I just want to know: why nasal?
:-)
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Jon S. Berndt wrote:
I just want to know: why nasal?
Like I said. I don't have a clue.
Andy
nasal ... Sounds like it might have something to do with the space program
... ;-)
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Did I overlook something, do I miss some relevant information ?
Thanks,
Martin.
Hi, Martin:
I'm pretty busy at the moment doing some rewriting of the JSBSim propulsion
systems, but I will refer you at the moment to a set of notes I wrote for
our gear model. I have not revisited the
If there were no winds at all, that might help. Otherwise, it doesn't work
at all.
Jon
Let me expand on that. If you do come to a stop, and there are no winds at
the moment, then the winds come up after you have stopped, then having
reduced the forces as your velocity goes to zero, you won't
David M. wrote:
Unfortunately, not -- when the JSBSim and YASim aircraft are rolling,
they are still far too much affected by the wind. In real life, even
with 30 kt gusts, you can usually taxi a 172 or Cherokee around as if
it were a car. Personally, I do set the controls appropriately
It's the ground reaction code. :)
JSBSim and YASim do things pretty much the same way, using a
coefficient of friction for gear as they slide over the ground. This
integration works fine for a moving aircraft, but it's really not
right for a stopped one. An aircraft with exactly zero speed
I like the idea of just having some sort of overide FDM when stationary.
We can model surface conditions later including water landings
for floatplanes and snow landings for aircraft with skis.
I have some design docs for floatplanes such as the older 1940's era
Clipper style of aircraft and I
I have some design docs for floatplanes such as the older 1940's era
Clipper style of aircraft and I am wanting in the worst way to model one
of those just for nostalgia - they were fascinating planes, and I
believe a
well modeled aircraft would add a lot to FlightGear. Imagine a nice flight
-Original Message-From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of
NickSent: Saturday, November 15, 2003 2:39 PMTo:
FlightGear developers discussionsSubject: Re: [Flightgear-devel]
Airport vehicle (driving) sim
Good afternoon again.
I just remembered
FlightGear would need several changes in various areas to support
things like water landings.
Not really. The FDM would initially assume that you were going to land on
water. The ground reactions would be the same no matter what kind of
terrain you were on. This could prove interesting,
Yes I would prefer an ac+fdm+autopilot solution strictly
for realism purposes -- but anything that instances planes controled by
FG needs to be hooked into my network code so that ac status updates can
be made visible to all other participants. AIPlane
definitly meets some of my needs
The only reason I'm not done with the fly together code is I'm packing
to
move from Kentucky to Texas this weekend
Good move. :-) ;-)
Where in Texas?
Jon
(Houston)
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I wanted to see what the aircraft looks like when there is a wind - for gear
debugging. What are the keyboard commands I will need in viewing my aircraft
from a nearby location or aircraft?
Jon
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I would propose that the server be structured so that a purely
civilian/non-combat version could be run. I don't want it to be
possible for some idiot to come and blow me out of the sky when I'm
practicing ILS approaches in my C172 at my local airport.
I guess there ought to be an explicit
John Barrett writes:
Would a --no-combat option on the server be acceptable ??
(i.e. someone can pull the trigger, but it wont do anything to the
multiplayer world -- they could still use you for a target, but
you would
never see the ordinance)
That sounds reasonable. I would add
use?
Thanks (and welcome)!
Jon Berndt
Coordinator,
JSBSim Project (a Flight Dynamics Model used in FlightGear)
www.jsbsim.org
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At full throttle and a 1500 fpm decent it wouldn't go over 140
knots. In real life it would hit VNE very quickly.
Is that true? I've never taken a 172 that fast in real life, but they
are very draggy. In fact, when someone in a slick gets into a spiral,
one of the recommended emergency
Do A/C like the F16 and T38 have a yaw damper system.
The F-16 FCS has a LOT of things, including gun firing compensation!
Jon
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I just built 0.9.3 and downloaded the 0.9.3 base package. The
T-38 pulled
left until I reset *both* the surface winds and the 500-foot
winds to zero.
Now it goes straight as an arrow.
So, this says there is a problem with winds as added to JSBSim aero?
Jon
Please don't get me wrong in that I'm criticising the YASim engine model.
The YASim solver makes it possible for me to make aircraft and I love it,
but after trying to do a few YASim fdms I've come to the conclusion that
there's a lot more to modelling the propulsion system than at first meets
I do have the lookup tables for horizontal tail deflection at different
alpha and beta angles. Would that mean I can add them and use them like
the other surfaces?
