Re: [fossil-users] I have no idea what this is trying to tell me...

[Michael Richter]

As a workaround I deleted the four files before committing, then re-added
them and committed again since the history on these particular files isn't
really important.  But for future reference I'd like to know how to avoid
this in the first place and, if it should happen, how to resolve it.

On Thu, 9 May 2019 at 09:30, Michael Richter  wrote:

> New_Version:
> 0d481726efdeaf7e1e425da5db82af9042217eaa59ca689e3a253cefdbb93a77
> ERROR: [CPU/STM32F103RC_buildnumber] is different on disk compared to the
> repository
> NOTICE: Repository version of [CPU/STM32F103RC_buildnumber] stored in
> [file-61e47e1f48a9c5ea]
> ERROR: [CPU/STM32L051C8_buildnumber] is different on disk compared to the
> repository
> NOTICE: Repository version of [CPU/STM32L051C8_buildnumber] stored in
> [file-a6f36ff4f651070e]
> ERROR: [CPU/STM32L071RB_buildnumber] is different on disk compared to the
> repository
> NOTICE: Repository version of [CPU/STM32L071RB_buildnumber] stored in
> [file-4d2773b552c88285]
>
> I can't make heads or tails of this, making it difficult for me to find a
> solution.  Could some kind soul please translate this?
>
> --
> "Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
> of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
> people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot."
> --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the "don't be evil" mantra.
>


-- 
"Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot."
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the "don't be evil" mantra.
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[fossil-users] I have no idea what this is trying to tell me...

[Michael Richter]

New_Version:
0d481726efdeaf7e1e425da5db82af9042217eaa59ca689e3a253cefdbb93a77
ERROR: [CPU/STM32F103RC_buildnumber] is different on disk compared to the
repository
NOTICE: Repository version of [CPU/STM32F103RC_buildnumber] stored in
[file-61e47e1f48a9c5ea]
ERROR: [CPU/STM32L051C8_buildnumber] is different on disk compared to the
repository
NOTICE: Repository version of [CPU/STM32L051C8_buildnumber] stored in
[file-a6f36ff4f651070e]
ERROR: [CPU/STM32L071RB_buildnumber] is different on disk compared to the
repository
NOTICE: Repository version of [CPU/STM32L071RB_buildnumber] stored in
[file-4d2773b552c88285]

I can't make heads or tails of this, making it difficult for me to find a
solution.  Could some kind soul please translate this?

-- 
"Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot."
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the "don't be evil" mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Colored output on console

[Michael Richter]

Just to clarify, the fsl wrapper is not my work (although I contributed to
the cookbook and one of the standard enhancements in the default .fslrc
file was put in at my behest).  I'm just a fan of DIY customization instead
of asking the core devs to add every little feature every user can think
of, and fsl is the single best approach I've seen to that for Fossil.

On 26 April 2016 at 00:05, Matt Welland <mattrwell...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Michael,
>
> I've wanted to try your wrapper several times now but I've not had time
> and "just copy to a location on your path" is sadly a barrier to those of
> us who are chronically overloaded. If you want to get some momentum maybe
> consider adding a windows installer which includes fsl and fossil. Note
> that there is another wrapper out there and in parallel with you and for
> different reasons I created yet another wrapper (
> http://chiselapp.com/user/kiatoa/repository/fsl/index). I would love to
> move my wrapper into yours if it made sense. Really the only thing from my
> wrapper that I need is the repo extension. Would you be interested in
> adding something like that to the base fsl wrapper as a standard filter?
>
> You can get a sense of what the repo extension does from this wiki page:
> http://chiselapp.com/user/kiatoa/repository/fsl/wiki?name=Usage
>
> Thanks,
>
> Matt
> -=-
>
> On Mon, Apr 25, 2016 at 7:48 AM, Michael Richter <ttmrich...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I know that every time I mention this I get silently, perhaps even
>> hostilely, ignored, but really guys, why not just use fsl for your
>> customization needs?  Colourizing output is in the cookbook:
>> http://fossil.0branch.com/fsl/wiki?name=Cookbook, along with lots of
>> other nifty tricks like aliasing, adding commands (like workflow-based ones
>> I've done for my stuff), etc.  It really is a nifty little package and I
>> don't get the hostility (or at least utter apathy) it generates in the
>> Fossil community.
>>
>> I look forward to the "ignore the very existence of this message" that is
>> traditional each time I bring it up.
>>
>> On 25 April 2016 at 09:48, Steve Schow <st...@bstage.com> wrote:
>>
>>> For now, if you’re on a unix platform, you can try a wrapper script like
>>> this:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> #!/bin/bash
>>>
>>> export COLOR_NC='^[[0m'
>>> export COLOR_RED='^[[1;31m’
>>>
>>> fossil $* |\
>>> sed -e "s/ERROR/${COLOR_RED}ERROR${COLOR_NC}/g” \
>>> sed -e “s/WARNING/${COLOR_RED}WARNING${COLOR_NC}/g”
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Apr 24, 2016, at 4:07 AM, Marko Käning <sec001+fos...@posteo.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> > Hi devs,
>>> >
>>> > it would be great if one could colorise Fossil’s output on the console!
>>> >
>>> > Quite a few times I missed an error or warning message which slipped
>>> in between of many lines of the usual fossil output on the console.
>>> >
>>> > Red colouring of words like “warning” or “error” would be very helpful
>>> there.
>>> >
>>> > The poor man’s solution would at least be to use capital letters and
>>> some sort of line head along the lines of
>>> >
>>> >   > ERROR: blaa
>>> >   > WARNING: blubb
>>> >
>>> > Right now I can’t send an example of such a easily slipping through
>>> message, but I can deliver if I come across one again.
>>> >
>>> > Greets,
>>> > Marko
>>> >
>>> > ___
>>> > fossil-users mailing list
>>> > fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org
>>> > http://lists.fossil-scm.org:8080/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fossil-users
>>>
>>> ___
>>> fossil-users mailing list
>>> fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org
>>> http://lists.fossil-scm.org:8080/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fossil-users
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> "Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
>> of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
>> people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot."
>> --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the "don't be evil" mantra.
>>
>> ___
>> fossil-users mailing list
>> fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org
>> http://lists.fossil-scm.org:8080/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fossil-users
>>
>>
>


-- 
"Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot."
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the "don't be evil" mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Colored output on console

[Michael Richter]

I know that every time I mention this I get silently, perhaps even
hostilely, ignored, but really guys, why not just use fsl for your
customization needs?  Colourizing output is in the cookbook:
http://fossil.0branch.com/fsl/wiki?name=Cookbook, along with lots of other
nifty tricks like aliasing, adding commands (like workflow-based ones I've
done for my stuff), etc.  It really is a nifty little package and I don't
get the hostility (or at least utter apathy) it generates in the Fossil
community.

I look forward to the "ignore the very existence of this message" that is
traditional each time I bring it up.

On 25 April 2016 at 09:48, Steve Schow  wrote:

> For now, if you’re on a unix platform, you can try a wrapper script like
> this:
>
>
>
> #!/bin/bash
>
> export COLOR_NC='^[[0m'
> export COLOR_RED='^[[1;31m’
>
> fossil $* |\
> sed -e "s/ERROR/${COLOR_RED}ERROR${COLOR_NC}/g” \
> sed -e “s/WARNING/${COLOR_RED}WARNING${COLOR_NC}/g”
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Apr 24, 2016, at 4:07 AM, Marko Käning 
> wrote:
>
> > Hi devs,
> >
> > it would be great if one could colorise Fossil’s output on the console!
> >
> > Quite a few times I missed an error or warning message which slipped in
> between of many lines of the usual fossil output on the console.
> >
> > Red colouring of words like “warning” or “error” would be very helpful
> there.
> >
> > The poor man’s solution would at least be to use capital letters and
> some sort of line head along the lines of
> >
> >   > ERROR: blaa
> >   > WARNING: blubb
> >
> > Right now I can’t send an example of such a easily slipping through
> message, but I can deliver if I come across one again.
> >
> > Greets,
> > Marko
> >
> > ___
> > fossil-users mailing list
> > fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org
> > http://lists.fossil-scm.org:8080/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fossil-users
>
> ___
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> fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org
> http://lists.fossil-scm.org:8080/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fossil-users
>



-- 
"Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot."
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the "don't be evil" mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil crashing when opening or checking out a repository.

[Michael Richter]

Trying to open the same repository under a Linux system (fossil version
1.33 [5b456cfa6b]) gives me this: "[1]9388 segmentation fault  fossil
open /path/to/Joystick.fossil"

On 15 April 2016 at 11:31, Michael Richter <ttmrich...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Platform: Windows 10.
> Fossil version: 1.34 [62dcb00e68]
>
> After making a few changes to a project (IAR Embedded Workbench for ARM)
> and committing them on a feature branch, I tried to check out the main
> development branch.  The result was a hard crash.  My repository is now in
> a state where I can't open it, even in a fresh directory, and even after
> doing a "fossil all rebuild".  When I try I get Windows 10's idiotic
> dialogue: "Fossil is a simple, high-reliability, distributed software
> configuration management system. has stopped working \ A problem caused the
> program to stop working correctly.  Windows will close the program and
> notify you if a solution is available."  (All typos and odd wording
> straight from the original.)
>
> "fossil export" crashes as well.
>
> I appear to have lost, according to "fossil ui" one check-in's worth of
> work, most of which I fortunately happen to have in an archive.  I'm not
> sure, however, how to go about getting the repository into a recoverable
> state.  I *could* just use that archive as the basis of a new repository,
> but now I'm left with this nagging question of when it will happen again.
>
> Can anybody suggest some steps forward to recovery here?
>
> --
> "Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
> of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
> people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot."
> --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the "don't be evil" mantra.
>



-- 
"Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot."
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the "don't be evil" mantra.
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[fossil-users] Fossil crashing when opening or checking out a repository.

[Michael Richter]

Platform: Windows 10.
Fossil version: 1.34 [62dcb00e68]

After making a few changes to a project (IAR Embedded Workbench for ARM)
and committing them on a feature branch, I tried to check out the main
development branch.  The result was a hard crash.  My repository is now in
a state where I can't open it, even in a fresh directory, and even after
doing a "fossil all rebuild".  When I try I get Windows 10's idiotic
dialogue: "Fossil is a simple, high-reliability, distributed software
configuration management system. has stopped working \ A problem caused the
program to stop working correctly.  Windows will close the program and
notify you if a solution is available."  (All typos and odd wording
straight from the original.)

"fossil export" crashes as well.

I appear to have lost, according to "fossil ui" one check-in's worth of
work, most of which I fortunately happen to have in an archive.  I'm not
sure, however, how to go about getting the repository into a recoverable
state.  I *could* just use that archive as the basis of a new repository,
but now I'm left with this nagging question of when it will happen again.

Can anybody suggest some steps forward to recovery here?

-- 
"Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot."
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the "don't be evil" mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Shorter alias for FOSSIL AMEND --EDIT-COMMENT request

[Michael Richter]

Here I go again reminding people that if you just want short versions of
commands, aliases for common command operations with specific switches,
etc. that http://fossil.0branch.com/fsl/home has a solution for this
already that's been available for years now.

On 26 February 2016 at 10:57, Ross Berteig  wrote:

> On 2/25/2016 4:58 PM, to...@acm.org wrote:
>
>> Would it be possible to add a short version for the –-EDIT-COMMENT
>> option of the AMEND command (just like there is for –-comment)?
>> Something like –e perhaps?
>>
>
> A quick check of the handy /test-all-help page for references to -e shows
> that no command uses it now, so it doesn't have any overloaded meanings to
> confuse things. The checkin command has no option at all to cause the
> comment to be edited (that is what happens if -m or -M are not used). If it
> did, I suppose that --edit-comment would be its likely name, and -e its
> likely short name.
>
> So it looks like that was a six character edit to the amend command. Try
> checkin [769bc7b4] as see if it does what you expected.
>
> --
> Ross Berteig   r...@cheshireeng.com
> Cheshire Engineering Corp.   http://www.CheshireEng.com/
> +1 626 303 1602
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>



-- 
"Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot."
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the "don't be evil" mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Bug? FOSSIL MV does not work as expected (Win7 machine)

[Michael Richter]

The key wording there is *within the repository* tree.

It doesn't change the file system, only the naming of the files, etc. in
the repository.  Whether this is desired or correct behaviour is … an area
of frequent discussion.

My own response to that discussion is to use the fsl wrapper (
http://fossil.0branch.com/fsl/home) and make it do whatever I expect it to
do.

On 17 April 2015 at 21:48, Tony Papadimitriou to...@acm.org wrote:

   This is on a Win7 machine (if it matters).  A simple way to reproduce
 (f = fossil):

 f new xxx.fossil
 f o xxx.fossil
 mkdir a\a
 dir  a\a\xxx
 f add a
 f com -m Initial
 f mv a\a b
 f close

 Based on help screen, and usual behavior of mv, I would expect
 subdirectory a\a to be now known as b, and of course all files below to
 move accordingly.  But nothing happens.  If I move each file separately, it
 works.

 This is what the help screen shows:

 Usage: f mv|rename OLDNAME NEWNAME
or: f mv|rename OLDNAME... DIR

 Move or rename one or more files or directories within the repository tree.
 You can either rename a file or directory or move it to another
 subdirectory.


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-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] fossil vs git-based arrangements. code review and ticket export

[Michael Richter]

On 27 July 2014 11:04, Eric Rubin-Smith eas@gmail.com wrote:

 Fossil *could* support export to JIRA+git in particular, for example, by
 providing a tool that (a) exports to JIRA's supported JSON import format,
 (b) collects the mapping from the fossil ticket IDs to the JIRA ticket
 IDs, then (c) does a git export but massages the check-in comments
 according to the data collected in (b).


I'd find a tool like that really useful.  I'd find the reverse even more
useful.  I look forward to your F/OSSed implementation!

More seriously, you're comparing a small project like Fossil's with the
capabilities of behemoths like Microsoft.  Microsoft can throw as many code
monkeys at something as they'd like, hence the wide variety of exporting
formats (of wildly varying stability and utility) in Microsoft Office, et
al.  In a small F/OSS project it's going to be more tools created by people
who scratched an itch and shared their ointment.  (OK, maybe I stretched
that analogy a bit far.)

I don't think you're going to find the tool you're looking for.  What you
might find useful, however, is Marc Simpson's fsl wrapper which will
allow you to almost seamlessly integrate whatever tools you do come up with
into Fossil's command line and workflow: http://fossil.0branch.com/fsl.  Be
sure to check out the cookbook for ideas of how to accomplish things as
well: http://fossil.0branch.com/fsl/wiki?name=Cookbook.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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[fossil-users] TH scripting question

[Michael Richter]

Where do I find the variables and commands Fossil exposes to TH documented?

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] How to ignore UNIX executables?

[Michael Richter]

On 15 August 2013 21:23, John Long codeb...@inbox.lv wrote:

 Hi, is it possible to ignore UNIX executables? I want to do an addr on a
 directory tree but I don't know how to tell fossil not to track the
 binaries
 since they have no naming pattern. Until now I've been living with it but
 it
 is very annoying and time for me to ask. Help!


You can always use Marc Simpson's fsl
http://fossil.0branch.com/fsl/homewrapper script around fossil to do
whatever workflow you like.  If you need
help writing a script for this, drop me a line and I'll gladly work one out
with you.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] How to ignore UNIX executables?

[Michael Richter]

On 15 August 2013 21:23, John Long codeb...@inbox.lv wrote:

 Hi, is it possible to ignore UNIX executables? I want to do an addr on a
 directory tree but I don't know how to tell fossil not to track the
 binaries
 since they have no naming pattern. Until now I've been living with it but
 it
 is very annoying and time for me to ask. Help!


You can always use Marc Simpson's fsl
http://fossil.0branch.com/fsl/homewrapper script around fossil to do
whatever workflow you like.  If you need
help writing a script for this, drop me a line and I'll gladly work one out
with you.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Making the go tool support fossil

[Michael Richter]

On 21 February 2013 04:57, Lluís Batlle i Rossell vi...@viric.name wrote:

 1) there were a way to clone+checkout at once into a subdirectory:
   fossil clonedir http://blabla.org/ blabla
   # ^ It creates blabla/, blabla/.repository.fossil, and in it, checks out
   # the .repository.fossil, for example


Marc Simpson's *fsl* wrapper gives you the ability to make all kinds of
neat alterations to Fossil's command line.  Instructions for doing so are
here:
http://yfl.bahmanm.com/Members/ttmrichter/yfl-blog/fsl-interceptor-creationand
examples that cover your specific use case are found in the cookbook
here: http://fossil.0branch.com/fsl/wiki?name=Cookbook

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Help with Chisel

[Michael Richter]

You should have set your check-in date to something ridiculously early.
(One of the options when creating the repo for pushing.)  Since you didn't,
shun instead the initial check-in.  When I did that to my hosted app it
worked fine.


