Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Warren Young]

On Aug 8, 2018, at 5:49 PM, Will Parsons  wrote:
> 
> I am
> disappointed that now I shall have to use a (expletive deleted) web
> forum to post comments...I have been using Gmane to read and post to
> both the Fossil and SQLite mailing lists.

I’ve always thought of Gmane as just another web front end for mailing list 
archives, but I now see that they allow NNTP posting.  May I then rephrase your 
complaint as “NNTP good, HTTP POST bad?”

On Gmane’s About page, we find this: "Gmane is not an unproblematic 
project…Gmane makes it much easier for spam harvesters to gather these real, 
authentic mail addresses.”  So, Gmane is part of the problems that originally 
motivated the creation of and move to Fossil forums!

> Please don't let this happen to the SQLite
> mail list also.

I believe the only question is “when,” not “whether:”

http://sqlite.1065341.n5.nabble.com/Mailing-list-shutting-down-td102466.html

This change is happening as a result of list spam problems going back to 
October 2015 at least:


http://sqlite.1065341.n5.nabble.com/Problems-with-v3-9-0-entry-point-sqlite3-finalize-could-not-be-located-tp85005p85069.html

I’ve gotten such spam here at work as recently as July 11, and our corporate 
email is handled by a mail service that’s *very* aggressive about dropping such 
emails before they even get to us.  My home email server gets a lot more of it.

I remember a time when an X Window server would allow any other computer on the 
LAN to pop up a window on your computer.  There was a program that marched an 
Energizer bunny across the bottom of all computers in the lab, with no special 
permission or background program needed on each computer to allow it.  The 
program just started sending pixels to each machine in turn, and the X server 
dutifully displayed the graphics as requested.

We don’t live in that world any more.  Spammers and other malefactors took our 
civilized Internet and ruined it for the rest of us.

Expletives indeed, but that solves nothing.  Fossil forums should be an 
effective solution to this real problem, and they give many benefits to us 
besides:

https://fossil-scm.org/index.html/doc/trunk/www/forum.wiki
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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Will Parsons]

On Wednesday,  8 Aug 2018  8:40 AM -0400, Richard Hipp wrote:
> The new "forum" feature of Fossil is now live on the self-hosting website:
>
> https://fossil-scm.org/forum
>
> The forum feature is intended as a replacement for mailing lists like
> this one. Though still very "beta", I believe in eating ones own
> dogfood, and hence I am cutting over to the forum for Fossil itself.
>
> There is a "subscribe" option on the link above where you can sign up
> for email notifications to new forum posts.  The enhance email
> notification should work just like a mailing list, with individual
> emails for each forum post containing complete post content and
> correct In-Reply-To headers.  The only major difference between the
> forum and this list is that you must go to the forum website to post
> new content.  New submissions via email are disallowed as an anti-spam
> measure.
>
> The Fossil homepage now has a link to the forum instead of a link to
> mailing list sign-up.
>
> Please discontinue use of this mailing list except as an emergency
> back-up to the forum in case the forum stops working.  If forum is not
> working, you can also send email directly to me.
>
> After we have shaken out the forum feature a little further, I will
> shut down this legacy mailing list.

I know I'm far too late to roll back a _fait accompli_, but I am
disappointed that now I shall have to use a (expletive deleted) web
forum to post comments.  Please don't let this happen to the SQLite
mail list also.  (FYI, I have been using Gmane to read and post to
both the Fossil and SQLite mailing lists.)

-- 
Will

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Re: [fossil-users] 'fossil open' and existing local 'manifest' and 'manifest.uuid' files

[Artur Shepilko]

> Maybe it should only delete these files when you say “fossil set manifest 0”?

Thanks for the info.
I also looked up where this happens in the code (manifest_to_disk() in
checkout.c 
[http://fossil-scm.org/index.html/artifact?udc=1&name=30d687f7642ce389&ln=136])

One way to get around this automatic deletion (when creating a new
repo with files already in the work directory) is to use 'fossil open
--empty' flag, though such use is somewhat non-intuitive.

I wonder if before deleting the local manifest files we should test if
the repo is freshly created and is empty (How?).
This would at least give the user a chance to decide what to do about
these manifest files and the "manifest" setting.
Otherwise the manifest files just surprisingly disappear.

