Re: STP SCA Component - STP SCA Tools sub project
Hi Jean-Sebastien, all, Thanks for your comments. On Wed, Apr 9, 2008 at 8:34 PM, Jean-Sebastien Delfino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The proposal looks pretty good to me. I have a few comments/questions: - Are you going to have tools to create SCA contributions, imports/exports, contribution dependencies etc? Yes. I haven't defined components for these tools because they don't seem big enough to create specific components. - You mention validation rules in the EMF model. Will the tool create problems, warnings, tasks etc in the Eclipse problem view? Yes. I have already implemented some of these rules. Currently I don't have enough resources to work more on this part. - Do you have any plans to provide hooks to Run/Debug SCA components from the tool? - Are you going to cover any of the SCA domain and deployment aspects, like deploying SCA contributions and composites to an SCA domain shared by a team for example? These two last items will be covered by the SCA Integration component and other components of STP like the SOA System component. I will discuss more on this (in the coming weeks) with the leaders of the other STP components that adress packaging, deployment, and policies to define better the role of everyone. +1 from me to have Tuscany listed as an interested party. -- Jean-Sebastien - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: STP SCA Component - STP SCA Tools sub project
+1, good for both projects. And to reply to a comment in the original email - I'm not sure that we really need an explicit vote for this can just assume from all the positive comments so far and lazy consensus that its fine unless someone complains (which i'm sure they wont). ...ant On Tue, Apr 8, 2008 at 5:17 PM, Simon Nash [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This proposal looks good to me. I'd be happy to see the Apache Tuscany project listed as an interested party. Simon Stéphane Drapeau wrote: Hi, I created an entry [0] in the Eclipse bugzilla with the proposal. Your comments are welcome. Best regards Stéphane Drapeau Obeo [0]: https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=225956 On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 11:10 AM, Stéphane Drapeau [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Haleh, Raymond, Thank you for your answers. Haleh, you're right. I make no distinction between tools for SCA developers and tools for SCA users. The goal of the project is to develop tools to help users of the SCA technology. I will modify my sentence. Stéphane Drapeau Obeo On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 6:21 AM, haleh mahbod [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Stephan, This looks good since it looks like tools for SCA will get more focus :) I have a question. You mention the goals of the new sub-project are to develop a set of tools for SCA developers and SCA users. What is the difference between SCA developer and SCA user in this context? Haleh On 4/2/08, Stéphane Drapeau [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Jean-Sebastien, Haleh, all, The proposal is a 3 pages document describing the scope/intent of the proposed project. The outline is: 1. Introduction: the proposition of the transformation of the STP/SCA component into a sub-project named SCA Tools under the top level project STP. 2. Background: presentation of STP + presentation of the existing STP/SCA component. 3. Description: the goals of the new sub-project are to develop a set of tools for SCA developers and SCA users. Another goal is also to link this sub-project with other components of STP (Service Creation, Policy Editor) 4. Proposed components: SCA Domain Model (SCA meta model), SCA Composite Designer, SCA Composite Editors (tree, xml and form), SCA Integration (integration with other STP components) 5. Relationship with Other Eclipse Projects: STP, EMF, GMF, M2M, ... 6. Organization: this sub-project will take place under the top level project STP. 7. A list of proposed initial committers. 8. Code Contribution: the Eclipse STP/SCA component will be the initial code. 9. Interested parties: this section lists companies and communities that support the creation of the project. They don't take other engagements. 