On 17 February 2013 22:09, jim Schimpf jim.schi...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi,
 I am attempting to use the free Fossil hosting at chiselapp.com.
  You can load repository's there and they do effectively a CGI host.  Works
 very well and thanks  and props to James for hosting the site.

 There are some limits if you want to upload your repository is
 must  8 meg and if you want to clone it, also it cannot be too large as
 the web page times out.

 I have a 64Meg repository that I want on there, to do that you
 have to fossil push it there.  You create a repository  (using the Chisel
 web page) and get the project-code from your local version (fossil info -R
 repo name) and put that in the create so you can log in for the push.
  Also you want to set the password just so you know it.

 Next you push to the site with:

 https://jschimpf:password@
 chiselapp.com/user/jschimpf/repository/Firenet

 and then wait.

 When done you can go the the above URL and login into your site.
  You must also set up the site so it has the same Initial wiki page name as
 the original.  Then your wiki will show up on the pushed site.

 After doing this I have my wiki, ticket and time line but I don't
 see any of the files.  I have also tried this locally doing a push on my
 local machine I have the same problem.  All the other stuff is there but no
 files.  The repository is as large as the original so the files are there
 but aren't accessible in the pushed version.  Doing a fossil open on the
 pushed repository works but no files in the new location.

 What vital thing did I miss ?

 Thanks for the help

 --jim schimpf
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Re: [fossil-users] fossil sqlite3

[Michael Richter]

On 31 December 2012 15:53, Edward Berner e...@bernerfam.com wrote:

 fossil info calls it project-code but it seems to be the same thing
 that fossil new and fossil clone call project-id.


Waitwhat?  My version of Fossil (This is fossil version 1.25 [558a17a686]
2012-12-22 13:48:31 UTC) doesn't show anything about project-id for
fossil new/clone.

-- 
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Re: [fossil-users] fossil sqlite3

[Michael Richter]

On 31 December 2012 17:27, Edward Berner e...@bernerfam.com wrote:

 Waitwhat?  My version of Fossil (This is fossil version 1.25 [558a17a686]
 2012-12-22 13:48:31 UTC) doesn't show anything about project-id for
 fossil new/clone.


 What do you get when you create a test repository?  It should, I think,
 display the project-id, etc., after creating the repository. eg:

 $ ./fossil new test.fossil
 project-id: 2d7cade36dce2af94df648e178d588**e5a3b00a14
 server-id:  af94c0a2462bc18103a19c20fd0b39**18c3f9a2a3
 admin-user: erb (initial password is 811b05)


Ah.  I misunderstood.  I thought you meant there was a command line option
related to the project ID.

-- 
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil vs. Git/Mercurial/etc.?

[Michael Richter]

 If I had written a ten-page post explaining in excruciating detail
 what rebase is, why it matters, and how to adapt it to the Fossil
 philosophy, who -but who!- would have read that first post?


I, for one, would have.  I wouldn't necessarily have agreed, mind, because
the disagreement may be philosophical, not technical, but I appreciate
people putting in actual explanatory effort over it's too much work.


 I was
 being (I thought!) considerate.  And judging by last night's 30 posts,
 would it have made any difference to post a thesis-length argument for
 rebase?  And if so, how was I to know that?  Or should I have given up
 at the very first sign of trouble?



I'm still baffled, frankly, as to why you don't just use the DSCM that does
what you want now instead of tilting at windmills with the one that doesn't
do what you want.

The Erlang community faces this kind of problem on an almost monthly
basis.  I really like Erlang, it invariably starts, but I don't like
immutable variables, and I want module-level mutable state, and I'd like to
be able to overload default function implementations with customized ones,
and I'd like a more imperative syntax, and…

In the end what they *really* want is Ruby (or Python (or C++ (or …))) with
one added feature from Erlang: easy concurrency.  They don't understand
that the features of Erlang were set up the way they are for a specific
purpose, and a purpose that gets undermined when you remove those
features.  The easy concurrency is the *least* important of the
architectural decisions that went into Erlang, it's just the most visible
of them.  (Erlang isn't intended as a language for easily writing
concurrent systems.  It's intended as a language for easily writing *
reliable* systems.  The fabled nine-nines.)

You want rebase (or equivalent) because you want a clean history.  I
appreciate Fossil *because* of the messy (where for me *s/messy/honest/*)
history.  Because that messy history is a warning.  It's a flag saying
something went wrong here that shows possibly complicated code issues or
problems in work flow or even problems with a developer's habits.  If
understanding why something got that way is a problem, we enter with
another concept that's sadly all too lacking in software: we
*document*it.  We explain it.  We don't just brush it under the carpet
and pretend it
didn't happen.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil vs. Git/Mercurial/etc.?

[Michael Richter]

I'd just like to add a link to a Git user who *doesn't* like rebasing:
http://paul.stadig.name/2010/12/thou-shalt-not-lie-git-rebase-ammend.html


On 31 December 2012 07:26, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 If I had written a ten-page post explaining in excruciating detail
 what rebase is, why it matters, and how to adapt it to the Fossil
 philosophy, who -but who!- would have read that first post?


 I, for one, would have.  I wouldn't necessarily have agreed, mind, because
 the disagreement may be philosophical, not technical, but I appreciate
 people putting in actual explanatory effort over it's too much work.


 I was
 being (I thought!) considerate.  And judging by last night's 30 posts,
 would it have made any difference to post a thesis-length argument for
 rebase?  And if so, how was I to know that?  Or should I have given up
 at the very first sign of trouble?



 I'm still baffled, frankly, as to why you don't just use the DSCM that
 does what you want now instead of tilting at windmills with the one that
 doesn't do what you want.

 The Erlang community faces this kind of problem on an almost monthly
 basis.  I really like Erlang, it invariably starts, but I don't like
 immutable variables, and I want module-level mutable state, and I'd like to
 be able to overload default function implementations with customized ones,
 and I'd like a more imperative syntax, and…

 In the end what they *really* want is Ruby (or Python (or C++ (or …)))
 with one added feature from Erlang: easy concurrency.  They don't
 understand that the features of Erlang were set up the way they are for a
 specific purpose, and a purpose that gets undermined when you remove those
 features.  The easy concurrency is the *least* important of the
 architectural decisions that went into Erlang, it's just the most visible
 of them.  (Erlang isn't intended as a language for easily writing
 concurrent systems.  It's intended as a language for easily writing *
 reliable* systems.  The fabled nine-nines.)

 You want rebase (or equivalent) because you want a clean history.  I
 appreciate Fossil *because* of the messy (where for me *s/messy/honest/*)
 history.  Because that messy history is a warning.  It's a flag saying
 something went wrong here that shows possibly complicated code issues or
 problems in work flow or even problems with a developer's habits.  If
 understanding why something got that way is a problem, we enter with
 another concept that's sadly all too lacking in software: we *document*it.  
 We explain it.  We don't just brush it under the carpet and pretend it
 didn't happen.


 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




-- 
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[fossil-users] fossil sqlite3

[Michael Richter]

Is there any way to execute SQL statements from the command line using
fossil sqlite3?  The docs for
thishttp://www.fossil-scm.org/xfer/help?cmd=sqlite3are a bit skimpy
(to say the least).  Like what are the
*?OPTIONS?* mentioned, precisely?

What I'm specifically trying to accomplish is to extract the project ID
from the repository in a script file.  If there's another way to do this
I'm happy to use that instead, of course.

-- 
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil vs. Git/Mercurial/etc.?

[Michael Richter]

I'm pretty sure that rebase or its equivalents will never be a part of
Fossil.  Given that there are tools out there (like Git) that feature this
functionality that some (and I stress it's only *some*) users want, perhaps
this following question is to practical but … why not use Git, the tool
that has the feature you want?  This arguing over whether rebase is good or
bad and whether you're a good or bad person for wanting it is futile.  I'm
pretty damned sure that it's not going to ever be added (given Richard
Hipp's philosophical stance on rewriting repository history).

TL;DR version: stop whining and use Git if you want Git.


On 30 December 2012 12:29, Mike Meyer m...@mired.org wrote:



 Nico Williams n...@cryptonector.com wrote:

 On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 5:31 PM, Mike Meyer m...@mired.org wrote:
  You missed the point. Nothing should *ever* be rebased. It's a
 rewrite of history, which is a fundamentally bad thing. While a SCM
 should make generating patch files easy, it shouldn't require rewrites
 of history to do so.
 You missed my proposal that a fossil rebase operation always copy the
 branch being rebased and rebase that copy.  It was in my very first
 post on this thread:

 I didn't miss it. I asked for clarification, for two reasons:

 1) Rebase involves two branches, both of which get changed. Your proposal
 only mentions one. Given that I'm not all that familiar with rebase, I have
 *no* idea what this means in terms of additions to the history tree.

 2) Your use case (generating patches to make upstream happy) isn't one
 I've ever experienced, but it doesn't sound like it needs to change the
 tree at all.

 So, for the third time, can you describe your proposed new feature
 *without* saying the words git or rebase.
 --
 Sent from my Android tablet with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my swyping.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil vs. Git/Mercurial/etc.?

[Michael Richter]

On 30 December 2012 12:56, Nico Williams n...@cryptonector.com wrote:

 What is it about rebase that causes so many to miss the idea of a
 rebase that is NOT destructive because it creates a new branch instead
 of doing a destructive change to an existing branch?


I don't know.  You won't explain it.  It's too much work, remember?


 I shall wait for D. Richard Hipp's word as to any kind of rebase never
 making it into Fossil.


http://www.mail-archive.com/fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org/msg01792.html

That alone would be a pretty strong indicator given the context of the
thread it's in.  Too, the fact that *two years after* the first round of
requests for rebase there is still no rebase functionality and this
conversation is coming up *yet again* is another pretty strong indicator.


   TL;DR version: stop whining and use Git if you want Git.

 You fail reading comprehension.


No, you just don't like my interpretation.


 I do use git, nearly exclusively.  And I use rebase.  And I use it in
 a way that is non-destructive (because I always rebase fresh branches
 that are copies of the ones I want to rebase).


Good.  So you're happy with Git.  Keep using Git.  You like its features
and you don't like the fact Fossil doesn't have these features (and that it
likely never will).  There's no reason to make every DSCM turn into a Git
clone.  (Indeed there's every reason *not* to have a myriad of Git clones
out and about!)


 I happen to think that Fossil has a superior architecture and design.


Except part of its design is *no rewriting of history*.  Hence, no rebase
in the Git sense.


 I'd like to use Fossil, but I can't, and I've explained why.


So use Git.  Nobody here is calling you a bad person because you're using
Git.  Nobody here is holding a gun to your head forcing you to use not-Git.


 I've also explained why I'm unlikely to be the only user who needs this
 one feature.


This is the C++ approach to things: add every conceivable feature because
someone, somewhere might want to use it.  The result is a language that
should be an embarrassment with so much of a learning
curve^H^H^H^H^H*cliff*that very few people (if any) could really be
called expert users.  (The
funniest part was that the standards committee decided to address this
specific problem by *adding even more features*.)

There's use cases for every bizarre feature in every bizarre SCM
(distributed or otherwise) out there.  Let's not turn Fossil into the C++
of DSCMs, shall we?  If you *really, positively, absolutely* must have
rebase, Git is that-a-way.  Insisting that Fossil should turn into Git is
not a viable argument.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil vs. Git/Mercurial/etc.?

[Michael Richter]

On 30 December 2012 13:02, Nico Williams n...@cryptonector.com wrote:

 On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 10:57 PM, Mike Meyer m...@mired.org wrote:
  So, for the third time, can you describe your proposed new feature
 *without* saying the words git or rebase.
 No: it's too much work, and many people understand git rebase, and
 
  -1.

 So is that a -1 to the attitude, the proposal, or both?  I can't tell.
  If the attitude, can you explain why you would want an explanation of
 rebase in words other than those that have already been used
 (probably by so many)?  What's the problem with making reference to
 git?  Is git anathema?  Is this NIH syndrome?


I can't speak for Mike Meyer, but I'd -1 that attitude because you're
basically saying, stripping away the pretty posturing, I WANT THIS NEW
FEATURE AND I WON'T EXPLAIN IT TO YOU BECAUSE THAT'S TOO MUCH WORK FOR ME
INSTEAD I WANT YOU TO DO THE WORK FOR ME!

If you can't (or, rather, won't!) explain Git's rebase command to people
who *very obviously are not using Git* and who are equally obviously *not
interested in learning or using Git*, then your attitude does, in fact,
reek.

You want the feature.  We don't.  It's kind of up to *you* to explain to *us
* (in *our* terms!) why it's important and how it doesn't undermine the
very point of Fossil's design.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil vs. Git/Mercurial/etc.?

[Michael Richter]

On 30 December 2012 13:23, Nico Williams n...@cryptonector.com wrote:

 A rebase operation takes a branch (typically the current one) and
 two commits (oldbase and newbase) in the repository and then a)
 computes the set of commits that are in the branch since oldbase
 then b) creates a new line of commits that consists of newbase plus
 the commit set computed in (a), each commit in that set applied as a
 delta onto newbase, merging as needed.


And why would I want to do this?  Explain as you would to, say, a small
child.


 So, if we have a branch called trunk with this history:

 A---B---C---D

 and a branch called new-feature with these commits

 A---B---C---a---b---c

 where commits a, b, and c are in the new-feature branch but not in
 trunk, and clearly we're missing commit D from trunk in new-feature,
 we want to end up with:

 A---B---C---D---a'---b'---c'

 Where a', b', and c' are each based on commits a, b, and c, but merged
 onto D.


Why not, for example, just merge c into D or vice versa?  I really don't
see what modifying history does here.  Possibly because I lack the
imagination to put any concrete examples into A, B, C, D, a, b, c, a', b',
c' where this would be a desirable feature.  Could you be more specific?

A---B---C---D---a'---c'---b'  (re-order commits, not merely change the
 base of commit a)


Why?


 A---B---C---D---a'---c'  (drop a commit, not merely change the base of a)


Why?


 A---B---C---D---abc' (merge all three of a, b, and c, into abc')


Why?


 A---B---C---D---ac'---b' (re-order and merge some)


Why?


 A---B---C---D---a1'---a2'---b'---c' (split a and rebase)


Why?


 A---B---C---abc'  (no rebase, just merge the top three commits)


Why?


 These are things that upstream maintainers of large projects quite
 often insist upon.


And why do they do this?  I kinda/sorta get the mechanism.  I just don't
see the motivation.  (And upstream maintainers insist upon this is not
motivation, it's just moving the question of motivation around.)

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil vs. Git/Mercurial/etc.?

[Michael Richter]

On 30 December 2012 14:00, Nico Williams n...@cryptonector.com wrote:

  And why do they do this?  I kinda/sorta get the mechanism.  I just don't
 see
  the motivation.  (And upstream maintainers insist upon this is not
  motivation, it's just moving the question of motivation around.)

 Because they want clean history.


This is precisely why I maintain that you're not going to see a rebase in
Fossil.  Quoting from
http://www.mail-archive.com/fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org/msg01792.html:

*There are differing philosophies here.  Some say it is important to
present a clean, linear narrative of what took place - a narrative
that is easy to follow and easy to understand. Others say that it is
more important to present history as it actually occurred, in all its
messy detail, not how you wish it had occurred.  Git and Hg tend more
toward the first view whereas Fossil leans toward the second.*

That's the Voice of God for Fossil speaking there.  What you want is
exactly not what Fossil was built to provide.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil vs. Git/Mercurial/etc.?

[Michael Richter]

On 30 December 2012 14:19, Nico Williams n...@cryptonector.com wrote:

  There are differing philosophies here.  Some say it is important to
  present a clean, linear narrative of what took place - a narrative
  that is easy to follow and easy to understand. Others say that it is
  more important to present history as it actually occurred, in all its
  messy detail, not how you wish it had occurred.  Git and Hg tend more
  toward the first view whereas Fossil leans toward the second.

 There's room for interpretation, and for persuasion.


Not really, no.  Any interpretation that says anything other than it is
more important to present history as it actually occurred isn't
interpretation, it's dissembling.


 Fossil didn't always have private branched.  It does now.  Isn't that
 a concession that sets precedent?


I'd say the private branches pretty much eliminate your need for rebasing
entirely given what you've described as rebasing.  Make your mess in your
private branches.  Expose the pretty stuff in non-private branches.

Problem solved.

