Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Wednesday 24 January 2007 15:41, Roman Neuhauser wrote: # [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 13:57:03 +0200: and also in these days I'm looking for 19 inch (or more) wide LCD sceerns to able to fit longer lines in my screen... Number of reading errors people make grows with line length, this has been known for as long as I remember. You're increasing the probability of bugs in the code, and get tired sooner because following long lines requires more energy. Yes and no, because these days I'm obsessed very very large arrays like $arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for']; And If I start to do if( ($arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 5) ($arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 10)) blah blah then problem begins :) -- How many Vietnam vets does it take to screw in a light bulb? You don't know, man. You don't KNOW. Cause you weren't THERE. http://bash.org/?255991 -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
# [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-25 11:06:22 +0200: On Wednesday 24 January 2007 15:41, Roman Neuhauser wrote: # [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 13:57:03 +0200: and also in these days I'm looking for 19 inch (or more) wide LCD sceerns to able to fit longer lines in my screen... Number of reading errors people make grows with line length, this has been known for as long as I remember. You're increasing the probability of bugs in the code, and get tired sooner because following long lines requires more energy. Yes and no, because these days I'm obsessed very very large arrays like $arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for']; Well, ugh! And If I start to do if( ($arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 5) ($arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 10)) blah blah then problem begins :) That's atrocious no matter how wide your screen is. -- How many Vietnam vets does it take to screw in a light bulb? You don't know, man. You don't KNOW. Cause you weren't THERE. http://bash.org/?255991 -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
Vinicius C Silva wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? Just thought I'd add my bit, I used to use phpedit when I developed on a windows systems, then I started using Zend. Ive now moved to linux and still use Zend and I am slowly learning VIM. Now, eddie, the dude I work with is a vi master, he does stuff in that editor that Zend can't even comprehend. Watching eddie work with vi, is like watching a conductor conducting a orchestra, quick, efficient and pretty much amazing. clive ps. I dont really listen to orchestral music. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Thu, 2007-01-25 at 10:12 +, Roman Neuhauser wrote: # [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-25 11:06:22 +0200: On Wednesday 24 January 2007 15:41, Roman Neuhauser wrote: # [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 13:57:03 +0200: and also in these days I'm looking for 19 inch (or more) wide LCD sceerns to able to fit longer lines in my screen... Number of reading errors people make grows with line length, this has been known for as long as I remember. You're increasing the probability of bugs in the code, and get tired sooner because following long lines requires more energy. Yes and no, because these days I'm obsessed very very large arrays like $arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for']; Well, ugh! And If I start to do if( ($arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 5) ($arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 10)) That's terrible... first off we'll start by doing the following: if( ($arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 5) ($arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 10) ) Next we'll chop off the redundant bits: if( $arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 5 $arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 10 ) Now we'll make sure we don't throw any sloppy errors: if( isset( $arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] ) $arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 5 $arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 10 ) :) Cheers, Rob. -- .. | InterJinn Application Framework - http://www.interjinn.com | :: | An application and templating framework for PHP. Boasting | | a powerful, scalable system for accessing system services | | such as forms, properties, sessions, and caches. InterJinn | | also provides an extremely flexible architecture for | | creating re-usable components quickly and easily. | `' -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Fwd: Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Thursday 25 January 2007 08:14, David Robley wrote: tedd wrote: At 9:07 PM -0500 1/24/07, Robert Cummings wrote: Code structure Ahem to that! You're on a roll brother -- keep going. Can I get another Ahem?! tedd I'll see your 'Ahem' and raise you an 'Amen' :-) 'n a God Bless. Cheers -- David Robley Vultures only fly with carrion luggage. Today is Setting Orange, the 25th day of Chaos in the YOLD 3173. -- --- Børge Kennel Arivene http://www.arivene.net --- -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Thu, January 25, 2007 3:06 am, Sancar Saran wrote: On Wednesday 24 January 2007 15:41, Roman Neuhauser wrote: # [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 13:57:03 +0200: and also in these days I'm looking for 19 inch (or more) wide LCD sceerns to able to fit longer lines in my screen... Number of reading errors people make grows with line length, this has been known for as long as I remember. You're increasing the probability of bugs in the code, and get tired sooner because following long lines requires more energy. Yes and no, because these days I'm obsessed very very large arrays like $arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for']; And If I start to do if( ($arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 5) ($arr['this']['is']['what']['i']['m']['looking']['for'] 10)) blah blah then problem begins :) Get back to us after you get over your array obsession... :-) I rarely find myself using more than 2-D, or occasionally, 3-D array lookups within any given section of code. I *might* have deeper arrays, but I'm either going to recurse through them, or break it down by what's actually in all those layers, and do something different as I descend. I would suggest that if one has data nested that deeply, perhaps the stat structure itself is a poor choice. :-) -- Some people have a gift link here. Know what I want? I want you to buy a CD from some starving artist. http://cdbaby.com/browse/from/lynch Yeah, I get a buck. So? -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Wed, January 24, 2007 8:07 pm, Robert Cummings wrote: On Wed, 2007-01-24 at 18:23 -0600, Richard Lynch wrote: On Wed, January 24, 2007 7:41 am, Roman Neuhauser wrote: # [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 13:57:03 +0200: and also in these days I'm looking for 19 inch (or more) wide LCD sceerns to able to fit longer lines in my screen... Number of reading errors people make grows with line length, this has been known for as long as I remember. You're increasing the probability of bugs in the code, and get tired sooner because following long lines requires more energy. I believe those results are specific to what is being read. Surely it's easier to read: SELECT blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah if it's all on one line, no matter how many fields there are, while trying to read the code as a whole. Sure, it can be hard to find/read the individual field names, on the rare occasion that you need to do that... Dear Mr Lynch, normally I highly respect your commentary on the list, but today I think you've been-a-smoking the crackpipe a tad too much. There is no way in hell one long line of SQL is easier to read than formatted