Re: [VOTE] Jakarta Sandbox

2006-04-08 Thread Andrew C. Oliver

-1 on these points

1. There should not be an escape from the pain of the incubator.  All 
new projects must go through the incubator and endure.  Commons sandbox 
was created prior to the incubator.
2. No to [EMAIL PROTECTED] if it is a MEGA-list for all of 
Jakarta.  The commons list is horrible and I get enough email.  There is 
no technical advantage to one mega list for all software.  Most problems 
are NOT oversite problems/discussions.
3. -1 to the form of this proposal which seems overly coarse grained or 
not nearly detailed (I'm not sure which)


-Andy

Henri Yandell wrote:



On Sat, 8 Apr 2006, Simon Kitching wrote:


On Fri, 2006-04-07 at 16:28 -0700, Martin Cooper wrote:

On 4/7/06, Henri Yandell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:



Calling a vote to create a Jakarta Sandbox; which entails:

  * Move Jakarta Commons Sandbox to Jakarta Sandbox
  * Migrate Jakarta Taglibs Sandbox into Jakarta Sandbox
  * Create development mailing list ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
  * Create wiki (and migrate wiki bits from j-c-s/j-t-s)
  * Jakarta Sandbox to initially use the Commons sandbox processes.



What would be the constraints on what could go in there? Anything, 
as long

as it's written in or for Java?


And who is expected to subscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]


Those who want to? :)

I imagine those working on sandbox components at the moment, plus a 
handful of people who tend to subscribe to such lists.


Out of interest - if we take a list with N mails a day, and have 2 
lists with N/2 mails a day, is that something you'd view as more 
painful or the same amount of pain?


I know that when subscribing to Jakarta subprojects I'm not interested 
in as a coder, I subscribe to both the -user and -dev and funnel them 
both into the same folder. For my level of interest it's just 
[EMAIL PROTECTED], not ecs-xxx@ etc. So I'm probably answering more pain 
to the above, but I've got a simple solution that hides the minor pain 
increase.


Hen

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Andrew C. Oliver
SuperLink Software, Inc.

Java to Excel using POI
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Re: [VOTE] Jakarta Sandbox

2006-04-08 Thread Rainer Klute
Am Freitag, den 07.04.2006, 19:17 -0400 schrieb Henri Yandell:
 Calling a vote to create a Jakarta Sandbox; which entails:
 
   * Move Jakarta Commons Sandbox to Jakarta Sandbox
   * Migrate Jakarta Taglibs Sandbox into Jakarta Sandbox
   * Create development mailing list ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
   * Create wiki (and migrate wiki bits from j-c-s/j-t-s)
   * Jakarta Sandbox to initially use the Commons sandbox processes.
 
 
 [ ] +1
 [X] -1

I vote -1 because I do not want my mailbox to be flooded with piles of
mails about stuff I don't care about. I'd like to solicit only those
pieces I am interested in.

Best regards
Rainer Klute

   Rainer Klute IT-Consulting GmbH
  Dipl.-Inform.
  Rainer Klute E-Mail:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  K├Ârner Grund 24  Telefon: +49 172 2324824
D-44143 Dortmund   Telefax: +49 231 5349423

Public key fingerprint: E4E4386515EE0BED5C162FBB5343461584B5A42E


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Re: [VOTE] Jakarta Sandbox

2006-04-08 Thread Henri Yandell



On Sat, 8 Apr 2006, Andrew C. Oliver wrote:


-1 on these points

1. There should not be an escape from the pain of the incubator.  All new 
projects must go through the incubator and endure.  Commons sandbox was 
created prior to the incubator.


Nope, all new communities must go through the incubator, not all new 
projects (well, components).


2. No to [EMAIL PROTECTED] if it is a MEGA-list for all of Jakarta.  The 
commons list is horrible and I get enough email.  There is no technical 
advantage to one mega list for all software.  Most problems are NOT oversite 
problems/discussions.


Is it the naming? How about [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Are you suggesting that there should be a mailing list per component in 
the sandbox? [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] etc?


dev@ was in Stephen's original proposal on Commons - so not something I'm 
personally tied to. It's not tied to my 'one-community' mantra, though I 
suspect it might appear that way :)


3. -1 to the form of this proposal which seems overly coarse grained or not 
nearly detailed (I'm not sure which)


Sounds about right - response so far suggests I need a lot more in the 
proposal - and it's probably better to go with the JLC vote next so the 
sandbox issue would be more obvious (things would be going from Commons 
Sandbox to JLC grouping).


Hen

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Re: [VOTE] Jakarta Sandbox

2006-04-08 Thread Henri Yandell



On Sat, 8 Apr 2006, Rainer Klute wrote:


Am Freitag, den 07.04.2006, 19:17 -0400 schrieb Henri Yandell:

Calling a vote to create a Jakarta Sandbox; which entails:

  * Move Jakarta Commons Sandbox to Jakarta Sandbox
  * Migrate Jakarta Taglibs Sandbox into Jakarta Sandbox
  * Create development mailing list ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
  * Create wiki (and migrate wiki bits from j-c-s/j-t-s)
  * Jakarta Sandbox to initially use the Commons sandbox processes.


[ ] +1
[X] -1


I vote -1 because I do not want my mailbox to be flooded with piles of
mails about stuff I don't care about. I'd like to solicit only those
pieces I am interested in.


That's why it didn't say general@ :)

Hen

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Re: [VOTE] Jakarta Sandbox

2006-04-08 Thread Nathan Bubna
On 4/8/06, Andrew C. Oliver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Henri Yandell wrote:
 
 
  On Sat, 8 Apr 2006, Andrew C. Oliver wrote:
 
  -1 on these points
 
  1. There should not be an escape from the pain of the incubator.  All
  new projects must go through the incubator and endure.  Commons
  sandbox was created prior to the incubator.
 
  Nope, all new communities must go through the incubator, not all new
  projects (well, components).

 So basically if I call my project a component I don't have to go through
 the incubator just YOUR
 incubator.

 Basically misery loves company so I think if the same sin buys me
 purgatory, I'd like to see you there.  Even if you call your project a
 component.

So, if i have an idea for a new group of code (avoiding component vs
project terminology for the moment) that would reasonably fit within
the jakarta mission (whatever you think that might be), you think i
should have to go through the incubator to start developing it? 
sounds like a great plan to shut down innovation from within the
jakarta community or else force it to go underground and hide out
within existing groups of code.

maybe i'm wrong on this, but i always understood the incubation
process to be for bringing in outside
groups-of-code/communities-of-developers into the ASF.If some
Jakarta developers want to try and start a new group-of-code that
would fit in Jakarta, a sandbox seems like a great place to play
around with it and develop interest.

If, on the other hand, i've been developing some group-of-code over at
sourceforge, with oversight and community happening there, and at some
later point i want to bring that into Jakarta, then incubation makes
perfect sense to me.

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