Re: [MD] dark night

2012-06-18 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi MarshaV and All, I can't figure why Schopenh(aurer) would grumble about his intellect? He must have heard Parrots howling! The timeless value of DQ/SQ metaphysics manifested after his time so how could he feel led into error? Maybe he was just a grumbler. Joe M(aurer) On 6/18/12 2:23 AM,

Re: [MD] Ham's Value Rigidity?

2012-06-17 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ham and All, I would echo that the first problem encountered in the history of human civilization is the reality of a story about eating an apple! How are male and female individuals judged to be on the same level in evolution, human? It is not good for man to be alone! First one, then two,

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-06-16 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark, Round and round she goes and where she stops nobody knows! (Except the one putting on the brakes!) Joe On 6/15/12 2:26 PM, 118 ununocti...@gmail.com wrote: We made up the term evolution (as well as Quality); we have complete control over what it is, not the other way around.

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-06-15 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, I have no clue to your take on the delineation of existing reality in evolution? For myself I accept evolution as the description of an observed hierarchal order of levels in existence characterized in MOQ, indefinable/ definable, DQ/SQ evolutionary reality. IMHO the discussion

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-06-13 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ant, I love you! Joe On 6/13/12 4:05 AM, Ant McWatt antmcw...@hotmail.co.uk wrote: Can you you provide a typical context where these indefinable emotions appear? Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-06-12 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ant McWatt and All, Dynamic Quality doesn't move anywhere. I am trying to envision the reality of evolution. Dynamic Quality exists, and IMHO accepts existence in every level in evolution. Existence evolves. E.G., I accept indefinable emotions as DQ. The existence of every level in

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-06-10 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi DMB Naming names and kicking ass! Wow! Joe On 6/10/12 9:22 AM, david buchanan dmbucha...@hotmail.com wrote: I think it's worse than odd. The overall thrust of the defense mounted by Mark, Marsha and others is to generally undermine the very idea that one can be right or wrong about

Re: [MD] T.U.R.T.L.E.W.A.X.

2012-06-09 Thread Joseph Maurer
is beyond static (patterned) value - beyond concepts percepts - nothing that can be called meaningful by human standards - that makes it a wondrous participation indeed! http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dWocYObumVo Marsha On Jun 8, 2012, at 4:21 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net wrote

Re: [MD] T.U.R.T.L.E.W.A.X.

2012-06-09 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Michael, I experience upset and indefinable DQ. Is there an indefinable emotional perception? Joe On 6/8/12 2:16 PM, Michael R. Brown m...@fuguewriter.com wrote: We are. : ) -Original Message- From: Joseph Maurer How do we experience indefinable DQ? Moq_Discuss mailing

Re: [MD] T.U.R.T.L.E.W.A.X.

2012-06-09 Thread Joseph Maurer
are wise. Marsha On Jun 9, 2012, at 1:39 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net wrote: Hi Marsha, If you read it as sarcasm, I'm sorry I wrote it. I was not trying to be sarcastic. I was trying to describe the moment. Probably never a good idea since moments do not have

Re: [MD] T.U.R.T.L.E.W.A.X.

2012-06-08 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi MarshaV and All, In the MOQ, DQ/DQ, the question begged is How do we experience indefinable DQ? For myself I am content declaring that emotions are indefinable. We experience them. They are known in my reality. Surrendering to authority usually keeps me out of jail! A justification for

Re: [MD] T.U.R.T.L.E.W.A.X.

2012-06-08 Thread Joseph Maurer
; digging, digging and digging deeper into knowing yourself (a flow of ...); paying attention, even arguing. The sangha? Best leave that discussion for another day. :-) Marsha On Jun 8, 2012, at 2:22 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net wrote: Hi MarshaV and All, In the MOQ, DQ/DQ

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-06-06 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ham and All, I realize I am late getting back to you! I am sorry. IMHO Negation is not a metaphysical principle but a logical principle NO!. Evolution, levels in existence, is a metaphysical principle of existence. Evolution as levels in existence describes the metaphysical realm DQ/SQ,

Re: [MD] The hard question

2012-06-05 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark, My understanding of puzzle pieces in a metaphysical environment is a description of existence in evolution. DQ/SQ exist. S/O is defined as existing. Joe On 6/4/12 3:33 PM, 118 ununocti...@gmail.com wrote: The notion of puzzle pieces is, of course, the application of SQ to

Re: [MD] A problem with the MOQ.