At Sun, for example, we had official repos for products (gates),
 project repos aiming at eventual integration into product gates, and
 individual repos.  Individuals pushed to either project gates or
 product gates, depending on what they were working on.  Product gates
 were always archived and available, even for ancient releases of the
 products.  Project gates were generally (but not always) archived and
 available.  Individual repos were generally littered across the place,
 with no real way for one to find them without asking the developer
 working on them.  History was cleaned prior to pushing to gates higher
 up the hierarchy, but past history in product gates was never
 rewritten.  This worked spectacularly well.  Who wants to see typos
 made and fixed before the commits landed on the product gates??
 Answer: no one, because such things are useless and a burden.


So … have a public-facing clean repository and a private dirty
repository with private branches?  Again, I don't see what screwing with
the DAG of the SCM buys you besides trouble.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil vs. Git/Mercurial/etc.?

[Michael Richter]

On 25 December 2012 07:12, Mike Meyer m...@mired.org wrote:

  for u in $DEVS ADMINS $READERS
  do
# create user name from company mail address, password is PWname.
fs new $u $u...@company.com PW$u -R $REPO
  done
 
  for dev in $DEVS
  do
# Set up developers
fs cap $dev v -R $REPO
  done
 
 
 I know I'm probably going to come across as being thick as a whale
 sandwich
 here, but ... what is this fs thing?

 No, it's my bad. fs is my local alias for fossil. I should have
 replaced expanded it before sending in the examples.


This leaves me doubly confused.  Neither of these command lines works for
me.  There is no fossil cap I can see.  (Fossil whines about unknown
command: cap.)  And fossil new doesn't have that command line that I can
see.  Is this some variant that's not on trunk?  (I have a fossil from
2012-12-22's trunk.)

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil vs. Git/Mercurial/etc.?

[Michael Richter]

http://facepalm.org

I feel stupid.


On 26 December 2012 02:23, Michael L. Barrow mlbar...@barrow.me wrote:

  On 12/25/2012 12:44 AM, Michael Richter wrote:


 This leaves me doubly confused.  Neither of these command lines works for
 me.  There is no fossil cap I can see.  (Fossil whines about unknown
 command: cap.)  And fossil new doesn't have that command line that I can
 see.  Is this some variant that's not on trunk?  (I have a fossil from
 2012-12-22's trunk.)


 The word user is missing from the command line invocations:

 Usage: fossil user SUBCOMMAND ...  ?-R|--repository FILE?

 Run various subcommands on users of the open repository or of
 the repository identified by the -R or --repository option.

fossil user capabilities USERNAME ?STRING?

Query or set the capabilities for user USERNAME

fossil user default ?USERNAME?

Query or set the default user.  The default user is the
user for command-line interaction.

fossil user list

List all users known to the repository

fossil user new ?USERNAME? ?CONTACT-INFO? ?PASSWORD?

Create a new user in the repository.  Users can never be
deleted.  They can be denied all access but they must continue
to exist in the database.

fossil user password USERNAME ?PASSWORD?

Change the web access password for a user.


 --
 Michael Barrow
 michael at barrow dot me
 +1 (408) 782-4249


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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil vs. Git/Mercurial/etc.?

[Michael Richter]

On 19 December 2012 07:33, Mike Meyer m...@mired.org wrote:

 for u in $DEVS ADMINS $READERS
 do
   # create user name from company mail address, password is PWname.
   fs new $u $u...@company.com PW$u -R $REPO
 done

 for dev in $DEVS
 do
   # Set up developers
   fs cap $dev v -R $REPO
 done


I know I'm probably going to come across as being thick as a whale sandwich
here, but ... what is this fs thing?
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Re: [fossil-users] File moves reported in commit as file deletion!

[Michael Richter]

You know, for someone using a tool that hasn't paid for it, you have a real
tone of overweening entitlement.  Perhaps you need to look up the
definitions involved in free software and open source software.  You
may wish, in particular, to pay attention to the portions of it that
involve how to get people to work for you (*for free*, I remind you).

You should perhaps be thankful that Richard Hipp doesn't share my
temperament.  Had this been my project you would have been silently removed
from a real mailing list to a black hole one where every email you sent
never made it to another person, even though you could still read each and
every message.

As for your later offer of a bounty?  Forget it.  Your attitude clearly
marks you as the kind of person who'd be a client from Hell.  I suspect
that, given your performance on the list so far, you'll find it difficult
to hire anybody.  You probably now rely on the good, kind, professional
graces of Richard.  May God have mercy on your code.


On 18 December 2012 04:58, K k...@lightpowered.org wrote:

 I don't need to make assumptions, and therefore am not. I'm going off of
 the facts, which I can observe, and which I can present to others.

 The file was not deleted. It was moved using Fossil's own fossil mv
 command. It's irrational to treat this as a deletion.

 If you cannot provide justification for this behavior, we should move to
 discussing the behavior Fossil should exhibit.

 ^K


 on Dec 17, 2012, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
 
 
 
 On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 3:49 PM, K k...@lightpowered.org wrote:
 
 
 
 As I said, I did not DELETE any files, but rather moved them. fossil
 changes reported
 them as RENAMED. And in the check in, they are being reported as DELETED.
 
 
 
 I'm just asking how in the design of Fossil you justified this decision.
 Please directly
 address this vs skirting it.
 
 I would guess that when generating the DELETED text the code merely
 notes that a
 file with that name is no longer part of the check-in and that the code
 does not
 go to the extra trouble to figure out if the filename changed.
 
 
 
 You seem to be making the assumption that whoever wrote that bit of code
 made a deliberate
 decision to obscure the fact that the filename changed.  Why would you
 assume that?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 ^K
 
 
 
 
 
 on Dec 17, 2012, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 2:55 PM, K k...@lightpowered.org wrote:
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 I'm looking at the page for my file and its history ends as deleted when
 I did not
 
 delete it. I moved it, which fossil changes reported as a RENAMED. I
 commited and
 
 now have the surprise dumped on me that my file was deleted and whatever
 else, when
 
 it was not. This is not acceptable to lose the history of a file just
 because I
 MOVE
 
 it. I cannot believe this is how Fossil is operating and apparently is
 expected
 to
 
 operate. PLEASE JUSTIFY THIS.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 I've very sorry that the file history report does not structure the
 information
 as
 
 you would prefer.
 
 
 
 All of the information needed to track file changes across renames is
 contained
 in
 
 the repository.  And, in fact, the annotate screens do trace changes
 across renames.
 
 But nobody has yet taken the time to write a report screen that displays
 a file
 history
 
 graph across renames.  Perhaps because nobody cares as passionately
 about this as
 
 you seem to.  The Fossil source code is open-source; you could
 contribute a solution
 
 if you wanted to.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 --
 
 D. Richard Hipp
 
 d...@sqlite.org
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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 --
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 d...@sqlite.org
 
 
 
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Re: [fossil-users] why does `fossil rm' not do the real thing?

[Michael Richter]

Do you two need a room?  If so, there's a local so-called love hotel I
can book for you in two-hour slots.


On 18 December 2012 13:00, Chad Perrin c...@apotheon.net wrote:

 On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 05:02:23PM -0800, Joe Mistachkin wrote:
 
  Chad Perrin wrote:
  
   If you use bleeding edge versions, you should already be prepared to
 deal
   with changes in behavior.  I don't see the problem.
  
 
  I help write the bleeding edge versions.  Therefore, it is useful that
 I
  run them on a daily basis as well.

 . . . therefore, I don't see the problem.


  
   There will always be someone disenfranchised.  The question is whether
 we
   should disenfranchise people who are very, very bad at software
   management, or disenfranchise people who want their software to work
 in a
   reasonable manner.
 
  I would just like to point out here that, contrary to your assertion to
 the
  contrary, I do care about other people besides myself in this matter.

 I'd call it a suggestion, rather than an assertion.  I don't think I
 quite explicitly made that charge.  It's nice to know you care, though.
 Perhaps you'd like to acknowledge that fact in future comments rather
 than phrase your commentary like that two which I responded.


  
   Show me where I demonized anyone.  I didn't imply people are stupid,
   the way some emails opposed to changing `rm` and `mv` have.  I didn't
 say
   people were morally reprehensible, acting maliciously to make others'
   lives difficult.  I just asked about whether the primary priority
 should
   be for people who don't care enough about their work to pay attention
 to
   their tools.
 
  It's very subtle, but it's there.  To quote, someone who will never pay
  attention to warnings.  Out of curiousity, how many warnings given by
  software do *YOU* routinely ignore (e.g. web site security, etc)?

 Someone who will never pay attention to warnings isn't a demonization.
 It's a characterization of people who, well, never pay attention to
 warnings -- which, you may note, was obviously not directed at you
 personally, in any case.

 There are people out there who never pay attention to warnings, and
 people who use four-year out of date software with critical security
 vulnerabilities left unpatched.  Screws fall out all the time.  The world
 is an imperfect place.

 Please tell me who else would not notice warnings over a gentle
 deprecation period with warnings other than:

 1. those who never pay attention to warnings

 2. those who go for ridiculously long times without updating software

 I'm willing to acknowledge the existence of people in large numbers
 falling through that crack if you can point out such a crack through
 which large numbers of people might fall.  The world is, after all, an
 imperfect place (see above).  I just see no evidence of them in any
 arguments for inflexible stasis of software defaults so far.


  
   . . . except that, given your reactions to some of the other things I
   said, you seem inclined to take statements as insults when they
 obviously
   are not intended as insults, so the problem isn't really solved on your
   end.  Right?
 
  After having read several of your previous posts to others on this list,
  including several containing insults, it seemed to be a fair assumption.

 I recommend you read for denotative meaning of words rather than for
 imagined tone in the future.  Emails do not generally come with tone of
 voice.


  
   That seems like another implementation detail.
 
  I'm not sure how to respond to this.  Yes, changes to software do require
  changing the implementation.

 When taken in isolation, ignoring everything else I said about
 implementation details, I suppose it's easy to pretend I said something
 nonsensical.

 --
 Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]
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Re: [fossil-users] Wiki naming limitations

[Michael Richter]

On 29 October 2012 02:44, K k...@lightpowered.org wrote:

 Literally my first day using Fossil I ran into a problem, the wiki naming
 limitation. This doesn't seem too obscure to not warrant a tweak to the
 code.


The obscure part isn't the naming limitation, it's the desire to have
page names under 3 characters in length.  Fossil's been around for quite a
while now and *nobody* has noticed this limitation before because,
apparently, the overwhelming majority of users use 3 or more characters.

I'm not sure what the ramifications are—if any—to use of 2 or 1 characters
for wiki names, but I'm pretty sure that the devs are going to look closely
at these potential problems before modifying anything.  And, likely, that
look will be a pretty low priority.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] Delete Ad-Unit button doesn't work

[Michael Richter]

I'm going to ask what is probably a remarkably stupid question, but what is
an ad-unit?  I can't find mention of it in a(n admittedly cursory)
look-over of the docs.

On 10 August 2012 03:11, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:



 On Thu, Aug 9, 2012 at 2:50 PM, Sergey Sfeli sergey.sf...@gmail.comwrote:

 db_multi_exec(DELETE...) in setup.c (line 1417) deletes an ad-unit and
 then textarea_attribute() adds it back.


 Your work-around is to simply change the text of the ad-unit to an empty
 string.



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[fossil-users] MIME types in Fossil's document server

[Michael Richter]

I'm having a weird problem serving up files in my /doc/tip/*.  Some of the
files I access through that tree are source files.  If the source files are
foo.m (Mercury source), fossil serves them up as MIME type text/html and it
gets displayed nicely in my browser (Firefox 14).  If, however, the source
files are foo.sno (SNOBOL4 source), fossil serves them up as… well, I'm not
absolutely positive.  Firefox reports them as sno File and won't give me
an option to display them, only to download them and/or to associate them
with an application.

Why is Fossil reporting things so differently for .sno files over .m files
and how do I get it to stop?

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] problem with illegal characters

[Michael Richter]

On 8 March 2012 03:18, Gour g...@atmarama.net wrote:

  I already voiced a release engineer's reluctance to pursue Fossil due
  to the restriction of '[]'s.



 I'm with computers since time of Apple's IIe and never encountered need
 to have filenames with '[]'s.


Never worked with VMS then, I'm gathering.  Or a few other such OSes.


 Even if such would arise, I'd try as hard as possible to find workaround
 instead of fiddling with strange bugs which might occur due to shell's
 mechanisms etc., so here I fully agree with Richard's decision.


Sometimes those strange bugs are part of the actual file system and can't
be worked around.

-- 
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Re: [fossil-users] Login seems to be broken. (Showstopping)(Solved)

[Michael Richter]

After a lot of hair-pulling, the problem was solved.

The issue is, as is usual for me, the Great Firewall.  I have a back door to
get around it, but that back door's pipeline is a bit narrow so I don't use
it for all web sites.  Instead I use a PAC file to decide if a given URL is
going to take me through my back door or through a direct link.

The approach I used in the PAC file is if this URL matches any of the
following patterns, go through the proxy, otherwise go direct.  One of my
rules happened to match the login URL for my repositories.  When I was
logging in I was coming in through the proxy, but when I was trying to
access the repository otherwise I was coming in directly.  Confusion ensues.

The solution was, once the problem was identified, trivial: add a snippet of
logic at the head: if this URL matches any of the following patterns, go
direct.  This allows me to insert sites that I know for certain work to
avoid the possibility of accidentally catching up on a proxied URL pattern.

On 12 October 2011 20:40, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 On 12 October 2011 19:01, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:

 On Wed, Oct 12, 2011 at 12:20 AM, Michael Richter 
 ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:

 Using a recent version of fossil (Fossil version 1.19 [6092935ff2]
 2011-10-05 02:03:04) I can't log in to any repository at all (including
 repos I've had up for over a year without a problem) except on the local
 machine.  I've attached an example of this behaviour as an empty repository.
  There are two users on this repo: michael and nii.  The former is
 Super-user and the latter is Developer.  Both have the password 12345.  I
 can only log in as michael when run locally (and, indeed, hitting Logout
 leads me to an Unable to connect message).  When running remotely I can
 access the Login page, but can't actually log in.  It *says* I've been
 logged in, but going anywhere other than the login window says I'm not
 logged in.


 There were some (backwards compatible) security enhancements to login
 about a year ago.  But nothing has changed lately.  What changed on your end
 to make it stop working?


 Well, that's the thing.  I haven't had cause to use Fossil remotely in a
 long time, so I'm not sure what changes happened nor when they did.  I'm
 sniffing the network right now to see what's happening.


 Login uses cookies.  Did you turn off cookies in your browser?


 Nope.  Cookies work fine (except for the ones I've explicitly
 black-listed).


 The login cookie contains (among other things) the first 16 bits of your
 IP address.  Did you switch to IPv6 all of a sudden?  Are you on a
 multiplexed connection where the IP address changes with each packet?


 That, sadly, is a decided possibility.  I'm behind the Great Firewall and
 use some tricksy proxy stuff to get around it.  I'll investigate this angle
 more closely.  It could be that something is triggering a switch through the
 proxy for some transactions only.

 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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[fossil-users] Fwd: Login seems to be broken. (Showstopping)

[Michael Richter]

OK, got tired of waiting for the moderation, so reposting without the
attached repository.  I can mail the repository in question to anybody who
wants to look at it.

-- Forwarded message --
From: Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com
Date: 12 October 2011 12:20
Subject: Login seems to be broken. (Showstopping)
To: fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org


Using a recent version of fossil (Fossil version 1.19 [6092935ff2]
2011-10-05 02:03:04) I can't log in to any repository at all (including
repos I've had up for over a year without a problem) except on the local
machine.  I've attached an example of this behaviour as an empty repository.
 There are two users on this repo: michael and nii.  The former is
Super-user and the latter is Developer.  Both have the password 12345.  I
can only log in as michael when run locally (and, indeed, hitting Logout
leads me to an Unable to connect message).  When running remotely I can
access the Login page, but can't actually log in.  It *says* I've been
logged in, but going anywhere other than the login window says I'm not
logged in.

This behaviour happens on Chromium, Firefox and Opera under Ubuntu 10.04.
 Updating the remote fossil instance to the latest (Fossil version 1.19
[55fb082ae5] 2011-10-11 20:46:54) doesn't change the behaviour in the
slightest.  Any guidance?  Has there been a change I missed, or should I put
up a ticket on this?

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.



