OCR (was: Converting FM to Word and previously: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker)
OmniPage 15 is about the best OCR program out there, and it is nearly perfect., if you're going to OCR anything. -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+convextech=alltel@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+convextech=alltel.net at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Combs, Richard Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2006 12:37 PM To: David Levy; Framers List; Free Framers List Subject: Converting FM to Word (was RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker) David Levy wrote: > I'm at the point where, if a client wants the work done in Word, I > build it in FM, PDF it, and then use an OCR program to convert it to > Word. The results are better than FM's "Save as" feature. OCR??? The PDF contains *real words*, not an *image* of the words! Why on earth would you want to treat it as an image? > Close my eyes, send it on, and I've never heard back from a client. No proofing? You do realize that OCR isn't perfect, don't you? > Anyone have other suggestions for getting from FM to Word? By far the best method is Mif2Go (http://www.omsys.com/dcl/mif2go_main.htm). Acrobat's Save As RTF is OK, too. For that matter FM's Save As should work better than OCR, assuming you have an appropriate Word template that uses styles with the same names as the FM formats. Heck, I'd rather save the whole thing as plain text, dump it into a Word doc, and retag it than use OCR. Richard -- Richard G. Combs Senior Technical Writer Polycom, Inc. richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom 303-223-5111 -- rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom 303-777-0436 -- ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as convextech at alltel.net. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/convextech%40alltel.net Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
>> NeXT even bundled FrameMaker 3.x with its machines. > >I don't remember FrameMaker being bundled with NeXT boxes. Was it a >trial version? We bought all of our licenses (could have been a site >license). Should I call tech support? > >I remember the word processor Write Now was bundled. It was FrameMaker 3.1. Yes, call tech support. If I answer, it's a time warp, so hang up immediately. Regards, Peter Gold KnowHow ProServices
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
At 8:17 AM -0400 4/27/06, Rick Quatro wrote: >If I remember correctly, there was a smaller footprint program >called FrameReader that could be used to view FrameMaker documents. >I think it was less expensive than FrameViewer. I think it was FV with even more FrameMaker stuff removed. As Acrobat improved, FR was even less attractive. Regards, Peter Gold KnowHow ProServices
Converting FM to Word (was RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker)
Syed Zaeem Hosain wrote: > Hmmm ... I would be surprised if he is using a true "image" > OCR program. I suspect a mis-speak! :) Perhaps you're right. But in fact, there's no _other_ kind of OCR program. OCR stands for "optical character recognition." It's the process of converting an _image_ or _representation_ of a character into the ASCII (or ANSI or UTF...) character that it appears to represent. Pedants 'r Us :-) Richard -- Richard G. Combs Senior Technical Writer Polycom, Inc. richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom 303-223-5111 -- rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom 303-777-0436 --
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
On 27 Apr 2006, at 03:18, Peter Gold wrote: > > I'm not sure if you'd find it by digging in Wikipedia, but to put your > point in context, it helps to know that in the early days of unix and > FrameMaker, as with the early days of CP/M, each hardware manufacturer > had a proprietary version of the OS, which required software to be > written, converted, adapted, or "ported" to run on it. To sell these > adamantly-independent hardware platforms, their manufacturers like > Pyramid, Sequent, CGI, NeXT, and others PAID BIG BUCKS to companies > like Frame Technology, Sybase, and others whose software they wanted > to offer to attract customers. NeXT even bundled FrameMaker 3.x with > its machines. I don't remember FrameMaker being bundled with NeXT boxes. Was it a trial version? We bought all of our licenses (could have been a site license). Should I call tech support? I remember the word processor Write Now was bundled. FWIW, Paul
Re: Converting FM to Word (was RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker)
Hi, Richard Combs, Richard wrote: Syed Zaeem Hosain wrote: Hmmm ... I would be surprised if he is using a true "image" OCR program. I suspect a mis-speak! :) Perhaps you're right. But in fact, there's no _other_ kind of OCR program. OCR stands for "optical character recognition." It's the process of converting an _image_ or _representation_ of a character into the ASCII (or ANSI or UTF...) character that it appears to represent. Yes, sorry, that is what I meant too. Meaning he is *not* doing a true OCR from an image - just converting from the PDF file with some software (like I do). At least, I hope that is the case! Going to Word from a scanned-in image (printed from the PDF) would be quite an unusual way to do this! Pedants 'r Us :-) :) :) Z ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Converting FM to Word (was RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker)
Hi, Richard Combs, Richard wrote: > Syed Zaeem Hosain wrote: > >> Hmmm ... I would be surprised if he is using a true "image" >> OCR program. I suspect a mis-speak! :) > > Perhaps you're right. But in fact, there's no _other_ kind of OCR > program. OCR stands for "optical character recognition." It's the > process of converting an _image_ or _representation_ of a character into > the ASCII (or ANSI or UTF...) character that it appears to represent. Yes, sorry, that is what I meant too. Meaning he is *not* doing a true OCR from an image - just converting from the PDF file with some software (like I do). At least, I hope that is the case! Going to Word from a scanned-in image (printed from the PDF) would be quite an unusual way to do this! > Pedants 'r Us :-) :) :) Z
RE: Converting FM to Word (was RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker)