2012-06-04 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Andre, Wow! I will be 80 in September. What am I missing? Metaphysics has been around for a few centuries. I do not yet understand the values of indefinable DQ and definable SQ. I never tried to understood a value of S/O metaphysics it was just what I was taught. Logic is interesting to

Re: [MD] The hard question

2012-06-03 Thread Joseph Maurer
:-( ? On 6/2/12 2:27 PM, MarshaV val...@att.net wrote: :-) On Jun 2, 2012, at 4:47 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net wrote: Hi Marsha, The world comes to us in an endless stream of puzzle pieces that we would like to think all fit together some how, but that in fact

Re: [MD] The hard question

2012-06-03 Thread Joseph Maurer
Marsha, I understood! But the questions never end! Joe On 6/3/12 12:44 PM, MarshaV val...@att.net wrote: Joe, What? I thought the quote you offered was perfect? That's why I offered the big smile. Marsha On Jun 3, 2012, at 3:20 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net

Re: [MD] The hard question

2012-06-02 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Marsha and all, I like the phrase levels in existence to describe the meaning of evolution. Pirsig described DQ as indefinable. In my experience emotional experience fits that description. The apparatus for knowledge in a sentient being includes emotion and intellect. Instinctive and

Re: [MD] The hard question

2012-06-02 Thread Joseph Maurer
? Marsha On Jun 1, 2012, at 2:46 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net wrote: Hi Marsha, Metaphysics formats our experience of reality. Pirsig observed DQ/SQ in his experience. He observed that DQ/SQ described the experience of reality. Emotions are not thoughts like S/O. Emotions

Re: [MD] The hard question

2012-06-02 Thread Joseph Maurer
that the values of art and morality and even religious mysticism are verifiable (LILA, Chapter 8) Marsha On Jun 2, 2012, at 2:12 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net wrote: Hi Marsha and all, I like the phrase levels in existence to describe the meaning of evolution. Pirsig

Re: [MD] The hard question

2012-06-01 Thread Joseph Maurer
val...@att.net wrote: Hi Joe, Hi Joe, I consider perceptions to be experiences of the senses: seeing, tasting, touching, smelling and hearing. Are you using the term to mean something different? Marsha On May 31, 2012, at 2:06 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net

Re: [MD] The hard question

2012-05-31 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Marsha and All, I want to consider the difference between emotional perception and intellectual conception. For myself emotional perception is DQ. There is no way to confine individualized emotional perceptions to a definition. Emotions stand alone. The DQ perception of evolving reality as

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-05-30 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi DMB and All, In MOQ DQ is indefinable and SQ defined. Is definition necessary in the distinction between perception and conception? Imho DQ is perceivable without definition. DQ is a word without static patterns. Joe On 5/30/12 10:50 AM, david buchanan dmbucha...@hotmail.com wrote: But

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-05-27 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi MarshaV and all, MOQ DQ/SQ emphasizes the distinction between indefinable reality and definable reality. How can I know indefinable DQ as reality? For myself I am comfortable conceiving indefinable emotion DQ a part of my everyday experience. There is also an historical higher emotional and

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-05-24 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ham and All, When I negate existence I feel empty/death! And when I conceive sensible variety negation leaves me speechless. I find 'essence', a word created by the combination of the infinitive and participle of to be, esse, ens to be too contradictory for metaphysical purposes. In essence

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-05-23 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Jan and all, I am trying to understand a value in evolution. The value between defineable and indefinable is negation. Evolution is not negation. Existence is logically perceived in different formats, DQ/SQ. I do not want to view DQ as individuality, but rather as common to sentient

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-05-22 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ant and All, I am thinking Physics are mathematically definable. Metaphysics are mathematically indefinable. SQ/DQ. Does this distinction open any doors for a valuation of evolution as levels in existence? Joe On 5/19/12 6:40 AM, Ant McWatt antmcw...@hotmail.co.uk wrote: Consequently,

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-05-19 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Carl, Evolution! Levels in existence. Joe On 5/17/12 8:39 PM, Carl Thames ctha...@centurytel.net wrote: I don't know how it came up, but recently I stumbled across what's known as The Hard Question about consciousness. Specifically, that question is how consciousness arises from

Re: [MD] The hard question.