SQL that clearly delineates the clause structure. SELECT A.field1 AS afield1, A.field2 AS afield2, B.field1 AS bfield1, B.field2 AS bfield2, C.field1 AS cfield1, C.field2 AS cfield2, D.field1 AS dfield1, D.field2 AS dfield2 FROM tableA as A LEFT JOIN tableB AS B ON B.fee = A.foo LEFT JOIN tableC AS C ON C.fii = B.fee LEFT JOIN tableD AS D ON D.fuu = C.fii WHERE A.foo = 'someValue' ORDER BY afield1 ASC, cfield2 ASC The above line should be on one line, but my email client might autowrap it. Either way, the following is formatted and is much clearer. SELECT A.field1 AS afield1, A.field2 AS afield2, B.field1 AS bfield1, B.field2 AS bfield2, C.field1 AS cfield1, C.field2 AS cfield2, D.field1 AS dfield1, D.field2 AS dfield2 FROM tableA as A LEFT JOIN tableB AS B ON B.fee = A.foo LEFT JOIN tableC AS C ON C.fii = B.fee LEFT JOIN tableD AS D ON D.fuu = C.fii WHERE A.foo = 'someValue' ORDER BY afield1 ASC, cfield2 ASC While the above is contrived, most of us know such examples happen quite often in the wild. Not only is it easier to read, but the task of adding or removing selected fields is trivial. I meant ONLY the SELECT part on a single line. Only a moron would cram the FROM and all that into the same line. :-) $query = SELECT blah1, blah2, blah3, ... blah147 ; $query .= FROM table1 ; $query .= LEFT OUTER JOIN table2 ; $query .= ON blah7 = blah42 ; $query .= WHERE blah16 ; $query .=AND blah42 ; $query .= ORDER BY blah9, blah8 desc, blah6 ; is what I go for. The SELECT line is the only one that ever gets all that long, really... -- Some people have a gift link here. Know what I want? I want you to buy a CD from some starving artist. http://cdbaby.com/browse/from/lynch Yeah, I get a buck. So? -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On 21/01/07, Arno Kuhl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Original Message- From: Vinicius C Silva [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 21 January 2007 02:54 To: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: [PHP] most powerful php editor For me the analogy goes something like this: if you type the occasional letter or note then Wordpad is perfectly adequate, but if your livelihood is churning out professional well-formatted heavy-weight documents then it pays you to invest in a top-class word processor and supporting tools. Or alternatively, use vim and LaTeX and produce documents of a consistently higher quality than practically any top-class word processor. -robin -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Wed, 2007-01-24 at 10:31 +, Robin Vickery wrote: On 21/01/07, Arno Kuhl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Original Message- From: Vinicius C Silva [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 21 January 2007 02:54 To: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: [PHP] most powerful php editor For me the analogy goes something like this: if you type the occasional letter or note then Wordpad is perfectly adequate, but if your livelihood is churning out professional well-formatted heavy-weight documents then it pays you to invest in a top-class word processor and supporting tools. Or alternatively, use vim and LaTeX and produce documents of a consistently higher quality than practically any top-class word processor. The inherent problem in any top-class word processor being used to produce PHP code is that PHP will quite likely (read WILL) choke on the binary format. And if it's not saved in a binary format, then it's probable you've lost all that top-class formatting :B Cheers, Rob. -- .. | InterJinn Application Framework - http://www.interjinn.com | :: | An application and templating framework for PHP. Boasting | | a powerful, scalable system for accessing system services | | such as forms, properties, sessions, and caches. InterJinn | | also provides an extremely flexible architecture for | | creating re-usable components quickly and easily. | `' -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
I believe this was related to what did you want to do with your editor. I use these editors Linux - KDE - Kate Win32 - Ultra Edit Both are support UTF8 and both can handle more than one file at one session.. Enough search and replace abilites. Both can highlight code... I wish to KDE (and or Kate) can support key macros to support my G15 extra buttons for speeding up some HTML and PHP standart code blocks... I use pico and nano for editing php code very long time ago. (multiple shell windows etc). Then I realize, abilites of editor effect my coding style. At that days, I star to add line brake to SQL querys line because of long sql querys does not fit the screen. And also I detect when you adjust yourself to high capacity editor, you may be very frusturated and feel uncomfortable with that low capacity ones... and also in these days I'm looking for 19 inch (or more) wide LCD sceerns to able to fit longer lines in my screen... Regards Sancar -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
# [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 13:57:03 +0200: and also in these days I'm looking for 19 inch (or more) wide LCD sceerns to able to fit longer lines in my screen... Number of reading errors people make grows with line length, this has been known for as long as I remember. You're increasing the probability of bugs in the code, and get tired sooner because following long lines requires more energy. -- How many Vietnam vets does it take to screw in a light bulb? You don't know, man. You don't KNOW. Cause you weren't THERE. http://bash.org/?255991 -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Wed, 2007-01-24 at 13:41 +, Roman Neuhauser wrote: # [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 13:57:03 +0200: and also in these days I'm looking for 19 inch (or more) wide LCD sceerns to able to fit longer lines in my screen... Number of reading errors people make grows with line length, this has been known for as long as I remember. You're increasing the probability of bugs in the code, and get tired sooner because following long lines requires more energy. Yep long lines are hard to read and formatting lines can improve information absorption by providing extra visual cues. I use a 20 LCD monitor and still format to 78 character wide lines. Cheers, Rob. -- .. | InterJinn Application Framework - http://www.interjinn.com | :: | An application and templating framework for PHP. Boasting | | a powerful, scalable system for accessing system services | | such as forms, properties, sessions, and caches. InterJinn | | also provides an extremely flexible architecture for | | creating re-usable components quickly and easily. | `' -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
At 09:41 AM 1/24/2007, Roman Neuhauser wrote: # [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 13:57:03 +0200: and also in these days I'm looking for 19 inch (or more) wide LCD sceerns to able to fit longer lines in my screen... Number of reading errors people make grows with line length, this has been known for as long as I remember. You're increasing the probability of bugs in the code, and get tired sooner because following long lines requires more energy. Good point Roman. Just think how that would cut down traffic on the list! The most powerful editor should have a setting MAX_WORDS_PER_LINE = 11. g More seriously, many times I've taken a It's right, but not working, dammit! SQL statement, broken it up so it's listed vertically and discovered the error. Rather than a wide monitor, I'd like to have a tall one - say 21 square. How did we ever live with 12 terminal windows - huge to KayPro folk. Cheers - Miles -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.410 / Virus Database: 268.17.8/649 - Release Date: 1/23/2007 -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
Miles Thompson wrote:
More seriously, many times I've taken a It's right, but not working,
dammit! SQL statement,
broken it up so it's listed vertically and discovered the error.