Syed Zaeem Hosain wrote: > Hmmm ... I would be surprised if he is using a true "image" > OCR program. I suspect a mis-speak! :) Perhaps you're right. But in fact, there's no _other_ kind of OCR program. OCR stands for "optical character recognition." It's the process of converting an _image_ or _representation_ of a character into the ASCII (or ANSI or UTF...) character that it appears to represent. Pedants 'r Us :-) Richard -- Richard G. Combs Senior Technical Writer Polycom, Inc. richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom 303-223-5111 -- rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom 303-777-0436 -- ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
NeXT even bundled FrameMaker 3.x with its machines. I don't remember FrameMaker being bundled with NeXT boxes. Was it a trial version? We bought all of our licenses (could have been a site license). Should I call tech support? I remember the word processor Write Now was bundled. It was FrameMaker 3.1. Yes, call tech support. If I answer, it's a time warp, so hang up immediately. Regards, Peter Gold KnowHow ProServices ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
At 8:17 AM -0400 4/27/06, Rick Quatro wrote: If I remember correctly, there was a smaller footprint program called FrameReader that could be used to view FrameMaker documents. I think it was less expensive than FrameViewer. I think it was FV with even more FrameMaker stuff removed. As Acrobat improved, FR was even less attractive. Regards, Peter Gold KnowHow ProServices ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: OCR (was: Converting FM to Word and previously: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker)
OmniPage 15 is about the best OCR program out there, and it is nearly perfect., if you're going to OCR anything. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Combs, Richard Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2006 12:37 PM To: David Levy; Framers List; Free Framers List Subject: Converting FM to Word (was RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker) David Levy wrote: > I'm at the point where, if a client wants the work done in Word, I > build it in FM, PDF it, and then use an OCR program to convert it to > Word. The results are better than FM's "Save as" feature. OCR??? The PDF contains *real words*, not an *image* of the words! Why on earth would you want to treat it as an image? > Close my eyes, send it on, and I've never heard back from a client. No proofing? You do realize that OCR isn't perfect, don't you? > Anyone have other suggestions for getting from FM to Word? By far the best method is Mif2Go (http://www.omsys.com/dcl/mif2go_main.htm). Acrobat's Save As RTF is OK, too. For that matter FM's Save As should work better than OCR, assuming you have an appropriate Word template that uses styles with the same names as the FM formats. Heck, I'd rather save the whole thing as plain text, dump it into a Word doc, and retag it than use OCR. Richard -- Richard G. Combs Senior Technical Writer Polycom, Inc. richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom 303-223-5111 -- rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom 303-777-0436 -- ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/convextech%40alltel.net Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Converting FM to Word (was RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker)
Hi, Richard Combs, Richard wrote: David Levy wrote: I'm at the point where, if a client wants the work done in Word, I build it in FM, PDF it, and then use an OCR program to convert it to Word. The results are better than FM's "Save as" feature. OCR??? The PDF contains *real words*, not an *image* of the words! Why on earth would you want to treat it as an image? Hmmm ... I would be surprised if he is using a true "image" OCR program. I suspect a mis-speak! :) While I have no reason to transfer from FrameMaker to Word, I do use a program from Nuance (formerly Scansoft) called "PDF Converter 3" to bring in standard PDF files into Word. This works directly on the PDF file, not an image. And, PDF Converter 3 does provide pretty darn good results for this conversion process. Z ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Converting FM to Word (was RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker)
Hi, Richard Combs, Richard wrote: > David Levy wrote: >> I'm at the point where, if a client wants the work done in >> Word, I build it in FM, PDF it, and then use an OCR program >> to convert it to Word. The results are better than FM's >> "Save as" feature. > > OCR??? The PDF contains *real words*, not an *image* of the > words! Why on earth would you want to treat it as an image? Hmmm ... I would be surprised if he is using a true "image" OCR program. I suspect a mis-speak! :) While I have no reason to transfer from FrameMaker to Word, I do use a program from Nuance (formerly Scansoft) called "PDF Converter 3" to bring in standard PDF files into Word. This works directly on the PDF file, not an image. And, PDF Converter 3 does provide pretty darn good results for this conversion process. Z
Converting FM to Word (was RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker)
David Levy wrote: > I'm at the point where, if a client wants the work done in > Word, I build it in FM, PDF it, and then use an OCR program > to convert it to Word. The results are better than FM's > "Save as" feature. OCR??? The PDF contains *real words*, not an *image* of the words! Why on earth would you want to treat it as an image? > Close my eyes, send it on, and I've never heard back from a client. No proofing? You do realize that OCR isn't perfect, don't you? > Anyone have other suggestions for getting from FM to Word? By far the best method is Mif2Go (http://www.omsys.com/dcl/mif2go_main.htm). Acrobat's Save As RTF is OK, too. For that matter FM's Save As should work better than OCR, assuming you have an appropriate Word template that uses styles with the same names as the FM formats. Heck, I'd rather save the whole thing as plain text, dump it into a Word doc, and retag it than use OCR. Richard -- Richard G. Combs Senior Technical Writer Polycom, Inc. richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom 303-223-5111 -- rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom 303-777-0436 --
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
