RE: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment

2006-02-25 Thread Brad Larson
Or how about automatic sector failover that puts no traffic on the network
when things are working correctly. Brad





-Original Message-
From: Lonnie Nunweiler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2006 12:02 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment


Tom, what if you could take the Cell/Sector system and add some
routing that determined when a path had stopped and chose another one.

You have controlled this by your choice of units to make those cross
connections and really all that is happening is that the mesh routing
is constantly testing to see if it needs to try another route.

We used to do this manually and what a pain it was.  This new routing
does what I used to do, except it does not sleep, have bathroom breaks
or go out for lunch.  You can assign weights to connections and force
your chosen route to get used, at least until it goes down, which
hopefully never happens, but if and when it does you are covered with
your alternate path.

What is so terrible about that?

Lonnie

On 2/24/06, Tom DeReggi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Brad,

  I agree. Our downtown Mesh versus Cell/Sector trials proved exactly that
Our tests showed that the cities like DC could be better served with
 Cell/Sector models more effectively.
 As a matter of fact, Alvarion product, appeared to be well equiped for
that
 task.
 I think projects like Phili's will bring a rude awakening. I can't prove
 that, but there is no reason for me to.
 Thats the point of modelling. So you can pre-dict BEFORE you spend.
 Its the Muni's budget to pay for, to find the true answer, not mine.

 Tom DeReggi
 RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
 IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


 - Original Message -
 From: Brad Larson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 2:49 PM
 Subject: RE: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment


  Tom, IMHO mesh is great for lighting up downtown and city parks etc. but
  it
  has yet to prove itself in a large deployment with 1,000's of customers
or
  1,000's of nodes deployed. I too have first hand experience backhauling
  several mesh projects and the mesh edge so far has not been easy at all
 Here in Northeast USA 15 mesh nodes per square miles doesn't even come
  close
  to what's needed. I've also found that implementing mesh in major metro
  areas, where there are already 1,000's of wifi access points, shrinks
  coverage models and can turn a well intentioned response to an RFP
  laughable. I believe Philadelphia projects 70k users in 5 years on 3900
  mesh
  nodes backhauled by Canopy. We'll see.
 
  I'd love to see a comparison of our BreezeAccess VL with one mile
centers
  and our high powered DS11 on the edge in Anytown USA vs mesh. I'm
working
  on
  a few of my guys to do such a test so stay tuned.
 
  What it comes down to is the fact that Matt may have just the right
  terrain
  and noise floor without the traffic that some of these larger projects
  will
  get hammered with so it works for his company. Mesh is a tool for a
  certain
  job just like other gear. But I don't believe mesh should be construed
as
  broadband for the masses in any major metro area. Brad
 
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: Tom DeReggi [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 2:28 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment
 
 
  Matt,
 
  I think you are misinterpretting my comments. Don't read more in to them
  than are there.
  I am in no way attacking the validity of your experience or comments.
I'm
  simply asking for more detail, so that I can learn from your experience

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Valemount Networks Corporation
http://www.star-os.com/
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viruses.



[WISPA] Switch recommendations

2006-02-25 Thread Pete Davis
I was wondering what switch has the largest mac address table. I don't 
need more than 6 ports, but the $19.95 cheapy switches that my AP 
Bridges all go into might be hurting my performance, I am thinking. If 
shelling out $100 or so for a good switch makes sense, I am willing to 
get one, but I don't want to spend money where its not needed.


What does the professional ISP use?
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RE: [WISPA] Switch recommendations

2006-02-25 Thread Dylan Bouterse
We use Cisco 3550. Not gonna fall into the $100 price range I'm afraid.



From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Pete Davis
Sent: Sat 2/25/2006 10:05 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Switch recommendations



I was wondering what switch has the largest mac address table. I don't
need more than 6 ports, but the $19.95 cheapy switches that my AP
Bridges all go into might be hurting my performance, I am thinking. If
shelling out $100 or so for a good switch makes sense, I am willing to
get one, but I don't want to spend money where its not needed.

What does the professional ISP use?
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Re: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment

2006-02-25 Thread Lonnie Nunweiler
OLSR does put its handshaking on the sectors, but you are right, no
data traffic goes down that alternate until the primary fails.  The
changeover is typically within 15 to 30 seconds.

The other cool thing is being able to add ADSL backups into the
system, at various spots (could be T1, cable, etc), and by assigning
weights to them, you can have automatic gateway selection if your
primary goes down.