-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Login seems to be broken. (Showstopping)

[Michael Richter]

On 12 October 2011 19:01, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:

 On Wed, Oct 12, 2011 at 12:20 AM, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:

 Using a recent version of fossil (Fossil version 1.19 [6092935ff2]
 2011-10-05 02:03:04) I can't log in to any repository at all (including
 repos I've had up for over a year without a problem) except on the local
 machine.  I've attached an example of this behaviour as an empty repository.
  There are two users on this repo: michael and nii.  The former is
 Super-user and the latter is Developer.  Both have the password 12345.  I
 can only log in as michael when run locally (and, indeed, hitting Logout
 leads me to an Unable to connect message).  When running remotely I can
 access the Login page, but can't actually log in.  It *says* I've been
 logged in, but going anywhere other than the login window says I'm not
 logged in.


 There were some (backwards compatible) security enhancements to login about
 a year ago.  But nothing has changed lately.  What changed on your end to
 make it stop working?


Well, that's the thing.  I haven't had cause to use Fossil remotely in a
long time, so I'm not sure what changes happened nor when they did.  I'm
sniffing the network right now to see what's happening.


 Login uses cookies.  Did you turn off cookies in your browser?


Nope.  Cookies work fine (except for the ones I've explicitly black-listed).


 The login cookie contains (among other things) the first 16 bits of your IP
 address.  Did you switch to IPv6 all of a sudden?  Are you on a multiplexed
 connection where the IP address changes with each packet?


That, sadly, is a decided possibility.  I'm behind the Great Firewall and
use some tricksy proxy stuff to get around it.  I'll investigate this angle
more closely.  It could be that something is triggering a switch through the
proxy for some transactions only.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Has any fossil user ever experienced a SHA1 collision?

[Michael Richter]

On 15 September 2011 22:43, Ron Aaron r...@ronware.org wrote:

 On 09/15/2011 05:34 PM, Richard Hipp wrote:
  Using the birthday paradox, I calculated last year that for the
  SQLite repository, if it continues to change and evolve at the same
  rate it has for the previous 10 years, will encounter its first SHA1
  collision in approximately 3.6e20 years



 Oh, sure -- but what will you do then?


Evolve into a more responsible life form that uses SHA-1073741824,
obviously.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] _FOSSIL_ vs. .fos Was: New features for merging

[Michael Richter]

On 13 August 2011 07:31, Joerg Sonnenberger jo...@britannica.bec.de wrote:

 (if you can figure out how to mark _FOSSIL_ as hidden on Windows,
 that would be good too).


The ATTRIB command isn't working for you?

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
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It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] Needed: volunteer to autoconf Fossil

[Michael Richter]

On 14 June 2011 15:57, Stephan Beal sgb...@googlemail.com wrote:

 On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 1:27 AM, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:

 If you have a way other than autoconf to generate a universal build script
 that runs on any unix machine without special software installed, then that
 will be fine.  CMake does not qualify because it is not installed by default
 on most unix boxes.  I think autoconf is probably going to be the only
 general-purpose solution, but I am open to alternatives if you have them.


 /bin/sh

 it's not nearly as painful as the Auto, my ass! Tools.


Mix that with /usr/bin/awk or it will be as painful as the
auto-my-ass-tools.  Luckily Awk is mandated by POSIX so it's guaranteed to
be on any POSIX-compliant system.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
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It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] Needed: volunteer to autoconf Fossil

[Michael Richter]

*A Modest Proposal*
*
*
The problems with the auto* tools are myriad and well-documented in the grey
hairs and bald pates of many a poor soul who's had to put them to use.
 Other environments suggested -- CMake, QMake, Jam, et al -- suffer from
assorted platform problems including (but not limited to):

   1. Not being ported to many potential target platforms (QNX, for
   example).
   2. Supporting some platforms better than others.
   3. Requiring huge resources to get working.

One option -- using a Bourne shell script (perhaps augmented with Awk) --
works well on POSIX-compliant systems but, again, leaves Windows users in
the lurch for no particularly good reason.  (Yes, I know of Cygwin -- and
wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy.  I also know of MinGW/MSYS, but this is
a suboptimal solution for people who don't *want* to Unixify their boxen.)

So...

My proposal is to put all platforms on an even footing.  Generate the
Makefiles using a SNOBOL4 http://www.snobol4.org/ program.  SNOBOL4 isn't
native to *any* platform any longer, but there is a SNOBOL4 implementation
available for a whole lot of systems http://www.snobol4.org/csnobol4/curr/,
and there are very few languages (read: none) that have SNOBOL4's raw power
for text manipulation.

Of course SNOBOL4 isn't on every platform by default, but that, too, is OK.
 The tarball for that SNOBOL4 system is under 3MB uncompressed (under ¾MB
compressed) so we could just include a full SNOBOL4 implementation in Fossil
itself and build it (ironically it uses auto*) as part of the building of
Fossil.

I mean yeah, sure, SNOBOL4 has a pretty funky and odd syntax, but it's far
less painful than auto*
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Re: [fossil-users] Sub-repositories?

[Michael Richter]

Thanks, Richard.  That cleared things up.

On 29 March 2011 20:25, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:



-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58 [SOLVED]

[Michael Richter]

Thanks for all the friendly help I got on this issue and for the near
saintlike patience Richard showed.

The problem has been solved.  I blame China.  (I'm only being a little
bit facetious in this.)

Something Richard asked -- about a proxy that filters anything with
timeline in the URL -- got me thinking.  The pattern I was seeing was
anything involving the timeline view was getting me flagged as not being
logged in.  This only happened with Google Chrome (at first) and not with
Firefox or Opera.  Further it didn't happen on Windows' version of Google
Chrome (along with Firefox and Opera).  It was only with my Ubuntu version
of Chrome and only with remote repositories, not local.

Now for the interesting part.

I routinely use an SSH-based SOCKS5 proxy as a back door through the Great
Firewall because I'm not afraid of the harmful effects of seeing the
Internet in its entirety.  On my Windows machine I just have the proxy
running all the time and use it for all access (for Chrome and Firefox at
any rate -- Opera doesn't support SOCKS5 proxies for some bizarre reason).
 When I log in to a repository from Windows I'm either always going through
the proxy (Chrome/Firefox) or I'm never going through a proxy (Opera).

On Ubuntu I have a slightly more sophisticated setup.  Because my SSH tunnel
is painfully slow, I only use it when I'm forced to.  I've built a sizable
script to decide on an URL-by-URL basis whether it should go through my
proxy or not.  This is irrelevant for Opera, of course, because Opera sucks
for proxy support.  Both Firefox and Chrome, however, support proxies quite
well.

What Chrome DOESN'T do well, however, is quickly turning proxy support on
and off.  My Firefox configuration has a button for it, though.  So
sometimes I run with the proxy script in line and sometimes I don't.
 Initially I didn't have it turned on, so I was just like Opera -- running
without a proxy.  Sometime in the few days I was playing I turned it on for
accessing some site the Chinese government decided my tender eyes couldn't
cope with (Youtube) and then, a day later, long after I'd forgotten that I'd
done it, I tried accessing my repositories with Firefox and the bit rot
happened.

This doesn't explain the odd specificity of the problem, however.  What does
is the URL patterns I use.  Usually I give URL patterns for domains (*
youtube.com*) or by path elements known to be problematical (*/blog/*).
 For safety's sake I always try to locate it either with a full domain name
or with path elements in the pattern.  But I made a mistake at some point
and when I meant to type *time.com* I accidentally wound up inserting
*time*.  The relevance of that pattern to the timeline issue is, I
think, obvious.  I did grep on timeline after Richard suggested this
possibility but it never occurred to me until later in the shower (I do a
lot of my thinking there) that there might be other fragments (time or
line) that could be to blame.  I went over my (literally hundreds of)
filters with a fine-toothed comb and found the offending script entry.

So why did this not cause a problem for local repositories?  Why did this
not cause a problem when I went through Richard's sockettee thing?  Well, I
automatically, at the head of my script, return the direct link for any
access to localhost, to my local network and a few other such entries where
I know I can't physically ever be blocked by the Great Firewall.  Since
sockettee goes through localhost, and since fossil server/ui also goes
through localhost there was never any kind of filtering.

TL;DR summary: if you're using complex scripts to work around people with
the mentality of small, frightened children controlling your Internet,
sometimes it'll do bizarre, undiagnosable things.  Fossil is blameless.  The
stupid bastards in Beijing are another matter.  (And my own intellect is
apparently somewhat questionable as well.)

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

More data on this problem.  It's now happening to me on Firefox.  A repo
that was working fine for me with Firefox for several days (but not Chrome
-- no repo ever works with Chrome) has suddenly developed the same disease
using Firefox.  I'm logged in.  I can see everything clearly.  Except the
timeline view which insists I'm logged out, no matter what name I happen to
be logged in under.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

And more data: It seems Firefox is just plain tainted now -- I can't access
the timeline view on ANY fossil repository, just like the problem I had for
Chrome.

On 24 March 2011 00:45, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 More data on this problem.  It's now happening to me on Firefox.  A repo
 that was working fine for me with Firefox for several days (but not Chrome
 -- no repo ever works with Chrome) has suddenly developed the same disease
 using Firefox.  I'm logged in.  I can see everything clearly.  Except the
 timeline view which insists I'm logged out, no matter what name I happen to
 be logged in under.

 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

And yet more data.  If I turn on history view for user nobody the problem
vanishes.

The problem seems to be some very bad interaction between the login
credentials and the check for those in the timeline view.  I'm not sure why
the bit rot with Firefox happened, but perhaps it shows a problem in the
cookie management?

On 24 March 2011 00:47, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 And more data: It seems Firefox is just plain tainted now -- I can't access
 the timeline view on ANY fossil repository, just like the problem I had for
 Chrome.


 On 24 March 2011 00:45, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 More data on this problem.  It's now happening to me on Firefox.  A repo
 that was working fine for me with Firefox for several days (but not Chrome
 -- no repo ever works with Chrome) has suddenly developed the same disease
 using Firefox.  I'm logged in.  I can see everything clearly.  Except the
 timeline view which insists I'm logged out, no matter what name I happen to
 be logged in under.

 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

And another data point.  I can't see the timeline SETTINGS from the admin
panel.  So I log in.  I click on Admin.  I click on Timeline.  I'm thrown to
the login page.

On 24 March 2011 01:01, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 And yet more data.  If I turn on history view for user nobody the problem
 vanishes.

 The problem seems to be some very bad interaction between the login
 credentials and the check for those in the timeline view.  I'm not sure why
 the bit rot with Firefox happened, but perhaps it shows a problem in the
 cookie management?


 On 24 March 2011 00:47, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 And more data: It seems Firefox is just plain tainted now -- I can't
 access the timeline view on ANY fossil repository, just like the problem I
 had for Chrome.


 On 24 March 2011 00:45, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 More data on this problem.  It's now happening to me on Firefox.  A repo
 that was working fine for me with Firefox for several days (but not Chrome
 -- no repo ever works with Chrome) has suddenly developed the same disease
 using Firefox.  I'm logged in.  I can see everything clearly.  Except the
 timeline view which insists I'm logged out, no matter what name I happen to
 be logged in under.

 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

I've tried this (and just retried it in Firefox) and in Chrome I even took
the extreme measure of disabling all extensions and then switching to
private browsing mode.  Still no dice.

On 24 March 2011 01:00, Douglas Fitzmaurice dig...@gmail.com wrote:

 Does switching to Private mode on either browser have any effect?
 It should be an easy way to avoid any local cookies or extensions (in
 Chrome) from interfering with the process.

 On 23 March 2011 16:47, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 And more data: It seems Firefox is just plain tainted now -- I can't
 access the timeline view on ANY fossil repository, just like the problem I
 had for Chrome.


 On 24 March 2011 00:45, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 More data on this problem.  It's now happening to me on Firefox.  A repo
 that was working fine for me with Firefox for several days (but not Chrome
 -- no repo ever works with Chrome) has suddenly developed the same disease
 using Firefox.  I'm logged in.  I can see everything clearly.  Except the
 timeline view which insists I'm logged out, no matter what name I happen to
 be logged in under.

 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.

 ___
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 fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org
 http://lists.fossil-scm.org:8080/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fossil-users



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-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

To clarify further, the problem doesn't VANISH if I turn on history view for
user nobody.  I'm still flagged as logged out and I still can't configure
the timeline from the admin panel.  I can, however, see and interact with
the timeline which allows me to use my repositories at least in the short
term.  As a long term solution, however, it stinks.  :(

On 24 March 2011 01:05, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 And another data point.  I can't see the timeline SETTINGS from the admin
 panel.  So I log in.  I click on Admin.  I click on Timeline.  I'm thrown to
 the login page.


 On 24 March 2011 01:01, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 And yet more data.  If I turn on history view for user nobody the problem
 vanishes.

 The problem seems to be some very bad interaction between the login
 credentials and the check for those in the timeline view.  I'm not sure why
 the bit rot with Firefox happened, but perhaps it shows a problem in the
 cookie management?


 On 24 March 2011 00:47, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 And more data: It seems Firefox is just plain tainted now -- I can't
 access the timeline view on ANY fossil repository, just like the problem I
 had for Chrome.


 On 24 March 2011 00:45, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 More data on this problem.  It's now happening to me on Firefox.  A repo
 that was working fine for me with Firefox for several days (but not Chrome
 -- no repo ever works with Chrome) has suddenly developed the same disease
 using Firefox.  I'm logged in.  I can see everything clearly.  Except the
 timeline view which insists I'm logged out, no matter what name I happen to
 be logged in under.

 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the
 discussions of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the
 Chinese people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil
 mantra.




 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

On 24 March 2011 01:17, Douglas Fitzmaurice dig...@gmail.com wrote:

 Are you able to make a Wireshark capture of the traffic from one of these
 requests?
 There is a tutorial on capturing using Ubuntu here:
 http://www.howtoforge.com/network-analysis-with-wireshark-on-ubuntu-9.10
 (Apologies if you know how to use it, it does start with baby steps!)


It looks like I'm going to have to try wireshark next.  This is getting
disturbingly ridiculous.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

On 24 March 2011 01:14, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:

 Do you have some strange proxy that is rewriting URLs that contain the
 keyword timeline in them?


Not to my knowledge, no.  I mean I have a proxy I use to get around the
Great Firewall, but I'm pretty sure that timeline isn't in my list of
patterns (as in I just grepped on it).


 Does http://server/path/test_env show anything interesting or helpful?


OK, let's take a look.  First hitting a repo's base URL while not logged in:

uid=33, gid=33
 g.zBaseURL = http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe
 g.zTop = /repos/microbe
 CONTENT_LENGTH = 0
 HTTP_COOKIE =
 fossil_login_0f664cb5=1%2F4A9C4FFA107651AF574A8EDF5A856376E718E436DDA284B08C
 HTTP_HOST = halfbaked.doesntexist.org
 PATH_INFO = /test_env
 REMOTE_ADDR = 221.234.159.113
 SCRIPT_NAME = /repos/microbe
 fossil_login_0f664cb5 =
 1/4A9C4FFA107651AF574A8EDF5A856376E718E436DDA284B08C


Now I'll log in:


 uid=33, gid=33
 g.zBaseURL = http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe
 g.zTop = /repos/microbe
 CONTENT_LENGTH = 0
 HTTP_COOKIE =
 fossil_login_0f664cb5=1%2F25F7E9D6B9F86E8A25D3B2874BD28D2A6858ABCB71BB83B23B
 HTTP_HOST = halfbaked.doesntexist.org
 PATH_INFO = /test_env
 REMOTE_ADDR = 221.234.159.113
 SCRIPT_NAME = /repos/microbe
 fossil_login_0f664cb5 =
 1/25F7E9D6B9F86E8A25D3B2874BD28D2A6858ABCB71BB83B23B


Now I'll hit the timeline:

...

OK, now when I go to
http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe/test_envI get ... the
timeline view, not the test view.

So I don't know what the server is seeing.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

On 24 March 2011 04:05, Joshua Paine jos...@letterblock.com wrote:

 On 03/23/2011 01:01 PM, Michael Richter wrote:
  I'm not sure why the bit rot with Firefox happened



 Did you just upgrade? 4.0 final came out in the last couple days.


Nope.  It's still 3.6.15 here.


 We really need that wireshark packet capture to make sense of this.


Yeah, it's looking this way.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

Oops.  I didn't see this, Richard.  Sorry.  I'll get this set up now and
send you the results.

Once I figure out how to get Tcl working.  :)

On 17 March 2011 01:21, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:

 On Wed, Mar 16, 2011 at 11:30 AM, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:


 OK, this is the sequence I've tried on my main workstation (Ubuntu 10.04):

 1.  Delete all fossil-scm.org cookies.
 2.  Close my browser (Chrome 10.0.648.134).
 3.  Re-open my browser.
 4.  Go to fossil-scm.org.
 5.  Log in.
 6.  Click on Timeline.

 Result: you are not logged in.