At 6:42 AM -0500 4/27/06, Peter Gold wrote: >Hi, Bill: > >At 8:23 AM -0300 4/27/06, Bill Briggs wrote: >>At 7:14 AM -0400 4/27/06, Batsford, Steve wrote: >>>Rick, >>> >>>My sentiment exactly. >>>The popups and all of the available links SOUND cool. But in the real >>>world all my content to my end users is in PDF. >> >> There used to be a product called FrameViewer, and you could view other >> people's FrameMaker documents with it. In FV all of the popups worked. Of >> course FV died after Adobe took over the product. > >FrameViewer was FrameMaker, just crippled to prevent authoring. It was >expensive to purchase for just a product that reads and prints FrameMaker >files, and it was also expensive in the amount of storage space and machine >resources it required in those days. I know. And as someone already mentioned, there was FrameReader, v5.1 of which is still available for download at the Adobe web site. I forget right off the top of my head what the difference was between Reader and Viewer. >Adobe's not the villain here, IMO. Acrobat's PDF is more versatile for >distributing files for reading, commenting, printing, information-collecting, >and publishing for more applications beyond FrameMaker. Nobody is disputing that. But if the company that owns both is using its head, it would roll those really nice features of FrameMaker that we've been lauding into PDF functionality. >You might say that Windows is a more likely villain, because on unix, >FrameMaker's "floating" licensing approach minimized the need to purchase one >license per user. Floating licenses could be checked out, used, and checked >in, to release them for other users. If 20 simultaneous users are likely to >need FrameMaker at any one time, a customer needs to purchase only 20 floating >licenses to serve an enterprise of thousands of potential users. It's even better than that. We bought FrameMaker for our department, and including techs and clerical staff we number 30 people. We got FrameMaker licenses for Solaris, Windows, and Mac. We were sold 10 concurrent licenses, even though only the UNIX version can use a license server. It was done on the "honour system". So the mechanism exists to "not buy a licence for every computer" if your usage habits are such that it's not warranted. We also paid in advance for the upgrade, and given that no Mac upgrade ever surfaced, I think we were treated unethically by Adobe. Even the Windows upgrade from 7 to 7.1 was not worth it. - web
Converting FM to Word (was RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker)
David Levy wrote: > I'm at the point where, if a client wants the work done in > Word, I build it in FM, PDF it, and then use an OCR program > to convert it to Word. The results are better than FM's > "Save as" feature. OCR??? The PDF contains *real words*, not an *image* of the words! Why on earth would you want to treat it as an image? > Close my eyes, send it on, and I've never heard back from a client. No proofing? You do realize that OCR isn't perfect, don't you? > Anyone have other suggestions for getting from FM to Word? By far the best method is Mif2Go (http://www.omsys.com/dcl/mif2go_main.htm). Acrobat's Save As RTF is OK, too. For that matter FM's Save As should work better than OCR, assuming you have an appropriate Word template that uses styles with the same names as the FM formats. Heck, I'd rather save the whole thing as plain text, dump it into a Word doc, and retag it than use OCR. Richard -- Richard G. Combs Senior Technical Writer Polycom, Inc. richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom 303-223-5111 -- rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom 303-777-0436 -- ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
At 7:14 AM -0400 4/27/06, Batsford, Steve wrote: >Rick, > >My sentiment exactly. >The popups and all of the available links SOUND cool. But in the real >world all my content to my end users is in PDF. There used to be a product called FrameViewer, and you could view other people's FrameMaker documents with it. In FV all of the popups worked. Of course FV died after Adobe took over the product. - web
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
At 9:18 PM -0500 4/26/06, Peter Gold wrote: >Hi, Bill, Dan, and all: > >At 8:46 PM -0300 4/26/06, Bill Briggs wrote: >>Yeah, it would be a really great thing to have all of FrameMaker's hypertext >>capabilities survive to PDF. But we'll see a plethora of tiny little >>Photoshop-style pallets before we'll see something useful like what Dan was >>talking about. Makes you wonder what drives the decision mechanism (if there >>is one) regarding software improvements. Once FrameMaker is reduced to a >>single platform, down from the glory days when it was on many. Two great >>quotes from the Wikipedia entry for FrameMaker. >> >>"At the height of its success, FrameMaker ran on more than thirteen UNIX >>platforms, including NeXT Computer's NeXTSTEP and IBM's AIX operating >>systems." >> >>"Frame Technology later ported FrameMaker to Microsoft Windows, but the >>company lost direction soon after its release." > >I'm not sure if you'd find it by digging in Wikipedia, but to put your point >in context, it helps to know that in the early days of unix and FrameMaker, as >with the early days of CP/M, each hardware manufacturer had a proprietary >version of the OS, which required software to be written, converted, adapted, >or "ported" to run on it. To sell these adamantly-independent hardware >platforms, their manufacturers like Pyramid, Sequent, CGI, NeXT, and others >PAID BIG BUCKS to companies like Frame Technology, Sybase, and others whose >software they wanted to offer to attract customers. NeXT even bundled >FrameMaker 3.x with its machines. Yes, they mention the lower pricing of the Windows version and how it was an issue in the Wiki. And they mention the investment of platform manufacturers. I just thought it was interesting that once Frame Technology got mixed up with the Windows world, that's when it all fell apart. Flirt with the Borg and you take the consequences... >In its early years, Sun required its resellers to sell a certain amount of >software and support with each workstation, to avoid having resellers compete >solely on bottom-dollar hardware prices and leave customers with no software >and no support. FrameMaker on Solaris was a common component in those >packages; both companies benefited. > >Actually, FrameMaker was ported to Macintosh before Windows, because Windows >at the time was too wimpy to support it. I know. I have a copy of FrameMaker 2.1 for the Mac here somewhere. But I didn't use it a LOT until version 3, which I'd still use ahead of Word, if that were the choice. - web
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