We have had these backups and alternate paths for years, but we
managed them manually.  It worked but what a pain it was, and things
were frantic while you tried to figure out what went down and then get
in and change routing by hand.  Once things restored we had to go back
in and roll the changes back.

It was cool to be able to do those things, but it is even cooler to
have those same capabilities but not to have to any of the manual
changing.  In this way I do say that smart engineers (OLSR developers)
have coded the thing to be better than a human network techie (me).  I
know networking better than a lot of you guys and I still make
mistakes.  OLSR does not seem to be fooled and I have no hesitation in
saying it is better than I am at routing decisions.

Is it perfect?  Is it the answer for all routing?  NO to both, but it
sure beats the way a lot of people are doing it.

Lonnie

On 2/25/06, Brad Larson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Or how about automatic sector failover that puts no traffic on the network
 when things are working correctly. Brad





 -Original Message-
 From: Lonnie Nunweiler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2006 12:02 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment


 Tom, what if you could take the Cell/Sector system and add some
 routing that determined when a path had stopped and chose another one.

 You have controlled this by your choice of units to make those cross
 connections and really all that is happening is that the mesh routing
 is constantly testing to see if it needs to try another route.

 We used to do this manually and what a pain it was.  This new routing
 does what I used to do, except it does not sleep, have bathroom breaks
 or go out for lunch.  You can assign weights to connections and force
 your chosen route to get used, at least until it goes down, which
 hopefully never happens, but if and when it does you are covered with
 your alternate path.

 What is so terrible about that?

 Lonnie

 On 2/24/06, Tom DeReggi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Brad,
 
   I agree. Our downtown Mesh versus Cell/Sector trials proved exactly that
 Our tests showed that the cities like DC could be better served with
  Cell/Sector models more effectively.
  As a matter of fact, Alvarion product, appeared to be well equiped for
 that
  task.
  I think projects like Phili's will bring a rude awakening. I can't prove
  that, but there is no reason for me to.
  Thats the point of modelling. So you can pre-dict BEFORE you spend.
  Its the Muni's budget to pay for, to find the true answer, not mine.
 
  Tom DeReggi
  RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
  IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
 
 
  - Original Message -
  From: Brad Larson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
  Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 2:49 PM
  Subject: RE: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment
 
 
   Tom, IMHO mesh is great for lighting up downtown and city parks etc. but
   it
   has yet to prove itself in a large deployment with 1,000's of customers
 or
   1,000's of nodes deployed. I too have first hand experience backhauling
   several mesh projects and the mesh edge so far has not been easy at all
  Here in Northeast USA 15 mesh nodes per square miles doesn't even come
   close
   to what's needed. I've also found that implementing mesh in major metro
   areas, where there are already 1,000's of wifi access points, shrinks
   coverage models and can turn a well intentioned response to an RFP
   laughable. I believe Philadelphia projects 70k users in 5 years on 3900
   mesh
   nodes backhauled by Canopy. We'll see.
  
   I'd love to see a comparison of our BreezeAccess VL with one mile
 centers
   and our high powered DS11 on the edge in Anytown USA vs mesh. I'm
 working
   on
   a few of my guys to do such a test so stay tuned.
  
   What it comes down to is the fact that Matt may have just the right
   terrain
   and noise floor without the traffic that some of these larger projects
   will
   get hammered with so it works for his company. Mesh is a tool for a
   certain
   job just like other gear. But I don't believe mesh should be construed
 as
   broadband for the masses in any major metro area. Brad
  
  
  
  
   -Original Message-
   From: Tom DeReggi [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
   Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 2:28 PM
   To: WISPA General List
   Subject: Re: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment
  
  
   Matt,
  
   I think you are misinterpretting my comments. Don't read more in to them
   than are there.
   I am in no way attacking the validity of your 

RE: [WISPA] Switch recommendations

2006-02-25 Thread Mike Bushard, Jr
We run Foundry FES2402-Premium's. Obviously more than $100, though.

Mike Bushard, Jr
Wisper Wireless Solutions, LLC





-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Pete Davis
Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2006 9:05 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Switch recommendations

I was wondering what switch has the largest mac address table. I don't 
need more than 6 ports, but the $19.95 cheapy switches that my AP 
Bridges all go into might be hurting my performance, I am thinking. If 
shelling out $100 or so for a good switch makes sense, I am willing to 
get one, but I don't want to spend money where its not needed.

