Re: farsi. farsi! farsi? farsi:
On Sat, 13 Dec 2003, Nadim Shaikli wrote:
--- Behnam Esfahbod [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Fri, 12 Dec 2003, Behdad Esfahbod wrote:
On Fri, 12 Dec 2003, Roozbeh Pournader wrote:
Akka 2.0, may make up a good name. I too prefer not binding a
new name to the same functionality. Perhaps we would want to
give some hints and credit to pre-2.0 Akka. Roozbeh?
I prefer a name more neutral. Something that is not against the
nationalism of any Arab or Persian or Hebrew person. Go find some!
Nadim proposed something along 'beacon', as in 'bicon', as in
'bidi con{sole,dom}'. I like both. 'bicon' goes more with
'fribidi's, but as we converted freebidi to fribidi, we do bicon
to beacon too. I'm with beacon then. [Roozbeh,Behnam: And we
can call it 'faanoos' :)].
Cool..., So we can call it Faanoos Navy (TM)!
Actually Faanoos sounds cool :-)
Actually, Faanoos with the same spelling is already taken by me
for a couple of projects ;-). BTW, is it an Arabic word too?
My votes would be for (in order of preference),
Akka 2.0
Faanoos (and not fanoos, read why below)
BiCon (or even HetroCon :-)
beacon
Based on Google search results, I vote for BiCon too (beacon hits
some 2 million results). So BiCon, but don't forget that in
filenames it should be written bicon.
Another problem with faanoos is that it's again bounded to
Persian (maybe and Arabic).
I think it would be a good idea to find a unique name that does
not produce millions of hits in google at min :-) This is the
last I will say about this topic and will leave it to those that
have worked and will work on the project to decide.
search faanoos in Google and you will be lost in found Persian
pages.
Salam.
- Nadim
behdad
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Re: farsi. farsi! farsi? farsi:
On Fri, 12 Dec 2003, Roozbeh Pournader wrote:
Oops. Sent empty last time.
Akka 2.0, may make up a good name. I too prefer not binding a
new name to the same functionality. Perhaps we would want to
give some hints and credit to pre-2.0 Akka. Roozbeh?
I prefer a name more neutral. Something that is not against the
nationalism of any Arab or Persian or Hebrew person. Go find some!
Nadim proposed something along 'beacon', as in 'bicon', as in
'bidi con{sole,dom}'. I like both. 'bicon' goes more with
'fribidi's, but as we converted freebidi to fribidi, we do bicon
to beacon too. I'm with beacon then. [Roozbeh,Behnam: And we
can call it 'faanoos' :)].
Roozbeh's and mine are in LGPL. (Roozbeh?).
Confirmed. If the license is incompatible with other things, let us know
so we can fix it.
The font may be GPL. We surely want to keep library code in
LGPL. Application stuff can go with GPL or LGPL.
Tables may need some update. Roozbeh?
They may need so. But I can't check that. Anyone interested, please
check with the latest ArabicJoining.txt file in Unicode data files.
Not me ;-). Behnam, can you give it a try? Long time you have
not done these stuff.
