Re: NAS software for Raspberry Pi that supports full range of client OS (Win-10, MacOS-X, Linux) ?

[Vincent Lammens]

Hi Rick

You could try openmediavault. It has an iso for the raspberrypi, and 
comes with a smb, ftp and ssh system preinstalled, so serving all kinds 
of client os's should be no problem. It also has a webgui, and has a few 
plugins to add webdav for example.


---
Regards

Vincent Lammens
https://vincentlammens.net

Charles Curley schreef op 2020-03-24 05:28:

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 20:43:43 -0700
"Rick Thomas"  wrote:


Can anybody suggest a good NAS package? Debian based is preferable,
but almost any Linux will do.


I find a combination of plain vanilla Samba and nextcloud do me quite
well.

Re: NAS software for Raspberry Pi that supports full range of client OS (Win-10, MacOS-X, Linux) ?

[Charles Curley]

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 20:43:43 -0700
"Rick Thomas"  wrote:

> Can anybody suggest a good NAS package? Debian based is preferable,
> but almost any Linux will do.

I find a combination of plain vanilla Samba and nextcloud do me quite
well.

-- 
Does anybody read signatures any more?

https://charlescurley.com
https://charlescurley.com/blog/

NAS software for Raspberry Pi that supports full range of client OS (Win-10, MacOS-X, Linux) ?

[Rick Thomas]

The covid-19 situation is giving me lots of free time recently, so I've ordered 
a Raspberry Pi 4 with delivery expected sometime this week.

I'd like to use it for a NAS for the home network, so my family can share files 
without resorting to sneaker-net.

We have a full range of clients -- Mac, Win, Linux (mostly debian, but also 
CentOS and Ubuntu) and I'd like to be able to serve all of them if possible.

Can anybody suggest a good NAS package? Debian based is preferable, but almost 
any Linux will do.

I've been looking at Rockstor but I don't see anything there that will run on a 
Raspberry Pi.

Anybody using something they have had good experience with?

Thanks in advance,
Rick

Re: Doublets cartes/sorties

[Pierre ESTREM]

Bonsoir,

C'est OK avec sed et 2 for :

#!/bin/bash

tab=(`pacmd list-cards | sed -n 's/^\tname: <\(.*\)>$/\1/p; 
s/^\t\+output:\([^:]\+\).*$/    \1/p'`)


 Nombre d'éléments du tableau tab
Dim=${#tab[@]}

 Première boucle cherchant le nom d'une carte
for ((i=0; i<$Dim ; i++))
do
     Nom de la carte
    card=${tab[i]}
     Deuxième boucle cherchant les sorties de la carte
    for ((j=$[i+1] ; j<$Dim ; j++))
    do
    if [ ! "`echo ${tab[j]} | grep '_card.'`" ]; then
        output="${tab[j]}"
        echo "$card    $output"
    else break;
    fi
    done
    i=j
done

Votre code renvoie le même tableau ; je n'ai que 8 sorties alors qu'il 
m'avait semblé en avoir 1 ou 2 de plus.

Les résultats sont identiques.

Je peux attaquer le test des profiles.

Merci pour votre aide :)

pierre estrem


Le 23/03/2020 à 23:19, Étienne Mollier a écrit :

Pierre ESTREM, on 2020-03-23 22:15:20 +0100:

Aïe, il y a des chevrons qui encadrent le nom des cartes.
J'ai des erreurs avec ton code, mais je vous remercie de votre
participation.

Quelles erreurs se produisent exactement ?
Et sur quelle version de Debian ?

J'ai vérifié avec ma configuration de cartes son et j'obtiens la
sortie suivante chez moi, indépendemment de l'implémentation de
Awk (mawk vs gawk vs busybox) :

alsa_card.pci-_01_00.1  hdmi-stereo
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-stereo
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-stereo+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-21
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-21+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-40
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-40+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-41
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-41+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-50
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-50+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-51
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-51+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-71
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-71+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  iec958-stereo
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  iec958-stereo+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  iec958-ac3-surround-51
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  iec958-ac3-surround-51+input
alsa_card.platform-pcspkr   mono-fallback
alsa_card.platform-pcspkr   multichannel-output

Mais peut-être que j'ai mal compris le problème ?  Avec une
correction mineure sur le premier split pour régler une bonne
fois pour toute cette histoire de chevrons, et en mode « one
liner épique », je propose :

pacmd list-cards | awk '/^\tname: <.*>$/{split($0,n,"^\tname: 
<|>$");}/^\t+output:/{split($0,o,":");printf "%-31s %-s\n",n[2],o[2]}'

Peut-être que j'ai eu la mauvaise idée de tester sur Sid, et que
les autres versions de Debian se comportent différement ?


J'ai une horreur de 'awk' (c'est ma faute).
J'ai avancé avec la solution sed mais je dois passer ensuite par des boucles
for.

J'ai du mal à me représenter de solution simple en sed ou en
shell ; mais j'imagine que c'est possible.  Si vous y parvenez,
alors je serais curieux de la voir.  N'hésitez pas à la poster !

Amicalement,

Re: Buster without systemd?

[David Wright]

On Mon 23 Mar 2020 at 20:27:31 (+0100), Klaus Singvogel wrote:
> Tony van der Hoff wrote:
> > I know it's a sensitive subject, and I really don't want to upset the list,
> > there's been enough of that already, but why are some people so afraid of
> > systemd?
> 
> My reasons:

[…]

> Logging (journald) disables searching in /var/log: "grep -r" not really
> working there.

I commented on this already. grep -r is alive and well.

> My computer "hickups" for 20 seconds at boot. With systemd I don't have
> the slighest idea which process delays, as several processes start after
> the delay at once. I had the feeling with Init scripts it was more obvious
> to see which "startup file" hangs.

$ systemd-analyze critical-chain

Is that any help in finding what's waiting for what?

> Its flooding syslog/messages with unnecessary information (type: INFO).

Does removing "info" from the .conf file not work?

> But some important messages are not found in syslog nor messages.

Which ones are missing?

> No easy way to find out: if and what fails. Example: After months I found
> out that mlocate doesn't update it's database anymore: previously updates
> were done by cron, but the distri moved to systemd's way (timer) and by
> default the updatedb was disabled.

I've not touched the default. What did you have to change to make it run?

$ ls -l /var/lib/mlocate/mlocate.db 
-rw-r- 1 root mlocate 46870853 Mar 23 08:18 /var/lib/mlocate/mlocate.db
$ 

Cheers,
David.

Re: Buster without systemd?

[David Wright]

On Mon 23 Mar 2020 at 19:16:33 (+), Joe wrote:
> On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 13:15:13 -0400 Greg Wooledge  wrote:

> > 5) It does not write logs in human-readable files.  You need systemd's
> >tools to read systemd's logs.  This makes post mortem diagnostics
> >much more difficult.
> 
> You might add 5a): Why? 
> 
> There's not exactly a burning need to compress text into illegibility to
> save disc space these days. How many rational purposes are there to
> make logs readable only through systemd's own code?

All my buster systems log in the usual manner. Yes, I have some
incantations that I've copied from this list, but I don't normally
use them. eg:

$ journalctl -xe _SYSTEMD_UNIT=ssh.service | lessx
-- Logs begin at Mon 2020-03-23 08:11:58 CDT, end at Mon 2020-03-23 21:10:01 
CDT. --
Mar 23 08:12:35 wren sshd[701]: Server listening on 0.0.0.0 port 22.
Mar 23 08:12:35 wren sshd[701]: Server listening on :: port 22.
$ grep 'Server listening' /var/log/auth.log
Mar 22 08:10:57 wren sshd[976]: Server listening on 0.0.0.0 port 22.
Mar 22 08:10:57 wren sshd[976]: Server listening on :: port 22.
Mar 23 08:12:35 wren sshd[701]: Server listening on 0.0.0.0 port 22.
Mar 23 08:12:35 wren sshd[701]: Server listening on :: port 22.
$ 

Looks the same to me.

Cheers,
David.

Re: How can I see only the latest change log of packages before update ?

[David Wright]

On Tue 24 Mar 2020 at 00:35:39 (+0200), Anastasios Lisgaras wrote:
> 
> My update/upgrade system script is about that :
> sudo apt update && sudo apt list --upgradable -a && sudo apt
> dist-upgrade -y && sudo apt autoremove -y && sudo apt autoclean -y &&
> sudo apt clean -y
> 
> But I want for *each* package that has an update available, before I
> update it to see its changes.

Then you have to split the upgrade command into a download-only part
(-d in apt-get, and I assume it's the same in apt), and the installing
part itself (with no -d).

> I found for that (maybe) two tools :
> * apt-listchanges
> * changelog
> 
> 1) The "apt-listchanges" tool I cannot understand how it is used
> ```
> apt-listchanges thunderbird
> apt-listchanges: thunderbird does not have '.deb' extension
> ```

man apt-listchanges says:

apt-listchanges [[options...]] {[--apt] | [package.deb...]}
  

so you have to give it the actual filename (after the download part,
of course), and not just the name of the package.

> 2) With the "changelog" I got the change logs, but i think i'm not just
> getting the last ones ..
> 
> apt changelog openssh-client : https://pastebin.com/raw/15rCqULj
> apt changelog thunderbird : https://pastebin.com/raw/RdfnwtDD
> 
> I want to see *only* the *latest* change logs for *each* update
> available package.

This time, the bare package name is sufficient, and by default you get
the installed version's changelog. You have to add options (like those
for the install command) so it can download a different version to
give you the information for packages not already installed on the system.

But, in view of your upgrade script, you obviously don't need
changelog, because apt-listchanges will fit nicely between your
apt -d dist-upgrade   and   apt dist-upgrade   commands.

Cheers,
David.