10. Tentative Plan for 2008 and 2009. Our goal is to identify formally the scope of the tools that we develop around SCA. The new status will provide some advantages. - I think that the SCA tools will be more visible in the Eclipse community if we are identified as a sub-project. - From the users point of view, it will not change anything. - Concerning us, we should be more formal: clear roadmap, new features described/discussed first in bugzilla, ... - It will also present some advantages for Obeo by becoming a sub-project leader. In the near future all STP components will become STP sub-projects. To summarize, all of this is purely administrative. I will send you the proposal document ASAP. If you have any questions, don't hesitate. Haleh, yesterday I sent you more information about the SCA Composite Designer on the thread named [Website] - Tooling for Java SCA. You can add it on the web page. Tell me if you need more/different information. My post describes what version of Tuscany can be used. I also introduce a tutorial that I made. This tutorial is based on the SCA designer and Tuscany 1.1. Best regards, Stéphane Drapeau Obeo On Wed, Apr 2, 2008 at 8:05 AM, haleh mahbod [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Stephane, Welcome to Tuscany. How will changing the status of STP SCA from a component to a sub project change its future development and focus? Tuscany community had asked about tools for SCA and because of that I recently added a website page [1] to collect more information about available open source tools. I added a link to STP
Re: STP SCA Component - STP SCA Tools sub project
Stéphane Drapeau wrote: Hi, I created an entry [0] in the Eclipse bugzilla with the proposal. Your comments are welcome. Best regards Stéphane Drapeau Obeo [0]: https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=225956 The proposal looks pretty good to me. I have a few comments/questions: - Are you going to have tools to create SCA contributions, imports/exports, contribution dependencies etc? - You mention validation rules in the EMF model. Will the tool create problems, warnings, tasks etc in the Eclipse problem view? - Do you have any plans to provide hooks to Run/Debug SCA components from the tool? - Are you going to cover any of the SCA domain and deployment aspects, like deploying SCA contributions and composites to an SCA domain shared by a team for example? +1 from me to have Tuscany listed as an interested party. -- Jean-Sebastien - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: STP SCA Component - STP SCA Tools sub project
This proposal looks good to me. I'd be happy to see the Apache Tuscany project listed as an interested party. Simon Stéphane Drapeau wrote: Hi, I created an entry [0] in the Eclipse bugzilla with the proposal. Your comments are welcome. Best regards Stéphane Drapeau Obeo [0]: https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=225956 On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 11:10 AM, Stéphane Drapeau [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Haleh, Raymond, Thank you for your answers. Haleh, you're right. I make no distinction between tools for SCA developers and tools for SCA users. The goal of the project is to develop tools to help users of the SCA technology. I will modify my sentence. Stéphane Drapeau Obeo On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 6:21 AM, haleh mahbod [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Stephan, This looks good since it looks like tools for SCA will get more focus :) I have a question. You mention the goals of the new sub-project are to develop a set of tools for SCA developers and SCA users. What is the difference between SCA developer and SCA user in this context? Haleh On 4/2/08, Stéphane Drapeau [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Jean-Sebastien, Haleh, all, The proposal is a 3 pages document describing the scope/intent of the proposed project. The outline is: 1. Introduction: the proposition of the transformation of the STP/SCA component into a sub-project named SCA Tools under the top level project STP. 2. Background: presentation of STP + presentation of the existing STP/SCA component. 3. Description: the goals of the new sub-project are to develop a set of tools for SCA developers and SCA users. Another goal is also to link this sub-project with other components of STP (Service Creation, Policy Editor) 4. Proposed components: SCA Domain Model (SCA meta model), SCA Composite Designer, SCA Composite Editors (tree, xml and form), SCA Integration (integration with other STP components) 5. Relationship with Other Eclipse Projects: STP, EMF, GMF, M2M, ... 6. Organization: this sub-project will take place under the top level project STP. 7. A list of proposed initial committers. 8. Code Contribution: the Eclipse STP/SCA component will be the initial code. 9. Interested parties: this section lists companies and communities that support the creation of the project. They don't take other engagements. 