If I remember correctly, there was a smaller footprint program called FrameReader that could be used to view FrameMaker documents. I think it was less expensive than FrameViewer. Rick > FrameViewer was FrameMaker, just crippled to prevent authoring. It was > expensive to purchase for just a product that reads and prints FrameMaker > files, and it was also expensive in the amount of storage space and > machine resources it required in those days. > > Adobe's not the villain here, IMO. Acrobat's PDF is more versatile for > distributing files for reading, commenting, printing, > information-collecting, and publishing for more applications beyond > FrameMaker. > > You might say that Windows is a more likely villain, because on unix, > FrameMaker's "floating" licensing approach minimized the need to purchase > one license per user. Floating licenses could be checked out, used, and > checked in, to release them for other users. If 20 simultaneous users are > likely to need FrameMaker at any one time, a customer needs to purchase > only 20 floating licenses to serve an enterprise of thousands of potential > users. > > There are some similar third-party application-sharing tools that work on > Windows across applications; they incur other overhead penalties and > impose their own maintenance requirements. > > > > Regards, > > Peter Gold > KnowHow ProServices
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
Hi, Bill: At 8:23 AM -0300 4/27/06, Bill Briggs wrote: >At 7:14 AM -0400 4/27/06, Batsford, Steve wrote: >>Rick, >> >>My sentiment exactly. >>The popups and all of the available links SOUND cool. But in the real >>world all my content to my end users is in PDF. > > There used to be a product called FrameViewer, and you could view >other people's FrameMaker documents with it. In FV all of the popups >worked. Of course FV died after Adobe took over the product. FrameViewer was FrameMaker, just crippled to prevent authoring. It was expensive to purchase for just a product that reads and prints FrameMaker files, and it was also expensive in the amount of storage space and machine resources it required in those days. Adobe's not the villain here, IMO. Acrobat's PDF is more versatile for distributing files for reading, commenting, printing, information-collecting, and publishing for more applications beyond FrameMaker. You might say that Windows is a more likely villain, because on unix, FrameMaker's "floating" licensing approach minimized the need to purchase one license per user. Floating licenses could be checked out, used, and checked in, to release them for other users. If 20 simultaneous users are likely to need FrameMaker at any one time, a customer needs to purchase only 20 floating licenses to serve an enterprise of thousands of potential users. There are some similar third-party application-sharing tools that work on Windows across applications; they incur other overhead penalties and impose their own maintenance requirements. Regards, Peter Gold KnowHow ProServices
RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
At 6:42 AM -0500 4/27/06, Peter Gold wrote: >Hi, Bill: > >At 8:23 AM -0300 4/27/06, Bill Briggs wrote: >>At 7:14 AM -0400 4/27/06, Batsford, Steve wrote: >>>Rick, >>> >>>My sentiment exactly. >>>The popups and all of the available links SOUND cool. But in the real >>>world all my content to my end users is in PDF. >> >> There used to be a product called FrameViewer, and you could view other >> people's FrameMaker documents with it. In FV all of the popups worked. Of >> course FV died after Adobe took over the product. > >FrameViewer was FrameMaker, just crippled to prevent authoring. It was >expensive to purchase for just a product that reads and prints FrameMaker >files, and it was also expensive in the amount of storage space and machine >resources it required in those days. I know. And as someone already mentioned, there was FrameReader, v5.1 of which is still available for download at the Adobe web site. I forget right off the top of my head what the difference was between Reader and Viewer. >Adobe's not the villain here, IMO. Acrobat's PDF is more versatile for >distributing files for reading, commenting, printing, information-collecting, >and publishing for more applications beyond FrameMaker. Nobody is disputing that. But if the company that owns both is using its head, it would roll those really nice features of FrameMaker that we've been lauding into PDF functionality. >You might say that Windows is a more likely villain, because on unix, >FrameMaker's "floating" licensing approach minimized the need to purchase one >license per user. Floating licenses could be checked out, used, and checked >in, to release them for other users. If 20 simultaneous users are likely to >need FrameMaker at any one time, a customer needs to purchase only 20 floating >licenses to serve an enterprise of thousands of potential users. It's even better than that. We bought FrameMaker for our department, and including techs and clerical staff we number 30 people. We got FrameMaker licenses for Solaris, Windows, and Mac. We were sold 10 concurrent licenses, even though only the UNIX version can use a license server. It was done on the "honour system". So the mechanism exists to "not buy a licence for every computer" if your usage habits are such that it's not warranted. We also paid in advance for the upgrade, and given that no Mac upgrade ever surfaced, I think we were treated unethically by Adobe. Even the Windows upgrade from 7 to 7.1 was not worth it. - web ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
On 27 Apr 2006, at 03:18, Peter Gold wrote: I'm not sure if you'd find it by digging in Wikipedia, but to put your point in context, it helps to know that in the early days of unix and FrameMaker, as with the early days of CP/M, each hardware manufacturer had a proprietary version of the OS, which required software to be written, converted, adapted, or "ported" to run on it. To sell these adamantly-independent hardware platforms, their manufacturers like Pyramid, Sequent, CGI, NeXT, and others PAID BIG BUCKS to companies like Frame Technology, Sybase, and others whose software they wanted to offer to attract customers. NeXT even bundled FrameMaker 3.x with its machines. I don't remember FrameMaker being bundled with NeXT boxes. Was it a trial version? We bought all of our licenses (could have been a site license). Should I call tech support? I remember the word processor Write Now was bundled. FWIW, Paul ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