2012-05-18 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Dan and All, Levels in consciousness? You declare there are four levels of evolutionary existence. It seems existence can be described as the medium of evolutionary levels. How many levels? As a singer I am familiar with the acceptance of a seven discreet levels in sound DQ, RE, MI, FA,

Re: [MD] Plato's Good

2012-05-12 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark, I don't know if you attach any meaning to parts of speech. Some words used for meaning in this discussion were adjectives. In ordinary parlance Quality, Quantity, good, true are adjectives that modify existing nouns. Can the meaning from adjectives like quality, quantity good, true

Re: [MD] Plato's Good

2012-05-11 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ant and All, I have no idea what essential means in this context. If good exists how is it differentiated by essential nature? Is essential nature not good? Joe On 5/11/12 10:24 AM, Ant McWatt antmcw...@hotmail.co.uk wrote: Well, I agree with Pirsig in that the Good¹s essential nature

Re: [MD] Plato's Good

2012-05-11 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, In SOM this question has meaning logically. In the metaphysics of a DQ/SQ reality a further problem arises. It is impossible to discuss DQ mathematically since DQ is not conceptual in being indefinable. Only analogy and metaphor handle DQ. The further perception of analogy

Re: [MD] Plato's Good

2012-05-11 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ant and All, Given the acceptance of evolutionary reality, essential nature modifies reality SO. Instead of SO essential nature I prefer to conceptualize evolution metaphysically as levels in existence for fundamental nature of. Joe On 5/11/12 11:02 AM, Ant McWatt antmcw...@hotmail.co.uk

Re: [MD] reifying carrots

2012-05-03 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi MarshaV and All, IMHO Evolution, DQ, is perceived emotionally. The intellectual conception of Evolution as levels in existence SQ follows that DQ perception. The emotional perception, apprehends indefinable values. I intellectually conceptualize these values in evolution, levels in

Re: [MD] reifying carrots

2012-05-02 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi MarshaV and all, Conceptualizing metaphysics in DQ/SQ format Pirsig accepts SQ reality/DQ reality, evolution. The indefinable is existent and experienced DQ. IMHO MOQ Evolution, indefinable levels in existence, DQ/SQ metaphysical reality. Joe On 5/2/12 1:14 AM, MarshaV val...@att.net

Re: [MD] A problem with the MOQ.

2012-05-01 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ham and All, In a metaphysical discussion you can't presume a definition. Metaphysics formats physics logically. Awareness and otherness stand alone. Two definitions are required for these two words in a metaphysical setting. Subject and object exist differently. Are you suggesting that

Re: [MD] A problem with the MOQ.

2012-05-01 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Tuukka, In a metaphysical reality DQ/SQ, indefinable DQ is acceptable. I was trying to conceptualize how definition like in mathematical reality is different from metaphysical requirements. Joe On 5/1/12 12:10 PM, Tuukka Virtaperko m...@tuukkavirtaperko.net wrote: Tuukka: Yes you

Re: [MD] A problem with the MOQ.

