Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition
straight back at ya on the Tone Justine. there are more than just you and yours working to enhance midwifery ( even if MC is a consumer organization not a midwifery one) . I too put in hours of unpaid work ( not tax deductible) on top of my paid midwifery work and even though I only have 4 children not 6 I'm sure you can appreciate we are all in a similar position when it comes to families. I have been involved MC and have been involved through infosheets as I'm sure you well know. However you seem to be under the impression that no questioning on this subject is allowed I am also well aware of your tract record Justine and you are making this unnecessarily personal I wasn't for one minute questioning anyone's integrity. I was under the impression that the quote was written by someone active in the MC of course I could be wrong I wouldn't embarrass them any further even if they were. If we all work together we can effectively lobby for systemic change whilst we support and empower women through individual advocacy. I agree, all of us doing what we believe to be the right thing. Lisa Barrett - Original Message - From: Justine Caines [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: OzMid List ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, March 02, 2007 10:44 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition Dear All Jo and Deb, thanks for your respones. Lisa I am sorry you are unaware of what MC does. Just so you know. I have 15 years experience as an advocate and lobbyist and post graduate qualifications in the field. Advocacy and lobbying are co-dependent. In fact when MC sets up a local branch or group and engages in lobbying we must have local women who want us to advocate for them personally (or local health authorities will most often respond by saying there is no demand. In your message you said: This is something I read on a public forum about the MC, Lobbying is a pretty dispassionate job and advocacy work can get in the way of effective lobbying I would be surprised if this came from an active MCer, more likely someone who did not know or appreciate what we do. I find lobbying very challenging and advocacy essential to keep us relevant and representative. MC needs a diverse range of people to support the many facets of its work. \ Lisa for the record. I had one baby when I joined MC 7 years ago. I know have 6! I am acutely aware of the challenges of volunteer community work whilst raising a family. Unlike midwives, this is not my profession, I cannot claim tax deductions for attending conferences etc. I am seriously considering lobbying/ providing media advice for money! It would be nice to receive a supportive even if enquiring e-mail Lisa. Your tone is not welcoming to those who have given so much to the enhancement of midwifery in Australia. In solidarity Justine Caines National President Maternity Coalition Inc PO Box 625 SCONE NSW 2329 Ph: (02) 65453612 Fax: (02)65482902 Mob: 0408 210273 E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.maternitycoalition.org.au -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition
Can I just say that it would be terrible if this thread deteriorated yet again into a personal slinging match. Please can we all keep in our minds and our hearts that we are all doing what we can, with the time we have, to further the cause and help women...making comments on people's tone is not in my honest opinion called for, or constructive. A lovely friend of mine, one of the wisest women I know, has talked with me about the email thing and the problems that we as women in particular, encounter with it. Her take on it, and I agree wholeheartedly is that we must keep in mind that it was invented by blokes, and that it has no ability to convey the subtlety of emotion that we often use to soften or round off our comments. Its purpose initially was probably for the sharing of meeting minutes, and the like. We don't talk like that, we don't communicate like that, and when we attempt to use a medium that doesn't have the features we need to put across the whole of the message, not just the words, then something within that message can be lost. Please, please, can we keep our own agendas out of this. I have been a member of birth support and information groups for nearly 10 years and for the most part, it has been smooth sailing. I still don't have a handle on what the MC really does, even though I've been a member for sometime, and our consumer groups have been members. That doesn't mean I'm not interested, or supportive. It means I'm uninformed, and I thought for a minute there, with this thread, that I might become a bit more informed. This is a public list. Christopher Cain and other presidents of the AMA would be laughing their heads off if they were aware of the bitching and internal back biting that goes on between us all. As I've said before, with us behaving like this, they have nothing to worry about. Tania x -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.5/707 - Release Date: 1/03/2007 2:43 PM -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition
Here here Tania. I don't know what is going on in other states regarding birth support groups, in whatever role or title, but maybe an explanation of what we have in SA might be helpful, in return I would love to hear about everyone else. SA has a lovely history of birth groups. Those on the list who know more than me about it, please add. We have the Homebirth Network which has been going for many many years, anyone in SA know how long? Many moons ago, we had MAMA (?), Mums and Midwives working together, I believe they successfully lobbied for a birth centre at one of our large teaching hospitals. This group is now part of our history. Name escapes me, but we have a group for our Ind Midwives too. Help on that one? CARES, a caesarean support group, established over 8 years ago by Jo, Caroline and Emma. Going strong and doing amazing work. Birth Matters, also established over 8 years ago. BM sees itself as a generic support group, they provide the information so as choice is available. Maternity Coalition, established a few years, more low key here. Our groups are well established and continue to function together as needed. When we join forces so to speak, we go under the title of The Birth Networks of SA or similar. A number of the women in these groups wear many hats, and work very hard for the cause. Always as a vounteer and nearly always with no previous experience. I too started off with 1 child, now with 4, as many of our families have grown and along the way dealt with all the wonders life offers, sad and happy. SA has become less present in the lobby arena, lack of time and burn-out. We seem to be focusing on support for now and getting out there to educate our birthing Mums and Dads. Next weekend Adelaide is hosting WOMAD, a world music festival, Birth Matters with Homebirth Network have been fortunate to secure a stall. We will have a wonderful oppurtunity to talk with thousands of people, delight them with our beautiful births and handout good information. We have been at Mothers and Baby expo a number of times, a tuff gig, to say the least. Sharing the most intimate moment of your life, only to have women loudly show there disgust at the video of a birth. Not the Grandmas or the men, but women due to birth. It's a very tiring 3 days of your life. Adelaides birth groups work independantly to and alongside each other. They say it takes a village to raise a child, well it takes many forms to educate our birthing community, AND WE ALL MATTER! SO, I look forward to reading about any birth groups out there, whatever you are called and in what ever capaticty your contribution is. A pat on the back to us all, Cheers Megan Resch Of -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tania Smallwood Sent: Saturday, 3 March 2007 8:40 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition Can I just say that it would be terrible if this thread deteriorated yet again into a personal slinging match. Please can we all keep in our minds and our hearts that we are all doing what we can, with the time we have, to further the cause and help women...making comments on people's tone is not in my honest opinion called for, or constructive. A lovely friend of mine, one of the wisest women I know, has talked with me about the email thing and the problems that we as women in particular, encounter with it. Her take on it, and I agree wholeheartedly is that we must keep in mind that it was invented by blokes, and that it has no ability to convey the subtlety of emotion that we often use to soften or round off our comments. Its purpose initially was probably for the sharing of meeting minutes, and the like. We don't talk like that, we don't communicate like that, and when we attempt to use a medium that doesn't have the features we need to put across the whole of the message, not just the words, then something within that message can be lost. Please, please, can we keep our own agendas out of this. I have been a member of birth support and information groups for nearly 10 years and for the most part, it has been smooth sailing. I still don't have a handle on what the MC really does, even though I've been a member for sometime, and our consumer groups have been members. That doesn't mean I'm not interested, or supportive. It means I'm uninformed, and I thought for a minute there, with this thread, that I might become a bit more informed. This is a public list. Christopher Cain and other presidents of the AMA would be laughing their heads off if they were aware of the bitching and internal back biting that goes on between us all. As I've said before, with us behaving like this, they have nothing to worry about. Tania x -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.5/707 - Release Date: 1/03/2007 2:43 PM -- This mailing list is sponsored
Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition
Thanks for that Megan. It was great to read what is going on in SA. WOMAD sounds like lots of fun, what great exposure! Wendy ( in Victoria) - Original Message - From: Megan Larry [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Saturday, March 03, 2007 12:25 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition Here here Tania. I don't know what is going on in other states regarding birth support groups, in whatever role or title, but maybe an explanation of what we have in SA might be helpful, in return I would love to hear about everyone else. SA has a lovely history of birth groups. Those on the list who know more than me about it, please add. We have the Homebirth Network which has been going for many many years, anyone in SA know how long? Many moons ago, we had MAMA (?), Mums and Midwives working together, I believe they successfully lobbied for a birth centre at one of our large teaching hospitals. This group is now part of our history. Name escapes me, but we have a group for our Ind Midwives too. Help on that one? CARES, a caesarean support group, established over 8 years ago by Jo, Caroline and Emma. Going strong and doing amazing work. Birth Matters, also established over 8 years ago. BM sees itself as a generic support group, they provide the information so as choice is available. Maternity Coalition, established a few years, more low key here. Our groups are well established and continue to function together as needed. When we join forces so to speak, we go under the title of The Birth Networks of SA or similar. A number of the women in these groups wear many hats, and work very hard for the cause. Always as a vounteer and nearly always with no previous experience. I too started off with 1 child, now with 4, as many of our families have grown and along the way dealt with all the wonders life offers, sad and happy. SA has become less present in the lobby arena, lack of time and burn-out. We seem to be focusing on support for now and getting out there to educate our birthing Mums and Dads. Next weekend Adelaide is hosting WOMAD, a world music festival, Birth Matters with Homebirth Network have been fortunate to secure a stall. We will have a wonderful oppurtunity to talk with thousands of people, delight them with our beautiful births and handout good information. We have been at Mothers and Baby expo a number of times, a tuff gig, to say the least. Sharing the most intimate moment of your life, only to have women loudly show there disgust at the video of a birth. Not the Grandmas or the men, but women due to birth. It's a very tiring 3 days of your life. Adelaides birth groups work independantly to and alongside each other. They say it takes a village to raise a child, well it takes many forms to educate our birthing community, AND WE ALL MATTER! SO, I look forward to reading about any birth groups out there, whatever you are called and in what ever capaticty your contribution is. A pat on the back to us all, Cheers Megan Resch Of -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tania Smallwood Sent: Saturday, 3 March 2007 8:40 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition Can I just say that it would be terrible if this thread deteriorated yet again into a personal slinging match. Please can we all keep in our minds and our hearts that we are all doing what we can, with the time we have, to further the cause and help women...making comments on people's tone is not in my honest opinion called for, or constructive. A lovely friend of mine, one of the wisest women I know, has talked with me about the email thing and the problems that we as women in particular, encounter with it. Her take on it, and I agree wholeheartedly is that we must keep in mind that it was invented by blokes, and that it has no ability to convey the subtlety of emotion that we often use to soften or round off our comments. Its purpose initially was probably for the sharing of meeting minutes, and the like. We don't talk like that, we don't communicate like that, and when we attempt to use a medium that doesn't have the features we need to put across the whole of the message, not just the words, then something within that message can be lost. Please, please, can we keep our own agendas out of this. I have been a member of birth support and information groups for nearly 10 years and for the most part, it has been smooth sailing. I still don't have a handle on what the MC really does, even though I've been a member for sometime, and our consumer groups have been members. That doesn't mean I'm not interested, or supportive. It means I'm uninformed, and I thought for a minute there, with this thread, that I might become a bit more informed. This is a public list. Christopher Cain and other presidents of the AMA
RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition
Hey Lisa, I'm a bit baffled by that quote. My dictionary states that advocacy means - 'support for people who are thought likely to be disregarded or to have difficulty in gaining attention, so that their opinion is listened to' And that lobbying means - 'a group of campaigners and representatives of particular interests who try to influence political policy on a particular issue' Essentially isn't it one in the same - advocacy being on a more personal level and lobbying being on a political level. I can't really see how you can have one without the other. You need the personal to get to the political. There would be no point in lobbying the Govt or politicians if there is no one that you are advocating for. In my limited understanding and it is limited, because I don't work for or on behalf of MC, but don't Unions and other orgs or bodies that deal with such issues do both. Whilst advocating on behalf of a group of people for a particular issue, they try to influence political policy on that particular issue. Ok, I'll stop getting off track - back to Uni work! Jo -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lisa Barrett Sent: Friday, 2 March 2007 12:56 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition The way I understand the maternity coalition are formally recognised as a lobbying goup. This is something I read on a public forum about the MC, Lobbying is a pretty dispassionate job and advocacy work can get in the way of effective lobbying Well, I know that MC did a lot of individual consumer advocacy in the early days but, realistically, MC cannot be an advocacy group and a lobby group simultaneously. Again, it's a simple issue of (wo)man power. Consider the fact that all active members are volunteers and almost all are mothers with babies and young children themselves and you'll understand that the face2face advocacy work is very time consuming and extremely stressful for an untrained individual to take on. You don't want unskilled people doing advocacy work!! Maybe it should be clearer what exactly the maternity coalition do so woman understand how it's helping them and in what capacity and we can really get it out there. Lisa Barrett From: Justine Caines [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2007 9:37 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: web sites for antenatal information Dear Carol I have just squizzed your website and notice Maternity Coalition missing. It would be useful to link MC to help women to understand that they can challenge obstetric domination (should they want to). Also helps to get it out there that there is a national maternity consumer advocacy organisation. Kind regards Justine Caines National President Maternity Coalition Inc PO Box 625 SCONE NSW 2329 Ph: (02) 65453612 Fax: (02)65482902 Mob: 0408 210273 E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.maternitycoalition.org.au - Email [EMAIL PROTECTED] to turn on/off the digest mode. Email [EMAIL PROTECTED] to turn on/off vacation mode. Email [EMAIL PROTECTED] if you need assistance or have a quesion. To unsubscribe, click on the following web page. http://cgi.mail-list.com/u?ln=ozmidwifery[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.5/706 - Release Date: 28/02/2007 4:09 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.5/706 - Release Date: 28/02/2007 4:09 PM -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition
Like a said Jo, It's something I read and I wondered what it meant in terms of women. I suppose the difference between the two definitions to me is that one is directly involved with the women on a individual basis to get their opinion noted and their needs addressed. and the other is involved with changing political policy but doesn't involve individuals and their difficulties but is trying over all to change for the common good. I was just asking. Can a woman come to the MC one an individual basis and get help from to address her individual difficulties with the system. Which is what consumer advocacy implies to me. Or is it you take each case and put them together to lobby public opinion and government for change which is totally different. Or is it both. I field calls from many people with problems in the system looking for help. I do give strategies and advice but some woman aren't able to get what they want alone it would be nice to know that I could refer them on to a group that could get involved. Often they don't actually want an independent midwife but just general help. Although I do the best I can I'm one person. I didn't think the maternity coalition did that sort of thing. If they do I'll start suggesting women get in touch. Lisa Barrett -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition
Lisa, a woman on BB had a terrible time with a nasty Ob, I put her in touch with MC. She joined as a member (so she could be represented) and her case was dealt with by the MC. I am not sure whats happened since but he's had complaints against him before. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lisa Barrett Sent: Friday, March 02, 2007 8:13 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition Like a said Jo, It's something I read and I wondered what it meant in terms of women. I suppose the difference between the two definitions to me is that one is directly involved with the women on a individual basis to get their opinion noted and their needs addressed. and the other is involved with changing political policy but doesn't involve individuals and their difficulties but is trying over all to change for the common good. I was just asking. Can a woman come to the MC one an individual basis and get help from to address her individual difficulties with the system. Which is what consumer advocacy implies to me. Or is it you take each case and put them together to lobby public opinion and government for change which is totally different. Or is it both. I field calls from many people with problems in the system looking for help. I do give strategies and advice but some woman aren't able to get what they want alone it would be nice to know that I could refer them on to a group that could get involved. Often they don't actually want an independent midwife but just general help. Although I do the best I can I'm one person. I didn't think the maternity coalition did that sort of thing. If they do I'll start suggesting women get in touch. Lisa Barrett -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition
What do I do as an MC member (actually WA State President, but that's by-the-by)? Well, for starters, I do the following (and more besides): I help out individual women with questions about maternity care in WA. Perhaps they want to know where they can get a waterbirth (answer: virtually nowhere in WA public hospitals), so I can tell them what the situation is. I can point them in the right directions to independent midwives, support groups etc. I sit on a number of committees: the Community Midwifery Programme Steering Committee, the Exec Committee of the WA Branch of ACM, and a Working Party for implementing a BMid at a local university. I recently was part of a workshop canvassing comment on the new draft consultation document on maternity services (Future Directions) and submitted a written submission on the same document. I also met with Dept of Health personnel on the same subject. I keep an eye on local and national newspapers and write comments where I believe maternity services (and midwifery-led care in particular) need a balanced comment. Yes - I do lobby (sometimes), and I do advocate (sometimes), and a whole load of things beside. I may march on parliament if needs be, and we do meet regularly with MP's. What I do, do is to try and represent the women and men who come to me, and call for midwifery-led care as the normal/default model for maternity services. Maternity Coalition also provides prenatal information sessions Choices for Childbirth, although not in WA. MC is much more than a lobbying organization (or an advocacy service). We represent consumers and are an umbrella organization for local groups. For those of you who know the National Childbirth Trust in the UK, there are many similarities between MC and the NCT in their fledgling years MC are always looking for people to support their work - why not join? Oh - by the way - I'm the national membership secretary so all you need to do is contact me :-) Debbie Slater Perth, Wa -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lisa Barrett Sent: Friday, 2 March 2007 6:13 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Maternity coalition Like a said Jo, It's something I read and I wondered what it meant in terms of women. I suppose the difference between the two definitions to me is that one is directly involved with the women on a individual basis to get their opinion noted and their needs addressed. and the other is involved with changing political policy but doesn't involve individuals and their difficulties but is trying over all to change for the common good. I was just asking. Can a woman come to the MC one an individual basis and get help from to address her individual difficulties with the system. Which is what consumer advocacy implies to me. Or is it you take each case and put them together to lobby public opinion and government for change which is totally different. Or is it both. I field calls from many people with problems in the system looking for help. I do give strategies and advice but some woman aren't able to get what they want alone it would be nice to know that I could refer them on to a group that could get involved. Often they don't actually want an independent midwife but just general help. Although I do the best I can I'm one person. I didn't think the maternity coalition did that sort of thing. If they do I'll start suggesting women get in touch. Lisa Barrett -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
[ozmidwifery] Re:
Hi Belinda, you poor thing! I'm not sure if you use essential oils (I'm a bit of a oil queen). But you could try clove, thyme, oregano, tea tree, melaleuca ericifolia, manuka, cassia cinnamon bark. If you get them through young living essential oils they have some blends call purification, melrose, exodusII and Theives. Dilute 50-50 and apply 2-3 drops on the boils 3-6 times daily. You sound like you could be a bit run down too, i'd recommend seeing a naturopath and also taking some acidophils (?sp) after the antibiotics. I never realized you had another baby...congratulations!! Love, Rachael - Original Message - From: Belinda Pound To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2007 4:51 PM Just wondering if anyone has any ideas on treating boils. Started about 18/40 (second pregnancy..none with first). Glucose at 28/40 fine. Drs said it was due to pregnancy. Had several courses of oral ab's, two treatments of bactroban nasally. (partner and 2yo daughter also treated with nasal ab at this time). Bath in detol/phisohex. Baby now 11 weeks, breastfeeding, and I currently have four boils. All have been on the right hand side of body. Take pregnancy and breastfeeding vitamin daily. (have had 15-20 in past 6 months.and don't want yet another dose of ab's) Any suggestions on experience/treatment greatly appreciated. Thanks Belinda __ NOD32 1.1725 (20060825) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com
[ozmidwifery] RE:
Hi Belinda, My daughter had recurrent boils for approximately 2 years and we tried all the treatments you have mentioned: salt baths, vitamin supplements and antibiotics (even though I hate them and believe they are overused) etc ... etc ... I spoke with a naturopath and she said it tended to be a depressed immune system. So I decided to try to improve her diet as my daughter has always been a fussy eater. I started giving her a punnet of strawberries and a punnet of cherry tomatoes every week and she hasnt had a boil since!! It would seem that the extra vitamin C has boosted her immune system sufficiently. So ... its worth a try and tastes alot better than antibiotics without the side-effects!! All the best, Leanne. Leanne Wynne Midwife in charge of Women's Business Mildura Aboriginal Health Service Mob 0418 371862 From: Belinda Pound [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:51:11 +1000 Just wondering if anyone has any ideas on treating boils. Started about 18/40 (second pregnancy..none with first). Glucose at 28/40 fine. Drs said it was due to pregnancy. Had several courses of oral ab's, two treatments of bactroban nasally. (partner and 2yo daughter also treated with nasal ab at this time). Bath in detol/phisohex. Baby now 11 weeks, breastfeeding, and I currently have four boils. All have been on the right hand side of body. Take pregnancy and breastfeeding vitamin daily. (have had 15-20 in past 6 months.and don't want yet another dose of ab's) Any suggestions on experience/treatment greatly appreciated. Thanks Belinda _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t=757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
