Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Jun 17, David Cantrell wrote: Out of interest, does anyone know if it's done in-house or contracted out? (I strongly suspect the latter) The latter. Via EDS and Microsoft, I believe. *shudder* EDS. That explains it then! This incompetence is further manifested in their choice of platform. even if I *could* use it, I wouldn't use it anyway, as I do not have sufficient confidence in the integrity of the server for such important information as my (eg) medical and tax data. Err, why? What do you know about its implementation as opposed to any other government website? david@lapdog:~$ HEAD http://www.gateway.gov.uk|grep ^Server Server: Microsoft-IIS/5.0 That, and EDS and Microsoft being involved. Ah, so primarily blind bigotism then. Note that whilst other government sites may suffer from the same problems, What problems? Other than the people behind it you've not mentioned any. -- | Mark Hynes [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | What are you trying to incinerate? |
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Mon, Jun 18, 2001 at 02:00:32PM +0100, Mark Hynes wrote: On Jun 17, David Cantrell wrote: david@lapdog:~$ HEAD http://www.gateway.gov.uk|grep ^Server Server: Microsoft-IIS/5.0 That, and EDS and Microsoft being involved. Ah, so primarily blind bigotism then. No, they're using software with a poor reputation, and having the site developed in conjunction with two companies with a poor reputation. -- David Cantrell | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david/ Good advice is always certain to be ignored, but that's no reason not to give it-- Agatha Christie
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Jun 09, David Cantrell wrote: So yes, the only reason for not allowing me to use it is incompetence on the part of whichever civil 'servants' were in charge of implementing it. Out of interest, does anyone know if it's done in-house or contracted out? (I strongly suspect the latter) This incompetence is further manifested in their choice of platform. even if I *could* use it, I wouldn't use it anyway, as I do not have sufficient confidence in the integrity of the server for such important information as my (eg) medical and tax data. Err, why? What do you know about its implementation as opposed to any other government website? -- | Mark Hynes [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | What are you trying to incinerate? |
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Sun, Jun 17, 2001 at 12:49:50PM +0100, Mark Hynes wrote: On Jun 09, David Cantrell wrote: So yes, the only reason for not allowing me to use it is incompetence on the part of whichever civil 'servants' were in charge of implementing it. Out of interest, does anyone know if it's done in-house or contracted out? (I strongly suspect the latter) The latter. Via EDS and Microsoft, I believe. This incompetence is further manifested in their choice of platform. even if I *could* use it, I wouldn't use it anyway, as I do not have sufficient confidence in the integrity of the server for such important information as my (eg) medical and tax data. Err, why? What do you know about its implementation as opposed to any other government website? david@lapdog:~$ HEAD http://www.gateway.gov.uk|grep ^Server Server: Microsoft-IIS/5.0 That, and EDS and Microsoft being involved. Note that whilst other government sites may suffer from the same problems, they are only sources of information and not places where I would submit any information which I need to have kept confidential. -- David Cantrell | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david/ Good advice is always certain to be ignored, but that's no reason not to give it-- Agatha Christie
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
At 07:14 AM 2001.06.13 +0100, Chris Benson wrote: I need to read the news more often, I was thinking about Louisiana! I also need to get a better grip of the geography: I thought LA. was the Florida side of Mississippi and Alabama. No, it's the place where I was born -- Lower Alabama. Also refers to nearby Literate Mississippi, where the joke, it is generally noticed, is missed entirely by the locals. -- Chris Devers [EMAIL PROTECTED] webmaster work: 781.270.5372 Skillcheck aol-im: chdevers
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
Wednesday, June 13, 2001, 1:16:12 AM, Dave Cross wrote: DC On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 10:55:17PM -0500, Mike Jarvis ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Larry speaks in a bit over 9 hours. Yippee! DC Actually - he doesn't :) DC http://use.perl.org/article.pl?sid=01/06/12/2255236 It all worked out ok. Daminan filled in, and was great as always. I would have liked to see Larry, but Damian's a great second choice. -- mike
RE: www.gateway.gov.uk
From: Chris Benson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Why, when the sun is shining (almost) and there is a popular (?) govt. do I feel like I did in early/mid 70's: like the end of the world was nigh? Hmm, not sure... but is the feeling helped buy having someone in the White House who has no real idea of foreign policy (and doesn't seem to care that much), and is sitting at his desk thinking (and I use the term advisedly) - 'I wonder what this big red button does...' No, I thought not. Rob --- Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of IBNet Plc. This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this message which arise as a result of e-mail transmission. If verification is required please request a hard-copy version.
