Re: [gentoo-dev] GLEP 42 (Critical news reporting) updates
On Sun, Dec 11, 2005 at 01:35:50AM +, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: Although most package updates are clean and require little user action, occasionally an upgrade requires user intervention during the upgrade process. Recent examples of the latter include the ``gcc-3.4`` stabilisation on ``x86`` and the ``mysql-5`` database format changes. There are currently several ways of delivering important news items to our users, none of them particularly effective: I'd suggest changing this to something more constructive - calling our current efforts none of them particularly effective isn't exactly a constructive way of critizing things. * Gentoo Weekly News * The ``gentoo-announce``, ``gentoo-user`` and ``gentoo-dev`` mailing lists * The Gentoo Forums * The main Gentoo website * RSS feeds of Gentoo news Einfo is currently being used for that purpose as well - even if the GLEP will leave it for less important news in the future. So i guess it should be listed here. A more reliable way of getting news of critical updates out to users is required to avoid repeats of the various recent upgrade debacles. As it was mentioned above, gcc 3.4 went pretty well on x86, can't comment on mysql as i don't use it myself. I'd suggest changing this text for something more diplomatic as i don't see much sense in having council approved GLEPs talking about council approved upgrade debacles. I'd suggest: A more reliable way of getting news of critical updates out to users is required to prevent problems during upgrades. .. Important:: This GLEP does not seek to replace or modify ``einfo`` messages which are displayed post-install. That is a separate issue which is handled by ``elog`` [#bug-11359]_. Thanks for clearing this quite important point up. Thus, at least 72 hours before a proposed news item is committed, it must be posted to the ``gentoo-dev`` mailing list and ``Cc:``\ed to [EMAIL PROTECTED] (exceptions may be made in exceptional circumstances). Any complaints ??? for example regarding wording, clarity or accuracy ??? **must** be addressed before the news item goes live. I know you think it is beyond the scope of this GLEP, but i believe having a new tool with rules for publication and OTOH all the old tools mentioned above without clear guidelines/hints how to use them doesn't make perfect sense. The gcc upgrade on x86 has shown so far that combining our efforts does work quite well. Even if not within this GLEP there should be some documentation how to make use of all available tools to inform users. Otherwise we just have another tool that gets more or less acceptance within the community. I'd suggest extending the process of creating a news item to also create a text to be posted to www.gentoo.org, the announce-mailinglist, the forums, RSS feeds, GWN, etc. Of course depending on the importance it may be decided to e.g. not post it on announce but only www.gentoo.org. Do you think this can be done within this GLEP or rather outside? cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-dev] Optimizing performance
On Thu, Dec 15, 2005 at 09:13:34AM -0500, Chris Gianelloni wrote: CFQ is much worse for a desktop system. I tend to like deadline for playing games. These can probably make a bit more difference than a new -fomg-itsofast-and-broken-math added to CFLAGS. That's funny, i switched from default to CFQ on my notebook which has a rather slow disk and it feels much better, especially when recovering from suspend to disk which swaps out a lot. It's possible it decreases overall performance, but it may feel faster sometimes. There was a tip in the GWN about turning on dir_index on an already formatted file system. If formatting a new one, just use mkfs.ext2 -J -O dir_index /dev/$whatever to create your file system. Good thing you remind me of that. As a new ext3 convert (i happily used reiser3 for years before), any problems to be expected by doing so? Afaics it turns on B-trees which should have no impact on the safety of my data, right? Just want to make sure, i rather use a slightly slower file system than risking data loss. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-dev] Stepping aside...
The GDP does very good work and i think you did your part to make this happen. Thanks! On Fri, Dec 23, 2005 at 04:44:28PM +0100, Sven Vermeulen wrote: With kind regards (yes, that's what Wkr stands for), Wkr, too :-) Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpsmioZ96jed.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Gentoo World Domination. a 10 step guide
On Wed, Oct 04, 2006 at 10:27:17AM -0400, Chris Gianelloni wrote: Here's the games team's status reports for every month: Fixed more bugs, added more packages, cleaned up some ebuilds. You forgot to mention the weekly team meeting including a motivational speech. Shame on you! Apart from that, i guess a lot of reports will look like that, so i don't really see the point in making them, too. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgp7vIeDq22Fk.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Gentoo World Domination. a 10 step guide
On Wed, Oct 04, 2006 at 07:15:16AM -0500, Brandon Low wrote: As usual, sweeping new policies or procedures WILL NOT FIX THINGS. I fully agree to this. While some of the ideas may be good, and some not, each of them should be discussed seperately and eventually something good will come out of it. A list of 10 big changes (some of them even affect our current metastructure) is hardly something that will get clear yes/no support from anyone. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpV6M3HjSM1n.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Resignation
Seeing you go under these circumstances really worries me. Perhaps you want to reconsider it - if not: All the best! cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpIebpqWuMLk.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] New Developer: Alexis Ballier (aballier)
On Mon, Oct 09, 2006 at 07:40:07PM +0200, Christian Heim wrote: He hails from Marseille (that's in France if someone doesn't know where Marseille is). Where's France? ;-) So please welcome Alexis as a new fellow developer among us! Welcome Alexis! cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpwcJYLXfEzH.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Missing: Universal-CD - Gentoo discriminates shell and networkless users
On Tue, Oct 10, 2006 at 10:13:41AM +, Duncan wrote: Personally, I'd say 686 is the lowest reasonable to support at this point. Below that, try an appropriate binary distribution and save the days/weeks of compiling. Bollocks. I run a print/samba/backup box at work which is a pentium II 400. Compiling glibc takes 3 hours here and while it may not be the fastest box around it is enough to fulfill its duty. It also beats my desktop (a pentium 3 866) every time i do upgrade operations involving recompiling (bigger parts of) the system, simply because it has way less packages installed (e.g. no X, mozilla-*, openoffice, etc). So basically i should probably switch over my desktop if it was about compile times - but honestly i don't care about them a lot anyway. Also, there is no binary distribution i find as attractive as Gentoo and know how to manage that well. Of course, Gentoo is highly customizable, and folks could try it on 386 if they wanted, but I don't believe it's worth supporting below 686 at this point. That's personally. I'm sure there are folks that would argue we should at least support 586, but I simply don't believe it's worth it. Which kind of support are you speaking of? As for installation media, i really don't care. I fully agree i686 is dying out and if the release media is built built for i686 only i have no problem with that either. If you really want to put Gentoo on a i586 there are a other ways to do it, too, but i don't think we should stop supporting i586 in general. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpgFK3iXNWm9.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Missing: Universal-CD - Gentoo discriminates shell and networkless users
On Tue, Oct 10, 2006 at 07:13:39AM -0500, Andrew Gaffney wrote: Uhh, P2 is i686, which falls squarely into the realm of supported and reasonable :) Oh my goodness, i forgot to upgrade my cflags/chost/foo then when i put the disk from the old pentium into this one then. Think of all those optimizations! ;-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpTtgCoz30M4.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Missing: Universal-CD - Gentoo discriminates shell and networkless users
On Tue, Oct 10, 2006 at 12:28:10PM -0400, Chris Gianelloni wrote: Which kind of support are you speaking of? As for installation media, i really don't care. I fully agree i686 is dying out and if the release media is built built for i686 only i have no problem with that either. If you really want to put Gentoo on a i586 there are a other ways to do it, too, but i don't think we should stop supporting i586 in general. Nobody has said that. So long as glibc/gcc/etc still work on i586, we'll still provide the ability to use it on those machines. That doesn't mean we'll support it. It's like GCC 2.x, which is still in the tree. It's there. It's usable. It's totally unsupported. That's exactly what i can perfectly live with (i do even have a real i586 box that's not a pentium 2 ;-) ), thanks for clearing it up. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpzFHtMe4JH7.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] *plop*