Boils are a balant sign the immune system is struggling and given over 80% of the immune system pivots on the bacterial populations in the git - no wonder AB arent helping - they often worsen the situation. Yes, see a good naturoapth and you'll get it sorted. Vit C, zinc, bioflavonoids, betacarotene, and probiotics are all a great start. Kristin (Naturopath CBE) From: "leanne wynne" [EMAIL PROTECTED]Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: [ozmidwifery] RE:Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 09:08:12 +1100Hi Belinda,My daughter had recurrent boils for approximately 2 years and we tried all the treatments you have mentioned: salt baths, vitamin supplements and antibiotics (even though I hate them and believe they are overused) etc ... etc ...I spoke with a naturopath and she said it tended to be a depressed immune system. So I decided to try to improve her diet as my daughter has always been a fussy eater. I started giving her a punnet of strawberries and a punnet of cherry tomatoes every week and she hasnt had a boil since!! It would seem that the extra vitamin C has boosted her immune system sufficiently.So ... its worth a try and tastes alot better than antibiotics without the side-effects!!All the best,Leanne.Leanne WynneMidwife in charge of "Women's Business"Mildura Aboriginal Health Service Mob 0418 371862From: "Belinda Pound" [EMAIL PROTECTED]Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auDate: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:51:11 +1000Just wondering if anyone has any ideas on treating boils. Started about18/40 (second pregnancy..none with first). Glucose at 28/40 fine. Drs saidit was due to pregnancy. Had several courses of oral ab's, two treatmentsof bactroban nasally. (partner and 2yo daughter also treated with nasal abat this time). Bath in detol/phisohex. Baby now 11 weeks, breastfeeding,and I currently have four boils. All have been on the right hand side ofbody. Take pregnancy and breastfeeding vitamin daily. (have had 15-20 inpast 6 months.and don't want yet another dose of ab's) Any suggestions onexperience/treatment greatly appreciated. Thanks Belinda_Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL="">--This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.Advertisement: Amazing holiday rentals? -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: reflux
I've had two very unsettled babies. One was diagnosed with rel\flux, then a behaviour problem,( at seven months!) and then lactose intolerance. vomiting and diarrhoea. We finally took him to a chiropractor at nine months who manipulated his neck, and he was a different baby. My last little person was so miserable, unsettled and yucky. I was house bound for months because she wouldn't settle and going out was a trial. Again vomiting but this one was constipated. She grew into a whingy, whiney toddler, temper tantrums, always into everything. She was slow with speech and understanding, but her physical skills were excellent. I actually went back to work to get away from her. I finally sought help when she was four. She's allergic to cow milk protein and vanilla. Five years later we are still battling, but it is much better. We think part of her behaviour was due to cerebral irritation related to the allergies. Babies 1 and 3 were lovely little people, normal. Babies cry for many reasons, not always oblivious, one needs to 'think outside the square' and be flexible in thinking. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Alesa Koziol Sent: Saturday, 3 February 2007 5:28 PM To: ozmidwifery Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: reflux Not wishing to simplify this discussion but I found this somewhere, years ago and it took my fancy, (don't know if it is a genuine quote, but if it is..) it suggests that colic and its associated parental concerns have been with us for a very long time! Peine in the belly is a common disease of children . The childe cannot rest but cryeth and fretteth itself Moreover the noyse and rumbling in the guttes, hither and thider, declareth the childe to be greved, with wynde in the belly, and colyke . Thomas Phaires Boke of Chyldren, 1545 Cheers Alesa
[ozmidwifery] RE: reflux
Not wishing to simplify this discussion but I found this somewhere, years ago and it took my fancy, (don't know if it is a genuine quote, but if it is..) it suggests that colic and its associated parental concerns have been with us for a very long time! ..Peine in the belly is a common disease of children The childe cannot rest but cryeth and fretteth itself Moreover the noyse and rumbling in the guttes, hither and thider, declareth the childe to be greved, with wynde in the belly, and colyke... Thomas Phaire's Boke of Chyldren, 1545 Cheers Alesa
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
Alan is it ok if I contact you off list to give you the contact details of this woman in Ararat??? My email address is [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cheers Amanda. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:31:00 +1100 I would be available Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 21:25 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: October Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:38:14 +1100 I'm on my way down to VIC in the next couple of weeks. When do you need someone for? Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 17:28 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all, Am looking for a midwife/doula that will visit Ararat. Can anyone help??? Cheers Amanda. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_ t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t=757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
[ozmidwifery] RE:
I'm on my way down to VIC in the next couple of weeks. When do you need someone for? Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 17:28 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all, Am looking for a midwife/doula that will visit Ararat. Can anyone help??? Cheers Amanda. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Re:
Yea I saw it. Let's do it ... Helen - Original Message - From: Ping Bullock [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 6:46 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: - Original Message - From: Amanda W [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 4:27 PM Hi all, Am looking for a midwife/doula that will visit Ararat. Can anyone help??? Cheers Amanda. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. __ NOD32 2013 (20070127) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
October Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:38:14 +1100 I'm on my way down to VIC in the next couple of weeks. When do you need someone for? Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 17:28 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all, Am looking for a midwife/doula that will visit Ararat. Can anyone help??? Cheers Amanda. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t=757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
I would be available Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 21:25 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: October Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:38:14 +1100 I'm on my way down to VIC in the next couple of weeks. When do you need someone for? Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 17:28 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all, Am looking for a midwife/doula that will visit Ararat. Can anyone help??? Cheers Amanda. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_ t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
Amanda, can I contact you off-list? Cheers, Melissa. Melissa Maimann m: 0400 418 448 Essential Birth Consulting -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday 28 January 2007 21:25 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: October Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:38:14 +1100 I'm on my way down to VIC in the next couple of weeks. When do you need someone for? Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 17:28 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all, Am looking for a midwife/doula that will visit Ararat. Can anyone help??? Cheers Amanda. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_ t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
Sure Melissa my email address is [EMAIL PROTECTED] Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Melissa [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:35:24 +1100 Amanda, can I contact you off-list? Cheers, Melissa. Melissa Maimann m: 0400 418 448 Essential Birth Consulting -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday 28 January 2007 21:25 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: October Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:38:14 +1100 I'm on my way down to VIC in the next couple of weeks. When do you need someone for? Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 17:28 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all, Am looking for a midwife/doula that will visit Ararat. Can anyone help??? Cheers Amanda. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_ t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t=757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
As a midwife or a doula?? Thanks so much. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:31:00 +1100 I would be available Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 21:25 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: October Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:38:14 +1100 I'm on my way down to VIC in the next couple of weeks. When do you need someone for? Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 17:28 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all, Am looking for a midwife/doula that will visit Ararat. Can anyone help??? Cheers Amanda. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_ t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: It's simple! Sell your car for just $20 at carsales.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fsecure%2Dau%2Eimrworldwide%2Ecom%2Fcgi%2Dbin%2Fa%2Fci%5F450304%2Fet%5F2%2Fcg%5F801577%2Fpi%5F1005244%2Fai%5F838588_t=757768878_r=endtext_simple_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
Midwife Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Monday, 29 January 2007 08:38 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: As a midwife or a doula?? Thanks so much. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:31:00 +1100 I would be available Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 21:25 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: October Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:38:14 +1100 I'm on my way down to VIC in the next couple of weeks. When do you need someone for? Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 17:28 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all, Am looking for a midwife/doula that will visit Ararat. Can anyone help??? Cheers Amanda. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_ t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_ t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: It's simple! Sell your car for just $20 at carsales.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fsecure%2Dau%2Eimrworldwide%2 Ecom%2Fcgi%2Dbin%2Fa%2Fci%5F450304%2Fet%5F2%2Fcg%5F801577%2Fpi%5F1005244%2Fa i%5F838588_t=757768878_r=endtext_simple_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
Alan hangs out on BB (and has for a long time now!), he's very cool :) We keep joking that he'll have to be the official BB midwife as everyone wants him to live in their town, so he'll have to be the BB mobile midwife!!! Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Conception, Pregnancy, Birth and Baby BellyBelly Birth Support -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Alan Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 9:34 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Midwife Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Monday, 29 January 2007 08:38 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: As a midwife or a doula?? Thanks so much. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:31:00 +1100 I would be available Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 21:25 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: October Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Alan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:38:14 +1100 I'm on my way down to VIC in the next couple of weeks. When do you need someone for? Alan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Sunday, 28 January 2007 17:28 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all, Am looking for a midwife/doula that will visit Ararat. Can anyone help??? Cheers Amanda. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_ t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_ t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ Advertisement: It's simple! Sell your car for just $20 at carsales.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fsecure%2Dau%2Eimrworldwide%2 Ecom%2Fcgi%2Dbin%2Fa%2Fci%5F450304%2Fet%5F2%2Fcg%5F801577%2Fpi%5F1005244%2Fa i%5F838588_t=757768878_r=endtext_simple_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
[ozmidwifery] Re:
- Original Message - From: Amanda W [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 4:27 PM Hi all, Am looking for a midwife/doula that will visit Ararat. Can anyone help??? Cheers Amanda. Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] re co-sleeping
My oldest grandson is so used to co-sleeping that, when he was about 5 or 6 and we were discussing sleeping arrangements (must have been staying at my place or something) he thought that his stepfather could sleep with me in my bed! I don't think so!! Joy Joy Cocks RN (Div 1) RM IBCLC BRIGHT Vic 3741 email:[EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: nunyara [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 14:40 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] re co-sleeping Hi all! Just a word on the co-sleeping issue. Was told not to when I had my first child who is now 30 but tiredness won me over in the first couple of weeks so into the bed she came. Same thing happened with second child 12 months later. On and off they co-slept and, even now, when visiting and staying over (although they only live 5 minutes away), they jump at the chance to sleep in bed with Mum when Dad is away working. My grandson always sleeps with me when he stays as does my almost 4 year old grand daughter. My youngest daughter also co-sleeps with her children. Never any problems other than the occasional falling out of bed but the mattress on the floor does the trick there! Cheers Ramona -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Cheryl LHK Sent: Monday, 22 January 2007 5:55 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] re co-sleeping Yes! So true. As a permanent P/T night-duty person, I hear the don't want to get him/her into a bad habit far too often. I find by night 2/3 they are so tired, they think that co-sleeping is a possibility and I encourage them fully! Mine still manage to find their way into our bed, and the youngest little possum is 4!! But at least they don't wander in until 4-5am now. Cheryl From: Ken Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] re co-sleeping Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 18:27:17 +1100 It's not necessarily the midwives preventing co-sleeping. I often hear 'the baby's been awake all night. Would go to sleep and wake up as soon as I put him down.' When suggestions are made to co-sleep, they don't want to start bad habits. a lot of women are influenced by their mothers, partners etc, who don't approve of co-sleeping., thank God the influence on breast feeding isn't quite as strong as it used to be. It's strange, these little ones are expected to sleep on a hard, cold surface after been snuggled up listening to mum for months. If I remember right a co-sleeping policy was short and sweet. Mum had to be sedative free, the bedside up and bed as low as possible. Ken Maureen Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] winmail.dat _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] re co-sleeping
Hi all! Just a word on the co-sleeping issue. Was told not to when I had my first child who is now 30 but tiredness won me over in the first couple of weeks so into the bed she came. Same thing happened with second child 12 months later. On and off they co-slept and, even now, when visiting and staying over (although they only live 5 minutes away), they jump at the chance to sleep in bed with Mum when Dad is away working. My grandson always sleeps with me when he stays as does my almost 4 year old grand daughter. My youngest daughter also co-sleeps with her children. Never any problems other than the occasional falling out of bed but the mattress on the floor does the trick there! Cheers Ramona -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Cheryl LHK Sent: Monday, 22 January 2007 5:55 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] re co-sleeping Yes! So true. As a permanent P/T night-duty person, I hear the don't want to get him/her into a bad habit far too often. I find by night 2/3 they are so tired, they think that co-sleeping is a possibility and I encourage them fully! Mine still manage to find their way into our bed, and the youngest little possum is 4!! But at least they don't wander in until 4-5am now. Cheryl From: Ken Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] re co-sleeping Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 18:27:17 +1100 It's not necessarily the midwives preventing co-sleeping. I often hear 'the baby's been awake all night. Would go to sleep and wake up as soon as I put him down.' When suggestions are made to co-sleep, they don't want to start bad habits. a lot of women are influenced by their mothers, partners etc, who don't approve of co-sleeping., thank God the influence on breast feeding isn't quite as strong as it used to be. It's strange, these little ones are expected to sleep on a hard, cold surface after been snuggled up listening to mum for months. If I remember right a co-sleeping policy was short and sweet. Mum had to be sedative free, the bedside up and bed as low as possible. Ken Maureen Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] winmail.dat _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t =757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
[ozmidwifery] re co-sleeping
It's not necessarily the midwives preventing co-sleeping. I often hear 'the baby's been awake all night. Would go to sleep and wake up as soon as I put him down.' When suggestions are made to co-sleep, they don't want to start bad habits. a lot of women are influenced by their mothers, partners etc, who don't approve of co-sleeping., thank God the influence on breast feeding isn't quite as strong as it used to be. It's strange, these little ones are expected to sleep on a hard, cold surface after been snuggled up listening to mum for months. If I remember right a co-sleeping policy was short and sweet. Mum had to be sedative free, the bedside up and bed as low as possible. Ken Maureen Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] attachment: winmail.dat
RE: [ozmidwifery] re co-sleeping
Yes! So true. As a permanent P/T night-duty person, I hear the don't want to get him/her into a bad habit far too often. I find by night 2/3 they are so tired, they think that co-sleeping is a possibility and I encourage them fully! Mine still manage to find their way into our bed, and the youngest little possum is 4!! But at least they don't wander in until 4-5am now. Cheryl From: Ken Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] re co-sleeping Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 18:27:17 +1100 It's not necessarily the midwives preventing co-sleeping. I often hear 'the baby's been awake all night. Would go to sleep and wake up as soon as I put him down.' When suggestions are made to co-sleep, they don't want to start bad habits. a lot of women are influenced by their mothers, partners etc, who don't approve of co-sleeping., thank God the influence on breast feeding isn't quite as strong as it used to be. It's strange, these little ones are expected to sleep on a hard, cold surface after been snuggled up listening to mum for months. If I remember right a co-sleeping policy was short and sweet. Mum had to be sedative free, the bedside up and bed as low as possible. Ken Maureen Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] winmail.dat _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau_t=757263760_r=Hotmail_EndText_Dec06_m=EXT -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
[ozmidwifery] Re: [C-Aware] (no subject)
Oh dear, look at the subliminal message in this photo. The baby bottle feeding and held remotely frm the mother's body, sigh. Doesn't that show the source of the disconnection so rampant in our society sadly, Carolyn - Original Message - From: Helen and Graham To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; ozmidwifery ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, December 23, 2006 10:46 PM Subject: [C-Aware] (no subject) http://seven.com.au/todaytonight/story/?id=30477 Caesareans and circumcisions REPORTER: Jackie Quist BROADCAST DATE: December 19, 2006 Researchers are looking again at whether circumcision can reduce the spread of AIDS, and whether caesarean section births create extra risks. Two of the most emotive and contentious medical issues affecting most Australian families are caesarean births and whether to circumcise boys. Now experts say new research may change the way we think about both. National spokesperson for the Caesarean Awareness Network, Cas McCulloch, says up to 29 per cent of Australia's childbirths are now caesarean sections. It is an increasing rate that suggests Australia is on the way to having one-in-three babies entering the world in an operating theatre. Of course, some caesareans are a medical necessity. Some are the mother's choice and others are recommended by the treating doctor. Anecdotally, we hear stories that actually confirm that that is the case, Ms McCulloch said. We know that litigation plays a really important role in doctors' decisions to prefer caesareans. We also know that a lot of doctors think caesareans are safer. After two natural births, Karen Hindle was told she had placenta previa. There was no option but to have baby Sarah by caesarean. It worked out really well as far as the child was concerned, but for me, I was very sick for about two/two and a half months, Karen said. ADVERTISEMENT Karen can't understand why anyone would elect to have a caesarean. I could barely stand for the first six weeks, she said. I could only stand at five minute intervals and then I was on the couch, or on the bed, for the rest of the time. It would take me a bit to psych myself up for the shower, so it was a bit horrific. Ms McCulloch claimed there were other possible downsides to caesareans. There's a longer stay in hospital, there's a risk of respiratory distress for the baby, there's a higher risk of breastfeeding complications, she said. There's a risk that the baby might be cut during the surgery, there's a risk that your other organs might be cut during the surgery, there's a number of risks. Severe bleeding was another risk. Studies now show that one-in-155 women needed a hysterectomy after their first caesarean birth, with the risk rising to one-in-40 after the fourth. If you have a baby boy, there's the issue of circumcision. The trend these days is not to circumcise, but Melbourne University's Dr. Roger Short said the debate needed to be re-examined. The new evidence that has come through should make everyone turn around and do a complete rethink, he said. This month, the results of a large, two year study conducted in Africa showed circumcised men almost halved their risk of contracting the HIV virus. The suggestion was this age old practice may be the most effective weapon against a scourge that now plagues some Third World countries. Karen and Keith McFarlane were among the 10 per cent of Australian parents who circumcise their sons. The procedure takes only one minute, but does carry a risk of bleeding and infection. In Australia, a child dies every five years from a botched procedure. According to Dr. George Williams from Circumcision Information Australia, it is a practice the country simply cannot justify. The ethics is, do doctors have the right to alter a penis that is normal, and by surgical means? Dr Williams said. I don't think that can be ethically justified. Disclaimer The information on yahoo7.com.au/todaytonight is made available for information purposes only, and is not intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Also, the accuracy, currency and completeness of the information is not guaranteed. The Seven Network does not accept any liability for any injury, loss or damage incurred by use of or reliance on the information. -- ___ 'The C-Aware list exists to promote discussion about caesarean birth and VBAC, and to provide space for all interested parties to take part in this discussion. The contents of emails sent through the C-Aware list are confidential and are for the sole purpose of free and frank discussion of the issues women are confronted with when approaching caesarean, or birth after caesarean. Birthrites holds no responsibility
[ozmidwifery] Re: [MCVic] Breastfeeding National Inquiry
