Re: [OSM-talk] Wiki project: Article about the standard layer, with key
Nice work so far, but are the any plans on carto side and on the wiki side to support the taginfo feature projects ? All together we could leave the dumb work for the machines and use our brains for the creative part. On the wiki side I would like to have some extension of the taginfo box or even an additional feature to better show the supporting software on each tag page. Cheers colliar Am 20.04.2015 um 20:10 schrieb nebulon42: Great! I can offer some support regarding the symbols that have been redrawn by me. Why bother with PNG when we can have SVG versions? I will upload all of my icons that are currently used by osm-carto in coloured SVG versions to the wiki and collect them at this page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Nebulon42/Icons (By the way it is easy to create a coloured Osmic icon collection like that by looking at https://github.com/nebulon42/osmic/blob/master/tools/export.md.) I will also replace any existing new symbols in your key page with these SVG versions. As I'm not able to replace all other usages of the new symbols (maybe not needed yet?) I could use some help with that. 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Tagging POI's - nodes vs. areas
Am 22.04.2015 um 19:12 schrieb EthnicFood IsGreat: Thanks to everyone who contributed on this subject. I think I've got a better understanding now of tagging buildings vs. tagging amenities. And sorry if I should've posted to the tagging list instead. There are so many lists. I think I'm subscribed to four of them already. How many more...? Well, it depends on your interest. I would say talk@, tagging@ and the one for your region (mother tong) are useful. Additionally, I already mentioned help.openstreetmap.org in my first reply. This question [1] looks pretty similar, don't you think? Maybe adding some additional information could help further. cu colliar [1] https://help.openstreetmap.org/questions/617/when-you-have-a-building-and-a-surrounding-area-which-one-should-most-tags-be-on? 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Tagging POI's - Nodes vs. areas
Hey While this email would rather suit tagging@ or help.openstreetmap.org I gonna try to answer: First of all, please, do not mix building-use and building=*. The later is for the construction type which might overlap with the actual use. amenity=hospital is the tag for a hospital and needed to get it rendered but this can include several buildings and even the surrounding area. Well, for a single building both might be needed: amenity=hospital building=hospital/yes name=* cu colliar Am 21.04.2015 um 15:58 schrieb EthnicFood IsGreat: I want to know how to tag buildings which are also amenities or shops. I have consulted the wiki and I cannot find a clear explanation of this. Say you have a building which is a hospital. One way to tag the polygon would be building = hospital. Another way would be amenity = hospital. Another way would be to simply tag the building as building = yes and then place a node inside the building polygon and tag the node as amenity = hospital. I'm thinking in terms of how the hospital will show up in the various renderers. Do most renderers require the amenity tag in order to display a hospital symbol at that location? (In other words, what happens if I just use the building = hospital tag on the polygon and no amenity tag?) And what about the hospital name? Do I include it with the building polygon or the node? Or both? This is very confusing. It seems there is a certain amount of overlap when it comes to the application of building, amenity, and shop tags. 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] New features in iD - looking for feedback and beta testers..
Am 27.03.2015 um 19:39 schrieb Bryan Housel: - Don’t delete ways that are part of a route/boundary Relation This will prevent a bunch of breaking edits to relations - Thanks RichardF! https://github.com/openstreetmap/iD/pull/2526 https://github.com/openstreetmap/iD/pull/2526 Why only route and boundary relations ? How about multipolygons, turn-restrictions and all the relations iD does not know about ? As long as iD often hides the membership behind a scroll bar on the left, people will not easily recognize all the relations an object is member of. cu colliar 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Tagging Warnings Posted on Beaches
Am 21.03.2015 um 18:28 schrieb Bryce Nesbitt: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:information A new information=warning_sign Could do it. Most rendered maps will show the (i) symbol, which is a good first guess. Think this belongs on tagging@ ! this has nothing to do with tourism. cu colliar 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] New taginfo feature and a challenge...
Am 05.03.2015 um 17:28 schrieb Jochen Topf: Hi! Taginfo just got a new feature, it can now find keys similar to other keys. This is useful to find related keys, but also to find misspelled keys. I hope the community uses this feature to clean up those wayward keys... More at http://blog.jochentopf.com/2015-03-05-new-taginfo-features-and-a-challenge.html Thanks a lot. Not sure if it is connected but I have problems with the taginfo website. If I want to have a closer look at a tag (key=value) like highway=cycleway [1], I only get one page with the former tabs as links but clicking on them does not change anything except the URL [2]. The page stays the same. Did try it with firefox 36 and chromium 37 on Linux with exactly the same outcome. Is it only my setup or do others have the same problem ? Cheers colliar [1] https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/highway=cycleway [2] https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/highway=cycleway#combinations 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] High load on the rendering servers?
Am 08.03.2015 um 10:20 schrieb Christoph Hormann: On Sunday 08 March 2015, Tom Hughes wrote: Wow. This constitutes an extremely simple way to mount a DoS attack on the OSM tileservers. I will have to assume that the Operations WG is already thinking of ideas on how to prevent this possibility in the future. I think I can safely say we're not. Of course if you have a brilliant idea how to do such a thing then I'm sure we'd love to hear it. The OSM inspector already has a display mode for ways with long segments - it currently however seems it is not working: http://tools.geofabrik.de/osmi/?view=geometryoverlays=ways_with_long_segments,long_segments And it has a fairly low threshold (0.3 degrees - that is ~40km) so it highlights quite a lot of stuff. With an additional layer highlighting only the very long segments (like above 300km segment length) you could quickly see such issues. And editors of course also should prominently warn about such edits. Sounds like work for the editor software if the api is not capable to prevent moving a node hundreds of kilometres. cu colliar [1] https://josm.openstreetmap.de/ticket/11215 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Big Lakes
Am 18.02.2015 um 14:48 schrieb malenki: Jochen Topf wrote: Please do not add more (and more difficult cases like lakes on islands in lakes on land) to the data, otherwise this process will get more brittle than it already is. Well, that is a word. What do you think of the Great Lakes mapped (partly) both with coastline and MPs? -1 We already have problems with the update cycle differences of the coastline and the rest of the map. Would would not gain much and simply move the decision over to the renderer. Dual-Systems are confusing and lead to further divergence. As long as we do not have an area type we just need to use relations. With boundaries we had/have similar problems. Right now, we might have to live with nested relations and either use type=multilinestring [1] or a newly created type=* colliar [1] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Relation:multilinestring 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Merkaartor dead ?
Do not reach the homepage [1] and only found github [2] but no release the last two years. Did I miss something ? Should at least adjust the wiki page [3]. Cheers colliar [1] http://merkaartor.be/ [2] https://github.com/openstreetmap/merkaartor [3] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Merkaartor 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] guide to vandalism” in OSM?
Am 12.02.2015 um 15:46 schrieb Michał Brzozowski: I happen to fix a lot of notes in Poland. For me it would be impractical to check every POI that I add from notes. Mind you, I do the research in the Internet if it's a feature that could possibly have a website (fire station, church, restaurant, supermarket etc), but the only way to check some (eg. smaller shops) would be to check on the ground. Unless there's a mapper in every single municipality it's not practical to do so - drive a long way to just check yep, it's there. Therefore sometimes I simply assume good faith which in my opinion *is* sensible. But I mark any changesets or POIs with source=notes. +1 I often test the reaction by asking a question about additional tags. I even got some anonymous reporter to learn about the needed information like surface, lit, sidewalk, maxspeed, opening_hours, building, brand and cuisine. Not sure if they are that anonymous anymore but the seem to strain from creating an account. cu colliar 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] this has to stop: iD user mistakes all over the place
Am 12.02.2015 um 14:27 schrieb malenki: On Wed, 11 Feb 2015 16:08:37 -0500, Tom MacWright wrote: Ever since 2012, in the second commit ever, Not breaking other people's data has been one of the three clearly stated public design goals of iD. Regarding this statement it is interesting that iD went live with no graphic hints about the existence of relations. (I hope I remember this point correct.) +1 Well, methinks thou dost protest too much. I did mention all my points longer time ago and there exists open issues about them. Still do not see the point why some actions should not be denied until they proper work especially as there seems to be not much interest in fixing them. I just was ask by an user of iD how to check the consistency of common relations like multipolygon, boundary and route in iD. Does anyone have an answer ? Where do I find a wiki or help system about iD explaining me the software ? Only found one page which does not even mention relations. I have no problems with newbie mistakes but users with over 2000 commits are no newbies anymore but still miss the common understanding of relations and are not aware of all tags of an object. What do you say about changesets with comment hopefully did not break any relation this time or sorry about breaking relations ? I would say, nice the user is at least adding changeset comments but as an developer alarm bells should start ringing in my head. For sure, I use PM and directly discuss on changesets but so far my advice is at least do not use combine ways or merging nodes at all, plus always discuss in advance of deleting or even better use a better editor software. Cheers colliar 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] this has to stop: iD user mistakes all over the place
Hey Maybe, it is me only to slow in reverting and solving these mistakes or even the bugs I incounter in JOSM while working but I am definitely feed up with talking about the same things over and over again and I am probably not even polite enough to do the job of communicating. So what to do ? Silently reverting is not an option. Always getting DWG involved neither. I am fed up with: * iD making it way to easy to delete objects but not offering an option to undelete them (is there any history information at all ?) * simply combining ways and merge nodes without any validation or warning about conflicts in tags or problems with relations * not telling the user about the importance of all tags, even unknown to the software and allowing user to communicate with user of the last change of the object Any plans of supporting lanes-tagging-system ? Otherwise there will be even more complains in the future. Is there anyone taking care of mistake made by iD users and documenting the most common ones to either better explain how to avoid them and/or fix the software ? As iD is supposed to be the newbie editor all mistakes will rather turn them down than encourage them. So far, I try to keep calm and rather save my changes and upload them later after solving conflicts instead of starting an edit war by reverting or uploading older versions but I spend more time with communication and investigating problems than actually mapping and resolving notes and I still have quite some gpx tracks and photos from over a year ago to map. How about simply denying some changes with iD like combining ways ? Cheers colliar 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [Imports] amenity=bicycle_repair_station :::: only 18 so far
