On 10/06/2015 05:24, Xidorn Quan wrote:
On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 9:09 AM, Mark Côté mc...@mozilla.com wrote:
To that end, I'd like to consider the voting feature. While it is
enabled on a quite a few products, anecdotally I have heard
many times that it isn't actually useful, that is, votes
On 13/06/2015 05:43, Robert Kaiser wrote:
Mark Côté schrieb:
* Change bug tagging to something like favouriting (or a word with
less contentious spelling ;). Rework the UI to provide an obvious
way to both favourite a bug and to see your favourites list.
I actually think that tagging
Mark Côté schrieb:
* Change bug tagging to something like favouriting (or a word with
less contentious spelling ;). Rework the UI to provide an obvious
way to both favourite a bug and to see your favourites list.
I actually think that tagging is an established way to call such a
On 09/06/15 23:07, Mark Côté wrote:
I would ask, then, what the purpose of the feature is. If we know it
isn't used to make decisions, why use it? The only thing I can think of
is as a sort of spam honeypot, to get people to not +1 or me too
bugs, but this seems strange at best and actively
Here's something to consider. I've seen my friend Jen Simmons encourage
people to use voting as a way to tell us that it's important to them for
Firefox to support a particular html or css feature. Here's a recent
example https://twitter.com/jensimmons/status/601184865732534272 - the bug
mentioned
I agree. While it is certainly true that prioritizing work based on how
many noisy people are campaigning for it is not a good idea, I reject
the notion that the only useful goal here is to prevent bugspam, as that
implies that user input is worthless.
me too/+1 comments on bugs are clearly
DevTools does something like this with UserVoice. I don't think we should
get rid of voting unless we replace it with something else (UserVoice is a
good alternative).
There are plenty of people that recommend others to vote on bugs that
they want prioritized, and us removing voting will make it
On 2015-06-11 2:51 PM, Jared Wein wrote:
DevTools does something like this with UserVoice. I don't think we should
get rid of voting unless we replace it with something else (UserVoice is a
good alternative).
There are plenty of people that recommend others to vote on bugs that
they want
On 6/11/2015 11:51 AM, Jared Wein wrote:
There are plenty of people that recommend others to vote on bugs that
they want prioritized, and us removing voting will make it look to the
outsider that Mozilla is becoming more closed.
If ignoring votes is a sign the Mozilla is closed, and there is a
On 2015-06-11 3:48 PM, R Kent James wrote:
Maybe the correct fix is to start paying attention to votes.
If you choose your project priorities based on internet voting, you're
gonna have a bad time.
The word vote implies that the act of voting has a direct effect on
the outcome, which is
On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 1:18 PM, Mike Hoye mh...@mozilla.com wrote:
On 2015-06-11 3:48 PM, R Kent James wrote:
Maybe the correct fix is to start paying attention to votes.
If you choose your project priorities based on internet voting, you're
gonna have a bad time.
The word vote implies
On Thursday 2015-06-11 11:13 -0700, Steve Fink wrote:
If I were to handwave up a new mechanism to replace bug comments + voting,
I'd probably want a feature/bug page with
- upvote/downvote counts (3 vs 100 is useful information, even if it
doesn't decide anything on its own)
- list of
On 6/11/15 10:18 PM, Mike Hoye wrote:
On 2015-06-11 3:48 PM, R Kent James wrote:
Maybe the correct fix is to start paying attention to votes.
If you choose your project priorities based on internet voting, you're
gonna have a bad time.
I don't think its about the complete list of project
On 2015-06-11 4:46 PM, Chris Hofmann wrote:
On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 1:18 PM, Mike Hoye mh...@mozilla.com wrote:
On 2015-06-11 3:48 PM, R Kent James wrote:
Maybe the correct fix is to start paying attention to votes.
If you choose your project priorities based on internet voting, you're
On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 2:38 PM, Mark Côté mc...@mozilla.com wrote:
There are a few of us still round from the origin of many of these
bugzilla
features
and for this one I think it was mostly just intended as a mechanism to
make sure we
had some ways to get a good collection of
I would like to vote for voting.
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On 2015-06-11 6:43 PM, Chris Hofmann wrote:
Furthermore, since bugs with lots of votes also have lots of CCs (see an
earlier post of mine), if we want to just acknowledge that a bug is
popular, we can just use CC counts above a certain threshold.
Admittedly there's no way to search for that,
On 6/11/2015 3:57 PM, L. David Baron wrote:
For what it's worth, I'd pay more attention to votes if I could see
the graph of how vote counts changed over time.
I explicitly want to call out attention to this. In my experience, it's
not the absolute vote count that matters but rather the vote
On Fri, Jun 12, 2015 at 3:49 AM, Ehsan Akhgari ehsan.akhg...@gmail.com wrote:
On 2015-06-11 2:51 PM, Jared Wein wrote:
DevTools does something like this with UserVoice. I don't think we should
get rid of voting unless we replace it with something else (UserVoice is a
good alternative).