Just my 2 cents worth...
SQL actually does lend itself rather well to normal code style
indenting, even though not many seem to do it...Breaking it (and PHP
code of course) into 78/80-char lines makes great sense for readability
within PHP code:
$sql =
SELECT
(list of fields),
CASE ... END AS field
...
FROM (table)
JOIN (table) USING(column)
JOIN (table) ON(column=column)
...
WHERE
(condition)
AND
(
(sub-condition)
OR
(sub-condition)
)
GROUP BY (column)
...
;
These things are a real pain to read without formatting! :-)
I think writing unformatted SQL queries is like writing code like if
($var) { statement; statement; statement; foreach ($var as $v) {
statement; statement; statement; } statement; etc. }
jon
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Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
# [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 10:44:21 -0400: Rather than a wide monitor, I'd like to have a tall one - say 21 square. Wide screens are nice, you can have more 80-char terminals next to each other. -- How many Vietnam vets does it take to screw in a light bulb? You don't know, man. You don't KNOW. Cause you weren't THERE. http://bash.org/?255991 -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
At 10:04 AM -0500 1/24/07, Jon Anderson wrote:
Miles Thompson wrote:
More seriously, many times I've taken a It's right, but not
working, dammit! SQL statement,
broken it up so it's listed vertically and discovered the error.
Just my 2 cents worth...
SQL actually does lend itself rather well to normal code style
indenting, even though not many seem to do it...Breaking it (and PHP
code of course) into 78/80-char lines makes great sense for
readability within PHP code:
-snip-
These things are a real pain to read without formatting! :-)
I think writing unformatted SQL queries is like writing code like
if ($var) { statement; statement; statement; foreach ($var as $v) {
statement; statement; statement; } statement; etc. }
jon
jon:
That's nice -- never thought about that -- thanks.
As for monitor size, I've noticed over the years that my function
size increased with the height of my monitor.
The width of my monitors didn't affect much because I've always
worked with one line, one statement and most statements are shorter
than 80 characters. However, having more than one monitor (I have
three) is absolutely great in that I can have several windows open at
the same time.
As for 12 inch monitors, I remember my old Apple ][ with a 9 inch
monitor (not Apple, I think Sanyo) that I used with a real-time
analog video camera, graphic tablet for digitizing, and the
computer's text and graphics were drawn on top of everything -- now
that was small, but it worked great. I could digitize the head of
Lincoln from a penny.
tedd
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Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Wed, January 24, 2007 7:41 am, Roman Neuhauser wrote: # [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 13:57:03 +0200: and also in these days I'm looking for 19 inch (or more) wide LCD sceerns to able to fit longer lines in my screen... Number of reading errors people make grows with line length, this has been known for as long as I remember. You're increasing the probability of bugs in the code, and get tired sooner because following long lines requires more energy. I believe those results are specific to what is being read. Surely it's easier to read: SELECT blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah if it's all on one line, no matter how many fields there are, while trying to read the code as a whole. Sure, it can be hard to find/read the individual field names, on the rare occasion that you need to do that... Assuming you actually planned your DB and queries out to fit your application needs in the first place. I guess if you're coding in an unstructured iterative way to design the db, then, yeah, it would be harder on the eyes as you morph that statement into what it should be... :-v -- Some people have a gift link here. Know what I want? I want you to buy a CD from some starving artist. http://cdbaby.com/browse/from/lynch Yeah, I get a buck. So? -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
# [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 18:23:10 -0600: On Wed, January 24, 2007 7:41 am, Roman Neuhauser wrote: # [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 13:57:03 +0200: and also in these days I'm looking for 19 inch (or more) wide LCD sceerns to able to fit longer lines in my screen... Number of reading errors people make grows with line length, this has been known for as long as I remember. You're increasing the probability of bugs in the code, and get tired sooner because following long lines requires more energy. I believe those results are specific to what is being read. Surely it's easier to read: SELECT blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah Not for me. SQL is just another programming language, and I fail to see why principles of programming hygiene shouldn't apply to it. Sure, it can be hard to find/read the individual field names, on the rare occasion that you need to do that... Like, on the rare occasion that you need to find a bug in a program with poor formatting. Assuming you actually planned your DB and queries out to fit your application needs in the first place. I guess if you're coding in an unstructured iterative way to design the db, then, yeah, it would be harder on the eyes as you morph that statement into what it should be... :-v That's a strong argument against indenting source code: all you need is a solid design upfront! Of course, if your queries sum up to blah, blah, blah, it might not be worth designing them in the first place. :-^ -- How many Vietnam vets does it take to screw in a light bulb? You don't know, man. You don't KNOW. Cause you weren't THERE. http://bash.org/?255991 -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On 1/20/07, Vinicius C Silva [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? So now we have a 4 day thread of discussing nothing but, this is what i use Curt. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
Curt Zirzow wrote: On 1/20/07, Vinicius C Silva [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? So now we have a 4 day thread of discussing nothing but, this is what i use let see if we can make it a full week :-P Curt. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
Jochem Maas wrote: Curt Zirzow wrote: On 1/20/07, Vinicius C Silva [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? So now we have a 4 day thread of discussing nothing but, this is what i use let see if we can make it a full week :-P If we want to argue about this, let's set a few guidelines as to what powerful means. I propose these guidelines 1. Syntax highlighting 2. Web server integration 3. Link checking 4. Browser check in the top three (Mozilla-IE-Opera) Now maybe you disagree, maybe you agree. I'd love to just use vi and type away, but quite frankly I'm not that smart. And if you have your own guidelines, let's hear them. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Wed, 2007-01-24 at 18:23 -0600, Richard Lynch wrote: On Wed, January 24, 2007 7:41 am, Roman Neuhauser wrote: # [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-24 13:57:03 +0200: and also in these days I'm looking for 19 inch (or more) wide LCD sceerns to able to fit longer lines in my screen... Number of reading errors people make grows with line length, this has been known for as long as I remember. You're increasing the probability of bugs in the code, and get tired sooner because following long lines requires more energy. I believe those results are specific to what is being read. Surely it's easier to read: SELECT blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah if it's all on one line, no matter how many fields there are, while trying to read the code as a whole. Sure, it can be hard to find/read the individual field names, on the rare occasion that you need to do that... Dear Mr Lynch, normally I highly respect your commentary on the list, but today I think you've been-a-smoking the crackpipe a tad too much. There is no way in hell one long line of SQL is easier to read than formatted SQL that clearly delineates the clause structure. SELECT A.field1 AS afield1, A.field2 AS afield2, B.field1 AS bfield1, B.field2 AS bfield2, C.field1 AS cfield1, C.field2 AS cfield2, D.field1 AS dfield1, D.field2 AS dfield2 FROM tableA as A LEFT JOIN tableB AS B ON B.fee = A.foo LEFT JOIN tableC AS C ON C.fii = B.fee LEFT JOIN tableD AS D ON D.fuu = C.fii WHERE A.foo = 'someValue' ORDER BY afield1 ASC, cfield2 ASC The above line should be on one line, but my email client might autowrap it. Either way, the following is formatted and is much clearer. SELECT A.field1 AS afield1, A.field2 AS afield2, B.field1 AS bfield1, B.field2 AS bfield2, C.field1 AS cfield1, C.field2 AS cfield2, D.field1 AS dfield1, D.field2 AS dfield2 FROM tableA as A LEFT JOIN tableB AS B ON B.fee = A.foo LEFT JOIN tableC AS C ON C.fii = B.fee LEFT JOIN tableD AS D ON D.fuu = C.fii WHERE A.foo = 'someValue' ORDER BY afield1 ASC, cfield2 ASC While the above is contrived, most of us know such examples happen quite often in the wild. Not only is it easier to read, but the task of adding or removing selected fields is trivial. Cheers, Rob. -- .. | InterJinn Application Framework - http://www.interjinn.com | :: | An application and templating framework for PHP. Boasting | | a powerful, scalable system for accessing system services | | such as forms, properties, sessions, and caches. InterJinn | | also provides an extremely flexible architecture for | | creating re-usable components quickly and easily. | `' -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Wed, 2007-01-24 at 18:48 -0700, John Meyer wrote: Jochem Maas wrote: Curt Zirzow wrote: On 1/20/07, Vinicius C Silva [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? So now we have a 4 day thread of discussing nothing but, this is what i use let see if we can make it a full week :-P If we want to argue about this, let's set a few guidelines as to what powerful means. I propose these guidelines 1. Syntax highlighting Useful, but I stuck with joe for 3 years before they got syntax highlighting. I like the editor that much :) 2. Web server integration Why? Web servers read files. Editor's read and write files. Seems the filesystem is plenty of glue. 3. Link checking Ummm, what do you do about generated links? My experience has been that ripping through the site towards the end of development with wget is quite satisfactory. 4. Browser check in the top three (Mozilla-IE-Opera) Huh? What's browser check? Don't you just test with each of the browsers? IE works quite nicely with windows confined to a vmware sandbox. Cheers, Rob. -- .. | InterJinn Application Framework - http://www.interjinn.com | :: | An application and templating framework for PHP. Boasting | | a powerful, scalable system for accessing system services | | such as forms, properties, sessions, and caches. InterJinn | | also provides an extremely flexible architecture for | | creating re-usable components quickly and easily. | `' -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Wednesday 24 January 2007 8:07 pm, Robert Cummings wrote: There is no way in hell one long line of SQL is easier to read than formatted SQL that clearly delineates the clause structure. Sure there is. If it's a very simple SQL statement. I have at various times done all of the following, depending on the complexity of the statement in question: SELECT id, foo, FROM foo_table WHERE id=5 (Too short to really bother with splitting up.) SELECT id, foo, bar, baz FROM foo_table INNER JOIN bar_table on a=b LEFT OUTER JOIN baz_table on b=c WHERE blah AND stuff narf OR (thingie AND other) ORDER BY foo SELECT a.a, a.b, a.c b.d, b.e, b.f FROM a INNER JOIN b ON whatever ORDER BY a.b, a.c DESC Like any other programming language, or rather any language that isn't Python, formatting matters most to the reader, not to the program. So, optimize your style for readability. Readability is, of course, partially subjective so your style will differ from my style, but the key point is still to optimize the code for when you come back in 3-6 months to add a feature or find an obscure bug and don't remember what the frel you were doing. -- Larry Garfield AIM: LOLG42 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 6817012 If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession of every one, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it. -- Thomas Jefferson -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Wed, 2007-01-24 at 20:44 -0600, Larry Garfield wrote: On Wednesday 24 January 2007 8:07 pm, Robert Cummings wrote: There is no way in hell one long line of SQL is easier to read than formatted SQL that clearly delineates the clause structure. Sure there is. If it's a very simple SQL statement. I have at various times done all of the following, depending on the complexity of the statement in question: SELECT id, foo, FROM foo_table WHERE id=5 (Too short to really bother with splitting up.) SELECT id, foo, bar, baz FROM foo_table INNER JOIN bar_table on a=b LEFT OUTER JOIN baz_table on b=c WHERE blah AND stuff narf OR (thingie AND other) ORDER BY foo SELECT a.a, a.b, a.c b.d, b.e, b.f FROM a INNER JOIN b ON whatever ORDER BY a.b, a.c DESC I notice you formatted all of the long ones. That's why in my original statement I wrote There is no way in hell one long line. Subsequently, I deem you to be in agreement with my point, despite the misguided protest :B Cheers, Rob. -- .. | InterJinn Application Framework - http://www.interjinn.com | :: | An application and templating framework for PHP. Boasting | | a powerful, scalable system for accessing system services | | such as forms, properties, sessions, and caches. InterJinn | | also provides an extremely flexible architecture for | | creating re-usable components quickly and easily. | `' -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
At 6:48 PM -0700 1/24/07, John Meyer wrote: If we want to argue about this, let's set a few guidelines as to what powerful means. I propose these guidelines 1. Syntax highlighting 2. Web server integration 3. Link checking 4. Browser check in the top three (Mozilla-IE-Opera) Now maybe you disagree, maybe you agree. I'd love to just use vi and type away, but quite frankly I'm not that smart. And if you have your own guidelines, let's hear them. I'm not that smart either, but probably more so than you. ;-) I use GoLive for the Mac for all my html, javascript, ajax, dom scripting, php, and mysql development. It has a bunch of WYSIWYG junk that I seldom use. But, it gives me: a great editor (syntax coloring throughout the different languages); allows me to develop real-time on the web (virtual host stuff); with universal link checking (i.e, change one, it changes the rest); excellent search and replace features; and an on-line/off-line directory structure that makes it very easy to update files to/from my server. Plus, it allows me to edit files via their parent application (i.e., Photoshop, GIF editor, Flash, whatever) while using GoLive. As far as Browsers, GoLive can launch any Mac browser, but not IE -- there is no IE for Mac, other than IE5.2. As such, I use BrowserCam to check for layouts and I think that's a better way to check for css differences between browsers. I never observe any php/mysql differences. The layout allows me to set-up my defaults to the way I want thing to be from what the doctypes my files are to be saved as to the way and type of helper windows I want. Cheers, tedd -- --- http://sperling.com http://ancientstones.com http://earthstones.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