If I remember correctly, there was a smaller footprint program called FrameReader that could be used to view FrameMaker documents. I think it was less expensive than FrameViewer. Rick FrameViewer was FrameMaker, just crippled to prevent authoring. It was expensive to purchase for just a product that reads and prints FrameMaker files, and it was also expensive in the amount of storage space and machine resources it required in those days. Adobe's not the villain here, IMO. Acrobat's PDF is more versatile for distributing files for reading, commenting, printing, information-collecting, and publishing for more applications beyond FrameMaker. You might say that Windows is a more likely villain, because on unix, FrameMaker's "floating" licensing approach minimized the need to purchase one license per user. Floating licenses could be checked out, used, and checked in, to release them for other users. If 20 simultaneous users are likely to need FrameMaker at any one time, a customer needs to purchase only 20 floating licenses to serve an enterprise of thousands of potential users. There are some similar third-party application-sharing tools that work on Windows across applications; they incur other overhead penalties and impose their own maintenance requirements. Regards, Peter Gold KnowHow ProServices ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
Hi, Bill: At 8:23 AM -0300 4/27/06, Bill Briggs wrote: At 7:14 AM -0400 4/27/06, Batsford, Steve wrote: Rick, My sentiment exactly. The popups and all of the available links SOUND cool. But in the real world all my content to my end users is in PDF. There used to be a product called FrameViewer, and you could view other people's FrameMaker documents with it. In FV all of the popups worked. Of course FV died after Adobe took over the product. FrameViewer was FrameMaker, just crippled to prevent authoring. It was expensive to purchase for just a product that reads and prints FrameMaker files, and it was also expensive in the amount of storage space and machine resources it required in those days. Adobe's not the villain here, IMO. Acrobat's PDF is more versatile for distributing files for reading, commenting, printing, information-collecting, and publishing for more applications beyond FrameMaker. You might say that Windows is a more likely villain, because on unix, FrameMaker's "floating" licensing approach minimized the need to purchase one license per user. Floating licenses could be checked out, used, and checked in, to release them for other users. If 20 simultaneous users are likely to need FrameMaker at any one time, a customer needs to purchase only 20 floating licenses to serve an enterprise of thousands of potential users. There are some similar third-party application-sharing tools that work on Windows across applications; they incur other overhead penalties and impose their own maintenance requirements. Regards, Peter Gold KnowHow ProServices ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
At 7:14 AM -0400 4/27/06, Batsford, Steve wrote: >Rick, > >My sentiment exactly. >The popups and all of the available links SOUND cool. But in the real >world all my content to my end users is in PDF. There used to be a product called FrameViewer, and you could view other people's FrameMaker documents with it. In FV all of the popups worked. Of course FV died after Adobe took over the product. - web ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
At 9:18 PM -0500 4/26/06, Peter Gold wrote: >Hi, Bill, Dan, and all: > >At 8:46 PM -0300 4/26/06, Bill Briggs wrote: >>Yeah, it would be a really great thing to have all of FrameMaker's hypertext >>capabilities survive to PDF. But we'll see a plethora of tiny little >>Photoshop-style pallets before we'll see something useful like what Dan was >>talking about. Makes you wonder what drives the decision mechanism (if there >>is one) regarding software improvements. Once FrameMaker is reduced to a >>single platform, down from the glory days when it was on many. Two great >>quotes from the Wikipedia entry for FrameMaker. >> >>"At the height of its success, FrameMaker ran on more than thirteen UNIX >>platforms, including NeXT Computer's NeXTSTEP and IBM's AIX operating >>systems." >> >>"Frame Technology later ported FrameMaker to Microsoft Windows, but the >>company lost direction soon after its release." > >I'm not sure if you'd find it by digging in Wikipedia, but to put your point >in context, it helps to know that in the early days of unix and FrameMaker, as >with the early days of CP/M, each hardware manufacturer had a proprietary >version of the OS, which required software to be written, converted, adapted, >or "ported" to run on it. To sell these adamantly-independent hardware >platforms, their manufacturers like Pyramid, Sequent, CGI, NeXT, and others >PAID BIG BUCKS to companies like Frame Technology, Sybase, and others whose >software they wanted to offer to attract customers. NeXT even bundled >FrameMaker 3.x with its machines. Yes, they mention the lower pricing of the Windows version and how it was an issue in the Wiki. And they mention the investment of platform manufacturers. I just thought it was interesting that once Frame Technology got mixed up with the Windows world, that's when it all fell apart. Flirt with the Borg and you take the consequences... >In its early years, Sun required its resellers to sell a certain amount of >software and support with each workstation, to avoid having resellers compete >solely on bottom-dollar hardware prices and leave customers with no software >and no support. FrameMaker on Solaris was a common component in those >packages; both companies benefited. > >Actually, FrameMaker was ported to Macintosh before Windows, because Windows >at the time was too wimpy to support it. I know. I have a copy of FrameMaker 2.1 for the Mac here somewhere. But I didn't use it a LOT until version 3, which I'd still use ahead of Word, if that were the choice. - web ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