Re: Falha no Boot - Positivo Mobo S7 (Programa UCA)

[osvaldo luciano Santos]

Salve Leandro!
De repente uma luz... ainda não tinha usado esse caminho! Eu tinha acessado
uma outra página com a lista de suportes para vários produtos. Usei o seu
caminho, mas também só há pequenas correções para o Mandriva Mini, nada
para BIOS!
Muito obrigado, mesmo assim!
Abraço,
Osvaldo

Em seg., 23 de mar. de 2020 às 14:46, Leandro Pereira <
lean...@fullonmorning.com> escreveu:

> lá no site da positivo, na parte de drivers, tem um opção para digitar
> o número de série do equipamento para acessar os downloads e outras
> informações. Já tentou verificar la?
>
> Leandro L. Pereira
>
> Em dom., 22 de mar. de 2020 às 16:23, osvaldo luciano Santos
>  escreveu:
> >
> > Olá pessoal!
> >
> > Leandro, a Positivo não oferece nem mais informações sobre esse produto
> em seu suporte. Logo, na minha situação, sem chances de arriscar uma
> atualização de BIOS por outras referências. Mas, obrigado pela atenção!
> >
> > "nandre@", as fontes e baterias são todas originais - e esse problema
> acontece tanto com as máquinas em que as baterias não mantêm a carga quanto
> nas que mantêm. Também não dá para visualizar a mensagem em tela porque na
> etapa em que o boot pára fica apenas uma tela preta! Mas, é ótimo conhecer
> este tipo de erro possível. Muito obrigado! Vou continuar a pesquisar e
> mesmo não encontrando, basta ensinarmos as crianças a ultrapassarem este
> simples obstáculo! Só não vai ficar "elegante"! rs. Mas, valerá a pena - só
> em São Carlos são 1700 que foram comprados, no Brasil estima-se 225 mil
> netbooks vendidos pela Positivo aos governos!
> >
> > Abraços e seguimos na luta!
> > Osvaldo
> >
> >
> >
> > Em qui., 19 de mar. de 2020 às 14:28, ndre  escreveu:
> >>
> >> Olá Osvaldo,
> >>
> >> ter 17 mar 2020 às 20:56:24 (1584489384), osvaldoluci...@gmail.com
> enviou:
> >> > Saudações pessoal,
> >> >
> >> > Sou professor das séries iniciais e peço ajuda nesta lista. Estou
> >> > trabalhando no desafio de tentar resgatar para o uso aqueles
> classmates
> >> > (design da Intel) que a Positivo vendeu ao governo brasileiro no
> Programa
> >> > UCA (Um Computador por Aluno). Originalmente ele veio com o Mandriva
> Mini.
> >> > Mesmo neste SO original eles estão apresentando um problema:
> >> > *- a BIOS (Phoenix SecureCore vs ec 1.01) inicia, mas após fazer a
> leitura
> >> > completa do hardware, pára e não inicia o grub, fica uma tela preta;
> só
> >> > consegue iniciá-lo na segunda tentativa. Nesta tela preta, qualquer
> tecla
> >> > pressionada faz ele reiniciar.*
> >> >
> >> > Fiz uma customização do debian, com xfce e várias suítes de jogos do
> kde,
> >> > com alguns aplicativos do projeto DebianEdu também (tudo num cartão
> de 4G)
> >> > e acho que consegui dar um fôlego maior a esses equipamentos públicos.
> >> > Hoje, estou trabalhando com uma customização do Debian9.11/XFCE4.12.
> Porém,
> >> > estou com aquele problema no boot. Só na segunda tentativa
> inicializa. E o
> >> > mais curioso, se for curto o intervalo entre o desligamento e o novo
> boot,
> >> > ele inicializa normalmente (ou seja, na terceira, na quarta...
> tentativas).
> >> >
> >> > Alguém conhece as razões do problema ou tem hipóteses para
> investigação?
> >> >
> >> > Agradeço muito e abraços a todos!
> >>
> >> Você sabe se a fonte de energia desses computadores é original
> >> do fabricante?
> >>
> >> Pergunto porque tive um problema _parecido_ ao trocar uma fonte
> >> por outra genérica. A inicialização era interrompida logo no
> >> início com uma mensagem de erro informando a inadequação da
> >> amperagem/voltagem. Pressionando qualquer tecla a inicialização
> >> prosseguia.
> >>
> >> No seu caso, eu pesquisaria no site do fabricante acerca dos
> >> "bios boot error codes/signal". Essas mensagens de erro
> >> geralmente são por sinais sonoros ou luminosos. Observe se
> >> há algum tipo de repetição luminosa parecida com um código
> >> morse e compare com as informações do fabricante. Isso
> >> provavelmente significa que algum componente não está
> >> funcionando da forma esperada ou que algum conector está
> >> com defeito. A solução seria então identificar qual o
> >> componente/conector defeituoso e consertá-lo.
> >>
> >> Boa sorte!
> >>
>
>

Re: Doublets cartes/sorties

[Pierre ESTREM]

Bonsoir,

> pacmd list-cards | awk '/^\tname: <.*>$/{split($0,n,"^\tname: 
<|>$");}/^\t+output:/{split($0,o,":");printf "%-31s %-s\n",n[2],o[2]}'


J'utilise une base Debian Jessie et très exactement AccessDV Linux 
puisque je suis DV (déficient visuel).


Le code dessus fonctionne et me renvoie un beau tableau.
Je dois creuser car il me semble qu'il manque 1 ou 2 sorties.

Ca renvoie :

alsa_card.pci-_00_03.0  hdmi-stereo
alsa_card.pci-_00_03.0  hdmi-surround
alsa_card.pci-_00_03.0  hdmi-stereo-extra1
alsa_card.pci-_00_03.0  hdmi-surround-extra1
alsa_card.pci-_00_03.0  hdmi-stereo-extra2
alsa_card.pci-_00_03.0  hdmi-surround-extra2
alsa_card.pci-_00_1b.0  analog-stereo
alsa_card.pci-_00_1b.0  analog-stereo+input

J'ai progressé dans mon code sed et for ; je posterai !

Merci
pierre estrem

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Michael Howard]

On 23/03/2020 23:20, Patrick Bartek wrote:

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 15:15:14 +
Michael Howard  wrote:


On 23/03/2020 14:28, Patrick Bartek wrote:

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:37:47 -0400
Jude DaShiell  wrote:
  

There is devuan-ascii 2.x but I don't know its equivalent to buster.
That system maintained sysv and still has support.

ASCII is Stretch without systemd or any of the dependencies.  Devuan
hasn't release its "Buster" version yet.

B
  

It can be upgraded to 'beowulf' using apt of course.

I did that some months ago with Ascii running in Virtualbox.  And it did
work, but there were enough problems then that it wasn't suitable
for general use -- just evaluation. Perhaps there have been
improvements since then, but I'll wait for Beowulf to be officially
released before checking it out again.  Currently, I'll stick with
Stretch running sysvinit until long term support for ceases.

B


I guess it depends exactly what is installed but I have upgraded
via this route a number of times.

--
Michael Howard

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Patrick Bartek]

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 15:15:14 +
Michael Howard  wrote:

> On 23/03/2020 14:28, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:37:47 -0400
> > Jude DaShiell  wrote:
> >  
> >> There is devuan-ascii 2.x but I don't know its equivalent to buster.
> >> That system maintained sysv and still has support.  
> > ASCII is Stretch without systemd or any of the dependencies.  Devuan
> > hasn't release its "Buster" version yet.
> >
> > B
> >  
> It can be upgraded to 'beowulf' using apt of course.

I did that some months ago with Ascii running in Virtualbox.  And it did
work, but there were enough problems then that it wasn't suitable
for general use -- just evaluation. Perhaps there have been
improvements since then, but I'll wait for Beowulf to be officially
released before checking it out again.  Currently, I'll stick with
Stretch running sysvinit until long term support for ceases.

B

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Toni Mas]

I did. I just did not use "full-upgrade" option. I upgraded package by
package resolving all dependencies and I had to install elogind but it
is not needed to start X system. It was just for dependencies.

Please, could you explain the race of conditions risk race?

Thanks.

Toni Mas

Missatge de Renato Gallo  del dia dl., 23 de
març 2020 a les 9:06:
>
>
> linux without systemd = race condition risks = why in hell anyone would want 
> to do it ?
>
> - Messaggio originale -
> Da: "Felix Miata" 
> A: "debian-user" 
> Inviato: Lunedì, 23 marzo 2020 8:08:28
> Oggetto: Re: Buster without systemd?
>
> Marc Shapiro composed on 2020-03-22 18:21 (UTC-0700):
>
> > after 21 to 22 years of using
> > Debian (since Bo), do I have to switch to another linux distro?
>
> AFAIK, no one has ever died as a consequence of using an OS with systemd. So, 
> no,
> you don't "have to" switch to another distro. You can do as most have done, 
> fondly
> or not so fondly remember sysvinit, and accept the change, whether for better 
> or
> worse.
>
> OTOH, would switching to Devuan really be "switching" to another distro? 
> That's
> like "switching" to any of the zillion distros based on Debian that include 
> Debian
> repos in sources.list. They're mostly Debian but with different defaults,
> different far more the interface than the guts that make Debian debian.
> --
> Evolution as taught in public schools is religion, not science.
>
>  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!
>
> Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/
>

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Gene Heskett]

On Monday 23 March 2020 16:34:22 Greg Wooledge wrote:

> On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 04:09:14PM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > That which I have managed to get my head wrapped around, do seem to
> > be a better idea. But thats far from all of it at the present time.
> > For starters, lets say you know you are having a dhcpd problem, so
> > you go read man dhcpd, and it has nothing to say about it if its now
> > managed by systemd. Hells bells, people, at least put a "see also
> > man xxx" pointing at the systemd managed version of its man
> > page.
>
> Please remember that Debian does not use systemd's network interface
> bringing-up features by default.  If you've gone out of your way to do
> so locally, that's on you.
>
Thats a problem I don't have Greg. I went to a locally defined hosts file 
30+ years ago for all my private resolutions, and it Just Works. Queries 
that go out on the wire for resolution are relayed to the dns services 
of my provider. Resolution times for external sites are sub 100 
millisecond as a general rule. Thats ALL handled by my router running 
dd-wrt which I think is using dnsmasq.

