Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
with a 500+ mile range for bragging / non-stop cross-country touring (65 MPH * 8 hours = 520 miles), but never a 1000 mile range. b -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/7fb6c0 d0/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/077cfc64/attachment-0001.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/8781470a/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
we'll never see significant numbers of thousand-mile-range cars on the market. That's almost twelve hours at 85 MPH, and over eighteen hours at 55 MPH. What we'd see long before then would be cars with half as much battery. Never mind the savings in money; the space and weight could be put to better use. Or, if a battery of that much capacity winds up in a vehicle, the vehicle will be something like the Hummer: hugely oversized and inefficient, but still with a 500-mile range due to twice the batteries. It looks like a 200-mile range seems to be the point where Joe Sixpack stops having crippling amounts of range anxiety (whether justified or not), and we're transitioning to that being not untypical. Tesla's had that for a while and all the rumors are about the next vehicles from various major manufacturers meeting that spec. I'd expect most cars to eventually settle on a 250 - 350 mile range, no matter what happens to battery capacity. There might be some premium models with a 500+ mile range for bragging / non-stop cross-country touring (65 MPH * 8 hours = 520 miles), but never a 1000 mile range. b -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/7fb6c0 d0/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/077cfc64/attachment-0001.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/8781470a/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/9eca01e3/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
On Mar 6, 2015, at 5:57 PM, Robert Bruninga bruni...@usna.edu wrote: Sure, different strokes for different folks, but EV enthusiasts are shooting us in the foot when they claim that EV's are no viable until they have 200 mile batteries! That's not at all what I and others are doing. If you re-read my note, you'll see that I wrote, Today's EV fleet makes all kinds of sense for significant numbers of people, including many who might initially dismiss them out of hand. That's not even remotely close to claiming that EVs are only viable if they have a 200 mile range. The point I'm trying to make is that most people's perception is such that a 200 mile range crosses a threshold past which an EV becomes a general-purpose no-restrictions vehicle, as opposed to a specialty / niche / limited vehicle as it is today. That perception is largely valid, even if a sizable fraction of the driving public are perfectly suited for that niche. It's the difference between an EV being an ideal commuter car for one of the two people in a two- or three-car household, and an EV being an ideal car, period, full stop. We need to be realistic about this, or else people will think we're just blowing electric smoke up their tailpipes. Sell the EVs for what they're great at, which is quite significant. But don't try to tell people that they're wasteful or being uneconomical or whatever just because they're part of that sizable population for which today's EVs are a bad fit -- and _especially- not when general-purpose EVs are right around the corner. At $300/kWh by 2020, that's $20,000 for a 200 mile battery. For an EV that should only cost about $20k, then why pay DOUBLE for a battery that 66% of us don't need. That's the kind of thing I mean. Tell people that they don't need a 200-mile vehicle when they're used to doing 400-mile road trips without a second thought, and they'll think you're some sort of tree-hugging Luddite ascetic who doesn't understand why anybody would waste money on two-ply toilet paper or name-brand boxed Mac Cheese. Instead, tell people that EVs beat the pants off gassers when it comes to commuter vehicles and city cars. Tell them that full-range EVs are here if you've got the dough for a Tesla, and will soon be here if you've got the dough for a midrange non-luxury non-econobox sedan. But _don't_ tell them that they don't actually need a 200 mile range and that they're idiots for even thinking about spending that kind of money on such waste. Cheers, b -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/99ec976c/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
https://transportevolved.com/2015/03/04/nimh-batteries-could-yet-again-power-electric-cars-says-basf-thanks-to-ten-fold-increase-in-energy-density/ NiMH Batteries Could Yet Again Power Electric Cars Says BASF, Thanks to Ten-Fold Increase in Energy Density March 4, 2015 By Nikki Gordon-Bloomfield [images https://d290b3p3ki7y5s.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/RAV4-EV-1st-gen.jpg Previous generation cars like the RAV4 EV used NiMH battery packs. https://d290b3p3ki7y5s.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/BASF.jpg BASF says it thinks it can increase the energy density of NiMH cells tenfold. https://d290b3p3ki7y5s.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/untitled.jpg NiMH is still used today in Toyota Prius hybrid battery packs (except the Prius Plus and Prius plug-in hybrid) ] At some point in the future, we’re pretty sure historians will call the current period of history we’re living in the lithium-ion age, because lithium-ion battery packs are used in everything from electric car battery packs and laptop computers to gadgets, medical devices and telephones. Not so long ago however, nickel-metal-hydride batteries were the preferred chemistry of the humble rechargeable battery pack, thanks to their lower cost and long life. Look back at any of the first-generation plug-in cars produced at the turn of the last century — the Toyota RAV4 EV or late-model GM EV1 for example, — and you’ll find nickel-metal hydride battery packs providing the grunt needed to power these legendary vehicles. These days, nickel-metal-hydride battery packs are only found in a handful of hybrid vehicles — like Toyota’s legendary family of Prius hybrids — and the occasional low-volume electric vehicle, but as our friends over at GreenCarReports detail, that could soon change thanks to a promised ten-fold increase in NiMh battery capacity being talked about by German chemical supplier BASF. According to a recent post over at Technology Review, BASF’s team of scientists who work at its dedicated research centre have been working hard to change the microstructure of the electrodes used in nickel-metal battery packs, making it far more energy dense and durable. The result? it needs less electrode material for a given power output and storage capacity. They claim already to have produced NiMH cells in a laboratory environment with an energy density of 140 watt-hours per kilogram. While that’s less than 230-240 watt-hours that some lithium-ion cells can