranian president on Charlie Rose last night. That is, out a country of 300 million, even 4 years out, the number of American citizens with any realistic chance of becoming the next president was probably well under 100 (counting those with the interest, desire, name recognition, financial resources, minimal qualifications, etc.) By 2 years out, this number was down to maybe 20, max. By now, it's down to, what, maybe 2 or 2 in each party - maybe 5 persons with any real chance? But again, all of this is OUR fault; for acquiescing to the existing system and state of affairs, and for so long. And I would include in this the failure to question institutions like the Presidency over the last 231 years, since we declared independence. The institution, which Bush has given us the great gift of helping show, if we'd only see this, is an obsolete anachronism in a modern world; one which confers infinitely more power and consequentiality onto any modern occupant (not just Bush) than the King of England we claimed to have revolted against because we didn't want to live under such a powerful personage. That we accept all of this and don't even think to question, that we can question any of this, is reflection of our disempowerment and our distorted perception that the people who gave us this government were not only the smartest people of their time, but were effectively deities or messagers of deities or a religion or other absolute truth; such that the system they gave us 230 plus years ago would also be the best possible system for all time, no matter how much things change. If Paul is really for change then he should probably try to run as an independent, perhaps in coalition with one or some others; maybe even establish a new movement or even party. If I were him, I would go directly to the people, over the heads of the mainstream media and political structure. But if he is holding himself out (or being taken) as yet another Messiah, another white knight, then that is a pseudo answer. The real answer is for a leader to, as Bill Bradley says, reflect back on the people, to show and inspire them and us to empower ourselves to bring about real change, including making whatever changes are needed. Always looking for this or that white knight who we desperately hope has the answers we can't come up with ourselves; hoping they will make better all that the past white knight-now-turned-Demon-Bush-Cheney ended up making such a mess of. The answer isn't to find one white knight to clean up the mess of another, fallen one. The real answer is for us to stop relying on white nights, experts, gurus, religions, ideologies, parties, political leaders, religious leaders, teachers, etc. and start realizing that we have the capacity to come up with our own answers, and start doing so. Randall - Original Message - From: Matthew Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2007 9:10 AM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Fw: [CGUYS] [ OT WARNING Like him, hate him, think him a loon or a wise man, but Ron Paul is definitely not cut from the same cloth as the other candidates for President. On Sep 24, 2007, at 3:46 PM, Randy wrote: Someone for real, fundamental change wouldn't run for President * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.30/1025 - Release Date: 9/23/2007 1:53 PM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe
Re: [CGUYS] [Fwd: Walgreen's offers free ink refills]
They are renamed Lexmark printers, but, as they always say if you call tech support, other cartridges won't or often don't work, as has been my experience twice now. Not sure what, exactly, they do to them to prevent other ones from working, but sure some others here might know. As for the transdermal patches, sounds pretty cool, just so long as you or the pharmacy doesn't get mixed up and fill the medical patches with ink or the ink patches with medicine! What do you mean about WalMart not paying taxes? Are you talking about illegally not paying them or finding some legal way not to do so? Randall - Original Message - From: b_s-wilk [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 9:08 AM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] [Fwd: Walgreen's offers free ink refills] Randy [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Beginning to get jealous of people who live within close proximity to Walgreens or Walmart! Walgreen's yes, it's a good store. Walmart no, it's owned by evil trolls who lure you with phony low prices, then steal your money by not paying taxes. interesting note from slashdot: Hewlett-Packard's microneedle technology, used in its inkjet cartridges, could soon be used in transdermal patches to deliver a time-controlled release of drugs to patients. Still at the prototype stage, the patch will likely be 25 mm square in size and 3 mm thick. It will incorporate an array of microneedles that are between 75 and 100 microns, which will penetrate the top dry layer of the skin, also known as the stratum corneum. Above the microneedles is an array of wells, [and] those wells can hold one or more drugs, the device has an active mechanism to push the drug through the needle. ...so in the future maybe you can go to Walgreens to refill your transdermal patches as well. That means you could maybe get transdermal patches filled with inks for painless permanent tattoos. Could be the next fad. BTW, who makes Dell printers? Lexmark? Can their cartridges be refilled successfully? Do they have a microchip that makes them fail if you refill them? Betty * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] [Fwd: Walgreen's offers free ink refills]
Beginning to get jealous of people who live within close proximity to Walgreens or Walmart! Didn't see my Dell 4 in 1 printer listed on list of Dell printers that are refillable. Since two generic cartridges didn't work, maybe there's a good reason. Either Dell is lying when they repeatedly say generic cartridges don't work with Dell printers or some of these generic cartridge makers or sellers are lying when they claim that they do and can! A set of dell cartridges seems to be maybe a third the cost of the damn printer! Randall - Original Message - From: b_s-wilk [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 12:59 AM Subject: [CGUYS] [Fwd: Walgreen's offers free ink refills] Free Ink? I like free. Original Message Subject: Walgreen's offers free ink refills Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2007 12:43:04 -0400 Extremetech is reporting that Walgreens is offering one free ink jet refill to promote their refilling service. This will happen on Wednesday, September 12. http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1558,2181480,00.asp * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.14/1001 - Release Date: 9/11/2007 1:37 PM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
[CGUYS] Phone Internet: Comcast, Verizon or other?