What does the professional ISP use?
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Re: [WISPA] Switch recommendations

2006-02-25 Thread Matt Liotta
Dell seems to make switches that deliver good performance for the cheap 
price you pay. Whenever we don't need the capabilities of a Cisco 
switch, but want something managable that won't fall down we go with Dell.


-Matt

Pete Davis wrote:

I was wondering what switch has the largest mac address table. I don't 
need more than 6 ports, but the $19.95 cheapy switches that my AP 
Bridges all go into might be hurting my performance, I am thinking. If 
shelling out $100 or so for a good switch makes sense, I am willing to 
get one, but I don't want to spend money where its not needed.


What does the professional ISP use?



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Re: [WISPA] MikroTik MUM - Dallas

2006-02-25 Thread Mac Dearman
I see MikroTik has their MUM (MikroTik Users Meeting) scheduled for Dallas, 
Texas May 4-5th as well as a


3 day training before that - - anyone here going to attend other than me? I 
aint bashful and would share a room


with someone :-) if they dont snore as loud as myself or BUTCH EVANS


Mac Dearman
Maximum Access, LLC.
Authorized Barracuda Reseller
MikroTik RouterOS Certified
www.inetsouth.com
www.mac-tel.us
www.RadioResponse.org (Katrina Relief)
Rayville, La.
318.728.8600
318.303.4227
318.303.4229





- Original Message - 
From: Mark Koskenmaki [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 11:18 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] VOIP



I'm just looking to offer customers an alternative to the phone line.

That is, I'd like to give them an excuse to drop the Qwest copper line, 
keep

phone service, and give me the money instead.

And for those who live outside any other broadband, I can make a package
deal that puts them right in there with what they'd get if the telco did
move in... in other words, NO REASON TO LEAVE IN THE FUTURE.




North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!

-
- Original Message - 
From: Peter R. [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 8:28 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] VOIP



The margin in consumer VOIP is disappearing. The costs of the
infrastructure including DIDs and 911 implementation have slammed the
industry. Read Vonage's IPO to better understand the 911 liability and
cost.

In a couple of cases I have consulted on, the local CO was not
accessible by any CLEC, so no LNP, so no one to outsource the VOIP to.

BOCs have learned that most consumers switch to VOIP for cost savings,
so have lowered their costs. Plus cableco's have gotten into the game
(and can do 911) and bundle on one bill.

You can try to do it yourself (and Asterisk is a GREAT tool for this),
but if you aren't a CLEC, how do you handle 911 and LNP?

Now if you wanted to sell Hosted PBX to Businesses, that's valuable.

Regards,

Peter
RAD-INFO, Inc.

Mark Koskenmaki wrote:

I don't understand your point about selling on margins.

I was merely asking for a wholesale product that was priced less than
RETAIL.

Nothing more, nothing less.

I have yet to figure out how it is all the wholesale products are
currently anywhere between 10 and 100% more than the current retail
offerings.

There's no margin in that, unless I'm supposed to subsidize VOIP

service

with my WISP revenue, which is the reverse notion of more revenue per
customer.

I didn't say I wanted a fat margin.  I just said I wanted something I
could bundle with my data service that didn't cost me more than retail 
to
get, which is why I'm a bit taken back at the notion that wholesale 
costs

more than retail.

If that' whining, in your view, I'd say your view was a little strange.

As

best I can tell, the biggest costs for VOIP are the infrastructure and
customer service.I merely wanted to make the unusual split of 
dealing

with customer service myself, but farming out the infrastructure.

Nobody

seems to be interested in doing that, and I'm not sure why. Lots of
ISP's are outsourcing customer service, and seemingly it has advantages,

one
would naturally assume this is true of the VOIP business, but, hey, 
maybe
not.   The infrastructure, as best I can tell, is the most cost 
effective

to

scale upwards, more so than customer service.


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[WISPA] staros vs mt routing

2006-02-25 Thread Kurt Fankhauser








Has anyone seen issues between the two? I have a situation
where I replaced a staros box with a MT box (Im
running rip) and the routes are getting distributed, I can pass traffic on to
the internet, but I cant do anything past the MT box in the direction
going away from the internet. Now on the otherside of
the MT box I can do anything, browse internet, ping anywhere, etc. But from the
otherside I cant get past it.



Kurt Fankhauser

WAVELINC

114 S. Walnut St.

Bucyrus, OH 44820

419-562-6405

www.wavelinc.com








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Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

2006-02-25 Thread John J. Thomas
There has been so much talk about this, I might be inclined to help the FCC 
find those WISPs that are snubbing their noses at the law. This is a 
professional list and those here should be abiding by the law. I wonder if it 
would be a good thing to kick out those that promote illegal activities?

