Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-26 Thread Alan Teeder



 Hmm - some kind of Nasal issue then? Any kind of error message?

 Vivian

No  error messages , it just stops with an Windows crash report.

The dos window is, as usual,  filled with the usual stream of annoying 
messages from traffic manager and navaids.

At the moment I am looking at the electrical nasal code, but it could turn 
out to be the result of applying power to some system or instrument. 


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-26 Thread Alan Teeder
Problem now solved !!

In Lighning-electrical.nas, line 378
if(bus_volts  114){setprop(instrumentation/radar/switch,on );}

Setting this to on crashes Flightgear on both my computers here.

I can do the same by setting the property from the Browse Internal 
Properties menu.

During my checking I have modified most of the Lightning's nasal files, 
especially the electrical file. These modifications were aimed at inserting 
missing nasal var statements.

Also I have changed the battery charge integrator time constant as it was 
using milliseconds instead of seconds, and the battery was even worse at 
holding charge than my old laptop  running down 1000 times faster than 
it should do!

Who should I post these changes to for testing and CVS commit ?

Thanks for the help.

Alan 


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-26 Thread Vivian Meazza
Alan Teeder

 
 Problem now solved !!
 
 In Lighning-electrical.nas, line 378
   if(bus_volts  114){setprop(instrumentation/radar/switch,on );}
 
 Setting this to on crashes Flightgear on both my computers here.
 
 I can do the same by setting the property from the Browse Internal
 Properties menu.
 
 During my checking I have modified most of the Lightning's nasal files,
 especially the electrical file. These modifications were aimed at
 inserting
 missing nasal var statements.
 
 Also I have changed the battery charge integrator time constant as it was
 using milliseconds instead of seconds, and the battery was even worse at
 holding charge than my old laptop  running down 1000 times faster than
 it should do!
 
 Who should I post these changes to for testing and CVS commit ?
 

I can do that for you.

Vivian



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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Alan Teeder

--
From: James Turner zakal...@mac.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 10:20 PM
To: FlightGear developers discussions 
flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs


 On 24 Mar 2010, at 22:09, Vivian Meazza wrote:

 Bad news - works perfectly here on XP with cvs as of a few minutes ago!
 Checking to see if I can break it still though.

 I was using the Lightning to test my mach-calculations code earlier today 
 (Mac, latest CVS code) and it seemed fine.

 James

James, Vivian

Thanks for the feedback. I will roll back the CVS  to see if I can find when 
this bug first started.

When the splash screen is replaced by  the cockpit view I see this error, 
repeated 5 times:

glLinkProgram  Failed
Program  infolog:
Fragment shader uses varying gl_FrontFacing but vertex shader does not write 
to it.

To get past the already mentioned debug probelm at the start of this thread 
I have tried debugging by attaching the Visual Studio debugger to an already 
running Flightgear . I now get this:

Unhandled exception at 0x3e814f0 in fgfs.exe: 0xC05: Access violation 
reading location 0x000.

When I hit the Break button the debug pointer is at line 60 in 
osg\PrimitiveSet.cpp:
else glDrawArrays(_mode,_first,_count);

I have updated Osg to the latest SVN and the error remains.

The same behaviour is on both my XP desktop and my Vista laptop.

Finally, Vivian (or anyone else) , do you have any problems running 
Flightgear under Debug from the Visual Studio IDE?

Alan 


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Alan Teeder
In my last post, I forgot to say that the Fgfs crash and debug message come 
when the engine reaches aprox 50% rpm.
Alan 


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Vivian Meazza
Alan Teeder wrote

 -Original Message-
 From: [mailto:ajtee...@v-twin.org.uk]
 Sent: 25 March 2010 09:29
 To: FlightGear developers discussions
 Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs
 
 
 --
 From: James Turner zakal...@mac.com
 Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 10:20 PM
 To: FlightGear developers discussions
 flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
 Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs
 
 
  On 24 Mar 2010, at 22:09, Vivian Meazza wrote:
 
  Bad news - works perfectly here on XP with cvs as of a few minutes ago!
  Checking to see if I can break it still though.
 
  I was using the Lightning to test my mach-calculations code earlier
 today
  (Mac, latest CVS code) and it seemed fine.
 
  James
 
 James, Vivian
 
 Thanks for the feedback. I will roll back the CVS  to see if I can find
 when
 this bug first started.
 
 When the splash screen is replaced by  the cockpit view I see this error,
 repeated 5 times:
 
 glLinkProgram  Failed
 Program  infolog:
 Fragment shader uses varying gl_FrontFacing but vertex shader does not
 write
 to it.
 