My year special for Comcast internet expired Aug. 1, so spent considerable time on phone with customer service re. options for internet and/or phone (not to mention separately, with tech support re. log-in problem - this time actually got someone who could do a little critical thinking). After asking a ton of questions to extract information from the customer rep who was otherwise not forthcoming, the best option he could offer me going forward is this: internet and phone service (including unlimited long distance) for $69/month plus taxes fees, which he estimated at maybe another $9. This would be for either one or two years, with a penalty for early cancellation of, I think, $150. At this point, I'm not too concerned about what the rate will go to in a year or two, after the special, and he did say I could renew at this rate. I don't have this in writing, which I may ask for before signing on to anything. But I do need to have highspeed internet of some sort and if I do nothing (as happened last year, when a previous special ran out without my being made aware of it - leading to endless billing headaches for many months) my internet bill will stay at its new rate of about $57/month, which is not acceptable. This offer sounds tempting, but given some of the comments I've been hearing lately about Comcast (including a few negative ones about the phone service specifically) thought I'd see what current or former Comcasters here think. The alternative I was thinking about was to switch to Verizon for both phone and DSL, to get the current one-year special (something like $16/month last I checked, but it changes so often its hard to keep up). I currently have Cavalier for phone (including long distance, which they threw in so I wouldn't leave, as I threatened, because of the price) which is only $25, but they bill some fees, etc. differently than Verizon, so there is an additional $16 or so just in taxes and fees - for a monthly total of almost $42/month! I'm guessing Verizon might end up about as much if I get various features, like voice mail and caller id, but bundled with a low-cost internet, thinking it won't be too bad. Would prefer to have faster cable, as left Cavalier DSL because it was far too slow (and slower than adverstised), but the price difference might get me to overcome that preference. So any thoughts on Verizon phone DSL vs. Comcast phone internet? At this point, I have little interest or at least little money to pay for cable tv, so not interested in any bundles that include this, if can be avoided. Are there any other alternatives I should consider? Someone on another list mentioned that RCN might be worth considering for phone/internet. Any experience here with them? Wonder if anyone else here thinks this rings true for themselves: If I total all current expenses for all forms of communication (phone, internet, cell phone, newspaper, etc.) it seems like one of my largest expense categories. Thanks Randall * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] computer guys...kinda
The problem of integrity is even more basic. It has to do with the inconvenient truth that truth is not really valued across the board, despite all our rhetoric to the contrary. Valuing truth includes honesty and therefore integrity. There are only 2 basic ways to value truth and know the truth - either it is given by some external source and taken to be inherently true or self-evident or through the process of inquiry. The only reliable form of inquiry (epistemology) is Reason and reasoning, which is critical thinking. These two basic ways of knowing and of evaluating truth-claims correspond to 2 fundamentally different meta-epistemologies. If one believes something on the basis that this person or that external source says so (a leader, politician, religion, parent, neighbor, expert), they embrace the first type of epistemology. What leads people to inquire and thus to thinking critically is either that they are not satisfied with their current understanding of something or that they are not satisfied with the given state of affairs in some way. To not be satisfied with one's understanding engenders curiosity and if one truly values Truth their threshold for being satisfied or accepting something or some understanding is much higher. Think Einstein vs. George Bush. Not only is truth not valued, outside certain narrow domains and with respect to certain questions (the valuing is contingent on something besides the value of Truth per se) but, as a consequence, as I indicated, critical thinking is neither valued nor practiced very much and certainly is not with respect to virtually all public/political discourse and thinking and policy making regarding important societal issues and problems. Most people think that they and people like them - those of the same political persuasion, religion, philosophy, etc. - think critically in general and with respect to all these issues, but few people apply critical thinking across the board, to all thinking and discourse, and certainly on important societal issues. I believe, and believe I can amply demonstrate, that this failure to value and think critically is the most fundamental problem we, as a society and species, and maybe in our personal lives, have, underlying virtually every significant societal problem. Most people think critically about only certain issues and domains of concern to them, if at all, but not generally, across the board. I couldn't resist chiming in here, as I'm developing a theory about critical thinking and especially its application to societal problems and discourse, as well as some related theories, such as a theory of questions and maybe a theory of thought. Hope to get a blog or website up and post them there and hopefully in a