On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 1:18 PM, Mike Hoye mh...@mozilla.com wrote:
The word vote implies that the act of voting has a direct effect on the
outcome, which is clearly not the case here and really shouldn't be. But
that's probably the root of a lot of community frustration.
Forums like Reddit
On 6/9/15 11:09 PM, Mark Côté wrote:
To that end, I'd like to consider the voting feature. While it is
enabled on a quite a few products, anecdotally I have heard
many times that it isn't actually useful, that is, votes aren't really
being used to prioritize features fixes. If your team
Original-Nachricht
Betreff: Voting in BMO
Von: Mark Côté mc...@mozilla.com
An:
Datum: 2015-06-09 23:09
To that end, I'd like to consider the voting feature. While it is
enabled on a quite a few products, anecdotally I have heard
many times that it isn't actually useful
On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 11:09 PM, Mark Côté mc...@mozilla.com wrote:
To that end, I'd like to consider the voting feature. While it is
enabled on a quite a few products, anecdotally I have heard
many times that it isn't actually useful, that is, votes aren't really
being used to prioritize
Regarding CC instead of voting, there is another issue. Voting is not
enabled in every component, so on these bugs I add me to the CC list.
But sometimes it happens that a bug will be marked as confidential after
I added me to the CC list. In that case I have still access to the not
public
On 6/10/15 1:24 PM, Dirkjan Ochtman wrote:
Similarly, I could imagine that the very explicit CC list could be
changed to be more like a Follow button, plus a (simplified) way to
include others for those who have relevant privileges.
Have you seen the experimental bugzilla UI? It has a follow
On 2015-06-10 3:55 AM, Mark Banner wrote:
Replying to this got me thinking - what about changing vote to I
have this issue similar to support.mozilla.org. However, I think the
usefulness would end up in the same way as voting.
As a suggestion though, how about adding something near the
On 09/06/2015 23:19, R Kent James wrote:
Without voting, how do you direct users to express an interest in seeing
a bug solved without adding a me too comment?
Maybe the answer is that we don't. We just need to be honest - it would
be very difficult to create a fair system that could be used
On 2015-06-09 11:58 PM, Wayne wrote:
That said, there are much bigger issues with Bugzilla's UI, and removing
voting is probably the smallest possible improvement. But it's probably
easy to just disable it for a while, and see what happens?
I never have seen the voting UI as being the least
Philipp Kewisch schrieb:
I could live without this feature if the number of people on CC gives
some indication of how wanted a feature may be.
Well, I tend to CC myself to thing I seriously do not want to change but
really want to be informed about when they actually get done. I wouldn't
use
On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 05:37:03PM -0400, Mark Côté wrote:
Thanks for all the input on this feature. This was a good discussion.
Here's what I've learned:
* Almost no one makes decisions based on the number of votes
(Thunderbird and related may be an exception).
** Ergo, most users
Thanks for all the input on this feature. This was a good discussion.
Here's what I've learned:
* Almost no one makes decisions based on the number of votes
(Thunderbird and related may be an exception).
** Ergo, most users voting on bugs are probably being misled into
thinking their vote
On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 9:37 AM, Mark Côté mc...@mozilla.com wrote:
* Change bug tagging to something like favouriting (or a word with
less contentious spelling ;). Rework the UI to provide an obvious
way to both favourite a bug and to see your favourites list.
...
* After those are
On 6/9/15 2:09 PM, Mark Côté wrote:
In a quest to simplify both the interface and the maintenance of
bugzilla.mozilla.org, we're looking for features that are of
questionable value to see if we can get rid of them. As I'm sure
everyone knows, Bugzilla grew organically, without much of a road
On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 9:09 AM, Mark Côté mc...@mozilla.com wrote:
In a quest to simplify both the interface and the maintenance of
bugzilla.mozilla.org, we're looking for features that are of
questionable value to see if we can get rid of them. As I'm sure
everyone knows, Bugzilla grew
In a quest to simplify both the interface and the maintenance of
bugzilla.mozilla.org, we're looking for features that are of
questionable value to see if we can get rid of them. As I'm sure
everyone knows, Bugzilla grew organically, without much of a road map,
over a long time, and it
We don't use bugzilla votes as a strong signal for prioritization on
devtools.
We do actually keep an eye on votes in some other channels (
ffdevtools.uservoice.com), but I don't think anyone on devtools would
object strongly to votes going away in bugzilla.
-dave
On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 3:48
I recall that at least one group actively uses votes to prioritize stuff.
I can't really tell which one, I'm leaning towards devtools, but I don't
have any data to back that up.
I mostly remember because I was surprised.
Also, for a component like devtools, I can see how it'd make sense.
