In a message dated 06/28/2001 12:23:24 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Personally I don't care much about BSD vs. GPL and am
annoyed by Microsoft's hypocricy (sp?). The fact that
they're using open source software is great.
That was the point I was trying to
anyone seen this yet or am I slow as usual?
http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/dotnet/2001/06/27/dotnet.html
Ak
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Rik van Riel wrote:
On Tue, 26 Jun 2001, Wes Peters wrote:
Rik van Riel wrote:
On Sun, 24 Jun 2001, Rahul Siddharthan wrote:
Wes Peters said on Jun 23, 2001 at 23:28:42:
Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
Of course, they say it's all meant only
Rik van Riel wrote:
On Sun, 24 Jun 2001, Rahul Siddharthan wrote:
Wes Peters said on Jun 23, 2001 at 23:28:42:
Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
Of course, they say it's all meant only for legacy Unix stuff.
Can you substantiate your claim there is
On Tue, 26 Jun 2001, Wes Peters wrote:
Rik van Riel wrote:
On Sun, 24 Jun 2001, Rahul Siddharthan wrote:
Wes Peters said on Jun 23, 2001 at 23:28:42:
Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
Of course, they say it's all meant only for legacy Unix stuff.
Can you substantiate your claim there is plenty of GNU stuff in
Interix, or are you just talking out your ass as usual?
Substantiate? Look at the component list:
http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp
Why should I substantiate it? Do it yourself if it bothers you.
To
Rahul Siddharthan wrote:
http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/interixinc.asp
Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
Of course, they say it's all meant only for legacy Unix stuff.
Can you substantiate your claim there is plenty of GNU stuff in
Interix, or are
Mark Valentine wrote:
No. The core SpiderTCP protocol implementation is _not_ derived
from BSD. Some of the utilities which were added as the product
was developed came from Net/1 or Net/2 (hence the FTP.EXE copyright
string), but others such as route and netstat were written from
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Wes Peters writes:
Mark Valentine wrote:
No. The core SpiderTCP protocol implementation is _not_ derived
from BSD. [...]
(NOTE: this was never sockets over TLI like the stuff some UNIX
vendors bought from a Spider competitor!)
*Cough*Lachman*cough*.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/interixinc.asp
Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
Of course, they say it's all meant only for legacy Unix stuff.
Can you substantiate your claim there is plenty of GNU stuff in
Interix, or are you just talking out
In mailinglist.freebsd.hackers, you wrote:
This is a good reference, but sadly it only really refers to the
sockets paradigm as first popularized by BSD, which means they could
have followed the API without touching a single line of BSD code.
To reiterate: What I'm looking for is some true,
Wes Peters said on Jun 23, 2001 at 23:28:42:
Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
Of course, they say it's all meant only for legacy Unix stuff.
Can you substantiate your claim there is plenty of GNU stuff in
Interix, or are you just talking out your ass as
On Sun, 24 Jun 2001, Rahul Siddharthan wrote:
Wes Peters said on Jun 23, 2001 at 23:28:42:
Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
Of course, they say it's all meant only for legacy Unix stuff.
Can you substantiate your claim there is plenty of GNU stuff in
Dear Jordan,
Bill Gates has jumped in to clarify OS vs. GPL surprisingly quickly after
the publication in WSJ. Lee is my hero.
Sort of the other way around. We were the several FreeBSD
volunteers referenced in the article. Lee's my press contact at the
WSJ and he's done a number of
Koster, K.J. said on Jun 21, 2001 at 10:24:24:
Perhaps Lee can consider tracking down how much GLP lisenced software is
used in companies in close proximity to Microsoft. While Microsoft is not
going to be caught dead using it,
http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/interixinc.asp
OOPs ;)
check
http://linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2001-06-20-018-20-NW-MS-SW
Ak
Koster, K.J. said on Jun 21, 2001 at 10:24:24:
Perhaps Lee can consider tracking down how much GLP lisenced software is
used in companies in close proximity to Microsoft. While
Microsoft is not
going
Andy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
http://linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2001-06-20-018-20-NW-MS-SW
Doesn't this mean software developed with Microsoft's SDK is viral?
And doesn't *that* mean you're not allowed to develop it with
Microsoft's SDK? And doesn't this sound a bit circular?
DES
--
On 21 Jun 2001, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote:
Andy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
http://linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2001-06-20-018-20-NW-MS-SW
Doesn't this mean software developed with Microsoft's SDK is viral?
And doesn't *that* mean you're not allowed to develop it with
Microsoft's SDK?
Rahul Siddharthan [EMAIL PROTECTED] types:
http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/interixinc.asp
Plenty of GNU stuff there, though it doesn't say so explicitly.
Of course, they say it's all meant only for legacy Unix stuff.
Legacy being industry jargon for working.
mike
--
Mike
Jordan Hubbard ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
From: Jeroen Massar [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 13:16:20 +0200
It all sounds really odd to me but alas a cat does stupid things when it
gets cornered...