Am 27.01.2015 um 08:43 schrieb Paul Johnson: On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 11:27 AM, JB jb...@mailoo.org mailto:jb...@mailoo.org wrote: Le 26/01/2015 17:59, Jo a écrit : It would indeed be preferable to use OSM Notes for that purpose. Ho crap. Instead of importing 500 low-quality POI, just import 500 low-quality notes… So that only the notes DB is a dump, but not the main one. Sorry for the bad energy, but please do not consider the note feature as a second level one. And for the fun, please close the 10 closer to your location :-) If there was high quality information to be had, it'd be in the map already instead of a note...notes have information that need a little more polish before it's usable data. I don't see an issue with throwing a few dozen extra notes around when we have field QA tools like Osmand that make finding them in the field easy. +1 as far as I understand it these POIs where collected by some crowed and every one could have opened this note by him-/herself without Bryce as moderator. In future it would be much better if the person who is collecting the data, simply openes a note. E.g. this way we hopefully would not have to search on the other side of the street as the note is often better placed regarding geometry. cu fly 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changeset messaging Notes feature question
Am 01.01.2015 um 01:39 schrieb Tom Hughes: On 01/01/15 00:36, Dave F. wrote: Hey I'm struggling to comprehend how a button to turn off the notes layer, that's separate ( hidden!) from the only obvious button to turn the layer on can be described as 'logical' to an experienced user let alone a newbie.. Well the problem is that what you see as a button to turn on the notes layer is what I see as a button to add a new note ;-) That button was intended to encode the add a note action, not the view notes action. If I just wanted to view existing notes I wouldn't use that button, I would open the layer switcher and turn on the notes layer. The problem with turning off the notes layer again when the add note control is disabled is that it might already have been on before you started adding a note, so we would probably have to remember if we had turned it on or if it was already on . Trying to figure out what to do if somebody starts toggling the notes layers on and off manually while the add note control is active just introduces even more levels of complication... By 'we' do you mean the programmers? I hope not. It's not that complicated! on/off, yes/no, 0/1 binary! It's the DNA of computers! No I'm not saying the programming is necessary complicated, I'm saying it's hard to know what the correct behaviour is from a UX point of view. Would be nice if the two lowest buttons for activating Report/Open note and Query would be deactivated with a second click and maybe restore the previous state considering notes. Thanks colliar 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] MEP - pipelines
Am 05.01.2015 um 00:17 schrieb Lists: On Jan 4, 2015, at 21:11, Richard Z. ricoz@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Jan 04, 2015 at 09:18:57AM -0200, Lists wrote: May I suggest the following work flow: 1) Agree upon 2 dates sufficiently spaced i.e. 2 weeks apart 2) First date, add the new tag, leave the old tag in the system. This will not break anything, and from that date data consumers know they can start migrating their renderers, harvesters, or whatever into the new scheme without loss of data integrity 3) Run sanity checks on the data, maybe manually correct slips such as type=sewer - substance=sewage if needed 4) On Second date remove the unwanted key, objects where the key should remain should have been flagged by now, and data consumers should all be on the new scheme also. 5) Define an interval to re-run the scripts if it is probable that anybody still might use the old scheme. it needs more flexible rules and generally the suggested 2 weeks are extremely short. I was just throwing out a suggestion for timeframe without thinking much about its feasibility, I agree that the timeframe might need to be longer, and that is for me an open topic for discussion. I will not myself take part in any mechanical edit, though I might be affected as a data consumer. +1 For example we still have many (not counted) culvert=yes even though it is considered obsolete since a long time. That might be that they haven’t done any mechanical edits, and that old data still are accepted in many data consumers Think some QA software could do the job but we need to request for it. JOSM's validator could even silently change or at least ofter an automatically change. In those cases (like here) when it is possible to have the old and new tagging in parallel the transition could be done in two steps long apart. I agree that it should be a two-step job +1 no problem to delete type=* so far but adding additional tags should be no problem. This should be the general rule for mechanical edits when migrating tagging schemes. Also make sure that editors such as Potlatch2, iD, JOSM and Merkaartor, all have corrected their presets by the second date. If old scheme is stuck in the preset than it is likely that old scheme will continue to be used. also to be considered if keepright or similar need adjustments I was mentioning a few sources I could get from the top of my head, I probably have forgotten a lot of them It is always depending on the support of as many different projects as possible but that is sometimes a lot of work. cu colliar 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Omaha World-Herald using OSM without attribution
Am 18.12.2014 um 11:09 schrieb JB: Le 18/12/2014 00:02, Clifford Snow a écrit : According to the wiki [1] they may be properly attributing OSM. Paragraph 3. They provided a link and they are treating us with the same prominence as other map suppliers. [1] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Legal_FAQ So the fight began anyway. Sensitive subject. Sorry, but I read there (same page, paragraph 3a, seems you stopped reading too early) : /For a //*browsable electronic map*//(e.g. embedded in a web page or mobile phone application), the credit should appear in the corner of the map, as commonly seen with map APIs/libraries such as Google Maps. // /So, no, it /should /be on the map. +1 So far we are talking about the map data, but they use tiles from all kinds of OSM-Services. Thought these tiles are under some licences, too, but do not find any mentioned. Not on the online map nor on the about page. cu colliar 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Issues with Mapbox paid mappers
Am 28.11.2014 um 21:31 schrieb Paul Johnson: Curious how I get on as a Mapbox paid mapper. +1 Might have some time for mapping and do not mind if it gets paid. colliar 0xE8F56581.asc Description: application/pgp-keys signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] amenity=bicycle_repair_station :::: only 18 so far
Am 15.11.2014 um 02:32 schrieb Bryce Nesbitt: I'd like to encourage people to map bicycle repair stations. There are only 18 in the database right now. Can we double that this week? http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:amenity%3Dbicycle_repair_station Should this not be under proposal name space ? Probably better mentioned on tagging@: Do DIY indoor repair station sometimes with little fee also qualify ? cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] JOSM Imagery Contrast
Am 20.10.2014 21:59, schrieb Mike Thompson: Andrew, Thanks I will try and reach out to PovAddict, as well as submit a ticket in Trac. About the ticket, someone was faster [1]. There is little hard coded support within the imagery preferences dialog but I did not use it lately and never for micro mapping. cu colliar [1] https://josm.openstreetmap.de/ticket/10417 signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Detrimental validation software
Please, no. noexit=yes is wrong as there is an exit at least for foot. Adding a short connecting path in between is the right solution. The QA software should not report the case if there is a connection and even if it is reported you would not change the situation if unsure but rather get in touch with the last editor. cu colliar Am 16.10.2014 15:04, schrieb Andrew Buck: Yes, in a case like the sidewalk separating them as a barrier though, you can simply add a noexit=yes on the road end. All major error checkers override the warning when this is present. I think this is the obvious solution and am surprised this thread has gone on this long. A simple mistake was made, it was found and corrected, and people will be more careful in the future. This is how OSM works, why are we still discussing this? signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Detrimental validation software
Am 14.10.2014 15:18, schrieb Richard Welty: On Mon, 13 Oct 2014 13:32:44 -0400, Aaron Lidman aaronlid...@gmail.com wrote: The software is not being misused to insert errors into the OSM database, it was a mistake. Just like Keepright, Osmose, and JOSM, to-fix has false positives. It's unfortunate and we're actively working to reduce them in number but they happen. Looking at the imagery I can see how it might be thought they connect, especially when none of us are using google maps for verification, right? in addition to the fact that we do not have permission to use google maps in this manner, keep in mind that google maps also contains errors and is nowhere near as reliable as a proper ground survey. so there are two excellent reasons not to use google maps. +1 Just, last month I revisited a spot where I had official raster data to use plus several good to superb aerials and was still not able to judge the situation. Importing and armchair mapping might work but you always have to recheck ground truth. Especially, QA problems are often not simply fixable without survey and I often have delete layer=-1 from waterways or noexit=yes which where added to silence the QA software and now hide the real problems (missing bridge/tunnel, respective missing connection). Please, make it mis-understandably clear that if unsure, you should change anything, and that silencing the QA software like adding layer=-1 to all waterways is vandalism. Thanks and cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] wiki tag page template: ways vs areas vs relations
Am 07.10.2014 15:48, schrieb moltonel 3x Combo: The wiki is not in great shape (arguably in worse shape than the osm data itself), but if less than perfect data was a blocker, OSM would never have goten off the ground. The wiki is the 2nd most important source of OSM docs, after all the in-editor stuff. It should be well cared for. Tools to cross-check the wiki against taginfo, presets, validators, etc would be great. Discrepancies would need to be checked manually, as no source is authoritative. It'd be great to have more machine-parseable data in the wiki, for example if a tag is sensitive to way direction or if it expects other tags to be present. Actually, taginfo has a new feature which shows the information about editor support. The lists are available and machine readable. Yet, another example where wiki needs more attention (maybe include the editor support). The major problem of the wiki, in my eyes, are a missing inter language changelog to notice changes on the English version and the editing attitude on the wiki, which leads to quite some edit wars, introducing new tags into wrong space and thousands of useless redirects which makes it impossible to distinguish accepted tags from proposed/unused ones. In this way, could some wiki admin please delete all uuid:*=* wiki pages, which are only redirects to the proposal pages and the tags are deprecated plus not in use. Thanks and cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Visually detect missing roads
Am 20.09.2014 21:10, schrieb John F. Eldredge: On 09/18/2014 11:07 AM, Stephan Knauss wrote: Dave F. writes: On 17/09/2014 23:30, Stephan Knauss wrote: In Google the road is listed as a major highway. Are you interpreting this data from Google's visual render or extracting it from their database? It's coming from their database. Google does expose a classification through the v3 API. My map does consider the road types arterial and highway as major and local as minor. For OSM data unclassified and higher is considered major. I think that calling a road tagged as highway=unclassified a major road is an overstatement. So, you feel that any road which isn't classified as highway=residential, highway=service, or highway=track is a major road? +1 Thought the difference between unclassified and residential is often only the landuse surround it. We use unclassified in industrial and commercial areas plus outside of settlements and residential only within residential areas. cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Wood Park mapnik carto anomaly?