Erik
I would think so. Here's the deal. I can't remember offhand exactly how the
F-16 DFlCS moves and mixes the roll command to
Interesting ... and if you go out 2 days earlier, you could also see
this:
http://www.nellisairshow.com/
Curt.
It must be the season:
http://www.wingsoverhouston.com/
Jon
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I'm
not sure if this is helpful at all, but have a look here (read
carefully):
http://www.u-dynamics.com/aerosim/default.htm
Jon
-Original Message-From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of
NickSent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 6:53 PMTo:
That's good. Maybe a more generic Historical category would be
useful?
Don't all of our aircraft fit into that category?
:-)
Jon
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I think he just used JSBSim to figure out how to write his own EOM. Not
sure, though.
Martin Spott wrote:
When he uses parts of JSBSim, then I assume the license is
compatible with
the GPL. This means, it should be possible to use DFM data,
aircraft models,
textures and probably scenery
Did I mention this link yet?
http://www.web-discovery.net/
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Just updated fgfs from CVS and rebuilt. GOt this:
g++ -o test-up.exe test-up.o -lsgmath -lsgdebug -lplibsg -lplibul
/usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-cygwin/3.2/../../../../i686-pc-cygwin/bin/ld:
cannot find -lsgmath
collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
make[1]: *** [test-up.exe] Error 1
make[1]:
I noticed this evening after getting fgfs rebuilt again and the new scenery
installed that an old problem seems to have snuck in again. When flying
around and using the mouse to change the view (looking about the airplane),
I noticed that when one clicks out of that mode, the view does not return
A left click will automagically return you to the 'forward view'
I thought I had tried everything imaginable: left click, right click, middle
click, double click. I guess I didn't get the right one (or rather, the left
one). I still dislike this feature, never liked it, never will. I think
it's
Don't forget that a couple months ago we needed to move the location
of the FlightGear base package CVS. The old site might still exist
(John?) but it is not being updated. If you suspect you might be
pointing to the old repository (rockfish.net), then you should go to
the FlightGear web
OK. According to this page,
http://www.flightgear.org/cvsResources/anoncvs.html in step 4, the data
(base package) is back at flightgear.org ??
Jon
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Jon Berndt
Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2003 10:09 PM
Jon Berndt writes:
OK. According to this page,
http://www.flightgear.org/cvsResources/anoncvs.html in step 4, the data
(base package) is back at flightgear.org ??
Affirmative.
Curt.
The instructions (step 3 and step 4) are the same for the base package and
the source code !?!?
What
The instructions (step 3 and step 4) are the same for the base package and
the source code !?!?
What if you just want to update one of them? This seems confusing at best
and wrong at worst. Some clarification should be given in the
directions, in any case, as to why this is.
Oops.
I see
By the way, this still works:
cvs -d :pserver:[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/var/cvs/FlightGear-0.9 co
source
Now if this is the right way:
cvs -d :pserver:[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/var/cvs/FlightGear-0.9 co
source
should both work??
Jon
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Crap. I KNEW I was going to do that. Sorry. COrrected below:
By the way, this still works:
cvs -d :pserver:[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/var/cvs/FlightGear-0.9 co
FlightGear
(or perhaps it was lower case)
Now if this is the right way:
cvs -d :pserver:[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/var/cvs/FlightGear-0.9 co
source
I have rewritten the flightgear code that used metakit and have
removed all traces of metakit from simgear and will probably have done
the same in the flightgear tree by the time most people read this.
That will make things a lot easier for my do-everything script I use under
CygWin. I
My question is: do I have to rotate the model in blender so that both
nose and main gear are on the same level, or will jsbsim place the 3d
model inside fgfs such that both nose and main gear will have ground
contact ? Of course given the correct numbers in the UNDERCARRIAGE
section (ie.
I think that my long-held [EMAIL PROTECTED] address will have to be
euthanised. It has been getting many tens of thousands of messages a
Yeah, it's pretty bad. Microsoft ought to be completely embarrassed. For
those of you whose ISPs provide a filtering service I'd advise taking it. I
pay
Outlook is actually a more capable version of Outlook Express (thus the name
Express). I use Outlook. I haven't had any problems with it. I just don't
open the wrong kinds of attachments. Problem solved. Also, I use the
filtering service my ISP makes available.
Jon
-Original Message-
When Grand Slam was dropped the fuselage 'jumped' upwards quite
radically.
What's Grand Slam?