I
* Dave McKay [EMAIL PROTECTED] [010620 15:26] wrote:
Jordan Hubbard ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
From: Jeroen Massar [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 13:16:20 +0200
It all sounds really odd to me but alas a
http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-6322264.html?tag=tp_pr
Gates talks about GPL and being against it. ---Quote:
In an interview Tuesday with CNET News.com at the TechEd 2001 conference,
Gates observed that Microsoft routinely shares the source code for its Windows
operating system with its
Peter wrote:
However, Gates said, there are problems for commercial users relative to the
(GNU General Public License), and we are just making sure people understand the
GPL.
end Quote.
But the issue is that wasn't the end of the quotation. Later on, Bubba says,
And so people
Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
GPL is great for simple things, that don't create any standard, but
work upon one. But as even RMS [I think it was RMS] agreed, BSD
license is much better for 'standards'. -- ie the oog format was BSD
licensed and the GPL people endorsed it because this would
On Mon, Jun 18, 2001 at 10:55:06PM -0400, Sergey Babkin wrote:
Josef Karthauser wrote:
On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 01:16:28PM -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
is BSDI's stack so superior to any of the other BSDs that MS would pay BSDI
for it, particularly at a time when BSDI was trying to
Jordan Hubbard wrote:
I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
utilities, and though it's always been common knowledge in the
community that they were, when I set about to prove it I found it
Dan Nelson wrote:
In the last episode (Jun 15), Jordan Hubbard said:
Thanks, that represents the first hard hit I've seen yet:
root@winston- strings FTP.EXE |grep University of California
@(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California.
But this probably just
An article over on www.Kuro5hin.org by a someone who claims
to be a former MS employee describes the stack used in NT back
in the early 90's as code which was liscensed from a company
called 'Spider'. In the comp.unix.admin archives I found a post
which references Spider QNIX as a *nix variant so
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Adam)
Date: Tue 19 Jun, 2001
Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
An article over on www.Kuro5hin.org by a someone who claims
to be a former MS employee describes the stack used in NT back
in the early 90's as code which was
On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 01:16:28PM -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
is BSDI's stack so superior to any of the other BSDs that MS would pay BSDI
for it, particularly at a time when BSDI was trying to compete with MS in the
server market? Seems like something that a bunch of BSD fanatics
Hmm, anyone seen this then in the Wall Street J ??
Or is this what started this thread (if so I musta
missed one somewhere along the line).
Ak
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Josef Karthauser
Sent: 18 June 2001 11:17
To: [EMAIL
jeez, forgot the link to WSJ
http://public.wsj.com/news/hmc/sb992819157437237260.htm
If this is what started this forgive me for being
so unobservent, we're a bit slow here in the UK
sometimes (well I am that is!)
Ak
Hmm, anyone seen this then in the Wall Street J ??
Or is this what
In a message dated 06/17/2001 2:27:59 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
2. We're not bashing Microsoft here. We're just trying to figure
out if their recently published comments that Open Source is bad
and inimical to our interests is really just marketspeak which
I'm not sure if this will help or not but Winsock.h, Winsock2.h, and Ws2spi.h
which are shipped with visual studio 6 include the following in the header:
* This file includes parts which are Copyright (c) 1982-1986 Regents
* of the University of California. All rights reserved. The
*
Sort of the other way around. We were the several FreeBSD
volunteers referenced in the article. Lee's my press contact at the
WSJ and he's done a number of pieces favorable to us in the past.
Again, I'd like to thank the various folks on -hackers who responded
(you know who you are) and were a
+ Adam wrote:
| I'm not sure if this will help or not but Winsock.h, Winsock2.h, and Ws2spi.h
| which are shipped with visual studio 6 include the following in the header:
|
| * This file includes parts which are Copyright (c) 1982-1986 Regents
| * of the University of California. All
Josef Karthauser wrote:
On Sat, Jun 16, 2001 at 01:16:28PM -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
is BSDI's stack so superior to any of the other BSDs that MS would pay BSDI
for it, particularly at a time when BSDI was trying to compete with MS in the
server market? Seems like something that a
Jordan Hubbard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
utilities, and though it's always been common knowledge in the
community that they were, when I set about to
On Sun, Jun 17, 2001 at 01:16:20PM +0200, Jeroen Massar wrote:
Jordan Hubbard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
utilities, and though it's always been common
From: Jeroen Massar [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 13:16:20 +0200
It all sounds really odd to me but alas a cat does stupid things when it
gets cornered...
I sincerely hope that you BSD guysgals stay far far
Jordan Hubbard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Jeroen Massar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
It all sounds really odd to me but alas a cat does stupid things
when it gets cornered...
I sincerely hope that you BSD guysgals stay far far away from the
microsoft is evil, we can't win it easily so let's
microsoft is evil, we can't win it easily so let's bash it to
microsoft /is/ evil. point in fact they're one of the most unethical
capitalist organizations you could find as far as their business practices
are concerned. unfortunately, the masses are also too stupid to protect
themselves.