Oops, sorry, attached was an unfinished draft of a media release for ABA. I sent it by mistake, and was kinda hoping the list would strip it. Apologies Barb -- # House of Representatives - Email alert service # Issued by: House of Representatives Liaison Projects Office, Wednesday 6 December 2006 Parliament launches new inquiry into breastfeeding Chairman of the House of Representatives Standing Committee on Health and Ageing, Alex Somlyay, today announced a new parliamentary inquiry into the health benefits of breastfeeding. Mr Somlyay said that the Committee will examine how the Australian government can take a lead role to improve the health of the population through support for breastfeeding. There is considerable evidence suggesting the health of the Australian population may be improved by increasing the rate of breastfeeding, Mr Somlyay said. The committee will be looking at the potential effects on the long term sustainability of Australia's health system. In 2001, approximately 54 per cent of babies were fully breastfed at 3 months of age or less, compared with around 32 per cent of infants by 6 months of age or less. Rates of breastfeeding vary between different population groups. It is worth noting that there is anecdotal evidence that new mothers are not being closely supported or greatly encouraged to persist with breastfeeding, Mr Somlyay said. The public perception is that breastfeeding is not necessarily accepted as the most desirable way of nourishing young babies or preventing long term health problems. The Committee invites public submissions by 28 February 2007 on: How the Commonwealth government can take a lead role to improve the health of the Australian population through support for breastfeeding, with particular consideration to: · The extent of the health benefits of breastfeeding; · Evaluate the impact of marketing of breast milk substitutes on breastfeeding rates and, in particular, in disadvantaged, Indigenous and remote communities; · The potential short and long term impact on the health of Australians of increasing the rate of breastfeeding; · Initiatives to encourage breastfeeding; · Examine the effectiveness of current measures to promote breastfeeding; and · The impact of breastfeeding on the long term sustainability of Australia's health system. For media interview with the Chairman: Please contact the Committee Secretary on 02 6277 4145. For a copy of the terms of reference and further information on making a submission: contact the Committee secretariat on (02) 6277 4145 or email [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit the website at www.aph.gov.au/house/committee/haa Issued by: Andrew Dawson, media adviser, Liaison Projects Office, House of Representatives Tel: (02) 6277 2063 wk, 0401 143 724 mob. Have you got About the House magazine yet? Visit: http://www.aph.gov.au/house/news/ To unsubscribe from the House of Representatives email alert service, please send an email with unsubscribe from email alert service in the header to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __._,_.___ Messages in this topic (1) Reply (via web post) | Start a new topic Messages | Files | Photos | Links | Database | Polls | Members | Calendar Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch format to Traditional Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe Visit Your Group . __,_._,___
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk
Title: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk Very interesting, thank you! Vedrana From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Justine Caines Sent: Sunday, October 15, 2006 4:18 AM To: OzMid List Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk Dear All Further to our discussion on risk The Australian bureau of Statistics has a Mortality Atlas It is not available free but below is a snapshot Compare this with the Australian Mortality data for childbirth (1997-99) Yes that is the latest data. As usual they sit on this report (quite telling as to the importance of birthing women) The 19971999maternal mortality ratio (MMR) was 8.2deaths per 10confinements, compared with 9.1per 10in 19941996. JC Mortality Atlas from the ABS Age Standardised Death Rates (average 1997-2000) Cause Males (deaths per 100,000 persons) Females (deaths per 100,000 persons) Malignant Neoplasms 237.8 146.7 Ischaemic Heart Disease 190.0 119.9 Cerebrovascular diseases 65.8 65.8 Chronic lower respiratory diseases 46.6 23.2 Diabetes mellitus 18.8 13.6 Influenza and pneumonia 13.4 11.4 Accidents 35.6 17.7 Motor vehicle traffic accidents 13.1 5.5 Intentional self harm (suicide) 21.9 5.5 Organic, including symptomatic, mental disorders (includes dementia) 9.3 10.8
Re: [ozmidwifery] re: goodbyes
well said Tania, I have been trying to think about all of this and what to say but am a bit fragile due to a difficult birth this week...talk about the politics and consequences of blood gases int hospital system for a baby transferred in! I would have Lisa's straight talking and advocacy in my corner any time...I do think it is a skill that we have to acknowledge some people are better at than others...I am not great on the in your face stuff, I wish I was, I am not good at confrontation and I really wish i was... I do what I believe I need to do and refuse to do what I don't think is needed but i take the stress with me and I find the fights eat up my energy which is definitely flagging Lisa reminds me that we need to support and embrace and argue and challenge - not to be afraid of our individuality or difference, I wish I had her energy and ability to speak out regardless of how we would see things I am a glass half full kinda person, I try to be anyway, if unsure assume the positive aspect rather than negative so that what is a debate does not get seen as personal, I often see people getting upset and am surprised because I didn't read it that way maybe we are so used to being out on a limb alone and always defending ourselves we struggle to see that difference in debate or practice or context is not a personal attack? Belinda Tania Smallwood wrote: I’d like to add to the current conversation about cord blood gases… I’ve been lurking just lately, as many of you know, I’ve had to make a difficult decision to stop practicing independently due to family commitments…and so, when the bloke I’m married to is actually here, I don’t spend as much time as I used to reading and contributing to Ozmid. Just yesterday I had a few moments to catch up, and when I read the thread on blood gases, I was sure that I’d missed some mails (perhaps I have, there seems to be a few problems with mails doubling up, or getting temporarily lost in cyberspace!). Halfway through the mails, it seemed to go from a lively and informative debate, (something that’s been missing from this list for a while IMHO) to a slinging match, with people getting upset that others are honest and up front about their views. Can I just say that I know Lisa B, and if there is a midwife who has walked in the shoes of every midwife torn between hospital policy, threat of losing her job, and what’s best for the women, it’s Lisa. She’s worked in a position of authority for over 2 years at one of Adelaide’s esteemed private hospitals, and I’m sure the conversations we’ve had about what she had to fight for there are only a small portion of what actually goes on. She’s well aware as we all are, of what a battle it can be in the system, and along with me, and all the IPM’s I know, has utter respect and admiration for those attempting to change things one birth at a time. I also see Lisa as a straight talker, and sometimes even I find it confronting to hear what she has to say, and I know her better than most on this list! But that doesn’t mean that I pack my bags and go away, I may not agree, or I might think hey, that’s a bit blunt, but I also think that she’s made me think about things that I’d otherwise just go along merrily with, and not look at in a truly critical light. I actually think that along with */everyone/* on this list, she has oodles of knowledge and skill, and heaps to contribute. I know I will never be a strong enough midwife to do what most of you do, go in every day and beat my head against that wall and hope to Goddess that a woman gets away with a good birth. But please, don’t stop contributing because it’s hard. Being a midwife is a hard road, no matter where you decide to direct your skill and passion. We’re a downtrodden minority group, with ideals about women that are not shared by most of the people in power. Refusing to keep the dialogue going is never going to be productive, all it will do is stagnate us where we are, and I think we all want midwifery and provision of evidence based maternity services to improve and become stronger in this country. That’s all from me for now, Tania x -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.4/476 - Release Date: 14/10/2006 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.4/476 - Release Date: 14/10/2006 -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] re: goodbyes
Hugs to you Belinda, call me anytime, you know where I am :) and I make a mean coffee... Tania x -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 16 October 2006 9:29 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re: goodbyes well said Tania, I have been trying to think about all of this and what to say but am a bit fragile due to a difficult birth this week...talk about the politics and consequences of blood gases int hospital system for a baby transferred in! I would have Lisa's straight talking and advocacy in my corner any time...I do think it is a skill that we have to acknowledge some people are better at than others...I am not great on the in your face stuff, I wish I was, I am not good at confrontation and I really wish i was... I do what I believe I need to do and refuse to do what I don't think is needed but i take the stress with me and I find the fights eat up my energy which is definitely flagging Lisa reminds me that we need to support and embrace and argue and challenge - not to be afraid of our individuality or difference, I wish I had her energy and ability to speak out regardless of how we would see things I am a glass half full kinda person, I try to be anyway, if unsure assume the positive aspect rather than negative so that what is a debate does not get seen as personal, I often see people getting upset and am surprised because I didn't read it that way maybe we are so used to being out on a limb alone and always defending ourselves we struggle to see that difference in debate or practice or context is not a personal attack? Belinda Tania Smallwood wrote: I’d like to add to the current conversation about cord blood gases… I’ve been lurking just lately, as many of you know, I’ve had to make a difficult decision to stop practicing independently due to family commitments…and so, when the bloke I’m married to is actually here, I don’t spend as much time as I used to reading and contributing to Ozmid. Just yesterday I had a few moments to catch up, and when I read the thread on blood gases, I was sure that I’d missed some mails (perhaps I have, there seems to be a few problems with mails doubling up, or getting temporarily lost in cyberspace!). Halfway through the mails, it seemed to go from a lively and informative debate, (something that’s been missing from this list for a while IMHO) to a slinging match, with people getting upset that others are honest and up front about their views. Can I just say that I know Lisa B, and if there is a midwife who has walked in the shoes of every midwife torn between hospital policy, threat of losing her job, and what’s best for the women, it’s Lisa. She’s worked in a position of authority for over 2 years at one of Adelaide’s esteemed private hospitals, and I’m sure the conversations we’ve had about what she had to fight for there are only a small portion of what actually goes on. She’s well aware as we all are, of what a battle it can be in the system, and along with me, and all the IPM’s I know, has utter respect and admiration for those attempting to change things one birth at a time. I also see Lisa as a straight talker, and sometimes even I find it confronting to hear what she has to say, and I know her better than most on this list! But that doesn’t mean that I pack my bags and go away, I may not agree, or I might think hey, that’s a bit blunt, but I also think that she’s made me think about things that I’d otherwise just go along merrily with, and not look at in a truly critical light. I actually think that along with */everyone/* on this list, she has oodles of knowledge and skill, and heaps to contribute. I know I will never be a strong enough midwife to do what most of you do, go in every day and beat my head against that wall and hope to Goddess that a woman gets away with a good birth. But please, don’t stop contributing because it’s hard. Being a midwife is a hard road, no matter where you decide to direct your skill and passion. We’re a downtrodden minority group, with ideals about women that are not shared by most of the people in power. Refusing to keep the dialogue going is never going to be productive, all it will do is stagnate us where we are, and I think we all want midwifery and provision of evidence based maternity services to improve and become stronger in this country. That’s all from me for now, Tania x -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.4/476 - Release Date: 14/10/2006 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.4/476 - Release Date: 14/10/2006
RE: [ozmidwifery] re: goodbyes
Title: Message Tania, The easiest way to avoid conflict is to walk away. The bravest and strongest battle everyday, unfortunately people often don't see these battles and nobody pins a medal on their chest! Unfortunately, I personally feel this, those in management positions are put there by others to keep the waters still and they do generally turn their cheeks the other way in conflict. Midwives need to be supportive of each other, respect individuality and differing views and just keep moving forward in the hope one day we will all be working in an environment that supports our work. In the hope your daughter, grand daughter will have birth space respected.In achieving our goals don't forget family, they are important for grounding us and providing the shoulders we cry on. Sorry about you having to make that choice Tania but keep your dream. Cheers Barb -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tania SmallwoodSent: Sunday, 15 October 2006 10:52 AMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: [ozmidwifery] re: goodbyes Id like to add to the current conversation about cord blood gases Ive been lurking just lately, as many of you know, Ive had to make a difficult decision to stop practicing independently due to family commitmentsand so, when the bloke Im married to is actually here, I dont spend as much time as I used to reading and contributing to Ozmid. Just yesterday I had a few moments to catch up, and when I read the thread on blood gases, I was sure that Id missed some mails (perhaps I have, there seems to be a few problems with mails doubling up, or getting temporarily lost in cyberspace!). Halfway through the mails, it seemed to go from a lively and informative debate, (something thats been missing from this list for a while IMHO) to a slinging match, with people getting upset that others are honest and up front about their views. Can I just say that I know Lisa B, and if there is a midwife who has walked in the shoes of every midwife torn between hospital policy, threat of losing her job, and whats best for the women, its Lisa. Shes worked in a position of authority for over 2 years at one of Adelaides esteemed private hospitals, and Im sure the conversations weve had about what she had to fight for there are only a small portion of what actually goes on. Shes well aware as we all are, of what a battle it can be in the system, and along with me, and all the IPMs I know, has utter respect and admiration for those attempting to change things one birth at a time. I also see Lisa as a straight talker, and sometimes even I find it confronting to hear what she has to say, and I know her better than most on this list! But that doesnt mean that I pack my bags and go away, I may not agree, or I might think hey, thats a bit blunt, but I also think that shes made me think about things that Id otherwise just go along merrily with, and not look at in a truly critical light. I actually think that along with everyone on this list, she has oodles of knowledge and skill, and heaps to contribute. I know I will never be a strong enough midwife to do what most of you do, go in every day and beat my head against that wall and hope to Goddess that a woman gets away with a good birth. But please, dont stop contributing because its hard. Being a midwife is a hard road, no matter where you decide to direct your skill and passion. Were a downtrodden minority group, with ideals about women that are not shared by most of the people in power. Refusing to keep the dialogue going is never going to be productive, all it will do is stagnate us where we are, and I think we all want midwifery and provision of evidence based maternity services to improve and become stronger in this country. Thats all from me for now, Tania x --No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.4/476 - Release Date: 14/10/2006
[ozmidwifery] re: goodbyes
Id like to add to the current conversation about cord blood gases Ive been lurking just lately, as many of you know, Ive had to make a difficult decision to stop practicing independently due to family commitmentsand so, when the bloke Im married to is actually here, I dont spend as much time as I used to reading and contributing to Ozmid. Just yesterday I had a few moments to catch up, and when I read the thread on blood gases, I was sure that Id missed some mails (perhaps I have, there seems to be a few problems with mails doubling up, or getting temporarily lost in cyberspace!). Halfway through the mails, it seemed to go from a lively and informative debate, (something thats been missing from this list for a while IMHO) to a slinging match, with people getting upset that others are honest and up front about their views. Can I just say that I know Lisa B, and if there is a midwife who has walked in the shoes of every midwife torn between hospital policy, threat of losing her job, and whats best for the women, its Lisa. Shes worked in a position of authority for over 2 years at one of Adelaides esteemed private hospitals, and Im sure the conversations weve had about what she had to fight for there are only a small portion of what actually goes on. Shes well aware as we all are, of what a battle it can be in the system, and along with me, and all the IPMs I know, has utter respect and admiration for those attempting to change things one birth at a time. I also see Lisa as a straight talker, and sometimes even I find it confronting to hear what she has to say, and I know her better than most on this list! But that doesnt mean that I pack my bags and go away, I may not agree, or I might think hey, thats a bit blunt, but I also think that shes made me think about things that Id otherwise just go along merrily with, and not look at in a truly critical light. I actually think that along with everyone on this list, she has oodles of knowledge and skill, and heaps to contribute. I know I will never be a strong enough midwife to do what most of you do, go in every day and beat my head against that wall and hope to Goddess that a woman gets away with a good birth. But please, dont stop contributing because its hard. Being a midwife is a hard road, no matter where you decide to direct your skill and passion. Were a downtrodden minority group, with ideals about women that are not shared by most of the people in power. Refusing to keep the dialogue going is never going to be productive, all it will do is stagnate us where we are, and I think we all want midwifery and provision of evidence based maternity services to improve and become stronger in this country. Thats all from me for now, Tania x -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.4/476 - Release Date: 14/10/2006
Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk
Title: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk Dear All Further to our discussion on risk The Australian bureau of Statistics has a Mortality Atlas It is not available free but below is a snapshot Compare this with the Australian Mortality data for childbirth (1997-99) Yes that is the latest data. As usual they sit on this report (quite telling as to the importance of birthing women) The 19971999 maternal mortality ratio (MMR) was 8.2 deaths per 100 000 confinements, compared with 9.1 per 100 000 in 19941996. JC Mortality Atlas from the ABS Age Standardised Death Rates (average 1997-2000) Cause Males (deaths per 100,000 persons) Females (deaths per 100,000 persons) Malignant Neoplasms 237.8 146.7 Ischaemic Heart Disease 190.0 119.9 Cerebrovascular diseases 65.8 65.8 Chronic lower respiratory diseases 46.6 23.2 Diabetes mellitus 18.8 13.6 Influenza and pneumonia 13.4 11.4 Accidents 35.6 17.7 Motor vehicle traffic accidents 13.1 5.5 Intentional self harm (suicide) 21.9 5.5 Organic, including symptomatic, mental disorders (includes dementia) 9.3 10.8
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk
Title: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk No luck with Jeff Richardson L. I found this at http://www.deh.gov.au/education/publications/epa/modules/module5.html: Risks Associated with Common Activities the annual chance of dying in a car crash if you drive the average number of kilometres is 1 in 4,000 a cyclist faces an annual risk of dying from pedalling of 1 in 30,000 smokers who commenced smoking at age 15 and smoke one pack a day face a risk of death from lung cancer of 1 in 800 lifetime risk of developing cancer in the USA is 1 in 5 the chance of developing skin cancer in Australia is (women) 1 in 33000 and (men) 1 in 2 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mary Murphy Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 7:42 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk Any chance of something more specific Justine? I cant seem to find him. MM From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Justine Caines Sent: Wednesday, 11 October 2006 9:23 PM To: OzMid List Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk Hi Vedrana and All I think you are referring to the work of Jeff Richardson from Monash University in Melbourne. Yes it is very good stuff. Interestingly I spoke to him (some time ago) and one of his colleagues from the Health research unit at Monash. He understood my links between his work and obstetrics and yet would not do anything, fearful of maintaining his funding (I despair!!). I then spoke to a female colleague at his suggestion and she attacked me for saying childbirth was essentially safe (!!!) And then all but cried about her experience (!!). This is what we come up against when lobbying politicians and decision makers. You should find Jeffs work at www.monash.edu.au and then search for him Kind regards Justine
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk
Title: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk Then there is this, along with interesting references: http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/329/7470/849 From: Vedrana Valčić Sent: Friday, October 13, 2006 4:49 PM To: 'ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au' Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk No luck with Jeff Richardson L. I found this at http://www.deh.gov.au/education/publications/epa/modules/module5.html: Risks Associated with Common Activities the annual chance of dying in a car crash if you drive the average number of kilometres is 1 in 4,000 a cyclist faces an annual risk of dying from pedalling of 1 in 30,000 smokers who commenced smoking at age 15 and smoke one pack a day face a risk of death from lung cancer of 1 in 800 lifetime risk of developing cancer in the USA is 1 in 5 the chance of developing skin cancer in Australia is (women) 1 in 33000 and (men) 1 in 2 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mary Murphy Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 7:42 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk Any chance of something more specific Justine? I cant seem to find him. MM From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Justine Caines Sent: Wednesday, 11 October 2006 9:23 PM To: OzMid List Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk Hi Vedrana and All I think you are referring to the work of Jeff Richardson from Monash University in Melbourne. Yes it is very good stuff. Interestingly I spoke to him (some time ago) and one of his colleagues from the Health research unit at Monash. He understood my links between his work and obstetrics and yet would not do anything, fearful of maintaining his funding (I despair!!). I then spoke to a female colleague at his suggestion and she attacked me for saying childbirth was essentially safe (!!!) And then all but cried about her experience (!!). This is what we come up against when lobbying politicians and decision makers. You should find Jeffs work at www.monash.edu.au and then search for him Kind regards Justine
[ozmidwifery] RE: Risk
Once again J: From: Vedrana Valčić Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 9:57 AM To: 'ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au' Subject: Risk Once I found an infosheet (I think it was on some Australian web site) with great info on relative risk. It gave a list of everyday risks (car accidents, plane accidents, thunder strike and similar things) in order for consumers to better perceive a risk of some medical procedure. I cant find it anywhere anymore, however. Does anyone know where I could find it? Vedrana
Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk
Title: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk Hi Vedrana and All I think you are referring to the work of Jeff Richardson from Monash University in Melbourne. Yes it is very good stuff. Interestingly I spoke to him (some time ago) and one of his colleagues from the Health research unit at Monash. He understood my links between his work and obstetrics and yet would not do anything, fearful of maintaining his funding (I despair!!). I then spoke to a female colleague at his suggestion and she attacked me for saying childbirth was essentially safe (!!!) And then all but cried about her experience (!!). This is what we come up against when lobbying politicians and decision makers. You should find Jeffs work at www.monash.edu.au and then search for him Kind regards Justine
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk
Title: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk Any chance of something more specific Justine? I cant seem to find him. MM From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Justine Caines Sent: Wednesday, 11 October 2006 9:23 PM To: OzMid List Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Risk Hi Vedrana and All I think you are referring to the work of Jeff Richardson from Monash University in Melbourne. Yes it is very good stuff. Interestingly I spoke to him (some time ago) and one of his colleagues from the Health research unit at Monash. He understood my links between his work and obstetrics and yet would not do anything, fearful of maintaining his funding (I despair!!). I then spoke to a female colleague at his suggestion and she attacked me for saying childbirth was essentially safe (!!!) And then all but cried about her experience (!!). This is what we come up against when lobbying politicians and decision makers. You should find Jeffs work at www.monash.edu.au and then search for him Kind regards Justine
[ozmidwifery] Re: (No subject header)
david tonkin wrote: I have just been welcomed to the list what now ok, I know logically that there must be many Dave Tonkins in the world, but I have to ask if this particular David Tonkin ever taught high school? Welcome to the list anyways, hope you have fun cheers -- Jennifairy Gillett RM Midwife in Private Practice Women’s Health Teaching Associate ITShare volunteer – Santos Project Co-ordinator ITShare SA Inc - http://itshare.org.au/ ITShare SA provides computer systems to individuals groups, created from donated hardware and opensource software -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
[ozmidwifery] Re: missing post on the list