Hi, Bill, Dan, and all: At 8:46 PM -0300 4/26/06, Bill Briggs wrote: >Yeah, it would be a really great thing to have all of FrameMaker's >hypertext capabilities survive to PDF. But we'll see a plethora of >tiny little Photoshop-style pallets before we'll see something >useful like what Dan was talking about. Makes you wonder what drives >the decision mechanism (if there is one) regarding software >improvements. Once FrameMaker is reduced to a single platform, down >from the glory days when it was on many. Two great quotes from the >Wikipedia entry for FrameMaker. > >"At the height of its success, FrameMaker ran on more than thirteen >UNIX platforms, including NeXT Computer's NeXTSTEP and IBM's AIX >operating systems." > >"Frame Technology later ported FrameMaker to Microsoft Windows, but >the company lost direction soon after its release." I'm not sure if you'd find it by digging in Wikipedia, but to put your point in context, it helps to know that in the early days of unix and FrameMaker, as with the early days of CP/M, each hardware manufacturer had a proprietary version of the OS, which required software to be written, converted, adapted, or "ported" to run on it. To sell these adamantly-independent hardware platforms, their manufacturers like Pyramid, Sequent, CGI, NeXT, and others PAID BIG BUCKS to companies like Frame Technology, Sybase, and others whose software they wanted to offer to attract customers. NeXT even bundled FrameMaker 3.x with its machines. In its early years, Sun required its resellers to sell a certain amount of software and support with each workstation, to avoid having resellers compete solely on bottom-dollar hardware prices and leave customers with no software and no support. FrameMaker on Solaris was a common component in those packages; both companies benefited. Actually, FrameMaker was ported to Macintosh before Windows, because Windows at the time was too wimpy to support it. While it's easy to point to what FrameMaker still hasn't incorporated from the long-standing user wish list, it's pretty remarkable to look back all the way to the FrameMaker 2.x era and see how much of the product's current productive feature set was built into it so early on. It's quite correct to say that the code base evolved to a point that's nearly impossible to maintain, as features have been added and refined. This is what's holding back the ability to evolve on any of the remaining supported platforms, or those that have been dropped. While many of us are quite inconvenienced by not having Mac OS X FrameMaker, how many users do we hear from who miss FrameMaker on Pyramid, Sequent, or NeXT? What's interesting about unix, is that it's easy to run FrameMaker on one Solaris machine and serve it to whole enterprises of users who connect to it from other unix platforms. It's not emulation, dual-boot, or virtual-machine - it's just unix. As far as lack of support for converting the FrameMaker's advanced hypertext features - pop-up menus, button matrixes, etc. to other distribution formats - mif2go and WebWorks Publisher Professional accomplish these behaviors in HTML with somewhat less complex preparation in FrameMaker than FrameMaker's own steps require. I believe that some of these can also be accomplished in PDF with some of Shlomo Perets' tools. It's half full, IMO. But, like most FrameMaker users, I expect at least three-quarters full. Hoping for more... Regards, Peter Gold KnowHow ProServices
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
Yeah, it would be a really great thing to have all of FrameMaker's hypertext capabilities survive to PDF. But we'll see a plethora of tiny little Photoshop-style pallets before we'll see something useful like what Dan was talking about. Makes you wonder what drives the decision mechanism (if there is one) regarding software improvements. Once FrameMaker is reduced to a single platform, down from the glory days when it was on many. Two great quotes from the Wikipedia entry for FrameMaker. "At the height of its success, FrameMaker ran on more than thirteen UNIX platforms, including NeXT Computer's NeXTSTEP and IBM's AIX operating systems." "Frame Technology later ported FrameMaker to Microsoft Windows, but the company lost direction soon after its release." - web At 4:31 PM -0400 4/26/06, Rick Quatro wrote: >Hi Bill, > >I agree wholeheartedly, but it's a shame that only FrameMaker users can >benefit. As Dan said, it would be nice if all of FrameMaker's hypertext >goodies would convert to PDF. > >Rick > >>Popups in FrameMaker are a treat. I made a little book for myself once (it >>had all sorts of stuff in it related to work, an address book, and a ton of >>other stuff) and I used it in printed form daily, but it had popups and >>hyperlink buttons for navigation in the software version. It was a great way >>to get around the book. I've used them in a few other places too, sometimes >>with an "invisible" button, so there was nothing in the printed version. >>Always loved that feature. >> >>- web
Re: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
Hi, Bill, Dan, and all: At 8:46 PM -0300 4/26/06, Bill Briggs wrote: Yeah, it would be a really great thing to have all of FrameMaker's hypertext capabilities survive to PDF. But we'll see a plethora of tiny little Photoshop-style pallets before we'll see something useful like what Dan was talking about. Makes you wonder what drives the decision mechanism (if there is one) regarding software improvements. Once FrameMaker is reduced to a single platform, down from the glory days when it was on many. Two great quotes from the Wikipedia entry for FrameMaker. "At the height of its success, FrameMaker ran on more than thirteen UNIX platforms, including NeXT Computer's NeXTSTEP and IBM's AIX operating systems." "Frame Technology later ported FrameMaker to Microsoft Windows, but the company lost direction soon after its release." I'm not sure if you'd find it by digging in Wikipedia, but to put your point in context, it helps to know that in the early days of unix and FrameMaker, as with the early days of CP/M, each hardware manufacturer had a proprietary version of the OS, which required software to be written, converted, adapted, or "ported" to run on it. To sell these adamantly-independent hardware platforms, their manufacturers like Pyramid, Sequent, CGI, NeXT, and others PAID BIG BUCKS to companies like Frame Technology, Sybase, and others whose software they wanted to offer to attract customers. NeXT even bundled FrameMaker 3.x with its machines. In its early years, Sun required its resellers to sell a certain amount of software and support with each workstation, to avoid having resellers compete solely on bottom-dollar hardware prices and leave customers with no software and no support. FrameMaker on Solaris was a common component in those packages; both companies benefited. Actually, FrameMaker was ported to Macintosh before Windows, because Windows at the time was too wimpy to support it. While it's easy to point to what FrameMaker still hasn't