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Kind of hard to help you unless you at least
give us some error messages :-)
Oops. Yes, the error is in fact different. It's confusing me. I just had a
good build of simgear, too. The wierd thing (to me) in the messages below is
this especially:
cannot find -lsgmat h
What's
It *appears* that g++ isn't searching /usr/local/lib automatically for
libraries. You might want to try configuring FlightGear with
something like:
LDFLAGS=-L/usr/local/lib ./configure
That's a can of worms where differnet people think different things
about /usr/local and it cause
If I include the change you suggest, will that stop the build process from
trying to use the wrong version of opengl?
Jon
It didn't seem to help.
Jon
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curt:
Have you done this, yet? I still can't build from a CVS checkout?
Norman, GL/glut.h seems more proper than GL/glut.h so I will make
the change in the configure.ac files.
Thanks for catching this,
Curt.
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Still can't get through the build process with Flightgear. SimGear built,
and I do have the library in question (libsgmath.a) in /usr/local/lib), but
I still get this:
Making all in tests
make[1]: Entering directory `/home/Jon/src/FlightGear/tests'
g++ -o test-up.exe test-up.o -lsgmath
cannot find -lsgmat h
What's that?
Never mind this. It was my copy/paste job. I'm braindead today.
Jon
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Wait. I forgot to update SimGear.
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Jon Berndt
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2003 11:12 PM
To: FlightGear developers discussions
Subject: RE: [Flightgear-devel] Build problems
curt:
Have you done
Somehow I managed to build flightgear and end up with a 42 MB executable.
Now, change the name of the thread to Run Problems ;-)
I run, and get this:
Base package check failed ... Found version 0.9.1 at: /home/Jon/FlightGear
Please upgrade to version: 0.9.2
I know I've seen this before, but
Now I am getting this when trying to build the latest simgear from CVS:
Making all in clouds3d
make[5]: Entering directory
`/home/Jon/src/SimGear/simgear/scene/sky/clouds3d'
if
cc -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I. -I../../../../simgear -I../../../.. -I/usr/X11R6
/include -D_REENTRANT -MT extgl.o -MD -MP
I've tried building the latest flightgear from CVS. I've updated to the
latest version both plib and simgear and they build. However, when trying
to build flightgear I get an error right away when trying to build the
applications in test:
===
--- START ---
===
Making
What happened in your case was that a function was declared in the
system OpenGL headers *and* in the extgl headers.
Erik
Is there something I am doing wrong in my build process, do I need to change
anything? Or is there a fix in CVS?
Jon
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Norman, I think I've got the ARB_multitexture stuff worked out quite
well right now and I think we can do without the extgl.* files by adding
a few lines to SimGear/simgear/screen/texture.hxx
Would you be willing to check that out and create a patch fro that?
extgl has proven to be a
Can anyone tell me what the confstatX directories I keep getting in my
build directories is?
Jon
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: [Flightgear-devel] Build problems
Jon Berndt writes:
I've tried building the latest flightgear from CVS. I've updated to the
latest version both plib and simgear and they build. However,
when trying
to build flightgear I get an error right away when trying to build the
applications
Why? This doesn't seem right to me? Is there some basis in reality
for this change?
What does seem right to you?
Surely not the way it was before ...
Erik
Are there some before and after shots? Just curious.
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I've downloaded the latest fgfs, plib, and simgear, and as usual I need to
install the latest metakit - which I did. However, the simgear build process
doesn't seem to know it exists. I get this when building simgear:
checking for mk4.h... yes
checking for metakit 2.4.3 or newer... wrong
http://www.msnbc.com/news/946048.asp?0cv=CB10
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I'm no 3d modeling expert, but I have yet to see any 3d modeler with a
comprehensible gui. 3d modeling is a very complex process and so the
gui's are also necessarily complex. But with most of them, you can be
very productive once you learn the various tricks and keyboard
accelerators, and
Hi,
Andrei has kindly offered to do a bit of web page redesign for the
FlightGear project. The included message has a link to his proposed
changes for the front page. What do people think? The sample is up
at geocities so ignore the advertising; that of course is not part of
the
Speaking of 747's, has anyone made a JSBSim 747 FDM, yet? I've got some
data. If nobody has, I might give that a shot this evening. IT would at
least be a start.
Jon
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I've got that data, I think. Roskam got it from somewhere else. A lot of
his numbers came from an oft-cited NASA tech note that featured several
aircraft. I'd copy it, but it's huge.
Anyhow, for those guys that have made JSBSim models lately, do we have a
turbine for it?
From Roskam:
Wt=
Anyone running FG on XBox/linux yet?
http://xbox-linux.sourceforge.net/index.php
Dave
Hilarious. I wonder if MS saw that coming.