On Fri, Oct 13, 2006 at 10:31:04PM +0200, Thierry Carrez wrote: I used to have a job and situation that left me a lot of time to work for Gentoo, and security work is something that takes a lot of time and dedication. Now that I'm a father, that I changed jobs and (recently) houses, it's simply not possible anymore. Congratulations! One of these days i'm gonna trade in all Gentoo devs for a child, too. Just one little crying child to take care of instead of 300. ;-) Thanks for your Gentoo work, i guess your name will be remembered well (among other things because of all the GLSA mails you sent out). cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgp1OB7egboiz.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Recommended -march settings [was: Re: [gentoo-dev] CFLAGS paragraph submission for the GWN]
On Sat, Oct 14, 2006 at 05:16:29AM -0400, Mike Frysinger wrote: On Saturday 14 October 2006 04:49, Sebastian Bergmann wrote: Do we have an official list of recommended -march settings somewhere? [..] but what you actually want is a list that tells you what cpu value to pass to -march/-mtune based upon the product name of the processor you're running What about creating an official document for both -march/mtune and CFLAGS settings for different CPUs? If some other people like the idea and no one else volunteers i can go poke the different arch teams, toolchain folks and whoever else may be involved about it and compile a list based on their input. I wouldn't try to make it a ricer issue but rather a list of flags that are known to be sane and supported by Gentoo. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpLCoRe889mh.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: [gentoo-core] Developer retirement
unsubscribe On Mon, Oct 16, 2006 at 09:35:08PM +0200, Jakub Moc wrote: Donnie Berkholz napsal(a): Jakub Moc wrote: I don't see what's there to fix, already told that the behaviour is damned inconsistent with all other mailing lists. Fix the mailing list, ktnxbye, don't have time for such nonsense. Why don't you use Reply All or Reply to List, like everyone else? Yes, that's a wonderful and popular workaround that makes me recieve half of the replies on that list multiple times, because I'm apparently not the only only having the problem with the stupid behaviour. Wouldn't it make sense to finally fix it instead of wasting bandwidth and pissing off developers for no apparent reason? TIA. -- Best regards, Jakub Moc mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] GPG signature: http://subkeys.pgp.net:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0xCEBA3D9E Primary key fingerprint: D2D7 933C 9BA1 C95B 2C95 B30F 8717 D5FD CEBA 3D9E ... still no signature ;) Wheee, if you managed to scroll down so far, you found the irony. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpFGsiWZfD5C.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] RFC: Gentoo Commitfests
On Fri, Oct 20, 2006 at 10:42:43PM +0100, Roy Bamford wrote: money-- ++ As said in some other mail, stats in GWN or something like that would be nice - kloeri already did some nice graphs (see planet). We aren't all on the same currency and everyone is volunteers. You're just jealous because you guys still haven't introduced the Euro on that island of yours :-P cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgphsYo9D0Qix.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] New Developer: Matti 'mabi' Bickel
On Sun, Oct 22, 2006 at 04:03:05PM +0200, Tobias Scherbaum wrote: Hey, finally - after a very long time a new developer joining us from the Eastern part of Germany! Yeah, uh.. great, another German is exactly what we needed. :-P I'll look forward seeing you again at the Congress in Berlin and hey - don't forget that you're (as a developer) are expected to join us at the events in Chemnitz and Dresden next year ;) Yeah, you really don't want to miss Chemnitz, i'm looking forward to seeing you guys there. Please give him a warm welcome! Willkommen! =) Habe die Ehre :-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgp0kmgxN06uq.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Massive package.mask cleanup
On Sun, Oct 22, 2006 at 09:08:18PM +0200, Jakub Moc wrote: I also fail to see the problem. I checked and none of the unmasked versions/ebuilds is actually in the tree. Where's the security issue here? Do we need a dumspace for non-existant stuff in package.mask? It's important to yell at the new guy so he realizes he could have broken stuff even if he didn't. Makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside. :-P cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpkEhbvTxAM5.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: RFC: Gentoo Commitfests
On Mon, Oct 23, 2006 at 11:19:41AM +0200, Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò wrote: On Monday 23 October 2006 11:07, Simon Stelling wrote: This makes Gentoo look very unprofessional. It even makes us look like we're having fun. How did you dare to not wear your tie today?! I thought it's casual monday today? cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpSMxbPcUXKt.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Take this motha to IRC lolz
On Tue, Oct 31, 2006 at 06:53:20PM +, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: On Tue, 31 Oct 2006 10:45:02 -0800 Chris White [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: | Alright kids, you've been emailing back and forth since 7AM my time | in a frequence of about 5 minute intervals. Just take this motha to | IRC already. Please stop adding to the noise with these worthless posts. You've been doing it a lot lately, and it doesn't contribute anything to the discussion. Hm, seems -dev is choking under that thread already, i never received the email you responded to. So perhaps taking it to irc really is a good idea... cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpjD3BccusVU.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Retirement
On Fri, Nov 03, 2006 at 02:15:58PM -0500, Jon Portnoy wrote: And of course, the only thing anyone is really concerned about; robbat2 has already laid claim to fortune-mod-gentoo-dev ;) Good to hear the really important packages are in good hands. :-) Later. It's been fun, it's been real, but it hasn't been real fun. :) Too bad to see you go, thanks for the stuff you did to^Wfor Gentoo. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpcvhwRN4beP.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Monthly Gentoo Council Reminder for November
On Mon, Nov 06, 2006 at 05:20:49PM -0500, Mike Frysinger wrote: most of your dislike for SPF centers around the idea you dont want to send mail via gentoo.org mail servers ... is this really a problem ? seems like it's pretty trivial to do so While i couldn't care less about the whole SPF discussion i'd just like to point out sending mail via gentoo's email servers is listed as a last resort according to our docs rather than an alternative. http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/infrastructure/dev-email.xml writes: Warning: Do not do this unless absolutely necessary. Please use your ISPs relay server whenever possible. If you need a relay-server desperately and have no other means of sending e-mails, you can use dev.gentoo.org as a relayserver. To do Using dev.gentoo.org as a mail relay server Perhaps that paragraph needs some rethinking if it affects SPF? cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgp2El20XRwjp.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Gentoo list server dropping mail
Great, this has been a bit annoying recently, hope it works now. Thanks Andrea! cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpoxVDr0Bohg.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] New developer: Charlie Shepherd (masterdriverz)
On Tue, Nov 21, 2006 at 11:13:48PM +0200, Petteri Räty wrote: It's my pleasure to introduce to you Charlie masterdriverz Shepherd. Perfect opportunity for a goat joke! So please give masterdriverz the usual warm welcome. Welcome masterdriverz :-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpJ13X1uG3VC.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] http://bugs.gentoo.org/
On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 03:34:39PM +0200, Sergey Borodich wrote: What with http://bugs.gentoo.org/ ? Can anyone fix it ? 14:48 -!- Topic for #gentoo-dev: Sometimes on topic || Bugzie dead, jforman working on it: http://tinyurl.com/y4evnv || Bugday on saturday. Please tell eroyf if you have any bugs you think users're able to help with. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgptLSYi9oRej.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Last rites: net-misc/cidr
On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 02:52:50PM +1100, Andrew Ross wrote: It's always nice to suggest a replacement - I use net-misc/whatmask :-) net-misc/ipcalc is quite nice, too. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpGF3Hb0OnNV.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] New developer: Christian Marie (pingu)
On Mon, Dec 18, 2006 at 02:06:47PM +0200, Petteri Räty wrote: So please give pingu the usual warm welcome. So where's Chris White with his mad pole dancing skills when you need him? cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpazslVWJqo5.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Removal Announcements (or, Bring out yer dead)
On Sat, Dec 30, 2006 at 08:25:50PM -0600, Ryan Hill wrote: two, we have a perfectly good announce ML that right now is only used for GLSAs, and an announcement forum that is used for GLSAs and major announcements. what do people think about posting last rites to these places, maybe in one post on a weekly basis like the package moves section in the GWN (which BTW is a very welcome addition ;)). Sounds like a good idea, probably best to talk to tomk how to implement this on the forums, either talk to him directly or drop by in #gentoo-forums. Iirc he's on holiday for a few days right now though. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpd0nAIYYR9k.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] bugs.gentoo.org migration - completed!