RE: www.gateway.gov.uk
From: Paul Makepeace [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] PS -- that is one truly obnoxiously big sig. I apologise profusely for my employers lawyers need to avoid any form of litigation due to something that I may or may not say to the right or wrong person while sending an email which may or may not be on behalf of the company and therefor needs the sig from hell to disclaim anything that I may or may not have said within said email and basically saying that anything I did say wasn't said by me on behalf of the company or anybody else including myself and in fact you really should consider the email that you might have received to be totally empty and must destroy all traces of it but not until you've emailed me back to say that you may have received it possibly or not in error. Rob Maybe I should be a lawyer. Except, of course, I didn't say that. --- Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of IBNet Plc. This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this message which arise as a result of e-mail transmission. If verification is required please request a hard-copy version.
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
This in the Opera (browser) Newsletter I received yesterday: * Opera challenges UK govt to support standards * The British government's prestigious gateway http://www.gateway.gov.uk/ security system only lets users perform transactions when using IE. Opera challenges the UK government to support World Wide Web Consortium (W3C) standards and let British citizens enjoy full access to the Web from different browsers, platforms and devices. In the future, British users might even find that they can't access the gateway, because wireless devices' manufacturers increasingly are choosing other browsers than IE. The British wireless consortium Symbian is an example of a future leading platform not running IE. Opera's CTO, Håkon Lie, is currently in contact with the assistant to UK's e-envoy, Andrew Pinder. Pinder's office is responsible for the commissioning of the site, gateway.gov.uk. Read the story in The Register: http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/19275.html I don't know whether that link was the one quoted previously. Cheers, Philip -- Philip Newton [EMAIL PROTECTED] All opinions are my own, not my employer's. If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
Obnoxious sigs (was Re: www.gateway.gov.uk)
Robert Thompson wrote: I apologise profusely Sorry, you'll have to give me a hardcopy version of that before I'll believe you: E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this message which arise as a result of e-mail transmission. If verification is required please request a hard-copy version. Your apology might otherwise be construed to be the figment of some mailer-daemon's imagination :-) (Oh, no! I just quoted Robert Thompson! Doesn't that contravene If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. since the message was addressed to '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' and not to me?) Hm, perhaps I'll use the company semi-official sig for a change. (The official one specifies which fonts[1] and sizes to use, but I can't do that in plain text email, so I don't bother.) No ugly disclaimers in that, thank goodness, but no proper sig delimiter, either. [1] That explains the long lines of dashes; they're supposed to align with the longest line of text *on the print-out*, and are based on sending HTML or Rich Text email in Arial, not a fixed-width font such as I use to compose my messages. Cheers, Philip Newton -- datenrevision GmbH Co. OHG a gedas company Cuxhavener Straße 36, D-21149 Hamburg Telefon/phone +49-40-797 007-37 Telefax/telefax +49-40-797 007-10 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.datenrevision.de --
Re: Obnoxious sigs (was Re: www.gateway.gov.uk)
Isn't there some cough/ perl module that might allow us to rig a sig-stripper to be installed at dircon? Where sig = any trailer that has more than four un-para'ed lines. Or give these people a damn shell account. Or SOMETHING. (Actually I don't really care I just got carried away with the melodrama.) Paul
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
* at 11/06 21:38 +0100 Robin Szemeti said: On Mon, 11 Jun 2001, Chris Benson wrote: Didn't ukonline.co.uk complain about trademark infringement a while back? Is gateway.gov.uk the result? and is there any possible trademark confusion with this address? ring ring 'hello .. is that the government? .. oh good. I'd like to complain about trademark infringement by one of your sites ..' pause 'yes .. yes .. oh I see .. yes .. no, no you are quite right I don;t want to spend the the next 20 years talking to VAT inspectors and men from the Inland Revenue ... ah forget I ever called, by the way, did I mention waht a fantastic set of teeth Tony has?' that really is terribly cynical of you. i really can't imagine a giverment as benevolent and trustworthy as ours even contemplating such a thing. struan