Hi Sue, I found one of your messages in my ISP's junk filter. I released it and it came through to the list as usual. I have set the level of filtering at my ISP to the maximum (getting 200+ spam emails a day) and sometimes it picks up messages for the ozmid list. Every day I go the website for my ISP and check the quarantine area to make sure I don't miss anything genuine. I suspect that many other ozmid listers may be having problems with messages being caught up like this. I can only suggest that you all check you own ISP junk filter system (find out what this is if you don't know). Another suggestion would be to make sure that you don't copy your message for the list to others at the same time - that is, send messages only to the list. Messages to multiples people at the same time can look like spam to a filtering system. I know that I miss some messages from time to time and realise this when I see replies from someone else, quoting the original message. As I have said before, we are not censoring any of these messages and everything should go through. Why some messages miss out is anyone's guess - the internet and email is not a perfect system and in the efforts to prevent our in-boxes being totally clogged by spam, we have to pay as small price, it seems. Let's just keep going on as we are - most stuff is coming though and it is always fascinating reading! Andrea At 12:38 AM 10/10/2006, you wrote: Testing - are mails going missing again? I posted one 3 times and it has not appeared in my in box, also very few posts these past 3 days Sue -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] RE:
I agree Michelle, I too worked in a rural area prior to completing my Mid many years ago and can still remember the revelations I felt while learning Midwifery.As anRN non Midwife, I was quite ignorant of what a true Midwife's role involved. It was scarey stuff. Cheers Di M
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
Just wanted to add something here as a consumer who has spent my child bearing years fighting for one to one midwifery care to be recognized as the gold standard for most pregnant women. It is only about 2 ½ years so far but I have learnt a lot and as a doula have learnt a lot about women and birth. I still have so far to go. However, my sister is an RN and a good one but she will admit that I know more about birth in this short time I have had than she does. So would I want her to be my care provider? Good Heavens No! I dont even want her at my births she is so full of fear. What I want is a midwife whose training and experience gives me the confidence to know she is watching for anything to go wrong and that she has the trust in birth to know that I capable. I would want an RN if I were sick or if my family were, but pregnant women are not often sick (and when they are there are extra things to consider) so I would not want to be treated as such. Just my two cents. Philippa Scott Birth Buddies - Doula Assisting women and their families in the preparation towards childbirth and labour. President of Friends of the Birth Centre Townsville From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Michelle Windsor Sent: Friday, 29 September 2006 9:53 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Doing midwifery was the biggest learning curve in my life. This was despite having worked in a country hospital as an enrolled nurse and RN where you were expected to assist the midwife at births and give care to women on the ward when the midwife was with someone in labour. I had already witnessed about a hundred births, but there is no way the level of knowledge I had before doing mid compared with what I learnt in my training (and am still learning!) I totally object to RN's doing midwifery care. It is a specialised area and requires special skills. Allowing RN's to domidwifery care undervalues the role and skills of midwives. I have been working in the Northern Territory and have seen first hand the results of non-midwifery care. While recognising that many of the RN's are doing the best they can (in remote areas) there were often huge gaps in the care given. At the end of the day it is the women and their babies that suffer and this is totally unacceptable. Cheers Michelle Rene and Tiffany [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The art of midwifery existed long before the need for qualifications existedfunny how I had to do 3 years nursing training (with 6 months of antenatal/womens health training included) to become a registered nurse and have had to work as such for 12 months before I could even apply to train as a midwife. From the original post it appears that they are not suggesting the nurses birth babies, but assist in the care of the woman and the neonate - something new mothers do without the need for specialist training I personally do not object to this. From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Lisa Barrett Sent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 4:28 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Some of the best people I have worked with have been div2's. Their knowledge and understanding put some of the 'midwives' to shame. Just how much nursing care does a newborn need? Many LC's are not midwives, as are childbirth educators. Maybe we should be assisting these people to be woman wise, and not judge them on qualifications. I have no doubt that there are many people other than midwives that have vast knowledge and understanding but antenatal and postnatal care is not nursing care at all. It is specific to normal healthy women who are childbearing. If anyone can be trained to do this in just 8 days why bother with midwifery training. If we and not judging people on their qualifications some of the brilliant lay midwives out there wouldn't be persecuted and they are way more specialised than nurses. Lisa Barrett -Original Message- From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au]On Behalf Of Ganesha Rosat Sent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 8:33 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all u wonderful women! Just a quick posting in line with the current debate about maternity services within country areas and who provides services. The hospital I am currently working in has decided to address our midwife shortage but training division two nurses to work in the maternity department. These nurses have 3 days of theory, one day of orientation in óbstetric and five days of clinical experience. On completion of their modules these girls will be able to: Assist in the provision of antenatal
Re: [ozmidwifery] RE:
Some of the best people I have worked with have been div2's. Their knowledge and understanding put some of the 'midwives' to shame. Just how much nursing care does a newborn need? Many LC's are not midwives, as are childbirth educators. Maybe we should be assisting these people to be woman wise, and not judge them on qualifications. I have no doubt that there are many people other than midwives that have vast knowledge and understanding but antenatal and postnatal care is not nursing care at all. It is specific to normal healthy women who are childbearing. If anyone can be trained to do this in just 8 days why bother with midwifery training. If we and not judging people on their qualifications some of the brilliant lay midwives out there wouldn't be persecuted and they are way more specialised than nurses. Lisa Barrett -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Ganesha RosatSent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 8:33 AMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: Hi all u wonderful women! Just a quick posting in line with the current debate about maternity services within country areas and who provides services. The hospital I am currently working in has decided to address our midwife shortage but training division two nurses to work in the maternity department. These nurses have 3 days of theory, one day of orientation in óbstetric and five days of clinical experience. On completion of their modules these girls will be able to: Assist in the provision of antenatal nursing care to the client Assist in the provision of nursing care to the healthy newborn baby Discuss the establishment and maintenance of breastfeeding Assist in the evaluation of key stage of growth and development of the baby Assist in the provision of postnatal nursing care to the woman This again indicates to me the lack of understanding of the needs of women (not clients). Instead of the hospital supporting midwives and creating a working environment that encourages new midwives to come to the area, they find quick fixes that only further add to the fragmentation of care. Anyway what do u all think? And is this happening anywhere else? Cheers Ganesha
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
The art of midwifery existed long before the need for qualifications existedfunny how I had to do 3 years nursing training (with 6 months of antenatal/womens health training included) to become a registered nurse and have had to work as such for 12 months before I could even apply to train as a midwife. From the original post it appears that they are not suggesting the nurses birth babies, but assist in the care of the woman and the neonate - something new mothers do without the need for specialist training I personally do not object to this. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lisa Barrett Sent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 4:28 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Some of the best people I have worked with have been div2's. Their knowledge and understanding put some of the 'midwives' to shame. Just how much nursing care does a newborn need? Many LC's are not midwives, as are childbirth educators. Maybe we should be assisting these people to be woman wise, and not judge them on qualifications. I have no doubt that there are many people other than midwives that have vast knowledge and understanding but antenatal and postnatal care is not nursing care at all. It is specific to normal healthy women who are childbearing. If anyone can be trained to do this in just 8 days why bother with midwifery training. If we and not judging people on their qualifications some of the brilliant lay midwives out there wouldn't be persecuted and they are way more specialised than nurses. Lisa Barrett -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Ganesha Rosat Sent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 8:33 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all u wonderful women! Just a quick posting in line with the current debate about maternity services within country areas and who provides services. The hospital I am currently working in has decided to address our midwife shortage but training division two nurses to work in the maternity department. These nurses have 3 days of theory, one day of orientation in óbstetric and five days of clinical experience. On completion of their modules these girls will be able to: Assist in the provision of antenatal nursing care to the client Assist in the provision of nursing care to the healthy newborn baby Discuss the establishment and maintenance of breastfeeding Assist in the evaluation of key stage of growth and development of the baby Assist in the provision of postnatal nursing care to the woman This again indicates to me the lack of understanding of the needs of women (not clients). Instead of the hospital supporting midwives and creating a working environment that encourages new midwives to come to the area, they find quick fixes that only further add to the fragmentation of care. Anyway what do u all think? And is this happening anywhere else? Cheers Ganesha
[ozmidwifery] Re:
Yes I have heard of this and am glad that you have provided some info on exactly what the training and expectedfield of work is. Although I acknowledge that women have been caring for each other since we first started to walk on our hind legs, I do not believe that replacing a midwife in the clinical setting within a hospital environment is the appropriate way to solve the shortage. I actually consider this an insult to the skills and knowledge that Midwives have paid, financially and in spirit to gain. Midwifery is not just about birthing, support of the new mother is a vital part of our role. Alesa Alesa KoziolClinical Midwifery EducatorMelbourne - Original Message - From: Ganesha Rosat To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 8:33 AM Hi all u wonderful women! Just a quick posting in line with the current debate about maternity services within country areas and who provides services. The hospital I am currently working in has decided to address our midwife shortage but training division two nurses to work in the maternity department. These nurses have 3 days of theory, one day of orientation in óbstetric and five days of clinical experience. On completion of their modules these girls will be able to: Assist in the provision of antenatal nursing care to the client Assist in the provision of nursing care to the healthy newborn baby Discuss the establishment and maintenance of breastfeeding Assist in the evaluation of key stage of growth and development of the baby Assist in the provision of postnatal nursing care to the woman This again indicates to me the lack of understanding of the needs of women (not clients). Instead of the hospital supporting midwives and creating a working environment that encourages new midwives to come to the area, they find quick fixes that only further add to the fragmentation of care. Anyway what do u all think? And is this happening anywhere else? Cheers Ganesha
Re: [ozmidwifery] RE:
Your right the art of midwifery has existed for hundreds of years, never, however were birth attendents inexperienced in the art of birthing, they apprenticed with other expert women and learned their craft from the bottom up. If you had a heart attack and youwere critically illwould you want to be cared for by a midwife? I also disagree with you about the specialist training of mothers, you have nine months of specialist training with your body getting ready for birth and in that time you get as much information may it be from friends, relatives, books, the internet or dare I say it from your midwife to help you gain the knowledge to start your parenting job, most of the rest is learning the craft from the bottom up just like any other apprentice to make you the expert you soon become. Where exactly do you need nursing care in all that. Lisa Barrett - Original Message - From: Rene and Tiffany To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 4:30 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: The art of midwifery existed long before the need for qualifications existed funny how I had to do 3 years nursing training (with 6 months of antenatal/womens health training included) to become a registered nurse and have had to work as such for 12 months before I could even apply to train as a midwife. From the original post it appears that they are not suggesting the nurses birth babies, but assist in the care of the woman and the neonate - something new mothers do without the need for specialist training I personally do not object to this.
Re: [ozmidwifery] RE:
But the better option would be to facilitate them to become midwives rather than stick a bandaid on the problem which is a shortage of midwives. On 9/28/06, Ken Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Some of the best people I have worked with have been div2's. Their knowledge and understanding put some of the 'midwives' to shame. Just how much nursing care does a newborn need? Many LC's are not midwives, as are childbirth educators. Maybe we should be assisting these people to be woman wise, and not judge them on qualifications. -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Ganesha RosatSent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 8:33 AMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: Hi all u wonderful women! Just a quick posting in line with the current debate about maternity services within country areas and who provides services. The hospital I am currently working in has decided to address our midwife shortage but training division two nurses to work in the maternity department. These nurses have 3 days of theory, one day of orientation in óbstetric' and five days of clinical experience. On completion of their modules these girls will be able to: Assist in the provision of antenatal nursing care to the client Assist in the provision of nursing care to the healthy newborn baby Discuss the establishment and maintenance of breastfeeding Assist in the evaluation of key stage of growth and development of the baby Assist in the provision of postnatal nursing care to the woman This again indicates to me the lack of understanding of the needs of women (not clients). Instead of the hospital supporting midwives and creating a working environment that encourages new midwives to come to the area, they find quick fixes that only further add to the fragmentation of care. Anyway what do u all think? And is this happening anywhere else? Cheers Ganesha -- My photos online @ http://community.webshots.com/user/mike1962nzMy Group online @ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PSP_for_PhotographersNew Photo site@Mike - http://mikelinz.dotphoto.comLindsay - Http://likeminz.dotphoto.com Life is a sexually transmitted condition with 100% mortality and birth is as safe as it gets. Unknown
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
Doing midwifery was the biggest learning curve in my life. This was despite having worked in a country hospital as an enrolled nurse and RN where you were expected to assist the midwife at births and give care to women on the ward when the midwife was with someone in labour. I had already witnessed about a hundred births, but there is no way the level of knowledge I had before doing mid compared with what I learnt in my training (and am still learning!) I totally object to RN's doing midwifery care. It is a specialised area and requires special skills. Allowing RN's to domidwifery care undervalues the role and skills of midwives. I have been working in the Northern Territory and have seen first hand the results of non-midwifery care. While recognising that many of the RN's are doing the best they can (in remote areas) there were often huge gaps in the care given. At the end of the day it is the women and their babies that suffer and this is totally unacceptable.Cheers MichelleRene and Tiffany [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:The art of midwifery existed long before the need for qualifications existed funny how I had to do 3 years nursing training (with 6 months of antenatal/womens health training included) to become a registered nurse and have had to work as such for 12 months before I could even apply to train as a midwife. From the original post it appears that they are not suggesting the nurses birth babies, but assist in the care of the woman and the neonate - something new mothers do without the need for specialist training I personally do not object to this. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lisa BarrettSent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 4:28 PMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Some of the best people I have worked with have been div2's. Their knowledge and understanding put some of the 'midwives' to shame. Just how much nursing care does a newborn need? Many LC's are not midwives, as are childbirth educators. Maybe we should be assisting these people to be woman wise, and not judge them on qualifications. I have no doubt that there are many people other than midwives that have vast knowledge and understanding but antenatal and postnatal care is not nursing care at all. It is specific to normal healthy women who are childbearing. If anyone can be trained to do this in just 8 days why bother with midwifery training. If we and not judging people on their qualifications some of the brilliant lay midwives out there wouldn't be persecuted and they are way more specialised than nurses.Lisa Barrett-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Ganesha RosatSent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 8:33 AMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: Hi all u wonderful women!Just a quick posting in line with the current debate about maternity services within country areas and who provides services. The hospital I am currently working in has decided to address our midwife shortage but training division two nurses to work in the maternity department. These nurses have 3 days of theory, one day of orientation in óbstetric and five days of clinical experience. On completion of their modules these girls will be able to: Assist in the provision of antenatal nursing care to the client Assist in the provision of nursing care to the healthy newborn baby Discuss the establishment and maintenance of breastfeeding Assist in the evaluation of key stage of growth and development of the baby Assist in the provision of postnatal nursing care to the womanThis again indicates to me the lack of understanding of the needs of women (not clients). Instead of the hospital supporting midwives and creating a working environment that encourages new midwives to come to the area, they find quick fixes that only further add to the fragmentation of care.Anyway what do u all think? And is this happening anywhere else?Cheers Ganesha On Yahoo!7 K-Zone Magazine: Check out the new look
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
Doing midwifery was the biggest learning curve in my life. This was despite having worked in a country hospital as an enrolled nurse and RN where you were expected to assist the midwife at births and give care to women on the ward when the midwife was with someone in labour. I had already witnessed about a hundred births, but there is no way the level of knowledge I had before doing mid compared with what I learnt in my training (and am still learning!) I totally object to RN's doing midwifery care. It is a specialised area and requires special skills. Allowing RN's to domidwifery care undervalues the role and skills of midwives. I have been working in the Northern Territory and have seen first hand the results of non-midwifery care. While recognising that many of the RN's are doing the best they can (in remote areas) there were often huge gaps in the care given. At the end of the day it is the women and their babies that suffer and this is totally unacceptable.Cheers MichelleRene and Tiffany [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:The art of midwifery existed long before the need for qualifications existed funny how I had to do 3 years nursing training (with 6 months of antenatal/womens health training included) to become a registered nurse and have had to work as such for 12 months before I could even apply to train as a midwife. From the original post it appears that they are not suggesting the nurses birth babies, but assist in the care of the woman and the neonate - something new mothers do without the need for specialist training I personally do not object to this. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lisa BarrettSent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 4:28 PMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Some of the best people I have worked with have been div2's. Their knowledge and understanding put some of the 'midwives' to shame. Just how much nursing care does a newborn need? Many LC's are not midwives, as are childbirth educators. Maybe we should be assisting these people to be woman wise, and not judge them on qualifications. I have no doubt that there are many people other than midwives that have vast knowledge and understanding but antenatal and postnatal care is not nursing care at all. It is specific to normal healthy women who are childbearing. If anyone can be trained to do this in just 8 days why bother with midwifery training. If we and not judging people on their qualifications some of the brilliant lay midwives out there wouldn't be persecuted and they are way more specialised than nurses.Lisa Barrett-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Ganesha RosatSent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 8:33 AMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: Hi all u wonderful women!Just a quick posting in line with the current debate about maternity services within country areas and who provides services. The hospital I am currently working in has decided to address our midwife shortage but training division two nurses to work in the maternity department. These nurses have 3 days of theory, one day of orientation in óbstetric and five days of clinical experience. On completion of their modules these girls will be able to: Assist in the provision of antenatal nursing care to the client Assist in the provision of nursing care to the healthy newborn baby Discuss the establishment and maintenance of breastfeeding Assist in the evaluation of key stage of growth and development of the baby Assist in the provision of postnatal nursing care to the womanThis again indicates to me the lack of understanding of the needs of women (not clients). Instead of the hospital supporting midwives and creating a working environment that encourages new midwives to come to the area, they find quick fixes that only further add to the fragmentation of care.Anyway what do u all think? And is this happening anywhere else?Cheers Ganesha On Yahoo!7 Answers: 25 million answers and counting. Learn something new today
[ozmidwifery] RE:
Some of the best people I have worked with have been div2's. Their knowledge and understanding put some of the 'midwives' to shame. Just how much nursing care does a newborn need? Many LC's are not midwives, as are childbirth educators. Maybe we should be assisting these people to be woman wise, and not judge them on qualifications. -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Ganesha RosatSent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 8:33 AMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: Hi all u wonderful women! Just a quick posting in line with the current debate about maternity services within country areas and who provides services. The hospital I am currently working in has decided to address our midwife shortage but training division two nurses to work in the maternity department. These nurses have 3 days of theory, one day of orientation in óbstetric and five days of clinical experience. On completion of their modules these girls will be able to: Assist in the provision of antenatal nursing care to the client Assist in the provision of nursing care to the healthy newborn baby Discuss the establishment and maintenance of breastfeeding Assist in the evaluation of key stage of growth and development of the baby Assist in the provision of postnatal nursing care to the woman This again indicates to me the lack of understanding of the needs of women (not clients). Instead of the hospital supporting midwives and creating a working environment that encourages new midwives to come to the area, they find quick fixes that only further add to the fragmentation of care. Anyway what do u all think? And is this happening anywhere else? Cheers Ganesha
[ozmidwifery] Re: conflict?
