David Rubio 1976, after Tielke
On Apr 30, 2012, at 3:41 PM, sterling price wrote:
Hi--Today I recieved a 2LP recording by Toyohiko Satoh called 'French
Baroque Lute Music' from 1978. Unfortunatly the liner notes are missing
from the set. If someone has the recording, could you check and
Petter Möller Polska -
http://www.polyhymnion.org/swv/music/polska/polska39.mp3
http://www.polyhymnion.org/swv/music/polska/polska39.pdf
Tidemand Polska -
http://www.polyhymnion.org/swv/music/polska/polska40.mp3
http://www.polyhymnion.org/swv/music/polska/polska40.pdf
Gutår,
RT
more at
Roman,
Yes , no one questions that. Lute Suites are not well written for lute, for
sure. Weather they are playable or not can be discussed. However we are not
talking about this. The question is if Bach intended them to be performed on a
lute. I can tell you something from my own experience.
JSB never played trumpet either, but he wrote for it competently.
There is sufficient grounds to assume he would have approached lute
with equal consideration he afforded any other instrument he wrote for,
given his diligence and meticulousness.
The lute is the only instrument he showed no
meant there ARE suff. etc.
RT
- Original Message -
From: Roman Turovsky r.turov...@verizon.net
To: Jarosław Lipski jaroslawlip...@wp.pl; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 9:19 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Bach’s Lute Suites: This Myth is Busted
JSB never played trumpet either,
On 30 April 2012 15:19, Roman Turovsky r.turov...@verizon.net wrote:
JSB never played trumpet either, but he wrote for it competently.
There is sufficient grounds to assume he would have approached lute
with equal consideration he afforded any other instrument he wrote for,
given his diligence
I heard these things a million times.
However even a mediocre professional could play his instrumental parts
(complaints notwithstanding).
Which we cannot say that about his Lute Suites.
They are inappropraiate beyond all measure, and it takes a player of
inordinate
virtuosity to perform
However, questioning established theories is often fruitful. A theory's
validity isn't necessarily related to how long ago it was generated. I believe
the discussion at hand is more about questioning the old theory of how we came
to know Bach's lute suites as music actually intended for lute
I have an issue whenever I hear a blanket statement like He never wrote for
it, and JSB never played the trumpet. It strikes me as similar to there
is no God or there is a God.
We know JSB liked the sound of the lute - he invented a keyboard instrument
to imitate that sound. We can guess that he
His low opinion of hammerklaviers he saw in Berlin is documented.
And it is safe to assume he never liked a guitar either.
How much German music for baroque guitar do you know?
3 things come to mind, Kremberg, Diesel and Losy.
RT
- Original Message -
From: Mayes, Joseph ma...@rowan.edu
On Apr 30, 2012, at 6:31 AM, David van Ooijen wrote:
There is a general consensus among musicians that Bach never
really understood their instrument, because however good his music for
other instruments, it's always unplayable on their own instrument.
From Letter from an able Musikant
On Apr 30, 2012, at 7:32 AM, Roman Turovsky wrote:
His low opinion of hammerklaviers he saw in Berlin is documented.
Inaccurate, I think.
Johann Friedrich Agricola related in a 1768 treatise on keyboard
instruments that Bach once tried a Silbermann pianoforte (didn't say when or
where), and
Avoiding definitive categorical strikes me as usually a good plan.
Eugene
-Original Message-
From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of
Mayes, Joseph
Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 10:25 AM
To: Roman Turovsky; Jarosław Lipski; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Then why is it possible to state categorically that Bach never wrote for
lute? How can we assume what Back must have expected?
JM
On 4/30/12 10:52 AM, howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com wrote:
We can't say categorically that Bach never wrote for piano. When he sent The
Musical Offering to
Yep, especially if one could milk such murky waters for an academic
livelihood.
RT
From: Braig, Eugene brai...@osu.edu
Avoiding definitive categorical strikes me as usually a good plan.
Eugene
-Original Message-
From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On
Dear all,
I find it odd that Bach's lute music is so contentious. By and
large, it seems that classical guitarists feel more of a need to prove
them to be works intended for lute than us luters. Is it really worth
the effort?
(I'm going to risk getting my head bitten
Alas, yes. Personally, I would have rather he tempered with some caveat like
may not have or similar. Unfortunately, strong and controversial categorical
statements seem to be what grab attention with popular press and what raise
hackles of scholarly readers.
Eugene
-Original
Losy was Czech.