Am 18.09.2014 00:18, schrieb Martin Koppenhoefer: Il giorno 17/set/2014, alle ore 22:32, Dave F. dave...@madasafish.com ha scritto: As an example: If it has a name you'd have two objects of that name, when in fact there's only one. If someone wanted to find out how many named wood there are in a city it would return inaccurate data. I agree with this, that's why IMO we should have 2 distinct kind of properties (and maybe objects), one kind for name (and type of thing) and one kind for descriptions of subobjects like an area where trees grows. inside a named forest you might have lots of areas without actual trees. Eg natural=wood and name=* vs. landcover=trees No, the name problem is simply solved with a multipolygon or site relation if needed. This way we still have one single object. It is still a forest even if there are no trees atm. Please use landcover=* to add this information. Or exclude the area if permanent. One more option would be to use place=locality or even place=forest with the name cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Wood Park mapnik carto anomaly?
Am 16.09.2014 15:59, schrieb Martin Koppenhoefer: 2014-09-16 15:32 GMT+02:00 Dave F. dave...@madasafish.com mailto:dave...@madasafish.com: I find it surprising something as arbitrary as size is used as the defining factor. Comparing actual tags would surely make more sense. well, size surely has some correlation with importance. For practical reasons it is generally working quite well to have first render the bigger stuff and then render the smaller stuff on top, because it leads typically to less covering. In this particular case more detailed mapping of the tree areas could solve it, e.g. split the wood object at the cutting roads and waterways, but admittedly in this case by looking at the bing aerial imagery it seems indeed to be a continuity of trees on both sides of these. No, we need a solution which allows overlaps and still renders the differences. One possible solution are pictographs or not solid by striped rendering. Once landcover comes in play we have the next overlap. And we still have the problem with building=roof/yes + layer 0 not been rendered on top of highway=* and area=yes, even if the size is smaller. cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] keys with multiple values
Am 15.09.2014 19:08, schrieb Norbert Wenzel: On 09/15/2014 06:45 PM, moltonel 3x Combo wrote: The problem with semicolon-separated values is that you can never be sure wether you're looking at multiple values, or one value that happens to contain a semicolon. That's part of the reason why other tags sometimes use a different separator (a coma, a pipe...). It's messy. Actually, I met a lot of special characters in name but no semi-colon, so far. As I've mainly thought about name tags (as you may have guessed from my examples) I still think it's safe to assume there is no name containing a semicolon (except Little Bobby Tables), but nevertheless you have a very valid point here. Of course we could define some escape character like the famous backslash but ... I don't even want to write that stupid idea down. Do not think that is stupid but one solution for a rare situation. If it is properly described on the wiki, there should be no problem. Supporting multiple values natively in the osm data model would provide a clean and efficient solution, but updating all the tools to support it would be a huge undertaking. That would be the best solution and should at least be considered for a next API version, whenever that seems necessary. The API already supports it but other software might not. While I was reading your mail I just remembered I tried to put multiple values under the same key when I started with OSM and I was surprised the editors wouldn't let me do this. So this might also be the most intuitive way to add multiple values. Some years of OSM made me forget about that. ;-) Once more, depending on the software (editor) cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Adding Wikidata tags to 70k items automatically
And there are relations type=tunnel/bridge [2] which should have the highest priority [2] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Relations/Proposed/Bridges_and_Tunnels cu colliar Am 28.08.2014 23:06, schrieb Janko Mihelić: Well, you should at least take preference to man_made=bridge[1] if there is any. Highways can be split, just like in my example, and then that looks as if there are two bridges. What if there is a footway running besides the road? Should it also get the wikidata tag? If we start putting wikidata=* on highways, there should be an initiative to add man_made=bridge on those and move the tag there. At least with bridges that have more than one highway on them. The same story is with tunnels, although I see there is no page with man_made=tunnel yet. [1] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dbridge 2014-08-28 19:42 GMT+02:00 Edward Betts edw...@4angle.com mailto:edw...@4angle.com: Janko Mihelić jan...@gmail.com mailto:jan...@gmail.com wrote: Bridges are bit of a grey area, is a highway with bridge=yes really a bridge, or is it a highway which has a property of being on a bridge? I think we should map these notable bridges as an area with man_made=bridge and put the tag on that. The very first example of a bridge on your list is already problematic: http://www.openstreetmap.org/way/5620489 That way represents both the street and the bridge. I don't think there is any problem with adding a tag for the matching item on wikidata. http://wikidata.org/wiki/Q4547392 -- Edward. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org mailto:talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Own wikipage for every single speed limit??
Am 28.08.2014 15:07, schrieb Andreas Goss: The problem behind this is that there is no way to mark the reason why there is a redirect. Well, there is a little trick ;) http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:amenity%3Dalmaction=edit http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/amenity=alm#wiki This does not work for example for all uuid:* pages which are redirects to the proposal page and have 0 uses. See https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_Features/UUID#UUID_Tagging Could some wiki admin please delete these pages and fix the links. Thanks Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] route=road - What's that all about then?
Am 23.08.2014 15:53, schrieb John F. Eldredge: I have seen park roads that were accessible to the public only during specified daylight hours. Using them after park closing time would likely lead to trespassing charges. So, an opening_hours tag on those roadways would make sense. access:conditional= no @ (sunset-sunrise) or foot:conditional= no @ (sunset-sunrise) depending on other access restrictions. cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Carto: High zoom levels (17-19) not updated
Hey Is it only me or do other also see no updates of zoom level 17 to 19 of the main mapnik renderer. Usually, they update within minutes when reloaded but now I am waiting for some days and nothing happens. I did delete my browser cache mean while. Have a look at [1] and zoom in. Cheers colliar [1] https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/48.0646/7.7198 signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Carto: High zoom levels (17-19) not updated
Am 18.08.2014 20:58, schrieb Paul Norman: On 8/18/2014 11:01 AM, colliar wrote: Is it only me or do other also see no updates of zoom level 17 to 19 of the main mapnik renderer. Usually, they update within minutes when reloaded but now I am waiting for some days and nothing happens. http://munin.openstreetmap.org/openstreetmap/render.openstreetmap/renderd_queue.html indicates that the is a queue for tile rendering. I believe one of the rendering servers is temporarily down. There was no queue this morning though. Try the /dirty-trick yesterday already but I am not sure if it is still working. There are other normal reasons why there can be a queue at other times, such as monthly re-rendering of low and medium zooms and stylesheet updates. Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Carto: High zoom levels (17-19) not updated
Am 18.08.2014 21:31, schrieb Tom Hughes: On 18/08/14 19:58, Paul Norman wrote: On 8/18/2014 11:01 AM, colliar wrote: Is it only me or do other also see no updates of zoom level 17 to 19 of the main mapnik renderer. Usually, they update within minutes when reloaded but now I am waiting for some days and nothing happens. http://munin.openstreetmap.org/openstreetmap/render.openstreetmap/renderd_queue.html indicates that the is a queue for tile rendering. I believe one of the rendering servers is temporarily down. Both machines are up - yevaud looks like it's down because it hasn't been reporting to munin but it is actually up. Well now the new tiles are rendered. Thanks anyway. colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Incorrect speed limit anonymous notes - who is behind that?