On Sat, Jan 06, 2007 at 12:27:31AM -0800, Robin H. Johnson wrote: And we're done! Thanks to myself, kingtaco, ramereth, solar, jforman and cshields for all playing a part of getting this together so far! A special thank you to our sponsor GNi (gni.com) for the hardware. I hear there will be an article on them in an upcoming GWN. That's great news, thanks everyone! cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpNrr4IF0taR.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] New developer: Vic Fryzel (shellsage)
On Sun, Jan 21, 2007 at 12:44:28PM +0100, Christian Heim wrote: [..] software. And please be aware, he's assistant instructor and student of Shaolin Wu Su Kung Fu. Wow, that's probably the second best thing after Ninjas [1]. Welcome Vic! cheers, Wernfried [1] http://www.realultimatepower.net/ -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgppRlTfuzZjn.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Topic for Feb council meeting
On Sun, Jan 28, 2007 at 02:24:49PM -0800, Mike Doty wrote: 1. re-elect a whole new council. Seems to be overkill to me. 2. elect a new member at a reduced term to fill the vacancy. Personally i'd rather go with #3, but the GLEP also states: If a council member who has been marked a slacker misses any further meeting (or their appointed proxy doesn't show up), they lose their position and a new election is held to replace that person. The newly elected council member gets a 'reduced' term so that the yearly elections still elect a full group. Seems to be the closest case to a member simply resigning with the slacker regulation. 3. take the 8th spot from the last election. Seems to be the best - and least complicated - version to me. 4. The position stays empty until the next election (As long the number of council members doesn't drop below a certain number, let's say 5. Just adding this as it may be an option, too. The spirit of the GLEP would indicate option 2, but it's never spelled out. Speak out now if you have a opinion on the subject. Agreed, personally i'd go with #2. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgp9Wk3Aft4Vi.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] New developer: Samuli Suominen (drac)
On Sat, Feb 03, 2007 at 11:15:22PM +0200, Petteri Räty wrote: A fellow countryman so he hails from Finland. He has been using Linux for about 10 years now. He says he spents about 75% of his free time on Gentoo so expect Xfce 4.4 to be unmasked sometime soon :) Welcome Samuli, Xfce4(-devs)++ :-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgp8Boo94G4T7.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] New network config for baselayout-ng
On Thu, Feb 08, 2007 at 11:02:38AM +, Roy Marples wrote: Who said that there would be loss of functionality? I'm just suggesting a new config while supporting the old one. That sounds great, especially for all the slackers unwilling to change their config files. :-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpOpIxtEqxYR.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] New network config for baselayout-ng
On Thu, Feb 08, 2007 at 12:45:30PM +, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: Ooh, an ad hominem! Is that the name of paludis' bug reporting tool? cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpmVi8GZwueT.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] emerge glitz fails (/usr/lib64/libGL.so: File wrong format) Glut also
On Sun, Feb 18, 2007 at 07:51:56PM +0100, KLessou wrote: Hello I don't understand why I cannot emerge glitz Not really a gentoo development related issue, so i just wanted to suggest you post to gentoo-user or the forums, but as i just noticed you already did anyway: http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-541060.html Let's keep it there and not on this list, thanks. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgp5x9H5IPykV.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Introducing the Proctors - Draft Code of Conduct for Gentoo
On Tue, Mar 13, 2007 at 04:09:53PM -0500, Grant Goodyear wrote: * Can we find a better name than the Proctors, please? Yes, that's a completely petty point, but it was the first one that came to mind. +1, i think i haven't ever heard that word before, and it sounds quite empty to me as a non english person. * I understand the desire to act quickly, so that it appears that Gentoo is doing something about this problem. However, I agree with those who think that a few days isn't really enough time for an adequate discussion. For this sort of policy to be effective, devs need to agree with it. The Council can still make temporary rules on Thursday while allowing the rest of the process to occur more leisurely. Wanted to write something like that too, but your version is better than mine. ;-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpnkHLYjnyZu.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Introducing the Proctors - Draft Code of Conduct for Gentoo
[replying here as it already cleared out a couple of things i wanted to ask] On Tue, Mar 13, 2007 at 05:19:03PM +, Christel Dahlskjaer wrote: 3. The proctors would be given the access required to execute any suspensions or similar actions. Please define access. Does that mean they get to ban people from the forums and all #gentoo-* channels? Do they get mod/op powers or just request it from the respective forum moderators / channel operators (who _have_ to follow their orders)? This is also very unclear in the doc: Things that could get you banned/suspended from Gentoo's official communication infrastructure: What exactly is Gentoo's official communication infrastructure? The mailinglists? _All_ IRC channels? So far #gentoo and #gentoo-dev are the only channels following some official policy, all others are ruled by whatever project/owner they have (afaik, correct me if wrong). Would a ban also affect all #gentoo-* channels and the forums? Posting on planet? What about gentoo developers calling people names in non-gentoo channels while wearing a gentoo cloak on irc or being otherwise easily identified as such (e.g. posting flames to debian mailing lists using @gentoo.org email)? 4. By Gentoo fora/Official Communication Channels we refer to all official channels of communication; MLs, IRC, Forums, IM, Bugzilla etc. Kind of answers my question, but i'm still asking for confirmation because i have a hard time believing it. Do the proctors get to overrule every team that moderates some communication channel already? (This does NOT mean we are replacing guidelines for sub-fora -- the CoC would be in addition to IRC and Forum guidelines). This should be added to the doc - as far i understand it defines minimum standards, and there are additional rules for certain irc channels and the forums (probably best to link them in the guide). Furthermore this raises an important question for me: So far, the forums moderators (as well as the ops in #gentoo) have enforced their policies. As long proctors and mods/ops are of the same opinion about a person, fine - but what about the following situations: - A developer misbehaves on the forums according to the forums staff and gets banned by them. So far, it has been our policy (not written, and hardly used every 2 years) to let devrel know about it in case they wanted to do something else about it. I guess it would make sense to continue that. What if the proctors disagree with the ban? - The proctors think someone is misbehaving on the forums and want him banned, while the forums staff think it is not ban worthy. What now? I also understand that the timeframe for peer-review is shorter than what you have all expected (and wished for), and I fully understand the annoyance in regards to this. It's shorter than what we had originally aimed for. I seriously hope the council doesn't do a final vote on something where a lot of details are yet unclear and undefined, otherwise i'll vote the bums out. [1] Don't get me wrong, it's about time to do something, but rushing through something completely new probably will only make things worse. cheers, Wernfried [1] before anyone goes proctor on me, read http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/glep/glep-0039.html :-P -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgp2CehAC2qcO.pgp Description: PGP signature
[gentoo-dev] Slightly different proposal for a Code of Conduct