At 09:32 AM 4/30/2012, Roman Turovsky wrote:
How much German music for baroque guitar do you know?
3 things come to mind, Kremberg, Diesel and Losy.
RT
Edward Martin
2817 East 2nd Street
Duluth, Minnesota 55812
e-mail: e...@gamutstrings.com
voice: (218) 728-1202
He was actually ethnically Swiss.
RT
From: Edward Martin e...@gamutstrings.com
Losy was Czech.
At 09:32 AM 4/30/2012, Roman Turovsky wrote:
How much German music for baroque guitar do you know?
3 things come to mind, Kremberg, Diesel and Losy.
RT
Edward Martin
2817 East 2nd Street
Duluth,
On Apr 30, 2012, at 7:57 AM, Mayes, Joseph wrote:
Then why is it possible to state categorically that Bach never wrote for
lute?
I wouldn't know; I've never said it.
How can we assume what Back must have expected?
We don't have to assume--when you send music to someone who plays the
Everything you need to know about Losy here :
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~lsa/publications/J/1980/Vogl-LosyPragueLutenist.pdf
Best,
Jean-Marie
=
== En réponse au message du 30-04-2012, 17:15:42 ==
He was actually ethnically Swiss.
RT
From: Edward Martin
What Vogl doesn't mention is an interesting side-detail: Losy's original
hometown fell victim of a catastrophic landslide that buried most of it, and
that's how Losys ended up in Bohemia.
RT
- Original Message -
From: Jean-Marie Poirier jmpoiri...@wanadoo.fr
To:
On 30 April 2012 18:01, howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com wrote:
(as part of a summary of the place of Bach's lute works in his general
output that I can only agree with):
Not everything Bach wrote is the B minor Mass
[...]
trumpets were not played with fingers
[...]
lute players and
I love this discussion and I hope, the big master can hear it!
I fear he could say:Do You really suppose I think of Your wretched
lutes when the spirit gets hold of me?
Replace lute by violin, than this is what half a century later
Beethoven said to the violinist Schuppanzigh when
On Apr 30, 2012, at 9:25 AM, David van Ooijen wrote:
Did you ever have the doubtful pleasure of attending a concert of the
B-minor mass with _real_ Baroque trumpets (without holes instead of
the 1960s 'Bach' trumpets which are the generally accepted standard in
today's early music
Only very short: It seems that the family of Losy (Loschi, Lossio) was a
protestant family from Italy who has to flee from Italy to the region Veltlin
(exactly Piuro or older: Plurs) who was then under the leadership of the Drei
Bünde (today Kanton Graubünden). The Drei Bünde were in these
The difficulties of the trumpet part in Bach's Cantata 90 may seem bizarre
Es reißet euch ein schrecklich Ende ... how true. Been there done
that, and I do remember the poor trumpeter (not to mention the poor
ears of all the members of our ensemble ;-).
David
--
JSB didn't play gamba either as evidenced by his reassignment of nicely
playable lute part in the MatthäusPassion to an impossible one for gamba in
the 2nd version.
Any gambist would tell you that that gamba part is pure hell.
RT
From: howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com
Needless to say, I
On 30 April 2012 20:34, Roman Turovsky r.turov...@verizon.net wrote:
JSB didn't play gamba either as evidenced by his reassignment of nicely
playable lute part in the MatthäusPassion to an impossible one for gamba in
the 2nd version.
Any gambist would tell you that that gamba part is pure
All the gambists I know (a goodly #) dread playing that aria.
RT
- Original Message -
From: David van Ooijen davidvanooi...@gmail.com
To: lute net lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 2:46 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bach's Lute Suites: This Moth is Blessed
On 30 April
On 30 April 2012 20:51, Roman Turovsky r.turov...@verizon.net wrote:
All the gambists I know (a goodly #) dread playing that aria.
Tell them not to come to Holland, where playing Matthew is a major
part of a gambist's yearly income.
David
--
***
David van Ooijen
Not only in Holland, so - material interests prevail.
RT
From: David van Ooijen davidvanooi...@gmail.com
On 30 April 2012 20:51, Roman Turovsky r.turov...@verizon.net wrote:
All the gambists I know (a goodly #) dread playing that aria.
Tell them not to come to Holland, where playing Matthew
Italian music entertainment on this May Day:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TR773XlyCTcfeature=youtu.be
More entertainment on May Day (the Italian idea of a French
entertainment):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qedRGde-kEEfeature=youtu.be
Happy May Day!