Am 16.08.2014 08:28, schrieb Maarten Deen: On 2014-08-16 01:48, Andreas Vilén wrote: This continues to be really annoying, and the obvious spam seems to cluster at a few locations, where 10-20 notes can be created with the same information. The maker of this app must be made clear that notes can't work like this, and users would at least be required to give some contact information. Most of the notes that come from this app are useless and will probably stay in the database forever. And the notes may be anonymous, but IMHO it is prudent to put in the message or the metadata which app reported it. That way you don't have to go on a wild goose chase to see where it is coming from. Think any app that creates notes should have a proper user with some information on the user's page and like wise an email address to contact. This way users could still create nodes anonymously but we would reach the person with power. cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Using Notes in France
Am 30.07.2014 11:05, schrieb Pieren: On Wed, Jul 30, 2014 at 10:32 AM, JB jb...@mailoo.org wrote: Hey, I think you are loosing the point. It is different to say « Here is a pharmacy missing » (carry an information) than to say « here is the street name missing » (IMO carry no information). Well, a note saying here is THIS street or group of street names missing is still helpful. But a note saying ALL street names or ALL buildings or ALL addresses are missing in this town is not helpful at all because everyone can observe this and write such remarks. Notes have to bring some information or point out mistakes, not general comments about how slow the crowd is filling the geodata in a big area. +1 Well, I had to train my local anonymous note creators, but now I get really useful information and, yes, I usually get answers from them quite fast, if I add a comment. If the information is missing important parts or even if I like to know more than only the name of the street, I often add questions as comment. I thought street names are included in cadastre-fr, e.g. you should be able to get the name with little investigation, other wise a comment about a missing name in cadastra-fr and a needed survey would be nice. Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Using Notes in France
Am 30.07.2014 15:58, schrieb Glenn Plas: Akward moment, I though my French escaped my brain somehow but it didn't. so what (in French Oui. Quels sont-ils ?) 'Oui, Quels sont-ils?' means: Yes, which ones are they? ! So he's asking if you know the names of the missing street. and closing the note. Therefor you need to have a login to reopen in order to be able to comment and it will disappear after one week. Not the best way to get an answer. cu co signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] cycle.travel bike routing for Western Europe
Am 17.07.2014 20:14, schrieb Maarten Deen: On 2014-07-17 16:38, Richard Fairhurst wrote: Maarten Deen wrote: Thanks for an online bicyle routing. It's nice and fast! But it is not really apt in finding shortest or quickest routes. +1 I entered my daily commute (from 51.3207,5.9888 to 51.5428,5.9827, permalink does not work properly) and it comes with a (for me new) route of 18.3 miles (=29.45 km) in 2:02. If I move the route to what I actually do, I get 17.9 miles and 1:59. And there are no paths or tracks in either route. The route it chooses has an off-road cycleway for more of the route (all the way to Eijkenhofweg) and then highway=unclassified (Steegse Peelweg), whereas the 17.9-mile route has more highway=tertiary (Loorban and Veulenseweg). In general cycle.travel prefers a balanced route using traffic-free and quiet roads, rather than just trying to find the shortest or quickest route along busier roads. I find several problems. 1. How are separate drawn cycleways next to roads handled ? 2. Neither traffic_light/crossing nor shape turns are evaluated. 3. I would like to show you some examples but I did not find any link/shortlink feature. Are gpx tracks any help ? So, can't I just ask shortest or quickest road? As you say, the router has no idea about traffic levels. I mean, if a router can't give me either shortest or quickest, then I always think I get some random route that is not optimal in any aspect. +1 Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] cycle.travel bike routing for Western Europe
Am 17.07.2014 22:01, schrieb Richard Fairhurst: colliar wrote: 1. How are separate drawn cycleways next to roads handled ? It prefers cycleways to roads, so it'll usually route via the cycleways (assuming they're properly connected). It makes a real difference if you have a cycletrack along side a primary route or a cycleway through the fields. In a city you often prefer calm residential roads over cycleways along side major roads. In this way the routing does not find many smarter, saver and shorter + faster routes. 2. Neither traffic_light/crossing nor shape turns are evaluated. There's a routing penalty for traffic lights. Well, how about crossing=* ? In my region there are no traffic_signals map on cycleways but crossing=traffic_signal together with highway=traffic_signal or highway=crossing on the common node of cycleway and road. Not sure what you mean by shape turns - can you explain? Sorry, was a typo. I meant sharp turns. I found a route where in favour of the cycleway the route leads down a ramp, makes a u-turn (radius 2.5m otherwise you fall into the river) and on the next bridge the same, first 180° turn than uphill a ramp and two more turns. 3. I would like to show you some examples but I did not find any link/shortlink feature. Are gpx tracks any help ? You can log into the site and save routes that way - that's probably the best way! Please, have an option to share the route without logging in. Thanks colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik Lowzoom TIles - proof of concept
Am 07.07.2014 16:13, schrieb Frederik Ramm: Hi, On 07/07/2014 01:41 PM, Christoph Hormann wrote: That was actually an existing feature - a transport route from the coast to the French Concordia station - you can even marginally see it on the LIMA mosaic if you look closely: Oh dear. I automatically assumed that it must be some kind of doodle because of being long and straight and practically nodeless ;) The tagging might of course be considered wrong - it could be more like highway=track and surface=snow but for the standards of the region highway=secondary might even be an understatement. What would you recommend? Seems to be a winter_road only usable in summer ! Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Proposed repeated mechanical edit: Empty relations
Am 24.06.2014 07:12, schrieb Paul Norman: I completed the edit without issues. https://github.com/openstreetmap/iD/issues/2270 opened for one source. JOSM had a few too, but those cover more versions so don't show up at the top. Thanks for your work. Could you please post complete numbers ? Would a JOSM validator warning help ? Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] undiscussed (?) mechanical edit on diet:vegan and diet:vegetarian
Am 20.05.2014 13:04, schrieb Martin Koppenhoefer: 2014-05-20 12:42 GMT+02:00 Michael Reichert naka...@gmx.net mailto:naka...@gmx.net: No, not every mechanical edit. There is no sharp border. The example you gave correct errors. Such edits should not have to be discussed. But the changeset I gave changed tagging and IMHO did not fix errors (see the linked wiki page). +1, well-meaning tag-normalization should not be tolerated without discussion, not even if the wiki proposes different tags, while fixing typos should. +1 but please be friendly and explain the difference to the user. IMHO we should add this information to the wiki. colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] How to handle copyright status of notes information.
How do you handle the copyright status on information from notes ? I often find useful information like opening_hours and new openings of shops/amenities in notes but how do I know if the anonymous user did add this information from survey or legal sources ? cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Are there some infos about the outtake ?
Hey Are there any infos available about the current outtake ? I am just curious if I will have a chance to upload soon or if I should save, go to bed and try tomorrow again. Many thanks to the admins for there nice job. Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Azimuth measurement
Am 09.04.2014 14:41, schrieb Tobias Knerr: On 09.04.2014 10:21, schrieb moltonel 3x Combo: For the specific case of benches, if you care about orientation you might as well draw a way instead of a node. It's easyer to map, and less ambiguous (tag name ? value format ? mapper error ?). One thing the wiki doesn't specify for way-benches is the viewing direction (left or right of the way). But following the same conventsion as for water and cliffs, view on the right sounds intuitive. Somebody should check actual usage and update the wiki. I think the meaning of an explicit direction tag is much more obvious than an implicit convention based on way direction. I did start to add lower_side=right to barrier=retaining_wall, man_made=enbankment and natural=cliff. Ways for benches could still make sense for curved benches or extremely long ones, of course. Yes, I found some around trees. colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Azimuth measurement
Am 09.04.2014 16:18, schrieb JB: Le 09/04/2014 16:01, colliar a écrit : I did start to add lower_side=right to barrier=retaining_wall, man_made=enbankment and natural=cliff. Argh, why? Written in bold in the wiki. Is it really a solution to add a redondant tag? Why not contributing right from the beginning than adding more cases to take into account? http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:natural%3Dcliff Please, read carefully, I only wrote right and not right/left. I actually, do not know right now, but JOSM did not warn about reverting direction of these ways for a long time and other editors will still not. My hope is/was that left/right is more supported and maybe, to get rid of tags depending on way direction (like the above and guard_rail which I always have to look up). If you will find lower_side=left this is an indication about a reverted direction. cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Azimuth measurement
On 08.04.2014 11:45, François Lacombe wrote: Hi, Here is a topic discussed with a few people during State Of The Map FR last week end in Paris. Some features mapping would require to tag their azimuth as for knowing how they are really installed in the environment. For instance, benches mapped with nodes may be tagged with azimuth=* because nodes don't tell which direction the bench follows. Think the tag is direction=* [1] but there is no explanation how to measure. But how contributors can measure it ? Common devices like smart phones carry compass captors, used by compass applications. These captors only sense the magnetic north to determine the azimuth of the device. The magnetic north is continuously diverting from the geographic north. Using the magnetic north isn't a good idea since the azimuth will be continuously changing instead from the geographic azimuth. There will be the same question regarding standard compasses. Magnetic diversion is mathematically known and such azimuth could be converted into geographic ones. Is there a solution to that issue ? Take a photo to have a reference point either to adjust your compass results later or to completely measure later. Cheers colliar [1] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:direction signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Azimuth measurement
On 08.04.2014 15:44, SomeoneElse wrote: Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: on iPhones you can change this in settings (geographic vs magnetic north) not sure for other devices but my guess is there will be settings as well... Unless you're in northern Canada I really wouldn't worry about the difference between geographic and magnetic north. Just for a laugh I've looked at the compass results from a couple of phones (an iPhone and a Blackberry Q10) and an actual compass (piece of metal on a stick in a box - remember them?). Obviously indoors it's really not a fair test, but if I point the phones north (which the actual compass gets correct) the phones read 268 and 210 rather than 0. You have to watch out for other factors like metal next to you or even iron in the earth. So perhaps facing north/east/south/west is good enough for a bench? Guess it could be little more precise just by looking at the sun (or stars with a proper calendar). This would be another measurement method with an analog watch (display) and the sun. So far I did use direction=* mainly with oneway traffic_signals and benches. cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Maximum recommended length of ways tagged with layer
On 22.03.2014 11:01, Richard Z. wrote: On Fri, Mar 21, 2014 at 05:05:21PM -0500, Paul Johnson wrote: On Mar 21, 2014 4:59 PM, Richard Z. ricoz@gmail.com wrote: Example of a problem this should catch: I have seen cases where someone wanted to tag a simple bridge with layer and added the layer to the wrong segment - tagging a hundred or more miles of road accidentally, possibly affecting crossings far away for an area not downloaded. The validator will not detect it and in most cases the renderer will work around this bug very well so it is only discovered by accident in most cases. This is not limited to layer, I have seen the same problem with culverts and bridges. This seems like something a validator should be able to catch without overly complicating how levels work. I am not trying to complicate how layers work right now but trying to codify how they already work in 99% of cases in easy to follow rules that could be utilised by validators. Yes, the validator should be able to catch such situations. Just how? It doesn't right now. I see some possible approaches: * warn user if tagging excessively long ways with layer. Here the problem is to judge what is excessively long. As judgement is difficult and it will still depend on other cases, I do not think this will help that much * warn user if applying layer to a way that exceeds the size of downloaded area because in this situation the validator is unable to do even the basic checks. even though this will lead to false warnings when working with incomplete data, I would give this solution a try. * warn user if applying layer to a way without tunnel/bridge/covered/indoor or similar tags. Covered is an example where it does not work e.g. you tag the building=roof with layer and not the way underneath. Still for other tags (bridge/tunnel etc) this would be helpful. There is more than just JOSM and all should follow the same rules so ideally this rules would be nicely documented in the wiki. +1 Note, JOSM would almost be able to use the list right now, already. What kind of underground areas are that in Kansas, do you have a pointer? I'm not exactly sure where exactly it is, but there's apparently a pretty extensive underground industrial and office district entirely underground complete with drivable underground streets in KCK thanks to repurposing an old mine. interesting, I will have a look when I have some time. Could you post a link, please. I wonder how mapnik will work with that as there are already problems with a single underground floor/parking. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Hate captchas!!!!