 If I repeat this experiment on my backup machine (Windows XP,
 Chrome 10.0.648.133) I do not have this problem.  Curious about that, I
 tried other browsers (Opera, Firefox) on my main machine again.  Again I
 don't have this problem.

 The issue seems specific to Chrome under Linux in my case.  I have no idea
 how to proceed from here on however because I can't figure out what could be
 going wrong that affects only Fossil and nothing else, especially since I
 killed all cookies related to the fossil-scm.org domain.

 Any suggestions or ideas on what's next to investigate?


 The attachment is a Tcl/Tk script that sets up a TCP/IP proxy.  Please make
 it point to http://www.fossil-scm.org/ and then point your Chrome browser
 at the proxy.  Record your traffic.  Send me what you see.


 --
 D. Richard Hipp
 d...@sqlite.org




-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

On 21 March 2011 22:21, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:



 On Mon, Mar 21, 2011 at 10:01 AM, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:

 OK, perhaps I'm being as thick as a whale omlette here, but I cannot get
 this to work at all.

 First attempt: relay-to was set to www.fossil-scm.org:80, listen was
 set to 8180.  I access http://localhost:8180 and I get ... the SQLite
 home page, not Fossil's.  Tinkering around with various values for
 relay-to always gets me either SQLite's home page or error messages.

 What, precisely, should I be setting up in there?


 Bummer.

 www.sqlite.org and www.fossil-scm.org use the same IP address.  The web
 server distinguishes between them by looking at the HOST: parameter in the
 HTTP header.  But with the setup above, the HOST: parameter is being set to
 localhost:8180 which the web server then defaults to SQLite.

 I'm not sure how to work around that.  Anybody else have any ideas on how
 to eavesdrop on the TCP/IP connection between the web browser and the Fossil
 web server?


Can you set up a dummy fossil repo on that machine at any other port and
give it the account error password check for logging in?

As another data point, if I use fossil ui, I have no problem logging in and
seeing the timeline properly.  The same applies if I run fossil server on a
remote machine and connect -- indeed the very same machine I'm having
problems with in my official repos.  The problem seems to lie specifically
in repos that are CGI-enabled.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

On 21 March 2011 23:30, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:

 On Mon, Mar 21, 2011 at 11:10 AM, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:

 Try running the experiment here:  http://www.sqlite.org/debug1



 OK, I can log in and see the timeline properly here.  Are you running this
 through CGI or is this just a fossil server running straight up?



 It is exactly the same CGI script as runs the native Fossil website.


 That is very odd.

So, I've just now done the following two tests:

1.  Went to http://www.sqlite.org/debug1 directly in the browser, logged in,
accessed the timeline page.
2.  Used sockettee directing to www.sqlite.org:80 and went to
http://localhost:8180/debug1, logged in, accessed the timeline page.

The first test fails.  The timeline view is never logged in while everything
else is.

The second test succeeds.  I can access any page and be logged in.

This is getting weirder by the minute.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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[fossil-users] Ticket 305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58

[Michael Richter]

The ticket
http://fossil-scm.org/index.html/tktview/305143bd876f693f446f78d12dbef143c46eec58
is
moving into show-stopper territory for me.  I'm trying to share a
repository's code through fossil to fossil non-users.  The inability to log
in in the timeline views means no ability to bundle up ZIP/TAR files.

Could someone look into this and let me know either what the problem is or
what stupid thing I'm doing?

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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[fossil-users] $home, et al in headers and footers

[Michael Richter]

I'm trying to do some stuff with base urls in my header and I can't seem to
get it to work.  Part of the problem is that $home is a relative address.
 It occurs to me that I have absolutely no idea what all the $variables are
in Fossil.  Is there a list of them anywhere (I couldn't find one in the
mailing list or the main site) or is there a file I should look at in the
source?

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] $home, et al in headers and footers

[Michael Richter]

 On Fri, Jan 28, 2011 at 11:36 AM, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:

 I'm trying to do some stuff with base urls in my header and I can't seem
 to get it to work.  Part of the problem is that $home is a relative address.
  It occurs to me that I have absolutely no idea what all the $variables are
 in Fossil.  Is there a list of them anywhere (I couldn't find one in the
 mailing list or the main site) or is there a file I should look at in the
 source?


 Look at the style_header() function in the style.c source file for the TH1
 variables that get set.  They are:  $project_name, $title, $baseurl, $home,
 $index_page, $current_page, $manifest_version, $manifest_date,
 $manifest_name, and $login.


Thanks, Richard.  Exactly what the doctor ordered!

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Hello. Anyone for source highlighting?

[Michael Richter]

As another option on this there's a pretty good JavaScript-based code
colorizer out there.  The colorizer could be built-in for common languages
and could be pointed at the repository itself for including project-specific
language configurations with ease.  This would trump calling external
scripts that aren't guaranteed to work cross-platform.

On 8 November 2010 20:51, Gour g...@atmarama.net wrote:

 On Mon, 8 Nov 2010 21:51:19 +1030
  Martin == Martin Sandiford wrote:

 Martin Look forward to some feedback, and thanks again for the great
 Martin tool.

 Very nice. Thank you!

 I've just checked GNU library and see there is even support for D
 sources. :-)


 Sincerely,
 Gour

 --

 Gour  | Hlapicina, Croatia  | GPG key: CDBF17CA
 

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Re: [fossil-users] Possible to export revision history?

[Michael Richter]

On 24 September 2010 03:20, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:

 The deconstruct method is fossil's equivalent to fast-export.  Why does
 this not meet your needs and what exactly are you looking for?  Are you
 wanting an export in the git-specific format?  How could we export wiki and
 tickets in that case?


What deconstruct method?

mich...@isolde:~$ fossil help

Usage: fossil help COMMAND.

Available COMMANDs:

addco leaves rename ui

allcommit ls revert undo

annotate   configuration  merge  rm unset

artifact   delete mv scrub  update

branch descendantsnewsearch user

cgidiff   open   server version

changesextras pull   settings   wiki

checkout   finfo  push   sha1sumzip

ci gdiff  rebuildstatus

clean  help   reconstructsync

clone  http   redo   tag

close  info   remote-url timeline

This is fossil version [1516a26dc8] 2010-09-16 14:13:51 UTC

mich...@isolde:~$ fossil help deconstruct

fossil: unknown command: deconstruct

mich...@isolde:~$ fossil deconstruct

fossil: unknown command: deconstruct

fossil: use help for more information


I see a reconstruct there, but no matching deconstruct.  Did I do something
bad when building?

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil redirect loop

[Michael Richter]

OK, I simply cannot find a sequence that replicates this bug.  I lost the
broken repo (which I thought I'd backed up) and I can't find anything that
gives me redirect loops.  The only clues we have are that a) there is
something that generates redirect loops, b) this something survives a
cloning and c) this something doesn't survive a configuration reset all.
 That's pretty slim pickings for debugging.  :(

On 19 September 2010 10:33, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 Dammit.  Scratch that.  I don't have the backup anymore.  :(


 On 19 September 2010 10:21, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 It occurs to me that I still have the broken repo as a backup.  Would you
 be interested in seeing it?


 On 19 September 2010 07:48, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:



 On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 7:23 PM, Michael Richter 
 ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:

 OK, so I fixed it shortly before crashing for the night.  I'll go over
 what I did to fix it, but can't help you on the what's causing the 
 redirect
 loop thing because I really have no clue.  The only even remotely relevant
 change I can think of having done was changing the home to point away from
 an internal document back to /home.

 First, trying to access specific URLs (like /setup) just didn't work.
  Everything got thrown into a redirect loop.

 Second, cloning the repo didn't fix the problem.  Whatever the problem
 was it's something that lives through a cloning.

 What did work in the end was fossil configuration reset all.  After
 doing that I had an accessible repository again that allowed me to change
 everything.  I'll tinker around sometime today to see if I can replicate
 this problem.


 That's a good one to remember.  When the repository is not accessible:

 fossil config reset all

 I would have suggested that earlier, but I had forgotten about it.
 Hopefully l will remember next time.  :-)

 Please do try to replication your problem so that we can set about fixing
 it.





 On 18 September 2010 21:44, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:



 On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 7:53 AM, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com
  wrote:

 I've got a fossil repository I can't touch because of something being
 reported as a redirect loop.  Firefox just gives a user-friendly 
 error
 with no useful information.


 With fossil ui running, try manually moving to the setup pages by
 typing in a URL like this:

 http://localhost:8080/setup

 Can you give me some clues as to what is causing the redirect loop so
 that I can fix the problem in the Fossil code?




  Chrome gives a bit more:

 This webpage has a redirect loop.

 The webpage at *http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe/home* has
 resulted in too many redirects. Clearing your cookies for this site or
 allowing third-party cookies may fix the problem. If not, it is possibly 
 a
 server configuration issue and not a problem with your computer.
  Here are some suggestions:

- Reload http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe/home this
web page later.
- Learn 
 morehttp://www.google.com/support/chrome/bin/answer.py?answer=95626hl=en-US
  about
this problem.

  More information on this error

 Below is the original error message
 Error 310 (net::ERR_TOO_MANY_REDIRECTS): There were too many
 redirects.
 The problem is I get this both on a local repository (i.e. fossil
 server or fossil ui) and on my remote one.  So I can't actually, you 
 know,
 access my repository to administer it.  Can anybody give me an idea of 
 how
 to get around this problem that doesn't involve losing all my previous 
 work?

 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the
 discussions of entering China our focus has really been what's best for 
 the
 Chinese people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil
 mantra.

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 --
 D. Richard Hipp
 d...@sqlite.org

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 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the
 discussions of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the
 Chinese people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil
 mantra.

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 --
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 d...@sqlite.org

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[fossil-users] Fossil redirect loop

[Michael Richter]

I've got a fossil repository I can't touch because of something being
reported as a redirect loop.  Firefox just gives a user-friendly error
with no useful information.  Chrome gives a bit more:

This webpage has a redirect loop.

The webpage at *http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe/home* has
resulted in too many redirects. Clearing your cookies for this site or
allowing third-party cookies may fix the problem. If not, it is possibly a
server configuration issue and not a problem with your computer.
Here are some suggestions:

   - Reload http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe/home this web
   page later.
   - Learn 
morehttp://www.google.com/support/chrome/bin/answer.py?answer=95626hl=en-US
about
   this problem.

 More information on this error

Below is the original error message
Error 310 (net::ERR_TOO_MANY_REDIRECTS): There were too many redirects.
The problem is I get this both on a local repository (i.e. fossil server or
fossil ui) and on my remote one.  So I can't actually, you know, access my
repository to administer it.  Can anybody give me an idea of how to get
around this problem that doesn't involve losing all my previous work?

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil redirect loop

[Michael Richter]

OK, so I fixed it shortly before crashing for the night.  I'll go over what
I did to fix it, but can't help you on the what's causing the redirect
loop thing because I really have no clue.  The only even remotely relevant
change I can think of having done was changing the home to point away from
an internal document back to /home.

First, trying to access specific URLs (like /setup) just didn't work.
 Everything got thrown into a redirect loop.

Second, cloning the repo didn't fix the problem.  Whatever the problem was
it's something that lives through a cloning.

What did work in the end was fossil configuration reset all.  After doing
that I had an accessible repository again that allowed me to change
everything.  I'll tinker around sometime today to see if I can replicate
this problem.

On 18 September 2010 21:44, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:



 On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 7:53 AM, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:

 I've got a fossil repository I can't touch because of something being
 reported as a redirect loop.  Firefox just gives a user-friendly error
 with no useful information.


 With fossil ui running, try manually moving to the setup pages by typing
 in a URL like this:

 http://localhost:8080/setup

 Can you give me some clues as to what is causing the redirect loop so that
 I can fix the problem in the Fossil code?




  Chrome gives a bit more:

 This webpage has a redirect loop.

 The webpage at *http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe/home* has
 resulted in too many redirects. Clearing your cookies for this site or
 allowing third-party cookies may fix the problem. If not, it is possibly a
 server configuration issue and not a problem with your computer.
  Here are some suggestions:

- Reload http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe/home this
web page later.
- Learn 
 morehttp://www.google.com/support/chrome/bin/answer.py?answer=95626hl=en-US
  about
this problem.

  More information on this error

 Below is the original error message
 Error 310 (net::ERR_TOO_MANY_REDIRECTS): There were too many redirects.
 The problem is I get this both on a local repository (i.e. fossil server
 or fossil ui) and on my remote one.  So I can't actually, you know, access
 my repository to administer it.  Can anybody give me an idea of how to get
 around this problem that doesn't involve losing all my previous work?

 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.

 ___
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 --
 D. Richard Hipp
 d...@sqlite.org

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-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil redirect loop

[Michael Richter]

It occurs to me that I still have the broken repo as a backup.  Would you be
interested in seeing it?

On 19 September 2010 07:48, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:



 On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 7:23 PM, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:

 OK, so I fixed it shortly before crashing for the night.  I'll go over
 what I did to fix it, but can't help you on the what's causing the redirect
 loop thing because I really have no clue.  The only even remotely relevant
 change I can think of having done was changing the home to point away from
 an internal document back to /home.

 First, trying to access specific URLs (like /setup) just didn't work.
  Everything got thrown into a redirect loop.

 Second, cloning the repo didn't fix the problem.  Whatever the problem was
 it's something that lives through a cloning.

 What did work in the end was fossil configuration reset all.  After doing
 that I had an accessible repository again that allowed me to change
 everything.  I'll tinker around sometime today to see if I can replicate
 this problem.


 That's a good one to remember.  When the repository is not accessible:

 fossil config reset all

 I would have suggested that earlier, but I had forgotten about it.
 Hopefully l will remember next time.  :-)

 Please do try to replication your problem so that we can set about fixing
 it.





 On 18 September 2010 21:44, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:



 On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 7:53 AM, Michael Richter 
 ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:

 I've got a fossil repository I can't touch because of something being
 reported as a redirect loop.  Firefox just gives a user-friendly error
 with no useful information.


 With fossil ui running, try manually moving to the setup pages by
 typing in a URL like this:

 http://localhost:8080/setup

 Can you give me some clues as to what is causing the redirect loop so
 that I can fix the problem in the Fossil code?




  Chrome gives a bit more:

 This webpage has a redirect loop.

 The webpage at *http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe/home* has
 resulted in too many redirects. Clearing your cookies for this site or
 allowing third-party cookies may fix the problem. If not, it is possibly a
 server configuration issue and not a problem with your computer.
  Here are some suggestions:

- Reload http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe/home this
web page later.
- Learn 
 morehttp://www.google.com/support/chrome/bin/answer.py?answer=95626hl=en-US
  about
this problem.

  More information on this error

 Below is the original error message
 Error 310 (net::ERR_TOO_MANY_REDIRECTS): There were too many redirects.
 The problem is I get this both on a local repository (i.e. fossil server
 or fossil ui) and on my remote one.  So I can't actually, you know, access
 my repository to administer it.  Can anybody give me an idea of how to get
 around this problem that doesn't involve losing all my previous work?

 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the
 discussions of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the
 Chinese people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil
 mantra.

 ___
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 --
 D. Richard Hipp
 d...@sqlite.org

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 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.

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 --
 D. Richard Hipp
 d...@sqlite.org

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-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil redirect loop

[Michael Richter]

Dammit.  Scratch that.  I don't have the backup anymore.  :(

On 19 September 2010 10:21, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 It occurs to me that I still have the broken repo as a backup.  Would you
 be interested in seeing it?


 On 19 September 2010 07:48, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:



 On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 7:23 PM, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:

 OK, so I fixed it shortly before crashing for the night.  I'll go over
 what I did to fix it, but can't help you on the what's causing the redirect
 loop thing because I really have no clue.  The only even remotely relevant
 change I can think of having done was changing the home to point away from
 an internal document back to /home.

 First, trying to access specific URLs (like /setup) just didn't work.
  Everything got thrown into a redirect loop.

 Second, cloning the repo didn't fix the problem.  Whatever the problem
 was it's something that lives through a cloning.

 What did work in the end was fossil configuration reset all.  After doing
 that I had an accessible repository again that allowed me to change
 everything.  I'll tinker around sometime today to see if I can replicate
 this problem.


 That's a good one to remember.  When the repository is not accessible:

 fossil config reset all

 I would have suggested that earlier, but I had forgotten about it.
 Hopefully l will remember next time.  :-)

 Please do try to replication your problem so that we can set about fixing
 it.





 On 18 September 2010 21:44, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:



 On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 7:53 AM, Michael Richter 
 ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:

 I've got a fossil repository I can't touch because of something being
 reported as a redirect loop.  Firefox just gives a user-friendly error
 with no useful information.