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 08:15:36AM +0100, Robert Thompson wrote: From: Chris Benson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Why, when the sun is shining (almost) and there is a popular (?) govt. do I feel like I did in early/mid 70's: like the end of the world was nigh? Hmm, not sure... but is the feeling helped buy having someone in the White House who has no real idea of foreign policy (and doesn't seem to care that much), and is sitting at his desk thinking (and I use the term advisedly) - 'I wonder what this big red button does...' Oh yes, I vaguely thought on reading about the floods in The South that maybe this was supposed to be a message like Repent your sins or I wash you off the face of the Earth. If so it missed Washington DC by about a 1,000 miles and Texas by 500. It probably missed GWB by a couple of light years. No, I thought not. Thank you for the cheery thought anyway. -- Chris Benson
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 08:55:38PM +0100, Chris Benson wrote: Oh yes, I vaguely thought on reading about the floods in The South that maybe this was supposed to be a message like Repent your sins or I wash you off the face of the Earth. I think it's more along the lines of the Creator(s) saying Oh, that Global Warming thing, you might want to check into it again. By the way, the most populous city in your home state? *WHOOSH* Paul -- Balance the consistency principle with the inconsistency principle
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Tue, 12 Jun 2001, Chris Benson wrote: I know a state-of-emergency (or whatever) has been called to right it has, as I understand it this means now that you are supposed to drive a 5.3L V8 rather than the 7.1L V8 unless absolutlely necessary ... oops .. read 358cubic inch and 427ci ... these new fangled litres and things don't work over there yet :)) -- Robin Szemeti Redpoint Consulting Limited Real Solutions For A Virtual World
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
Tuesday, June 12, 2001, 2:55:38 PM, Chris Benson wrote: CB On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 08:15:36AM +0100, Robert Thompson wrote: From: Chris Benson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Why, when the sun is shining (almost) and there is a popular (?) govt. do I feel like I did in early/mid 70's: like the end of the world was nigh? Hmm, not sure... but is the feeling helped buy having someone in the White House who has no real idea of foreign policy (and doesn't seem to care that much), and is sitting at his desk thinking (and I use the term advisedly) - 'I wonder what this big red button does...' CB Oh yes, I vaguely thought on reading about the floods in The South CB that maybe this was supposed to be a message like Repent your sins or CB I wash you off the face of the Earth. If so it missed Washington DC CB by about a 1,000 miles and Texas by 500. It probably missed GWB by a CB couple of light years. Missed Texas by 500 miles? I think not. I was in Houston. Worst place on earth. I most definatly did NOT miss Texas. And I wouldn't have been any happier had it hit DC instead. I live there, as do several million people who weren't elected to anything (including dubya). If you could localize the storm to a box bounded by D 2nd SE and H and 17th NW, I'd be ok with that. Oh, and take out Georgetown too while you're at it. -- mike
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 10:10:28PM -0500, Mike Jarvis wrote: Missed Texas by 500 miles? I think not. I was in Houston. Worst place on earth. I most definatly did NOT miss Texas. Houston rocks, although if I moved back it would be to Austin. Houston's humidity (the airborne type, as opposed to the 10ft deep land-based stuff) and traffic are beyond vile. Paul -- Cut a vital connection
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 10:55:17PM -0500, Mike Jarvis ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Larry speaks in a bit over 9 hours. Yippee! Actually - he doesn't :) http://use.perl.org/article.pl?sid=01/06/12/2255236 Dave... -- Drugs are just bad m'kay
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 10:10:28PM -0500, Mike Jarvis wrote: Tuesday, June 12, 2001, 2:55:38 PM, Chris Benson wrote: CB I wash you off the face of the Earth. If so it missed Washington DC CB by about a 1,000 miles and Texas by 500. It probably missed GWB by a CB couple of light years. Missed Texas by 500 miles? I think not. I was in Houston. Worst place on earth. I most definatly did NOT miss Texas. I need to read the news more often, I was thinking about Louisiana! I also need to get a better grip of the geography: I thought LA. was the Florida side of Mississippi and Alabama. -- Chris Benson
