https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
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addresses)
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specification
already contains such exceptions, like DMARC quarantine policies that
must be ignored if they include a pct value of less than 100, so this
wouldn’t be completely new grounds.
BIMI seems like a very gentle tool for operational pressure.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc
source, but you'd have to find out from them.
Whatever they are doing is wrong.
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Bill Cole
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addresses)
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suspects who keep on using it.
Who uses it?
I'm not seeing it at all in my recent personal "mail worth keeping"
corpus except for one idiosyncratic case of a sender who always uses it
with the full message length.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @
On 2024-04-19 at 07:21:47 UTC-0400 (Fri, 19 Apr 2024 12:21:47 +0100)
Sebastian Arcus via mailop
is rumored to have said:
On 18/04/2024 14:05, Marco Moock via mailop wrote:
Am 18.04.2024 schrieb Bill Cole via mailop :
I can't say that Spamhaus lists IPs that engage in the abusive
practice
- as it would be useful to narrow down a bit what am I looking for.
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(AKA @grumpybozo@toad.social and many
indistinguishable from nearby compromised
Windows machines and IoT devices.
--
Bill Cole
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addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
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gs, so this is
likely to indicate that both organizations have independently deemed
your IP to be badly behaving.
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Bill Cole
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slightly resembles a service that anyone in the private sector
is already trying to do for a profit. Any such proposal raises screams
of "SOCIALISM!" which basically kills anything.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com
of some people who arguably
deserve it and some whom you can only hope will be sympathetic and not
report it as spam. Hopefully some day the dysfunction will provide
enough negative feedback to make what you are doing illegal instead of
unavoidable.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc
the
profitable market for usable addresses.
--
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https
a STARTTLS on the same TCP
connection. The plaintext fallback behavior that I'm aware of in MTAs'
SMTP clients is by way of a fresh connection. Some have done so poorly
at times and I'm not sure how good fallback is across the class. I don't
think any MUA client knows how to fall back in any way.
--
that essentially all of the legit mail I see using
TLSv1.[01] bears indicators of JavaMail.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
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Not Currently Available For Hire
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On 2024-03-13 at 10:56:53 UTC-0400 (Wed, 13 Mar 2024 15:56:53 +0100)
Marco Moock via mailop
is rumored to have said:
Am 13.03.2024 um 10:43:27 Uhr schrieb Bill Cole via mailop:
Without one, disabling them is a cargo-cult praxis that is worse than
any false sense of security provided
to oblivious
peers who can't do TLSv1.2 or better. It is a disservice to end recipients for
a pair of MTAs to fall back to plaintext when both ends could in principle
negotiate a rock-solid ciphersuite with TLSv1.0 or TLSv1.1.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @gru
that are NOT appropriate
for SRS.
--
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/listinfo/mailop
--
Stefano Bagnara
Apache James/jDKIM/jSPF
VOXmail/Mosaico.io/VoidLabs
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Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many
of lists, including this one.
Right, but they do not use the SMTPUTF8/EAI mechanism (raw UTF8
characters) but instead use the long-established MIME mechanism for
encoding non-ASCII header fields using Base64 or Quoted-Printable.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA
On 2024-03-06 at 13:35:10 UTC-0500 (Wed, 6 Mar 2024 13:35:10 -0500)
Michael W. Lucas via mailop
is rumored to have said:
On Wed, Mar 06, 2024 at 01:17:43PM -0500, Bill Cole via mailop wrote:
Call me crazy, but if the policy changes on sub-day cadence, I don't
think I
want that email anyway
day, it's not Policy.
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Not Currently Available For Hire
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bytes in headers unless you have a narrowly limited
audience of receivers.
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Not Currently Available For Hire
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mailop
ever was school progress reports. Students
are often motivated to report them as spam, which occasionally will
convince a mail provider to filter them. And many providers who don't
filter them will still send a steady stream of spam reports of them in
their FBLs and instill a sense of impending
00 Beautiful British Columbia, Canada
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Not Currentl
figuration is requiring that an IP have a PTR
(equivalent to Postfix's "reject_unknown_reverse_client_hostname") and
sometimes people figure out ways to require more (e.g. that the name
resolve to something.)
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA
Not at all. If the big mailbox providers switch and break mail to them
from non-compliant senders, everything else still functions normally. No
need for any sort of "flag day."
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addr
.