2012-04-30 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ham and All, I don't trust your statement that there are two entities to be accounted for. A conception of evolution as inorganic, organic1 (replication by a single cell splitting itself), organic 2 (replication by the penetration of an egg cell by a sperm cell) etc., suggests a finite

Re: [MD] Tuukka's letter to Robert Pirsig

2012-04-30 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Tuukka and All, Color coding (the blue box) will not distinguish DQ from SQ. There can be no defined process in apprehending indefinable DQ. DQ remains indefinable and knowable. The intellect monitors definitions. E.G., Emotions are DQ, indefinable. Is it possible to describe emotions in

Re: [MD] Intellectual Separation From DQ

2012-04-27 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, DQ is indefinable. The metaphysics DQ/SQ conceptualizes evolution as following a repeating format for differing levels in existence. Conceptualize evolution? Reality is DQ/SQ in MOQ. There is a level in evolution that conceptualizes indefinable DQ. I suggest the format of the

Re: [MD] A problem with the MOQ.

2012-04-23 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Tuukka and All, Moving, temporal, emergent, evolutionary are good words when describing a concept of reality. A logic validating evolution points to a structure, like levels in existence MOQ DQ/SQ, for indefinable/definable reality. Indiscriminate SOM has no piece in a game distinguishing

Re: [MD] A problem with the MOQ.

2012-04-22 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ham and All, I have no idea how you distinguish metaphysics from physics? A defined language of physics, mathematics embraces SOM. SOM denies reality to the indefinable aspect in logic found in DQ/SQ metaphysics. Analogy and metaphor are indefinable when describing evolution as levels in

Re: [MD] A problem with the MOQ.

2012-04-21 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ham and all, In my opinion essence is a bogus word. It combines two parts of speech, to be (esse) and being (ens) in one conception thereby becoming twisted and outside reality. Metaphysically two are not one. Whenever I see the word essence I translate it to existence dq/sq and I feel more

Re: [MD] The Future of the MOQ

2012-04-13 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Tuukka and All, Mathematics is a formal language, definable terms only for logic. MOQ metaphysics supports logic in discussing indefinable/definable reality DQ/SQ. Rigid logic in mathematics does not configure evolution it accepts evolution described by metaphysics. 1 is created, not

Re: [MD] Awareness and consciousness in the MOQ

2012-04-12 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Arlo and all, Individuality is indefinable and seeks metaphysical justifications in existence. E. g., in SOM 1, a metaphysical concept, is transcendent. 1 is not DQ. What is 1 when I say 2?. Social is a negation of 1. In MOQ 1 is redefined in a DQ/SQ indefinable/definable reality instead

Re: [MD] Hero or Villain?

2012-04-10 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ant and All, The feeling of generosity and kindness that flow through your words leaves me breathless. Thank you! As you probable guessed much of my philosophical endeavors have been involved in trying to understand the Metaphysics of the Greeks SOM (I am approaching 80 years old). I beg

Re: [MD] Awareness and consciousness in the MOQ

2012-04-09 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ant and All, Through the ages heroes have been made not born, or is it born not made? I question your statement that intellect is as good as it gets. IMHO a hero like Christ, Plato, Aristotle etc., were operating beyond commonly understood intellectual capabilities On 4/9/12 6:48 AM, Ant

Re: [MD] Awareness and consciousness in the MOQ

2012-04-08 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Andre and All, I am trying to clarify, by speaking openly, what I envision privately. DQ is existent though indefinable. That statement opens up questions for the theory of knowledge--How do we know the indefinable? DQ/SQ metaphysics in existence! MOQ metaphysics accepts the proposal of

Re: [MD] Awareness and consciousness in the MOQ

2012-04-07 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Andre and All. I don't know your take on evolution. MOQ indefinable DQ definable SQ creates a framework for thought. Both exist. The indefinable is not non existent! There are some thoughts for evolution which are beyond logic like inorganic and organic existence which requires a change in

Re: [MD] Awareness and consciousnes in the MOQ

2012-04-02 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Andre, WONDERFUL 111. IMHO There are two Knives-Scalpels in a metaphysical discussion. EMOTIONS DQ and INTELLECT SQ. IMHO ,1, starts at the level in evolution inorganic, followed by organic (single cell-multiple cell),, emotional, intellectual, esoteric (higher emotional, higher

Re: [MD] lila's soliloquy

2012-03-31 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Tukka and all, DQ is indefinable not unknowable. The theory of knowledge is broadened in a conception of indefinable consciousness like the addition of free-will. There is a difference between defined and experienced as. One is intellectual the other is existential. Knowledge describing