produce, NiMH is inherently more stable as a battery chemistry, requiring less safety failsafes than lithium-ion. In an automotive application for example, the weight saved by choosing NiMH over lithium-ion could represent a sizeable improvement in overall efficiency, and with NiMH battery packs known to suffer less from premature ageing and degradation with time, opting for NiMH rather than lithium-ion could pay dividends for an automaker willing to support BASF in its research. At the moment, BASF says it believes it can continue to work on increasing the energy density of its NiMH test cells, resulting the kind of energy density never-before imagined for that particular chemistry. If it succeeds — with a figure of around 700 watt-hours per kilogram — it would also place NiMH back in the spotlight as the chemistry of choice, since a ten-fold increase would place it way ahead of current lithium-ion technology. In addition to dramatically increasing the storage capabilities of an automotive battery pack by an order of magnitude while reducing its weight by an equally large amount, the kind of developments being researched by BASF could very well pave the way to cars that could travel more than 1,000 miles on a battery pack the same size as the ones in today’s mid-priced electric cars. At that point, the use of ... any kind of fossil fuel, would become something of a moot point for most car drivers. There’s only one problem: at the moment, this technology and the promises being made are stuck in a laboratory environment. Just like so many other battery breakthroughs we’ve told you about in recent years, it’s a long way from the laboratory to the automotive factory. It’s worth remembering too that BASF is researching other battery technologies too at the same time, like advanced lithium-ion cells. That said, BASF isn’t a small research company and unlike other battery breakthroughs we’ve covered, has a fighting chance of bringing this technology to market. [© transportevolved.com] ... http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1097016_nickel-metal-hydride-batteries-for-electric-cars-energy-density-can-rise-10-fold-researchers Nickel-Metal-Hydride Batteries For Electric Cars? Energy Density Can Rise 10-Fold: Researchers By John Voelcker Mar 2, 2015 ... http://www.technologyreview.com/news/535251/old-battery-type-gets-an-energy-boost/ Old Battery Type Gets an Energy Boost By Kevin Bullis February 19, 2015 The chemical company BASF says the basic type of battery used
[EVDL] EVLN: Aston Martin DBX EV concept preview @2015 Geneva motor show
http://www.classicdriver.com/en/article/cars/all-electric-aston-martin-dbx-concept-previews-future-grand-touring All-electric Aston Martin DBX concept ‘previews future of grand touring’ 03 March 2015 Joe Breeze [images / Aston Martin http://www.classicdriver.com/sites/default/files/styles/full_width_slider/public/article_images/dbx-concept_01.jpg http://www.classicdriver.com/sites/default/files/styles/full_width_slider/public/article_images/dbx-concept_04.jpg http://www.classicdriver.com/sites/default/files/styles/full_width_slider/public/article_images/dbx-concept_05.jpg http://www.classicdriver.com/sites/default/files/styles/full_width_slider/public/article_images/dbx-concept_07.jpg http://www.classicdriver.com/sites/default/files/styles/full_width_slider/public/article_images/dbx-concept_09.jpg ] Aston Martin has completed its trio of new cars for Geneva by revealing the DBX: an experimental, all-electric crossover aimed at ‘challenging the conventions of the luxury GT segment’… Back to the drawing board It’s been six years since the Geneva reveal of the ill-received Lagonda SUV concept – but now, Aston Martin can leave that particular debacle firmly in the past, as it unveils a new take on the Grand Touring genre. According to new Aston CEO Andy Palmer, the DBX “envisages a world, perhaps a world not too far away, when luxury GT travel is not only stylish and luxurious but also more practical, more family-friendly and more environmentally responsible.” The all-electric nature of the concept might not be ideal for long-distance touring given current technology, but the lack of a colossal V12 up front would certainly free up luggage space – the DBX’s in-wheel motors and underfloor batteries mean both fore and aft compartments are vacant for passenger belongings. While Aston admits the DBX is clearly not production ready, Palmer sees the silhouette of such a vehicle on the horizon: “We will, in due course, be entering a car into the new DBX space.” By the time it arrives, that ultra-luxury SUV market is certainly going to be well populated. [© classicdriver.com] ... http://www.worldcarfans.com/115030389803/aston-martin-dbx-concept-revealed-previews-the-future Aston Martin DBX Concept revealed, previews the future of the GT segment [03 March 2015] By Septerra ... http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/autos-pedal-luxury-with-eye-on-future-at-geneva-motor-show-315871.html Autos pedal luxury with eye on future at Geneva Motor Show March 04, 2015 by Trevor Noon http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/03/03/us-autoshow-geneva-aston-idUSKBN0LZ11120150303 Aston Martin crossover may deepen Daimler partnership By Laurence Frost GENEVA Tue Mar 3, 2015 (Reporting by Laurence Frost; Editing by Christian Plumb) (Reuters) - Aston Martin on Tuesday announced plans for a luxury crossover SUV that may draw more heavily on its partnership with Daimler, as the British sports car maker confirmed moves to raise more capital and expand into new vehicle categories. Aston has secured about 150 million pounds ($230 million) in additional funding, Chief Executive Andy Palmer said in an interview at the Geneva car show before unveiling an electric DBX concept car prefiguring the new vehicle, expected by 2019. Palmer said Aston's main shareholders, private equity groups Investindustrial and Investment Dar of Kuwait, had agreed to back the capital hike and range expansion first reported by Reuters in December. He acknowledged that the future production SUV model could use a four-wheel drive architecture from 5 percent shareholder Daimler, which is already supplying Aston with electronics and V8 engines from its AMG performance division under a 2013 deal. It's not ruled out, nor is it agreed, Palmer said, without elaborating. A Daimler spokesman declined to comment. The cash injection, in addition to 500 million pounds already earmarked for a revamp of the core sports car lineup, will enable Aston to hit a consistently sustainable level of spending on new models, Palmer said. Held back by ageing models and weak investment, the company has missed out on a global luxury car boom. Last year it delivered 4,000 cars, far short of its 7,300 record in 2007. In a departure from its pure sports-car heritage, Aston is going ahead with four-door luxury sedans under a revived Lagonda badge as well as SUV-styled vehicles designed to increase its appeal to younger consumers, women and faster-growing markets. The reality is that we have to expand our customer base, we have to address the issue of our (CO2) emissions and we have to appeal to a generation of kids who have grown up with SUVs – particularly in places like China, Palmer said. Daimler boss Dieter Zetsche has previously indicated readiness to share SUV architecture with Aston, while dismissing speculation that the German premium carmaker may eventually increase its stake in the British brand. The two-door crossover unveiled in Geneva is also Aston's first
