[Vo]: What is HTP??

2006-08-14 Thread john herman
Dear Vo., cut from post: Please. what is HTP?? If one manufactures 35% HO-OH on a small scale(garage), which is safe (probably, whereas HTP is notsafe) then the amount needed for the 500 miles jumpsall the way to 250 liters, imposing a weight penalty, but one which is in the same range

[Vo]: Re: What is HTP??

2006-08-14 Thread Jones Beene
High-strength peroxide (also called high-test peroxide, or HTP) the acronym is a holdover from the days of rocketry. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_peroxide

Re: [Vo]: Re: What is HTP??

2006-08-14 Thread Terry Blanton
What are you doing awake so early?!? On 8/14/06, Jones Beene [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: High-strength peroxide (also called high-test peroxide, or HTP) the acronym is a holdover from the days of rocketry. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_peroxide

[Vo]: High Oil Prices Temporary?

2006-08-14 Thread OrionWorks
Hi Oil Prices Temporary? I doubt it. But It's a nice thought. See: http://energy.seekingalpha.com/article/15450 Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.Zazzle.com/orionworks

[Vo]: Re: What is HTP??

2006-08-14 Thread Jones Beene
Make hay when the sun shines, but make HTP when the moon shines?? --- Terry Blanton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What are you doing awake so early?!? On 8/14/06, Jones Beene [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: High-strength peroxide (also called high-test peroxide, or HTP) the acronym is a holdover

[Vo]: Re: What is HTP ?

2006-08-14 Thread Jones Beene
Well, since this thread title is a natural, for an update of what can be acomplished by grumpy-old-men, for very little $, here it is... Over the past days, I'm pretty sure that we have advanced towards a simple way to make a pretreated waterfuel which has an active ingedient consisting of mostly

Re: [Vo]: Goldes Patent App

2006-08-14 Thread Terry Blanton
On 8/3/06, Terry Blanton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: . . . is posted on his site: http://www.magneticpowerinc.com/mpi-patentapplication.pdf Some piccys of Mark's research have shown up on PESwiki: http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Magnetic_Power_Inc You gotta love that Alcoa Faraday

Re: [Vo]: History of Electric Vehicles

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
I wrote: Adjusting for inflation gasoline was $2.00/litre , compared to $1.00 /litre in Canada today. That must be adjusted for inflation. Where did that info come from? It sounds about right. This checks out. See: http://www.bankofcanada.ca/en/dollar_book/appendixa.pdf Quote: . . . one

[Vo]: The non-future of economics and manufacturing

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
Earlier, I wrote in response to Ed Storms: A country needs to produce something the rest of the world wants. I do not think that will be as true in the future. I think people will be more autonomous, particularly in the far distant future when manufacturing is done entirely with robots and

[Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
Edmund Storms wrote: No one can win against a foe who is willing to die for their belief . . . True for non-conventional wars. Many Japanese people were willing to die for their country in 1945 but the U.S. won with conventional weapons and techniques. (I think the war would have been over

RE: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Zell, Chris
I agree that cutting off the flow of oil derived wealth is the likely solution to most of the terror. Many Arab countries might be better off if their oil disappeared and they were forced to develop real, balanced economies that involve manufacturing and trade - like Turkey. If oil wealth were

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Edmund Storms
Jed Rothwell wrote: Edmund Storms wrote: No one can win against a foe who is willing to die for their belief . . . True for non-conventional wars. Many Japanese people were willing to die for their country in 1945 but the U.S. won with conventional weapons and techniques. (I think the

RE: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
Zell, Chris wrote: If oil wealth were to evaporate, Iran in particular might become a surprizingly liberal democracy, with a secular basis. Supposedly, less than 25% of Iranians see religion as the dominant influence in their life. I have heard that. There is also a lot of support for the US

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
Edmund Storms wrote: I don't think this approach will work under present conditions. In the process of denying funding, the people will get even more improvised and desperate. There are 2 billion people in the world living in desperate conditions on the edge of starvation. They are not

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread leaking pen
not all terrorist groups are muslim, and not all muslim groups are oil funded. drugs funds a lot of them as well, and some are funded through other, not oil businesses. On 8/14/06, Jed Rothwell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Edmund Storms wrote:No one can win against a foe who is willing to die for

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
Leaking pen wrote: not all terrorist groups are muslim, and not all muslim groups are oil funded. The only terrorists threatening the US and the UK are Muslim. Everything and everyone in the Middle East outside of Israel is funded by oil. They have no other industry or source of income. The