The same goes for sender verification.
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Not Currently Available For Hire
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On 2024-02-12 at 14:23:39 UTC-0500 (Mon, 12 Feb 2024 20:23:39 +0100)
Thomas Walter via mailop
is rumored to have said:
> Hey Bill,
>
> On 12.02.24 17:31, Bill Cole via mailop wrote:
>> On 2024-02-12 at 07:13:13 UTC-0500 (Mon, 12 Feb 2024 13:13:13 +0100)
>> Thomas Walter via
ttacks and improper
diversion of mail with very little visibility.
--
Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital sig
ot yet today.
> You need it right now if you want to protect your communication against
> forgeries.
Not so much. DKIM and SPF are adequate for most senders. Arguably, SPF would
suffice for most sending domains if it were not for transparent forwarding.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or b
for
anyone other than the behemoths to support ARC in any meaningful way for
the near term (0-5 years) and you will always (effectively... ) have
sites rejecting on SPF failures out of misguided "principle."
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpyboz
right thing."
> (and sometimes in addition to the presence
> of an MX record when any or all of the defined MXes rejects their
> attempts with 4yz {temporary} or 5yz {permanent} SMTP error codes).
Very much NOT the right thing.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA
get email for your MTA so the milter "sees" the email.
I don't believe that is true, since you can reject based on recipient
addresses in the filter_recipient() subroutine, where you have both a
current recipient and the client IP each time that it is called.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scc
EDROP) that one can expect NO friendly traffic from. NO
ONE should see any collateral damage from using DROP.
UCEPROTECT L3 is an intentional collateral damage list. If one COULD use
it as a router blocking list, one would not perceive the Internet to be
functional.
--
Bill Cole
b
orporations who have had policies
of rejecting any meeting invites with .ics files unless the sender is
whitelisted. Too many people do not expect random strangers "inviting"
them to meetings and have their settings configured to auto-accept
invites.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.c
http://www.infinitemho.fi/
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b
-small percentage of known DNS block
lists could not be even marginally described as "real time".
Well, there is also that...
Graeme (wearing massive floppy felt pedant hat with huge gold tassels
attached to make the point) :)
Excellence in headgear.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.co
mail=1 rcpt=1
data=1 quit=1 commands=7
EHLO after STARTTLS is normal and proper. See the RFC.
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
ECDSA DKIM yet without ruining people's day?
Exclusively? Not yet.
--
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Not Currently Available For Hire
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e earliest discussions that resulted in SPF.
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and wait for complaints. A large fraction of such systems never handle a
legitimate message for the domains to which they send their garbage.
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
re
solely
those of the author and are not intended to represent those of the
company.
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(AKA @grumpybozo and man
age) email, the cost of being blocked can be the whole business.
The more you handle typical conversational email, the less you can
tolerate practices that lead to blocking.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not
this is only feasible for
similar operations where mailing list hosting is not a free-standing
offering, but only something we offer to our mailbox customers.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently
On 2023-11-19 at 14:02:04 UTC-0500 (Sun, 19 Nov 2023 19:02:04 +
(GMT))
Andrew C Aitchison via mailop
is rumored to have said:
On Sun, 19 Nov 2023, Bill Cole via mailop wrote:
On 2023-11-19 at 06:59:37 UTC-0500 (Sun, 19 Nov 2023 12:59:37 +0100)
Alessandro Vesely via mailop
is rumored
, but I wouldn't be at all surprised
if some sites still have a 90%+ spam burden.
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Not Currently Available For Hire
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with
72 signatures. It's obviously
a bug, but it's a rather strange bug.
My bet is that it's a line-break error. Some text file somewhere is
missing LFs
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Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available
e sites WILL
refuse mail based on such absurdities and no amount of RFC-lawyering
will change their minds.
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Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
__
business organizations where you could
reasonably expect an outage starting on Friday night would not even be
noticed until Monday morning. I'm pretty sure my first IDA/KJS Sendmail
machine had a 5-day queue lifetime, as I had no clue how to change it...
--
Bill Cole
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an artifact of Exim being used so
widely in cPanel.
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https
ndled by 1 aspmx.l.google.com.
arxiv.org mail is handled by 5 alt1.aspmx.l.google.com.
arxiv.org mail is handled by 5 alt2.aspmx.l.google.com.
So, clearly the problem is somewhere at Google...