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
At 18:51 09/06/01 +0100, you wrote: Monday morning Precisely. And using Java et al is a discrimination against the mobility impaired. Not to mention the way it discriminates totally against people who can't afford, don't have, morally object to, are too old to learn to use, computers. Sure, it's kind of a crap designed website, and they should have done it in a way that worked on more platforms (although, to be honest, I can't see a way round the problems - it's very hard to do client side certificates in a portable way, and I'd rather see them do something than nothing). However, it's not that big a deal. However, it's hardly the end of the world /J\ -- Jonathan Peterson Technical Manager, Unified Ltd, 020 7383 6092 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 09:56:19AM +0100, Jonathan Peterson wrote: At 18:51 09/06/01 +0100, you wrote: Monday morning Precisely. And using Java et al is a discrimination against the mobility impaired. Not to mention the way it discriminates totally against people who can't afford, don't have, morally object to, are too old to learn to use, computers. Sure, it's kind of a crap designed website, and they should have done it in a way that worked on more platforms (although, to be honest, I can't see a way round the problems - it's very hard to do client side certificates in a portable way, and I'd rather see them do something than nothing). However, it's not that big a deal. It is that big a deal. The government has legal requirements for accessibility in other areas, I don't see why it's public interface on the Internet should be any different. If there was no ability for disabled people to enter government buildings at Westminster, there would be outrage from the disabled communities. In short, it's a big deal because they made it a big deal. I haven't looked at the certificate issue, but most of the things I've read so far state that it's only a problem because they've made it a problem by using non-standard technology. However, it's hardly the end of the world No, but it is the start of the long slippery slope. Which most of us hope to avoid travelling down. -Dom -- | Semantico: creators of major online resources | | URL: http://www.semantico.com/ | | Tel: +44 (1273) 72 | | Address: 33 Bond St., Brighton, Sussex, BN1 1RD, UK. |
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
From: Jonathan Peterson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Not to mention the way it discriminates totally against people who can't afford, don't have, morally object to, are too old to learn to use, computers. How come. It's an alternative to, not a replacement for, the usual paper based forms; isn't it? /Robert
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 10:19:21AM +0100, Dominic Mitchell wrote: On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 09:56:19AM +0100, Jonathan Peterson wrote: I haven't looked at the certificate issue, but most of the things I've read so far state that it's only a problem because they've made it a problem by using non-standard technology. And it doesn't seem very impartial if they continue building these sites which you can only use if you buy products from a given company. (If I understand the current requirements, you have to buy MacOS (from Apple) or Windows (from Microsoft) to run your free (no cost) browser) (Is it legal to be anticompetitive by encouraging a duopoly?) However, it's hardly the end of the world No, but it is the start of the long slippery slope. Which most of us hope to avoid travelling down. I agree. It's the not the end of the world. Just the beginning of the end. Nicholas Clark
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 11:26:39AM +0100, Nicholas Clark wrote: (If I understand the current requirements, you have to buy MacOS (from Apple) or Windows (from Microsoft) to run your free (no cost) browser) IIUIC IE on MacOS lets you look at the site, but you can't do anything useful due to lack of certificates. (Is it legal to be anticompetitive by encouraging a duopoly?) Hardly a duopoly! Anyone see the Steve Bell cartoon in the Gaudrian: on Saturday: Light conquers the forces of darkness ... with the light in question shining from the arse of a fat cat with no noticable resemblance to anyone in Redmond. However, it's hardly the end of the world It will be when you get the Go to Jail card because you haven't filled in your on-line tax return. Best start shouting now. No, but it is the start of the long slippery slope. Which most of us hope to avoid travelling down. I agree. It's the not the end of the world. Just the beginning of the end. Amen. Why, when the sun is shining (almost) and there is a popular (?) govt. do I feel like I did in early/mid 70's: like the end of the world was nigh? -- Chris Benson -- It ain't dark yet, but it's getting there.