Yet every time I promote such a structure as a solution to someones local 
network problems I am the idiot according to you for not using dhcp 
globally. I don't enjoy being painted as an a-hole for using something 
that Just Works.  So I've quit unless you or someone like you pulls my 
chain.

> For a Debian system, the path of inquiry is still the same as before
> -- /etc/network/interfaces and then Network Manager, for the vast
> majority of systems.

For the "vast majority of system's", as I install them, the first thing I 
have to do is uninstall that stuff as it has yet in the last 5 years, to 
use anything in the routing table but the avahi supplied 169.xx.cc.nn 
address which is not allowed off the premises by dd-wrt.

I have repeatedly said I'll use what works, and NM/Avahi hasn't yet in 
all the years it has existed.

> Raspbian is of course a separate distribution, and you'd have to ask a
> Raspbian mailing list if your issue is with something of theirs.

I will, just as soon as one is instigated.  All they have is a forum with 
a broken search engine, if you actually find an answer, its the result 
of reading half the msgs ever posted to that forum. Fortunately I read 
at a good clip. Thats how I got to be a C.E.T., and a very well paid 
broadcast engineer/Chief Operator on an 8th grade education. I got that 
way the hard way, I never asked for a raise, I just got them.


Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 

installing with Flatpak

[Anil Felipe Duggirala]

hello,
I would like to ask if there are any drawbacks in installing software
using Flatpak. As far as I understand, this installation method
installs packages in an isolated way (whatever that means). 
I would imagine this would require more disk space. But will
performance of the software be affected when running it this way?
thank you,

Re: Re: buster, ekiga.

[Anil Felipe Duggirala]

On Fri, 2020-01-03 at 18:03 -0800, Ernesto Alfonso wrote:
> I was able to use linphone, which is available in buster.
> 
> Ernesto

Linphone is also available from a Flatpak. The newer version is much
better than the one in the Debian main repository.

Installing Debiam

[Chocolate Island Prince]

This information is wowfactor 10!
I never knew any of this.  I have a an old but in excellent condition a
Sony Vaio  and a 16 years old Macbook.
1. Sony has no OS . I would like a good system installed.
So What do uou suggest n how can I down load ?
Should I use usb stick?

2. Macbook it has OS but slow.
Please help me. Thank you

How can I see only the latest change log of packages before update ?

[Anastasios Lisgaras]

Hello,

My update/upgrade system script is about that :
sudo apt update && sudo apt list --upgradable -a && sudo apt
dist-upgrade -y && sudo apt autoremove -y && sudo apt autoclean -y &&
sudo apt clean -y

But I want for *each* package that has an update available, before I
update it to see its changes.

I found for that (maybe) two tools :
* apt-listchanges
* changelog

1) The "apt-listchanges" tool I cannot understand how it is used
```
apt-listchanges thunderbird
apt-listchanges: thunderbird does not have '.deb' extension
```

2) With the "changelog" I got the change logs, but i think i'm not just
getting the last ones ..

apt changelog openssh-client : https://pastebin.com/raw/15rCqULj
apt changelog thunderbird : https://pastebin.com/raw/RdfnwtDD


I want to see *only* the *latest* change logs for *each* update
available package.


Thank you,
Tasos

Re: Doublets cartes/sorties

[Étienne Mollier]

Pierre ESTREM, on 2020-03-23 22:15:20 +0100:
> Aïe, il y a des chevrons qui encadrent le nom des cartes.
> J'ai des erreurs avec ton code, mais je vous remercie de votre
> participation.

Quelles erreurs se produisent exactement ?
Et sur quelle version de Debian ?

J'ai vérifié avec ma configuration de cartes son et j'obtiens la
sortie suivante chez moi, indépendemment de l'implémentation de
Awk (mawk vs gawk vs busybox) :

alsa_card.pci-_01_00.1  hdmi-stereo
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-stereo
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-stereo+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-21
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-21+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-40
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-40+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-41
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-41+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-50
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-50+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-51
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-51+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-71
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  analog-surround-71+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  iec958-stereo
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  iec958-stereo+input
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  iec958-ac3-surround-51
alsa_card.pci-_00_14.2  iec958-ac3-surround-51+input
alsa_card.platform-pcspkr   mono-fallback
alsa_card.platform-pcspkr   multichannel-output

Mais peut-être que j'ai mal compris le problème ?  Avec une
correction mineure sur le premier split pour régler une bonne
fois pour toute cette histoire de chevrons, et en mode « one
liner épique », je propose :

pacmd list-cards | awk '/^\tname: <.*>$/{split($0,n,"^\tname: 
<|>$");}/^\t+output:/{split($0,o,":");printf "%-31s %-s\n",n[2],o[2]}'

Peut-être que j'ai eu la mauvaise idée de tester sur Sid, et que
les autres versions de Debian se comportent différement ?

> J'ai une horreur de 'awk' (c'est ma faute).
> J'ai avancé avec la solution sed mais je dois passer ensuite par des boucles
> for.

J'ai du mal à me représenter de solution simple en sed ou en
shell ; mais j'imagine que c'est possible.  Si vous y parvenez,
alors je serais curieux de la voir.  N'hésitez pas à la poster !

Amicalement,
-- 
Étienne Mollier 
Fingerprint:  5ab1 4edf 63bb ccff 8b54  2fa9 59da 56fe fff3 882d
Et Hip, Hip, Hip, Hourra !   Pour le personnel infirmier !   \o/


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Re: Buster without systemd?

[Charles Curley]

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 19:51:18 +0100
kjo...@fastmail.com (Kamil Jońca) wrote:

> Well. I am quite happy when systemd start to govern
> services/daemons.

Good for you.


I don't suppose you use gpsd under systemd. The gpsd maintainers hate
systemd with a passion because systemd makes assumptions about daemons
which simply do not apply to gpsd. And every time the gpsd maintainers
cobble together some way of beating systemd into submission, systemd
changes the rules and we're back to the drawing board.


> 
> I also understand timers - cron and anacron sometimes are too "weak".

What does "weak" mean?

cron has its problems. So someone -- debian? -- glued anacron on top of
that, giving us the subsequent mess. Now along comes systemd with more
of the same ill-thought-out design? No thanks.


> But now systemd wants:
> - manage network interfaces
> - do name resolving
> - and so on.
> and quite often it cannot do it properly (ie. with little more
> complicated configuration). 

And there's perfectly good code out there, some of which has been in
use since before Bill Gates was in diapers.

-- 
Does anybody read signatures any more?

https://charlescurley.com
https://charlescurley.com/blog/

Re: exemple de ~/.pgpass qui marche (PostGreSQL/Debian/Buster) - et aide souhaitée en OpenStreetMap.

[Yves Rutschle]

Hello,

On Sun, Mar 22, 2020 at 04:34:46PM +0100, Basile Starynkevitch wrote:
> S'il y a des gens pour m'aider sur https://github.com/bstarynk/helpcovid ils
> sont bienvenus. Mais en anglais s'il vous plait, le contributeur le plus
> actif étant indien.

J'ai perdu le mail où tu annonces ton projet, mais j'ai
l'impression que ça existe déjà sous le nom "en première
ligne" (je ne connais pas plus l'application que ça car
c'est madame qui s'en ai servi, mais je sais que ça marche
déjà)

Y.

Re: Speed of USB ports on Inspiron 1501

[rhkramer]

On Monday, March 23, 2020 02:20:19 PM David Christensen wrote:
> The first link is:
> 
> https://downloads.dell.com/manuals/all-products/esuprt_laptop/esuprt_inspir
> on_laptop/inspiron-1501_owner%27s%20manual_en-us.pdf

Thanks, that worked.

> Was your laptop originally sold in Finland?

Not as far as I know, and I see no evidence thereof (I mean, all of the labels 
and such are in English, and Windows seemed to be setup to use the English 
locale.

Re: Doublets cartes/sorties

[Pierre ESTREM]

Bonsoir Etienne et le monde libre...

Aïe, il y a des chevrons qui encadrent le nom des cartes.
J'ai des erreurs avec ton code, mais je vous remercie de votre 
participation.


J'ai une horreur de 'awk' (c'est ma faute).
J'ai avancé avec la solution sed mais je dois passer ensuite par des 
boucles for.


A suivre

pierre estrem



Le 23/03/2020 à 20:46, Étienne Mollier a écrit :

Pierre ESTREM, on 2020-03-22 23:34:28 +0100:

Je tente des tests de profiles de cartes son et j'ai besoin de les stocker
sous forme de tableau comme ceci :

carte1 sortie1
carte1 sortie2
carte1 sortie3
carte2 sortie1
carte2 sortie2
carte3 sortie1

Je fais ceci :

pacmd list-cards | sed -n 's/^\tname: <\(.*\)>$/\1/p;
s/^\t\+output:\([^:]\+\).*$/\1/p'

Ainsi je n'ai pas les paires "cartes/sorties" mais tout est en ligne...

Avec des boucles je ne m'en sors pas et j'ai une peur de awk.

Quelqu'en saurait-il faire cela ?

Bonsoir,

Je suppose que c'est possible de faire plus simple.  Mais avec
du code awk malheureusement j'ai ceci, qui m'a l'air de produire
une sortie comme vous semblez espérer l'obtenir :

pacmd list-cards \
| awk '
/^\tname: <.*>$/ {
split($0, name, "<|>");
}
/^\t+output:/ {
split($0, output, ":");
printf "%-31s %-s\n", name[2], output[2]
}'

Le premier match enregistre le nom de la carte dans le second
champ deux du tableau name.  Le second match extrait chaque
sorties son dans le champ deux du tableau output, puis affiche
ladite sortie, préfixée du nom de la carte.  Ça devrait bien
marcher tant que "name:" apparait en premier, et que le nom de
la carte ne contient pas de chevrons.

Amicalement,

Re: Buster without systemd?

[deloptes]

Gene Heskett wrote:

> That along would ease the transition, and reduce the the systemd hate and
> discontent on ALL of these lists.  And justify the reason for the
> individual change. None of us like being kept in the dark.