[EVDL] GerzanychMason's 350Green-EVSE bilked Million$
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-electric-car-fraud-met-20150304-story.html#page=1 Two picked to build Chicago-area car-charging stations charged with fraud By Patrick M. O'Connell Chicago Tribune [image http://www.trbimg.com/img-54f7b042/turbine/chi-car-charger-company-indictment-20150304/600/600x338 Car charger company indictment Mariana Gerzanych, CEO of 350Green, and Timothy Mason, president of 350Green, at the Chicago Auto Show in February 2011. (William DeShazer, Chicago Tribune) ] Feds say pair defrauded Chicago, federal government with project to install electric car-charging stations. Touted with fanfare by city officials and then-Gov. Pat Quinn at the 2011 Chicago Auto Show, a planned network of charging stations for electric vehicles was billed as an environmentally friendly project designed to be the best and largest in the country. But the green initiative fizzled badly, and now two former owners of a California-based company initially selected to build the sprawling Chicago-area network stand charged with fraud in an indictment made public Wednesday in Chicago's federal court. Prosecutors alleged the pair, Mariana Gerzanych and Timothy Mason, falsely obtained almost $3 million in federal grants administered by the city of Chicago and government agencies in Pennsylvania and California. To collect the grant money, the two falsely claimed that their company, 350Green LLC of Los Angeles, paid subcontractors and vendors when in fact they had not, the indictment charged. Both were charged with five counts of wire fraud and will be arraigned later. The Tribune has reported extensively on the FBI investigation and the mounting troubles with the project's funding and implementation. Envisioned as the backbone to a less gasoline-dependent future, the charging station network was supposed to allow electric vehicle drivers across the area to power their cars in a matter of minutes. Years later, only a fraction of the charging stations planned for Chicago exist as the project has been slow to materialize amid a series of legal, equipment and organizational setbacks. When 350Green was picked to build the charging stations here, Chicago was heralded as an early adopter of electric car technology, but that crumbled amid evidence of unpaid bills and accounting issues. Projects by the company in 19 other markets across the country also collapsed. The city of Chicago and 350Green entered into a contract in October 2010 that provided the company with $1.9 million in grants from the U.S. Department of Energy under the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act. Under that deal, 350Green was required to provide $6.8 million of its own funds to complete the ambitious project but failed to do so, the indictment charged. The company also entered into similar but less lucrative contracts with the Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Protection and two San Francisco-area government agencies. Prosecutors alleged Mason, 57, and Gerzanych, 36, both of California, defrauded Chicago and the other agencies by submitting false claims for expenses to obtain the grant money. When questions arose, the two made up statements about 350Green's financial status, according to the indictment. Under the scheme, prosecutors alleged, the two created fake checks for purported payments for chargers and submitted fake invoices to the city of Chicago claiming it had paid subcontractors. Checks were made out to Actium Power, a front company created by Gerzanych, for amounts far greater than what chargers should cost, and the actual manufacturer of the chargers was never paid, according to the indictment. When subcontractors complained, the two told them late payments were caused by the city of Chicago failing to pay invoices on time, the indictment alleges. When allegations of fraud surfaced, prosecutors said, Gerzanych posted a statement on the company website, emailed employees and those overseeing the Bay Area grant, falsely claiming that 350Green had invested $4.6 million in private capital funds into the Chicago project. The indictment alleges the private investment money did not exist. Gerzanych, who was 350Green's CEO, and Mason, its president, didn't respond Wednesday to requests for comment, and it was unclear if they had hired attorneys for the criminal case. Both individually filed for federal bankruptcy protection from creditors last year, records show. Mason told the Tribune in 2013 that the expiration of the Alternative Fuel Vehicle Refueling Property tax credit at the end of 2011 had sunk the project's financing. Mason said the company counted on the tax credit for about 50 percent of the project's funding. The tax credit was extended in 2013, at which point, Mason said, it was too late. According to an FBI search warrant obtained by the Tribune last year, a bookkeeper for 350Green told authorities that Mason and Gerzanych would ask the employee to submit copies of checks to the city
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
It's worse than that. They should build them along interstates at current fueling stations. 90% of the current stations are unused because people charge at home. Who wants to sit at a charger with nothing to do? From: Peri Hartman via EV ev@lists.evdl.org To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@lists.evdl.org Sent: Friday, March 6, 2015 11:18 AM Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight Yes, irrelevant in a way. But what's not irrelevant is our charging infrastructure. We're building out L3 charging which, I believe, will be too slow once 200+ mile range cars are out. We should be spending now on infrastructure that will be useful for the next 10 years, what we're doing now will be obsolete before the build out is finished. Tesla is doing a much better job but, of course, only available to Tesla owners. Peri -- Original Message -- From: paul dove via EV ev@lists.evdl.org To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@lists.evdl.org Sent: 06-Mar-15 9:11:42 AM Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight Irrelevant until a person can actually purchase one. Till then it's pie in the sky. -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/a97a9344/attachment-0001.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