Re: [MD] Contradiction and incoherence

2012-03-31 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Andre, Shit happens! Joe On 3/31/12 6:22 AM, Andre andrebroer...@gmail.com wrote: Of course I can give dozens more examples but I hope you get my drift Joe. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives:

Re: [MD] lila's soliloquy

2012-03-30 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi MarshaV and All' True and False have existential connotations. I love it that Pirsig valued indefinable DQ and definable SQ in existence. Joe On 3/29/12 9:37 PM, MarshaV val...@att.net wrote: Protagoras: ³Man is the measure of all things.², or as poor maligned Lila might have

Re: [MD] Contradiction and incoherence

2012-03-30 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Andre, If you don't create you're not responsible for it. I think free will fits in there somewhere. Joe On 3/29/12 10:19 AM, Andre andrebroer...@gmail.com wrote: Next she'll tell us that we create our own reality! Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.

Re: [MD] lila's soliloquy

2012-03-30 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Tuukka, The rigid logic of mathematics cannot embrace indefinable DQ. Levels in evolution embrace DQ. The rigid logic of mathematics cannot embrace 1 as a metaphysical principle of 1, individuality, which flows through different disciplines in evolution. Joe On 3/30/12 6:50 AM, Tuukka

Re: [MD] Following DQ in Zen Tradition

2012-03-30 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark, things which I can leave behind In a DQ/SQ metaphysics words are not things. Words are signs for reality DQ/SQ. Things have a strong affinity to existence SQ. It is a relief that DQ is indefinable, limited existence, which helps me think. I am left on my own and he who is led by

Re: [MD] DMB's friends

2012-03-27 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark, A mathematical conception of DQ is ambivalent. Metaphysics follows a reality of perception prior to the logic of conception. There is a difference between the perception of metaphysics and the conception of mathematical logic. In MOQ there is no definition of DQ. IMHO DQ is the

Re: [MD] DMB's friends

2012-03-26 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, Imho Pirsig has provided the conception for that cypher DQ/SQ. DQ is the indefinable emotional reality and SQ is defined intellectual reality. Joe On 3/25/12 6:11 PM, 118 ununocti...@gmail.com wrote: The use of an appropriate cypher is required to decrypt passages, which

Re: [MD] Why are things called patterns?

2012-03-26 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Marsha and all, Are human cognitive processes the only experience of structured reality or can animal/human instincts process DQ? Joe On 3/25/12 9:40 PM, MarshaV val...@att.net wrote: Hi Craig, On Mar 25, 2012, at 11:43 PM, craig...@comcast.net wrote: [Craig, previously] Can

Re: [MD] Why are things called patterns?

2012-03-26 Thread Joseph Maurer
: Hi Joe, No, not if you have a Heart. Marsha On Mar 26, 2012, at 2:15 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net wrote: Hi Marsha and all, Are human cognitive processes the only experience of structured reality or can animal/human instincts process DQ? Joe On 3/25

Re: [MD] Dewey's Zen

2012-03-25 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi DMB and All, My take on this particular passage: The impetus to defined DQ/SQ metaphysics is the perception that indefinable emotion is the door DQ/SQ. Joe On 3/24/12 9:37 PM, david buchanan dmbucha...@hotmail.com quotes James: The underlying unity of qualitativeness regulates pertinence

Re: [MD] Why are things called patterns?

2012-03-24 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark, Imho There is one meaning for cognition which follows a logic for physical reality dependent on mathematical logic for verification, physics. There is a further meaning in cognition which accepts DQ/SQ metaphysics. Evolution is beyond mathematical physics. Mathematics a lower level can

Re: [MD] FW: The value of static patterns.

2012-03-22 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi DMB, To start a post with the statement below and then continue the criticism leaves you open to the observation that possibly you are viewing things from a weird perspective. Joe On 3/22/12 6:18 AM, david buchanan dmbucha...@hotmail.com wrote: There's no way to know for sure

Re: [MD] The value of static patterns.