During discussing the current CoC Draft, i decided to write down a slightly different version, that solves some problems with conflicts of interest and redundancy between different teams - well at least according to me. ;-) Anyway, here it is, and open to comments (which i may not be able to integrate until the meeting due to time issues), merging with the other one or your personal /dev/null. I left some stuff unclear with respect to the Council as i didn't want to put things in there that should be clearly designed by them (e.g. the punishment stuff, or what powers the mailing list mods should get). cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org Simplified restructured approach to establishing a Code of Conduct. So far, some media are already moderated, while other are not. Furthermore, abusive behaviour in one (or several of them) is likely to have no negative consequences. The aim of this proposal is to address both of these issues by creating a Code of Conduct (CoC) and establishing means for identifying negative behaviour while integrating existing structures. ) Establish a CoC (note: most parts shamelessly stolen from Christel) Desired Behaviour * Be courteous. Respect is, and has to be, earned, but even if someone has not done so there is no reason to assume that their input is worthless, or that they do not deserve a measure of politeness in your response. * Giving accurate information in the spirit of being helpful. * Respectfully disagreeing with or challenging other members. The operative word here is RESPECTFULLY. * Using the correct forum for your post. Bug reports and idle chatter do not belong on the gentoo-dev mailing list; discussion about a wide-ranging change to the tree probably does not belong on Bugzilla. Different fora will also have different standards of behaviour -- a joke that is perfectly acceptable on IRC will be taken differently when made on a mailing list. * Admit the possibility of fault, or of people holding different views. Noone is perfect -- you will get things wrong occasionally. Don't be afraid to admit this. Similarly, while something may seem perfectly obvious to you, others may see it differently. This does not make their contribution less worthwhile, even if they do turn out to be wrong. * If you screw up, apologize sincerely. Unacceptable behaviour Deciding to suspend or ban someone isn't a decision we take lightly, but sometimes it has to happen. Below is a list of things that could get your access suspended. Please keep in mind that the decision to ban (or not) is a subjective one, and is based on many factors. If you ever have questions about our decisions, feel free to talk to us about it. Things that could get you banned/suspended from Gentoo's official communication infrastructure: * Flaming and trolling. * Receiving one (or more) warnings. Usually, you wouldn't be banned for a single warning, but it might happen if we feel your infraction is severe enough. We consider banning to be pretty serious; we take each situation on a case-by-case basis and make sure we always have a consensus for whatever decision we reach. * Constantly purveying misinformation despite repeated warnings. * Being judgmental, mean-spirited or insulting. It is possible to challenge someone (respectfully, of course), in a way that empowers without being judgemental. * Posting/participating only to incite drama or negativity rather than to tactfully share information. * Violating the specific rules of a communication rules, such as the forum rules on forums.gentoo.org or the rules for #gentoo. ) CoC is a minimum standard for all Gentoo media. It has to be followed everywhere. Some media (e.g. the forums, or #gentoo may have additional rules that need to be followed, too). ) Get moderators for unmoderated media This mostly means establishing a group of people who watch over the Gentoo mailing lists and identify non acceptable behaviour. The council may or may not want to give them some powers to unsubscribe/mute/... people at their discretion. (note: Dear council, please figure out yourself what you want them to be able to, and fill it in here.) ) Integrate existing media Existing moderation teams already enforce rules that cover the rules in the CoC, at least in the spirit of the rules. Like the mailing list mods, they have some powers to ban/mute/... people misbehaving. In case of minor offences (like a single swearword in #gentoo), a local warning or +q for a couple of minutes by the local moderators may be enough, and it is not necessary to escalate it further. Depending on the violation (and if it actually violates the CoC), this will be reported UPSTREAM
Re: [gentoo-dev] Slightly different proposal for a Code of Conduct
On Thu, Mar 15, 2007 at 08:51:42AM +0100, Denis Dupeyron wrote: From your draft: (note: most parts shamelessly stolen from Christel) In that case, showing only what differs from Christel's proposal would have been a better way to present yours. Sorry if that was unclear, that note didn't apply to the whole document but only the Code of Conduct itself (i did some rearranging putting the dos above the don'ts, i also added that violating the rules of a subforum also may be a breach of CoC). I could have written down my own version of this, but Christel's pretty much summed up what i would have written, too. The rest of the document is not shamelessly stolen, and it's probably best to read both docs to see the difference. My key point is that i suggest a clear seperation between the moderators of the mailing lists and the people who actually enforce the CoC while the proctors do both things. It also integrates existing moderation structures and only adds a new one for unmoderated mailing lists, reducing overlaps and potential conflicts of interest. There is no new department for executing the CoC, but this responsibility rather lies with existing structures (Devrel or Userrel, depending on the status of the person violating CoC), which reduces redundancy and overlap once again. I think that sums the most important differences up, if you need more information, please read post proposals. ;-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpgpoUMLel5m.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Gentoo's problems
On Wed, Mar 14, 2007 at 09:58:50PM +, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: * The wrong idea of what the user base is, and what the target user base is. Gentoo's direction is too heavily influenced by a small number of extremely noisy ricer forum users, many of whom don't even run Gentoo. Unfortunately, this self-perpetuating clique wields huge amounts of influence. I was certain that Gentoo's direction was influenced by the people working on Gentoo; not ricers. Do you have any examples of when the ricers changed the direction of things in Gentoo. Sunrise is the canonical example. Also consider the way the forums are being run (like it or not, the forums are taken by many to be representative of Gentoo's user base)... Drop your theories about the forums from this list please, it's really far OT and creating a quite unproductive atmosphere. Thanks, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpBGpeQb9yG1.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: gentoo-dev vs lkml?
On Wed, Mar 14, 2007 at 06:15:27PM +, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: No one's been complaining about the user forums, apart from ciaran afaict Oh, I assure you I'm not the only person to have serious issues with the forums. A number of Gentoo developers and former Gentoo developers have expressed similar views to mine on the subject... Once again, stop turning every thread into a tirade against the forums. Thanks, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpSBOHPHtTkq.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] New developer: Anant Narayanan (anant)
On Wed, Mar 21, 2007 at 08:55:56AM +0100, Christian Heim wrote: Please welcome Anant as a new fellow developer among us ! That nick already sounds so familiar, i thought he already is. Well, welcome anyway then. :-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpE5TEB6C8w4.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] My turn to wear the cursed medalion of retirement
On Mon, Mar 19, 2007 at 01:10:49AM +0100, Alexandre Buisse wrote: [some stuff] I just ran into recently with some latex stuff and you really were very helpful and showed a lot of patience - thanks a lot for that and all the other work you did for Gentoo. Sorry to see you go. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpX3KxMs2cAI.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] [soc] Python bindings for Paludis
On Sat, Mar 24, 2007 at 01:46:45PM +1100, Jonathan Adamczewski wrote: Paludis is a tool used for working with the Gentoo Portage tree - there is no problem with it being part of a Gentoo Google Summer of Code project as it will benefit the Gentoo project and its users. Why not simply solve the situation by making paludis the mentoring organisation instead of Gentoo? cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpPRc9PWndC4.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] [soc] Python bindings for Paludis
On Sat, Mar 24, 2007 at 01:31:08AM -0700, Alec Warner wrote: [some stuff] Thanks for the explanation, i guess that makes sense. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgp0iYPX1u5mI.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] get pci info in Linux?