Absolutely agree with this. It took me about an year to read myself in to
the systemd and understand the idea behind.

On the server and the firewall it is buster and still sysvinit. On the
desktop it is systemd - and this is where it belongs.
Meanwhile I must admit it does not cause troubles at all (or at least I do
not notice them, if there are such).

I think it is a very good choice to put it on the desktop. On the server I
do not know what it is good for ... perhaps depends on what kind of server
it is.

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Greg Wooledge]

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 04:09:14PM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> That which I have managed to get my head wrapped around, do seem to be a 
> better idea. But thats far from all of it at the present time. For 
> starters, lets say you know you are having a dhcpd problem, so you go 
> read man dhcpd, and it has nothing to say about it if its now managed by 
> systemd. Hells bells, people, at least put a "see also man xxx" 
> pointing at the systemd managed version of its man page.

Please remember that Debian does not use systemd's network interface
bringing-up features by default.  If you've gone out of your way to do
so locally, that's on you.

For a Debian system, the path of inquiry is still the same as before --
/etc/network/interfaces and then Network Manager, for the vast majority
of systems.

Raspbian is of course a separate distribution, and you'd have to ask a
Raspbian mailing list if your issue is with something of theirs.

Re: Identification orange.fr

[NoSpam]

Le 23/03/2020 à 20:07, ajh-valmer a écrit :

On Monday 23 March 2020 17:52:14 F. Dubois wrote:

Bonjour à toutes et tous.
Depuis quelques jours, et à priori sans intervention de ma part, la
connexion sur mon espace Orange est impossible.

Est la raison ? :
Notre secrétaire d'état au numérique demande de ne pas trop
pratiquer Internet, car très saturé en ce moment...
Préférer les SMS.


Internet n'est pas plus (ou pas beaucoup plus) qu'habituellement. Que 
les serveurs du CNED le soient ou quelques interco opérateurs ça oui.


Consulter sa BAL via SMS, faudra expliquer comment faire !

--

Daniel

logrotate

[Stefan van der Veen]

Hallo Debian gebruikers,

Weet iemand of er iets bestaat zoals 
https://crontab.guru, maar dan een website waarop je 
eenvoudig een logrotate script kunt maken of bij elkaar kunt klikken?

Met vriendelijke groeten,
Stefan

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Gene Heskett]

On Monday 23 March 2020 15:16:33 Joe wrote:

> On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 13:15:13 -0400
>
> Greg Wooledge  wrote:
> > 5) It does not write logs in human-readable files.  You need
> > systemd's tools to read systemd's logs.  This makes post mortem
> > diagnostics much more difficult.
>
> You might add 5a): Why?
>
> There's not exactly a burning need to compress text into illegibility
> to save disc space these days. How many rational purposes are there to
> make logs readable only through systemd's own code?

NONE Thats my Main objection to it. If it can't leave logs in 
plain "This is what you need to do text", in the users first language 
with instructions right in the log, one of us needs to get up and leave 
the party.

The current practice of posting the error, and praying someone can make 
ones native language out of it is the stuff found on the ground behind 
the male of the bovine specie.

That which I have managed to get my head wrapped around, do seem to be a 
better idea. But thats far from all of it at the present time. For 
starters, lets say you know you are having a dhcpd problem, so you go 
read man dhcpd, and it has nothing to say about it if its now managed by 
systemd. Hells bells, people, at least put a "see also man xxx" 
pointing at the systemd managed version of its man page.

That along would ease the transition, and reduce the the systemd hate and 
discontent on ALL of these lists.  And justify the reason for the 
individual change. None of us like being kept in the dark.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 

Re: Doublets cartes/sorties

[Étienne Mollier]

Pierre ESTREM, on 2020-03-22 23:34:28 +0100:
> Je tente des tests de profiles de cartes son et j'ai besoin de les stocker
> sous forme de tableau comme ceci :
> 
> carte1 sortie1
> carte1 sortie2
> carte1 sortie3
> carte2 sortie1
> carte2 sortie2
> carte3 sortie1
> 
> Je fais ceci :
> 
> pacmd list-cards | sed -n 's/^\tname: <\(.*\)>$/\1/p;
> s/^\t\+output:\([^:]\+\).*$/\1/p'
> 
> Ainsi je n'ai pas les paires "cartes/sorties" mais tout est en ligne...
> 
> Avec des boucles je ne m'en sors pas et j'ai une peur de awk.
> 
> Quelqu'en saurait-il faire cela ?

Bonsoir,

Je suppose que c'est possible de faire plus simple.  Mais avec
du code awk malheureusement j'ai ceci, qui m'a l'air de produire
une sortie comme vous semblez espérer l'obtenir :

pacmd list-cards \
| awk '
/^\tname: <.*>$/ {
split($0, name, "<|>");
}
/^\t+output:/ {
split($0, output, ":");
printf "%-31s %-s\n", name[2], output[2]
}'

Le premier match enregistre le nom de la carte dans le second
champ deux du tableau name.  Le second match extrait chaque
sorties son dans le champ deux du tableau output, puis affiche
ladite sortie, préfixée du nom de la carte.  Ça devrait bien
marcher tant que "name:" apparait en premier, et que le nom de
la carte ne contient pas de chevrons.

Amicalement,
-- 
Étienne Mollier 
Fingerprint:  5ab1 4edf 63bb ccff 8b54  2fa9 59da 56fe fff3 882d
Et Hip, Hip, Hip, Hourra !   Pour le personnel infirmier !   \o/


signature.asc
Description: PGP signature

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Klaus Singvogel]

Tony van der Hoff wrote:
> I know it's a sensitive subject, and I really don't want to upset the list,
> there's been enough of that already, but why are some people so afraid of
> systemd?

My reasons:

Can't debug the start / stop of daemons as good as before. "(ba)sh -x" no
more working.

Not able to move easily a more complex SysV init script to systemd. Lost
functionality by my home-made packages.

Logging (journald) disables searching in /var/log: "grep -r" not really
working there.

My computer "hickups" for 20 seconds at boot. With systemd I don't have
the slighest idea which process delays, as several processes start after
the delay at once. I had the feeling with Init scripts it was more obvious
to see which "startup file" hangs.

As others say: systemd is too fat and has too much functionality. It
throws too fast the experienced software overboard, replacing it by its
own version.

Its flooding syslog/messages with unnecessary information (type: INFO).
But some important messages are not found in syslog nor messages.

No easy way to find out: if and what fails. Example: After months I found
out that mlocate doesn't update it's database anymore: previously updates
were done by cron, but the distri moved to systemd's way (timer) and by
default the updatedb was disabled.

Default values without files: configuration files are not required, but
then some default values are used. You have to know which file by which
filename has to be created and how the variables/values are named. Not to
mention the lack of documentation for some configuration files.

Best regards,
Klaus.
-- 
Klaus Singvogel
GnuPG-Key-ID: 1024R/5068792D  1994-06-27

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Joe]

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 13:15:13 -0400
Greg Wooledge  wrote:


> 
> 5) It does not write logs in human-readable files.  You need systemd's
>tools to read systemd's logs.  This makes post mortem diagnostics
>much more difficult.
> 

You might add 5a): Why? 

There's not exactly a burning need to compress text into illegibility to
save disc space these days. How many rational purposes are there to
make logs readable only through systemd's own code?

-- 
Joe

Re: Pulseaudio

[ajh-valmer]

On Monday 23 March 2020 19:50:29 Sébastien NOBILI wrote:
> 21 mars 2020 18:23 "ajh-valmer"  a écrit:
> > Je tape aussi "dpkg-reconfigure pulseaudio".
> 
> Ça ne devrait pas faire grand-chose car pulseaudio ne se lance pas comme
> démon système (c'est déconseillé upstream).
> > Je dois fermer puis réouvrir ma session graphique pour avoir enfin
> > pulsaudio qui apparait dans Kmix.

> Et avant, quand ça ne fonctionne pas, est-ce que le serveur est démarré ? :

Oui, pulsaudio apparait bien dans les processus.

>ps aux | grep pulseaudio :
 
S

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Kamil Jońca]

Tony van der Hoff  writes:

> On 23/03/2020 15:15, Michael Howard wrote:
>> On 23/03/2020 14:28, Patrick Bartek wrote:
>>> On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:37:47 -0400
>>> Jude DaShiell  wrote:
>>>
> 
>
> I know it's a sensitive subject, and I really don't want to upset the
> list, there's been enough of that already, but why are some people so
> afraid of systemd?
Well. I am quite happy when systemd start to govern services/daemons.

I also understand timers - cron and anacron sometimes are too "weak".
But now systemd wants:
- manage network interfaces
- do name resolving
- and so on.
and quite often it cannot do it properly (ie. with little more
complicated configuration). 

KJ

-- 
http://wolnelektury.pl/wesprzyj/teraz/

Re: Identification orange.fr

[ajh-valmer]

On Monday 23 March 2020 17:52:14 F. Dubois wrote:
> Bonjour à toutes et tous.
> Depuis quelques jours, et à priori sans intervention de ma part, la 
> connexion sur mon espace Orange est impossible.

Est la raison ? :
Notre secrétaire d'état au numérique demande de ne pas trop
pratiquer Internet, car très saturé en ce moment...
Préférer les SMS.

Re: Pulseaudio

[Sébastien NOBILI]

Bonjour,

21 mars 2020 18:23 "ajh-valmer"  a écrit:

> Je tape aussi "dpkg-reconfigure pulseaudio".

Ça ne devrait pas faire grand-chose car pulseaudio ne se lance pas comme
démon système (c'est déconseillé upstream).

> Je dois fermer puis réouvrir ma session graphique pour avoir enfin
> pulsaudio qui apparait dans Kmix.