At 9:07 PM -0500 1/24/07, Robert Cummings wrote: Dear Mr Lynch, normally I highly respect your commentary on the list, but today I think you've been-a-smoking the crackpipe a tad too much. There is no way in hell one long line of SQL is easier to read than formatted SQL that clearly delineates the clause structure. SELECT A.field1 AS afield1, A.field2 AS afield2, B.field1 AS bfield1, B.field2 AS bfield2, C.field1 AS cfield1, C.field2 AS cfield2, D.field1 AS dfield1, D.field2 AS dfield2 FROM tableA as A LEFT JOIN tableB AS B ON B.fee = A.foo LEFT JOIN tableC AS C ON C.fii = B.fee LEFT JOIN tableD AS D ON D.fuu = C.fii WHERE A.foo = 'someValue' ORDER BY afield1 ASC, cfield2 ASC The above line should be on one line, but my email client might autowrap it. Either way, the following is formatted and is much clearer. SELECT A.field1 AS afield1, A.field2 AS afield2, B.field1 AS bfield1, B.field2 AS bfield2, C.field1 AS cfield1, C.field2 AS cfield2, D.field1 AS dfield1, D.field2 AS dfield2 FROM tableA as A LEFT JOIN tableB AS B ON B.fee = A.foo LEFT JOIN tableC AS C ON C.fii = B.fee LEFT JOIN tableD AS D ON D.fuu = C.fii WHERE A.foo = 'someValue' ORDER BY afield1 ASC, cfield2 ASC While the above is contrived, most of us know such examples happen quite often in the wild. Not only is it easier to read, but the task of adding or removing selected fields is trivial. Cheers, Rob. Ahem to that! You're on a roll brother -- keep going. Can I get another Ahem?! tedd -- --- http://sperling.com http://ancientstones.com http://earthstones.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Wednesday 24 January 2007 7:48 pm, John Meyer wrote: Jochem Maas wrote: Curt Zirzow wrote: On 1/20/07, Vinicius C Silva [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? So now we have a 4 day thread of discussing nothing but, this is what i use let see if we can make it a full week :-P If we want to argue about this, let's set a few guidelines as to what powerful means. I propose these guidelines 1. Syntax highlighting Yes. 2. Web server integration Irrelevant, except insofar as it supports a real-time debugger. 3. Link checking 4. Browser check in the top three (Mozilla-IE-Opera) These are both HTML editor features, not PHP editor features. For me, the big three features I want in a PHP dev environment are: - Syntax highlighting. - Context-sensitive code assistance. I hate having to remember the order of parameters, especially when they're irregular. - Real-time debugger. The only one I've found that works for me so far is Zend's. I cannot overstate how useful a real-time debugger is for tracking down bugs in complex applications. -- Larry Garfield AIM: LOLG42 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 6817012 If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession of every one, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it. -- Thomas Jefferson -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
tedd wrote: At 9:07 PM -0500 1/24/07, Robert Cummings wrote: Code structure Ahem to that! You're on a roll brother -- keep going. Can I get another Ahem?! tedd I'll see your 'Ahem' and raise you an 'Amen' :-) Cheers -- David Robley Vultures only fly with carrion luggage. Today is Setting Orange, the 25th day of Chaos in the YOLD 3173. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
# [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2007-01-25 02:21:34 +0100: Curt Zirzow wrote: On 1/20/07, Vinicius C Silva [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? So now we have a 4 day thread of discussing nothing but, this is what i use let see if we can make it a full week :-P This thread has been going on 8 years ago when I first subscribed to this list. 400 weeks has been enough! :] -- How many Vietnam vets does it take to screw in a light bulb? You don't know, man. You don't KNOW. Cause you weren't THERE. http://bash.org/?255991 -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Sat, January 20, 2007 6:54 pm, Vinicius C Silva wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? vi on a Crey. :-) -- Some people have a gift link here. Know what I want? I want you to buy a CD from some starving artist. http://cdbaby.com/browse/from/lynch Yeah, I get a buck. So? -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] most powerful php editor
I would put my vote on Eclipse. It has great support for cvs and also for general coding autofilling etc. The downside is that it is resource demanding... Best regards, Peter Lauri www.dwsasia.com - company web site www.lauri.se - personal web site www.carbonfree.org.uk - become Carbon Free -Original Message- From: Vinicius C Silva [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 2:54 AM To: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: [PHP] most powerful php editor hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Sat, 2007-01-20 at 22:54 -0200, Vinicius C Silva wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? Everyone knows, everyone probably being me, that joe is the best: http://sourceforge.net/projects/joe-editor/ Cheers, Rob. -- .. | InterJinn Application Framework - http://www.interjinn.com | :: | An application and templating framework for PHP. Boasting | | a powerful, scalable system for accessing system services | | such as forms, properties, sessions, and caches. InterJinn | | also provides an extremely flexible architecture for | | creating re-usable components quickly and easily. | `' -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
At 08:21 AM 1/21/2007, Robert Cummings wrote: On Sat, 2007-01-20 at 22:54 -0200, Vinicius C Silva wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? EditPlus or UltraEdit - particularly like the former because I can edit files on the server with its very transparent FTP functions. On top of that they do v. nice syntax highlighting in other languages, even Actionscript. If I could figure out a way to do the same (remote editing) with Eclipse I'd probably invest the time in it; code hinting / completion would be nice, particularly with frameworks like Qcodo. Which then leads me towards ZEND, although I've never used it. These observations have probably not been at all helpful. g Regards - Miles PS You're not forgetting source code control, are you? /mt -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.410 / Virus Database: 268.17.3/642 - Release Date: 1/20/2007 -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