On Mar 6, 2015, at 2:19 AM, brucedp5 via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: [T]he kind of developments being researched by BASF could very well pave the way to cars that could travel more than 1,000 miles on a battery pack the same size as the ones in today’s mid-priced electric cars. I'm sure we'll never see significant numbers of thousand-mile-range cars on the market. That's almost twelve hours at 85 MPH, and over eighteen hours at 55 MPH. What we'd see long before then would be cars with half as much battery. Never mind the savings in money; the space and weight could be put to better use. Or, if a battery of that much capacity winds up in a vehicle, the vehicle will be something like the Hummer: hugely oversized and inefficient, but still with a 500-mile range due to twice the batteries. It looks like a 200-mile range seems to be the point where Joe Sixpack stops having crippling amounts of range anxiety (whether justified or not), and we're transitioning to that being not untypical. Tesla's had that for a while and all the rumors are about the next vehicles from various major manufacturers meeting that spec. I'd expect most cars to eventually settle on a 250 - 350 mile range, no matter what happens to battery capacity. There might be some premium models with a 500+ mile range for bragging / non-stop cross-country touring (65 MPH * 8 hours = 520 miles), but never a 1000 mile range. b -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/7fb6c0d0/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
Yep, pretty much agree with you. The details will probably come down to the amount of time to recharge. If you can travel for 4 hours and recharge in 10-15 minutes, I think it will be scarce to find discontented people. 4 hours at 65mph would be 260 mile range. Of course, unless you regularly make trips longer than 4 hours, taking a bit longer to charge shouldn't be such a big deal :) I think it's excitinig that we're getting close to 200 mile range cars at a LEAF price. Peri -- Original Message -- From: Ben Goren via EV ev@lists.evdl.org To: brucedp5 bruce...@operamail.com; Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@lists.evdl.org Sent: 06-Mar-15 8:59:29 AM Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight On Mar 6, 2015, at 2:19 AM, brucedp5 via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: [T]he kind of developments being researched by BASF could very well pave the way to cars that could travel more than 1,000 miles on a battery pack the same size as the ones in today’s mid-priced electric cars. I'm sure we'll never see significant numbers of thousand-mile-range cars on the market. That's almost twelve hours at 85 MPH, and over eighteen hours at 55 MPH. What we'd see long before then would be cars with half as much battery. Never mind the savings in money; the space and weight could be put to better use. Or, if a battery of that much capacity winds up in a vehicle, the vehicle will be something like the Hummer: hugely oversized and inefficient, but still with a 500-mile range due to twice the batteries. It looks like a 200-mile range seems to be the point where Joe Sixpack stops having crippling amounts of range anxiety (whether justified or not), and we're transitioning to that being not untypical. Tesla's had that for a while and all the rumors are about the next vehicles from various major manufacturers meeting that spec. I'd expect most cars to eventually settle on a 250 - 350 mile range, no matter what happens to battery capacity. There might be some premium models with a 500+ mile range for bragging / non-stop cross-country touring (65 MPH * 8 hours = 520 miles), but never a 1000 mile range. b -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/7fb6c0d0/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
Irrelevant until a person can actually purchase one. Till then it's pie in the sky. From: Peri Hartman via EV ev@lists.evdl.org To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@lists.evdl.org Sent: Friday, March 6, 2015 11:07 AM Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight Yep, pretty much agree with you. The details will probably come down to the amount of time to recharge. If you can travel for 4 hours and recharge in 10-15 minutes, I think it will be scarce to find discontented people. 4 hours at 65mph would be 260 mile range. Of course, unless you regularly make trips longer than 4 hours, taking a bit longer to charge shouldn't be such a big deal :) I think it's excitinig that we're getting close to 200 mile range cars at a LEAF price. Peri -- Original Message -- From: Ben Goren via EV ev@lists.evdl.org To: brucedp5 bruce...@operamail.com; Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@lists.evdl.org Sent: 06-Mar-15 8:59:29 AM Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight On Mar 6, 2015, at 2:19 AM, brucedp5 via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: [T]he kind of developments being researched by BASF could very well pave the way to cars that could travel more than 1,000 miles on a battery pack the same size as the ones in today’s mid-priced electric cars. I'm sure we'll never see significant numbers of thousand-mile-range cars on the market. That's almost twelve hours at 85 MPH, and over eighteen hours at 55 MPH. What we'd see long before then would be cars with half as much battery. Never mind the savings in money; the space and weight could be put to better use. Or, if a battery of that much capacity winds up in a vehicle, the vehicle will be something like the Hummer: hugely oversized and inefficient, but still with a 500-mile range due to twice the batteries. It looks like a 200-mile range seems to be the point where Joe Sixpack stops having crippling amounts of range anxiety (whether justified or not), and we're transitioning to that being not untypical. Tesla's had that for a while and all the rumors are about the next vehicles from various major manufacturers meeting that spec. I'd expect most cars to eventually settle on a 250 - 350 mile range, no matter what happens to battery capacity. There might be some premium models with a 500+ mile range for bragging / non-stop cross-country touring (65 MPH * 8 hours = 520 miles), but never a 1000 mile range. b -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/7fb6c0d0/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/fed9be0b/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] EVLN: 50 e-NV200 as DHL Express EVs In MilanRome.it
http://insideevs.com/dhl-express-put-50-nissan-e-nv200-work-milan-rome/
DHL Express Puts 50 Nissan e-NV200 To Work In Milan And Rome
[20150301] by Mark Kane
[image
http://insideevs.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/128700_1_5.jpg
DHL Express Put 50 Nissan e-NV200 To Work In Milan And Rome
http://insideevs.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/116242_1_5.jpg
Nissan e-NV200
]
Nissan began deliveries of 50 e-NV200 electric vans under one of the largest
orders to date to DHL in Italy.