Et avant, quand ça ne fonctionne pas, est-ce que le serveur est démarré ?

ps aux | grep pulseaudio

Sébastien

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Kenneth Parker]

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020, 12:48 PM Tony van der Hoff 
wrote:

>
> I know it's a sensitive subject, and I really don't want to upset the
> list, there's been enough of that already, but why are some people so
> afraid of systemd?
>

I consider myself Neutral on the subject, actually wanting to educate
myself on, both systemd and its alternatives.  So, since I have multiple
Partitions, on multiple Systems, I have room to experiment with both.  So
my two, main Operating systems are Buster, and Devuan Ascii.  And I have
Development tools on both, to help my Education.

Mainly, my goal, right now is to use each correctly.

Also, I can answer questions on both frameworks.

Kenneth Parker

>

Re: Identification orange.fr

[Klaus Becker]

Le 23/03/2020 à 19:40, F. Dubois a écrit :

Le 23/03/2020 à 19:23, NoSpam a écrit :


Bonjour,

vider le cache et virer les cookies, tester avec un autre butineur.

--

Daniel

Bonsoir, c'est fait. De plus les extensions installées font le vide au 
minimum à chaque redémarrage. Et rien n'y change.
Comme dit dans d'autres messages, le problème doit être lié à ma config 
de firefox puisque le problème ne se pose pas avec les autres ordis 
autour de moi. Clairement je pense qu'il y a quelque chose à nettoyer, 
mais quoi... j'ai viré tout ce qui semblait se rattacher à orange... Et 
c'est arrivé de nulle part, je n'ai rien changé et pouf, plus possible...


Bon, je vais continuer à chercher, désinstaller les extensions une par 
une, 



Il suffit de les désactiver

Klaus


quitte au pire à créer un nouveau profil et importer un par un tout

ce que je veux conserver.

En tout cas merci à tous pour vos réponses.
Remarquons que par les temps qui courent beaucoup doivent avoir un peu 
plus de temps...


Bonne soirée à toutes et tous, portez vous bien.

Fabien

Re: Identification orange.fr

[F. Dubois]

Le 23/03/2020 à 19:23, NoSpam a écrit :


Bonjour,

vider le cache et virer les cookies, tester avec un autre butineur.

--

Daniel

Bonsoir, c'est fait. De plus les extensions installées font le vide au 
minimum à chaque redémarrage. Et rien n'y change.
Comme dit dans d'autres messages, le problème doit être lié à ma config 
de firefox puisque le problème ne se pose pas avec les autres ordis 
autour de moi. Clairement je pense qu'il y a quelque chose à nettoyer, 
mais quoi... j'ai viré tout ce qui semblait se rattacher à orange... Et 
c'est arrivé de nulle part, je n'ai rien changé et pouf, plus possible...


Bon, je vais continuer à chercher, désinstaller les extensions une par 
une, quitte au pire à créer un nouveau profil et importer un par un tout 
ce que je veux conserver.


En tout cas merci à tous pour vos réponses.
Remarquons que par les temps qui courent beaucoup doivent avoir un peu 
plus de temps...


Bonne soirée à toutes et tous, portez vous bien.

Fabien

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Dan Ritter]

Henning Follmann wrote: 
> On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 04:31:33PM +, Tony van der Hoff wrote:
> > I ask the question in all innocence, purely to understand whypeople seem to
> > want to jump through hoops to avoid it.
> > 
> 
> Maybe lack of self medication?
> Duck...

Not only was that not helpful, you knew it wasn't going to be
helpful. And you still posted it.

-dsr-

Re: Identification orange.fr

[NoSpam]

Le 23/03/2020 à 17:52, F. Dubois a écrit :


Bonjour à toutes et tous.
Depuis quelques jours, et à priori sans intervention de ma part, la 
connexion sur mon espace Orange est impossible.



Le service a rencontré un problème réseau, veuillez réessayer.

Telle est la réponse lorsque je clique sur S'identifier.
Quelques précisions...
j'utilise firefox 74.0 avec pas mal d'extensions de sécurité/non 
pistage... mais rien de nouveau qui justifierait ce comportement

debian sid
pas de souci au même endroit (même box...) pour se connecter depuis un 
ordi win10 avec la même version de firefox
j'ai effacé de firefox tout ce qui était enregistré concernant orange 
(mdp...)


Si quelqu'un a une idée de ce que je devrais vérifier, duckduckgo ne 
m'a pas aidé sur le coup.

Merci,
Fabien


Bonjour,

vider le cache et virer les cookies, tester avec un autre butineur.

--

Daniel

Re: Speed of USB ports on Inspiron 1501

[David Christensen]

On 2020-03-23 03:43, rhkra...@gmail.com wrote:

On Monday, March 23, 2020 01:42:40 AM David Christensen wrote:

If I am reading the user manual for my E1505 and the Intel ICH7
datasheet correctly, the ExpressCard port in my laptop should be PCIe 1x
at 2.5 Gbps.  I would expect your E1501 to be equivalent (?).


I bought it used, don't have the user manual, and had trouble finding it online
(it amazes me how often I choose the wrong search keywords and don't find
things that I'm sure must be out there).


I found the owner's manual last week, so it is easier to craft a search 
phrase when you already know the answer:


site:dell.com inspiron 1501 "owner's manual"


The first link is:

https://downloads.dell.com/manuals/all-products/esuprt_laptop/esuprt_inspiron_laptop/inspiron-1501_owner%27s%20manual_en-us.pdf


The canonical search should be:

site:dell.com inspiron 1501 support


The first link looks like it is in Finnish (?):

https://www.worldatlas.com/aatlas/ctycodes.htm


The links that look like English are all community posts.


Was your laptop originally sold in Finland?


David

Re: Identification orange.fr

[contact]

Bonsoir,

moi j'y suis allé hier sans problème dans mon espace perso avec Firefox 74


François-Marie BILLARD
Le 23/03/2020 à 18:36, Klaus Becker a écrit :

Le 23/03/2020 à 17:52, F. Dubois a écrit :

Bonjour à toutes et tous.
Depuis quelques jours, et à priori sans intervention de ma part, la 
connexion sur mon espace Orange est impossible.



    Le service a rencontré un problème réseau, veuillez 
réessayer.


Telle est la réponse lorsque je clique sur S'identifier.
Quelques précisions...
j'utilise firefox 74.0 avec pas mal d'extensions de sécurité/non 
pistage... mais rien de nouveau qui justifierait ce comportement

debian sid
pas de souci au même endroit (même box...) pour se connecter depuis 
un ordi win10 avec la même version de firefox
j'ai effacé de firefox tout ce qui était enregistré concernant orange 
(mdp...)


Si quelqu'un a une idée de ce que je devrais vérifier, duckduckgo ne 
m'a pas aidé sur le coup.

Merci,
Fabien



Salut,

j'ai pas ce problème avec FF 74.0

Klaus

Re: Falha no Boot - Positivo Mobo S7 (Programa UCA)

[Leandro Pereira]

lá no site da positivo, na parte de drivers, tem um opção para digitar
o número de série do equipamento para acessar os downloads e outras
informações. Já tentou verificar la?

Leandro L. Pereira

Em dom., 22 de mar. de 2020 às 16:23, osvaldo luciano Santos
 escreveu:
>
> Olá pessoal!
>
> Leandro, a Positivo não oferece nem mais informações sobre esse produto em 
> seu suporte. Logo, na minha situação, sem chances de arriscar uma atualização 
> de BIOS por outras referências. Mas, obrigado pela atenção!
>
> "nandre@", as fontes e baterias são todas originais - e esse problema 
> acontece tanto com as máquinas em que as baterias não mantêm a carga quanto 
> nas que mantêm. Também não dá para visualizar a mensagem em tela porque na 
> etapa em que o boot pára fica apenas uma tela preta! Mas, é ótimo conhecer 
> este tipo de erro possível. Muito obrigado! Vou continuar a pesquisar e mesmo 
> não encontrando, basta ensinarmos as crianças a ultrapassarem este simples 
> obstáculo! Só não vai ficar "elegante"! rs. Mas, valerá a pena - só em São 
> Carlos são 1700 que foram comprados, no Brasil estima-se 225 mil netbooks 
> vendidos pela Positivo aos governos!
>
> Abraços e seguimos na luta!
> Osvaldo
>
>
>
> Em qui., 19 de mar. de 2020 às 14:28, ndre  escreveu:
>>
>> Olá Osvaldo,
>>
>> ter 17 mar 2020 às 20:56:24 (1584489384), osvaldoluci...@gmail.com enviou:
>> > Saudações pessoal,
>> >
>> > Sou professor das séries iniciais e peço ajuda nesta lista. Estou
>> > trabalhando no desafio de tentar resgatar para o uso aqueles classmates
>> > (design da Intel) que a Positivo vendeu ao governo brasileiro no Programa
>> > UCA (Um Computador por Aluno). Originalmente ele veio com o Mandriva Mini.
>> > Mesmo neste SO original eles estão apresentando um problema:
>> > *- a BIOS (Phoenix SecureCore vs ec 1.01) inicia, mas após fazer a leitura
>> > completa do hardware, pára e não inicia o grub, fica uma tela preta; só
>> > consegue iniciá-lo na segunda tentativa. Nesta tela preta, qualquer tecla
>> > pressionada faz ele reiniciar.*
>> >
>> > Fiz uma customização do debian, com xfce e várias suítes de jogos do kde,
>> > com alguns aplicativos do projeto DebianEdu também (tudo num cartão de 4G)
>> > e acho que consegui dar um fôlego maior a esses equipamentos públicos.
>> > Hoje, estou trabalhando com uma customização do Debian9.11/XFCE4.12. Porém,
>> > estou com aquele problema no boot. Só na segunda tentativa inicializa. E o
>> > mais curioso, se for curto o intervalo entre o desligamento e o novo boot,
>> > ele inicializa normalmente (ou seja, na terceira, na quarta... tentativas).
>> >
>> > Alguém conhece as razões do problema ou tem hipóteses para investigação?
>> >
>> > Agradeço muito e abraços a todos!
>>
>> Você sabe se a fonte de energia desses computadores é original
>> do fabricante?
>>
>> Pergunto porque tive um problema _parecido_ ao trocar uma fonte
>> por outra genérica. A inicialização era interrompida logo no
>> início com uma mensagem de erro informando a inadequação da
>> amperagem/voltagem. Pressionando qualquer tecla a inicialização
>> prosseguia.
>>
>> No seu caso, eu pesquisaria no site do fabricante acerca dos
>> "bios boot error codes/signal". Essas mensagens de erro
>> geralmente são por sinais sonoros ou luminosos. Observe se
>> há algum tipo de repetição luminosa parecida com um código
>> morse e compare com as informações do fabricante. Isso
>> provavelmente significa que algum componente não está
>> funcionando da forma esperada ou que algum conector está
>> com defeito. A solução seria então identificar qual o
>> componente/conector defeituoso e consertá-lo.
>>
>> Boa sorte!
>>

Re: Le seul livre disponible en français sur le site de Debian est un livre sur Debian 8

[fw]

Idée très bonne, mais peux-tu conserver les 2 versions, au cas ou qqun 
aurais un besoin spécifique de la V8 ?