roozbeh
behdad
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farsi. farsi! farsi? farsi: (fwd)
in a PSF font. The glyphs are then extracted from the BDF font. ascii is the ascii block identity mapping. farsi_arabic is the base arabic block. farsi_marks maps control chars, formatting chars, different spacing and punctuation, It is used for when you do not want to remove marks in the pipeline. farsi_nomarks instead, uses the same space as farsi_marks, but feels with Latin characters. All these maps try their best to map as many character as possible. For example, c-cedilla may be mapped on c. There are marks as # RTL ... in these files, that trigger the perl script to mirror rtl chars if asked so. Note: The package uses 512char fonts. So you would lose one color bit of your console. This is the default since Red Hat 8 or 9. BTW, if you load framebuffer console (sample is in my farsiredhat package), you get your color bit back. testtexts/hafez First Persian sonnet from Hafez. testtexts/fatiha First surrah of Quran. testtexts/marks Some Unicode marks with their names. To check if you are seeing marks or they are removed. Well, that's it. Behdad Esfahbod Dec 11 2003 ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
Re: FarsiWeb Digest, Vol 7, Issue 1
On Sat, 6 Dec 2003, Roozbeh Pournader wrote: On Sat, 2003-12-06 at 20:07, Sam Baran wrote: Moreover, Farsi is the name used by the Iranian government. No, Persian is the name used by the Iranian government. I assume he does not differentiate between the language he is speaking. I assume he is talking about the fact that in Iran everyone says faarsi. Someone mailed me the other day about the same issue, after /me explaining to him, he confessed that he never knew that Farsi and Persian are the same word in two different languages. I assume he's yet another American Born Confused Iranian (ABCI). -- Official Flamer Bejan Baran Just curious: Is your name Sam or Bejan? Your signature is contradicting your From: line. Yet another proof for my claim above. roozbeh ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
Le Monde diplomatique this time
Mr Connie Genius, Got some juice for you. Please go for this one: http://ir.mondediplo.com/article208.html Mr Joe Dumb ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
Re: Trick or Treat!!
On Sun, 2 Nov 2003, Behnam wrote: Behdad, First of all: There are two Behnam's on this list interested in font issues! Not to mention many more people with names starting or ending with beh! (like Connie for example !!) That Connie case is an exception (do they say beh beh instead of bah bah in Ghazvini?). Well, here is the problem, as Behnam Esfahbod mentioned earlier, the isolated letters (those that do not join to the left or right letters) and Persian YE and KE are those that are drawn with the small (bitmap?) font. And here is my explanation of the cause of the problem (just guessing from the symptoms, but pretty sure that's it): First, the correct font (big one) do not have glyphs for Persian Ye and Ke letters. And second one should be in the engine: The isolated glyphs are shared between Arabic block (0600) and Arabic Presentation Forms B (FB00) in the font, and Mozilla and any other Arabic shaping engine maps the isolated letters to the Forms B block, but the rendering engine refuses to draw them, as its simply using the glyph for the 0600 codepoint. It should be pretty simple to hack a workaround in the Mozilla codebase. Send me an iBook and I will do that in a week. I guess you got it right. I don't understand the programming part but I'm familiar with Arabic Presentation Forms. Let's hope Panther did the needed work. It's more practical than sending you an iBook. Besides, I have a desktop computer! I guess using a bitmap font instead solves the issue, as bitmap fonts usually do not share glyphs. A friend of mine in Italy has Panther installed and he told me that everything on his browser is now appearing normal with the exception of dotted Yeh, which I don't think is related to the same issue. That's from the page itself. Thanks, Behnam Joe, PS. Doesn't feel quite bad when you sign your emails with Joe, AND people see that you are not so dumb! ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
Re: Font Problem (fwd)