God I love this list.. great answers everyone! (serious and non-serious :) In addition to the editors listed, here's a few more to consider: Crimson Editor - my personal favorite when I don't need code completion. Code highlights for many different types of code (including my beloved LUA files used in World of Warcraft scripting hah). I use the macro record/playback a lot. http://www.crimsoneditor.com/ Emerald Editor - crimson editor has been abandoned for years (and still kicks ass), these guys hope to revive it as a new project called Emerald. It's not done yet. http://www.emeraldeditor.com/ Notepad++ - looks spiffy, but wasn't enough of of a change to get me to switch from Crimson editor (although it came damn close) http://notepad-plus.sourceforge.net/uk/site.htm Zend Studio - Still my 'professional' choice, but since it's a java app, it's kind of heavy on the system. And it's made by the people who created the core PHP engine, so they know a few things. http://www.zend.com/products/zend_studio Komodo - Similar to Zend Studio.. but much like Notepad++ and Crimson Editor.. not enough of an 'upgrade' to get me to switch, but a former coworker swore by it. http://www.activestate.com/Products/Komodo/ Should be enough to get you started investigating. -TG = = = Original message = = = At 08:21 AM 1/21/2007, Robert Cummings wrote: On Sat, 2007-01-20 at 22:54 -0200, Vinicius C Silva wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? ___ Sent by ePrompter, the premier email notification software. Free download at http://www.ePrompter.com. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
Since a couple of IDEs have also been mentioned, I would like to add to the list of sugestions phpEdit (http://waterproof.fr/) for Windows only. It does all that Eclipse with all the plugins for PHP does, plus some, but it is much slimmer and faster. I admit that since what I have already installed satisfies me, I never went beyond the free trial version, but it was really good and woked as advertised, and this was more than a year ago and they keep sending e.mails with the updates, and they keep adding and adding. As I said, I already have all I need, in bits and pieces assembled together over time, but if you start from scratch, this product is great. Satyam - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: php-general@lists.php.net Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor God I love this list.. great answers everyone! (serious and non-serious :) In addition to the editors listed, here's a few more to consider: Crimson Editor - my personal favorite when I don't need code completion. Code highlights for many different types of code (including my beloved LUA files used in World of Warcraft scripting hah). I use the macro record/playback a lot. http://www.crimsoneditor.com/ Emerald Editor - crimson editor has been abandoned for years (and still kicks ass), these guys hope to revive it as a new project called Emerald. It's not done yet. http://www.emeraldeditor.com/ Notepad++ - looks spiffy, but wasn't enough of of a change to get me to switch from Crimson editor (although it came damn close) http://notepad-plus.sourceforge.net/uk/site.htm Zend Studio - Still my 'professional' choice, but since it's a java app, it's kind of heavy on the system. And it's made by the people who created the core PHP engine, so they know a few things. http://www.zend.com/products/zend_studio Komodo - Similar to Zend Studio.. but much like Notepad++ and Crimson Editor.. not enough of an 'upgrade' to get me to switch, but a former coworker swore by it. http://www.activestate.com/Products/Komodo/ Should be enough to get you started investigating. -TG = = = Original message = = = At 08:21 AM 1/21/2007, Robert Cummings wrote: On Sat, 2007-01-20 at 22:54 -0200, Vinicius C Silva wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? ___ Sent by ePrompter, the premier email notification software. Free download at http://www.ePrompter.com. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
That's interesting. I've been trying to use Eclipse, and its code-assistance for PHP is some of the worst I've ever used. I can't type array without it trying to complete that to an Array class from SPL, yet it never auto-completes to any function or class I wrote myself. Nor does it seem to pick up on anything BUT classes. It's terrible. How'd you get it to behave? On Sunday 21 January 2007 5:22 am, Peter Lauri wrote: I would put my vote on Eclipse. It has great support for cvs and also for general coding autofilling etc. The downside is that it is resource demanding... Best regards, Peter Lauri www.dwsasia.com - company web site www.lauri.se - personal web site www.carbonfree.org.uk - become Carbon Free -Original Message- From: Vinicius C Silva [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 2:54 AM To: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: [PHP] most powerful php editor hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? -- Larry Garfield AIM: LOLG42 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 6817012 If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession of every one, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it. -- Thomas Jefferson -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] most powerful php editor
I don't know what version you are using or what plugin you are using, there are more then one plugin :) To be clear: I am using Eclipse 3.1 with PHPEclipse 1.1.8 and that is working very well. It does auto complete classes and functions written by my self etc. I tried some other PHP plugin for Eclipse, and that one behavied like you describe, therefore my change to SourceForge PHP Eclipse Plugin. Best regards, Peter Lauri www.dwsasia.com - company web site www.lauri.se - personal web site www.carbonfree.org.uk - become Carbon Free -Original Message- From: Larry Garfield [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 9:31 PM To: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor That's interesting. I've been trying to use Eclipse, and its code-assistance for PHP is some of the worst I've ever used. I can't type array without it trying to complete that to an Array class from SPL, yet it never auto-completes to any function or class I wrote myself. Nor does it seem to pick up on anything BUT classes. It's terrible. How'd you get it to behave? On Sunday 21 January 2007 5:22 am, Peter Lauri wrote: I would put my vote on Eclipse. It has great support for cvs and also for general coding autofilling etc. The downside is that it is resource demanding... Best regards, Peter Lauri www.dwsasia.com - company web site www.lauri.se - personal web site www.carbonfree.org.uk - become Carbon Free -Original Message- From: Vinicius C Silva [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 2:54 AM To: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: [PHP] most powerful php editor hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? -- Larry Garfield AIM: LOLG42 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 6817012 If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession of every one, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it. -- Thomas Jefferson -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On 1/20/07, Vinicius C Silva [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? I think Stut hinted a lot in his PS he provided, if you believe this to be a common question, it would be best to research this and provide information on what kind of editor you would like to work with. Considering the editors that have been requested: vim: this is the best if you do vim eclipse: this is the best if you do eclipse editor2: this is the best if you do editor2 editor3: this is the best if you do editor3 I would though add to the the mix: ed or cat /dev/random they are the best imo As far as powerful, it depends on what power you want and are capable to do, some people think DreamWeaver is powerful for a php editor, and some people will think a hex editor is even more powerful You have to look at this at what level you want the editor to do things for you. Asking a general question like this to an audience dependent on where their level of comfort is, will get you a different answer all the time. Curt. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