The electric vans will be used in dispatches and delivery fleets in Milan
and Rome.
DHL Express tested the e-NV200 prior to ordering and according to the press
release, the electric version was able to keep up the pace of conventional
ICE vans. As average daily mileage of these type of vans in real use in
Europe is less than 100 km, we expect more EVs to come:
“The e-NV200 has been tested by many organisations and fleets globally
and has now satisfied even the service demands of DHL Express in Italy. In a
simulated daily use in the area of Rome, the Nissan van completed 45
deliveries and made 25 collections, entirely in line with the daily workload
of a traditional vehicle, travelling approximately 120 km and therefore
without running down the batteries, well within the vehicles 170km official
range. Research shows that 70% of European van operators average less than
100 km per day, while 35% never exceed 120 km. Florence, Verona, Bologna,
Naples, Salerno, Bari and Catania will join Rome and Milan in introducing
e-NV200 to the fleets there.
Ideal for operations in the urban centres of the cities, where access is
prohibited to vehicles with diesel engines, the Nissan e-NV200 boasts not
only the complete absence of harmful emissions, but also huge savings on
running costs with respect to a comparable diesel van, extraordinary comfort
thanks to the complete silence of the engine, no gear changes and brisk
acceleration.
Equipped with an electric motor that has been derived from that of the
Nissan LEAF, with batteries that can be recharged to 0-80 percent in less
than 30 minutes, using the CHAdeMO quick charging system, the e-NV200 is an
externally compact vehicle but with transport capacity that is right at the
top of its range. The van features a load bay of 4.2 m3, the equivalent of
two Euro pallets, with a useful capacity of 770 kg. The battery pack,
situated under the floor panel, does not intrude into the load area and
keeps the centre of gravity very low.”
Bruno Mattucci, Managing Director of Nissan Italia stated:
“The start of deliveries of the first e-NV200s, which will be used for
deliveries starting from the major Italian cities of Milan and Rome, is a
further demonstration of Nissan’s commitment to spreading use of electric
mobility throughout Italy”.
Alberto Nobis, Managing Director of DHL Express Italia commented:
“The agreement with Nissan is perfectly in line with the commitment we
have been pursuing for years to the environment. Use of these innovative
zero-impact vans is another part of the global GoGreen programme designed by
Deutsche Post DHL to lower the Group’s worldwide CO2 emissions by 30% by
2020. Moreover, the Nissan Vehicles us to implement a sustainable City
Logistics strategy, as they are also particularly well suited to making
deliveries in historic centres”.
[© insideevs.com]
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http://www.torquenews.com/1080/nissan-leaf-taxis-enter-service-blackpool-2nd-ev-evolution
LEAF Taxis Enter Service in Blackpool UK As 2nd EV Evolution
http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/local/community/cabarrus/article11142953.html
University City CA Tesla L3 Supercharger station to open soon
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EVLN: Aston Martin DBX EV concept @2015 Geneva motor show
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
Isn't that a bit extreme? What about the many people who want to own only one car and normally drive 20 miles a day but once a week or so go out of town - to the mountains, to the beach, to the inlaws... They could rent but might prefer the convenience of having their own vehicle ready to go. Peri -- Original Message -- From: Robert Bruninga via EV ev@lists.evdl.org To: Ben Goren b...@trumpetpower.com; Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@lists.evdl.org; brucedp5 bruce...@operamail.com Sent: 06-Mar-15 9:50:03 AM Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight It is ludicrous for someone to be paying for a 200 mile battery when all she needs is 80. As with everything else, there needs to be a variety. The smart EV shopper buys the -smallest- battery that meets her daily need. Paying for a 200 mile battery is like commuting 10 miles a day and dropping off the kids in a hummer. Bob, WB4APR -Original Message- From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Ben Goren via EV Sent: Friday, March 06, 2015 11:59 AM To: brucedp5; Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight On Mar 6, 2015, at 2:19 AM, brucedp5 via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: [T]he kind of developments being researched by BASF could very well pave the way to cars that could travel more than 1,000 miles on a battery pack the same size as the ones in today's mid-priced electric cars. I'm sure we'll never see significant numbers of thousand-mile-range cars on the market. That's almost twelve hours at 85 MPH, and over eighteen hours at 55 MPH. What we'd see long before then would be cars with half as much battery. Never mind the savings in money; the space and weight could be put to better use. Or, if a battery of that much capacity winds up in a vehicle, the vehicle will be something like the Hummer: hugely oversized and inefficient, but still with a 500-mile range due to twice the batteries. It looks like a 200-mile range seems to be the point where Joe Sixpack stops having crippling amounts of range anxiety (whether justified or not), and we're transitioning to that being not untypical. Tesla's had that for a while and all the rumors are about the next vehicles from various major manufacturers meeting that spec. I'd expect most cars to eventually settle on a 250 - 350 mile range, no matter what happens to battery capacity. There might be some premium models with a 500+ mile range for bragging / non-stop cross-country touring (65 MPH * 8 hours = 520 miles), but never a 1000 mile range. b -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/7fb6c0 d0/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