IANAWXPE, but give fonts at http://www.farsiweb.info/font/parsa.zip a try. (Afterall it's the FarsiWeb list...) behdad On Thu, 23 Oct 2003, Payam Poursaied wrote: Hi Having installed one of latest critical updates for XP ( don't know exactly which one) my persian fonts aren't accessible anymore. and when try to install them I received damaged font file message. nazanin is one of these fonts. looking through newsgroups I found that someone in other countries get in same trouble. I have heared that incompatibility with unicode in such fonts cause these problem. have anyone more experience or information about this issue? -payam ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
Re: Font Problem (fwd)
On Thu, 23 Oct 2003, C Bobroff wrote: I have heared that incompatibility with unicode in such fonts cause these problem. Payam, I don't think it's related to incompatibility with unicode. I have XP and after all the critical updates all my Persian fonts are working fine. Hopefully you can just download and install the fonts again. You goofed Connie. Forgot that there are zillions of different versions of those fonts? -Connie behdad, who is going to study after finishing this mail. ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
Re: [farsi] Re: SOLVED: Button translation
On Wed, 15 Oct 2003, Behnam Esfahbod wrote: On Wed, 15 Oct 2003, Roozbeh Pournader wrote: On Tue, 2003-10-14 at 11:04, Behdad Esfahbod wrote: Button Phrasing. Write button labels as imperative verbs, for example Save, Print. This allows users to select an action with less hesitation. An active phrase also fits best with the button's role in initiating actions, as contrasted with a more passive phrase. For example Find and Log In are better buttons than than Yes and OK. Isn't this only about *English* button labels? I think no, it's right about *buttons*. But we should translate Print... in File menu as infinitive, chaap or chaap-kardan, IMPO. Actually I hate to see chaap kardan... in a menu. What does it mean? The shortest sentence you can build up to fit that is Baraaye chaap-kardan injaa ro feshaar dahid! I prefer chaap..., as a short form for dialog-e chaap. And finally chaap kon on a buttons is the best, as it's the whole sentence, you don't need to guess the sentence! About QA that Roozbeh mentioned, it's a standard that links to dialogs are always followed by ellipsis. I like it that when you see chaap kon, you know that pressing the button would do the printing job, but you see chaap..., you know that you are going to make the final decision(TM) later. behdad, who is going to study after finishing this mail. ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
Re: [PersianComputing] Re: persian-language.org
On Mon, 6 Oct 2003, C Bobroff wrote: They *could* be instructed. Google is very bad in linguistics, specially when considering Persian. Oh? So they ARE supposed to be equal and the problem is with Google and not with those tables. I'm greatly relieved! Next question: Why hasn't Google been instructed? How can we give it a refresher course in linguistics? They don't have computational linguistics for any language other than English AFAIK. So, I do not recommend trying that. Really, you'd better use both :(( You are cruel! -Connie behdad, which is going to study after finishing this mail. ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
Re: Translation
On Sat, 4 Oct 2003, Roozbeh Pournader wrote: On Sat, 2003-10-04 at 11:05, Behdad Esfahbod wrote: [snip my .02] So you mean ghaltak means abzaar-e ghalt-zadan?? I'm sorry, but language is not that exact, neither I am an expert in these. ghaltak means abzaar-e ghalt-zan. neshaanak may mean abzaar-e neshaan-zan (not exactly, yes). Also, these suffixes do not exactly bring a meaning with themselves, contrary to what we've been learning in high school. The -ak in sorkhak and zardak is just a suffix that creates a noun out of an adjective. In ghaltak and probably kaardak, it just makes a tool out of something else. Just don't try to be productive in the old sense, trying to assign exact meanings to each postfix and prefix. Well, you're probably right, but then the suffixes are going to lose all their meaning as a suffix. After a while there would be no common sense between words ending with ak... (and yes, there would be no suffix, some new words). [snip again] Unfortunately I'm loosing my last hopes on them. I can't fight for all these silly funny words (just a few of them are quoted): * database - daadegaan The relationship of base and -gaan is existing, I guess -gaan should have been a widely used postfix in Pahlavi. paadegaan? -gaan is not anything special, it's just aan for plural, joined to a word ending with hah-e naamalfooz. Just like saadegaan. So it means datas. But again AFAIK data and daade are both plurals. Don't know about paadegaan. * ftp - ghaap That's an abbreviation: FTP = gharaardaad-e enteghaal-e parvande: gheyn, alef, pe. If