incorporated from the long-standing user wish list, it's pretty remarkable to look back all the way to the FrameMaker 2.x era and see how much of the product's current productive feature set was built into it so early on. It's quite correct to say that the code base evolved to a point that's nearly impossible to maintain, as features have been added and refined. This is what's holding back the ability to evolve on any of the remaining supported platforms, or those that have been dropped. While many of us are quite inconvenienced by not having Mac OS X FrameMaker, how many users do we hear from who miss FrameMaker on Pyramid, Sequent, or NeXT? What's interesting about unix, is that it's easy to run FrameMaker on one Solaris machine and serve it to whole enterprises of users who connect to it from other unix platforms. It's not emulation, dual-boot, or virtual-machine - it's just unix. As far as lack of support for converting the FrameMaker's advanced hypertext features - pop-up menus, button matrixes, etc. to other distribution formats - mif2go and WebWorks Publisher Professional accomplish these behaviors in HTML with somewhat less complex preparation in FrameMaker than FrameMaker's own steps require. I believe that some of these can also be accomplished in PDF with some of Shlomo Perets' tools. It's half full, IMO. But, like most FrameMaker users, I expect at least three-quarters full. Hoping for more... Regards, Peter Gold KnowHow ProServices ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
At 1:00 PM -0700 4/26/06, FIONA HANINGTON wrote: >I would *love* to see a sample of this in action - does anyone have one that >they would be willing to share with me? I'm sending you a current work in progress that uses this feature. - web
Re: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
Yeah, it would be a really great thing to have all of FrameMaker's hypertext capabilities survive to PDF. But we'll see a plethora of tiny little Photoshop-style pallets before we'll see something useful like what Dan was talking about. Makes you wonder what drives the decision mechanism (if there is one) regarding software improvements. Once FrameMaker is reduced to a single platform, down from the glory days when it was on many. Two great quotes from the Wikipedia entry for FrameMaker. "At the height of its success, FrameMaker ran on more than thirteen UNIX platforms, including NeXT Computer's NeXTSTEP and IBM's AIX operating systems." "Frame Technology later ported FrameMaker to Microsoft Windows, but the company lost direction soon after its release." - web At 4:31 PM -0400 4/26/06, Rick Quatro wrote: >Hi Bill, > >I agree wholeheartedly, but it's a shame that only FrameMaker users can >benefit. As Dan said, it would be nice if all of FrameMaker's hypertext >goodies would convert to PDF. > >Rick > >>Popups in FrameMaker are a treat. I made a little book for myself once (it >>had all sorts of stuff in it related to work, an address book, and a ton of >>other stuff) and I used it in printed form daily, but it had popups and >>hyperlink buttons for navigation in the software version. It was a great way >>to get around the book. I've used them in a few other places too, sometimes >>with an "invisible" button, so there was nothing in the printed version. >>Always loved that feature. >> >>- web ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
Hi Bill, I agree wholeheartedly, but it's a shame that only FrameMaker users can benefit. As Dan said, it would be nice if all of FrameMaker's hypertext goodies would convert to PDF. Rick > Popups in FrameMaker are a treat. I made a little book for myself once (it > had all sorts of stuff in it related to work, an address book, and a ton > of other stuff) and I used it in printed form daily, but it had popups and > hyperlink buttons for navigation in the software version. It was a great > way to get around the book. I've used them in a few other places too, > sometimes with an "invisible" button, so there was nothing in the printed > version. Always loved that feature. > > - web
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
At 11:47 AM -0700 4/26/06, Daniel Emory wrote: >--- "Carol J. Elkins" >wrote: >> Good post, Dan. However, I'm trying to visualize >your >> statement, "...clicking on this button produced a >> menu of links to major subject areas..." The >> button part I understand, the menu of links I'm >> struggling with. A popup menu? If so, could you tell >> me how you achieve the menu of links functionality? > >You asked how a popup menu is created in FrameMaker. >Here?s the procedure: Popups in FrameMaker are a treat. I made a little book for myself once (it had all sorts of stuff in it related to work, an address book, and a ton of other stuff) and I used it in printed form daily, but it had popups and hyperlink buttons for navigation in the software version. It was a great way to get around the book. I've used them in a few other places too, sometimes with an "invisible" button, so there was nothing in the printed version. Always loved that feature. - web
Re: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
Hi Bill, I agree wholeheartedly, but it's a shame that only FrameMaker users can benefit. As Dan said, it would be nice if all of FrameMaker's hypertext goodies would convert to PDF. Rick Popups in FrameMaker are a treat. I made a little book for myself once (it had all sorts of stuff in it related to work, an address book, and a ton of other stuff) and I used it in printed form daily, but it had popups and hyperlink buttons for navigation in the software version. It was a great way to get around the book. I've used them in a few other places too, sometimes with an "invisible" button, so there was nothing in the printed version. Always loved that feature. - web ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
At 1:00 PM -0700 4/26/06, FIONA HANINGTON wrote: >I would *love* to see a sample of this in action - does anyone have one that >they would be willing to share with me? I'm sending you a current work in progress that uses this feature. - web ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