published essay and a book. If and when I do I'll post the site here, rather than ramble on in an email. Randall - Original Message - From: Rev. Stewart Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 1:21 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] computer guys...kinda Tom the lack of integrity in politics goes back way before the current administration. We have made politics what is by electing and continually reelecting these ethical black holes. Need I remind you of certain lacks of truth from Clinton et.al. Plus the dearth of who me's when others in congress got caught in the same predicaments. When we elect these yahoos and knowingly put in office people who are ethical slippery eels, we are getting what we deserve. Not sure how to stop it all, but Politics is a lot more than what do I get out of this bill ethics. I have called politicians on decisions that showed poll watching instead of integrity and get sappy no answer answers from them. Then next time in the ballot booth, mark an x in front of the opponents name. Problem is Americans in general tend to be way too independent and self serving when it comes to politics. Last state election the incumbent State Supreme Court Chief Justice had a comfortable lead until he started bad mouthing his opponent, a female. Half truths, swapped charges etc. bounced around the TV stations and radio stations. Enough people got sick of it and the lack of integrity that the Incumbent Chief Justice is now former Chief justice. Stewart At 01:17 PM 7/6/2007, you wrote: When people do not respond with integrity that is when really bad things start happening: Abu Grav, Gitmo, firings of U.S. attorneys, Microsoft anti-trust, etc. etc. None would have happened if people had responded with integrity. No, the Computer Guys is not of the same scale, but lack of integrity has a corrosive action on all aspects of life. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE
Re: [CGUYS] Top ten lists:
Betty, Right, mac, not MAC, not big Mac (the sandwich or the former steroid-enabled slugger). Thanks, yes, the list is in the right direction for crashes. It'd be nice to have a list of other problems, such as slow running computer, frequent freezing, etc., with the corresponding likely or possible causes. Regarding some of the problems you mention, such as bad ram, bad hard drive or file conflicts, how much of this do or can most computers indicate themselves or does the user have to know to take some action, such as checkdisk? Or, for instance, should one run certain things like checkdisk on a regular basis to catch such problems? This might not be so good for people who provide tech support, but wonder why, say, a computer couldn't be hooked up to some online diagnostic program sort of like how they hook a car up to computer diagnostic machines. The program would check out the computer's status, especially anything affecting performance, stability and safety and either make corrections or suggest them. Or at least indicate things that should be looked into, say, too little memory or whatever. I know there are some diagnostic programs you can run, but not sure how comprehensive they are. If they do exist and are not very expensive, I'd sure be interested in knowing about them! Speaking of diagnostics, my Windows Defender apparently became inoperative, so downloaded latest version and ran full scan, which picked up 3 possible problems not picked up in quick scan. Wasn't sure what the 3 things were it suggested were medium risk problems (refers you to the relevant Microsoft website, but once there, don't see any information on these items and didn't feel like spending an unpredictable amount of time tracking this down) so had program quarantine them. Subsequently, some programs (1 or 2 that I'm so far aware of) suddenly seem gone or inaccessible. Have noticed similar issue with running other antispyware or adware - insufficient information provided about what the questionable items found are, how important (or even whether) is it to delete or quarantine them, whether to delete or quarantine and what the consequences will be of deleting or quarantining them. Maybe this is because I'm using the cheap or free programs, but if all users should be regularly running antispyware, etc., yet it is not clear what the results mean or what to do with them, this seems like yet another dilemma. Randall - Original Message - From: b_s-wilk [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 12:22 AM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Top ten lists: Randy [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Here's something think might be helpful for the novice or inexperienced computer user: Develop two top ten lists - the first, top ten things (in sequence) that a user should do for computer safety and performance and second, a top ten list of the most common computer problems and the most typical causes or sources. Of course ten is an arbitrary number; maybe it's 5 for one list and 12 for the other. But it occurs that it might be good for a lost user (as I often am) to have some ideas of what to consider when yet another problem crops up. Hopefully, the lists would be based on the pooled experience of people, like many here, who have dealt with a lot of various problems. Just an idea. Bet this list could do a good job generating both lists. Okay, maybe would need separate lists for MAC and PC (or no problem list for MAC?) First, a Macintosh computer is a Mac, not a MAC. For MAC, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MAC_address. I have a pretty good list from a long time ago--maybe 1994 or earlier, when PC parts were much more expensive--and it's been helpful many times. This was a reply to a befuddled user several years ago: - Blue