you have problems with abbreviations, don't use them. And write gharaardaad-e enteghaal-e parvande everywhere? I like Omid Milani's transliteration for HTML as echtemel, and XML as iksemel (I prefe eksemel myself though). * redo - az no This is the translation of the Redo menu, not the action of redo-ing. I agree that it's not that good, but I've not seen many good ones. Your suggestion? az no reminds me of reset in forms. dobaare and tekraar may have the same meaning as az no, but do it better, again IMHO. * scroll - navardidan! The problem? Your suggestion? navardidan is completely another word, isn't? It do not hold the feeling of rolling in a single direction, and it contains a sense of a challenge, that cannot be ignored. My suggestion? Good question. And their inconsistencies: * interface - vaaset, miaanaa * Graphical User Interface - miaanaa-ye ... (miana is the second choice for interface) There is still a debate going on over that. vaaset was already approved for a term in the Electricity Word-Choosing Group, but the Computer group wanted miaanaa. That is not finalized, so they are listing both candidates for feedback. vaaset is so common. The problem should be kind of Arabic vs Ferdowsi. ;) * output (device) - khorooji (Isn't khorooji also a noun in Persian?) It's *only* a noun in Persian, as far as I can tell. I'm not getting what you mean. Would you explain? From what I get, is that they are translating the output of a program as boroon-daad, but an output device as dastgaah-e khorooji. Exactly. They never bothered themselves to identify nouns and verbs in their list. They do, in the final published list. They are assuming it's evident from the translation. But in this certain case, I agree that they have not translated output in the verb sense. The problem is that, they are misusing their power to decide for the language! You and I could have been decide on many technicall matters, and spread it all around the world by coding that here and there. But we have never done that so to decide for others. Better the propose words and wait some 5 or 10 years, and decide if that can be settled. rayane is setteled down. But the way they do it, they force many bodies to follow their word. roozbeh behdad ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
Re: Translation
On Sat, 4 Oct 2003, Skip Tavakkolian wrote: vaaset is so common. The problem should be kind of Arabic vs Ferdowsi. ;) I find this discussion very educational. Isn't this problem easier to handle in Arabic than in Farsi? From my limited knowledge of Arabic, it seem that, because Arabic's diction and vocabulary are in harmony with its grammar, inventing new words are a matter of straight forward application of existing rules; that is also exactly the reason why it is hard in Farsi. Exactly, and that's why I don't like these using suffixes for any random meaning. ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
Re: Translation
Hi, You know that the 'book' in 'bookmark' is refering to the book/n/, not book/v/. The original word bookmark/v/ is kind of tricky, as it's not listed in dictionaries, and is a invented to be used in browsers. BTW, the standard Persian translation for bookmark/n/ is choob-alef. It may seem weird, but better we stick with it and spread it around, instead of replacing with a new word. I remember the word was there back in early 90s in Persian MS Windows 3.1s. And perhaps bookmark/v/ can be translated as choob-alef gozaashtan or literally choob-alef gozaardan. behdad On Fri, 3 Oct 2003, Ali A Khanban wrote: It seems to me something like sabt-e neshaani for bookmark is more relevant, if we look at the meaning and also think of book as register. So for bookmark this page we may say neshaani-ye in safhe raa sabt konid. -ali- Skip Tavakkolian wrote: Does any one knows a translation forBOOKMARK orBOOKMARK THIS PAGE in Persian? neshaane safheh or neshaane ketab? I don't know if such a phrase is actually in common use. Reminds me of my highschool physics teacher trying to explain where the word shaar (a replacement for flux) came from. After thinking about it, he said, it comes from Farsie be pedar o madar. ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
Re: [PersianComputing] RE: [farsiweb] New keyboard layout for Windows