That alone is reason to celebrate :) sean On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 1:43 PM, Lee Hart via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: brucedp5 via EV wrote: https://transportevolved.com/2015/03/04/nimh-batteries- could-yet-again-power-electric-cars-says-basf- thanks-to-ten-fold-increase-in-energy-density/ NiMH Batteries Could Yet Again Power Electric Cars Says BASF, Thanks to Ten-Fold Increase in Energy Density None of this matters if no one can buy it. So what this tells me is that Chevron's nimh patent monopoly is broken, or at least cracked. BASF wouldn't invest in a technology that they couldn't sell. -- Anyone can make the simple complicated. Creativity is making the complicated simple. -- Charles Mingus -- Lee Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeah...@earthlink.net ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/NEDRA) -- Sean Korb spk...@spkorb.org http://www.spkorb.org '65,'68 Mustangs,'68 Cougar,'78 R100/7,'60 Metro,'59 A35,'71 Pantera #1382 The more you drive, the less intelligent you get --Miller Computers are useless. They can only give you answers. -P. Picasso -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/fa9e079f/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
brucedp5 via EV wrote: https://transportevolved.com/2015/03/04/nimh-batteries-could-yet-again-power-electric-cars-says-basf-thanks-to-ten-fold-increase-in-energy-density/ NiMH Batteries Could Yet Again Power Electric Cars Says BASF, Thanks to Ten-Fold Increase in Energy Density None of this matters if no one can buy it. So what this tells me is that Chevron's nimh patent monopoly is broken, or at least cracked. BASF wouldn't invest in a technology that they couldn't sell. -- Anyone can make the simple complicated. Creativity is making the complicated simple. -- Charles Mingus -- Lee Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeah...@earthlink.net ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
It is ludicrous for someone to be paying for a 200 mile battery when all she needs is 80. As with everything else, there needs to be a variety. The smart EV shopper buys the -smallest- battery that meets her daily need. Paying for a 200 mile battery is like commuting 10 miles a day and dropping off the kids in a hummer. Bob, WB4APR -Original Message- From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Ben Goren via EV Sent: Friday, March 06, 2015 11:59 AM To: brucedp5; Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight On Mar 6, 2015, at 2:19 AM, brucedp5 via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: [T]he kind of developments being researched by BASF could very well pave the way to cars that could travel more than 1,000 miles on a battery pack the same size as the ones in today's mid-priced electric cars. I'm sure we'll never see significant numbers of thousand-mile-range cars on the market. That's almost twelve hours at 85 MPH, and over eighteen hours at 55 MPH. What we'd see long before then would be cars with half as much battery. Never mind the savings in money; the space and weight could be put to better use. Or, if a battery of that much capacity winds up in a vehicle, the vehicle will be something like the Hummer: hugely oversized and inefficient, but still with a 500-mile range due to twice the batteries. It looks like a 200-mile range seems to be the point where Joe Sixpack stops having crippling amounts of range anxiety (whether justified or not), and we're transitioning to that being not untypical. Tesla's had that for a while and all the rumors are about the next vehicles from various major manufacturers meeting that spec. I'd expect most cars to eventually settle on a 250 - 350 mile range, no matter what happens to battery capacity. There might be some premium models with a 500+ mile range for bragging / non-stop cross-country touring (65 MPH * 8 hours = 520 miles), but never a 1000 mile range. b -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/7fb6c0 d0/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
Sure they might exist but it's not economical to own that much battery for occasional use. People like that usually have multiple cars. We first must get past the adoption curve. Too much range anxiety among people with no EV experience. From: Peri Hartman via EV ev@lists.evdl.org To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@lists.evdl.org Sent: Friday, March 6, 2015 11:56 AM Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight Isn't that a bit extreme? What about the many people who want to own only one car and normally drive 20 miles a day but once a week or so go out of town - to the mountains, to the beach, to the inlaws... They could rent but might prefer the convenience of having their own vehicle ready to go. Peri -- Original Message -- From: Robert Bruninga via EV ev@lists.evdl.org To: Ben Goren b...@trumpetpower.com; Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@lists.evdl.org; brucedp5 bruce...@operamail.com Sent: 06-Mar-15 9:50:03 AM Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight It is ludicrous for someone to be paying for a 200 mile battery when all she needs is 80. As with everything else, there needs to be a variety. The smart EV shopper buys the -smallest- battery that meets her daily need. Paying for a 200 mile battery is like commuting 10 miles a day and dropping off the kids in a hummer. Bob, WB4APR -Original Message- From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Ben Goren via EV Sent: Friday, March 06, 2015 11:59 AM To: brucedp5; Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight On Mar 6, 2015, at 2:19 AM, brucedp5 via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: [T]he kind of developments being researched by BASF could very well pave the way to cars that could travel more than 1,000 miles on a battery pack the same size as the ones in today's mid-priced electric cars. I'm sure we'll never see significant numbers of thousand-mile-range cars on the market. That's almost twelve hours at 85 MPH, and over eighteen hours at 55 MPH. What we'd see long before then would be cars with half as much battery. Never mind the savings in money; the space and weight could be put to better use. Or, if a battery of that much capacity winds up in a vehicle, the vehicle will be something like the Hummer: hugely oversized and inefficient, but still with a 500-mile range due to twice the batteries. It looks like a 200-mile range seems to be the point where Joe Sixpack stops having crippling amounts of range anxiety (whether justified or not), and we're transitioning to that being not untypical. Tesla's had that for a while and all the rumors are about the next vehicles from various major manufacturers meeting that spec. I'd expect most cars to eventually settle on a 250 - 350 mile range, no matter what happens to battery capacity. There might be some premium models with a 500+ mile range for bragging / non-stop cross-country touring (65 MPH * 8 hours = 520 miles), but never a 1000 mile range. b -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/7fb6c0 d0/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/077cfc64/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