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For those of us using FlightGear to supplement our training for a
PPL, a Cessna
152 would be a great benefit... Not quite the 747 complexity,
but maybe a good
starting point... ;)
Just a very quick off-the-top-of-my-head question: could we get a decent
approximation of a C-152 by using the
There is a very complete paper on the Schweizer here:
www.dfrc.nasa.gov/DTRS/1990/PDF/H-1563.pdf
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of David Culp
Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2003 9:04 PM
To: flightgear-devel
Subject: [Flightgear-devel] newer
What do you think we do now? Fair Use is now Fair paymelicencefees Use.
g.
http://www.airrace.org/raceCourse.php
http://tinyurl.com/g5io
Jon
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It seems we could invent a competitive flying or even
dogfighting game that
didn't involve guns and actually shooting down aircraft.
Aerial Paintball.
:-)
..getting hit should _hurt_, change the colors and add a
ton to the weight? ;-)
:-)
I know (and can appreciate) that
Well, it was a nice thought while it lasted - developing a
plug-in for air
racing fans out there to go online and have a virtual air race on a
virtual Reno course. It's sad that I have to bring you the bad news but
things are sometimes just what they are - the Reno/Stead facility
as well as
Jim wrote:
Before we get too worked up about this... It has absolutely
nothing to do with modeling the aircraft. It is only a reference
point for positioning the 3D model in the scene. All the nose is,
sans pitot tubes and other items that are not centered, is a
location easy to identify
It seems we could invent a competitive flying or even
dogfighting game that
didn't involve guns and actually shooting down aircraft.
Aerial Paintball.
:-)
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Jim:
Do we still have an issue with aa hard reference point between the 3D model
and the FDMs?
I've been thinking about this some more, and I think we might be able to
supply the location of the 0,0,0 point in the FDM structural frame, in which
the aircraft is defined. Would this be helpful?
How do you plan to model aerodynamics with your helicopter FDM? We set up
JSBSim to allow helicopters to be modeled, but the Rotor class has not yet
been written. If that was written, it could be that JSBSim would allow
helicopters to be modeled. It all depends on how you plan to model all the
Thanks for picking up on my joke about the O'Reilly book. The biggest
problem with serious documentation right now is that so much of
FlightGear is in a state of flux: even the mini-HOWTO's I've written
fall quickly out of date. I'm not saying that we shouldn't document,
but anyone working
As for myself I would be very nervous using any altitude control system
that didn't return elevator trim to 'neutral'(1) on disengagment because
as you say it is a potential killer
Tony wrote:
Whose to say that neutral trim is better? And aside from that, there
really is no such thing
In real life, changing the trim actually causes the elevator or
stabilator to move -- our summing up of the two is simply a kludge.
David
I have a hunch that modeling the trim tab effects on the elevator and the
resulting movement, etc. would be a worse kludge.
Jon
As an interim solution, here is a turbine module that no longer checks if
there is any fuel in the tanks. This turbine is always on, regardless of
fuel state. The module goes in FlightGear-0.9.2/src/FDM/JSBSim/
http://home.attbi.com/~davidculp2/FGSimTurbine.cpp
I'll see if the JSBSim
Has anyone else been having a problem with trying to set the fuel load at
startup using property /consumables/fuel/tank[n]/level-gal_us ?
I find that sometimes I get the fuel load I want, and sometimes I get
empty
tanks. Is it just me? This might be specific to JSBSim.
Dave Culp
Dave:
These are the values from the c172p -set.xml configuration:
consumables
fuel
tank n=0
level-gal_us20/level-gal_us
/tank
tank n=1
level-gal_us20/level-gal_us
/tank
/fuel
/consumables
I believe the problem is not that it works sporadically, but that JSBSim
The way I see it, the aircraft configuration files should define the
possibilities of the aircraft and not the current state. I was under the
impression the current state was defined in the reset00 and
reset001 files?
Erik
The reset file sets the current *dynamic* state. I suppose we
http://www.aeronautica3d.com/
Aeronautica 3D.url
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I don't have a problem with it. But I think the changes need to go in en
masse, so before committing the JSBSim.?xx changes to JSBSim CVS, we need
to make sure the rest of the changes are approved to go into FlightGear
CVS.