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Mon, Jun 11, 2001 at 11:26:39AM +0100, Nicholas Clark wrote: (If I understand the current requirements, you have to buy MacOS (from Apple) or Windows (from Microsoft) to run your free (no cost) browser) Looking at open.gov.uk, there is mention of the move to ukonline.gov.uk but no mention of gateway.gov.uk. Didn't ukonline.co.uk complain about trademark infringement a while back? Is gateway.gov.uk the result? and is there any possible trademark confusion with this address? -- Chris Benson
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Mon, 11 Jun 2001, Chris Benson wrote: Didn't ukonline.co.uk complain about trademark infringement a while back? Is gateway.gov.uk the result? and is there any possible trademark confusion with this address? ring ring 'hello .. is that the government? .. oh good. I'd like to complain about trademark infringement by one of your sites ..' pause 'yes .. yes .. oh I see .. yes .. no, no you are quite right I don;t want to spend the the next 20 years talking to VAT inspectors and men from the Inland Revenue ... ah forget I ever called, by the way, did I mention waht a fantastic set of teeth Tony has?' -- Robin Szemeti Redpoint Consulting Limited Real Solutions For A Virtual World
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Sat 09 Jun, Robert Shiels wrote: Assume for a moment that I'm using lynx on Linux, and I want to send the government my tax return securely. What are the security implications, can it actually be done. I don't want to go off half-cocked and complain about something when I don't fully understand why the alternative is better. Could someone explain it to me, and give me an address to send my complaint to, and I'll definitely do it. As someone else has pointed out, this derived from a Linuxuser article at http://www.linuxuser.co.uk/articles/issue11/gateway.html This points out that most Government IT is now contracted out and this is so far as I am aware correct. Most departments appear to have *no* professional computing staff. (Some months ago I converted a Court Guide prepared by a judge into HTML. The intention was that this should be put on the Court Service site. Unfortunately Court Service had had its site redesigned -- white text on a purple background, etc -- and so the 39 files needed to be topped and tailed with their standard templates. When I suggested that this would not take even me more than an hour to do with Perl I was told by the Court Service IT department We use DreamWeaver, we have no need for Perl. The Guide -- complete with meta tags on each page saying meta name=author content=The Court Service Publications Branch -- appeared on the CS site about 6 weeks later.) One of the main outside companies used by Departments is EDS. So far as certificates are concerned, at a meeting I went to a week or so ago the chairman, who is employed by another legal government department, handed round a message to him from a colleague saying that all contact with outsiders would require the use of digital certificates. The message was accompanied by a Paper which gave the impression of being written by someone in the department. In fact it was a topped and tailed copy of a paper written by one of the certificate suppliers, Entrust, on PKI (public key infrastructure?) http://www.entrust.com/resourcecenter/descriptions/152.htm Unsurprisingly it claims that digital certificates are essential. I note that the whole idea of PKI has been questioned: http://www.counterpane.com/pki-risks.html Another series of Articles from the Register show that EDS in NZ have dropped the idea in relation to their Revenue. If it is not essential there presumably it is not essential here. See the three links at the end of http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/19340.html But how one persuades the civil service of that I don't know. Roger H -- Roger Horne, 11 New Square, Lincoln's Inn, London WC2A 3QB mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http:www.hrothgar.co.uk/
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
From: Jonathan Stowe [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: www.gateway.gov.uk As a public service I would exhort all of you to go to this site and then complain when it tells you that you are using an 'Unsupported Browser' (which I guess will be more than half of you :) I agree that this is pants. I don't see why I need cookies, javascript and Java enabled. But I don't fully understand digital certificates. Assume for a moment that I'm using lynx on Linux, and I want to send the government my tax return securely. What are the security implications, can it actually be done. I don't want to go off half-cocked and complain about something when I don't fully understand why the alternative is better. Could someone explain it to me, and give me an address to send my complaint to, and I'll definitely do it. /Robert