 To get past the already mentioned debug probelm at the start of this
 thread
 I have tried debugging by attaching the Visual Studio debugger to an
 already
 running Flightgear . I now get this:
 
 Unhandled exception at 0x3e814f0 in fgfs.exe: 0xC05: Access violation
 reading location 0x000.
 
 When I hit the Break button the debug pointer is at line 60 in
 osg\PrimitiveSet.cpp:
 else glDrawArrays(_mode,_first,_count);
 
 I have updated Osg to the latest SVN and the error remains.
 
 The same behaviour is on both my XP desktop and my Vista laptop.
 
 Finally, Vivian (or anyone else) , do you have any problems running
 Flightgear under Debug from the Visual Studio IDE?



 

Well - that narrows it down. Possibly a video driver issue? Or perhaps this
is as simple as FG/SG OSG not properly up-to-date.

I have seen something like this if I add the generate tag to a model
shader. generate works fine in a terrain shader. However as default you
should not be using any model shader with generate.

No problem with running FG under debug - although constructing a command
line is a pain.

Vivian 
 



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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Frederic Bouvier

- Vivian Meazza a écrit :
 I have seen something like this if I add the generate tag to a
 model shader. generate works fine in a terrain shader. 
 However as default you should not be using any model shader 
 with generate.

What ?

-Fred

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Vivian Meazza
Frederic Bouvier

 - Vivian Meazza a écrit :
  I have seen something like this if I add the generate tag to a
  model shader. generate works fine in a terrain shader.
  However as default you should not be using any model shader
  with generate.
 
 What ?

What What? 

I haven't mentioned this before because I'm still investigating..  Lauri
Peltonen also had a look and came up with an odd error which neither of us
understood properly, but there is some indication that it depends on the
order of the tags. Or it might be that my shaders are simply crap. 

Or are you querying the default shaders?


Vivian




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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Alan Teeder

--
From: Vivian Meazza vivian.mea...@lineone.net
Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 10:18 AM
To: 'FlightGear developers discussions' 
flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

 Frederic Bouvier

 - Vivian Meazza a écrit :
  I have seen something like this if I add the generate tag to a
  model shader. generate works fine in a terrain shader.
  However as default you should not be using any model shader
  with generate.

 What ?

 What What?

 I haven't mentioned this before because I'm still investigating..  Lauri
 Peltonen also had a look and came up with an odd error which neither of us
 understood properly, but there is some indication that it depends on the
 order of the tags. Or it might be that my shaders are simply crap.

 Or are you querying the default shaders?


 Vivian


At the moment I can´t roll back the CVS very far as the old version of 
SGClipGroup.hxx fails to compile with my SVN version of Osg . - 
RegisterRenderBinProxy is not a member of osgUtil

I´m not very keen to roll back Osg as it takes so long to re-build.

Alan 


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Frederic Bouvier
- Vivian Meazza a écrit :
 Frederic Bouvier
 
  - Vivian Meazza a écrit :
   I have seen something like this if I add the generate tag to a
   model shader. generate works fine in a terrain shader.
   However as default you should not be using any model shader
   with generate.
  
  What ?
 
 What What? 
 
 I haven't mentioned this before because I'm still investigating.. 
 Lauri Peltonen also had a look and came up with an odd error 
 which neither of us understood properly, but there is some 
 indication that it depends on the order of the tags. Or it 
 might be that my shaders are simply crap. 
 
 Or are you querying the default shaders?

I am just unaware of this kind of problems and it could have received
more publicity than just an anecdote in a somewhat unrelated thread.

-Fred

-- 
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Vivian Meazza
Frederic Bouvier

 
 - Vivian Meazza a écrit :
  Frederic Bouvier
 
   - Vivian Meazza a écrit :
I have seen something like this if I add the generate tag to a
model shader. generate works fine in a terrain shader.
However as default you should not be using any model shader
with generate.
  
   What ?
 
  What What?
 
  I haven't mentioned this before because I'm still investigating..
  Lauri Peltonen also had a look and came up with an odd error
  which neither of us understood properly, but there is some
  indication that it depends on the order of the tags. Or it
  might be that my shaders are simply crap.
 
  Or are you querying the default shaders?
 
 I am just unaware of this kind of problems and it could have received
 more publicity than just an anecdote in a somewhat unrelated thread.
 

No one else is reporting it therefore this is most likely my own
incompetence, and it's only in shaders that I have written myself. When I
have shown that it isn't I will file a bug report.