2012-03-21 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi DMB and All, I have no interest in getting a PHD degree. I feel you are biased and speaking from a pedestal instead of from a level in evolution which you have attained. The idea of business you appeal to can be a lie and non-existent in being specified only by a vague here. Joe On

Re: [MD] Contradiction and incoherence.

2012-03-21 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi DMB and all, How do dictionaries define evolution? Is it static and ever-changing? On 3/21/12 12:39 PM, david buchanan dmbucha...@hotmail.com wrote: (According to all the dictionaries static and ever-changing have opposite meanings so that they could never rightly be equated.)

Re: [MD] The value of static patterns.

2012-03-21 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi DMB, As I approach my 80th birthday I have to agree with everything you have said. Still there is something in me that hollers Pay Attention! I do not expect a revelation. Speaker and audience have differing outlooks. Evolution is a nightmare yet very reasonable. I don't think you value

Re: [MD] Contradiction and incoherence.

2012-03-21 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi David, What do dictionaries have to do with DQ? JOE On 3/21/12 1:15 PM, david buchanan dmbucha...@hotmail.com wrote: How do dictionaries define evolution? Is it static and ever-changing? evolution |ˌevəˈloō sh ən|noun1 the process by which different kinds of living organisms are

Re: [MD] Why are things called patterns?

2012-03-19 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Andre and All, Imho evolution is a twisted knot in existence. DQ, indefinable, in originating evolution creates a dual meaning DQ/SQ while remaining indefinable. DQ/SQ is a metaphysical formulation for all reality not a formula in physics. In an indefinable, definable relationship, MOQ

Re: [MD] Why are things called patterns?

2012-03-18 Thread Joseph Maurer
, Mar 17, 2012 at 11:08 AM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net wrote: Hi Ron, Metaphysics are intellectual! It's a touchdown!  Water boys don't play! Joe On 3/17/12 6:20 AM, X Acto xa...@rocketmail.com wrote: What can be said is that a MoQ is an intellectual idea about making good value

Re: [MD] Why are things called patterns?

2012-03-17 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ron, Metaphysics are intellectual! It's a touchdown! Water boys don't play! Joe On 3/17/12 6:20 AM, X Acto xa...@rocketmail.com wrote: What can be said is that a MoQ is an intellectual idea about making good value distinctions. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.

Re: [MD] Why are things called patterns?

2012-03-13 Thread Joseph Maurer
:15 PM, 118 ununocti...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Joe, What I mean is more faith. What do you not understand about that? Do you not have more faith in somethings as opposed to others? I am not sure where you are going with this, but I am interested. Cheers, Mark On 3/12/12, Joseph Maurer jh

Re: [MD] Why are things called patterns?

2012-03-12 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, I do not understand more faith? Feelings (emotions) are indefinable. DQ has an indefinable structure in the core. Joe On 3/11/12 9:14 PM, 118 ununocti...@gmail.com wrote: I have more faith in what I do not understand, but can feel in my core. Moq_Discuss mailing list

Re: [MD] Why are things called patterns?

2012-03-11 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, Imho Distractions can be DQ or SQ. Focusing attention adds emphasis to the awareness for revealing distractions by acknowledging the order in individuality and evolution. Joe On 3/10/12 6:22 PM, 118 ununocti...@gmail.com wrote: I am not sure what you mean by focussing your

Re: [MD] Why are things called patterns?

2012-03-11 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi MarshaV and all, Have a relationship.. I agree with you! A pattern of inorganic reality, must differ in sensation from a pattern of organic reality in order to tell them apart. I do not use Pirsig's 4 levels for evolution. As a singer I am more intrigued by the musical scale Do, re,

Re: [MD] Why are things called patterns?

2012-03-11 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, I describe evolution as describing discrete levels in existence. Focusing attention is useful when describing levels in existence, evolution. For me looking through a microscope (a tool for visual enlargement a little stronger than a pair of binoculars) is the analogy I use

Re: [MD] Why are things called patterns?