Whether you like it or not, WISPs will eventually be taxed- I guarantee the 
ILECs will see to that. If the FCC wants you, they will eventually find you.

John Thomas


-Original Message-
From: Frank Muto [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 06:20 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

http://www.fcc.gov/broadband/broadband_data_faq.pdf


20. Are there penalties for not filing Form 477?

Entities that are required to file Form 477 but fail to do so may be subject
to the

enforcement provisions of the Communications Act and any other applicable
law. In

particular, the Commission has authority pursuant to sections 502 and 503 of
the

Communications Act to enforce compliance by fine or forfeiture.





Frank Muto
Co-founder -  Washington Bureau for ISP Advocacy - WBIA
Telecom Summit Ad Hoc Committee
http://gigabytemarch.blog.com/ www.wbia.us














- Original Message -
From: Bob Moldashel [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org; Marlon Schafer
(509-982-2181) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 8:20 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st


 OK...OK.

 I agree that all should probably file.  I have several partners so I am
 not the only one to decide so I will leave it at that as it pertains to my
 WISP entity.

 BUT...What is the penalty for not filing  Does anyone know???  Can
 we get an official statement for this situation? Are there fines?
 Penalty's?? Do you get a nasty gram??  Do they not send me a xmas card
 next year??  What???

 It may help bring more compliance or it may result in less filings.
 Either way I think the membership should know.

 Marlon...How about asking some of your contacts.

 -B-

 --
 Bob Moldashel
 Lakeland Communications, Inc.
 Broadband Deployment Group
 1350 Lincoln Avenue
 Holbrook, New York 11741 USA
 800-479-9195 Toll Free US  Canada
 631-585-5558 Fax
 516-551-1131 Cell

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Re: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment

2006-02-25 Thread John J. Thomas
We are still waiting to deply Cisco mesh, so I can't vouch for it *yet*. We 
will be installing for the City of Gilroy Ca. probably in the next 4 weeks. 
This is currently only a partial deployment, but they plan on lighting the 
whole city. I can tell you that the equipment is expensive -$3500 per mesh box 
but has fantastic specs. It uses a 5.7-8 GHz radio for backhaul and 2.4 GHz for 
access. As soon as I get the testing done, I promise to share numbers

John Thomas


-Original Message-
From: ISPlists [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 02:32 PM
To: isp-wireless@isp-wireless.com, ''WISPA General List''
Subject: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment

Does anyone have a good recommendation on some Mesh equipment.  I have a small 
town that wants to provide Internet access to the entire town and I'm thinking 
of using mesh technology.  Any ideas would be great.

Thanks,
Steve


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Re: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment

2006-02-25 Thread John J. Thomas
Yes, unfortunately, the Cisco mesh is only using 5.8 for backhaul right now. 
Since they recommend 16-18 mesh boxes per square mile, 5.25 GHz and up would be 
a much better choice

John


-Original Message-
From: Jack Unger [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 08:41 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment

Tom,

You make a very good point that 5.3 GHz should be used wherever possible 
while reserving 5.8 for longer-distance backhauling and supercell use. 
We should all be thinking in terms of using 5.3 whenever we can and 
reserving the higher-power 5.8 authorization for those situations where 
we really, really need it.
jack

Tom DeReggi wrote:

 Or realize that everyone in the world is using the precious 5.8Ghz 
 spectrum already for long critical links, that are limited to 5.8Ghz for 
 PtP rule higher SU antenna, or long distance.
 5.3Ghz is an ideal backhaul channel for MESH, up to 7 miles (with 2 ft 
 dish), and avoid the interference headaches.  There is now a HUGE range 
 of spectrum available at 1 watt, the 5.3G and 5.4Ghz newly allocated 
 255Mhzspectrum usable as if this past January.  Design mesh networks to 
 utilize these many channel options, avoid interference, and don't 
 destroy the industry by unnecessisarilly using the precious 5.8Ghz.  In 
 a MESH design its rare to need to go distances longer than 2 miles, all 
 within the realm of possibility with low power 5.3G and 5.4G and Omnis 
 and relatively small panel antennas.
 
 Likewise, reserve the precious 2.4Ghz for the link to consumer, the 
 spectrum supported by their laptops.  I hope to see the industry smart 
 enough to use the new 5.4Ghz for MESH type systems, which is one of the 
 reasons it was allocated for.
 