On Thu, Mar 29, 2007 at 06:02:34PM +0300, Bilanchuk Vitaly wrote: Who knows how can I get information about pci-device (for example, vendor and name of network card) without using /proc and /sys systems? Seems you are looking for lspci from the package sys-apps/pciutils. Btw, as this doesn't seem to be a Gentoo development related question, please ask on the gentoo-user list, the forums or in #gentoo on IRC next time, but not here. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpycw3VGJqhn.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] clanlib-0.6 and friends masked for removal
On Sat, Mar 31, 2007 at 02:06:14PM +0200, Denis Dupeyron wrote: That means it's going right into my local overlay until my son eventually gets tired of playing pingus. Just install Doom :-] cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpqtTIxa8JBg.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Monthly Gentoo Council Reminder for April
Since i tried to get things running for the last week or two, i need to throw in my 2 cents here. On Wed, Apr 04, 2007 at 10:18:17AM +0200, Bryan Østergaard wrote: On Wed, Apr 04, 2007 at 01:51:56AM -0400, Mike Frysinger wrote: some topics off the top of my head: - unaddressed CoC issues: - add a mission statement ++, also some other docs stuff. - fix wording to have a positive spin Sounds like a good idea. Since i first read about this here on the dev list: Please, if you want to get stuff done, at least cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] so they have a chance to do so. - what else ? We need quite a few more people on the CoC team. One reason being that we want to be sure to cover more timezzones and different cultures. I fully agree. So far two people have been added, who were suggested by me and added after a given timeframe had passed with no complaints. Still, this is not enough yet i think. Other reason being to make sure it's not just an old boys club where everybody on the team sees things exactly the same way which could easily undermine any consensus based decisions. Which is the reason i didn't bring in more people myself, but am still waiting for others to suggest someone. :-P Other than that, i already expected this to be a topic at the next council meeting and there is a list of things that should be done by then. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpTe3IM5RzPA.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Monthly Gentoo Council Reminder for April
On Wed, Apr 04, 2007 at 05:55:56AM -0400, Mike Frysinger wrote: On Wednesday 04 April 2007, Wernfried Haas wrote: Since i tried to get things running for the last week or two, i need to throw in my 2 cents here. On Wed, Apr 04, 2007 at 10:18:17AM +0200, Bryan Østergaard wrote: On Wed, Apr 04, 2007 at 01:51:56AM -0400, Mike Frysinger wrote: - unaddressed CoC issues: - add a mission statement ++, also some other docs stuff. snip Other than that, i already expected this to be a topic at the next council meeting and there is a list of things that should be done by then. rather than hinting at stuff, can we make sure all issues expect to have discussed actually enumerated ? I'm not sure if i understand your question correctly, so sorry if my answer has nothing to with your question. I compiled a list of things that i think need to be done such as defining some general guidelines for work, setting up a project page, recruiting people, etc. Since none of the council people watching over the work complained, i think we're on the right track, but if there's something missing or you have a list of issues that need to be addressed, please give me a copy to merge it with mine. If you want to be involved more closely or need more info, just poke me on irc. vagueness in the past has forced us to simply punt topics to the next meeting :/ I'm a bit sucked up by real life atm, but i definitely want to (and most likely will) to get work done until the next meeting. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpKTQCupy6YM.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Monthly Gentoo Council Reminder for April
On Thu, Apr 05, 2007 at 09:26:41AM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: Unfortunately, what the GLEP doesn't do is prevent the Council from having secret meetings and refusing to discuss not only the content of those meetings but even the topic. Perhaps a requirement that any Council meeting logs be made public would be useful, with a waiver that the Council can have a secret meeting if it officially announces that it is doing so? If they want to have sekrit meetings with sekrit handshakes, let them. If enough people think this is not acceptable, they'll be gone on the next election. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgp04r7RTHldf.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Monthly Gentoo Council Reminder for April
On Wed, Apr 04, 2007 at 12:27:09PM -0400, Mike Frysinger wrote: sorry, due to the thread (things for Council to talk about), i thought the work you were talking about was stuff for the Council to discuss ... that seems to not be the case Ah, sorry about that. As you said, right now there is nothing on my mind that needs to be actually discussed by the council. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpCCFkeImvi3.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Monthly Gentoo Council Reminder for April
On Thu, Apr 05, 2007 at 02:18:40PM -0700, Ned Ludd wrote: I object and hope this is never done. There are things said on core that I do not wish to be public. I've sent mails myself that if they were ever going to be published publicly I would of never sent them. As far i remember the idea was only to make mails public from whenever this applies, not the ones sent before. So you can still stop sending your weekly goat pics once that happens. :-] cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpRjeCV5NaCu.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Tears of unfathomable sorrow
On Fri, Apr 06, 2007 at 06:30:19PM -0700, Alec Warner wrote: Much to the joy of many I am now retiring from Gentoo. No joy here, sorry to see you go. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpkFftItcYQw.pgp Description: PGP signature
[gentoo-dev] Introducing the proctors
Hi everyone, Recently the Code of Conduct was established, and it's about time to present the initial team of people working on getting things done: Roy Bamford (NeddySeagoon) Joshua Jackson (tsunam) and myself. We are currently in the process of bringing in some more people to gain a team that is both responsive and represents different opionions that will result in fair judgement. Furthermore Mike Doty (KingTaco) and Bryan Østergaard (kloeri) are looking over our shoulders, helping with advice and making sure we do our work well and in accordance with the wishes of the Council. There are still some things to set up for us, but we are already reading along the lists. If something bugs you, you can reach us via the proctors alias [1] or on irc in #gentoo-proctors. cheers, Wernfried [1] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpCD4ChQpEcD.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: April Council meeting summary
On Fri, Apr 13, 2007 at 07:20:46PM +0200, Jakub Moc wrote: Ciaran McCreesh napsal(a): If someone can provide a good reason for changing to a system that's more work, I'll change. If there isn't a good reason, I won't. Maybe if you actually read the council log, you'd see the reason? yeah, it's indeed there, believe me. proctor Jakub: Please refrain from comments like that one, it does not help creating a productive atmosphere. Everyone else: Please do not feel tempted to reply with a snappish answer here. Thanks everyone, Wernfried /proctor -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgplKwHDU0eB2.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] New developer: Thomas Scharl (think4urs11)
On Sat, Apr 14, 2007 at 01:01:38PM +, Jorge Manuel B. S. Vicetto wrote: Congrats on getting the official Gentoo colors! That means you have no more excuse to slacking ;) Unless of course you become forums admin, which is the best slacker job ever. Having that said i'm going back to the pool for my 16:45 massage and some more cocktails while you guys please do all the work. :-P cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpQqpJRjYyyv.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Resignation
On Tue, Apr 17, 2007 at 11:35:01PM +1200, Christopher Sawtell wrote: I just hope we are not going to get overly 'precious' about this CoC thing, which btw, I note contains the colloquial phrase 'If you screw up ...'. That sort of lazy slang language has no place in the official document set of any self-respecting organisation. Might I suggest it be replaced by something akin to 'If you discover you have made as mistake ...'. Also I noticed a simple typo: s/noone/no one/ in the previous paragraph. Thanks for the input, the council already asked us to go over it and do some rewording/a more positive approach/etc. We'll keep your suggestions in mind, too. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpGjYv9NCVcq.pgp Description: PGP signature
[gentoo-dev] [proctors] (was: FYI: Jakub suspended two weeks for bad behaviour)
On Tue, Apr 17, 2007 at 10:44:09PM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: On Tue, 17 Apr 2007 23:19:14 +0200 Jakub Moc [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry, you've miserably failed, you should have retired this guy long time ago before things went this far, since he obviously doesn't care about Gentoo users, but just about his territorial pissings. Instead, you've chosen to jump on me for doing my job. Oh well done indeed. I believe your job was to assist developers, not to make things harder for them. Meddling with correctly assigned bugs just to generate bugspam for people you don't like falls into the latter category. Maybe just read above? What kind of co-operation are you expecting wrt developers who have repeatedly shown that they can't plain be bothered with fixing their junk, because they are just way too cool to deal with some useless idiots, such as bug wranglers? It's good that you've seen straight to the core of the issue. Folks, please let this subthread (and all others other subthreads of this thread potentially going downhill, too) die before it turns into a flamewar. Remember this is the Gentoo development list and that the Code of Conduct applies here. Thank you for your cooperation. Good night. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpG67siV8zaP.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Proctors Episode II - Attack of the clones