2012-03-10 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, What if existence is patterned and my creation is simply the result of focusing my attention? I would then become aware of the level in existence under consideration. Evolution describes the level of the existence of the individual in a moral order. Joe On 3/10/12 9:45 AM,

Re: [MD] understanding pattern

2012-03-09 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, IMHO DQ cannot be 0. In any format 0 is non-existence not a midpoint in logic between +1 and -1. DQ is indefinable and exists. Metaphysics DQ/SQ is the format for reality, logic. It cannot support reality in a language of creation from nothing by an unlimited force. There is

Re: [MD] understanding pattern

2012-03-09 Thread Joseph Maurer
HI MarshaV, ??? Joe On 3/9/12 4:40 AM, MarshaV val...@att.net wrote: Joe, 01001001 0010 01101100 0110 01110110 01100101 0010 0001 0110 01110101 00101100 0010 01101010 0110 01100101 Marsha On Mar 8, 2012, at 2:53 PM, Joseph Maurer jh

Re: [MD] understanding pattern

2012-03-09 Thread Joseph Maurer
be made of one and zero as in the binary system of numbers which is used for computers. There were times when those zeros had an important relationship in decoding computer dumps. That was a very long time ago, though. Marsha On Mar 8, 2012, at 2:53 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net

Re: [MD] understanding pattern

2012-03-08 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Marsha and All, I find no negation in 0. It is hard for me to see 0 as a relationship of the midpoint between +1 and -1. Joe On 3/8/12 2:18 AM, MarshaV val...@att.net wrote: Marsha: I understand granite, dog, family and zero all to be relationships and processes (patterns).

Re: [MD] First Division 2.0

2012-03-06 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and all, And away we Go! On 3/5/12 9:39 PM, 118 ununocti...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Joe, Sent laboriously from an iPhone, Mark On Mar 5, 2012, at 5:16 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net wrote: Hi David, A logic of a metaphysics of DQ/SQ, begs the question: How can

Re: [MD] aggregates of grasping

2012-03-06 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Ham, Good to read you posting again! Flattery will get you everywhere! Joe On 3/6/12 12:35 AM, Ham Priday hampd...@verizon.net wrote: And friend Joseph is so fixated on evolutionary theory that he cannot explain human Will or Intellect as anything but a product of passions and

Re: [MD] First Division 2.0

2012-03-05 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi David, A logic of a metaphysics of DQ/SQ, begs the question: How can an indefinable DQ have meaning? In SOM S depends on O activity in the definition in existence. S has no definition in existence awaiting O's behavior. Different activities determine a reality manifesting existence.

Re: [MD] First Division 2.0

2012-03-04 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Andre and all, I am confused at a dust up over Love. In the past in a discussion of parts of speech I was taught that Quality and Quantity were accepted as the first adjectives modifying nouns. Quality has a history. Patterns of quality seems to let Quality stand alone as a noun although

Re: [MD] aggregates of grasping

2012-03-04 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, Hi Mark and All, In my opinion, feeling's cannot be divided into categories outside of the intellect. I do not know how you rationalize DQ. For myself I view feelings as emotions and imho indefinable emotions have metaphysical reality DQ in MOQ. categories is a product of

Re: [MD] Tweaking the emergence

2012-03-03 Thread Joseph Maurer
Wow! Joe On 3/2/12 8:56 AM, 118 ununocti...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Marsha, I fully understand what you are saying by the not knowable stuff below. I have been there and moved on, or maybe come back is more appropriate. This not D,D,K is not an unusual way in which to present a

Re: [MD] First Division 2.0

2012-03-03 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Andre, I did not realize I was upsetting you! I am sorry! In my last post everything came through as though I was reposting. Computers! I do not know how you view SOM, nor your understanding of how MOQ is such a huge clarification in metaphysics. I am old and I apologize for a feeling of

Re: [MD] First Division 2.0

2012-02-29 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi David, DQ is a metaphysical term, indefinable in levels in existence, evolution. DQ is not non-existent. Behavior follows existence DQ/SQ. Emotions are DQ. The conception of a level in evolution, not the existence of the level, follows the manifestation of that level in DQ/SQ metaphysics.