On 09.06.15 23:24, Chris Peterson wrote:
I vote for bugs as a polite (sneaky?) way to watch a bug's bugmail
without spamming all the other CCs by adding myself to the bug's real
CC list.
Same here. Removing the voting feature means that I will cause a lot of
email spam in the future. :) I
On 2015-06-09 5:39 PM, Sören Hentzschel wrote:
On 09.06.15 23:24, Chris Peterson wrote:
I vote for bugs as a polite (sneaky?) way to watch a bug's bugmail
without spamming all the other CCs by adding myself to the bug's real
CC list.
Same here. Removing the voting feature means that I will
On 6/9/15 2:24 PM, Chris Peterson wrote:
I vote for bugs as a polite (sneaky?) way to watch a bug's bugmail
without spamming all the other CCs by adding myself to the bug's real
CC list.
I think if Bugzilla, with its long and complex history, ever has a hope
of being untangled into something
On 2015-06-09 5:24 PM, Xidorn Quan wrote:
On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 9:09 AM, Mark Côté mc...@mozilla.com wrote:
In a quest to simplify both the interface and the maintenance of
bugzilla.mozilla.org, we're looking for features that are of
questionable value to see if we can get rid of them. As
On 6/9/2015 2:09 PM, Mark Côté wrote:
If your team uses voting,
I'd like to talk about your use case and see if, in general, it makes
sense to continue to support this feature.
Thanks,
Mark
I've always considered voting as an important feature for Thunderbird
bugs. Yes it is not a
On 6/9/15 17:00, Justin Dolske wrote:
On 6/9/15 2:24 PM, Chris Peterson wrote:
I vote for bugs as a polite (sneaky?) way to watch a bug's bugmail
without spamming all the other CCs by adding myself to the bug's real
CC list.
I think if Bugzilla, with its long and complex history, ever has a
I've never seen votes make a real difference in the 6 years I've been
around on Bugzilla. The one use case I can think for keeping them is as an
escape valve for user frustration on old, long-standing bugs like
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=41489
I.e. when people start griping
On 2015-06-09 6:00 PM, Justin Dolske wrote:
That said, there are much bigger issues with Bugzilla's UI, and removing
voting is probably the smallest possible improvement. But it's probably
easy to just disable it for a while, and see what happens?
Indeed, it's a minor thing. Consider it a
On 2015-06-09 5:09 PM, Mark Côté wrote:
In a quest to simplify both the interface and the maintenance of
bugzilla.mozilla.org, we're looking for features that are of
questionable value to see if we can get rid of them. As I'm sure
everyone knows, Bugzilla grew organically, without much of a
I have seen voting being recommended as alternative to +1's which is a
plus, we have never used them to prioritise although not sure our area of
bugs is popular enough to be using votes in that way.
As a developer of a bugzilla client however I have see a major missing
feature being the ability
On 6/9/2015 4:09 PM, Mark Côté wrote:
To that end, I'd like to consider the voting feature. While it is
enabled on a quite a few products, anecdotally I have heard
many times that it isn't actually useful, that is, votes aren't really
being used to prioritize features fixes. If your team uses
Dale Harvey wrote:
As a developer of a bugzilla client however I have see a major missing
feature being the ability to favourite bugs in bugzilla., not to cc and get
a baggage of email but somewhere you can keep check on a list of bugs you
have an interest in, personally I make a meta bug and
On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 5:09 PM, Mark Côté mc...@mozilla.com wrote:
To that end, I'd like to consider the voting feature. While it is
enabled on a quite a few products, anecdotally I have heard
many times that it isn't actually useful, that is, votes aren't really
being used to prioritize
On 6/9/2015 6:00 PM, Justin Dolske wrote:
On 6/9/15 2:24 PM, Chris Peterson wrote:
I vote for bugs as a polite (sneaky?) way to watch a bug's bugmail
without spamming all the other CCs by adding myself to the bug's real
CC list.
I think if Bugzilla, with its long and complex history, ever
On 6/9/15 7:09 PM, Ehsan Akhgari wrote:
I cannot remember a single instance where I or someone who I know has
used the number of votes on a bug as an input for making a decision, and
that is for good reason, since the number of votes tell you nothing
about how severe a problem actually is, and
Byron Jones wrote:
this feature exists and is called bug tagging.
you'll need to enable it via the prefs page (it's disabled by default
because the ux needs some love).
https://www.bugzilla.org/docs/4.2/en/html/query.html#individual-buglists
(section 5.5.5).
i should add that the plan for
On Tue, Jun 09, 2015 at 08:13:15PM -0700, Justin Dolske wrote:
On 6/9/15 7:09 PM, Ehsan Akhgari wrote:
I cannot remember a single instance where I or someone who I know has
used the number of votes on a bug as an input for making a decision, and
that is for good reason, since the number of
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