 With fossil ui running, try manually moving to the setup pages by
 typing in a URL like this:

 http://localhost:8080/setup

 Can you give me some clues as to what is causing the redirect loop so
 that I can fix the problem in the Fossil code?




  Chrome gives a bit more:

 This webpage has a redirect loop.

 The webpage at *http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe/home* has
 resulted in too many redirects. Clearing your cookies for this site or
 allowing third-party cookies may fix the problem. If not, it is possibly a
 server configuration issue and not a problem with your computer.
  Here are some suggestions:

- Reload http://halfbaked.doesntexist.org/repos/microbe/home this
web page later.
- Learn 
 morehttp://www.google.com/support/chrome/bin/answer.py?answer=95626hl=en-US
  about
this problem.

  More information on this error

 Below is the original error message
 Error 310 (net::ERR_TOO_MANY_REDIRECTS): There were too many redirects.
 The problem is I get this both on a local repository (i.e. fossil
 server or fossil ui) and on my remote one.  So I can't actually, you know,
 access my repository to administer it.  Can anybody give me an idea of how
 to get around this problem that doesn't involve losing all my previous 
 work?

 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the
 discussions of entering China our focus has really been what's best for 
 the
 Chinese people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil
 mantra.

 ___
 fossil-users mailing list
 fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org
 http://lists.fossil-scm.org:8080/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fossil-users




 --
 D. Richard Hipp
 d...@sqlite.org

 ___
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 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.

 ___
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 --
 D. Richard Hipp
 d...@sqlite.org

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 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue

Re: [fossil-users] Why has fossil stopped signing things?

[Michael Richter]

*$ fossil setting*
...
clearsign
...
pgp-command
...


No setting which means, I assume, defaults.

On 2 August 2010 06:22, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:

 What are your:

fossil setting clearsign
fossil setting pgp-command

 On Sat, Jul 31, 2010 at 12:19 PM, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.comwrote:

 Over the past couple of days Fossil has stopped signing my transactions.
  I can't for the life of me figure out why.  What is it that fossil looks
 for to decide whether it signs or not?

 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.

 ___
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 --
 -
 D. Richard Hipp
 d...@sqlite.org

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-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese people.
It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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Re: [fossil-users] Why has fossil stopped signing things?

[Michael Richter]

Ah!  That could be the problem then.

On 2 August 2010 10:17, Joshua Paine jos...@letterblock.com wrote:

 Little while ago fossil stopped signing by default--Richard concluded it
 was confusing and/or irritating to more people than liked it. Should work
 again if you turn it on (by GUI or command line).

 Joshua Paine
 LetterBlock: Web applications built with joy
 http://letterblock.com/
 301-576-1920
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Re: [fossil-users] Skins

[Michael Richter]

I'm out of commission on this temporarily since I've been bitten by the
upgrade bug and am now in reinstallation Hell.

On 26 July 2010 03:20, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:



 On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 1:25 PM, Zed A. Shaw zeds...@zedshaw.com wrote:

 On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 07:39:28PM +0800, Michael Richter wrote:
  Looking more into the skinning issue, it looks to me like the file
 skins.c
  contains a bunch of stuff that could be generated trivially from a
 script of
  some sort.  Is there any interest in me making the skinning system more
  flexible so it's easier to add a new skin by basically just checking in
  three files under a new directory?  The idea would be something like
 this:

 I think that'd work at first, but just to be clear, this means that you
 can only change the look of a fossil site by recompiling the binary
 right?  A more useful solution would one that doesn't require a
 recompile.


 You can always customize a skin, just as you do now.  I think the idea is
 that there are more built-in prepackaged skins that you can use as starting
 points or templates.  Only the built-ins are compiled in.

 Use the fossil configuration export skin command to export a file
 containing a skin for export to others.  Or fossil configuration import to
 start using a skin previously exported by somebody else.




 --

 Zed A. Shaw
 http://zedshaw.com/
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 d...@sqlite.org

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[fossil-users] Skins

[Michael Richter]

The skins available in the default build of fossil seem to be mislabelled.

When I select the one labelled plain grey, no logo, I get a plain grey
theme with a big lighter-grey box that occupies 3/4 of the top
(left-aligned) with a logo in the middle.  khaki, no logo is what it says
on the box.  Black  white, menu on the left is as well, except it doesn't
mention not having a logo.  It doesn't have a logo, however.

Also, weren't there more skins than these three contributed?  Zed Shaw
referred to a wedding white that I've seen mentioned before but I'm not
seeing it.  I'm sure there were others.

-- 
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Re: [fossil-users] Skins

[Michael Richter]

Looking more into the skinning issue, it looks to me like the file skins.c
contains a bunch of stuff that could be generated trivially from a script of
some sort.  Is there any interest in me making the skinning system more
flexible so it's easier to add a new skin by basically just checking in
three files under a new directory?  The idea would be something like this:

fossil source root
| ...
+- skins
| |
| +- skinname1
| | |
| | +- skininfo.txt
| | |
| | +- style.css
| | |
| | +- header.html
| | |
| | +- footer.html
| |
| +- skinname2
| ...

Then inside src would be a utility like translate that walks over all the
subdirectories of ./skins, grabs the explanatory information from
skininfo.txt, grabs the style, header and footer code and builds skins.c
exactly as it is now (but with more skins, naturally) before translate is
run on it and fossil as a whole is built.

The advantage to this system is that people can add new skins easily,
without any C hacking, by simply providing four files under a subdirectory
of ./skins:

   - skininfo.txt provides the name of the skin, a brief description and
   (optionally) the name of the author.
   - style.css, header.html and footer.html just do what their respective
   sections in skins.c do.

A further advantage is that people unfamiliar with C won't accidentally
insert subtle, hard-to-catch bugs.

-- 
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It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] add empty directory

[Michael Richter]

On 13 July 2010 00:35, Sergey Volkov s...@mooby.org wrote:

 12.07.2010 19:05, Joshua Paine пишет:
  I have needed this also, and I do: `touch empty_dir/dir; fossil add
  empty_dir`
 
 

 So to add empty directory i need to create any empty file in it?
 for example
   mkdir empty_dir
   touch empty_dir/.empty
   fossil add empty_dir

 i should work, i think, of course directory will not by empty :)


To avoid any confusion, I'd suggest touch empty_dir/.not-quite-empty.

-- 
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Re: [fossil-users] Makefile

[Michael Richter]

OK, this *really* is the last thing before bed.  I've documented the new
build system (somewhat) here:
http://fossil-scm.org/index.html/wiki?name=New+Build+Documentation

On 10 July 2010 01:54, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 Last thing before I go to bed, I've tagged the relevant check-ins
 newbuild.


 On 10 July 2010 01:43, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 Did I say tomorrow?  I decided sleep is an optional and highly-artificial
 construct.  MingGW32 builds are tested, corrected and checked-in.

 http://fossil-scm.org/index.html/timeline?p=7496


 On 10 July 2010 00:30, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com wrote:

 I've checked in my first try at re-organizing the build files.  You can
 take a look at my changes at
 http://fossil-scm.org/index.html/info/d3252d7488 or by *fossil update
 ttmrichter* to switch over to my branch.

 Currently I've only tested Linux builds using both gcc and clang as the
 compiler.  I have not had the opportunity to test the mingw32/msys build and
 won't be getting around to that until tomorrow.

 Anybody using MacOS or (Open)Solaris is welcome to try making makefile
 fragments suited to those environments based on the fragments already
 available as a model.  I will never be able to make a MacOS-specific build,
 lacking, you know, a Mac, but I will be firing up an OpenSolaris environment
 over the next few days to try my hand at an OpenSolaris build.

 Feedback is welcomed.




 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




 --
 Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions
 of entering China our focus has really been what's best for the Chinese
 people. It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
 --Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.




-- 
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--Sergey Brin, demonstrating the emptiness of the don't be evil mantra.
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[fossil-users] Makefile

[Michael Richter]

I'd like to re-engineer the Makefile approach in fossil so that it's easier
to work out what needs to be put in place for any given platform.  Is there
enough interest in this that it's worth doing the work in my private branch
for inspection?

-- 
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Re: [fossil-users] Makefile

[Michael Richter]

I'm looking more at having separate included .mk files for platform-specific
stuff as well as better support for compiling under Windows as you've noted.
 Ideally I'd like to have a decent selection of platforms including:
- Linux
- *BSD
- Solaris
- Windows

I'd also like to explore making compiler choices configurable through simple
environment variable settings or the like with support for these out of the
box:
- gcc (obviously)
- clang
- Visual Studio?


On 7 July 2010 18:34, Paul Ruizendaal p...@planet.nl wrote:

 On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 16:34:31 +0800, Michael Richter ttmrich...@gmail.com
 wrote:
  I'd like to re-engineer the Makefile approach in fossil so that it's
 easier
  to work out what needs to be put in place for any given platform.  Is
 there
  enough interest in this that it's worth doing the work in my private
 branch
  for inspection?

 I find that building on Linux and FreeBSD works out of the box, and I'm
 told that cross-building Win executables on Linux with gcc-mingw installed
 also works out of the box. Building on Windows itself with gcc-mingw
 doesn't work for me (just mingw installed, not cygwin or msys). I keep
 finding myself making the following adjustments to Makefile and
 src/main.mk:

 - change from slash to backslash in the file paths
 - create VERSION.h by hand: even with awk installed, the quoting involved
 doesn't work

 There was an attempt to fix both issues a few weeks back, but is was a
 botched attempt and the changes were backed out. The slash/backslash thing
 should not be too hard to correct, and I'm thinking to have a little C
 program to generate VERSION.h instead of using awk for that. The source is
 already heavily preprocessed, so building one more tool should not upset
 the build design.

 Perhaps others can comment on building fossil on OS X and Solaris.

 How can I help?

 Paul

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Re: [fossil-users] Features request

[Michael Richter]

On 30 June 2010 21:24, Joshua Paine jos...@letterblock.com wrote:

 On 06/30/2010 01:52 AM, Ruslan Popov wrote:
  When I use git I like its feature to do 'more' showing huge diff.
  Especially it would be convinient for fossil on Windows.

 `fossil diff | more`  Windows doesn't have much of a command line
 environment, but that much at least works on my Windows XP test machine.


I remember when the Unix philosophy was espoused as a collection of tools,
each of which does one thing well, connected together by pipes.

Now it seems Unix is a collection of tools, each of which is bloated with
overlapping functionality that is none of it very good.

Why does git replicate functionality in a utility that's been in Unix (and
Windows (and OS/2 (and DOS (and even the DEC OSes in some form or
another since time immemorial?

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It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] filename contains illegal characters

[Michael Richter]

On 28 June 2010 21:20, Kevin Greiner grein...@gmail.com wrote:

 For a few files I see the following error:
fossil: filename contains illegal characters: prep_20100113[1] clean/
 135816_0001.ps

 I understand it's the square brackets that are causing this error but not
 why this is by design. Could someone explain the rationale?

 Also, is there a way to get these files into fossil without renaming them?


Well, looking in file.c for the function file_is_simple_pathname (failure of
which causes that error in add.c), I see:

/*
** Return true if the filename given is a valid filename for
** a file in a repository.  Valid filenames follow all of the
** following rules:
**
** *  Does not begin with /
** *  Does not contain any path element named . or ..
** *  Does not contain any of these characters in the path: \*[]?
** *  Does not end with /.
** *  Does not contain two or more / characters in a row.
** *  Contains at least one character
*/

So it's definitely being done by design.  Now the * and ? ban I can see.
 Files with that in the name would cause confusion on almost every platform.
 Some quick tests, though, see that files like test[1].txt are permitted
under both Linux and Windows so I can't quite understand the justification
there.  (Under Windows a file with [] in the name has to be put in quotes,
mind, but so do files with spaces.)

Tragically, fossil won't let me add test[1].txt even if I do put it in
quotes, although it will allow me to add test 1.txt.  So it looks to me
like right now you just can't add those files until (if?) this gets changed.

-- 
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It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] filename contains illegal characters

[Michael Richter]

On 29 June 2010 02:18, Eric e...@deptj.eu wrote:

 [] are there for the same reason as * and ?:

 ~ $ ls -d p[lu]*
 play  public_html


Ah.  I was unaware of that expansion.  I always used something like p{l,u}*
in those situations.

-- 
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It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] Mix of UTF-8 and CP1251 (Russian cyrillic) in project

[Michael Richter]

On 25 June 2010 21:34, Michal Suchanek hramr...@centrum.cz wrote:

 Perhaps fossil should have a system encoding which it would get from
 the environment (locales, windows codepage) and mark all commit
 messages with it.


I vote that this is an extraordinarily bad idea.

Fossil is a *distributed* SCM system.  Potentially the distributed database
in question could be spread around the world.  Do you really want the
nightmare (and impossibility!) of trying to keep track of which project is
in which encoding scheme on which machine?  UTF-8 is a standard
*explicitly*designed to
*stop* this kind of confusion.  It's also been around since 1993, so your
development tools have had plenty of time to catch on and actually use it.

-- 
Perhaps people don't believe this, but throughout all of the discussions of
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Re: [fossil-users] fossil rebase

[Michael Richter]

What does this do that *fossil merge trunk* from my branch in
*ttmrichter* doesn't
do?

On 24 June 2010 16:31, altufa...@mail.com wrote:

 Well, you have custom changes (A, B, C) in a branch and you want to
 keep up with latest changes happening in trunk - at frequent intervals.

 What rebase does is it applies your changes A, B  C to new head (G)
 with a knowledge of everything that has happened between E  G. If any
 of A, B or C was pulled in to the trunk, that change will be removed
 automatically.

 - Altu


 -Original Message-
 From: Eric e...@deptj.eu
 To: fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org
 Sent: Thu, Jun 24, 2010 12:00 pm
 Subject: Re: [fossil-users] fossil rebase


  Git rebase help has a very good graphic to explain what it does:
 Assume the following history exists and the current branch is
 topic:   A---B---C topic  / D---E---F---G
 master From this point, the result of either of the following
 commands: git rebase master git rebase master topic would be:
   A'--B'--C' topic  / D---E---F---G
 master Here, git forgets versions A, B  C if they are not published
 (tagged). I agree we don't want fossil to forget anything. However,
 if fossil can do following, that would be very helpful:
 A---B---C topic/   /   A'--B'--C' (new name)
  /   / D---E---F---G trunk - AltuBut why would
 anyone want to do
 that?E.___fossil-users
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Re: [fossil-users] Not within an open checkout

[Michael Richter]

On 16 June 2010 05:41, ghiù pistacc...@gmail.com wrote:

 Long story short, I downloaded the latest build for MacOSX and put it in
 /usr/local/bin/. I run without a problem fossil new test and it created a
 new archive.
 I then tried fossil ui and I got a not within an open checkout. Now,
 every command I try to execute (status, commit, add...), from whatever
 position within the filesystem (root, my home, the dir with the archive, a
 dir upper or a dir under it etc) gives me this error. I also tried to remove
 the .fossil file it creates in home, all without a result.


I'm not seeing a fossil open in that sequence up above.

The workflow for a new repo is:

fossil new (or clone if you're copying another repo)
fossil open
fossil do-everything-else

You'll find full instructions at
http://www.fossil-scm.org/index.html/doc/tip/www/quickstart.wiki.  Sadly the
instructions are in the wrong order and mistakenly put the configuration
stuff ahead of the opening of the repository, so I can see where the
confusion comes in.  If I had check-in privileges I'd fix that myself, but
sadly I don't.

-- 
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It's not been about our revenue or profit or whatnot.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil for dummies PDF

[Michael Richter]

Very nice and exactly the kind of thing Fossil needs.

On 29 May 2010 18:20, Jim Schimpf jim.schi...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi,

 I've been working on this for a while and thought it might be useful
 for the group.  This is a PDF for a new user of Fossil to show them how to
 use it in a simple project.  It's not for most of the people on this list
 who know much more than I about Fossil.  It is meant to be something you can
 give to the friend who just wants to use Fossil for his projects. The online
 documentation on the Fossil site is very good and I used the ideas there for
 some of the book but personally I really like having a PDF with an active
 index and TOC for documentation.

Here is the site:

  http://pandora.dyn-o-saur.com:8080/cgi-bin/Book.cgi

 (it's served by Fossil, naturally).

 If you have comments or want to add to this let me know and I can give
 you a login and of course credit in the text.  I would very much appreciate
 your comments on what I did or did not do correctly and how it can be
 improved.

 --jim schimpf

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Re: [fossil-users] Graphical display of fork/merge actions in timeline

[Michael Richter]

On 6 February 2010 05:16, D. Richard Hipp d...@hwaci.com wrote:

 You know, 15 years ago, I could have done (and did do) a slick looking
 interface like this using a couple dozen lines of easy to understand
 and easy to modify Tcl/Tk code in a canvas widget.  Now, I have to
 write hundreds or thousands of lines of javascript and CSS to do the
 same thing.  And they call this progress?