On Wed, Apr 18, 2007 at 10:30:33AM +0200, Wernfried Haas wrote: All of them have a background in forums/#gentoo/userrel and hopefully will help in bringing peace to this galaxy. JFTR, as this was probably poorly worded: Each of them belongs to at least one of those three groups, not all of them. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpX0cTWleeZa.pgp Description: PGP signature
[proctors] Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Re: Resignation
I seem to miss a mail or two here, so the reply is not at the exact starting point of this subthread. As already pointed out by Mike, Alec, Ferris and probably others, this thread has degraded far enough and is off topic here. If you still want to discuss it, do it in a civil way and in the right place (see the other mails where that may be). Thanks, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpCO0foCArqi.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Re: Re: Resignation
Ciaran, Steve, I think i made it clear this subthread needs to be left alone here and moved to a better place (if any) as already explained here: http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.gentoo.devel/48164/focus=48271 So please stop it, both of you. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgp8WwvjJcg6V.pgp Description: PGP signature
[PROCTORS] Re: [gentoo-dev] [ANN] Multiple version suffixes illegal in gentoo-x86
Just a general note to everyone in this thread: I haven't had the time to read the posts in this thread, but proctors have received complaints about behaviour within. For the time being, i would ask all people participating to remember the CoC applies here and act accordingly. We will review the posts in this thread for CoC violations as soon as possible. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpNyJFJRpbsB.pgp Description: PGP signature
[PROCTORS] Re: [gentoo-dev] new herd: theology
On Fri, Apr 27, 2007 at 07:54:00AM +0200, Steffen Brumm wrote: and darwin is satan, other beliefs than christianity - death penalty, fight the sciences, womans have to go behind the cooker or into the open flame, only conservapedia is real,... This certainly is an interesting first post to the Gentoo development list, not sure if it's pure trolling or just a joke gone bad. In any way, this is not exactly Gentoo development related and not really CoC [1] compliant. Please read the CoC before posting again. Everyone else, please don't reply to this subthread as well for the same reasons. cheers, Wernfried [1] http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/council/coc.xml -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne at gentoo dot org Gentoo Forums: http://forums.gentoo.org IRC: #gentoo-forums on freenode - email: forum-mods at gentoo dot org pgpGOx81MaWTH.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] [news-item] Paludis 0.24
On Fri, May 04, 2007 at 10:49:47PM +0200, Piotr Jaroszy??ski wrote: Justification: major config format change. As of Paludis 0.24, the use of '*' to match all packages in the Paludis configuration files 'use.conf', 'keywords.conf' and 'licenses.conf' is deprecated in favour of '*/*'. You should update your configuration files after upgrading. GLEP 42 wrote: Users should be told of changes before they break a system, News items must only be for important changes that may cause serious upgrade or compatibility problems. Ordinary upgrade messages and non-critical news items should remain in einfo notices. The importance of the message to its intended audience should be justified with the proposal. Not sure what paludis does if it finds a * instead a */* in some config file, but does it actually break the system or cause serious upgrade or compatibility problems (e.g. like the upgrade to gcc 3.4, as mentioned as example in the GLEP)? If not, it sounds like an issue for elog. If yes, the should update part may need some stronger language like you must update. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org http://forums.gentoo.org || http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/proctors/ forum-mods (at) gentoo.org || proctors (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums || #gentoo-proctors (freenode) pgpD5HMoDrW2Q.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] [news-item] Paludis 0.24
On Sat, May 05, 2007 at 06:21:47PM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: So the only important question is whether the news items are useful for the people who will see them. In this case we know the answer is yes. No one answered my question asked in Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] what paludis actually does in case it encounters a config file using the old syntax so far, but as long it doesn't break the system, it doesn't need a news item. GLEP 42 talks about critical, really important news, not just useful ones. Imho the whole GLEP process is being abused to define some scenario to get the support for news, and then push it through for stuff way outside the boundaries defined in the GLEP. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org http://forums.gentoo.org || http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/proctors/ forum-mods (at) gentoo.org || proctors (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums || #gentoo-proctors (freenode) pgp6XmuysP0mb.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] [news-item] Paludis 0.24
On Sat, May 05, 2007 at 06:46:47PM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: It warns noisily. Then it's not even close to being broken and i don't see the need for a news item. It doesn't say how to fix it. I'm sure that can be arranged even without a news item. Imho the whole GLEP process is being abused to define some scenario to get the support for news, and then push it through for stuff way outside the boundaries defined in the GLEP. Hardly... Not having the news item will cause considerable user confusion. Then you may need to rewrite the GLEP so it allows news items whenever something confuses users, not just the critical updates (e.g. incompatible mysql upgrades or the apache 2 config upgrade were used as examples) described in the GLEP. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org http://forums.gentoo.org || http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/proctors/ forum-mods (at) gentoo.org || proctors (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums || #gentoo-proctors (freenode) pgpSTcJQhFKcb.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] [news-item] Paludis 0.24
On Sat, May 05, 2007 at 08:29:14PM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: You don't use Paludis. Irrelevant to the issue at hand. We're discussing the (ab-)use of the news system, not my personal choice of package manager. Paludis users do see the need for a news item. Not the question if paludis users see the need. Not even the question if i see the need. The point is that GLEP 42 doesn't. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org http://forums.gentoo.org || http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/proctors/ forum-mods (at) gentoo.org || proctors (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums || #gentoo-proctors (freenode) pgpeQfwH7gh86.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [PROCTORS] [gentoo-dev] [news-item] Paludis 0.24
On Sat, May 05, 2007 at 09:27:41PM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: On Sat, 05 May 2007 22:19:27 +0200 Jakub Moc [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK, is this the 'how stupid this thread can become' contest? No, it's about delivering the best experience we can to end users. If you're wanting to find a thread to stupidify, pick a different one. There may be some small conflict of interest as i actively participated in this thread before, but i think i am still objective enough to say that the direction of the last 2 posts is definitely not the one to take on the gentoo-dev list. So let's stop with the stupid stuff, thanks. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org http://forums.gentoo.org || http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/proctors/ forum-mods (at) gentoo.org || proctors (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums || #gentoo-proctors (freenode) pgpmlz0cbqP52.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [PROCTORS] [gentoo-dev] [news-item] Paludis 0.24
On Sat, May 05, 2007 at 09:54:08PM +0100, George Prowse wrote: Ciaran McCreesh wrote: On Sat, 05 May 2007 22:03:08 +0200 Jakub Moc [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, then frankly feed those news to your overlay users A good number of Paludis users don't use the overlay. Because the above is clearly stupid - what are you really after here, may I ask? I guess amne is right here. I'm after improving the user experience for Gentoo users. Hah! There's an easier way than paludis then, lol Another subthread that should rather go extinct than continue in this direction. Just because people disagree there's no need to make it personal. Thanks, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org http://forums.gentoo.org || http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/proctors/ forum-mods (at) gentoo.org || proctors (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums || #gentoo-proctors (freenode) pgpR48156q7WR.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Retirement
Thanks, it's been a pleasure to have you around. Good luck with everything! cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org http://forums.gentoo.org || http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/proctors/ forum-mods (at) gentoo.org || proctors (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums || #gentoo-proctors (freenode) pgpgxxnm0V9zA.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Intentions to remove mail-client/muttng from the tree
I think the most important patch is the side bar, which is also available in mutt (thanks so much ferdy) :-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org http://forums.gentoo.org || http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/proctors/ forum-mods (at) gentoo.org || proctors (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums || #gentoo-proctors (freenode) pgpSrtJB7KsK7.pgp Description: PGP signature
[half-PROCTORS] Re: [gentoo-dev] Bye Gentoo!