Vivian 



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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Alan Teeder
I have rolled CVS back to 1 Feb, except for SGClipGroup.cxx and .hxx. These 
are the current ones to match with the SVN Osg. I have not rolled back 
Flightgear data as this takes for ever.

Unfortunately  Flightgear still crashes when I open up the Lightning´s 
engines.

Perhaps the fault is within Osg.

Alan 


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Tim Moore
Alan,
What graphics hardware are you running on? Turning off shaders should get
you going for the moment. Then we'll figure out how to conditionalize the
shader code for drivers that don't support gl_FrontFacing.

Tim

On Thu, Mar 25, 2010 at 4:33 PM, Alan Teeder ajtee...@v-twin.org.uk wrote:

 I have rolled CVS back to 1 Feb, except for SGClipGroup.cxx and .hxx. These
 are the current ones to match with the SVN Osg. I have not rolled back
 Flightgear data as this takes for ever.

 Unfortunately  Flightgear still crashes when I open up the Lightning´s
 engines.

 Perhaps the fault is within Osg.

 Alan



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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Alan Teeder
Tim

I am seeing this on 2 machines.

The desktop runs XP and has an NVIDEA FX 5200 card.

The laptop runs Vista and is an Acer 5920 has Intel 965 video, with latest 
the drivers from Intel. (The Acer supplied driver had problems giving a few 
screen fulls of OpenGL errors on FG startup).

Alan

From: Tim Moore
Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 5:21 PM
To: FlightGear developers discussions
Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs


Alan,
What graphics hardware are you running on? Turning off shaders should get 
you going for the moment. Then we'll figure out how to conditionalize the 
shader code for drivers that don't support gl_FrontFacing.

Tim 


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Alan Teeder
Tim

I should have been a bit clearer in my last post I was talking about FG 
crashing when I open up the Lightning Engines.

I have tried turning off shades from the FG menu bar, but this does not come 
up until after the glFrontFacing errors so I have seen no change. This error 
seems to be present in many aircraft, not just the Lightning.

Alan


From: Tim Moore
Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 5:21 PM
To: FlightGear developers discussions
Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs


Alan,
What graphics hardware are you running on? Turning off shaders should get 
you going for the moment. Then we'll figure out how to conditionalize the 
shader code for drivers that don't support gl_FrontFacing.

Tim 


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Vivian Meazza
Alan Teeder

 Tim
 
 I should have been a bit clearer in my last post I was talking about FG
 crashing when I open up the Lightning Engines.
 
 I have tried turning off shades from the FG menu bar, but this does not
 come
 up until after the glFrontFacing errors so I have seen no change. This
 error
 seems to be present in many aircraft, not just the Lightning.
 
 Alan
 
 
 From: Tim Moore
 Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 5:21 PM
 To: FlightGear developers discussions
 Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs
 
 
 Alan,
 What graphics hardware are you running on? Turning off shaders should get
 you going for the moment. Then we'll figure out how to conditionalize the
 shader code for drivers that don't support gl_FrontFacing.
 

Unlikely, I know, but is this crash related to the afterburners? 

Vivian



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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Victhor
Yup, tested and I only get a crash if I use the afterburners, engines
can be started just fine.
 Alan Teeder
 
  Tim
  
  I should have been a bit clearer in my last post I was talking about FG
  crashing when I open up the Lightning Engines.
  
  I have tried turning off shades from the FG menu bar, but this does not
  come
  up until after the glFrontFacing errors so I have seen no change. This
  error
  seems to be present in many aircraft, not just the Lightning.
  
  Alan
  
  
  From: Tim Moore
  Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 5:21 PM
  To: FlightGear developers discussions
  Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs
  
  
  Alan,
  What graphics hardware are you running on? Turning off shaders should get
  you going for the moment. Then we'll figure out how to conditionalize the
  shader code for drivers that don't support gl_FrontFacing.
  
 
 Unlikely, I know, but is this crash related to the afterburners? 
 
 Vivian
 
 
 
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Frederic Bouvier
Vivian Meazza

- Vivian Meazza a écrit :
 Frederic Bouvier
 
  
  - Vivian Meazza a écrit :
   Frederic Bouvier
  
- Vivian Meazza a écrit :
 I have seen something like this if I add the generate tag to
 a
 model shader. generate works fine in a terrain shader.
 However as default you should not be using any model shader
 with generate.
   
What ?
  
   What What?
  
   I haven't mentioned this before because I'm still investigating..
   Lauri Peltonen also had a look and came up with an odd error
   which neither of us understood properly, but there is some
   indication that it depends on the order of the tags. Or it
   might be that my shaders are simply crap.
  
   Or are you querying the default shaders?
  