No.  They call this enterprise software.

I always wondered what enterprise software meant.  Then I had the
epiphany: all enterprise software relies on huge, unreadable messes
involving comically verbose languages (Java, for example, and in the modern
web-front world JavaScript as well) and comically verbose configuration
files (XML-based being the ideal these days).  You  see if you have such
comically verbose and rigid languages as your tool, you need large teams of
code monkeys to build and maintain it, thus making your empire larger.
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Re: [fossil-users] Repository-dependant cookies

[Michael Richter]

On 1 February 2010 23:19, D. Richard Hipp d...@hwaci.com wrote:

 I do *not* want to turn Fossil into a general-purpose web server and
 replacement for Apache.  That is not its purpose.  We have to draw the
 line somewhere, and I propose to draw the line here.


Absolutely agreed.  The feature is cool and renaming my repos to *.fossil is
a minor task.  If I want a fuller web experience, I'll use a web server and
CGI -- like I already do, in fact.  :)
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Re: [fossil-users] Repository-dependant cookies

[Michael Richter]

2010/1/31 D. Richard Hipp d...@hwaci.com

 There was another recent request for the ability to serve multiple
 repositories off of the same TCP port without using a web server.  The
 current syntax to launch a stand-alone server is:

   fossil server REPOSITORYFILE

 Suppose we expanded this to allow multiple repositories to be named on
 the command-line.  So if you had a directory full of repositories, you
 could do:

   fossil server *.fossil

 Suppose the names of the repositories files are abc.fossil,
 def.fossil, ghi.fossil and so forth.  Then to reach each repository,
 visit:

 http://localhost/abc
 http://localhost/def
 http://localhost/ghi

 And so forth.  If this functionality were implemented, then the cookie
 names would be fossil_login_2F616263, fossil_login_2F646566, and
 fossil_login_2F676869.  Since the cookie names are different, you
 could log onto all repositories all at once.  If no repository is
 specified in the URL (if  you enter http://localhost/) what should it
 do?  Show an error?  Return a list of repositories?  Choose the first
 one named?

 Perhaps the syntax should be:

 fossil server --directory FOLDER_HOLDING_REPOSITORIES

 In that case, fossil is able to serve any fossil repository in the
 named directory.  The particular repository chosen by the path in the
 URL.  With this syntax, new repositories can be added to the site
 without having to restart the server - simply move files into the
 appropriate folder.  We still have the problem of what to do with an
 unknown path.


I like these ideas a *lot*, Richard.  As in I like all of them.  For just
quickly sharing a specific repository you use the single-file version (the
default as now).  If you want to share specific repositories but not all of
them, the multiple repositories on the command line is perfect.  If you want
to host many repositories and expand/contract them as needed without
restarting the server your directory syntax is perfect.

If you enter just the root there's arguments for two approaches:

   1. The open approach is to list all the accessible repos.
   2. The more security-semi-conscious approach would be to assume someone
   hitting the root isn't authorized to access any repository and thus should
   gets flipped the bird, metaphorically.
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Re: [fossil-users] cloning http://www.fossil-scm.org/ fails

[Michael Richter]

2010/1/25 D. Richard Hipp d...@hwaci.com

 I'm not sure what was going wrong.  But hopefully it is fixed now.


It works now on all the platforms I have access to.
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Re: [fossil-users] Add files recursively?

[Michael Richter]

2010/1/21 Daniel Carrera dcarr...@gmail.com

  When you clone A to B, a note is made in B that you cloned from A.  So
  when you are working in B and you push or pull or sync it knows that the
  endpoint of that operation is A.



 I think that's bad. Darcs doesn't do that, and I would venture to guess
 that Bazaar and Mercurial don't either. Branches should be equal and
 independent.


Really?  Watch and learn.

mich...@isolde:~/junk$ mkdir A B Remote
mich...@isolde:~/junk$ cd Remote
mich...@isolde:~/junk/Remote$ darcs initialize
mich...@isolde:~/junk/Remote$ touch 1
mich...@isolde:~/junk/Remote$ darcs add 1 ; darcs record
addfile ./1
Shall I record this change? (1/1)  [ynWsfvplxdaqjk], or ? for help: y
What is the patch name? file 1 in Remote
Do you want to add a long comment? [yn]n
Finished recording patch 'file 1 in Remote'
mich...@isolde:~/junk/Remote$ cd ../A
mich...@isolde:~/junk/A$ darcs initialize ; darcs pull ../Remote
Thu Jan 21 21:01:48 CST 2010  ttmrich...@gmail.com
  * file 1 in Remote
Shall I pull this patch? (1/1)  [ynWsfvplxdaqjk], or ? for help: a
Finished pulling and applying.
mich...@isolde:~/junk/A$ touch 2
mich...@isolde:~/junk/A$ darcs add 2
mich...@isolde:~/junk/A$ darcs record
addfile ./2
Shall I record this change? (1/1)  [ynWsfvplxdaqjk], or ? for help: a
What is the patch name? file 2 in A
Do you want to add a long comment? [yn]n
Finished recording patch 'file 2 in A'
mich...@isolde:~/junk/A$ cd ../B
mich...@isolde:~/junk/B$ darcs initialize
mich...@isolde:~/junk/B$ darcs pull ../A
Thu Jan 21 21:01:48 CST 2010  ttmrich...@gmail.com
  * file 1 in Remote
Shall I pull this patch? (1/2)  [ynWsfvplxdaqjk], or ? for help: a
Finished pulling and applying.
mich...@isolde:~/junk/B$ touch 3
mich...@isolde:~/junk/B$ darcs add 3
mich...@isolde:~/junk/B$ darcs record
addfile ./3
Shall I record this change? (1/1)  [ynWsfvplxdaqjk], or ? for help: a
What is the patch name? file 3 in B
Do you want to add a long comment? [yn]n
Finished recording patch 'file 3 in B'

The stage is now set.  We have a remote repository.  We have a local
repository A taken from the remote one that has added some stuff.  We have a
local repository B taken from A that has added some stuff.  Now watch:

mich...@isolde:~/junk/B$ cd ..
mich...@isolde:~/junk$ rm -fR A
removed `A/1'
removed `A/_darcs/tentative_pristine'
removed
`A/_darcs/patches/000115-3cd043376a21c461f8605abb2a579f58ff2419e37248c357425a3a143a9d6ecb'
removed `A/_darcs/patches/pending'
removed
`A/_darcs/patches/000110-b044ffccac260b63c9f0f4d92b1c5b85e4221128a9ddf37c12a36415a8d2bdd4'
removed `A/_darcs/patches/pending.tentative'
removed directory: `A/_darcs/patches'
removed
`A/_darcs/inventories/000187-198d8c81582fe412f44f446a65a8e40b3b1267107a3e6e72ad2b50a27dbd67e9'
removed
`A/_darcs/inventories/000369-511de1bfebfc9e3803f8c9d12aef84bf5312f03b013eb16c07709fc8b67ba625'
removed directory: `A/_darcs/inventories'
removed `A/_darcs/format'
removed `A/_darcs/prefs/repos'
removed `A/_darcs/prefs/boring'
removed `A/_darcs/prefs/author'
removed `A/_darcs/prefs/binaries'
removed `A/_darcs/prefs/motd'
removed `A/_darcs/prefs/defaultrepo'
removed directory: `A/_darcs/prefs'
removed `A/_darcs/hashed_inventory'
removed
`A/_darcs/pristine.hashed/000168-cdb7d192d528a5ab1468b5d4339004ddf47442b6bd2d2e2a6f3ba38c724c0883'
removed `A/_darcs/pristine.hashed/da39a3ee5e6b4b0d3255bfef95601890afd80709'
removed
`A/_darcs/pristine.hashed/00-e3b0c44298fc1c149afbf4c8996fb92427ae41e4649b934ca495991b7852b855'
removed
`A/_darcs/pristine.hashed/84-555aaf4b6798d05de804c5dd6de6d1707fece5d5d1dcc9dd34c3834e55058b1e'
removed directory: `A/_darcs/pristine.hashed'
removed directory: `A/_darcs'
removed `A/2'
removed directory: `A'
mich...@isolde:~/junk$ cd B
mich...@isolde:~/junk/B$ darcs push

darcs failed:  Not a repository: /home/michael/junk/A
(/home/michael/junk/A/_darcs/inventory: openBinaryFile: does not exist (No
such file or directory))

Oops.  So much for equal and independent branches!

This is what happens when your working set and your repository are one and
the same.  You create chains of relationships that can *and do* (keep in
mind that I have used both Mercurial and Darcs long before I found fossil)
lead to lost data and difficult to debug problems.

Consider this sequence instead:

   - I clone a remote repository to A.
   - Someone else clones my repository A to B.
   - I make my changes and push them.
   - The other guy makes his changes and pushes them.
   - I don't notice this last thing and think that I'm done with my work and
   delete my working set/repository.
   - He thinks his work is done and deletes his working set/repository.

The other guy's work is now lost because of that chain of working
set/repositories.  In fossil the workflow is different:

   - I clone a remote repository to a repository file in a known location.
   (For my work I have them in ~/Repositories.  For my shared work I have them
   in /var/repositories.)
   - I 

Re: [fossil-users] Noob windows build problems

[Michael Richter]

You need to have zlib built and the library in your library path.  Google
for zlib and download it, compile it and place it in your lib directory for
MinGW/MSYS.

2010/1/21 Simon Horton sij.hor...@gmail.com

 Hello,

 I have fossil source code: fossil-src-20091220213451

 I have setup Ming and MSYS (http://www.mingw.org/wiki/msys). Attempting to
 compile gives me an error caused by a missing zlib.h. I am guessing this
 means I need to include source code for zlib. Can someone point me in the
 right direction to get fossil compiled from scratch? Here is the full
 output:


 $ make -f Makefile.w32
 gcc -g -O2 -o translate ./src/translate.c
 ./translate ./src/add.c add_.c
 ./translate ./src/allrepo.c allrepo_.c
 ./translate ./src/bag.c bag_.c
 ./translate ./src/blob.c blob_.c
 ./translate ./src/branch.c branch_.c
 ./translate ./src/browse.c browse_.c
 ./translate ./src/captcha.c captcha_.c
 ./translate ./src/cgi.c cgi_.c
 ./translate ./src/checkin.c checkin_.c
 ./translate ./src/checkout.c checkout_.c
 ./translate ./src/clearsign.c clearsign_.c
 ./translate ./src/clone.c clone_.c
 ./translate ./src/comformat.c comformat_.c
 ./translate ./src/configure.c configure_.c
 ./translate ./src/construct.c construct_.c
 ./translate ./src/content.c content_.c
 ./translate ./src/db.c db_.c
 ./translate ./src/delta.c delta_.c
 ./translate ./src/deltacmd.c deltacmd_.c
 ./translate ./src/descendants.c descendants_.c
 ./translate ./src/diff.c diff_.c
 ./translate ./src/diffcmd.c diffcmd_.c
 ./translate ./src/doc.c doc_.c
 ./translate ./src/encode.c encode_.c
 ./translate ./src/file.c file_.c
 ./translate ./src/finfo.c finfo_.c
 ./translate ./src/http.c http_.c
 ./translate ./src/http_socket.c http_socket_.c
 ./translate ./src/http_transport.c http_transport_.c
 ./translate ./src/info.c info_.c
 ./translate ./src/login.c login_.c
 ./translate ./src/main.c main_.c
 ./translate ./src/manifest.c manifest_.c
 ./translate ./src/md5.c md5_.c
 ./translate ./src/merge.c merge_.c
 ./translate ./src/merge3.c merge3_.c
 ./translate ./src/name.c name_.c
 ./translate ./src/pivot.c pivot_.c
 ./translate ./src/pqueue.c pqueue_.c
 ./translate ./src/printf.c printf_.c
 ./translate ./src/rebuild.c rebuild_.c
 ./translate ./src/report.c report_.c
 ./translate ./src/rss.c rss_.c
 ./translate ./src/rstats.c rstats_.c
 ./translate ./src/schema.c schema_.c
 ./translate ./src/search.c search_.c
 ./translate ./src/setup.c setup_.c
 ./translate ./src/sha1.c sha1_.c
 ./translate ./src/shun.c shun_.c
 ./translate ./src/skins.c skins_.c
 ./translate ./src/stat.c stat_.c
 ./translate ./src/style.c style_.c
 ./translate ./src/sync.c sync_.c
 ./translate ./src/tag.c tag_.c
 ./translate ./src/th_main.c th_main_.c
 ./translate ./src/timeline.c timeline_.c
 ./translate ./src/tkt.c tkt_.c
 ./translate ./src/tktsetup.c tktsetup_.c
 ./translate ./src/undo.c undo_.c
 ./translate ./src/update.c update_.c
 ./translate ./src/url.c url_.c
 ./translate ./src/user.c user_.c
 ./translate ./src/verify.c verify_.c
 ./translate ./src/vfile.c vfile_.c
 ./translate ./src/wiki.c wiki_.c
 ./translate ./src/wikiformat.c wikiformat_.c
 ./translate ./src/winhttp.c winhttp_.c
 ./translate ./src/xfer.c xfer_.c
 ./translate ./src/zip.c zip_.c
 gcc -g -O2 -o mkindex ./src/mkindex.c
 ./mkindex add_.c allrepo_.c bag_.c blob_.c branch_.c browse_.c captcha_.c
 cgi_.c
  checkin_.c checkout_.c clearsign_.c clone_.c comformat_.c configure_.c
 construc
 t_.c content_.c db_.c delta_.c deltacmd_.c descendants_.c diff_.c
 diffcmd_.c doc
 _.c encode_.c file_.c finfo_.c http_.c http_socket_.c http_transport_.c
 info_.c
 login_.c main_.c manifest_.c md5_.c merge_.c merge3_.c name_.c pivot_.c
 pqueue_.
 c printf_.c rebuild_.c report_.c rss_.c rstats_.c schema_.c search_.c
 setup_.c s
 ha1_.c shun_.c skins_.c stat_.c style_.c sync_.c tag_.c th_main_.c
 timeline_.c t
 kt_.c tktsetup_.c undo_.c update_.c url_.c user_.c verify_.c vfile_.c
 wiki_.c wi
 kiformat_.c winhttp_.c xfer_.c zip_.c page_index.h
 gcc -g -O2 -o makeheaders ./src/makeheaders.c
 awk '{ printf #define MANIFEST_UUID \%s\\n, $1}'
 ./src/../manifest.uuid VE
 RSION.h
 awk '{ printf #define MANIFEST_VERSION \[%.10s]\\n, $1}'
 ./src/../manifest.
 uuid VERSION.h
 awk '$1==D{printf #define MANIFEST_DATE \%s %s\\n,
 substr($2,1,10),substr(
 $2,12)}'  ./src/../manifest VERSION.h
 ./makeheaders  add_.c:add.h allrepo_.c:allrepo.h bag_.c:bag.h
 blob_.c:blob.h bra
 nch_.c:branch.h browse_.c:browse.h captcha_.c:captcha.h cgi_.c:cgi.h
 checkin_.c:
 checkin.h checkout_.c:checkout.h clearsign_.c:clearsign.h clone_.c:clone.h
 comfo
 rmat_.c:comformat.h configure_.c:configure.h construct_.c:construct.h
 content_.c
 :content.h db_.c:db.h delta_.c:delta.h deltacmd_.c:deltacmd.h
 descendants_.c:des
 cendants.h diff_.c:diff.h diffcmd_.c:diffcmd.h doc_.c:doc.h
 encode_.c:encode.h f
 ile_.c:file.h finfo_.c:finfo.h http_.c:http.h http_socket_.c:http_socket.h
 http_
 transport_.c:http_transport.h info_.c:info.h login_.c:login.h
 main_.c:main.h man
 

Re: [fossil-users] Add files recursively?

[Michael Richter]

2010/1/21 Daniel Carrera dcarr...@gmail.com

 Michael Richter wrote:
  mich...@isolde:~/junk/B$ darcs push
 
  darcs failed:  Not a repository: /home/michael/junk/A
  (/home/michael/junk/A/_darcs/inventory: openBinaryFile: does not exist
  (No such file or directory))
 
  Oops.  So much for equal and independent branches!

 Ugh. Your beef is that you have to specify where you are pushing to?


Do you read before you respond?  My specific beef was given and it has
nothing to do with specifying where I'm pushing to.  (Hint: *lost work*.)


 That hardly seems like a dependency, or like something that fossil can
 avoid. How does any SCM, know where I want to push when I just say
 push?