At 10:05 AM -0400 1/21/07, Miles Thompson wrote: Which then leads me towards ZEND, although I've never used it. I purchased the Pro version (ZendStudioClient) but considering that I couldn't get it to work with my host in real time, I went back to GoLive for the Mac. That way my develop, upload, and test cycle is nearly immediate. However, others may have solved this problem more efficiently than me. I often do things the hard way. tedd -- --- http://sperling.com http://ancientstones.com http://earthstones.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] most powerful php editor
-Original Message- From: Vinicius C Silva [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 21 January 2007 02:54 To: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: [PHP] most powerful php editor hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? = There've been lots of good replies to this, and I figured I'll add my 2c I spent several months trying out many editors and IDE's on the Windows platform about 3 years ago - all the usual suspects, most have been mentioned in other replies - and settled on Nusphere's PHPEd (an IDE rather than an editor). Every year when it comes time to renew my license (which I had to do 2 weeks ago) I look at what else is available and new, try out the latest versions of some of the candidates that made it to my short list, and then renew my license anyway because it's worth every cent and because for me there's nothing that matches it. There are lots of good editors and a few good IDE's, but every one I tried had some or other niggle that put me off: buggy software, slow performance, missing or shallow functionality, bitty integration, etc. Nusphere's PHPEd was the 2nd most expensive (at the time) but it hit the sweet spot and I've never regretted buying it. A bonus was finding that the response from the support forum was good, and updates are regular and stable and meaningful. A real bonus was finding that the most recent license renewal is now valid for 3 years instead of 1 year. So I'll only be looking at the competition again in 3 years time - unlike Stut I hope this question is asked at least once a year because I'd like to hear what's new. For me the analogy goes something like this: if you type the occasional letter or note then Wordpad is perfectly adequate, but if your livelihood is churning out professional well-formatted heavy-weight documents then it pays you to invest in a top-class word processor and supporting tools. The same goes for an IDE. Arno -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Mon, 2007-01-22 at 01:22 +0200, Arno Kuhl wrote: For me the analogy goes something like this: if you type the occasional letter or note then Wordpad is perfectly adequate, but if your livelihood is churning out professional well-formatted heavy-weight documents then it pays you to invest in a top-class word processor and supporting tools. The same goes for an IDE. I think I just vomited in my mouth... Yep, tastes like bile :| Cheers, Rob. -- .. | InterJinn Application Framework - http://www.interjinn.com | :: | An application and templating framework for PHP. Boasting | | a powerful, scalable system for accessing system services | | such as forms, properties, sessions, and caches. InterJinn | | also provides an extremely flexible architecture for | | creating re-usable components quickly and easily. | `' -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] most powerful php editor
-Original Message- From: Robert Cummings [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 22 January 2007 01:32 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: RE: [PHP] most powerful php editor On Mon, 2007-01-22 at 01:22 +0200, Arno Kuhl wrote: For me the analogy goes something like this: if you type the occasional letter or note then Wordpad is perfectly adequate, but if your livelihood is churning out professional well-formatted heavy-weight documents then it pays you to invest in a top-class word processor and supporting tools. The same goes for an IDE. I think I just vomited in my mouth... Yep, tastes like bile :| Cheers, Rob. -- Hope you get over it :) So you don't think EditPlus or UltraEdit or Notepad++ (some of the proposed editors that I consider Wordpad-type editors) would be a bit inadequate for more complex project developments? Some people who've never been exposed to a really good IDE think this is as good as it gets. Arno -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] most powerful php editor
On Mon, 2007-01-22 at 02:13 +0200, Arno Kuhl wrote: -Original Message- From: Robert Cummings [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 22 January 2007 01:32 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: RE: [PHP] most powerful php editor On Mon, 2007-01-22 at 01:22 +0200, Arno Kuhl wrote: For me the analogy goes something like this: if you type the occasional letter or note then Wordpad is perfectly adequate, but if your livelihood is churning out professional well-formatted heavy-weight documents then it pays you to invest in a top-class word processor and supporting tools. The same goes for an IDE. I think I just vomited in my mouth... So you don't think EditPlus or UltraEdit or Notepad++ (some of the proposed editors that I consider Wordpad-type editors) would be a bit inadequate for more complex project developments? Some people who've never been exposed to a really good IDE think this is as good as it gets. Not at all, to each their own. But your comment suggests that one can't as easily churn out professional well-formatted heavy-weight documents unless one uses a top-class word processor and supporting tools. The same goes for an IDE. I strongly disagree. Knowledge, experience, and attention to detail produces profession well-formatted heavy-weight documents (in fact more likely lightweight), not the software you use to type it. There are plenty of monkeys that use your ingredients for coding and produce drivel. Cheers, Rob. -- .. | InterJinn Application Framework - http://www.interjinn.com | :: | An application and templating framework for PHP. Boasting | | a powerful, scalable system for accessing system services | | such as forms, properties, sessions, and caches. InterJinn | | also provides an extremely flexible architecture for | | creating re-usable components quickly and easily. | `' -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
Dear god Arnot, would you like to stand back for a moment and consider how retarded those statements are, or would you like for me to do it for you? Whether you use a powerful IDE or not, you still have to use the same compiler underneath. In PHP, that compiler is the web server. Unless you buy an IDE that contains a mini-server for you to test the files, yoru comparison between IDEs and word processors is ludicrous at best. On Mon, 2007-01-22 at 01:22 +0200, Arno Kuhl wrote: For me the analogy goes something like this: if you type the occasional letter or note then Wordpad is perfectly adequate, but if your livelihood is churning out professional well-formatted heavy-weight documents then it pays you to invest in a top-class word processor and supporting tools. The same goes for an IDE. I think I just vomited in my mouth... Yep, tastes like bile :| Cheers, Rob. -- Hope you get over it :) So you don't think EditPlus or UltraEdit or Notepad++ (some of the proposed editors that I consider Wordpad-type editors) would be a bit inadequate for more complex project developments? Some people who've never been exposed to a really good IDE think this is as good as it gets. Arno -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