 One of the most important tasks for WISPs is to conserve the 5.8Ghz 
 spectrum and only use it when needed.  It is in shortage most compared 
 to the other ranges. I had hoped and lobbied hard that half of the 
 5.4Ghz range would be allowed for higher power and PtP rules, but it had 
 not. Its still perfect for mesh and OFDM. Don;t be fooled into believing 
 high power is the secret weapon for mesh, as it is not, LOW power is.  
 Interference and noise is accumulative and travels for miles around 
 corners and obstructions, unlike good RSSI and quality signal.  Get 
 better RSSI in MESH, by Reducing self interference and noise, by using a 
 wider range of channel selections and lower power.  5.3 and 5.4 gives 
 you 350Mhz to select channels from, of equal specification/propertied 
 RF.  Design it into your MESH design.  If you can't transport it in 
 1watt, redesign radio install locations and density.  Every single 
 additional non-inteferring channel selection, drastically logrithmically 
 increases the odds of getting a non-interfering channel selection.  5.4G 
 is the best thinng that happened to MESH. Unfortuneately, worthless for 
 super cell design.  But if MESH embrases 5.4 like it should, it leaves 
 5.8Ghz for Super cell.  Otherwise the MESH designer is destined to fail, 
 because it will become a battle that the Super Cell guy won't be able to 
 give up on until his death, as he has no other option but the range he 
 is using.  The mesh provider has options.
 
 Tom DeReggi
 RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
 IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
 
 - Original Message - From: Jack Unger [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 6:29 PM
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Mesh Equipment
 
 
 Unless you expect to handle only very low levels of traffic, avoid 
 mesh nodes with only one radio. Choose nodes that have one radio on 
 2.4 GHz for customer connections and one radio on 5.8 GHz for 
 backhauling. In other words, separate the access traffic from the 
 backhaul traffic. Your overall throughput capability will be many 
 times greater.

 jack


 ISPlists wrote:

 Does anyone have a good recommendation on some Mesh equipment.  I 
 have a small town that wants to provide Internet access to the entire 
 town and I'm thinking of using mesh technology.  Any ideas would be 
 great.
  Thanks,
 Steve


 -- 
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 Serving the License-Free Wireless Industry Since 1993
 Author of the WISP Handbook - Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs
 True Vendor-Neutral WISP Consulting-Training-Troubleshooting
 Phone (VoIP Over Broadband Wireless) 818-227-4220  www.ask-wi.com



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Serving the License-Free Wireless Industry Since 1993
Author of the WISP Handbook - Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs
True Vendor-Neutral WISP Consulting-Training-Troubleshooting
Phone (VoIP Over Broadband Wireless) 818-227-4220  

Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

2006-02-25 Thread A. Huppenthal
I don't think WISPA should police WISPs. The organization does encourage 
conforming to FCC regs, and we've seen numerous postings from Marlon and 
others answering difficult rule interpretation. That's the best focus 
for our energies as a WISP organization - that is; making FCC links and 
docs available where needed, providing liaison between FCC and WISPs to 
accomodate WISPs customers needs... That's my stand.


John J. Thomas wrote:

There has been so much talk about this, I might be inclined to help the FCC find those 
WISPs that are snubbing their noses at the law. This is a professional list and those 
here should be abiding by the law. I wonder if it would be a good thing to kick 
out those that promote illegal activities?

Whether you like it or not, WISPs will eventually be taxed- I guarantee the 
ILECs will see to that. If the FCC wants you, they will eventually find you.

John Thomas


  

-Original Message-
From: Frank Muto [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 06:20 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

http://www.fcc.gov/broadband/broadband_data_faq.pdf


20. Are there penalties for not filing Form 477?

Entities that are required to file Form 477 but fail to do so may be subject 
to the


enforcement provisions of the Communications Act and any other applicable 
law. In


particular, the Commission has authority pursuant to sections 502 and 503 of 
the


Communications Act to enforce compliance by fine or forfeiture.





Frank Muto
Co-founder -  Washington Bureau for ISP Advocacy - WBIA
Telecom Summit Ad Hoc Committee
http://gigabytemarch.blog.com/ www.wbia.us














- Original Message - 
From: Bob Moldashel [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org; Marlon Schafer 
(509-982-2181) [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 8:20 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st




OK...OK.

I agree that all should probably file.  I have several partners so I am 
not the only one to decide so I will leave it at that as it pertains to my 
WISP entity.