On 14.03.2014 19:12, Tobias Knerr wrote: On 14.03.2014 17:15, Tom Hughes wrote: I think most of those are already whitelisted aren't they? Unless I'm mistaken, these are the currently whitelisted URLs: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Captcha-addurl-whitelist How about adding *.wikipedia.org and josm.openstreetmaü.de to the list ? I am still in favour of interwiki links as they keep the connection protocol. cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Hate captchas!!!!
On 14.03.2014 16:06, Richard Z. wrote: Hi, is there really no way to avoid those horrible captchas whenever I add a link to a JOSM bug ticket or another friendly website to the wiki?? How about interlinks ? JOSM Trac has some for most common external website (OSM, OSM-wiki, OSM-Trac etc.) This is also needed to stay on the same protocol (https) There are at least 2 tickets open which could help a lot: *https://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/5116 *https://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/3898 I need on average 4 captcha-reloads before I get a captcha picture which I can recognise with good enough confidence to even try it. How about an OSM quiz instead of captchas? colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Hate captchas!!!!
On 14.03.2014 17:01, Tom Hughes wrote: On 14/03/14 15:50, Richard Z. wrote: On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 03:43:38PM +, Tom Hughes wrote: On 14/03/14 15:06, Richard Z. wrote: How about an OSM quiz instead of captchas? You're offering to write one I take it? will think about one. In the short term, there are open tickets which should make it a lot easier Well 5116 doesn't actually specify what it is you actually the admins to do. It asks for known good URLs to be whitelisted without actually defining what constitutes a known good URL. Since I'm pretty sure that both known good and known bad are infinite sets, even if anybody could agree what constituted good or bad in this context, it is really very helpful. I'm sure if you make concrete suggestions for URLs that should be whitelisted then somebody will consider them. I'm not exactly sure what 3898 is asking for because I'm not familiar with the details of that config option, but it sounds like it is just asking for the captcha to be switched off. I'm sure that would be lovely for the real wiki users. I'm equally sure it would be lovely for the spammers, so it's not really a solution for anything. Certainly neither of those tickets seems to represent something trivial or concrete that could be actioned immediately in the way you are implying. How about interwiki links to *.wikipedia.org, *.openstreetmap.org and josm.openstreetmap.de for a start ? Could be first in the whitelist but interwiki links would be much nicer. cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-dev] NOTICE: Upcoming Maintenance / Downtime
On 25.11.2013 16:36, Florian Lohoff wrote: Hi, On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 10:23:43AM -0500, Richard Weait wrote: Grant, thanks always to you and to the full admin team, for making OpenStreetMap work and work well. I appreciate your constant attention to the nitty bits and the gritty bits of OpenStreetMap infrastructure, keeping everything up and running. The way that you make frequent improvements and additions to OpenStreetMap Foundation services is wonderful. Your immediate attention and rapid response to unscheduled events is exemplary. Thanks so much. You admins should be paid in more than just thanks. Not just for your continued expertise, but for the ten years of commitment so far. Sysadmin appriciantion day is on 28th of July :) SCNR Flo PS: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/System_Administrator_Appreciation_Day And you give only presents on birthday and Christmas ? Thank you for the nice work over the years. colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] api down ?
Hey Can not connect to api with JOSM nor getting infos about recent changeset on webpage (third tab). Overpass works for downloading but how to get only a few members of an relation ? cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] api down ?
On 22.11.2013 03:16, colliar wrote: Hey Can not connect to api with JOSM nor getting infos about recent changeset on webpage (third tab). Is working again. Overpass works for downloading but how to get only a few members of an relation ? Thanks signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapping of multiple-lane toll areas
Am 25.10.2013 17:04, schrieb Dave F.: On 23/10/2013 10:01, Pieren wrote: But I can say that tagging each lane with highway=motorway + lanes=1 is incorrect and seems to be tagging for the renderer (just to show the toll on mapnik) There's nothing wrong with that. It's mapped accurately as individual lanes clarified with the lanes=* tag. As long as there is no physical separation you should use the :lanes system and only use separate ways for the individual booths. All elements are tagged for the renderer How else would they know how to render them? What shouldn't be done is tagging incorrectly to get it to render, such as labelling a golf bunker as a beach to get it to appear yellow. I'm surprised someone with your OSM experience needs to be reminded of this. Well, as long as the renderer do not respect width=* or lanes=* people will experiment and rendering is not the only purpose. You can do quite a lot more things with a geodata base. I do not want to tag for the renderer (e.g. I do not add area=yes on any multipolygon and closed ways which make no sense to not be interpreted as area). I even did open a bug report about it against carto only to have it closed as other software. cu fly signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Dirt Roads in Mapnik, default render in OSM
Am 24.08.2013 01:42, schrieb Martin Koppenhoefer: Il giorno 23/ago/2013, alle ore 16:52, Pieren pier...@gmail.com ha scritto: BTW I just discover that some people are tagging for routing (after tagging for the renderer). They add access=yes or motor_vehicle=yes to open the routable track in OSRM... there is no problem with tagging correct access restrictions, especially for tracks you can't know who is entitled to access the way if you don't have deep insight into the national or regional legislation, e.g. in at least one German Land (BaWü) motorized traffic is implicitly excluded from tracks while in the rest of Germany it is only excluded if signposted. Sorry, but how do you get the hint that it is a track and not an unclassified highway and you are not allowed to use it without sign ? I live in BaWü and I always find these signs and tag accordingly if possible and I did not find many tracks without sign. You might be right if you are talking about tracks through the forest. These are usually only allowed for forestry and bicycles are not allowed on pathes in the forest ! cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making iD the default editor on osm.org
Am 24.08.2013 11:00, schrieb Lester Caine: Case 1 ... better imagery shows that the location of a way is wrong ... so move the way to the new location! Do not delete the way and and start again from scratch. This is were 'imports' are very badly broken, and when a new import is applied it should update the one it replaces especially when other material may well now be using the original nodes? We have many years of 'history' building up, but if that is wiped every time some new raw data is loaded information is lost. Case 2 ... an area is redeveloped and the road structure and buildings replaced with a new layout. In this case the old layout very much needs retaining and is exactly the sort of thing that needs to be transferred to an historic map. Again - delete - is totally the wrong action! Case 3 ... vandalism creating havoc ... this can only be correctly handled by reverting the change set ... a delete button is not the right tool! Case 4 ... you add something wrong to the map while editing ... use undo! Bottom line - remove the delete button :) +1 The revert button is also not needed quite often and as direction is only indicated with oneway you would only need it to change the direction of a oneway street which works by changing the tag. E.g. why is the button that prominent ? Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] What the status of trac tickets with mapnik as component ?