10. Tentative Plan for 2008 and 2009. Our goal is to identify formally the scope of the tools that we develop around SCA. The new status will provide some advantages. - I think that the SCA tools will be more visible in the Eclipse community if we are identified as a sub-project. - From the users point of view, it will not change anything. - Concerning us, we should be more formal: clear roadmap, new features described/discussed first in bugzilla, ... - It will also present some advantages for Obeo by becoming a sub-project leader. In the near future all STP components will become STP sub-projects. To summarize, all of this is purely administrative. I will send you the proposal document ASAP. If you have any questions, don't hesitate. Haleh, yesterday I sent you more information about the SCA Composite Designer on the thread named [Website] - Tooling for Java SCA. You can add it on the web page. Tell me if you need more/different information. My post describes what version of Tuscany can be used. I also introduce a tutorial that I made. This tutorial is based on the SCA designer and Tuscany 1.1. Best regards, Stéphane Drapeau Obeo On Wed, Apr 2, 2008 at 8:05 AM, haleh mahbod [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Stephane, Welcome to Tuscany. How will changing the status of STP SCA from a component to a sub project change its future development and focus? Tuscany community had asked about tools for SCA and because of that I recently added a website page [1] to collect more information about available open source tools. I added a link to STP there. It would be great if you could provide more content about what is available and what version of Tuscany it works with. [1]: http://incubator.apache.org/tuscany/java-sca-tools.html Haleh On 4/1/08, Jean-Sebastien Delfino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Stéphane Drapeau wrote: Hi, I'm Stéphane Drapeau from Obeo. I work on tools for SCA and I lead the Eclipse SCA component which is a component of the STP project [1]. Currently, I'm writing a proposal to change the status of the STP SCA * component* to STP/SCA Tools *sub project*. I would like know if I can refer Tuscany community as interested party of our proposal. It's purely administrative. Jean Sebastien told me that the Tuscany community must vote on this issue. So the discussion is open ;) Thanks very much. Best regards Stéphane Drapeau Obeo [1]: http://www.eclipse.org/stp/sca/index.php Hi Stephane, Thanks for posting here, it'll enable the whole Tuscany community to get involved in the discussion around your SCA editor proposal. Can you tell us a bit more about the proposal?
Re: STP SCA Component - STP SCA Tools sub project
Hi, I created an entry [0] in the Eclipse bugzilla with the proposal. Your comments are welcome. Best regards Stéphane Drapeau Obeo [0]: https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=225956 On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 11:10 AM, Stéphane Drapeau [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Haleh, Raymond, Thank you for your answers. Haleh, you're right. I make no distinction between tools for SCA developers and tools for SCA users. The goal of the project is to develop tools to help users of the SCA technology. I will modify my sentence. Stéphane Drapeau Obeo On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 6:21 AM, haleh mahbod [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Stephan, This looks good since it looks like tools for SCA will get more focus :) I have a question. You mention the goals of the new sub-project are to develop a set of tools for SCA developers and SCA users. What is the difference between SCA developer and SCA user in this context? Haleh On 4/2/08, Stéphane Drapeau [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Jean-Sebastien, Haleh, all, The proposal is a 3 pages document describing the scope/intent of the proposed project. The outline is: 1. Introduction: the proposition of the transformation of the STP/SCA component into a sub-project named SCA Tools under the top level project STP. 2. Background: presentation of STP + presentation of the existing STP/SCA component. 3. Description: the goals of the new sub-project are to develop a set of tools for SCA developers and SCA users. Another goal is also to link this sub-project with other components of STP (Service Creation, Policy Editor) 4. Proposed components: SCA Domain Model (SCA meta model), SCA Composite Designer, SCA Composite Editors (tree, xml and form), SCA Integration (integration with other STP components) 5. Relationship with Other Eclipse Projects: STP, EMF, GMF, M2M, ... 6. Organization: this sub-project will take place under the top level project STP. 7. A list of proposed initial committers. 8. Code Contribution: the Eclipse STP/SCA component will be the initial code. 9. Interested parties: this section lists companies and communities that support the creation of the project. They don't take other engagements. 