Oh. On February 14, 2012 BASF http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BASF announced that it had acquired Ovonic Battery Company from Energy Conversion Devices Inc.[27] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patent_encumbrance_of_large_automotive_NiMH_batteries#cite_note-27 On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 1:43 PM, Sean Korb spk...@gmail.com wrote: That alone is reason to celebrate :) sean On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 1:43 PM, Lee Hart via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: brucedp5 via EV wrote: https://transportevolved.com/2015/03/04/nimh-batteries- could-yet-again-power-electric-cars-says-basf- thanks-to-ten-fold-increase-in-energy-density/ NiMH Batteries Could Yet Again Power Electric Cars Says BASF, Thanks to Ten-Fold Increase in Energy Density None of this matters if no one can buy it. So what this tells me is that Chevron's nimh patent monopoly is broken, or at least cracked. BASF wouldn't invest in a technology that they couldn't sell. -- Anyone can make the simple complicated. Creativity is making the complicated simple. -- Charles Mingus -- Lee Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeah...@earthlink.net ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/NEDRA) -- Sean Korb spk...@spkorb.org http://www.spkorb.org '65,'68 Mustangs,'68 Cougar,'78 R100/7,'60 Metro,'59 A35,'71 Pantera #1382 The more you drive, the less intelligent you get --Miller Computers are useless. They can only give you answers. -P. Picasso -- Sean Korb spk...@spkorb.org http://www.spkorb.org '65,'68 Mustangs,'68 Cougar,'78 R100/7,'60 Metro,'59 A35,'71 Pantera #1382 The more you drive, the less intelligent you get --Miller Computers are useless. They can only give you answers. -P. Picasso -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/c937bc6e/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] NiMH patents expired : EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
[ref
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-BASF-sez-1000-mi-NiMH-EV-Pack-700Wh-kg-lighter-weight-tp4674087.html
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-BASF-sez-1000-mi-NiMH-EV-Pack-700Wh-kg-lighter-weight-tp4674087.html
]
http://ev.com/nimh-ev-batteries-held-hostage-until-2014/
NiMH EV Batteries Held Hostage Until 2014 --EV.com | EV ...
Nov 10, 2013 - Several critical patents on NiMH EV batteries will expire in
2014, so they ... In October 2000, GM sold the patent to Texaco and a week
later ...
http://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/2okxlo/nimh_patent_held_by_chevron_to_expire_by_the_end/
NiMH patent held by Chevron to expire by the end of 2014 ...
Dec 7, 2014 - NiMH battery patent was purchased from Ovonics by General
Motors in 94, then sold to Texaco and a week later to Chevron. Then, Chevron
...
{brucedp.150m.com}
-
On Fri, Mar 6, 2015, at 10:43 AM, Lee Hart via EV wrote:
... what this tells me is that
Chevron's nimh patent monopoly is broken, or at least cracked. BASF
wouldn't invest in a technology that they couldn't sell.
-
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[EVDL] Fwd: Calling all owners of cheap Chinese EV's? (the Jonway Massimo / Mullen 100e / Atomic-EV / etc)
I bought myself a big expensive toy a few weeks ago. It's a Jonway Massimo MSE-220. This is also being sold as a Mullen Motors e100, or an Atomic-EV, or probably a dozen other names. This car is being cranked out in mass numbers over in China, and begun to show up here. Only problem is that there doesn't seem to be a whole lot written on them. I was given a manual with mine from www.jonwayauto.com which looks to have been translated from Mandarin to English using an online translator (it's rough readin'). I am working on correcting all of the mistakes, and I will be publishing that soon (to somewhere). I have to assume that there is someone else out there that has one of these. And is looking for 'friends' to share information with. For instance - I would like to try to find a way to lift the speed restrictions on my controller. But it's an unmarked Chinese number and I can't find anything online about it. I tore my controller out and opened it up today and I don't see any easy way to lift the restrictions. There is a strange 10 pin DIN port on the side, which I would think might be a serial interface. But then again it may be for accessories, service troubleshooting, etc. Here are some pictures I took today: https://plus.google.com/photos/100430129794260842281/albums/6122935252456685905?authkey=CLSS8ZD567rmZQ Perhaps if any of you out there have worked on something similar, you can offer some advice. If you also own one of these, or you have a friend who does, put them in touch with me. We need a fan club! Steve Ballantyne Network Engineer MCSE/MCDST; Novell CLA; LPIC-1; CTT+; A+; Network+; Linux+; Server+; I-Net+; Security+; SonicWALL CSSA ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Fwd: Calling all owners of cheap Chinese EV's? (the Jonway Massimo / Mullen 100e / Atomic-EV / etc)
Steve, The Made by ZAP is that the same vehicle? Can they help you to get info on the controller? Else it will simply be a matter of trying - take a multimeter and measure the voltage on the pins of the connector. If you see one that is between 6 and 12V and occasionally dips (varies) in voltage then that might be an RS232 TX line. Oscilloscope will tell you if it is a digital comm signal. Seeing the 5 connectors: red, black and 3 color outputs, tells me that this is an AC controller. I presume that the connectors with the double row of contacts are the control inputs (switches, sensors and throttle) but in my controller, there is also a serial interface on one of these connectors (but that is not a chinese controller). Even if you can find the serial port connections, it will be another challenge to find out how to program it... Success! Cor van de Water Chief Scientist Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com Email: cwa...