I'd have to say I have a somewhat different view from this after nearly twenty years of feminist activism. I dislike the idea that women are a homogeneous group who must all stand shoulder to shoulder without question or compromise to achieve our goals. I know Condoleeza Rice and I have little in common! We are socialised to avoid conflict at all costs hence the reason (among others, of course, but a big one) that we need birth activism in the first place. Many of us struggle to believe our right to question or say no is actually a right, not a privilege to be carefully exercised only when it can be guaranteed not to offend anyone. I'm tired of the old "women are harder on each other than men" line which is thinly veiled misogygny. Men also beat one another to death but no one says it about them! And most frequently that violence comes at women but again no oneseems to think that may actually be harder on women than a frank exchange of views! Masculinism has a lot more to lose than we do as women claim power for themselves and this is one way it keeps a stranglehold on us. Conflict or difference are not innate problems. How they are managed is the issue. In any relationship differences will arise, and it's the way that is met and dealt with that either ends or continues the relationship, now strengthened by honesty and clarity of purpose and understanding. We cannot simply accept unquestioningly all ideas or this would turn us into mindless sheeple and there are enough of those in the world already. Our diversity is actually our strength, not a pretence at some kind of vagina solidarity. By the same token, the enforced uniformity of the monolith we oppose is both it's weakness and strength. Yes, the walls are strong but they cannot fail to fall with enough brilliance, strength and purpose pushing on them. Shutting up and not speaking our truths is way too dangerous and simply the patriarchy within enforcing it's rules through us as surely as women performing genital mutilation on one another. I'm not scared of wellmanaged disagreement because it's normal and ok to disagree even with those who share wider goals. Being challenged is essential to keeping us all learning and thinking and I'm so grateful to the women who challenge me and have nourished my soul and intellect this way. So thanks, Kelly, for speaking YOUR truth and I would cheerfully lie in front of a bulldozer to support your right so to do as soon as I climb down from the tree I'm hugging. J - humourless feminist - Original Message - From: Sadie To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Saturday, September 23, 2006 11:22 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] FYI news article GO MARY Luv Sadie - Original Message - From: Mary Murphy To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Saturday, September 23, 2006 6:51 AM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] FYI news article Tania rightly says I have never gotten used to the amount of internal bickering and horizontal violence that is perpetrated by women, towards other women. CAN WE PLEASE STOP THIS! This juvenile attitude has split the womens movement, the homebirth movement and every other collection of women I have seen and read about.
RE: [ozmidwifery] re birth story
Just chiming in, we have three very active consumer based birth support/education groups here in Adelaide, CARES, the caesarean support group, Birth Matters SA, a more generic info group where women gather and talk about where to get good information, and how to get a good/better birth, and the Homebirth Network of SA, which has been clocking over 40 women a month at our regular coffee mornings! Not bad for a group that only 3 years ago had two or three women turning up there are small but significant communities out there, and yes, there does need to be more of a commercial feel about some of it. Unfortunately we live in a time where many people think that the more you pay for something, the more it is worth. Hence a few of our information nights such as a waterbirth info night, attracted a lot more interest when we advertised it as $15 per couple, than when we held Birth Choices nights for freethats just how it is, and if you can charge for something, and then plough the profits back into more advertising in the mainstream, or into your library or newsletters etc, then thats great. Also agree with Barb, the ABA was a lifesaver for me with a new baby and in a remote place as a new mum Tania -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.3/447 - Release Date: 13/09/2006 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.3/447 - Release Date: 13/09/2006
Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story
and don't forget Tania, you run the meet a midwife sessions at naturescradle in your own time and at no cost to the consumer. When it gets established this has a great potential for helping women with birth choices. Lisa Barrett - Original Message - From: Tania Smallwood To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 4:15 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Just chiming in, we have three very active consumer based birth support/education groups here in Adelaide, CARES, the caesarean support group, Birth Matters SA, a more generic info group where women gather and talk about where to get good information, and how to get a good/better birth, and the Homebirth Network of SA, which has been clocking over 40 women a month at our regular coffee mornings! Not bad for a group that only 3 years ago had two or three women turning up… there are small but significant communities out there, and yes, there does need to be more of a commercial feel about some of it. Unfortunately we live in a time where many people think that the more you pay for something, the more it is worth. Hence a few of our information nights such as a waterbirth info night, attracted a lot more interest when we advertised it as $15 per couple, than when we held Birth Choices nights for free…that’s just how it is, and if you can charge for something, and then plough the profits back into more advertising in the mainstream, or into your library or newsletters etc, then that’s great. Also agree with Barb, the ABA was a lifesaver for me with a new baby and in a remote place as a new mum… Tania --No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.3/447 - Release Date: 13/09/2006 --No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.3/447 - Release Date: 13/09/2006
Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story
Looks like we are all working hard together, in different ways, toward the same outcome. I believe we will get there, even if governments and policy makers only agree on a costs basis. That is why caseload is able to get off the ground in some areas. Gosford and Wyong are starting soon! Di - Original Message - From: Lisa Barrett To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 6:00 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story and don't forget Tania, you run the meet a midwife sessions at naturescradle in your own time and at no cost to the consumer. When it gets established this has a great potential for helping women with birth choices. Lisa Barrett - Original Message - From: Tania Smallwood To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 4:15 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Just chiming in, we have three very active consumer based birth support/education groups here in Adelaide, CARES, the caesarean support group, Birth Matters SA, a more generic info group where women gather and talk about where to get good information, and how to get a good/better birth, and the Homebirth Network of SA, which has been clocking over 40 women a month at our regular coffee mornings! Not bad for a group that only 3 years ago had two or three women turning up… there are small but significant communities out there, and yes, there does need to be more of a commercial feel about some of it. Unfortunately we live in a time where many people think that the more you pay for something, the more it is worth. Hence a few of our information nights such as a waterbirth info night, attracted a lot more interest when we advertised it as $15 per couple, than when we held Birth Choices nights for free…that’s just how it is, and if you can charge for something, and then plough the profits back into more advertising in the mainstream, or into your library or newsletters etc, then that’s great. Also agree with Barb, the ABA was a lifesaver for me with a new baby and in a remote place as a new mum… Tania --No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.3/447 - Release Date: 13/09/2006 --No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.3/447 - Release Date: 13/09/2006
Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story
I know of many women who really baulk at making contact with a 'group' of some sort where they need to phone in or go to a meeting place. I agree Tania, that consumer society must feel they have to pay for something for it be valuable, pretty sad, but true. I'm hoping to access those women and their families who just stumble upon the information about courses and groups by coming browsing in the 'shop' part, some people don't know what they want until it is front of them. This makes sense as, many women don't know what choices they have until they hear about others, and if birth isn't in the everyday tearoom discussions, then women just don't hear about it. Their Doctor isn't likely to tell them! Even in our public systemwomen just don't know what their choices are until they come to book in. Usually the GP asks if theyhave private health cover, if they do, they ask which OB they want to see. Most of the women's mothers just ask when they get to see the doctor! If we can get to those who don't know what to look for , then we might get somewhere. JB getting out to fetes etc is one way,and things like IWD and RTN, but I think that many of those women are already wellinformed and politically motivated. Its the others, the mainstream, that I hope to get to. When we get to them, they can then get information about different groups and maybe gain confidence to join ABA and other groups. Cheers Di - Original Message - From: Tania Smallwood To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 4:45 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Just chiming in, we have three very active consumer based birth support/education groups here in Adelaide, CARES, the caesarean support group, Birth Matters SA, a more generic info group where women gather and talk about where to get good information, and how to get a good/better birth, and the Homebirth Network of SA, which has been clocking over 40 women a month at our regular coffee mornings! Not bad for a group that only 3 years ago had two or three women turning up… there are small but significant communities out there, and yes, there does need to be more of a commercial feel about some of it. Unfortunately we live in a time where many people think that the more you pay for something, the more it is worth. Hence a few of our information nights such as a waterbirth info night, attracted a lot more interest when we advertised it as $15 per couple, than when we held Birth Choices nights for free…that’s just how it is, and if you can charge for something, and then plough the profits back into more advertising in the mainstream, or into your library or newsletters etc, then that’s great. Also agree with Barb, the ABA was a lifesaver for me with a new baby and in a remote place as a new mum… Tania --No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.3/447 - Release Date: 13/09/2006 --No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.3/447 - Release Date: 13/09/2006
Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story
Hi, I know I'm far away from you here in Finland, but this souds a bit like what I am doing. I run the biggest and trendiest maternity speciality store in our capital city. We have nice store in the very best market palce in the newiest shopping mall. Our store is quite nice with trendy maternity brands, baby wear, nursing tops, breast pumps, slings, Ergos, large selection of books etc. We have about 50-70clients in the store every day and they are mostly quite mainstream. Now we are trying to build a new service and share all this valuable birth / breastfeeding info with the parents and build a kind of community like you described.We organice info nights and send out e-letters. I am only starting this all and I'm sure there will be many things I will be asking you all about? It's great to know, that someone is already doing a similar thing so we can all learn from others. Päivi Childbirth educator Finland - Original Message - From: diane To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 4:53 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story That's right Janet, i know these online communities exist for those who seek them out or find them. What Im looking at is a physical presence in the community, where people gather, for info, friendship,access to services and advice. Iwould love granny to be doing her groceries and spot the shopfront and come in for a look at the products then find out about the services and groups etc that are available , then take her info home to her pregnant grandaughter who will share with her friends. I dont really want a retail style thing but a few product lines like slings etc to draw people in. The more in one physical community that are exposed to normal birth, the more the good stories perpetuate. Di - Original Message - From: Janet Fraser To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 11:25 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Di you're describing Joyous Birth LOL. We have about 600 online members who meet all over Australia regularly and do exactly what you're talking about! But you knew this, I'm sure : ) How lovely! J - Original Message - From: diane To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 9:18 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story That's a great article Pinky. One of my visions is to create a community of women where positive birth stories are told. I'm hoping to develop a 'birthplace' where women can access services, classes, alternate therapies, groups, resources and products, to help change the culture at least at a local level. I attended the Calmbirth course last week, which was great. One of the most interesting things was meeting midwives and doulas from all over the country, and hearing their different stories. We have little pockets here and there in this country where natural birth and homebirth is not considered to be too radical. The culture in Melbourne is so different, there are doula's and homebirth midwives everywhere, where in other parts of the country they are unheard of! Places like Bellingen, the north coast of NSW, Toowoomba have their own little sub-cultures that are growing. We need to act locally for a sub - culture to develop, that then becomes part of a wider movement. The more positive stories that hit the 'mainstream' , the more momentum is gained. (thanks Pinky and Kelly, and all of you who vocally and publicly advocate for natural birth!) Cheers, Di - Original Message - From: Pinky McKay To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 8:52 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Hi all, I have just thought some of you may be interested in reading my "column' about my daughters waterbirth - it was published as one of my monthly columns in Practical Parenting a few months ago and is up on my website - every little bit helps, as they say. http://www.pinky-mychild.com/features/pregnancy/family_born.html Pinky
Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story
What a lot of fabulous people all out there working away in different ways supporting parents! Your conceptsounds lovely Dianne. And Parvi - your shop sounds beautiful - a greatway to reach more mothers who possibly have no idea that they need to prepare for birth and motheringin any way other than buying pretty clothes or gear for baby. Any English speakers who may be interested in my new book - Sleeping Like a Baby - definitely baby and birth friendly and absolutely no controlled cryng!? Pinky www.pinky-mychild.com - Original Message - From: diane To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 5:15 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story I know of many women who really baulk at making contact with a 'group' of some sort where they need to phone in or go to a meeting place. I agree Tania, that consumer society must feel they have to pay for something for it be valuable, pretty sad, but true. I'm hoping to access those women and their families who just stumble upon the information about courses and groups by coming browsing in the 'shop' part, some people don't know what they want until it is front of them. This makes sense as, many women don't know what choices they have until they hear about others, and if birth isn't in the everyday tearoom discussions, then women just don't hear about it. Their Doctor isn't likely to tell them! Even in our public systemwomen just don't know what their choices are until they come to book in. Usually the GP asks if theyhave private health cover, if they do, they ask which OB they want to see. Most of the women's mothers just ask when they get to see the doctor! If we can get to those who don't know what to look for , then we might get somewhere. JB getting out to fetes etc is one way,and things like IWD and RTN, but I think that many of those women are already wellinformed and politically motivated. Its the others, the mainstream, that I hope to get to. When we get to them, they can then get information about different groups and maybe gain confidence to join ABA and other groups. Cheers Di - Original Message - From: Tania Smallwood To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 4:45 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Just chiming in, we have three very active consumer based birth support/education groups here in Adelaide, CARES, the caesarean support group, Birth Matters SA, a more generic info group where women gather and talk about where to get good information, and how to get a good/better birth, and the Homebirth Network of SA, which has been clocking over 40 women a month at our regular coffee mornings! Not bad for a group that only 3 years ago had two or three women turning up… there are small but significant communities out there, and yes, there does need to be more of a commercial feel about some of it. Unfortunately we live in a time where many people think that the more you pay for something, the more it is worth. Hence a few of our information nights such as a waterbirth info night, attracted a lot more interest when we advertised it as $15 per couple, than when we held Birth Choices nights for free…that’s just how it is, and if you can charge for something, and then plough the profits back into more advertising in the mainstream, or into your library or newsletters etc, then that’s great. Also agree with Barb, the ABA was a lifesaver for me with a new baby and in a remote place as a new mum… Tania --No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.3/447 - Release Date: 13/09/2006 --No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.3/447 - Release Date: 13/09/2006
Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story
Hi Di,As far as I'm aware there's nothing like that here (but having just returned after 7 months away I could be wrong!) Anyway, it's a great idea. I've just returned from doing some relief work in the Community Midwifery Practice in Darwin which is in a block opposite a shopping centre. Often people saw the sign and wandered in. I'm sure it would get off the ground in Mackay.Cheers Michellediane [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Michelle, Is there anything like what Janet and I are talking about around Mackay? Do you think it might get off the ground there. I figure there are lots of bored lonley women there who's partners are away in the mines all week, and families are down south. Cheers, Di- Original Message - From: diane To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 11:53 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth storyThat's right Janet, i know these online communities exist for those who seek them out or find them. What Im looking at is a physical presence in the community, where people gather, for info, friendship,access to services and advice. Iwould love granny to be doing her groceries and spot the shopfront and come in for a look at the products then find out about the services and groups etc that are available , then take her info home to her pregnant grandaughter who will share with her friends. I dont really want a retail style thing but a few product lines like slings etc to draw people in. The more in one physical community that are exposed to normal birth, the more the good stories perpetuate. Di- Original Message - From: Janet Fraser To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 11:25 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth storyDi you're describing Joyous Birth LOL. We have about 600 online members who meet all over Australia regularly and do exactly what you're talking about! But you knew this, I'm sure : ) How lovely! J- Original Message - From: diane To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 9:18 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth storyThat's a great article Pinky. One of my visions is to create a community of women where positive birth stories are told. I'm hoping to develop a 'birthplace' where women can access services, classes, alternate therapies, groups, resources and products, to help change the culture at least at a local level. I attended the Calmbirth course last week, which was great. One of the most interesting things was meeting midwives and doulas from all over the country, and hearing their different stories. We have little pockets here and there in this country where natural birth and homebirth is not considered to be too radical. The culture in Melbourne is so different, there are doula's and homebirth midwives everywhere, where in other parts of the country they are unheard of! Places like Bellingen, the north coast of NSW, Toowoomba have their own little sub-cultures that are growing. We need to act locally for a sub - culture to develop, that then becomes part of a wider movement. The more positive stories that hit the 'mainstream' , the more momentum is gained. (thanks Pinky and Kelly, and all of you who vocally and publicly advocate for natural birth!) Cheers, Di- Original Message - From: Pinky McKay To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 8:52 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] re birth storyHi all, I have just thought some of you may be interested in reading my "column' about my daughters waterbirth - it was published as one of my monthly columns in Practical Parenting a few months ago and is up on my website - every little bit helps, as they say.http://www.pinky-mychild.com/features/pregnancy/family_born.htmlPinky Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Dating: Get busy flirting with your 7-day free pass
[ozmidwifery] re birth story
Hi all, I have just thought some of you may be interested in reading my "column' about my daughters waterbirth - it was published as one of my monthly columns in Practical Parenting a few months ago and is up on my website - every little bit helps, as they say. http://www.pinky-mychild.com/features/pregnancy/family_born.html Pinky
Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story
That's a great article Pinky. One of my visions is to create a community of women where positive birth stories are told. I'm hoping to develop a 'birthplace' where women can access services, classes, alternate therapies, groups, resources and products, to help change the culture at least at a local level. I attended the Calmbirth course last week, which was great. One of the most interesting things was meeting midwives and doulas from all over the country, and hearing their different stories. We have little pockets here and there in this country where natural birth and homebirth is not considered to be too radical. The culture in Melbourne is so different, there are doula's and homebirth midwives everywhere, where in other parts of the country they are unheard of! Places like Bellingen, the north coast of NSW, Toowoomba have their own little sub-cultures that are growing. We need to act locally for a sub - culture to develop, that then becomes part of a wider movement. The more positive stories that hit the 'mainstream' , the more momentum is gained. (thanks Pinky and Kelly, and all of you who vocally and publicly advocate for natural birth!) Cheers, Di - Original Message - From: Pinky McKay To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 8:52 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Hi all, I have just thought some of you may be interested in reading my "column' about my daughters waterbirth - it was published as one of my monthly columns in Practical Parenting a few months ago and is up on my website - every little bit helps, as they say. http://www.pinky-mychild.com/features/pregnancy/family_born.html Pinky
Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story
How beautiful, Pinky. I love a real family birth! J - Original Message - From: Pinky McKay To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 8:52 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Hi all, I have just thought some of you may be interested in reading my "column' about my daughters waterbirth - it was published as one of my monthly columns in Practical Parenting a few months ago and is up on my website - every little bit helps, as they say. http://www.pinky-mychild.com/features/pregnancy/family_born.html Pinky
Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story
Di you're describing Joyous Birth LOL. We have about 600 online members who meet all over Australia regularly and do exactly what you're talking about! But you knew this, I'm sure : ) How lovely! J - Original Message - From: diane To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 9:18 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story That's a great article Pinky. One of my visions is to create a community of women where positive birth stories are told. I'm hoping to develop a 'birthplace' where women can access services, classes, alternate therapies, groups, resources and products, to help change the culture at least at a local level. I attended the Calmbirth course last week, which was great. One of the most interesting things was meeting midwives and doulas from all over the country, and hearing their different stories. We have little pockets here and there in this country where natural birth and homebirth is not considered to be too radical. The culture in Melbourne is so different, there are doula's and homebirth midwives everywhere, where in other parts of the country they are unheard of! Places like Bellingen, the north coast of NSW, Toowoomba have their own little sub-cultures that are growing. We need to act locally for a sub - culture to develop, that then becomes part of a wider movement. The more positive stories that hit the 'mainstream' , the more momentum is gained. (thanks Pinky and Kelly, and all of you who vocally and publicly advocate for natural birth!) Cheers, Di - Original Message - From: Pinky McKay To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 8:52 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Hi all, I have just thought some of you may be interested in reading my "column' about my daughters waterbirth - it was published as one of my monthly columns in Practical Parenting a few months ago and is up on my website - every little bit helps, as they say. http://www.pinky-mychild.com/features/pregnancy/family_born.html Pinky
Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story