Hi On trac.osm.org you can still find mapnik as component. I wonder: * is it still needed * did the tickets get evaluated when developing the carto style * is the new code checked against these reports/requests As there are still tickets filled they are probably against carto. cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making iD the default editor on osm.org
On 16.08.2013 15:39, Tom MacWright wrote: Hi all, Now as ever is a good time to post bug reports and suggestions to the issue tracker, where developers can see, act, and respond to them: https://github.com/systemed/iD/issues Another website with another login and no option for anonymous reports. Why is it not using trac.osm.org or at least some OSM domain ? Sorry, I usually do not use ID but I do reporting JOSM bugs. The two issues where mentioned the last time we were talking about ID on this list and if people are either developing or testing they should have noticed already. If you have any question as far as 'what is in the latest version of iD' or 'is X fixed or not', you can as always, use the testing instance that has the absolute latest code to find out yourself: http://openstreetmap.us/iD/master/#background=Bingmap=20.00/-77.02271/38.90085 This instance is really slow with iceweasel ! The two issues are not fixed ! Why didn't you mention this ? Forward/backward/left/right are established prefixes, values and roles and I expect developers to know about it, especially if the software is quite new. Also, as always, it's a great time to be objective and constructive in your criticism. Please, do not offer a delete function that prominent ! Please, fully support forward/backward/left/right as part of the key and value, and appropriate adjust them when changing direction of a way and combining ways. Forward/backward as roles need to be adjusted, as well, with these two actions. As long as this is not fixed, deny to combine or change directions on any way. Thanks a lot ! Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making iD the default editor on osm.org
On 17.08.2013 15:26, Tom MacWright wrote: Hey Please, do not offer a delete function that prominent ! This has come up before. Where should this action button move? Or should there be an alert message? How to resolve this with pro users who get angry with how hidden or alert-messaged the functionality is? Would welcome feedback here beyond the simple negative. * Have it placed in some menu/panel but not in the centre. * Power user can always use keyboard shortcuts. Al * The alert message needs a checkbox with the option to disable it for the session. For what it's worth, the Delete key which is mapped in JOSM and P2 as well, is also pretty easy to hit, and the trash icon in JOSM is even larger than the trash in iD, just positioned differently. Sorry, I do not find any delete button in JOSM except in the main menu edit. Delete mode is only available in expert modus. Seems to me you misunderstood us. We are talking about delete object. Forward/backward/left/right are established prefixes, values and roles and I expect developers to know about it, especially if the software is quite new. Please search for, link to, or comment on an issue. Here it is: https://github.com/systemed/iD/issues/299 Was closed but never fully implemented ! The link to the JOSM is mentioned but the source what not read carefully. Thanks a lot for respecting mappers' work ! colliar P.S.: A possibility to turn of the background is useful. Do not think people understand that they need to use an empty sting as custom server to disable it. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making iD the default editor on osm.org
Hey, Why do we set a default editor right from the beginning and do not let the user decide ? I think it depends on the individual which editor fits to whom. I met several people who know how to work with GUIs but are not familiar with OSM. All had no problem getting along with JOSM right away and some where looking for features like filter, purge, export to file/gpx and printing. The international student projects on several highschool across Europe did only use JOSM and it work, too. A short description of iD, Potlatch2, JOSM and Merkaartor with links would be nice. Cheers Colliar On 16.08.2013 08:59, Frederik Ramm wrote: Hi, it has been proposed to make the newly released iD v1.1 the default editor on openstreetmap.org, meaning that if someone doesn't explicitly chose an editor they will open iD instead of Potlatch. Refer to the previous thread In the works: iD 1.1 for details on that release. The relevant GitHub pull request is here: https://github.com/openstreetmap/openstreetmap-website/pull/453 It is likely that this pull request will be merged (i.e. accepted and incorporated into the OSM web site) in the near future unless there are important reasons not to. Bye Frederik signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making iD the default editor on osm.org
On 16.08.2013 08:59, Frederik Ramm wrote: As long as the delete function is that prominent it is not an editor for newcomers. Please, do make it easier to use existing objects and do not lead the user to delete and then create a new object. How about the full support to preserve forward/backward/left/right for all keys and values and as role when changing directions and combining ways ? cu colliar it has been proposed to make the newly released iD v1.1 the default editor on openstreetmap.org, meaning that if someone doesn't explicitly chose an editor they will open iD instead of Potlatch. Refer to the previous thread In the works: iD 1.1 for details on that release. The relevant GitHub pull request is here: https://github.com/openstreetmap/openstreetmap-website/pull/453 It is likely that this pull request will be merged (i.e. accepted and incorporated into the OSM web site) in the near future unless there are important reasons not to. Bye Frederik signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Www.openstreetmap.org Down?
Am 14.08.2013 21:57, schrieb Grant Slater: The site is up and traffic is at expected levels. Does the site not respond at all or a part not load? If there were a major outage it would be reported here: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Platform_Status Strange, I had major problem the day before (13. of August). I noticed this from time to time. Sometimes it is the wiki and sometimes the api or even www. For me it seems to be a problem with dns and I am not sure but I think it started with the introduction of several dns-servers. Do not really know what the problem is but twice already I did get it working again with restarting my router (local dns server) but this did not help all the time, nor was I allowed to restart the router all the time. Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Is there some lag in the backend data?
On 24.07.2013 17:35, Andy Robinson wrote: colliar [mailto:colliar4e...@aol.com] Sent: 24 July 2013 14:14 To: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Is there some lag in the backend data? On 24.07.2013 10:39, Andy Robinson wrote: From: Maarten Deen [mailto:md...@xs4all.nl] Dear Andy Would you two please report this at the right place. [1] ! For your tone it sounds like you think the discussion here was wrongly directed? No, do not get me wrong. I am sorry if my mail was too short and misleading. A discussion here might have its reasons but we often have complains about JOSM on this list or the forum but no word about it on JOSM-trac though it is anonymous editable. I did sometimes check and report the issue but it is much easier if the original reporter reports his/her issue. Please, if interested in any changes, report problems or enhancement request at JOSM-Trac. Thanks colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Is there some lag in the backend data?
On 24.07.2013 10:39, Andy Robinson wrote: From: Maarten Deen [mailto:md...@xs4all.nl] Would you two please report this at the right place. [1] ! Thanks fly [1] https://josm.openstreetmap.de/newticket signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Upgraded map controls
Am 21.07.2013 22:01, schrieb Frederik Ramm: Hi, On 21.07.2013 21:28, Kai Krueger wrote: It begs the question, if this high level design decisions shouldn't live on the design@ list instead of rails-dev or in the git-hub bug tracker. Yes, I can imagine that to some a you only have to follow rails-dev is a very hitchhikers-guidesque response. My impression is this: 1. Lots of people re-iterate the mantra that mailing lists (and talk in particular) are places where you'll only get flak for all your good ideas, and endless bikeshedding, and whatnot. I think that this is not supported by facts. 2. Therefore if you do something you're tempted to ignore the mailing lists, as everyone tells you they're the pits of hell. 3. Therefore, people on the mailing lists - even the majority that is not troublemakers - feel sidelined, and complain. Often even *informing* people in advance could help a lot. I think that the situation would already be much improved if, when something of greater importance pops up on rails-dev or elsewhere, someone informs the talk list about that. For example, in the specific case, once TomH had set up the working branch with the new UI, a quick note should have gone up on talk: look here this new design, being discussed here in case you want to say something. A couple of people might want to say something but the majority will just be pleased to have been told about it. Anyone can do this cross-pollination of the talk list, and maybe we should make it a habit. +1 I'll start with: Hi everyone, there's an idea to provide a new welcome/landing page used to send new users to, or maybe those who come to OSM via one of the sites using OSM maps. It can be viewed here http://welcome.apis.dev.openstreetmap.org/welcome and the discussion is here https://github.com/openstreetmap/openstreetmap-website/pull/338 Please, use an own thread for announcements, otherwise they are often missed. colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Analysis and improvement of the OpenStreetMap street color scheme for users with color vision deficiencies
On 15.07.2013 11:57, Johannes Kröger wrote: Hey Johannes Thanks for the information. Gonna read it the next days. My own conclusion was that my colors looked too out of place in the map and thus I did not want to suggest them as changes. Maybe this is just me though, so if you think differently, please say so! In my opinion it would be much more reasonable to design a whole new dedicated accessibility style (to not only cover color vision but also take general bad sight into account). I would be interested in working on that collaboratively in case others would like to. Please do not mix colour and contrast. A well designed colour map which also respects contrasts might perfectly work either with colours or in black and white. Cheers Colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Using OpenStreetMap on a daily basis
Am 10.07.2013 15:31, schrieb Kathleen Danielson: Hey folks, This has been a really interesting and constructive conversation-- what I'm interested in is what we do next. There are a lot of really great ideas in here and I'd hate to see them just gathering dust. This raises a larger issue of figuring out how we as a community move forward when good ideas are put forth. I think it's natural for a project like this to adopt change (large or small) slowly, and to some extent, that's really beneficial (we wouldn't want rash decisions to grossly alter the course of the project without thinking through consequences). However, I think there's risk of becoming both risk- and change-averse, which can be really detrimental. Anyway, with my diatribe over, I'd like to return to the question of: now what? A documentation on the discussion and solutions/wishes would be a good starting point. I am not sure how well the ticket system is used for the front page but for many discussions it would be helpful to have some summarizing available. Even only a link list will help everyone to get a faster overview than starting researching manually. Maybe on the wiki ? fly signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Using OpenStreetMap on a daily basis
Am 09.07.2013 13:57, schrieb Simon Poole: Well we do have http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/List_of_OSM_based_Services and other lists of services (not suggesting that they are a sufficient replacement for a integrated solution). and you do not find it cause it is hidden in the wiki and not many pages link to it. Well, a link to two or three of these list in the wiki about services, online maps and tools in general would be really helpful. Last week I had to help a friend to get a marker set. Still is still an issue. It is explained on help.osm but again no link from page. The .svg export is another annoying issue as it rarely works. How about a link page under osm.org to better guide interested people ? Could be even just a link to a wiki page. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] How useful is the JOSM wiki
On 08.07.2013 00:21, Dave Swarthout wrote: Hey Dave + every one else I saw this topic the other day and wanted to respond but because I am such a newcomer to JOSM and the Talk list I did not. I used the JOSM Wiki to get started and learned the basics a few months ago. That said, what is in there is good information but there is much, much more detail needed to make the Wiki useful. It's also out-of-date and does not cover new features well, if at all. That is exactly the problem. We need to adjust/update all the time cause JOSM is developing quite fast but this needs more people. As the wiki is anonymously editable with even a button to do so from help browser it is not a big task to add info and belief me we do not bite but would be happy about any useful edit. For example, I downloaded the latest JOSM update the other day. I especially wanted to begin using keyboard shortcuts to invoke some of my custom presets. I've looked everywhere and can find nothing about this new feature. I don't even know where in JOSM's menu system the new shortcuts managing stuff can be found. The Wiki? No help. It should on this page: https://josm.openstreetmap.de/wiki/Help/Preferences/Shortcuts So, how does one use the new keyboard shortcuts? I thought it is explained in the start up message. Anyway, either use right click menu in the top panel or navigate to the keyboard icon in the preferences. And, who does the maintenance of the Wiki? I know it's an open book and anyone can modify pages but when a page doesn't yet exist, how then does one learn to use the missing features? There is no maintainer but a handful of user (mostly one for each language). We use the JOSM wiki within JOSM trac and of course for the internal help browser, but I never know if it is worth to spend much time with updating and formating as I do not get any feedbacks. colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] How does the priority on wiki search function work ?