screens of death [crashes, etc.] can mean the program has stopped behaving normally, and is running random data instead of code. This can be caused by (in order of decreasing likelyhood and increasing horror): 1) Corrupt prefs or other files, often fonts 2) Missing dll, or file conflicts 3) Bad RAM 4) Bad external device or cable or termination 5) Bad hard drive 6) Bad power supply 7) Bad motherboard Be an acrobat. Keep your fingers crossed while reinstalling everything from your backup disks to a reinitialized or reformatted hard drive. Have you tried a different power cord or battery? - Randy - does that fit your requirements? I will add to the list that there are plenty of important documents online at a variety of help and mfg support sites. I bought a new Epson scanner last week, installed the software and discovered that it 'broke' Photoshop completely. I found parallel solutions at both Epson support and Adobe. The scanner works fine now. Add online support sites to your solutions list on YOUR web site. Betty
Re: [CGUYS] What should one charge?
The power button and its indicator light on my Dell 8300 computer are on the front panel, easily accessible. However, the light is extremely tiny and I often find it difficult to tell if the indicator is on or not. This has long struck me as a design flaw - make the indicator larger or something, so there is no doubt. Randall - Original Message - From: Paula Minor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 9:53 AM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] What should one charge? I have not visited Apple recently - are the power buttons hard to find on the current models? The power button on my iMac is on the back, the same white color as the case. When I first got it I had to search a while for it. Paula IN/USA Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, wine in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming WOO HOO what a ride! Have a wonderful day! * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.6.6/794 - Release Date: 5/8/2007 2:23 PM * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Why not build back up function into the computer?? (part 1 of response)
(part 1, original was rejected as too long) Thanks, a lot to chew over. I'm stuck for now with my Dell Dimension 8300 PC, which was supposed to be a pretty good computer based on the research I did and opinions I got on it when i bought it 3-4 years ago. I don't have the Office 2007 interface and haven't seen it, so can't say. Don't remember Bob and don't know what Clippy refers to either, so I plead much ignorance. After I posted it occurred that if you had some built-in back up device you could have an option when saving a document to simultaneously also copy it to the backup device. This could be the default option, with the option to over-ride it so you can manually decide on a case-by-case basis whether to back up while saving. But if there was a save/backup default, every new file or every change to an existing file would be changed on the back up, just as on the original hard drive. The back up could then be an exact mirror of whatever is currently on the hard drive. In fact, isn't there something that basically does this now? Is that what ghosting refers to? Maybe you could also set the option to automatically back up all incoming or sent email or do so by message rules or manually, for each email. It would be nice if computers were more intelligent and interactive if possible, so perhaps the computer could prompt the user to see if they wish to back up a new or changed file. It'd also be nice if a computer could do more ongoing monitoring of the system and, when necessary or useful, prompt the user to take some action, such as update a program when it can't be done automatically. Right now, when my computer starts running slow or freezes a lot, I can try to use the Help option, but usually this gets to a point where you run into a lot of technical jargon and its easy to quickly get lost unless one is willing to spend a whole lot of time trying to understand and work through these terms, etc. on a piecemeal basis. I realize that things are better than they use to be, that we don't all have to know DOS, for instance, but I bet things could be easier and simpler. Perhaps MACS are, I have no experience to say. When, for example, a computer is running slower or freezing frequently or taking longer to load (all problems I've been having in recent months) the computer should be monitoring and maybe addressing this sort of thing, at least doing some diagnostics and/or alert the user and suggest diagnostic or corrective actions. When I see, say, 70 processes running, I shouldn't have to google each one (learned this from the CG show recently) to see what they are; I should be able to simply, say, right-click on the process and the computer should tell me what the process is and important details about it or go online and find out. Sometimes, my Dell does pop up and mention something that it suggests needs fixing or addressing, but not enough and not for most of these performance issues. Maybe there could be one monitoring screen where all relevant indicators of the computer's operation and security are displayed, sort of like the indicators on a car dashboard. Periodically or when a problem arises, the user could be alerted by a prompt to open that screen. From that one central screen, one could see all that needs to be done, what has been done in the past and when and the current status. If, say, its been a year since you defragged the hard-drive or the need to do so can be monitored, the computer could either alert the user to do this or simply do it automatically. The computer could perhaps periodically go to the websites of manufacturers or the sellers of software you are running to see if there is an updated version one should have, just as Windows updates can be done this way. If I'm using too much memory or some program is, the computer could alert the user as another example. Maybe adding such monitoring or diagnostics would be impractical or cause other problems, i.e. mean yet more programs have to be running, taking up memory, etc. and I'm no programmer, designer or engineer. But I can't believe that computers in 2007 can't be made more user-friendly, more like the experience driving a car. Cars could also probably be made more user-friendly, but that's another story. Randall - Original Message - From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need