On Thu, May 31, 2007 at 03:35:20AM +0200, Bryan Østergaard wrote: No matter how hard I try fighting for what I feel is right we seem to end up with petty fights, flamewars or what I consider even worse - people simply ignore what I'm working hard towards. On Thu, May 31, 2007 at 03:01:07AM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: Sad to see one of the few remaining sane people leave. I take this as a compliment to Bryan, but then still you are implying that most of the people here are not sane. I specifically also put in the quote by Bryan, because your comment in this thread seems to sum up the problem quite nicely. If we can't even have a thread where a developer leaves out of frustration without general insults from you, there may be the need for the proctors to do something about it. So please, be nice to other people. kloeri: I don't think everything you did was perfect, but i believe you always had the best for Gentoo in mind when you made your decisions. Overall i think you did a fine job, sorry to see you go, thanks for the fish and kthxbyebye. :-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org http://forums.gentoo.org || http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/proctors/ forum-mods (at) gentoo.org || proctors (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums || #gentoo-proctors (freenode) pgpaBITX1eoGm.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [half-PROCTORS] Re: [gentoo-dev] Bye Gentoo!
On Thu, May 31, 2007 at 10:22:31AM -0400, Chrissy Fullam wrote: On Thu, May 31, 2007 at 03:01:07AM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: Sad to see one of the few remaining sane people leave. I take this as a compliment to Bryan, but then still you are implying that most of the people here are not sane. Amne, I do value your opinion but in this case, I respectfully disagree. Fair enough. I do not see the harm in what Ciaran said above to be any greater than another person stating sad to see one of the best/key/etc leave - by your standards that would imply the rest of us are less than best. That would be a positive statement because it would imply the other people are normal, and Bryan was one of the best, which is a positive statement. Saying one of the few remaining sane people is a generally negative statement that is judgemental towards the whole community, which is what the the CoC/proctors are supposed to proactively discourage. I think much worse things have been said on this list before, but still statements like that are the basis of a poisonous environment. All i was asking ciaranm is to be nice to people. Ciaran may be controversial at times, but I think we can see that he was paying Bryan a compliment. I even admitted it was meant as a compliment, see above. Hope that clears things up a bit. cheers, Wernfried PS: If anyone feels tempted to reply to this, please take it to the gentoo-proctors list instead of -dev, we're getting OT here. ;-) -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org http://forums.gentoo.org || http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/proctors/ forum-mods (at) gentoo.org || proctors (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums || #gentoo-proctors (freenode) pgp9x8uol4g82.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Living in a bubble [gentoo-proctor] Warning^2
On Tue, Jun 05, 2007 at 11:08:27PM +0100, Richard Brown wrote: Proctors: please let me know when my ban expires. You're not even banned? -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org http://forums.gentoo.org || http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/proctors/ forum-mods (at) gentoo.org || proctors (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums || #gentoo-proctors (freenode) pgpnpwnaXNHoK.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: [RFC]: gentoo-politics ML
On Mon, Jun 11, 2007 at 01:42:40PM -0700, Ilya A. Volynets-Evenbakh wrote: That statement presumes that gentoo-politics will not be read. I don't think this is (or should be) true. It's also based on the fact that people still read all the crap on gentoo-dev. Newsflash: They don't. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpdUO33HngOn.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: [RFC]: gentoo-politics ML
On Mon, Jun 11, 2007 at 02:35:42PM +0200, Alexander Gabert wrote: You left the project and it's your choice to continue working with it and on it. Nonono, you got it all wrong. He didn't leave, he was fired [1]. cheers, Wernfried [1] https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=114944 -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgp7y7ADCF0cv.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Are you guys for real?
On Thu, Jun 14, 2007 at 11:23:49AM +0200, Jan Kundrat wrote: On Wed, 13 Jun 2007, Hélder Máximo Botter Riba wrote: I'm using gentoo for 4 years, I love emerge, I enjoy to be part of gentoobr( Gentoo Brazilian community ), I'm always helping at gentoobr and gentoo-chat. I really enjoy gentoo. Who stole the double 'e' from the gentoobr? Oh noes, Gentoo _is_ over then. ;-) /me opens another bottle Just make sure it's beer-signed. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpuQ6Fp8Xjko.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: QA issue: No stable skype in Tree
On Mon, Jun 18, 2007 at 11:39:26AM -0700, Chris Gianelloni wrote: Internet Explorer doesn't even *run* on Gentoo. If it did, it would likely be in the tree since quite a few people would likely use it, even if just for testing. I know that if I were able to test things on IE from Linux without having to fire up VMware that I would be quite happy. Haven't tried it, nor do i care about IE, but i ran into that a while ago: http://www.tatanka.com.br/ies4linux/page/Main_Page cheers, Wernfried PS: No, i'm not posting this for the sake of proving IE works on Gentoo, just as information for people who may need it. -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpLyiyrWpFln.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] gentoo-dev-announce list
I think the council discussed/decided something about mailing lists in their last meeting, there doesn't seem to be a log/summary out though. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpeeL21EhRFt.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Nominations open for the Gentoo Council 2007/08
On Tue, Jul 03, 2007 at 03:10:10PM +0200, Jan Kundrát wrote: I nominate Wernfried Haas (amne). Based on a thorough and detailed review of Gentoo state-of-affair that we did together over several beers some time ago when he was at Prague, I'm sure he's one of the best candidates for the human, caring part of the Council. Thanks Jan and others for the nomination. Once again this proves that beer solves all promblems. ;-) Until now I haven't had time to actually think about accepting it, but i hope everything around me calms down a bit in the next days. In any way i feel flattered by the trust put in me by some of the folks here - thanks. Anyone pointing out at any old dirty laundry concerning Wernfried will be slapped to death with an empty beer pint. This is no assault, but rather a simple matter of fact. Alternatively, we could just get a refill. :-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgplJ7kpyhh48.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Nominations open for the Gentoo Council 2007/08
On Wed, Jul 04, 2007 at 07:01:52PM +0200, Wernfried Haas wrote: Until now I haven't had time to actually think about accepting it, but i hope everything around me calms down a bit in the next days. I hereby accept the nomination. I may write up a longer manifest some time, but fwiw i will try to push the council into a more open direction. The recent development of council meetings and their summaries not being posted (or at least very late) to the list makes me think that there is some alienation between council and developers, which i hope i can change. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpm2IQO6hdcz.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Nominations open for the Gentoo Council 2007/08
On Sat, Jul 14, 2007 at 01:29:35PM -0400, William L. Thomson Jr. wrote: I don't thing they are intentionally alienating, or delaying in summaries. Most likely not, but still something i'd like to change. ;-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpNjzZ7bJcWJ.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] council and proctors
On Sun, Jul 15, 2007 at 05:11:56PM +0200, Timothy Redaelli wrote: I have always thought that proctors/COC is useless, I vote to remove it. Proctors have already been removed in the last council meeting. As far the CoC is concerned, i'm not sure what the current status is and if anyone is supposed to enforce it atm (devrel? userrel?). cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgps7Ewljdh12.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] So...