Arto
To get on or off this list
That's done if the nut grooves aren't perfectly smooth and the string
stretches on the peg side of the nut, when tuning, then suddenly jumps
to a higher pitch. The cord (usually polyester, which has very little
stretch) won't stretch so much and reduces this effect.
When this is
Alain,
The practice you have described is one I would only employ if the
string is too short to reach the peg.
I prefer the approach of one teacher who advised: Never cut a good
string!
This would entail running the entire length of the string through the
peg-hole, with
On Apr 30, 2012, at 12:02 PM, Alain wrote:
Hi everyone,
When stringing a lute, some people like to cut the strings a little above the
nut and tie them with a knot to some non-elastic material like rope or
synthetic fiber of some kind that is wound to the peg. What are the
advantages of
On Apr 30, 2012, at 11:34 AM, Roman Turovsky wrote:
JSB didn't play gamba either as evidenced by his reassignment of nicely
playable lute part in the MatthäusPassion to an impossible one for gamba in
the 2nd version.
Any gambist would tell you that that gamba part is pure hell.
And anyone
I call that extra tied on bit a leader. If I use a less stretchy
material I know I'll have less spring between peg and nut which speeds
and stabilizes tuning. That w/ a bit of beeswax at the nut makes for
quicker work.
The other reason I'll use it is economy. Sometimes I can get two
For me, the only reason is economic; to get two strings for the price of one
(esp. high priced gut), If the nut is properly round and smooth, the grooves as
well, no reason to create even more trouble on an already troublesome aspect of
lute maintenance. There may be more detailed discussion of
I stand corrected!
ed
At 10:15 AM 4/30/2012, Roman Turovsky wrote:
He was actually ethnically Swiss.
RT
From: Edward Martin e...@gamutstrings.com
Losy was Czech.
At 09:32 AM 4/30/2012, Roman Turovsky wrote:
How much German music for baroque guitar do you know?
3 things come to mind, Kremberg,
Hello fellow lutenetters,
A
a gentleman from Boston area contacted me to rent or buy a lute.A I
personally have nothing available for him.A Anyone in the Boston area
able to help out this person?
A
see message below
A
Bruno Cognyl-Fournier
A
A
On 04/30/2012 01:21 PM, Adam Olsen wrote:
Is there a good app for recording yourself on Android? I tried a few
apps, but the sound came out very distorted and blown out. I know the
phone's microphone is better than that, because if I use the video
camera app it sounds fine.
I don't know
Good idea and very well done Arto, but May Day doesn't really promise to be an
entertainment day this year in France with all the political hubbub before the
elections next Sunday... :-( !
Jean-Marie
=
== En réponse au message du 30-04-2012, 21:12:48 ==
Several companies are now making good quality microphones specifically
for iOS:
Tascam iM2 $79 (has its own precision preamp and A/D converter)
Blue Mikey Digital $99 and Spark Digital $199
IK Multimedia iRig Mic $59 and iRig Mic Cast $39
Apogee MiC $199
I'm sure any of these would blow the
Yes, thanks Arto. Dare I say that I prefer this light music to Bach?
And Jean-Marie, I wish we had only 1 or 2 weeks of political hubbub
before elections here in the USA. Zut alors!
Best to all,
Chris.
On Mon, Apr 30, 2012 at 4:37 PM, Jean-Marie Poirier
Hi-sorry if this has been discussed in this thread, but consider
Bach's BWV 1025 for violin and harpsichord which was only recently
(1993) discovered to be based on a lute suite by Weiss. Did Weiss
supply Bach with a score in staff notation, or did Bach read from the
tab?
Thanks Jean-Marie and Chris! :-)
Now also in Vimeo:
http://vimeo.com/41307569
http://vimeo.com/41307711
Best,
Arto
On 01/05/12 01:10, Christopher Stetson wrote:
Yes, thanks Arto. Dare I say that I prefer this light music to Bach?
And Jean-Marie, I wish we had only 1 or 2 weeks
Arto, I think you do a fantastic job of driving a zamboni !
( ... http://www.zamboni.com/ )
Really very nice music and very nicely played. Thanks,
Tom
Dear lutenists,
just in case our List will come alive again:
I re-recorded some Zamboni when warming up my 10-course Vieil Accord
I guess I should state that I don't care if it's quality, just that I
can here myself play and look for places I can improve. I will look
for an app that might have some preamp or gain settings
On Apr 30, 2012 2:34 PM, Toby [1]t...@tobiah.org wrote:
On 04/30/2012 01:21 PM, Adam
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