Jon
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
The Wilson P-51D Gunfighter model has the following named parts:
name RightInnerGearCover
name LeftInnerGearCover
name CanopyRail
name ConsolePanel
name RightFrontCorner
name LeftFrontCorner
name RightGun3
name RightGun2
name RightGun1
name LeftGun3
name LeftGun2
name LeftGun1
name RightWall
name
I guess I should introduce myself; My name is Adam Renner. I
have just recently recieved my Bachelors and Masters Degrees in
Biomedical Engineering from Wright State University in Ohio. As
an engineer, I have had some programming experience, and since my
graduation I have really become
Yeah, but the windtunnel or flight-test data woudl include the
individual coefficients in one single value. This means that if there is
data for -180 ... +180 degree AOA and Yaw JSBSim (and UIUC) woudl be
more accurate compared to YASim.
That said, YASim is realy a good alternative for most
Note that JSBSim would get all of this for free simply by allowing
coefficients to be (optionally) specified for individual surfaces,
each with its own orientation. All JSBSim would have to do is sum up
the moments and forces (mostly forces) for the collection of surfaces.
I think we all
distracted by Jim's awesome 3D model, waiting for it's FDM,
Jon is busily
forming aero data from DATCOM runs ... DANG! all out of
Foster's in the
fridge - need to run to the store.
Fosters? Guess I should have used an Aussie scheme:
I'd like to nominate Jim for Employee Of The Month. :-) That's looks
awesome, Jim. Can't wait to see this and Jon's FDM model in action.
distracted by Jim's awesome 3D model, waiting for it's FDM, Jon is busily
forming aero data from DATCOM runs ... DANG! all out of Foster's in the
fridge
Has anyone ever considered implementing aircraft shadows projected on the
ground?
Jon
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I have fixed the landing gear on the shuttle model (thanks Phillip).
Here's a nice thing to try:
fgfs --aircraft=shuttle --offset-distance=8.0 --altitude=1 --pitch=-20
.0 --vc=300
The drag is way too low on this beast, now. I hope to fix this weekend.
Jon
JON S. BERNDT
Coordinator, JSBSim
How about this one: http://www.airnav.com/airport/X68
It's in FG's airport database.
That's it, I think. I found out that I didn't have that scenery, yet.
... downloading ...
Jon
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The X68 runway may be messed up. There are criss-crossing runways. The
real shuttle landing facility has only one runway.
Jon
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what command line are you using to fly to it?
Jon
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Curtis L.
Olson
Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 8:29 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [Flightgear-devel] Shuttle
Jon Berndt writes:
The X68
I did start the conversion (the easy part of it) and on closer
examination it
the model really isn't as great as I thought it was. So I've
started building
one of my own:
http://www.spiderbark.com/fgfs/p51d-01.png
Is this a mesh, or what? I'm trying out AC3D, now.
Jon
smime.p7s
Not yet. It's possible that I don't have a current email address, but
in
this case, not likely. He might just be on vacation.
I did start the conversion (the easy part of it) and on closer
examination it
the model really isn't as great as I thought it was. So I've
started building
one
I'm not sure I changed the right coefficients, though -- I'm going to
look into it more when I get the chance. The real problem might be in
the moments of inertia.
Hmm. I'm not so sure. The moments of inertia are cut and pasted from a
technical document. That's just what they are. You can't
Full tanks way out on the wingtips of a 310 must create a significant
roll moment. JSBSim will generate that moment for us, based on the
amount of fuel in the tanks; however, if the published moment
*already* assumes full wingtip tanks, then we'll get far too much
rolling.
I am 90% sure that
[Resent now I'm subscribed!!!]
Hi Jon,
You could try replacing
bcopy(pos, tag, 3);
with
bcopy(pos, tag[0], 3);
and let us know how that goes. What compiler and OS are you on -
I don't see this with gcc-3.2 on either Cygwin or Linux.
Is this your code?
How about other CygWin
Did you try the proposed fix, and did it work?
Yes, I did, and it worked great.
Here's what I am using:
$ g++ --version
2.95.3-5
Jon
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Is there a recent updated options list for FlightGear, or is
fgfs --help
going to give me all the options available?
Also, how do I get 3D clouds to work?
Jon
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If it's not too much trouble, you might ask about Mustang
Half Half that he also did. It's got the exact markings
of the P-51D I photogrpahed and incorporated into a lot of
our FlightGear and JSBSim artwork. See my airshow pictures
here:
http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsb/airshow.html
I'm getting a build error for FlightGear with the newest stuff from CVS.
Any clues?
Jon
g++ -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I. -I../../src/Include -I../.. -I../../src -c
-o transmissionlist.o `test -fcho './'`transmissionlist.cxx
transmissionlist.cxx: In method `class string
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