@proxim.comPrivate: http://www.cvandewater.info Skype: cor_van_de_water XoIP: +31877841130 Tel: +1 408 383 7626Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 -Original Message- From: EV on behalf of Steve Ballantyne via EV Sent: Fri 3/6/2015 6:52 PM To: ev@lists.evdl.org Subject: [EVDL] Fwd: Calling all owners of cheap Chinese EV's? (the Jonway Massimo / Mullen 100e / Atomic-EV / etc) I bought myself a big expensive toy a few weeks ago. It's a Jonway Massimo MSE-220. This is also being sold as a Mullen Motors e100, or an Atomic-EV, or probably a dozen other names. This car is being cranked out in mass numbers over in China, and begun to show up here. Only problem is that there doesn't seem to be a whole lot written on them. I was given a manual with mine from www.jonwayauto.com which looks to have been translated from Mandarin to English using an online translator (it's rough readin'). I am working on correcting all of the mistakes, and I will be publishing that soon (to somewhere). I have to assume that there is someone else out there that has one of these. And is looking for 'friends' to share information with. For instance - I would like to try to find a way to lift the speed restrictions on my controller. But it's an unmarked Chinese number and I can't find anything online about it. I tore my controller out and opened it up today and I don't see any easy way to lift the restrictions. There is a strange 10 pin DIN port on the side, which I would think might be a serial interface. But then again it may be for accessories, service troubleshooting, etc. Here are some pictures I took today: https://plus.google.com/photos/100430129794260842281/albums/6122935252456685905?authkey=CLSS8ZD567rmZQ Perhaps if any of you out there have worked on something similar, you can offer some advice. If you also own one of these, or you have a friend who does, put them in touch with me. We need a fan club! Steve Ballantyne Network Engineer MCSE/MCDST; Novell CLA; LPIC-1; CTT+; A+; Network+; Linux+; Server+; I-Net+; Security+; SonicWALL CSSA ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 5059 bytes Desc: not available URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150306/805bd361/attachment.bin ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Fwd: Calling all owners of cheap Chinese EV's? (the Jonway Massimo / Mullen 100e / Atomic-EV / etc)
I wish you luck. I've not had a lot of luck with my chinese controller. It *is* possible to get info on the controller, but only if you can find someone at one of the companies that sells the parts. As an aside, I *was* able to get a CD with some update software, but it was a major struggle to find, and I still haven't been able to use it due to other issues (extreme noise on the 12v system). If I see something on this, I'll be sure to let you know. Cheers, Peter On 3/6/15 6:52 PM, Steve Ballantyne via EV wrote: I bought myself a big expensive toy a few weeks ago. It's a Jonway Massimo MSE-220. This is also being sold as a Mullen Motors e100, or an Atomic-EV, or probably a dozen other names. This car is being cranked out in mass numbers over in China, and begun to show up here. Only problem is that there doesn't seem to be a whole lot written on them. I was given a manual with mine from www.jonwayauto.com which looks to have been translated from Mandarin to English using an online translator (it's rough readin'). I am working on correcting all of the mistakes, and I will be publishing that soon (to somewhere). I have to assume that there is someone else out there that has one of these. And is looking for 'friends' to share information with. For instance - I would like to try to find a way to lift the speed restrictions on my controller. But it's an unmarked Chinese number and I can't find anything online about it. I tore my controller out and opened it up today and I don't see any easy way to lift the restrictions. There is a strange 10 pin DIN port on the side, which I would think might be a serial interface. But then again it may be for accessories, service troubleshooting, etc. Here are some pictures I took today: https://plus.google.com/photos/100430129794260842281/albums/6122935252456685905?authkey=CLSS8ZD567rmZQ Perhaps if any of you out there have worked on something similar, you can offer some advice. If you also own one of these, or you have a friend who does, put them in touch with me. We need a fan club! Steve Ballantyne Network Engineer MCSE/MCDST; Novell CLA; LPIC-1; CTT+; A+; Network+; Linux+; Server+; I-Net+; Security+; SonicWALL CSSA ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BASF sez 1k+mi NiMH EV Pack 700Wh/kg, lighter-weight
On 6 Mar 2015 at 10:08, paul dove via EV wrote: Sure they [people who usually drive only 20 mi/day but now and then need more range] might exist but it's not economical to own that much battery for occasional use. Well, now, that depends. If you only use 10% of your battery's capacity per day, you only have to charge every 8 days or so. That battery is likely to last the life of the vehicle, or longer, unless you're using lithium and the calendar-life-over-cycle-life restriction comes into play. That might be an appropriate and economical choice for some people. Let's say (somewhat optimistically) that the vehicle will last 15 years, and you drive 12k miles per year. That's an average of 32 miles oer day, and a total of 180k over the vehicle's life. So, maybe a range of 80-100 miles is plenty. But suppose you buy a bigger battery, with a rated range of 200mi, and you use 80% of it before charging (a good plan for long battery life). Thus most weeks, you'll charge only once every 5.6 days (rounding, every 5 days). You'll thus cycle your battery 1095 times over the life of the vehicle. I don't know enough about lithium to say, and I think it varies with chemistry, but at that point an NiMH battery (existing technology) will probably have used no more than half of its usable cycle life. So you probably do have more battery than you need for your normal vehicle mission. But wait. For one thing, this means you'll probably never have to worry about ponying up the cash for a new battery. That's comparable (in financial disruption even if not in exact cost) to having to replace the engine in your ICEV, something every ICEV owner dreads. I know quite a few people who live paycheck to paycheck, and simply don't have that kind of cash. For them, paying more upfront so they don't have to worry about buying a replacement battery later might be a reasonable choice. For another, what if you need to make a 180+ mile trip now and then? With an absurdly large battery, you have the spare capacity, and again - freedom from worry. If, for example, your daughter at college 90 miles away calls at 1am and says she's just been busted, you can go bail her out right now. (Not that this has actually happened to me, but you never know.) David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA EVDL Administrator = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/ = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Note: mail sent to evpost and etpost addresses will not reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ . = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