Sergey Babkin wrote:
| Brian Wolter wrote:
|
|microsoft is evil, we can't win it easily so let's bash it to
|
| microsoft /is/ evil. point in fact they're one of the most unethical
| ^^^
| capitalist organizations you
Doesn't any one remember Netiquette these days and trim what they are
replying to??
[ thread left below to see how bad this is getting.. ]
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:42:35PM -0700, Jordan Hubbard wrote:
This is a good reference, but sadly it only really refers to the
sockets paradigm as first
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Doesn't any one remember Netiquette these days and trim what they are
replying to??
No. Every month is September.
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Hi,
I agree with Serger Babkin - strings(1) wouldn't help.
Main keywords are: ndis.vxd , vip.386 , vtcp.386 .
Any DLL's has nothing common with TCP/IP stack - at least on md 9x.
Sergey Babkin wrote:
I know one way but it's a hard one: disassemble and manually decomiple
the code and
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jordan Hubbard)
Date: Fri 15 Jun, 2001
Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
root@winston- strings FTP.EXE |grep University of California
@(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California.
You can't tell much from
is BSDI's stack so superior to any of the other BSDs that MS would pay BSDI
for it, particularly at a time when BSDI was trying to compete with MS in the
server market? Seems like something that a bunch of BSD fanatics conjured up
after a few beers.
Bryan
To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL
In the previous episode, Jordan Hubbard said:
Not really, I don't have any contacts there. Sigh. I didn't think
proving this would be quite so hard. :(
If you issue the following command on hub:
% grep microsoft.com freebsd-* 2/dev/null
you may be able to find some contacts there.
What I read awhile back was MS licensed from BSDi their TCP/IP stack for use
in W2K.
Steve B.
- Original Message -
From: Jordan Hubbard [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 1:57 PM
Subject: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
I've
Do you have a pointer to what you read? I really need HARD evidence
here, not just anecdotal stuff. Thanks!
- Jordan
From: Steve B. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:59:51 -0700
What I read awhile back was MS
Do you happen to have any of their Winsock propoganda handy (specifically
developer materials or winsock.h header file)? I know for a fact that they
have said repetedly that some of it was taken directly from Berkely. I'm
just not sure where... I'm going to start digging through my stuff to see
I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
utilities, and though it's always been common knowledge in the
community that they were, when I set about to prove it I found it to
be less easy than
http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/psdk/winsock/apistart_9g1e.htm mentions
BSD, not sure if is direct enough.
I'm downloading the SDK right now so I can grepmonkey through the latest
and greatest headers, etc.
HTH
--
[ Joseph Mallett[EMAIL PROTECTED] ] [ http://srcsys.org ]
[ xMach
With the full knowledge that what I'm saying will probably be of no use,
I have a personal friend who is a Microsoft certified developer, with
full access to the source code of most Windows versions and other
well-known Microsoft apps. He has told me more than once that, yes,
the NT TCP/IP stack
According to Jordan Hubbard:
Do you have a pointer to what you read? I really need HARD evidence
here, not just anecdotal stuff. Thanks!
If you do a strings on ftp.exe (at least in win95), you should find some BSD
copyright strings.
--
Ollivier ROBERT -=- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! -=-
This is a good reference, but sadly it only really refers to the
sockets paradigm as first popularized by BSD, which means they could
have followed the API without touching a single line of BSD code.
To reiterate: What I'm looking for is some true, hard evidence that
Microsoft has used BSD code
Thanks, that represents the first hard hit I've seen yet:
root@winston- strings FTP.EXE |grep University of California
@(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California.
Now if we can just locate something in the kernel or a well-used
DLL..
- Jordan
From: Ollivier Robert
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 03:05:17PM -0600, Nate Williams wrote:
I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
utilities, and though it's always been common knowledge in the
community that they
From: Joseph Mallett [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft is using BSD TCP/IP code?
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:50:00 -0400 (EDT)
Well, looking through headers, a lot of stuff says taken from the BSD
file..., namely winsock.h and winsock2.h, at the very least it
I'll see if I can dig it up it was awhile back in one of the trade magazines
or their ezine.
Steve B.
- Original Message -
From: Jordan Hubbard [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 2:01 PM
Subject: Re: Query: How to tell if Microsoft
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:47:21PM -0700, Jordan Hubbard wrote:
Thanks, that represents the first hard hit I've seen yet:
root@winston- strings FTP.EXE |grep University of California
@(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California.
Here's one more:
(echo) [system32]$
In the last episode (Jun 15), Jordan Hubbard said:
Thanks, that represents the first hard hit I've seen yet:
root@winston- strings FTP.EXE |grep University of California
@(#) Copyright (c) 1983 The Regents of the University of California.
But this probably just means that FTP.EXE is based
Jordan Hubbard wrote:
I've had several marketing types approach me recently for details as
to whether or not Microsoft was using the BSD TCP/IP stack and/or user
utilities, and though it's always been common knowledge in the
community that they were, when I set about to prove it I found it
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