At 11:47 AM -0700 4/26/06, Daniel Emory wrote: >--- "Carol J. Elkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >wrote: >> Good post, Dan. However, I'm trying to visualize >your >> statement, "...clicking on this button produced a >> menu of links to major subject areas..." The >> button part I understand, the menu of links I'm >> struggling with. A popup menu? If so, could you tell >> me how you achieve the menu of links functionality? > >You asked how a popup menu is created in FrameMaker. >Heres the procedure: Popups in FrameMaker are a treat. I made a little book for myself once (it had all sorts of stuff in it related to work, an address book, and a ton of other stuff) and I used it in printed form daily, but it had popups and hyperlink buttons for navigation in the software version. It was a great way to get around the book. I've used them in a few other places too, sometimes with an "invisible" button, so there was nothing in the printed version. Always loved that feature. - web ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
--- "Carol J. Elkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Good post, Dan. However, I'm trying to visualize your > statement, "...clicking on this button produced a > menu of links to major subject areas..." The > button part I understand, the menu of links I'm > struggling with. A popup menu? If so, could you tell > me how you achieve the menu of links functionality? You asked how a popup menu is created in FrameMaker. Heres the procedure: (steps 1 and 2 are used only if a button in a background text frame on a master page is used to open the menu. If, instead, you want to open the menu from highlighted anchor text within a body page, proceed directly to step 3). 1. On a reference page, draw a text frame. Inside that text frame draw a button, and use the drawing tools text button to insert, inside the button, a descriptive name for the button. 2. Inside the empty paragraph at the top of the text frame (not inside the button) insert a hypertext marker of the form: popup flowname where flowname is the name of a text flow of a text frame you are going to draw on a reference page. 3. Alternatively, you can skip steps 1 and 2, and instead insert the "popup flowname" hypertext marker into highlighted text (i.e., the hypertext anchor) within an ordinary body page. NOTE: If you are using structured FrameMaker, it might be advisable to specify the "popup flowname" marker in your structure rules, and define it as an element of type marker. 4. On a reference page (I usually create a special reference page named "Popups"), draw a text frame and assign that text frame the same flowname you specified in step 2 or 3. 5. In the first paragraph inside the text frame created in step 4, enter, on the top line, the title of the popup menu (itll only appear in the popup menu on Unix platforms). In the second and succeeding paragraphs within the menu, type the names of the items you want to appear on the menu. 6. Immediately following the last letter of each menu item (other than the title) added in step 5, insert the appropriate hypertext marker type (most commonly jump to named destination, but other types may also be used). The Jump to Named Destination marker has the form: gotolink destination_name where destination_name is the unique name of a newlink hypertext marker which you insert in the text of the applicable content. However, the hypertext link can also be to a popup sub-menu, in which case the menu item that refers to the submenu would be created in step 4 thru 6. However, a sub-menu cannot reference another popup menu. 7. If you used the button approach described in steps 1 and 2, copy the text frame containing the button you created, and paste it as a background text frame on a master page. 8. Once all that is accomplished, clicking on the button (or the highlighted text) will open the popup menu, and the user can then select the desired subject node from the menu. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Creating Popup menus in FrameMaker
--- "Carol J. Elkins" wrote: > Good post, Dan. However, I'm trying to visualize your > statement, "...clicking on this button produced a > menu of links to major subject areas..." The > button part I understand, the menu of links I'm > struggling with. A popup menu? If so, could you tell > me how you achieve the menu of links functionality? You asked how a popup menu is created in FrameMaker. Here?s the procedure: (steps 1 and 2 are used only if a button in a background text frame on a master page is used to open the menu. If, instead, you want to open the menu from highlighted anchor text within a body page, proceed directly to step 3). 1. On a reference page, draw a text frame. Inside that text frame draw a button, and use the drawing tool?s text button to insert, inside the button, a descriptive name for the button. 2. Inside the empty paragraph at the top of the text frame (not inside the button) insert a hypertext marker of the form: popup flowname where flowname is the name of a text flow of a text frame you are going to draw on a reference page. 3. Alternatively, you can skip steps 1 and 2, and instead insert the "popup flowname" hypertext marker into highlighted text (i.e., the hypertext anchor) within an ordinary body page. NOTE: If you are using structured FrameMaker, it might be advisable to specify the "popup flowname" marker in your structure rules, and define it as an element of type marker. 4. On a reference page (I usually create a special reference page named "Popups"), draw a text frame and assign that text frame the same flowname you specified in step 2 or 3. 5. In the first paragraph inside the text frame created in step 4, enter, on the top line, the title of the popup menu (it?ll only appear in the popup menu on Unix platforms). In the second and succeeding paragraphs within the menu, type the names of the items you want to appear on the menu. 6. Immediately following the last letter of each menu item (other than the title) added in step 5, insert the appropriate hypertext marker type (most commonly jump to named destination, but other types may also be used). The Jump to Named Destination marker has the form: gotolink destination_name where destination_name is the unique name of a newlink hypertext marker which you insert in the text of the applicable content. However, the hypertext link can also be to a popup sub-menu, in which case the menu item that refers to the submenu would be created in step 4 thru 6. However, a sub-menu cannot reference another popup menu. 7. If you used the button approach described in steps 1 and 2, copy the text frame containing the button you created, and paste it as a background text frame on a master page. 8. Once all that is accomplished, clicking on the button (or the highlighted text) will open the popup menu, and the user can then select the desired subject node from the menu.