Cordialement

Re: Identification orange.fr

[Klaus Becker]

Le 23/03/2020 à 17:52, F. Dubois a écrit :

Bonjour à toutes et tous.
Depuis quelques jours, et à priori sans intervention de ma part, la 
connexion sur mon espace Orange est impossible.



Le service a rencontré un problème réseau, veuillez réessayer.

Telle est la réponse lorsque je clique sur S'identifier.
Quelques précisions...
j'utilise firefox 74.0 avec pas mal d'extensions de sécurité/non 
pistage... mais rien de nouveau qui justifierait ce comportement

debian sid
pas de souci au même endroit (même box...) pour se connecter depuis un 
ordi win10 avec la même version de firefox
j'ai effacé de firefox tout ce qui était enregistré concernant orange 
(mdp...)


Si quelqu'un a une idée de ce que je devrais vérifier, duckduckgo ne m'a 
pas aidé sur le coup.

Merci,
Fabien



Salut,

j'ai pas ce problème avec FF 74.0

Klaus

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Henning Follmann]

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 04:31:33PM +, Tony van der Hoff wrote:
>
[...]
> I know it's a sensitive subject, and I really don't want to upset the list,
> there's been enough of that already, but why are some people so afraid of
> systemd?
>

Who said "Jehovah"?


> I have  used it since the beginning of jessie, through stretch, and now
> buster, and have had no problems with it.
> 
> I ask the question in all innocence, purely to understand whypeople seem to
> want to jump through hoops to avoid it.
> 

Maybe lack of self medication?
Duck...


-- 
Henning Follmann   | hfollm...@itcfollmann.com

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Greg Wooledge]

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 04:31:33PM +, Tony van der Hoff wrote:
> I know it's a sensitive subject, and I really don't want to upset the list,
> there's been enough of that already, but why are some people so afraid of
> systemd?

Well, there seem to be several reasons.  In no particular order:

1) It's new.  Some people hate new things, simply because they've
   become accustomed to the old things.

2) Because it's new, it has not had a chance to reach maturity.  There
   are still flaws being worked out.

3) It's extremely large.  Compared to sysvinit, it is a sprawling
   leviathan of software.  Not only does size = bugs, but some people
   object to the increase in memory usage, disk space usage, etc.

4) It does way more than just replace /sbin/init.  It has components
   that try to bring up network interfaces, implement DNS resolution,
   implement NTP, implement cron-like functionality, and so on.  Many
   people feel this is over-reaching.  (And to be fair, Debian disables
   most of these optional subsystems by default.)

5) It does not write logs in human-readable files.  You need systemd's
   tools to read systemd's logs.  This makes post mortem diagnostics
   much more difficult.

6) It is more complex than sysvinit.  There's a lot to learn.  However, it
   should be noted that there is an enormous degree of *hidden* complexity
   in sysv-rc (decades worth of hacks developed to work around sysv-rc's
   fundamental flaws), and these things go away with systemd.  So, really
   it's trading one set of complexity for a different set of complexity.
   But some people don't see it that way.

7) Some people have developed a personal dislike of the author.

I'm sure there are other reasons, but these are the main ones of which
I'm aware.

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Dan Ritter]

Tony van der Hoff wrote: 
> On 23/03/2020 15:15, Michael Howard wrote:
> > On 23/03/2020 14:28, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > > On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:37:47 -0400
> > > Jude DaShiell  wrote:
> > > 
> 
> 
> I know it's a sensitive subject, and I really don't want to upset the list,
> there's been enough of that already, but why are some people so afraid of
> systemd?
 
Nobody, to a first approximation, is afraid of systemd.

> I ask the question in all innocence, purely to understand whypeople seem to
> want to jump through hoops to avoid it.


systemd started with a good idea: let's make an init system that solves
the problems of sysvinit. They then proceeded to ignore the long
history of people writing software to do that, and chose:

- a heavyweight implementation
- written as a series of executables that interlock with each
- which try to handle:

- process 0 init existence
- system startup and shutdown 
- daemon start, status check and stop

Everything above this line is generally agreed to be the
province of an init system. Systemd also wants to take over:

- system logging
- network interface configuration, including DHCP
- DNS resolver selection
- network time protocol
- cron
- login management and authentication/authorization
- setup of virtual machines
- package management

I see the attitude of most people as being "I don't care, as
long as it works."  That's a sane attitude.

The problem is that for me -- and many other people -- there is
a long history of not wanting to change a working system unless
the benefits of that change are clear and worthwhile. I judge
that systemd is less reliable than existing systems, causes
needless chaos, and does not deliver benefits that are not
available from other, less disruptive systems.

Not only does it have to work, it has to work well. 

-dsr-

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Michael Howard]

On 23/03/2020 16:31, Tony van der Hoff wrote:

On 23/03/2020 15:15, Michael Howard wrote:

On 23/03/2020 14:28, Patrick Bartek wrote:

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:37:47 -0400
Jude DaShiell  wrote:




I know it's a sensitive subject, and I really don't want to upset the 
list, there's been enough of that already, but why are some people so 
afraid of systemd?

Afraid?

--
Michael Howard

Re: Buster without systemd?

[tomas]

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 04:31:33PM +, Tony van der Hoff wrote:
> On 23/03/2020 15:15, Michael Howard wrote:
> >On 23/03/2020 14:28, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> >>On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:37:47 -0400
> >>Jude DaShiell  wrote:
> >>
> 
> 
> I know it's a sensitive subject, and I really don't want to upset
> the list, there's been enough of that already, but why are some
> people so afraid of systemd?
> 
> I have  used it since the beginning of jessie, through stretch, and
> now buster, and have had no problems with it.
> 
> I ask the question in all innocence, purely to understand whypeople
> seem to want to jump through hoops to avoid it.

I think you'll get as many answers as people out there. In my case,
I'd like to keep alternatives to systemd viable. At the same time,
I want the discussion to stay civil and don't want to see anyone
denigrated over it. Proponents and opponents likewise.

Cheers
-- tomás


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Description: Digital signature

Identification orange.fr

[F. Dubois]

Bonjour à toutes et tous.
Depuis quelques jours, et à priori sans intervention de ma part, la 
connexion sur mon espace Orange est impossible.



   Le service a rencontré un problème réseau, veuillez réessayer.

Telle est la réponse lorsque je clique sur S'identifier.
Quelques précisions...
j'utilise firefox 74.0 avec pas mal d'extensions de sécurité/non 
pistage... mais rien de nouveau qui justifierait ce comportement

debian sid
pas de souci au même endroit (même box...) pour se connecter depuis un 
ordi win10 avec la même version de firefox
j'ai effacé de firefox tout ce qui était enregistré concernant orange 
(mdp...)


Si quelqu'un a une idée de ce que je devrais vérifier, duckduckgo ne m'a 
pas aidé sur le coup.

Merci,
Fabien

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Tony van der Hoff]

On 23/03/2020 15:15, Michael Howard wrote:

On 23/03/2020 14:28, Patrick Bartek wrote:

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:37:47 -0400
Jude DaShiell  wrote:




I know it's a sensitive subject, and I really don't want to upset the 
list, there's been enough of that already, but why are some people so 
afraid of systemd?


I have  used it since the beginning of jessie, through stretch, and now 
buster, and have had no problems with it.


I ask the question in all innocence, purely to understand whypeople seem 
to want to jump through hoops to avoid it.


--
Tony van der Hoff| mailto:t...@vanderhoff.org
Buckinghamshire, England |

Re: problemas con impresora Epson L 3110

[Francisco Cid]

El lun., 23 mar. 2020 a las 13:08, Juan Lavieri ()
escribió:

>
>
> El 23/3/2020 a las 11:03 a. m., Marcelo Eduardo Giordano escribió:
> >
> > On 21/3/20 15:21, JavierDebian wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> El 21/3/20 a las 12:50, Marcelo Eduardo Giordano escribió:
> >>> hola amigos. Al instalar la Epson L3110 con un dpkg
> >>> nombredelinstalador.deb
> >>>
> >>> me sale el siguiente error
> >>>
> >>>epson-inkjet-printer-escpr depende de lsb (>= 3.2); sin embargo:
> >>> El paquete `lsb' no está instalado.
> >>>
> >>> Me pasa en debian 10 xfce de dos computadoras
> >>>
> >>> Gracias desde ya
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> # apt install lsb-base
> >>
> >> https://wiki.linuxfoundation.org/lsb/start
> >>
> >>
> >> JAP
> >>
> > me dice que ya está instalado
> >
>
>
> Hola.
>
> ¿Y qué versión tienes instalada?
>
>
>
>
> --
> Errar es de humanos, pero es mas humano culpar a los demás
>
>


Porque no instalas la maquina con Cups?
Saludos,

Re: problemas con impresora Epson L 3110

[Juan Lavieri]

El 23/3/2020 a las 11:03 a. m., Marcelo Eduardo Giordano escribió:


On 21/3/20 15:21, JavierDebian wrote:



El 21/3/20 a las 12:50, Marcelo Eduardo Giordano escribió:
hola amigos. Al instalar la Epson L3110 con un dpkg 
nombredelinstalador.deb


me sale el siguiente error

   epson-inkjet-printer-escpr depende de lsb (>= 3.2); sin embargo:
    El paquete `lsb' no está instalado.