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com
to
create external pressure for Amazon & their customers to tighten up
their practices...
(I've been doing my part in that effort for a couple years, but I've
been rejecting nearly nothing from SES in recent months.)
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpy
's c=simple/simple DKIM
signature.
Yes, I'm sure it does.
Using simple/simple canonicalization is not for people who want robust
DKIM signatures.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Curre
ahead of
signing.)
--
Bill Cole
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Not Currently Available For Hire
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generating broken email.
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regards,
Camille
Le 12/09/2023 à 00:26, Bill Cole via mailop a écrit :
On 2023-09-11 at 17:05:00 UTC-0400 (Mon, 11 Sep 2023 23:05:00 +0200)
Camille - Clean Mailbox via mailop
is rumored to have said:
Dear co-listers,
I'm seeing an increase of SSL/TLS errors for incoming emails to our
service over
certificate. You
should remove any reference to the 'DST Root CA X3' certificate. You may
also need to change how you maintain your certificate.
--
Bill Cole
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Not Currently Available For Hire
want their service, they
will extract value from you one way or another to get it.
I should probably add that I would be entirely willing to experience an
Internet without B2C ESPs. It's nothing personal, it's just that I've
never been convinced that their existence isn't an attractive nui
und the word "policy"
The default attribute does not advise anyone what to do, it simply
expresses a vague judgment by the domain owner of how complete &
reliable the SPF record is.
(I'm not saying one should pay a lot of attention to the policy, but
it's a policy.)
It's policy-esque.
On 2023-07-13 at 12:06:45 UTC-0400 (Thu, 13 Jul 2023 11:06:45 -0500)
Grant Taylor via mailop
is rumored to have said:
On 7/13/23 10:49 AM, Bill Cole via mailop wrote:
It's not at all logically hard to meet that arbitrary requirement,
you just need a zone cut everywhere you have a MX record
t was entirely the invention of
the Big Brains at Yahoo, the place that helped give us the ridiculous
fragility of DKIM...
--
Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
__
Zone files are very small and
numerous. *Logistically* changing an existing zone with many MXs for
subdomains to that model could be a serious chore.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Availabl
On 2023-07-12 at 18:53:31 UTC-0400 (Wed, 12 Jul 2023 15:53:31 -0700)
Michael Peddemors via mailop
is rumored to have said:
On 2023-07-12 12:53, Jaroslaw Rafa via mailop wrote:
Most of regular consumer email users don't have any reason for this.
As Bill
Cole, whom I was replying to, wrote
customers, and their
prospective customers who need to know that their spam is authentic.
--
Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
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Internet, an A will do but you really want an MX.
Primarily because if you don't, it may confuse and distract people who
should know better, and generate LONG mailing list threads.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses
On 2023-07-11 at 13:49:32 UTC-0400 (Tue, 11 Jul 2023 19:49:32 +0200)
Benny Pedersen via mailop
is rumored to have said:
> Bill Cole via mailop skrev den 2023-07-11 19:01:
>> On 2023-07-11 at 11:08:23 UTC-0400 (Tue, 11 Jul 2023 17:08:23 +0200)
>> Benny Pedersen via mailop
>&g
t; mechanisms of
Sendmail and Postfix. This practice, *without SRS*, is still the most
widespread form of forwarding individual addresses to other individual
addresses.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Cu
,
beyond simply protecting the contents of email.
--
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Not Currently Available For Hire
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.
Hobbyists can live with not delivering to GMail or MS, companies that
need to work with other businesses via email cannot.
--
Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
appears to reject mail solely for that
reason and inbound mail works perfectly. It is, after all, the way
email was originally designed to work.
However, I admit my evidence for that is ~2y old. I wouldn't
*intentionally* allow an actively mailing domain to rely on A
fallback...
--
Bill
machine's network circumstances. IOW: I don't think it's a case of MS
blocking Google or any Google network per se.
But that's just a hunch...
--
Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
bots.
Do you have any idea how many of those would be tripped up by a
Postfix-style banner delay?
--
Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
harmless cute tricks like banner weirdness, it is intentional shotgun
breakage that requires constant tuning.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
s of email. If you have evidence that it is
actually worthwhile for you, you could just say that. My experience
includes evidence that it is not. Maybe that has changed in 2023, but I
doubt it.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scc
think that you are so big that the rules can't apply to you.
That you are somehow different and special.