  I am just unaware of this kind of problems and it could have
 received
  more publicity than just an anecdote in a somewhat unrelated
 thread.
  
 
 No one else is reporting it therefore this is most likely my own
 incompetence, and it's only in shaders that I have written myself.
 When I have shown that it isn't I will file a bug report.

If you are not so sure there is a bug, why are you saying :

 However as default you should not be using any model shader
 with generate.

so my what ?

Good night,
-Fred

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http://www.youtube.com/user/fgfred64   Videos


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Alan Teeder
Thanks for all the responses.

I have done a lot more playing around this evening.

It seems to be to do with generator/battery/external power switching.

I can remove the problem by artificially setting a constant voltage on the 
master bus and inhibiting bus switching.

Finding out whether this is due to the electrical switching logic or to some 
related effect in one of the aircraft systems is my next step.

With the switching inhibited the afterburners seem OK.

Are any other aircraft similarly affected?

 I am using the Lightning as a template for a model that I am developing, so 
I had problems when this fault suddenly appeared in my own development. Back 
checking to the original aircraft showed that for once it wasn't my stupid 
fault!.

AFAIK the Lightning has been stable and unchanged for some time now.

Alan
--
From: Victhor victhor.fos...@gmail.com
Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:51 PM
To: FlightGear developers discussions 
flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

 Yup, tested and I only get a crash if I use the afterburners, engines
 can be started just fine.
 Alan Teeder

  Tim
 
  I should have been a bit clearer in my last post I was talking about FG
  crashing when I open up the Lightning Engines.
 
  I have tried turning off shades from the FG menu bar, but this does not
  come
  up until after the glFrontFacing errors so I have seen no change. This
  error
  seems to be present in many aircraft, not just the Lightning.
 
  Alan
 
 
  From: Tim Moore
  Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 5:21 PM
  To: FlightGear developers discussions
  Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer 
  runs
 
 
  Alan,
  What graphics hardware are you running on? Turning off shaders should 
  get
  you going for the moment. Then we'll figure out how to conditionalize 
  the
  shader code for drivers that don't support gl_FrontFacing.
 

 Unlikely, I know, but is this crash related to the afterburners?

 Vivian



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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-25 Thread Vivian Meazza
Alan Teeder

 
 Thanks for all the responses.
 
 I have done a lot more playing around this evening.
 
 It seems to be to do with generator/battery/external power switching.
 
 I can remove the problem by artificially setting a constant voltage on the
 master bus and inhibiting bus switching.
 
 Finding out whether this is due to the electrical switching logic or to
 some
 related effect in one of the aircraft systems is my next step.
 
 With the switching inhibited the afterburners seem OK.
 
 Are any other aircraft similarly affected?
 
  I am using the Lightning as a template for a model that I am developing,
 so
 I had problems when this fault suddenly appeared in my own development.
 Back
 checking to the original aircraft showed that for once it wasn't my stupid
 fault!.
 
 AFAIK the Lightning has been stable and unchanged for some time now.
 

Hmm - some kind of Nasal issue then? Any kind of error message?

Vivian



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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-24 Thread Vivian Meazza
Alan Teeder wrote

 Using latest CVS on windows .
 
 The EE Lightning  aircraft starts OK, all controls and views seem normal,
 but when the engines reach about 60% rpm  Flightgear crashes. This fault
 is
 quite new and was not here about one month ago.
 
 For many month now I have been unable to run Flightgear in debug mode as
 it
 crashes in soundmgr_openall.cxx at line 486 :-
 if ( sample-is_file() )
 free(sample_data);
 
 Erik is aware of this, but nobody else has reported this particular
 problem.
 This crash occurs before the cockpit view appears.
 
 Unfortunately this means that I can't find much about the cause of the
 crash.
 
 So far I have had a good go at the Lightning nasal files. The electrical
 system had no var statements, and one or two were missing in the others.
 All this to no avail.
 
 According to the lightning-electrical.nas file, the electrical generators
 should cut in at 58%, and this is my only clue.
 
 
 Does anyone have any clues?
 


Bad news - works perfectly here on XP with cvs as of a few minutes ago!
Checking to see if I can break it still though.

Vivian



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Re: [Flightgear-devel] English Electric Lightning no longer runs

2010-03-24 Thread James Turner

On 24 Mar 2010, at 22:09, Vivian Meazza wrote:

 Bad news - works perfectly here on XP with cvs as of a few minutes ago!
 Checking to see if I can break it still though.

I was using the Lightning to test my mach-calculations code earlier today (Mac, 
latest CVS code) and it seemed fine.

James


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