Re: [MD] The dirty doors of perception?

2012-02-29 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark, Can I conceptualize will following the template provided by the intellect? How would will ever recognize such a template? A cart before the horse problem since will determines my actions while psychology describes them. Determination follows description follows reality. Evolution as

Re: [MD] Tweaking the emergence

2012-02-28 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, What are the most common approaches to experiencing reality? Touch in a spectrum from gas to liquid to solid, soft to rigid. Sight in a color spectrum from infra red to ultra violet. Sound in a scale Do RE MI_FA Sol La Ti_DO repeating at doubled intensity ad infinitum?. Imho

Re: [MD] The dirty doors of perception?

2012-02-27 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark, DQ is not non-existent in being indefinable. IMHO I experience the indefinable emotionally. Joe On 2/26/12 9:09 PM, 118 ununocti...@gmail.com wrote: Only I will ever know that I am here. To others I am just another person who could be any I. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo,

Re: [MD] The dirty doors of perception?

2012-02-26 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, The words come slower and slower as I get older. A group is defined by the definition of individuality which comes first. IMHO the individual can be said to exist beyond mathematical 1. Thing, good, true, something have meaning. There is an indefinable metaphysics beyond 1.

Re: [MD] The dirty doors of perception?

2012-02-22 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi David and All, You mention a God hypothesis and other intriguing claims, but I did not see a reference to the evolution of levels in existence to describe individuality in reality. The individual cannot have defining existence but can be defined by the existence it has. Evolution is an

Re: [MD] The dirty doors of perception?

2012-02-20 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and all, Metaphysics is a format. Physics follows the defined description of a format. Meaning in DQ/SQ follows the format where one aspect of knowledge is indefinable by individualization. In evolution 1 is not definable and mathematical logic is inadequate. In analogy and metaphor

Re: [MD] The dirty doors of perception?

2012-02-19 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark, This sentence hit my logic button, particularly the phrase Other species who must constantly be in tune with DQ. I am unclear what other species mean. Are these aliens from other planets or individuals on our own planet? I can not follow when DQ is unrelated to self awareness. I

Re: [MD] The dirty doors of perception?

2012-02-18 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi Mark and All, I am thinking of levels in evolution. Pirsig's metaphysics of Quality DQ/SQ proposes that one level DQ is indefinable. The other level SQ is definable and limited since unlimited is indefinable. Oddly enough as I ponder this I expect that SQ is a higher level than DQ since it

Re: [MD] Metaphysics and the mystic.

2012-02-15 Thread Joseph Maurer
for your opinion. I simply had no reply. Mostly because I did not understand it. Cheers, Mark On 2/13/12, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net wrote: Hi Mark, Kid gloves? I come from a family with 14 children and differences became acceptable after enough squabbling. Joe On 2/12/12

Re: [MD] Metaphysics and the mystic.

2012-02-13 Thread Joseph Maurer
Hi MarshaV and all, Imho Language is in turmoil. MOQ metaphysics defining reality is under discussion. My view is that evolution cannot be conceptualized as SOM creation. MOQ views evolution in terms of DQ/SQ structuring reality in existence. For example in metaphysics the word QUALITY

Re: [MD] Metaphysics and the mystic.

2012-02-13 Thread Joseph Maurer
confess, I have no idea what you are talking about, but it sounds interesting. Type away, I am listening. I know that my wife is my better half. Mark On Sat, Feb 11, 2012 at 1:58 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net wrote: Hi Mark and all, I do not know how you view sexual differences

Re: [MD] Metaphysics and the mystic.

2012-02-12 Thread Joseph Maurer
about, but it sounds interesting. Type away, I am listening. I know that my wife is my better half. Mark On Sat, Feb 11, 2012 at 1:58 PM, Joseph Maurer jh...@comcast.net wrote: Hi Mark and all, I do not know how you view sexual differences: Man/Woman.  An emphasis on differences between

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