You are wrong. You're nothing special. You're just big. Get over
yourselves.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com
s think
they should do, especially if it possible for them to perceive such
deadbeats to be competitors. If you run a mail server, Microsoft will at
some point treat you as a competitor rather than as a partner. Do not
expect anything else.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.
se
positives and has become increasingly risky to the checker's reputation and
error-prone over the years. A "legally mandated" sender should probably expect
some of that to still be in use, because the long tail of mail admin
incompetence is a thing...
--
Bill Cole
b...@sccon
OK at mail-tester.com with the envelope from address
lowercased.
As one self-appointed victim* of their chronic incompetence, I feel
compelled to beg you: don't waste your time trying to figure out what
mail-tester.com is doing wrong.
*: SpamAssassin committer/PMC member
--
Bill Cole
b
at you must do, your server=your rules, but I can only
say: "EWWW!"
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Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
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ndmail and Postfix DO NOT change the envelope sender for mail forwarded via
alias or .forward mechanisms. That's the whole reason SRS tools exist.
--
Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available Fo
legal issues they
might have with liability for uncertain electronic delivery by having
customers 'agree' to click-thru terms specifically for electronic
delivery. It's never something they do by default.
--
Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpybozo and many
op.org
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Bill Cole
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Not Currently Available For Hire
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nges where I've seen suspect
traffic from many sources recently and deemed them generally disposable.
e.g. I'll likely never have a legit packet from any random nameless
ChinaNet IP, so why waste TCP on any of them?
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Bill Cole
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(AKA @grumpyboz
a large scale event that we're all seeing.
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On 2023-05-12 at 16:52:38 UTC-0400 (Fri, 12 May 2023 13:52:38 -0700)
Brandon Long via mailop
is rumored to have said:
On Fri, May 12, 2023 at 8:54 AM Bill Cole via mailop
wrote:
On 2023-05-12 at 09:40:14 UTC-0400 (Fri, 12 May 2023 13:40:14 +)
Paul Gregg via mailop
is rumored to have
to
work, you won't put out-of-spec addresses where they might be replied
to.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
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results that are "generic."
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
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Just to close this loop:
I resent my report this evening and got an autoreply as normal, so I
guess AT hasn't gone Twitter on us...
On 2023-05-06 at 16:53:58 UTC-0400 (Sat, 06 May 2023 16:53:58 -0400)
Bill Cole via mailop
is rumored to have said:
For unknown reasons, I got one
doing something wrong.
I see 74 domains listed there ending in .de. The specific ones in
question start at line 12026.
Which precisely matches my current state of knowledge.
`grep '^\S*\.de$' public_suffix_list.txt` is enlightening.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA
this to domain tails on the PSL, that at least
limits the damage and makes some sense. People possibly harmed in that
case can at least address the problem directly themselves.
It would be nice if Yahoo clarified what they are actually doing.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc
th a fresh address in billmail.scconsult.com that
Yahoo accepts and delivers (some) mail from domains that are not at a
zone cut.
This is despite what their postmaster page says and their support
confirmed to you. Maybe someone with a clue has reversed the extremely
bad policy?
--
B
ipient
address rejected: User unknown in local recipient table
Last-Attempt-Date: Sat, 6 May 2023 16:04:31 -0400
That's their Proofpoint inbound filter being told by an actual AT
machine that the address they tell people to mail does not exist.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc.
header in any way that tried to interpret its meaning beyond
correlating existence and basic validity with spamminess. The semantic
content of that header is strictly MUA-fodder.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses
tive signer has poor key management. If the putative signer uses
512-bit keys rotated hourly, they might as well be publishing the keys.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currentl
customers in
5 minutes if they have a valid credit card number.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
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addresses to facilitate
spamming, traditional transparent forwarding had to go. SPF is a tool
for killing it off.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Availabl
referring to?
# dig _domainkey.lena.kiev.ua
; <<>> DiG 9.18.12 <<>> _domainkey.lena.kiev.ua
;; global options: +cmd
;; Got answer:
;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 11967
;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 0, AUTHORITY: 1, ADDITIONAL: 1
--
B
rs
who do not retry. They are harmless (aside from delay) for mail being
haqndlked by a proper MTA that implements a MX fallback and retry
strategy.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Availabl
forwarding the message, nothing you do to the
envelope sender can (or should) save it.
--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Not Currently Available For Hire
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Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com
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