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Edmund Storms
Jed Rothwell wrote: Edmund Storms wrote: I don't think this approach will work under present conditions. In the process of denying funding, the people will get even more improvised and desperate. There are 2 billion people in the world living in desperate conditions on the edge of

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
Edmund Storms wrote: OK, what do you think causes terrorism? Why would an educated person give up their life to blow up an airplane? These people are not insane or without love of life, and the 72 virgins reason is pure propaganda. I believe the pattern of history is clear on this. The

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread leaking pen
al queada, based out of afghanistan, is funded primarily by the manufacture and sale of opium and heroin. middle east countries have many other sources of income besides oil. And hows about the basque terrorists? Hows about the oklahoma city bombing, was that a muslim? didnt think so, and

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
leaking pen wrote: Ohh, and, the main breeding of terrorism is the prescence of other groups within thier countries. namely, us and israeli prescence. if it werent for our bases in iran and turkey, osama bin laden wouldnt have given two pieces of ratshit for us in the usa. That is not

RE: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Zell, Chris
When 9-11 happened, what depressed and horrified me the most was not the actual losses of life and property, although they were bad enough. What horrified me most was hearing that the Muslim men involved might have attended college, gone to strip clubs and consumed alcohol. In short, they had

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Edmund Storms
I don't believe they hate our freedom and our good life as we are encouraged to believe. They say they do! Have you read bin Laden speeches? You can see what he has to say in books such as, Imperial Hubris. He is the most popular man in the Muslim world and millions of people have named

RE: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
Zell, Chris wrote: What horrified me most was hearing that the Muslim men involved might have attended college, gone to strip clubs and consumed alcohol. In short, they had every available benefit or pleasure western society offered - and still dedicated themselves to mass murder and

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Nick Palmer
Jed Rothwell wrote:- Leaking pen wrote: not all terrorist groups are muslim, and not all muslim groups are oil funded. The only terrorists threatening the US and the UK are Muslim. True now; but in the UK, we had the IRA terrorists bombing civilians for decades. They got a lot of

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Edmund Storms
Jed, you are proposing we treat the Moslem countries exactly how we treated Germany after WWI. The plan was make them pay for what they did during WWI and make them too poor to ever do it again. As a result Hitler and WWII resulted. On the other hand, after WWII we gave a great deal of

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
Nick Palmer wrote: True now; but in the UK, we had the IRA terrorists bombing civilians for decades. And now they have stopped, thank goodness. I think it is over. That's my point; these things eventually stop. They got a lot of financial support from the Boston, USA area of America and

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread leaking pen
hes also stating that the average person ever sees dime one of the oil money. its the primary income for the RICH. not every one else there. On 8/14/06, Edmund Storms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jed, you are proposing we treat the Moslem countries exactly how wetreated Germany after WWI.The plan was

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
Edmund Storms wrote: I don't believe they hate our freedom and our good life as we are encouraged to believe. They say they do! Have you read bin Laden speeches? You can see what he has to say in books such as, Imperial Hubris. . . . I think this conclusion is too simplistic. What they

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Edmund Storms
Zell, Chris wrote: When 9-11 happened, what depressed and horrified me the most was not the actual losses of life and property, although they were bad enough. What horrified me most was hearing that the Muslim men involved might have attended college, gone to strip clubs and consumed

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Harry Veeder
While we are on the subject... What is the value of a term like Islamic-fascist ? Was Nazis Germany ruled by Christian-fascists? Harry

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Philip Winestone
Tut Tut Ed... The problem is that you believe everyone thinks rationally and quasi-legally like you do. Most don't. And as for: A sane person does not try to murder his neighbor because he thinks she is a slut. On the other hand, if, for example, the neighbor takes all the water, treats you

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Edmund Storms
Philip Winestone wrote: Tut Tut Ed... The problem is that you believe everyone thinks rationally and quasi-legally like you do. Most don't. Good point, Philip. Nevertheless, most people, except the insane, are rational if the rules of the game are understood. For example, as you note

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
Harry Veeder wrote: While we are on the subject... What is the value of a term like Islamic-fascist ? Well, they consider themselves Islamic and we think they are fascist. I doubt they would object. Many of them are in sympathy with the Nazis, although not the Italian fascists as far as I

[Vo]: OT: Lee Smolin on A Crisis in Fundamental Physics

2006-08-14 Thread Harry Veeder
A recent article by Lee Smolin entitled A Crisis in Fundamental Physics http://www.nyas.org/publications/UpdateUnbound.asp?UpdateID=41 Harry