On Mon, Jul 16, 2007 at 08:41:42PM +, Luis Medinas wrote: On Mon, 2007-07-16 at 15:06 -0400, Doug Goldstein wrote: So it's 97 degrees outside.. it's pretty hot... Since everyone loves to debate non-technical things on this list.. Let's debate Fahrenheit vs Celcius... Discuss! Well Celcius isn't the S.I scale for temperature but it's related with Kelvin which is the S.I scale for temperature. The conversion formula to Fahrenheit is °F = (°C × 1.8) + 32 and to kelvin is just K = °C + 273.15. These days i use more Kelvin than Celcius because it's used on real life problems i have to solve. Rankine [1] brings you the best of two worlds: Starting at scientific 0 degrees, but using the convenient degree scale defined by some obscure water-salt-mixture and a the slight fever of the average gentoo-dev poster. :-) cheers, Wernfried [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rankine -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpTPvJrzskkM.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: ML changes
On Tue, Jul 17, 2007 at 12:22:09AM +0200, Torsten Veller wrote: What will you do when users start sending mail from dev addresses? Ban the sender's address :-] cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgp8kotTRdogk.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] council and proctors
On Mon, Jul 16, 2007 at 04:58:43PM -0700, Chrissy Fullam wrote: Developer Relations will continue to assist on requests and any extra bit that we can. We will see which way this ML thing takes Gentoo and offer our support in any way we can. Nice statement from a PR POV, but i really have problems understanding the actual message. :-P So the way i read it devrel would like to do something if requested, but isn't supposed to enforce the CoC, nor has the authority? cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpEQuXa0HCE8.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Getting -project started
On Tue, Jul 17, 2007 at 10:04:55AM +0300, Petteri Räty wrote: I have seen no real opposition for the creation of the -project mailing list (just to avoid misunderstandings, we're not only talking about creating -project, but also the stuff that people with non @gentoo.org address get moderated on -dev as discussed in the last 100 mails or so, right?) I've pretty much kept my opinion out of it because even if the council screws up, it's up to the council to decide things. Since no opposition suddenly became the basis to pull it through: I find the idea terrible. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpc8xecI7zFK.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Getting -project started
On Tue, Jul 17, 2007 at 10:54:35AM +0300, Petteri Räty wrote: No, just the mailing list. Dunno but I tried to make that clear in my mail. Oops, sorry. No opposition to _that_. ;-) cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpZgw4o8vxN7.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] council and proctors
On Tue, Jul 17, 2007 at 12:09:58PM -0700, Chris Gianelloni wrote: Considering that the Code of Conduct is a subset of the regular Gentoo developer policies that Developer Relations already enforces, I would say that they are definitely enforcing the CoC and have the authority. What DevRel currently doesn't have is authority to exercise over users, rather than just developers. Basically, we're back to where we were before we had the Proctors, except we have a more succinct document on what is expected behavior. There are several proposals out now (you've seen the enormous thread, I'm sure) dealing with possible alternative solutions to the Proctors. One of them will likely be implemented some time soon. We'll just have to wait and see. That was about what i would have guessed - thanks for the explanation. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgprmZU3hcjLW.pgp Description: PGP signature
[gentoo-dev] Gentoo-project and gentoo-dev-announce mailing lists created.
Hi, Many people may already have noticed it, but here's an announcement for those who haven't yet. Gentoo-project and gentoo-dev-announce mailing lists created. These two mailing lists have been created to improve the flow of information and create an appropriate channel for non-technical discussions. The gentoo-project list is for all non-technical discussions currently found on the development mailing list, which should only be used for technical discussion. The gentoo-dev-announce mailing list will feature announcements relevant to the development process, which makes it easier to stay up to date on the development process. More information (including how to subscribe) can be found on http://www.gentoo.org/main/en/lists.xml cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpdbOxEewNXq.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] Nominations Update
Those who have accepted though havent sent information regarding why we should vote for them: Since it's almost time to vote, here's a collection of my thoughts about the council: http://dev.gentoo.org/~amne/stuff/councilnomination.txt If something is unclear or you have further questions, feel free to ask. cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpcfwmvBfmfl.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] QA last rites for sys-fs/dd-rhelp
Hi,
while this is a tool i never like to use, it's really hand in case you
have it around.
On Fri, Oct 22, 2010 at 09:23:30AM +0200, Diego E. Pettenò wrote:
# Obsolete even by upstream standard, since version 0.1.2
# is out since 2007 (and has a version bump request in bug
# #223299 since May 2008);
Agreed.
uses ???obsolete??? tail/head
# syntax (bug #159606, the warning has since been removed
# from coreutils);
in dd_rhelp-0.1.2: # grep head dd_rhelp
i=$(echo $parsechunk | ${head} -n 1 )
firstline=$(echo $parsing | ${head} -n 1)
firstline=$(echo $parsing | ${head} -n 1)
lnb_save=$(echo $lnb_save | ${head} -n 1 | cut -f 1 -d )
That seems to be the new syntax already.
more importantly autotools are rebuilt by
# a maintainer-mode-triggered check, but no dependency over
# autotools, with or without the correct version is present
# (bug #318487; automake 1.8 is nowadays not that common to
# find installed).
Also from 0.1.2:
Installation (for dd_rhelp 0.1.0)
===
Installation process have been greatly simplified with version
0.1.0 as
it as been completely removed ! Removing the previous hassle of the
./configure make make install normally reserved for
languages that requires compilation.
So for version superior to 0.1.0, installation is only a mean of a
direct
use of dd_rhelp, or a simple cp dd_rhelp /your/bin/path.
So basically 0.1.2 should fix all those problems.
I'd do it myself if i were ebuild maintainer (which i am not), but
maybe someone could pick this up and just make a new ebuild for 0.1.2?
Seems to be a quite simple job and whoever is willing to save this
really useful tool will get a beer from me next Linuxtag :-)
cheers,
Wernfried
--
Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org
Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org
forum-mods (at) gentoo.org
#gentoo-forums (freenode)
pgpaZCLN2VTl6.pgp
Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] QA last rites for sys-fs/dd-rhelp
On Fri, Oct 22, 2010 at 05:36:08PM +0200, Micha?? Górny wrote: I don't think there's a reason to do so. We have ddrescue, and users should be encouraged to migrate to that. Ah, found it (sys-fs/ddrescue, not sys-fs/dd-rescue) and it actually does all the stuff that dd-rhelp does. I guess in that case it's a good idea to let dd-rhelp go (probably with a note to people like me who aren't aware that ddrescue does the same job these days). Thank you for the information. Cheers, Wernfried -- Wernfried Haas (amne) - amne (at) gentoo.org Gentoo Forums - http://forums.gentoo.org forum-mods (at) gentoo.org #gentoo-forums (freenode) pgpzLsvATfPGm.pgp Description: PGP signature