Because, Sparky, when you clone a repo in fossil you have a repository
file.  That repository file contains the original place you cloned from
within it.

You have to *open* said file to get your working set and the repo that your
working set comes from is conveniently stored for you in _FOSSIL_ -- that
file you hate so much.  So when you say fossil commit, fossil knows where
to commit because, get this, your working set comes from a repository and
has it recorded all automagically-like.  Further, when you say fossil
push, fossil knows which repository you're talking about (from _FOSSIL_)
and then where that repository pushes to (the repo file).

That whole separation of concerns thing is what I like about Fossil and what
I didn't like about Mercurial or Darcs.


 Where does Fossil push if I just say fossil push? What if I remove
 that location? Will Fossil not complain? Or will it somehow know I want
 to push to some other place?


If you're dumb enough to remove the repository (as opposed to your working
set) you've got problems of course.  The difference is that it takes
specific user action separate and above the deletion of the working set to
delete the repository.  With Darcs and Mercurial both I've accidentally
turfed repositories that held data as yet un-propagated because I'd
forgotten that I'd cloned them to do some work and pushed locally.  I
deleted what I thought was basically just a working set only to find out
that I'd accidentally deleted actual work.

This kind of accident doesn't happen in Fossil because I don't delete
repositories unless I'm sure that, you know, I'm never working on that
project again.  In the case of my shared repositories I don't delete them at
all unless the project itself has been canned (and even then I keep 'em
around).  No room for accidents.

Anyway, with this I'm bowing out.  You're obviously not reading the docs nor
the messages of the people explaining things to you.  I'll let people more
patient than me educate you if you're at all capable of such.
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Re: [fossil-users] What is maximum limit size of a .fsl file ?

[Michael Richter]

2010/1/8 Stephan Beal sgb...@googlemail.com

 _in theory_, the largest item which can portably be committed is somewhere
 around 1.7GB. That number comes from:
 a) max memory space for 32-bit platforms = ~4GB. In my experience,
 3.6-3.8GB is the max.
 b) fossil does its diffs in memory, meaning 2 copies (plus the delta) are
 in memory.


The overwhelming number of modern 32-bit systems are actually 36-bit in
address space.  You have to turn on appropriate options to use that mode, of
course.  For Windows that means running a server edition.  For Linux that
means turning on certain kernel options when compiling (or using a server
kernel for those distros that support this).  I am, for example, happily
using my full 4GB on a 32-bit version of Ubuntu.
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Re: [fossil-users] Numbered list syntax?

[Michael Richter]

2009/12/9 chi ml-fos...@qiao.in-berlin.de

  I don't get it. We never had to number the list ourselves.
  What was wrong with :
 
  Numbered list
 
   0  Number one
   0  Number two
   0  Number three
 
 
  It gives you a list that looks like:
 
  0. Number one
  0. Number two
  0. Number three
 
  That's not really a numbered list, now, is it?

 Ahhh ... in my Fossil wiki it gives me:

 1. Number one
 2. Number two
 3. Number three

 Try for yourself in the Fossil wiki's sandbox ...


I did before I posted.


 But pay attention: Every number enclosed in *two* Blanks!


Yes, I know this.  I got a list of 0.  (Note the period in my list there?)
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Re: [fossil-users] Numbered list syntax?

[Michael Richter]

I like it a lot.  Renumbering lists was always a hassle.

2009/12/9 altufa...@mail.com

 Me like it too.

  - Altu


 -Original Message-
 From: Wilson, Ronald rwils...@harris.com
 To: fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org
 Sent: Wed, Dec 9, 2009 6:54 am
 Subject: Re: [fossil-users] Numbered list syntax?

  I like it.

 Ron Wilson, Engineering Project Lead
 (o) 434.455.6453, (m) 434.851.1612, www.harris.com

 HARRIS CORPORATION   |   RF Communications Division assuredcommunications(tm)


  -Original Message-
  From: fossil-users-boun...@lists.fossil-scm.org [mailto:fossil-users- 
  fossil-users-?
  boun...@lists.fossil-scm.org] On Behalf Of Jeremy Cowgar
  Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2009 6:58 PM
  To: Fossil User Mailing List
  Subject: Re: [fossil-users] Numbered list syntax?
 
 
  Any feedback on the below?
 
  Jeremy
 
  
  Subject: Numbered list syntax?
 
  Hello,
 
  I am looking at the source and see that enumerated lists are defined by:
 
1.  Hello
2.  Goodbye
 
  i.e. a two spaces, a number, a period, two spaces, text.
 
  Why was it decided to use that syntax instead of the common # syntax? This
  means that if I have a list of ten things and want to add in an item after
  position 4, I have to reorder the entire list.
 
  In the fossil docs for the rationale of the wiki markup, I read: The wiki
  markup used by fossil, though limited, is common to most other wiki
  engines, is
  intuitive, and is sufficient for 90% of all formatting tasks. I've used a
  lot
  of wiki's and have not seen the numbered list syntax of above and it does
  not
  seem intuitive either.
 
  I made the change to fossil to support
 
#  Hello
#  Goodbye
 
  can I commit the change drh? The
 
1.  Hello
2.  Goodbye
 
  syntax is intact and unchanged.
 
  Jeremy
 
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Re: [fossil-users] The case for Markdown (yes, I rtfm)

[Michael Richter]

And with this you lose the interoperability of Fossil repositories.

Go team.

2009/11/29 Jeremy Cowgar jer...@cowgar.com

 For those that would like a real human formatting language it would be
 worth
 a dependency. For those that prefer to use HTML can simply not link in the
 library.

 #ifdef MARKDOWN
 #include markdown.h
 #endif

 ...

 #ifdef MARKDOWN
 output = ConvertMarkdown(rawText);
 #endif

 ...

 $ gcc -DMARKDOWN fossil.c -o fossil

 Pretty easy, eh? Now, that's an over simplification but not by much.

 Jeremy

 --
 From: Eric e...@deptj.eu
 Sent: Sunday, November 29, 2009 6:44 AM
 To: fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org
 Subject: Re: [fossil-users] The case for Markdown (yes, I rtfm)

  The number of mails about this just proves that there is no right choice
  for a new wiki markup. There are plenty of lightweight markup formats out
  there (with their own enthusiastic followers) that haven't even been
  mentioned here yet. If you want to do your project documentation a
  particular way, then do it that way - as project files. The other problem
  is introducing external dependencies for Fossil - have you noticed how
 few
  there are?
 
  My vote (somebody else mentioned votes!) is to leave the Fossil wiki
 alone
  (except for gradual improvement).
 
 
  Eric
 
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Re: [fossil-users] The case for Markdown (yes, I rtfm)

[Michael Richter]

2009/11/29 Jeremy Cowgar jer...@cowgar.com

 It has been mentioned that there will be complaining and arguing to what
 format to choose and yet there has been none, only those who dislike a
 format *making assumptions* as to what will happen.


In other news, irony is my very favourite thing in the whole world.
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Re: [fossil-users] external links

[Michael Richter]

Are you kidding Richard?  Unicode is only 8 years old as a standard.  It'll
be at least another 20 before people finally get it (semi-)right.

2009/11/2 D. Richard Hipp d...@hwaci.com


 On Nov 2, 2009, at 3:05 AM, altufa...@mail.com wrote:

  Hi DRH,
 
  Check-in [0039b7813e] shows a rectangle next to external links in IE
  and chrome. Is that intentional? I expected to see some other shape.
 


 OK.  Good to know.  I figured that all browsers these days could
 handle unicode, but apparently IE and Chrome cannot.  I'll take this
 back out for now.

 I suppose I should also back out the similar change at
 http://www.sqlite.org/draft/index.html


 D. Richard Hipp
 d...@hwaci.com



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Re: [fossil-users] external links

[Michael Richter]

2009/11/2 D. Richard Hipp d...@hwaci.com

 An image does not change color according to whether or not the link
 has been visited.  :-(


You can use a different image for visited links and unvisited links, though,
right?
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Re: [fossil-users] external links

[Michael Richter]

2009/11/2 D. Richard Hipp d...@hwaci.com

  Are you kidding Richard?  Unicode is only 8 years old as a
  standard.  It'll be at least another 20 before people finally get it
  (semi-)right.



 two rows of the table at
 http://www.sqlite.org/draft/fileformat2.html#serialtype
  works correctly but that the check-mark symbols at
 http://www.sqlite.org/draft/fileformat2.html#cellformat
  do not work.



 So I guess the rule is, always try out your HTML on IE to see what
 does and does not work


If you want a real laugh, look at CJK support on anything other than the
biggest of the big tickets

The check-marks work for me (Ubuntu 9.04/Firefox 3.0.14) but I'm not sure
what I'm looking for at the first one.  Is it the = symbol?
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Re: [fossil-users] including diagrams in the Fossil wiki

[Michael Richter]

Would not a *file* extension tell you about the format of the *file* and not
its *source*, keeping to the so-called principle of least astonishment?

2009/10/30 Wilson, Ronald rwils...@harris.com

 So the .wiki extension does not a wiki page make?  Surprising.

 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principle_of_least_astonishment

 Ron Wilson, Engineering Project Lead
 (o) 434.455.6453, (m) 434.851.1612, www.harris.com

 HARRIS CORPORATION   |   RF Communications Division
 assuredcommunications(tm)


  -Original Message-
  From: fossil-users-boun...@lists.fossil-scm.org [mailto:fossil-users-
  boun...@lists.fossil-scm.org] On Behalf Of D. Richard Hipp
  Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 10:17 AM
  To: fossil-users@lists.fossil-scm.org
  Subject: Re: [fossil-users] including diagrams in the Fossil wiki
 
 
 
  On Oct 30, 2009, at 9:50 AM, Wilson, Ronald wrote:
 
   Why doesn't the embeddeddoc.wiki show up in the list of all wiki
   pages?
  
   http://www.fossil-scm.org/index.html/wcontent
 
  Because it isn't a wiki page.  It is embedded documentation.  Wiki
  and embedded docs may use the same markup, but they are still
  different creatures.
 
 
  D. Richard Hipp
  d...@hwaci.com
 
 
 
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Re: [fossil-users] Developing on Unix and Windows

[Michael Richter]

2009/10/24 altufa...@mail.com

 Last time I used vi, it showed ^M at end of each line... does the new
 version classify files as DOS/Unix and handles edits correctly?


vim (the most common vi variant in use nowadays) is incredibly
configurable.  I guarantee you that there's an option for handling pretty
much anything at the end of line.

Using the online help (*:help*, followed by */DOS*) might give you some
insight.
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[fossil-users] OK, so how does revert actually work?

[Michael Richter]

I had a big problem going back in time to an older version of some code.  In
brief I had to go fossil ui, find the version I wanted, copy the code from
the browser into my editor, save and commit because I could not get fossil
revert to do what I wanted.  I've replicated something approximating my
actions here below with a dirt-simple test case (albeit a bit long).  I've
highlighted the interesting bits in bold.

mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ fossil new ../test.fsl
project-id: 08a20a854e993e02d01c19fc452e51bc39880377
server-id:  368536210f8131b68d08f97f69195b5c514c7ffc
admin-user: michael (initial password is f9dca9)
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ fossil open ../test.fsl
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ for a in 1 2 3 4 5 ; do date  $a ; done
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ cat 1 2 3 4 5
Sun Oct 25 20:00:38 CST 2009
Sun Oct 25 20:00:38 CST 2009
*Sun Oct 25 20:00:38 CST 2009*
Sun Oct 25 20:00:38 CST 2009
Sun Oct 25 20:00:38 CST 2009
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ fossil add .
ADDED  1
ADDED  2
ADDED  3
ADDED  4
ADDED  5
fossil: cannot add _FOSSIL_
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ fossil commit -m Commit 1

You need a passphrase to unlock the secret key for
user: Michael T. Richter (Personal Key) ttmrich...@gmail.com
1024-bit DSA key, ID A550E784, created 2006-01-09

New_Version: *f6eb797b4f*d295ca22161cee0a4f89fc8512338b
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ for a in 1 3 5 ; do date  $a ; done
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ fossil diff
Index: 1
===
fossil diff /home/michael/junk/test/1
1c1
 Sun Oct 25 20:00:38 CST 2009
---
 Sun Oct 25 20:01:27 CST 2009
Index: 3
===
fossil diff /home/michael/junk/test/3
1c1
 Sun Oct 25 20:00:38 CST 2009
---
 Sun Oct 25 20:01:27 CST 2009
Index: 5
===
fossil diff /home/michael/junk/test/5
1c1
 Sun Oct 25 20:00:38 CST 2009
---
 Sun Oct 25 20:01:27 CST 2009
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ fossil commit -m Commit 2

You need a passphrase to unlock the secret key for
user: Michael T. Richter (Personal Key) ttmrich...@gmail.com
1024-bit DSA key, ID A550E784, created 2006-01-09

New_Version: c999d7693599a7f4551062a98e83fda9270a4f1f
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ date  3
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ fossil diff
Index: 3
===
fossil diff /home/michael/junk/test/3
1c1
 Sun Oct 25 20:01:27 CST 2009
---
 Sun Oct 25 20:01:50 CST 2009
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ fossil commit -m Commit 3

You need a passphrase to unlock the secret key for
user: Michael T. Richter (Personal Key) ttmrich...@gmail.com
1024-bit DSA key, ID A550E784, created 2006-01-09

New_Version: 08f71893204692d6ea4efc714f03e6cb79c38097
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ cat 1 2 3 4 5
Sun Oct 25 20:01:27 CST 2009
Sun Oct 25 20:00:38 CST 2009
*Sun Oct 25 20:01:50 CST 2009*
Sun Oct 25 20:00:38 CST 2009
Sun Oct 25 20:01:27 CST 2009
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ fossil timeline
=== 2009-10-25 ===
12:02:06 [08f7189320] *CURRENT* Commit 3 (user: michael tags: trunk)
12:01:37 [c999d76935] Commit 2 (user: michael tags: trunk)
12:00:58 [*f6eb797b4f*] Commit 1 (user: michael tags: trunk)
12:00:02 [5d21199bba] initial empty check-in (user: michael tags: trunk)
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ *fossil revert f6eb797b4f 3*
revert file '3'? this will destroy local changes [y/N]? y
3 reverted
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ fossil diff
mich...@isolde:~/junk/test$ cat 1 2 3 4 5
Sun Oct 25 20:01:27 CST 2009
Sun Oct 25 20:00:38 CST 2009
*Sun Oct 25 20:01:50 CST 2009*
Sun Oct 25 20:00:38 CST 2009
Sun Oct 25 20:01:27 CST 2009

I'm looking this over and looking this over.  I cannot see what I'm doing
wrong according to fossil help revert and yet I cannot get files to revert.
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Re: [fossil-users] Fossil customisation [was: Developing on Unix and Windows]

[Michael Richter]

2009/10/23 Ramon Ribó ram...@compassis.com

   Seriously, how hard
  is it to make a build environment with a script that modifies what should
 be
  modified on checkout?  I don't see the extreme problems here with fossil
  update followed by bin/convert where the latter is a script specific
 to
  your project that converts only the files that need to be converted for
 the
  target platform.
 

 This could be a solution for checking out and creating a release in the
 target
 platform but this is not a solution useful to develop in both, unix and
 windows.
 It is not enough to convert after checkout or update. What about commit,
 what
 about diff? It just does not work.


Now try going beyond a single example into the general point being
illustrated.  The general point is that there *is no automated solution to
this that will work on every project*.  Projects are too varied for this to
happen.  *Any* automated solution provided by Fossil will work for such a
small subset of projects, and for such a large expenditure of effort, that
it is utterly and completely pointless.

So.

If *you* have such a project with development working on multiple platforms
checking out and checking in willy-nilly, it is up to *you* to make the
build and development environment work appropriately, not Fossil.  Making
this development environment includes, but is not limited to, the following:

   1. Correct selection of tools (like editors) so that the impact of \n and
   \r\n is mitigated.
   2. The creation (and maintenance) of build and scm wrapper scripts such
   that your files which simply *must* be \r\n (MSVC build files, batch
   files, etc.) are always cast (so to speak) into the correct form before
   check-in and after check-out (and ditto for things which *must* be in \r
   or \n or even \x1e).
   3. For all other files a simple policy (perhaps enforced by wrapper
   scripts again) that chooses one format as the canonical format to be
   checked-in.
   4. insert any other specific requirements your project has here

There is no way for Fossil to know which files have to be in which format.
Short of embedding an AI more sophisticated than any ever built before
there's no way for Fossil to be built to know this.  Any actually plausible
solution built into Fossil will be wrong for a huge subset of projects
anyway so it's utterly wasted effort that could be better spent on features
that are actually useful.
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