10. Tentative Plan for 2008 and 2009. Our goal is to identify formally the scope of the tools that we develop around SCA. The new status will provide some advantages. - I think that the SCA tools will be more visible in the Eclipse community if we are identified as a sub-project. - From the users point of view, it will not change anything. - Concerning us, we should be more formal: clear roadmap, new features described/discussed first in bugzilla, ... - It will also present some advantages for Obeo by becoming a sub-project leader. In the near future all STP components will become STP sub-projects. To summarize, all of this is purely administrative. I will send you the proposal document ASAP. If you have any questions, don't hesitate. Haleh, yesterday I sent you more information about the SCA Composite Designer on the thread named [Website] - Tooling for Java SCA. You can add it on the web page. Tell me if you need more/different information. My post describes what version of Tuscany can be used. I also introduce a tutorial that I made. This tutorial is based on the SCA designer and Tuscany 1.1. Best regards, Stéphane Drapeau Obeo On Wed, Apr 2, 2008 at 8:05 AM, haleh mahbod [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Stephane, Welcome to Tuscany. How will changing the status of STP SCA from a component to a sub project change its future development and focus? Tuscany community had asked about tools for SCA and because of that I recently added a website page [1] to collect more information about available open source tools. I added a link to STP there. It would be great if you could provide more content about what is available and what version of Tuscany it works with. [1]: http://incubator.apache.org/tuscany/java-sca-tools.html Haleh On 4/1/08, Jean-Sebastien Delfino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Stéphane Drapeau wrote: Hi, I'm Stéphane Drapeau from Obeo. I work on tools for SCA and I lead the Eclipse SCA component which is a component of the STP project [1]. Currently, I'm writing a proposal to change the status of the STP SCA * component* to STP/SCA Tools *sub project*. I would like know if I can refer Tuscany community as interested party of our proposal. It's purely administrative. Jean Sebastien told me that the Tuscany community must vote on this issue. So the discussion is open ;) Thanks very much. Best regards Stéphane Drapeau Obeo
Re: STP SCA Component - STP SCA Tools sub project
Hi Stephane, Welcome to Tuscany. How will changing the status of STP SCA from a component to a sub project change its future development and focus? Tuscany community had asked about tools for SCA and because of that I recently added a website page [1] to collect more information about available open source tools. I added a link to STP there. It would be great if you could provide more content about what is available and what version of Tuscany it works with. [1]: http://incubator.apache.org/tuscany/java-sca-tools.html Haleh On 4/1/08, Jean-Sebastien Delfino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Stéphane Drapeau wrote: Hi, I'm Stéphane Drapeau from Obeo. I work on tools for SCA and I lead the Eclipse SCA component which is a component of the STP project [1]. Currently, I'm writing a proposal to change the status of the STP SCA * component* to STP/SCA Tools *sub project*. I would like know if I can refer Tuscany community as interested party of our proposal. It's purely administrative. Jean Sebastien told me that the Tuscany community must vote on this issue. So the discussion is open ;) Thanks very much. Best regards Stéphane Drapeau Obeo [1]: http://www.eclipse.org/stp/sca/index.php Hi Stephane, Thanks for posting here, it'll enable the whole Tuscany community to get involved in the discussion around your SCA editor proposal. Can you tell us a bit more about the proposal? do you have an outline? Also can you help us understand what it means to be listed under interested parties in such a proposal? Any questions or thoughts from others on the list? -- Jean-Sebastien - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: STP SCA Component - STP SCA Tools sub project