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 01:54:01PM +0100, Robert Shiels wrote: From: Jonathan Stowe [EMAIL PROTECTED] As a public service I would exhort all of you to go to this site and then complain when it tells you that you are using an 'Unsupported Browser' (which I guess will be more than half of you :) I agree that this is pants. I don't see why I need cookies, javascript and Java enabled. But I don't fully understand digital certificates. Assume for a moment that I'm using lynx on Linux, and I want to send the government my tax return securely. What are the security implications, can it actually be done. I don't want to go off half-cocked and complain about something when I don't fully understand why the alternative is better. They also don't let you use Netscape on Linux, even with 128-bit encryption and all the other security goodies. That is just as secure as - if not better than - IE on Windows. So yes, the only reason for not allowing me to use it is incompetence on the part of whichever civil 'servants' were in charge of implementing it. This incompetence is further manifested in their choice of platform. even if I *could* use it, I wouldn't use it anyway, as I do not have sufficient confidence in the integrity of the server for such important information as my (eg) medical and tax data. Could someone explain it to me, and give me an address to send my complaint to, and I'll definitely do it. http://www.stand.org.uk should have the Fax My MP thing back soon. I have a long list of things to bother mine about, none of which he bothered to answer when I asked him during the election campaign. No surprise that I didn't vote for the little shit then. -- David Cantrell | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david/ Good advice is always certain to be ignored, but that's no reason not to give it-- Agatha Christie
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 02:06:24PM +0100, David Cantrell wrote: So yes, the only reason for not allowing me to use it is incompetence on the part of whichever civil 'servants' were in charge of implementing it. And nothing to do with the deal struck between Microsoft and the government. No. -- You want to read that stuff, fine. You want to create a network for such things, fine. You want to explore the theoretical boundaries of free speech, fine. But when it starts impacting *people* trying to *communicate*, then that is where I draw the line. - Russ Allbery, http://www.slacker.com/rant.html
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 02:09:23PM +0100, Simon Cozens wrote: On Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 02:06:24PM +0100, David Cantrell wrote: So yes, the only reason for not allowing me to use it is incompetence on the part of whichever civil 'servants' were in charge of implementing it. And nothing to do with the deal struck between Microsoft and the government. No. I tend not to pay much attention to conspiracy theories. -- David Cantrell | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david/ Good advice is always certain to be ignored, but that's no reason not to give it-- Agatha Christie
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Sat, 09 Jun 2001, Robert Shiels wrote: From: Jonathan Stowe [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: www.gateway.gov.uk As a public service I would exhort all of you to go to this site and then complain when it tells you that you are using an 'Unsupported Browser' (which I guess will be more than half of you :) I agree that this is pants. I don't see why I need cookies, javascript and Java enabled. But I don't fully understand digital certificates. Assume for a moment that I'm using lynx on Linux, and I want to send the government my tax return securely. What are the security implications, can it actually be done. yes .. its just SSL .. the digital certificate is just to identify who you are .. like a digital signature. so the SSL layer provides the transport security .. the digital certificate ( that you get from an issuing authority ) proves who you are ( maybe ). I don't want to go off half-cocked and complain about something when I don't fully understand why the alternative is better. the new site is a fine example of something that was dreamt up by webdesigneers with no concept of 'cross platform coding' or standards compliance. its suppose to ditribute information in a clear and concise way .. not piss about with animated sliding panles and multilayer flirtations with art design .. you can do good and attrctive designs in simple HTML, you don;t need Java to getthe message across. Could someone explain it to me, and give me an address to send my complaint to, and I'll definitely do it. well .. consider this. the old ( apache / Linux ) driven site (www.open.gov.uk IIRC ) was a testament to good web design. graphics light and W3C html compliant AND it met the W3C accessibility guidelines .. the new site is a stinking pile of shit. all the backgrounds are fixed colour, the text fixed colour and the text size is pixed in pixels .. what use is that to anyone with colour blindness/poor