Re: [CGUYS] Why not build back up function into the computer??
(part 2) One thing a computer should be good at - certainly better than a person - is monitoring and keeping track of things - upgrades, changes, differences in performance today vs. 6 months ago, what should be done, when, etc. As much as possible, it would be nice to have these things built-in and operating automatically. Unlike a person, a computer should be able to precisely monitor its status or health, in the sense of always knowing how it is different today than from, say, a week, a month or a year ago, in terms of relevant changes to hardware or software, related to performance, such as download speeds or security. Presumably, it should also have some capacity to evaluate these changes, especially if they are problematic. Is any of this not feasible or too much to ask? Then, of course, it would be nice to have that computer itself be a tool for monitoring and tracking other things in one's life. For example, all power use in, say, a home, should be able to be monitored by a central computer. If there is unnecessary power use, maybe the source could be automatically shut off, such as a powerstrip when one retires for the evening. My car should be able to talk to my computer, to track maintenance, record (upload) important measurements, e.g. automatic mileage monitoring, etc. I'm guessing a lot of this can be done or is already being done if one is willing to spend enough. I just look forward to when much more of this is accessible and built-in for everyone. Okay, enough science fiction and day dreaming! Randall - Original Message - * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] back up question: what to back up and what doesn't need backing up?
Mike, Sounds like a fairly easy way to do regular backups, though couldn't afford it at the moment. I'm stuck copying onto DVDS, which I tried, but didn't go so easily. Had more to back up than on DVD's worth and was hoping it would be like I remember copying onto floppys, where the copy would be continued onto the next floppy after being prompted. But unless I missed some option for this using XP backup utility, couldn't do this, so couldn't do the option of backing up all info on computer. Ended up doing a selective backup several times to whittle it down to what could fit on one DVD, then did some more on another. Certainly didn't seem like something that I would likely go through on a very regular basis! Guess I'll just muddle through with trying to remember to regularly back up especially important documents. Randall - Original Message - From: Michel Lowe [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2007 9:32 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] back up question: what to back up and what doesn't need backing up? Randall, I bought a Western Digital external (USB) hard drive, 250Gig. Newegg lists a Maxtor 500Gig external drive for $150. My WD came with an automatic backup utility that makes it bootable and even includes a scheduler. The timer pops every week on Wednesdays and I get a full backup during lunch. No muss, no fuss -- especially futzing around with media. The downside is like you say: if you have anything undesirable on your PC it will get backed up, too. Probably a good idea to clean the PC somewhat, do a full virus scan, run some of the spyware/malware checkers before your first backup. Good luck, -Mike __ Michel David Lowe Purcellville, VA -Original Message- From: Computer Guys Announcements and Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Randy Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2007 10:21 PM To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Subject: [CGUYS] back up question: what to back up and what doesn't need backing up? Have only done very sporadic and partial data back ups in past, but after hearing yesterday's CG's show (mention of cost of data recovery!) and seeming increasing problems with computer's performance, decided it's high time (past time) to start backing up all those precious files regularly. However, not sure which of the options in the back up utility that came with computer to use. Tempted to use option to back everything on computer up for comprehensiveness and simplicity, but wonder if this might mean backing up some bad and nasty things which might harm the back up disk (plan to burn onto rewritable DVD, as don't have any other good back up options that I'm aware of). I definitely want to back up email as well, unless I can export it all to some other secure venue. There is an option to customize back up in order to select what to back up. I could do that if I knew I was going to back up everything important and it also might be nice not to back up a lot of unnecessary, space consuming files. Any suggestions? Should I just use the back up everything option? Thanks, Randall * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
[CGUYS] Why not build back up function into the computer?? (was back up question: what to back up and what doesn't need backing up?)