[VO]:Re: OT How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread RC Macaulay
Howdy Vorts, Been an interesting series of comments but I see no consensus. At the fundamental base of humanity, very few have an inherent evil within. I have metvery few that were evil to the core without any redemptive value. There seems to be an age , possibly around 6-9 years, where

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Philip Winestone
Good points Ed. As for the lack of parental control (and ultimately the lack of self-control), I think I know what you're getting at; rules in some form are very necessary, despite our dislike of people curtailing our freedom (although the rules, in the case of honour killings (I like to call

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Harry Veeder
Jed Rothwell wrote: Harry Veeder wrote: While we are on the subject... What is the value of a term like Islamic-fascist ? Well, they consider themselves Islamic and we think they are fascist. I doubt they would object. Many of them are in sympathy with the Nazis, although not the

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Harry Veeder
Oh fuddle duddle... The notion of a self-made nation is an ego trip like the self-made man. Harry Philip Winestone wrote: Good points Ed. As for the lack of parental control (and ultimately the lack of self-control), I think I know what you're getting at; rules in some form are very

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Harry Veeder
Zell, Chris wrote: When 9-11 happened, what depressed and horrified me the most was not the actual losses of life and property, although they were bad enough. What horrified me most was hearing that the Muslim men involved might have attended college, gone to strip clubs and consumed

Re: [Vo]: Second Installment (Verne-vision-quest)

2006-08-14 Thread Robin van Spaandonk
In reply to Terry Blanton's message of Sat, 12 Aug 2006 22:29:34 -0400: Hi, [snip] On 8/12/06, Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: NaCl might not be the best choice. Apart from the fact that it tends to create corrosive byproducts, and toxic chlorine gas, it doesn't contain any Mills

Re: [Vo]: RIP Detroit - Formally: Detroit Sees the Light

2006-08-14 Thread Robin van Spaandonk
In reply to Terry Blanton's message of Sat, 12 Aug 2006 22:34:39 -0400: Hi, [snip] On 8/12/06, Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: According to Tesla, the batteries are good for 500 recharges. If you recharge the batteries every night, they are going to need replacing after 18

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Jed Rothwell
Harry Veeder writes: Well, they consider themselves Islamic and we think they are fascist. I doubt they would object. Many of them are in sympathy with the Nazis, although not the Italian fascists as far as I know. Who is they? All of Islam? Of course not. Only the ones who have it in for

Re: [Vo]: New Segway Products

2006-08-14 Thread Robin van Spaandonk
In reply to Kyle R. Mcallister's message of Sun, 13 Aug 2006 11:27:48 -0400: Hi, [snip] In order to legitimize their special brew of hatred these fascists and extremist have hijacked the local religion. Any religion will do. It's just that typically it's the one they grew up in that that gets

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Harry Veeder
Jed Rothwell wrote: Harry Veeder writes: Well, they consider themselves Islamic and we think they are fascist. I doubt they would object. Many of them are in sympathy with the Nazis, although not the Italian fascists as far as I know. Who is they? All of Islam? Of course not. Only

Re: [Vo]: New Segway Products

2006-08-14 Thread Harry Veeder
Mike Carrell wrote: The accusation that the US is acting as colonial power in the Iraq conflict is a bit glib. I submit that one general problem that the US has in the world is that we have no real taste for Empire. The US out-sourced the task of running an empire. Harry

Re: [Vo]: New Segway Products

2006-08-14 Thread Harry Veeder
Terry Blanton wrote: On 8/11/06, Edmund Storms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We need to use our creativity to explore another way. That's easy: 1) Make energy free. 2) Eliminate religion. It's only the path which is in question. Terry Make free energy a part of every religion?

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread Robin van Spaandonk
In reply to Jed Rothwell's message of Mon, 14 Aug 2006 15:22:41 -0400: Hi, [snip] What makes these people so angry they would give this up and want to kill us? Actually, we have little to do with it. It is a fight within these countries, which is spilling over to us. Our administrations going

Re: [Vo]: OFF TOPIC How to deal with terrorism

2006-08-14 Thread leaking pen
lets also recall where osama bin laden got his training in guerilla warfare. yup, us, when we supported him in afghanistan to drive out russia. On 8/14/06, Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In reply toJed Rothwell's message of Mon, 14 Aug 2006 15:22:41-0400:Hi,[snip]What makes these