vision. try feeding any single page of the new shite ( oops type put 'shite' instead of site .. ) through validator @ w3c and laugh at the error output ... kilobytes of it. and if it decides it doesn;t like your browser it won;t even let you in! .. never mind that it might not display correctly .. it simply wont let you in full stop. pile of crap. this is supposed to be a government info site .. not some web designers multimedia experience .. the first priority should be making the information available THEN making it animated etc .. its feck all use if I cant actually even get onto the site to use it. I complained to the UK Online helpdesk .. they deny all responsiblity for the thing .. but can give you helpdesk contacts for the 3 government agencies contained within the 'government gateway' site .. of course they deny all responsiblity for it as well... -- Robin Szemeti Redpoint Consulting Limited Real Solutions For A Virtual World
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 02:26:40PM +0100, David Cantrell wrote: I tend not to pay much attention to conspiracy theories. Me neither. http://linuxtoday.com/imgs/microsoft/gateway-microsoft-rationale-statement.pdf -- This process can check if this value is zero, and if it is, it does something child-like. -- Forbes Burkowski, CS 454, University of Washington
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 02:10:38PM +0100, Robin Szemeti wrote: I complained to the UK Online helpdesk .. they deny all responsiblity for the thing .. but can give you helpdesk contacts for the 3 government agencies contained within the 'government gateway' site .. of course they deny all responsiblity for it as well... Are these e-mail addresses? If so, does it make it possible to forward all 4 denials in 1 message To: all four and ask for one joined up government answer? Nicholas Clark
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 02:59:48PM +0100, Nicholas Clark wrote: Are these e-mail addresses? If so, does it make it possible to forward all 4 denials in 1 message To: all four and ask for one joined up government answer? http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/19340.html says the man to talk to is [EMAIL PROTECTED] I've just asked him whether he thinks restricting access to IE and NS only (hence cutting off speech browsers for the blind) constitutes discrimination against the disabled. :) -- Britain has football hooligans, Germany has neo-Nazis, and France has farmers. -The Times
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Sat, 09 Jun 2001, Nicholas Clark wrote: On Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 02:10:38PM +0100, Robin Szemeti wrote: I complained to the UK Online helpdesk .. they deny all responsiblity for the thing .. but can give you helpdesk contacts for the 3 government agencies contained within the 'government gateway' site .. of course they deny all responsiblity for it as well... Are these e-mail addresses? If so, does it make it possible to forward all 4 denials in 1 message To: all four and ask for one joined up government answer? dunno .. try if you like ... ### From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Government Gateway is a Government website but is an external site to UKonline. It has been produced by a different department and therefore any technical difficulties in accessing the site should be directed at their helpdesk who will be able to provide an answer to your enquiry.. There are currently three services available on the Government Gateway. Each of the Government departments handling online services has its own Help Desk. These are the only contact details on the Government Gateway web site.. The numbers of these are listed below. Choose the number for one of the services you are enrolled for (or intending to enrol for). If you are an individual and having problems registering for Electronic VAT return Phone 01702 367930. If you are a farmer and having problems registering for MAFF IACS Area Aid Application Phone 0845 6013482 E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you are an organisation and having problems registering for PAYE End of Year Returns for Employers and Agents Phone 0845 6055999 or E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Robin Szemeti Redpoint Consulting Limited Real Solutions For A Virtual World
Re: www.gateway.gov.uk
On Sat, 9 Jun 2001, Simon Cozens wrote: On Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 02:59:48PM +0100, Nicholas Clark wrote: Are these e-mail addresses? If so, does it make it possible to forward all 4 denials in 1 message To: all four and ask for one joined up government answer? http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/19340.html says the man to talk to is [EMAIL PROTECTED] I've just asked him whether he thinks restricting access to IE and NS only (hence cutting off speech browsers for the blind) constitutes discrimination against the disabled. :) Precisely. And using Java et al is a discrimination against the mobility impaired. /J\