Tony, Sounds good, but I'd have to first learn what you are talking about and how to do it :) After reading your response and Mike's this thought occurred to me: Everyone who seems to know much about computers seems to advise that everyone regularly back up their computer. The same for running antivirus, spyware, adware and whatever else I'm leaving out or not aware of. Yet I believe I've heard the stat that only a fairly small minority of users (not speaking of businesses) actually back up regularly, not to mention doing the other important security things (spyware, etc.) The figure 20% of users doing regular back ups comes to mind, though not sure where I heard this or how accurate it is. Nevertheless, if regular backing up is something that everyone who owns and uses a computer should be doing, regardless of their technical expertise, why isn't backing up - the hardware and the software - a built in function of the computer itself? Or are there some computers that actually do this? I envision a modular set up with a back up drive that could easily be removed, which could also maybe make extra copies for separate storage at the same time onto DVDS, CDS. I also envision the back up function running automatically as a default (or as automatically as possible, say, every day at least) and that before each back up, built in anti-virus software, spyware, adware, whatever-else ware software would be run on the info to be backed up, so a clean backup would be likely. Maybe even some diagnostic exam to see if one is about to back up corrupted or damaged files, etc. If backing up or checking for spyware are important if not essential functions that should be performed regularly, they should be built in as part of the computer to the extent feasible, IMO. Is this asking too much or somehow unrealistic? It just seems to me that if something should be done as a regular part of using a computer, why not build it in and make it as easy and as automatic to use as possible, for all levels of users? So if someone wants, take my idea and go make millions on it; just remember me and send me a small royalty if you don't mind! I realize most PC makers don't usually also develop software for their computers, but maybe Apple could do this or maybe more PC makers could and should start producing an integrated, whole product. Could the fact that Apple develops both its software and its hardware be part of why it is generally considered a better product? Knowing little about the technical aspects of any of this, it intuitively seems like it designing an integrated product - hardware and software (including my back up module :)) - would more likely avoid glitches and produce a better product. Just wondering. I wonder if companies like Apple, Microsoft or PC developers ever hire novices or average users to give them feedback on what is needed or desirable in their products or if they basically only get the perspective and feedback of techies, programmers, and experienced users? From my perspective, computers and everything about them (still) seem unnecessarily complex and complicated, though admittedly this is based just on PCs. I do realize it is the American way to have endless choices and options for each of these things - ways of backing up, spyware, anti-virus, firewalls, adware, ISPS, email program, this program, that program, etc. However, for myself, and I suspect many, maybe most, average or novice users, all these choices simply add too much complexity, too many decisions, too many things to think about as far as whether they work with each other program or each piece of hardware, leading to the requirement of spending too much time and energy (mental and otherwise). Perhaps those who are much more knowledgeable about all of this like having so many options, but I think many users, myself included, would simply like a computer that works reliably, with as much of this stuff being pre-packaged and automated as possible. We would like it to be more like buying a new car, where what you need and want, as much as possible, comes with the car, not programs or hardware that you have to make decisions about and purchase subsequent to purchasing the car. The goal should be an integrated product and simplicity, not unnecessary fragmentation and thus unnecessary complexity. I also realize such complexity does create jobs for some who like and have mastered much of it, but I'm speaking as a simple user who wants to spend more time using the computer as a tool or a means than time, energy and money making sure this tool is working properly. Of course all tools need to maintained, but the maintenance shouldn't equal or exceed the utility of the tool in the first place! And, of course, we could say much the same thing for all the other ever-changing technological gadgets and gizmos that are out there and which are being constantly