BTW, I discovered this behavior while trying to populate a new repo
with the contents of a downloaded current Fossil master tarball. It
would add all files without any warnings, then it would just fail to
build due to missing 'manifest.uuid' needed to gen the VERSION.h. Yet
the 'manifest.uuid' is included in the tarball.
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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Warren Young]

On Aug 8, 2018, at 8:33 AM, Andy Bradford  wrote:
> 
> Thus said Richard Hipp on Wed, 08 Aug 2018 08:40:37 -0400:
> 
>> New submissions via email are disallowed as an anti-spam
>> measure.
> 
> Will this ever be enabled? I prefer email over web forum posting.

How would you prevent spammers from using an email submission mechanism?  

Security through obscurity won’t work.  I’ve got an email address that got onto 
the spamners' lists despite only ever being published in a short-run book 
distributed to about 50 people.

If we don’t solve that problem first, we’ll be right back in much the same mess 
as today.

Moderation doesn’t help.  Someone could weed the current mailing list archives, 
too.  What we want is to bar such things at the gates.

> I personally prefer reading archives via:
> 
> https://marc.info/?l=fossil-users
> https://marc.info/?l=fossil-dev

Is that just about features?  What features do you find essential in the 
current mailing list archive services over what’s currently presented at 
fossil-scm.org/forum ?

Keep in mind that Fossil Forums gives us a lot of features we don’t get from 
third-party mail archive / gateway services:

http://fossil-scm.org/index.html/doc/trunk/www/forum.wiki
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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Joseph R. Justice]

On Wed, Aug 8, 2018, 10:31 AM Petr Man  wrote:

I registered in the forum and the password manager didn't save my
> password. I don't see any way of resetting it.
>

I have the same problem.  : - (.

Username JayAreJay with the email address I am mailing from here.



Joseph
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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Andy Bradford]

Thus said Richard Hipp on Wed, 08 Aug 2018 08:40:37 -0400:

> New submissions via email are disallowed as an anti-spam
> measure.

Will this ever be enabled? I prefer email over web forum posting.

Also, would it  be a good idea  to subscribe some of  the mail archiving
addresses for continuity?

I personally prefer reading archives via:

https://marc.info/?l=fossil-users
https://marc.info/?l=fossil-dev

Thanks,

Andy
-- 
TAI64 timestamp: 40005b6aff59


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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Petr Man]

Hello Richard,

I registered in the forum and the password manager didn't save my
password. I don't see any way of resetting it.

Best,
Petr
On Wed, Aug 8, 2018 at 2:40 PM Richard Hipp  wrote:
>
> The new "forum" feature of Fossil is now live on the self-hosting website:
>
> https://fossil-scm.org/forum
>
> The forum feature is intended as a replacement for mailing lists like
> this one. Though still very "beta", I believe in eating ones own
> dogfood, and hence I am cutting over to the forum for Fossil itself.
>
> There is a "subscribe" option on the link above where you can sign up
> for email notifications to new forum posts.  The enhance email
> notification should work just like a mailing list, with individual
> emails for each forum post containing complete post content and
> correct In-Reply-To headers.  The only major difference between the
> forum and this list is that you must go to the forum website to post
> new content.  New submissions via email are disallowed as an anti-spam
> measure.
>
> The Fossil homepage now has a link to the forum instead of a link to
> mailing list sign-up.
>
> Please discontinue use of this mailing list except as an emergency
> back-up to the forum in case the forum stops working.  If forum is not
> working, you can also send email directly to me.
>
> After we have shaken out the forum feature a little further, I will
> shut down this legacy mailing list.
>
> --
> D. Richard Hipp
> d...@sqlite.org
> ___
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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Philip Bennefall]

Thanks, I am getting forum emails just fine now. What I am wondering is, 
what do I miss if I don't have a user account? I wanted to subscribe as 
a named user "philip_bennefall".