BUT...What is the penalty for not filing  Does anyone know???  Can 
we get an official statement for this situation? Are there fines? 
Penalty's?? Do you get a nasty gram??  Do they not send me a xmas card 
next year??  What???


It may help bring more compliance or it may result in less filings. 
Either way I think the membership should know.


Marlon...How about asking some of your contacts.

-B-

--
Bob Moldashel
Lakeland Communications, Inc.
Broadband Deployment Group
1350 Lincoln Avenue
Holbrook, New York 11741 USA
800-479-9195 Toll Free US  Canada
631-585-5558 Fax
516-551-1131 Cell

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Re: [WISPA] Switch recommendations

2006-02-25 Thread John J. Thomas


Where are these being used?  If it is at the customer edge, it will be 
different than if at your core. The Netgear FS726T runs between 100 and 200 
dollars and supports up to 8000 MAC adresses.

John


-Original Message-


From: Pete Davis [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2006 07:05 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: [WISPA] Switch recommendations

I was wondering what switch has the largest mac address table. I don't 
need more than 6 ports, but the $19.95 cheapy switches that my AP 
Bridges all go into might be hurting my performance, I am thinking. If 
shelling out $100 or so for a good switch makes sense, I am willing to 
get one, but I don't want to spend money where its not needed.

What does the professional ISP use?
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Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

2006-02-25 Thread Blair Davis
Do you report people to the authorities for not wearing their seat 
belts?  How about for speeding?


Both of those can result in direct harm to people.  Filing or not filing 
form 477 will not directly harm anyone.  It might result in the non 
filer getting in trouble.  But that is HIS or HER problem.  Not yours.


It is not your place to enforce this on others.

If this mailing list becomes an enforcement tool for the government, I'm 
out of here 

P.S.  I have and will continue to file the 477.  I just have no use for 
nark's.


--
Blair Davis
West Michigan Wireless ISP
269-686-8648




John J. Thomas wrote:


There has been so much talk about this, I might be inclined to help the FCC find those 
WISPs that are snubbing their noses at the law. This is a professional list and those 
here should be abiding by the law. I wonder if it would be a good thing to kick 
out those that promote illegal activities?

Whether you like it or not, WISPs will eventually be taxed- I guarantee the 
ILECs will see to that. If the FCC wants you, they will eventually find you.

John Thomas


 


-Original Message-
From: Frank Muto [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 06:20 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

http://www.fcc.gov/broadband/broadband_data_faq.pdf


20. Are there penalties for not filing Form 477?

Entities that are required to file Form 477 but fail to do so may be subject 
to the


enforcement provisions of the Communications Act and any other applicable 
law. In


particular, the Commission has authority pursuant to sections 502 and 503 of 
the


Communications Act to enforce compliance by fine or forfeiture.





Frank Muto
Co-founder -  Washington Bureau for ISP Advocacy - WBIA
Telecom Summit Ad Hoc Committee
http://gigabytemarch.blog.com/ www.wbia.us














- Original Message - 
From: Bob Moldashel [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org; Marlon Schafer 
(509-982-2181) [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 8:20 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st


   


OK...OK.

I agree that all should probably file.  I have several partners so I am 
not the only one to decide so I will leave it at that as it pertains to my 
WISP entity.


BUT...What is the penalty for not filing  Does anyone know???  Can 
we get an official statement for this situation? Are there fines? 
Penalty's?? Do you get a nasty gram??  Do they not send me a xmas card 
next year??  What???


It may help bring more compliance or it may result in less filings. 
Either way I think the membership should know.


Marlon...How about asking some of your contacts.

-B-

--
Bob Moldashel
Lakeland Communications, Inc.
Broadband Deployment Group
1350 Lincoln Avenue
Holbrook, New York 11741 USA
800-479-9195 Toll Free US  Canada
631-585-5558 Fax
516-551-1131 Cell

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Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

2006-02-25 Thread Mark Koskenmaki

- Original Message - 
From: John J. Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2006 11:04 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st


 There has been so much talk about this, I might be inclined to help the
FCC find those WISPs that are snubbing their noses at the law. This is a
professional list and those here should be abiding by the law. I wonder if
it would be a good thing to kick out those that promote illegal
activities?

Could you provide a list of illegal activities that have been promoted
here?I've been watching this list since the day it started, and aside
from some humorous comments, I have never seen anyone promoting illegal
activities.I tried to get WISPA members interested in lobbying the FCC
to stop doing this, but it seems they want regulation and taxation... so...
So be it.