On Thu, 12 Jun 2003, Roozbeh Pournader wrote: On Thu, 12 Jun 2003, Linguasoft wrote: For comparison, European keyboards or the US-International keyboard also do not include standalone versions of all accents, and use many keys (accent keys and others) with a deadkey function to generate accented characters. Remember that accents are different from HARAKATs. An A character with caron is quite different from A, so when you push backspace after the combination, you wish that the A with the caron is deleted. But when you put a FATHE after a SHIN, they are two different characters, and SHIN is the same in both a single SHIN, and a SHIN with FATHE above. When pushing backspace, you expect that the FATHE is deleted, but not the SHEEN... Just for the record, I oppose any deadkey mechanism for any Arabic script keyboard layout. The notion is rather complicated, and is only familiar to the Europeans. Asian people are used to live keys instead, the ones that appear after the letter. roozbeh -- Behdad Esfahbod 24 Khordad 1382, 2003 Jun 14 http://behdad.org/ [Finger for Geek Code] In the corner of the dream was the man with the blue guitar It had no strings but the music touched the stars ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
[farsiweb]Re: [PersianComputing] FarsiMozilla Announcement
Dear Mohsen, Despite all respect I consider for you and your work on Mozilla, I believe that you are too over-announcing a really early stage piece of work. I have recieved your mail at least five times in past two days. As you know we have discussed a lot that every list has its own goal and its own members, so please post to the right list, and don't crosspost. If someone has not subscribed to the related lists, may it be that she doesn't want to hear about some stuff. BTW, I'm writing this because I feel I have enough permissions to nag in the farsiweb and persiancomputing lists. Yours, behdad On Wed, 20 Nov 2002, Mohsen Sajjadi wrote: Dear Reader You can find langpacks for Farsi Mozilla, currently at verion 0.52beta for Mozilla 1.1 and soon to release for mozilla 1.2b, at: http://persianmozilla.sourceforge.net/ or if u r in a hurry gotohttp://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/persianmozilla/fa-IR1.1-0.52beta.xpi?download Could people using linux test this on linux and give me their feedback. thnx Mohsen -- Behdad Esfahbod 30 Aban 1381, 2002 Nov 21 http://behdad.org/ [Finger for Geek Code] #define is_persian_leap(y) y)-474)%2820+2820)%2820*31%12831) ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
Re: [farsiweb]Solution for some sorting problems
Hi, Nice idea, this is the same as what I'm going to implement for postgresql, BTW, does it support PE, CHE, ... too? On Mon, 24 Jun 2002, Hamidreza Younesy Aghdam wrote: Hi, Fortunately I found some kind of solution for the sorting problem, just after sending the mail. I was mixied with this problem for more than a week, but i don't know why I must find the answer after sending the question (beleive me)! May be some kind of holy spirit on this mailing list ;) As I had talked personaly to some of the friends in this list before and we didn't find a reasonable solution, I hope this may be useful for some of you: 1. create a userdefined function: CREATE FUNCTION CorrectSort (@field char(100)) RETURNS char(100) AS BEGIN RETURN REPLACE(REPLACE((REPLACE(REPLACE(@field, 'Heh','$' ),'Waw','Heh')),'$','Waw'),'Keheh','Kaf') END use the exact farsi characted instead of the Heh, Waw, Keheh, Kaf. use any dummy char instead of $) then use this function in the order by clase: SELECT * FROM Personal ORDER BY CorrectSort(Lastname), CorrectSort(Firstname) BTW, I am still looking for some solution for substituting the Keheh with Kaf on data entry. = ../--/| /--/|... ./ /_// / /.. // /amidreza Younesy Aghdam .../ ___ / / Emails : [EMAIL PROTECTED] ../ /|_/ / / [EMAIL PROTECTED] ./__/ //__/ /omepage:http://ce.sharif.edu/~younesy .|__|/ |__|/... __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb -- Behdad Esfahbod 4 Tir 1381, 2002 Jun 25 http://behdad.org/ [Finger for Geek Code] Debug is human, de-fix divine. ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
[farsiweb] Fonts (Specially Design or otherwise) that contain the completeNames of Allah(swt) (fwd)
-- Forwarded message -- Date: Mon, 8 Apr 2002 13:39:00 -0700 (PDT) From: muslim mahmood [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Fonts (Specially Design or otherwise) that contain the complete Names of Allah(swt) Peace to all, I'm looking for fonts that contains the 99 Names of Allah (swt), now getting to 2yrs. Help! Anyone with a solution or has discovered the mine? Thanks and peace, Muslim __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ___ General mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.arabeyes.org/mailman/listinfo/general ___ FarsiWeb mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.sharif.edu/mailman/listinfo/farsiweb