I also have a small suggestion about forum email notifications. In the 
From header, it only lists the email address so you cannot see who 
wrote the post simply by looking at the From name. The From header and 
the subject line is the only information I see in my email client inbox 
view so I have to open each message in order to figure out who wrote it. 
Normally I make a snap judgement as to whether I will read a message in 
a given thread based on the poster, so it would be great if the From 
header could say something like:



"username via Fossil forum"


Or something similar. Just a thought.


Thanks,


Philip


On 8/8/2018 3:10 PM, Richard Hipp wrote:

On 8/8/18, Philip Bennefall  wrote:

I am still getting stuck on the registration screen due to the captcha.
What parts do I miss if I don't have an account for now?

I have added you as a verify subscriber.  You should be getting forum
notifications now, without the need to fill in the captcha.



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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Gour]

On Wed, 8 Aug 2018 08:40:37 -0400
Richard Hipp  wrote:

> Please discontinue use of this mailing list except as an emergency
> back-up to the forum in case the forum stops working.  

What about devel list?


Sincerely,
Gour

-- 
Abandoning all attachment to the results of his activities,
ever satisfied and independent, he performs no fruitive action,
although engaged in all kinds of undertakings.


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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Stéphane Aulery]

Hello,

Le 08/08/2018 14:40, Richard Hipp a écrit :
The new "forum" feature of Fossil is now live on the self-hosting 
website:


https://fossil-scm.org/forum

The forum feature is intended as a replacement for mailing lists like
this one. Though still very "beta", I believe in eating ones own
dogfood, and hence I am cutting over to the forum for Fossil itself.

The Fossil homepage now has a link to the forum instead of a link to
mailing list sign-up.

Please discontinue use of this mailing list except as an emergency
back-up to the forum in case the forum stops working.  If forum is not
working, you can also send email directly to me.


Will you import list archives in fossil forum?

Regards,

--
Stéphane Aulery
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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Pietro Cerutti]

On Aug 08 2018, 13:01 UTC, Richard Hipp  wrote:

On 8/8/18, joerg van den hoff  wrote:



On 08.08.18 14:40 , Richard Hipp wrote:

Please discontinue use of this mailing list except as an emergency
back-up to the forum in case the forum stops working.  If forum is not
working, you can also send email directly to me.



well no luck here. this:

An email has been sent to "veedeeh...@gmail.com". That email contains a
hyperlink that you must
click on in order to activate your subscription.

simply has not happened so far (>5-10 minutes since subscribe).



Check your spam folder?


It would help (my spam filter to correctly tag them as not-spam) if 
emails sent by the forum would have a Mime-Version: 1.0 header and the 
charset=us-ascii (or whatever charset a particular post has) parameter 
of the Content-Type: text/plain header.


By the way: is charset assumed to be us-ascii? I don't see the body of a 
forum post being converted anywhere in forum.c.


--
Pietro Cerutti


signature.asc
Description: PGP signature
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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Richard Hipp]

On 8/8/18, Philip Bennefall  wrote:
>
> I am still getting stuck on the registration screen due to the captcha.
> What parts do I miss if I don't have an account for now?

I have added you as a verify subscriber.  You should be getting forum
notifications now, without the need to fill in the captcha.

-- 
D. Richard Hipp
d...@sqlite.org
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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Richard Hipp]

On 8/8/18, joerg van den hoff  wrote:
>
>
> On 08.08.18 14:40 , Richard Hipp wrote:
>> Please discontinue use of this mailing list except as an emergency
>> back-up to the forum in case the forum stops working.  If forum is not
>> working, you can also send email directly to me.
>
>
> well no luck here. this:
>
> An email has been sent to "veedeeh...@gmail.com". That email contains a
> hyperlink that you must
> click on in order to activate your subscription.
>
> simply has not happened so far (>5-10 minutes since subscribe).
>

Check your spam folder?

-- 
D. Richard Hipp
d...@sqlite.org
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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[joerg van den hoff]

On 08.08.18 14:40 , Richard Hipp wrote:

Please discontinue use of this mailing list except as an emergency
back-up to the forum in case the forum stops working.  If forum is not
working, you can also send email directly to me.



well no luck here. this:

An email has been sent to "veedeeh...@gmail.com". That email contains a hyperlink that you must 
click on in order to activate your subscription.


simply has not happened so far (>5-10 minutes since subscribe).

br/joerg

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Re: [fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Philip Bennefall]

Hi Richard,

I am still getting stuck on the registration screen due to the captcha. 
What parts do I miss if I don't have an account for now?