Hi Jean-Sebastien, Haleh, all, The proposal is a 3 pages document describing the scope/intent of the proposed project. The outline is: 1. Introduction: the proposition of the transformation of the STP/SCA component into a sub-project named SCA Tools under the top level project STP. 2. Background: presentation of STP + presentation of the existing STP/SCA component. 3. Description: the goals of the new sub-project are to develop a set of tools for SCA developers and SCA users. Another goal is also to link this sub-project with other components of STP (Service Creation, Policy Editor) 4. Proposed components: SCA Domain Model (SCA meta model), SCA Composite Designer, SCA Composite Editors (tree, xml and form), SCA Integration (integration with other STP components) 5. Relationship with Other Eclipse Projects: STP, EMF, GMF, M2M, ... 6. Organization: this sub-project will take place under the top level project STP. 7. A list of proposed initial committers. 8. Code Contribution: the Eclipse STP/SCA component will be the initial code. 9. Interested parties: this section lists companies and communities that support the creation of the project. They don't take other engagements. 10. Tentative Plan for 2008 and 2009. Our goal is to identify formally the scope of the tools that we develop around SCA. The new status will provide some advantages. - I think that the SCA tools will be more visible in the Eclipse community if we are identified as a sub-project. - From the users point of view, it will not change anything. - Concerning us, we should be more formal: clear roadmap, new features described/discussed first in bugzilla, ... - It will also present some advantages for Obeo by becoming a sub-project leader. In the near future all STP components will become STP sub-projects. To summarize, all of this is purely administrative. I will send you the proposal document ASAP. If you have any questions, don't hesitate. Haleh, yesterday I sent you more information about the SCA Composite Designer on the thread named [Website] - Tooling for Java SCA. You can add it on the web page. Tell me if you need more/different information. My post describes what version of Tuscany can be used. I also introduce a tutorial that I made. This tutorial is based on the SCA designer and Tuscany 1.1. Best regards, Stéphane Drapeau Obeo On Wed, Apr 2, 2008 at 8:05 AM, haleh mahbod [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Stephane, Welcome to Tuscany. How will changing the status of STP SCA from a component to a sub project change its future development and focus? Tuscany community had asked about tools for SCA and because of that I recently added a website page [1] to collect more information about available open source tools. I added a link to STP there. It would be great if you could provide more content about what is available and what version of Tuscany it works with. [1]: http://incubator.apache.org/tuscany/java-sca-tools.html Haleh On 4/1/08, Jean-Sebastien Delfino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Stéphane Drapeau wrote: Hi, I'm Stéphane Drapeau from Obeo. I work on tools for SCA and I lead the Eclipse SCA component which is a component of the STP project [1]. Currently, I'm writing a proposal to change the status of the STP SCA * component* to STP/SCA Tools *sub project*. I would like know if I can refer Tuscany community as interested party of our proposal. It's purely administrative. Jean Sebastien told me that the Tuscany community must vote on this issue. So the discussion is open ;) Thanks very much. Best regards Stéphane Drapeau Obeo [1]: http://www.eclipse.org/stp/sca/index.php Hi Stephane, Thanks for posting here, it'll enable the whole Tuscany community to get involved in the discussion around your SCA editor proposal. Can you tell us a bit more about the proposal? do you have an outline? Also can you help us understand what it means to be listed under interested parties in such a proposal? Any questions or thoughts from others on the list? -- Jean-Sebastien - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: STP SCA Component - STP SCA Tools sub project
Hi Stephan, This looks good since it looks like tools for SCA will get more focus :) I have a question. You mention the goals of the new sub-project are to develop a set of tools for SCA developers and SCA users. What is the difference between SCA developer and SCA user in this context? Haleh On 4/2/08, Stéphane Drapeau [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Jean-Sebastien, Haleh, all, The proposal is a 3 pages document describing the scope/intent of the proposed project. The outline is: 1. Introduction: the proposition of the transformation of the STP/SCA component into a sub-project named SCA Tools under the top level project STP. 2. Background: presentation of STP + presentation of the existing STP/SCA component. 3. Description: the goals of the new sub-project are to develop a set of tools for SCA developers and SCA users. Another goal is also to link this sub-project with other components of STP (Service Creation, Policy Editor) 4. Proposed components: SCA Domain Model (SCA meta model), SCA Composite Designer, SCA Composite Editors (tree, xml and form), SCA Integration (integration with other STP components) 5. Relationship with Other Eclipse Projects: STP, EMF, GMF, M2M, ... 6. Organization: this sub-project will take place under the top level project STP. 7. A list of proposed initial committers. 