Great, thats fantastic to get a public presence. I do recall seing a thing about a meet the midwife in Melbourne. Not much of that type of thing happening on Central coast NSW or Newcastle area. Anyone around Mackay area know of any of these types of groups ? Di - Original Message - From: Janet Fraser To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 12:00 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Di JB meets face to face in Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, Adelaide, Hobart, Blue Mountains and Albury Wodonga. That's definitely in the community! We go to fetes, expos, feminist occasions like IWD and RTN, we lend books, videos, magazines and birth pools to members and nonmembers alike. There are a couple of shops in Adelaide that are AP-focussed and run community gatherings as well as carrying stock like slings, hammocks, nappies etc. The "meet the midwife" days are going really well there too! : ) J - Original Message - From: diane To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 11:53 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story That's right Janet, i know these online communities exist for those who seek them out or find them. What Im looking at is a physical presence in the community, where people gather, for info, friendship,access to services and advice. Iwould love granny to be doing her groceries and spot the shopfront and come in for a look at the products then find out about the services and groups etc that are available , then take her info home to her pregnant grandaughter who will share with her friends. I dont really want a retail style thing but a few product lines like slings etc to draw people in. The more in one physical community that are exposed to normal birth, the more the good stories perpetuate. Di - Original Message - From: Janet Fraser To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 11:25 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Di you're describing Joyous Birth LOL. We have about 600 online members who meet all over Australia regularly and do exactly what you're talking about! But you knew this, I'm sure : ) How lovely! J - Original Message - From: diane To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 9:18 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story That's a great article Pinky. One of my visions is to create a community of women where positive birth stories are told. I'm hoping to develop a 'birthplace' where women can access services, classes, alternate therapies, groups, resources and products, to help change the culture at least at a local level. I attended the Calmbirth course last week, which was great. One of the most interesting things was meeting midwives and doulas from all over the country, and hearing their different stories. We have little pockets here and there in this country where natural birth and homebirth is not considered to be too radical. The culture in Melbourne is so different, there are doula's and homebirth midwives everywhere, where in other parts of the country they are unheard of! Places like Bellingen, the north coast of NSW, Toowoomba have their own little sub-cultures that are growing. We need to act locally for a sub - culture to develop, that then becomes part of a wider movement. The more positive stories that hit the 'mainstream' , the more momentum is gained. (thanks Pinky and Kelly, and all of you who vocally and publicly advocate for natural birth!) Cheers, Di - Original Message - From: Pinky McKay To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 8:52 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Hi all, I have just thought some of you may be interested in reading my "column' about my daughters waterbirth - it was published as one of my monthly columns in Practical Parenting a few months ago and is up on my website - every little bit helps, as they say. http://www.pinky-mychild.com/features/pregnancy/family_born.html Pinky
RE: [ozmidwifery] re birth story
We are in the planning stages of setting this kind of thing up here in Townsville. It is very exciting. Here is a web link for a place in San Francisco that is doing it now. http://www.naturalresources-sf.com/classes.html it is very inspiring. Cheers Philippa Scott Birth Buddies - Doula Assisting women and their families in the preparation towards childbirth and labour. President of Friends of the Birth Centre Townsville From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of diane Sent: Thursday, 14 September 2006 11:54 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story That's right Janet, i know these online communities exist for those who seek them out or find them. What Im looking at is a physical presence in the community, where people gather, for info, friendship,access to services and advice. Iwould love granny to be doing her groceries and spot the shopfront and come in for a look at the products then find out about the services and groups etc that are available , then take her info home to her pregnant grandaughter who will share with her friends. I dont really want a retail style thing but a few product lines like slings etc to draw people in. The more in one physical community that are exposed to normal birth, the more the good stories perpetuate. Di - Original Message - From: Janet Fraser To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 11:25 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Di you're describing Joyous Birth LOL. We have about 600 online members who meet all over Australia regularly and do exactly what you're talking about! But you knew this, I'm sure : ) How lovely! J - Original Message - From: diane To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 9:18 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] re birth story That's a great article Pinky. One of my visions is to create a community of women where positive birth stories are told. I'm hoping to develop a 'birthplace' where women can access services, classes, alternate therapies, groups, resources and products, to help change the culture at least at a local level. I attended the Calmbirth course last week, which was great. One of the most interesting things was meeting midwives and doulas from all over the country, and hearing their different stories. We have little pockets here and there in this country where natural birth and homebirth is not considered to be too radical. The culture in Melbourne is so different, there are doula's and homebirth midwives everywhere, where in other parts of the country they are unheard of! Places like Bellingen, the north coast of NSW, Toowoomba have their own little sub-cultures that are growing. We need to act locally for a sub - culture to develop, that then becomes part of a wider movement. The more positive stories that hit the 'mainstream' , the more momentum is gained. (thanks Pinky and Kelly, and all of you who vocally and publicly advocate for natural birth!) Cheers, Di - Original Message - From: Pinky McKay To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 8:52 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] re birth story Hi all, I have just thought some of you may be interested in reading my column' about my daughters waterbirth - it was published as one of my monthly columns in Practical Parenting a few months ago and is up on my website - every little bit helps, as they say. http://www.pinky-mychild.com/features/pregnancy/family_born.html Pinky
Re: [ozmidwifery] re . insurance for midwives
Well said Cath, As a mother with a young family, and being the main income support for my family, there is no way that I could afford to lose everything (possessing little in the way of assests, I would) and I also could not afford to hb full time. However if with insurance more midwives were happy to do at least a few births or provide antenatal and postnatal care, perhaps the profile of midwives as professionals would increase in the publics perception of good birthing care. I believe that it is also foolish to believe that a client would be unlikely to sue, even the most enthusiastic homebirther may find her mind change when faced with the long term cost of raising a child with special needs. I have been involved in a case with a highly educated and motivated couple who had a baby with cerebal palsy (no birth complications except for a flat baby), this case has been ongoing for several years now, and I don't see how anyone would survive the financial cost of either a just or unjust case. And yes - no fault system such as the ones in NZ or the trust system in the UK are both preferrable alternatives. I agree that I would prefer that the college should take on insurance for it's members, and would happily support it's investigation of this or any other offer. With the greater numbers of members a reasonable deal may be able to be negotiated. Meg - Original Message - From: cath nolan To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 7:54 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] re . insurance for midwives As always, well said Justine. I feel that insurance being offered is a very positive move for midwifery in Australia. I know of several midwives who would be more willing to work outside of the hospital if they had insurance, and personally speaking I would welcome cover with open arms. As Andrea says, we don't all have the ability to have no assets, and why should we? I work in an area where homebirth is virtually unheard of. If I didn't work in the hospital I would not have an income.I would love that to change but kids, house etc require certain income, and in reality I can't see a full time midwifery practise in demand in this area in the near future.I am damn sure I am not alone. Lets look at this offer of some professional protection and embrace the positive side effects that it will bring if itcomes to fruition. By all means we need to examine the policy but not shoot it down before it is offered. Cath
Re: [ozmidwifery] re . insurance for midwives
Tania, where did you access the midwives PI list? meg - Original Message - From: Tania Smallwood To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 8:24 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] re . insurance for midwives Can I just say that I don’t think anyone is shooting anything down, I’m really glad that there is finally some open discussion going on around this issue! There are many of us over in SA who are feeling a bit in the dark about where things are up to, and what having our name on this list means. I’m open to having a look at what is on offer, I think it’s great that after all this time, someone is willing to take us on and offer us something that is possibly affordable. I can see however why midwives might be hesitant to allow an insurance company to take over the running of their finances, tax payments etc, especially given the reality of working as an IPM, ie not every midwife bills and expects payment in the same way, and not every woman can afford to pay up front etc. I can just understand how confronting it might be to have to change the entire way one works regarding payment etc and I’m wondering how a one size fits all plan might work for 200 or so people that all run their businesses very differently. Please can we keep the open dialogue going on this issue, and is there some way that we can have access to any minutes etc from the meetings that have been taking place? I am on the Midwives PI list, but can’t receive attachments via that list, so is there some way that each of the IPM groups in each state can be sent the information about where things are up to for now? Cheers Tania From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of cath nolanSent: Tuesday, 5 September 2006 7:25 PMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: [ozmidwifery] re . insurance for midwives As always, well said Justine. I feel that insurance being offered is a very positive move for midwifery in Australia. I know of several midwives who would be more willing to work outside of the hospital if they had insurance, and personally speaking I would welcome cover with open arms. As Andrea says, we don't all have the ability to have no assets, and why should we? I work in an area where homebirth is virtually unheard of. If I didn't work in the hospital I would not have an income.I would love that to change but kids, house etc require certain income, and in reality I can't see a full time midwifery practise in demand in this area in the near future.I am damn sure I am not alone. Lets look at this offer of some professional protection and embrace the positive side effects that it will bring if itcomes to fruition. By all means we need to examine the policy but not shoot it down before it is offered. Cath --No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/437 - Release Date: 4/09/2006 --No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/437 - Release Date: 4/09/2006
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: RWH - Pain Relief Comment on Website
I disagree strongly with this section of the RWH website (below). I think many women who birth without pain relief are dismissed as having been lucky to have had an easy labour. Women who birth naturally are often not credited with managing their own pain and are not recognised as having informed themselves to labour in less pain-causing ways in the first place. It's as if pain is something that can be objectively measured and only managed with medical intervention. - Original Message - and if they manage to achieve delivery without any form of pain relief, they receive some mythical 'badge of honour'. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
[ozmidwifery] RE: RWH - Pain Relief Comment on Website
Gosh it gets worse The options available for pain relief during labour have increased dramatically since that time but it has only been in the second half of this century that they have been made readily available for women. The reality is that about 2 thirds of normal, healthy pregnant women suffer severe or intolerable pain during labour, and only about 2% of women are fortunate enough to describe little or no discomfort. However, despite this many women are still made to feel guilty or inadequate if they ask for pain relief, and if they manage to achieve delivery without any form of pain relief, they receive some mythical 'badge of honour'. In no other situation would anyone deliberately allow someone to suffer so severely for so long without attempting to relieve their pain. It is, of course, always the expectant mother's decision as to whether she will have anything during labour, but this can only be done in an informed fashion if she has been told her options and the pros and cons of each before she goes into labour. Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support From: Kelly @ BellyBelly [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, 30 August 2006 9:44 PM To: 'ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au' Subject: RWH - Pain Relief Comment on Website I found this on the RWH website in the section about the cons of epidurals: 6. Some people believe that epidurals may increase the duration of labour, or increase the likelihood of needing forceps or a Caesarean section. The evidence for or against this belief is very controversial. It is almost impossible to do unbiased studies to confirm or deny this belief. Women who have excessive pain and ask for an epidural may be the ones with bigger babies or smaller pelvises and thus be more likely to need forceps or a Caesarean section anyway. In addition, even if labour is prolonged, is it better to have a 9 hour labour in agony, or a 13 hour labour in relative comfort (as long as the baby and mother are monitored and both are well)? I would suspect the latter. In conclusion I think it is important to stress that no-one can predict how they will feel during labour, and some labours are far more painful than others. Women who ask for pain relief during labour should not be made to feel guilty or inadequate, as if they have failed, but rather reassured and given the pain relief they require. The attitude of '...no, you'll be fine...let's hold of for a few more hours and see how you go...' is no longer appropriate unless the baby is about to pop out any second. Eck. Love their choice of wording too. http://www.rwh.org.au/rwhanaes/whatis.cfm?doc_id=2392 Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support
Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: RWH - Pain Relief Comment on Website
Given that they have a 1 in 3 c-sec rate and have got rid of their BC while pretending to "extend it's ethos" throughout the new buildings, what part of this surprises you, Kelly? The only thing I love about RWH is how unashamedly they promote this rubbish and how conveniently they put protocols and stats on their website so you can show consumers why not to go there. I can barely read their crap, it makes me inarticulate with rage. J - Original Message - From: Kelly @ BellyBelly To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 9:50 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: RWH - Pain Relief Comment on Website Gosh it gets worse The options available for pain relief during labour have increased dramatically since that time but it has only been in the second half of this century that they have been made readily available for women. The reality is that about 2 thirds of normal, healthy pregnant women suffer severe or intolerable pain during labour, and only about 2% of women are fortunate enough to describe little or no discomfort. However, despite this many women are still made to feel guilty or inadequate if they ask for pain relief, and if they manage to achieve delivery without any form of pain relief, they receive some mythical 'badge of honour'. In no other situation would anyone deliberately allow someone to suffer so severely for so long without attempting to relieve their pain. It is, of course, always the expectant mother's decision as to whether she will have anything during labour, but this can only be done in an informed fashion if she has been told her options and the pros and cons of each before she goes into labour. Best Regards,Kelly ZanteyCreator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to ParenthoodBellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support From: Kelly @ BellyBelly [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, 30 August 2006 9:44 PMTo: 'ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au'Subject: RWH - Pain Relief Comment on Website I found this on the RWH website in the section about the cons of epidurals: 6. Some people believe that epidurals may increase the duration of labour, or increase the likelihood of needing forceps or a Caesarean section. The evidence for or against this belief is very controversial. It is almost impossible to do unbiased studies to confirm or deny this belief. Women who have excessive pain and ask for an epidural may be the ones with bigger babies or smaller pelvises and thus be more likely to need forceps or a Caesarean section anyway. In addition, even if labour is prolonged, is it better to have a 9 hour labour in agony, or a 13 hour labour in relative comfort (as long as the baby and mother are monitored and both are well)? I would suspect the latter. In conclusion I think it is important to stress that no-one can predict how they will feel during labour, and some labours are far more painful than others. Women who ask for pain relief during labour should not be made to feel guilty or inadequate, as if they have failed, but rather reassured and given the pain relief they require. The attitude of '...no, you'll be fine...let's hold of for a few more hours and see how you go...' is no longer appropriate unless the baby is about to pop out any second. Eck. Love their choice of wording too. http://www.rwh.org.au/rwhanaes/whatis.cfm?doc_id=2392 Best Regards,Kelly ZanteyCreator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to ParenthoodBellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: RWH - Pain Relief
Recently a friend of mine had twins at our large teaching hospital. She did not want an epidural or any interference whatsoever. She was pressed for induction and asked for the information leaflet from RACOG and the hospitals consent form. She read it at 36 weeks and said what woman in their right mind would choose induction with all its risks? She also asked for the Epidural information and had the same reaction. However, during a long spontaneous labour (not knowing she was 7cms) she asked for an epidural. We said she could have one anytime and she walked from the bathroom to the labour room. On VE before the E/D she was 7cm she felt much better and stronger in spirit. The walk had moved things and she was able to go on with midwifery encouragement and N2O2, She birthed her two little boys into the midwifes hands. The only medical input was a real time U/S to ascertain the 2nd twins position(ceph). My point? Accurate information before labour and encouragement about the benefits to herself and baby of not having drugs may help the automatic I need an epidural. I also think that women dont realize that midwives will be there to comfort them help them through the hard patches. More midwifery input in the A/N period. MM
Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: RWH - Pain Relief Comment on Website
This reminds me of what a woman was told in private antenatal classes that rating pain from 1 to 10 with 10 the worst pain you can imagine, then labour will probably sit at about 20. How's thatfor getting the adrenaline going and inhibiting endorphins! No wonder some of these women walk in at 1cm wanting an epidural.Michelle"Kelly @ BellyBelly" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Gosh it gets worse The options available for pain relief during labour have increased dramatically since that time but it has only been in the second half of this century that they have been made readily available for women. The reality is that about 2 thirds of normal, healthy pregnant women suffer severe or intolerable pain during labour, and only about 2% of women are fortunate enough to describe little or no discomfort. However, despite this many women are still made to feel guilty or inadequate if they ask for pain relief, and if they manage to achieve delivery without any form of pain relief, they receive some mythical 'badge of honour'. In no other situation would anyone deliberately allow someone to suffer so severely for so long without attempting to relieve their pain. It is, of course, always the expectant mother's decision as to whether she will have anything during labour, but this can only be done in an informed fashion if she has been told her options and the pros and cons of each before she goes into labour. Best Regards,Kelly ZanteyCreator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to ParenthoodBellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support From: Kelly @ BellyBelly [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, 30 August 2006 9:44 PMTo: 'ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au'Subject: RWH - Pain Relief Comment on WebsiteI found this on the RWH website in the section about the cons of epidurals:6. Some people believe that epidurals may increase the duration of labour, or increase the likelihood of needing forceps or a Caesarean section. The evidence for or against this belief is very controversial. It is almost impossible to do unbiased studies to confirm or deny this belief. Women who have excessive pain and ask for an epidural may be the ones with bigger babies or smaller pelvises and thus be more likely to need forceps or a Caesarean section anyway. In addition, even if labour is prolonged, is it better to have a 9 hour labour in agony, or a 13 hour labour in relative comfort (as long as the baby and mother are monitored and both are well)? I would suspect the latter.In conclusion I think it is important to stress that no-one can predict how they will feel during labour, and some labours are far more painful than others. Women who ask for pain relief during labour should not be made to feel guilty or inadequate, as if they have failed, but rather reassured and given the pain relief they require. The attitude of '...no, you'll be fine...let's hold of for a few more hours and see how you go...' is no longer appropriate unless the baby is about to pop out any second.Eck. Love their choice of wording too.http://www.rwh.org.au/rwhanaes/whatis.cfm?doc_id=2392 Best Regards,Kelly ZanteyCreator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to ParenthoodBellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support Do you Yahoo!? Take part in Total Girls Ultimate Slumber Party and help break a world record
[ozmidwifery] re peter mourik
Thanks everyone for the info, I'm about to head off to this little soiree. Will let you know my impressions. Apparrently today he was quietly quizzing others on if there were any independent midwives locally and loved our newly implemented 'midwifery model' which by the way and much to my chagrin has no antenatal care component at all. The an care provided is ínfo sessions'. All nicely controlled by our ever growing number of obstetricians. Warrnambool is looking at having 5 obs next year!! It is a regional centre of 35,000. plus significant outlying area. Too many poking fingers for my liking. Cath
RE: [ozmidwifery] re grief and childrens books
It may not be exactly what you are looking for, but a book has left a lasting impression on me is You, me and the rainbow by Petrea King (bestselling author of Quest for life). A copy of her rainbow ritual may be what you are looking for. Check them out on her website www.questforlife.com.au Cheers Belinda From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ken Ward Sent: Wednesday, 16 August 2006 12:10 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] re grief and childrens books I have a lovely little book on life times. It talks about all creatures from butterflies to people. That no matter how long or short life is to celebrated and death comes to all, not to be scared of, but a natural part of life. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of cath nolan Sent: Tuesday, 15 August 2006 8:37 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] re grief and childrens books I used to read a book to my kids called sophieby mem fox I think. It was a lovely gentle book about a special grandfather dying and provoked lots of discussion in our house with my three girls about dying. It speaks from a cycle of life perspective with birth showing hope and new life.Unfortunately a subject we have had to deal with quite a bit in the past few years. I found it very helpful. Cath. t
[ozmidwifery] re grief and childrens books
I used to read a book to my kids called "sophie"by mem fox I think. It was a lovely gentle book about a special grandfather dying and provoked lots of discussion in our house with my three girls about dying. It speaks from a cycle of life perspective with birth showing hope and new life.Unfortunately a subject we have had to deal with quite a bit in the past few years. I found it very helpful. Cath. t
RE: [ozmidwifery] re grief and childrens books
I have a lovely little book on life times. It talks about all creatures from butterflies to people. That no matter how long or short life is to celebrated and death comes to all, not to be scared of, but a natural part of life. -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of cath nolanSent: Tuesday, 15 August 2006 8:37 PMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: [ozmidwifery] re grief and childrens books I used to read a book to my kids called "sophie"by mem fox I think. It was a lovely gentle book about a special grandfather dying and provoked lots of discussion in our house with my three girls about dying. It speaks from a cycle of life perspective with birth showing hope and new life.Unfortunately a subject we have had to deal with quite a bit in the past few years. I found it very helpful. Cath. t
[ozmidwifery] RE: VBA2C in SA
Sorry one in Perth, one Adelaide Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support From: Kelly @ BellyBelly [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, 1 August 2006 6:28 PM To: 'ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au' Subject: VBA2C in SA Dear all, Can anyone help with some contacts in SA for VBA2C? There are two mums in my forums desperate for a VB and are being laughed at by their doctors and midwives. One has a history of PE and the other not. I have suggested hiring a MIPP to go with them, but if anyone knows of a place that they can go which is more VBAC friendly that would be great. The discussion is here: http://bellybelly.com.au/forums/showthread.php?t=17152 Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support
[ozmidwifery] RE: Home/water birth stories needed!