Thanks,

Philip
On 8/8/2018 2:40 PM, Richard Hipp wrote:

The new "forum" feature of Fossil is now live on the self-hosting website:

 https://fossil-scm.org/forum

The forum feature is intended as a replacement for mailing lists like
this one. Though still very "beta", I believe in eating ones own
dogfood, and hence I am cutting over to the forum for Fossil itself.

There is a "subscribe" option on the link above where you can sign up
for email notifications to new forum posts.  The enhance email
notification should work just like a mailing list, with individual
emails for each forum post containing complete post content and
correct In-Reply-To headers.  The only major difference between the
forum and this list is that you must go to the forum website to post
new content.  New submissions via email are disallowed as an anti-spam
measure.

The Fossil homepage now has a link to the forum instead of a link to
mailing list sign-up.

Please discontinue use of this mailing list except as an emergency
back-up to the forum in case the forum stops working.  If forum is not
working, you can also send email directly to me.

After we have shaken out the forum feature a little further, I will
shut down this legacy mailing list.



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[fossil-users] This mailing list is now deprecated

[Richard Hipp]

The new "forum" feature of Fossil is now live on the self-hosting website:

https://fossil-scm.org/forum

The forum feature is intended as a replacement for mailing lists like
this one. Though still very "beta", I believe in eating ones own
dogfood, and hence I am cutting over to the forum for Fossil itself.

There is a "subscribe" option on the link above where you can sign up
for email notifications to new forum posts.  The enhance email
notification should work just like a mailing list, with individual
emails for each forum post containing complete post content and
correct In-Reply-To headers.  The only major difference between the
forum and this list is that you must go to the forum website to post
new content.  New submissions via email are disallowed as an anti-spam
measure.

The Fossil homepage now has a link to the forum instead of a link to
mailing list sign-up.

Please discontinue use of this mailing list except as an emergency
back-up to the forum in case the forum stops working.  If forum is not
working, you can also send email directly to me.

After we have shaken out the forum feature a little further, I will
shut down this legacy mailing list.

-- 
D. Richard Hipp
d...@sqlite.org
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Re: [fossil-users] 'fossil open' and existing local 'manifest' and 'manifest.uuid' files

[Warren Young]

On Aug 7, 2018, at 8:51 PM, Artur Shepilko  wrote:
> 
> When executing 'fossil
> open' for a newly created repo, if there're any existing local files
> named "manifest" and "manifest.uuid"  these get deleted.

Those files are generated by Fossil when you have the default-off setting 
“manifest” enabled.

I’m guessing that Fossil sees the files there, sees that “manifest” is 
disabled, so it assumes they were left by a previous run with the setting 
enabled and cleans them up.

Maybe it should only delete these files when you say “fossil set manifest 0”?
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Re: [fossil-users] Who runs Fossil servers on Windows?

[Jan Nijtmans]

Op di 7 aug. 2018 om 18:57 schreef Richard Hipp :
>
> If you are running a Fossil server on Windows, please share with me
> how you set it up.  You can respond via private email directly to me
> if you like.
>
>   (1)  Run using "fossil server"
>   (2)  Run using "fossil winsrv"
>   (3)  Using Apache with CGI
>   (4)  Using Apache with SCGI
>   (5)  Using Nginx with SCGI
>   (6)  Via SSH using some kind of SSHD for Windows
>   (7)  Some other webserver (please specify)
>   (8)  Other (please specify)
>
> I have the impression that most if not all Fossil servers on Windows
> are run using either (1) or (2).  If you are using any of the other
> approaches, then I especially want to hear from you.

In april 2016, I was setting up fossil using a combination of (2) and
(7). The IIS frontent was simply used as proxy, forwarding the generic
port 80 to the internal port used by the fossil service. That's how I
discovered that at that time the --baseurl option didn't work correctly
on Windows. I fixed ithat n commit
 
(and a minor follow-up in the next commit). Since then,
everything is working fine.

Regards,
 Jan Nijtmans
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