Me pasa en debian 10 xfce de dos computadoras

Gracias desde ya




# apt install lsb-base

https://wiki.linuxfoundation.org/lsb/start


JAP


me dice que ya está instalado




Hola.

¿Y qué versión tienes instalada?




--
Errar es de humanos, pero es mas humano culpar a los demás

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Michael Howard]

On 23/03/2020 14:28, Patrick Bartek wrote:

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:37:47 -0400
Jude DaShiell  wrote:


There is devuan-ascii 2.x but I don't know its equivalent to buster.
That system maintained sysv and still has support.

ASCII is Stretch without systemd or any of the dependencies.  Devuan
hasn't release its "Buster" version yet.

B


It can be upgraded to 'beowulf' using apt of course.

--
Michael Howard

Re: Buster without systemd?

[tomas]

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 07:28:25AM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:37:47 -0400
> Jude DaShiell  wrote:
> 
> > There is devuan-ascii 2.x but I don't know its equivalent to buster.
> > That system maintained sysv and still has support.
> 
> ASCII is Stretch without systemd or any of the dependencies.  Devuan
> hasn't release its "Buster" version yet.

Thanks for confirming :-)

Cheers
-- t


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Description: Digital signature

Re: problemas con impresora Epson L 3110

[Marcelo Eduardo Giordano]

On 21/3/20 15:21, JavierDebian wrote:



El 21/3/20 a las 12:50, Marcelo Eduardo Giordano escribió:
hola amigos. Al instalar la Epson L3110 con un dpkg 
nombredelinstalador.deb


me sale el siguiente error

   epson-inkjet-printer-escpr depende de lsb (>= 3.2); sin embargo:
    El paquete `lsb' no está instalado.

Me pasa en debian 10 xfce de dos computadoras

Gracias desde ya




# apt install lsb-base

https://wiki.linuxfoundation.org/lsb/start


JAP


me dice que ya está instalado

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Patrick Bartek]

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:37:47 -0400
Jude DaShiell  wrote:

> There is devuan-ascii 2.x but I don't know its equivalent to buster.
> That system maintained sysv and still has support.

ASCII is Stretch without systemd or any of the dependencies.  Devuan
hasn't release its "Buster" version yet.

B

Re: Buster without systemd?

[tomas]

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 08:37:47AM -0400, Jude DaShiell wrote:
> There is devuan-ascii 2.x but I don't know its equivalent to buster.
> That system maintained sysv and still has support.

Going by [1], I'd guess Devuan ASCII is roughly Debian Stretch. More
knowledgeable statements always welcome, of course.

Cheers
[1] https://files.devuan.org/devuan_ascii/Release_notes.txt
-- tomás


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Description: Digital signature

Re: Boot process hangs at, it seems, network initialisation

[Brad Rogers]

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 14:51:53 +0200
Andrei POPESCU  wrote:

Hello Andrei,

>A standard[1] Debian install "requires[2] networking only for
>(security) updates.

Thanks for the info, Andrei.

A classic case of "a little knowledge"  My little knowledge, of
course.

-- 
 Regards  _
 / )   "The blindingly obvious is
/ _)radnever immediately apparent"
You only see me for the clothes that I wear
Public Image - Public Image Ltd


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Re: Buster without systemd?

[Jude DaShiell]

There is devuan-ascii 2.x but I don't know its equivalent to buster.
That system maintained sysv and still has support.

#!/usr/bin/env bash
# file: getdevuan.sh - get devuan iso.
wget -bc 
http://files.devuan.org/devuan_ascii/minimal-live/devuan_ascii_2.1_amd64_minimal-live.iso
On Sun, 22 Mar 2020,
Marc Shapiro wrote:

> Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2020 21:21:56
> From: Marc Shapiro 
> To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
> Subject: Buster without systemd?
> Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2020 01:39:10 + (UTC)
> Resent-From: debian-user@lists.debian.org
>
> Supposedly, one can install/upgrade to Buster while maintaining sysv as init.?
> Or has this changed.? Over the past several months I have been attempting to
> upgrade to Buster, but I have been completely unsuccessful.
>
> Has anyone managed to upgrade to Buster without installing systemd, or jumping
> through hoops that would drive a lion tamer mad?
>
> I made a copy of all of my partitions so that I could do the upgrade while
> maintaining Stretch in case something went wrong. I'm glad that I did!
>
> The first time that I tried this, I actually managed to upgrade to Buster and
> have everything appear to work.? Then I realized that I had only done an
> "upgrade" but not a "full-upgrade".? After that, X would not start.? I have,
> as I said, spent several months trying to get X working on Buster without
> systemd.? I have not been successful.? None of my later attempts ever got a
> working Buster with X, at all.
>
> Is it possible to do what I want?? Or, after 21 to 22 years of using Debian
> (since Bo), do I have to switch to another linux distro?? I would rather not
> have to switch, but you choose the distro that suits your needs, and if Debian
> no longer suits my needs then I may have to.
>
>
> Marc
>
>
>
>

-- 

Re: Boot process hangs at, it seems, network initialisation

[Andrei POPESCU]

On Lu, 23 mar 20, 10:47:14, Brad Rogers wrote:
> 
> TBH, I wasn't sure.  Certain things require networking availability, so
> that got me thinking.  Anyhow, that turned out to be a blind alley.
 
A standard[1] Debian install "requires[2] networking only for (security) 
updates.

[1] i.e. something that is supported by the installer. Things like root 
on NFS or similar must be explicitly configured by the user.

[2] it's possible to update also via sneaker-net or similar, just not 
very convenient.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser


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Re: Boot process hangs at, it seems, network initialisation

[Brad Rogers]

On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 12:26:05 +0200
Andrei POPESCU  wrote:

Hello Andrei,

>In the default install the display manager does not wait for networking 
>(why should it?), your problem is most likely elsewhere.

TBH, I wasn't sure.  Certain things require networking availability, so
that got me thinking.  Anyhow, that turned out to be a blind alley.

>Try investigating with 'systemctl status' and/or various 
>'systemd-analyze' commands. 

No time today, but will have options to look at when I get enough 'round
toits'.

Thanks for the advice.

-- 
 Regards  _
 / )   "The blindingly obvious is
/ _)radnever immediately apparent"
Looking for something I can call my own
Chairman Of The Bored - Crass


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Re: OT: Questions about (buying and) using a laptop docking station

[rhkramer]

On Monday, March 23, 2020 02:27:17 AM David Christensen wrote:
> The 187 MB/s is a worst-case scenario for FHD video -- decode on the CPU
> and send uncompressed frames over USB 3.0 to the video RAM in the
> docking station.  Hopefully Debian, Linux, Xorg, whatever, have the
> architecture and drivers to offload the CPU/GPU cycles and RAM
> requirements to the docking station, and it all works on your laptop.
> If so, the results could be pleasing.

We will see.

Re: Speed of USB ports on Inspiron 1501

[rhkramer]

On Monday, March 23, 2020 01:42:40 AM David Christensen wrote:
> If I am reading the user manual for my E1505 and the Intel ICH7
> datasheet correctly, the ExpressCard port in my laptop should be PCIe 1x
> at 2.5 Gbps.  I would expect your E1501 to be equivalent (?).

I bought it used, don't have the user manual, and had trouble finding it online 
(it amazes me how often I choose the wrong search keywords and don't find 
things that I'm sure must be out there).

> Please let us know how the ExpressCard dual USB 3.0 adapter and docking
> station work with Debian.

I will, but it will probably be several months, as quite a few other things 
may keep me busy (and the decline in meetings which I might go to and get help 
for my programming efforts).
 
> Be prompt about testing and keep all the boxes, packaging, etc., in
> pristine condition, so you can return everything within the time window
> if there are problems.

I wouldn't plan to return any of that unless it is truly defective, but I do 
usually do that anyway.

Re: Résolution OpenVPN

[Sil]

Le 19/03/2020 à 16:15, Guillaume Clercin a écrit :


Il est possible, pour le client, d'utiliser un serveur dns qui se
trouve de coté du serveur.
Dans la configuration du service openvpn, tu peut ajouter:
push "dhcp-option DNS "

et éventuellement
push "dhcp-option DOMAIN "

À noter que, une fois le client est connecté au vpn, toutes les
requêtes passeront par le vpn.


Bonjour,

J'ai ajouté l'option "dhcp-option DNS" et la résolution fonctionne. Il 
faut juste attendre un peu, car ça prend un peu de temps.


Je ne pensais pas que l'on pouvait atteindre autre chose que l'IP du 
serveur VPN.


Merci

Sil

Re: Boot process hangs at, it seems, network initialisation

[Andrei POPESCU]

On Du, 22 mar 20, 14:43:37, Brad Rogers wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> For the first time, I'm having problems installing Debian testing on new
> hardware;
> 
> Asus TUF X570 Plus mobo with onboard Realtek network L8200A i/f
> 
> As things stand, it /seems/ that the boot process is waiting for the
> network interface to come up, before proceeding to start the SDDM log in
> manager.  

In the default install the display manager does not wait for networking 
(why should it?), your problem is most likely elsewhere.

Try investigating with 'systemctl status' and/or various 
'systemd-analyze' commands. 

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser


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Re: Buster without systemd?

[Reco]

Please do not top post. Reply to the list.

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 09:59:25AM +0100, Renato Gallo wrote:
> 
> 
> Rly, systemd is, between things, a way to be sure when and after what 
> something starts isn't it ?

Does not make it any special, in comparing to any other init system in
existence.

Reco

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Renato Gallo]

Rly, systemd is, between things, a way to be sure when and after what something 
starts isn't it ?

- Messaggio originale -
Da: "Reco" 
A: "debian-user" 
Inviato: Lunedì, 23 marzo 2020 9:27:29
Oggetto: Re: Buster without systemd?