Hey Just wonder how does the priority setting for the wiki search results work. Searching for tracks offers me highway=track in first place but I did not find tracks=* within the first 20 results. Shouldn't it be the first result as it is the exact match ? cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Power generation refinement approved
Am 30.06.2013 01:02, schrieb François Lacombe: Salut François Last June 11, the power generation refinement proposal was approved by 30 wiki users. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Power_generation_refinement It aims to provide a strong and consistent tagging model to map power plants and power generators too. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dplant http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dgenerator Thus, power=plant replace the deprecated power=station (for places where power is generated only, see http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Substation_refinement for other OSM use cases). power=generator is reserved for devices which convert power from one kind to another kind. Wiki update is still in progress but rendering models and editors presets should be upgraded with that new stuff. If there's anything you need to bring this up to date, please ask here and I would be pleased to precise any unclear point. Please note that 3 other proposals are still draft or RFC and should be voted in next monts. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Substation_refinement http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Power_transmission_refinement http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Power_routing_proposal Reading JOSM's defaultpresets.xml I found a comment about mixed-up voltage values in the preset. Could someone please tell me the major voltages in use. If someone knows the voltages in use for railways/busses I am interested, too Thanks colliar Thanks signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik Lowzoom TIles - proof of concept
Am 04.07.2013 11:18, schrieb Christian Quest: Based on Frederik lowzoom idea, I started improving the low zooms on our OSM-FR style... Here is zoom 7 (others are in the render_list queue): http://tile.openstreetmap.fr/?zoom=7lat=46.88069lon=3.13697layers=B0FFF Here is how I did it: - modify my OSM-FR to remove all labels and boundary at zoom 8 (which was already using landcover/landuse), - generate 4 large PNG using nik2img - combine them and generate one large tiled z8.tif using gdal_translate (133MB, if you want to play with it I can share the result) - create a very simple stylesheet to test using this z8.tif as raster, then add placenames and boundaries It's a work in progress. I'm currently merging this lowzoom stylesheet to my main OSM-FR style sheet. I've not played with imagemagick, it is just a lanczos downscaling made by mapnik. Label ordering is handled by using the place=* tag, then the population=* tag so large cities are placed first. The placename density is limited using text-min-distance. Nice One minor problem: Some city names are not rendered but the city nodes. Probably it makes sense to allow to move label a bit if they are to close. Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Would some wiki admin please move the page gluten_free=* back to proposal namespace
Hi I did move the page [1] a few days to proposal name space and started a discussion on its talk page [2]. On the same time we have a discussion about this issue on tagging@. Now with out discussion the page was reverted and I got following answer on my request to move it back [3]: I do not recognise the 'approval' process. I believe the wiki is for documenting tags as used. I do not propose to move this page back and will treat other attempts to move it as vandalism! Please, would some wiki admin move this page back to proposal name space and tell the user how to create page for new unused tags or tags with low usage and how communication works in OSM. I expect at least an apology for moving the page without any comment. Thanks colliar - [1] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:gluten_free [2] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:gluten_freeoldid=921090 [3] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User_talk:SK53 signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik Lowzoom TIles - proof of concept
Am 01.07.2013 22:32, schrieb Joseph Reeves: Hi Frederik, I really liked this when I saw it last year; am pleased to see it back on the mailing list! To be honest, I prefer the last year's version, but only because of one feature: country borders. I often use the MapQuest Open tiles, for example, at low zooms because they show borders much more clearly than the standard Mapnik tiles do. Likewise, last year's low zoom tiles are easier to understand when it comes to borders (and is therefore more useful to people looking to identify the general location of an entire country, something OSM isn't the best resource for). +1 Would love to see this on osm.org http://osm.org! +1 Yeah, mapnik's low zoom level are quite empty and ugly. colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] How useful is the JOSM wiki
Hey I wonder how useful the JOSM wiki is ? * Is it used at all ? * Why do only a handful persons edit it though you can even edit anonymously ? Comments ? See you colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Please test this Native wikipedia link - feature
On 29.06.2013 01:33, Bryce Nesbitt wrote: On Tue, Jun 25, 2013 at 6:41 PM, Bryce Nesbitt bry...@obviously.com mailto:bry...@obviously.com wrote: On Tue, Jun 25, 2013 at 6:04 PM, Tirkon tirko...@yahoo.de mailto:tirko...@yahoo.de wrote: My idea was to use these Wikidata objects to link everybody to the Wikipedia article of his browser language. For the Universe article this should be done by clicking this: http://tools.wmflabs.org/wdrdr/cgi-bin/index.cgi?item=q1 The same thing could help the OSM wiki. For example JOSM hard codes each available language translation: item name=Artwork icon=presets/arts_centre.png type=node,way,closedway link href=http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:tourism=artwork; de.href=http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:Tag:tourism=artwork; es.href=http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/ES:Tag:tourism=artwork; fr.href=http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/FR:Tag:tourism=artwork; it.href=http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/IT:Tag:tourism=artwork; pt_BR.href=http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt-br:Tag:tourism=artwork; / label text=Edit Artwork / key key=tourism value=artwork / /item Which will be instantly out of date, when anyone adds a new translation. +10, it's a pain See https://josm.openstreetmap.de/ticket/3540 colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Server down ?
Get connection time out from api and website. Is it only me ? colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Server down ?
Am 27.06.2013 02:02, schrieb Cartinus: On 06/27/2013 01:56 AM, colliar wrote: Get connection time out from api and website. Is it only me ? I just managed to start P2. So it's not a general break down. Strange only thing I did which might be uncommon was to start a second josm instance with different config dirs. Did not try it lately but it did work in the past. I am still able to browse with jmapviewer (josm download dialog) but: user@host:~$ ping osm.org PING osm.org (193.63.75.100) 56(84) bytes of data. ^C --- osm.org ping statistics --- 21 packets transmitted, 0 received, 100% packet loss, time 20160ms says it all. Even mirror download does not work. Colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Server down ?
Am 27.06.2013 02:42, schrieb colliar: Am 27.06.2013 02:02, schrieb Cartinus: On 06/27/2013 01:56 AM, colliar wrote: Get connection time out from api and website. Is it only me ? Works again. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] What to do with a improper created wiki page ?
How/Where can we move a page like https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:landuse=breeding out of the way ? There is no proposal and the tags usage is at three (taginfo). Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Survey on the OSM Wiki
On 25.06.2013 21:58, Pieren wrote: On 25/06/2013 17:22, Jonathan Bennett wrote: Sorry to be so harsh It's not the first time we welcome researchers on this list in such a bad mood (not necessarily you Jonathan). It's childish. You could start by explaining that the tagging process is complex, is not only happening on the wiki, that not all of them are the result of a consensus, that some of them are raised on foreign countries and extended later to the world (e.g. the Karlsruhe schema). Sorry, but if you are planning a research I expect you to first read a bit. It should not be so hard to find older threads on the list's archive and you will easily find what infos are wished. On Tue, Jun 25, 2013 at 8:23 PM, Serge Wroclawski emac...@gmail.com wrote: I'd argue that consensus is formed not from the wiki as much as from from the editors, and the renderers, and taginfo. You cannot say that. Give me an example where the editors decided how to tag features in the past. By chance, the developers are not trying to impose new tags or changes. They follow what's happening on the tagging list and/or the wiki. Wow, what an optimistic view. At least for JOSM I hope the few developers spend there time coding and not checking the wiki and follow the sometimes never ending discussions on the mailing lists. The presets syntax is not that hard but there are only few people supplying patches. And taginfo is just showing stats which can be easily biased by mass imports. +5 I think it's 3% of OSM users are responsible for 80-something percent of all OSM data and probable 1% of that 3% is talking about creating, refining or changing tags. Most of the contributors simply don't search too long for a tag definition or a corresponding proposal on the wiki or statistics on taginfo. Most of them will simply not map the feature if if it's not present in the presets and in the map features wiki page. Now you did explain yourself why editors (presets) form a tagging scheme. Once you have reached a certain usage it is quite hard to change the tag and there is no rule not to include tags in presets below a certain usage or certain number of different users adding that tag. One advise for Andrea: check the osm.org main mailing list and tagging list archives about the vote process on the wiki. This will tell you more than anything on the wiki about the process of establishing new tags in OSM. Or just have a look at the last month and you will learn at lot about the process of developing tags (e.g. reservoir, power). colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Survey on the OSM Wiki
On 25.06.2013 21:35, Peter Wendorff wrote: Am 25.06.2013 19:57, schrieb Mulone Moligiangi: On 25/06/2013 17:22, Jonathan Bennett wrote: * What are you hoping to show with this survey? What use do you see this information being to the OSM community, and will they see the results? I'm working on the tagging process, trying to understand how it works on the wiki and how people reach consensus on difficult issues. The OSM community will see the results in academic articles. Sorry to ask back carefully here again: Do we have to extend will see the results in academic articles by if they have enough money to buy the corresponding academic newspaper/magazine? or by , which are ensured to be available free of charge and for anybody interested.? One of my personal main problems with academic research is that it's incredible expensive to look into articles without having access to them (or to libraries which pay for that access somehow), so this would be at least a good argument for me (and I guess some others) to put more effort in telling you more detailled stuff, I guess ;) +10 Why should I help a research if some big player make money of this knowledge/result and even the researcher have to pay money to get it publish. Knowledge is substantial for men kind and should be free for everyone. colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] What to do with a improper created wiki page ?