I was originally using PHPEclipse. When I rebuild my computer a few weeks ago, I decided to give the PHP-IDE package a try (given that Zend is planning to replace their own first-class IDE with the results of the PHP-IDE work). In both of them, I found the same major problems: - Code assistance gets in my way more often than not, and has not once given me useful help. (Zend Studio is a godsend here.) - Setting up new projects out of CVS or SVN and managing them is far harder than it has any right to be. (Zend Studio projects are simply based on a directory tree, not extra indexing, and works just fine for me.) - The whole system is an insane memory hog. - I've not yet figured out how to get it set up with xdebug for easy real-time debugging. (That feature alone is worth using Zend Studio.) To be fair, that could just be me not knowing how to do it. I use Zend Studio at work and love it. I keep trying to find a good open source development setup for home that will let me not have to spend triple digits on Zend Studio for home, but so far I've just not found that with Eclipse. On Sunday 21 January 2007 2:01 pm, Peter Lauri wrote: I don't know what version you are using or what plugin you are using, there are more then one plugin :) To be clear: I am using Eclipse 3.1 with PHPEclipse 1.1.8 and that is working very well. It does auto complete classes and functions written by my self etc. I tried some other PHP plugin for Eclipse, and that one behavied like you describe, therefore my change to SourceForge PHP Eclipse Plugin. Best regards, Peter Lauri www.dwsasia.com - company web site www.lauri.se - personal web site www.carbonfree.org.uk - become Carbon Free -Original Message- From: Larry Garfield [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 9:31 PM To: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor That's interesting. I've been trying to use Eclipse, and its code-assistance for PHP is some of the worst I've ever used. I can't type array without it trying to complete that to an Array class from SPL, yet it never auto-completes to any function or class I wrote myself. Nor does it seem to pick up on anything BUT classes. It's terrible. How'd you get it to behave? On Sunday 21 January 2007 5:22 am, Peter Lauri wrote: I would put my vote on Eclipse. It has great support for cvs and also for general coding autofilling etc. The downside is that it is resource demanding... Best regards, Peter Lauri www.dwsasia.com - company web site www.lauri.se - personal web site www.carbonfree.org.uk - become Carbon Free -Original Message- From: Vinicius C Silva [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 2:54 AM To: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: [PHP] most powerful php editor hi everyone! i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? -- Larry GarfieldAIM: LOLG42 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 6817012 If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession of every one, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it. -- Thomas Jefferson -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php -- Larry Garfield AIM: LOLG42 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 6817012 If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession of every one, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it. -- Thomas Jefferson -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] most powerful php editor
-Original Message- From: John Meyer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 22 January 2007 03:15 To: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor Dear god Arnot, would you like to stand back for a moment and consider how retarded those statements are, or would you like for me to do it for you? Whether you use a powerful IDE or not, you still have to use the same compiler underneath. In PHP, that compiler is the web server. Unless you buy an IDE that contains a mini-server for you to test the files, yoru comparison between IDEs and word processors is ludicrous at best. == That's the point I was trying to make, but obviously not very well. A good PHP IDE does have a built-in web server. It can do profiling, debugging, error high-lighting, project level function cross-checking, scope-checking, defines checking, version control, internal ftp, db front-end, and a whole truckload of other features that help you manage large projects. Sure it's not going to turn a monkey into a coding guru, but it's sure going to help anyone trying to manage large complex environments. I had the fortune to work with a brilliant IBM IDE years ago when I was working in C, and I discovered how much more you can get done (code and complexity) when you use the right tools. When I moved to PHP I struggled for the first while working on a project with more than a hundred files and more than a hundred db tables, using a bunch of unintegrated tools to get the job done. I could make it work but it was a laborious process of cross-checking every step of the way. And the biggest problem was no debugger. Now with a real IDE I can work between 4 and 10 times as fast, and tackle bigger projects and far more complex stuff. But as Robert said, to each their own. BTW I did once have the misfortune of having to prepare about 100 documents for ECITE back in 2002, each doc about 20-50 pages. Between projects and short of cash. I'm no document formatter - I far prefer coding for 18 hrs a day than spending 18 hrs a day formatting documents, no matter how good the word processor. I believe there are people who lap this kind of stuff up, but I'm not one of them. I got the job done but would never do it again. A good example where the right tools can't turn a monkey into a pro. But my point is that not even the pro's could do it properly without the right tools. Arno -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] most powerful php editor
Vinicius C Silva wrote: hi everyone! doctor name=nickHi everybody!/doctor i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? Definitely the chainsaw. Lets you slice your PHP scripts up into iddy biddy pieces so you can try different combinations. It's also a hell of a lot of fun!! Or did you mean a different kind of powerful? -Stut PS: If you think it's a common question, search the list archives before posting. Actually, before you post any question you should search the list archives. And Google. And your brain. And down the back of the sofa (you wouldn't believe the things I've found back there!!) -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] most powerful php editor
[snip] i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? [/snip] What is power when regarding a PHP editor? My team uses Eclipse but we are all comfortable with VI or PICO. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] most powerful php editor
I use Quanta when doing PHP development. Used to use vi, but Quanta won me. Sorry vi. Is Quanta powerful in my opinion? Yes. Why? Because it fits all requirements And then some. Just my 2 cents. Tom -Original Message- From: Jay Blanchard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: January 20, 2007 10:31 PM To: Vinicius C Silva; php-general@lists.php.net Subject: RE: [PHP] most powerful php editor [snip] i'd like to ask something maybe commonly asked here. what is the most powerful php editor? [/snip] What is power when regarding a PHP editor? My team uses Eclipse but we are all comfortable with VI or PICO. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.2/641 - Release Date: 20/01/2007 10:24 AM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.2/641 - Release Date: 20/01/2007 10:24 AM -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