Hi.

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 08:48:57AM +0100, Renato Gallo wrote:
> 
> linux without systemd = race condition risks = why in hell anyone would want 
> to do it ?

.
Rly?

Reco

RE: ifup && iptables error

[Bonno Bloksma]

Hi,

[]
> Right, your basic problem is that your interfaces are now names
> enp7s0
> and
> wlp6s0
>
> not eth0 and wifi0 or whatever they used to be.
>
> Fix them in /etc/network/interfaces, double check your iptables rules 
> are either using the new names or don't mention interfaces at all, and 
> you should be relatively happy.

I was going to say or
Edit the file /etc/udev/rules. d/70-persistent-net and change the "stange 
names" back to their "proper name" but .
It seems that even though the /etc/udev/rules.d/ directory still exists, it is 
empty, no 70-persistent-net file present.
See https://wiki.debian.org/NetworkInterfaceNames why and how to get another 
set of predictable names like lan0 if you want that.

Bonno Bloksma

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Reco]

Hi.

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 08:48:57AM +0100, Renato Gallo wrote:
> 
> linux without systemd = race condition risks = why in hell anyone would want 
> to do it ?

.
Rly?

Reco

Re: Buster without systemd?

[tomas]

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 08:48:57AM +0100, Renato Gallo wrote:
> 
> linux without systemd = race condition risks = why in hell anyone would want 
> to do it ?

I think we've had enough of this already.

See, Marc?

Cheers
-- tomás


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Re: Buster without systemd?

[tomas]

On Sun, Mar 22, 2020 at 09:57:36PM -0400, The Wanderer wrote:
> On 2020-03-22 at 21:21, Marc Shapiro wrote:
> 
> > [...]  Then I realized that I
> > had only done an "upgrade" but not a "full-upgrade".  After that, X
> > would not start [...]

> How are you starting X?
> 
> I start it manually from the console via startx, and in order for that
> to work, I've needed the xserver-xorg-legacy package and some matching
> settings configured locally.

Oh, yes, forgot about that one (since it came up with Stretch). I'm
running xserver-xorg-legacy too.

Cheers
-- tomás


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Re: Buster without systemd?

[tomas]

On Sun, Mar 22, 2020 at 06:21:56PM -0700, Marc Shapiro wrote:
> Supposedly, one can install/upgrade to Buster while maintaining sysv
> as init.  Or has this changed.  Over the past several months I have
> been attempting to upgrade to Buster, but I have been completely
> unsuccessful.
> 
> Has anyone managed to upgrade to Buster without installing systemd,
> or jumping through hoops that would drive a lion tamer mad?

I'm currently running Buster, upgraded from Stretch. It makes sense
to either raise sysv-rc or to lower systemd in your apt preferences:
some more advanced installers tend to come up with creative solutions
to dependency problems. Nothing that can't be managed, but...

Note that if you expect some "advanced desktop stuff" things might
become more difficult.

> Is it possible to do what I want?  Or, after 21 to 22 years of using
> Debian (since Bo), do I have to switch to another linux distro?  I
> would rather not have to switch, but you choose the distro that
> suits your needs, and if Debian no longer suits my needs then I may
> have to.

Less drama and more helping hands would be appreciated. There is a
Debian sysvinit maintainers group who maintain the sysv-rc package.

Devuan could use some help too. Drama unnecessarily burns up CPU
cycles.

Cheers
-- tomás
> 
> 
> Marc
> 
> 
> 


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Re: Buster without systemd?

[Renato Gallo]

linux without systemd = race condition risks = why in hell anyone would want to 
do it ?

- Messaggio originale -
Da: "Felix Miata" 
A: "debian-user" 
Inviato: Lunedì, 23 marzo 2020 8:08:28
Oggetto: Re: Buster without systemd?

Marc Shapiro composed on 2020-03-22 18:21 (UTC-0700):

> after 21 to 22 years of using 
> Debian (since Bo), do I have to switch to another linux distro? 

AFAIK, no one has ever died as a consequence of using an OS with systemd. So, 
no,
you don't "have to" switch to another distro. You can do as most have done, 
fondly
or not so fondly remember sysvinit, and accept the change, whether for better or
worse.

OTOH, would switching to Devuan really be "switching" to another distro? That's
like "switching" to any of the zillion distros based on Debian that include 
Debian
repos in sources.list. They're mostly Debian but with different defaults,
different far more the interface than the guts that make Debian debian.
-- 
Evolution as taught in public schools is religion, not science.

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: Pulseaudio

[Fabien R]

On 21/03/2020 18:23, ajh-valmer wrote:
> Bonjour,
> 
> J'ai installé Pulseaudio, mais je n'arrive pas à "l'incruster".

Sous xfce, j'utilise xfce4-pulseaudio-plugin qui me donne accès à pavucontrol.
Tu dois avoir un équivalent sous KDE.

--
Fabien

Le seul livre disponible en français sur le site de Debian est un livre sur Debian 8

[Hamdy Abou El Anein]

Bonjour,

Le seul livre disponible sur le site de Debian est sur Debian 8.

https://www.debian.org/doc/books.fr.html#french

Je vous propose de le remplacer par cet ouvrage : Le guide complet de Linux 
Debian 10 Buster.

https://medium.com/@hamdyabouelanein/le-guide-complet-de-linux-debian-10-buster-ee5994d1a01e

Meilleures salutations.

Hamdy Abou El Anein
Founder / Linux system engineer
Daylightlinux.ch

Re: Boot process hangs at, it seems, network initialisation

[Brad Rogers]

On Sun, 22 Mar 2020 21:10:48 +0100
Bernd Gruber  wrote:

Hello Bernd,

>Brad Rogers wrote:
>
>>  Failed to start NVIDIA Persistence Daemon  
>have you looked this up, I find it several times on ddg.

Briefly, but didn't pursue it, before I took myself down a blind alley.

I've not got time to look into this for a couple of days (work, real
life, etc.) but will will start again on Wednesday.

Thanks for your interest.

-- 
 Regards  _
 / )   "The blindingly obvious is
/ _)radnever immediately apparent"
I can't do a thing 'cause I can't relax
Independence Day - Comsat Angels


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Re: Buster without systemd?

[Felix Miata]

Marc Shapiro composed on 2020-03-22 18:21 (UTC-0700):

> after 21 to 22 years of using 
> Debian (since Bo), do I have to switch to another linux distro? 

AFAIK, no one has ever died as a consequence of using an OS with systemd. So, 
no,
you don't "have to" switch to another distro. You can do as most have done, 
fondly
or not so fondly remember sysvinit, and accept the change, whether for better or
worse.

OTOH, would switching to Devuan really be "switching" to another distro? That's
like "switching" to any of the zillion distros based on Debian that include 
Debian
repos in sources.list. They're mostly Debian but with different defaults,
different far more the interface than the guts that make Debian debian.
-- 
Evolution as taught in public schools is religion, not science.

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: OT: Questions about (buying and) using a laptop docking station

[David Christensen]

On 2020-03-22 17:37, rhkra...@gmail.com wrote:

Thanks to all who replied, to either this thread or my other related one,
"Speed of USB ports on Inspiron 1501".

In that other thread, I point out that I decided to buy a Wavlink 3.0 docking
station (with HDMI, DVI, and VGA video outputs) (on sale today at Newegg) and
a dual USB 3.0 ExpressCard on ebay (for under $10).

Thanks to Dave Christensen for pointing out the throughput I'd need for VGA
1080p (187 MB/s at 30 fps) -- I'm hoping that won't really be a problem as I
don't plan to use graphic intensive applications on the laptop, although I'm
not sure whether it will be a problem -- I'll be using things like kate,
kmail, and then command line stuff to work on some programs.



The 187 MB/s is a worst-case scenario for FHD video -- decode on the CPU 
and send uncompressed frames over USB 3.0 to the video RAM in the 
docking station.  Hopefully Debian, Linux, Xorg, whatever, have the 
architecture and drivers to offload the CPU/GPU cycles and RAM 
requirements to the docking station, and it all works on your laptop. 
If so, the results could be pleasing.



David

Re: Buster without systemd?

[Sven Joachim]

On 2020-03-22 21:57 -0400, The Wanderer wrote:

> On 2020-03-22 at 21:21, Marc Shapiro wrote:
>
>> Supposedly, one can install/upgrade to Buster while maintaining sysv
>> as init.  Or has this changed.  Over the past several months I have
>> been attempting to upgrade to Buster, but I have been completely
>> unsuccessful.
>>
>> Has anyone managed to upgrade to Buster without installing systemd,
>> or jumping through hoops that would drive a lion tamer mad?
>>
>> I made a copy of all of my partitions so that I could do the upgrade
>>  while maintaining Stretch in case something went wrong. I'm glad
>> that I did!
>>
>> The first time that I tried this, I actually managed to upgrade to
>> Buster and have everything appear to work.  Then I realized that I
>> had only done an "upgrade" but not a "full-upgrade".  After that, X
>> would not start.  I have, as I said, spent several months trying to
>> get X working on Buster without systemd.  I have not been successful.
>> None of my later attempts ever got a working Buster with X, at all.
>
> How are you starting X?
>
> I start it manually from the console via startx, and in order for that
> to work, I've needed the xserver-xorg-legacy package and some matching
> settings configured locally.
>
> IIRC that around the time of the systemd switchover (not necessarily
> tied to systemd itself), there were changes made in the way X is to be
> launched, such that with the right configuration it can be run without
> root rights - but that if you don't have that configuration, and you're
> not launching X as root directly, you need this "legacy" setup. Last
> time I was looking at it, I don't think I found any practical way to do
> that configuration without systemd or some replication of part of its
> functionality.

It should be possible to run X without root rights if you install
elogind.  What the X server needs is access to your input devices, and
logind provides that to locally logged in users.

With systemd-logind startx works out of the box, no configuration
necessary.  Since elogind is a fork of systemd-logind, I suspect the
same holds for it, but I cannot easily test that.

Cheers,
   Sven