"I am doing some work for the Nappy Bag Book for next year, writing an article and also assisting them to locate some great birth stories for the book. If anyone would be happy to share their home and/or waterbirth for the book along with some photos (must be a good size/resolution) then please send them this way. Feel free to distribute this so we can get some wonderful birth stories widely distributed around Australia.Kelly Zantey" Hi Kelly, Joyous Birth (being that it's the Australian Homebirth Network) has plenty of gorgeous homebirth/waterbirth stories, as well as a Gallery of birth images. I know you're a member, so you can just look at the Birth Stories in the forum; here's the direct link:- http://www.joyousbirth.info/forums/viewforum.php?f=9sid=f2ac02da1bb67b7d63456c2eb86f1fbe And here's the Gallery:- http://www.joyousbirth.info/gallery/main.php Please contact me on [EMAIL PROTECTED] if you're interested in any stories/images so we can arrange appropriate permission from the Mama in question. :o)
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE: Home/water birth stories needed!
Id love to look through them all Felicity but I am completely, madly, flat chat and doing more than I can really handle at the moment! If you could please just pass on my message it would be a huge help! Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Stephen Felicity Sent: Saturday, 29 July 2006 4:40 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: Home/water birth stories needed! I am doing some work for the Nappy Bag Book for next year, writing an article and also assisting them to locate some great birth stories for the book. If anyone would be happy to share their home and/or waterbirth for the book along with some photos (must be a good size/resolution) then please send them this way. Feel free to distribute this so we can get some wonderful birth stories widely distributed around Australia. Kelly Zantey Hi Kelly, Joyous Birth (being that it's the Australian Homebirth Network) has plenty of gorgeous homebirth/waterbirth stories, as well as a Gallery of birth images. I know you're a member, so you can just look at the Birth Stories in the forum; here's the direct link:- http://www.joyousbirth.info/forums/viewforum.php?f=9sid=f2ac02da1bb67b7d63456c2eb86f1fbe And here's the Gallery:- http://www.joyousbirth.info/gallery/main.php Please contact me on [EMAIL PROTECTED] if you're interested in any stories/images so we can arrange appropriate permission from the Mama in question. :o)
[ozmidwifery] re book launch
Hi all, If any of you would like to come, the official launch of my new book "Sleeping Like a Baby" ( Penguin) is this Saturday. Babies MOST welcome. Feel free to pass this on to anybody who may be interested. See below for details. Pinky www.pinky-mychild.com When? Saturday 8 July 2006 @ 2pm Where? Borders, Chadstone, VIC Shop B16, Chadstone Shopping Centre 1341 Dandenong Road, Chadstone PLEASE RSVP by Thursday 6 July 2006 to Vicky Axiotis (03) 9811 2415 or email [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[ozmidwifery] RE:
If you are with the Nth Womens, then I would have thought you have the best of both worlds, your own Midwife, access to gov funded homebirth and transfer to hospital where you keep your Midwife. I love the idea of labouring at home, and then make your decision where you will birth. If you feel safe at home, chances are you will stay there, but if your instinct wants to be in hospital then that is where you will go. You can be prepared for both options, discuss all of this with your Midwife and then let it all go and be with your labour. Obviously this is a basic rundown of one way of looking at it, but if you want to be with women who have very positive attitudes to birth then join us at Birth Matters for a coffee gathering and see if that lifts your spirit. We always meet at Eastwood Community centre, 95 Glen Osmond Rd, next one will be on July 20th, 7.30 - 9.30pm, just turn up and enjoy. If you want the other dates just get back to me for them, cheers Megan From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Stepney, Natalie Anita - stena001Sent: Friday, 23 June 2006 10:27 PMTo: OZmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: Hi Kate, I was meant to finish my degree last year, just doing my catch-ups and then i can register. I thought that i would feel more safe at home, but again after that experience and the birth getting closer i'm not so sure. My partner is supportive of wherever i choose to birth. He's left the decision up to me. We are going through Northern Women's so our only option is the Lyell McEwin in there birthcentre, high side or home ofcourse. Iam happy to gothere as i've had a taste of most of the midwifery units in Adelaide, and felt that the Lyell suited me. But i also didn't think i would need to think about it, as i was keen to have a homebirth. Cheers Nat
Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Low iron and inability to breastfeed?
I would suggest changing carers! Megan - Original Message - From: Kelly @ BellyBelly To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Monday, June 19, 2006 1:41 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: Low iron and inability to breastfeed? Sorry forgot to include: They told me I would likely need a transfusion after the birth as well, and that I would be too weak to even stand after the birth and would need the oxytocin injection after birth to ensure I did not loose too much blood (I had asked for a natural third stage). I've been on supplements the whole time - in fact, the doctor has put me on twice the recommended level, but for some reason my body is not absorbing the iron. Best Regards,Kelly ZanteyCreator, BellyBellycom.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to ParenthoodBellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support From: Kelly @ BellyBelly [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 19 June 2006 1:34 PMTo: 'ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au'Subject: Low iron and inability to breastfeed? Yeah my jaw dropped too any advice for this mum?: I was wondering if anyone else has been told they would have trouble b/f as their iron levels are too low? I'm due any day now and have never leaked or had any signs that I will be able to produce milk... The midwife at the BC told me that as my iron levels were below 100 I would have trouble b/f... this has upset me greatly as I really want to be able to do this.. I was wondering if she could be wrong, or if anyone else has had a similar experience and what happened? Best Regards,Kelly ZanteyCreator, BellyBellycom.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to ParenthoodBellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support
[ozmidwifery] RE: {RMA} quote of the week
Since 1990, the number of women giving birth with a midwife has doubled, signaling a growing trend among women who seek a more natural -- as opposed to medical -- childbirth. While only 4 percent of women gave birth with a midwife in 1990, 8 percent of women chose a midwife in 2003, according to the National Center for Health Statistics. Pregnancy and birth are expensive when it comes to medical care, so insurance coverage plays a major role in the decision for a lot of families. Many insurance companies do cover the use of a midwife, as long as she is licensed and working in a hospital or birthing center. Coverage for midwives who are not certified, or who work outside of a hospital setting, is less widespread and varies by state and health plan. However, the major reason why most families chose a midwife was to experience a more natural birth. Contrary to traditional hospital births, midwives generally encourage using drug-free, natural methods of childbirth. Those who have used a midwife describe the experience as soothing and private, and say having the freedom to go through labor and give birth in a way that feels comfortable to them, such as in a bathtub, was empowering. Yahoo News May 30, 2006 Dr. Mercola's Comment: The United States and Canada are the only countries in the world where highly trained surgeons called obstetricians attend the majority of normal births. Cesarean section can save the life of the mother or her baby. Cesarean section can also kill a mother or her baby. How can this be? Because every single procedure or technology used during pregnancy and birth carries risks, both for mother and baby. The decision to use technology is a judgment call -- it may either make things better or worse. Merely putting yourself in the hands of a high-tech doctor and a high-tech hospital does not guarantee you the safest birth. You yourself musttake responsibility for your own child's birth, including the decision to have technology used on you and your baby. There is not a single report in the scientific literature that shows obstetricians to be safer than midwives for low risk or normal pregnancy and birth. So if you are among the over75 percent of all women with a normal pregnancy, the safest birth attendant for you is not a doctor but a midwife. Try Juno Platinum for Free! Then, only $9.95/month! Unlimited Internet Access with 1GB of Email Storage. Visit http://www.juno.com/value to sign up today! -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.1/369 - Release Date: 6/19/2006 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.1/369 - Release Date: 6/19/2006
[ozmidwifery] Re: Starting solids too early
Hi Kelly, Thought you might like this artickle. I picked it up from an AP-list, but who ever posted it couldn't remember where she had found it... Päivi Baby Led Weaning. What a sensible approach. You walk past the supermarket shelves of nappies, dummies, bottles, teats and formula quite happily but somehow at around four months you find yourself glancing at the baby rice and colourful jars and tins. You are not sure if these so called children's foods belong in a separate category along with turkey twizzlers but there seems to be a children's version of most products and they are hard to avoid. Everyone else is weaning but somehow it doesn't feel right for you and your baby? Stop! There is another way. A fantastically instinctive and intuitive approach to weaning has been developed by UNICEF and the world heath organisation WHO Baby led weaning basically is what it says - you do not even offer solid food until the baby shows signs of internal and external readiness (being able to sit up unaided, tongue thrust movement disappears, gut lining becomes less leaky between during the weeks between four and six months.) This generally happens somewhere around the middle of the babies first year. At this time at normal family meal times you simply sit the baby up at the table and offer them pieces of the raw or cooked ingredients from your family meal. E.g. - cucumber batons, banana chunks, cooked pasta shapes, avocado slices. Until the child's pincer movement develops further they are unlikely to be able to pick up pieces small enough to choke on and that is pretty much it! Over the time between 6 and 12 months on a very gradual basis they will move from being exclusively breast fed to taking about half of their calories from solid food. When you consider that almost 350g of cooked carrot contains the same amount of energy as 100g of breast milk it makes those entire big baby / small baby / weight gain arguments look pretty daft! The key seems to me that you are not feeding the child - so throw away those weaning spoons - Just as a breast fed baby has learnt to regulate their food intake for the first six months and you learn to adjust to the idea that you can't visualise how much milk they are taking this is simply a continuation of trusting your baby. Missing out the goo stage means you also miss out the fiddleyness of introducing one food at a time - babies who were videoed for the unicef study seemed to do this naturally. Weaning is an incredible gradual process on using this approach - A child needs the same amount of calories at 6 months, 1 year, 2 years and 3 years (as their growth rate slows) - it is simply the composition of these calories that is changing. The iron issue is often used to encourage mothers to wean early - breast milk is low is iron yes but this iron is easily and readily absorbed by the baby - the store built up at birth is usually running low between six and twelve months - you can offer iron rich foods from six months but you must trust that the baby that needs them will eat them and the baby that doesn't won't!! Health Visitors in the UK are only just beginning to be schooled in this new approach and it is unlikely to be rolled out until government plans to extend maternity leave are approved. (Just as the government weaning advice was changed in 2004 from four to six months when maternity leave rules were changed before.) Anecdotal evidence suggests most health visitors are ignoring this new advice anyway and still encouraging mothers to wean far to early. Weaning does seem to be occurring later in the west - some babies born in the sixties were often solids at three weeks, ten weeks seemed popular in the seventies - and so on - politics of our attitudes to food aside you could view this as the logical next stage! - Just because your four-month-old baby is watching you eat it doesn't mean they are ready for solids - they watch you do everything - that is just what four-month-old babies do. - Do not be tempted to spoon feed your baby - allow them to continue regulating there own food intake just as they have done already - a very useful skill and one that may help them avoid eating disorders in adult life. - You can introduce a spoon as their manual dexterity improves but it is for them to use it. - Present a selection of healthy foods in pieces they can manage - let them choose which to eat or explore with their mouths. Do not put foods in their mouths - this is where the choking danger comes from. - Babies given solids early do not sleep better - gram for gram in comparison to breast milk solids are very low in calories so will not fill them up contrary to what many people think. - Waiting for your baby to be ready means that preparing food is much easier (i.e. no hand blender etc needed) and food allergies are less likely. - Baby food manufacturers should no longer be labelling jars and packets with 16 weeks they have been told by the government to
[ozmidwifery] RE: Low iron and inability to breastfeed?
Sorry forgot to include: They told me I would likely need a transfusion after the birth as well, and that I would be too weak to even stand after the birth and would need the oxytocin injection after birth to ensure I did not loose too much blood (I had asked for a natural third stage). I've been on supplements the whole time - in fact, the doctor has put me on twice the recommended level, but for some reason my body is not absorbing the iron. Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support From: Kelly @ BellyBelly [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 19 June 2006 1:34 PM To: 'ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au' Subject: Low iron and inability to breastfeed? Yeah my jaw dropped too any advice for this mum?: I was wondering if anyone else has been told they would have trouble b/f as their iron levels are too low? I'm due any day now and have never leaked or had any signs that I will be able to produce milk... The midwife at the BC told me that as my iron levels were below 100 I would have trouble b/f... this has upset me greatly as I really want to be able to do this.. I was wondering if she could be wrong, or if anyone else has had a similar experience and what happened? Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support
Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Low iron and inability to breastfeed?
So she went to a BC expecting evidence based care, did she? What a rude awakening... J - Original Message - From: Kelly @ BellyBelly To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Monday, June 19, 2006 1:41 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: Low iron and inability to breastfeed? Sorry forgot to include: They told me I would likely need a transfusion after the birth as well, and that I would be too weak to even stand after the birth and would need the oxytocin injection after birth to ensure I did not loose too much blood (I had asked for a natural third stage). I've been on supplements the whole time - in fact, the doctor has put me on twice the recommended level, but for some reason my body is not absorbing the iron. Best Regards,Kelly ZanteyCreator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to ParenthoodBellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support From: Kelly @ BellyBelly [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 19 June 2006 1:34 PMTo: 'ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au'Subject: Low iron and inability to breastfeed? Yeah my jaw dropped too any advice for this mum?: I was wondering if anyone else has been told they would have trouble b/f as their iron levels are too low? I'm due any day now and have never leaked or had any signs that I will be able to produce milk... The midwife at the BC told me that as my iron levels were below 100 I would have trouble b/f... this has upset me greatly as I really want to be able to do this.. I was wondering if she could be wrong, or if anyone else has had a similar experience and what happened? Best Regards,Kelly ZanteyCreator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to ParenthoodBellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support
Re: [ozmidwifery] Re:
Dear all, coincidently, I heard one of my colleagues consent a women last night on Vit K and she informed the mother that babies have little or novit K at birth until the gut flora can develop and thence oral absorption begins. This was not my understanding of the facts, but as I was not able to put my finger on the source and veracity of my info, said nothing to the other MW. But I would like to know the real facts. Can anyone help? - Original Message - From: penny burrows To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Saturday, May 27, 2006 7:47 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: One thing that I wonder about: Routine supplementation with any vitamin seems to be a bad idea for pregnant women as well as for babies. Do we know the effects of supplementation with vitamin K on pregnant women? What intricate balances might this be upsetting? It seems like this could be another, if more natural form of blanket treatment. If we truly believe that mother nature has designed things well and the newborn low levels are there for a reason, then do we want to boost the levels available in mum's milk? More to ponder, Penny - Original Message - From: Sue Cookson To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 8:11 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Hi,With the new Konakion MM it's the other way around. It has been designed by increasing it's absorbability in fat to be more affective if given orally. It has NOT been proven to be as effective as the old Konakion in being absorbed by the IM route. They are waiting to see if the surveillance of the new Konakion through Australia, Switzerland and a few other countries is as effective IM as it is oral. The oral route has been found to give a higher vit K cover than the IM route over a few weeks.THere is so much misinformation about vit K. It is available to the baby through breastmilk and maternal supplementation does increase neonatal serum K levels. What more do we want??And by the way, all formla fed babies should be excluded from any study due to the addition of vit K to formulas. ie babies planned to be formula fed do not need vit k!!Suestudent midwifebirth practitionervit K has been my research assignment for the past three years If a solution is designed to be given IM is it absorbed effectively if given via the GI tract ? No mention of this in the literature accompanying the Konakion. Most IM meds are NOT designed to be administered or guaranteed by the pharmaceutical company to be effective if given orally. It may be neutralised by gastric secretions, I am unaware of any research re this. Anyone else know of any ? If you are going to introduce a foreign substance into the GI tract of a baby you'd want to have a good reason be sure that it was being absorbed wouldn't you ? With kind regards Brenda Manning www.themidwife.com.au - Original Message - From: "diane" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 6:48 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Apart from the fact it tastes like Sh** (very bitter). Been reading about Vit K all day today . Seems like a pretty good option as far as the statitistics go. http://www.nhmrc.gov.au/publications/_files/ch39.pdf they recommend further research into the effectiveness of supplimenting brestfeeding mothers to increase the vit K in breastmilk as an effective suppliment. Di - Original Message - From: "Kelly @ BellyBelly" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 5:30 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Just a side question if that's okay - what are your opinions on oral vitamin K versus injection? Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Andrea Quanchi Sent: Friday, 26 May 2006 3:24 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: The place I work we give it when we do the NST. It was a midwife decision not an evidence based one. Like giving it with the vit K it is easier to do it at a predictable time so that it doesn't get overlooked. The midwives wanted not to do it at birth as they were wanting to do as little as possible to interupt Mum and baby, As we need to have a signed consent form to give it and the mothers have often not filled this is prior to birth it was very interupting to get all this"Done" on the birth day and we find it not an issue later when everyone has had time to sit down read the literature and discuss it. Of course then we do have a number of mums who decline to have it which is their right and is not an issue
Re: [ozmidwifery] Re:
Hi,I have several different thoughts on Vit K, they do contradict each other a bit, Firstly, with regards to supplementing, most women would supplement pre-pregnancy and first three months with folic acid to prevent neural tube defects- so why would you not consider the same for HDN- HOWEVER why does mother nature give babies"low levels" of vit K ???,With regards to giving oral vit K,we try so hard to promote breast feeding and avoid BMS;obviously for many reasons, but one of them being it (BMS) changes thebalanceof the GI system, so why introducea preparation thatis specially prepared for IM administration- surelyitwould cause some sort of irritation/ unbablanceto the GIS.It is such a big topic, and I am probably a bit of a fence sitter on it,I suppose it's just a decision each parent has to make, with (hopefully) an informedconsent.VickySue Cookson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Brenda,The surveillance is the reporting of neonates suspected of having HDN caused by low levels of vit K - not a randomised trial - everyone agrees an RCT would be impossible due to the low numbers of babies who do have problems, and the difficulty proving that the problem is caused by whatever vitamin K deficiency may be. Levels of vitamin K drop due to other problems such as liver or gut related pathologies - most of the babies who have died from late onset K deficiency have in fact had undiagnosed liver problems.And the discussion around diet, supplements etc is interesting, but if you spend enough time around big hospitals and see the pitiful state a lot of women are in these days - obese, addicted to coca cola, first choice of a meal after birth is a Big Mac, than you start to see a whole picture of why we might need to make sure people are getting some food groups. Hmm,Sue Thank youSue, So. why haven't hospitals in Oz been given this info when they are administering this drug, mainly IM (perhaps ineffectively)on a daily basis to 100's of babies ?? The healthy neonates aside, what if it doesn't work effectively on the 'at risk' babies it was designed to assist? Are they part of a randomised trial,happening without parental consent ? Brenda - Original Message - From: Sue Cookson To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 8:11 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Hi,With the new Konakion MM it's the other way around. It has been designed by increasing it's absorbability in fat to be more affective if given orally. It has NOT been proven to be as effective as the old Konakion in being absorbed by the IM route. They are waiting to see if the surveillance of the new Konakion through Australia, Switzerland and a few other countries is as effective IM as it is oral. The oral route has been found to give a higher vit K cover than the IM route over a few weeks.THere is so much misinformation about vit K. It is available to the baby through breastmilk and maternal supplementation does increase neonatal serum K levels. What more do we want??And by the way, all formla fed babies should be excluded from any study due to the addition of vit K to formulas. ie babies planned to be formula fed do not need vit k!!Suestudent midwifebirth practitionervit K has been my research assignment for the past three years If a solution is designed to be given IM is it absorbed effectively if given via the GI tract ? No mention of this in the literature accompanying the Konakion. Most IM meds are NOT designed to be administered or guaranteed by the pharmaceutical company to be effective if given orally. It may be neutralised by gastric secretions, I am unaware of any research re this. Anyone else know of any ?If you are going to introduce a foreign substance into the GI tract of a baby you'd want to have a good reason be sure that it was being absorbed wouldn't you ?With kind regards Brenda Manning www.themidwife.com.au- Original Message - From: "diane" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 6:48 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Apart from the fact it tastes like Sh** (very bitter). Been reading about Vit K all day today . Seems like a pretty good option as far as the statitistics go. http://www.nhmrc.gov.au/publications/_files/ch39.pdfthey recommend further research into the effectiveness of supplimenting brestfeeding mothers to increase the vit K in breastmilk as an effective suppliment.Di - Original Message - From: "Kelly @ BellyBelly" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 5:30 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re:Just a side question if that's okay - what are your opinions on oral vitamin K versus injection?Best Regards,Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/bi
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My understanding is that the preparation is designed to be absorbed from all tissues, especially to meet the challenges of the oral route, MM From: Vicky so why introducea preparation thatis specially prepared for IM administration- surelyitwould cause some sort of irritation/ unbablanceto the GIS.