 Whether you like it or not, WISPs will eventually be taxed- I guarantee
the ILECs will see to that. If the FCC wants you, they will eventually find
you.

Why help them?



 John Thomas


 -Original Message-
 From: Frank Muto [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 06:20 PM
 To: 'WISPA General List'
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st
 
 http://www.fcc.gov/broadband/broadband_data_faq.pdf
 
 
 20. Are there penalties for not filing Form 477?
 
 Entities that are required to file Form 477 but fail to do so may be
subject
 to the
 
 enforcement provisions of the Communications Act and any other applicable
 law. In
 
 particular, the Commission has authority pursuant to sections 502 and 503
of
 the
 
 Communications Act to enforce compliance by fine or forfeiture.
 
 
 
 
 
 Frank Muto
 Co-founder -  Washington Bureau for ISP Advocacy - WBIA
 Telecom Summit Ad Hoc Committee
 http://gigabytemarch.blog.com/ www.wbia.us
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 - Original Message - 
 From: Bob Moldashel [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org; Marlon Schafer
 (509-982-2181) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 8:20 PM
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st
 
 
  OK...OK.
 
  I agree that all should probably file.  I have several partners so I am
  not the only one to decide so I will leave it at that as it pertains to
my
  WISP entity.
 
  BUT...What is the penalty for not filing  Does anyone know???
Can
  we get an official statement for this situation? Are there fines?
  Penalty's?? Do you get a nasty gram??  Do they not send me a xmas card
  next year??  What???
 
  It may help bring more compliance or it may result in less filings.
  Either way I think the membership should know.
 
  Marlon...How about asking some of your contacts.
 
  -B-
 
  -- 
  Bob Moldashel
  Lakeland Communications, Inc.
  Broadband Deployment Group
  1350 Lincoln Avenue
  Holbrook, New York 11741 USA
  800-479-9195 Toll Free US  Canada
  631-585-5558 Fax
  516-551-1131 Cell
 
  -- 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 -- 
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 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 


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Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

2006-02-25 Thread Bob Moldashel

John J. Thomas wrote:


There has been so much talk about this, I might be inclined to help the FCC find those 
WISPs that are snubbing their noses at the law. This is a professional list and those 
here should be abiding by the law. I wonder if it would be a good thing to kick 
out those that promote illegal activities?

Whether you like it or not, WISPs will eventually be taxed- I guarantee the 
ILECs will see to that. If the FCC wants you, they will eventually find you.

John Thomas


 


Dude,

No one likes a snitch...

Your energy would be better spent working on your website...Don't cha' 
think


-B-

--
Bob Moldashel
Lakeland Communications, Inc.
Broadband Deployment Group
1350 Lincoln Avenue
Holbrook, New York 11741 USA
800-479-9195 Toll Free US  Canada
631-585-5558 Fax
516-551-1131 Cell

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RE: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

2006-02-25 Thread Chuck
AMEN !

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Blair Davis
Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2006 1:39 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

Do you report people to the authorities for not wearing their seat 
belts?  How about for speeding?

Both of those can result in direct harm to people.  Filing or not filing 
form 477 will not directly harm anyone.  It might result in the non 
filer getting in trouble.  But that is HIS or HER problem.  Not yours.

It is not your place to enforce this on others.

If this mailing list becomes an enforcement tool for the government, I'm 
out of here 

P.S.  I have and will continue to file the 477.  I just have no use for 
nark's.

--
Blair Davis
West Michigan Wireless ISP
269-686-8648




John J. Thomas wrote:

There has been so much talk about this, I might be inclined to help the FCC
find those WISPs that are snubbing their noses at the law. This is a
professional list and those here should be abiding by the law. I wonder if
it would be a good thing to kick out those that promote illegal
activities?

Whether you like it or not, WISPs will eventually be taxed- I guarantee the
ILECs will see to that. If the FCC wants you, they will eventually find you.

John Thomas


  

-Original Message-
From: Frank Muto [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 06:20 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

http://www.fcc.gov/broadband/broadband_data_faq.pdf


20. Are there penalties for not filing Form 477?

Entities that are required to file Form 477 but fail to do so may be
subject 
to the

enforcement provisions of the Communications Act and any other applicable 
law. In

particular, the Commission has authority pursuant to sections 502 and 503
of 
the

Communications Act to enforce compliance by fine or forfeiture.