On 26.06.2013 00:26, Frederik Ramm wrote: Hi, On 25.06.2013 22:03, colliar wrote: How/Where can we move a page like https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:landuse=breeding out of the way ? There is no proposal and the tags usage is at three (taginfo). It could be moved to the Proposal namespace and left to the original author to beef up into a proper proposal. Anyone can move pages btw., it's hidden beneath the down arrow left of the search field. Thanks, done ! Cheers signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Costa Rica Panama borders
On 23.06.2013 20:47, Bryce Nesbitt wrote: On Sun, Jun 23, 2013 at 11:32 AM, Felix Delattre m...@delattre.de mailto:m...@delattre.de wrote: I decided to delete the line (I didn't know about relations at this moment), because first I had tried to correct it, but it was very dififcult. It was easier to make a new line and conect it with the others. It looks like I did it badly and I really didn't know better. Yesterday I modified it again and I put the relations on the vector of the new part of the southern border. I see this as a tools issue. The tools are not really set up to keep relations happy, with users coming in to make reasonable looking edits. +1 What were the involved editors ? There needs to be at least a warning and editors should support to replace an old way with a new way aka ReplaceGeomitry of the utils2Plugin fly signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Re-opening a note if necessary?
On 09.06.2013 20:33, John F. Eldredge wrote: I agree that it should be possible to update notes after the fact. malenki o...@malenki.ch wrote: On 08.06.2013 22:22, James Mast wrote: I'm curious, but does anybody think that notes should be able to be re-opened if necessary? Definitely yes. I've created a ticket here: https://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/4874 I was astonished there wasn't one since I heard a lot of complaining about this missing feature both in OpenStreetBugs and now at notes. Regards Thomas +10 Please, this is needed ! fly signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Key Proposal wheelchair:toilet
Am 07.06.2013 14:26, schrieb Martin Koppenhoefer: 2013/6/7 Christoph Bünte christ...@sozialhelden.de mailto:christ...@sozialhelden.de Hi everyone, we at wheelmap.org http://wheelmap.org want to take our service to the next level by tagging public places wether there is an wheelchair accessible toilet or not. To start the discussion we prepared an key proposal: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/wheelchair:toilet Please let us know what you think about it. There is a little typo under applies to first word. the proposal looks reasonable at first glance, if you see this as an attribute to something (and it will definitely be easier to evaluate this way). An alternative might be to tag explicitly the toilet and add wheelchair tags to the toilet. I checked with tag info and there are already tags in use: http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/toilets e.g. wheelchair:*toilets* http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/wheelchair%3Atoilets *toilets*:wheelchair http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/toilets%3Awheelchair the suggestion for a toilet attribute on a POI according to http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:amenity%3Dtoilets is toilets, that's why I suggest you change the wording in your proposal to plural. IMHO the most logical way would be toilets:wheelchair=yes/no but wheelchair:toilets is currently used far more often. +1, for toilets:wheelchair=0-100, or even toilets:wheelchair:female=1 fly signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Parking map
Am 06.06.2013 14:16, schrieb Gervase Markham: The on-street parking restrictions around our church are complex. I'd love to make a map on a web page, where you could put into a form widget: Day of week: Friday Start parking: 8am End parking: 10am and it would colour the sides of the road and the car parks with green (free), yellow (pay), or red (can't park here). Updating the widgets would update the map on the fly. I realise this would require me to put all the parking restrictions into the OSM database using the complex tagging system defined for the purpose. But what else would it require? - Do I need to find some HTML5/Canvas map renderer and hack that? Or can I do some sort of overlay on top of existing map tiles? - Do I need to download the data into the web page using the Overpass API? Or another API? Has anyone done anything like this before? Ideas very welcome. Do you know this map ? Would be a start. http://parking.openstreetmap.de/ colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Are there any guidelines for wiki admins ?
Hey After the dispute last week and another private issue, I wonder if there are any wiki-admin guidelines as I'd like to have a look at. * How are new admins instructed ? * Are there any golden rules ? * Is it clear for all admins that: * voting in the wiki is not that important ? * to discuss major changes in advanc on tagging@osm ? Thanks and cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Notes feature
Am 01.06.2013 01:38, schrieb Paul Johnson: Curious when the JOSM OpenStreetBugs feature will be updated to handle the new Notes system, does anyone know? See https://josm.openstreetmap.de/ticket/8193 It does not have to be either or but both will probably be supported for a while. fly signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Notes feature
Am 01.06.2013 01:38, schrieb Paul Johnson: Curious when the JOSM OpenStreetBugs feature will be updated to handle the new Notes system, does anyone know? See https://josm.openstreetmap.de/ticket/8193 It does not have to be either or but both will probably be supported for a while. fly signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Read-only for next few hours
On 25.05.2013 18:16, Roland Olbricht wrote: Hi Grant, OpenStreetMap is now back online. All services are returned to normal. Thank you for the quick fix :) +1 Thanks for your work Grant. colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Appeal for a JOSM fieldpapers plugin to replace walkingpapers
On 27.05.2013 11:23, RB wrote: Le 27 mai 2013 12:22, maning sambale a écrit : Dear osm-talk, Posting this appeal to the general talk list. Hoping someone can catch this. ;) Back story: We use walkingpapers a lot for community mapping, it would be nice for a plugin that uses fieldpapers. Filed ticket: http://josm.openstreetmap.de/ticket/8738 Modify the walkingpapers plugin to use fieldpapers instead Description Walkingpapers is currently unmaintained for over a year now. Requesting a modification or a new plugin that uses fieldpapers instead. Thanks! I support very much this idea. It would be very useful. +1 signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Unsubscribe
On 25.05.2013 14:09, Martin Schafran wrote: geh auf http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk und suche: To unsubscribe from talk, ... It is very common for a mailing list to offer the unsubscribe link in the footer. Is there a reason to not adding the link to the footer ? Cheers colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] List: Densely Mapped Areas
On 24.05.2013 21:51, Frederik Ramm wrote: On 24.05.2013 18:30, Christoph Hormann wrote: By the way you do realize that Cameroon and other equatorial areas have a significant advantage to higher latitudes in this measurement. So it might be prudent to not only say 'FSVO mapped' but also 'FSVO densely'. I re-did the list with nodes per square kilometre, although this also renders the basic idea of looking at z16 meta tiles kind of arbitrary. Here's the result: http://fred.dev.openstreetmap.org/density/sqkm.html Cameroon still features near the top but France has grabbed the first four spots. Thanks Frederik Still think the results are illusions and it is no wonder to almost only find areas with open and imported cadastre data. 1. Better take the population density and not just the area 2. Would be nice to only clean out imported data which has not been modified after. I am not willed to map every tree in the forest or ever sand grain in the dessert to compete in this list. Colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Could someone please contact a user in Spanish ?
Hi The JOSM team is hunting a bug [1] concerning consecutive identical nodes in ways. Now one user did produce quite a lot of these ways the last days. I did already write a message to him/her in English but I did not get any answer so far and I am not sure if the user knows enough English to communicate. Would someone please kindly ask him/her, * if all plugins are up to date ? * if she/he does not get error warnings from validator on upload ? * which plugins are installed (version) * How she/he is able to produce these ways (workflow). Thanks a lot colliar [1] https://josm.openstreetmap.de/ticket/8591 [2] http://toolserver.org/~mapjedi/blame.txt signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Could someone please contact a user in Spanish ?
On 22.05.2013 18:51, colliar wrote: Found one. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] from-via-to relation
On 21.05.2013 14:38, Martin Schafran wrote: On Tuesday 21 May 2013 13:20:20 Steve Doerr wrote: YES, its the best match until now as to the idea. regarding to the term I can't judge. Sounds a bit like the proposed 'through route' relation: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/through_route No, through_route defines a route to follow to get through/bypass a town/city. Martin wants to play with traffic_signals and single junctions. E.g. this traffic_signal counts only for straight traffic while turning left is allowe all the time. The relation would be close to turn-restrictions. cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] duplicated ways (same geometry and tags)
Am 13.05.2013 17:11, schrieb Jean-Marc Liotier: On 13/05/2013 12:04, SomeoneElse wrote: didier2020 wrote: I have not analyzed the causes of these duplicates. I delete a lot of ways and node everywhere on the planet, also this explanation seemed necessary on this list Would it be possible to link to the relevant changesets? Edits by the account didier2020 uses for those types of corrections: http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/botdidier2020/edits Wow quite impressive list. Would it be possible to make a list available similar to https://josm.openstreetmap.de/ticket/8591#comment:9 It would make it more visible for all developers. Thanks colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] duplicated ways (same geometry and tags)
On 13.05.2013 12:04, SomeoneElse wrote: didier2020 wrote: H I have not analyzed the causes of these duplicates. I delete a lot of ways and node everywhere on the planet, also this explanation seemed necessary on this list Then you will never find the root cause nor are you able to inform developers or users about mistakes. Would it be possible to link to the relevant changesets? +1 This happen if JOSM fails to upload correctly and the user does not update data before trying to upload again. In fact there is even a bug in JOSM where the upload finishes but JOSM never gets that important answer from the server. Do not know about other editors. cu colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM relation ID property in Wikidata
On 11.05.2013 04:19, malenki wrote: colliar wrote: Am 05.05.2013 05:26, schrieb malenki: The tool replace geometry exists - at least for JOSM. It even works on replacing an old (existing) Node for a new way. Yes it is a nice tool but it only does include the node in the new way. E.g. you still have a new object representing the real world object. Cannot confirm. Right now tested on this way - the old id still is used: http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/28820333 You did replace a way with a way but not a node with a way ! colliar signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