8. Code Contribution: the Eclipse STP/SCA component will be the initial code. 9. Interested parties: this section lists companies and communities that support the creation of the project. They don't take other engagements. 10. Tentative Plan for 2008 and 2009. Our goal is to identify formally the scope of the tools that we develop around SCA. The new status will provide some advantages. - I think that the SCA tools will be more visible in the Eclipse community if we are identified as a sub-project. - From the users point of view, it will not change anything. - Concerning us, we should be more formal: clear roadmap, new features described/discussed first in bugzilla, ... - It will also present some advantages for Obeo by becoming a sub-project leader. In the near future all STP components will become STP sub-projects. To summarize, all of this is purely administrative. I will send you the proposal document ASAP. If you have any questions, don't hesitate. Haleh, yesterday I sent you more information about the SCA Composite Designer on the thread named [Website] - Tooling for Java SCA. You can add it on the web page. Tell me if you need more/different information. My post describes what version of Tuscany can be used. I also introduce a tutorial that I made. This tutorial is based on the SCA designer and Tuscany 1.1. Best regards, Stéphane Drapeau Obeo On Wed, Apr 2, 2008 at 8:05 AM, haleh mahbod [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Stephane, Welcome to Tuscany. How will changing the status of STP SCA from a component to a sub project change its future development and focus? Tuscany community had asked about tools for SCA and because of that I recently added a website page [1] to collect more information about available open source tools. I added a link to STP there. It would be great if you could provide more content about what is available and what version of Tuscany it works with. [1]: http://incubator.apache.org/tuscany/java-sca-tools.html Haleh On 4/1/08, Jean-Sebastien Delfino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Stéphane Drapeau wrote: Hi, I'm Stéphane Drapeau from Obeo. I work on tools for SCA and I lead the Eclipse SCA component which is a component of the STP project [1]. Currently, I'm writing a proposal to change the status of the STP SCA * component* to STP/SCA Tools *sub project*. I would like know if I can refer Tuscany community as interested party of our proposal. It's purely administrative. Jean Sebastien told me that the Tuscany community must vote on this issue. So the discussion is open ;) Thanks very much. Best regards Stéphane Drapeau Obeo [1]: http://www.eclipse.org/stp/sca/index.php Hi Stephane, Thanks for posting here, it'll enable the whole Tuscany community to get involved in the discussion around your SCA editor proposal. Can you tell us a bit more about the proposal? do you have an outline? Also can you help us understand what it means to be listed under interested parties in such a proposal? Any questions or thoughts from others on the list? -- Jean-Sebastien - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
STP SCA Component - STP SCA Tools sub project
Hi, I'm Stéphane Drapeau from Obeo. I work on tools for SCA and I lead the Eclipse SCA component which is a component of the STP project [1]. Currently, I'm writing a proposal to change the status of the STP SCA * component* to STP/SCA Tools *sub project*. I would like know if I can refer Tuscany community as interested party of our proposal. It's purely administrative. Jean Sebastien told me that the Tuscany community must vote on this issue. So the discussion is open ;) Thanks very much. Best regards Stéphane Drapeau Obeo [1]: http://www.eclipse.org/stp/sca/index.php
Re: STP SCA Component - STP SCA Tools sub project
Stéphane Drapeau wrote: Hi, I'm Stéphane Drapeau from Obeo. I work on tools for SCA and I lead the Eclipse SCA component which is a component of the STP project [1]. Currently, I'm writing a proposal to change the status of the STP SCA * component* to STP/SCA Tools *sub project*. I would like know if I can refer Tuscany community as interested party of our proposal. It's purely administrative. Jean Sebastien told me that the Tuscany community must vote on this issue. So the discussion is open ;) Thanks very much. Best regards Stéphane Drapeau Obeo [1]: http://www.eclipse.org/stp/sca/index.php Hi Stephane, Thanks for posting here, it'll enable the whole Tuscany community to get involved in the discussion around your SCA editor proposal. Can you tell us a bit more about the proposal? do you have an outline? Also can you help us understand what it means to be listed under interested parties in such a proposal? Any questions or thoughts from others on the list? -- Jean-Sebastien - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