Frank Muto
Co-founder -  Washington Bureau for ISP Advocacy - WBIA
Telecom Summit Ad Hoc Committee
http://gigabytemarch.blog.com/ www.wbia.us














- Original Message - 
From: Bob Moldashel [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org; Marlon Schafer 
(509-982-2181) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 8:20 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st




OK...OK.

I agree that all should probably file.  I have several partners so I am 
not the only one to decide so I will leave it at that as it pertains to
my 
WISP entity.

BUT...What is the penalty for not filing  Does anyone know???
Can 
we get an official statement for this situation? Are there fines? 
Penalty's?? Do you get a nasty gram??  Do they not send me a xmas card 
next year??  What???

It may help bring more compliance or it may result in less filings. 
Either way I think the membership should know.

Marlon...How about asking some of your contacts.

-B-

-- 
Bob Moldashel
Lakeland Communications, Inc.
Broadband Deployment Group
1350 Lincoln Avenue
Holbrook, New York 11741 USA
800-479-9195 Toll Free US  Canada
631-585-5558 Fax
516-551-1131 Cell

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Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

2006-02-25 Thread JohnnyO




Hey John Thomas -Were you the hall monitor in school ? Did you take names for the teacher when she walked out of the classroom ?

JohnnyO

On Sat, 2006-02-25 at 19:04 +, John J. Thomas wrote:


There has been so much talk about this, I might be inclined to help the FCC find those WISPs that are snubbing their noses at the law. This is a professional list and those here should be abiding by the law. I wonder if it would be a good thing to kick out those that promote illegal activities?

Whether you like it or not, WISPs will eventually be taxed- I guarantee the ILECs will see to that. If the FCC wants you, they will eventually find you.

John Thomas


-Original Message-
From: Frank Muto [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 06:20 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

http://www.fcc.gov/broadband/broadband_data_faq.pdf


20. Are there penalties for not filing Form 477?

Entities that are required to file Form 477 but fail to do so may be subject 
to the

enforcement provisions of the Communications Act and any other applicable 
law. In

particular, the Commission has authority pursuant to sections 502 and 503 of 
the

Communications Act to enforce compliance by fine or forfeiture.





Frank Muto
Co-founder -  Washington Bureau for ISP Advocacy - WBIA
Telecom Summit Ad Hoc Committee
http://gigabytemarch.blog.com/ www.wbia.us














- Original Message - 
From: Bob Moldashel [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org; Marlon Schafer 
(509-982-2181) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 8:20 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st


 OK...OK.

 I agree that all should probably file.  I have several partners so I am 
 not the only one to decide so I will leave it at that as it pertains to my 
 WISP entity.

 BUT...What is the penalty for not filing  Does anyone know???  Can 
 we get an official statement for this situation? Are there fines? 
 Penalty's?? Do you get a nasty gram??  Do they not send me a xmas card 
 next year??  What???

 It may help bring more compliance or it may result in less filings. 
 Either way I think the membership should know.

 Marlon...How about asking some of your contacts.

 -B-

 -- 
 Bob Moldashel
 Lakeland Communications, Inc.
 Broadband Deployment Group
 1350 Lincoln Avenue
 Holbrook, New York 11741 USA
 800-479-9195 Toll Free US  Canada
 631-585-5558 Fax
 516-551-1131 Cell

 -- 
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

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Re: [WISPA] FCC Form 477 Due March 1st

2006-02-25 Thread JohnnyO




I 2nd that one Bob ! - Noone likes a lil tattle tale - I think John Thomas just let his alligator mouth overload his mockinbird butt on this one. Definitely lost my respect.

JohnnyO

On Sat, 2006-02-25 at 18:49 -0500, Bob Moldashel wrote:


John J. Thomas wrote:

There has been so much talk about this, I might be inclined to help the FCC find those WISPs that are snubbing their noses at the law. This is a professional list and those here should be abiding by the law. I wonder if it would be a good thing to kick out those that promote illegal activities?

Whether you like it or not, WISPs will eventually be taxed- I guarantee the ILECs will see to that. If the FCC wants you, they will eventually find you.

John Thomas


  

Dude,

No one likes a snitch...

Your energy would be better spent working on your website...Don't cha' 
think

-B-

-- 
Bob Moldashel
Lakeland Communications, Inc.
Broadband Deployment Group
1350 Lincoln Avenue
Holbrook, New York 11741 USA
800-479-9195 Toll Free US  Canada
631-585-5558 Fax
516-551-1131 Cell





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