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Apart from the fact it tastes like Sh** (very bitter). Been reading about Vit K all day today . Seems like a pretty good option as far as the statitistics go. http://www.nhmrc.gov.au/publications/_files/ch39.pdf they recommend further research into the effectiveness of supplimenting brestfeeding mothers to increase the vit K in breastmilk as an effective suppliment. Di - Original Message - From: Kelly @ BellyBelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 5:30 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Just a side question if that's okay - what are your opinions on oral vitamin K versus injection? Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andrea Quanchi Sent: Friday, 26 May 2006 3:24 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: The place I work we give it when we do the NST. It was a midwife decision not an evidence based one. Like giving it with the vit K it is easier to do it at a predictable time so that it doesn't get overlooked. The midwives wanted not to do it at birth as they were wanting to do as little as possible to interupt Mum and baby, As we need to have a signed consent form to give it and the mothers have often not filled this is prior to birth it was very interupting to get all thisDone on the birth day and we find it not an issue later when everyone has had time to sit down read the literature and discuss it. Of course then we do have a number of mums who decline to have it which is their right and is not an issue at all. Andrea Q On 25/05/2006, at 8:10 PM, Amanda W wrote: Hi all, I have just started working at a new health facility that tends to give hep B injections on day 2 or 3. I have come from a facility that gives hep B at birth when vitamin k is given. Can anyone shed some light as to why the might do it this way. Any articles. They seem to not know why they do it. I just want to change practice so that can be done at the same time as the vitamin k. Thanks. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Re:
If a solution is designed to be given IM is it absorbed effectively if given via the GI tract ? No mention of this in the literature accompanying the Konakion. Most IM meds are NOT designed to be administered or guaranteed by the pharmaceutical company to be effective if given orally. It may be neutralised by gastric secretions, I am unaware of any research re this. Anyone else know of any ? If you are going to introduce a foreign substance into the GI tract of a baby you'd want to have a good reason be sure that it was being absorbed wouldn't you ? With kind regards Brenda Manning www.themidwife.com.au - Original Message - From: diane [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 6:48 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Apart from the fact it tastes like Sh** (very bitter). Been reading about Vit K all day today . Seems like a pretty good option as far as the statitistics go. http://www.nhmrc.gov.au/publications/_files/ch39.pdf they recommend further research into the effectiveness of supplimenting brestfeeding mothers to increase the vit K in breastmilk as an effective suppliment. Di - Original Message - From: Kelly @ BellyBelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 5:30 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Just a side question if that's okay - what are your opinions on oral vitamin K versus injection? Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andrea Quanchi Sent: Friday, 26 May 2006 3:24 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: The place I work we give it when we do the NST. It was a midwife decision not an evidence based one. Like giving it with the vit K it is easier to do it at a predictable time so that it doesn't get overlooked. The midwives wanted not to do it at birth as they were wanting to do as little as possible to interupt Mum and baby, As we need to have a signed consent form to give it and the mothers have often not filled this is prior to birth it was very interupting to get all thisDone on the birth day and we find it not an issue later when everyone has had time to sit down read the literature and discuss it. Of course then we do have a number of mums who decline to have it which is their right and is not an issue at all. Andrea Q On 25/05/2006, at 8:10 PM, Amanda W wrote: Hi all, I have just started working at a new health facility that tends to give hep B injections on day 2 or 3. I have come from a facility that gives hep B at birth when vitamin k is given. Can anyone shed some light as to why the might do it this way. Any articles. They seem to not know why they do it. I just want to change practice so that can be done at the same time as the vitamin k. Thanks. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
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Hi Kelly, I like the concept of not giving an injection, but when we were giving oral vit k in the past it felt strange to give something I was used to giving IM orally, ie it was not specially prepared for oral administration. I don't know if there are oral forms for babies, I know there are for adults. It also entails having three doses, which would require parents who would follow this through, either by staying in touch with a health professional who can supply it, or taking the other doses with them and giving them to the baby themselves. With adequate information I am sure parents are capable of this. I think parents should be able to make their own decision. Regards, Nicole. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Kelly @ BellyBelly Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 5:31 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Just a side question if that's okay - what are your opinions on oral vitamin K versus injection? Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andrea Quanchi Sent: Friday, 26 May 2006 3:24 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: The place I work we give it when we do the NST. It was a midwife decision not an evidence based one. Like giving it with the vit K it is easier to do it at a predictable time so that it doesn't get overlooked. The midwives wanted not to do it at birth as they were wanting to do as little as possible to interupt Mum and baby, As we need to have a signed consent form to give it and the mothers have often not filled this is prior to birth it was very interupting to get all thisDone on the birth day and we find it not an issue later when everyone has had time to sit down read the literature and discuss it. Of course then we do have a number of mums who decline to have it which is their right and is not an issue at all. Andrea Q On 25/05/2006, at 8:10 PM, Amanda W wrote: Hi all, I have just started working at a new health facility that tends to give hep B injections on day 2 or 3. I have come from a facility that gives hep B at birth when vitamin k is given. Can anyone shed some light as to why the might do it this way. Any articles. They seem to not know why they do it. I just want to change practice so that can be done at the same time as the vitamin k. Thanks. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
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Hi All, If a baby is truly vitamin K deficient such as may happen if a baby has been on IV fluids only because it was sick then the best way to give Konakion is IMI as it is absorbed more quickly. The fact is most baby's dont need it! Leanne. Leanne Wynne Midwife in charge of Women's Business Mildura Aboriginal Health Service Mob 0418 371862 From: Kelly @ BellyBelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Date: Fri, 26 May 2006 17:30:37 +1000 Just a side question if that's okay - what are your opinions on oral vitamin K versus injection? Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andrea Quanchi Sent: Friday, 26 May 2006 3:24 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: The place I work we give it when we do the NST. It was a midwife decision not an evidence based one. Like giving it with the vit K it is easier to do it at a predictable time so that it doesn't get overlooked. The midwives wanted not to do it at birth as they were wanting to do as little as possible to interupt Mum and baby, As we need to have a signed consent form to give it and the mothers have often not filled this is prior to birth it was very interupting to get all thisDone on the birth day and we find it not an issue later when everyone has had time to sit down read the literature and discuss it. Of course then we do have a number of mums who decline to have it which is their right and is not an issue at all. Andrea Q On 25/05/2006, at 8:10 PM, Amanda W wrote: Hi all, I have just started working at a new health facility that tends to give hep B injections on day 2 or 3. I have come from a facility that gives hep B at birth when vitamin k is given. Can anyone shed some light as to why the might do it this way. Any articles. They seem to not know why they do it. I just want to change practice so that can be done at the same time as the vitamin k. Thanks. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
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Another reason for not giving something you have not checked and drawn up yourself. cheers Judy --- Melissa Singer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Amanda, I have worked places where they don't give Vit K until mum and baby have returned to the ward. They changed their practice so babies are not given any routine medication at all in birth suite (unless for resus) because their have been a few instances where baby inadvertently and tragically was given the mothers syntocinon. A way in this could happen is someone else prepared the synto, accidentally leaves it on the resus trolley. The primary midwife is unaware and gets her own synto and the second midwife thinks she is giving Vik K. Regards, Melissa - Original Message - From: Nicole Carver [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 6:35 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] RE: Hi Amanda, Why not delay the Vit K and do both on day 1? We have just stopped giving vit K and weighing the babe in the birth suite so that there is less interruption to the early time between babe and parent/s and first breast feed. We generally give Hep B on day 2 or 3 if the parents want the babe to have it. Regards, Nicole. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2006 8:11 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all, I have just started working at a new health facility that tends to give hep B injections on day 2 or 3. I have come from a facility that gives hep B at birth when vitamin k is given. Can anyone shed some light as to why the might do it this way. Any articles. They seem to not know why they do it. I just want to change practice so that can be done at the same time as the vitamin k. Thanks. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Re:
Hi, With the new Konakion MM it's the other way around. It has been designed by increasing it's absorbability in fat to be more affective if given orally. It has NOT been proven to be as effective as the old Konakion in being absorbed by the IM route. They are waiting to see if the surveillance of the new Konakion through Australia, Switzerland and a few other countries is as effective IM as it is oral. The oral route has been found to give a higher vit K cover than the IM route over a few weeks. THere is so much misinformation about vit K. It is available to the baby through breastmilk and maternal supplementation does increase neonatal serum K levels. What more do we want?? And by the way, all formla fed babies should be excluded from any study due to the addition of vit K to formulas. ie babies planned to be formula fed do not need vit k!! Sue student midwife birth practitioner vit K has been my research assignment for the past three years If a solution is designed to be given IM is it absorbed effectively if given via the GI tract ? No mention of this in the literature accompanying the Konakion. Most IM meds are NOT designed to be administered or guaranteed by the pharmaceutical company to be effective if given orally. It may be neutralised by gastric secretions, I am unaware of any research re this. Anyone else know of any ? If you are going to introduce a foreign substance into the GI tract of a baby you'd want to have a good reason be sure that it was being absorbed wouldn't you ? With kind regards Brenda Manning www.themidwife.com.au - Original Message - From: "diane" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 6:48 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Apart from the fact it tastes like Sh** (very bitter). Been reading about Vit K all day today . Seems like a pretty good option as far as the statitistics go. http://www.nhmrc.gov.au/publications/_files/ch39.pdf they recommend further research into the effectiveness of supplimenting brestfeeding mothers to increase the vit K in breastmilk as an effective suppliment. Di - Original Message - From: "Kelly @ BellyBelly" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 5:30 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Just a side question if that's okay - what are your opinions on oral vitamin K versus injection? Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Andrea Quanchi Sent: Friday, 26 May 2006 3:24 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: The place I work we give it when we do the NST. It was a midwife decision not an evidence based one. Like giving it with the vit K it is easier to do it at a predictable time so that it doesn't get overlooked. The midwives wanted not to do it at birth as they were wanting to do as little as possible to interupt Mum and baby, As we need to have a signed consent form to give it and the mothers have often not filled this is prior to birth it was very interupting to get all this"Done" on the birth day and we find it not an issue later when everyone has had time to sit down read the literature and discuss it. Of course then we do have a number of mums who decline to have it which is their right and is not an issue at all. Andrea Q On 25/05/2006, at 8:10 PM, Amanda W wrote: Hi all, I have just started working at a new health facility that tends to give hep B injections on day 2 or 3. I have come from a facility that gives hep B at birth when vitamin k is given. Can anyone shed some light as to why the might do it this way. Any articles. They seem to not know why they do it. I just want to change practice so that can be done at the same time as the vitamin k. Thanks. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. __ NOD32 1.1454 (20060321) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.nod32.com
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Am going to paint again - BB are eating/messing with disgusting things - Original Message - From: diane [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 4:48 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Apart from the fact it tastes like Sh** (very bitter). Been reading about Vit K all day today . Seems like a pretty good option as far as the statitistics go. http://www.nhmrc.gov.au/publications/_files/ch39.pdf they recommend further research into the effectiveness of supplimenting brestfeeding mothers to increase the vit K in breastmilk as an effective suppliment. Di - Original Message - From: Kelly @ BellyBelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 5:30 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Just a side question if that's okay - what are your opinions on oral vitamin K versus injection? Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andrea Quanchi Sent: Friday, 26 May 2006 3:24 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: The place I work we give it when we do the NST. It was a midwife decision not an evidence based one. Like giving it with the vit K it is easier to do it at a predictable time so that it doesn't get overlooked. The midwives wanted not to do it at birth as they were wanting to do as little as possible to interupt Mum and baby, As we need to have a signed consent form to give it and the mothers have often not filled this is prior to birth it was very interupting to get all thisDone on the birth day and we find it not an issue later when everyone has had time to sit down read the literature and discuss it. Of course then we do have a number of mums who decline to have it which is their right and is not an issue at all. Andrea Q On 25/05/2006, at 8:10 PM, Amanda W wrote: Hi all, I have just started working at a new health facility that tends to give hep B injections on day 2 or 3. I have come from a facility that gives hep B at birth when vitamin k is given. Can anyone shed some light as to why the might do it this way. Any articles. They seem to not know why they do it. I just want to change practice so that can be done at the same time as the vitamin k. Thanks. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Re:
We give out vit K and hep B info and consent forms at 31 weeks which does give the parents time to read and consent well in advance of the birth. In clinic I find that very few (i.e. virtually none) refuse vitK but some discerning folks elect to avoid the hep B at birth but usually say they will have it with first immunisations. We do give vit K soon after birth but hep B is given at some point before discharge - may be day 1 or 5 depending how long they stay in (and how busy we are) None for a long time have requested oral vit K. I do remember one tragic case where a bub was given synto instead of vit K, a long time ago in UK - baby died I believe, it was a very sad situation with a very experience m/w who was about to retire - a sad end to a long and happy career for this woman, but shows how these mistakes can happen in a busy labour ward when injections are drawn up routinely ahead of need. When I was a 'baby' midwife in UK many years ago, we only gave vit K to bubs that had a traumatic delivery, now its all of them. I wonder about the need although some years back I subscribed to a USA mid list and this topic was discussed - seemed that many of the 'lay' midwives did not give it and the occasional baby did develop HDN in the first week or two, even though mum may have been taking high vit K diet pre and post birth. Sue "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing"Edmund Burke - Original Message - From: Sue Cookson To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 6:11 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Hi,With the new Konakion MM it's the other way around. It has been designed by increasing it's absorbability in fat to be more affective if given orally. It has NOT been proven to be as effective as the old Konakion in being absorbed by the IM route. They are waiting to see if the surveillance of the new Konakion through Australia, Switzerland and a few other countries is as effective IM as it is oral. The oral route has been found to give a higher vit K cover than the IM route over a few weeks.THere is so much misinformation about vit K. It is available to the baby through breastmilk and maternal supplementation does increase neonatal serum K levels. What more do we want??And by the way, all formla fed babies should be excluded from any study due to the addition of vit K to formulas. ie babies planned to be formula fed do not need vit k!!Suestudent midwifebirth practitionervit K has been my research assignment for the past three years If a solution is designed to be given IM is it absorbed effectively if given via the GI tract ? No mention of this in the literature accompanying the Konakion. Most IM meds are NOT designed to be administered or guaranteed by the pharmaceutical company to be effective if given orally. It may be neutralised by gastric secretions, I am unaware of any research re this. Anyone else know of any ? If you are going to introduce a foreign substance into the GI tract of a baby you'd want to have a good reason be sure that it was being absorbed wouldn't you ? With kind regards Brenda Manning www.themidwife.com.au - Original Message - From: "diane" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 6:48 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Apart from the fact it tastes like Sh** (very bitter). Been reading about Vit K all day today . Seems like a pretty good option as far as the statitistics go. http://www.nhmrc.gov.au/publications/_files/ch39.pdf they recommend further research into the effectiveness of supplimenting brestfeeding mothers to increase the vit K in breastmilk as an effective suppliment. Di - Original Message - From: "Kelly @ BellyBelly" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 5:30 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Just a side question if that's okay - what are your opinions on oral vitamin K versus injection? Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Andrea Quanchi Sent: Friday, 26 May 2006 3:24 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: The place I work we give it when we do the NST. It was a midwife decision not an evidence based one. Like giving it with the vit K it is easier to do it at a predictable time so that it doesn't get overlooked. The midwives wanted not to do it at birth as they were wanting to do as little as possible to interupt Mum and baby, As we need to have a signed consent form to give it and the mothers have often not filled this is prior to birth it was very interupting to get all this"Done" on the bir
Re: [ozmidwifery] Re:
Thank youSue, So. why haven't hospitals in Oz been given this info when they are administering this drug, mainly IM (perhaps ineffectively)on a daily basis to 100's of babies ?? The healthy neonates aside, what if it doesn't work effectively on the 'at risk' babies it was designed to assist? Are they part of a randomised trial,happening without parental consent ? Brenda - Original Message - From: Sue Cookson To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 8:11 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Hi,With the new Konakion MM it's the other way around. It has been designed by increasing it's absorbability in fat to be more affective if given orally. It has NOT been proven to be as effective as the old Konakion in being absorbed by the IM route. They are waiting to see if the surveillance of the new Konakion through Australia, Switzerland and a few other countries is as effective IM as it is oral. The oral route has been found to give a higher vit K cover than the IM route over a few weeks.THere is so much misinformation about vit K. It is available to the baby through breastmilk and maternal supplementation does increase neonatal serum K levels. What more do we want??And by the way, all formla fed babies should be excluded from any study due to the addition of vit K to formulas. ie babies planned to be formula fed do not need vit k!!Suestudent midwifebirth practitionervit K has been my research assignment for the past three years If a solution is designed to be given IM is it absorbed effectively if given via the GI tract ? No mention of this in the literature accompanying the Konakion. Most IM meds are NOT designed to be administered or guaranteed by the pharmaceutical company to be effective if given orally. It may be neutralised by gastric secretions, I am unaware of any research re this. Anyone else know of any ? If you are going to introduce a foreign substance into the GI tract of a baby you'd want to have a good reason be sure that it was being absorbed wouldn't you ? With kind regards Brenda Manning www.themidwife.com.au - Original Message - From: "diane" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 6:48 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Apart from the fact it tastes like Sh** (very bitter). Been reading about Vit K all day today . Seems like a pretty good option as far as the statitistics go. http://www.nhmrc.gov.au/publications/_files/ch39.pdf they recommend further research into the effectiveness of supplimenting brestfeeding mothers to increase the vit K in breastmilk as an effective suppliment. Di - Original Message - From: "Kelly @ BellyBelly" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 5:30 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Just a side question if that's okay - what are your opinions on oral vitamin K versus injection? Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Andrea Quanchi Sent: Friday, 26 May 2006 3:24 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: The place I work we give it when we do the NST. It was a midwife decision not an evidence based one. Like giving it with the vit K it is easier to do it at a predictable time so that it doesn't get overlooked. The midwives wanted not to do it at birth as they were wanting to do as little as possible to interupt Mum and baby, As we need to have a signed consent form to give it and the mothers have often not filled this is prior to birth it was very interupting to get all this"Done" on the birth day and we find it not an issue later when everyone has had time to sit down read the literature and discuss it. Of course then we do have a number of mums who decline to have it which is their right and is not an issue at all. Andrea Q On 25/05/2006, at 8:10 PM, Amanda W wrote: Hi all, I have just started working at a new health facility that tends to give hep B injections on day 2 or 3. I have come from a facility that gives hep B at birth when vitamin k is given. Can anyone shed some light as to why the might do it this way. Any articles. They seem to not know why they do it. I just want to change practice so that can be done at the same time as the vitamin k. Thanks. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This ma
